**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Mar 02 02:59:57 2011 Mar 02 04:06:03 hi all Mar 02 04:13:48 anyone here? Mar 02 04:36:30 so, according to this story on infoworld, the atrix really has a CPU inside the "dock" and it doesn't infact all run on the phone, like so many people claimed it did Mar 02 04:36:33 http://www.infoworld.com/d/mobile-technology/can-the-atrix-4g-really-become-your-next-pc-843?page=0,2 Mar 02 07:51:59 ali: ok, i have rpmlint running Mar 02 07:52:04 the results are well, interesting Mar 02 07:52:25 and sadly slightly buggy Mar 02 10:33:34 * lcuk peeks in Mar 02 10:38:16 lcuk \o Mar 02 10:38:57 RST38h, accepted your linkedin doofer thingy Mar 02 10:39:41 yea, seen that, cool Mar 02 10:40:55 I haven't updated my profile there in a while, perhaps I should Mar 02 10:41:36 depends on your plans I guess Mar 02 10:43:11 just for wanting to keep it updated sake Mar 02 10:47:40 hello lcuk :) Mar 02 10:47:44 i should also do something about my linkedin profile Mar 02 10:47:50 maybe delete it :D Mar 02 11:31:54 I have looked every where through the forums before asking Mar 02 11:32:18 I can't get empathy to connect Mar 02 11:32:20 to anythign Mar 02 11:36:10 so, rpm/spec people? Mar 02 11:37:18 ali1234: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1118032 is my current patch Mar 02 11:41:33 and http://mxr.meego.com/repo.meego.com/source/rpmlint.txt is the output Mar 02 11:41:41 (that file isn't indexed right now, but it certainly could be) Mar 02 11:41:42 \o hey timeless_office Mar 02 11:42:05 hey Mar 02 11:42:09 you ran lint over everything in mxr? :D Mar 02 11:42:16 just the spec files Mar 02 11:42:31 it runs relatively quickly all things considered Mar 02 11:43:02 lcuk: so, that leaves me w/ a few problems: Mar 02 11:43:29 1. i'd like to get my changes to rpmlint integrated into meego's build system - so that my errors would cause packages to fail to integrate until they're fixed Mar 02 11:43:45 2. while packages do fail rpmlint, i need to do something... Mar 02 11:44:45 one approach is that i can run rpmlint on spec files before rpmbuild -bp, and if it fails, i can just dump the output into the package source directory and skip the -bp bit, leaving a copy of the unpacked rpm Mar 02 11:45:07 another approach would be to rewrite the .spec file so that things which my rpmlint wouldn't like get dropped Mar 02 11:45:30 well a few extra checks on things which are easily identifiable using rpmlint would be useful indeed Mar 02 11:45:55 timeless_office: I thought MeeGo used dpkg packaging, is there some progress going on for changing that? Mar 02 11:45:58 and the last approach i can think of is a restricted shell which only allows the commands i listed and which doesn't allow perl/python to fork Mar 02 11:46:11 weasel: you clearly didn't pay any attn to anything Mar 02 11:46:15 thanks for your help Mar 02 11:46:32 http://meego.com/about/faq Mar 02 11:47:25 lcuk: anyway, if you could look over my pastebin, i'd appreciate it Mar 02 11:47:46 also, if i could get you to file bugs against the packages tagged by rpm lint for my specific E:, that'd be great Mar 02 11:48:08 which pastebin? the rpmlint.txt? Mar 02 11:48:24 http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1118032 Mar 02 11:48:26 .. Mar 02 11:48:58 note that the rpmlint i'm running doesn't have access to a real 'rpm' distro, so e.g. the non-standard-group warning is because it doesn't have access to that, not because it's actually wrong Mar 02 11:51:07 timeless_office: thank you for correcting my misunderstanding. Mar 02 11:51:39 :) Mar 02 11:52:34 weasel: of note, just because 'official meego' will use rpm, doesn't mean some braindead vendor won't try to pass off some product that was spec'd 3 years ago w/ some other format as 'meego like' using some other format Mar 02 11:52:50 but any such hypothetical product really isn't on topic here imo Mar 02 11:53:53 I thought MeeGo somehow inherited that design failure from maemo, this is getting ever more interesting os Mar 02 11:55:00 in principal meego actually got most of the 'right' technologies Mar 02 11:55:39 s/principal/principle/ Mar 02 11:55:40 timeless_office meant: in principle meego actually got most of the 'right' technologies Mar 02 11:56:01 unfortunately it turns out that the 'right' technologies aren't sufficiently mature either Mar 02 11:56:05 * timeless_office kicks rpmbuild/rpmlint Mar 02 11:56:24 and note: i have the right to kick these things, i write patches. Mar 02 11:56:58 oh.. and i generally end up using something more heavily w/in a week than most people do in a decade :) Mar 02 11:57:23 grrr. my macbook pro doesn't have a touchscreen Mar 02 11:58:03 timeless_office, would the rpmlint patch have to be applied to OBS in general Mar 02 11:58:17 or to specific build versions (ie configurable from the .ks) Mar 02 11:58:33 lcuk: well, ideally it'd be integrated into rpmlint upstream and everyone would be asked to upgrade Mar 02 11:58:35 timeless_office, lol @ mbp Mar 02 11:58:41 I was looking at the weekend Mar 02 11:58:43 grr, lunch time Mar 02 11:58:56 \o bon appetite Mar 02 12:29:42 * lcuk faffs with new laptop Mar 02 12:35:39 sp3000 Mar 02 12:43:01 * lcuk unfaffs Mar 02 12:45:00 timeless_office, I brought up the rpmlint stuff in #meego-arm Mar 02 12:45:13 hmmh, all of rpmlint messages on that page for my packages are bogus, explicitly allowed by packaging guidelines (well except one but that was created by NMU) Mar 02 13:20:26 at least one unexpected nice thing coming out of the Christchurch quake Mar 02 13:20:27 http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/03/01/AR2011030100118.html Mar 02 13:20:35 handwritten time capsules from 19th century Mar 02 13:57:01 anyone here who might know anything about setting up meego-sdk with nvidia quadro card? When im trying to start the runtime, i get segfaults and presumably it might be because of gl stuff. Mar 02 14:02:10 jani: I had some problems with Qt apps crashing under Ubuntu Mar 02 14:02:45 in fact all Qt apps would crash, I'd have to dig out the bug report, but was solved by skipping a couple of Xorg updates Mar 02 14:02:53 for reference: ubuntu 10.04 seems to work for me (i386 host, intel graphics) Mar 02 14:04:04 (and for me using a patched Xorg in the meantime) Mar 02 14:04:16 That was somewhere around Ubuntu 10.04 iirc Mar 02 14:05:15 lardman: well, the issue is that runtime wont start .. i get the segfault immedietly after trying to poweron the runtime and there's entry in the syslog like this: Mar 02 14:05:16 Mar 2 16:03:38 helruo-dhcp022206 kernel: [ 992.858377] qemugl[3054]: segfault at b7785ff4 ip b76e94fe sp 4aeb6190 error 7 in libGL.so.260.19.06[b7671000+9c000] Mar 02 14:06:05 My problem wasn't OpenGL related, so must not be the same thing, sorry Mar 02 14:06:34 i found few messages that have this same issue and those just seem to pinpoint that the issue is in nvidia side. which is propably not fixed but i was kinda hoping there would be a workaround =) Mar 02 14:07:08 http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-sdk/2010-November/000460.html Mar 02 14:08:01 jani, do you run poweron with -fg option? Mar 02 14:08:22 yes Mar 02 14:20:30 hey why was there a update to new telepathy version when core is supposed frozen / feature complete? Mar 02 14:20:39 for 1.2 Mar 02 14:21:06 jbos: CCB process, possibly Mar 02 14:21:16 things are more regulated Mar 02 14:21:32 CCB? Mar 02 14:22:09 http://wiki.meego.com/Product_Management Mar 02 14:43:51 Stskeeps Mar 02 14:43:54 no CCB Mar 02 14:44:01 just random update Mar 02 14:44:11 then there was a BMC# attached Mar 02 14:44:12 https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13593 Mar 02 14:44:14 Bug 13593 nor, Undecided, ---, paolo.capriotti, VERI FIXED, update telepathy-qt4 to 0.5.7 Mar 02 14:44:48 just the point they changed interfaces Mar 02 14:44:55 and functionality Mar 02 14:45:06 jbos: well, take it up on meego-pm@ ideally, looks a little like sidetracking of program management Mar 02 14:47:20 i mean i'm glad that they updated, stuff get fixed which was broken for us (or needed to be hacked) - thats a plus Mar 02 14:47:40 but still the process is broken and - i fear it might break again Mar 02 14:47:52 :) and than its not going to end well Mar 02 14:47:53 ;) Mar 02 14:47:54 bring it up, we're a transparent project :) Mar 02 14:52:05 telepathy-qt4 has class names that are way too long, can I file a bug for that ? :P Mar 02 14:54:37 I upgraded my dev unit (Handset UX/Pinetrail) to 20110301.7 via the repos and it now fails to start because of applauncherd crashing. Possibly a regression of BMC# 13603 or BMC# 12846. Mar 02 14:55:01 however, my setup is a little mixed... so before I go update bugs... Mar 02 14:55:07 Has anyone else noticed this? Mar 02 14:55:14 bug 13603 and bug 12846 Mar 02 14:55:16 Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13603 maj, Medium, 1.0.90.3, miroslav.safr, RELE FIXED, Applauncherd crash infinitely (no UI) Mar 02 14:55:18 Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=12846 maj, High, ---, tuomas.jarvensivu, NEW, [REG]duihome startup fail. Mar 02 14:55:57 gabrbedd, I noticed a low level bug relating to booting from usb image Mar 02 14:56:14 on both netbook and handset builds for my ideapad Mar 02 14:56:44 lcuk: Hmmm... this was a HD install on ideapad. Mar 02 14:56:56 bug 13956 Mar 02 14:56:59 Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13956 maj, Undecided, ---, peter.j.zhu, NEW, [Trunk:testing][REG] Pinetrail Handset and Netbook Images do not boot from USB Mar 02 14:57:13 yes gabrbedd I know, but perhaps the same package screwed up on update as what is there Mar 02 14:57:31 * lcuk does not know the magic required internally Mar 02 14:58:45 lcuk: ewwww.... that's nasty! Mar 02 14:59:04 * lcuk nods Mar 02 14:59:12 So, it's possible that nobody /has/ noticed it because they can't get as far as I got. :-) Mar 02 14:59:18 :) Mar 02 15:11:57 join #meego Mar 02 15:12:07 @join #meego Mar 02 15:12:35 urgh, anybody here from meego? Mar 02 15:12:36 welcome, you've joined #meego Mar 02 15:12:43 this is the channel Mar 02 15:12:57 Ah ok, sorry I am useless with irc Mar 02 15:14:14 Have a few questions regarding meego. I am trying to get MythTV to play with meego. As you might expect there are loads of dependencies missing in meego repos. Mar 02 15:14:32 examples? Mar 02 15:21:09 hi can anybody help with missing packages in meego? I am trying to get MythTV to play but there are tons of dependencies that are missing in MeeGo repos. Any help would be much appreciated. Mar 02 15:21:44 ivan_: i just asked if you have some examples of missing dependancies :) Mar 02 15:21:45 morn lbt Mar 02 15:22:10 morning Mar 02 15:23:27 well, to start with alsa audit-libs mysql... but the list goes on and on Mar 02 15:24:41 meego's a tad different, but alsa is there for sure Mar 02 15:26:13 I guess it would be great if there was upstream distro (e.g. openSUSE or fedora) that I can nick packages from. I've tried openSUSE and managed to install a few deps, but many have problems with versions and vendor change Mar 02 15:31:31 ivan_, I have ported a few things from Fedora 14 to meego, by at most minor tweaks to the spec file Mar 02 15:31:39 oh dear, timing Mar 02 16:07:15 stskeeps: so... Mar 02 16:07:31 i spent an hour trying to understand the factory.config file from rpmlint-Moblin Mar 02 16:07:36 it's incredibly confusing Mar 02 16:08:03 don't know anything about it, just point your rpmlint to there :P Mar 02 16:11:11 stskeeps: so, i was able to eventually do that Mar 02 16:11:26 * gabrbedd seems to start trouble everywhere he goes :-/ Mar 02 16:11:30 the problem is that when i added my own warning to rpmlint, it was downgraded from E: to W: by the config Mar 02 16:11:47 gabrbedd: as long as you help resolve it :) Mar 02 16:11:59 stskeeps: but i can't figure out how to upgrade my W: back to E: Mar 02 16:12:10 timeless_office: don't know, maybe cost or something Mar 02 16:12:13 all i managed to get was an extra (Badness: XXXXX) string Mar 02 16:14:49 timeless_office: eh... I've gotten caught up in a ML thread where the root problem is... "Just what the hell /is/ the MTF?" Mar 02 16:15:29 oh, that's easy "a disaster that jumped into the open before it could be shot dead while living in a closet" Mar 02 16:15:46 timeless_office: LOL! Mar 02 16:16:02 Developing Under Influence? ;p Mar 02 16:16:40 stskeeps: developing while depressed (SADD) Mar 02 16:16:58 s/SADD/SAD/ Mar 02 16:16:59 timeless_office meant: stskeeps: developing while depressed (SAD) Mar 02 16:19:06 gabrbedd: so, since i've solved your ML issue, it's your turn to help me :) Mar 02 16:20:32 timeless_office: no, you didn't... but whatcha need? Mar 02 16:21:29 jeez... now they're talking about wayland... ready to pull the trigger. Mar 02 16:21:57 gabrbedd: so, given an installed 'rpmlint' and access to a 'rpmlint-Moblin' Mar 02 16:22:02 http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1118032 is a patch for rpmlint Mar 02 16:22:31 if you use that patch w/ rpmlint w/o rpmlint-Moblin on some .spec file which violates its rule, you get an E: line Mar 02 16:22:42 with the rpmlint-Moblin config file, it becomes a W: line Mar 02 16:23:05 i need help figuring out how to make the rpmlint-Moblin thing treat my E: as an E: Mar 02 16:23:20 i tried adding the obvious line to the rpmlint-Moblin config file, but it didn't do the right thing Mar 02 16:24:46 stskeeps: so, for some strange reason, using rpmlint-Moblin, my rpmlint output is double spaced Mar 02 16:25:18 timeless_office: hmmm... I'm not sure this is a fair trade. :-p Mar 02 16:25:24 I'll see what I can do. Mar 02 16:25:28 thanks Mar 02 16:25:59 stskeeps: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1118762 Mar 02 16:26:11 timeless_office: sorry, i'm not interested in rpmlint :) Mar 02 16:26:21 grr Mar 02 16:26:21 wayland will become popular about the same time they can convince nvidia to port their driver to it. so about 20 years. Mar 02 16:26:33 ali1234! help! Mar 02 16:26:44 yeah, i read it, i don't know the answer Mar 02 16:27:06 where is rpmlint-Moblin? Mar 02 16:27:12 the answer must be in that file somewhere Mar 02 16:28:44 have you tried giving your test a badness above the badness threshol? Mar 02 16:29:12 10000 for fatal checks Mar 02 16:32:54 yes Mar 02 16:33:24 so, the extra random blank lines comes from what seems like a bug in Filter.py Mar 02 16:33:39 - _diagnostic.append(s + "\n") Mar 02 16:33:49 that's where the random \n comes from Mar 02 16:42:36 * timeless_office sighs Mar 02 16:48:09 ok, i'm confused Mar 02 16:48:21 on my system, the obvious setting for badness does yield a useful result Mar 02 17:30:04 Hi .. any updates on NOKIA roadmap for meego divison ? Mar 02 17:31:31 chinmaya: give it time :) Mar 02 17:32:52 Stskeeps: the meego smartphone is N950 Mar 02 17:35:27 yeah 950 is a good number Mar 02 17:35:33 MeeGo will run on the Nokia N900 and Nokia Booklet 3G if you tweak it Mar 02 17:47:09 chinmaya: Do you have any definite statement from Nokia that their first and only ever Meego device will be a phone? Mar 02 17:48:34 bunk: I recommend you read this thread: http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=2719 Mar 02 17:48:55 bunk: As far as I know, it's the best info avail. re: nokia's upcoming meego device. Mar 02 17:50:22 gabrbedd: That's what I'm saying - the only confirmed public information I've ever seen talks about a "device", not a "phone". Mar 02 17:50:51 bunk: did you read the thread? Mar 02 17:51:53 bunk: Admittedly it's long... but I think your answer is in there. Mar 02 17:52:11 gabrbedd: i think you lost the train Mar 02 17:52:17 chinmaya is the one asking the question Mar 02 17:52:32 bunk: Meanwhile, I haven't been tracking the issue closely... so I took the safe route and called it "device" Mar 02 17:53:08 timeless_office: ah. I see. Mar 02 17:53:18 sorry. Mar 02 17:53:29 appologies to bunk, not me :) Mar 02 17:53:46 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=957776 Mar 02 17:53:51 bunk: nevermind... sorry! Mar 02 17:54:05 since i had read it couple of days back .. just wanted to check Mar 02 17:54:10 timeless_office: did you get your rpmlint thing worked out. Mar 02 17:54:14 ? Mar 02 17:54:17 yeah Mar 02 17:54:17 gabrbedd: I doubt we'll find confirmed information from N's management somewhere hidden in some forum thread. Mar 02 17:54:23 gabrbedd: No problem. Mar 02 17:54:25 it turns out that it was working on my computer Mar 02 17:54:36 not sure how my computer differed from the one i originally tested w/ Mar 02 17:55:57 gabgrbedd: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1119050 is my full set fwiw Mar 02 17:56:08 bunk: Well, they lost my attention when they said it would actually be a maemo device. Mar 02 17:56:22 timeless_office: cool... glad it's working! Mar 02 17:59:39 gabrbedd: I already saw that - N's CTO is shorthly talking about a MeeGo *device* (before starting a long "We told you you should switch to Qt and now we are screwing you - but please continue writing applications for our obsolete Symbian as long as our new incompatible platform is not available.") Mar 02 18:03:26 (if I was CEO of N, the device would be a pocket calculator - that would be a win-win situation, since it would not contribute much to competing platforms, and the demotivational effect would reduce the amount of people that have to be expensively fired...) Mar 02 18:07:02 valhalla says he's joining Intel in April Mar 02 18:07:28 berndhs: source? Mar 02 18:07:43 valhalla101 on twitter Mar 02 18:08:13 ah, no surprises Mar 02 18:08:35 it is consistent Mar 02 18:08:41 isn't he the nokia rep for meego? Mar 02 18:08:43 * dm8tbr tries to act surprised and fails Mar 02 18:09:11 CosmoHill: resigned nokia some time ago Mar 02 18:09:18 few days ago I think Mar 02 18:09:34 thursday Mar 02 18:09:37 week ago Mar 02 18:10:01 when he resigned or announced he was joining intel Mar 02 18:10:11 CosmoHill: resigned Mar 02 18:10:36 will he have to move house / country? Mar 02 18:10:43 dunno? Mar 02 18:12:41 doubtful, unless he really wants to Mar 02 18:14:19 hey Alison_Chaiken Mar 02 18:14:43 Hey CosmoHill. Mar 02 18:16:03 interesting: this AMD looks to be processor compatible with MeeGo: http://www.kustompcs.co.uk/acatalog/info_5528.html Mar 02 18:16:32 do we have any AMD employees in the channel? Mar 02 18:19:43 CosmoHill: that's old news Mar 02 18:19:58 I only find out when it comes into stock Mar 02 18:22:41 looks like it would make a nice little media PC or home server Mar 02 18:26:31 ali1234: http://mxr.meego.com/repo.meego.com/source/rpmlint.txt is my final output for rpmlint Mar 02 18:32:16 damn that's a big file timeless_office Mar 02 18:32:25 not really Mar 02 18:32:33 my firefox didn't like it Mar 02 18:32:37 really? Mar 02 18:33:01 I have the spinning beach ball of doom Mar 02 18:33:06 consider that it's the output of running rpmlint against ~1400 packages Mar 02 18:33:23 loaded for me nearly instantly (just now) Mar 02 18:33:32 what version of firefox? Mar 02 18:33:50 latest Mar 02 18:33:55 3.6.14 Mar 02 18:34:02 loaded now Mar 02 18:34:42 6525 lines of text there Mar 02 18:37:33 try 4.0b12 Mar 02 18:38:10 cosmohill: that file is incredibly tame when you consider what other files look like in that tree Mar 02 18:46:26 4 has hardware acceleration for graphics / flash, right? Mar 02 18:48:25 kinda Mar 02 18:48:47 technically it does, but practically, if you have to ask, you probably won't get Mar 02 18:49:06 4 will only accelerate stuff if it thinks your graphics driver won't crash Mar 02 18:49:19 and it thinks most drivers *will* crash (because we have evidence to show that they do) Mar 02 18:49:21 I think my graphics card is too old anyway for it, it's a ATi 9700 Mobillity Mar 02 18:49:38 whaow quite a relic :) Mar 02 18:49:40 we don't require graphics acceleration Mar 02 18:49:45 so you can still use 4 Mar 02 18:50:17 but if you happen to buy an nVidia card and insert it later, you can get some acceleration then :) Mar 02 18:50:44 sunspinder should improve JS performance, but then again so would coding the damn website properly Mar 02 18:50:51 note to self: Mar 02 18:50:52 https://build.meego.com/package/source_history?package=OpenEXR&project=Trunk%3ANetbook Mar 02 18:50:57 https://build.opensuse.org/package/source_history?package=openexr&project=openSUSE%3A11.4 Mar 02 18:51:21 = file bug for build.m.c Mar 02 18:52:25 firefox doesn't crash with nvidia but the performance is much worse than any other driver Mar 02 18:52:46 including "VGA" Mar 02 18:53:50 eg: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox-3.0/+bug/223238 Mar 02 18:54:00 (btw, that page itself triggers the bug) Mar 02 18:54:17 it takes about 20 seconds to load up on my system Mar 02 18:54:51 ali: can you help me figure out where to file bugs about the spec file for that one? Mar 02 18:55:00 which one? Mar 02 18:55:32 http://mxr.meego.com/repo.meego.com/source/rpmlint.txt?mark=1-3#1 Mar 02 18:56:10 file them on bugs.meego.com? Mar 02 19:38:11 oh look what was snuck into the meego kernel config: Mar 02 19:38:14 -# CONFIG_EXT4_FS is not set Mar 02 19:38:14 +CONFIG_EXT4_FS=m Mar 02 19:38:28 that should make some folks happy :) Mar 02 19:38:54 :) Mar 02 19:39:33 finally ;) Mar 02 19:40:09 auke for president! Mar 02 19:41:35 auke, for mere mortals, does that mean that we can stop whining about btrfs and get back to rpm vs deb? Mar 02 19:41:58 lcuk: hahahaha Mar 02 19:42:05 without anything to bitch about, mere mortals would become extinct in the boredom Mar 02 19:42:21 note however, ext4 is a MODULE Mar 02 19:42:22 auke: hahahahaha! Mar 02 19:42:27 so you still cannot install on ext4 Mar 02 19:42:42 lcuk: There's still plenty of time to bitch about NTFS. Mar 02 19:42:48 that's right, there are actually no problems in the world Mar 02 19:43:00 auke, what does it mean though? Mar 02 19:43:09 just that ext4 is available? Mar 02 19:43:10 auke: just for /boot, right? Mar 02 19:43:41 * lcuk only notices filesystems when they corrupt (and hence have to find fix tools) or because they are slow Mar 02 19:44:12 for all I cared, there could be little men inside painting grains of rice to store the data on Mar 02 19:44:30 lcuk: that's how it works, yes Mar 02 19:44:33 :D Mar 02 19:45:11 lcuk: Eh, the tweakers have me futzing around with *buntus and *ndows on the same drives as MeeGo. So this makes my life a little easier. :-) Mar 02 19:45:35 gabrbedd, right, so ext4 is a normal Windows partition type? Mar 02 19:46:01 lcuk: Normal Ubuntu partition type. Mar 02 19:46:35 :D and now a little more sense at the enjoyment from the change Mar 02 19:47:49 lcuk: btw... I loved the screen shot on twitter. :-) Mar 02 19:48:20 gabrbedd, the real thing is bettre, tis a shame it is so simple and cutdown vs Qt/MeeGo though Mar 02 19:48:41 s/bettre/better/ Mar 02 19:48:42 lcuk meant: gabrbedd, the real thing is better, tis a shame it is so simple and cutdown vs Qt/MeeGo though Mar 02 19:49:48 lcuk: huh? I didn't follow the "cutdown" part. Mar 02 19:49:59 gabrbedd, that is not qt Mar 02 19:51:11 lcuk: GTK+ ? Still cool. :-) Mar 02 19:51:21 gabrbedd, that is not GTK+ Mar 02 19:51:41 Qt has a GTK+ style setting if you want :) Mar 02 19:51:54 lcuk: GIMP? :-p Mar 02 19:52:02 gabrbedd, that is not GIMP :P Mar 02 19:52:17 lcuk: look source code Mar 02 19:52:20 gimp was what gave way to GTK though wasn't it? Mar 02 19:53:15 hey bergie - happy birthday \o/ Mar 02 19:53:18 (yesterday) Mar 02 19:53:32 lcuk: Yes, GTK means "GIMP Tool Kit", but I was implying that it was just a manufactured image. Mar 02 19:54:49 gabrbedd, oh, far from it - the screenshot is just liqbase with a new background picture and handwritten fonts Mar 02 19:55:09 heres a really short video on my n900 from october 2009 Mar 02 19:55:11 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hGUKICDeok Mar 02 19:55:45 lcuk: Ah. I saw your posts on liqbase and wanted to check it out... Mar 02 19:57:23 yeah, often heard, I cannot organise/polish/package anything properly tho Mar 02 19:59:37 but anyway, it has had little done to it since I made those videos, been trying to handle other real things Mar 02 20:03:31 * gabrbedd is geeking out over liqbase... Mar 02 20:04:08 gabrbedd, it was not designed for geeks :P just regular people like me and my son :) Mar 02 20:04:41 i showed it my mum, and her and jacob were playing tictactoe :) Mar 02 20:05:38 lcuk: Whatever, I think's really cool. :-) Mar 02 20:05:45 I do too :) Mar 02 20:06:08 gabrbedd, I am just pleased I finally got my handwriting neat :) Mar 02 20:06:09 did you do it all in OpenGL or something? Mar 02 20:06:10 http://liqbase.net/liq.20110208_002.liqbook.on.meego.ideapad.jpg Mar 02 20:06:23 gabrbedd, I did it all on my N810, there is no opengl at all Mar 02 20:06:29 and it still runs happily on there actually Mar 02 20:06:50 people bugged me loads to push an update out :) Mar 02 20:09:36 gabrbedd, I am the n00b in all this though, prior to maemo I spent 10 years as a visual basic developer (hence my simple thinking) Mar 02 20:13:51 lcuk: is it open source? Mar 02 20:15:18 * gabrbedd can't find a link to the sources... Mar 02 20:16:45 gabrbedd, yes Mar 02 20:16:49 github/com/lcuk Mar 02 20:16:55 github.com/lcuk Mar 02 20:17:54 gabrbedd, probably the most clear info page: http://liqbase.net/liqbase.info.txt Mar 02 20:22:38 lcuk: ok... got it, thanks! Mar 02 20:29:34 lcuk: ok, I see... you're pretty much doing Xlib stuff. Mar 02 20:31:11 gabrbedd, yes Mar 02 20:31:25 gtk was too slow Mar 02 20:31:39 (on the n810) Mar 02 20:31:48 xlib direct was as well Mar 02 20:32:04 and the only tearfree option was to draw onto the xvideo surface Mar 02 20:32:09 (because videos play tearfree..) Mar 02 20:32:26 but that left me with 0 rendering or support features Mar 02 20:32:31 so I had to write them myself Mar 02 20:34:55 lcuk: nice overview: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUPp_mE7rwI Mar 02 20:34:56 Title of Tumi_'s link: YouTube - lcuk liqbase overview Mar 02 20:36:34 lcuk: nice! So how is wayland going to affect you? Mar 02 20:36:53 haha Tumi_ :) Mar 02 20:36:58 that was my first ever video Mar 02 20:37:14 back then, everything was monolithic and built in - I did not know how to make a linux library Mar 02 20:37:18 * lcuk still uses that build Mar 02 20:37:46 gabrbedd, wayland appears to be based on simplifications I have called for for years Mar 02 20:37:52 but still gives me the idea what you're after =) Mar 02 20:37:57 Tumi_, :) Mar 02 20:38:11 I just released the merging of those 2 things a few weeks ago Mar 02 20:38:28 the same book reader UI Mar 02 20:38:34 but now using my own handwriting Mar 02 20:38:35 http://liqbase.net/liq.20110208_002.liqbook.on.meego.ideapad.jpg Mar 02 20:41:20 lcuk: Well, I think Xlib support for wayland is questionable... not sure about Xv. Mar 02 20:41:32 lcuk: I know wayland is about direct rendering... Mar 02 20:41:41 lcuk: but I don't know much about Xv. :-) Mar 02 20:41:45 gabrbedd, no, wayland is not going to support xapps etc Mar 02 20:41:51 xv is shared memory bitmap Mar 02 20:41:59 ie direct rendering Mar 02 20:42:48 and gabrbedd - if wayland does *not* support VX (and the YUV video mode in particular) rendering videos will be needlessly wasteful Mar 02 20:42:54 cpu/battery wise Mar 02 20:42:57 XZ Mar 02 20:43:00 XV ffs Mar 02 20:43:33 gabrbedd, because whilst you can get shader programs in gles to do yuv->rgb conversion, it is a heavy process Mar 02 20:44:12 You can do Xv without shm too ;p Mar 02 20:45:04 or they could make a new api that does the same thing, but isn't rubbish Mar 02 20:47:04 * TSCHAKeee is concerned how much work it will be to move LinuxMCE to use Wayland, as we use a whole composite of X apps Mar 02 21:35:39 o_O http://www.itworld.com/hardware/138767/cebit-asus-motherboard-box-doubles-pc-case-video Mar 02 21:38:38 hum Mar 02 21:39:19 qt on tegra 2, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJwXZySRMyg Mar 02 21:39:38 any major compatibility differences between 1.1 netbook and the 1.2 tablet prealpha ux? 1.1 boots fine on my tablet, 1.2 initially looks to boot, and displays what looks like the top left corner of the ui for a fraction of a second then just sits at some blue screen with a triangle on the right side forever Mar 02 21:40:58 nid0, tried touching the triangle or sweeping over it? Mar 02 21:41:31 tried going over the whole screen, nothing does anything - the triangle looks to just be part of whatever background image it's showing rather than something interactable Mar 02 21:42:17 nid0, I had the same triangle on the joggler. Black screen until I touched. Mar 02 21:43:05 nidO, try dropping to terminal (ctrl+alt+fsomething) and opening ui desktop applications Mar 02 21:43:16 see what happens, perhaps the compositor screwed itself up Mar 02 21:43:58 Something similar to how you describe happened on my netbook build and instead of top bar I got just randomness until I opened something that needed an extra window Mar 02 21:43:59 i'll give it a shot Mar 02 22:04:07 well, can drop to terminal fine, most ui stuff is just spitting out failures to connect to x, even though it is running Mar 02 22:04:36 I can launch the live installer though and that comes up fine, but will then still only drop back to terminal Mar 02 22:05:01 killing uxlaunch just restarts it and brings back up the same static image i've been seeing Mar 02 22:07:24 nidO: Yeah, if uxlaunch fails... it `init` just keeps trying to restart it. At times it's a cool feature... but when things are failing it's really annoying. Mar 02 22:08:53 ~seen sivang Mar 02 22:09:08 sivang <~sivan@unaffiliated/sivang> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 5d 2h 5m 58s ago, saying: '*MSWindows'. Mar 02 22:09:47 nidO: what hardware are you using? Mar 02 22:10:23 nidO, Mar 02 22:10:28 export DISPLAY=:0 Mar 02 22:11:00 this might not work at all though, it is just idea to try :$ Mar 02 22:11:15 * lcuk is person who will try rather than sit on hands Mar 02 22:11:24 gabrbedd: its a novatech ntablet - basically a rebadged tega v2, its an nm10 graphics controller on an atom n455 Mar 02 22:13:05 lcuk: nada Mar 02 22:13:35 the thing that gets me is just before giving me this blank splash screen its showing the top left corner of the proper home screen for a fraction of a second with the "my tablet" splash info Mar 02 22:18:18 nidO: can you examine /tmp/Xorg.log (or /tmp/Xorg.0.log or something) ?? It looks like X11 isn't starting... and that log will probably tell you why. Mar 02 22:21:19