**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Mar 22 02:59:57 2011 Mar 22 03:09:34 vgrade: does the kernel adaptation joggler work with the latest builds (everything seems to have shifted up to 2.6.37) Mar 22 03:18:43 you know, it'd be cool as hell Mar 22 03:18:50 if we knew what the hell everybody was working on in OBS Mar 22 03:34:54 I'm unable to create an account at bugs.meego.com Mar 22 03:36:00 I get a message that says "ACCESS DENIED \n You are not authorized to access this page." Mar 22 03:36:54 rdesfo: file a bug Mar 22 03:37:02 rdesfo: just kidding.... Mar 22 03:37:22 gabrbedd: thats funny Mar 22 03:37:54 rdesfo: seriously... I guess post something to the meego-packaging ML about it. Mar 22 03:38:23 rdesfo: FWIW, I get the same thing if I try to create a new acct. Mar 22 03:42:05 is there a way to add more web accounts right now all I see is last.fm and tweeter Mar 22 03:45:47 rdesfo: on handset? Hrm... I can't even make *those* work without a USB keyboard. Mar 22 03:46:18 meego netbook Mar 22 03:46:46 idk. Mar 22 03:47:23 idk? is that like sdk? does it still need to be developed? Mar 22 03:48:40 idk == i don't know. Mar 22 03:48:41 sorry. Mar 22 03:49:50 oh ok... np Mar 22 03:53:47 morning Mar 22 03:59:06 good morning! Mar 22 04:10:39 hi quick question im in usa i want to buy some kinda tablet but the wetab isnt in usa? any ideas Mar 22 04:21:51 AFAIK you can order it from amazon.de Mar 22 04:23:13 in the us? Mar 22 04:26:04 453.9 euros = 645.3096 US dollars lol forget that Mar 22 04:28:42 pauly: what are you wanting the tablet for? Mar 22 04:31:33 pauly: Lots of guys have been using the Lenovo S10-3t which is a convertable netbook/tablet. Only caveat is the unsupported broadcom wifi card on many of them. Mar 22 04:32:03 pauly: The internal intel guys have been using the ExoPC lately, or so I've heard from the likes of DawnFoster Mar 22 04:33:00 pauly: And there's the ii-View M1Touch, which I've been developing on. The only caveat there is the touchscreen driver (which has been submitted to the devs for the 1.2 release) Mar 22 04:34:15 pauly: Those are all x86 options, btw. If you're looking for an ARM-based tablet... I won't be much help on that one. :-) Mar 22 04:58:47 btw, how long meego releases are supported? 1 year after the original release? Mar 22 04:58:59 something like that Mar 22 04:59:32 or is that extended with every update release for another x months, ie., 1.0.1, 1.0.2 etc.? Mar 22 05:00:06 doubt it is extended Mar 22 05:00:10 Just wondering as the 1.0 will meet the 1 year marker in couple of months. Mar 22 05:02:12 and is there a process for community/vendors if they want to provide updates for these old releases? or does this mean that they need to setup their own obs to do that? Mar 22 05:02:20 * TSCHAKeee was able to do a feasibility test with our OpenGL UI (V2) in MeeGo on the Joggler.. the key here is that the display is a combination of OpenGL and window compositing providing the entire display. To date, the only other driver besides Intel EMGD to do this CORRECTLY is the NVIDIA Binary driver. ;) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoNdwD9mMHk Mar 22 05:03:34 Sage: i suppose there is nothing stopping anyone from providing updates Mar 22 05:10:05 who actually decides when a MeeGo release is not supported anymore? Mar 22 05:12:27 TSG maybe? Mar 22 05:15:24 could be Mar 22 05:15:47 The devices where MeeGo is used are usually used more than 1 year and when the device is released it is most probably using a bit old release already. I just wonder how many of the vendors will actually update to newer meego release during the device life cycle. Mar 22 05:18:00 when it runs out of resourcing prolly Mar 22 05:18:21 yep. unless the upgrading is made easy vendors most likely aren't too keen on doing it Mar 22 05:22:44 from an end user point of view I would for example expect netbooks to be easy to upgrade but currently it's far from that. If there would be such a mechanism for netbooks I can't see why it wouldn't work for handsets as well Mar 22 05:23:37 and there really should be some easy way to upgrade MeeGo Mar 22 05:24:03 is 1.1 upgradable to 1.2 btw? I recall seeing bug about that at some point. Mar 22 05:24:27 think the sad thing is that noone automatically tests Mar 22 05:24:47 bug 9205 Mar 22 05:24:50 <_MeeeGoBot_> Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=9205 enh, High, 1.1.0, anas.nashif, NEW, Cannot Update from 1.0 to 1.1 Mar 22 05:28:26 * timoph voted Mar 22 05:33:31 hmmh. automating upgrade test shouldn't be that hard. basically automatically install release n, tell it to upgrade to version n+1, check that the system works by running all the tests. Requires work and would be a long test but IMO doable Mar 22 05:34:11 a quick question: how to submit my modified sorce code ? or how to check if I am authorized to do that ? Mar 22 05:34:34 to where? obs? Mar 22 05:35:20 wuyongb: contribution guidelines = http://meego.com/about/contribution-guidelines Mar 22 05:36:50 Stskeeps: wuyongb is one of the guys executing tests on n900 Mar 22 05:39:04 ah Mar 22 05:39:19 still, or request a obs account Mar 22 05:40:33 stskeeps : yes , I explained what I am going to do , to request a obs account , yesterday Mar 22 05:54:04 stskeeps : how to request account ? Mar 22 05:56:08 wuyongb: thought i gave the url yesterday :) Mar 22 05:56:24 wuyongb: while waiting for the account me or Kaadlajk could update your test package in obs so the test can be run Mar 22 05:58:04 can Qt Quick stuff run under Android via the Qt port? Mar 22 05:58:27 stskeeps : yes, I have followed the instructions there, now already checked out packages and checked in locally. so how can i submit my changes ? Mar 22 05:58:43 wuyongb: osc submitreq Mar 22 05:58:52 TSCHAKeee: think i saw demos Mar 22 06:00:12 wuyongb: osc ci Mar 22 06:00:38 ah. nevermind you already did that :) Mar 22 06:01:16 btwm the check-in is not a local operation. it pushes your changes into obs Mar 22 06:01:16 timoph : thanks Mar 22 06:01:50 timoph and stskeeps : thanks. and my request id is 15080 Mar 22 06:02:11 stskeeps : how can I check the status of my request ? Mar 22 06:03:39 wuyongb: if you have email address sert you will get mail Mar 22 06:04:02 when the request is accepted or declined Mar 22 06:05:11 sage : if my request is a high priority one, how can I make to be checked soon to get accepted ? Mar 22 06:07:22 well i guess you could sent mail to meego-packaging or to person that handles request for your target project Mar 22 06:07:37 wuyongb: ping Kaadlajk. he takes care of those packages Mar 22 06:07:53 thanks. I will Mar 22 06:12:46 wuyongb: btw, you didn't update the changelog, etc. only the tar ball Mar 22 06:15:54 timoph : no, only the tar ball. is that right ? Mar 22 06:19:59 wuyongb: no it's not. see http://wiki.meego.com/Packaging/Guidelines#Changelogs (and I'd guess you should change the version number as well) Mar 22 06:27:50 wuyongb: you should not change the content of the tar ball witout changing the name/version. and if you are not the upstream maintainer you should not change the version. Mar 22 06:28:47 so the best way would be that you would add a patch to the ppackage that does your changes to the current tarball Mar 22 06:29:33 so the upstream maintainer could take the patch to the upstream and next official version Mar 22 06:35:46 sage and timoph : so how can I cancel my request ? Mar 22 06:39:04 wuyongb: IIRC it's osc request revoke [id] Mar 22 06:40:27 timoph : now I need you help to update test package as you saied. Mar 22 06:41:11 timoph : your email ? Mar 22 06:41:25 wuyongb: please talk with Kaadlajk with that since I'm out of office today Mar 22 06:41:44 timoph : ok .thanks Mar 22 07:32:53 morning Mar 22 08:58:19 * timeless_w7ip sighs Mar 22 08:58:21 lcuk: ping Mar 22 08:59:13 http://mxr.meego.com/meego.gitorious.org/source/meego-contacts-sync/README?force=1&mark=2-2 Mar 22 08:59:31 ok, halp Mar 22 09:00:06 http://mxr.meego.com/meego.gitorious.org/source/meego-contacts-sync/README?force=1&mark=2-2 Mar 22 09:00:25 argh, I hate putty Mar 22 09:00:47 heh Mar 22 09:00:58 cute Mar 22 09:01:07 Qt creator is also creative about spelling contacts Mar 22 09:01:10 http://mxr.meego.com/meego.gitorious.org/search?string=contacs Mar 22 09:01:42 not really, need to install some other sw, not used to use irc on the win laptop Mar 22 09:02:55 iekku: mirc is the standard, i'm using Comic Chat 2.5 Mar 22 09:03:06 sane people would probably grab chatzilla-xulrunner Mar 22 09:03:50 i usually use terminal Mar 22 09:05:12 http://mxr.meego.com/repo.meego.com/search?string=contacs&find=&findi=&filter=^[^\0]*%24&hitlimit=&tree=repo.meego.com Mar 22 09:05:15 * timeless_w7ip cries Mar 22 09:05:23 note to self: slap the idiots who write ontologies Mar 22 09:05:58 now i'm running putty tray, better Mar 22 09:16:04 iekku: so, how's the bug triage going? (and where is it going?) Mar 22 09:17:11 timeless_w7ip, curently no tirages ongoing Mar 22 09:17:24 timeless_w7ip, triages even Mar 22 09:35:48 oh, heh Mar 22 09:36:01 there's a maemo.gitorious.org in addition to a meego.gitorious.org Mar 22 09:36:04 how confusing Mar 22 09:36:17 * timeless_w7ip wonders if there's anything meego related in it Mar 22 09:39:41 * timeless_w7ip sighs Mar 22 09:40:45 X-Fade: do you have time to take a look on a the broken arm build issue (https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14693)? Mar 22 09:40:47 <_MeeeGoBot_> Bug 14693 nor, Undecided, ---, maemo, NEW, speedrpm fails to build chroot properly in chroot OBS builds outside build.meego.com Mar 22 09:41:04 mdfe_: Yes, we're checking it out. Mar 22 09:41:13 :) Mar 22 09:41:14 timeless_w7ip: yes, there si Mar 22 09:41:20 timeless_w7ip: s/si/is/ Mar 22 09:43:02 any idea why http://apidocs.meego.com/ gives me 403 (forbidden) ? Mar 22 09:44:03 matrixx: sounds friendly :) Mar 22 09:44:06 wondering just is it only me or for everyone :] Mar 22 09:44:28 http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:i0zEKdfiRXYJ:apidocs.meego.com/+http://apidocs.meego.com/&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&client=firefox-a&source=www.google.com Mar 22 09:44:31 it's not just you Mar 22 09:44:45 matrixx: what do you need from it? Mar 22 09:45:01 matrixx: will check it out. Mar 22 09:45:02 timeless_w7ip: just checking on MNotification class of libmeegotouch Mar 22 09:45:31 X-Fade: great Mar 22 09:45:51 matrixx: you can try http://mxr.meego.com/meego.gitorious.org/ident?i=MNotification Mar 22 09:46:28 http://mxr.meego.com/meego.gitorious.org/source/libmeegotouch/src/corelib/notification/mnotification.h#32 Mar 22 09:46:34 is the documentation source.. Mar 22 09:46:36 timeless_w7ip: never mind, I have the source code, was just too lazy to check from there Mar 22 09:46:57 matrixx: aww Mar 22 09:47:14 it's hypertext... hypertext is your friend Mar 22 09:47:32 yeah, I like hypertext, thanks :) Mar 22 09:47:44 * timeless_w7ip is trying to get people to use mxr Mar 22 09:47:48 be an early adopter! Mar 22 09:48:06 I will! Mar 22 09:49:06 matrixx: fixed Mar 22 09:49:53 X-Fade: thanks Mar 22 09:50:12 works perfectly now :) Mar 22 09:50:31 timeless_w7ip: mxr seems also very nice :) Mar 22 09:50:33 * timeless_w7ip disagrees w/ perfectly Mar 22 09:50:37 http://apidocs.meego.com/1.0/mtf/introduction.html Mar 22 09:50:38 hehe Mar 22 09:50:48 where's http://apidocs.meego.com/1.0/mtf/duiplatform.png ? Mar 22 09:51:09 oops Mar 22 09:53:38 matrixx: anyway, if you have any problems/questions/concerns about mxr, please let me know :) Mar 22 09:53:47 ideally it should be able to answer many questions for you Mar 22 09:55:00 ooh Mar 22 09:55:13 * timeless_w7ip wonders if the doxygen paths on apidocs are reliable Mar 22 09:57:03 timeless_w7ip: thanks, I will Mar 22 10:05:50 wow Mar 22 10:05:52 * timeless_w7ip ponders Mar 22 10:06:40 it's taking about an hour to do an identifier index for meego, and closer to 80mins to do a freetext index for the same (if i have my numbers right) Mar 22 10:25:48 for those who had asked to see a video of the Qt+QML clone of xbmc: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmmyTEY6o0Y Mar 22 10:26:27 thiago: hey, so, do you guys have people who pay attn to bugs.meego.com? :) Mar 22 10:26:33 * timeless_w7ip wants to use it to file bugs about Qt Creator Mar 22 10:26:35 not from Qt, no Mar 22 10:26:41 :( Mar 22 10:26:51 we have our own bugtracker for that Mar 22 10:26:59 we don't pay attention to distro's bugtrackers Mar 22 10:27:10 * timeless_w7ip nods Mar 22 10:27:27 do you reasonably expect the maintainers to send you their bugs/patches? Mar 22 10:27:34 yes Mar 22 10:27:38 ok :) Mar 22 10:27:43 not submitted = doesn't exist from our point of view Mar 22 10:27:52 * thiago walked over the list of patches on top of Qt once with the Kubuntu maintainers Mar 22 10:27:55 scary stuff Mar 22 10:28:09 heh Mar 22 10:28:14 timeless_w7ip: if you want creator bugs to be fixed, file them at bugreport.qt.nokia.com Mar 22 10:28:22 that said, most of the patches that MeeGo applies on top of Qt come from us anyway Mar 22 10:28:28 https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14795 Mar 22 10:28:30 <_MeeeGoBot_> Bug 14795 nor, Undecided, ---, maurice.kalinowski, NEW, contacts is misspelled in qt-creator addressbook-sdk.qdoc Mar 22 10:28:31 it's fixes backported from the next release Mar 22 10:29:04 andre: i don't want bugs fixed, i want people to get into the habit of talking to upstream :) Mar 22 10:29:15 maurice is upstream Mar 22 10:29:24 if we get in the habit of doing it now, maybe thiago won't run into the problem he ran into w/ kubuntu Mar 22 10:29:25 timeless_w7ip: I am upstream. Mar 22 10:30:01 * thiago tried to upgrade to gcc 4.5 yesterday for ARM and got a bunch of errors from qatomic_armv6.h Mar 22 10:30:10 googling for the error shows gcc developers discussing it Mar 22 10:30:19 * timeless_w7ip is on the shore tossing breadcrumbs in to see where they go Mar 22 10:30:33 thiago: ain't gcc fun? Mar 22 10:30:38 are you looking forward to llvm? :) Mar 22 10:30:43 yes Mar 22 10:30:59 but right now, I can't compile QtGui with -Werror Mar 22 10:31:16 the fact that GCC doesn't test against major projects is rather unfortunate Mar 22 10:31:26 "we have a test suite, it doesn't cover the real world, we don't care" Mar 22 10:31:41 "web browsers, operating systems, compilers, toolkits, -- not important" Mar 22 10:31:47 jeremiah: ping Mar 22 10:32:57 * timeless_w7ip wonders where qt-creator hides its .ts files Mar 22 10:33:20 timeless_w7ip: assigning spelling mistakes to maurice personally does not look like a sensible thing to do. in practice, for one line changes like that, speak up on #qt-creator or such and it will be fixed immediately. creating a bugreport for that is a complete waste of resources. Mar 22 10:33:29 http://mxr.meego.com/qt.gitorious.org/source/qt-creator/share/qtcreator/translations/qtcreator_es.ts Mar 22 10:33:57 * timeless_w7ip joins Mar 22 10:45:45 lbt: pont Mar 22 10:46:15 or pong even Mar 22 10:46:37 heh .... at some point I want to get a vendor ecosystem going Mar 22 10:46:56 to drive MeeGo to be more oriented towards their real customers Mar 22 10:47:01 lbt: This is really crucial Mar 22 10:47:01 interested? Mar 22 10:47:08 Yes, I am most interested. Mar 22 10:47:27 OK. Mar 22 10:47:31 lbt: Not least because in GENIVI there is going to be a reliance (hopefully) on this type of solution Mar 22 10:47:51 BTW seen http://mer-l-in.blogspot.com/2011/02/what-now-for-meego.html Mar 22 10:47:53 That means that a number of large companies will want an open OBS that is a clone of the "original" OBS Mar 22 10:48:06 * jeremiah reads lbt's link Mar 22 10:48:11 jeremiah: yep ...and that's what I'm bitching about here Mar 22 10:49:00 lbt: Yeah. Obvisously Novell is going to want to go after that business Mar 22 10:49:11 But LF has promised that the OBS will remain open Mar 22 10:49:20 So we have to make sure they keep that promise Mar 22 10:49:34 And that means good documentation, a team to report issues to, etc. Mar 22 10:49:47 I'm not worried about open at the license level - that'll happen Mar 22 10:49:56 I'm worried about operational open-ness Mar 22 10:50:09 Yeah, exactlhy. Mar 22 10:50:29 part of it is the ad hoc style we're in currently, but part of it is institutional inertia Mar 22 10:51:40 Right now there are a lot of "operational open-ness" issues. Like who builds the package patterns, who decides core, compliance, TSG make up, etc. Mar 22 10:51:46 Who can create / from whom should I ask access to build.meego.com? I am pan1nx on meego.com... Thanks! Mar 22 10:52:15 pan1nx: Did you file a bug in the MeeGo bug tracking system? Mar 22 10:52:19 That is the first step Mar 22 10:52:51 Is there a faster way? Thanks jeremiah... Mar 22 10:53:19 pan1nx: Not at this point I am sorry to say. Mar 22 10:53:46 pan1nx: You may want to follow up with an email to one of the lists, perhaps meego-dev if I'm not mistaken. Mar 22 10:53:55 pan1nx: do you have commit rights to a core package? Mar 22 10:54:24 if you just want to build OSS apps etc you want the community OBS Mar 22 10:54:36 see http://wiki.meego.com/OBS Mar 22 10:54:38 Yeah, that is what I'd suggest too Mar 22 10:55:55 I got the answer! Thank you guys... Mar 22 10:56:14 http://wiki.meego.com/Core_OBS Mar 22 10:56:49 Ok. Thanks. Mar 22 10:57:09 (that URL was for general consumption.) Mar 22 10:59:39 is this right place: https://build.pub.meego.com/user/register_user Mar 22 10:59:52 for the record... Mar 22 11:00:36 pan1nx: That is for the community OBS Mar 22 11:00:42 pan1nx: Not for the "core" OBS Mar 22 11:01:35 Thanks jeremiah, I go for OSS for now :) Mar 22 11:01:51 pan1nx: w00t! Mar 22 11:02:25 pan1nx: yep... that's right Mar 22 11:03:06 lbt, I emailed you already... Mar 22 11:03:29 not arrived yet... Mar 22 11:04:02 greylisting can delay it an hour... account? Mar 22 11:05:50 pan1nx Mar 22 11:06:53 done Mar 22 11:07:19 thanks Mar 22 11:08:13 works... lbt, thanks Mar 22 11:08:17 np Mar 22 11:49:19 * timeless_w7ip realizes that andre != andre__ Mar 22 11:49:40 heh Mar 22 11:49:48 i know you probably tried to warn me Mar 22 11:49:51 but it didn't work! Mar 22 11:51:41 lbt: ping Mar 22 11:57:04 akiniemi: pong Mar 22 11:57:55 lbt: I need access to community OBS, my username is akiniemi Mar 22 11:58:14 I'm working on the N900 DE Mar 22 11:58:23 akiniemi: sure .. Mar 22 11:58:35 * lbt stabs Stskeeps for the big list... Mar 22 11:59:22 actually akiniemi ... you can probably help Stskeeps out here... it would save us time to just get a list of meego.com usernames for the DE people Mar 22 11:59:54 maybe you can find a way to help him make the list? Mar 22 12:01:46 if people would be patient and wait for my talk ;) Mar 22 12:07:22 lbt: makes sense, though I don't have such a list myself Mar 22 12:08:05 Stskeeps: heh ... Mar 22 12:17:36 cool, Qt Creator is so stable, even a monkey can crash it! Mar 22 12:17:56 * timeless_w7ip suspects a cat could crash it too Mar 22 12:22:45 timeless_w7ip, how did it break? Mar 22 12:23:27 well, it crashed Mar 22 12:23:32 i didn't ask the debugger how it crashed Mar 22 12:23:42 Nokia-Qt is stupid and doesn't offer pdb's Mar 22 12:24:13 and they hide the option to build pdb's in a deep dark corner of a closet in an unused guest bedroom Mar 22 12:24:18 meh unstable IDE is part of life Mar 22 12:24:32 I have heard developers up and down the ages curse as the IDE crashes Mar 22 12:24:40 Hi, one short question: I want to try meego on my n900 on microSD, do I need to back up anything from my phone? Many thanks :) Mar 22 12:24:56 lcuk: usually you have to at least open a project to crash an ide Mar 22 12:25:03 i didn't get that far Mar 22 12:25:29 almorelle, backing up is something you should do anyway :) but no, the normal instructions for n900 installation are non destructive and once you reboot out of meego your main phone and eMMC contents are lal the same Mar 22 12:25:36 hahahaha timeless_w7ip Mar 22 12:26:18 lcuk, sure ;) Thank you very much ! Mar 22 12:27:31 victory! Mar 22 12:27:34 psr wins! Mar 22 12:27:57 lcuk: do you have opera handy? Mar 22 12:28:37 no, but there is a ballet performance on in the kitchen. Mar 22 12:28:56 souds good, broadcast w/ your n900? k thx Mar 22 12:29:00 s/d/nd/ Mar 22 12:29:00 :D Mar 22 12:29:01 timeless_w7ip meant: sounds good, broadcast w/ your n900? k thx Mar 22 12:29:11 have a nice day :) Mar 22 12:29:20 no, it is on lukes phone Mar 22 12:29:28 timeless_w7ip, why do you ask? Mar 22 12:29:33 others might have it Mar 22 12:30:20 the easiest way to watch this is w/ opera or msie Mar 22 12:30:31 don't have either Mar 22 12:30:38 you were more likely to have opera Mar 22 12:30:42 * lcuk uses firefox Mar 22 12:30:56 * timeless_w7ip nods Mar 22 12:31:01 i don't *use* opera Mar 22 12:31:12 but it seems that i do have it Mar 22 12:31:16 * timeless_w7ip wonders if it's out of date Mar 22 12:31:42 timeless_w7ip, the other lesser browsers do not have flashblock :) Mar 22 12:31:59 * lcuk smiles everytime that nobble is visible because I helped fix it :) Mar 22 12:46:11 heh Mar 22 13:21:46 timoph, USB networking with n900 and ideapad Mar 22 13:21:53 do you know if it works well? Mar 22 13:22:03 hmmh Mar 22 13:22:14 haven Mar 22 13:22:24 't tested that lately Mar 22 13:23:52 timoph, only thinking of travelling and the ad-hoc networking issue Mar 22 13:24:24 so if it works, can just plug in and the big meego device and n900 can work together :) Mar 22 13:24:42 they should work Mar 22 13:25:49 I thought you meant ssh'ing into netbook image using usbnet :) Mar 22 13:26:12 * timoph break. bbl Mar 22 13:39:06 lcuk: http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/ideapad/source/qt2010sdk/qt-creator-falls-over-when-poked-Problem_20110322_1417/slide0002.ht Mar 22 13:39:12 s/ht/htm Mar 22 13:39:14 rr Mar 22 13:39:17 lcuk: http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/ideapad/source/qt2010sdk/qt-creator-falls-over-when-poked-Problem_20110322_1417/slide0002.htm Mar 22 13:39:19 * timeless_w7ip sighs Mar 22 14:30:20 timeless_w7ip, ... Mar 22 14:30:32 your walk through is special - nice way of presenting bug actually Mar 22 14:30:58 have you put it somewhere where real qt qt-creator people can see it? Mar 22 14:34:32 yeah Mar 22 14:34:39 they claim it isn't applicable to 2.1/2.2 Mar 22 14:34:41 * timeless_w7ip shrugs Mar 22 14:34:50 lcuk: that's from Mar 22 14:35:13 it dates to vista iirc Mar 22 14:35:41 lcuk: I claim I cannot apply the manually extracted screenshots to either 2.1 nor 2.2, and "staying as close as possible" does not lead to a crash Mar 22 14:36:42 lcuk: in any case, bugreports.qt.nokia.com is the place to report such stuff, preferably in an easily inspectable way. and a stack trace would be nice. Mar 22 14:37:14 * timeless_w7ip claims nokia shouldn't expect stack traces if it isn't willing to provide pdb's Mar 22 14:37:20 and yes, it's my dumb employer Mar 22 14:37:40 but we're not that stupid in the Maemo side of things, we collect core dumps and pair them to symbols to get stack traces automatically Mar 22 14:38:38 timeless_w7ip: I _am_ not Nokia. I work there. _I_ expect a stack trace, _Nokia_ probably doesn't Mar 22 14:39:07 you have my sympathies Mar 22 14:39:58 but i've been involved w/ major projects for over a decade, and in projects where crashing is expected, collecting crash reports is part of the project and is managed appropriately Mar 22 14:40:23 andre, What happens if you send the stack trace to Mr Elop? Mar 22 14:40:43 perhaps he (like yourself) will be personally interested in it! Mar 22 14:40:48 and for groups which try to offer themselves as a platform, it's a good idea to provide the necessary bits, which includes symbols (especially for projects which are open source where there's nothing to hide) Mar 22 14:40:55 lcuk: seems unrelated. Mar 22 14:41:15 lcuk: his priority is wp7 Mar 22 14:41:32 and i'm 99% certain wp7 includes enough symbol info for the os to get work done Mar 22 14:41:37 windows certainly does Mar 22 14:41:40 mutter.... so I'm doing tests on usenames ... pick a "random won't be used one".... turns out we have a "froggy" ... ah well Mar 22 14:41:43 lcuk: the point is: if you want the thing fixed, make it easy to reproduce. or at least known. #1 is using the right bugtracker Mar 22 14:41:43 and there's no reason for ms not to do so for wp7 Mar 22 14:41:49 where can I get mad-developer for meego-handset-ia32-qemu-1.1.2-runtime ? Mar 22 14:42:06 andre: i don't really care if the things gets fixed Mar 22 14:42:18 lcuk: creating bug reports like https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14795 is a complete waste of time. Mar 22 14:42:20 <_MeeeGoBot_> Bug 14795 nor, Undecided, ---, maurice.kalinowski, NEW, contacts is misspelled in qt-creator addressbook-sdk.qdoc Mar 22 14:42:22 but i do want people to be aware that their toolchain is significantly inferrior to the competition Mar 22 14:42:35 Windows Phone 7 debugging is completly different to regular windows because its all .NET Mar 22 14:42:45 so symbols and symbol tables are done differently Mar 22 14:42:56 andre, why a waste of time? Mar 22 14:43:04 lcuk: that's 20 seconds work to fix on short notice on #qt-creator Mar 22 14:43:07 since the bug is occuring on the meego sdk Mar 22 14:43:07 Although I have no doubt that Microsoft does have internal servers with symbols for publicly released builds of WP7 Mar 22 14:43:16 andre, not everyone uses irc Mar 22 14:43:23 infact, most do not. Mar 22 14:43:39 lcuk: then on bugreports.qt.nokia.com. and you guys obviously do. Mar 22 14:43:47 obviously? Mar 22 14:43:49 * timeless_w7ip coughs Mar 22 14:43:54 99.99% of us do not Mar 22 14:44:03 andre, why not just add yourselves to CC on meego.com bugs? Mar 22 14:44:12 heck, even the maemo people generally filed bugs in maemo bug trackers Mar 22 14:44:18 and expected someone else to migrate them across Mar 22 14:44:22 timeless_w7ip: "Reported: 2011-03-22 02:30 PDT by timeless " Mar 22 14:44:29 you can be assigned default person on the bugtracker Mar 22 14:45:02 and if it turns out to be a general problem it can be mirrored wherever else you need Mar 22 14:45:03 lcuk: andre indicated that maurice (the assignee) is a Qt person Mar 22 14:45:09 but users around meego have a meego user account Mar 22 14:45:26 ahh so, this noise is not required Mar 22 14:45:27 * lcuk shuts up Mar 22 14:46:14 Do both these procedures enable me to package a Qt application for building on community OBS , http://wiki.meego.com/SDK/Docs/1.0/Packaging/Tutorial, http://wiki.meego.com/SDK/Tutorials/Packaging or do I need bits from both? Mar 22 14:46:16 timeless_w7ip: still wrongly assigned. Mar 22 14:46:26 so fix the assignee Mar 22 14:46:33 if you want a different default assignee, file a bug Mar 22 14:46:36 we'll change it Mar 22 14:47:27 timeless_w7ip: that bug is fixed. I won't create a meego account to re-assign a fixed bug. Mar 22 14:47:40 * lcuk puts hand up ginergly Mar 22 14:47:41 vgrade-nexus: Why don't you try it out and report if there are problems? That gives us a good way to validate the docs? Mar 22 14:47:48 andre, but you just asked others to do the same for oyu Mar 22 14:47:58 s/oyu/you/ Mar 22 14:47:59 lcuk meant: andre, but you just asked others to do the same for you Mar 22 14:49:34 lcuk: alright. maybe we should settle one question first. are you (as in 'meego') interested in getting creator bugs fixed, or are you happy enough with a bugtracker that acts as /dev/null? Mar 22 14:49:36 * lcuk has an account at qt.nokia.com :) Mar 22 14:49:59 lcuk: just drop a notic on #qt-creator, you don't need an account for that Mar 22 14:50:08 X-Fade, I can report the more manual procedure is OK to package the simple sample application. I'm stuggling to package a more complex Qt app due to my inexperiance with rpm. Mar 22 14:50:24 andre, I am all for fixes - it is principle reason why we are software engineers Mar 22 14:50:39 vgrade-nexus: Did you create the qt app in Qt Creator? Mar 22 14:50:45 andre: the reason i'm filing bugs in meego is that i want to set up a pipeline between MeeGo's bug tracker and the other ones Mar 22 14:50:58 so that when others come to meego and file bugs, their bugs will not end up in /dev/null Mar 22 14:51:10 because we'll have a working process for sending them to where they belong Mar 22 14:51:21 ++ Mar 22 14:51:48 part of this also involves showing people how to use the tools available at meego.com, which includes the mxr indexes which were included in that bug report Mar 22 14:52:05 lcuk: ok, good. then the problem is to find a simple way to coordinate the processes. Mar 22 14:52:55 yes, we can either keep telling people they need to jump further to file bugs now and in the future, or you can setup assignee to interact between meego users and qt directly? Mar 22 14:53:01 lcuk: my position is that trivial stuff like fixing a spelling mistake does not need a "process" Mar 22 14:54:28 * timeless_w7ip notes that it took nokia's symbian team 8 months to integrate "simple stuff" like "spelling" fixes Mar 22 14:54:38 andre, :) I have seen timeless discuss "trivial" things for a long time - it matters in a deep way. Try to imagine if your entire user interface was hand written and carefully done - spelling and grammar mistakes glare out. Mar 22 14:55:21 X-Fade: I'm sure it was. QtQuickPlayground. I started with the more manual procedure as I'd not noticed what looks like the easy method. My only question withe the shorter method was 'does it produce a spec file I can use with COBS' Mar 22 14:55:27 it is just one level of care that we should be striving to achieve. Mar 22 14:56:07 lcuk: I am about to setup an account there. but I won't be part of any process that requires a one page bug report to fix a typo Mar 22 14:56:09 vgrade-nexus: Afaik packaging can be done automatically in Qt Creator? Mar 22 14:57:38 andre, sure thing - let the bugs be low priority and at some point an interested person will hopefully offer patches Mar 22 14:58:27 there is no real mechanism in any OS/app to notify trivial bugs n a different way. Mar 22 14:59:50 andre, if the bugs are tagged correctly, having an intern run around and fixup these things would be good (like summer students) Mar 22 15:00:14 X-Fade: Cool, so then I can use the same spec file on COBS? Mar 22 15:00:15 they are not intended to take highly important developer time away Mar 22 15:00:30 vgrade-nexus: There is nothing special about the spec. Mar 22 15:00:39 lcuk: I am looking through maurice's bugs on bugs.meego.com right now. Mar 22 15:00:47 cool Mar 22 15:00:48 lcuk: and the intern learns valuable skills, like proper spelling :P Mar 22 15:00:54 yes Mar 22 15:01:12 and also the layout of the app :) ie valuable lessons :) Mar 22 15:01:42 X-fade, thanks, I'll update the wiki with any observations Mar 22 15:02:37 vgrade-nexus: You can also check spec files from other Qt apps to see what they are doing. Mar 22 15:05:33 X-Fade, yes, I tried that and that got me this far with the manual procedure, https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=armv7el&package=Qt-Quick-Playground&project=home%3Avgrade&repository=MeeGo_current_Core_standard Mar 22 15:06:04 X-Fade: ie managed to get the app to compile and link but fell down installing it to the correct place Mar 22 15:07:35 vgrade-nexus: Did you specify that yaml file somewhere? Mar 22 15:10:58 vgrade-nexus, another question for your skillset: Mar 22 15:11:13 the ideapad has pretty poor backlighting/contrast ratio Mar 22 15:11:31 which meego device currently offers the closest to Nokia CBD type real clear black displays Mar 22 15:11:53 because with the clock displayed on a mostly black screen there is still lots of light seeping through the ideapad Mar 22 15:12:28 CBD?? Mar 22 15:12:39 X-Fade: woops, yes I reomved that file from the OBS but not from the spec, rebuilding Mar 22 15:13:06 lcuk, let me do a comparison when I'm next in MeeGo control Mar 22 15:13:25 lcuk, I will guess the joggler Mar 22 15:14:19 * lbt wants his joggler to run 1.2 rc Mar 22 15:14:46 vgrade-nexus, really? Mar 22 15:14:50 that is the oldest of the devices Mar 22 15:15:02 it seems odd for it to potentially have the better screen Mar 22 15:15:29 or is that just a component sourcing decision made by the O2 Joggler people? Mar 22 15:25:45 lcuk, thats just my recollection, i'll check tonight Mar 22 15:26:18 vgrade-nexus, is there a joggler image available online? I will have a peek myself with mine Mar 22 15:28:25 lbt, lcuk, a bit old but still good, http://bug10738.openaos.org/images/joggler/ Mar 22 15:28:27 <_MeeeGoBot_> Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10738 nor, Undecided, ---, tero.kojo, NEED, Meego community ftp server or similar needed Mar 22 15:28:54 vgrade-nexus: yes - I've used that Mar 22 15:29:18 I want to have an up-to-date one with the latest EMGD/xorg pairing Mar 22 15:31:48 the kernel also has to match Mar 22 15:32:08 *nod* Mar 22 15:37:08 * lcuk wonders if XV works on the joggler, as on the n900 it is sad panda (bug 13084 has fun screenshot from me within) Mar 22 15:37:11 <_MeeeGoBot_> Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13084 maj, Medium, ---, carsten, ASSI, [n900] Horizontal tearing with xvimagesink Mar 22 15:37:43 ooh lbt, you are displayed on that screenshot too! Mar 22 15:38:58 :) Mar 22 16:00:22