**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Aug 19 02:59:57 2011 Aug 19 03:21:39 looks like WebOS also had issues with first-boot, according to Jaaksi: "It is not speculation. I know. TouchPad didn't handle the first hour of sync, logging in, indexing, and other admisinstrative task well while reviewers were pushing the performance tests at the same time. But after things settle, TouchPad performs much better. And now the new update addresses also some of these concerns." Aug 19 03:28:59 WebOS UX on top of meego core, anyone? :p Aug 19 03:32:38 anyone here familiar with autoconf? trying to build a lib on OBS and running into trouble... Aug 19 03:34:26 specifically: configure.ac:113: error: possibly undefined macro: AC_DEFINE Aug 19 03:54:44 where are this place Aug 19 04:33:03 good night Aug 19 05:14:38 Please note core OBS is DOWN (that's what the check script for the API says) Aug 19 05:14:45 wasn't me this time Aug 19 05:15:00 but it seems to me that it's up? Aug 19 05:15:11 I saw a blip on ##meego-dashboard : Aug 19 05:15:12 00:34:22< forMeeGoBot> PROBLEM build.meego.com HTTP CRITICAL CRITICAL - Socket timeout after 10 seconds Fri Aug 19 00:32:06 UTC 2011 Aug 19 05:15:15 00:48:46< forMeeGoBot> RECOVERY build.meego.com HTTP OK HTTP OK: HTTP/1.1 200 OK - 9715 bytes in 0.548 second response time Fri Aug 19 00:46:56 UTC 2011 Aug 19 05:15:19 right Aug 19 05:15:25 and checked if API is up using lbt's one liner Aug 19 05:15:33 meego:/tmp# if curl -s "https://api.meego.com/public/lastevents?start=$(echo $(( $(curl -s https://api.meego.com/public/lastevents | cut -f2 -d'"') - 10 )))" | grep -q "remote error"; then echo Public API down; else echo Public API up; fi Aug 19 05:15:37 Public API down Aug 19 05:15:41 so that happens once in a while, i really think there's a DDoS filter or something Aug 19 05:15:59 the problem is that httpd came back but API didn't Aug 19 05:17:36 even if I ignore the API downtimes then the pure http downtimes are around 5% of this month Aug 19 05:18:05 given that API was down for a whole weekend and now since 5h the real downtime is probably closer to 10% Aug 19 05:18:42 actually probably even more Aug 19 05:20:49 * dm8tbr would be really glad to see RE get their act together and reach decent service availability Aug 19 05:25:37 libs that the OBS builds should end up in the same place as any other package right? Aug 19 05:25:52 right Aug 19 05:26:07 dm8tbr: i'm not 100% sure if it's a OBS problem.. i've seen similar issue on download.meego.com Aug 19 05:33:26 Stskeeps: it's the API that goes down together with httpd and does not come back up if httpd is restarted. At least that's how I understood lbt Aug 19 05:33:34 ok Aug 19 07:31:06 arfoll: I e-mailed the guy who wrote the chrontel code we've been using, (and I'd say WeTab used his code and hacked on it, so its all his code in the end) Aug 19 07:32:23 flailingmonkey: to explain the gpio stuff? Aug 19 07:33:02 arfoll: yeah, just told him what I've been up to, trying to get working, etc. He already responded, super informative Aug 19 07:33:53 nice Aug 19 07:34:01 \o/ for open source Aug 19 07:34:30 btw on c.obs whats the diff between your kernel and what i have on obs? Aug 19 07:35:26 arfoll: i was partially doing my own kernel thing because I didn't know you had a branch, and also to learn obs stuff Aug 19 07:35:45 I only enabled kernel config for i2c_chardev and i2c_i801 Aug 19 07:36:01 and then there were many others when I was trying to get GPIO stuff :p Aug 19 07:36:41 something he mentioned was that they had connected the hot plug detect to the NM10 in the Acer chromebook because they thought it would be useful Aug 19 07:36:55 so it might not actually be connected like that in the EXOPC :/ Aug 19 07:36:56 flailingmonkey: ok so same as mine, cool was wondering if we needed more Aug 19 07:37:23 i have been getting the feeling that MeeGo kernel config is... weird or messy Aug 19 07:37:29 options all over the place Aug 19 07:37:44 that might explain why you had trouble with the gpio stuff Aug 19 07:38:00 make menuconfig has a few warnings about things being selected but missing direct dependencies Aug 19 07:38:48 file a bug ;-) but generally i find the kernel (comparitive to its complexity), is a nice enough pkg Aug 19 07:39:11 it works yeah, but hard to track down through all the options which are really needed and why :p Aug 19 07:40:21 the why is easy; because arjen decided so ;-) Aug 19 07:40:47 the guy, Mark Hayter, also mentioned why they moved the HPD to using GPIO. HPD using chrontel was used for a long time but it requires firmware to be running on the chrontel all the time. Aug 19 07:41:34 is having firmware on the chrontel a problem? I guess power consumption? Aug 19 07:41:47 That wasn't an issue until they came across a bug where some pictures on some 1080p TVs caused picture jiggle or loss of sync, and it went away when they the firmware stopped running Aug 19 07:42:32 so with the GPIO HPD detection, they only run the firmware when there isn't a monitor attached, because it is needed when the EDID gets read in on connection, etc Aug 19 07:43:01 ah the firmware is only for the EDID info? Aug 19 07:43:29 it probably does more but that is one of the most important functions, and then configuring output resolution etc Aug 19 07:45:00 well having the firmware loaded is probably a better plan than having a weird kernel module, more change of going into meego 1.2/1.3 Aug 19 07:46:05 i've still had no reply about bug #15637. Aug 19 07:46:08 Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=15637 nor, Medium, ---, peng.li, NEW, [EXOPC] Unable to connect HDMI Aug 19 07:46:20 yeah, Mark didn't work on the nm10_gpio module either. since it was a decision that was specifically made for Acer chromebook to connect HPD to the intel tigerpoint chipset GPIO, it might not even be useful for EXOPC Aug 19 07:47:30 does anyone have schematics for EXOPC wiring? lol Aug 19 07:48:38 well you could always ask wetab guys Aug 19 08:05:24 morning \o Aug 19 08:40:47 lbt / X-Fade: is publishing/syncing to repo.pub broken atm? Aug 19 08:42:55 prod me in 15min Aug 19 08:43:33 Beineri: Should not. Aug 19 08:44:04 Beineri: Ah, let me check. Aug 19 08:46:36 X-Fade: tia Aug 19 08:56:20 lbt, what is your MINT project? Aug 19 09:26:23 + Aug 19 09:28:51 Morning, all Aug 19 09:35:13 lbt, what do you know about long polling and COMET programming Aug 19 09:53:15 lcuk: MINT is BOSS/REVS/IMG ... stuff needed/useful to do MeeGo INTegration Aug 19 09:53:20 lcuk: nothing Aug 19 09:53:22 Jaffa: hey Aug 19 09:54:03 Beineri: X-Fade ... all OK ? Aug 19 09:55:49 lbt: Should be ok yes. Aug 19 09:59:53 lbt: 'lo Aug 19 10:01:29 lbt, re MINT ahh is it going smoothly? Aug 19 10:01:38 mmm Aug 19 10:01:46 it's going faster now Aug 19 10:01:54 but a little bumpy Aug 19 10:02:07 things are always bumpy Aug 19 10:18:31 ack, publishing works again :-) Aug 19 10:23:36 hi there; I was wondering where I can found source for the N950's Harmattan web browser, the "grob" thing Aug 19 10:24:59 it's closed source afaik, like the rest of the UI side of apps Aug 19 10:25:02 it's not open source Aug 19 10:25:35 I see, that's a bit disappointing Aug 19 10:45:20 morning Aug 19 10:48:26 morning Termana \o Aug 19 11:00:26 http://pics.kuvaton.com/kuvei/how_we_see_others.jpg Aug 19 11:00:39 it's friday, need to have something fun :) Aug 19 11:03:04 lol iekku Aug 19 11:07:08 Sage, I am going to try and build a CommunityEdition for intel device this weekend, do you know if anybody has already experimented yet? Aug 19 11:08:12 lcuk, should work mostly, i mean, we build for x86 too Aug 19 11:08:41 http://repository.maemo.org/meego/n900-de/daily/1.2.0.90.12.20110810.2.DE.2011-08-15.1/images/ Aug 19 11:08:53 looking on the images folder Stskeeps there are only n900 and n950 builds Aug 19 11:09:05 if they are built for x86 already, where are they? Aug 19 11:09:43 lcuk, i mean rpms are Aug 19 11:10:00 lcuk, need .ks adjusted for x86 for making image Aug 19 11:10:54 yes Stskeeps that is expectedI am just trying to see what might be feasible Aug 19 11:11:07 and how well the apps would work when on more powerful hardware Aug 19 11:11:42 if I hear back from DawnFoster about the exopc I could even start including it in my testing Aug 19 11:12:01 i thought you had an exo for some reason Aug 19 11:12:04 though I believe she is at the LinuxCon this week Aug 19 11:12:08 lenovo is ok too Aug 19 11:12:24 Stskeeps, I have my lenovo though it runs MeeGo netbook stable Aug 19 11:12:44 and at this time is in fulltime real use Aug 19 11:13:47 it has become primary house machine for my journal stuff Aug 19 11:14:08 ok Aug 19 11:15:35 Stskeeps, jake would keep asking to use it Aug 19 11:15:54 and until we have meeJournal stuff working on it he would be sad panda Aug 19 11:17:05 hopefully DawnFoster will read mails and try to see about processing things Aug 19 11:22:49 i'd test an exopc image for sure Aug 19 11:27:15 lcuk: mce is one things that comes to my mind that might have issues with intel hw, but otherwise it probably should work. Aug 19 11:34:50 flailingmonkey, more than testing Aug 19 11:35:09 would like to make a stable build that simplifies device adaption Aug 19 11:35:24 as lbt said last night it is quite an important goal Aug 19 11:35:40 aha sensible Aug 19 11:36:22 flailingmonkey, improving the firstboot ux is another major one Aug 19 11:36:25 i've been mainly working on getting exopc hardware supported, and next packaging stuff up for that support Aug 19 11:36:35 since on the n900 people are sad panda as indexing and stuff occurs Aug 19 11:36:42 yup Aug 19 11:37:01 if we can make people smile and give a really warm welcome when they startup their device Aug 19 11:37:08 better to have nothing show up in media apps than bad first impression Aug 19 11:37:09 half the battles are done and the rest is easy Aug 19 11:37:28 lcuk: present them with money every timethy start the device! Aug 19 11:37:31 well on n900-ce at the moment there is bug 13084 which I cannot work out how to cure Aug 19 11:37:34 Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13084 maj, Medium, ---, liquid, ASSI, [n900] Horizontal tearing with xvimagesink Aug 19 11:37:51 RST38h, sensible options! Aug 19 11:38:08 lcuk: Present them with porn? Aug 19 11:38:22 any asian phones coming with meego? Aug 19 11:41:28 the preincluded mini games on the n900-ce are a defined step in the right direction Aug 19 11:44:00 RST38h, an awesome techdemo (best of Assembly2011 or something) would actually make for decent tech pron Aug 19 11:44:14 lcuk: Not interested in demos Aug 19 11:44:29 RST38h, for first boot it gives something to watch Aug 19 11:44:35 rather than blank page syndrome Aug 19 11:45:09 here we have the most awesome device in the world, but it needs several hours of your configuration to make it so" Aug 19 11:45:35 it is the same with many aspects of computing, getting the firstboot experience right is important Aug 19 11:46:18 even just saying that it is "calibrating your plasma manifolds" would be a step up Aug 19 11:46:26 hah yeah Aug 19 11:46:31 reticulating splines! Aug 19 11:46:44 at least then they'd know "oh its busy, it hasn't just frozen" Aug 19 11:46:59 that is not such a bad idea actually flailingmonkey :) Aug 19 11:47:30 thanks :) unfortunately I don't think there's a way to estimate the time tracker takes to complete Aug 19 11:52:53 raster: Hi! :-D Aug 19 11:54:16 raster: how's embedded business? Any perspectives to share, to better our recently somewhat depressed mood? Aug 19 11:54:48 raster: seriously though, your little internal project is quickly becoming the ONLY hope in town Aug 19 11:54:57 indeed Aug 19 11:55:04 raster: so, some news would be very helpful indeed Aug 19 11:56:12 what is depressed? Aug 19 11:57:33 what is rasters project? Aug 19 11:57:48 uhm, did raster just say something in the past few minutes? Aug 19 11:57:55 no Aug 19 11:58:02 not here at least Aug 19 11:58:05 DocScrutinizer: YO Aug 19 11:58:13 now he did :-D Aug 19 11:58:14 Is openmoko phone capable of meego? Aug 19 11:58:18 RST38h: "LA LA LA" :( Aug 19 11:58:18 good, started to doubt my sanity (and ignores) Aug 19 11:58:22 RST38h: u'll have to wait Aug 19 11:58:23 :) Aug 19 11:58:29 i'm still here Aug 19 11:58:37 and we're not downsizing or stopping Aug 19 11:58:43 business as usual Aug 19 11:58:44 good to hear Aug 19 11:58:46 What is your project raster Aug 19 11:59:18 ? Aug 19 11:59:27 DocScrutinizer: nothing really differenty to say yet Aug 19 11:59:35 hmm Aug 19 11:59:48 #j#jjjjjjjjhfdsfthuozgresfthiuohtfdsftukohtdsdvgkulohtfdftkuojgdsadvgjkulozgresadrgzjilhtrdsftukozgrdsdrgzjiozgresvgnjlhbfdgzjlhtfdsgnjlgdgnjlgrdsfhkltfewhjl Aug 19 11:59:49 PugVader: Error: "j#jjjjjjjjhfdsfthuozgresfthiuohtfdsftukohtdsdvgkulohtfdftkuojgdsadvgjkulozgresadrgzjilhtrdsftukozgrdsdrgzjiozgresvgnjlhbfdgzjlhtfdsgnjlgdgnjlgrdsfhkltfewhjl" is not a valid command. Aug 19 11:59:53 PugVader: oi Aug 19 11:59:59 seemed to me you were close to rollout some 6 months ago Aug 19 12:00:10 PugVader: ummm it's a biggish project at samsung Aug 19 12:00:42 linux "mobile os" Aug 19 12:00:50 SLP or how was it? Aug 19 12:00:53 its linux as in regular linux Aug 19 12:00:55 not android Aug 19 12:00:58 yes Aug 19 12:01:07 thats what its known as generally Aug 19 12:01:17 well, it uses EFL so that was what tipped me :P Aug 19 12:01:25 raster: some links to latest "press releases" or some wiki page, tweet (UEARG!), anything? Aug 19 12:01:25 funy that Aug 19 12:01:39 one of the biggest reasons to be here Aug 19 12:01:40 :) Aug 19 12:01:52 DocScrutinizer: nothing to throw at you currently Aug 19 12:01:53 :) Aug 19 12:02:01 raster: i'm kind of perturbed about some SDK QA people from Intel talking about tips and tricks for SLP SDK Aug 19 12:03:12 (http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-sdk/2011-August/001502.html ) Aug 19 12:03:19 what was it again.. "wrong distro list"? Aug 19 12:03:20 tried to recall the mail and all :> Aug 19 12:05:33 LOL http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-sdk/2011-August/001506.html Aug 19 12:06:57 has anybody used these "Ultra High Capacity Li-on" batteries before with the n900? http://cgi.ebay.de/QUALITATS-AKKU-BL-5J-NOKIA-5800-5228-C3-X6-N900-/300559370824?pt=DE_Handy_PDA_Akkus&hash=item45fabc0a48 are they any good? Aug 19 12:09:49 raster: if you (as in Raster & Samsung) don't come up with a tiny notice about SLP right now, you actually miss a great opportunity to get some attention. Mood for receiving such a notice never been better than right now Aug 19 12:10:59 Stskeeps: how interesting Aug 19 12:11:19 raster: yeah X-P Aug 19 12:11:36 however TLAs are tricky Aug 19 12:11:44 DocScrutinizer: i know what the field looks like. Aug 19 12:12:10 Actually Doc is probably wrong Aug 19 12:12:25 Right now is not the time. Aug 19 12:12:52 The time will come when every single Android hardware manufacturer will suddenly find out they have got another WinCE on the ir hands Aug 19 12:12:54 meego has been pretty badly shot in the foot due to nokia dropping it. webos just got badly shafted. android now has its os maker owning a phome maker... will it stay open and a level playing field in the long term? who knows. wp7 is where it always was (no interest to linux/oss people) and ios.. similar Aug 19 12:12:55 :) Aug 19 12:13:49 i.e. they do get a free,if somewhat mediocre, OS, but they cannot make their offers to the customers different from other offers Aug 19 12:13:50 RST38h: i dont speak for samsung in this regard.. but hw makers arent stupid... and they almost all (except moto) are publically saying "cool" and privately are probably going "wtf?.... what now?" Aug 19 12:14:05 raster: A moment Aug 19 12:14:12 raster: It is not even about Motorola, really. Aug 19 12:14:18 i have no idea what samsung is doing - but enough peopoe have speculated on this already in blogs Aug 19 12:14:27 the SLP "spec" looks cool Aug 19 12:14:36 oh this isnt that new Aug 19 12:14:45 raster: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/08/04/android_wheres_the_profit/ Aug 19 12:14:59 raster: also see http://www.asymco.com/2011/07/29/apple-captured-two-thirds-of-available-mobile-phone-profits-in-q2/ Aug 19 12:15:03 skyhook court case has exposed some interestign details on android + google + relationships with google hw makers Aug 19 12:15:20 You will see that Samsung is leading, but mostly because of the amount of devices they produce Aug 19 12:15:37 There is very little added value in Android devices Aug 19 12:15:47 RST38h: funny that :) Aug 19 12:15:49 BTW, same situation in the Android Market Aug 19 12:16:12 You basically cannot make money there, neither on selling your product, nor on advertisement Aug 19 12:16:46 In order to do that,you have to move huge volumes of copies, which , of course, only happens for a dozen or so developers Aug 19 12:17:01 yup Aug 19 12:17:14 though thats not vastly differnt on ios/appstore Aug 19 12:17:20 the majority make a loss Aug 19 12:17:24 a big one Aug 19 12:17:24 yes Aug 19 12:17:39 But it is not asustainable situation. It cannot continue forever. Aug 19 12:17:44 ie dont even make enough to pay themselevs the same they would get doign similar work for an employer etc. Aug 19 12:17:48 and yup Aug 19 12:17:50 SO in the next few years we weill see Changes Aug 19 12:17:55 yup Aug 19 12:18:14 u can have the current model as long as enough "suckerS" throw good money after bad in hopes of coming out on top Aug 19 12:18:23 One of which will probably be of many developers abandoning app stores Aug 19 12:18:27 then again you can argue that about lottery ticketx Aug 19 12:18:30 tickets Aug 19 12:18:45 the appstore (or market) is a lottery ticket Aug 19 12:18:48 Except lottery tickets are a form of entertainment Aug 19 12:18:49 effectively Aug 19 12:18:55 hehe Aug 19 12:18:55 sure Aug 19 12:19:03 effort and cost required are miniscule Aug 19 12:19:08 possible payback is huge Aug 19 12:19:13 but then again the odds are miniscule too Aug 19 12:19:18 yes, by definition, or nobody would play Aug 19 12:19:51 an appstore - effort is large, odd are better than lottery, payback is.. not as good but... stil can be in the millions Aug 19 12:20:18 nah Aug 19 12:20:30 odds are actually about the same or even lower :) Aug 19 12:21:17 Cut off at the amount of profit that makes it worth participating Aug 19 12:21:25 and you will get rather meager odds Aug 19 12:28:39 true Aug 19 12:30:16 And why are we forgetting the Chinese? Aug 19 12:30:52 Who have sufficient low-cost low-quality developerresources to carpet bomb theapp stores with dirt cheap apps Aug 19 12:31:20 Sometimes recompiledand adopted GPL code or repackagedstufffromother developers Aug 19 12:35:42 RST38h, your space bar doesn't seem to work fine, don'tknowifyounoticed :P Aug 19 12:36:37 morning Aug 19 12:38:04 w00t_, are you currently using saesu for local sync daily Aug 19 12:38:06 morning berndhs Aug 19 12:38:47 lcuk: for some things Aug 19 12:40:18 w00t_, it would be good to build a game with similar lan multicast stuff Aug 19 12:40:42 to have all your contacts as characters in it and more join as your devices come into the lan Aug 19 12:51:35 RST38h: we already forget the chinese. poor buggers. :( Aug 19 12:52:51 q Aug 19 12:53:35 RST38h: but by that logic... apple is doomed. china can just make cheap iphone-like things :) Aug 19 12:54:07 reality is.. brand and image matter a lot... so until the chinese gain brand image... its a threat only to those who are competing only on price Aug 19 12:54:29 raster, they do, even cloned Steve with one of their CEOs Aug 19 12:54:37 ab: hahahah Aug 19 12:54:54 oh lawdy, two Steves Aug 19 12:55:11 the world is gonna have its hands full Aug 19 12:55:41 double-stevin' it yo Aug 19 12:56:53 raster, jokes aside, Chinnese government has simpler ways to decrease profitability of american companies. Along with US government. Aug 19 12:57:19 doesnt bother me Aug 19 12:57:26 i work for a korean one :) Aug 19 12:57:39 afterall it has bought US's currency :) Aug 19 12:57:51 south or north? ;) Aug 19 12:58:05 north of course! Aug 19 12:58:08 god Aug 19 12:58:15 who do you take me for.. Aug 19 12:58:29 if offered the ability to join the axis of evil... what do u think i'd do? Aug 19 12:58:29 :) Aug 19 12:58:30 kim jong il in disguise ;) Aug 19 12:58:31 obviously, raster *hates* 'go south' Aug 19 12:58:38 * raster MUWHAUAHAUAHAHAUAUAHAHAUAHAHA's Aug 19 12:59:09 Russia is also a pretty nice place to be in ;) Aug 19 12:59:17 as is Vietnam Aug 19 13:39:48 Anyone here using Meego for In Car? Aug 19 13:46:12 madsara, there is a dedicated IVI team Aug 19 13:46:24 what is your ponderment Aug 19 13:54:44 lcuk: Question is basically a poll to determine if people prefer it or something else for IVI. Aug 19 13:55:16 madsara: most people don't choose their IVI platform, they choose a car and get whatever is given to them... Aug 19 13:55:33 you'd have to be a /very/ dedicated geek to choose your car based on its IVI platform Aug 19 14:04:12 Robot101, what about the pasenger units for folks in the back, they can be after market addons Aug 19 14:04:31 passenger * Aug 19 14:05:15 what, you duct tape an ipad to the seat? I don't think that accounts for any non-trivial part of the IVI market :P Aug 19 14:07:28 Robot101: velcro would work better. and it could be the majority of the market, there are more passengers than drivers. drivers should not be entertained in the first place Aug 19 14:07:47 Robot101, of course not but everything has to start somewhere! Aug 19 14:11:06 http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_241769_langId_-1_categoryId_165743 Aug 19 14:11:22 Robot101, in car headrest dvds are popular Aug 19 14:11:50 fsvo popular including I wasn't even aware they existed :P Aug 19 14:12:17 sample size ;) Aug 19 14:12:25 well, perhaps not pupolar with the auto manufacturers :) Aug 19 14:12:28 this is like a netbook, at some point they become the same price as a proper laptop and the section disappears. in this case, the car manufacturers will be able to add them cheaply enough (or cheaper than the add-on) Aug 19 14:12:29 in the "In car tech" section of local halfords Aug 19 14:12:59 you would want a standard protocol so the units could do multi-player games and such Aug 19 14:13:11 yeah berndhs Aug 19 14:13:43 gps readonly capabilities so kids can have "are we nearly there yet" answered digitally Aug 19 14:14:22 mind you, two way gps would be good, let the kids add stop off points at mcdonalds and such *grin* Aug 19 14:15:42 aha, the IVI system is turning into a server Aug 19 14:17:17 berndhs, the IVI is anyway, with ipod dock on most "simple" car stereos Aug 19 14:18:05 yes, happened already Aug 19 14:18:12 inputs from the various cameras for parking etc Aug 19 14:20:30 berndhs, networking to sharing movies is a bit more complex Aug 19 14:20:36 especially when passengers want different ones Aug 19 14:21:14 * lcuk should go into the Renault garage and see what IVI they have Aug 19 14:21:24 I know they were investigating meego stuff a while ago Aug 19 14:21:35 better jhave individual movie channels, the whole idea is to keep the passengers quiet Aug 19 14:22:09 yeah Aug 19 14:28:59 berndhs, considering the form factor and position of rear seat ivi Aug 19 14:29:04 what sorts of games would suit Aug 19 14:29:16 or would you also include a games controller/mote thingie Aug 19 14:29:38 racing games, flight simulator ? Aug 19 14:29:49 i don't know, i dont play games much Aug 19 14:29:53 those assume a handheld controller Aug 19 14:29:59 Is there meego qt channel? Aug 19 14:31:19 is there something that converts between rpm and debian changelog ? Aug 19 14:32:01 berndhs, not that I have come across but sample size Aug 19 14:32:09 yeah Aug 19 14:32:54 without some tool, i put change comments in git. THen in the rpm foo.changes, then in debian, then in osc commit comment Aug 19 14:33:25 yeah I looked for something Aug 19 14:33:44 perhaps lbt will know, he was trying to get changelogs and versions in sync a while ago Aug 19 14:34:07 s/was trying/managed/ Aug 19 14:34:07 lcuk meant: perhaps lbt will know, he managed to get changelogs and versions in sync a while ago Aug 19 14:34:24 many people must be annoyed but this :) Aug 19 14:35:07 actually, osc grabs the foo.changes file, sometimes Aug 19 14:35:12 berndhs: an RPM changelog does not require version info... just date. So rpm.changelog --> debian.changelog can't be done universally. Aug 19 14:35:20 berndhs: Use the git log and create the changelogs from it. Aug 19 14:35:37 berndhs: however, debian.changelog --> rpm.changelog seems quite possible to do. Aug 19 14:36:06 hmm Aug 19 14:36:06 gabrbedd, :) Aug 19 14:36:23 git-dch creates Debian changelogs from git logs, there's probably something for rpm as well Aug 19 14:36:36 bbiab anyway, trying to grok mic2 Aug 19 14:36:49 Although I don't know whether you get git-dch working in a non-Debian environment Aug 19 14:37:35 berndhs: Yeah, I think juliank's suggestion is probably a better approach. Create your changelogs from git instead of rpm <--> debian. Aug 19 14:38:20 right, git->rpm and git->debian would work, and perhaps keep people more honest in git comments Aug 19 16:11:24 Hello. Can meego run on the OMAP4 Motorola Droid 3? http://www.motorola.com/Consumers/US-EN/Consumer-Product-and-Services/Mobile-Phones/DROID-3-by-MOTOROLA-US-EN Aug 19 16:12:24 new $530 Aug 19 16:12:50 it could be like a n950, no? Aug 19 16:44:17 hi guys what apps does meego have? Aug 19 16:49:13 Hi, i compiled a game for harmattan, and installed to N950, and i compiled new build, then copied the new binary to game's folder. The N950 is rebbooted, and i get this message: "Device is malfunctioning" pls try reflash blablabla Security problem (meegotouchome): /opt/mygame/mygame Aug 19 16:49:34 any idea? Aug 19 16:50:48 i copied the new binary as root... but i don't know, what is this security error.. and why? Aug 19 16:55:25 what apps does meego have at the moment Aug 19 16:57:06 tim____, better question would be what are you looking for Aug 19 16:57:24 or are you expecting to see all of them listed on irc? Aug 19 16:59:03 i havnt got meego yet im still deciding Aug 19 16:59:53 meego has all the same apps as maemo Aug 19 17:00:04 except when they haven't been ported yet Aug 19 17:00:19 so more accurately, meego has a subset of the apps maemo has Aug 19 17:00:47 cool so it still has fm transmitter Aug 19 17:01:08 do they work as expected? Aug 19 17:02:12 Andy1210: does meego check for binary signatures after installing? Aug 19 17:05:06 Andy1210: do not copy binaries, always install the deb Aug 19 17:05:20 Andy1210: your questions are better asked on #harmattan though Aug 19 18:21:08 the people who decided to use "*" to mark things in files to be processed with sh deserve punishment Aug 19 18:21:37 could you give an example? Aug 19 18:21:49 10 lashes Aug 19 18:21:55 I meant of the crime Aug 19 18:22:12 items in changelogs for rpm and deb Aug 19 18:22:17 also a lash could be a night out, depending upon what part of essex you're in Aug 19 18:22:31 lashes like in the old Navy tradition Aug 19 18:22:46 you forgot to salute your superior officer, 10 lashes Aug 19 18:22:57 I know what I means Aug 19 18:23:08 I was making a joke about essex Aug 19 18:23:28 berndhs: http://download.bluesquarelinux.co.uk/felix/SPECS/zsh.spec Aug 19 18:23:34 <3 * Aug 19 18:23:38 would this be guilty of the crime? Aug 19 18:23:50 lupine_85: that would make you a slut since you love everything Aug 19 18:24:02 right Aug 19 18:24:13 berndhs: really? cos that's the spec file format Aug 19 18:24:22 exactly Aug 19 18:24:23 :p Aug 19 18:24:35 ah I see now Aug 19 18:25:06 you try to grab stuff out of those files with little shell scripts, out put stuff in,... Aug 19 18:31:25 I'm just happy if it makes the RPM without anything catching on firee Aug 19 18:34:23 smoku: do you have an omap4 with meego? Aug 19 18:35:14 pawlik, no Aug 19 18:35:48 pawlik, or yes. depending whether you count harmattan as meego ;-) Aug 19 18:36:04 omap4? Aug 19 18:36:05 :P Aug 19 18:38:01 * CosmoHill wishes his sky+ box worked Aug 19 18:38:16 Stskeeps, all omaps are same to me. I don't track these numbers ;-) Aug 19 18:38:53 Harmattan is OMAP3630. Aug 19 18:40:37 Cool persons run OMAP5s - until it's publically available than that's only slightly cool anymore Aug 19 18:41:08 if motorola unlocks the bootloader, then the droid 3 can run meego i think Aug 19 18:41:13 making it an excellent phone Aug 19 18:41:35 good lord berndhs, what have you done now? Aug 19 18:41:36 Unlocked bootloader is half of it. Aug 19 18:41:45 Droids have crap keyboards. Aug 19 18:41:54 yeah see all those * ? Aug 19 18:42:10 SpeedEvil: there is already meego builds for omap4 pandaboard i think Aug 19 18:42:17 berndhs: this must be your personal hell then? Aug 19 18:42:19 Jaffa, I noticed you say something about apps modifying their layout when viewed as thumbnails in the dashboard Aug 19 18:42:25 Unlocked bootloader is useless if there is no userlevel software that can talk to the driver Aug 19 18:42:26 this is nice principle Aug 19 18:42:30 do you know which do this? Aug 19 18:42:47 and is it just another qml state to allow this Aug 19 18:42:55 i do not know how to make a bootloader Aug 19 18:42:56 it would be productive to document this Aug 19 18:43:53 pawlik: Consider what happens now if you can't talk to the modem in the phone, as it has a hardware driver with an undocumented interface. Aug 19 18:44:16 oh yes Aug 19 18:44:33 SpeedEvil, the n950 for instance is getting a meego-ce Aug 19 18:45:03 sure each device will take time, but once we get base ux happy to work without much in the way of external requirements it will be better Aug 19 18:45:14 because devices can be up and working quicker Aug 19 18:45:19 and useful Aug 19 18:45:21 To a degree, yes. Aug 19 18:45:35 bug 20099 for instance needs merging upstream Aug 19 18:45:38 Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=20099 nor, High, ---, geoff, ASSI, [CE] Calculator crashes after pressing any button and then "." . Aug 19 18:45:52 then even without a modem the meego-ce can work as desktop calculator ;) Aug 19 18:46:02 But if for example there is a hardware 'driver' for the modem, in a device which simply talks to an undocumented binary blob for which you do not have source, then there is an issue. Aug 19 18:46:03 i should see if I can be useful with the meego-ce people and n950 Aug 19 18:46:19 berndhs, yes Aug 19 18:46:31 who are they ? they have meetings I think Aug 19 18:46:35 berndhs: #meego-arm Aug 19 18:46:46 aha, I'll go look Aug 19 18:46:51 berndhs: meetings on tuesdays (whole project), adaptation thursday Aug 19 18:46:54 berndhs, there are a number of us Aug 19 18:47:03 same faces from n900 adaption team Aug 19 18:47:16 jukka eklund msugano are team lead Aug 19 18:47:28 I'll look for meeting logs and such, see what's missing Aug 19 18:50:07 berndhs, there is a full list somewhere of people participating in the n900 Aug 19 18:50:11 it is a great list Aug 19 18:50:15 Stskeeps, can you remember the url Aug 19 18:50:24 was in the meeting this week afaik Aug 19 18:51:23 http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/Contributors Aug 19 18:51:27 ahhah Aug 19 18:51:47 lcuk: yup? Aug 19 18:52:19 Jaffa, question up there ^ Aug 19 18:52:21 lcuk: You can see Clock do it, for a simple example: it removes the second hand. gPodder does it as well - showing a "now playing" overlay when in the task manager. Aug 19 18:52:37 lcuk: There's a state on pageWindow which represents "thumbnail" IIRC. I assume that's how they do it Aug 19 18:53:02 bbl thanks Jaffa Aug 19 18:56:43 does the maemo software like fm transmitter work well on meego Aug 19 18:57:24 tim____: Fremantle's FM transmitter is part of the OS; so "it" doesn't run on MeeGo. As for FM TX in MeeGo, that will depend on hardware capabilities. I don't think any of the current devices support it Aug 19 18:57:45 damm Aug 19 19:06:07 current devices? Aug 19 19:06:24 at least 50% of them do Aug 19 19:06:40 i don't know if the N950 does or not Aug 19 19:10:50 n950 has no fm tx Aug 19 19:32:23 why does osc want to connect to my xserver now? Aug 19 19:35:52 ah, keyring bs. Aug 19 19:37:25 and no-keyring still wants to use my x server Aug 19 19:38:01 is there any way to stop osc from using a keyring? Aug 19 19:39:10 if you find out how, please tell me too because I haven't managed to get it obey my wishes in that regared Aug 19 19:39:48 wilco Aug 19 19:44:43 this is so very broken Aug 19 19:46:15 err Aug 19 19:46:30 have you read the comments in ~/.oscrc ? Aug 19 19:47:11 and the values ... things like "use_keyring=1" ... :) Aug 19 19:47:30 Bostik: jedix ^^ Aug 19 19:48:03 lbt: osc doesn't honour them, at least for my use Aug 19 19:48:43 regardless of keyring/gnome_keyring values the client blindly assumes I have a keyring Aug 19 19:48:46 anyone else having bizarre osc problems when trying to commit stuff? Aug 19 19:48:48 try #obs then if you've found a bug Aug 19 19:49:36 (I have to say it seems to work fine here - I'm honestly not sure/bothered where it's storing it though) Aug 19 19:49:45 rgs_: ? Aug 19 19:49:53 it seems to work rather nicely *IF* I happen to have a gnome desktop (like my laptop does) but a custom WM-only system I have for my real desktop system is a problem Aug 19 19:50:03 * lbt runs kde FTW Aug 19 20:08:25 \o lbt Aug 19 20:09:13 lbt: yes Aug 19 20:09:48 lbt: use_keyring = 0; keyring = 0; rm -rf ~/.kde ~/.gnupg ~/.GConf ~/.gnome ~/.gnome2 .. still bitches Aug 19 20:10:32 I'm also in #obs asking. Aug 19 20:10:36 no solution there either Aug 19 20:11:03 why in gods name does the obs server command line interface try to connect to x at all? Aug 19 20:17:52 Bostik: remove libgnome-keyring0 python-keyring Aug 19 20:23:53 jedix: Bostik would be happy to be cc'ed in a (suse?) bug report about this Aug 19 20:24:37 add a . after Bostik :) Aug 19 20:24:39 lbt: sounds peachy, pm me his email please? Aug 19 20:25:18 mmm add a ", I" after Bostik :) Aug 19 20:25:43 OK ... from scratch : jedix, Bostik, I would be happy to be cc'ed in a (suse?) bug report about this Aug 19 20:30:39 ah, okay Aug 19 20:30:49 what's your email then? Aug 19 20:31:57 'Symbian, Meego and WebOS have all either been mothballed or have been given a termination date.' - heh I love it when journos get it wrong... Aug 19 20:32:19 although nowadays I'm not sure how close that is to the truth... Aug 19 20:32:20 yeah, I saw that too Aug 19 20:32:57 have to look for a while for journos to get something right actually, in all subjects Aug 19 20:37:55 lbt: what's your email? Aug 19 20:40:38 lbt, Bostik: Bug 713261 Aug 19 20:55:23 dont you guy just talk? Aug 19 20:56:39 we like a high signal to noise ratio Aug 19 20:57:15 after the summer it looks like both are very silent... :( Aug 19 20:58:02 hello mr openstreetmap, thanks for your work harbaum Aug 19 20:59:37 hi, you're welcome Aug 19 21:02:21 :) Aug 19 21:02:28 lucky owner Aug 19 21:19:38 am trying to Play H264 video on Intel board from QML player using QtMobility and libva , but am unable to play video , but if i try to play using native gstreamer(gst-launch- ....) am able to do that , please can one help me in resolving this issue ? Aug 19 21:21:36 so i have just installed meego 1.2.0.9 on my exopc. And i am looking for a place where i can rtfm on how to update/install new repos and use the installer in meego. Aug 19 21:21:48 could someone be kind enough to link me? Aug 19 21:22:07 novice: I saw the same issue before Aug 19 21:23:02 novice: i am not sure how QtMobility or perhaps QtMultimedia does it's thing with finding codecs Aug 19 21:23:20 flailingmonkey : any clue to fix ? Aug 19 21:23:59 flailingmonkey: i'm not an expert anymore but i'd expect in the end it would use gstreamers decodebin for it... Aug 19 21:24:37 it uses playbin2 from gstreamer plugins and even gst-launch playbin2 uri=file:///..... also uses playbin2 Aug 19 21:31:16 i had no problem with playing files using gst-launch playbin2, but the whole meego-apps-videos thing, i believe is a QML app like what you are talking about, didn't work Aug 19 21:37:38 flailingmonkey : sorry there was connection error , i couln't see any of ur replies Aug 19 21:38:05 flailingmonkey : please can you copy again if you commented something ? Aug 19 21:38:28 http://mg.pov.lt/meego-irclog/latest.log.html Aug 19 21:38:30 for logs :) Aug 19 21:41:20 i didn't say much, but it is possible that you could search through the logs too for others with issue Aug 19 21:42:08 flailingmonkey : :) Yeah even am able to play through gstreamer but , from QML am not able to play , also from gst logs am able to see frame buffers are moving , but where its playing no idea ? Aug 19 21:53:00 flailingmonkey : do you have any idea on colorkey value used when we use gstreamer to play video using VA Aug 19 21:53:29 i was just using staightup playbin2, without any other values >_> Aug 19 21:53:46 was testing out fluendo proprietary codecs Aug 19 21:54:25 first time i paid for a pack of codecs... not very expensive Aug 19 21:54:49 but good stuff Aug 19 21:55:36 also am able to play using "player" app comes with QtMobility , but when i use QML elements it cribs :) Aug 19 21:56:48 well i believe in OpenSource component :) and they are the best .... :) Aug 19 22:02:36 hmm you know i could be wrong but i have a feeling that the "improved" browser in symbian anna is the same one used on meego Aug 19 22:02:48 (and maemo) Aug 19 22:02:55 rendering engine that is Aug 19 22:08:59 possibly the UI as well Aug 19 22:09:13 it doesn't look like a symbian app any more, it looks like QML Aug 19 22:37:45 so with all this orphaned hp hardware available on the market (and soon to be available at discounts at stores), what about putting meego on it? Aug 19 22:38:06 holy shit: john prescott is hosting have I got news for you Aug 19 22:38:33 again? Aug 19 22:38:39 is it a repeat Aug 19 22:38:41 might be a repeate Aug 19 22:38:47 he hosted it the day after the election Aug 19 22:39:45 from my point of view the elections are badly timed, same week as deadlines Aug 19 22:45:26 ali1234: year it's a repeat Aug 19 22:46:22 http://www.phoronix.com/image-viewer.php?id=tyke_dual_monitor&image=tyke_stand_intro_lrg "now which keyboard was it for IRC" Aug 19 22:47:28 one desktop, 7 laptops / netbooks, 7 monitors and 6 keyboards Aug 19 22:47:37 and 2/3 of a pint Aug 19 23:14:04 jedix: https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=713261 Bug #713261 does not exist Aug 20 00:06:07 night night Aug 20 00:17:38 yeah, does the meego community care about the HP tablet thing? Aug 20 00:17:56 how does it relate? Aug 20 00:23:22 you tell me :) ...does it matter? Aug 20 00:26:21 to me, almost not at all Aug 20 00:27:56 the meego community isn't really keeping anybody out Aug 20 00:39:56 could a small company port meego to a phone and release that os for a fee? Aug 20 00:40:09 that would be normal GPL compliant Aug 20 00:48:51 yes Aug 20 00:48:55 Maybe. Aug 20 00:49:14 It depends on if the phone will run without any binary blobs for the drivers that are uncleared for copyright. Aug 20 00:49:32 there's nobody stopping them, other than whether the marketing would work Aug 20 00:51:28 If there are binary blobs, then it's more tricky legally. Aug 20 00:51:39 yes it is Aug 20 00:52:31 but suppose that's not an issue, that the phone just looks/works better with meego Aug 20 00:52:39 Diddn't apple get upset at a vendor selling patch kits for OSX to make it run on alien hardware? Aug 20 00:52:50 then you would have to convince consumers to buy the new os and put it on their phones Aug 20 00:52:58 Indeed. Aug 20 00:53:06 Meego at the moment is not very shiny - in general. Aug 20 00:53:30 May it work better than the stock OS on some phones if you get the right software combination - possibly. Aug 20 00:54:03 I think the mechanics of "simple" users installing a different OS could be a hurdle Aug 20 00:55:24 Perhaps. Aug 20 00:57:51 the advantage could be something we're not tihnking of, say its the only OS for that phone that's in Chinese, or that isn't in Chinese Aug 20 00:58:39 it would depend on just how bad the native OS is for that phone Aug 20 00:58:54 And how likely the users are not to rip it off. Aug 20 00:59:31 right, you might only sell 3 to an install base of 3 million **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Aug 20 02:59:56 2011