**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Mar 12 10:59:56 2006
Mar 12 17:53:08 <prpplague> ~seen beewoolie-afk
Mar 12 17:53:11 <purl> beewoolie-afk <n=beewooli@206.124.142.26> was last seen on IRC in channel #openjtag, 3d 22h 53m 3s ago, saying: 'just returned from skiing.'.
Mar 12 18:00:20 <NAiL> hmm
Mar 12 18:00:29 <NAiL> how sensitive to length are JTAG cables?
Mar 12 18:01:14 <lennert> depends on the speed you're driving them at, i'd guess
Mar 12 18:01:55 <NAiL> hmm
Mar 12 18:01:57 <vmaster> 20cm worked for me nicely at a few mhz, at 40cm there was no reliable communication above 1-2mhz
Mar 12 18:02:25 <NAiL> I don't know how fast I need it...
Mar 12 18:02:41 <vmaster> a wiggler does ~350kHz
Mar 12 18:03:31 <NAiL> hmm
Mar 12 18:03:54 <NAiL> My cable is 18cm, but I need to tack on some form of converter for the ds101
Mar 12 18:05:25 <NAiL> but I don't need to run at high speeds, do I? I basically just need to upload a kernel :)
Mar 12 18:07:27 <lennert> the speed you need to run at depends on how long you are willing to wait ;)
Mar 12 18:07:36 <NAiL> ah, good
Mar 12 18:08:02 <NAiL> how long would I expect to wait when using e.g. a wiggler?
Mar 12 18:08:08 <NAiL> for a 1mb kernel uploaded to ram
Mar 12 18:09:18 <NAiL> ie, is it minutes, hours, days? ;)
Mar 12 18:09:24 <koen> weeks?
Mar 12 18:09:26 <lennert> minutes, i guess
Mar 12 18:09:43 <lennert> just a few minutes
Mar 12 18:09:54 <NAiL> doesn't sound too bad. I could stand to wait an hour or two once in a while, but days would be painful ;)
Mar 12 18:11:08 <NAiL> (used to uploading the darn kernel with xmodem to the ds101 anyways)
Mar 12 18:22:22 <lennert> case $TARGET in
Mar 12 18:22:27 <lennert>     i4004)    abort "ENOMEM" ;;
Mar 12 18:22:33 <lennert> whoops, wrong channel :)
Mar 12 18:22:41 <lennert> (that's from crosstool)
Mar 12 18:57:50 <prpplague> NAiL: i've seen my wiggler stuff behave quite odd with long cables that were not properly grounded
Mar 12 18:58:08 <prpplague> NAiL: thats the main reason that the change was made from the 2x7 header to 2x10
Mar 12 18:58:13 <prpplague> NAiL: for arm that is
Mar 12 18:58:22 <NAiL> yeah
Mar 12 18:58:23 <prpplague> NAiL: so that every other wire was ground
Mar 12 18:59:00 <NAiL> the plug I'm going to use will actually have every other wire as GND (by accident rather than design ;)
Mar 12 18:59:38 <prpplague> NAiL: generally what most ppl will do is upload a micro-bootloader that initializes some interface like a uart to do the actual upload of soemthing like the kernel
Mar 12 19:00:02 <NAiL> like APEX
Mar 12 19:00:13 <prpplague> or even smaller
Mar 12 19:00:19 <prpplague> i have one that is just 1k
Mar 12 19:00:24 <NAiL> ooh
Mar 12 19:00:35 <NAiL> but will it work on my board?
Mar 12 19:00:37 <prpplague> all it does is init the uart, and prepare for a xmodem transfer
Mar 12 19:00:47 <prpplague> NAiL: what is your board?
Mar 12 19:00:58 <NAiL> it's an intel ixp420
Mar 12 19:01:54 <ka6sox> DS?
Mar 12 19:01:58 <NAiL> yeah
Mar 12 19:02:39 <NAiL> I just need to be able to transfer the kernel and boot it
Mar 12 19:02:51 <NAiL> so I can re-write the b0rked redboot
Mar 12 19:04:48 <NAiL> bbiaw, watching corpse bride
Mar 12 19:04:53 <prpplague> i don't see any reason you couldn't make an app for the ixp420
Mar 12 19:12:50 <AwayNAiL> well, I'm not much of a programmer ;)
Mar 12 19:13:02 <AwayNAiL> if uploading apex would work, I'm satisfied
Mar 12 19:13:24 <prpplague> AwayNAiL: ahh
Mar 12 19:16:53 <AwayNAiL> This JTAG-stuff is first and foremost for a one-time recovery of my DS101. 
Mar 12 19:18:03 <lennert> one-time.. that much confidence in yourself? :-)
Mar 12 19:20:35 <vmaster> hehehe
Mar 12 19:21:50 <prpplague> DS101 ?
Mar 12 19:21:56 <lennert> i always make the same crucial mistakes at least twice
Mar 12 19:24:26 <AwayNAiL> hehe
Mar 12 19:24:42 <AwayNAiL> prpplague: Synology DS101. http://www.nslu2-linux.org/DS101/
Mar 12 19:25:34 <prpplague> ahh a slug device
Mar 12 19:26:37 <AwayNAiL> basically, yes
Mar 12 19:26:48 <AwayNAiL> twice the ram, twice the flash, and internal IDE
Mar 12 19:26:59 <AwayNAiL> unfortunately, the flash is DiskOnChip
Mar 12 19:27:53 <prpplague> AwayNAiL: ug
Mar 12 19:28:02 <prpplague> AwayNAiL: i'd get rid of that
Mar 12 19:31:08 <AwayNAiL> well, not very easy that
Mar 12 19:32:07 <AwayNAiL> (and, it makes making a custom firmware useable by others a real pita ;)
Mar 12 19:34:39 <prpplague> AwayNAiL: doc is pretty easy to replace
Mar 12 19:34:53 <prpplague> AwayNAiL: since you have all the data and address lines available
Mar 12 19:44:15 <AwayNAiL> yeah, but I'd need a flash chip to replace it with
Mar 12 19:46:06 <AwayNAiL> and a steady enough hand to solder it ;)
Mar 12 19:51:55 <ka6sox> AwayNAiL, I have replaced the flash before...its a NIGHTMARE
Mar 12 19:57:19 <AwayNAiL> I don't doubt it ;)
Mar 12 20:29:37 <NAiL> Anyway, as long as I can boot linux once, I should be able to recover fully
Mar 12 20:30:41 * NAiL likes the DS101 very much. Except the darn DoC.
Mar 12 20:30:55 * NAiL ponders putting an USB hub inside the case
Mar 12 20:33:51 <prpplague> NAiL: there are plenty of small 4 port hubs
Mar 12 20:34:02 <NAiL> yeah, I've got one that I consider ripping apart
Mar 12 20:34:13 <NAiL> the casing is huge, but the PCB itself is small
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Mar 13 10:59:57 2006