**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Oct 17 02:59:57 2019 Oct 17 12:22:26 PureTryOut[m]: it's not so much the marketing as the investment; we invest (mostly) in developing GNOME so that's what's talked about Oct 17 12:23:44 PureTryOut[m]: there's no reason that everything which runs on the PinePhone can't run on the Librem 5 Oct 17 12:26:05 we gave a bunch of (very expensive) devkits out to various developers Plasma Mobile, UBports, etc. Oct 17 12:29:09 what we do in the company day-to-day though is work on GNOME-based software like Calls and phosh and Chatty and gnome-control-centre and GTK and Epiphany Oct 17 12:29:45 although I did spend a bunch of time setting up automatic package builds for Plasma Mobile packages Oct 17 12:30:16 but our focus is on GNOME and the marketing just reflects that Oct 17 12:31:55 bencoh: I looked at getting the SHR GUI software working relatively recently, about 3 years ago, when I ported SHR to the Galaxy S3 Oct 17 12:33:08 bencoh: unfortunately it's deeply bit rotted; it's all based on Enlightenment and all of the mobile-specific plugins that the SHR devs made had been removed from Enlightenment because nobody was maintaining them Oct 17 12:34:50 my conclusion at the time was that the best approach would be to spend the time on Plasma Mobile instead Oct 17 12:35:20 The problem is that that marketing gives the community wrong ideas. For example https://twitter.com/thelinuxgamer/status/1181326286830092288, "TheLinuxGamer" who you guys also did a video with, calls the Librem 5 a "GNOME phone". But it _doesn't_ just run GNOME and it _isn't_ just made for GNOME. In the original campaign, UBPorts and Plasma Mobile was promised, but from what I've seen besides giving the devkits Oct 17 12:35:21 and I guess setting up package builds for Plasma Mobile, no actual effort to getting that stuff up and running was done on Purism's side. That would be fine, if they didn't actually promise those projects for the phone. Oct 17 12:35:37 yeah, in order to run SHR now you'd likely have to go back to e17 Oct 17 12:36:26 I mean, full SHR session in a way it was intended to run in the past Oct 17 12:36:57 PureTryOut[m]: to be clear: Other People do the marketing, we developers are not involved ;-) Oct 17 12:38:02 Oh I know, I'm not blaming you guys Oct 17 12:38:04 Interesting that there are multiple Purism devs here btw actually Oct 17 12:38:17 PureTryOut[m]: regarding other projects, we have collaborations with some, like Plasma Mobile, but they're collaborations which means we do some work (like setting up automatic package builds) and the other people do work as well Oct 17 12:38:28 we've been here for years :) Oct 17 12:38:55 On the postmarketOS side we have a dev that has the Librem 5 devkit and we actively work with the Plasma Mobile devs, so at least Plasma Mobile on postmarketOS on the Librem 5 will be an option at some point 😉 Oct 17 12:39:16 well that's good to know :-) Oct 17 12:42:06 I think everybody's on the same side in this field but there are communication issues sometimes, I think some of that is because Purism is trying to market to a larger audience than just hackers Oct 17 12:42:52 sometimes it seems like people think we have infinite resources and can hire 9000 developers to get All The Projects! working Oct 17 12:43:09 we don't, we're a small bunch, and we're doing what we can Oct 17 12:43:35 cut us some slack, please! ;-) Oct 17 12:43:42 PureTryOut[m]: IMO the main problem with supporting other DEs in pureos "natively" is that we're debian stable based. this means there's already not negligible amount of work involved backporting gnome stuff, and that we have too old Qt for plamo to sensibly work etc. Oct 17 12:44:25 so yeah, I see postmarketOS as extremely important part of the whole thing there, filling that gap Oct 17 12:44:40 Then stop being Debian based */me runs* Oct 17 12:44:44 heh Oct 17 12:44:52 Joking of course 😉 Oct 17 12:44:58 I mean, I understand it all, I just dislike the marketing Oct 17 12:45:45 sure Oct 17 12:45:59 I originally backed the Librem 5 because I thought my money would go towards just the phone and I would get Plasma Mobile on release, but that ended up not being the case so I asked for a refund. I'm just still a bit salty because of it. I have no hard feelings towards Purism or the individual people, just to be clear Oct 17 12:46:00 btw, I think postmarketOS is pure awesomeness Oct 17 12:46:17 I hope to try it on the Librem 5 one day Oct 17 12:46:27 Ha, thanks Oct 17 12:46:42 although I just have one question: when are you going to port Calls? Oct 17 12:46:44 I plan to port pmOS to GTA04 some day ;D Oct 17 12:46:45 * rah runs Oct 17 12:46:56 * rah is the Calls developer btw ;-) Oct 17 12:47:45 Ah good to know. I'm also the packager of Phosh for postmarketOS so it's good to know who to talk too for things lol Oct 17 12:48:15 I doubt the GTA04 runs on an architecture we support tbh lol. Is it at least armv6? Oct 17 12:48:26 it's armv7, just like N900 Oct 17 12:49:00 very similar SoC Oct 17 12:49:17 Oh in that case it should run fine Oct 17 12:49:22 GTA02 is armv4t, would be quite a pain :) Oct 17 12:49:48 It's just that the lack of a usable interface is a problem lol Oct 17 12:50:06 Ah that's what I was confused with Oct 17 12:50:20 we'll get there Oct 17 12:50:48 Yeah we don't support that architecture lol. And even if we did, I personally wouldn't bother with it as I doubt such a device would be useful in anyway. Although it's cool just to say it runs an updated system Oct 17 12:51:29 GTA02 would be very problematic - small flash, ram, armv4t, old kernel... Oct 17 12:52:00 but GTA04 should be easy; maybe even to the point of just trying and veryfying that it indeed works :D Oct 17 12:53:33 I'd like to see phoc and phosh running there some day (and on N900 too) Oct 17 12:53:42 we need software renderer in phoc first though Oct 17 12:54:04 otherwise it will be a slideshow ;) Oct 17 12:55:09 The N900 doesn't have hardware acceleration on pmOS due to the GPU requiring blobs, which is also an issue if you want to run anything that doesn't use software rendering lol Oct 17 12:55:12 (or some heavenly angel dropping open powervr 3D drivers for us out of nowhere) Oct 17 12:56:40 yeah, I'm used to not having 3D acceleration on GNU/Linux phones Oct 17 12:57:30 Librem 5 and PinePhone are on a whole new level for me because of that Oct 17 12:58:35 Ha, if only. That'd be amazing Oct 17 12:59:17 I can't wait for this new generation of Linux phones. With mainline from the start, it won't just die off after a few years **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Oct 18 02:59:58 2019