**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Apr 19 02:59:57 2007 Apr 19 05:03:03 counter Apr 19 05:03:03 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 6 days 03:28:28 (13.145 +-13.1 days) (921,167) Apr 19 05:03:21 ooh Apr 19 05:03:23 < 2 weeks now Apr 19 05:03:33 means in a week and 4 days, it'll be pushed back another two :P Apr 19 05:05:19 cingular rep told us first iPhone allocation is 1m units Apr 19 05:06:34 and they don't get any sort of employee priority for them, first come first served Apr 19 05:07:35 Now I have to choose, iPhone, neo1973, or s60 phone with US 3g... Apr 19 06:36:59 bhima|n800: don't buy anything, since US mobile network is very poor Apr 19 07:01:15 counter Apr 19 07:01:16 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 6 days 02:29:21 (13.104 +-13.1 days) (922,167) Apr 19 07:07:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Talk:Higher_level_language_options]] [[Higher_level_language_options]] [[WiFi_support_in_OpenMoko]] Apr 19 07:22:23 (script) openmoko-neo1973: Harald Welte Re: Power management concept... Apr 19 07:23:28 good morning Apr 19 07:24:04 'lo Apr 19 07:29:48 morn Apr 19 07:43:53 openmoko: 03laforge * r1803 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/ (4 files): Apr 19 07:43:53 openmoko: * remove mmc_partition_fix since it is now in mainline u-boot Apr 19 07:43:53 openmoko: * make sure uboot-s3c2410_udc and uboot-dfu still apply (makefile hunk update) Apr 19 07:43:53 openmoko: * actually copy descriptor in DFU rather than assigning pointers Apr 19 08:00:31 * koen____ gets annoyed by FUD about font sizes Apr 19 08:03:23 (script) planet: Marcin "hrw" Juszkiewicz: Pingwinaria 2007 http://blog.haerwu.biz/2007/04/19/pingwinaria-2007-2/ Apr 19 08:05:59 Hmm. Maybe someone could translate that blog entry... =P Apr 19 08:09:35 morning Apr 19 08:09:49 Rakshasa: if I will find time I will translate presentation ;) Apr 19 08:10:27 hrw: Thanks. (In advance) ^^ Apr 19 08:25:45 openmoko: 03laforge * r1804 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/ (3 files): Apr 19 08:25:45 openmoko: * merge dynpart-absorb-bad.patch into nand-dynamic_partitions.patch Apr 19 08:25:45 openmoko: * introduce new CONFIG_NAND_DYNPART to [de]activate dynpart feature Apr 19 08:25:45 openmoko: * modularize dynpart partition size and names into per-board data structures Apr 19 08:25:45 openmoko: * use CONFIG_NAND_DYNPART and per-board data from qt2410 and neo1973 Apr 19 09:00:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Neo1973_Power_Management]] Apr 19 09:06:23 openmoko: 03andrew * r1805 10/trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/openmoko/flash.sh: Apr 19 09:06:23 openmoko: Avoid "stat" in scripts as it doesn't even pretend to be cross-platform Apr 19 09:06:23 openmoko: (see BSD), and "gstat" is too risky. Apr 19 09:11:02 mornin' Apr 19 09:29:54 hi my name is Deepank and I have been selected for GSoC this year Apr 19 09:30:17 welcome deepank Apr 19 09:30:32 I will be doing the project on ad-hoc communication via bluetooth Apr 19 09:31:11 deepank: with Werner? Apr 19 09:31:22 yes Apr 19 09:31:40 deepank: is that meaning being able to setup tcp/ip pipes to people who happen to walk past, or being able to easilly build scatternets Apr 19 09:33:19 I will aim at building a scatternet .I do not know about TCP/IP pipies as such in detail Apr 19 09:33:45 deepank: ah cool, I always liked the idea of scatternets when I was working on reference BT designs, but no-one seems to use them Apr 19 09:34:47 scatternet + free GPRS on a couple of devices and suddenly an office of phones can become internet connected Apr 19 09:34:57 call centers tremble in fear :-) Apr 19 09:35:05 :) Apr 19 09:35:38 please tell me about the way to implement it in more detail and your past experience Apr 19 09:36:02 morning Apr 19 09:36:04 deepank: I didnt ever actually build one as back in those days devices couldnt master and slave at the same time Apr 19 09:36:22 deepank: but I spent many hours reading the specs in preperations Apr 19 09:36:47 great ... can u guide me furthur Apr 19 09:37:01 deepank: after 7 years I forget all the details Apr 19 09:37:18 deepank, i have a friend who has just finished building a bluetooth gaming-network-layer for his dissertation, you may be interested in talking to him Apr 19 09:37:48 deepank: but from what I remeber contructing the net shouldnt be hard, its just making a service that will make use of it. I would suggest something like zeroconf for BT scatternet Apr 19 09:38:06 [paragOn]yes I would love to Apr 19 09:38:44 yes even i was planing to do so ... i was also recommeneded to use BlueZ-utils for the task Apr 19 09:39:18 deepank: anyway it will be an interesting 3 months for you and I really hope you make something interesting Apr 19 09:39:27 paragon: can u give me his contacts Apr 19 09:39:46 yes ... I plan to learn and do wonders in these 3 months Apr 19 09:40:51 wish me luck ... Apr 19 09:41:05 * XorA hands deepank a lorry load of lucky horseshoes Apr 19 09:41:37 deepank, i've PM'd them to you Apr 19 09:42:03 thanks XorA :) Apr 19 09:42:38 <_ASK> hello Apr 19 09:43:34 deepank: read about bnep, PAN Apr 19 09:43:56 Ok, wat is the full form of bnep Apr 19 09:44:32 got it Apr 19 09:48:08 can I have more advices regarding the way in which I must proceed .. Apr 19 09:48:36 hi everyone! buy in a couple of week from which date?? Apr 19 09:48:36 bgeradz: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Apr 19 10:05:02 bgeradz, try counter Apr 19 10:05:05 counter Apr 19 10:05:05 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 6 days 00:57:26 (13.040 +-13.0 days) (923,167) Apr 19 10:28:02 hi guys Apr 19 10:34:24 allo Apr 19 10:54:23 (script) planet: Marcin "hrw" Juszkiewicz: Feel the power of USB http://blog.haerwu.biz/2007/04/19/feel-the-power-of-usb/ Apr 19 10:54:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] Apr 19 11:09:09 counter Apr 19 11:09:10 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 6 days 00:25:24 (13.018 +-13.0 days) (924,167) Apr 19 11:11:41 can anyone verify that http://downloads.openmoko.org/sources/git_www.denx.de.git.u-boot.git..tar.gz is corrupted? Apr 19 11:11:55 fatal: corrupted pack file .git/objects/pack/pack-a146bcbc18f4826d6bf2a7f63be5dd77bbb5b2f5.pack Apr 19 11:12:53 file itself is correct Apr 19 11:13:05 unpacks ok Apr 19 11:13:30 hrw: do a git pull Apr 19 11:13:43 git pull git://www.denx.de/git/u-boot.git/ Apr 19 11:13:54 Already up-to-date. Apr 19 11:14:01 git --version Apr 19 11:14:09 1.5.1 Apr 19 11:14:54 counter Apr 19 11:14:54 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 6 days 00:22:32 (13.016 +-13.0 days) (925,167) Apr 19 11:15:01 will check with 1.4.2.3 on ltg Apr 19 11:15:19 fatal: corrupted pack file .git/objects/pack/pack-a146bcbc18f4826d6bf2a7f63be5dd77bbb5b2f5.pack Apr 19 11:15:37 hrw: should OE switch to git? :} Apr 19 11:15:55 ;D Apr 19 11:25:41 LaF0rge: mickey|zzZZzz: please take a look at #476 I have stopped the incremental build due this Apr 19 11:26:16 hrw: with out luck only 'odd' version numbers of git will work Apr 19 11:31:26 parag0n: what's "counter" ? Apr 19 11:34:33 counter Apr 19 11:34:33 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 6 days 00:12:43 (13.009 +-13.0 days) (926,167) Apr 19 11:34:37 this is counter Apr 19 11:34:57 counter? Apr 19 11:34:57 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 source: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile ; P0: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wishlist:Neo1973_P0_Review; a week, 6 days 00:12:31 (13.009 +-13.0 days) for devices for *ANYBODY* for $350 (targeting developers) (preorders: not yet) (2007-04-30); 4 months, 3 weeks, 6 days (150.017 +-15.0 days) for mass market (2007-09-15): see topic for more info (927,167) Apr 19 11:35:19 this is script which try to guess when phones will be available Apr 19 11:36:48 yes Apr 19 11:37:23 (script) openmoko-neo1973: Harald Welte Re: Power management concept... Apr 19 11:37:43 sorry, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 is another page, what's the url of the script? Apr 19 11:37:58 or am I blind or something Apr 19 11:46:02 openmoko: 03thomas * r1806 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-contacts/ (ChangeLog src/contacts-contact-pane.c): Apr 19 11:46:02 openmoko: * src/contacts-contact-pane.c: (make_widget), (update_ui): Apr 19 11:46:02 openmoko: - Add support for internally tagging multi line fields Apr 19 11:46:02 openmoko: - Add address, birthday and notes fields Apr 19 12:10:18 counter Apr 19 12:10:18 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 5 days 23:54:50 (12.996 +-13.0 days) (928,167) Apr 19 12:48:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] Apr 19 13:03:15 counter Apr 19 13:03:15 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 5 days 23:28:22 (12.978 +-13.0 days) (929,167) Apr 19 14:32:05 counter Apr 19 14:32:06 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 5 days 22:43:56 (12.947 +-12.9 days) (930,167) Apr 19 14:42:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[Web_Browser]] Apr 19 14:43:53 hi Apr 19 14:46:52 semi-topical: http://tglx.de/private/tglx/celf2007/celf-2007-keynote.pdf Apr 19 14:52:43 fledermaus: great ;) Apr 19 14:56:10 Nice artwork :) Apr 19 14:57:03 thomas gave a nice speech :) Apr 19 14:57:43 koen: You know if videos are available? Apr 19 14:57:50 the mobile phone day is today at CELF Apr 19 14:57:55 stefan_schmidt: later on Apr 19 14:58:06 koen: both cool Apr 19 15:12:19 a bit off topic Apr 19 15:12:31 but, does anybody know of any small ARM-based systems with an MMU that cost around $75 - 100 and can be plugged into (US) power Apr 19 15:16:26 dho: linksys nslu2? Apr 19 15:16:45 its ~100 eur Apr 19 15:17:04 dho: simtec may do something along those lines. Apr 19 15:17:12 hang on I'll ask one of their devs. Apr 19 15:17:34 waking the fluff :-D Apr 19 15:17:52 ethernet (10/100 minimum) is a requirement as well, which may put the price out of that range, but i dont' have to buy a bunch at once Apr 19 15:18:13 dho: nslu2 still meats that Apr 19 15:18:15 OOH Apr 19 15:18:16 dho: nslu2 has ethernet and 2xusb 2.0 Apr 19 15:18:21 Amazon has NSLU2 for $86 Apr 19 15:19:30 sucks with current GB rate that would only be about 42 quid Apr 19 15:19:36 but postage would kill Apr 19 15:19:41 I think walmart has them for $90 Apr 19 15:19:59 I think I'm going to buy 2 of them to start off with. Apr 19 15:20:04 New platform for Plan 9 I guess, heh. Apr 19 15:22:33 dho: http://www.simtec.co.uk/products/ Apr 19 15:23:14 may have something that meets your needs. Apr 19 15:23:30 of course with the current $/£ rate it'll be expensive. Apr 19 15:23:46 gumstix? Apr 19 15:24:01 LetoTo: ? Apr 19 15:24:12 gumstix are like $180 each Apr 19 15:34:13 is there any interface between framebuffer driver and jbt6k74.c lcd driver Apr 19 15:35:23 Can anybody tell me , is there any interface between framebuffer driver and jbt6k74.c lcd driver Apr 19 15:38:42 I assume that in normal case all the operation like lcd start / lcd stop should be called through framebuffer driver so there should be communication or interface between frambuffer driver and LCD driver Apr 19 15:39:12 But i didnt get it from code Apr 19 15:39:21 Can anybody clear my point Apr 19 15:39:30 thanks in adavance Apr 19 15:45:35 openmoko: 03thomas * r1807 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-contacts/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Apr 19 15:45:35 openmoko: * src/contacts-callbacks-ebook.c: (contacts_added_cb), Apr 19 15:45:35 openmoko: (contacts_changed_cb): Apr 19 15:45:35 openmoko: * src/contacts-contact-pane.c: (field_changed), (make_widget): Apr 19 15:45:35 openmoko: Plug some leaks and other potential problems Apr 19 15:50:37 Hmm. parallel fetch (pardon my gentooish dialect) would be a nice feature in mokomakefile... Apr 19 16:07:52 openmoko: 03laforge * r1808 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-s3c2440.patch: * add S3C2440 NAND driver support Apr 19 16:09:17 openmoko: 03laforge * r1809 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-hxd8.patch: Apr 19 16:09:17 openmoko: * use correct serial UART (3) for HXD8 Apr 19 16:09:17 openmoko: * add lowlevel_foo.bin building for HXD8 Apr 19 16:09:17 openmoko: * only use 300MHz core frequency due to PLL capacitor bug in early hardware Apr 19 16:09:27 Rakshasa: telll openmoko coreteam to update bitbake to 1.8 ;D Apr 19 16:11:51 ehm, cpu core? Apr 19 16:12:10 cu Apr 19 16:35:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] Apr 19 16:35:33 * koen reads http://www.gnome.org/mobile/ Apr 19 16:37:10 koen: nice touch Apr 19 16:37:38 koen_: nice touch Apr 19 17:24:31 Hello. Apr 19 17:25:55 I'll have to buy a cell phone in a month or so... I know that OpenMoko is not open to mass-market yet, but if I can qualify as a dev I'd like to try (after all, I am a developer and I'd like to get into the embedded market, just didn't have the chance yet). Apr 19 17:26:27 PupenoR: You can even buy if you are not a dev. Apr 19 17:26:37 cool! :) Apr 19 17:26:51 Would the phone work in Ireland? Apr 19 17:26:51 PupenoR: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Apr 19 17:26:52 PupenoR: But keep in mind that is under development. Not a finished product. Apr 19 17:27:08 PupenoR: It's a standard GSM phone Apr 19 17:27:15 stefan_schmidt: ok, it'll be unstable like everything around me where I can install software ;) Apr 19 17:27:48 too bad there would be problems on getting the device to Russia Apr 19 17:28:04 thresh: Why? Apr 19 17:28:23 it isnt certified by 'rostest' Apr 19 17:28:37 already had the problem with nokia n770 :/ Apr 19 17:29:07 thresh: hmm, already added this to the wiki? Apr 19 17:29:14 hmm, no Apr 19 17:29:37 thresh: Wouls be good to let people know about the problem. Perhaps they are able to care about it. Apr 19 17:30:20 right. Apr 19 17:31:08 PupenoR: So if you have all that in mind the phone would be fine for you. Even if it not always useable as phone. ;) Apr 19 17:31:38 stefan_schmidt: Ok for me... let's see if I can convince my wife. :P Apr 19 17:31:47 PupenoR: heh Apr 19 17:38:44 PupenoR: If she doesn't agree, you might be able to exchange her for at least two phones.. Apr 19 17:39:48 GaKkGaKk: what do you mean? the problem is not buying her an OpenMoko, the problem is that I have an OpenMoko and I arrive home to find her: I've been calling you for two hours, where have you been, I needed you to buy milk on your way home. I pick up the phone to find a kernel panic. Apr 19 17:41:11 PupenoR: What I really meant was... If she doesn't "let" you get this phone... You might be able to trade her away, and get one anyway :) Apr 19 17:41:35 hehehe. What a wife... she's already making excuses for me to buy it anyway :) Apr 19 17:56:01 Is the GTK lib that OpenMoko uses "complete"? Does it have all functions and such that normal GTK has? Apr 19 17:56:10 or have some functions or filetypes been removed? Apr 19 17:56:32 afaik it's complete, Apr 19 17:56:40 but applications should never rely on that Apr 19 17:56:49 I understand Apr 19 17:56:56 or rely on GTK at all Apr 19 17:57:33 counter? Apr 19 17:57:33 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 source: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile ; P0: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wishlist:Neo1973_P0_Review; a week, 5 days 21:01:13 (12.876 +-12.9 days) for devices for *ANYBODY* for $350 (targeting developers) (preorders: not yet) (2007-05-01); 4 months, 3 weeks, 5 days (149.752 +-15.0 days) for mass market (2007-09-15): see topic for more info (931,167) Apr 19 17:59:37 Hello :) Apr 19 18:01:10 Would it be possible to transfer data from one neo to another using a gsm connection? Apr 19 18:01:48 you mean gprs, I guess? Apr 19 18:02:09 Isn't it also possible over gsm? Apr 19 18:02:16 *possible* yes Apr 19 18:02:27 balrog-kun: but? :) Apr 19 18:02:43 like you could connect two computers through soundcard jacks in good old days Apr 19 18:03:40 would the transfered data be corrupted in some way? would it be possible to transfer some text data? Apr 19 18:04:10 I'm not sure it's possible when you just have AT commands for operating GSM. Dunno. Apr 19 18:04:16 with enough error checking, it would be possible and very impractical Apr 19 18:04:35 i mean connecting through your GSM operator Apr 19 18:04:37 gprs is the more elegant way? ;) Apr 19 18:04:47 not like ad-hoc Apr 19 18:04:56 yes, 5 Apr 19 18:05:04 I'm having trouble thinking of a reason not to use GPRS Apr 19 18:05:07 a/5// Apr 19 18:11:47 Anyone with a prototype device have news on what the battery is looking like? Apr 19 18:12:41 I'm so far, far from impressed with the < 12 hours of standbye from the qtopia device. ;) Apr 19 18:13:03 then you won't like this phone much Apr 19 18:13:14 well, it'll be better when suspend/resume works Apr 19 18:13:52 Yeah, I don't think this device that I'm playing with now has any sort of concept of suspend, it's just eating power all day. Apr 19 18:18:26 Would gprs be enough for simple chatting with your friends? Apr 19 18:18:44 voice or text? Apr 19 18:18:49 text ;) Apr 19 18:18:55 of course Apr 19 18:19:14 ping of ~1 second? Apr 19 18:19:57 less. Apr 19 18:25:06 koen: hi, how was your talk? Apr 19 18:25:14 koen: is anyone from Trolltech present at all? Apr 19 18:25:46 high-rez: fwiw, power management always seems to be the last thing on any oem's mind when it comes to prototypes Apr 19 18:29:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Shipping_Notes]] Apr 19 18:34:37 zecke: noone from TT Apr 19 18:34:42 and the talk went *really* well Apr 19 18:40:07 lots of MV people, though Apr 19 18:46:22 hi all Apr 19 18:46:26 i have played with my sdcard, i have partitioned etc... Apr 19 18:46:28 but actually i want to get back to work with my digital camera, how can i rastore that? i tryed with mkfs.vfat Apr 19 18:46:39 but actually not too many good happenned... Apr 19 18:56:20 koen: what do you think of the gnome announcement? Apr 19 18:57:17 pjz: it is a nice statement Apr 19 18:57:23 (script) planet: Koen Kooi: GNOME Mobile & Embedded Initiative http://dominion.kabel.utwente.nl/koen/cms/gnome-mobile-embedded-initiative Apr 19 18:57:56 but it basically is "ln .tar.bz2 GMAE/" at release time Apr 19 18:59:33 I see Apr 19 19:00:34 koen: did I mention I've handed my notice in? Apr 19 19:01:14 koen: just have to wait out the notice period and then I can finally hack on some OSS j2me stuff Apr 19 19:01:33 Stephmw: cool Apr 19 19:01:43 I hope you enjoy your new job Apr 19 19:01:52 I'm taking a break from work ;-) Apr 19 19:02:00 ... starting mid-August Apr 19 19:02:33 * koen heads out for lunch Apr 19 19:02:33 later all Apr 19 19:22:38 high-rez: flash to the latest 4.2.1 for the greenphone if you want better standyby time Apr 19 19:24:09 I'm trying to setup a dev environment with MokoMakefile - in openmoko-devel-image it is failing trying to unpack the uboot-gta01 git archive with the following message: "fatal: corrupted pack file .git/objects/pack/pack-a146bcbc18f4826d6bf2a7f63be5dd77bbb5b2f5.pack" Apr 19 19:24:11 high-rez: also, you have to go into power settings and set 'back to home screen' to get better power savings Apr 19 19:24:21 I tried re-downloading several times, so it's probably not a corrupted download Apr 19 19:24:28 any ideas what could be happening? Apr 19 19:24:29 jjongsma: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Apr 19 19:31:18 jjongsma you git seems to old Apr 19 19:31:30 i'm running 1.4.1 Apr 19 19:31:32 what is recommended? Apr 19 19:32:24 http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=476 Apr 19 19:32:33 1.4.4 or higher it seems Apr 19 19:32:42 ok, thank you! Apr 19 19:42:23 looks like it's working now, thanks Apr 19 20:02:56 counter Apr 19 20:02:56 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 5 days 19:58:31 (12.832 +-12.8 days) (932,167) Apr 19 20:22:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[FAQ]] [[User:Sleepless]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] Apr 19 20:28:02 On the Power Management Page is written, that the standby time rises significantly, if the cpu is off. Will the phone still be able to receive calls in this mode? Apr 19 20:28:26 yes Apr 19 20:28:46 it would be sensible to have a signal going from the GSM module to the embedded controller that makes it wakeup on demand. Apr 19 20:29:00 that's probably what they're doing. Apr 19 20:29:02 ah..very nice :) Apr 19 20:29:24 so standby time wil me earlier or later more than 4 days? :) Apr 19 20:29:33 dunno. Apr 19 20:32:09 350$ is about 260 euro? Apr 19 20:33:19 hopefully Apr 19 20:33:23 quickdev: yes, but usually shipping/import/taxes raises that a bit for me Apr 19 20:33:35 http://www.google.de/search?q=350%24+in+euro&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=com.ubuntu:en-US:official&client=firefox-a Apr 19 20:35:06 ah..thx Apr 19 21:07:43 Hiz Apr 19 21:07:46 counter Apr 19 21:07:47 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 5 days 19:26:06 (12.810 +-12.8 days) (933,167) Apr 19 21:31:04 OMG Apr 19 21:31:38 started using MokoMakeFile 4 hours ago, to see how OpenMoko looks for now and if there are some translatable progs :) Apr 19 21:31:53 how many hours left ? :( Apr 19 21:33:25 !counter Apr 19 21:35:41 What is the counter based on? Apr 19 21:37:17 eruptions on sun activity Apr 19 21:37:31 Sufflope depends on your machine and the speed of the web.. with 2-4mbit sdsl and a core duo 2ghz its about 6hours for the first build Apr 19 21:38:05 fast disks help... lots of configure runs which take longer than the actual compile Apr 19 21:40:12 * hrw builds on laptop with 5400rpm hdd (33MB/s) Apr 19 21:50:08 does openmoko (on the neo) support xrandr and randrrotation? Apr 19 21:51:57 yes Apr 19 21:52:46 its kdrive so it should Apr 19 21:57:11 thomasg_gpm jap Apr 19 21:57:13 ok, I just was wondering, why on all picutures in landscape-view the menu-bars were at left and right side (short sides), although using randrrotation would make it possible to have the bars top and down sided in landscape mode as well Apr 19 21:57:45 re koen Apr 19 21:58:03 hi roh Apr 19 21:58:43 thomasg_gpm the application sw is whats the most work will be in the future. till soon ago most work is gone into system level and nongui Apr 19 21:59:11 .oO(and i should go to bed soon) Apr 19 22:00:18 hope the neo will be released soon, so I can test all the things I'd like to know by myself :) Apr 19 22:01:59 in landscape the menu-bars would be taking more screen space Apr 19 22:02:21 balrog-kun, thats true Apr 19 22:02:23 and you don't have like a whole lot of content on them now Apr 19 22:02:54 so a function could be added to reduce the bars to a single one in landscape mode. but we'll see :) Apr 19 22:04:09 but thats not my problem. like I said, I was wondering why there is a landscape mode, but not with randrrotation. Apr 19 22:04:12 panels are on top/bottom in landscape Apr 19 22:04:22 but loose applets ;( Apr 19 22:04:34 hrw, not in here: http://sicherheitsschwankung.de/gallery2/gallery/d/5705-1/IMG_8396.JPG (btw. is this minimo?) Apr 19 22:05:08 http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/56329df942eab83c0db07dcdf252535c.png is what I have on device Apr 19 22:05:09 would be fun to see the screen rotate smoothly instead of entire 90 deg in one step like with randrrotation Apr 19 22:05:55 balrog-kun, but every animation takes some time. I dont like to wait until the device switches into landscape mode Apr 19 22:06:17 well, yes, this would be very heavy computationally Apr 19 22:06:31 hrw: you could do a video of your neo in action, I'd like to see the speed :) Apr 19 22:07:14 I haven't found a good "in action"-vid right now (in the wiki there's the a780/neo dial vid, but nothing else) Apr 19 22:08:26 thomasg_gpm: its slow Apr 19 22:08:59 because of the slow processor? slow software? less optimized? Apr 19 22:11:29 slow cpu gives slow gfx Apr 19 22:11:42 and theme use many pixmaps Apr 19 22:16:48 hrw: there is no coprocessor available (in the samsung bga package) for graphics? so all rendered in software, correct? Apr 19 22:17:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List]] [[WiFi_support_in_OpenMoko]] Apr 19 22:17:40 http://dev.eclipse.org/newslists/news.eclipse.dsdp.tml/msg00020.html Apr 19 22:18:26 thomasg_gpm: correct Apr 19 22:19:09 hi Apr 19 22:19:20 thomasg_gpm: looks like gta01bv5 (so called p1.5) will have s3c2440/2442/2443 instead of s3c2410 so it will be faster Apr 19 22:22:42 yes, I read this. but 266 MHz seems to be realtively much (have a symbian device with a 220 MHz ARM and 640x320), so I ask if the software shouldnt be more optimized to the current hardware base Apr 19 22:22:56 naive Apr 19 22:23:48 thomasg_gpm: ARM != ARM Apr 19 22:24:15 some ARM cpus have better gfx, some have extra dsp unit... Apr 19 22:24:25 some devices has extra gfx chips Apr 19 22:25:15 for example older VGA zaurus models have ATI W100 or Toshiba for gfx Apr 19 22:25:19 hrw: but it is an arm9 which supports co-processors, so a additional graphics processor should be possible, or am I wrong? Apr 19 22:25:38 a co-processor and a gpu are 2 different things Apr 19 22:26:16 not if the co-processor is a gpu (dont know what kinds of co processors are available) Apr 19 22:26:41 my statement covered that Apr 19 22:27:52 koen_: ~17 at your place? Apr 19 22:28:01 15:27 Apr 19 22:28:15 PDT iirc Apr 19 22:28:34 thomasg_gpm: it's possible to add a gpu coprocessor *for samsung* Apr 19 22:28:40 not for the board designer though Apr 19 22:28:59 unless some common bus is used Apr 19 22:29:43 balrog-kun, yes, I know. but the board designer could buy the soc with that gpu coprocessor Apr 19 22:30:04 shouldnt be sooo expensive, but would be useful Apr 19 22:30:10 it wouldn't Apr 19 22:30:16 why not? Apr 19 22:30:21 since you wouldn't have drivers Apr 19 22:30:35 ok, thats an argument Apr 19 22:38:34 I am currently at ncurses compilation stage, 5 hours of build :D Apr 19 22:39:19 but monotone push (or wathever the source sync is called) alone took 3-4 hours ! Apr 19 22:39:37 (I have a 4mbps ADSL line) Apr 19 22:40:01 sufflope hehe Apr 19 22:40:17 I hope there is some work for non-english translations so I didn't wait for nothing :) Apr 19 22:40:38 I can do a Engrish translation if you want Apr 19 22:40:50 ? Apr 19 22:41:21 I mean, I am willing to help translating OpenMoko in French, since it is the only way I can help Neo/OpenMoko Apr 19 23:06:23 still no release? Apr 19 23:06:35 counter Apr 19 23:06:36 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 5 days 18:26:41 (12.769 +-12.8 days) (934,167) Apr 19 23:51:22 anyone know if the same hacker kit will work with future openmoko products? Apr 19 23:55:14 Perhaps not fully. Apr 19 23:55:18 Perhaps not at all. Apr 19 23:55:30 Some of them may not even be the same CPU family. Apr 19 23:55:40 AIUI, they've said that as much as possible, yes. Apr 20 00:10:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Accelerometer_Fundamentals]] [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] [[Talk:Music_Player]] Apr 20 00:41:39 pjz every product we will do as mokos will be fully hackable. Apr 20 01:26:52 counter Apr 20 01:26:53 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1 guess: a week, 5 days 17:16:33 (12.720 +-12.7 days) (935,167) Apr 20 01:46:28 still trying to get a build working with MokoMakefile... I think I'm just about there, but it's failing in the package openmoko-devel-image, task "do_rootfs" with this error: "ERROR: Cannot satisfy the following dependencies for task-openmoko-debug: fstests" Apr 20 01:46:43 any ideas? Apr 20 01:54:44 jjongsma if thats needed make setup should build it Apr 20 01:56:29 else do cd into build, . ../setup-env , bitbake fstests Apr 20 01:56:36 it didn't... Apr 20 01:56:38 i'll try that... Apr 20 01:57:35 bitbake fstests exits with: Attempted builds: 0 Apr 20 01:59:04 have a look inside build/tmp/work/armv4t-linux/fstests-0.0+svn20060814-r1/temp Apr 20 01:59:46 there should be a logfile where it fails. put that on pastebin.ca Apr 20 02:00:42 hmm, there is no failure logged Apr 20 02:00:55 do_configure and do_compile succeeded, but do_install and do_stage are empty Apr 20 02:01:18 same here Apr 20 02:01:32 try again with just building it. change to build/ Apr 20 02:02:50 bitbake -v -D -cclean fstests Apr 20 02:03:21 ok, now it actually recompiled it. i'll try the image build again Apr 20 02:04:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List]] Apr 20 02:04:26 -c means command and clean is clear ;) build will build a package and rebuild ... quite easy if you first found out what to do and how. and be aware that bitbake is picky from where you call it. it uses relative paths Apr 20 02:04:53 ok Apr 20 02:08:20 on a different note, do you know why "make qemu" would start to boot, then fail with "Kernel panic - not syncing: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on unknown-block(0,0)" Apr 20 02:11:04 hmm, i'm still getting the same dependency error... Apr 20 02:22:37 jjongsma what distro are you building on? Apr 20 02:29:48 have you guys seen the UI on the deeda Pi? Apr 20 02:37:46 OMG "make setup && make openmoko-devel-image" finally over :) Apr 20 02:38:05 it only took 9 hours :) Apr 20 02:41:55 Sufflope congratulations Apr 20 02:42:13 then do a make update again to fetch the commits since then *duck* Apr 20 02:42:25 ;) Apr 20 02:42:34 just joking Apr 20 02:43:54 oh I just launched "make qemu" but I guess when it's over I'll launch an update ^^ Apr 20 02:44:34 that 'll be much faster then Apr 20 02:45:17 I hope so, otherwise why call it update :) Apr 20 02:46:16 but the funny part is that I'm doing this on a laptop which shall soon leave to get fixed... see you soon for 9 new gentoo-like hours :D Apr 20 02:46:16 http://www.mad4mobilephones.co.uk/news/774/ interesting UI on that **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Apr 20 02:59:57 2007