**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat May 19 02:59:56 2007 May 19 03:01:45 vfat is not being built into the modules May 19 03:01:53 i had the same problem until i formatted it ext3 :) May 19 03:07:32 whn will the phone arrive ? May 19 03:08:54 counter May 19 03:08:54 http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: a week, a day 08:51:03 (8.369 +-5.0 days) (1217;209) May 19 04:19:13 Does OpenMoko use GPE? May 19 04:35:36 "Perhaps late May"... pshhh (the sound of vapor). Man I wish these guys were a little more upfront about it. I'm betting that I won't see one until at least July at this rate May 19 04:38:16 "a little more upfront about it" - heh, what an idiot. May 19 04:38:55 hrr... crack, yeah.. May 19 04:54:54 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[WiFi_support_in_OpenMoko]] May 19 05:09:15 openmoko: 03laforge * r2035 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-20061030-neo1973.patch: put config.tmp into the correct directory (board/neo1973/gta01 rather board/neo1973) May 19 05:11:44 openmoko: 03laforge * r2036 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-dfu.patch: May 19 05:11:44 openmoko: u-boot DFU trailer support for bootloader partition. This prevents the May 19 05:11:44 openmoko: flashing of data into the bootloader partition, that is either not a u-boot May 19 05:11:44 openmoko: image, or not for the matching device and/or hardware revision. May 19 05:11:45 openmoko: To achieve this, we add a 16byte trailer at the end of u-boot.bin. The trailer May 19 05:11:47 openmoko: can be added using 'tools/mkudfu'. A new makefile target for u-boot.udfu can May 19 05:11:49 openmoko: do this for you. May 19 05:16:37 well.. if this was ordinary commercial product we would not hear about these delays and would instead get buggy product at September May 19 05:19:17 true May 19 05:19:51 question is, when is the optimal time May 19 05:20:03 too late and you miss out on the resources of others that would help May 19 05:20:18 too early and the community gets frustrated and leaves May 19 05:20:26 hopefully that day is soon ;-) May 19 05:20:44 (the release day) May 19 05:27:30 billl_ we are somehow bothered and frustraded ourselves by all the delays, but we are really trying to give you as much information as possible at the current time. May 19 05:27:52 openmoko: 03laforge * r2037 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/ (4 files): make smdk2440, smdk2443, hxd8 and gta02 support work with new udfu handling May 19 05:29:14 openmoko: 03laforge * r2038 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-mokoversion.patch: update to moko9 to reflect udfu handling May 19 05:29:25 oh, I'm not frustrated May 19 05:29:42 it's a complicated widget May 19 05:29:49 new ground is being covered May 19 05:30:05 billl_ its on the way, it just needs some time. its a mobile phone, with a immensive packaging density and a really freaking complex pcb which takes a lot more time than everybody i know of who does hardware engineering would have imagined. given all this were fairly confident that we will be able to deliver some stuff soon May 19 05:30:11 if it was opensource software only, I'd say no schedule at all May 19 05:30:17 it's done when it's done May 19 05:30:19 openmoko: 03laforge * r2039 10/trunk/oe/packages/uboot/uboot-gta01_svn.bb: prefer udfu to regular bin images May 19 05:30:27 but having a hardware pipeline kinda forces things May 19 05:30:52 billl_ yeah.. thats how i like it. do it right, no matter if it takes longer... sadly you cannot do hardware that way ;) May 19 05:34:08 right May 19 05:53:37 openmoko: 03laforge * r2040 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-dfu.patch: get_board_rev() is not universally present, this patch fixes the dfu dependency on it May 19 06:39:09 billl_: as soon as 1) the hardware is stable and 2) the software can be updated other than via JTAG, ship it! May 19 06:39:43 roh: as soon as 1) the hardware is stable and 2) the software can be updated other than via JTAG, ship it! May 19 06:39:51 then you get maximal developer time May 19 06:40:20 you MUST of course make it clear that the software is alpha quality May 19 06:41:26 pjz: this is exactly what we are doing ;) May 19 06:42:29 pjz: the problem is you only learn about all possible hardware bugs as the software evolves ;) May 19 06:45:07 how much can you do without a jtag. Is it required if you only want to develop some high level stuff and don't care about the low level stuff or the hardware. May 19 06:50:13 tholin: not required for anything above the bootloader May 19 06:51:02 (can be handy for debugging stuff, but not required to operate or reflash above bootloader, and you can even reflash bootloader without it if you're careful) May 19 06:51:38 sounds good. Then I get one when or if I need one. May 19 06:51:58 or I could just borrow my friends. May 19 06:54:54 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:Pander]] [[ChangeLog]] [[USB_Product_IDs]] [[Wish_List]] May 19 07:42:10 openmoko: 03laforge * r2041 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-s3c2410_udc.patch: May 19 07:42:10 openmoko: * fix STALL case, i.e. actually stall the USB bus if usb stack asks the May 19 07:42:10 openmoko: driver to send a stall packet. This also means that dfu-util will return a May 19 07:42:10 openmoko: proper error message in case DFU has some error (such as 'file not targeted for May 19 07:42:10 openmoko: this device') and recovers properly after it. May 19 07:42:13 openmoko: * use our own debug macros to prevent reentrance (Closes: #420) May 19 08:04:57 tag May 19 08:54:58 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:Pander]] May 19 10:55:58 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Translation]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] May 19 11:40:44 * mjr read up on jffs2 for fun, though the document was pre-nand-support May 19 11:56:10 osnews has an article about logfs May 19 11:57:46 http://www.osnews.com/comment.php?news_id=17939 May 19 12:04:45 logfs is the future May 19 12:04:52 jffs2 can't do >4GB May 19 12:05:02 and takes eons to mount May 19 12:14:57 no wonder it takes forever if you scan the whole fs at mount May 19 12:16:42 right May 19 12:16:43 :) May 19 12:16:52 that also explains why 'fsck.jffs2' doesn't exist May 19 12:16:53 wonder when logfs will be ready May 19 12:36:15 openmoko uses jffs2 for now, no? May 19 12:36:52 seems that way May 19 12:37:21 yaffs2 is turned on in the defconfig, but I wouldn't dare to use that May 19 12:37:54 but on an always-on device, who needs reboots? :) I think the mount-time is not too bad. May 19 12:37:55 !lart openmoko bugzilla May 19 12:37:56 * cdbot2 whacks openmoko bugzilla with the cluebat May 19 12:38:11 CoreDump|home: hey, it is debian stable May 19 12:38:21 zecke|study: it is ancient May 19 12:38:35 oe bugzilla == perfect =) May 19 12:39:20 how long is the mount time on the neo, btw? May 19 12:39:24 I don't like bugzilla 3.0 it looks unpolished May 19 12:40:37 it is easier to work with with 3rd-party apps May 19 12:42:08 I'm more interested in the total boot time of the neo May 19 12:43:31 My current nokia 3330 boots in 1 sec. May 19 12:43:48 It needs that time to heat up it's vacuum tubes I think May 19 12:45:07 * Kero is interested in wake-up after suspend-to-ram :) May 19 12:45:20 if qemu is any indication, boot time takes forever May 19 12:45:51 buz: no indication but OE's boot-time is bad and it is something that needs to be optimized May 19 12:46:15 so how long does a real neo take? May 19 12:46:38 i didn't measure it, but it can and should be optimized May 19 12:46:50 more like 30s or 2min? May 19 12:47:01 30s is acceptable for me, but much more is not May 19 12:47:43 see you use words like acceptable for a not yet finished product. I don't feel like answering such questions May 19 12:48:22 well in order to finish a product you'd usually have some target values May 19 12:49:20 buz: well take a look at the celf wiki and see what is possible May 19 12:56:20 which stance does the openmoko project take on propritary formats? Will mp3 decoding work out of the box? May 19 12:58:51 buz: the current P1 phone w/ default P1 image takes 1:45m from power-on to desktop May 19 12:59:05 thx ;) May 19 13:00:06 it is no indication of the finished product of course =) As zecke|break said, there is a lot of room for optimisation May 19 13:04:38 well at least it's not THAT much off May 19 13:05:43 but who reboots his phone anyway? apm suspend/resume is very fast May 19 13:05:59 well occasionally people turn them off May 19 13:06:19 and definitely when the battery is empty ;) May 19 13:07:20 ~botmail for koen page.mi.fu-berlin.de/~zecke/autobuild-openmoko.tar.gz May 19 13:14:57 tholin: good question. mp3 support - anyone? May 19 13:17:01 the user could manually add support if need be. May 19 13:17:25 But my grandmother could probably not do it herself... because she is dead. May 19 13:17:44 1:45 is faster than my s60 phone boots May 19 13:18:01 and I have to reboot that three or four times a day May 19 13:18:02 unknown_lamer: which phone? May 19 13:18:06 7610 May 19 13:18:10 worst firmware ever May 19 13:18:23 6600 takes some time to boot aswell May 19 13:18:58 i see it something like the gp2x, originally it took like a minute to start up, by firmware 2.0 it was down to like 4 seconds :D May 19 13:57:02 It's a lovely morning May 19 13:58:27 it's a lovely afternoon :) May 19 13:58:59 spring was a long time coming this year... May 19 13:59:23 my aspen trees are just now leafing out May 19 13:59:59 spring began in february. than it ended for some time and just started again :) May 19 14:00:17 de? May 19 14:00:30 hah May 19 14:00:59 I can live without this awful death-star in the sky May 19 14:01:06 s/de/northern Europe/ May 19 14:01:07 DukeOfURL meant: northern Europe? May 19 14:01:47 CoreDump|home: death star? May 19 14:01:57 aka sun =) May 19 14:02:23 I couldn't live without the sun (or the ocean) May 19 14:02:55 Does anyone know about XForms on a handheld? May 19 14:09:26 hi May 19 15:18:38 Hello May 19 15:20:38 Was already thought about a rotation sensor? For implementing some similar functions the iphone has May 19 15:22:09 ?! May 19 15:24:30 madwoota: I'm thinking of the function of the iphone where you can change to landscape mode(cross display) through rotate the phone May 19 15:24:46 Or is it covered by the accelerometer wikipage? May 19 15:25:20 quickdev: the device has an SPI and I2C bus accessible, so you can add your own orientation sensor if you'd like one... May 19 15:25:47 there's yet no plan for implementing one in the standard design May 19 15:25:59 though you're free to do whatever you like :) May 19 15:27:20 LuitvD: Yes - but couldn't it be integrated for all users - in the next hardware model? I think it's possible to implement it very simple May 19 15:27:43 And if it's implementable very easy - why not using the sweet feature in the phone? ;) May 19 15:28:04 well... the phone already has plenty of sweet features May 19 15:28:27 of course - but adding one without much effort would make it even better ;) May 19 15:28:39 n+1 small extra features adds many more hardware bugs to solve May 19 15:28:45 plus: it's not up to us to decide about the device. The Neo1973 is a product made by FIC May 19 15:29:02 and at this point the core team isn't looking for (n+1)^2 bugs to fix :) May 19 15:29:05 yeah - but it would be suggestable :P May 19 15:29:34 quickdev: just add it to the wishlist in wiki and write good enough description with use cases and it might have a chance May 19 15:29:46 yeah - I will :) May 19 15:30:40 well, that's up to FIC to decide about that. If you'd really like an orientation sensor, you can build one yourself, and connect it to the serial interfaces available as solder-pads on the mainboard of the neo May 19 15:31:52 I bet there are plenty of people who would love to have some other feature in that device, and the housing simply can't have them all May 19 15:34:41 riiight May 19 15:35:50 LuitvD: but if they are features requiring almost nothing housing space - then there's no prob ;) May 19 15:36:20 if there's a million of those features, there is a problem May 19 15:37:11 and, like guaqua said: adding something isn't done just like that. It needs a complete revision of the main PCB of the device May 19 15:37:27 and for software, adds a handfull of bugs for each new feature May 19 15:39:32 LuitvD: even if it didn't need a complete revision - it's going to take more work to get everything done May 19 15:39:50 of course May 19 16:32:08 re May 19 16:55:58 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Talk:USB_Product_IDs]] [[Wish_List]] May 19 17:17:30 counter May 19 17:17:30 http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: a week 18:42:27 (7.779 +-5.0 days) (1217;209) May 19 18:09:55 how much is the price on neo1973 expected to drop on mass market phase? May 19 18:09:56 keitsi: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) May 19 18:10:41 keitsi: I think the target is to keep the price at 350 May 19 18:10:48 not sure though... May 19 18:11:39 the only difference will be the software support, and the ability to buy it in mobile phone stores, and via carriers May 19 18:21:52 can anyone confirm this? May 19 18:22:55 not that the $350 would be a problem in my opinion, I am just being curious. May 19 18:54:14 iirc harald wrote a mail stating that accellerometers will be considered in the next generation models May 19 18:56:29 alphatwo, hrr :) May 19 19:20:15 openmoko: 03zecke * r2042 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-rssreader/ (ChangeLog src/callbacks.c): (log message trimmed) May 19 19:20:15 openmoko: 2007-05-19 Holger Freyther May 19 19:20:15 openmoko: Improve caching. org.openembedded.dev has a patch to libmrss May 19 19:20:16 openmoko: 0.17.2 to add a new method. Using this method we take over the May 19 19:20:16 openmoko: ownership of the buffer of the downloaded file. This avoid all May 19 19:20:19 openmoko: errors with mrss_write. May 19 19:20:21 openmoko: We are now caching the original file. May 19 19:21:09 mickey|moving: stefan_schmidt: You will need to pick the patch to libmrss from OE May 19 19:24:18 zecke|break: mickey|moving job. I still have no access to the oe part of the svn. May 19 19:25:04 * zecke|break searches a mice to have a right mouse button to use meld... May 19 19:25:17 * stefan_schmidt hopes mickey|moving will finish his moving soon. May 19 19:25:24 zecke|break: heh, apple pain ;) May 19 19:26:10 stefan_schmidt: badly written GNOME/KDE apps violating common HIGs May 19 19:26:22 stefan_schmidt: e.g. offering the same feature in the menu May 19 19:27:10 some doubt I have long time ago: will have openmoko support for non-touchscreen phones? May 19 19:27:30 zecke|break: Breaking HIGs is one point only have one button at the mouse another. Personally I could not live with it. May 19 19:27:58 nonickatm: We will work on this in the future May 19 19:28:25 Anyway, big headache today. bye folks May 19 19:28:34 bye and thanks May 19 19:28:57 stefan_schmidt: get well May 19 20:36:45 counter May 19 20:36:46 http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: a week 15:23:11 (7.641 +-5.0 days) (1218;209) May 19 20:39:10 i guess we'll hear something monday May 19 20:39:44 that's what we thought last week as well May 19 20:39:51 and the week before that May 19 20:39:53 =) May 19 20:41:50 Evening people. May 19 20:42:49 hi Elrond May 19 20:43:15 CoreDump|home: yeah, it's a shame how many projects can't keep to their schedule, it doesn't inspire great confidence May 19 20:43:27 Evening Elrond May 19 20:44:47 I'm surprised by the number of hardware problems they had. I mean, Taiwan beeing one of the top electronics manufacturers and all May 19 20:46:00 i think the move to China was a good one, i've dealt with them and they are very diligent and aware of time scales May 19 20:46:56 Yes, but at the same time you need to _exactly_ tell them what to do and don't leave anything up to their own interpretation :) May 19 20:47:39 hehe May 19 20:48:39 yeah May 19 20:49:35 I wonder, what happened, when the P0's flash badsector markings were lost. May 19 20:50:20 My father buys a lot of toys in China, last week, he had a toy gun he wanted to order, so he reads the product number off the package, sends it to the agency in an e-mail, they say they can't find it. They then proceed to list all the guns they think match the description, but it didn't have that particular gun. I then took a picture of the gun and sent it via e-mail. It's only then that they confirmed they had it in stock, under the exact prod May 19 20:50:20 uct number my father initially sent, heh. May 19 20:50:58 sounds in line with a lot i hear about such deals May 19 20:52:30 yes, things are so cheap though May 19 20:52:49 Elrond: they were? May 19 20:53:12 True May 19 20:53:44 one of the better stories is the one of a chinese odm shipping 110v only gear to europe after having been expressly told to ship 220v May 19 20:54:15 cant remember where i read about that one May 19 20:54:18 CoreDump|home - http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Category:Neo1973_Hardware#Bad_block May 19 20:54:42 Yeah, that kind of little details, heh. May 19 20:55:05 Elrond: ouch May 19 20:55:08 i think wrong powercords are sort of to be expected May 19 20:55:17 but wrong voltage? that sucks May 19 20:55:25 My father always needs to explicitly state that he only wants the RED fireman helmets and not the orange and pink ones, heh. May 19 20:55:59 SuN - Is it worth all the trouble? May 19 20:56:21 Oh yes, margins on that kind of products are sometimes 100% or more :) May 19 20:56:24 well you cant get toys from much other places May 19 20:57:01 And once you learn from that kind of "beginner's mistakes", the Chinese are really quite accurate. May 19 20:57:07 incldugin duty, etc.? May 19 20:57:28 And freight, etc., yes. May 19 20:57:42 But my dad has been doing this for 30 years or so, he knows stuff. May 19 20:57:42 100% margin is rather low for textiles, actually May 19 20:58:12 It depends on the kind of business as well, my father is in wholesale. May 19 20:58:20 SuN - Yeah. I'm not too used to this stuff. May 19 20:58:21 most retailers mark up more than that after buying from local wholesale May 19 20:58:29 Yep May 19 20:58:44 which again usually marks up chinese stuff 50-200% May 19 20:59:07 If the world knew... they'd never buy anything from China again, heh. May 19 20:59:15 CoreDump|home - And i wonder, if there is a "recommended way" to mittigate this thing. May 19 20:59:24 pollution is really getting out of hand May 19 21:00:01 (number one reason why i would turn down a china job, really) May 19 21:00:35 buz - political system would be number one for me, I think. May 19 21:00:45 from what i hear, that's less of an issue May 19 21:00:55 but the crowded cities can easily drive you crazy May 19 21:14:22 hi May 19 21:14:42 Hi Nebukadneza May 19 21:15:35 are there any news on the status of the current hardware? May 19 21:16:09 Couple of weeks or so May 19 21:16:11 likely. May 19 21:16:21 hm May 19 21:16:51 its always the same, really May 19 21:17:18 seems like it ;P May 19 21:17:41 just felt like asking becaus i thought after the production session on the 10th there could be some news ;P May 19 21:18:56 yeah we all thought that ;) May 19 21:20:50 :P May 19 21:20:58 oh by the way, another question on the hardware May 19 21:21:21 is the jtag standard jtag, or is it some weired connector? May 19 21:21:43 i mean, i could build me a usb jtag interface May 19 21:21:53 just the question whether i can connect it to the neo May 19 21:23:19 BTW: Is the pinout of the debug connector public? May 19 21:24:13 Nebukadneza - It's a nonstandard connector... hence I'm asking for the pinout. A friend offered me to build a jtag thingy. May 19 21:24:55 hm May 19 21:25:01 seems like the connector is a felxcable May 19 21:25:08 no way to built a adaptor for *that* May 19 21:25:14 Sure there is. May 19 21:25:35 You can get flex cables of many sizes. May 19 21:25:39 Or even etch them. May 19 21:26:10 hm May 19 21:26:15 Isn't the connector on the phone just a standard thingy? May 19 21:26:19 where would you get such a cable May 19 21:26:24 Elrond: doesnt look like it May 19 21:26:27 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Image:Gta01b_v2_debugport_open.jpg May 19 21:26:29 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Image:Debug_board_connector_closed_with_cable.jpg May 19 21:26:38 SpeedEvil: where May 19 21:26:47 i looked for flexcables for many applications May 19 21:26:51 never found one though May 19 21:27:03 IIRC digikey has some. May 19 21:27:20 thats a us company May 19 21:27:25 So? May 19 21:27:33 They deliver to most civilised places. May 19 21:27:34 for the shipping i could almost order a hackers lunchbox May 19 21:27:41 It's not _that_ bad. May 19 21:27:54 and shipping back if it doesnt fit May 19 21:27:56 Free over 100 quid here. (neglecting the tax) May 19 21:28:19 Nebukadneza - It's really not that bad. A friend ordered his sirf3 in .us (I'm in the same country as you, guessing from your hostmask) May 19 21:28:42 Just there's a nice chance of having fun with customs. May 19 21:29:24 But still the question of pinlayout. May 19 21:29:35 i also cant find information about size and how many lines the cable should have May 19 21:29:38 yep, and that May 19 21:29:54 Nebukadneza: there are really quite HR images of the connecotr. May 19 21:30:21 SpeedEvil: for measuring the size? Oo May 19 21:30:24 Yeah, we can guess that up. May 19 21:30:31 images cant possibly help to measure the size May 19 21:30:47 Course they can. May 19 21:30:54 The size of the display is known. May 19 21:30:57 You've got known IC pitches. May 19 21:31:04 SpeedEvil: knowing the macro level, the magnification level and the sensor size May 19 21:31:17 and the angel in which the photo was taken May 19 21:31:31 It's then just a matter of orthorectification, and working it otu. May 19 21:31:38 also on the debug board page they talk about a 20pin JTAG, i only know 5 and 8 pin jtag May 19 21:31:41 Nebukadneza - No need for that. We have sizes for other parts, so simple scaling will do. May 19 21:32:09 Nebukadneza - ARM-jtag seems to be 20pin standard. May 19 21:33:47 Oo May 19 21:33:52 9 of the 20 lines are GND May 19 21:33:57 lol May 19 21:34:22 hehe. May 19 21:34:49 now thats what i call "lets just add some lines becaus the 20lines cable costs a little less than the 11lines which isnt as common" May 19 21:36:03 SuN i hear king kong has made an appearance in the Netherlands, a gorilla called Bokito has made an escape May 19 21:36:19 Yeah, and seriously injured a woman too. May 19 21:36:28 ? May 19 21:36:52 Did it carry her up a tall building, and attempt to ravish her? May 19 21:37:08 Rumour has it this woman was in the zoo watching the gorillas almost daily, and darker rumour has it that she had been teasing the gorillas. May 19 21:37:22 Nah he just bit her and smacked her up. May 19 21:38:22 yeah i heard bit her as well, an 11year old gorilla suddenly realises that it can climb up the fence, what took it so long?! May 19 21:38:41 Never wanted to sufficiently. May 19 21:38:50 :D exactly. May 19 21:39:10 I know what I would do if I was fed at regular times and was given a nice environment to live in. May 19 21:40:11 Hang on IRC all day? May 19 21:40:23 Spot on :) May 19 21:42:01 haha nice May 19 21:42:34 Judging from the crowd I encounter on IRC, many of them might actually be gorillas, heh. May 19 21:43:01 '13 year old girl' (gorilla) May 19 21:47:35 The difference is: the gorilla can handle simple tools. May 19 22:56:58 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] May 19 22:59:08 webjames: the gorilla didn't climb over a fence... It jumped over the water May 19 22:59:20 which is odd.. May 19 23:06:55 yes, i suppose it is.. maybe gorillas don't like jumping, but the women on the other side looked tasty, or was tormenting it May 19 23:07:42 gorillas can jump... they're just afraid of water May 19 23:07:49 somehow, Bokito wasn't May 20 00:20:08 Looking at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Dfu-util#--list how does one get from "Runtime Mode" to "DFU Mode"? May 20 00:21:48 dfu-util does that for your as long as your are in u-boot mode May 20 00:24:38 CoreDump|home - Can't dfu-util do it just so to get the full "alt=*", "name=*" list? May 20 00:24:55 hrm May 20 00:24:59 well, dunno May 20 00:28:33 Okay, so if I see a "DFU runtime", I can go ahead and flash something into the device? May 20 00:30:50 you can flash when you are in the u-boot mode May 20 00:31:08 if the device isn't ready, dfu-util will tell you =) May 20 00:31:35 Yeah. May 20 00:32:19 how did you manage to get a neo anyway? ;) May 20 00:32:24 kids in ameriiicaaa May 20 00:33:26 CoreDump|home - A kind person (who now has a P1) borrowed me his P0 a few days ago. :) May 20 00:33:40 i see May 20 00:33:58 And as usual, I find all bugs. ;o) May 20 00:34:06 it's full of them =D May 20 00:34:13 lol May 20 00:34:20 what about the p1? May 20 00:34:32 Well, not only hardware bugs. ;) May 20 00:35:15 I just read some code and think, I need to review it tomorrow (when I'm more awake) again. ;) May 20 00:35:19 Bish: P1 behaves fine May 20 00:35:26 <3 May 20 00:35:30 i really want to buy this phone May 20 00:35:50 what is about the video aspect? will it be able to play videos like a movie? May 20 00:36:06 AFAIK, not at fullscreen =( May 20 00:36:27 probably not. May 20 00:36:47 .. hm even p2 ? May 20 00:37:04 It will play videos fullscreen. May 20 00:37:06 At half res. May 20 00:37:15 02:36 < Bish> .. hm even p2 ? May 20 00:37:16 *G* May 20 00:37:17 !!! ? May 20 00:37:24 Bish - We don't know. May 20 00:37:33 but WHAT do you think :/ May 20 00:37:47 i really would like to use it as mobile cinema , too May 20 00:38:06 we all would May 20 00:38:17 man that would be a big minus for 1973 May 20 00:38:21 Not me ;) May 20 00:38:55 i bet u live in console , Elrond May 20 00:40:10 IME. May 20 00:40:16 IMO rather. May 20 00:40:21 For 2.8" screen. May 20 00:40:25 Even quarter res is fine. May 20 00:40:32 160*120 May 20 00:40:38 At something like 200kbps May 20 00:40:58 Bish - Well, *I* live in the real world. :) If you mean, that I like consoles: Yes. May 20 00:41:06 lol , yeah May 20 00:41:23 SpeedEvil: but fullscreen lucks fuking better :/ May 20 00:41:29 looks* man damn alcohol May 20 00:41:52 Fullscreen, software expanded May 20 00:42:04 It does half resolution natively - the LCD May 20 00:42:09 320*240 May 20 00:42:21 SpeedEvil - Oh yes. I showed the thing of to a friend (he's working in the embedded area) with mostly good eyes. Even he thinks the fonts are too small. ;o) May 20 00:42:35 At normal viewing distances, 120*160 is quite reasonable DPI May 20 00:42:38 SpeedEvil - ... so QVGA or anything would be fine. :) May 20 00:42:51 * Bish prays that fullscreen will be possible May 20 00:43:06 Not really. May 20 00:43:15 There simply isn't enough CPU to decode at 640*480 May 20 00:43:32 but the cpu will be faster at P2 May 20 00:43:37 wont it? May 20 00:43:42 oh please .P May 20 00:43:49 You will not be able to see the difference. May 20 00:44:07 Between fullscreen, and half res. Unless you bring the screen within 20cm or so May 20 00:44:19 ah i now i got it.. May 20 00:44:26 It's a damn small screen. May 20 00:44:38 damn small? .. hm compared with my samsung d500 lol May 20 00:44:39 300dpi color is dman high res. May 20 00:44:49 2.8" May 20 00:45:23 im sure u guys will make openmoko/neo1973 quite cool May 20 00:45:41 Bish - You can also make it cool. ;) May 20 00:47:15 yeah, but my coding skills are not that good xD May 20 00:47:47 i even just using linux for 6 month May 20 00:47:56 translation? ;) May 20 00:47:59 ah sure.. May 20 00:48:16 but there are more than enough german translators May 20 00:48:25 hehe. ;o) May 20 00:48:42 How many percents of the people in this channel are from .de? ;) May 20 00:48:43 it was a joke right? coz my english is bad at the moment :P May 20 00:49:01 =D May 20 00:49:16 i dont know xD May 20 00:49:20 Bish - Or learn the wiki by heart and answer questions here and/or on the ML. ;o) May 20 00:49:28