**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Jul 26 02:59:56 2007 Jul 26 03:00:59 hey jason1 ive got a question Jul 26 03:01:07 k Jul 26 03:01:29 when you recieved your shipping confirmation, did you recieve it during the day, or was it sent over night Jul 26 03:01:47 im trying to figure out if theyre sending them from taiwan or from fic america Jul 26 03:01:55 ~5:50am this morning (same day that it was delivered) Jul 26 03:02:02 tight Jul 26 03:02:09 that would be 3:50am California time Jul 26 03:02:23 so it was sent from taiwan at the end of their work day Jul 26 03:02:34 seems to be... Jul 26 03:02:58 hopefully more will get confirmations tomorrow... Jul 26 03:03:17 yeah i had trouble with my cc, it was declined for fraud protection Jul 26 03:03:25 finally got charged yesterday Jul 26 03:03:28 sublime_: mine too. Jul 26 03:04:11 im hoping im still in on the first batch and i wont have to wait till next week Jul 26 03:04:29 if i am in on the first batch i should get conf tonight Jul 26 03:04:33 Wel. Jul 26 03:04:37 sublime_: Did oyu order the blk/silver? Jul 26 03:04:41 yeah Jul 26 03:04:48 RT#? Jul 26 03:04:51 cool. Jul 26 03:04:52 1843 Jul 26 03:05:02 but i didnt get charged till last night Jul 26 03:05:15 my dilemna Jul 26 03:05:49 My cc still hasn't been charged, but I just got my "Payment Rec'd" msg last night Jul 26 03:06:06 Should I be charged more than a day after? Jul 26 03:06:59 gtg later Jul 26 03:07:12 Jason1: Did you get your phone? Jul 26 03:12:57 someonehas compilled pngbook, sucessfully Jul 26 03:12:59 ? Jul 26 03:15:16 is for quemu Jul 26 03:15:32 qemu Jul 26 03:18:14 SpeedEvil: BlueTooth BlueCore4 ROM chip can draw < 1 ma while in page scan Jul 26 03:18:33 just need to wire it properly Jul 26 03:21:12 writchie: have you worked with these - or are you going by the datasheets Jul 26 03:23:55 havn't worked with this particular chip - going by datasheet & app notes. Jul 26 03:24:14 * mokobot mugs Jason1 for his neo and gives it to ScaredyCat Jul 26 03:25:29 SpeedEvil: if its not wired up, may be able to hack an external module of similar type for testing Jul 26 03:26:40 im at the OpenMoko BOF at OSCON Jul 26 03:26:57 noone official has shown up yet Jul 26 03:35:19 Hallelujah! Jul 26 03:36:06 mokobot, did you get your shipment notification? Jul 26 03:37:09 mokobot is a dysfunctional computer program. Jul 26 03:37:25 hehehe Jul 26 03:37:33 hello my moko monkeys Jul 26 03:37:35 Jason1: you're a celeb here Jul 26 03:37:39 Jason1: we're talking about you Jul 26 03:38:04 there are 23 people at this BOF Jul 26 03:38:10 You should see it when I try to go out in public :) Jul 26 03:38:31 don-o: Meet anyone interesting? Jul 26 03:40:47 :) Jul 26 03:41:04 how many have neos? Jul 26 03:41:24 happycube, Jason1 ... and that is it Jul 26 03:41:27 ;-) Jul 26 03:41:27 lol Jul 26 03:41:34 lucky guy Jul 26 03:41:47 Im not at the conference, however... Jul 26 03:41:57 so it does actually exist.. :) Jul 26 03:42:09 ajmitch: Yep :) Sure does Jul 26 03:42:39 what have you got working on it so far? I saw you managed to make a call manually Jul 26 03:44:57 ajmitch: Yeah. Been making good progress. Got a call via the GUI to go through. Very finicky. The GUI likes to crash if you look at it the wrong way. Also, you have to manually adjust the volume or you get an awful feedback noise Jul 26 03:45:13 Also, played an MP3 file. Jul 26 03:45:20 and reflashed it twice... Jul 26 03:46:06 Jason1: cool. i just read that sentance outloud to the group Jul 26 03:46:13 and removed the gps binary? :) Jul 26 03:46:26 yeah. Im kicking myself for that. Jul 26 03:46:41 ah well, others should get their phones in the next day or two, I hope Jul 26 03:47:03 there's no sms functionality at all yet, right? Jul 26 03:47:28 Not sure. You might be able to do it via libgsmd-tool Jul 26 03:47:57 * ajmitch is thinking that there could be some useful interaction between gps & sms & other apps Jul 26 03:48:07 ajmitch: ohh yeah Jul 26 03:48:18 like telling someone where you are, or where to go to from a map Jul 26 03:48:23 i'm tempted to pick up pygtk and write a ui in that Jul 26 03:48:35 and/or some means of easily writing code on the phone (usually while tethered) Jul 26 03:49:09 i *do* have a 2gb microsd i can put in... that'd fit gcc et al ;) Jul 26 03:49:17 happycube: that's what I plan to do, hopefuly getting a decent sized microSD card for it Jul 26 03:49:26 in the us they're $35 at costco Jul 26 03:49:48 fairly cheap here, too :) Jul 26 03:50:21 there's a pycairo isn't there? Jul 26 03:50:25 yes Jul 26 03:50:44 * ajmitch has done a bit of coding with pygtk lately Jul 26 03:50:48 cool Jul 26 03:51:15 I'm sure I'll be able to get emacs onto the phone, too ;) Jul 26 03:53:55 finally, I knew why my order still not arrive yet Jul 26 03:53:56 :) Jul 26 03:54:01 aw - why? Jul 26 03:54:11 crappy shopping system did not take my YES_I_DO Jul 26 03:54:34 Sean help me to find out my order, he told me that I did not confirmed my order. Jul 26 03:55:02 LOL and to think that I was suckered into the YES_I_DO thing more than 20 years ago Jul 26 03:55:12 argh Jul 26 03:55:31 drkludge, what do u mean? Jul 26 03:55:41 damn, i have to wait for another week Jul 26 03:55:48 I do as in getting married Jul 26 03:55:57 ;-) Jul 26 03:56:00 haha, i c Jul 26 03:56:10 sounds you are happy with that Jul 26 03:56:28 lol Jul 26 03:56:32 drkludge, it is good you only say once Jul 26 03:56:34 hey my pphones on the way Jul 26 03:57:04 Sean told me they start to ship orders today. Jul 26 03:57:05 No problems with the WAF, Wife Acceptance Factor Jul 26 03:57:16 but how come so many people get it before today? Jul 26 03:57:35 jackey: I think they actually started shipping yesterday Jul 26 03:58:21 Jason1, i c, sorry about my temper. Jul 26 03:58:22 someone brought a P1! Jul 26 03:58:31 i am a bad guy here Jul 26 03:58:31 :) Jul 26 03:58:42 don-o: ohh cool! Jul 26 03:58:56 jackey: hehe Jul 26 04:00:15 it seems that i can not bring it with me for Linux World Jul 26 04:00:53 RFID reader in phone, then put RFID tags in wallet, keys, etc and set up optional alarms when one of them leaves detection range. Perhaps the next version after this.... Jul 26 04:01:07 Jason1: its battery is dead. oh noes. Jul 26 04:01:16 Jason1: at least i got to hold it Jul 26 04:01:21 don-o: Ohhh no!!! Jul 26 04:01:28 don-o: What did you think? Jul 26 04:01:33 don-o: First time seing one? Jul 26 04:01:46 Lots of people have crazy ideas about the phones Jul 26 04:02:02 oh man, i know why i am a bad guy here. Jul 26 04:02:32 neo to be a toy or a product, which one you will choose? Jul 26 04:03:07 Jason1: its slightly big/thick but still very phone-like in its feel Jul 26 04:03:40 don-o: I thought it was thinner than the pictures portayed. I was pleasently surprised. Jul 26 04:03:57 don-o, u actually glue one? or just a prototype Jul 26 04:04:32 jackey: don-o is at a conference. They passed one around hte room Jul 26 04:04:35 jackey: a linux journalist got a phone yesterday. i assume by the timing that it is a P1 Jul 26 04:05:08 P1 with RFID feature buildin? Jul 26 04:06:26 time to sleep, no more openmoko and neo. Do not want to say YES_I_DO twice. Jul 26 04:08:17 sleep well Jul 26 04:08:30 Chairboy: ... Jul 26 04:08:32 Chairboy: dude. Jul 26 04:08:36 Chairboy: that is an awesome idea. Jul 26 04:09:09 Jason1: what is the little IRDA window thing on the upper left side? Jul 26 04:09:20 that is the AUX button Jul 26 04:09:21 Someone else requested an RFID reader. That'll just have to be a software idea for a future revision that has it maybe. :D Jul 26 04:09:28 Jason1: a button? oh. Jul 26 04:09:42 yup. It has 2 buttons. POWER and AUX Jul 26 04:10:11 don-o: Did they show the accessories too? Jul 26 04:11:34 Jason1: nope just the phone Jul 26 04:11:54 I was fairly impressed with them. The lanyard and pouch are pretty slick Jul 26 04:12:00 thu journalist is from http://tvlinux.org/ Jul 26 04:12:11 oh we did see the pouch Jul 26 04:12:16 the stylus is a bit cheap feeling, but it is 4-in-1 Jul 26 04:12:27 its still charging and wont turn on at the moment :( Jul 26 04:12:57 don-o: I was shocked that hte device shipped w/o a rootfs. Jul 26 04:13:10 I had to scramble to figure out how to flash it :) Jul 26 04:13:40 it's a test, i think ;0 Jul 26 04:13:41 ;) Jul 26 04:13:49 Jason1, you mean a moko? Jul 26 04:13:55 happycube: It definately tested me. Jul 26 04:13:56 and what do you mean without a rootfs? Jul 26 04:14:06 like no software on it? Jul 26 04:14:27 holycow: Yeah. It wont boot when you get it. Jul 26 04:14:38 Jason1, weird! you fixed it eh? Jul 26 04:15:37 holycow: yeah. you have to do this: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Flashing_openmoko Jul 26 04:15:50 aha Jul 26 04:15:51 neato Jul 26 04:16:43 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Vancouver]] [[Main_Page]] [[Flashing_openmoko]] Jul 26 04:19:09 roh: yt? Jul 26 04:25:22 hey duffyd Jul 26 04:25:38 hi ajmitch, how's tricks? Jul 26 04:25:44 good :) Jul 26 04:25:45 what's the weather like over there at the moment? Jul 26 04:26:02 quite nice this week, actually Jul 26 04:26:25 * ajmitch is just waiting patiently for a neo :) Jul 26 04:26:53 ajmitch: me three Jul 26 04:27:16 interesting to hear that Jason1 got one that was unbootable, though Jul 26 04:27:25 ajmitch: have you received a payment received confirmation mail yet? Jul 26 04:27:28 yeah true Jul 26 04:27:43 no, but I'm not the one who put in the group order Jul 26 04:27:48 I'm probably too busy to play with mine yet anyway :| Jul 26 04:27:57 * ajmitch points at hads Jul 26 04:28:01 duffyd: No, he hasn't :) Jul 26 04:28:35 hads: mmm, do you mind me asking what your order number is? Jul 26 04:28:55 mine is #2018 Jul 26 04:29:06 #26 something Jul 26 04:29:10 k Jul 26 04:29:20 #2672 Jul 26 04:29:37 So late enough to be in the second lot I guess. Jul 26 04:30:17 true, frustrating thing is, when I look at the P1_Owners page in the wiki, all those around me have received confirmation emails :-( Jul 26 04:30:36 * duffyd is dazed/confused Jul 26 04:30:43 :) Jul 26 04:30:51 hads: btw where are you based? Jul 26 04:31:05 South Island, New Zealand. Jul 26 04:31:40 hads: cool, my stomping ground too :-) Jul 26 04:31:44 well chch to be precise Jul 26 04:31:58 currently staying in Taiwan (hooray) until beginning of September Jul 26 04:32:19 I'm in Timaru Jul 26 04:32:31 Must be nice. Things are really wet here in Texas at the moment. Jul 26 04:33:01 hads: come to think of it, I've already asked you this question (in the past ;-) Jul 26 04:33:37 I thought I had deja vu :) Jul 26 04:35:14 hads: lol Jul 26 04:39:48 * ajmitch is hopeful that the phone will arrive before the start of september :) Jul 26 04:42:31 I've got a conference project to finish for the 15th August so I probably won't have time to play until then :( Jul 26 04:43:05 ajmitch: I'm definitely hopeful too! Jul 26 04:46:15 hads: given that they'll be probably another week or so for the second batch, there probably won't be too long that it'll sit alone on your desk Jul 26 04:47:39 True. There's another week on that 'cause I have to go to the conference and supervise the software make sure it doesn't explode :) Jul 26 04:48:01 moin Jul 26 04:49:10 hads: as long as you remember to send a phone south :) Jul 26 04:51:31 hads: what conference? Jul 26 04:56:27 ajmitch: Of course :) Jul 26 04:57:24 oscon Jul 26 04:57:31 ahhhh Jul 26 04:57:33 portland right? Jul 26 04:57:40 or is ubuntu live still going on? Jul 26 04:58:11 duffyd: It's some random conference in the financial sector. In Sydney. The wanted software to manage online registrations and create lanyard labels on the day etc. Jul 26 04:59:15 oh cool Jul 26 05:00:20 roh: ping Jul 26 05:14:27 * ScaredyCat sighs Jul 26 05:23:23 Iiiik, I've been offline for 14h or so, anything happened? Jul 26 05:23:33 oh, things have shipped places, interesting :) Jul 26 05:26:14 i cant wait for the neo <3 Jul 26 05:26:20 i soo want that lanyard Jul 26 05:32:00 counter Jul 26 05:32:00 (last update 2007-07-21 06:20) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Shipping prob. 75% in a day 03:13:57 (1.135±1.1 days) (1779;251) Jul 26 05:44:34 hello my moko monkeys Jul 26 06:11:19 DCC SEND LOLDONGSLOLDONGSLOLDONGSLOLDONGS 0 0 0 Jul 26 06:16:02 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Talk:Neo1973_Power_Management]] [[Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973]] [[Hear_Me_FIC]] Jul 26 06:27:09 What type of speeds do you get out of USB net? Jul 26 06:29:33 hads: If you're not asking specifically about neo, my ipaq gives me something around 0.5MByte/s (USB1.1) Jul 26 06:30:17 mmp: Thanks, that's helpful. I was thinking about the neo but it should be similar. Jul 26 06:46:20 Did jason1 received his neo? Jul 26 06:46:45 Dmitry_Platonov, yes Jul 26 06:48:23 How he liked it? Was it able to call? Jul 26 06:49:36 what have you got working on it so far? I saw you managed to make a call manually Jul 26 06:49:45 ajmitch: Yeah. Been making good progress. Got a call via the GUI to go through. Very finicky. The GUI likes to crash if you look at it the wrong way. Also, you have to manually adjust the volume or you get an awful feedback noise Jul 26 06:49:45 Also, played an MP3 file. Jul 26 06:49:46 and reflashed it twice... Jul 26 06:52:18 daMaestro, thanks. Sounds good :) Jul 26 06:52:54 DCC SEND loldongsloldongsloldongslol 0 0 0 Jul 26 07:31:12 Hello World\n Jul 26 07:38:31 morning Jul 26 07:39:20 morning TRIsoft, and morning from me too Jul 26 07:40:04 morning Placid :) Jul 26 07:42:18 * FuzzyCat sighs too Jul 26 07:42:36 * mokobot hands ScaredyCat Jason1's neo Jul 26 07:43:02 that seems to be the only way to get one Jul 26 07:45:47 The worst invention in the world was the snooze button Jul 26 07:46:45 nah Jul 26 07:46:49 the snooze button is great! Jul 26 07:47:02 it allows me to sleep in _and_ have a bad excuse, all at once! Jul 26 07:48:23 Hello Master Jul 26 07:50:32 blindcoder: heh Jul 26 07:56:10 * CM|Vacation still haven't recieved any mail or Neo Jul 26 07:57:28 Has anyone received a Neo yet? (Other than the free dev handouts earlier) Jul 26 07:57:47 Yes, look at the wiki Jul 26 07:58:29 CM|Vacation: neither have I, but it is still early .. Jul 26 08:03:04 sannes: Jason1 got his yesterday! Jul 26 08:03:40 Still, I won't be back home to recieve it for another week anyway, but a tracking number would be nice :) Jul 26 08:05:02 CM|Vacation, indeed :) Jul 26 08:05:43 Jason1: needs to hand i over. Jul 26 08:12:45 gah Jul 26 08:12:54 they refused my credit card :( Jul 26 08:13:00 i want my neo Jul 26 08:15:55 hi Jul 26 08:17:03 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Group_Order]] [[Hear_Me_FIC]] Jul 26 08:28:04 meh i just switched from #1985 to #4474 in the order queue :( Jul 26 08:28:30 Tv: outch! Jul 26 08:30:41 trying to rescue it... Jul 26 08:32:45 CM|Vacation: seems that they are sending to US folks first .. Jul 26 08:36:09 its like chucking raw flesh into a pirahna task here Jul 26 09:01:57 why do people keep bringing up the fecking forums on the mailing list., there is one if you like it use it, if you don't don't .. just stop fecking going on about it Jul 26 09:02:59 * Kero stopped rambling about forums :) Jul 26 09:03:24 now some gimp is going on about newgroups... Jul 26 09:03:36 Hm, someone from outside of US got a tracking number now .. hmm Jul 26 09:03:40 !# Jul 26 09:03:44 CM ? Jul 26 09:03:46 well, I do support the idea that just using gmane as forum would suffice Jul 26 09:03:58 but then, it's not my decision to make, so why flame about it? Jul 26 09:04:04 CM|Vacation: got one yet? :P Jul 26 09:04:16 sannes: :-P Jul 26 09:04:24 I wish.. Jul 26 09:04:34 so who was it sannes Jul 26 09:04:34 ? Jul 26 09:05:27 FuzzyCat: #1878 Mahender Norway Requested S/B 1x Neo Advanced July 24 July 26 Jul 26 09:06:07 !!1 Jul 26 09:06:12 onetyone! Jul 26 09:06:41 FuzzyCat: ? Jul 26 09:06:49 well that's not in order is it Jul 26 09:07:25 no, I also ordered an Neo Advanced to Norway aswell with a lower number Jul 26 09:07:30 Norway must be more experimental than we think :) Jul 26 09:07:51 express vs normal shipping ? Jul 26 09:08:23 Hmm: http://www.darkroastedblend.com/2007/07/anything-for-perfect-shot.html Jul 26 09:08:25 Anyone know what this is about: "Also worth mentioning, java-gnome (exciting work, and a really excellent presentation to highlight that) and OpenMoko, the latter of which I'm currently working on. Hopefully Jul 26 09:08:45 they'll be some news regarding that soon." Jul 26 09:15:24 * CM|Vacation is off for anonther nice 6-hour drive Jul 26 09:15:50 snif... HOW can I get DISTRO_EXTRA_RDEPENDS work :( ... Jul 26 09:16:31 this is frustrating. Now I have an IPK but I cant use it ! Jul 26 09:20:17 squalyl: DISTRO_EXTRA_RDEPENDS is not to tweak for users Jul 26 09:35:22 * Psi_ looks at topci Jul 26 09:35:25 *topic Jul 26 09:36:27 FuzzyCat: why the 'failed' in topic? Jul 26 09:37:44 i assume he means they weren't sent on that day Jul 26 09:40:39 * SpeedEvil sigs. Jul 26 09:40:59 yes, being facecious Jul 26 09:41:47 what failed? :p Jul 26 09:42:46 does anyone know much about 'saver' intl shipping, ive not heard of it before Jul 26 09:43:05 any idea of time for neo->NZ using saver? Jul 26 09:43:10 look it up on ups Jul 26 09:43:18 ah, so its a form of ups Jul 26 09:43:26 i think its 2 days to major bussiness center Jul 26 09:44:06 http://www.ups.com/content/us/en/shipping/time/service/worldwide_saver.html Jul 26 09:47:03 FuzzyCat, thanks Jul 26 09:47:14 looks to be ~ 3days Jul 26 09:47:35 maybe 2 Jul 26 09:48:28 Psi_: Probably 3-5 Jul 26 09:48:58 Plus 1 or 2 for customs maybe. Jul 26 09:49:01 yeah Jul 26 09:49:54 na NZ customs are far to busy looking for drugs to bother with getting tax from a neo Jul 26 09:50:34 Um, sure. Jul 26 09:50:48 i was in the auckland customs center today, cracking the password on a xray machine Jul 26 09:53:36 was a new model they were sent with a pw that didnt work :( Jul 26 09:55:51 Psi_: did you find the DFU image on the wiki? Jul 26 09:56:19 was i supposed to be looking for it? Jul 26 09:58:36 Sorry - attempted coming misunderstanding of X-ray-machine operating system. Jul 26 09:58:40 comic Jul 26 09:59:08 ah Jul 26 10:01:27 http://www.medisoncelebrity.com/ Jul 26 10:03:07 scam Jul 26 10:03:10 99% sure Jul 26 10:03:13 yeah Jul 26 10:03:23 really? Jul 26 10:03:24 was a warning on slashdot about it Jul 26 10:03:28 shit... Jul 26 10:03:30 BEWARE or something Jul 26 10:03:45 That link SFW? Jul 26 10:03:58 yes Jul 26 10:04:01 Thanks Jul 26 10:04:07 unless you find laptops offensive Jul 26 10:04:36 a laptop is always better when the stripper is crying! Jul 26 10:04:59 cjb_ie: :D Jul 26 10:05:20 Psi_: haha Jul 26 10:06:01 think about it, 4-6weeks is exactly how long it takes for credit card fraud claims to time out Jul 26 10:06:01 and also, the BOM of the laptop is higher than the selling price Jul 26 10:06:03 Hi, news on shipping for rest of the world? Jul 26 10:07:08 Tyrael, other than the word "failed" in the topic we dont know Jul 26 10:07:21 and even that we dont know what it means :P Jul 26 10:08:10 'BOM'? Jul 26 10:08:19 bill of materials Jul 26 10:10:48 Well - are they in fact an authrised reseller - that'd be easy too find out buz Jul 26 10:10:48 Psi_: It probably just failed as they didn't get it out the door before 25th of July was over .. I guess Jul 26 10:11:26 yeah Jul 26 10:11:30 that would be my guess too Jul 26 10:13:53 ok Jul 26 10:14:48 a days delay in OpenMoko stuff is like a seconds delay in the normal world :-D Jul 26 10:15:51 heh Jul 26 10:16:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[User:ChooseOpen]] Jul 26 10:16:55 at least, we know that Phase 1 neos actually exist Jul 26 10:17:51 .. but do we... Jul 26 10:18:01 Jason1 might be a plant Jul 26 10:18:14 ;) Jul 26 10:18:32 actually, he is suspect. how it could be #1 in queue? 8) Jul 26 10:18:46 s/it/he/ Jul 26 10:18:47 Dmitry_Platonov meant: actually, he is suspect. how he could be #1 in queue? 8) Jul 26 10:19:07 yeah, and he didn't provide any pictures Jul 26 10:19:35 Hm, for that medisoncelebrity.com-thing, contact: Jul 26 10:19:36 Call Center: Jul 26 10:19:36 E-mail: kc@infocare.se Jul 26 10:19:56 isn't the first one to get a new bit of kit supposed to do the 'unboxing' photos Jul 26 10:19:58 InfoCare is a large, highly respected (?) tech support & service provider. Jul 26 10:20:47 daxxar: email kc@ and ask them about problems with your medison and see what happes Jul 26 10:21:24 err...what is this medison? Jul 26 10:21:33 113 euros? Jul 26 10:21:37 guaqua: a really really dodgy looking 150$ laptop Jul 26 10:21:46 75gbp Jul 26 10:22:00 XorA: very much so Jul 26 10:22:13 but for that price it doesn't have to work for more than a few months anyway Jul 26 10:22:21 about medisoncelebrity.com: I think you will be charged for 600+$ for handling or something so. Jul 26 10:22:34 a bunch of indians in the UK as the mailing address, hmmm, not suspicious at all Jul 26 10:23:06 sounds like a dodgy Tottenham Court Road job to me Jul 26 10:24:26 taxes are an addition to that Jul 26 10:25:04 "Fees taken by our authorized partner 2CO are U$6.45 + 5,5% and extra on the price. Some smaller fees might be taken by your bank and varies on what bank and card you have." Jul 26 10:26:24 for finland that would be $150 + $6.45 euros + 5,5 * $150 + 0,22 * $150 + shipping (est. $50) Jul 26 10:26:39 g'mornin' Jul 26 10:26:47 XorA: I just asked them if they have any knowledge of them. Jul 26 10:26:53 XorA: I used to work at InfoCare norway, ;-) Jul 26 10:27:14 your maths is broken guaqua Jul 26 10:27:24 XorA: Slashdot talks about them using @hotmail.com, but that seems to be gone? Jul 26 10:27:47 FuzzyCat: where? Jul 26 10:27:53 err yes :D Jul 26 10:28:00 0,055 * $150 Jul 26 10:28:44 well, not only that.. Jul 26 10:28:53 you just kept adding stuff... Jul 26 10:29:03 !gcalc 150$ + 6.45 EUR + 5.5% * 150$ + 22% * 150$ in euros Jul 26 10:29:03 (150 US$) + (6.45 Euros) + ((5.5%) * (150 US$)) + ((22%) * (150 US$)) = 144.836397 Euros Jul 26 10:29:21 Valdi Ivancic (valdi_ivancic@hotmail.com) Jul 26 10:29:34 inz, that's wrong too. Jul 26 10:29:40 6.45 USD Jul 26 10:29:46 yay.. finally got a tracking # Jul 26 10:29:53 * FuzzyCat stabs andred Jul 26 10:29:55 oops Jul 26 10:29:58 * FuzzyCat stabs anrp Jul 26 10:30:01 ;) Jul 26 10:30:02 Fuzzy, yeah, it was just what guaque said Jul 26 10:30:14 due friday D: Jul 26 10:30:16 guaqua, what does exactly $6.45 euros mean? Jul 26 10:30:25 dollar euros :) Jul 26 10:30:33 eurodollars! Jul 26 10:30:33 Creation Date: 11-apr-2007 Jul 26 10:30:38 blahh :D Jul 26 10:31:07 poor UPS is gonna need to upgrade web servers Jul 26 10:31:16 updated the wookie anrp ? Jul 26 10:31:23 s/wookie/wiki/ Jul 26 10:31:23 FuzzyCat meant: updated the wiki anrp ? Jul 26 10:32:15 mm not yet Jul 26 10:33:00 when did you email arrive? Jul 26 10:33:08 and when was it sent? Jul 26 10:33:12 this morning.. Jul 26 10:33:20 hm, about 30 mins ago Jul 26 10:33:26 mmm... Jul 26 10:34:34 # Q: Can I buy your laptop in a store? Jul 26 10:34:35 A: At the moment you can buy our laptops only from our website. Jul 26 10:34:35 # Q: Can I pay the laptop without using my creditcard online? Jul 26 10:34:35 A: No, we do not offer any other ways of payments at the moment. Jul 26 10:34:45 sounds fishy Jul 26 10:35:02 does Jul 26 10:35:04 wot laptop? Jul 26 10:37:31 http://www.medisoncelebrity.com/ Jul 26 10:37:36 that one Jul 26 10:37:56 see http://linux.slashdot.org/linux/07/07/25/1519256.shtml Jul 26 10:38:05 "Update 2035 GMT by SM: As many readers have pointed out, the more you dig into the details of this company the more fishy it starts to seem. I would suggest any potential buyers be wary on this one." Jul 26 10:38:31 the domain is registered for one year only and they all use hotmail addresses Jul 26 10:38:38 yey Jul 26 10:38:38 <( Jul 26 10:38:40 :) Jul 26 10:38:52 theyve gotten alot of press in Sweden for some reason Jul 26 10:39:20 hotmail addresses are a baaad thing Jul 26 10:40:06 not per se, but in business uses... Jul 26 10:50:22 clearly a scam Jul 26 10:51:49 someone also dug deeper and the company is actually in the UK... Jul 26 10:52:04 registered very recently, there's a bad, bad smell about it Jul 26 10:52:14 anrp, is your neo being shiped intl? Jul 26 10:55:50 #1824 anrp USA Jul 26 11:20:58 denk 't wel :) Jul 26 11:21:03 oops Jul 26 11:56:09 did more than one non-us customer got a tracking-number? Jul 26 11:58:42 w))t!! people have started to receive tracking numbers Jul 26 11:59:36 empty_mind: I stole your Neo before it was shipped Jul 26 12:00:46 * empty_mind protests Jul 26 12:01:10 next time Sean or Herald are going to come to India we will do protests on Airport :-p Jul 26 12:01:23 Herald Sean ; go back :-p Jul 26 12:01:54 * SpeedEvil notes that nobody has confirmed a new batch is being made. Jul 26 12:02:27 w00t! Jul 26 12:02:30 All your neo are belong to us Jul 26 12:02:39 * XorA needs more Neos Jul 26 12:02:46 * mwester-road needs just one Jul 26 12:02:52 SpeedEvil, that demaaands another protest Jul 26 12:05:52 October promises to be a good month. Release of GTA02, and the new Battlestar Galactica series Jul 26 12:06:39 ewon: and the new neo can use bittorrent backup system to fetch new BSG and you can watch it on move Jul 26 12:06:49 hi Jul 26 12:08:52 XorA, thtats a good idea, neo as a bittorrent download device. while you sleep it downloads torrents over gprs Jul 26 12:10:00 that could be expensive Jul 26 12:10:05 gta02 could use wifi :) Jul 26 12:11:33 * XorA has always meant to setup a mobile device like that, but I dont own one that can play stuff as it comes off the web Jul 26 12:12:10 well gp2x can, buts its not suited for running bittorrent on Jul 26 12:15:34 Hello Lord Jul 26 12:15:49 XorA, you cant ply a bitorrent as it comes from web, unless bt client reassembles the blocks Jul 26 12:16:22 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Talk:OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Warsaw]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] Jul 26 12:16:52 empty_mind: "as it comes off web" means not being able to play "640x480" at 30 fps at insane bitrates like 4k Jul 26 12:17:08 empty_mind: and in widescreen and improperly encoded by XviD Jul 26 12:17:25 It can play DVD video as it streams over GPRS :) Jul 26 12:17:51 This isn't because it's got a fast CPU though :) Jul 26 12:17:56 SpeedEvil: ouch Jul 26 12:31:25 Hello Lord Jul 26 12:31:45 wtf? i want a hello lord too... Jul 26 12:31:45 tazz: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Jul 26 12:34:15 * jaebird got a ship notification! Jul 26 12:36:13 jaebird: outside usa? Jul 26 12:37:13 no inside Jul 26 12:40:50 update wiki jaebird .. Jul 26 12:42:10 yep Jul 26 12:42:35 just wondering, whats the highest rt# billed yet, everyone below the first 1000 have been billed? Jul 26 12:43:55 Sup3rkiddo: thats probably a bad indication as Ill bet my P0 rt# is in the same range as the shipping ones Jul 26 12:44:12 Subject: Your Neo1973 has been sent [rt.internal.openmoko.org #282] Jul 26 12:45:19 I got ship notification late last night Jul 26 12:45:21 XorA, oh, any word on the 2nd batch...i was thinking, since i have not been billed yet, maybe i ordered too late rt#3054, Jul 26 12:46:54 Sup3rkiddo: no idea, when P0, initial free P1 ranges stopped and when purchased started Jul 26 12:47:03 Sup3rkiddo: or even if it is the same rt system Jul 26 12:48:00 XorA, okie dokie thanks Jul 26 12:49:27 Sup3rkiddo: I've got 2233, and I've been billed. Jul 26 12:49:45 Hm, does HTC Touch have similar specs to Neo1973? Jul 26 12:50:00 daxxar, man, all you guys are making me jealous Jul 26 12:50:10 Sup3rkiddo: I've not been shipped yet Jul 26 12:50:35 daxxar, yeah but i have not even been billed yet Jul 26 12:51:25 Aw :/ Jul 26 12:51:34 Hm Jul 26 12:51:41 I wonder what VISA I used for the billing Jul 26 12:52:22 daxxar: post the number and Ill confirm for you :-D Jul 26 12:52:44 XorA: Harr harr Jul 26 12:52:48 i am just curious how many devices were ordered and how many have been billed, not shipped...that way i can know more neos are being produced to cover the demand Jul 26 12:53:32 openmoko: 03laforge * r2394 10/developers/laforge/: add my own directory Jul 26 12:53:56 Best guesses are >1000 orders. Jul 26 12:54:03 And <1000 made in the first batch. Jul 26 12:54:30 And no news on a new batch. Jul 26 12:55:27 SpeedEvil, so safe to assume that utmost 1000 orders have been billed Jul 26 12:55:41 Well. Jul 26 12:56:05 Actual desired orders of phones, that will be shipped when they get round to it - look to be >1K Jul 26 12:56:28 Based on best guesses - there has been no confirmation of this. Jul 26 12:56:41 thats pretty bad :(, if the neo lands up too late, am gonna be in the thick of semesters and can't hack on it Jul 26 12:58:35 Hello Master Jul 26 12:59:28 I also ordered "late" (if you can call a few days, late). No billing notice yet - it would be nice to know if it's not going to be in the first batch. Jul 26 12:59:41 Sup3rkiddo: have you been billed? Jul 26 12:59:54 If I have to wait for the second, I'd prefer to wait for the next generation instead. Jul 26 12:59:56 SpeedEvil, nope not yet Jul 26 13:00:16 Sup3rkiddo, and you will probably never be billed Jul 26 13:00:24 openmoko: 03nbd * r2395 10/developers/nbd/: add my own directory Jul 26 13:00:40 what's with the own directories? Jul 26 13:00:46 What's your RT number? Jul 26 13:00:48 Sup3rkiddo Jul 26 13:00:58 SpeedEvil, ours is 3054 Jul 26 13:01:11 I'm wondering if it's the upcoming 'new' user interface fork. Jul 26 13:01:48 That's right on the border of might be-might not be in the first batch. Jul 26 13:01:53 SpeedEvil, we have new UI ? Jul 26 13:02:17 There have been reports of a altered set of core apps coming from the core team. Jul 26 13:02:28 With improved finger support, larger fonts. Jul 26 13:02:33 hmm Jul 26 13:02:42 SpeedEvil, ordered it on around 5 AM GMT, 11th July Jul 26 13:04:38 did SpeedEvil received his phone Jul 26 13:05:40 I'm hopefully getting Jul 26 13:05:48 one from someone who over-ordered in the UK Jul 26 13:10:11 FIC will not ship into Russia :( not good. Jul 26 13:10:41 that's because the russian customs would hijack your device Jul 26 13:11:05 Have you tried the various shipping options? Jul 26 13:11:15 Some of them may have different allowed countries. Jul 26 13:11:32 Have you already ordered, or are you trying? Jul 26 13:11:33 * FuzzyCat points at the wiki page for Russia Jul 26 13:12:14 Russian Federation Jul 26 13:12:14 Not yet shipped there -Liane Jul 26 13:12:14 It was told that Customs never passed electronic devices (like Nokia N770) that arent certified by Rostest. So it seems we're unable to get openmokos directly here. Jul 26 13:12:22 Any RF device shold be certified to be sold here. Jul 26 13:12:48 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Shipping_Notes#Russian_Federation Jul 26 13:12:58 That page is _very_ out-of-date though. Jul 26 13:13:14 It may not be impossible that it's got that certification. Jul 26 13:13:20 Depends if it's one FIC usually does. Jul 26 13:14:59 why bother with P1 certification? P2 will need new one anyway Jul 26 13:15:00 gaaaawd! Jul 26 13:15:34 * hhf423_ is waiting for a packet for which he has a tracking number but which is only updated every 8h or so Jul 26 13:15:48 this is torture! Jul 26 13:16:16 neo1973 is FCC and CE certified, its in the FAQ Jul 26 13:16:54 FCC+CE != Rostest Jul 26 13:17:10 * Dmitry_Platonov agrees with SpeedEvil Jul 26 13:17:14 sure, so if it then can not be imported, you need to get it elsewhere and take it home Jul 26 13:17:41 * Dmitry_Platonov agrees with hhf423_ Jul 26 13:17:45 nobody questioned my mobile when I went to moskau a year ago Jul 26 13:18:00 * Dmitry_Platonov would wait for P2 anyway Jul 26 13:18:26 err moscow Jul 26 13:18:59 surely the phone has to pass through customs on its way to the certification authority. Jul 26 13:20:11 has rostest a website where the list which devices have been tested? Jul 26 13:20:41 what is that? (french news) http://www.generation-nt.com/gupp-phreedom-smartphone-linux-gsm-wifi-actualite-22433.html "Phreedom" linux phone with voip-gsm handover ! Jul 26 13:20:47 * FuzzyCat prints off some Rostest stickers and certificates Jul 26 13:20:55 also, I believe that customs is very likely to make the connection Nokia -> Mobile Phone, than OpenMoko -> Mobile Phone Jul 26 13:21:08 maybe it can just be declared a pda :-) Jul 26 13:21:53 hhf423_, yeah, if you carry your phone into Russia, they don't bother you with the rostest Jul 26 13:22:06 squalyl: does not say VOIP Gateway, says VOIP client Jul 26 13:23:27 "n appel commencé en VoIP peut basculer de façon transparente vers le réseau cellulaire ( handover ) ou passer d'un point d'accès à un autre sans manipulations de la part de l'utilisateur. Jul 26 13:23:27 " Jul 26 13:24:57 * FuzzyCat loves the babelfish translation Jul 26 13:25:01 Hello Master Jul 26 13:25:02 "A call started in VoIP can rock in a transparent way towards the cellular network ( handover ) or pass from an access point to another without handling on behalf of the user." Jul 26 13:25:13 hhf423_, do not think this list is public. Or at least, free. Jul 26 13:27:21 Dmitry_Platonov: should the public not be informed which devices have been tested? Jul 26 13:27:46 each approved device has sticker on it Jul 26 13:38:43 hello people Jul 26 13:39:04 does anybody here know Intermec 's CN3 Jul 26 13:40:05 and if it is not *stupid* to try running openmoko (eventually, slightly modified to fit it) on that platform? Jul 26 13:47:24 Kheldar: as long as it run linux it wil be possible Jul 26 13:52:49 Please don't let this man torture me. Jul 26 13:53:47 does openmoko run/compile on non-ARM processors? Jul 26 13:53:52 I need a free Neo over here. Jul 26 13:54:03 I'm sure it would Jul 26 13:54:29 Actually, I think there is a thing on the wiki about how you can compile it for x86 if you want Jul 26 13:55:37 ok Jul 26 13:56:16 It is just a variant of Linux after all Jul 26 14:05:59 hi Jul 26 14:07:13 MACHINE="x86" Jul 26 14:08:56 * * OM Bug 661 has been created by thebohemian(AT)gmx.net Jul 26 14:08:57 * * sfj2410 uses arch dependend header sys/io.h Jul 26 14:08:57 * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=661 Jul 26 14:09:48 howdy Jul 26 14:16:42 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[GTA01_gsm_modem]] [[Battery_Monitor]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Backup]] [[Wishlist:Ambient_Noise_Detection]] [[Advanced_End-user/it]] [[Advanced_End-user/bg]] [[Action_Button]] [[Wishlist:3D_Viewport]] [[Accelerometer_Fundamentals]] [[Wishlist:Dynamic_Screen_Orientation]] and other changes Jul 26 14:19:45 So who has their Neo? Jul 26 14:20:44 So who doesn't have their Neo and that is why they are here? Jul 26 14:20:46 whoever is listed on the P!_OWners page I assume.. Jul 26 14:20:53 ~P1 Jul 26 14:20:54 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/P1_Owners Jul 26 14:20:55 dtx: I have two Jul 26 14:21:05 I have 4 Jul 26 14:21:17 XorA: =D Jul 26 14:22:15 XorA: Are you one of the primary people pushing OpenMoko/Neo Jul 26 14:22:48 hrw: I'm assuming you are a member of some open source project so you got the early freebie? Jul 26 14:23:00 Very few got freebies. Jul 26 14:23:05 About 50 globally. Jul 26 14:23:12 dtx: I am one of core members of openembedded Jul 26 14:23:13 I was just guessing from the 2 answer Jul 26 14:23:19 Around 5 are regular contributors here Jul 26 14:23:21 dtx: one of the chips was supplied by my employers Jul 26 14:23:29 Other thn the core teams. Jul 26 14:23:38 XorA: Err - wolfson? Jul 26 14:23:48 James, Jul 26 14:23:48 Jul 26 14:23:48 Your order looks fine, we just haven`t gotten to it yet. Jul 26 14:23:48 It will be sent in the second batch next week. Jul 26 14:23:49 SpeedEvil: yes Jul 26 14:23:49 Regards, Jul 26 14:23:51 Will Jul 26 14:23:54 fyi Jul 26 14:24:20 'next week' ROFLMAO Jul 26 14:24:34 hrw: Thank you for OpenEmbedded it has come in very handy for me. Jul 26 14:24:58 XorA: which chip? Jul 26 14:25:08 The audio codec chip. Jul 26 14:25:09 dtx: wm8753 Jul 26 14:25:15 oh Jul 26 14:25:19 basically it does all the mixer stuff. Jul 26 14:25:20 hence the Err - wolfson? Jul 26 14:25:31 and speaker output, ... Jul 26 14:25:40 yea Jul 26 14:25:53 speaker out is done by a NatSemi lm4857 Jul 26 14:26:07 Its got the DAC Jul 26 14:26:25 I just assumed all audio functions where one chip? Jul 26 14:26:43 well, i got my shipment notification Jul 26 14:26:44 Digital mixing, then DAC Jul 26 14:27:03 But obviously I'm not a hardware guy so much Jul 26 14:27:39 that says "We're (UPS) sorry, we screwed up. We mis routed your package. You might see it tomorrow." Jul 26 14:28:03 the neo got a 3.5 mm headphone out? Jul 26 14:28:15 no Jul 26 14:28:22 2.5..? Jul 26 14:28:28 yes Jul 26 14:28:31 :\ Jul 26 14:30:28 Can I use any old pair of headphones with a 2.5? Jul 26 14:31:17 depends on the jack Jul 26 14:31:21 how can i set the date/time graphically? the time on top of the screen seems not to be clickable... Jul 26 14:31:45 dtx: you will need a 4pole 2.5 to 3 pole 3.5 adapter Jul 26 14:32:23 Is the 4 pole so it can have a mic component also? Jul 26 14:32:32 dtx: yes Jul 26 14:32:37 Cool Jul 26 14:32:44 I can live with that Jul 26 14:32:46 dtx: mic/button click for answer Jul 26 14:33:01 huh? Jul 26 14:33:13 there is an answer call button on headset Jul 26 14:33:20 oh I see Jul 26 14:33:30 it works I beleive by shorting mic to ground Jul 26 14:33:42 Thats what I would figure Jul 26 14:33:44 roh: yt? Jul 26 14:33:46 exactl: conf file Jul 26 14:34:33 Do bluetooth headsets all work with the same driver? Jul 26 14:34:40 Like is there a bluetooth headset standard? Jul 26 14:34:46 ewanm89mob: so graphically setting date/time is not yet implemented? Jul 26 14:34:51 dtx: yes its a standard Jul 26 14:34:56 s/l/t/ Jul 26 14:34:56 ewanm89mob meant: exactt: conf file Jul 26 14:35:22 great Jul 26 14:35:40 openmoko: 03shoragan * r2396 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.22.x/patches/gta01-power_control.patch: Jul 26 14:35:40 openmoko: Pull change r2388 (by roh) from trunk. Jul 26 14:35:40 openmoko: this should fix a missing sysfs entry when using gllin on _old_ (pre gta01bv3) devices Jul 26 14:35:40 openmoko: thanks henryk Jul 26 14:36:18 exactt: not that I know of. Jul 26 14:36:26 openmoko: 03shoragan * r2397 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.22.x/patches/: Jul 26 14:36:26 openmoko: r2392@polaris (orig r2388): roh | 2007-07-25 08:20:03 +0200 Jul 26 14:36:26 openmoko: this should fix a missing sysfs entry when using gllin on _old_ (pre gta01bv3) devices Jul 26 14:36:26 openmoko: thanks henryk Jul 26 14:37:20 roh: ping Jul 26 14:38:04 hi, can anyone plz put me out of my misery and let me know if my order is still in the issue collector at openmoko? Jul 26 14:38:19 ewanm89mob: does it make any sense to put this some todo list? Jul 26 14:38:30 order number is #2018 - just starting to think it no longer exists as all the people in the orders around me seem to have received payment confirmations :-( Jul 26 14:38:41 d'oh Jul 26 14:38:56 mokobot: lastseen roh Jul 26 14:39:47 exactt: at least put it into the wiki Jul 26 14:39:48 exactt: possibly Jul 26 14:40:45 ser/bg]] [[Action_Button]] [[Wishlist:3D_Viewport]] [[Accelerometer_Fundamentals]] [[Wishlist:Dynamic_Screen_Orientation]] and other changes Jul 26 14:40:45 * loufoque has joined #openmoko Jul 26 14:40:45 * orospakr has joined #openmoko Jul 26 14:40:45 So who has their Neo? Jul 26 14:40:45 So who doesn't have their Neo and that is why they are here? Jul 26 14:41:20 mokobot: seen roh Jul 26 14:41:20 roh is currently on #openmoko (1d 20h 25m 10s). Has said a total of 18 messages. Is idling for 20h 46m 45s, last said: 'hopefully there will be a lot of hands on hacking and not too much would be could be discussions.. but well manage and it will be very relaxing'. Jul 26 14:41:52 mokobot: /quit Jul 26 14:42:00 hm, don't work Jul 26 14:42:06 ynezz: nice try Jul 26 14:42:43 I wonder how many of the 364 people in this room are bots. Jul 26 14:42:48 Can mokobot tell me that? Jul 26 14:43:33 I recently remarked the huge number of nicknames on this channel :) this is weird Jul 26 14:43:43 maybe they're all developers :) Jul 26 14:44:15 guaqua: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wish_List#Misc_Software or do you a better place(something like a todo list? Jul 26 14:45:06 Is there an {{outdated}} tag for the wiki? Jul 26 14:45:30 Or ratehr - where is a list of tags Jul 26 14:45:36 ~reverse .toB a ma I Jul 26 14:45:36 And is tag the appropriate term Jul 26 14:45:37 I am a Bot. Jul 26 14:45:37 I am a Bot. Jul 26 14:45:48 still at least 2 Jul 26 14:45:49 Hello Master Jul 26 14:47:31 ozarka: I believe 4 and a scripted irssi. Jul 26 14:48:13 ~zap mokobot Jul 26 14:48:13 * apt takes out a cattle prod and gives mokobot a good jolt. Jul 26 14:50:58 mickeyl: http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/GeoClue is working quite nice nowadays Jul 26 14:51:35 mate of mine got his brother with a cattle prod; the brother shat himself. Jul 26 14:51:44 ewwww Jul 26 14:51:44 properly shat himself. Jul 26 14:51:51 lovely. Jul 26 14:52:07 yeah, his bro hasn't really forgiven him for that one yet. Jul 26 14:52:22 the joys of growing up in rural areas. Jul 26 14:52:51 lol Jul 26 14:54:44 mickeyl: Hi there - about? Jul 26 14:55:00 What's the SIP stack in the initial openmoko (if there is one)? Jul 26 14:55:31 * koen hopes telepathy Jul 26 14:55:39 dneary: congrats, btw Jul 26 14:55:50 koen: Thanks :) Jul 26 14:56:03 koen: Telepathy isn't a SIP stack, it's just a set of interfaces Jul 26 14:56:17 You need a SIP stack that implements the various Telepathy interfaces Jul 26 14:56:18 right Jul 26 14:56:29 I know that Sofia has already Jul 26 14:56:31 dneary: yos, you were missed. Jul 26 14:56:43 robster: At GUADEC, you mean? Jul 26 14:56:49 robster: Thanks :) Jul 26 14:56:49 (at GUADEC) Jul 26 14:58:06 But you know, I think a WengoPhone on the phone would be a good match Jul 26 14:58:17 Hardly surprising coming from me :) Jul 26 14:58:42 Certainly had more field usage than any Telepathy softphones Jul 26 14:59:43 dneary: your trac is broken. Jul 26 14:59:54 broken how? Jul 26 14:59:56 dneary: http://dev.openwengo.com/trac/openwengo/trac.cgi/browser/wengophone-ng/branches/2.1 Jul 26 14:59:57 Offline, or slow? Jul 26 15:00:06 dneary: which is the link on the frontpage of the site. Jul 26 15:00:18 bye all Jul 26 15:00:26 http://dev.openwengo.com/trac/openwengo/trac.cgi/browser/wengophone-ng/branches/wengophone-2.1 Jul 26 15:01:13 robster: Which URL for the front page? Jul 26 15:01:38 dneary: "Source browser" from Quick Links Jul 26 15:02:08 ok www.openwengo.org or dev.openwengo.org? Jul 26 15:02:26 gah Jul 26 15:02:34 I don't have access to www.openwengo.org Jul 26 15:02:41 Constant source of pain in the arsedness Jul 26 15:02:55 I plan to overhawl it and replace it with a drupal in September Jul 26 15:03:40 dneary: replace it with a Plone instance! Jul 26 15:03:43 ;-) Jul 26 15:03:47 dneary: hahaha, you must be kidding right? Jul 26 15:04:41 robster: Kidding about not having access? Jul 26 15:04:42 No Jul 26 15:05:10 The company is big enough to be compartmentalised - we have sysadmins who take care of infrastructure, and a web team which takes care of web content Jul 26 15:05:26 And having time from someone in the web team is painful Jul 26 15:07:06 dneary: no about using Drupal. Jul 26 15:07:38 robster: ;-) Jul 26 15:08:22 ah Jul 26 15:08:24 No, not at all Jul 26 15:08:27 Why? Jul 26 15:09:42 dneary: btw do you know if there is a ubuntu binary? Jul 26 15:09:51 of wengo that is Jul 26 15:10:25 duffyd: There's a link on the front page of the wiki: dev.openwengo.org Jul 26 15:10:33 By Ludovico Cavedon Jul 26 15:10:39 ta Jul 26 15:18:55 * * OM Bug 662 has been created by thebohemian(AT)gmx.net Jul 26 15:18:56 * * openocd FTBF on big endian machines Jul 26 15:18:57 * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=662 Jul 26 15:20:09 i have my tracking #! Jul 26 15:20:24 happycube, you are really a happycube Jul 26 15:20:26 happycube: congrats :-D Jul 26 15:20:29 ... although ups might be taking 2 days to get it here. argh Jul 26 15:20:40 even though it's 2-day air within california... eee Jul 26 15:20:53 openmoko: 03shoragan * r2398 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.22.x/patches/ (22 files): Port patches to 2.6.22.1 Jul 26 15:20:59 i think there are some presorting tricks that companies can do Jul 26 15:21:52 :P Jul 26 15:21:54 :) Jul 26 15:21:56 and thanks Jul 26 15:22:13 what 2 day air Jul 26 15:23:01 happycube, maybe they will send it via newyork Jul 26 15:23:19 empty_mind, and here we are without even getting billed Jul 26 15:24:02 Sup3rkiddo, no probs. Next time Herald or Sean come to India we will protest on the airport Jul 26 15:24:13 empty_mind, yay Jul 26 15:24:49 Sup3rkiddo, we will bring those rented labour union guys to shout with us :-p Jul 26 15:24:57 :P Jul 26 15:33:22 roh: ping Jul 26 15:36:54 stefan_schmidt: hi. Thanks a lot for pinging Harald :) Jul 26 15:37:11 stefan_schmidt: ping Jul 26 15:37:33 sorry about the pinging (need help!) Jul 26 15:38:10 rtp: NO problem. Jul 26 15:38:36 duffyd: What's up? Jul 26 15:38:45 mickeyl, bitbake doesn't realize there can be two different directories called 'pachtes' in svn, so it doesn't download the one from branches because it has the current one from trunk Jul 26 15:38:56 stefan_schmidt: hi, just wondering if you can help me confirm if my order is still valid (#2018)? Jul 26 15:39:14 as all the orders around me (on P1_Owners page) have received payment confirmations - not me :-( Jul 26 15:39:17 duffyd: Sorry, I'm a developer. No rt access. :( Jul 26 15:39:20 * duffyd bit anxious Jul 26 15:39:26 stefan_schmidt: ok, np Jul 26 15:39:27 duffyd: Wait until roh is awake again Jul 26 15:39:39 stefan_schmidt: ok :-) do you know when he is usually online? Jul 26 15:40:07 duffyd: No, he has his own timezone Jul 26 15:40:15 stefan_schmidt: lol, k thanks Jul 26 15:40:18 Hello Master Jul 26 15:40:18 !see roh Jul 26 15:40:23 !seen roh Jul 26 15:40:25 CoreDump|home, roh is right here! Jul 26 15:40:29 Timezone ROH+0 :-) Jul 26 15:40:39 mokobot: seen roh Jul 26 15:40:40 roh is currently on #openmoko (1d 21h 24m 29s). Has said a total of 18 messages. Is idling for 21h 46m 4s, last said: 'hopefully there will be a lot of hands on hacking and not too much would be could be discussions.. but well manage and it will be very relaxing'. Jul 26 15:41:42 ewanm89_laptop: thanks - checked that already :-) Jul 26 15:41:59 Gives al Jul 26 15:42:15 a/al/a lot more information/ Jul 26 15:42:39 alphaone: :-) Jul 26 15:48:05 Good morning. Jul 26 15:50:11 hi stefan - im trying to understand the video driver code, maybe you can help me - where is the code that changes the video mode of the LCM (I heard it can run in 240x320 mode...) Jul 26 15:56:19 jpcass: Moment, just in a discussion. Give me some minutes Jul 26 15:56:33 thanks stefan... Jul 26 15:58:13 Shoragan: oh, that's unfortunate. could you please a) check whether this is still a problem in bitbake 1.8.6 and b) add a bug entry against bitbake? Jul 26 15:59:06 there seems to be a localpath option for the svn fetches Jul 26 15:59:28 ah, i'm not familiar w/ recent bitbake fetchers Jul 26 16:01:15 jpcass: Back now Jul 26 16:01:28 Hi stefan_schmidt and mickeyl :) Jul 26 16:01:32 hi ElBenevolente Jul 26 16:01:38 urgs Jul 26 16:01:40 Elrond: hi Jul 26 16:01:57 jpcass: This is done in the SPI driver for LCM init. Let me search Jul 26 16:02:00 great - I'm a bit confused about the video driver, it seems to be split into several components... Jul 26 16:03:00 mickeyl - BTW: Why is the new UI not commited incrementally to SVN? Jul 26 16:03:02 is that the drivers/spi/jbt6k74.c Jul 26 16:03:15 jpcass - Yeah, looks like spi for the LCM. Jul 26 16:03:16 jpcass: you have 2 drivers for the video : 1 for the lcd controller (jbt6k74) and 1 for the framebuffer (s3c2410fb). Jul 26 16:03:21 jpcass: Yes, its init of the LCM itself and the framebuffer for drawing Jul 26 16:03:27 rtp: heh Jul 26 16:03:34 jpcass: and about about qvga it's not supported atm Jul 26 16:03:35 jpcass: http://svn.openmoko.org/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/gta01-jbt6k74.patch Jul 26 16:03:49 aha 320x240 is not in there yet... Jul 26 16:03:51 jpcass: That one is for SPI init Jul 26 16:04:22 jpcass: I started the QVGA init, but run into problems with iut and had no time to debug and finish it. :( Jul 26 16:04:35 ok i see.. Jul 26 16:04:51 stefan_schmidt: well, with the jbt6k74 datasheet it would be easier to do :) Jul 26 16:04:53 * rtp runs Jul 26 16:04:57 jaebird: http://people.openmoko.org/stefan/patches/LCM-QVGA/ Jul 26 16:05:00 Wouldn't one need some specs for the LCM to finish the QVGA thing? Jul 26 16:05:02 rtp: *sigh* Jul 26 16:05:08 so s3c2410fb is the framebuffer and creates /dev/fb0 right? Jul 26 16:05:14 rtp: sorry Jul 26 16:05:14 jpcass: yeah Jul 26 16:05:29 does jbt6k74 create a device? Jul 26 16:05:33 jpcass: no Jul 26 16:05:39 jpcass - Right, the framebuffer is in the cpu. Jul 26 16:05:48 Elrond: hmm, not really the above patches to exactly what the, really small, data sheet suggests. Jul 26 16:06:13 so there is an interface/interaction between s3c2410 and jbt6k74 to enable e.g. fbset? Jul 26 16:06:31 It's more about interaction with s3c2410fb I think, but like to be proven wrong Jul 26 16:06:33 jpcass - What part of fbset? Jul 26 16:06:33 fbset will act on /dev/fb0 ... must get command to jbt somehow? Jul 26 16:07:16 stefan_schmidt: iirc we already talked about that interaction looong time ago :) Jul 26 16:07:23 sorry, i dont really understand this fully but I thought you could change video mode with an ioctl on /dev/fb0 and thats what fbset did? Jul 26 16:07:34 Besides two or three diagrams all of the data sheet is already in the driver. Mostly tables with init sequenzes. Jul 26 16:07:58 rtp: Yeah, I know and I feel guilty not complete debugged this. :( Jul 26 16:08:02 jpcass - Ahh. For video mode changes, you need to reconfigute the LCM via spi _and_ change the in-cpu framebuffer. Jul 26 16:08:41 jpcass: yeah, there's an ioctl for this but the fb driver needs to talk to the spi chips and this is not implemented. Only a matter of having the hardware/time/infos to implement that Jul 26 16:09:15 ok so ultimately there will be code in s3c2410fb to act on an ioctl requesting mode change which will call some function in jbt6k73 driver... Jul 26 16:09:22 rtp - Well, IF the spi part is done (by stefan), the rest should just be putting the pieces together. Jul 26 16:09:29 stefan_schmidt: no, you should not feel guilty. I bet you have worked on a lot of other interesting this on the neo :) Jul 26 16:09:39 s/this/things/ Jul 26 16:09:40 rtp meant: stefan_schmidt: no, you should not feel guilty. I bet you have worked on a lot of other interesting things on the neo :) Jul 26 16:09:43 jpcass - Exactly. Jul 26 16:10:22 thanks guys, think i understand this better now... Jul 26 16:10:27 rtp: Yes, but I hate unfinished work. It'S still on my todo. :) Jul 26 16:10:34 thought someone had been playing with video on 240x320? Jul 26 16:10:53 In the end a fbset call should do all the magic from userspace Jul 26 16:11:02 (script) openmoko-community: Harald Welte Product naming / wiki page naming / restructuring Jul 26 16:11:12 stefan_schmidt: on mine too. iirc smdk2440 has also a spi lcd controller so there are other hardware needing that kind of stuff Jul 26 16:11:25 jpcass: It was the plan to have qvga fullscreen for better performance. (And scummvm of course) Jul 26 16:11:36 rtp: Cool Jul 26 16:12:07 stefan_schmidt: well, I don't habe a smdk2440 :( Jul 26 16:12:09 sounds about right...320x240 will be fine for video I think... Jul 26 16:12:14 rtp: My university semester is over right now. Next month should fulltime for OM. Perhaps I can free a day for this. We will see. Jul 26 16:12:34 stefan_schmidt: ok :) Jul 26 16:12:54 rtp: oh :( I also have no devel boards, just neos Jul 26 16:13:26 stefan_schmidt - "neo_s_"? How many do you have? ;o) Jul 26 16:13:44 Elrond: Yours and mine. ;) Jul 26 16:13:47 stefan_schmidt: fyi, I only have my h1940 and my neos as dev boards Jul 26 16:13:54 stefan_schmidt - :-) Jul 26 16:14:29 But neo is a nice devel board, yes. Jul 26 16:16:16 Elrond: yeah :) Jul 26 16:17:02 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Category:InProgress]] [[Neo1973_Power_Management]] [[Wishlist:ExpansionSpacer]] [[Wishlist:Location_based_reminders]] [[Category:Progress_unknown]] [[Action_Button]] [[Date_%26_Time_Field]] [[Template:ProgressUnknown]] and other changes Jul 26 16:18:12 did someone just get their advanced, only to find bits missing? Jul 26 16:26:14 ScaredyCat - What's missing? Jul 26 16:26:35 batteries and 'usD cards' Jul 26 16:26:48 mickeyl, how long until we switch to oe.dev? Jul 26 16:27:01 (huh, anyway, I need to run, catch some recreation, really) Jul 26 16:27:25 http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-July/008248.html Jul 26 16:27:58 myeah... Jul 26 16:28:15 don't care about uSD (can buy myself) Jul 26 16:28:33 battery would be nice (there's some Nokia battery that fits, iirc ?) Jul 26 16:29:40 if you've paid $450 you should be able to expect to get everyhing tbh Jul 26 16:29:58 maybe the guy hasn't found the 2nd layer of the box ? Jul 26 16:30:52 good luck Jul 26 16:38:06 Sweet, my Neo just arrived! Jul 26 16:38:06 anyone got a neo yet? Jul 26 16:38:20 how easy is it to use Jul 26 16:38:30 * empty_mind notices freelock is freed Jul 26 16:38:46 freelock: add yourself to the P1_Owners page then :) Jul 26 16:38:58 wiki update freelock? Jul 26 16:39:11 Doing it now... Jul 26 16:42:10 anyone else got a neo? Jul 26 16:43:21 andy_: It has only a bootloader. Not at all easy to use. It's a developer preview Jul 26 16:44:12 rwhitby, are you there? Jul 26 16:46:02 (script) openmoko-neo1973: Harald Welte Re: info on the SMedia 3362 Jul 26 16:46:26 mickeyl, i've backported the patch from bitbake svn-trunk Jul 26 16:47:22 (script) openmoko-neo1973: Harald Welte Re: TV-Out for Neo1973 Jul 26 16:52:00 has anyone got the neo1973 qemu emulator to support sound when running on a x86_64 Linux host? Jul 26 16:52:55 vallor: No, sorry. Jul 26 16:53:06 I haven't noticed any sound. Jul 26 16:53:13 dang Jul 26 16:53:41 "We're intending to have something like RGB or even DVI-out for the Jul 26 16:53:41 really high end models late 2008. Jul 26 16:53:44 ^ wow Jul 26 16:54:10 s/2008/2080/ Jul 26 16:54:22 lol Jul 26 16:54:44 happycube: do you have access to rt? Jul 26 16:54:50 rt? Jul 26 16:55:04 the order db Jul 26 16:55:09 not at all Jul 26 16:55:22 ok, np. Thanks Jul 26 16:55:22 i'm just reading what harald posted ;) Jul 26 16:55:28 ahhh Jul 26 16:55:36 hmm, bots no longer post wiki updates Jul 26 16:55:37 ? Jul 26 16:55:44 i saw some a bit ago Jul 26 16:55:47 i think they're batched Jul 26 16:55:53 yes, they did Jul 26 16:56:36 k Jul 26 16:56:42 (script) openmoko-neo1973: Harald Welte Re: Why Glamo3362 and not better Glamo3365 ? and 3 other mails Jul 26 16:57:40 you can always check 'recent changes' on the wiki Jul 26 16:58:30 wtf is openmoko-neo1973 Jul 26 16:58:41 neo1973-hardware Jul 26 16:58:47 not a mailing list Jul 26 16:59:01 happycube: yeah I know *that* Jul 26 16:59:37 i dunno Jul 26 17:05:09 Okay, having a bit of trouble with dfu-util Jul 26 17:05:23 "More than one DFU capable USB device found, you might try `--list' and then disconnect all but one device" Jul 26 17:05:41 Sure enough, it lists two, but I don't have anything else plugged in... Jul 26 17:05:53 some onboard device? Jul 26 17:06:03 I'm wondering if it's the fingerprint reader, or something else built in Jul 26 17:06:22 I tried adding -i 2 (which appeared in the list with openmoko plugged in) but no love Jul 26 17:06:57 does dfu-util give you the usb id of the DFU capable devices? Jul 26 17:07:02 (script) openmoko-neo1973: Harald Welte Re: Bluetooth to 2410 Wiring Jul 26 17:07:10 I have an electronic pen (handwriting recognition) and it appeared as a DFU capable device. Jul 26 17:07:25 how does that compare with lsusb/usbdevs/usbctl/etc... output Jul 26 17:07:56 ''aloril (script) openmoko-neo1973: Harald Welte Re: Bluetooth to 2410 Wiring'' <--- sorry to ask, but what is the url to that wiki? doesn't seem to showup on wiki.openmoko.org ... Jul 26 17:08:15 Vallor: it isn't on the wiki - sec we'll link Jul 26 17:08:24 vallor: that's probably a mailing list post Jul 26 17:08:27 http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/neo1973-hardware/ Jul 26 17:08:28 oh! Jul 26 17:08:35 thank you, sirs! Jul 26 17:08:37 Okay, looks like the other is my wireless card... lemme try passing that usbid Jul 26 17:09:55 Great! That's working! Jul 26 17:11:29 openmoko: 03shoragan * r2399 10/trunk/oe/packages/linux/ (2 files in 2 dirs): bb-file for linux 2.6.22.1 and matching defconfig Jul 26 17:11:36 The biggest challenge is keeping the neo awake to get each download started... Jul 26 17:12:49 press the "aux" button every 10 seconds or so Jul 26 17:12:52 thats what i do Jul 26 17:16:02 (script) openmoko-neo1973: "Werner Almesberger" Re: Hardware Schematics Jul 26 17:30:12 http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/06/08/add_a_monitor_using_usb/ <---- :) Jul 26 17:31:26 vallor that's usb2 Jul 26 17:31:44 oh, the neo1973 doesn't support usb2? Jul 26 17:32:53 it's just 1.1 Jul 26 17:32:58 vallor unfortunately Jul 26 17:33:09 i forget which way gta02 has usb2 Jul 26 17:33:40 roh: ping Jul 26 17:33:41 argh!!! I was thinking of doing vid/web cam stuff with it Jul 26 17:33:46 happycube there is a way? Jul 26 17:34:19 there's really no usb2? surprising. Jul 26 17:34:36 happycube it would have been great if the gpu had an usb2 interface - but it hasn't Jul 26 17:34:38 hello Jul 26 17:35:21 cjb there would have to be an other controller for that as the cpu would have a hard time to manage it, - i would guess Jul 26 17:39:17 okay, that was wrong - there are cpus out that do have usb2... Jul 26 17:40:22 yeah... it's an older cpu design Jul 26 17:40:37 i'm hoping the high end 2008 model gets an intel silverthorne ;) Jul 26 17:41:51 the price for a usb controller chip would not seem to be a factor... Jul 26 17:41:58 yeah but there are space issues Jul 26 17:41:59 happycube i was once wondering why the ipod could not be used while datatransfer and thought that the they had such an issue Jul 26 17:42:24 actually it's because the filesystem is in flux Jul 26 17:42:47 i see Jul 26 17:49:34 ah, here we go: http://www.smsc.com/main/catalog/usb2601.html Jul 26 17:51:28 can i have a price in euro of the final version?! Jul 26 17:51:28 rigobot: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Jul 26 17:52:18 rigobot, you already have a price in USD, right? Jul 26 17:52:27 yes Jul 26 17:52:50 rigobot, thats the only price known yet Jul 26 17:52:57 450 usd? Jul 26 17:53:29 rigobot, i hope you werent expecting us to calculate that in euro ;) Jul 26 17:53:47 :D Jul 26 17:53:51 ~change 450 usd to eur Jul 26 17:55:08 XorA|gone: www.xe.com Jul 26 17:55:36 ckuethe: apt looks it up there if you ask nicely Jul 26 17:55:39 ~zap apt Jul 26 17:55:40 * apt takes out a cattle prod and gives apt a good jolt. Jul 26 17:56:10 apt: change 450 usd to eur Jul 26 17:57:32 ~google 450 usd in eur Jul 26 18:06:26 hello Jul 26 18:08:53 hello Rince :-) Jul 26 18:16:16 Okay, I have it booting, dialing, and hey, look, it's getting an incoming call... Jul 26 18:16:23 However, no sound. Jul 26 18:16:26 nope Jul 26 18:16:32 :):( Jul 26 18:16:35 and can you answer the call? :) Jul 26 18:16:39 that bit's left as an exercise to the purchaser Jul 26 18:16:40 And now I see the backup instructions... Jul 26 18:16:54 did I nuke the binary GPS program? Jul 26 18:17:01 yep. Jul 26 18:17:13 Any way to get it back? Jul 26 18:17:19 nope. Jul 26 18:17:23 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Toronto]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Braunschweig]] [[OpenMoko]] [[GTA01_gsm_modem]] [[Neo1973_Power_Management]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups]] [[FAQ/fr]] [[Neo1973_Hardware/es]] [[Neo1973_Hardware/ru]] and other changes Jul 26 18:17:25 i think the current state is that the audio channel is not yet connected (via software), which is why you hear no audio. Jul 26 18:17:26 Well - not officially Jul 26 18:17:41 michaelshiloh: the mixer is _horribly_ complex. Jul 26 18:17:55 It can route audio in lots of different ways. Jul 26 18:18:16 if anything , it works too well :-) Jul 26 18:18:31 Well. Jul 26 18:18:38 True. Perhaps that's why it's not done yet :-) Jul 26 18:18:38 I would like more A/D and D/A. Jul 26 18:19:04 Kero: It gave me the choice of answer or reject... Jul 26 18:19:05 The current one for example can't talk to a caller and take a message while playing mp3 to you. Jul 26 18:19:28 There is only 2 A/D and 3 D/A (one low quality) Jul 26 18:19:28 How would I go about turning audio on? Jul 26 18:19:59 alsamixer i believe shoudl do it Jul 26 18:20:08 In theory yes. Jul 26 18:20:32 In practice the mixer controls are quite complex. Jul 26 18:20:58 Wow, lots of controls in there... Jul 26 18:22:03 ugh, i bet the fact that being able to ring while playing a movie is going to require all sorts of contortions hasn't occurred to anybody yet. Jul 26 18:22:08 that's because there are lots of audio options. i think there are some 5 speakers, no? Jul 26 18:22:28 3 speakers, 1 mic, and a bidirectional analog interface to the gsm Jul 26 18:23:51 galexande: not really - you just need a mixer daemon do that multiple things can open /dev/dsp Jul 26 18:25:50 yeah speed but no one has picked out a standard openmoko mixer daemon, i bet Jul 26 18:25:59 though i wouldn't object to that being yet another function of gsmd Jul 26 18:26:31 i wonder if there's a 'transparent' alsa approach to mixer daemmons Jul 26 18:27:04 Is there any update on when the final/stable phone is going to be out? (that is, did it got delayed?) Jul 26 18:27:04 Pupeno: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Jul 26 18:27:28 openmoko will use pusleaudio Jul 26 18:27:31 pupeno, they're notorious for not anouncing that a deadline won't happen until the deadline is near, but i would personally be shocked if there is anything shipping in october Jul 26 18:27:33 thanks koen Jul 26 18:27:35 pulseaudio that is Jul 26 18:28:00 http://www.pulseaudio.org/ Jul 26 18:29:47 freelock: to get sound in call do alsactl -f restore /etc/alsa/gsmhandset.state Jul 26 18:30:04 openmoko: 03shoragan * r2400 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.22.x/patches/ (4 files): Jul 26 18:30:04 openmoko: Fix function pointers Jul 26 18:30:04 openmoko: Thanks to Felix "nbd" Fietkau Jul 26 18:30:05 I'm so happy, my neo arrived Jul 26 18:31:00 calamous_: Welcome! Jul 26 18:31:11 Make sure you back up the filesystem before you flash it... Jul 26 18:31:19 wiki.openmoko.org | Store: www.openmoko.com | First phones arrived yesterday, more now. More to ship. (black/silver only, in order of RT) DO NOT FLASH WITHOUT SAVING gllin! Jul 26 18:31:23 I just lost my GSM software... (looking for another cop) Jul 26 18:31:25 y Jul 26 18:31:46 wiki.openmoko.org | Store: www.openmoko.com | First phones arrived yesterday, more now. More to ship. (black/silver only, in order of RT) DO NOT FLASH WITHOUT SAVING gllin (the GPS driver) Jul 26 18:32:59 oooohhhh Jul 26 18:42:09 openmoko: 03shoragan * r2401 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.22.x/patches/pcf50633.patch: Update to 2.6.22.1 Jul 26 18:50:38 Just had a successful outgoing call... Jul 26 18:50:52 Had to adjust the audio for both left and right speakers down during the call Jul 26 18:51:33 :) Jul 26 18:52:40 hehe Jul 26 18:52:42 gratz Jul 26 18:57:29 freelock: hmmm, left/right speakers shouldnt be on, I must have arsed up that file Jul 26 18:59:37 openmoko: 03shoragan * r2402 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.22.x/patches/gta02-core.patch: Update to 2.6.22.1 Jul 26 19:01:19 So now the real development gets started. :-) Jul 26 19:01:47 daxxar: nethack? Jul 26 19:02:23 ozarka: What about it? Jul 26 19:02:44 (I was saying so since phones have started arriving) Jul 26 19:02:57 I know. :-) Jul 26 19:03:20 how are the phones? Jul 26 19:03:26 I ordered an orange one, so I have nothing to do but stew in my own bitterness until they start shipping. Jul 26 19:03:43 ozarka: But what about nethack? Jul 26 19:04:16 Ah, orange, yes, I was considering it - to not be dull and stereotypically geek (black/silver is a bit cliche), but I luckily decided against it. ;-) Jul 26 19:04:31 You said "real development". It was a joke. :-) Jul 26 19:04:55 ozarka: Ah, haha ;P A bit slow today. Jul 26 19:05:10 Second time in ~5 minutes someone has made an IRC-joke that I didn't get. :S Jul 26 19:05:15 It's not you, it's me! Jul 26 19:05:23 I don't think I would have been in the first shipment anyway. Jul 26 19:05:45 I hope I am, not too certain though. But have they billed people who aren't in the first shipment? Jul 26 19:06:22 I don't know. Jul 26 19:06:39 Have you been billed? Jul 26 19:06:52 I have not been billed. Jul 26 19:07:03 Mkay, guess not, then. :) Jul 26 19:07:28 Aww, the dialer doesn't actually dial out for me. Jul 26 19:08:12 I'm 2742 and the highest billed according to the wiki is 24xx. Jul 26 19:08:16 Nor does the phone actually notice that it received a call, Maybe I didn't put the SIM card in right. Jul 26 19:09:21 But the terminal does. (-: Jul 26 19:11:05 ozarka: me too. orange for the lose. at least it will look cool once I get it. :P Jul 26 19:12:25 I work with BlackBerry devices. They all start to look the same after a while. Jul 26 19:12:58 if you guys need some good entertainment while waiting for your phones, watch this http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0065528/ Jul 26 19:13:16 gets you into the right state of mind... Jul 26 19:13:31 Thanks, roh. Jul 26 19:13:52 Are you saying it's a difficult device to work with? Jul 26 19:13:57 Is that a subtle hint? Jul 26 19:14:49 ozarka no. thats not the point.. its a point about the insanity of buerocrats and hierarchy Jul 26 19:15:17 Right. Got it. Jul 26 19:15:22 ;) Jul 26 19:16:34 * ScaredyCat gets out a poking stick Jul 26 19:30:08 what order number are they on for processing ? Jul 26 19:30:31 -9999 Jul 26 19:32:09 -9999 ? Jul 26 19:32:32 they're very very slow Jul 26 19:32:43 They're not over -9000? Jul 26 19:36:13 codyl: according to the wiki, the last one shipped was 24xx. Jul 26 19:36:32 shipped? or paid for Jul 26 19:36:41 ozarka, ah- so it is actually happening .. thank you Jul 26 19:36:45 Shipped. Jul 26 19:36:56 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/P1_Owners Jul 26 19:37:14 Surely I'm not the only one obsessively reloading that page? Jul 26 19:37:21 hahaah Jul 26 19:37:25 yes, but that means very little Jul 26 19:37:43 since they're not shipping in order number sequence Jul 26 19:38:10 It's _mostly_ number sequence. Jul 26 19:38:17 no it's not Jul 26 19:38:22 it's by country Jul 26 19:38:42 Right. Jul 26 19:38:47 usa first, then everyone else Jul 26 19:39:01 I'm in the US, so that makes sense to me. :-) Jul 26 19:39:03 although they seem to be shipping about 3 a day.. Jul 26 19:39:10 wow Jul 26 19:39:21 they might even be done by the time the second version ships! Jul 26 19:39:30 looks like 1 person in Norway has shipping confirmation Jul 26 19:39:38 And one in UK Jul 26 19:39:45 who alledged it'll be here tomorrow. Jul 26 19:39:49 gah, soon everyone will have a Neo and I shall no longer be cool Jul 26 19:40:58 XorA: even after they all ship, only a few thousand people on the planet will have one. Jul 26 19:41:14 denmark too Jul 26 19:41:21 So I think your "coolness" is safe. :-) Jul 26 19:41:31 yeah, i have to be lame with my Nokia 6260 until october or later... Jul 26 19:42:34 Are there still plenty of Silver/Black Neos? Jul 26 19:42:35 * ScaredyCat can't believe that it's going to hit 4 weeks soon Jul 26 19:42:49 ozarka: who will be the first to blend one though? Jul 26 19:43:40 Are there any left? Jul 26 19:44:49 http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-July/008279.html Jul 26 19:45:26 we need devices first Jul 26 19:47:54 * hhf423_ is already looking forward to the camp Jul 26 19:48:07 hhf423_ :) Jul 26 19:48:56 could i place my tent in gsm-village? Jul 26 19:49:30 bug_: you can place your tent whereever you want Jul 26 19:50:11 bug_: but I would advise not to do it where rain would gather if it does. last time people in the wrong places got almost flushed away :-) Jul 26 19:50:25 bug_ of course. Jul 26 19:50:33 ok! thanks! Jul 26 19:51:01 hi roh Jul 26 19:51:09 i can take a neo and a debugboard with Jul 26 19:51:49 (hopefully nobody needs the db) Jul 26 19:53:03 since some developers will be there we will have enough db to survive. to be fair i use it pretty seldom Jul 26 19:53:28 hhf432: i hope i find a good place since i arrive late (7.8. evening) Jul 26 19:54:28 roh: ok less stuff to care about ;-) Jul 26 19:54:33 there is plenty of space.. thats what i would not really worry about Jul 26 19:58:42 hmhm, I'll be on a different continent during camp... Jul 26 20:02:07 i might go there :p Jul 26 20:04:37 hey all! Have I missedanything exciting? I sawa few more people got their device! Jul 26 20:05:07 Jason1: see topic Jul 26 20:05:36 zecke: You sounds bitter :) Jul 26 20:05:43 we're! Jul 26 20:05:59 btw, how's your neo? :) Jul 26 20:06:09 awesome:) Jul 26 20:06:23 argh@#! Jul 26 20:06:28 Have not played with it much today. I am supposed to be working... Jul 26 20:06:30 Jason1: tired+hungry Jul 26 20:17:02 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wishlist:Silent_mode_timeout]] [[Wishlist:EggTimer]] [[Web_Browser]] [[Toolbar]] [[Message_Body]] [[System_Info]] [[Search_Widget]] [[Wishlist_-_Hardware_-_Novel_Devices]] [[Stylus]] [[Sources_Dialog]] [[Bluetooth_powered_Multi-SIM_support]] and other changes Jul 26 20:18:25 is there a trac for this project? Jul 26 20:19:54 phed_ have a look at: http://projects.openmoko.org/ - no trac though Jul 26 20:20:25 mm, with the timeline on trac it is easy to keep on top of how the project progresses Jul 26 20:20:59 especially since you can browse the source directly Jul 26 20:21:25 hi Jason1. if you have to be at work, at least the neo has time to change. Jul 26 20:21:28 !!! Jul 26 20:21:34 hi Federico22 Jul 26 20:21:41 Jason1: yesterday's BOF was less dramatic because the battery of the only neo was dead Jul 26 20:21:47 hi there Jul 26 20:22:06 don-o: Yeah, I have to let it rest every now an then. Jul 26 20:22:20 don-o: That sucks. How many people showed up? Jul 26 20:22:46 Jason1: about 25. Jul 26 20:22:50 Jason1: more than i expected. Jul 26 20:23:08 interesting. Jul 26 20:23:36 we didnt think anyone was going to show up with a neo Jul 26 20:23:45 so a couple people started the emulator on their laptops Jul 26 20:24:12 wish I could have made it. I wantedto goto Ubuntu Live, but we have a sfotware release coming up Jul 26 20:25:16 Jason1: i have yet to confirm that the P1 can actually take or make a call. Jul 26 20:26:09 don-o: Yeah it can. barely. Jul 26 20:26:41 The GUI crashes easily, and you have to tweakthe audio volume via SSH. Jul 26 20:26:52 Jason1: you were able to talk to the other end? Jul 26 20:26:56 and I still have not heard it ring when an incolimng call comes in. Jul 26 20:27:03 don-o: Yup. Jul 26 20:27:08 and listen. Jul 26 20:28:42 Jason1: cool. what about taking a call? Jul 26 20:28:47 Pretty cool stuff. I am hoping that the dialer bugs get worked out quickly so that I can at least avoid having to swap out the SIM all the time Jul 26 20:29:13 Jason1: how does SIM swapping help? Jul 26 20:29:30 don-o: It will take a call too. The problem is that I have not been able to get it to "ring". You have to be looking at the screen when the call comes in so that you can pressthe "answer" button Jul 26 20:29:48 Jason1: interesting. Jul 26 20:29:50 don-o: So people can still get ahold of me :) Jul 26 20:30:01 Jason1: do you have an idea of the battery life? Jul 26 20:30:17 don-o: It is definately not ready for daily use, but I dont think it is very far away. Jul 26 20:30:35 don-o: No idea. I have barely had it un-tethered. Jul 26 20:30:52 Jason1: ok. Jul 26 20:31:22 I did take it out to a restraunt yesterday (around my neck) :) Jul 26 20:31:55 wow. thats gotta get you some nerd-cred. ;) Jul 26 20:32:25 Jason1: I got mine today. and I have just flashed the kernel and rootfs onto it Jul 26 20:32:50 calamous_: ohh cool! What rootfs did you use? Jul 26 20:33:00 Jason1: the one on chooseopen.com Jul 26 20:33:06 calamous_: sweet Jul 26 20:33:16 cool. yeah the one on builhost dont work Jul 26 20:34:26 I was wondering how the sim card slot works, like if it is a device (i.e /dev/simcard) because it would be nice to copy the data off so I dont have to keep swaping sims when I need a "phone" Jul 26 20:35:19 I'm really inpressed with the display I set up USBnet (and routing on my host) and was viewing web pages and pictures Jul 26 20:35:19 calamous_ the sim is exclusively connected to the gsm modem. meaning every communication to the sim should go via gsmd Jul 26 20:35:37 calamous_: no idea. I think gsmd handles that. IIRC, the wiki says that libgsmd-tool has not implemented the SIM storage feature yet... Jul 26 20:36:41 calamous_: You gotta tell me how you did that. I can ssh into it, but the devicecant see the outside world Jul 26 20:37:07 Jason1 you need to set up nat Jul 26 20:37:18 On your host: echo "1" > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward Jul 26 20:37:33 iptables -A POSTROUTING -t nat -j MASQUERADE -s 192.168.0.0/24 Jul 26 20:37:39 iptables -P FORWARD ACCEPT Jul 26 20:37:51 and what calamous_ said Jul 26 20:37:57 roh's way works but I used a different way Jul 26 20:38:10 bridge-utils will work too iirc Jul 26 20:38:34 codyl should. but i am not shure since i havent tested that. Jul 26 20:38:44 Instead of masqing, on my router (since that is linux too, openwrt) you must set it back up to route anything to 192.168.0.0/24 to the IP of your host computer which has the usb<-->openmoko connection Jul 26 20:38:46 I have a bridge setup for VirtualBox. Whats the chances of me messing that up :) Jul 26 20:39:02 not much Jul 26 20:39:03 roh, ive used bridge-utils with bluetooth PAN before- works quite well Jul 26 20:39:22 brctl addif usb0 Jul 26 20:39:45 Make sure to copy your /etc/resolv.conf too Jul 26 20:39:50 calamous_ ah.. yes. but then you are limited to one router.. since i have it in my etc/network/interfaces i just have ip on the moko by plugging it into my notebook. regardless where that gets its upstream from. Jul 26 20:40:20 also bridging does _not_ work on wireless interfaces. means when the notebook has wifi for internet connection you cannot bridge that ot usb or ethernet Jul 26 20:40:25 roh: true. Jul 26 20:40:59 fell into that hole with qemu more than once. *sigh* Jul 26 20:41:05 roh: I would have done that but my firewall on my comp is one of those esay packages firestarter and it really dosent like me to mess with uptables Jul 26 20:41:06 roh: I learned that the hard way :) Jul 26 20:41:27 I want to try it on a bluetooth PAN next Jul 26 20:41:51 Does anyone know much about the on screen keyboard, I cant seem to change it to dvorak Jul 26 20:42:22 calamous_ hehe. yeah. eventually i should ask the freifunk guys toi add that to their image for WRt ans similar boxes. so anybody could just use that and add an usb-bt stick without any config work Jul 26 20:43:23 roh: yep. I had it ipkg all those bluetooth packages onto my router. the df shows that now my rootfs is 98% full. Linksys used to have so much more space, but they really cut it back Jul 26 20:43:42 The rev.1 boards always have the best CPU, ram, and flash Jul 26 20:44:17 bbl Jul 26 20:44:43 later roh Jul 26 20:44:52 whats the issue with wireless devices? I am quite i've done that Jul 26 20:44:57 * sure Jul 26 20:45:07 Does anyone know how to display the battery charge? Jul 26 20:45:19 should be at the top right? Jul 26 20:45:31 if not, you probably need to upgrade Jul 26 20:46:27 I just see the charge icon Jul 26 20:46:44 ah. well, if you weren't charging, it would display the charge state, I guess. Jul 26 20:46:56 openmoko: 03andrew * r2403 10/trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/ (48 files in 9 dirs): Pull changes from cvs.savannah.nongnu.org:/sources/qemu. (Closing bug #659) Jul 26 20:46:59 calamous_: Question: The neo is on a different subnet (192.168.0) vs(10.0.0.) than the host. Is that good or bad? Jul 26 20:47:11 Good Jul 26 20:47:25 if its on the same it wont know what interface to push out the packets Jul 26 20:48:03 Jason1: Whats your host's IP? Jul 26 20:48:12 10.0.0.10 Jul 26 20:48:23 and your USB one is 192.168.0.200? Jul 26 20:48:31 yup, default Jul 26 20:48:49 calamous_: acutally 192.168.0.202, right? Jul 26 20:49:07 Jason1: the neo should be .202 Jul 26 20:49:18 and you should be .200 Jul 26 20:49:19 ohh yes. of course. Jul 26 20:49:28 thats correct. Thats how it is Jul 26 20:49:39 openmoko: 03ortalo * r2404 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-calculator/ (6 files in 3 dirs): Improved display of non-finite numbers (with some special treatment for repeated NaN results...:-) Jul 26 20:51:01 Jason: on your host run: iptables -A POSTROUTING -t nat -j MASQUERADE -o eth0 -s 192.168.0.0/24 Jul 26 20:51:10 assuming that your ethernet is eth0 Jul 26 20:51:45 and echo "1" > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward Jul 26 20:51:51 Okay, I've gotten my contact list copied over from Evolution on the desktop, works great... Jul 26 20:52:17 Calendar is showing reminders on the home page, but haven't yet gotten to show in the calendar app Jul 26 20:53:44 calamous_: "sudo echo "1" > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward" give me "/proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward: Permission Denied Jul 26 20:53:58 Jason Jul 26 20:54:23 jason1: you are redirecting the output of sudo to /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward Jul 26 20:54:34 jason1: sudo su, then try it... Jul 26 20:54:48 jason1: not echo. do sudo -s -H first then run that command Jul 26 20:57:51 I have set the time with date but when I restart it dosent stick. is there a way to update the hardware? Jul 26 20:58:04 Wondering the same thing... Jul 26 20:58:30 is ntp available on the device? Jul 26 20:58:34 calamous_: man hwclock Jul 26 20:58:45 Kensan: ty Jul 26 21:04:08 Jason1: did you get your net worknig? Jul 26 21:04:09 calamous_: Got it! Took me a second to figure it out. My eth0 is bound to br0 so I had to modify your command to account for that. Works great now!!! Jul 26 21:04:34 Nice. go to some sites and look at the pic quality on the neo Jul 26 21:04:55 It has better res than the iPhone right? (even though its screen is smaller) Jul 26 21:05:15 calamous_: will I need to write a script to do that on boot, or will those changes persist? Jul 26 21:05:27 * calamous_ needs to break his habbit of comparing the neo to the iPhone Jul 26 21:05:45 Jason1: they will not be presistant so A script will be needed Jul 26 21:06:35 calamous_: Stupid question. how do you click in the broswer? Mine wants to pan the view instead of click Jul 26 21:07:13 Jason1: I could not tell you becasue when I click in my browser it closes like a SIGSEV Jul 26 21:07:18 lol Jul 26 21:07:21 ohh Jul 26 21:07:30 But I can go to address in the address bar Jul 26 21:07:41 thats weird. You should be uning hte same rootfs as me... Jul 26 21:08:04 Jason1: I agree. Jul 26 21:09:05 I think the keyboard is really unintutiave. It should have a "." in it and '/' and '-' on its regular mode, its a pain to type in the address Jul 26 21:10:00 calamous_: the keyboard needs work Jul 26 21:10:37 yeah I'm going to SVN the source and play around with it Jul 26 21:10:56 calamous_ - If you get to do something useful, submit a patch, please. Jul 26 21:11:04 Is there a reference around for the handwriting recognition? Jul 26 21:11:18 Can write most letters, but no space, no "i", and a few others... Jul 26 21:11:33 Elrond: of course Jul 26 21:11:39 freelock - I was locking for that info too. If you find it, let me know. Jul 26 21:13:11 calamous_, Elrond: Make sure you follow the work alphaone is already doing on it. Discuss is on matchbox ml Jul 26 21:14:07 matchbox ml? Jul 26 21:17:01 calamous_: matchbox project maillingliste Jul 26 21:17:20 calamous_: We use the matchbox-keyboard Jul 26 21:17:25 calamous_ - openmoko-keyboard is a fork of matchbox-keyboard. Jul 26 21:17:39 calamous_: http://matchbox-project.org/ Jul 26 21:17:59 ok ok. ty Jul 26 21:18:20 Elrond: The goal is to remove the fork. That's alphaone current task Jul 26 21:18:36 Jason1: have you gone to google.com on your neo yet? Jul 26 21:19:04 calamous_: Yeah, It looks good. I was trying to get to other pages, without much luck. Jul 26 21:19:23 Jason1: are you scrolling or wehn you click "search" lets say crashing? Jul 26 21:20:27 I fixed the scrolling thing. That little in lower right corner button in the keyboard is a mode switch. It craches when I press html buttons Jul 26 21:21:11 Does anyone know how to get dev-tools on the phone, it dosent have gcc and gdb (although I bet they would take lots of space)? Jul 26 21:25:47 stefan_schmidt - Ahh, super, I like that. :-) Jul 26 21:26:22 stefan_schmidt - I really hope it'll work out. My last attempts for re-unifying a fork took 3 years, after which I gave up. ;) Jul 26 21:27:10 Elrond: It's already on the way. Jul 26 21:27:52 calamous_: fyi, apparently browser doesnot support JPGs Jul 26 21:28:01 Elrond: Will take some time to get in all the needed bits, but at least O-Hand, company behind matchbox, is already working on OpenMoko :) Jul 26 21:28:17 Jason1: hmm, I wonder if it dosent have the decodeing for them Jul 26 21:28:28 Jason1: I wish I could port firefox to it, lol Jul 26 21:28:56 stefan_schmidt - Nice :-)) Jul 26 21:29:05 Elrond: samba-ng? Jul 26 21:29:30 LarstiQ - s/ng/tng/; Yes. Jul 26 21:29:39 woops Jul 26 21:29:47 but at least I remembered correctly Jul 26 21:29:57 hehe ;) Jul 26 21:32:03 calamous_: goto http://www.chooseopen.com/pic.html on the device. Its a picture sample... Jul 26 21:32:46 Jason1: Thats a nice picture Jul 26 21:32:53 There is no reason FF won't just work. Jul 26 21:33:12 It will not be battery optimal. Jul 26 21:33:57 And it will not be very fast ;) Jul 26 21:34:46 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Unresolved_Hardware_Questions - everyone who's just got hardware! Jul 26 21:37:21 Okay, no questions for me ;-) Jul 26 21:39:42 Elrond: for you - a copy of the script you use to start up gllin - and log, so others can produce nice long logs for stats. Jul 26 21:40:05 calamous_: Have you tested the audio yet? Jul 26 21:40:29 Jason1: no I haven. I would put an ogg on but I don't think it has the decoder. Jul 26 21:41:00 I did an MP3 yesterday... Jul 26 21:41:18 Jason1: It has an mp3 decoder on it? Jul 26 21:41:21 preinstalled? Jul 26 21:41:29 cause I can seem to get ipkg to work Jul 26 21:41:31 calamous_: yup Jul 26 21:41:38 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Audio_Subsystem Jul 26 21:41:41 SpeedEvil - Ahh, I'll call ph5 for the strace options. Jul 26 21:41:48 calamous_: very easy to play with Jul 26 21:41:54 Jason1: what do you use to play it? is there even a file manager Jul 26 21:42:21 mpg321 or something? Jul 26 21:42:32 madplay Jul 26 21:42:41 alsactl -f /etc/alsa/stereoout.state restore Jul 26 21:42:41 madplay myfavoritesong.mp3 Jul 26 21:43:37 calamous_: I copied an mp3 out to /mnt/card via scp Jul 26 21:45:42 * Kero smiles about his Ruby interface to dbus Jul 26 21:46:50 calamous_: Have you been able to makea call? Jul 26 21:53:28 Jason1: nope have you? Jul 26 21:53:34 calamous_: yup Jul 26 21:53:57 Jason1: through gsmd or the dialer? Jul 26 21:54:01 should be able to easily make call from SSH. Little more trial/error with hte GUI Jul 26 21:54:20 Jason1: I put in my flash card but I'm not sure what the dev node is called, do you know? Jul 26 21:54:29 sd card, or w/e its called Jul 26 21:54:42 stefan_schmidt - Any rough timeframe on the new-ui-commit / a new build on buildhost? Jul 26 21:55:16 calamous_: mine mounted automatically as /mnt/card Jul 26 21:55:37 Elrond: once you have gllin running - strace -s 9999 -o file should work. Jul 26 21:55:41 Elrond: Soon (TM) Jul 26 21:55:48 Elrond: once you have gllin running - strace -s 9999 -o file -p pidofgllin should work. Jul 26 21:56:01 Elrond: Sorry, I'm not the announcement guy. :( Jul 26 21:56:19 Jason1: if you type mount what dev node is linked to /mnt/card? Jul 26 21:57:31 /dev/mmcblk0p1 Jul 26 21:57:48 Ok. Jul 26 21:57:50 Do you think I could walk over to the local AT&T store and ask for an extra sim card, say I got 2 phones and I don't like swaping Jul 26 21:58:30 calamous_: I heard that SOME providers will sell you a replacement sim. Search howardforums. they are down with all that stuff Jul 26 21:59:39 stefan_schmidt - Heh, no problem. The second part of my question is more relating to the commits since 3 weeks, so one can try some of that. ;) Jul 26 22:02:10 Jason1: Nice I got that mp3 playing. I'm using the on screen kb, It needs to have numebrs slashes, perorid on the main screen, as well as tab (How could anyone use a shell without tab completion)? Jul 26 22:02:11 Elrond: yeah, unfortunately I have no access to the buildhost and my upload is to slow to put it on my people account from my local build Jul 26 22:02:28 calamous_: choose the other keyboard Jul 26 22:02:35 and how do I ctrl+c out of a program Jul 26 22:02:44 stefan_schmidt - No worry :-) Jul 26 22:03:30 Ok - I've written a small FAQ on how to measure power consumption of your neo. Anyone with a DMM and a P1 Neo - step up! http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Unresolved_Hardware_Questions Jul 26 22:03:35 freelock: ty. i didnt see that option. Do you know how to map it to dvorak? Jul 26 22:03:36 calamous_: Yeah the keyboard sucks. I could figure out ctrl-c either. I did everything via an ssh terminal Jul 26 22:03:37 (touch & hold the right edge of the white box, you get a dropdown with two keyboards and stroke recognizer Jul 26 22:03:49 could=couldnt Jul 26 22:04:25 Jason1: there is another kb that freelock helped me get to, its much better Jul 26 22:04:30 Don't see any option for dvorak Jul 26 22:04:46 * stefan_schmidt starts a timing for a OE.dev build for gat01 from scratch and goes to bed. Jul 26 22:04:47 calamous_: ohh? Jul 26 22:04:49 Night all. Jul 26 22:05:09 Jason1: if you click and hold the white box at top choose the middle option Jul 26 22:05:09 calamous_: found it Jul 26 22:05:13 nice Jul 26 22:05:18 MUCH better Jul 26 22:05:21 inst that much better Jul 26 22:05:23 yeah lol Jul 26 22:06:08 calamous_: Did you remember to backup your device before you flashed it? Jul 26 22:06:12 Jason1: the next step is to get Xmms first Jul 26 22:06:20 NO! I lost my gps driver apprently Jul 26 22:06:27 Good night stefan_schmidt Jul 26 22:06:48 calamous_: Exactly what I was goingto ask you for :( Jul 26 22:06:53 lost mine too Jul 26 22:06:54 calamous_: me too... :-( Jul 26 22:07:05 How could I back it up if it didnt boot Jul 26 22:07:18 Cause if I extracted the mem block it would just be binary data Jul 26 22:07:21 calamous_: Yeah, I dont think mine had rootfs on it... Jul 26 22:07:43 They made it seem like you need to take the_gps_driver.ko off and then flash and put it back on Jul 26 22:08:14 Why can't it be online, is the gps company worried about their precious source? Jul 26 22:08:15 It's not a ko Jul 26 22:08:17 it's a binary Jul 26 22:08:51 SpeedEvil: do you know where that binary resides? (or shoulb reside) Jul 26 22:09:00 SpeedEvil: You are going to remember to back your up and send it to all us idiots, right :) Jul 26 22:09:06 IIRC it's gllin. Jul 26 22:09:09 I dunno where it is. Jul 26 22:09:30 supposed to be in a folder off /root Jul 26 22:09:46 /root/DM or something like that Jul 26 22:09:50 How am I susposed to back it up if I dont have a rootfs? Jul 26 22:09:56 didn't Jul 26 22:11:24 Hmm. good question. Jul 26 22:11:27 Well i'll brb. I'm going to the local monopoly store (at&t) and asking for a second sim card Jul 26 22:11:39 SpeedEvil: Do you know that neo will run with Bat removed? Jul 26 22:11:46 writchie? Jul 26 22:11:53 Jason1/SpeedEvil: /home/root/gllin Jul 26 22:11:54 I don't _think_ it will. Jul 26 22:11:57 I dunno. Jul 26 22:12:48 SpeedEvil: your power measurements depend on charge current Jul 26 22:12:49 freelock: yep, mines gone Jul 26 22:12:57 writchie: not once it's charged. Jul 26 22:12:58 Mine too Jul 26 22:13:10 SpeedEvil: unless battery removed Jul 26 22:13:20 :( I was looking forward to seeing some GPS output Jul 26 22:13:44 What's strange right now is that the GSM antenna shows a signal Jul 26 22:13:46 I don't think it will run with battery out. Adn the battery is not charged at all once it's charged. Jul 26 22:13:51 ... and I took out the sim card an hour ago Jul 26 22:14:17 In some places you can make emergency calls with no SIM. Jul 26 22:14:21 freelock: Mine shows a week signal. It wouldnt trust it... Jul 26 22:14:54 the symbol dont work right Jul 26 22:15:30 same for bt symbol Jul 26 22:15:35 only placeholder Jul 26 22:16:19 It seems to partially work, for turning gsm antenna on/off and associating with network Jul 26 22:16:27 (not bt) Jul 26 22:17:02 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Unresolved_Hardware_Questions]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Pincher_Creek]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups]] [[User:XorA]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Edinburgh]] [[Category:Implemented]] [[Category:In_progress]] [[Category:InProgress]] and other changes Jul 26 22:17:11 freelock: mine little status bar thing crashes when I try to mess with hte GSM antenna menu items Jul 26 22:17:18 mine=my Jul 26 22:17:33 Mine seems to work a couple times, enough to (usually) get associated, then it crashes Jul 26 22:17:45 :) Jul 26 22:18:02 freelock: have you madea call yet? Jul 26 22:18:10 Yes, outgoing... Jul 26 22:18:18 incoming seems to crash right after picking up the call Jul 26 22:18:33 :( My incoming worked. Jul 26 22:18:40 cl or GUI? Jul 26 22:18:43 GUI. Jul 26 22:18:52 hrw|gone: ping Jul 26 22:18:55 Did you have the dialer running when you received the call? Jul 26 22:19:03 mickeyl: are we there yet? Jul 26 22:19:08 yeah, I think so Jul 26 22:19:41 Out of curiosity, does openmoko actually run gnome? Or can it? Jul 26 22:19:41 TheWordNerd: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Jul 26 22:20:35 TheWordNerd: it doesn't come with metacity, gnome-panel and nautilus but it uses GConf, GStreamer, EDS, GnomeVFS Jul 26 22:20:56 * * OM Bug 663 has been created by thebohemian(AT)gmx.net Jul 26 22:20:56 * * jffs2 image endianess depends on build hosts byteorder Jul 26 22:20:57 * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=663 Jul 26 22:21:05 I looked at the FAQ and list of software, but am not sure whether the full gnome stack is used/available or if there are specific libraries written to be more lightweight. I assume the latter but would rather not assume. :) Jul 26 22:21:32 FYI, I just built another rootfs image and uploaded it to: http://www.chooseopen.com/openmoko/build/ Jul 26 22:22:34 zecke, Have you heard of anyone using gnome-panel, etc. on it? Jul 26 22:23:52 I ask because I'm wondering how likely/possible it would be to run an accessible version of gnome on it, running orca for access by blind/visually impaired users. Granted, you'd need some sort of keyboard/keypad, but... Jul 26 22:24:46 Or perhaps you could skip the panel/metacity, dunno and haven't tried. Jul 26 22:25:14 TheWordNerd: lol, I think it is impossible to use orca :) Jul 26 22:25:38 zecke, Why do you say that, out of curiosity? Jul 26 22:25:50 TheWordNerd: it won't fit on the screen, and if it fits you can't have any other apps visible :) Jul 26 22:26:18 anyone working on sdio stack for the s3c2410/2440? Jul 26 22:26:32 zecke, Orca can be configured to not pop up a window by default. Jul 26 22:26:46 . . . and only pop up a window when configuring it. Jul 26 22:27:00 prpplague: the P2 wifi is on SDIO Jul 26 22:27:01 so, yes. Jul 26 22:27:12 TheWordNerd: what output would you use? braille, speach? Jul 26 22:27:28 TheWordNerd: but there isn't anything preventing you from using atk+ and guile Jul 26 22:27:32 zecke, Speech, presumably whatever sound hardware is on the phone already. Jul 26 22:28:07 SpeedEvil: who is the point on that? Jul 26 22:28:10 Hmmm, might have to give it a shot. How much storage and RAM does the phone include? Jul 26 22:28:22 prpplague: core team Jul 26 22:28:25 TheWordNerd 128m Jul 26 22:28:36 TheWordNerd/64, plus SD card Jul 26 22:28:43 SpeedEvil, Of RAM I assume? Jul 26 22:28:48 yes Jul 26 22:28:53 Oh, total? Jul 26 22:29:01 Ah. Jul 26 22:29:05 TheWordNerd: I have always wondered how you would do accessibility on a phone/pda and I blindly assume it is too small to be usable Jul 26 22:29:07 128M RAM, 64M flash, + microSD Jul 26 22:29:10 SpeedEvil: is there a list or channel i can work with the core team on the sdio stack stuff? Jul 26 22:29:15 no Jul 26 22:29:38 mail on the mailing list Jul 26 22:29:38 SpeedEvil: shame, they might like to have my code and notes :( Jul 26 22:29:52 openmoko-hardware or something. Jul 26 22:30:18 zecke, Some phones do already and it seems to work just fine, albeit expensively ($300+ in addition to the phone.) Jul 26 22:30:32 The SDIO pins are not exposed at the moment. Jul 26 22:30:53 So I'm wondering if openmoko+orca might be a less expensive alternative. Jul 26 22:31:00 TheWordNerd: I don't know which disabilities are targeted but the whole device is smaller than a usual input device (mice, special purpose mice) Jul 26 22:32:02 zecke, Right, so I'm thinking that either another device needs to be used (when the platform supports more) or I'd need to look into some sort of small bluetooth keyboard as a separate component. Not sure yet. Jul 26 22:33:10 ok, new commit on my dbus code; post to mailing list out. bedtime now, dreaming of emails about shipping neos. Jul 26 22:34:34 at&t said that a customer can only have one active SIM card at a time Jul 26 22:34:40 I said their system blew Jul 26 22:34:51 calamous_: that sucks Jul 26 22:34:56 SpeedEvil: the sd slot doesn't use the sdi controller on the s3c2410? i would be surprised if they are just using spi Jul 26 22:35:14 the extra wire isn't brought out. Jul 26 22:35:16 AIUI. Jul 26 22:35:22 I could be wrong. Jul 26 22:35:53 Jason1: when you click on the GSM atenna icon in the upper right and click power on dose it crash your whole top bar? Jul 26 22:36:06 calamous_: yup Jul 26 22:36:34 That makes me thing each icon is just a plugin to the bar, not its own program like on gnome or kde Jul 26 22:36:52 because when an applet crashes in gnome it just kills that icon, not the entire gnome-panel Jul 26 22:36:55 SpeedEvil: which extra wire is that? Jul 26 22:37:16 Isn't there another select line for SDIO cards? Jul 26 22:37:41 calamous_: could be.. Jul 26 22:37:46 I need to look at the standard again. Jul 26 22:39:50 SpeedEvil: for 1-bit sd the sdio is the same Jul 26 22:40:35 SpeedEvil: will you be around tomorrow? Jul 26 22:40:40 Yes. Jul 26 22:40:57 Jason1: When you ran cu -l /dev/ttySAC0 did youre's hang on connected or did it say that the AT inturpreter was ready? Jul 26 22:41:17 * SpeedEvil tries to remember. Jul 26 22:41:17 SpeedEvil: thanks Jul 26 22:41:22 Ah. Jul 26 22:41:30 is there a date on when the second batch of orders will start getting processed? Jul 26 22:41:33 I dont remember. I did that once. Jul 26 22:41:44 I was thinking of it in the context of multiple cards wired together,. Jul 26 22:41:51 ferric: no. Jul 26 22:42:14 sigh, all this excitement! :) Jul 26 22:42:23 The inital batch of 1000 made was shipped in two batches of 500 to the US. Jul 26 22:42:36 ferric: By time you get yours, we will have all the hard work done :) Jul 26 22:42:37 SpeedEvil: right, and the first 500 seem to be over. Jul 26 22:42:49 The arrival of the second 500 hasn't been noted. Jul 26 22:42:50 Jason1: that's the exciting part, somewhat. Jul 26 22:42:53 i mean, it's frustrating. Jul 26 22:44:23 Hmm. Jul 26 22:44:54 Anybody know how to set the timezone? Jul 26 22:45:38 It looks like 23/24th the majority of phones were going overseas. Jul 26 22:45:52 CC charges that is. Jul 26 22:46:22 ferric: Make one of these to keep you company: http://wiki.openmoko.org/images/2/27/Neo1973-doll.pdf Jul 26 22:46:28 :) Jul 26 22:47:52 proably cant ssh into it however... Jul 26 22:48:08 The total number of orders that have been charged - assuming that all the RTs are orders - might not be far off 500 Jul 26 22:48:15 s/orders/phones/ Jul 26 22:48:15 SpeedEvil meant: The total number of phones that have been charged - assuming that all the RTs are orders - might not be far off 500 Jul 26 22:50:02 Jason1: rofl Jul 26 22:50:27 The fact that up to 2464 the last ones all have comments about payment taken - and none after seems to me likely to indicate that the first 500 only have been processed. Jul 26 22:50:41 SpeedEvil: yep. Jul 26 22:50:47 (that's what i'm hoping, as well) Jul 26 22:50:58 * ferric goes home. Jul 26 22:51:24 * LarstiQ needs more than another 1000 after that to get his phone shipped Jul 26 22:51:31 :/ Jul 26 22:55:13 -sh-3.2# uname -a Jul 26 22:55:13 Darwin Gopiballava's iPhone 9.0.0d1 Darwin Kernel Version 9.0.0d1: Tue May 22 21:15:55 PDT 2007; root:xnu-933.0.0.178.obj~3/RELEASE_ARM_S5L8900XRB iPhone1,1 Darwin Jul 26 22:56:01 * Vnd[banho] is away: Banho - blog: tocadoelfo.blogspot.com Jul 26 22:56:12 Jason1: I think I'm just going to buy a cheep prepaid sim card Jul 26 22:56:24 That's a good idea... Jul 26 22:56:37 openmoko: 03shoragan * r2405 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.22.x/patches/ (5 files): Use better patch for MMC by Felix "nbd" Fietkau. Jul 26 22:57:13 calamous_: yeah. I am going to try and avoid that... I dont really need to talk on both of them. Jul 26 22:58:36 openmoko: 03shoragan * r2406 10/trunk/oe/packages/linux/linux-gta01/defconfig-2.6.22.1-fic-gta01: Update defconfig to disable MMC debugging. Jul 26 23:10:17 Anyone in here trying to get the QEMU gadgetfs module working under Ubuntu 7.0.4? Jul 26 23:13:00 I have instructions on how to build it on the wiki, but I need someone to verify Jul 26 23:21:11 re Jul 26 23:35:43 Jason1: What network was your simcard? Jul 26 23:35:59 I just bought a prepaid one but when I try to register it on the network it says I'm denied Jul 26 23:36:20 you may need to register Jul 26 23:36:24 calamous_: where are you based? Jul 26 23:36:30 Chicago Jul 26 23:38:24 in the UK - we have to phone the provider of prepaid sims to get the activated Jul 26 23:38:40 but yeah, phone system is the US is different so I probably can't help Jul 26 23:39:41 yeah, i think i am going to get a pre-paid sim tonight Jul 26 23:39:53 calamous_, what carrier? Jul 26 23:40:03 (the whole wonderful choice of tmobile or att) Jul 26 23:40:27 ATT Jul 26 23:40:40 At least you have a choice. We have one GSM provider :) Jul 26 23:40:45 calamous_, did you buy a "kit" ? Jul 26 23:40:58 I just bought a prepaid sim card and put it in my phone Jul 26 23:41:05 calamous_, from where? Jul 26 23:41:10 the local att store Jul 26 23:41:22 oh, they should have activated it for you Jul 26 23:41:30 did you just not want to show your neo? Jul 26 23:41:38 Yes Jul 26 23:41:47 calamous_, the sim is supposed to be activated when you leave the store Jul 26 23:42:04 Is there a "pin" assoiciated with a prepaid plan Jul 26 23:42:11 because if there is I never got one of them Jul 26 23:42:22 calamous_, i've not gotten any of the prepay accounts, yet Jul 26 23:42:30 i'll get my phone tomorrow (according to ups) Jul 26 23:42:38 calamous_: can you try the SIM in a different gsm phone? Jul 26 23:42:50 calamous_, if you would also write up your expriences on http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Carriers that would be awesome Jul 26 23:45:39 calamous_: you could try putting the card into a friend's phone to see if it works Jul 26 23:51:13 * Vnd[banho] is back (gone 00:55:11) Jul 26 23:55:47 roh: yt? Jul 26 23:59:30 printing just worked Jul 26 23:59:46 it hung my browser for a long time( about 60 seconds) Jul 27 00:00:29 sorry, wrong channel Jul 27 00:17:02 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups]] [[Wishlist:Extension_Framework]] [[User_talk:Aevin]] [[Building_Gadget_USB_Module]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Helsinki]] [[Talk:MokoMakefile]] [[Group_Order]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Braunschweig]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Berlin]] Jul 27 00:17:09 Why does the wiki have both Current_Events and Community_Events pages - any reason not to merge them? The former is more complete and has a link from the left-side page navigator. Jul 27 00:20:20 Is there an ipkg repository set up anywhere? Jul 27 00:20:30 Looking to install something like cron Jul 27 00:20:42 Also looking for a proc or sys interface for battery level Jul 27 00:21:38 I *think* that I successfully ordered a Neo the first day they were on sale, but I have not received any mail from FIC about it. Anyone know who I should talk to? Jul 27 00:21:39 joeyh: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Jul 27 00:25:05 from what I'm seeing in the shipping faq, others may have never gotten confirmation mails due to greylisting.. which I use Jul 27 00:27:55 idarwin: because the wiki is a horrible steaming mess. Jul 27 00:28:03 SpeedEvil: that's for sure Jul 27 00:28:14 SpeedEvil: it'd be nice to have a "wiki freeze" to go though and organize it Jul 27 00:28:23 and fix alot of it Jul 27 00:28:42 I'm at the moment going through all the pages, culling obvious errors, and adding categories. Jul 27 00:28:46 About 1/3 done. Jul 27 00:29:09 Though I'm not checking translated pages of course. Jul 27 00:29:19 SpeedEvil: I'd hope not! Jul 27 00:29:41 * SpeedEvil ponders correcting pages with google-translate. Jul 27 00:29:52 Hmm, I wonder if my sim reader is bad. I have tried to different sim cards and when I do AT commands I get back CME ERROR 10 which is sim not inserted Jul 27 00:30:13 The SIM connector is reportedly not brilliant. Jul 27 00:30:22 What I would try. Jul 27 00:30:28 Open the back of the phone. Jul 27 00:30:46 Press with 100g or so on the SIM, then power the phone up. Jul 27 00:30:53 While still pressing on it. Jul 27 00:31:08 anyone got a phone yet? Jul 27 00:31:42 Lots of people. Jul 27 00:31:47 Well - 6ish in here. Jul 27 00:31:55 6 lol Jul 27 00:31:56 * daMaestro should get his tomorrow Jul 27 00:32:02 in here. Jul 27 00:32:09 * duffyd is busting at the seems for his Jul 27 00:32:18 s/seems/seams Jul 27 00:32:18 oh my Jul 27 00:32:25 Do they not turn on without a battery? Jul 27 00:32:26 way to go simmons Jul 27 00:32:39 calamous_: it seems to me that it'd be difficult Jul 27 00:32:52 unless it was plugged in Jul 27 00:33:02 lol @ no battery Jul 27 00:33:21 yeah, sorry we forgot to add a solar panel Jul 27 00:33:21 SpeedEvil: Did you catch Harald's posting on community re: wiki / restructuring? Jul 27 00:33:32 of course I have it plugged in but It wont turn on without a batt Jul 27 00:33:37 * daMaestro makes a comment that the moko is so advanced it will pull enough power to turn on from area GSM waves Jul 27 00:33:38 lol Jul 27 00:33:47 Writchie: yeah. Jul 27 00:33:56 Writchie: that's the least of the wikis problems :) Jul 27 00:34:02 the thread was hijacked Jul 27 00:34:13 true on least of the problems Jul 27 00:34:15 daMaestro: you don't know how early crystal radios were powered, then? Jul 27 00:34:35 hi Jul 27 00:34:36 It's very, very hard to do two-way that way though. Jul 27 00:34:41 the openmoko is so powerful it will increase the IQ of your cat Jul 27 00:34:47 SpeedEvil: BTW BT wakeup doesn't look like it will work with present hardware Jul 27 00:34:52 You run into the 1/r^4 signal dropof. Jul 27 00:35:01 Writchie: where did you get that? Jul 27 00:35:22 Writchie: the pins on the BT module are connected to wakeup capable pins. Jul 27 00:35:25 AIUI. Jul 27 00:35:31 looks like the bug squashing will start this week Jul 27 00:35:33 SpeedEvil: not EINT pins Jul 27 00:35:35 just pio Jul 27 00:35:41 as phones arrive Jul 27 00:35:50 wakeup must be on EINT1 - 16 Jul 27 00:36:03 2410 host usb doesn't support wakeup either Jul 27 00:36:33 old way is to poll the gpio pin from slow mode Jul 27 00:36:40 old=only Jul 27 00:36:49 Bugger. Jul 27 00:37:08 if slow is really less than 50mw may not be too bad in interrim Jul 27 00:37:19 The CPU number is 33mW Jul 27 00:37:20 hopefully could be fixed for gta02 Jul 27 00:37:22 However. Jul 27 00:37:32 50mW is probably more realistic. Jul 27 00:38:01 i'll take 50mw - batter is 1200mahr * 3.6 V if a read it right Jul 27 00:38:08 It's not _bad_. Jul 27 00:38:25 It does have a nice side-effect - sortof. Jul 27 00:38:28 ultimately i'd like to see 5mw in BT wakeable standby flight mode Jul 27 00:38:42 It means that when bluetooth is on, you've got essentially free GPS. Jul 27 00:38:55 how much power for gsp in standby Jul 27 00:39:02 That's the nice thing. Jul 27 00:39:07 It can be off most of the time. Jul 27 00:39:22 wake up every 10 seconds for a peek? Jul 27 00:39:25 You only need to wake up the GPS and take a position every 3 min or so, for 1s to keep lock. Jul 27 00:39:49 wow, that's awesome Jul 27 00:39:49 Unless you're in a fast plane. Jul 27 00:39:55 This is in principle. Jul 27 00:40:01 my plane is only 160kts Jul 27 00:40:03 The current GPS driver cannot do this. Jul 27 00:40:11 nor BT Jul 27 00:40:15 isn't that half the fun? Jul 27 00:40:29 bring out the blue wires Jul 27 00:40:29 you need to move about a third of a millisecond or so in 3 mins in order to throw it off. Jul 27 00:40:54 :( my plane is only 100kts Jul 27 00:40:57 third of a ms? Jul 27 00:40:57 SpeedEvil: I keep getting CME error 10 Jul 27 00:41:08 I would hate to think that my sim reader is messed up Jul 27 00:41:10 has this SIM ever worked in any phone Jul 27 00:41:19 Chances are I'm making some mistake, hardware is usually not defective Jul 27 00:41:25 Writchie: Yes Jul 27 00:41:40 last resort: pencil eraser Jul 27 00:41:42 Ive tried 2 sim cards and they both work in other phones but not my neo Jul 27 00:41:48 sometimes corrosion Jul 27 00:41:49 Pencil eraser? Jul 27 00:41:50 calamous_: lol you're lucky, i've had more defective hardware than anyone else i know, however that's only when buying new Jul 27 00:41:56 They are not 3.3V SIMS? Jul 27 00:42:08 Dunno about that. Jul 27 00:42:19 SpeedEvil: Are there 3.3V and 5V sims? Jul 27 00:42:36 calamous_: yes - I don't know much about it. Jul 27 00:42:42 when's the last time you saw a 5V SIM? Jul 27 00:42:47 calamous_: I'd post to the community mailing list. Jul 27 00:43:19 goodidea Jul 27 00:43:41 Otherwise, do the warranty return thing :/ Jul 27 00:44:08 SpeedEvil, what carrier are you rocking? Jul 27 00:44:17 yugh warrranty returns are always a hassle Jul 27 00:44:24 SpeedEvil, this is assuming you actually have your phone Jul 27 00:44:26 carrier? Jul 27 00:44:28 what warrantee Jul 27 00:44:41 i just don't want to find out that carrier XYZ's sims don't work with the neo Jul 27 00:44:43 that would just suck Jul 27 00:44:50 * SpeedEvil doesn't have phone yet. Jul 27 00:45:17 ah sorry Jul 27 00:45:27 where is jason1 when you need him (or her) Jul 27 00:45:31 t-mobile sims work, at least... Jul 27 00:45:42 ok, well calamous_ is att Jul 27 00:46:03 wow that would suck; i've been looking more at att over t-mobile Jul 27 00:47:04 looks like 5v sim in 3.3V phone won't work. Jul 27 00:47:21 I have _no_ idea if that is the issue though. Jul 27 00:47:36 I don't think it is. Jul 27 00:47:45 The neo uses 3.3V? Jul 27 00:47:48 Writchie: where is the sim from? Jul 27 00:47:51 Never had problems with t-mobile sims Jul 27 00:48:01 AT&T Jul 27 00:48:10 what phone? Jul 27 00:48:14 prepay or not pre-pay? Jul 27 00:48:32 Prepaid ATT card Jul 27 00:48:33 i think he using an AT&T prepay SIM Jul 27 00:49:01 that should work, is the phone a nokia? Jul 27 00:49:17 he is using the neo1973 Jul 27 00:49:37 right but did he just buy a sim or pull it out of a pre-pay phone Jul 27 00:50:23 calamous_, you got just the sim correct? Jul 27 00:50:36 daMaestro: correct, and it works in other phones Jul 27 00:50:53 calamous_: what country are you in? Jul 27 00:50:56 US Jul 27 00:51:36 and you could just buy a sim? I've never heard of that Jul 27 00:52:20 but back to the task at hand, is there any text on the front and back of the sim? Jul 27 00:52:21 yeah, most countries allow you to buy a sim card (prepay) but you have to ring up the service provider first though to turn it on Jul 27 00:52:37 In the UK. Jul 27 00:52:47 If you buy a SIM, you can get them for $1 or so equiv. Jul 27 00:52:54 Even prepaid. Jul 27 00:53:00 or $100 in US Jul 27 00:53:01 But you have to top up by $15 to use it. Jul 27 00:53:05 for a $1 sim Jul 27 00:53:06 AT&T gave me a SIM for free with $20 credit Jul 27 00:53:10 yeah you can buy a sim card for $2 here in AU Jul 27 00:53:17 I hate the US Jul 27 00:53:22 move Jul 27 00:53:26 I will :) Jul 27 00:53:45 bhima, does it work with the neo? Jul 27 00:53:48 china has best rates Jul 27 00:54:03 daMaestro: I would presume it would, but I don't have a neo. Jul 27 00:54:05 ok Jul 27 00:54:07 US is in the stone age when it comes to mobile phones, I find it amusing that people see the iPhone as being curring edge when there are phones in Asia that have miles more features Jul 27 00:54:07 I just email Jason to ask him what he uses since he is chicago Jul 27 00:54:19 cutting* Jul 27 00:54:28 linux_galore: I could not agree with you more, american's are easly brainwashed Jul 27 00:54:35 yeah, well apple's stock is agreeing with that statement linux_galore Jul 27 00:54:36 linux_galore: I find people who rate "features" as the most important metric amusing. Jul 27 00:54:42 calamous_, thanks. Jul 27 00:54:51 Err. Jul 27 00:54:59 How aren't features important? Jul 27 00:55:02 calamous_, that is too much of a generalized statement for a FOSS project (a lot of us are in the US) Jul 27 00:55:29 For me, the major feature is 'can write own stuff'. As a phone, I'd never buy it if that wasn't the main feature. Jul 27 00:55:32 daMaestro: I make that judgement based upon the average consumer and what they tolerate in the US Jul 27 00:55:34 Kanji scanner isnt important heh heh Jul 27 00:55:40 If that wasn't a desire for me. Jul 27 00:55:59 second feature - you need a network that works Jul 27 00:56:06 daMaestro: and its a bunch not to do with technology, its goes with other things Jul 27 00:56:11 calamous_, s/tolerate/are force fed/ Jul 27 00:56:17 SpeedEvil: The feature spec sheet of the handset is not the most important thing. Jul 27 00:56:31 The feature set of the network + handset. Jul 27 00:56:39 calamous_: probably goes with the fact that 20% of americans are functionally illiterate ;) Jul 27 00:56:43 daMaestro: agreed, thats better diction. Jul 27 00:56:59 Agrajag: Really? Jul 27 00:57:00 SpeedEvil: Do you include usability as part of feature set? Jul 27 00:57:01 only 20% - you're dreaming ;) Jul 27 00:57:04 the major Telco here has a weird setup 850mhz channel for data with the rf using CDMA not gsm Jul 27 00:57:18 calamous_: apparently so - http://education-portal.com/articles/Illiteracy%3A_The_Downfall_of_American_Society.html Jul 27 00:57:19 Anyway, I would like to get my sim slot working Jul 27 00:57:24 where is that? Jul 27 00:57:38 bhima: of course. An unusable feature is not a feature. Jul 27 00:57:53 When I say features, I mean, "Send and recieve faxes", or "play youtube videos" Jul 27 00:58:04 SpeedEvil: Many, many people have trouble with that idea. :) Jul 27 00:58:31 So we have this wonderful nightmare were none of the Nokia phones work on this network because even though they support 850mhz for data they use GSM Jul 27 00:58:34 SpeedEvil: I see so many people saying, "But that one, it does , it's *better*!" Jul 27 00:58:48 But it is. Jul 27 00:58:51 If the others don't. Jul 27 00:58:57 And the user wants the feature enough. Jul 27 00:59:14 Yeah, 3 months is a long time in japan for a mobile heh Jul 27 00:59:17 OM may allow users to add features. Jul 27 00:59:22 SpeedEvil: thank you for being the voice of reason Jul 27 00:59:36 But that's not the point for a user at a given point in time. Jul 27 00:59:36 SpeedEvil: The last part, "wants the feature enough," is the operative part of that. Jul 27 00:59:57 SpeedEvil: I'm talking about people who say that "it does more" as if that makes it objectively better for that reason alone. Jul 27 01:00:00 they (ideally) compare features on phones, and buy the one that most suits them. Jul 27 01:00:07 Im wondering if the OM may become too feature rich Jul 27 01:00:14 SpeedEvil: Spec sheets are poor for evaluating usability. Jul 27 01:00:15 linux_galore: how do you figure? Jul 27 01:00:20 linux_galore: not really. Jul 27 01:00:20 Does anyone know about the Linux LED driver class. I looked though the vibrator source and its treated as the LED. Can I manually vibrate my phone by echoing 1 into some file in proc or sys? Jul 27 01:00:48 Bryce_Leo: people adding crack to set software sets Jul 27 01:01:09 linux_galore: huh? Jul 27 01:01:11 Bryce_Leo: end up like Gnome 1.4 with its 101 window setup options Jul 27 01:01:22 linux_galore: see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wishlist:Profiles#User_Profiles Jul 27 01:01:36 SOUTH SAN FRANCISCO, CA, US 7/26/2007 3:05 A.M. Jul 27 01:01:36 AN INCORRECT ROUTING AT A UPS FACILITY CAUSED THIS DELAY / THE PACKAGE WAS MISSORTED AT THE HUB. IT HAS BEEN REROUTED TO THE CORRECT DESTINATION SITE Jul 27 01:01:40 awesome.. way to go UPS Jul 27 01:01:58 You set it up so the user can pick the interface. Jul 27 01:02:07 morning Jul 27 01:02:15 daMaestro: Sorry to hear that Jul 27 01:02:18 Im just saying I hope we dont end up like Gnome 1.4 with all the useless crack (Gnome 2.0 removed it all) Jul 27 01:02:19 meh Jul 27 01:02:19 daMaestro: 2 days ago i had fedex steal parts of my package, scans in at 7.6 lbs gets to my house at 2.2lbs Jul 27 01:02:27 wow Jul 27 01:02:31 'teen/myspace' 'buisness/financial times' 'pervert/4chan' Jul 27 01:02:32 linux_galore: ahh ok i see what you mean Jul 27 01:02:35 now that i would be PISSED about Jul 27 01:02:57 'it fell open'. Jul 27 01:02:59 calamous_: I turned the vibrator on and off with an echo Jul 27 01:03:13 let me find it... Jul 27 01:03:14 What was the path you used Jul 27 01:03:15 ty Jul 27 01:03:20 daMaestro: i was furious, but fedex took the complaint, i called geeks.com and told them, they said, ok we'll handle it and 2nd day aired me a replacement Jul 27 01:03:29 daMaestro: and they've got it all handled Jul 27 01:03:46 Bryce_Leo, yeah.. i would have also be very livid Jul 27 01:03:53 I got my zaurus from geeks.com Jul 27 01:04:00 they had it on special Jul 27 01:04:17 they are pretty fast Jul 27 01:04:27 geeks.com is amazing, they've done nothing but treat me well, i've bout well over 1.5k worth of stuff from them Jul 27 01:05:14 I paid US$120 for a Zaurus 5500 (got a 5600 now) Jul 27 01:05:31 wow, i wish the zaurus was still available they were pretty cool Jul 27 01:06:01 XorA|gone Jul 27 01:06:02 oops Jul 27 01:06:19 Bryce_Leo: you can still buy them, i see Linux geeks with them all the time, especially the new clamshell models with a hardisk Jul 27 01:07:04 linux_galore: but where can you buy them from? Jul 27 01:07:13 i've got a treo right now and i'd like to just go back to a reg phone and pda Jul 27 01:07:36 calamous_: echo 1 > /sys/class/leds/gta01\:vibrator/brightness Jul 27 01:07:39 my treo is shite, it's been dropped, kicked, soaked, blasted with heat burried in sand.... Jul 27 01:07:44 calamous_: echo 0 > /sys/class/leds/gta01\:vibrator/brightness Jul 27 01:07:49 ... turns it back off Jul 27 01:08:04 freelock: thats, my girlfriend will like that feature Jul 27 01:08:05 Bryce_Leo: there are a few companies on line that sell them converted (Japanese -> English) for delivery all over the world Jul 27 01:08:10 thanks Jul 27 01:08:10 lol Jul 27 01:08:11 lol Jul 27 01:08:46 Bryce_Leo: although the Linux geeks throw that firmware in the bin and use the Debian version Jul 27 01:08:50 calamous_: the neo is _not_ 'water'proof. Jul 27 01:09:03 lol Jul 27 01:09:06 yes, "water" Jul 27 01:09:07 linux_galore: haha well that doesn't suprise me Jul 27 01:09:10 bwhwhahhahaha Jul 27 01:09:39 linux_galore: i've always been a fan of debians younger sluttier daughter Jul 27 01:09:43 I can imagine as soon as the debian guys see the openmoko they will create their own fork Jul 27 01:09:51 Bryce_Leo: I have a treo just like that! Jul 27 01:10:03 idarwin: lol pretty darn sturdy phone ain't it Jul 27 01:10:19 idarwin: my problem is i use Verizon and that means 500 to buy a new replacment no contract Jul 27 01:10:31 yeah, it just kept going and going until the end. Jul 27 01:10:51 create a waterproof mod case Jul 27 01:10:52 linux_galore: the debian folks probably would, but they might just leave it as it is Jul 27 01:11:04 urgh, I hate carrier lock-in but then you get the subsidy. :-( Jul 27 01:11:09 otter case Jul 27 01:11:11 those things are nuts Jul 27 01:11:24 so your Neo will replace your Treo, right? Jul 27 01:11:28 linux_galore: hi, fwiw, I'm a debian guy, and that's exactly why I (hopefully) have a neo on order Jul 27 01:11:35 Bryce_Leo: you know how the debian guys are, it has to bee 100% open source and gpl so they may fork it, Jul 27 01:11:40 idarwin: yes but why can you buy a treo 680 for gsm for 350 and yet it's 500 for a new 700 with identical specs to the 650 pretty much and the 650 is pretty similar to the 680 Jul 27 01:11:41 although I think of it more as packaging OpenMoko for Debian than a fork Jul 27 01:11:53 linux_galore: but they they'll be left without gprs Jul 27 01:12:14 I posted about my sim card reader on the list. Does anyone know any good way to clean the contacts? Jul 27 01:12:16 nah, just snarf the gprs stuff from the installed system during bootstrapping Jul 27 01:12:17 idarwin: that's the goal Jul 27 01:12:46 calamous_: use PCB cleaner, you can buy it at any electronics shop Jul 27 01:12:48 How easy is it to use the neo's touch screen with fingers? Jul 27 01:12:50 idarwin: i'd like to see my treo go away and switch to att contract with an open moko Jul 27 01:12:53 calamous_: I would wait till you get a comment from the list. Jul 27 01:13:09 ask me? no, ask palmsource. I dunno why they price it like that. Cuz GSM is better? Cuz it doesn't have wince inside? Really don't know Jul 27 01:13:27 <- electronics engineer Jul 27 01:13:37 retired though Jul 27 01:13:45 idarwin: it's probably because the cdma isn't open so they have to license the spec to build the hardware Jul 27 01:13:59 the merger of "community events" into "current events" is done in en, but will take a while for all the translations to synch. Jul 27 01:14:19 Ok. I'll sit tight Jul 27 01:14:26 I don't think that licensing fees are high enough to account for a $150 difference. Jul 27 01:14:45 Bryce_Leo, that could be, I just don't know Jul 27 01:14:53 calamous_: dont use any oil based products it will just attract dirt and some alcohol based cleaners leave residue Jul 27 01:15:01 bhima: they might be, i really don't know, i just think that it's stupid Jul 27 01:15:21 calamous_: if you have any eclipse cleaner for camera lenses that should work well Jul 27 01:15:48 All I know is, Palm gives you PalmOS and Wince as your OS choices. Not very impressive IMHO. Jul 27 01:16:04 Bryce_Leo: Just use PCB cleaner, it perfect, a sim card in reality is just a small pcb Jul 27 01:16:06 I'm taking a closer look at the sim contacts and it looks like one of them is too far depressed, I'm going to try and raise it a bit and try again. Jul 27 01:16:26 bhima: they'll have a linux option out by middle of next year supposedly Jul 27 01:16:29 Not to comment to much on the physical design, the construction of the sim card and memory card slots look "flimsey" Jul 27 01:16:48 WinCE is friggin slow Jul 27 01:16:51 Bryce_Leo: You mean, PalmOS UI with Linux underneath? Jul 27 01:16:52 linux_galore: i don't have any pcb cleaner so i generally use the eclipse to clean any contacts taht need it Jul 27 01:17:07 linux_galore: wince sucks terribly Jul 27 01:17:08 PalmOS was good 5 years ago Jul 27 01:17:52 bhima: sort of, linux underneath and for alot of things with a plam 68k compat envornment licences from Access to run the palm apps supposedly has 95% compatiblity Jul 27 01:18:05 I notice Palm's new ultra portable laptop runs LInux now and they are porting the palm software stack over Jul 27 01:18:08 licences = licenced Jul 27 01:18:23 linux_galore: yeah the foleo is all linux underpinings Jul 27 01:18:33 linux_galore: it's supposed to be pretty cool Jul 27 01:19:01 Bryce_Leo: price is pretty good too, be fun to see how the EEE and the Foleo compare Jul 27 01:19:54 Anyone know the pinouts of a sim card? Jul 27 01:19:59 linux_galore: the price is ok, i'm still waiting for the asus epc Jul 27 01:20:00 Bryce_Leo: although I have my sites set on a Toshiba R500 with a 64GB flash drive weighting 1.7lb Jul 27 01:20:04 Its multimeter time Jul 27 01:20:18 linux_galore: hahah that's a hell of a machine Jul 27 01:20:42 linux_galore: i got a brand new dell 1420 it's small enough and light enough to be just what i wanted Jul 27 01:20:51 Bryce_Leo: I cant believe they got that much grunt into such a small machine Jul 27 01:21:04 (R500) Jul 27 01:21:14 linux_galore: haha i know what you meant, that is remarkable Jul 27 01:21:24 linux_galore: i'm curious to see the speed and reliablity of the ssd Jul 27 01:21:35 Bryce_Leo: Ive already seen the R500 with a hardisk in the flesh, I have never seen a screen so thin Jul 27 01:22:02 Bryce_Leo: its so thin you can actually bend it Jul 27 01:22:11 linux_galore: that sounds almost dangerous Jul 27 01:22:36 Bryce_Leo: the sales guy said it was designed to be bent Jul 27 01:23:00 haha linux_galore check out this case http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=HM-103R&cat=NBB Jul 27 01:23:28 linux_galore: i hope they used hq polycarbonate rather than glass for the lcd Jul 27 01:23:50 Bryce_Leo: thats cheap, freight will cost more Jul 27 01:24:33 linux_galore: go computer the shipping you'll be floored Jul 27 01:24:40 they also have a smaller lighter one for up to 15" Jul 27 01:24:52 and every case i've got has been fantastic build quality Jul 27 01:24:56 Bryce_Leo: I think they go to china and just buy bulk stock of stuff thats not selling well Jul 27 01:26:11 Bryce_Leo: I have a aluminum attache case for my laptop, it was cheaper than buying a leather carry case, how dumb is that Jul 27 01:26:18 they probably just ship from china, if you buy in bulk and ship cheap frieght you can get incredible deals Jul 27 01:26:23 like tomtop.com is a great example Jul 27 01:26:40 linux_galore: i know exactly what you mean, it's crazy isn't it Jul 27 01:26:59 linux_galore: but if you go to get a aluminum case from most places they're rediculously badly priced Jul 27 01:27:13 Bryce_Leo: its padded inside too Jul 27 01:27:25 linux_galore: very nice, where'd you buy yours from? Jul 27 01:27:32 Bryce_Leo: yeah, I dont buy much from shops Jul 27 01:27:49 linux_galore: me neither i pretty much web/mail oreder everything Jul 27 01:27:58 linux_galore: ohh you mean you ebay alot?> Jul 27 01:28:11 Bryce_Leo: local chinese junk shop, they just buy lots of crap from China and sell it cheap Jul 27 01:28:36 linux_galore: that's pretty cool, what state are you in that has one of them? Jul 27 01:28:47 Bryce_Leo: Im in AU Jul 27 01:29:37 Bryce_Leo: I have a relative in CA who mails stuff for me Jul 27 01:29:48 linux_galore: lol ohhh ok, but you have china right there!! Jul 27 01:29:54 wait Jul 27 01:29:56 au or aus? Jul 27 01:30:00 yep Jul 27 01:30:13 US is actually closer than cn Jul 27 01:30:25 linux_galore: really? Jul 27 01:30:28 yeah Jul 27 01:30:35 wow that's pretty cool Jul 27 01:31:05 no real difference between shipping from the US and CN Jul 27 01:31:22 also with CN you can never be sure what your getting Jul 27 01:31:35 linux_galore: well i guess that's true Jul 27 01:31:41 Shipping stuff out of Kuwait is great. It's really, really cheap. Jul 27 01:32:06 bhima: wow really? what country are you in? Jul 27 01:32:17 Right now I"m in the US. But I lived in Kuwait for awhile. Jul 27 01:32:18 Bryce_Leo: go on youtube and type in fake ipod or fake nano , these are idiots who purchased an ipod from Chine only to get a crappy fake Jul 27 01:32:30 The only thing they ship out of Kuwait is oil. Jul 27 01:32:38 So they have many empty containers and airplanes leaving. Jul 27 01:33:21 bhima: yeah, Im amazed people dont transfer stuff in Kuwait to save money Jul 27 01:33:31 heh... go fig Jul 27 01:33:35 Shipping _in_ to Kuwait isn't that cheap. Jul 27 01:33:44 it's like booking a u-haul here Jul 27 01:33:55 one way is often *much* cheaper than the other depending on how people are migrating Jul 27 01:34:03 linux_galore: well that figures Jul 27 01:34:08 bhima: ahh ok Jul 27 01:34:38 I had a friend who just got back from the emirates on contract and the guy has so much luxury crap from Europe its not funny Jul 27 01:34:46 its all tax free Jul 27 01:35:03 wow, tax free? Jul 27 01:35:24 imagine fillinh your gas guzzling car for $12 Jul 27 01:35:36 filling* Jul 27 01:35:42 hahahahahahaha, now that's hard to imagine Jul 27 01:35:56 nope they have a special local rate for fuel Jul 27 01:36:03 linux_galore: wow, that sounds awesome Jul 27 01:36:18 People in Kuwait still pay attention to gas mileage. Jul 27 01:36:23 they dont have medical insurance, its all free Jul 27 01:36:50 Big American cars are known to be cheap for spare parts, but use more gas. Jul 27 01:37:00 Japanese cars are efficient but cost more to maintain. Jul 27 01:37:48 yeah, he was given a Toyota Land Cruiser (Diesel) Jul 27 01:37:55 as a company car Jul 27 01:38:23 land Cruisers are pretty common in the middle east Jul 27 01:38:28 that's a heck of a company car Jul 27 01:38:45 actually they are very common here in AU too Jul 27 01:39:05 linux_galore: how much is gas per litre by you/ Jul 27 01:39:07 ?* Jul 27 01:39:12 i'm assuming you don't buy per gallon Jul 27 01:40:35 Bryce_Leo: well my car (V6 3.8L motor) doesnt run on petrol (gas) but LPG, I pay AU$48c per litre (US$42c) Jul 27 01:41:30 your'e kidding me? that's like a 1.60 american per gallon Jul 27 01:41:32 petrol is about AU$118 Jul 27 01:41:53 petrol is about AU$1.18 per litre Jul 27 01:42:12 Bryce_Leo: good or bad Jul 27 01:42:21 linux_galore: very very very good Jul 27 01:42:49 i've always wanted a wlan cruiser Jul 27 01:42:53 Bryce_Leo: well Australia has tons of LPG, in the past we just burnt it as wast now we use it as a fuel Jul 27 01:42:55 with a big-arse antenna on top ;) Jul 27 01:42:58 linux_galore: about the same as here in edmonton, actually Jul 27 01:43:09 i can't imagine the shortsightedness of burning LPG/NG Jul 27 01:43:34 linux_galore: jeez, i couldn't imagine just burning it Jul 27 01:43:36 happycube: well it was a side product of the oil Jul 27 01:43:47 yeah... still Jul 27 01:44:07 Bryce_Leo: well for about 20-30 years they just burnt a few billion barrels of the stuff Jul 27 01:44:48 now every taxi or car with a big V8 in Australia runs on the stuff Jul 27 01:45:13 linux_galore: man, that's alot Jul 27 01:45:28 linux_galore: well it makes sense for them to all run on it now Jul 27 01:45:42 I was in the supermarket today. Jul 27 01:45:44 if you visit Sydney about 60% of the buses run on LNG Jul 27 01:45:54 Cooking oil was 59p/l. Jul 27 01:45:56 linux_galore: jeez that's good Jul 27 01:46:04 Diesel was some 90p/l. Jul 27 01:46:41 SpeedEvil: haha we had truckers around me getting in trouble for using that Jul 27 01:46:45 mh Jul 27 01:46:46 instead of diesel Jul 27 01:46:48 we also have shit loads of LNG, so much we export the stuff to Japan and China (China recently signed a US$20 Billion dollar contract) Jul 27 01:47:07 we pay something like 1.35€ per litre benzin now in germany Jul 27 01:47:15 thats something like 2$ Jul 27 01:47:16 :\ Jul 27 01:47:38 borg_: aww man that sucks Jul 27 01:47:38 US phones - http://ask.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/07/26/1420211 Jul 27 01:47:58 and why they suck Jul 27 01:48:03 i think ~70% of it is tax Jul 27 01:48:42 its funny CA kicked up a fuss about a transfer station for importing LNG from Australia, all thats hapened is China bought it all so now even if CA now reverses the decision they cant buy anything Jul 27 01:49:27 does anyone know how the openmoko phone is being distributed in canada? Do they have a canadian distributor yet? Jul 27 01:49:33 no. Jul 27 01:49:41 look at topic Jul 27 01:49:46 Blame Canada Jul 27 01:49:47 not yet... buy direct Jul 27 01:49:51 blame rogers. Jul 27 01:50:16 be back laterz Jul 27 01:50:21 linux_galore: lol Jul 27 01:50:27 linux_galore: sucks for CA Jul 27 01:50:35 Hello everyone, i just got my phone today and i accidentally calibrated the touchscreen wrong, how do i recalibrate the touchscreen? Thanks in advance. Jul 27 01:50:35 zaery: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Jul 27 01:50:55 zaery: you could always re-flash Jul 27 01:51:01 zaery: but i'm sure there's a better way Jul 27 01:51:32 SpeedEvil: Article is basically correct. Jul 27 01:52:10 alrighty guys i gotta run Jul 27 01:52:11 c ya Jul 27 01:52:16 Bryce_leo: cya Jul 27 01:52:17 North American Cellular was originally marketing an image Jul 27 01:52:22 Bryce_leo: and thx Jul 27 01:52:29 big time dude with a cellphone rather a tool Jul 27 01:53:02 Separation of handset and network is essential for either to be competitive. Jul 27 01:53:07 i.e. like gsm. Jul 27 01:53:25 this is the issue Goggle is trying to force open. Jul 27 01:54:24 Verizon is still bell-shaped heads - the same ones who argued the pstn would be destroyed if the conection to the network was allowed. Jul 27 01:55:02 US is now about 35 - 40 % GSM Jul 27 01:56:17 95% of americans don't realize they can buy their own handsets. Jul 27 01:56:50 as a result carriers build handset into the network service price. Jul 27 01:57:25 as Steve Jobs said, you have to push the phone through one of 4 orfices Jul 27 01:59:37 imho t-mobile and At&t together will now gain market share as their networks compete with one another in an environment of open attachment. Jul 27 01:59:57 we are not there yet but it is in sight. Jul 27 02:01:05 once americans learn about separation of handset and network and start buying each on their own merit, the gsm carriers togher will make gains against the other two. Jul 27 02:02:04 Witchie: It might be nice to see a separation of phone and device Jul 27 02:02:20 Americans certainly love to pull the wool over their own eyes, Jul 27 02:02:22 1.5 to 2 billion people already have this Jul 27 02:03:16 but the real problem is just that phones are very inexpensive (when subsidized by a two year contract) Jul 27 02:04:10 So I don't think it's a matter of Americans learning about separation of device and service. Jul 27 02:04:46 it is not possible to educate americans Jul 27 02:05:02 uh oh. The gloves are off now. :-) Jul 27 02:05:19 the culture doesn't allow it. Jul 27 02:05:32 I know, i am one Jul 27 02:05:59 But I lived overseas many years so I can now see the forest Jul 27 02:06:22 Apple may be able to change the landscape a little Jul 27 02:06:29 it will take a killer app of some kind Jul 27 02:06:41 but I don't think they're going to change the cellular culture entirely. Jul 27 02:06:44 Apple is it - they are playing ball. Jul 27 02:06:52 i mean apple isn't it Jul 27 02:07:00 apple is tied to the carrier. Jul 27 02:07:15 Openmoko devices may help Jul 27 02:07:22 For now. Jul 27 02:07:40 you need enough traction for the carrier to restructure subsidy. Jul 27 02:07:43 I think OpenMoko is neat, and I can't wait to get the phone I ordered Jul 27 02:08:02 but I don't think it will ever be anything but a sideshow. Jul 27 02:08:26 it could enable the killer app Jul 27 02:08:28 well you mean the neo1973 will be nothing but a sideshow Jul 27 02:08:36 the openmoko platform is what is going to be the gem Jul 27 02:08:42 the neo1973 is just the *start* Jul 27 02:09:04 ozark2 apple is not going to change american culture.. its just a company which adapted to feed that market products which are usable uneducated about things Jul 27 02:09:24 hello roh, how are things? Jul 27 02:09:42 daMaestro you do not want to know ;) Jul 27 02:16:42 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:Romulus]] [[Neo1973_Battery]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Vancouver]] [[Talk:Community_Events]] [[Community_Events]] [[Main_Page]] [[Current_events]] [[Neo1973_Power_Management]] [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Bern]] and other changes Jul 27 02:22:34 can i compile openmoko on a pc using gcc4.x? Jul 27 02:26:09 BlackBsd: only qemu needs gcc-3.x Jul 27 02:26:38 BlackBsd: and it autodetects, so you can install both the normal gcc-4.x packages and the gcc-3.x packages for your distribution and it'll figure it out Jul 27 02:29:26 roh: I wanna know Jul 27 02:33:02 seemant lots of stress. too many peeople asking questions they should ask end of the year earliest. Jul 27 02:33:38 roh: I'm sorry to hear that -- I hope things let up Jul 27 02:34:21 * SpeedEvil imagines the position must be like driving a car, with 14000 kids in the back asking if we're nearly there yet every 7 minutes. Jul 27 02:34:22 seemant e.g. tons of plain users which have no clue about the difference of gsm and cdma and what a sim is asking where to buy und what service they need.. such stuff takes a lot of power which we could use more productive Jul 27 02:34:31 SpeedEvil yeah ;) Jul 27 02:34:42 roh: indeed :/ Jul 27 02:34:57 Anyone have any ideas about "my broken sim reader"? Jul 27 02:35:05 roh: in a way it's good, because you know that people are thirsting for it Jul 27 02:35:11 I posted on the list but was reffered back to IRC Jul 27 02:35:53 I have tried many sim cards and get back CME ERROR 10 (sim card not inserted) from the GSM modem Jul 27 02:36:03 calamous_: That was you? :) Jul 27 02:36:22 (script) openmoko-neo1973: Harald Welte Re: Bluetooth to 2410 Wiring Jul 27 02:36:40 ChooseOpen: Jason? Jul 27 02:36:48 calamous_: Hey! Jul 27 02:36:50 LOL Jul 27 02:36:56 hey! lol yeah Jul 27 02:37:11 WARNING: I'm taking svn.openmoko.org offline temporarily Jul 27 02:37:21 "There are alot of smater people here" Jul 27 02:37:58 I just hope I'm doing something wrong and the hardware is not deffective Jul 27 02:39:55 * * OM Bug 664 has been created by autobuild-reports(AT)openmoko.org Jul 27 02:39:56 * * linux-gta01-2.6.21.6-moko10-r1_0_0_2388_0-do_fetch Jul 27 02:39:57 * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=664 Jul 27 02:40:01 calamous_ no. administrative work. Jul 27 02:40:30 calamous_ ah.. you mean your sim slot... did you lock it properly? Jul 27 02:40:38 roh: yeh Jul 27 02:40:48 roh: Ive made sure the pins are touching Jul 27 02:40:59 ok Jul 27 02:41:19 are all your sim from the same carrier? Jul 27 02:41:44 roh: unfortuantly, one 2 year old cingular one and 2 new AT&T ones Jul 27 02:41:46 anyone tried integrating the projected with eclipse? Jul 27 02:41:56 someone mentioned 3.3 and 5v sim cards Jul 27 02:41:57 are you the guy that posted to the mailing list too? Jul 27 02:42:05 yeah I'm Harry Jul 27 02:42:28 ok, did you try manually powering on the gsm modem? Jul 27 02:42:38 im the one that suggested that Jul 27 02:42:48 Yeah. ive tried it all Jul 27 02:43:06 I should be able to dial 911 (or 112) from the modem but I really don't want to test that Jul 27 02:43:16 good idea Jul 27 02:43:18 haha Jul 27 02:43:29 cause when i do AT+CREG I get error 32 which means no network but emergency calls allowed Jul 27 02:44:03 openmoko: 03root * r2528 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2008/: create OM-2008 directory Jul 27 02:44:03 "911 what is your emergency?" -- "nothing officer, just testing my neo" Jul 27 02:44:15 heh Jul 27 02:44:42 openmoko: 03root * r2529 10/trunk/ (applications/ src/target/OM-2008/applications/): move applications to the right location Jul 27 02:44:50 that's where you do it from a car ... with an anonymous prepaid SIM.... then leave. in a big hurry Jul 27 02:45:01 openmoko: 03root * r2530 10/trunk/ (artwork/ src/target/OM-2008/artwork/): move artwork to the right location Jul 27 02:45:27 openmoko: 03root * r2531 10/trunk/ (libraries/ src/target/OM-2008/libraries/): move libraries to the right location Jul 27 02:45:52 openmoko: 03root * r2532 10/trunk/ (mockups/ src/target/mockups/): move mockups to the right location Jul 27 02:51:34 I might take my neo down to the local 911 dispatch and do some testing Jul 27 02:51:59 compbrain: Thats nice of you to make it easy on the cops :) Jul 27 02:52:09 I've gpt a friend who works there, so he's actually auth'd to perform such tests Jul 27 02:52:31 and its dispatchers, not the cops, that handle calls Jul 27 02:55:56 Woot! I just got the bluetooth PAN set up (its slow as hell though). but now I have "wireless internet" on my moko (as long as I'm withen 15 ft of my comp) Jul 27 02:56:05 :) Jul 27 02:57:48 compbrain: they let you do that? Jul 27 02:58:23 I've got an adaptor that lets you use bluetooth up to 150 feet easily with the neo. Jul 27 02:58:37 The downside is that it's an 80cm satellite dish. Jul 27 02:58:47 (bought for GPS experiments). Jul 27 02:59:00 :) it sounded like a great home wifi replacement for a while there.. **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Jul 27 02:59:56 2007