**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Aug 20 02:59:56 2007
Aug 20 03:33:38 <mrcucumber> hi
Aug 20 03:39:05 <SpeedEvil> Things to avoid in the GPS router application: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/south_west/6646331.stm
Aug 20 03:41:01 <Agrajag-> hahah
Aug 20 03:41:32 <Agrajag-> my tomtom clearly labels train tracks differently from roads :P
Aug 20 03:50:36 <mwester> Darwin award candidate
Aug 20 03:55:46 <SpeedEvil> It depends on the signage.
Aug 20 03:56:06 <SpeedEvil> If the sign said "train crossing - if green light ..."
Aug 20 03:56:12 <SpeedEvil> then there is no real excuse.
Aug 20 03:56:29 <SpeedEvil> If it just says "If green light..." then that's bad signage.
Aug 20 03:57:31 <roh> its uk after all.. if their train crossings are as good as the rest of their railway system i don't wonder
Aug 20 04:01:45 * mwester thinks there must be something *very* different between US and UK train tracks and crossings if one can be sober, and still confuse them with a roadway.
Aug 20 04:03:57 <mrcucumber> SpeedEvil:are you working, or planning on working on a GPS nav app?
Aug 20 04:04:47 <SpeedEvil> No.
Aug 20 04:05:03 <SpeedEvil> The fundamental problem is that there is no available database of roads.
Aug 20 04:08:32 <Agrajag-> has anyone started work on a tracking app though? to create gpx (or whatever format takes your fancy) files?
Aug 20 04:09:55 <Agrajag-> i find my handheld one really useful for that (and then use google maps api to show the track - https://home.whatsbeef.net/~filip/map/ ). but i use a garmin for it, and it's got a fairly crappy gps receiver
Aug 20 04:17:17 <SpeedEvil> See [[GPS-Trails]] on the wiki
Aug 20 04:17:41 <Agrajag-> ta
Aug 20 04:18:43 <SpeedEvil> http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GPS-Trail
Aug 20 04:19:54 <SpeedEvil> Hmm. I need to rewrite that a bit, it doesn't explain it can also be used for other uses.
Aug 20 04:20:09 <SpeedEvil> At the moment.
Aug 20 04:20:29 <SpeedEvil> I just log the nmea output of the GPS binary, and drop it through gpsbabel to make gpx.
Aug 20 04:20:41 <Agrajag-> yeah, i can't imagine that's very hard
Aug 20 04:21:32 <SpeedEvil> Not really. The trails application gets moderately complex.
Aug 20 04:21:58 <SpeedEvil> It's basically intended as an 'install and forget' app for some users to contribute to OSM.
Aug 20 04:35:44 <mrcucumber> SpeedEvil: Lots of map resources
Aug 20 04:35:53 <mrcucumber> SpeedEvil: for the US Tiger/Line
Aug 20 04:36:04 <mrcucumber> SpeedEvil: Canada has something equivliant
Aug 20 04:36:21 <SpeedEvil> And not for most of the wor;d.
Aug 20 04:36:25 <mrcucumber> SpeedEvil: and for Europe you can read the propritary formats, but you have to buy them first
Aug 20 04:36:42 <eggsy> ?
Aug 20 04:36:48 <mrcucumber> SpeedEvil: you can read garmin maps, which includes just about everywhere
Aug 20 04:36:58 <mrcucumber> SpeedEvil: Theirs some basic work on navit.sf.net
Aug 20 04:37:17 <mrcucumber> they recomend a couple different map packages that you can buy that they can use as source data.
Aug 20 04:37:34 <mrcucumber> SpeedEvil: where are you located?
Aug 20 04:37:43 <joao> Has anyone having trouble building due to gtk? My build just failed
Aug 20 04:37:44 <aloril> joao: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.)
Aug 20 04:37:49 <daMaestro> mrcucumber, /dev/your/backyard
Aug 20 04:38:18 <mrcucumber> ??? you live in my backyard!?!
Aug 20 04:38:24 <mrcucumber> sweet, we should hang out sometime.
Aug 20 04:43:29 <mrcucumber> SpeedEvil: ?
Aug 20 04:49:52 <roh> morning
Aug 20 05:02:34 <blindcoder> moin
Aug 20 05:03:20 <Obri> moinmoin
Aug 20 05:20:45 <aloril> (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Neo1973/es]] [[Openstreetmap]] [[Wishlist:Bible_Reader]]
Aug 20 05:32:32 * xzcvczx wonders why the bible reader cant just be generalised as a (e)book reader
Aug 20 05:35:17 <anticw> lol. there is a bible reader?
Aug 20 05:35:23 <ckuethe> it should be
Aug 20 05:35:28 <Agrajag-> don't think so, but someone wants one. haha.
Aug 20 05:36:06 <ckuethe> "Most handheld platforms have some sort of bible, or religeous text reader. An excellent example would be bible+ for the palm platform. A good generic approach so that the reader was designed to read any religeous text would be a good idea."
Aug 20 05:36:39 <ckuethe> remove "religeous"...
Aug 20 05:36:50 <ckuethe> just a nice tight ebook reader
Aug 20 05:36:53 <Agrajag-> or at least spell it correctly
Aug 20 05:37:35 <thomasg> a specific "biblereader" is the most stupid things I've ever seen for the smartphone platforms
Aug 20 05:40:14 <ckuethe> i just edited to ask what good a specific bible reader is...
Aug 20 05:40:48 <ckuethe> is it one with a compressed dictionary of approved words so if it's not a word in the bible, you can't read it?
Aug 20 05:42:49 * mjr suspects it has something to do with verse indexing
Aug 20 05:43:05 <mwester> "red letter"-ing?
Aug 20 05:43:28 <mwester> concordance? (sp?)
Aug 20 05:44:22 <mwester> but still, a general ebook reader should suffice, one would think.
Aug 20 05:45:53 <ckuethe> bible-reader that groks regular ebooks, or ebook reader that groks popular bible formats... 
Aug 20 05:57:16 <aloril> (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wishlist:Bible_Reader]]
Aug 20 05:57:46 <xkr47> morning
Aug 20 05:58:09 <CM> morning 
Aug 20 05:58:15 <linux_galore> better as a Koran reader too heh
Aug 20 05:58:17 <mellon> ckuethe: it'll appeal to a certain demographic.   so why the heck not?
Aug 20 05:59:07 <linux_galore> the problem is if you add a bible reader then you have to also add readers for all the other religious denominations 
Aug 20 05:59:17 <mellon> up to them, isn't it?
Aug 20 05:59:40 <mellon> I'm sure there's a bible reader for the Palm Pilot, but since it's an add-on, nobody gets offended (much).
Aug 20 05:59:46 <linux_galore> no not if OM add the bible it isnt
Aug 20 05:59:52 <CM> mellon: Why not make a rosary bead app at the same time. Tap screen to go to the next bead-. ;)
Aug 20 06:00:03 <mellon> Not a good UI.   A real rosary is much easier.
Aug 20 06:00:14 <mellon> Or you can count on your knuckles - that way you don't have to carry anything extra.
Aug 20 06:00:32 <linux_galore> heh @ kinetic scrolling and rosary 
Aug 20 06:00:39 <CM> linux_galore: Hehe
Aug 20 06:00:50 <mellon> Quick or accurate: pick zero.
Aug 20 06:00:52 <mellon> :')
Aug 20 06:01:25 <mellon> The Survey of India would have loved some Neos.
Aug 20 06:02:39 <linux_galore> mellon: yeah, were to get a decent curry 
Aug 20 06:02:49 * linux_galore ducks
Aug 20 06:03:18 <mellon> Oh, back then you'd just ask.   I just mean it'd beat the crap out of a rosary for figuring out where you are - they used to count paces on a rosary to make maps.
Aug 20 06:06:21 <linux_galore> I propose a Gaydar app, enter an Apple store and it seg faults due to overload
Aug 20 06:06:49 <linux_galore> :-P
Aug 20 06:08:24 <mellon> It would be nice if you could keep the slurs to a minimum.
Aug 20 06:10:37 <torpor> what good are such comments to the sake of openmoko? 
Aug 20 06:11:48 <aloril> app in default image != app being available
Aug 20 06:12:02 * aloril doesn't see any reason to restrict later to some small number
Aug 20 06:14:04 <CM> aloril2: Did you get my message about the buying_interest list?
Aug 20 06:14:14 <aloril> CM: yes and I agree
Aug 20 06:14:22 <CM> Good. :)
Aug 20 06:14:39 <CM> Didn't want to move the whole old list since you started the page ;)
Aug 20 06:15:36 <aloril> just not gotten around to do it yet ;-) (P1 part to P1_Buying_interest_list and link from P1_Owners page to it with note that not all from it bought it or that some that are on that list who bought it are not in owners list)
Aug 20 06:15:46 <aloril> feel free to do it
Aug 20 06:16:10 <CM> I'll see if I get a moment to fix it during the day :)
Aug 20 06:20:20 <linux_galore> http://abc.net.au/news/stories/2007/08/20/2009811.htm
Aug 20 06:20:36 <linux_galore> revenge of the toxic avenger 
Aug 20 06:25:28 <CM> linux_galore: Ouch.. formaldehyde? ISn't that used to preserve corpses?
Aug 20 06:26:39 * CM remembers T.S.O.L's Code Blue
Aug 20 06:32:26 <josch> how do I build an older qemu version with moko makefile?
Aug 20 06:37:28 <CM> josch: In my local.conf I have this: 
Aug 20 06:37:30 <CM> PREFERRED_VERSION_qemu-native = "0.9.0+cvs20070701"
Aug 20 06:37:32 <CM> SRCDATE_qemu-native = 20070701
Aug 20 06:37:51 <FuzzyCat> bing
Aug 20 06:38:09 <josch> yeah I also added this to avoid localisation problems with my 64bit system and qemu
Aug 20 06:38:29 <FuzzyCat> erm
Aug 20 06:39:00 <CM> josch: You're on gentoo aswell?
Aug 20 06:39:03 <josch> but it doesn't seem to change the version in which I'm running openmoko
Aug 20 06:39:06 <josch> no, on ubuntu
Aug 20 06:39:39 <CM> Ok. I thought my localization problem was because I have limited the locales in glibc, but maybe it's a 64-bit thing
Aug 20 06:39:40 <FuzzyCat> why not just limit the locales
Aug 20 06:40:22 <josch> it surely is a 64bit thing
Aug 20 06:40:36 <josch> everybody I asked sayed that and it's also in the wiki
Aug 20 06:40:39 <CM> josch: what if you remove the-native from the qemu prefs in local.conf?
Aug 20 06:41:24 <CM> FuzzyCat: GLIBC_GENERATE_LOCALES = "en_US.UTF-8" saves me at least half an hour when building :)
Aug 20 06:41:41 <FuzzyCat> I know...
Aug 20 06:41:50 <FuzzyCat> I told you :) (alter ego)
Aug 20 06:42:23 <CM> Hehe
Aug 20 06:42:39 <FuzzyCat> my build problems stopped when I removed all the multi processor/parallel buildin 
Aug 20 06:42:41 <CM> Feeling fuzzy on a monday morning?
Aug 20 06:42:47 <FuzzyCat> very...
Aug 20 06:42:52 <FuzzyCat> 2 ours sleep
Aug 20 06:42:55 <FuzzyCat> hours
Aug 20 06:43:02 <CM> I did finish a build this morning, and tried to flash it
Aug 20 06:43:06 <FuzzyCat> just drove from .nl to uk
Aug 20 06:43:13 <CM> But then the neo wouldn't boot
Aug 20 06:43:16 <FuzzyCat> :o
Aug 20 06:43:20 <CM> Ah, ouch. How far is that?
Aug 20 06:43:33 <FuzzyCat> ~ 650km
Aug 20 06:43:36 <CM> It kernel panics on "No init found"
Aug 20 06:43:44 <CM> That's ok :-D
Aug 20 06:43:58 <FuzzyCat> you flashed the uImage and rootfs ?
Aug 20 06:44:20 <CM> No, I was too lazy to flash the uImage
Aug 20 06:44:25 <CM> So I guess that's why
Aug 20 06:44:28 * FuzzyCat slaps CM
Aug 20 06:44:32 <CM> Hehe
Aug 20 06:44:36 <CM> I was in a hurry!
Aug 20 06:44:38 <FuzzyCat> yeah, you need mathcing ones
Aug 20 06:44:49 <FuzzyCat> the kernel takes 10-20 second!
Aug 20 06:45:02 <CM> Well, I wanted to try if the kernel was ok, there's only a days difference
Aug 20 06:45:15 <FuzzyCat> it'd  do it in less time than it took to put your coat on
Aug 20 06:45:45 <FuzzyCat> I reflashed mine with .2  (nand erased first)
Aug 20 06:46:09 <CM> I did a nand erase too
Aug 20 06:46:10 <FuzzyCat> .3 seems to have nmoved forward a little... still very rough 
Aug 20 06:46:16 <FuzzyCat> .3==.2
Aug 20 06:46:35 <CM> Another reason I didn't want to flash the kernel is that it borkes my boot menu every time
Aug 20 06:46:57 <CM> But I'm getting quick at fixing that by now
Aug 20 06:47:04 <FuzzyCat> I used to get a power management menu, but now nothing 
Aug 20 06:47:17 <FuzzyCat> yeah, you have the practice :)
Aug 20 06:48:43 <FuzzyCat> I also moved my build from mokomaker to my laptop with no hitches at all
Aug 20 06:49:17 <CM> Just copy the whole folder or what?
Aug 20 06:49:19 <FuzzyCat> but I have to remember never to update the makefile...
Aug 20 06:49:39 <FuzzyCat> yeah.. copied the whole lot (rsync)
Aug 20 06:49:58 <FuzzyCat> + a copy of monotone in that dir too...
Aug 20 06:50:14 <FuzzyCat> so it's pretty standalone for the main tools
Aug 20 06:50:28 <FuzzyCat> and it doesn't need to rebuild the mtn db 
Aug 20 06:51:53 <rwhitby> FuzzyCat: why do you have to remember not to update the makefile?
Aug 20 06:52:35 <FuzzyCat> because it blew away my other stuff... 
Aug 20 06:52:47 <FuzzyCat> created a om2007.2 dir etc... 
Aug 20 06:52:53 <FuzzyCat> killed setup-env 
Aug 20 06:53:07 <FuzzyCat> and I had exta bits in for building my local apps
Aug 20 06:53:11 <FuzzyCat> extra
Aug 20 06:53:42 <FuzzyCat> was probably because I hadn't spotted that the default was .1 not .2 
Aug 20 06:54:04 <FuzzyCat> wheras the fitrst time it was .2
Aug 20 06:55:26 <FuzzyCat> I'm pretty happy that it's all setup anyway.. so the makefile only really handles make update, make openmoko-devel-image and make build-package-xxxx
Aug 20 06:56:08 <FuzzyCat> I can't imagine there's much else to add/remove/change in the makefile anyway
Aug 20 06:56:41 <FuzzyCat> oh, and I modified the 'svn revert -R . ' of openmoko svn stuff too
Aug 20 06:57:00 <FuzzyCat> now *that* was annoying :)
Aug 20 07:00:18 * FuzzyCat fires up the coffee machine...
Aug 20 07:00:55 <jeddy3> mmmm...coffee
Aug 20 07:01:03 <zash_se> mmmmm...
Aug 20 07:01:30 <FuzzyCat> they make me bring it back... along with beer
Aug 20 07:02:36 <josch> if anybody remembers - I had this problem with my touchscreen on qemu six hours ago and now I want to use an older version of qemu to verify that it's a problem with the emulator and not openmoko
Aug 20 07:05:35 <josch> my current qemu version is 0.9.0 but this is the latest, right?
Aug 20 07:07:10 <josch> I just saw that 0.9.0 is the version I set up with  PREFERRED_VERSION_qemu-native = "0.9.0+cvs20070701" in my local.conf
Aug 20 07:07:35 <josch> but can anybody tell me which qemu version I used with 2007.1 - it worked for me there
Aug 20 07:09:53 <Psi_> anything interesting now working since 20070810 2007.2 build?
Aug 20 07:10:42 <FuzzyCat> dunno... 
Aug 20 07:11:08 <FuzzyCat> I turned mine on the other day and it got 4 bars on the gsm ...
Aug 20 07:11:17 <FuzzyCat> usually I have to fiddle with it
Aug 20 07:11:23 <Psi_> thats good
Aug 20 07:11:27 * rtyler waves
Aug 20 07:11:40 <FuzzyCat> it only happend once
Aug 20 07:11:44 <Psi_> heh
Aug 20 07:12:02 <rtyler> Has Opera made any mention of desiring to support the Neo?
Aug 20 07:12:21 <FuzzyCat> and, I think it should be telling you which network it's connected to
Aug 20 07:12:31 <FuzzyCat> whcih, atm it doesn;t
Aug 20 07:12:43 <FuzzyCat> unless you manually at+cops?
Aug 20 07:13:02 <mrface> opera's not going to do that without a significant contribution from FIC
Aug 20 07:13:33 <rtyler> too bad Opera's not open source >_> 
Aug 20 07:13:37 * rtyler chuckles
Aug 20 07:13:38 <mrface> yes..
Aug 20 07:13:45 <rtyler> i'll be more than happy with a good WebKit based browser
Aug 20 07:14:09 <FuzzyCat> s/webkit based//
Aug 20 07:14:33 <rtyler> heh
Aug 20 07:14:34 <mrface> yes,  it sounds like webkit gtk came a long way due to the coding sprint at chaos camp
Aug 20 07:14:42 <jgm> Shame it doesn't compile any more...
Aug 20 07:14:52 <FuzzyCat> broken again jgm ?
Aug 20 07:14:59 <mrface> jgm: openmoko?
Aug 20 07:15:04 <FuzzyCat> or still
Aug 20 07:15:12 <jgm> ERROR: '/home/jgm/om/openembedded/packages/webkit/webkit-gtk_svn.bb' failed
Aug 20 07:15:22 <jgm> Yep, along with openmoko-libs and libmokogsmd2
Aug 20 07:15:37 <mrface> oh dear
Aug 20 07:15:43 <jgm> I know that SVN is development but you'd hope that people would at least commit code that compiled
Aug 20 07:16:04 <FuzzyCat> loll 
Aug 20 07:16:05 <FuzzyCat> -l
Aug 20 07:16:08 <FuzzyCat> yes..
Aug 20 07:16:32 <FuzzyCat> you'd think that part of changing the code would be testing it
Aug 20 07:16:41 <jgm> s/testing/compiling/
Aug 20 07:17:05 * FuzzyCat makes random changes to jgm
Aug 20 07:17:09 <CM> jgm: http://build.webkit.org/
Aug 20 07:17:44 <CM> You can set a certain revision if you want
Aug 20 07:17:55 <jgm> BTW are there any UI people here that are desperate to build a mini GUI for an openmoko app?  Massive rewards available (in the form of your name in the credits)
Aug 20 07:17:59 <CM> But I agree, it should definitely compile
Aug 20 07:18:44 <CM> jgm: Make some example of the ui you want, and show it. I'm sure someone that's good with UI's will give you comments how to fix it :)
Aug 20 07:19:32 * FuzzyCat connects to web cam to see if coffee is made yet...
Aug 20 07:20:00 <jgm> CM: yeah was going to look in to the whole "setting a particular revision of each package" thing but haven't found any references to doing so with Mokomakefile
Aug 20 07:20:04 <jgm> I just have no knowledge whatsoever of GTK programming and don't want to start now
Aug 20 07:20:06 <zash_se> coffeecam!
Aug 20 07:20:07 <ljp> FuzzyCat: thats the way to do it!
Aug 20 07:20:07 <jgm> But yeah it shouldn't be hard to knock up some examples of what the  GUI should look like
Aug 20 07:20:10 <rtyler|mobile> FuzzyCat: from your Neo right? :P
Aug 20 07:22:50 <CM> How fast is the OMAP 1710 at 252MHz that's in the N770 compared to the Neo's cpu?
Aug 20 07:23:07 <CM> I'm wondering about Canola running on the Neo :)
Aug 20 07:23:39 * FuzzyCat has a coffee :)
Aug 20 07:24:03 <FuzzyCat> canola is ok, it's just a little annoying ...
Aug 20 07:24:08 <FuzzyCat> very smart though
Aug 20 07:24:17 <CM> *nod*
Aug 20 07:24:18 <FuzzyCat> swooshy movement
Aug 20 07:24:38 <CM> I haven't tried it, but it looks slick I think :)
Aug 20 07:25:02 <FuzzyCat> was one of the first things I installed 
Aug 20 07:25:51 <FuzzyCat> but I only have the 64mb card... which is worse than useless for any amount of audio :/
Aug 20 07:28:08 <FuzzyCat> Q_Uncontinuum?
Aug 20 07:28:42 * FuzzyCat spikes a neuros 
Aug 20 07:28:45 <FuzzyCat> spies
Aug 20 07:39:19 <pH5> LaF0rge, jserv2: I think the mlbuf initialization and change of the length check was lost in the latest libgsmd commits, also it sometimes includes the \0 of zero-terminated strings when sending out commands: http://en.pastebin.ca/664190
Aug 20 07:40:33 <anticw> looking over gsm.log what would i see to know if the device is able to talk to the network?
Aug 20 07:42:28 <anticw> hmm, gsmd seems to crash a lot
Aug 20 07:42:44 <rtyler|mobile> anticw: everything seems to crash a lot ;)
Aug 20 07:43:09 <anticw> true :-)
Aug 20 07:43:19 <anticw> but the pictures are pretty
Aug 20 07:43:26 <pH5> anticw: look out for netreg events
Aug 20 07:43:49 <anticw> pH5: dont see them
Aug 20 07:44:11 <anticw> pH5: does gsmd also talk to the sim card ... could it be having problems then?
Aug 20 07:44:47 <rtyler|mobile> bummer, VPN's broke and my Neo is plugged in at work >_>
Aug 20 07:45:51 <anticw> is there a watchdog timer daemon yet?
Aug 20 07:45:53 <pH5> anticw: gsmd talks to the ti chip, the ti chip talks to the sim card, hopefully.
Aug 20 07:46:10 <pH5> "libgsmd-tool --mode atcmd" and "AT+COPS=?" should show you the available gsm networks
Aug 20 07:47:03 <anticw> EVENT: Netreg registered (roaming) LocationAreaCode = 0x00F0 CellID = 0x4ECD
Aug 20 07:47:11 <anticw> ok sweet, so it saw something
Aug 20 07:47:12 <anticw> hrm
Aug 20 07:48:50 <anticw> pH5: ok thanks, that sorta did something
Aug 20 07:51:56 <anticw> ok, so i can get calls out ... sorta; no sound
Aug 20 07:57:35 <aloril> (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[MacOS_X]] [[Main_Page/cs]] [[User:Mmontour/HHNotes]] [[Talk:SettingsGUI]] [[SH1_FAQ]]
Aug 20 08:09:07 <hhf423_w> anticw: thats because the neo does not properly switch sound profiles yet
Aug 20 08:09:40 <hhf423_w> you can do it manually with alsactl only at the moment.
Aug 20 08:10:11 <hhf423_w> I used gsmhandset.state which worked for me (then you have sound for the call, but no ringing, vibration, though)
Aug 20 08:10:52 * CM wonders what the Estonians are exporting to Sweden: (Off topic) http://bp3.blogger.com/_bKzNYxHFIcE/RsXSrham1iI/AAAAAAAAAFE/ikQDS-nNlMA/s1600-h/ass_transport.jpg
Aug 20 08:13:18 <zash_se> CM: trafficing?
Aug 20 08:16:56 <CM> zash_se: They have caught a lot of that recently, and I hope they continue to do so. But still, what a name on a company..
Aug 20 08:25:05 <Psi_> hhf423_w, do you know the reason it doesnt switch sound profiles yet?
Aug 20 08:26:08 <Psi_> just because its less important that other things? or is there a problem and no one has come up with a good solution yet?
Aug 20 08:26:40 <Psi_> im just curious
Aug 20 08:40:17 <josch> it seems that nobody can help me with my problem so could anyone at least confirm that openmoko 2007.2 in qemu build by mokomakefile works for him on his 64bit linux
Aug 20 08:40:41 <CM> josch: How new?
Aug 20 08:40:55 <CM> josch: And you mean to run in qemu?
Aug 20 08:41:17 <CM> I have built 2007.2 and used it on my Neo 2 days ago
Aug 20 08:41:32 <CM> But I haven't tried in qemu yet
Aug 20 08:45:16 <josch> i did  make update-makefile && make setup update openmoko-devel-image just now
Aug 20 08:45:16 <josch> then it *must* be a problem with qemu?
Aug 20 08:45:20 <josch> and I did have the error two days ago, too
Aug 20 08:48:03 <CM> josch: What error is it you're getting?
Aug 20 08:50:49 <josch> I explained it several times a few hours ago: the touchscreen device seems to be rotated 90° clockwise
Aug 20 08:51:00 <josch> if I want to hit a button I have to imagine the screen would be turned around
Aug 20 08:51:14 <CM> ok.. Weird
Aug 20 08:51:26 <CM> Never heard anyone else have that issue
Aug 20 08:51:32 <jgm> Could be a bad calibration?
Aug 20 08:51:53 <josch> this maybe a problem with the hardware emulation of qemu
Aug 20 08:52:13 <CM> Ah, and you could remove a file to redo the calibration
Aug 20 08:52:22 <josch> which one?
Aug 20 08:52:23 <CM> Hmm.. Someone said where, but I forgot
Aug 20 08:52:31 <CM> Wait, I'll search the logs
Aug 20 08:52:40 <jgm> You can run a binary to re-calibrate, think it is ts-calibrate in /usr/bin (but that's from memory)
Aug 20 08:53:09 <josch> I will search for something
Aug 20 08:53:28 <josch> whish me luck on finding the correct buttons for opening up the console ^^
Aug 20 08:54:34 <CM> rm /etc/pontercal
Aug 20 08:54:59 <CM> That's what XorA said a week ago to someone who asked
Aug 20 08:55:29 <CM> Maybe pointercal?
Aug 20 08:55:46 <FuzzyCat> xtcal ?
Aug 20 08:56:09 <CM> FuzzyCat: Might be, I just looked in the logs
Aug 20 08:56:26 <josch> ah thx - I will try it out
Aug 20 08:56:42 <josch> now that you mention it - in 2007.1 i had to run calibration every time I build a new image
Aug 20 08:56:56 <josch> now in 2007.2 it's not asking for it anymore
Aug 20 08:57:27 <CM> I guess they have a default calibration
Aug 20 08:58:03 <josch> which doesn't seem to work at least with qemu
Aug 20 09:00:33 <josch> it was ts_calibrate!!
Aug 20 09:01:30 <josch> thx guys!
Aug 20 09:01:35 <josch> should i write this down in the "openmoko in qemu" wiki entry?
Aug 20 09:01:36 <josch> I don't know i other also experienced this problem
Aug 20 09:01:37 <CM> josch: Do it anyway
Aug 20 09:01:40 <CM> If it's happened once, I'm sure it can happen to other people aswell
Aug 20 09:10:09 <jeddy3> do i have to rebuild anything after removing dependencies on openmoko-terminal/-keyboard (as mentioned in http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko2007.2 ) ...libmokogsmd2 still fails to build
Aug 20 09:12:42 <kristian-m> jeddy3 a dirty workaround for that: http://nopaste.eof.name/195 - seems to be a known error.
Aug 20 09:17:06 <jeddy3> kristian-m, hmm, i don't have a tmp/downloads
Aug 20 09:19:22 <kristian-m> hmm you should - in the build directory
Aug 20 09:20:40 <jeddy3> kristian-m, nope :)
Aug 20 09:21:05 <FuzzyCat> are you 'rm_work' ing ?
Aug 20 09:21:12 <jeddy3> FuzzyCat, no
Aug 20 09:23:59 <hhf423_w> Psi_: I believe it is in the works and was just not properly done yet. If I did not misunderstood mickey, it will get fixed in a few days
Aug 20 09:25:07 <CM> the webkit svn must be ridiculously slow.. It's been checking out for about 2 hours now
Aug 20 09:25:20 <Psi_> i see
Aug 20 09:26:58 <stefan_schmidt> CM: It's around 300MB in svn IIRC
Aug 20 09:27:34 <CM> stefan_schmidt: Ouch.. Still slow though. :)
Aug 20 09:27:44 <stefan_schmidt> CM: heh
Aug 20 09:27:57 <stefan_schmidt> CM: Ask zecke if you like to hear complains about it. :)
Aug 20 09:28:50 <CM> stefan_schmidt: I can only imagine. Glad I can just let it go in the background and do other things, like work-work. ;)
Aug 20 09:38:15 <rtyler> man, quilt and OE just hate Mac OS X
Aug 20 09:39:54 <zecke> rtyler: port install quilt
Aug 20 09:40:12 <zecke> rtyler: and it is not OE hating OSX, koen and me do use OSX. It is glibc hating OSX :)
Aug 20 09:40:49 <zecke> rtyler: "glibc requires a sane environment for building, OSX does not qualify" as the chief of glibc loves to say
Aug 20 09:41:05 <rtyler> heh
Aug 20 09:41:23 <rtyler> well, than it's the MokoMakefile needing to build quilt for some reason
Aug 20 09:42:12 <zecke> rtyler: I think I would need a week to make OE work on OSX, hating and working are two distinct things
Aug 20 09:42:38 <rtyler> heh
Aug 20 09:42:43 <rtyler> well, get to it mister :D
Aug 20 09:48:09 <jseghers> hello all
Aug 20 09:48:37 <jseghers> anyone have a fix for openmoko-libs failing to build?
Aug 20 09:49:08 <DPThought> zecke: you use osx? Can you tell me what this AJZaurusUSB thing does for me? As far as i can tell, OSX works just fine without it. I get e network device as soon as i plug in my neo.
Aug 20 09:49:39 <pH5> jserv2: do you have an idea what to do about gsmd_phonebook / llist_head already?
Aug 20 09:49:53 <zecke> DPThought: no idea, I write my own drivers
Aug 20 09:50:24 <pH5> jseghers: for now band-aid is to copy common/linux_list.h into the staging include dir
Aug 20 09:50:31 <torpor> ajzaurus just gives your osx machine a matching kext for the gadget ethernet interface.  its already included in newer versions of OSX (gadget eth driver, that is)
Aug 20 09:51:23 <DPThought> torpor: ok. So i don't need it? Or do i need the AJZaurusUSB for flashing?
Aug 20 09:51:35 <jseghers> pH5: thank you.  Do you know if there's an easy way to keep MokoMakefile from always trying to pull the latest and greatest? 
Aug 20 09:52:13 <pH5> jseghers: no, but expect that to be fixed soon in bitbake with SRCREV support
Aug 20 09:53:24 <jseghers> pH5: OK.. one other question: it seems that it always tries to rebuild uboot and linux packages with new timestamps, even if nothing has changed there.  Is it possible to keep it from doing that?
Aug 20 09:53:27 <pH5> morning mickeyl 
Aug 20 09:53:47 <mickeyl> morning
Aug 20 09:55:07 <jseghers> pH5: or is that part and parcel of the same SRCREV issue?
Aug 20 09:55:10 <pH5> jseghers: you could fix the SRCDATE to a certain day (SRCDATE_uboot-openmoko = "20070819" in some .conf)
Aug 20 09:55:38 <pH5> jseghers: it's the same issue, SRCDATE will be replaced by SRCREV, eventually.
Aug 20 09:55:44 <jseghers> pH5: OK, thanks, I'll see if I can find that.
Aug 20 09:55:48 <roh> hey pH5 
Aug 20 09:55:55 <pH5> hi roh
Aug 20 09:57:36 <aloril> (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Talk:OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] [[User:Dpavlin]] [[Wishlist:Bible_Reader]] [[Wishlist:BuiltInScriptingLanguage]]
Aug 20 09:57:49 <roh> i'd like to invoke a meeting of moko people in berlin... do you have time this week?
Aug 20 09:59:50 <pH5> roh: late afternoon/evening, yes.
Aug 20 10:00:12 <rwhitby> I'm going to remove the openembedded patches stuff from Mokomakefile, now that it's tracking .dev (since I can just as easily make a mod to oe.dev as add an openembedded path to mokomakefile.
Aug 20 10:03:02 <jgm> rwhitby: will that affect our ability to put our own patches together and integrate them in to the build as available at current?
Aug 20 10:03:24 <rwhitby> Hmm - good point.
Aug 20 10:04:22 <rwhitby> jgm: what I will do is remove the reverting stuff, so your local changes don't get reverted.
Aug 20 10:04:36 <jgm> Okay cool
Aug 20 10:05:17 <jgm> (I assume that the patching system is clever enough to understand incremental patching i.e. I build a patch with quilt, update, change the patch, update again and it will work out what to add where)
Aug 20 10:05:48 <zecke> mickeyl: BTW: I updated the python bindings. and mokogsmd, and mokoui should be fully covered, mokojournal needs some work and porting/recreating the example needs work as well
Aug 20 10:05:49 <rwhitby> currently it is, cause it does all the reverting.
Aug 20 10:06:06 <rwhitby> but people are rightly complaining that the reverting is taking a long time on updates
Aug 20 10:07:01 <rwhitby> that's the crux of the problem - how to enable local patches for some power users without slowing it down for the normal user
Aug 20 10:07:52 <jgm> make patches?
Aug 20 10:14:19 <rwhitby> ok, I think I've worked out how to not do the revert if there are no local patches.
Aug 20 10:20:14 <jgm> I have a local patch so can test it if you need
Aug 20 10:32:15 <mickeyl> zecke: cool!
Aug 20 10:32:20 <mickeyl> zecke: do we have a bb for thatß
Aug 20 10:32:21 <mickeyl> ?
Aug 20 10:32:35 <zecke> mickeyl: I think we don't
Aug 20 10:32:52 <mickeyl> zecke: ok, you're using distutils, right? 
Aug 20 10:32:57 <mickeyl> zecke: I'm adding one then
Aug 20 10:33:26 <zecke> mickeyl: no, autoconf
Aug 20 10:34:11 <mickeyl> eeks
Aug 20 10:34:21 <mickeyl> :)
Aug 20 10:34:26 <zecke> mickeyl: it should still be easy to package
Aug 20 10:34:50 <zecke> mickeyl: pygtk, pygobject, mokoui, mokogsmd, mokojournal are the deps, make install should work as well
Aug 20 10:35:27 <mickeyl> zecke: ok, fair enough.
Aug 20 10:35:32 <mickeyl> zecke: I'll have a go at packaging it then
Aug 20 10:35:53 <zecke> luckily we are scripting language agnostic :)
Aug 20 10:36:11 <mickeyl> of course :D
Aug 20 10:36:34 <mickeyl> some may be more supported than others, but that's natural selection
Aug 20 10:37:04 <zecke> mickeyl: as long as the name refers to british humor,
Aug 20 10:37:12 <mickeyl> right
Aug 20 10:38:04 <andylockran> my neo is currently in the hands of the Vodafone UK handset procurement manager...
Aug 20 10:38:32 <cjb_ie> for why?!?
Aug 20 10:39:02 <andylockran> cjb_ie: he was dead interested in it and has been on at me for a while about taking a look at it
Aug 20 10:39:14 <cjb_ie> cool
Aug 20 10:39:30 <cjb_ie> so long as he's not expecting something that works totally out of the box yet
Aug 20 10:39:53 <ewon> ah fuck it, nokia have released phones with worse bugs :)
Aug 20 10:40:01 <ewon> first generation 6230i has trouble turning on
Aug 20 10:40:02 <andylockran> cjb_ie: no - I´ve given him a proper heads up on it all - but I doubt vodafone with be the best network to take the handset
Aug 20 10:40:10 <andylockran> after what they did to the n95
Aug 20 10:40:31 <andylockran> but hey - it´s time for a change of strategy - so lets hope the neo can kick start it for them
Aug 20 10:41:07 <cjb_ie> no idea what they did to the n95, i'm looking from the far side of the irish sea here
Aug 20 10:41:26 <andylockran> cjb_ie: they crippled it :)
Aug 20 10:42:08 <andylockran> what are the licensing deals regarding the neo1973
Aug 20 10:42:38 <andylockran> whilst sim-free it seems obvious - should a network provider wish to add the neo to its stable - who would the network provider need to contact
Aug 20 10:43:00 <andylockran> I´m against having exclusive import licenses for individuals
Aug 20 10:43:17 <andylockran> but it could be a nice way of generating revenue to give some developers a bonus
Aug 20 10:43:18 <mickeyl> zecke: any preference for the name? python-libmoko ?
Aug 20 10:43:21 <mickeyl> python-pymoko?
Aug 20 10:43:23 <mickeyl> python-openmoko?
Aug 20 10:46:18 <hads> Who's responsible for the python-* packages?
Aug 20 10:46:29 <Shoragan> andylockran, they could probably just resell it
Aug 20 11:21:05 <rwhitby> jgm: give that version a try.
Aug 20 11:21:33 <mickeyl> so if you have any python problems, I'm afraid I'm the man
Aug 20 11:22:35 <hads> mickeyl: Cool. Hi :) I need to sit down at some stage when I have time and figure out how to make packages. I've got a script I want to run but it depends on pyserial so I need to add a couple of packages.
Aug 20 11:23:29 <xzcvczx> 3% of devel image done
Aug 20 11:24:04 <mickeyl> hads: distutils rocks. or do you mean .bb package?
Aug 20 11:24:06 <hads> mickeyl: Yeah, bb
Aug 20 11:24:11 <hads> Something I haven't read up on yet.
Aug 20 11:24:11 <mickeyl> hads: ah. once you use distutils, the .bb file is a four-liner :)
Aug 20 11:24:13 <mickeyl> SRC_URI = foo
Aug 20 11:24:15 <mickeyl> inherit distutils
Aug 20 11:24:15 <hads> Oh sweet
Aug 20 11:24:16 <mickeyl> + some metadata
Aug 20 11:24:17 <mickeyl> but this is more or less it
Aug 20 11:24:21 <hads> A couple of them are standard lib though, select and fcntl
Aug 20 11:24:25 <hads> Actually, that's all of them except for pyserial itself.
Aug 20 11:24:25 <mickeyl> hads: right. it's then a matter of the right RDEPENDS
Aug 20 11:24:27 <mickeyl> you can see in python-2.5-manifest.inc which package contains which subfile
Aug 20 11:24:31 <mickeyl> then you should RDEPEND on those packages
Aug 20 11:24:32 <hads> Cool, cheers for the pointers.
Aug 20 11:25:13 <mickeyl> np
Aug 20 11:25:17 <mickeyl> so how's the overall reception of the August snapshot? 
Aug 20 11:25:26 <mickeyl> oh, wait. the announcement hasn't made it yet
Aug 20 11:25:26 * mickeyl bites on his tounge
Aug 20 11:25:26 <zecke> lol
Aug 20 11:25:34 * rtyler looks about
Aug 20 11:25:38 <zecke> mickeyl: you mean the last snapshot before we switch to Windows Mobile 6.0 and shared source?
Aug 20 11:25:38 <ewon> hah
Aug 20 11:25:39 * ewon dies
Aug 20 11:25:40 <rtyler> what's the right version of quilt to have such that OE won't spew errors? There were like two point revisions where the CLI options changed significantly enough to break stuff
Aug 20 11:25:56 <mickeyl> zecke: ssschhhhh
Aug 20 11:25:59 <mickeyl> zecke: you are violating your NDA
Aug 20 11:26:02 <mickeyl> rtyler: OE builds its own quilt. it shouldn't use yours
Aug 20 11:26:08 <rtyler> yeah, and that seems to be the problem :)
Aug 20 11:26:08 <rtyler> it's failing miserably on it's own wonderful quilt
Aug 20 11:26:09 <zecke> mickeyl: NDAs only work if you can lose something. Do you want to take my teddy, NES or sweatshirt away?
Aug 20 11:26:09 <mickeyl> zecke: teddy!
Aug 20 11:26:11 <zecke> mickeyl: you monster!
Aug 20 11:26:12 <mickeyl> har har har
Aug 20 11:26:12 <mickeyl> :D
Aug 20 11:26:17 <Kovacs> Can texting messaging be achieved on the Neo 1973 with your thumb or does the stylus have to be used to type the characters? More importantly, can you type a text message out fast?
Aug 20 11:26:20 <rtyler> mickeyl: http://pastebin.ca/664312
Aug 20 11:26:23 <ewon> Kovacs: someone has to write the sms software first, the moko can barely make a phonecall presently
Aug 20 11:26:25 * rtyler gets write on that
Aug 20 11:26:28 <rtyler> *rimshot*
Aug 20 11:26:28 <Kovacs> Ok, I thought they would have implemented that by now
Aug 20 11:26:29 <rtyler> Kovacs: having a solid platform beneath it all is a bit more important IMIO ;)
Aug 20 11:26:38 <Kovacs> True
Aug 20 11:26:38 <mickeyl> rtyler: ooh, that doesn't look good
Aug 20 11:26:38 <rtyler> heh
Aug 20 11:26:39 <mickeyl> rtyler: you moved your sourcedir?
Aug 20 11:26:39 <rtyler> no kidding
Aug 20 11:26:39 <ewon> Kovacs: much haxoring to be done
Aug 20 11:26:39 <mickeyl> s/sourcedir/builddir/
Aug 20 11:26:39 <apt> mickeyl meant: rtyler: you moved your builddir?
Aug 20 11:26:41 <ewon> I personally am being a selfish swine and sitting around waiting for GTA02
Aug 20 11:26:42 <mickeyl> quilt freaks out if you move the builddir after it's been built
Aug 20 11:26:43 <cesarb> Managed to call UPS (yeah, they really do not work on weekends... Tried before 8:00, busy; 2 minutes after, answered; now it's 8:15)
Aug 20 11:26:43 <mickeyl> it contains hardcoded paths to its command plugins
Aug 20 11:26:43 <rtyler> this is with a clean slate AFAIK
Aug 20 11:26:45 <Kovacs> Me too ewon, me too :)
Aug 20 11:26:46 <cesarb> I have to pay before they send the package, since they will send via a third-party which cannot receive the money :P
Aug 20 11:26:46 <mickeyl> rtyler: sounds like quilt-native wasn't build then. try bitbake -c rebuild quilt-native
Aug 20 11:26:48 <rtyler> rwhitby didn't add a `make clean` so should I rename the builddir for now and see if it still falls over?
Aug 20 11:26:48 <ewon> I wonder how one tells the gsm modem you want to send an SMS; I suspect it's some form of AT command
Aug 20 11:26:48 <mickeyl> and then try again
Aug 20 11:26:49 <ewon> could be done from inside emacs I'm sure
Aug 20 11:26:52 <ewon> \o/
Aug 20 11:26:53 <cesarb> The call they made (and I didn't receive) friday was exactly to try to tell me that
Aug 20 11:26:54 <ewon> meta-x-I-want-to-send-an-sms-k-pls-thx
Aug 20 11:27:09 * cesarb suddenly has the scary mental image of a nerd on a bus with a Neo, on a monochromatic text-looking screen, doing everything (including call answering) from within emacs
Aug 20 11:27:16 * rtyler crosses fingers and hopes this works
Aug 20 11:27:17 <ewon> cesarb: that would be me
Aug 20 11:27:24 * cesarb has only ever used emacs seriously on MSDOS... Which led me to want to have a real Unix, and thus discover vim
Aug 20 11:27:42 <ewon> hah
Aug 20 11:27:44 * ewon readies the light-saber
Aug 20 11:27:44 <rtyler> mickeyl: the good news is that it sounds like that would work
Aug 20 11:27:44 <rtyler> the bad news is that it didn't, and I got checksum mismatching errors aplenty on quilt-native
Aug 20 11:27:44 <mickeyl> rtyler: why do i think there will be bad news as well? :D
Aug 20 11:27:44 <mickeyl> hah
Aug 20 11:27:53 <mickeyl> rtyler: might want to give a "manual" build a try?
Aug 20 11:27:54 <mickeyl> using bb and oe directly?
Aug 20 11:27:55 <cesarb> ewon: imagine a (if I recall correctly) M-x compile "freezing" the interface until the whole makefile ended, when all the output suddenly appeared and you could type again. The lack of multitasking was that bad.
Aug 20 11:27:55 * Kovacs will be sat in Starbucks with my Neo 1973 using their wifi :D
Aug 20 11:27:56 <Kovacs> his* crap... Third person!
Aug 20 11:27:58 <rtyler> is there and option to just go to the pub and hope this all works itself out by the time I get back? :P
Aug 20 11:28:00 <mickeyl> hardly
Aug 20 11:28:02 <Kovacs> If you have elves, then yes.
Aug 20 11:28:05 <rtyler> drats, rwhitby should add that to the Mokomakefile too then
Aug 20 11:28:09 <mickeyl> ooh
Aug 20 11:28:10 <ewon> cesarb: they've fixed that :)
Aug 20 11:28:10 <mickeyl> | darwin /Software/Opensource/openmoko/build/tmp/staging/i386-darwin/share/quilt/compat/getopt
Aug 20 11:28:11 <mickeyl> i386-darwin ???
Aug 20 11:28:12 <rtyler> heh
Aug 20 11:28:12 <rtyler> yes
Aug 20 11:28:12 <mickeyl> ah
Aug 20 11:28:14 <mickeyl> i think you're the first one building on such a machine
Aug 20 11:28:16 <mickeyl> welcome pioneer
Aug 20 11:28:16 <rtyler> mickeyl: great >_<
Aug 20 11:28:16 <cesarb> ewon: they have? Cool, I haven't looked at djgpp since about '97...
Aug 20 11:28:17 <rtyler> mickeyl: I have two and a half i386 Darwin machines here, no Linux, Linux is only at work
Aug 20 11:28:19 <rtyler> coincidentally, that's where my frakking Neo is right now too
Aug 20 11:28:20 <mickeyl> rtyler: I'm afraid you have to find out what's going wrong there. We don't have any experiences with darwin, but we'd like to add support for it, if we get patches
Aug 20 11:28:22 <rtyler> "Neo1973, Don't leave home without it"
Aug 20 11:28:22 <mickeyl> we, as in OpenEmbedded
Aug 20 11:28:30 <rtyler> mickeyl: for the most part it seems to work fine, but that's probably more attributabe to Python kicking ass on different platforms :)
Aug 20 11:28:31 <zecke> mickeyl: I have experience with darwin, but no time :)
Aug 20 11:28:37 <zecke> rtyler: e.g. do you have gnused and other GNU coreutils installed?
Aug 20 11:28:40 <rtyler> zecke: your Gallapogos escapdes are of no use here :)
Aug 20 11:28:44 <rtyler> s/escapdes/escapades/
Aug 20 11:28:44 <apt> rtyler meant: zecke: your Gallapogos escapades are of no use here :)
Aug 20 11:28:46 <rtyler> zecke: but of course :)
Aug 20 11:30:15 <C7_>  /join #ubuntu-ch  
Aug 20 11:30:19 <C7_> oops
Aug 20 11:30:23 <rtyler> hahah
Aug 20 11:30:25 <rtyler> it happens
Aug 20 11:31:00 <jgm> rwhitby: hmm... that new makefile deleted my patch
Aug 20 11:31:02 <jgm> (The patch was in openembedded)
Aug 20 11:31:02 <rtyler> your patch probably had it coming
Aug 20 11:31:05 <jgm> So it would appear.  Poor patch.
Aug 20 11:31:08 <rtyler> well, maybe next time it won't taunt the build system so much :P
Aug 20 11:31:21 * jgm makes note to write less offensive patches in future
Aug 20 11:31:33 * ruoso happy to see software testing page growing :)
Aug 20 11:31:40 <rtyler> oh yeah, got a link?
Aug 20 11:31:49 <rtyler> I always forget where it is
Aug 20 11:32:16 <ruoso> rtyler, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Phase_1_Software_Testing 
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Aug 20 11:33:59 2007
Aug 20 11:38:06 * ruoso feels a netsplit
Aug 20 11:38:58 <mickeyl> ~lart netsplits
Aug 20 11:39:42 <xzcvczx> is anyone else getting less than impressive speeds off downloads/buildhost.om.org
Aug 20 11:47:05 <zecke> tronical: do you want to have a patch for repairing SVG in WebKit/Qt?
Aug 20 11:49:32 <mickeyl> zecke: wrong window
Aug 20 11:50:05 <zecke> mickeyl: if you guys would switch to Qt, he would be here!
Aug 20 11:50:13 <mickeyl> hehe
Aug 20 11:51:06 <DPThought> Where can i find the latest and greatest builds? The wiki is a bit unclear about that.
Aug 20 11:52:19 <DPThought> http://ipkg.nslu2-linux.org/feeds/openmoko/images/ is down, http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/ semms to have no images and http://people.openmoko.org/mickey/images/ is maybe a bit old
Aug 20 11:52:26 * DPThought is confused
Aug 20 11:52:32 <gordonsyme> Has anybody used the 2007.2 images in qemu?
Aug 20 11:53:33 <rtyler> whew aren't netsplits fun :)
Aug 20 11:53:33 <gordonsyme> It doesn't run the touch-screen calibration prog on first boot, so I find that the touch-screen is 90 degrees rotated from the display, makes clicking things very hard
Aug 20 11:54:03 <rtyler> gordonsyme: I never got networking to properly work in qemu, so I gave up on it
Aug 20 11:57:51 <aloril> (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[FAQ/ru]]
Aug 20 12:01:16 <woglinde> hi stephmw
Aug 20 12:01:30 <Stephmw> heya
Aug 20 12:13:34 * ruoso wonders if we do need udev on a phone... removing it could make the boot a lot faster
Aug 20 12:14:11 <woglinde> ruoso yeah but you have problems with usb devices
Aug 20 12:14:37 <woglinde> udev is nice but the shellscripting suckz
Aug 20 12:14:57 <Writchie> once things are stable, especially as regards PM and resume, booting should be relatively rare
Aug 20 12:15:28 <ruoso> relatively means once a year?
Aug 20 12:15:55 <pH5> ruoso: well, every time you want to upgrade the kernel/uboot or when your battery runs out
Aug 20 12:16:00 <Writchie> more like once of month, due to shortcomings in the power part
Aug 20 12:16:34 <ruoso> even then a long boot seems anoying
Aug 20 12:16:36 <Writchie> people will not generally let their battery run - out when the understand the consequences
Aug 20 12:16:57 <ynezz> you can suspend phone if the battery is low
Aug 20 12:17:17 <Writchie> the phone ought to do this itself
Aug 20 12:17:30 <Writchie> and warn you when battery is low enough you need to find something to plug into
Aug 20 12:17:55 <ynezz> that's what i meant
Aug 20 12:17:58 <Writchie> like most reaonsable phones do now/ ;)
Aug 20 12:19:03 <Writchie> i suspect we'll even see 4AA packs with a mini B plug, to refesh the device on the go.
Aug 20 12:19:21 <sagacis> quick question: I've been building with the mokomakefile and bitbake.  I changed some stuff in the openmoko-panel-applet and want to test it.  How should I build it?
Aug 20 12:19:31 <sagacis> Writchie: You can get them now
Aug 20 12:19:31 <Writchie> Boot time does matter, e.g. for battery changes, but its certainly not important enough to give up udev
Aug 20 12:20:12 <mickeyl> right
Aug 20 12:20:16 <mickeyl> upstart!
Aug 20 12:20:22 <Writchie> sagacis: i'm not surprised, especially for moto phones which use this kind of plug
Aug 20 12:20:43 <ynezz> sagacis: bitbake -c compile openmoko-panel-applet
Aug 20 12:20:55 <ynezz> then copy binary to phone
Aug 20 12:21:00 <Writchie> kerenel upgrades will almost always dictate reboot
Aug 20 12:21:14 <ynezz> kexec :p
Aug 20 12:21:55 <sagacis> ynezz: Thanks!
Aug 20 12:22:20 <robtaylor> ~>
Aug 20 12:22:21 <robtaylor> ~
Aug 20 12:22:32 <sagacis> One of these days I'm going to have to read the Bitbake instructions instead of the irc....
Aug 20 12:23:36 <sagacis> ml down again?
Aug 20 12:26:27 <aloril> http://www.ladyada.net/make/mintyboost/ works, though it seems to basically keep it going, not actually charge (max draw is probably what its FAQ says: 250mA, which is roughly what Neo1973 uses when doing stuff)
Aug 20 12:27:10 <mdt> what does te kernel mean with: "powered down GSM, thus enabling serial console / powering up GSM, thus disconnecting serial console"? which serial console is it talking about?
Aug 20 12:27:11 <aloril> (you need to enable fast charge in u-boot, default 100mA is not enough to keep Neo1973 going)
Aug 20 12:35:30 <mickeyl> alphaone: stefan_schmidt arrived at your home?
Aug 20 12:37:58 <dotmef> mdt: I think this is the gsmd daemon. it uses a serial connection (ps -ef | grep for gsmd) to talk to the gsm modem
Aug 20 12:38:41 <dotmef> mdt: when the gsmd is stopped, you can use "cu -l /dev/ttySAC0" to talk to the gsm modem directly via serial
Aug 20 12:38:43 <mdt> dotmef, :D but it is disabled when i switch on the modem ;)
Aug 20 12:39:07 <mdt> these lines are logged when doing echo 0 > /sys/....
Aug 20 12:39:08 <dotmef> mdt: right. you can't use cu to talk to it when gsmd is
Aug 20 12:39:20 <mdt> no gsmd involved...
Aug 20 12:39:42 <mdt> just do a echo 0 > /... and you see the messages (stop gsmd before that)
Aug 20 12:39:44 <dotmef> hmm. must have it wrong then
Aug 20 12:40:11 <DPThought> how long shoudl i wait for linux-omap to build until i should be nevous? It's now feeling like ours since this package started building
Aug 20 12:40:21 <pH5> mdt: the ttySAC0 port can be used for either the gsm chip or as a serial console when the debug bard is connected
Aug 20 12:40:30 <CIA-20> openmoko: 03mickey * r2746 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/daemons/neod/src/buttonactions.c: neod: reset display brightness on power/aux button press
Aug 20 12:40:57 <mdt> pH5, ah, that explains everything. so no gsm when using serial port via debug board?
Aug 20 12:41:15 <cesarb> mdt: the opposite. No serial port on the debug board when using the gsm
Aug 20 12:41:27 <cesarb> mdt: it's the gsm that overrides the debug board's serial port
Aug 20 12:41:28 <mdt> :D okay....
Aug 20 12:41:31 <woglinde> DPThought better ask in oe
Aug 20 12:41:33 <cesarb> mdt: just check the debug board's schematics
Aug 20 12:41:52 <cesarb> mdt: it cuts off the serial when GSM_EN is enabled
Aug 20 12:41:56 <mdt> cesarb, hm, i'm more with software...
Aug 20 12:42:09 <mdt> cesarb, don't think i could read that :)
Aug 20 12:43:41 <dotmef> that makes more sense than my explanation. apologies for the red herring mdt :P
Aug 20 12:45:50 <mdt> dotmef, no prob
Aug 20 12:48:17 <alphaone> mickeyl: Yeah
Aug 20 12:48:40 <mickeyl> alphaone: ok, i'll call shortly
Aug 20 12:49:03 <alphaone> mickeyl: We're not there at the moment, but the call should be routed accordingly
Aug 20 12:49:12 <mickeyl> heh, ok
Aug 20 12:49:17 <mickeyl> were are you guys?
Aug 20 12:49:20 <mickeyl> where, even
Aug 20 12:49:33 <El_Salvador> http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Today/2007.2
Aug 20 12:49:34 <El_Salvador> O_o
Aug 20 12:49:38 <El_Salvador> cooming soon?
Aug 20 12:49:43 <El_Salvador> *coming
Aug 20 12:50:47 <alphaone> mickeyl: In bar of our student dorm.
Aug 20 12:50:54 <mickeyl> nice :D
Aug 20 12:51:12 <alphaone> It's closed during the day, but has more space that my room
Aug 20 12:51:42 <mickeyl> pretty handy
Aug 20 12:51:53 <alphaone> Yeah :-)
Aug 20 12:52:44 <alphaone> mickeyl: stefan_schmidt says that his "travel agent" didn't call back yet so you should probably wait with calling.
Aug 20 12:52:49 <stefan_schmidt> mickeyl: And all drinks are there. ;)
Aug 20 12:53:06 <mickeyl> right. makes no sense to book hotels before we have the flights.
Aug 20 12:53:06 <alphaone> :-)
Aug 20 12:53:09 <mickeyl> just keep me updated then
Aug 20 12:53:20 <mickeyl> btwe.
Aug 20 12:53:23 <stefan_schmidt> mickeyl: Perhaps again some trouble with a no-mor_available flight. Sh sorts this out now. :(
Aug 20 12:53:32 <stefan_schmidt> mickeyl: will do
Aug 20 12:53:36 <mickeyl> the longer i think about that berlin office the more i like the idea
Aug 20 12:54:02 <stefan_schmidt> mickeyl: me too
Aug 20 12:54:36 <mickeyl> that would also mean i have more time to pester zecke to do his studies
Aug 20 12:54:37 <mickeyl> :D
Aug 20 12:54:40 <woglinde> bye
Aug 20 12:54:44 <mickeyl> cu woglinde 
Aug 20 12:54:53 <mickeyl> and i could see woglinde's baby
Aug 20 12:54:56 <woglinde> he I will play pinball with zecke
Aug 20 12:55:01 <mickeyl> have fun :)
Aug 20 12:55:04 <woglinde> mickeyl he is no baby anymore
Aug 20 12:55:11 <woglinde> its called "kleinkind"
Aug 20 12:55:15 <mickeyl> hehe
Aug 20 12:55:20 <mickeyl> sun, even.
Aug 20 12:55:23 <mickeyl> son, even
Aug 20 12:55:39 <woglinde> and he has 3 thooths
Aug 20 12:55:54 <mickeyl> uh oh. short nights for you?
Aug 20 12:55:59 <woglinde> no
Aug 20 12:56:00 <zecke> woglinde: don't hurt me
Aug 20 12:56:10 <woglinde> zecke you will be the pinball
Aug 20 12:56:12 <mickeyl> hahaha
Aug 20 12:56:33 <zecke> woglinde: I know you like these strange japanese tv shows, where humans are pinballs...
Aug 20 12:56:41 <mickeyl> | ode.cpp:1361: error: expected primary-expression before ';' token
Aug 20 12:56:46 <mickeyl> *sigh* 
Aug 20 12:56:52 <mickeyl> how can guys still not use gcc 4.x?
Aug 20 12:56:54 <woglinde> takeshis castle
Aug 20 12:56:55 * mickeyl fixes
Aug 20 12:56:56 <woglinde> yes
Aug 20 12:57:29 <woglinde> okay
Aug 20 12:58:52 <mdt> someone also playing with gsmd/libgsmd?
Aug 20 13:01:19 <SpeedEvil> Sad state of affairs when my satnav system produces inferior GPS tracks to my neo. 
Aug 20 13:01:32 <SpeedEvil> Satnav system crashed twice in six miles, and rebooted.
Aug 20 13:01:52 <jgm> No, that's a great state of affairs
Aug 20 13:02:15 <dotmef> heh. agreed
Aug 20 13:02:22 <SpeedEvil> Indeed - in some ways.
Aug 20 13:02:34 <SpeedEvil> It's just damn annoying commercial software is so flaky.
Aug 20 13:02:44 <SpeedEvil> Even in embedded stuff which should in theory be more stable.
Aug 20 13:03:04 <Vegar> yeah
Aug 20 13:03:10 <Writchie> all non-trivial software has bugs
Aug 20 13:03:19 <Writchie> all software is non-trivial
Aug 20 13:03:24 <SpeedEvil> I can live with bugs.
Aug 20 13:03:27 <xzcvczx> Writchie: so hello-world has bugs? :P
Aug 20 13:03:42 <SpeedEvil> 'the software has encountered an error', followed by rebooting is suboptimal though.
Aug 20 13:03:43 <Vegar> the libraries used might have bugs
Aug 20 13:03:49 <SpeedEvil> Especially when it takes several minutes.
Aug 20 13:03:54 <jeddy3> xzcvczx, hello world is non trivial? :)
Aug 20 13:04:04 <Writchie> at one time the only error was "syntax error"
Aug 20 13:04:18 <rtyler> jeddy3: not if you're a super l337 perl haxx0r ;)
Aug 20 13:04:26 <jeddy3> rtyler, :D
Aug 20 13:04:51 <Writchie> it couln
Aug 20 13:05:03 <Writchie> it couldn't have failed - i only changed one thing
Aug 20 13:05:27 * xzcvczx laughs at the debugging techniques used in openmoko "got here" on every line that might be causing an issue
Aug 20 13:05:50 <mickeyl> zecke: are you going to clean up the qmake/qmake2/qt3/qt4x11 bbclass situation soon? if not, I'll do that next month
Aug 20 13:06:18 <Writchie> is that what's blowing up my build?
Aug 20 13:06:18 <xzcvczx> can anyone confirm if aug 19 on buildhost boots?
Aug 20 13:06:38 <alphaone> xzcvczx: Link?
Aug 20 13:06:49 <Writchie> uicmoc4-native-4.3.0-r2
Aug 20 13:06:56 <xzcvczx> http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/fic-gta01/OpenMoko-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-P1-August-Snapshot-20070819-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2
Aug 20 13:07:44 <alphaone> xzcvczx: Try http://buildhost.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.08/images/
Aug 20 13:08:56 <zecke> mickeyl: I can send you my local changes. but only qmake2,qt4x11 and qtopiacore
Aug 20 13:09:02 <zecke> mickeyl: and this is the wrong channel
Aug 20 13:09:06 <mickeyl> right
Aug 20 13:09:57 <xzcvczx> alphaone: have you got a md5sum of that one
Aug 20 13:10:21 <xzcvczx> 4ae582435db41b30f9bc76d5c3c03940 
Aug 20 13:11:11 <alphaone> 4ae582435db41b30f9bc76d5c3c03940
Aug 20 13:11:16 <alphaone> So they are the same
Aug 20 13:11:23 <xzcvczx> yup :)
Aug 20 13:11:29 <xzcvczx> will try a nand erase
Aug 20 13:11:34 <alphaone> xzcvczx: Then I can confirm that this image boots
Aug 20 13:11:58 <alphaone> xzcvczx: Updating to the newes u-boot should fix the nand erase bug
Aug 20 13:12:36 * SpeedEvil leaves the bug.
Aug 20 13:12:56 <SpeedEvil> It's just another line in the update script.
Aug 20 13:13:32 <xzcvczx> i thought the u-boot bug was meant to be fixed a while ago
Aug 20 13:14:06 <xzcvczx> hmmmm the new image booted this time but has funky colors
Aug 20 13:14:16 <alphaone> xzcvczx: Though in reality it was only fixed some weeks ago
Aug 20 13:15:42 <mickeyl> hmm
Aug 20 13:15:49 <mickeyl> sometimes i'm a bit disappointed with this community
Aug 20 13:15:59 <mickeyl> i see a fix for the mrxvt fonts on the wiki page
Aug 20 13:16:01 <mickeyl> but not on bugzilla
Aug 20 13:16:11 <mickeyl> guys, we can't track every means of communication
Aug 20 13:16:14 <mickeyl> please use bugzilla
Aug 20 13:16:22 * mickeyl applies the fix
Aug 20 13:17:08 <mdt> so no one is really interested to do phone calls with the neo? no interests in libgsmd? ;)
Aug 20 13:17:55 <alphaone> mdt: That is another problem...
Aug 20 13:17:59 <stefan_schmidt> mdt: The phone is only a feature
Aug 20 13:18:07 <SpeedEvil> You're missing the fact that few geeks talk to people :)
Aug 20 13:18:15 <mdt> :D
Aug 20 13:18:30 <alphaone> stefan_schmidt: http://maluga.com.pl/wp-content/uploads/bug-feature.jpg
Aug 20 13:19:00 <stefan_schmidt> mdt: Of course there will be more work on it. But atm we just have not the resources to fix all in one day.
Aug 20 13:19:08 <mickeyl> mdt: we _are_ interested... it's just that the gsmd developer is overbusy right now.
Aug 20 13:19:25 * SpeedEvil sics an illegal cloning team on the core team.
Aug 20 13:19:33 <mdt> i asked if help is wanted - and got no answer
Aug 20 13:20:57 <stefan_schmidt> mdt: hmm, where? Pepople from outside the project are already helping on it...
Aug 20 13:20:57 <Dmitry_Platonov> mdt, I'm interested too.
Aug 20 13:21:21 <Dmitry_Platonov> but I'd suggest rewrite ^_^
Aug 20 13:21:24 <mdt> stefan_schmidt, and distroyed it ;)
Aug 20 13:21:33 <stefan_schmidt> mdt: The point is that you would need to make your way through the source yourself. No time for help to get you in...
Aug 20 13:21:41 <mdt> stefan_schmidt, the current HEAD version does not work at all
Aug 20 13:21:51 <xzcvczx> mickeyl: should the .2 off buildhost from the 19th look generally the same as your builds from ~8th? in terms of gui color?
Aug 20 13:21:57 <stefan_schmidt> mdt: Send patches to fix this.
Aug 20 13:22:09 <stefan_schmidt> Dmitry_Platonov: Do it and let us know when you are ready.
Aug 20 13:22:14 <mdt> stefan_schmidt, point is, i would only do anything there if this is used later. anything else is braindead
Aug 20 13:22:31 <mickeyl> xzcvczx: yes
Aug 20 13:22:57 <xzcvczx> thats good to know as my version at the moment looks like billgates has bought the company or something :P
Aug 20 13:23:04 <Dmitry_Platonov> stefan_schmidt, I have own job. Would openmoko hire me?
Aug 20 13:23:08 <alphaone> mdt:Well, then write useful code ;-)
Aug 20 13:23:20 <stefan_schmidt> Dmitry_Platonov: To rewrite code we already have?
Aug 20 13:23:54 <Dmitry_Platonov> To do anything you want. Coding, bugfixing, packaging.
Aug 20 13:24:04 <Dmitry_Platonov> Consulting
Aug 20 13:24:17 <mdt> alphaone, asuming i do - looking at the response of questions i send to the mailing list i doubed my work would be read also...
Aug 20 13:25:02 <alphaone> mdt: As mickeyl said the gsmd developer is really busy with stuff != gsmd at the moment.
Aug 20 13:25:10 <Dmitry_Platonov> stefan_schmidt, even system administration would do 8)
Aug 20 13:26:12 <xzcvczx> stefan_schmidt: he can always be the office bi*ch
Aug 20 13:26:14 <mdt> alphaone, i know, but understand me, i would not like to do work nobody else is using and enhancing....
Aug 20 13:26:19 <alphaone> mdt: Even the patches for gsmd have been just sitting there until recently
Aug 20 13:26:39 <Writchie> this is open source project - so what's needed will eventually get done. I for one, want the full GSM/GPRS handset functionality to work, so that is what I am going to do. 
Aug 20 13:26:48 * stefan_schmidt goes back to work
Aug 20 13:28:05 <alphaone> mdt: I see people using and enhancing gsmd.
Aug 20 13:28:14 <alphaone> mdt: Look in svn logs
Aug 20 13:28:17 <mdt> so you are working on gsmd already, Writchie ?
Aug 20 13:28:50 <Writchie> i am working on what libgsm/gsmd does - but in a different way. 
Aug 20 13:28:53 <alphaone> mdt: But if you want to discuss everything before you'll have to wait. We don't have the resources for that now.
Aug 20 13:29:03 <mdt> alphaone, how does one get a commmit-account for that svn?
Aug 20 13:29:04 <zash_se> mdt: then theres the gsmd-devel mailinglist
Aug 20 13:29:34 <mdt> zash_se, as i said: no response...
Aug 20 13:29:37 <dotmef> sorry to be a bother - but is it worth lodging a bug about the save-rtc.sh script? I've noticed it's not quite right.
Aug 20 13:29:45 <Dmitry_Platonov> Writchie, if initial sales of neo will fail/delayed because of GSM/GPRS not working, it can be the end of openmoko.
Aug 20 13:30:16 <mdt> Writchie, can you explain what you meant?
Aug 20 13:30:17 <Writchie> depends on what you define as failure
Aug 20 13:30:55 <Writchie> if 2000 a month is defined as success, then neo will easily do this - even as it is.
Aug 20 13:31:08 <xzcvczx> why is it the people with 3 letter names that seem to be able to complain so much
Aug 20 13:31:11 <alphaone> mdt: What's wrong with sending patches?
Aug 20 13:31:53 <xzcvczx> dotmef: may as well anything that makes it better is good
Aug 20 13:31:54 <Writchie> the 7.10 mux, libgsm and gsmd are IMH just incomplete and barely workable frameworks.
Aug 20 13:31:59 <alphaone> Okay, gotta go back to work
Aug 20 13:32:38 <Writchie> the kernel mux doesn't even exist, the code isn't really there
Aug 20 13:32:52 <dotmef> roger. thanks xzcvczx
Aug 20 13:32:52 <mickeyl> please just continue adding patches to bugzilla. this is our memory.
Aug 20 13:32:53 <Dmitry_Platonov> Writchie, is it so?
Aug 20 13:34:28 <mdt> xzcvczx, sorry if it sounds as if i would compain. i'm just irritated that one of the most important features of the neo is so low in priority. specially if i ask if someone is interested in help. question is, how help is wanted, how gsmd is meant to be developed. 
Aug 20 13:35:24 <Writchie> mdt: do not get disheartened
Aug 20 13:35:28 <xzcvczx> mdt: well the power management is really just as important as there is no point in having a fully working phone if its battery only last 4 hrs
Aug 20 13:35:46 <Writchie> mdt: all of these things take time
Aug 20 13:36:12 <CIA-20> openmoko: 03chris * r2747 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (ChangeLog src/today-launcher.c): Fix the focus-on-search in openmoko-today2 launcher
Aug 20 13:36:20 <Writchie> the PM needs a lot of work - but that will get done.
Aug 20 13:36:49 <Dmitry_Platonov> Writchie, what about drivers/char/ts0710_mux.c ?
Aug 20 13:37:10 <mdt> don't get me wrong (sorry, my english is anything but perfect) but working on gsmd need at least a short discussion about how that was meant to work. some architecture discussion (as if 07.10 goes into the kernel or not)/
Aug 20 13:37:15 <Writchie> is you look at the code i think you will find that there is nothing there
Aug 20 13:37:26 <Writchie> unless it has just recently been patched
Aug 20 13:37:53 <Dmitry_Platonov> it seems it is commented out, but reason for me is unknown
Aug 20 13:38:09 <Dmitry_Platonov> it's nearly 4k lines
Aug 20 13:38:16 <Writchie> you don't need discussion if everything is done by one person
Aug 20 13:39:15 <SpeedEvil> You do if it's a core part of the architecture, and the person is not infallible.
Aug 20 13:39:16 <Writchie> mdt: I agree with you. 
Aug 20 13:39:23 <Dmitry_Platonov> err, not commented /syntax highlighting tricked me/
Aug 20 13:39:46 <Writchie> coding is at most 15%- 20% of the effort. 
Aug 20 13:39:50 <mdt> Writchie, so you would also work on gsmd?
Aug 20 13:40:03 <Writchie> mdt: yes, i am already
Aug 20 13:40:32 <mdt> Writchie, so what do you do with it?
Aug 20 13:40:34 <Writchie> but i'm not going to code things first - that happens later
Aug 20 13:41:44 <Writchie> i'm defining an d-bus layer by which applications could access all necessary functionality of the mobile terminal 
Aug 20 13:41:57 <Writchie> i hope to have that this week for discussion
Aug 20 13:41:59 <mdt> Writchie, can you send me some docs?
Aug 20 13:42:22 <mdt> Writchie, ah, okay. what's your background? you don't work for fic?
Aug 20 13:42:33 <Writchie> i don't work for FIC
Aug 20 13:42:42 <Writchie> i'm retired
Aug 20 13:42:50 <Writchie> sort of
Aug 20 13:43:03 <mdt> Writchie, wow... nice status ;)
Aug 20 13:43:16 <Fatal> FIC depresses me
Aug 20 13:43:29 <mdt> Writchie, so you are also not interested in earning money from fic..?
Aug 20 13:43:30 <Writchie> but i do have code i've written running in hundreds of millions of phones
Aug 20 13:43:37 <rtyler> Fatal: which letters in particular, the F?
Aug 20 13:43:58 <ynezz> Fatal: if it's 'C' take a blue pill
Aug 20 13:44:54 <Fatal> their mad order skills. seems the promised units I ordered were shipped elsewhere during the week they ignored the fact that I had sent in new CC information. *gn*
Aug 20 13:44:58 <mdt> Writchie, and you prefere dbus... ;)
Aug 20 13:45:36 <ossman> gsmd is stuck in some loop, eating 100% CPU
Aug 20 13:45:38 <ossman> known issue?
Aug 20 13:46:03 <Writchie> dbus is there - blueZ uses dbus, dbus appears more than adequate to the task
Aug 20 13:46:08 <Dmitry_Platonov> not working gsmd = known issue. details depend ^_^
Aug 20 13:46:26 <ossman> Dmitry_Platonov, ok
Aug 20 13:46:34 <Writchie> a definition around dbus does not preclude using similar objects and methods on a different framework
Aug 20 13:46:36 <mdt> Writchie, yes, i like dbus also, but i don't care if its something else and that works.
Aug 20 13:46:36 <ossman> minor feature, it's only a phone after all ;)
Aug 20 13:46:51 * Dmitry_Platonov agrees with Writchie about dbus
Aug 20 13:47:07 <xzcvczx> grrrrr dang the new bb doing qemu since it doesnt compile with gcc4
Aug 20 13:49:36 <mdt> Writchie, do you put your ideas on the ml?
Aug 20 13:49:57 <Writchie> some of them
Aug 20 13:50:15 <mickeyl> which one?
Aug 20 13:50:40 <Writchie> gsmd-dev
Aug 20 13:50:44 <mickeyl> ah
Aug 20 13:50:49 <mickeyl> that's the only one i'm not subscribed to
Aug 20 13:50:54 * mickeyl subscribes
Aug 20 13:52:00 <Writchie> dbus is a bit touchy subject
Aug 20 13:52:11 <mickeyl> is it? can't see why
Aug 20 13:52:18 <mickeyl> it's the standard Linux IPC nowadays
Aug 20 13:52:35 <mickeyl> that doesn't mean it should be the only one
Aug 20 13:52:35 <Writchie> i'm not sure of the reaons why
Aug 20 13:52:41 <mickeyl> but it makes sense for middleware
Aug 20 13:52:50 <Writchie> i agree
Aug 20 13:53:15 <Writchie> what goes on below that layer should be opaque
Aug 20 13:53:16 <mickeyl> i still think gsmd should not depend on it, but gsmd-dbus is a must IMO
Aug 20 13:53:31 * SpeedEvil agrees with mickeyl. 
Aug 20 13:53:37 <SpeedEvil> In some cases dbus'd be silly.
Aug 20 13:53:58 <SpeedEvil> One process doing embedded stuff with no UI, that just wants to make calls.
Aug 20 13:54:09 <jgm> D-Bus is definitely the way to go.  It's IPC without (a lot of) the hassle
Aug 20 13:54:42 <Writchie> SppedEvil: i'm not so sure the D-Bus isn't appropriate even with no UI
Aug 20 13:54:47 <Writchie> it's pretty lightweight
Aug 20 13:54:59 <SpeedEvil> I more mean 'just one process'.
Aug 20 13:55:14 <Writchie> you already have a bunch of processes
Aug 20 13:55:14 <SpeedEvil> with no need for any IPC at all.
Aug 20 13:55:46 <jgm> But it still needs to negotiate the GSM connection, which implies something arbitrating it, which implies IPC
Aug 20 13:55:46 <jeddy3> mickeyl, the new efl-related recipes are your work?
Aug 20 13:55:53 <mickeyl> jeddy3: yes
Aug 20 13:56:21 <SpeedEvil> jgm: True - which does not imply that it must be dbus, rather than standard library calls.
Aug 20 13:56:31 <jeddy3> mickeyl, have you tried to build the python bindings, python-evas and python-edje?
Aug 20 13:56:51 <aloril> (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973]] [[User_talk:Mateo]] [[P1_Owners]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Berlin]] [[Neo1973_Battery_Charger]] [[Neo1973_Charging]] [[Talk:Neo1973_Battery_Charger]] [[Today/2007.2]] [[Dialer/2007.2]] [[Contacts/2007.2]]
Aug 20 13:57:11 <mickeyl> jeddy3: yes. they built once for me. there's very much progress, so i expect them to break any time. i'm going to find a set of sane srcdates atm. again
Aug 20 13:57:12 <jgm> Ah, but the point is that it may as well be D-Bus.  Standard library calls won't work for arbitration unless they themselves do IPc at which case we're just pushing it down a layer
Aug 20 13:57:26 <Writchie> the present libgsm is an ad-hoc pipe from library to deamon
Aug 20 13:57:41 <mdt> Writchie, would you provide a client lib as today or just document the dbus-interface?
Aug 20 13:57:44 <jeddy3> mickeyl, ah ok...they seem to be broken now anyway =)
Aug 20 13:57:57 <jeddy3> mickeyl, or i have made some mistake...
Aug 20 13:57:57 <mickeyl> jeddy3: yeah. give me a couple of days and they should work again
Aug 20 13:58:04 <jeddy3> mickeyl, nod
Aug 20 13:58:23 <jeddy3> mickeyl, oh yeah, they are build from enlightenment cvs right?
Aug 20 13:58:30 <mdt> Writchie, so if you provide a lib i don't see the need for more discussion. if someone does not like the ipc mechanism used he may replace it
Aug 20 13:58:31 <Writchie> mdt: since d-bus already has bindings for everything, it seems to make sense to just use the dbus objects
Aug 20 13:58:45 <mickeyl> jeddy3: right. this is the source for the breakage. there's no point in using releases for EFL atm. since so much changes
Aug 20 13:59:00 <jeddy3> mickeyl, no wonder then =)
Aug 20 13:59:14 <AntonTakk> mickeyl: working on getting e17 to run on the neo?
Aug 20 13:59:32 <Writchie> mdt: you're making the assumption that the current libgsm API is architecturally sound.
Aug 20 13:59:45 <mickeyl> AntonTakk: no. to me, the EFL is much more interesting than actual E17
Aug 20 13:59:52 <mdt> Writchie, no. that's not what i meant
Aug 20 14:00:03 <mdt> Writchie, i have some wishes there also ;)
Aug 20 14:00:04 <jeddy3> second that, on efl
Aug 20 14:00:47 <shadoknight> hi
Aug 20 14:00:57 <mdt> Writchie, would you use dbus-signals for gsmd's events?
Aug 20 14:01:07 <Writchie> yes
Aug 20 14:01:07 <shadoknight> so, I've tried everything I can think of, and I'm still having trouble building qemu
Aug 20 14:01:09 <xzcvczx> does anyone know how i can stop qemu being built with openmoko-devel-image
Aug 20 14:01:13 <FuzzyCat> CM: ping
Aug 20 14:01:21 <xzcvczx> shadoknight: your using gcc4?
Aug 20 14:01:21 <CM> FuzzyCat: Pong ;)
Aug 20 14:01:23 <mdt> Writchie, i really would like to see your document.... :D
Aug 20 14:01:26 <shadoknight> yep
Aug 20 14:01:31 <xzcvczx> shadoknight: give up now
Aug 20 14:01:36 <shadoknight> heh
Aug 20 14:01:39 <shadoknight> oh
Aug 20 14:01:40 <shadoknight> no
Aug 20 14:01:42 <mickeyl> you _need_ gcc3 for qemu
Aug 20 14:01:43 <FuzzyCat> know of any good domain registrars in your region
Aug 20 14:01:44 <shadoknight> I mis-read your statement
Aug 20 14:01:47 <mickeyl> don't bother trying w/ 4
Aug 20 14:01:48 <jgm> xzcvczx: remove it from the dependency list in the makefile?
Aug 20 14:01:49 <AntonTakk> fair enough, thou having efl compiled and working is a big step in getting e17 it's self to build and run
Aug 20 14:01:52 <shadoknight> using 3.4
Aug 20 14:02:03 <xzcvczx> jgm: which makefile i am running round in circles trying to find it
Aug 20 14:02:08 <xzcvczx> shadoknight: what cpu
Aug 20 14:02:40 <shadoknight> xzcvczx: core duo
Aug 20 14:02:43 <CM> FuzzyCat: I have two using godaddy, but none are .se
Aug 20 14:02:43 <shadoknight> 32-bit
Aug 20 14:02:44 <mickeyl> ENABLE_BINARY_LOCALE_GENERATION = "0"
Aug 20 14:02:53 <CM> FuzzyCat: I can ask around :)
Aug 20 14:02:54 <mickeyl> should remove the need for qemu
Aug 20 14:03:02 <jgm> xzcvczx: are you using the new makefile?
Aug 20 14:03:03 <FuzzyCat> please 
Aug 20 14:03:11 <xzcvczx> jgm: yes
Aug 20 14:03:35 <shadoknight> xzcvczx: gentoo
Aug 20 14:03:43 <jgm> There's a build-qemu target, I'd imagine that is the one
Aug 20 14:04:12 <xzcvczx> jgm: no if you do make openmoko-devel-image qemu isnt build bitbake is dragging it in as a dependency somewhere
Aug 20 14:04:24 <shadoknight> I even made the soft-link CM recommended, then blew away the entire build space and started with a MokoMakefile current as of yesterday at about 3:00 pm
Aug 20 14:04:32 <xzcvczx> shadoknight: yeah i was able to fix it somehow cant remember how though
Aug 20 14:04:47 <shadoknight> (that is, made '/usr/bin/gcc-3.4' point to exactly the gcc-3.4.6 binary)
Aug 20 14:04:55 <xzcvczx> shadoknight: thought qemu is one of the worst things ever to compile
Aug 20 14:05:00 <shadoknight> ugh
Aug 20 14:05:01 <xzcvczx> shadoknight: type in gcc -l as root
Aug 20 14:05:06 <jgm> xzcvczx: hmm... unfortunately there are compilation errors at current so I can't test it any further than guessing in the makefile
Aug 20 14:05:20 <shadoknight> is that an l or a 1?
Aug 20 14:05:23 <xzcvczx> lucy
Aug 20 14:05:33 <shadoknight> I get 'argument to -l missing'
Aug 20 14:05:41 <xzcvczx> lol oops
Aug 20 14:05:44 <xzcvczx> gcc-config -l
Aug 20 14:05:46 <xzcvczx> thats the one
Aug 20 14:05:53 <xzcvczx> :S
Aug 20 14:06:13 <shadoknight> milamber ~ # gcc-config -l
Aug 20 14:06:13 <shadoknight>  [1] i686-pc-linux-gnu-3.3.6
Aug 20 14:06:13 <shadoknight>  [2] i686-pc-linux-gnu-3.4.6 *
Aug 20 14:06:13 <shadoknight>  [3] i686-pc-linux-gnu-3.4.6-hardened
Aug 20 14:06:13 <shadoknight>  [4] i686-pc-linux-gnu-3.4.6-hardenednopie
Aug 20 14:06:13 <shadoknight>  [5] i686-pc-linux-gnu-3.4.6-hardenednopiessp
Aug 20 14:06:15 <shadoknight>  [6] i686-pc-linux-gnu-3.4.6-hardenednossp
Aug 20 14:06:17 <shadoknight>  [7] i686-pc-linux-gnu-4.1.2
Aug 20 14:06:19 <shadoknight> milamber ~ # 
Aug 20 14:06:21 <shadoknight> (sorry for the spammage everyone)
Aug 20 14:06:31 <CM> FuzzyCat: I asked around some. Several of my friends use this site: http://www.iis.se/english/index.shtml?lang=en
Aug 20 14:06:51 <xzcvczx> shadoknight: whats your march
Aug 20 14:07:14 <CM> shadoknight: Did you try to freeze the qemu version?
Aug 20 14:07:23 <shadoknight> CFLAGS="-O2 -march=pentium4 -fomit-frame-pointer"
Aug 20 14:07:28 <shadoknight> from /etc/make.conf
Aug 20 14:07:34 <xzcvczx> shadoknight: are you trying to emerge it?
Aug 20 14:07:38 <shadoknight> no
Aug 20 14:07:42 <shadoknight> using MokoMakefile
Aug 20 14:07:50 <CM> xzcvczx: He's x86
Aug 20 14:08:03 <shadoknight> I get an error about 'unable to find a register to spill in class 'GENERAL_REGS'
Aug 20 14:08:27 <shadoknight> in ops_sse.h, in function 'op_psrlq_mmx' to be precise ;-)
Aug 20 14:08:34 <CM> shadoknight: Try a make clobber-qemu and then make again
Aug 20 14:09:07 <shadoknight> cm: did you see that I wiped the entire tree yesterday at about 3:00 and started with only the Makefile all the way up overnight, with the same result?
Aug 20 14:09:16 <shadoknight> (if there's been a change since then, I'll happily start over)
Aug 20 14:09:26 <CM> Hmm.. Not that I know of
Aug 20 14:09:56 <shadoknight> this is perfectly repeatable - it first showed up with the qemu build instructions (from the qemu svn, no MokoMakefile) from the Wiki
Aug 20 14:09:57 <CM> I have PREFERRED_VERSION_qemu-native = "0.9.0+cvs20070701" and SRCDATE_qemu-native = 20070701 in my build/conf/local.conf 
Aug 20 14:10:05 <shadoknight> then I tried with mokoMakefile, etc...
Aug 20 14:10:06 <shadoknight> ooh
Aug 20 14:10:08 <shadoknight> that looks helpful
Aug 20 14:10:08 <shadoknight> :)
Aug 20 14:10:43 * shadoknight has to run to a work meeting
Aug 20 14:10:46 <shadoknight> (stoopid work)
Aug 20 14:10:48 <shadoknight> :p
Aug 20 14:11:17 <xzcvczx> meh well if thats not it it will be his cflags set up for the package
Aug 20 14:11:29 <xzcvczx> soon as i changed it down to 486 from 686 it worked
Aug 20 14:13:31 <rtyler> I distinctly remember running 'make' on the Mokomakefile building my rootfs images and such
Aug 20 14:13:45 <rtyler> doesn't seem to want to do that nowadays, anybody know what changed?
Aug 20 14:14:17 <xzcvczx> rtyler: make all?
Aug 20 14:15:19 <CM> or make openmoko-devel-image
Aug 20 14:15:27 <CM> IT's the same isn't it?
Aug 20 14:16:37 <rtyler> hrm, are the mailing lists down again too?
Aug 20 14:17:08 * CM enjoys the silance
Aug 20 14:17:15 <xzcvczx> make all does build-qemu as well
Aug 20 14:17:16 * rtyler enjoys spellcheck
Aug 20 14:17:18 <CM> Bah, silence
Aug 20 14:17:20 <CM> :-P
Aug 20 14:17:40 * CM blames it on 1s lag
Aug 20 14:17:45 <rtyler> it seems to only be doing qemu builds
Aug 20 14:17:57 <rtyler> ls ls
Aug 20 14:17:59 <rtyler> whoops
Aug 20 14:18:07 <rtyler> this is definitely the wrong terminal >_>
Aug 20 14:18:23 <xzcvczx> lol
Aug 20 14:20:23 <C7_> rtyler: ;)
Aug 20 14:22:31 <FuzzyCat> thanks CM
Aug 20 14:22:51 <CM> FuzzyCat: Why do you want a swedish registrar?
Aug 20 14:23:02 * CM fears a secret invasion
Aug 20 14:23:28 <xzcvczx> you have to wonder why rtyler is doing "ls ls"
Aug 20 14:24:02 <rtyler> I run a fork of rxvt called "rxvt-female"
Aug 20 14:24:05 <zash_se> swedish whatnow?
Aug 20 14:24:06 <rtyler> I have to always tell it twice :P
Aug 20 14:24:10 * rtyler ducks
Aug 20 14:24:39 <mickeyl> hahaha
Aug 20 14:32:12 <CM> rtyler: Hehe.. Joke of the day for sure
Aug 20 14:44:43 <mdt> is there already a way to change cpu frequence on the fly with kernel 2.6.21.6-moko11?
Aug 20 14:54:48 <rtyler> alright
Aug 20 14:55:00 <rtyler> in 2007.2, who the fuck decided on the super loud robot sounds when it boots?
Aug 20 14:55:15 <dotmef> lol
Aug 20 14:55:19 * rtyler looks sheepish in the quiet office >_>
Aug 20 14:55:26 <CM> Hehe
Aug 20 14:55:27 <ozarka> My daughter loves that sound.
Aug 20 14:55:48 <rtyler> my beleagured, 8am monday morning coworkers don't :)]
Aug 20 14:55:52 * zash_se yawns
Aug 20 14:56:03 <rtyler> now they *know* i'm screwing around and not working
Aug 20 14:56:09 <rtyler> thanks OpenMoko -_-
Aug 20 14:56:34 <CM> rtyler: Just say you got an sms on your new phone 
Aug 20 14:57:02 <rtyler> CM: I work in a software company, not a daycare, these people know what I've got :P
Aug 20 14:57:09 <CM> Hehe
Aug 20 14:57:14 <dotmef> that's a big sms
Aug 20 14:57:24 <rtyler> I guess I should be glad the sound works now :P
Aug 20 14:57:32 <rtyler> that's the first thing I've *ever* heard from my Neo
Aug 20 14:57:38 * CM is surrounded mostly by morons
Aug 20 14:57:48 <rtyler> CM: working from home again? :P
Aug 20 14:57:51 * rtyler ducks
Aug 20 14:57:58 <CM> rtyler: :-P
Aug 20 14:58:41 <CM> Consultant, sent out to work for Volvo Cars, who are p0wnd by Ford
Aug 20 14:59:25 * CM has a SOX allergy
Aug 20 14:59:47 <cjb_ie> 20 15:58:45 < Gwilym> BlackBerryCool got a tip that not only was AT&T removing GPS functionality from their version of the BlackBerry 8820, they're doing it so it won't show up the iPhone.
Aug 20 14:59:54 <cjb_ie> interesting how phone markets work
Aug 20 15:00:08 <PBeck> hi
Aug 20 15:00:56 <zash_se> yay, 17:00! end of workday
Aug 20 15:01:47 <_buz> i consider being surrounded mostly by morons to be the natural state
Aug 20 15:01:48 <rtyler> alright, this snapshot is great and all, but how the hell do you turn the sound *off* from the UI O_o
Aug 20 15:03:45 <rtyler> especially since plugging in the headphones doesn't seem to switch off the speaker >_>
Aug 20 15:04:11 <CM> rtyler: Use alsamixer maybe?
Aug 20 15:04:31 <rtyler> CM: does that come with a touchscreen interface? :P
Aug 20 15:04:31 <CM> Not that easy with the ui, but should be doable..
Aug 20 15:04:33 * rtyler ducks
Aug 20 15:05:00 <CM> No, but it works with the onscren keyboard with arrow keys
Aug 20 15:08:09 <dotmef> night all
Aug 20 15:13:40 <nox-Hand> Don't spose anyone has successfully gotten OpenMoko running on an E65 (nokia)
Aug 20 15:15:19 <Stephmw> nox-Hand: ain't gonna happen
Aug 20 15:15:38 <Stephmw> nox-Hand: Nokia hw is way too closed
Aug 20 15:15:53 <Stephmw> nox-Hand: excluding the web tablets... and even they have a few closed bits
Aug 20 15:16:14 <nox-Hand> Haha
Aug 20 15:19:14 <C7_> rtyler: you're playin with the new snaphot image right?
Aug 20 15:19:23 <C7_> is gsm workin for you?
Aug 20 15:21:11 <rtyler> C7_: how would I know?
Aug 20 15:21:31 <shadoknight> oye
Aug 20 15:21:39 <shadoknight> cm: ok, so, that generated a new and different error
Aug 20 15:21:51 <shadoknight> I did the clobber-qemu, then 'make update && make setup && make all'
Aug 20 15:22:00 <shadoknight> and now it dies with something about 'MAP_32BIT' undeclared
Aug 20 15:22:00 <CM> shadoknight: The fun never ends.. ;)
Aug 20 15:22:03 <shadoknight> of course
Aug 20 15:22:24 <CM> shadoknight: I've never heard about that error either..
Aug 20 15:22:24 <shadoknight> so, I'm wondering if the two masks we've got here do more than just affect qemu
Aug 20 15:22:47 <shadoknight> (you know, self-contained build environments are supposed to make this easier...)
Aug 20 15:22:49 <shadoknight> :>
Aug 20 15:23:00 <C7_> rtyler: ?
Aug 20 15:23:17 <CM> I know, but i don't think it's all that self contained yet, unfortunately
Aug 20 15:23:17 <rtyler> C7_: what should I do to check? are you referring to just making a call or something?
Aug 20 15:23:23 <shadoknight> <nod>
Aug 20 15:23:24 <shadoknight> er
Aug 20 15:23:26 * shadoknight nods.
Aug 20 15:23:36 <shadoknight> (old mud habits die hard)
Aug 20 15:24:43 <CM> shadoknight: I know that all too well ;)
Aug 20 15:24:52 <shadoknight> heh
Aug 20 15:25:19 <C7_> rtyler: jep.. or like registering to the network
Aug 20 15:25:43 <C7_> till yesterday it was doing this
Aug 20 15:25:46 <ruoso> hehe
Aug 20 15:25:48 <C7_> evan made phone calls 
Aug 20 15:25:59 <C7_> s/evan/even
Aug 20 15:28:00 <shadoknight> hmm
Aug 20 15:28:14 <shadoknight> the qemu that is built with 'make all' doesn't seem to be the same as the one built with 'make qemu'
Aug 20 15:28:53 <C7_> rtyler: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Gsmd if you want to give it a try
Aug 20 15:29:20 <shadoknight> hmm
Aug 20 15:30:12 <rtyler> damnit, let me throw my SIM card in there to check it out :P
Aug 20 15:30:20 <CM> shadoknight: I think one is native, and the other one is used when building some arm things (I'm wildly guessing and speculating here)
Aug 20 15:33:23 <shadoknight> cm: yeah - according to the qemu wiki page, the neo version (which is 'make qemu' and also what we get without the mask you've got) has patches to support the actual neo hardware.
Aug 20 15:33:30 <shadoknight> ...
Aug 20 15:33:53 <shadoknight> so, is anyone in this group an expert on the qemu stuff, or are folks here mostly just trial-and-error-and-buy-the-device guys?
Aug 20 15:34:01 <CM> My mask is for qemu-native, since that was what I had trouble with
Aug 20 15:34:07 <shadoknight> hm
Aug 20 15:34:13 <rtyler> C7_: *appears* to have powered up, going to try making a call :P
Aug 20 15:34:17 * CM knows nothing at all
Aug 20 15:34:47 <shadoknight> 'make all' must make qemu-native, which must be similar to the neo one in the default, because the neo one gives me exactly the same error as the other qemu-native...
Aug 20 15:35:08 <andylockran> hey guys
Aug 20 15:35:15 <rtyler> ahh, there we go
Aug 20 15:35:27 <rtyler> went to power up GSM antenna, and the toolbar crashed
Aug 20 15:35:41 <mmazur> It's a feature ;)
Aug 20 15:35:53 <andylockran> http://blog.zrmt.com/?p=42 - there's a funny story if anyone's interested in how I got my neo
Aug 20 15:36:08 <andylockran> rtyler: I've had that same feature
Aug 20 15:36:15 <woglinde> hm
Aug 20 15:37:26 <tonyg> hi all - are others having trouble with mokomakefile applying bitbake-1.6.6-om3.patch?
Aug 20 15:37:57 <CM> tonyg: Have you updated to the latest makefile?
Aug 20 15:38:23 <tonyg> yep.
Aug 20 15:38:36 <woglinde> adnylockran lol
Aug 20 15:38:36 <tonyg> make update-makefile; make update
Aug 20 15:38:41 <tonyg> and then it fails...
Aug 20 15:38:51 * tonyg looks for lisppaste
Aug 20 15:39:34 <CM> tonyg: Maybe try make clobber-bitbake ; make update-bitbake
Aug 20 15:40:00 <CM> I'm at bitbake 1.8.9 with the 2007.2 makefile
Aug 20 15:40:18 <tonyg> sorry, forgot to mention I did a make clobber :-/
Aug 20 15:40:23 <tonyg> hm.
Aug 20 15:40:29 <tonyg> maybe I need to manually download the 2007.2 one?
Aug 20 15:40:39 <tonyg> I'll just paste the output
Aug 20 15:41:27 <tonyg> o. maybe clobber doesn't depend on clobber-bitbake :-/
Aug 20 15:42:40 <tonyg> http://paste.lisp.org/display/46455
Aug 20 15:43:57 <CM> tonyg: I just finished a build, I'll try doing the same
Aug 20 15:44:08 <tonyg> thank you.
Aug 20 15:44:37 <andylockran> woglinde: it was a frantic morning
Aug 20 15:47:16 <CM> tonyg: http://rafb.net/p/ltQxX224.html
Aug 20 15:47:20 <CM> No problems..
Aug 20 15:47:51 <tonyg> terrifying.
Aug 20 15:48:10 <tonyg> i shall hunt down and delete the 1.6.6 patch and maybe its parent directories...
Aug 20 15:49:32 <CIA-20> openmoko: 03laforge * r2748 10/trunk/src/target/gsm/ (include/gsmd/usock.h src/util/shell.c): (log message trimmed)
Aug 20 15:49:32 <CIA-20> openmoko: remove 'struct llist_head' from phonebook messages because
Aug 20 15:49:32 <CIA-20> openmoko: * pointer in data structures passed along sockets is a bad idea, if that socket
Aug 20 15:49:32 <CIA-20> openmoko:  is later a network socket and the pointer size of both ends is different
Aug 20 15:49:32 <CIA-20> openmoko: * we cannot include linux_list.h into libgsmd, since libgsmd is LGPL and
Aug 20 15:49:36 <CIA-20> openmoko:  linux_list.h GPL licensed
Aug 20 15:49:38 <CIA-20> openmoko: libgsmd and gsmd are actually not using that list header, only the shell
Aug 20 15:49:52 <tonyg> CM, thanks for your help. blowing away ./patches cleared up the problem.
Aug 20 15:50:03 <CM> tonyg: Ah, nice :)
Aug 20 15:50:23 <tonyg> now I only have several hours of building ahead of me :-)
Aug 20 15:52:14 <rtyler> tonyg: look at it in a positive light, you have several hours to nap, read a book, or iron clothes
Aug 20 15:53:00 <tonyg> *glee*
Aug 20 15:54:19 <mmazur> Count sheep.
Aug 20 15:54:26 <rtyler> baaaaaaah
Aug 20 15:54:58 <mmazur> That's one.
Aug 20 15:57:10 <aloril> (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:Dcorking]] [[GUI_Style_Guidelines]] [[Today/2007.2]] [[Main_Page]] [[Applications]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Contacts/2007.2]] [[Dialer/2007.2]] [[Screen_Shots]] [[Talk:Screen_Grabber]] [[Screen_Grabber]] [[Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973]]
Aug 20 16:04:28 <josch> does anyone know why 2007.2 no longer runs calibration on first startup?
Aug 20 16:20:40 <tonyg> any thoughts on whether a folding bluetooth keyboard might be a useful thing to use with the Neo?
Aug 20 16:20:53 <tonyg> ...and whether it'd be easy to configure...?
Aug 20 16:20:57 <mdt> tonyg, i would like to have one...
Aug 20 16:21:08 * hypa7ia wants a morse code input
Aug 20 16:21:24 <mdt> tonyg, but the nice ones are too expensive i think
Aug 20 16:22:04 <CM> tonyg: I'm sure it's really easy to configure, as long as it's a standard bluetooth hid
Aug 20 16:22:38 <mjr> tonyg, I've a squeeze-on mini keypad; was easy to configure (just start bt, run hidd --connect address)
Aug 20 16:22:40 <tonyg> I haven't experimented with bluetooth on my neo yet. is it more-or-less working, or work-in-progress?
Aug 20 16:22:44 <tonyg> mjr, cool
Aug 20 16:23:01 <mjr> bluetooth is one of the things that work fine
Aug 20 16:23:12 <mjr> (though no wakeup-on-bt, as has been noted)
Aug 20 16:23:24 <CM> mjr: Can the panel bluetooth thing do anything?
Aug 20 16:23:43 <rtyler> CM: it can be clicked and ignore it ^_^
Aug 20 16:23:43 <mjr> CM, haven't noticed :]
Aug 20 16:24:17 <CM> rtyler: That's what I've noticed too. Only the gsm pic has a menu
Aug 20 16:24:27 <CM> Not even the battery icon shows any status
Aug 20 16:24:33 <CM> Yet, I guess.
Aug 20 16:24:56 <rtyler> CM: this is along the lines of what the bluetooth panel app does: http://bash.org/?240849
Aug 20 16:24:56 <mjr> somebody here mentioned having done a bt on/off panel applet, with plans to extend
Aug 20 16:24:59 * rtyler chuckles
Aug 20 16:24:59 <mjr> don't recall any more
Aug 20 16:25:24 <CM> rtyler: Access denied by WebWasher DynaBLocator content category. The requested URL belongs to the following category: Erotic and Sex.
Aug 20 16:25:31 <rtyler> LOL!
Aug 20 16:25:43 * CM tunnels around Fords stupid proxies
Aug 20 16:25:51 <rtyler> CM: repasted
Aug 20 16:25:51 <rtyler> http://pastebin.ca/664515
Aug 20 16:26:33 <CM> rtyler: Hehe
Aug 20 16:26:35 <CM> Thanks
Aug 20 16:27:46 <rtyler> that's what I think of when I think of just about everything in the top panel
Aug 20 16:29:20 <CM> rtyler: Until the panel dies I presume ;)
Aug 20 16:39:45 <tonyg> argh. it's downloading me a copy of linux-2.6.20. And my internets are very slow today. Must be junk in the tubes.
Aug 20 16:41:59 <CM> tonyg: It build with linux-2.6.21.5-r3 for me
Aug 20 16:42:14 * tonyg rolls eyes.
Aug 20 16:42:20 <tonyg> Oh no! Even a make update clearly didn't :-)
Aug 20 16:42:37 <tonyg> ah well. I'm happy with a mostly-working build, since I'm just trying to work on a single app. (squeak smalltalk)
Aug 20 16:43:08 <CM> Are you sure you're building 2007.2 and not .1?
Aug 20 16:43:25 <tonyg> not really. i have probably missed an important instruction somewhere.
Aug 20 16:43:43 <tonyg> how can I check?
Aug 20 16:44:09 <CM> Look in the Makefile
Aug 20 16:44:29 <CM> My first non-comment row says OPENMOKO_GENERATION = 2007.2
Aug 20 16:44:40 * CM is off to help a friend move
Aug 20 16:45:07 <tonyg> me too
Aug 20 16:45:12 <tonyg> um, my first comment row
Aug 20 16:45:19 <tonyg> all my friends are securely settled presently.
Aug 20 16:51:42 <torpor> can someone tell me how i can get a global 'list' of tasks from the Makefile?  so i can tell what comes ahead of me (task 2075 of 3042) .. 
Aug 20 17:00:17 <jipi> hi. can i use sjf2410 to unbrick the neo?
Aug 20 17:04:48 <jipi> how come the sjf2410 tries to open a parallel port device only?
Aug 20 17:06:40 <jipi> gosh.. i just looked at the code of sjf2410. it only interfaces with a parallel port!
Aug 20 17:07:12 <rtyler> jipi: check the wiki for "devirginator"
Aug 20 17:09:50 <CIA-20> openmoko: 03stefan * r2749 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/panel-plugins/openmoko-panel-gsm/ (ChangeLog src/openmoko-panel-gsm.c): 
Aug 20 17:09:50 <CIA-20> openmoko: 2007-08-20 Stefan Schmidt <stefan@openmoko.org>
Aug 20 17:09:50 <CIA-20> openmoko:  * src/openmoko-panel-gsm.c:
Aug 20 17:09:50 <CIA-20> openmoko:  (mb_panel_applet_create):
Aug 20 17:09:50 <CIA-20> openmoko:  Use the right items for the signals.
Aug 20 17:10:13 * tonyg encourages his internet to run faster. Maybe it wants a cookie?
Aug 20 17:11:04 <jipi> rtyler: thanks. its a long one.
Aug 20 17:12:35 <tonyg> I'm curious: I got the plain vanilla neo, sans debug board; if I happened to brick mine, would I be able to go visit someone who had a debug board and devirginate my handset?
Aug 20 17:13:43 <torpor> yup
Aug 20 17:14:58 <tonyg> good to know, thanks :-)
Aug 20 17:15:10 <rtyler> if you have somebody within reach of course ;)
Aug 20 17:15:22 <torpor> is it safe to do update-makefile in te midst of a build?
Aug 20 17:15:40 <torpor> (build was stopped mid- i mean)
Aug 20 17:16:03 <tonyg> indeed. hey, anyone else in London? :-)
Aug 20 17:16:10 <tonyg> (don't worry, I've not bricked it - yet)
Aug 20 17:16:19 <mjr> hmh, when I try to connect to uBoot console, it goes "cu: open (/dev/ttyACM0): Permission denied\ncu: /dev/ttyACM0: Line in use"
Aug 20 17:16:24 <torpor> i'm hoping i'm going to be able to brick mine soon .. 
Aug 20 17:16:50 <jipi> torpor: write some garbage to the u-boot section. u'll brick it.
Aug 20 17:17:12 <torpor> i hope i can write a new image .. ;)
Aug 20 17:17:16 <fgau> mjr: try chgrp root /dev/ttyACM0
Aug 20 17:18:07 <mjr> fgau, weird. That did it.
Aug 20 17:20:31 <mjr> 5 bad blocks in the nand of the phone, 5 bad blocks in the nand, burn one out, mark out of band, 6 bad blocks in the nand of the phone
Aug 20 17:26:04 <rtyler> jipi: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_London
Aug 20 17:26:31 <rtyler> jipi: I'm trying to get people to make tables like ours in SF: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_San_Francisco
Aug 20 17:26:38 <rtyler> icons &stuff :P
Aug 20 17:27:14 <pH5> that reminds me. roh, count me in on thursday.
Aug 20 17:27:36 <pH5> rtyler: you should add an icon for debug boards ;)
Aug 20 17:28:31 <Writchie> pH5: yes
Aug 20 17:29:16 <cw666> rtyler: there are more SF people about than on that list, i know of three personally
Aug 20 17:29:25 <rtyler> cw666: get them on the list
Aug 20 17:29:30 <rtyler> and get them to buy me beerz!
Aug 20 17:29:46 <cw666> rtyler: (1) they might not want to be on the list (2) why would they buy you beer?
Aug 20 17:29:49 <rtyler> pH5: got an idea of a good image for the debug board? besides maybe a black lunchbox?
Aug 20 17:30:02 <rtyler> cw666: because I sez so for both! ;)
Aug 20 17:30:36 <cw666> rtyler: didnt you learn in kindergarten that just because you want something to be true doesn't necessarily mean it is?
Aug 20 17:30:54 <pH5> rtyler: a brick!
Aug 20 17:31:11 <pH5> seriously, no idea :)
Aug 20 17:31:12 <Writchie> with a red not symbol thru it
Aug 20 17:32:03 <Writchie> maybe blood tranfusion
Aug 20 17:36:25 <jipi> rtyler:http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Singapore
Aug 20 17:39:03 <rtyler> jipi: is that you O_o
Aug 20 17:39:43 <jipi> rtyler: yes. that's me.
Aug 20 17:39:59 <rtyler> oh, was getting you mixed with the chap from London :P
Aug 20 17:40:10 <cw666> rtyler: where in SF are you?
Aug 20 17:40:23 <rtyler> cw666: I live and work downtown, 2nd and Howard right now :P
Aug 20 17:41:42 <jipi> rtyler: oops. ok. 
Aug 20 17:42:00 <rtyler> jipi: do you have a debug board?
Aug 20 17:43:11 <rtyler> pH5: I have a good image for the 'Has Debug Board;' column, but nobody to modify :P
Aug 20 17:43:29 <jipi> rtyler: yes, i have. going thru the devirginator instructions now
Aug 20 17:43:39 <mmazur> Just don't be a brute.
Aug 20 17:43:49 <rtyler> woot, mind if I update your listing on the local group jipi?
Aug 20 17:44:02 <jipi> rtyler: of cos not.
Aug 20 17:51:01 <rtyler> jipi: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Singapore can't get more straight-forward than that
Aug 20 17:52:25 <jipi> rtyler: hahahah.. i like the lunch box.
Aug 20 17:58:10 <aloril> (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Singapore]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Berlin]] [[User:Kresp0]] [[Wishlist]] [[WishList]] [[Wishlist:Ignore_Call_Button]] [[MokoMakefile]] [[Contacts/2007]] [[Main_Page/kr]] [[Ts_calibrate]] [[User:Dcorking]] and other changes
Aug 20 18:06:17 <rtyler> FWIW, I added the "wiki codes" to the local groups page
Aug 20 18:09:25 <torpor> NOTE: Update svn://svn.openmoko.org/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/artwork;module=sounds;proto=http
Aug 20 18:09:29 <torpor> svn: Working copy '.' locked
Aug 20 18:10:13 <torpor> to where is openmoko-sound-theme-standard_vn going to be unpacking its work dir?  how can i find out, someone know?
Aug 20 18:17:11 <mickey|groceries> $SOURCE_DIR/svn/<packagename>
Aug 20 18:17:25 <rtyler> hehe, nice nick mickey :P
Aug 20 18:18:40 <mickey|groceries> oops
Aug 20 18:19:14 <mickeyl> to whomever asked... python-evas should now build again in org.oe.dev. still unbreaking python-ecore and -edje thogh
Aug 20 18:19:38 <jeddy3|Zzz> mickeyl, ok, nice
Aug 20 18:19:51 <mjr> hmh, python-subprocess on buildhost depends on nonexistant python-fcntl
Aug 20 18:19:52 <mickeyl> ah right - that was you
Aug 20 18:20:01 <jeddy3> mickeyl, :)
Aug 20 18:20:35 <mickeyl> mjr: oh yes, irritatingly the buildhost builds not all python subpackages. i suspect this is due to x86_64
Aug 20 18:21:07 <mickeyl> i can upload that package for you if you need it
Aug 20 18:21:15 <mickeyl> but i'd rather like to fix the cause
Aug 20 18:21:21 <mickeyl> (which may take longer)
Aug 20 18:21:39 <mjr> no hurry for that
Aug 20 18:21:52 <mjr> I'll just use old-style os.popen
Aug 20 18:21:56 <rtyler> mickeyl: do you know if mailman is broke again?
Aug 20 18:22:30 <mickeyl> rtyler: no idea. it's 02:22 in taipei
Aug 20 18:22:40 <rtyler> is that where mailman lives/
Aug 20 18:22:51 <rtyler> oh it's totally down then :P
Aug 20 18:22:51 <mickeyl> no, but where the interim-admin is atm.
Aug 20 18:23:02 <mickeyl> in few weeks we have a new full-time admin
Aug 20 18:23:42 <mickeyl> i might even have admin rights to the mailserver
Aug 20 18:23:51 <mickeyl> but i have no idea what to do once i log in :D
Aug 20 18:24:56 <mickeyl> hmm, no.
Aug 20 18:24:58 <mickeyl> no rights
Aug 20 18:31:08 <rtyler> mickeyl: it's so obvious: rm -rf /*
Aug 20 19:02:42 <J-23> Good night!
Aug 20 19:15:17 <dcordes> hi
Aug 20 19:15:50 <dcordes> hi
Aug 20 19:16:44 <zash_se> ya'hello
Aug 20 19:17:11 <speerschleuder> hello ph5
Aug 20 19:17:26 <pH5> hi speerschleuder
Aug 20 19:17:50 <speerschleuder> pH5, for this week, until sunday, i'm away on company bussines
Aug 20 19:18:06 <speerschleuder> ph5 so you will be on your one ;o)
Aug 20 19:18:28 <pH5> speerschleuder: hehe, ok :)
Aug 20 19:22:28 <speerschleuder> pH5, the only sunshine is, that i meet a college friend on saturdqy ;-)
Aug 20 19:22:57 <speerschleuder> pH5, could you come to the other #?
Aug 20 19:28:19 <hhf423> amazing, nothing new in the world
Aug 20 19:29:35 <speerschleuder> hhf423, maybe for you
Aug 20 19:29:46 <hhf423> hahaha
Aug 20 19:30:14 <torpor> svn: Directory 'trunk/src/target/OM-2007/.svn' containing working copy admin area is missing
Aug 20 19:30:24 <torpor> ^^ anyway to recreate it locally without having to rebuild?
Aug 20 19:32:38 <speerschleuder> hhf423, when i blink with my eyes i see dozens of interessting things which are worth investigating for
Aug 20 19:33:39 <hhf423> speerschleuder: I need the drugs you have :-)
Aug 20 19:36:45 <speerschleuder> hhf423, the drug is called "engineer" and makes you want to analyse all around you and break it into parts for further studies
Aug 20 19:36:54 <torpor> anyone got sounds_svn.openmoko.org_.trunk.src.target.OM-2007.artwork__20070820.tar.gz
Aug 20 19:37:20 <hhf423> speerschleuder: ah. that one. it wars off, believe me.
Aug 20 19:37:28 <hhf423> knowledge brings fear
Aug 20 19:37:49 <speerschleuder> normaly knowledge brings me into trouble...
Aug 20 19:37:50 <hhf423> wars off/wears off
Aug 20 19:39:13 <hhf423> whoo, laptops are becoming quite cheap now
Aug 20 19:40:01 <CIA-20> openmoko: 03alphaone * r2750 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/libraries/libmokogsmd2/ (ChangeLog libmokogsmd/moko-gsmd-connection.c): 
Aug 20 19:40:01 <CIA-20> openmoko: 2007-08-20 Daniel Willmann <daniel@totalueberwachung.de>
Aug 20 19:40:01 <CIA-20> openmoko:  * libmokogsmd/moko-gsmd-connection.c:
Aug 20 19:40:01 <CIA-20> openmoko:  (moko_gsmd_connection_network_register):
Aug 20 19:40:01 <CIA-20> openmoko:  Change the parameter of lgsm_netreg_register to reflect the changes in
Aug 20 19:40:04 <CIA-20> openmoko:  libgsmd. (fixes a segfault)
Aug 20 19:41:05 <ScaredyCat>  
Aug 20 19:41:15 <mickeyl> jeddy3|Zzz: NOTE: package python-edje-0.1.1+cvs20070819: completed
Aug 20 19:41:32 <mickeyl> NOTE: package python-ecore-0.1.1+cvs20070819: completed
Aug 20 19:42:32 <stefan_schmidt> ~praise alphaone for gsm work
Aug 20 19:42:33 <apt> All hail alphaone for gsm work!
Aug 20 19:42:43 <alphaone> heh
Aug 20 19:42:54 <mickeyl> NOTE: package python-emotion-0.1.1+cvs20070820: completed
Aug 20 19:43:08 <mickeyl> no idea whether all that stuff works, but feel free to experiment now that it's on buildhost.
Aug 20 19:43:17 <BlackBsd> is it possible to use xen opposed to qemu?
Aug 20 19:43:23 <alphaone> And off to fixing the next problem
Aug 20 19:43:46 <mickeyl> alphaone: yay!
Aug 20 19:44:46 * hhf423 also cheers, but has no idea whats going on
Aug 20 19:45:17 <BlackBsd> wow, after some time, i got a gcc3x compiler slotted, and qemu is building correctly..
Aug 20 19:47:04 <bkruse> BlackBsd: building qemu from scratch? :/
Aug 20 19:47:16 <BlackBsd> yep
Aug 20 19:47:24 <BlackBsd> almost done
Aug 20 19:47:43 <BlackBsd> gentoo is great for building from scratch
Aug 20 19:47:58 <BlackBsd> figuring out how to use the program is anothertopic
Aug 20 19:49:44 * hhf423 flashes the nightly build for the fun of it
Aug 20 19:50:26 <frma> Is there a better way to update the openmoko stuff in a build, then manually running mrproper,fetch and rebuild on each openmoko-package ?
Aug 20 19:51:13 <BlackBsd> that mproper stuff is from autotools?
Aug 20 19:51:46 <frma> I still get the smd/usock.h:5:31: error: common/linux_list.h: No such file or directory
Aug 20 19:51:47 <frma>  when building libmokogsmd2, anyone know why ?
Aug 20 19:52:00 <torpor> can someone please look at this:
Aug 20 19:52:01 <torpor> http://rafb.net/p/5cmcjm65.html
Aug 20 19:52:25 <torpor> and tell me what you think i ought to do?  i'm trying to 'svn cleeanup', but i don't know where this lock is located in the openmoko build tree ..
Aug 20 19:53:22 <frma> topor: I'd try bitbake -cmrproper openmoko-sound-theme-standard
Aug 20 19:54:04 <ScaredyCat> it's not you torpor
Aug 20 19:54:46 <mickeyl> didn't i already answer to that?
Aug 20 19:54:46 <ScaredyCat> one of the devs
Aug 20 19:55:03 <ScaredyCat> dunno...
Aug 20 19:55:06 <rtyler> frma: that bit of code was recently cleaned up IIRC
Aug 20 19:55:17 <mickeyl> *shrug*
Aug 20 19:55:23 <rtyler> (cleaned up meaning code removed because of licensing)
Aug 20 19:55:26 <mickeyl> rm -rf $SOURCE_DIR/svn/<package>
Aug 20 19:55:28 <ScaredyCat> I didn;t see it mickeyl ... 
Aug 20 19:55:33 <ScaredyCat> sorry
Aug 20 19:56:09 <mickeyl> bbiab, need a break
Aug 20 19:57:13 <torpor> ok
Aug 20 19:57:14 <torpor> thnks
Aug 20 19:57:27 <torpor> probelm is i removed an .svn dir when i probably shouldn't have .. 
Aug 20 19:57:30 <aloril> (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[SWAG]] [[User:Aztlek]] [[GUI_Style_Guidelines]] [[Flashing_openmoko]] [[MokoMakefile/es]] [[P1_Owners]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Vienna]] [[Neo1973_Hardware]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_San_Francisco]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups]] [[Buying_Interest_List]]
Aug 20 19:58:44 <frma> rtyler: I don't follow linux_list.h is still part of gsmd, but doesn't make it to staging ? 
Aug 20 19:59:33 <speerschleuder> bye
Aug 20 19:59:48 <rtyler> frma: 
Aug 20 19:59:49 <rtyler> 11:49 < CIA-20> openmoko: laforge * r2748 /trunk/src/target/gsm/ (include/gsmd/usock.h src/util/shell.c): (log  message trimmed)
Aug 20 19:59:52 <rtyler> 11:49 < CIA-20> openmoko: remove 'struct llist_head' from phonebook messages because
Aug 20 19:59:55 <rtyler> 11:49 < CIA-20> openmoko: * pointer in data structures passed along sockets is a bad idea, if that socket
Aug 20 19:59:59 <rtyler> 11:49 < CIA-20> openmoko:  is later a network socket and the pointer size of both ends is different
Aug 20 20:00:02 <rtyler> 11:49 < CIA-20> openmoko: * we cannot include linux_list.h into libgsmd, since libgsmd is LGPL and
Aug 20 20:00:05 <rtyler> 11:49 < CIA-20> openmoko:  linux_list.h GPL licensed
Aug 20 20:00:05 <rtyler> let laforge know if you still experience breakage
Aug 20 20:00:07 <rtyler> 11:49 < CIA-20> openmoko: libgsmd and gsmd are actually not using that list header, only the shell
Aug 20 20:00:23 <pH5> yesyesyes
Aug 20 20:00:34 <rtyler> pH5: ?
Aug 20 20:00:49 <stefan_schmidt> pH5: So you can revert the OE nad_aid :)
Aug 20 20:00:52 <stefan_schmidt> ban even
Aug 20 20:01:22 <torpor> what should i do - i've just accidentally deleted the openmoko/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2 and openmoko/trunk/src/target/OM-2007 subdirectories .. how do i re-build these?
Aug 20 20:01:48 <morten_> Sorry to bust in, but i've got a question: I've made a key board app for the Neo, http://finger-keyboard.projects.openmoko.org/ It's written in python and requires pygtk. How do i make this a openMoko compitable app?
Aug 20 20:01:54 <stefan_schmidt> torpor: svn up in target/ again?
Aug 20 20:01:59 <ScaredyCat> go to the top of the openmoko tree and type : svn update
Aug 20 20:02:07 <torpor> ok thanks
Aug 20 20:02:40 <torpor> wasn't sure of that was possible or not .. 
Aug 20 20:02:56 <frma> rtyler: tnx
Aug 20 20:02:59 <stefan_schmidt> morten_: You can use python and pygtk in OpenMoko, as all other languages, too.
Aug 20 20:03:05 <torpor> <-- a bit confused about the openmoko / openembedded dirs and how they get populated ..
Aug 20 20:03:11 <stefan_schmidt> morten_: There are also python bindings for the openmoko libs
Aug 20 20:03:13 <rtyler> MAGIC!
Aug 20 20:03:21 <ScaredyCat> openmoko is just svn
Aug 20 20:03:48 <torpor> but how is it then that openmoko-base-soundsbb got messed up in that dir then?
Aug 20 20:04:20 <ScaredyCat>  if you use the makefile, you'll see it does an svn revert to be sure you are starting from a known position
Aug 20 20:04:42 <torpor> i am using the Makefile .. guess i should've noticed that revert.
Aug 20 20:04:44 <ScaredyCat> the .bb file is int here ?
Aug 20 20:04:48 <morten_> stefan_schmidt, Oh.. seems like what i really need is to get some emulation of the neo up and going. But i've tried the guides around and i can't get it to work. None of the emulation packages will compile to my x86_64 arch :(
Aug 20 20:06:22 <stefan_schmidt> morten_: :(
Aug 20 20:06:39 <stefan_schmidt> morten_: Never tried on my x86_64 system as I have neos around
Aug 20 20:06:53 <morten_> stefan_schmidt, You're a dev?
Aug 20 20:07:15 <ScaredyCat> personally I want to know who ed is and why he wants his dbus on my machine  :P
Aug 20 20:07:28 <stefan_schmidt> morten_: jup
Aug 20 20:07:45 <alphaone> ScaredyCat: lol
Aug 20 20:09:02 <gavin8or> Hey guys funny question, my friend found a SIM card in a phone he pulled out of a fire
Aug 20 20:09:11 <gavin8or> But AT+CNUM=? gives me an error
Aug 20 20:09:19 <gavin8or> Does that mean that the SIM is no longer usable?
Aug 20 20:09:30 <ynezz> it's burned!
Aug 20 20:09:37 <ynezz> !ombug 666
Aug 20 20:09:39 <cdbot2> * * Bug 666, Status: NEW, Created: Unknown
Aug 20 20:09:40 <cdbot2> * * steven.demetrius(AT)fiwwi.com: 3G SIM capability
Aug 20 20:09:41 <cdbot2> * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=666
Aug 20 20:09:43 <morten_> stefan_schmidt, Cool, i'm just a 17 year old studen in Norway, but when i heard of OpenMoko it really kicked me off! I wanted to make something the neo could need so i'm doing the best i can to make a good, fast and finger-less keyboard sulotion.
Aug 20 20:09:45 <BlackBsd> so if i have qemu already on the pc, because my package manager installed it for me, do i still have to make qemu?
Aug 20 20:10:01 <ynezz> gavin8or: read the bugzilla...
Aug 20 20:10:18 <stefan_schmidt> morten_: Great. We like to get people interested to show us what is possible
Aug 20 20:11:45 <gavin8or> Thanks ynezz, cellOne doesn't use G3 does it?
Aug 20 20:11:45 <morten_> stefan_schmidt, But i have to get that emul going to get anywhere now =S Would be so much nicer to use the openeMoko api than gtk
Aug 20 20:12:27 <ScaredyCat> at+cfun=1  gavin8or?
Aug 20 20:12:37 <ScaredyCat> AT+cops?
Aug 20 20:12:45 <morten_> Anyone here know how to emulate the moko. I'm a little green on this =S
Aug 20 20:13:05 <BlackBsd> you have to use qemu
Aug 20 20:13:20 <gavin8or> I get an error when trying to register (COPS)
Aug 20 20:13:29 <stefan_schmidt> morten_: qemu on x86_64
Aug 20 20:14:55 <gavin8or> AT+CIMI
Aug 20 20:14:55 <gavin8or> 262011230058835
Aug 20 20:14:59 <morten_> stefan_schmidt, You've got a howto.. *blush
Aug 20 20:15:11 <gavin8or> So it seems like I can read the SIM
Aug 20 20:15:58 <hhf423> hmm, the latest snapshot seems to be not better that the last one
Aug 20 20:16:53 <BlackBsd> anyone having errors running make setup?
Aug 20 20:17:11 <BlackBsd> applying patch git.py
Aug 20 20:20:32 <Ghiottone> hi all
Aug 20 20:24:12 <Stephmw> evenin'
Aug 20 20:27:46 <Antioh> here is spiking russian. I badly speak on english
Aug 20 20:28:05 <stefan_schmidt> morten_: Sorry, no. Never used the emulator. *caught*
Aug 20 20:28:55 <morten_> Antioh,  As long as we understand, it's good enough
Aug 20 20:29:19 <morten_> stefan_schmidt, It's ok, i think i found somthing in the wiki, building now
Aug 20 20:29:31 <stefan_schmidt> morten_: good
Aug 20 20:30:19 <Antioh> Somebody in a rate. The phase 2 will leave in September or October
Aug 20 20:30:30 <torpor> okay now its libmokogsmd2 thats failing   http://rafb.net/p/JrakAI65.html
Aug 20 20:30:46 <josch_> just wanted to ask: there are some people in this chan I know about - I mean, that I know that they do some important stuff for the openmoko project - la f0rge and mickeyl are very famous but where can I get to know others who do a lot for the project?
Aug 20 20:31:02 <torpor> josch_: lurk in the channel a while.  
Aug 20 20:31:14 <torpor> lots of guys come and go
Aug 20 20:31:42 <Antioh> As at him(it) will be with localization, or itself it is necessary to do(make) (as nokia 770 or motorola a1200)
Aug 20 20:31:45 <pH5> torpor: rebuild libgsmd
Aug 20 20:32:14 <pH5> there is a band-aid for this in OE, but it is already fixed upstream, and should be automatically pulled beginning from tomorrow, 0:00h (UTC)
Aug 20 20:32:49 * stefan_schmidt really looks forward SRCREV
Aug 20 20:32:54 <torpor> pH5: so thats bitbake -crebuild libgsmd right?
Aug 20 20:33:19 <stefan_schmidt> torpor: yes
Aug 20 20:33:40 <torpor> not working .. 
Aug 20 20:33:55 <ScaredyCat> cd build ; . ../setup-env ; bitbake -c rebuild libgsmd
Aug 20 20:34:23 <stefan_schmidt> torpor: You of course updated the OE metadata to get the fix
Aug 20 20:34:41 <morten_> stefan_schmidt, Sorry to bug you, but is there somthing equivalent to the gtk.eventBox in the openmoko API?
Aug 20 20:34:44 <torpor> i don't think i did ..
Aug 20 20:35:04 <stefan_schmidt> torpor: Would be good. :)
Aug 20 20:35:19 <stefan_schmidt> morten_: hmm, don't know offhand
Aug 20 20:35:43 <morten_> stefan_schmidt, Ok, don't bother cheking it up, there probably is
Aug 20 20:37:21 <BlackBsd> anyone getting errors like  Patch patches/bitbake-1.6.6-om3.patch does not apply (enforce with -f)
Aug 20 20:37:39 <BlackBsd> im doing a make setup
Aug 20 20:38:53 <torpor> NOTE: Running task 2258 of 3392 (ID: 1834, /home/j/hak/openmoko/openembedded/packages/pulseaudio/pulseaudio_0.9.6.bb, do_compile)
Aug 20 20:39:04 <torpor> how to get a list of all tasks in total, so i can see whats on the horizon?
Aug 20 20:39:09 <morten_> Bah =/ getting this: "U-boot failed to finish writing in 300 seconds, giving up." when i try to run the flash.sh script. anyone know whats wrong?
Aug 20 20:45:55 <morten_> Getting this error trying to run qemu: http://pastebin.com/d3fe27638
Aug 20 20:46:09 <Aria> Dude! I got my phone while I was on vacation!
Aug 20 20:46:40 <morten_> Lucky =D
Aug 20 20:47:06 <Aria> Effin' sweet stylus, too. Man.
Aug 20 20:47:48 <mmazur> And nothing works! Woman :)
Aug 20 20:48:10 <morten_> Haha XD
Aug 20 20:48:25 * Aria laughs. Indeed.
Aug 20 20:48:34 <Aria> Except the screen. Which is beyond pretty.
Aug 20 20:48:49 <morten_> How big is it?
Aug 20 20:49:05 <morten_> I know 2.8" but how big does it feel?
Aug 20 20:49:15 <mmazur> Erm.
Aug 20 20:49:21 <mmazur> Taken out of context...
Aug 20 20:49:22 <Aria> Thick.
Aug 20 20:49:32 <Aria> But pleasant for my middle-sized hands.
Aug 20 20:49:48 <Writchie> SpeedEvil: BT module appears to consume 30ma from the USB supply. probably 30ma at 4V from the battery or 120mw - ugh
Aug 20 20:49:49 <morten_> Hehe, compared to eg a sony walkman phone
Aug 20 20:49:52 <Aria> And if it ever breaks, it'll be exceedingly pleasant to hurl too.
Aug 20 20:50:07 <Aria> (I'm actually comparing to an iPhone and my Samsung SGH-T509)
Aug 20 20:50:11 <Writchie> SpeedEvil: it appears two linear regulators between the bat and the 1.8V power supply to the BT chip.
Aug 20 20:50:36 <morten_> =) Think you can edit text with a vimlike app?
Aug 20 20:50:58 <morten_> Or surf ordinary webpages?
Aug 20 20:51:01 <Aria> With really good eyes and a liking of hunt-and-peck with a stylus, sure.
Aug 20 20:51:31 <Aria> The screen is certainly adequate for ordinary web pages, if one does it iPhone style and zoom a lot. (shame no multitouch for that, Apple got that one right)
Aug 20 20:51:39 <gavin8or> Ok I can't find anywhere on the internet or the wiki that says what AT+CIMI does
Aug 20 20:51:42 <Aria> But it's no WAP device.
Aug 20 20:51:48 <gavin8or> It that just printing the serial of the SIM?
Aug 20 20:52:18 <morten_> Hehe.. Oh, i'm looking so much forward to I get mine.. It's just that i have to wait for the gta02 as my student pocketbook cant afford two phones
Aug 20 20:52:43 <morten_> Aria, No, i mean wifi and usual computerpages
Aug 20 20:52:45 <Aria> gavin8or: Yeah -- the IMSI
Aug 20 20:53:00 <Writchie> gavin8or: CIMI gives you the IMSI for the phone International Subscriber Identity
Aug 20 20:53:21 <gavin8or> oh ok how can you find out if it is deactivated or not?
Aug 20 20:53:30 <Aria> morten_: Yeah, with wifi, it'd certainly be usable for many many tasks.
Aug 20 20:53:41 <morten_> *drool
Aug 20 20:54:04 <Writchie> what do you mean deactivated
Aug 20 20:54:14 <gavin8or> Can't SIM cards get deactivated or something?
Aug 20 20:54:44 <Writchie> just try to register with the network
Aug 20 20:54:52 <gavin8or> I'm just ready to flush everything down the toilet here (not really) cause the SIM card seems to be fully responsive but I can't register with the network at all
Aug 20 20:55:19 <gavin8or> AT+COPS
Aug 20 20:55:19 <gavin8or> ERROR
Aug 20 20:55:37 <Ghiottone> is somebody getting an error on building perl-native?
Aug 20 20:55:55 <gavin8or> AT+COPS=?
Aug 20 20:55:55 <gavin8or> OK
Aug 20 20:56:07 <gavin8or> Which is just mocking me :)
Aug 20 20:57:26 <Aria> Ghiottone: Yes.
Aug 20 20:57:32 <Aria> Ghiottone: Not sure why yet either
Aug 20 20:58:23 <Ghiottone> does it prints out quilt's usage and stops?
Aug 20 20:58:36 <Aria> Nope. 
Aug 20 20:58:40 <pH5> gavin8or: try AT+COPS=0, the standard says it needs the parameter
Aug 20 20:58:41 <Writchie> gavin8or: means you are not receiving
Aug 20 20:58:49 <Aria> Was gonna try again when I get my vacation finished here.
Aug 20 20:59:11 <Writchie> gavin8or: where are you located
Aug 20 20:59:16 <gavin8or> Writchie, you're saying that I just don't have signal? *blushes* 
Aug 20 20:59:48 <gavin8or> in my cabin, people with CellOne can talk from in here
Aug 20 21:00:02 <Writchie> what country?
Aug 20 21:00:08 <gavin8or> USA
Aug 20 21:03:34 <Writchie> gavin8or: cellular AFAIK is a mixed TDMA and GSM network, probably 850 gsm only where its installed
Aug 20 21:03:59 <Writchie> AFAIK no one has reported a successful connection to GSM850 with the neo
Aug 20 21:04:15 <gavin8or> Yeah I asked my neighbor and he said GSM was great in the area
Aug 20 21:05:14 <Writchie> GSM can be great on 850 and unusable on 1900
Aug 20 21:05:21 <gavin8or> How do I know if the tower is GSM850 or 1900?
Aug 20 21:05:59 <Writchie> its hard to know, depending on how many carriers are on it
Aug 20 21:06:42 <gavin8or> 1 carrier 
Aug 20 21:07:25 <Writchie> are there two rows of antenna.
Aug 20 21:08:38 <Writchie> the antennas are normally in a triangle (looking from the air) in 120 degrees
Aug 20 21:09:34 <Writchie> gavin8or: is this a prepaid SIM by any chance?
Aug 20 21:10:40 <gavin8or> yes it is
Aug 20 21:10:55 <Writchie> have you activated it on any phone
Aug 20 21:11:08 <gavin8or> Yeah on this particular tower I know there is only 1 carrier 
Aug 20 21:11:18 <gavin8or> yeah i have on the free nokia they gave me
Aug 20 21:11:35 <Writchie> it works from your location on the nokia
Aug 20 21:12:37 <Writchie> what model nokia
Aug 20 21:16:58 <gavin8or> nokia 1600
Aug 20 21:17:10 <gavin8or> I just put the SIM card into it and called my landine with it
Aug 20 21:17:26 <gavin8or> but i noticed i had to go upstairs to get a full 2 bars
Aug 20 21:19:05 <Writchie> any dash number on the model like 1600 - 4
Aug 20 21:20:16 <Writchie> since it works, it is most likely an 850/1900 and it may be working only on the 850 at your location.
Aug 20 21:20:34 <gavin8or> yes on the inside of the phone it says 1600 b
Aug 20 21:20:38 <Writchie> like I said before, no-one has yet confirmed that the gta01 actually works on gsm 850
Aug 20 21:21:22 <gavin8or> Yes it's a 1600B and it's a dual mode
Aug 20 21:21:36 <gavin8or> is there anyway i can find out with the nokia what band I'm on?
Aug 20 21:22:28 <Writchie> not afaik
Aug 20 21:25:53 <jgm> I suspect that this is a silly question but is there a library or some other part of openmoko that has a list of countries and their dialing codes?
Aug 20 21:27:39 <Ghiottone> it seems as quilt cannot patch anymore
Aug 20 21:28:54 <jgm> Ghiottone: are you using mokomakefile?
Aug 20 21:33:45 <Ghiottone> yes
Aug 20 21:34:49 <gavin8or> Crap I think Dobson (the guys that provide CellOne coverage here) only does 850 in these here parts
Aug 20 21:35:06 <jgm> It doesn't work with patching at current, I suspect that rwhitby will fix it tomorrow
Aug 20 21:35:07 <gavin8or> Probably because they get better range and propagation out of the lower frequencies? anyways it sucks for me :(
Aug 20 21:35:14 <Ghiottone> now I'm trying with an older version of bitbake, it seems that it has been updated today
Aug 20 21:35:20 <Ghiottone> oh
Aug 20 21:35:31 <Ghiottone> where exactly is the problem?
Aug 20 21:36:05 <jgm> He removed the patching code from mokomakefile because for most users (i.e. those that don't have their own patches) it slowed things down
Aug 20 21:36:20 <jgm> He put in a new system but it doesn't quite work yet
Aug 20 21:36:26 <Ghiottone> I hate to have to wait tomorrow as in office we have a proxy and the makefile doesn't work
Aug 20 21:36:34 <Ghiottone> ah I see.
Aug 20 21:36:38 <gavin8or> from phonesforums.com: "Cellular One (Dobson) is deploying a LOT of 850. In fact, the northern half of Wisconsin and all of Upper Michigan is 850 only"
Aug 20 21:36:55 <jgm> Ghiottone: it shouldn't make any difference to the build, only difference is that it won't add any patches that you have added yourself
Aug 20 21:36:57 <gavin8or> If anyone on here is trying to make 850 work, please email me!
Aug 20 21:37:04 <Ghiottone> so a temporary solution might be to revert to a bit older version of mokomakefile
Aug 20 21:37:08 <gavin8or> It would be good to make it work
Aug 20 21:37:16 <Ghiottone> I have no added patch, but perl does not build
Aug 20 21:37:54 <jgm> That's not a makefile issue, I think that there was something on the wiki about perl failing to build
Aug 20 21:38:50 <Ghiottone> mmmm
Aug 20 21:39:13 <jgm> Check out the discussion page on MokoMakefile, ther eis something in there about Perl not building
Aug 20 21:40:44 <Ghiottone> found it. but the error is not the same
Aug 20 21:41:15 <rwhitby> jgm: do you have a pastebin of the local patching not working?
Aug 20 21:41:41 <stefan_schmidt> pH5: btw, my gf should have send the htc phone out today. I send you the tracking number once I'm home again
Aug 20 21:41:48 <jgm> rwhitby: not any more, my patch was wiped :(
Aug 20 21:41:53 <jgm> The patch was in openembedded
Aug 20 21:42:33 <jgm> I'm not on my moko build box at the moment so can't build a new patch and try it again
Aug 20 21:43:55 <Writchie> gavin8or: the gta01 is supposed to be quad band, gsm 850 900 1800 1900
Aug 20 21:44:07 <rwhitby> jgm: the openembedded/patches dirs should have been a symlink back to patches/openmoko-HEAD, and the symlink comes and goes. How did your patch get wiped?
Aug 20 21:44:12 <Writchie> however, no one yet has reported it actually working on gsm 850
Aug 20 21:44:31 <Writchie> a number of people have had problems that suggest that it might not be working
Aug 20 21:44:32 <gavin8or> ahh
Aug 20 21:44:58 <gavin8or> Let me try one more time, I'll try to get a 5-bar signal 
Aug 20 21:45:05 <Writchie> this added to the FCC test report which only shows testing for 1900 and 2400 raises some questions
Aug 20 21:45:08 <gavin8or> I could drive right over to the tower 
Aug 20 21:45:29 <jgm> rwhitby: can't remember, it was definitely a symlink but not sure where it went to.  I'll try recreating the situation again when I'm back in front of my moko box (about another 8 hours or so) and will see if I can pin down the behaviour
Aug 20 21:45:47 <Writchie> if gsm850 has been disabled internally, for whatever reason, it will not work. 
Aug 20 21:46:04 <Writchie> But it would be good to have a report of what you get very close to a tower
Aug 20 21:46:10 <rwhitby> jgm: the lines that remove the symlink are rm -f (no -r), so they should not traverse a symlink
Aug 20 21:46:33 <gavin8or> yeah well a phone that doesn't support CMDA or GSM850 is completely useless as a phone in most of North America 
Aug 20 21:46:44 <jgm> Odd, I'm pretty sure that the patch vanished but I'll check it out and get back to you
Aug 20 21:46:48 <gavin8or> Yeah I can get to within 10 feet of a tower 
Aug 20 21:47:05 <gavin8or> What should I try when I get there though? I'm not going to have internet access
Aug 20 21:47:13 <rwhitby> it checks for the existence of a series file in the patches/openembedded-HEAD dir, and it one exists then it symlinks that dir to openembedded/patches.  If the series file does not exist then it removes the symlink.  only if the symlink is there does it do a revert.
Aug 20 21:47:36 <Writchie> AT+COPS=? should show you what's there
Aug 20 21:48:28 <Ghiottone> this is a pastebin of my perl compilation issue: http://pastebin.com/m5006bffd
Aug 20 21:48:30 <jgm> Yeah that sounds okay, so not usre what happened.
Aug 20 21:49:32 <gavin8or> ok thanks Writchie 
Aug 20 21:50:08 <rwhitby> Ghiottone: something wrong with how quilt is being called on your system, or quilt itself is broken or the wrong version or something.
Aug 20 21:51:07 <Writchie> gavin8or: you don't need to get all that close, 100 yard/meters is fine
Aug 20 21:51:26 <Ghiottone> rwhitby, that was my first guess. however, version is 0.46-4 and it has not been upgraded since several days and yesterday it was working
Aug 20 21:52:31 <rwhitby> Ghiottone: the only other thing I can suggest is removing the openembedded directory and checking it out from monotone again, in case there is something corrupted in your OE metadata
Aug 20 21:53:27 <Ghiottone> rwhitby, a make update-openembedded suited for that operation after removal?
Aug 20 21:53:35 <juri_> anyone here have a windows xp pro box, a linux box, and mind doing me a big favour? ;)
Aug 20 21:53:55 <Writchie> juri_: what?
Aug 20 21:54:05 <juri_> i need a tcpdump of an rdesktop client connecting to a windows XP PRO remote desktop server. just a connect, and disconnect.
Aug 20 21:54:13 <gavin8or> juri_, *raises hand
Aug 20 21:54:36 <rwhitby> Ghiottone: remove the openembedded dir and stamps/openembedded, then run make setup-openembedded
Aug 20 21:54:44 <juri_> i'm working on reverse engineering part of the protocol, and i've run into a block.
Aug 20 21:54:45 <gavin8or> Oh I wonder if I have it emulated (the Windows XP) would that be a problem?
Aug 20 21:55:00 <juri_> gavin: nope. as long as its xp pro, not home.
Aug 20 21:55:13 <gavin8or> Yeah it's pro
Aug 20 21:55:25 <gavin8or> I think I have to setup bridged networking first
Aug 20 21:55:30 <juri_> i'd really appreciate it. ;)
Aug 20 21:55:35 <gavin8or> I know I have it compiled in... hang on
Aug 20 21:55:49 <Ghiottone> rwhitby, I'm doing it thanks. and thanks jgm too
Aug 20 21:56:35 <gavin8or> Would juri_ would bridged networking do it for you?
Aug 20 21:56:49 <juri_> yepyep. as long as the packet can be captured. :)
Aug 20 21:56:51 <gavin8or> I'm trying to think.... no it wouldn't 
Aug 20 21:57:03 <gavin8or> Yeah but NAT doesn't give you a unique IP address 
Aug 20 21:57:05 <gavin8or> Does it?
Aug 20 21:57:21 <juri_> i don't need a unique ip address. its not ip related issues i'm fighting.
Aug 20 21:57:29 <juri_> (at the moment)
Aug 20 21:58:10 <aloril> (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Building_a_hello_world_application]] [[GUI_Style_Guidelines/es]] [[Ts_calibrate]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[Main_Page/sk]]
Aug 20 21:58:15 <jseghers> How ready for use is 2007.2?  
Aug 20 21:58:32 <hads> Use as in developing?
Aug 20 21:58:40 <gavin8or> yeah but rdesktop needs an IP address :)
Aug 20 21:58:46 <jseghers> hads: yes... as opposed to 2007.1
Aug 20 21:59:23 <hads> jseghers: I don't know much as I'm waiting for an announcement but it appears to be going well.
Aug 20 21:59:25 <jseghers> I'm experiencing a lot of churn over on the 2007.1 side--broken builds and such
Aug 20 21:59:25 <juri_> gavin: true that. :)
Aug 20 22:00:03 <Elrond> Evening people.
Aug 20 22:00:19 <Elrond> So what's new?
Aug 20 22:00:50 <torpor> portmap fails.
Aug 20 22:01:32 * juri_ toddles off to work.
Aug 20 22:01:40 <juri_> be back in about an hour.
Aug 20 22:02:04 <torpor> √
Aug 20 22:02:06 <torpor> √
Aug 20 22:02:26 <torpor> NOTE: Task failed: Error: /home/j/hak/openmoko/sources/portmap_5-26.diff.gz not found.
Aug 20 22:02:33 <faern> hi everyone! I am new here. I heard about the neo phone today..
Aug 20 22:02:51 <torpor> howdy faern 
Aug 20 22:02:59 <faern> I want to know. will the hardware be improved until user release?
Aug 20 22:03:00 <aloril> faern: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.)
Aug 20 22:03:27 <torpor> faern: yes .. the first release is gta01, this is only for developers to get the hardware working.
Aug 20 22:03:41 <torpor> then the real consume release in october will be the gta02, and will have more features.
Aug 20 22:04:11 <mickeyl> torpor: odd
Aug 20 22:04:17 <mickeyl> are you building another distro?
Aug 20 22:04:22 <mickeyl> openmoko.conf has a PREMIRROR
Aug 20 22:04:32 <mickeyl> which points to buildhost.openmoko.org/sources/
Aug 20 22:04:42 <mickeyl> which (among others) contains the file you are looking for
Aug 20 22:04:53 <faern> ok. I am very interested in the phone. an Yes I am a developer, I am interested in making third party software.. should I wait for the consumer version?
Aug 20 22:04:54 <torpor> nope, not building another distro.
Aug 20 22:05:02 <torpor> faern: no, get one!  ;)
Aug 20 22:05:41 <torpor> faern: see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Hardware
Aug 20 22:05:55 <Ghiottone> rwhitby, same error as before. I'm off to bed and I'll try again tomorrow
Aug 20 22:06:02 <torpor> mickeyl: can't work it out. ;(
Aug 20 22:06:04 <faern> torpor, I want to, software can easily be replaced, but if you upgrade the hardware it's kind of tempting to wait :P
Aug 20 22:06:13 <torpor> then wait!
Aug 20 22:06:22 <mickeyl> torpor: if all fails, manually download and put it into your SOURCE_DIR
Aug 20 22:06:30 <mickeyl> then touch <file>.md5
Aug 20 22:06:32 <mickeyl> and rebuild
Aug 20 22:06:32 <daltona> Hi all
Aug 20 22:06:46 <torpor> i'm gonna mrproper portmap first.
Aug 20 22:06:58 <torpor> maybe it just didnt' download because i had a net connection failure .. 
Aug 20 22:07:11 <daltona> is there any plan for a bluetooth control panel or menu on the panel in order to activate / deactivate it ?
Aug 20 22:07:16 <Writchie> rwhitby: is MokoMakefile supposed to work now for 2007.2 - i keep failing on compile of uicmoc4-native_4.3.0-r2  
Aug 20 22:07:57 <mickeyl> uicmoc is a bit bitchy, how does it bail out?
Aug 20 22:08:00 <mickeyl> (pastebin)
Aug 20 22:08:50 <Aria> daltona: There's a symbol in the panel in .2 that's a stub for that
Aug 20 22:09:11 <daltona> I actually started a quick hack by creating a menu that runs some scripts, but Iw onder if 
Aug 20 22:09:21 <daltona> there are specs for that
Aug 20 22:09:47 <Ghiottone> nite everyone
Aug 20 22:09:52 <torpor> mickeyl: NOTE: Task failed: Error: /home/j/hak/openmoko/sources/portmap_5-26.diff.gz not found.
Aug 20 22:09:52 <daltona> aria: I saw it, I was wondering of what will it be when not stubbed
Aug 20 22:10:00 <rwhitby> Writchie: I believe MokoMakefile is calling bitbake correctly for 2007.2 - as to whether OE .dev head builds from one minute to the next I have little control over :-)
Aug 20 22:10:02 <torpor> no sources dir, wtf!?!
Aug 20 22:10:38 <Writchie> rwhitby: mickeyl: tx - i'll see what i can find in the logs
Aug 20 22:11:06 <rwhitby> torpor: I thought bitbake created the sources dir if it didn't exist
Aug 20 22:11:09 <mickeyl> rwhitby: mokomakefile should honor PREMIRRORS and CVS_TARBALL_STASH, right?
Aug 20 22:11:14 <rwhitby> yep
Aug 20 22:11:39 <rwhitby> NOTE: fetch http://downloads.openmoko.org/sources/matchbox-panel-2_svn.o-hand.com_.repos.matchbox\
Aug 20 22:11:40 <rwhitby> .trunk__20070820.tar.gz
Aug 20 22:12:53 <daltona> ok I see specs on the wiki (http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Bluetooth_Connection_Status), is there someone working on that, or can I start some development ?
Aug 20 22:13:34 <mickeyl> hmm
Aug 20 22:13:39 <mickeyl> it should read buildhost.openmoko.org
Aug 20 22:13:45 <mickeyl> downlodas.openmoko.org/sources has less files
Aug 20 22:14:02 <mickeyl> (for some admin reasons i don't understand)
Aug 20 22:14:03 <torpor> okay, something is wrong.  portmap_5-26.diff.gz is nowhere on the server
Aug 20 22:14:31 <mickeyl> http://buildhost.openmoko.org/sources/portmap_5-9.diff.gz
Aug 20 22:14:41 <mickeyl> oh
Aug 20 22:14:43 <torpor> yeah thats not 5-26 tho 
Aug 20 22:14:44 <mickeyl> that's not 5-26
Aug 20 22:14:46 <mickeyl> right
Aug 20 22:14:46 <torpor> right
Aug 20 22:14:48 <mickeyl> let me check
Aug 20 22:14:56 <faern> are there any videos/prictures of a neo/openmoko in use?
Aug 20 22:15:07 <torpor> faern: yes, on youtube and google video
Aug 20 22:15:12 <torpor> just search for neo1973
Aug 20 22:15:16 <torpor> tons of stuff
Aug 20 22:15:19 <faern> nice
Aug 20 22:16:35 <josch_> for media check out people.openmoko.org
Aug 20 22:17:53 <rwhitby> mickeyl: can you remove ${OMDIR}/oe/packages/*/*.bb from openmoko/trunk/oe/conf/site.conf ?
Aug 20 22:17:58 <faern> thanks
Aug 20 22:18:01 <Elrond> *arg* So the new 2007.2 is EABI? How does one run gllin on it?
Aug 20 22:18:10 <rwhitby> you can't
Aug 20 22:18:11 <don-o> faern: http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=mokoNinja
Aug 20 22:18:16 <mickeyl> rwhitby: why?
Aug 20 22:18:33 <mickeyl> rwhitby: you still want to use the site file for OM2007.2?
Aug 20 22:18:36 <rtyler> mickeyl: is it "out" yet? :P
Aug 20 22:18:39 <Elrond> Okay, so no 2007.2 for me.
Aug 20 22:18:44 <don-o> omg how old is harold
Aug 20 22:18:49 <rwhitby> mickeyl: where should I be using the site file from?
Aug 20 22:19:02 <rwhitby> (I'm assuming we don't want everyone to create their own site file)
Aug 20 22:19:27 <mickeyl> rwhitby: well, do we need one? couldn't we just use the defaults?
Aug 20 22:19:56 <rwhitby> mickeyl: openmoko.conf in OE points premirrors points to downloads
Aug 20 22:20:11 <rwhitby> mickeyl: BBFILES needs to be set I believe.
Aug 20 22:20:38 <rwhitby> and DL_DIR.  I guess I can do those in the makefile to create a site.conf for people.
Aug 20 22:20:51 <torpor> anyone got any clues on my portmap prolem?
Aug 20 22:21:39 <mickeyl> rwhitby: it doesn't here: PREMIRRORS = "(ftp|http)://.*/.*/ http://buildhost.openmoko.org/sources/"
Aug 20 22:21:50 <aloril> (script) openmoko-community: Sean Moss-Pultz <sean at openmoko.com> Re: OpenMoko future.
Aug 20 22:21:59 <rwhitby> I just wondered whether you wanted to retain control of the site.conf that everyone uses, in case you wanted to put stuff in there in the future and have everyone pick it up automatically
Aug 20 22:22:37 <mickeyl> rwhitby: ya, that sounds not bad
Aug 20 22:22:38 <daltona> how can we know the parts that are actively under development and where help is needed ?
Aug 20 22:22:47 <mickeyl> rwhitby: can we still assume OMDIR being set?
Aug 20 22:22:54 <rwhitby> mickeyl: yes
Aug 20 22:23:04 <mickeyl> ok, then let me create a new site file 
Aug 20 22:23:41 <torpor> mickeyl: where do you think 5-26 is coming from?
Aug 20 22:24:29 <rwhitby> mickeyl: I have openembedded/conf/distro/openmoko.conf rev 5ad6f42b55c9b2e3db7384a70948aee3be638cd6
Aug 20 22:24:44 <rwhitby> and it says downloads for PREMIRRORS
Aug 20 22:25:26 <torpor> never mind .. i bitbake -cmrproper portmap, then make all, and it gets through .. 
Aug 20 22:27:01 <frma> Anyone heard when the gps-software will be available ?
Aug 20 22:27:07 <CIA-20> openmoko: 03mickey * r2751 10/trunk/src/host/openembedded/ (. site.conf): openembedded: add site file for MokoMakefile
Aug 20 22:29:49 <rwhitby> mickeyl: so the makefile will symlink that into build/conf/site.conf
Aug 20 22:29:58 <daltona> mickeyl: Do you know what are the component actively developed in OM and where help is needed ? 
Aug 20 22:32:20 <mickeyl> well
Aug 20 22:32:22 <mickeyl> http://buildhost.openmoko.org/sources/portmap_5-26.diff.gz
Aug 20 22:32:26 <mickeyl> it's actually there
Aug 20 22:32:28 <mickeyl> however apache can't cope with too many files in a directory
Aug 20 22:32:30 <mickeyl> so the directory listing doesn't show it
Aug 20 22:32:32 <mickeyl> heh
Aug 20 22:32:34 <torpor> ah
Aug 20 22:32:46 <mickeyl> rwhitby: http://svnweb.openmoko.org/trunk/src/host/openembedded/site.conf?rev=2751&view=log
Aug 20 22:32:47 <torpor> well so what i did was mrproper portmap and it seems to have smoothed out .. 
Aug 20 22:33:27 <mickeyl> daltona: major help atm. would be needed in porting application manager to OM-2007.2, fixing gsmd, adding better power management, etc. apart from that, cool applications :)
Aug 20 22:34:14 <rwhitby> mickeyl: http://pastebin.ca/664898 is how I will use it
Aug 20 22:34:24 <torpor> daltona: don't worry about the cool apps, i'm doing that .. ;)
Aug 20 22:34:43 <mickeyl> rwhitby: ok, cool
Aug 20 22:37:06 <faern> Will it be possible to buy the advanced neo kit of the consumer version?
Aug 20 22:37:33 <daltona> mickeyl: thanks, I'll see what I can do. that means that currently, no bluetooth devel is planned.
Aug 20 22:37:53 <daltona> torpor: what sort of cool apps do you develop ?
Aug 20 22:37:58 <mickeyl> daltona: nothing in particular. we're waiting a bit for bluez 4
Aug 20 22:38:06 <torpor> daltona: music apps and games
Aug 20 22:38:46 <torpor> but for the last 5 days i've been trying to finish a build of mokomakefile .. 
Aug 20 22:39:17 <torpor> looks like matchbox is borked.
Aug 20 22:40:27 <Elrond> mickeyl - Do the kernels on buildhost support eabi AND oabi?
Aug 20 22:40:44 <torpor> matchbox: http://rafb.net/p/DnYf0u94.html
Aug 20 22:40:50 <mickeyl> Elrond: a good question
Aug 20 22:40:56 <mickeyl> Elrond: i have no idea, actually
Aug 20 22:41:00 <mickeyl> let me check
Aug 20 22:41:30 <Writchie> mickeyl: my uicmoc was choking on not finding Xext
Aug 20 22:41:35 <r3pek> faern: yes
Aug 20 22:41:54 <mickeyl> Writchie: oh nasty. i'm afraid you need to have libxext-devel on your build machine
Aug 20 22:42:10 <Writchie> ok np thanks
Aug 20 22:42:20 <Writchie> wasn't the case of 2007.1
Aug 20 22:42:29 <faern> r3pek, ok nice. but now when I look at it it doesent seem to contain anything more than the phone in parts :/
Aug 20 22:42:43 <torpor> okay any clues on matchbox .. wasn't someone else having this problem just a bit earlier too?
Aug 20 22:42:45 <pH5> from do_configure() in linux-gta01.inc it looks, like CONFIG_OABI_COMPAT=y is set
Aug 20 22:42:51 <mickeyl> ah, right.
Aug 20 22:42:55 <mickeyl> pH5 was faster. thanks
Aug 20 22:43:04 <r3pek> faern: unless you want to debug hardware, i don't think it's for you
Aug 20 22:43:46 <mickeyl> hmm
Aug 20 22:43:56 <mickeyl> did alphaone forgot to check that file in?
Aug 20 22:44:12 <alphaone> what file?
Aug 20 22:44:18 <torpor> for matchbox?
Aug 20 22:44:23 <mickeyl> no, it's there
Aug 20 22:44:29 <mickeyl> torpor: is your repository up to date?
Aug 20 22:44:33 <mickeyl> mtn pull && mtn update
Aug 20 22:44:36 <mickeyl> don't forget to update
Aug 20 22:44:37 <Elrond> pH5, mickeyl - Okay... When I have time, I'll create a gllin-chroot.
Aug 20 22:44:40 <mickeyl> pull doesn't update your workarea
Aug 20 22:44:44 <mickeyl> Elrond: cool!
Aug 20 22:45:08 <torpor> you mean 'make update' doesn't get the repo upto date?
Aug 20 22:45:48 <Elrond> pH5, mickeyl - But don't hold your breath. I'll stay with an oabi rootfs for a while.
Aug 20 22:45:53 <torpor> make mtn-update
Aug 20 22:46:20 <stefan_schmidt> Elrond: OABI is so 1900
Aug 20 22:46:25 <stefan_schmidt> ;)
Aug 20 22:46:26 <mickeyl> hear haer
Aug 20 22:46:34 <alphaone> torpor: I think I know what your problem is
Aug 20 22:46:41 <torpor> great!
Aug 20 22:46:59 <Elrond> stefan_schmidt - *duck* Why did openmoko start with oabi in the first place? ;o)
Aug 20 22:47:16 <stefan_schmidt> Elrond: Because we suck? ;)
Aug 20 22:47:29 <torpor> becaue compilers suck?
Aug 20 22:47:37 <Elrond> stefan_schmidt - ;o)
Aug 20 22:47:47 <stefan_schmidt> Elrond: heh, of course oabi has still the right to exists.
Aug 20 22:48:07 <stefan_schmidt> Elrond: It's just that EABI is in pretty good shape in oe
Aug 20 22:48:11 <drath> stefan_schmidt: that's what we have museums for
Aug 20 22:48:14 <torpor> alphaone: got any clues for me?
Aug 20 22:48:15 <alphaone> torpor: can you look if you have tmp/work/arm*/matchbox-keyboard-inputmethod-0.0+svn20070821-r1 and tmp/work/arm*/matchbox-keyboard-inputmethod-0.0+svn20070820-r1 (note the date)
Aug 20 22:48:36 <stefan_schmidt> drath: :)
Aug 20 22:49:01 <alphaone> torpor: What happens to me is that do_fetch gets done before midnight and do_patch starts after midnight...
Aug 20 22:49:18 <Elrond> drath, stefan_schmidt The last 7 days I lived in something like a museum. ;o)  It was very nice. :-)
Aug 20 22:49:32 <torpor> alphaone: http://rafb.net/p/gpfscu83.html
Aug 20 22:49:49 <alphaone> And then do_fetch tries to operate on an empty directory
Aug 20 22:49:56 <torpor> ok
Aug 20 22:50:08 <torpor> so i should just mrproper all matchbox-* and do it again?
Aug 20 22:50:11 <mickeyl> ah, yes, the infamous date change problem
Aug 20 22:50:16 <mickeyl> a bitbake -c rebuild cures it
Aug 20 22:50:25 <torpor> sorry, i'm kind of futzing through this .. trying to get a build finished so i can focus on developj
Aug 20 22:50:28 <torpor> ment soon
Aug 20 22:50:32 <stefan_schmidt> Elrond: Where?
Aug 20 22:50:44 <mickeyl> sorry for getting all you through these troubles. we will have a toolchain ready soon
Aug 20 22:51:04 <alphaone> ~curse SRCDATE
Aug 20 22:51:04 <apt> May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, SRCDATE !
Aug 20 22:51:11 <Elrond> stefan_schmidt - In a "gate guard"-house. :-)
Aug 20 22:51:16 <torpor> how do i use bitbake rebuild then?
Aug 20 22:51:27 <mickeyl> bitbake -c rebuild <provider>
Aug 20 22:51:31 <torpor> oh
Aug 20 22:51:34 <torpor> of course.
Aug 20 22:51:35 <torpor> ;)
Aug 20 22:51:40 <rwhitby> or make rebuild-package-foo
Aug 20 22:51:45 <mickeyl> :)
Aug 20 22:51:48 <mickeyl> right
Aug 20 22:53:01 * rwhitby goes to work
Aug 20 22:55:52 <Elrond> Oh, power management: My Bv03 did not see any usb cable (not to mention external power) the last seven days... it booted fine 3 days ago, and now it still boots fine and has the battery at about 80% (guessing from looking at the icon)
Aug 20 22:58:58 <stefan_schmidt> night all
Aug 20 22:59:08 <Elrond> Night stefan_schmidt 
Aug 20 23:00:09 <pH5> g'night
Aug 20 23:00:43 <mickeyl> n8 stefan_schmidt 
Aug 20 23:01:02 <mickeyl> Elrond: wow, not bad
Aug 20 23:02:45 <Elrond> mickeyl - Note, that the Bv03 is assumed to have q1001, so something like that should in theory not be possible at all. I have no clue, why it's possible.
Aug 20 23:04:30 <Elrond> Anyway. Good night people.
Aug 20 23:07:10 * linux_galore waves
Aug 20 23:11:01 <mickeyl> n8 Elrond 
Aug 20 23:13:04 <torpor> http://rafb.net/p/99MWpR63.html
Aug 20 23:14:46 <andylockran>  http://www.vivekkhurana.com/pymoko site is down in case anyone in here knows who runs it :)
Aug 20 23:18:37 <mickeyl> torpor: bitbake intltool-native
Aug 20 23:18:43 <mickeyl> today2 should have a dependency on that
Aug 20 23:19:26 <mickeyl> indirectly, at least
Aug 20 23:19:32 <mickeyl> g'night
Aug 20 23:19:47 <torpor> g'night!
Aug 20 23:19:49 <Writchie> ng
Aug 20 23:19:51 <Writchie> gn
Aug 20 23:30:06 <zecke> bye
Aug 20 23:32:18 <Jason1> Has anyone been successful in building 2007.2 with MokoMakeFile?  I am getting an error...
Aug 20 23:37:15 <rtyler> Jason1: I have an image running from being built this morning
Aug 20 23:38:03 <Jason1> yeah?  I am getting an error on "Applying patch bitbake-1.6.6-om3.patch"
Aug 20 23:38:18 <Jason1> rtyler: Must be something with my environment
Aug 20 23:38:26 <Jason1> It was compiling 2007.1 just fine...
Aug 20 23:40:08 <r3pek> guys, just confirm me something. Neo1973 will no be 3g right?
Aug 20 23:40:15 <r3pek> s/no/not
Aug 20 23:40:21 <Writchie> no 3g no EDGE
Aug 20 23:40:29 <r3pek> :(
Aug 20 23:40:49 <Writchie> probably EDGE will come first - then 3G
Aug 20 23:40:59 <r3pek> what's EDGE?
Aug 20 23:41:01 <Jason1> rtyler: Did you have to do anything special to get it to work?
Aug 20 23:41:14 <rtyler> wish upon a star when I entered 'make'
Aug 20 23:41:36 <anrp> i'm telling you, phase of the moon
Aug 20 23:41:41 <Aria> EDGE is fast GPRS. Another set of data rates.
Aug 20 23:43:43 <linux_galore> GTA02 will have WiFi though
Aug 20 23:44:40 <linux_galore> if you live in a city I usually find there is no shortage of open wifi points
Aug 20 23:49:10 <Aztlek> r3pek: EDGE is "Enhanced Data Rates for GSM Evolution". See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_Data_Rates_for_GSM_Evolution
Aug 20 23:49:37 <r3pek> yeah... was reading it :) thx
Aug 20 23:53:30 <rwhitby> Jason1: did you type "make setup" after changing from om2007.1 to 2007.2 ?
Aug 20 23:54:16 <CIA-20> openmoko: 03rwhitby * r143 10mokomakefile/trunk/Makefile: Use the new om2007.2 site.conf
Aug 20 23:54:38 <juri_> "make fucking work you goddamn piece of shit"
Aug 20 23:54:56 * juri_ whistles innocently.
Aug 20 23:55:47 <Jason1> yeah, I did a "make update-makefile && make setup update openmoko-devel-image"
Aug 20 23:57:14 <rwhitby> Jason1: ah, I think I know the problem now.
Aug 20 23:57:32 <rwhitby> make clobber-patches first
Aug 20 23:57:38 <rwhitby> I'll work out how to do that automatically
Aug 20 23:57:45 <Jason1> standby
Aug 20 23:58:48 <Jason1> rwhitby: No rule to make target...  "make clobber-patches"???
Aug 20 23:58:50 <aloril> (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Neo1973_Debug_Board_v2]] [[Wishlist:Bible_Reader]] [[Talk:Menubar]] [[Talk:GUI_Style_Guidelines]] [[Talk:OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] [[Screen_Shots]]
Aug 20 23:59:00 <rwhitby> ok, rm -rf patches stamps/patches
Aug 20 23:59:59 <CIA-20> openmoko: 03rwhitby * r144 10mokomakefile/trunk/Makefile: Add clobber-patches target. Ensure that the old patches checkout is removed when switching from om2007.1 to om2007.2
Aug 21 00:00:30 <rwhitby> that should fix it for people switching from now on.
Aug 21 00:01:27 <rwhitby> if anyone sees anyone else with bitbake patching problem - just tell them to make clobber-patches first - it should happen automatically now, but if someone has already switched they will need to clobber-patches manually.
Aug 21 00:01:36 <Jason1> rwhitby: Looks like that did it.  You da man!
Aug 21 00:02:21 <rwhitby> Sorry about that - I was using a test to determine whether the patches were out of date or not, but then I swapped the branch and the trunk and that test no longer worked.
Aug 21 00:02:52 <Jason1> rwhitby: just dont let it happen again ;)
Aug 21 00:02:58 <rwhitby> heh
Aug 21 00:05:49 <jseghers> rwhitby: I'm setting up a parallel installation of 2007.2 (keeping my 2007.1 available in a separate tree).  I'm hoping that it will end up being a bit less problematic (fewer broken builds?) since it's where the dev focus is at this time.  Is that a hopelessly optimistic viewpoint ? :)
Aug 21 00:06:57 <rwhitby> jseghers: 2007.1 was old and broken and fixes didn't come quickly cause only the OM devs could fix the overlay.
Aug 21 00:07:30 <rwhitby> 2007.2 is new and breaks come more often cause there are more developers working on OE head, but hopefully fixes come quicker too.
Aug 21 00:09:34 <jseghers> rwhitby: that makes sense.  Is there someone working on a way to allow one to keep working with the local copy rather than always getting the latest?  
Aug 21 00:10:05 <rwhitby> for the OE metadata, just don't type "make update".
Aug 21 00:10:23 <rwhitby> for the OM svn stuff, we're waiting on full SRCREV support.
Aug 21 00:10:34 <rwhitby> but you can use the existing OE SRCDATE support to do it if you work out how.
Aug 21 00:12:03 <jseghers> rwhitby: I think I finally figured that out last night.  I changed a bunch of the "now" "preferred versions" to an arbitrary date of 8/15... but think I may have also introduced some oddities with that as well :)  Like you said...2007.1 is old and broken.
Aug 21 00:18:02 <ZerothCloned> umm, has anyone been having issues with the command: make update?
Aug 21 00:19:53 <rwhitby> patebin the error
Aug 21 00:21:46 <ZerothCloned> give me a sec.
Aug 21 00:24:13 <ZerothCloned> here ya go, rwhitby: http://pastebin.com/m765aff8f
Aug 21 00:25:08 <rwhitby> ZerothCloned: "make clobber-patches setup update" to fix it
Aug 21 00:25:32 <ZerothCloned> thanks dude.
Aug 21 00:28:28 <rwhitby> I've added that to the wiki page.
Aug 21 00:43:09 <jseghers> ummmm.... should make setup for 2007.2 be pulling stuff from openmoko/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/.....?
Aug 21 00:44:58 <rwhitby> jseghers: we currently get the *whole* openmoko svn.  whether or not it uses that subdir is another matter.
Aug 21 01:04:02 <jseghers> rwhitby: thanks
Aug 21 01:36:01 <Jason1> exit
Aug 21 01:43:38 <|R>  /clear
Aug 21 01:43:40 <|R> argh ;)
Aug 21 01:56:37 * rwhitby completes a 2007.2 build with today's SVN contents.
Aug 21 01:58:50 <aloril> (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[MokoMakefile]]
Aug 21 02:15:14 <sagacis> good morning
Aug 21 02:16:00 <davel> That's a matter of opinion
Aug 21 02:16:23 <davel> That is, it's 22:16 here...  Not quite morning yet.
Aug 21 02:19:11 <sagacis> ~ugt
Aug 21 02:19:11 <rwhitby> ~ugt
Aug 21 02:19:12 <apt> from memory, ugt is Universal Greeting Time. Created in #mipslinux, it is a rule that states that whenever somebody enters an IRC channel it is always morning, and it is always late when the person leaves. The local time of any other people in the channel, including the greeter, is irrelevant. http://www.total-knowledge.com/~ilya/mips/ugt.html
Aug 21 02:33:25 <linux_galore> ~display
Aug 21 02:33:25 <apt> Continuously redisplay output in a terminal window. URL: http://www.ipsmart.com/src/
Aug 21 02:33:34 <jaebird> top of the morning to you!
Aug 21 02:36:20 <sagacis> howdeeee
Aug 21 02:36:38 <sagacis> building now.... It seems rwhitby has updated the makefile
Aug 21 02:39:02 <gnu_> when initially flashing a phone, is the snapshot under http://buildhost.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.08/images/ a good one to use?
Aug 21 02:41:49 <ferric> http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko2007.2#Pre-built_snapshot_images
Aug 21 02:41:58 <ferric> gnu_: looks like they are confirmed as working.
Aug 21 02:42:33 <gnu_> ferric:  thx!
Aug 21 02:43:10 <ferric> i'm going to flash my device right now with that as well.
Aug 21 02:43:31 <ferric> my sound doesn't seem to be working out of the box.
Aug 21 02:49:04 <arw_> see you tomorrow
Aug 21 02:49:49 <ferric> ciao
Aug 21 02:50:38 <arw_> ciao
Aug 21 02:50:40 <arw_> :)
Aug 21 02:59:02 <ferric> gnu_: did you flash your device?
Aug 21 02:59:18 <gnu_> ferric:  it's flashing now.  the filesystem takes a while.
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Aug 21 02:59:56 2007