**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Apr 08 02:59:56 2008 Apr 08 03:37:33 Is there a picture viewer that works well on the neo1973? Apr 08 04:23:42 Is there a picture viewer that works well on the neo1973? Apr 08 04:23:58 The one originally installed worked well Apr 08 04:24:06 It was also a graphics editor Apr 08 04:24:15 Which was that? Apr 08 04:24:28 I think it began with 'g'. Apr 08 04:24:29 :/ Apr 08 04:26:33 gimp Apr 08 04:26:39 * raster giggles Apr 08 04:27:56 was gimp ever built into rootfs? It would be a rather clumsy picture viewer anyway. Apr 08 04:30:52 no. Apr 08 04:31:22 It was a paint program, more than a proper graphics editor Apr 08 04:31:49 What happened to it? Apr 08 04:31:55 not there any more Apr 08 04:32:20 It was some 100K Apr 08 04:35:56 well, fwiw, I haven't been marked as an invalid application Apr 08 04:45:15 bmidgley: have you had A2DP working recently? /me is awaiting H2DPhones. Apr 08 05:14:55 moin...I have some problems building om with the MokoMakefile. http://www.pastebin.ca/976473 Apr 08 05:15:04 can anybody help me? Apr 08 05:25:46 Why is "maybe due April" removed from the topic ? Apr 08 05:26:13 too much hype I assume Apr 08 05:26:55 I see Apr 08 05:27:21 I don't really know, but there's been a lot of anxious users, and I get the feeling OM doesn't really want to commit Apr 08 05:27:33 it may also be that it's just around the corner, but I don't know that :) Apr 08 05:28:06 I can't wait any longer .. I'm buying a JasJar Apr 08 05:28:13 this has gone too far Apr 08 05:29:09 JasJar? Apr 08 05:30:20 I honestly think FreeRunner is right around the corner Apr 08 05:30:30 summatusmentis: an i-mate JasJar Apr 08 05:30:34 aka HTC Universal Apr 08 05:33:59 SpeedEvil not recently, but it should just work Apr 08 05:34:44 k Apr 08 05:34:45 a2dp encoder runs really well on gta01 Apr 08 05:35:32 just last change on that page was oct, and I wondered Apr 08 05:35:56 I would try it now but my phone is in the queue for a firmware update Apr 08 05:39:35 SpeedEvil what version of bluez-utils do you get in OM these days? Apr 08 05:44:41 bmidgley: The preferred-om-2008-versions file says 3.23 Apr 08 05:45:09 and hcidump 1.38 Apr 08 05:46:15 lol, the FreeRunner is hitting the final PVR stages and *now* he cannot wait anymore? Apr 08 05:46:23 That's funny to me :) Apr 08 05:47:01 PVT, I mean Apr 08 05:47:20 Hehe Apr 08 05:50:06 Hmm... 7000+ GSoC apps, of which Openmoko maybe has ~50 Apr 08 05:50:16 1% =( Apr 08 05:50:46 * abraxa__ crosses fingers for more than two slots Apr 08 05:51:48 abraxa__: And if you don't get two slots, blame Android and make a fuss about it ;) Apr 08 05:52:07 rofl! Apr 08 05:54:45 * CM tries to flash a new build :) Apr 08 06:07:14 Hmm.. Crappy.. Latest image (built during the night) doesn't boot to X Apr 08 06:10:23 On try number two it did :) Apr 08 06:12:52 abraxa__: well, I did what I could, I should be one of those 50 ;) Apr 08 06:35:06 freesmartphone.org: 03hepaajan * r149 10/trunk/software/gsmd2/ (20 files in 4 dirs): Apr 08 06:35:06 freesmartphone.org: Started API wrapper libfreesmartphone Apr 08 06:35:06 freesmartphone.org: Build gsmd2 as daemon binary + libgsmd2 Apr 08 06:35:06 freesmartphone.org: Changed vendor interface so that vendor plugins link to libgsmd2 Apr 08 06:35:06 freesmartphone.org: Some formating cleanups Apr 08 06:42:01 How many apps does gsoc fund? Apr 08 06:45:21 SpeedEvil: I think I remember the number being a little over 700 in total? Apr 08 06:46:03 oh wait, sorry, a bit more than 900 Apr 08 06:46:15 http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2008/faqs.html#0.1_number_students Apr 08 06:46:19 * SpeedEvil wishes he could apply. Apr 08 06:53:07 freesmartphone.org: 03hepaajan * r150 10/trunk/software/gsmd2/libgsmd2.pc.in: Add missing libgsmd2.pc.in Apr 08 06:59:20 good morning Apr 08 07:00:13 hi Apr 08 07:45:27 mornin Apr 08 07:47:32 473 votes Apr 08 08:32:55 hi Apr 08 08:47:13 josch: what was that voting link again? Apr 08 08:47:26 cb22, http://neo1973-germany.de/wiki/Tshirt :P Apr 08 08:48:34 you are going to hate all of us after this, arent you :p Apr 08 08:49:52 hehe Apr 08 08:50:56 josch: doesn't your girlfriend mind?;) Apr 08 08:51:01 is freerunner still estimated for april? Apr 08 08:51:02 ooh, topic == wrong splling of OpenMoko Apr 08 08:51:20 edistar_, we'll see ^^ Apr 08 08:51:40 bwahaha, we are so evil Apr 08 08:51:49 ecraven: officially yes Apr 08 08:57:48 openmoko: 03thomas * r4322 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/common/Makefile.am src/dialer/dialer-main.c): Apr 08 08:57:48 openmoko: 2008-04-08 Thomas Wood Apr 08 08:57:48 openmoko: * src/common/Makefile.am: Add missing header file Apr 08 08:57:48 openmoko: * src/dialer/dialer-main.c: (program_log), (main): Create the history Apr 08 08:57:48 openmoko: widget after everything else has loaded, unless it is explicitly Apr 08 08:57:50 openmoko: requested at runtime Apr 08 09:00:48 josch: hope and pray for the pvt runs Apr 08 09:01:45 what would you guess: how long will it takes from passing the PVT until i can order it? and how long until i can hold it in my hands? ;) i'v no working mobile phone atm. i was about to buy a new one last summer but i spoke to harald at the CCCamp and he told me that the gta02 should be available until the end of the year. so i decieded to wait, and i'm still waiting.. ;) Apr 08 09:02:34 fish_, rly nobody can be 100% sure Apr 08 09:02:42 josch: of course Apr 08 09:03:17 fish_, where do you live? Apr 08 09:03:19 germany? Apr 08 09:03:26 (as you visited the cccamp) Apr 08 09:04:02 i would never blame harald for that or the openmoko for not getting it done ;) i'm still happy about that project and can't wait to have a free phone! :) Apr 08 09:04:05 josch: yes Apr 08 09:04:17 fish_, /join #neo1973-germany Apr 08 09:04:52 ah crap.. not another irc channel.. ;)) Apr 08 09:20:00 * * OM Bug 1325 has been created by allen_lin(AT)openmoko.com Apr 08 09:20:02 * * Battery icon display cannot decrease automatically Apr 08 09:20:03 * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1325 Apr 08 09:26:18 oooh ... someone completely ballsed up the build Apr 08 09:35:26 freesmartphone.org: 03hepaajan * r151 10/trunk/software/gsmd2/test/ (call_unit.py gsmd_common.py): Example of synchronizing tests Apr 08 09:59:14 ScaredyCat: 494 votes Apr 08 10:01:16 495 :) Apr 08 10:02:03 think it'll reach 1000+? Apr 08 10:02:26 no Apr 08 10:02:40 o rly? Apr 08 10:03:43 I think that most people who have an opinion would have voted fairly early on... it's going up, but in 1's and 2's rather than 10's 20's that it was doing yesterday. Apr 08 10:04:26 yeah true, now's the time when we call rentacrowd and tell them to vote Apr 08 10:04:28 :p Apr 08 10:04:39 but we don;t want that really... Apr 08 10:04:59 you don't want people who have no interest in the project voting just to fuck it up Apr 08 10:05:10 12:04 < cb22> :p Apr 08 10:05:30 that smily is suppesed to negate everything i just said Apr 08 10:05:34 lets do a voting bot that interpolates the missing 500 votes :P Apr 08 10:05:48 josch: we could just times the results by 2x Apr 08 10:05:50 well, that's easy Apr 08 10:05:57 but one thing ive noticed Apr 08 10:06:00 yes cb22 - I saw the :p Apr 08 10:06:21 is that people needing 3g has always been around 49->55% or so Apr 08 10:06:33 not as if it was jumping around like crazy Apr 08 10:07:29 no, and 50% is a big chunk Apr 08 10:09:09 abraxa_: fix the topic! OpenMoko = Openmoko :) Apr 08 10:10:30 Why me? I'm innocent! Apr 08 10:10:31 xP Apr 08 10:10:58 Okay, but only because it was too easy Apr 08 10:11:09 (the topic is editable by anyone btw) Apr 08 10:11:22 then it's going to have a new device development? :D Apr 08 10:11:45 wohoo! editable by anyone!! Apr 08 10:12:02 rofl Apr 08 10:12:39 Der kleine Josch moechte im Kinderparadies abgeholt werden Apr 08 10:12:40 ;) Apr 08 10:13:56 abraxa_, hahaha Apr 08 10:14:31 can u translate? :D Apr 08 10:15:01 "Little Josch wants to be picked up at the kid's playground" Apr 08 10:15:18 kids'* Apr 08 10:15:47 methril, kinderparadies is usually the place in big stores where you can leave your children to play with toys there Apr 08 10:16:26 abraxa_, imitated the loudspeaker voice you here in those stores when someone got missing Apr 08 10:16:53 thanks josch :D Apr 08 10:17:33 and then... what about the new development? i read something in the kernel mailing list about a evaluation board Apr 08 10:19:35 openmoko: 03rob * r4323 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/daemons/neod/src/buttonactions.c: Remove the "Lock Phone" option from the power menu. Apr 08 10:22:18 methril: Got a link to the post by chance? Apr 08 10:24:31 http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-March/001796.html Apr 08 10:25:49 Thanks Apr 08 10:26:04 yw Apr 08 10:27:17 Hmm, I don't see anything about an evaluation board there Apr 08 10:27:53 Sure, they may be "playing with some hardware" but that doesn't mean anything for us just yet :) Apr 08 10:28:05 yes Apr 08 10:28:15 but it's something Apr 08 10:28:27 it's another CPU Apr 08 10:28:37 S3C6400 User's Manual Apr 08 10:28:43 & S3C2443 Apr 08 10:29:36 My Apple Mail client advises me that it "thinks this message is Junk Mail." LOL!!! Apr 08 10:30:01 * * OM Bug 1326 has been created by erin_yueh(AT)openmoko.com Apr 08 10:30:01 * * cannot display missed call icon in home screen Apr 08 10:30:02 * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1326 Apr 08 10:32:00 * * OM Bug 1327 has been created by erin_yueh(AT)openmoko.com Apr 08 10:32:01 * * support *#06# from dialer Apr 08 10:32:02 * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1327 Apr 08 10:45:41 abraxa_: apple's "mail" really sucks ;) Apr 08 10:46:18 Maybe, I just think it's funny as the mail itself is a joke Apr 08 10:46:53 fish_ it sucks Apr 08 10:46:53 i agree Apr 08 10:53:49 well.. i think apple sucks at all ;) Apr 08 11:18:41 should i reopen bug 79, because resume often crashes? Apr 08 11:25:41 ah, if i wouldn't be bound to the place where i live ($girlfriend ;)) i would apply for the sysadmin job at openmoko. would be really nice to help the projects _and_ get paid for it ;)) Apr 08 11:34:05 freesmartphone.org: 03mickeyl * r152 10/trunk/software/pyrtc/ (. AUTHORS Makefile README pyrtc.pyx rtc.c setup.py): add pyrtc, a python binding to the real time clock found in PCs or SoCs Apr 08 11:53:32 freesmartphone.org: 03pikkive * r153 10/trunk/software/gsmd2/test/ (4 files): Apr 08 11:53:32 freesmartphone.org: Added a generic test function to simplify testing Apr 08 11:53:32 freesmartphone.org: Began converting tests to use that function. Apr 08 11:53:32 freesmartphone.org: Added phonebook tests. Apr 08 12:04:02 openmoko: 03rob * r4324 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/daemons/neod/src/ (Makefile.am buttonactions.c wifi.c wifi.h): Apr 08 12:04:02 openmoko: Add Wifi control options to the power menu. Apr 08 12:04:02 openmoko: Hook up the peripheral control options to the function that actually makes the Apr 08 12:04:02 openmoko: changes. Apr 08 12:25:18 hello all... Apr 08 12:25:25 good evening!! Apr 08 12:25:26 :-) Apr 08 12:26:37 i saw that the xlsfonts command gives the different font combinations possible with the available fonts.... Apr 08 12:27:03 so, i need to install fonts so that the output of xlsfonts includes the new fonts. Apr 08 12:27:30 can anyone help me in getting me know the location to put the new required fonts. Apr 08 12:34:36 freesmartphone.org: 03pikkive * r154 10/trunk/software/gsmd2/test/ (call_unit.py gsmd_common.py): Apr 08 12:34:36 freesmartphone.org: Added some comments to perform function. Apr 08 12:34:36 freesmartphone.org: Modified rest of call tests to use perform funcion. Apr 08 12:38:32 Hmm, do openmoko people know that the http://direct.openmoko.com link is currently dead? And that if one clicks on the shop/buy links on the openmoko.com web site, it comes back with an error? Apr 08 12:40:37 direct.openmoko.com is working for me Apr 08 12:41:05 they're sold out anyway Apr 08 12:41:11 I'm getting an error saying that it's using an invalid security certificate Apr 08 12:41:15 "Openmoko Online Shop\nSOLD OUT!\nDear customers.... Apr 08 12:41:23 maybe it's due to them getting ready to put up the freerunner pages. Apr 08 12:41:24 wibbit: they are using a cacert certificate Apr 08 12:41:33 wibbit: so you have to accept this certificate ;) Apr 08 12:41:47 Hmm, I wonder if it some thing screwy with the F9 firefox3 package Apr 08 12:42:37 wibbit: dont know.. i only know that cacert certificates are not accepted automatically ;) Apr 08 12:42:55 https://www.cacert.org/ <- is this page working for you? Apr 08 12:43:17 Okay, well it's some thing odd with how firefox deals with it, they provide a page very similar to a 404, with the error message, as opposed to a pop up Apr 08 12:43:22 sorry for the false alarm Apr 08 12:44:46 wibbit: no problem ;) but i dont think its an firefox bug :-/ may you have to reset your security settings? Apr 08 12:45:10 nezza-_-: not a bug per say, just a change in how Firefox3 is throwing up cert errors Apr 08 12:45:47 They don't provide a pop up asking if you want to accept the cert, and the info behind it, it is presented as a web page, along the lines of the 404 errors, or other this server/page is dead, give. Apr 08 12:45:51 I rare read them Apr 08 12:45:57 looks like I'll hav eot change me ways Apr 08 12:46:13 hmmm i think it has something to do with your settings for certificates.. Apr 08 12:46:25 nezza-_-: you're using Firefox3? Apr 08 12:46:45 no.. but i will try out.. just wait a moment ;-) Apr 08 12:46:49 have to install it Apr 08 12:46:53 kay Apr 08 12:49:12 hlf meg of votes Apr 08 12:49:15 half Apr 08 12:50:05 ScaredyCat: for the 3g thing? Apr 08 12:50:11 ya Apr 08 12:50:19 I don't know how I feel about that to be honest. Apr 08 12:50:41 I think GPRS is probably fine for most things I'd be looking to do when out and about, unless a decent SIP client was present Apr 08 12:50:55 there is a 'I don't know' option - just for you :) Apr 08 12:51:26 Yup, I noticed that (already voted) Apr 08 12:51:34 well, yes, but noone will develop one if it can't be used... (although wifi will help) Apr 08 12:52:51 i've been using Truphone on my Nokia E70 which worked well over both 3G and wifi, by all accounts their backend runs astrisk Apr 08 12:53:20 well and iax client would be nice too Apr 08 12:53:30 iax? Apr 08 12:53:32 gprs is just so useless, even irc is laggy over it :D Apr 08 12:53:48 Inter Asterisk eXchange Apr 08 12:54:08 it's an asterisk protocol - uses 1 port for data and control messages Apr 08 12:54:19 Basheri: fine for what I'd be looking to do, I.E. email/rss general browsing. Apr 08 12:54:47 ScaredyCat: Only problem is, I don't think truphone would open up their stuff, to allow some thing on the freerunner to connect Apr 08 12:54:50 though I may be wrong Apr 08 12:54:59 * wibbit considers going to their forumn and asking Apr 08 12:55:20 well, there are enough free open sip and iax clients about.. Apr 08 12:55:47 besides truephone don;t need to Apr 08 12:56:05 they just need to offer something that works.. even if it's closed... Apr 08 12:56:11 ScaredyCat: It's not so much the client, but more the backend infrastructure that I like, maybe other companies offer the same, and are open enough. Apr 08 12:56:17 ie it wont be on an image, but you can install it Apr 08 12:56:40 ScaredyCat: I'd be very happy if they did do that Apr 08 13:05:24 ScaredyCat: Several posts in the forum and no response regarding whether or not it'll be supported, which is a pity Apr 08 13:05:58 you don't have an asterisk box? Apr 08 13:06:28 of course not :[ Apr 08 13:06:36 That was meant to be :p Apr 08 13:06:39 I'm pretty sure you can use any old sip client with truephone... Apr 08 13:06:56 iirc they even let you register an asterisk box Apr 08 13:07:01 I tried using ekiga but couldn't get it to connect Apr 08 13:07:02 so it shouldn;t be an issue Apr 08 13:07:23 But that was probably about a year or so ago, may be they've improvde things since Apr 08 13:16:43 it looks like it could be a good idea wibbit Apr 08 13:19:40 except ... Apr 08 13:19:47 "All our rates are flat. " which is a lie Apr 08 13:22:54 Why do you say it's a lie? Apr 08 13:29:41 freesmartphone.org: 03mickeyl * r155 10/trunk/software/py-odeviced/modules/ (kernel26.py powercontrol-neo.py): py-odeviced: add preliminary FreeRunner WiFi Power Control Object Apr 08 13:31:50 wibbit: because they have diferent rates for different countries Apr 08 13:31:59 yet they claim they are the same Apr 08 13:32:36 ScaredyCat: My only guess would be there is some thing that normal mobile operators in the UK do as far as billing, which truphone don't do Apr 08 13:32:58 charge up the wazzoo ? Apr 08 13:33:07 LOL Apr 08 13:34:17 i really can't comment on that aspect, however the way in which it intergrates on the nokia is very smooth, as is the automatic forwarding of sip calls to the GSM number if you're not online Apr 08 13:36:42 yes.. afaik you can just give out your truphone number and not you're mobile... Apr 08 13:36:55 although I don;t know how they get around roaming charges Apr 08 13:37:05 openmoko: 03thomas * r4325 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/dialer/dialer-main.c): Apr 08 13:37:05 openmoko: 2008-04-08 Thomas Wood Apr 08 13:37:05 openmoko: * src/dialer/dialer-main.c: (main): Revert previous history widget Apr 08 13:37:05 openmoko: creation changes until at least after MP image. Apr 08 13:37:16 perhaps they just hve boxen in each european country Apr 08 13:37:33 ScaredyCat: That's my understanding of how it works. Apr 08 13:37:49 but don't you still get roaming chages? Apr 08 13:37:54 ScaredyCat: Nope Apr 08 13:38:02 which is probably what they mean by flat rate Apr 08 13:38:03 mmmm, you sure? Apr 08 13:38:17 A sip call is the same cost irrespective of which location I'm in. Apr 08 13:38:19 a k mobile in .nl Apr 08 13:38:25 a uk mobile in .nl Apr 08 13:38:33 yes, but what if no wifi? Apr 08 13:38:38 ScaredyCat: Ahh, you mean if I'm abroad and it forwards on to my GSM number, would I get done for roaming? Apr 08 13:38:43 yes Apr 08 13:38:52 Yes you would Apr 08 13:39:02 However, their client has a nice feature Apr 08 13:39:02 so, there are roaming charges then Apr 08 13:39:21 That is not a truphone charge, and it's hardly fair to hold them accountable for it Apr 08 13:39:46 no but they say no roaming charges... Apr 08 13:39:49 when there are Apr 08 13:39:53 Additionally, if you swap out the GSM chip, it will pick up the new number, and you can update the voice forwarding automatically. Apr 08 13:40:13 you mean the sim? Apr 08 13:40:27 rather than the chip :) Apr 08 13:40:28 * SpeedEvil has a rework station, and is not afraid to use it! Apr 08 13:40:32 So if you move between to or three countries regularly, just sign up for a pay as you go account in those locations, and when you move from country to country, swap out the sim, and the truphone system will redirect the sip call to the latest number Apr 08 13:40:59 * wibbit wonders what's the techincal difference between the "sim" and a generic "chip" :p ignoring food Apr 08 13:41:23 wibbit: the SIM is a special purpose chip - that only holds the users identity. (classically) Apr 08 13:41:31 * ScaredyCat points at the soldering on the chip pads Apr 08 13:41:55 wibbit: Chip is a more general purpose thing - encopassing every sort of complex semiconductor. Apr 08 13:42:14 ScaredyCat: There are not truphone related roaming charges, if you're logged in to their SIP network irrespective of what country you're in, it is the same charge. I can't accept it a fair or dishonest criticism, to hold them accountable for you're mobile operators roaming charges. Apr 08 13:42:27 SpeedEvil: I'm sure that a chip can be as simple as a sim Apr 08 13:42:35 aha, chip, see, you called it a chip Apr 08 13:42:35 :p Apr 08 13:42:58 I know it's more general purpose, doesn't make it wrong though Apr 08 13:43:04 wibbit: sure - it's just generally - a SIM will be referred to as a SIM. Much like you'll call a car a car, rather than a collection of machined metals. Apr 08 13:43:23 *shrug* Apr 08 13:43:29 wibbit: they shouldn't be claiming that there are no roaming charges. Apr 08 13:43:39 it implies that there are NO roaming charges Apr 08 13:44:30 And there are no roaming charges when using their product (the SIP service) Apr 08 13:44:57 their product encompasses sms, gsm calls etc Apr 08 13:45:05 not just the sip stuff Apr 08 13:45:39 I just saying , those words shouldn;t be there... Apr 08 13:45:41 I understand where you are coming from, I just disagree with you, and do not believe it is a fare critasisim Apr 08 13:45:59 You're entitled to be wrong ;) Apr 08 13:46:05 as are you Apr 08 13:46:10 neva! Apr 08 13:46:24 * ScaredyCat dons a cloak of never-wrongness Apr 08 13:47:14 I hate feeling ill Apr 08 13:48:33 s/ill/wrong/ Apr 08 13:48:34 :P Apr 08 13:50:59 :p Apr 08 13:51:39 I think I'll go and rot my brain playing metroid prime onthe wii Apr 08 13:51:44 see if I can work out where I'm going next Apr 08 13:51:52 for such a linear game, it's depressingly easy to get lost Apr 08 13:52:51 stupid dorm mates, get out of the shower already! Apr 08 13:54:31 Get in with them! Apr 08 13:54:36 ScaredyCat, did you get moko-gtk-engine to work in the end? Apr 08 13:55:16 err.. Apr 08 13:55:27 been a bit busy... Apr 08 13:55:33 promise to have a go tonight Apr 08 13:55:35 ScaredyCat, that's a no then :-P Apr 08 13:55:45 it's ok, i was just curious Apr 08 15:02:11 any new, in here? Apr 08 15:02:31 new what? Apr 08 15:02:42 new news Apr 08 15:02:48 Bish: yeah ... the "maybe due April" was removed from the topic Apr 08 15:03:55 They are doing production verification testing Apr 08 15:04:17 Figuring out ways to tweak the manufacturing process to increase yield and decrease cost Apr 08 15:04:55 Of course, that's for the final FR hardware; final software is at least 6 months later Apr 08 15:06:07 openmoko: 03erin_yueh * r4326 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/daemons/neod/src/buttonactions.c: neod: modify gsm, gps, bluetooth device PATH (Erin Yueh) Apr 08 15:07:11 wurp2: so then, is there likely to be another 'product release' to coincide w/ final software? Apr 08 15:07:24 I would think so Apr 08 15:07:26 Not as far as revealed Apr 08 15:07:28 I get the impression people are thinking that FR == final software Apr 08 15:07:40 Assuming by product release, you mean marketing push Apr 08 15:07:41 Freerunner is simply the hardware. Apr 08 15:07:57 I know that, but I think people on the mailing lists are looking for a final releas Apr 08 15:08:00 release* Apr 08 15:08:09 Yeah - I'd expect a 'Freerunner - now your mom can be open!' ad campaign or something. Apr 08 15:08:14 Err. Apr 08 15:08:20 Maybe an unfortunate phrase. Apr 08 15:08:20 >:-) Apr 08 15:08:25 ROFL Apr 08 15:08:26 :) Apr 08 15:08:54 I'd rather my mom not be open, thanks, but I see what you mean Apr 08 15:09:02 SpeedEvil: If you have to accidentally deliver a 'yr mom' joke, at least it was a good one Apr 08 15:10:07 It's kind of unfortunate that OM isn't keeping the 'hungry consumers' satiated. There are a lot of people who are fed up w/ waiting. I understand that this is how stuff goes, but others don't seem to Apr 08 15:10:38 Yeah, I don't really know how they could keep them satisfied Apr 08 15:10:48 SW and HW development are inherently slow Apr 08 15:10:56 I feel like the company should maybe be doing more to make sure people understand how the process works Apr 08 15:11:14 Although one developer devoted to obvious features could probably make the 01 users happier, if that was a goal Apr 08 15:11:34 Stuff like adding numbers from your call history to contacts has been really nice Apr 08 15:11:43 wurp2: right, that's the point. People seem to think that when something gets announced, it's right around the corner, and are getting fed up w/ waiting. There needs to be a shift in what people are expecting Apr 08 15:12:12 CVirus: -_- Apr 08 15:12:13 IMO - obvious features - say a dialer and SMS thingy - even if it was bad - and a list of all projects that are _not_ being worked on by the core devs would have put the project forward 6 months IMO. Apr 08 15:12:19 'obvious' meaning end users see progress, not necessarily addressing obvious deficiencies Apr 08 15:12:33 Bish: ! Apr 08 15:13:04 SpeedEvil: agreed! There has been a lack of communication on where the focus is (and isn't) Apr 08 15:13:07 does this mean, its out :D? :DD CVirus Apr 08 15:13:26 nope Apr 08 15:13:43 I am kind of not liking the whole everything-runs-as-root thing Apr 08 15:14:03 wait, we're still having everything run as root? Apr 08 15:14:08 or, not still, but what? Apr 08 15:14:12 at least in the snapshot from yesterday Apr 08 15:14:27 can that be changed? Apr 08 15:14:46 I think it would be not *too* much work and I might do it if I can figure out what the hell is going on at boot time Apr 08 15:15:06 even a user account w/ no password would be better than running everything as root Apr 08 15:15:08 even a passwordless normal user + daemons running as root would be better Apr 08 15:15:17 great minds think alike Apr 08 15:15:18 :) Apr 08 15:15:28 and a good first step before adding a little login manager maybe Apr 08 15:15:38 who wants a login manager on their phone? Apr 08 15:15:42 I do :-) Apr 08 15:15:45 I do. Apr 08 15:15:54 There are _many_ use-cases. Apr 08 15:16:04 I mean it's a slow computer and all ... I could give other people accounts on it or something Apr 08 15:16:09 A) user does not have full rights as they have not bought the phone, but are renting it. Apr 08 15:16:29 B) Lend phone to friend - they get phone functions capped at a budget - and that's it. Apr 08 15:16:45 C) Kids phone - you want it locked to one setup. Apr 08 15:16:46 SpeedEvil: yeah, but noone wants to have to 'login' to their phone Apr 08 15:16:58 C) setup a drunk-party account that does not allow random folks to dial your parents or boss ;-) Apr 08 15:16:58 I don't want it to ask me for a password every time it wakes up Apr 08 15:17:07 Some do. Apr 08 15:17:25 that's just a hassle Apr 08 15:17:36 which is why it would be yet another optional component Apr 08 15:17:38 I personally would like the option that it's completely a brick without a passphrase, even if you've got a JTAG board. Apr 08 15:17:58 (I might be ok with putting in a sequence of accelerometer movements to unlock it though) :D Apr 08 15:18:11 up-up-down-left-down-right-up Apr 08 15:18:26 write a gesture generating program and then add a pam module for it Apr 08 15:18:51 or an across the body downward slash :) Apr 08 15:19:09 is there really no settings application in the openmoko image? Apr 08 15:19:12 w/ lightsaber noises!!! Apr 08 15:19:17 unknown_lamer: I couldn't find it either Apr 08 15:19:29 I've given up on using the X bits and just ssh into the emulated phone now Apr 08 15:19:41 given that I'm just trying to get text mode clisp running for now this works Apr 08 15:20:01 the generational gc and ffi don't quite work properly on eabi, but they work fine on oabi! Apr 08 15:20:20 now I get to pick up a bit of arm assembly and learn the horrid details of the eabi stack layout Apr 08 15:20:39 sounds scary Apr 08 15:21:01 someone else spent a month banging at it before giving up so I have his scattered notes he published on the web to work from Apr 08 15:21:24 does anyone know off hand if the openmoko kernel has softfloat enabled? Apr 08 15:21:56 (to get the ffi working I either have to add an option to disable binding floats or rewrite the arm stuff to use softfloat instead of arm fpu instructions) Apr 08 15:23:45 summatusmentis: scary and difficult, but in the end I either get a concussion from banging my head against the desk, *or* a working knowledge of ARM assembly and a working Lisp system with Gtk bindings on my phone Apr 08 15:23:53 summatusmentis: naturally I'd prefer the latter Apr 08 15:24:02 ew.. Apr 08 15:24:12 summatusmentis: if I suffer the former fate I can always use ... guile (slow, but it has full gnome platform bindings) Apr 08 15:24:13 * summatusmentis hated scheme, he assumes lisp is close Apr 08 15:24:32 Common Lisp is quite a bit larger and a bit funkier than Scheme Apr 08 15:24:41 funkier? Apr 08 15:24:59 It's *Common* Lisp so it's an amalgamation of a bunch of old 70s Lisp dialects Apr 08 15:25:12 [2008-04-08 16:04:40] openmoko: erin_yueh * r4326 /trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/daemons/neod/src/buttonactions.c: neod: modify gsm, gps, bluetooth Apr 08 15:25:15 gah!!! Apr 08 15:25:35 ScaredyCat? Apr 08 15:25:57 device PATH Apr 08 15:26:08 it got cut off.. Apr 08 15:26:21