**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri May 30 02:59:57 2008 May 30 03:00:02 I think enlightenment offers a lot of integration advantages May 30 03:02:00 ok May 30 03:02:06 like edje May 30 03:02:15 right May 30 03:02:35 this is all speculation, mind you, but I assume that's why they changed May 30 03:05:04 ok May 30 03:09:14 twm ftw! May 30 03:22:57 lol twm May 30 03:23:21 OLPC think about switching from matchbox to metacity May 30 03:24:00 maybe they should take a look at enlightenment May 30 04:14:45 openmoko: 03john_lee 07org.openmoko.dev * rb863913e1c7d 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): from openembedded.devel mailing list, Robert Schuster: May 30 04:27:14 hi :> May 30 04:31:05 any chance of putting a csr bluecore external memory bluetooth chipset on the freerunner? May 30 04:31:15 bluecore4* May 30 04:34:56 Only if you solder it on May 30 04:35:12 It's on an external module, so in principle you could May 30 04:37:02 yeah but the bluetooth chipset that will be used on freerunner has not been announced yet, 1973 was using bluecore4ROM, it would be a good idea to produce the freerunner with an updatable firmware bluetooth chip May 30 04:37:45 In principle yes. May 30 04:37:49 In practice, it's more expensive. May 30 04:37:55 but if not, u can still plugin a usb dongle so not big deal May 30 04:38:12 As I understand it, it's the same module. May 30 04:38:25 Do you have the CSR SDK? May 30 04:39:22 sdk=? May 30 04:39:37 softare development kit. May 30 04:39:45 $6K IIRC May 30 04:40:21 no :p but there is patched firmware to allow sniffing + injection May 30 04:45:01 Why stop there? How about adding a general purpose radio transmitter with adjustable power amplifier so that you can "inject" signals into police and fire trunking radios, interfere with aircraft flight control communications, jam walkie-talkies and other portable transmitters. What fun! May 30 04:45:29 And of course, open the GSM firmware so you can inject data into the cell networks at will... May 30 04:46:09 * mwester marvells that people see the need to turn everything into something they can cause trouble with! May 30 05:30:29 mwester: good idea, sounds like fun May 30 06:45:08 morning May 30 06:46:43 morning May 30 07:19:08 openmoko: 03john_lee 07org.openmoko.dev * r6f49098a9d9e 10/packages/meta/meta-toolchain-openmoko.bb: opkg-cl depends on libopkg, libcurl, libz. However, native recipes do May 30 07:19:09 openmoko: 03john_lee 07org.openmoko.dev * r80e90e1b8721 10/conf/distro/include/preferred-om-2008-versions.inc: preferred-om-2008-versions: modify the classpath rev to more sensible May 30 07:28:14 openmoko: 03john_lee 07org.openmoko.asu.dev * r89844d0007b4 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): from openembedded.devel mailing list, Robert Schuster: May 30 07:28:15 openmoko: 03john_lee 07org.openmoko.asu.dev * r3b065fbd973b 10/conf/distro/include/preferred-om-2008-versions.inc: preferred-om-2008-versions: modify the classpath rev to more sensible May 30 07:29:10 openmoko: 03john_lee 07org.openmoko.asu.stable * rdd5dd50b1337 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): from openembedded.devel mailing list, Robert Schuster: May 30 07:29:10 openmoko: 03john_lee 07org.openmoko.asu.stable * r19bc8ac5257f 10/conf/distro/include/preferred-om-2008-versions.inc: preferred-om-2008-versions: modify the classpath rev to more sensible May 30 07:44:14 good morning May 30 07:47:30 morning May 30 08:50:25 morning to all May 30 08:52:47 morning there stranger May 30 10:08:32 Question i could probably get an answer from by reading all the mailing lists: May 30 10:08:51 The Freerunner wont be able to display video right? What about other graphical things May 30 10:09:16 e.g for a mp3 player (the bars and such going up and down, cant remember the name all of a sudden), highlight me with some kind of answer please, gotta run to the dentist :( May 30 10:09:55 flexd, that's no problem. mpeg4 video might be possible if someone gets around to writing a driver for the gpu decoder... May 30 10:10:27 I basically want a mp3/mp4/ogg/and so on player to use on the phone, with fancy virtualizations May 30 10:10:41 visualizations, you mean May 30 10:11:01 Tired of all these ipod fankids running around mocking my huge block of a creative zen sleek :P May 30 10:11:12 mjr: yes those, my bad. May 30 10:11:15 but bbl May 30 10:31:11 freesmartphone.org: 03vesa.pikki * r7bcacf4474d4 10/ (9 files in 2 dirs): Multipart pdu userdata header parsing fixed May 30 10:38:37 hi i have problems with running openmoko under qemu, ist starts, boots, than somthing looking like a menu and than black screen, i'running it again now, and past after it the log, hope you can help me May 30 10:38:55 did someone just break the wiki? May 30 10:39:49 the navigation i at the bottom of the page and it says May 30 10:41:30

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May 30 10:41:33 wth May 30 10:46:42 so, now what the shell sais http://pastebin.kubuntu-de.org/183 May 30 11:18:44 openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * rf33972e86fef 10/packages/tasks/task-openmoko-feed.bb: [feed] remove qtopia-phone from task-openmoko-feed May 30 11:20:39 Random thought I had: in some countries it's legally required that cell phone cameras make a shutter sound to prevent them from being used as spying or peeping tom devices May 30 11:21:14 abraxa__: damn japanese! May 30 11:21:15 :) May 30 11:21:34 With OM being so open I it makes it very easy to remove this sound, making me wonder if phones from OM, Inc. will be outlawed in such countries (e.g. Korea) May 30 11:22:16 raster: I'm sure you're enjoying the benefits of that country, too ;) May 30 11:22:25 nah May 30 11:22:27 moved out May 30 11:22:27 :) May 30 11:22:40 as such - don't know what the laws are May 30 11:23:02 they may require the phone from the factory does this and provides no way to turn it off that is normally accessible May 30 11:23:10 pretty much every phone can somehow be reflahsed May 30 11:23:20 but it is a question of what is considered reasonable for the maker to do May 30 11:23:31 ie if default firmware config and apps dont allow it May 30 11:23:35 well then - that may be fine May 30 11:23:43 again - probably depends from country to country May 30 11:24:07 True that May 30 11:24:29 Prolly some legalese to prevent Jon Doe from turning it off May 30 11:24:52 it's me again May 30 11:26:48 abraxa__: in the ned that is a big problem if om want sto start having telcos re-sell the phone in their stores May 30 11:26:53 and hgave them as a "with my plan" option May 30 11:27:02 until then its likely a moot point May 30 11:27:12 as tho technically not legal - no one will notice or care May 30 11:27:21 until they are available in sufficient numbers ot cause a problem May 30 11:27:45 zash: posted to community maillist hope somebody will pong back May 30 11:28:17 I've noticed that my K810 is silent when taking pictures if you just have it in the silent mode May 30 11:42:30 CM: Sounds like a design flaw to me then: "ah, let's just turn off the amp when in silent mode" or similar May 30 11:44:00 Could be :) May 30 11:49:56 Xand3r, I got it working somehow Just build and flash latest I ve done make update-makefile && make setup update openmoko-devel-image; make flash-qemu-local; make run-qemu. It boots and going immediately to suspend or something like this May 30 11:53:42 thx May 30 11:53:45 h May 30 11:54:16 i have a problem with "make openmoko-devel-image" May 30 12:00:02 hey, I get the same problem with run-qemu... now I updating the image and will try again May 30 12:00:37 nab: ping May 30 12:01:55 http://pastebin.kubuntu-de.org/184 May 30 12:08:05 Any_Key: an idea? May 30 12:14:05 Xand3r: 'sudo echo "0" > /proc/sys/vm/mmap_min_addr' should solve that May 30 12:17:03 this is not going to work May 30 12:17:21 if you don't want that give you that error every reboot May 30 12:17:33 Xand3r: or put in your /etc/systcl.conf 'vm.mmap_min_addr = 0' May 30 12:17:43 check /etc/sysctl.conf May 30 12:59:54 again a qestion, with "make openmoko-devel-image" i get a parsing errors May 30 13:02:05 http://pastebin.kubuntu-de.org/185 May 30 13:05:29 cyrilRomain, Any_Key, can you help me May 30 13:07:28 Xand3r: it seems you are behind a firewall, preventing you to fetch subversion repositories May 30 13:07:43 ? May 30 13:10:16 Xand3r: check out https://svn.projects.openmoko.org/svnroot/ninja/trunk/ with svn outside of OE/OM then accept the certificate permanently May 30 13:10:19 Xand3r: hmm or maybe you just have to type 'p' to accept permanently the certificate May 30 13:10:28 Xand3r: then it will work within OE/OM May 30 13:11:07 XorA: he can also type in 'p' and press enter while bitbake is parsing May 30 13:11:33 cyrilRomain: that doesnt seem to work anymore May 30 13:11:38 XorA: it arrived to me once May 30 13:11:40 kk May 30 13:11:40 XorA: ah .. May 30 13:11:56 cyrilRomain: since OE split into client/server, but I could be wrong May 30 13:13:21 XorA: BTW thanks for the 'kermit playing NIN' video on your blog. It's a really nice video ;) May 30 13:13:40 cyrilRomain: heh, the wonders of youtube :-) May 30 13:16:36 openmoko: 03graeme 07org.openmoko.dev * ra21e9315f228 10/packages/openmoko-projects/etk-theme-ninja_svn.bb: etk-theme-ninja_svn.bb : no need to confuse people by using https May 30 13:16:54 fixed the https svn issue anyway :-) May 30 13:21:26 hi there. May 30 13:36:50 XorA, self signed ssl? May 30 13:37:08 Any_Key: dont ask me May 30 13:39:33 XorA, OK May 30 13:42:06 ssssl for short? May 30 13:45:01 * * OM Bug 1435 has been created by mdt(AT)emdete.de May 30 13:45:02 * * modem/kernel truncates packages in mux mode after hours of operation May 30 13:45:03 * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1435 May 30 14:23:14 ERROR: '/home/sudharsh/Projects/openmoko/openembedded/packages/linux/linux-openmoko_2.6.24+git.bb' failed, anyone getting this lately? May 30 14:23:52 nope and I just did two kernel builds May 30 14:24:14 hmm.. :/ May 30 14:24:24 make update and still the same error May 30 14:24:34 whats the full error? May 30 14:26:35 Sup3rkiddo: Yeah, same error here May 30 14:26:57 abraxa_, not a git repository? May 30 14:27:11 Sup3rkiddo: Sorry, I don't understand that question May 30 14:27:11 lemme just pastebin the stuff May 30 14:27:58 abraxa_, oops...was that the error? May 30 14:28:42 http://pastebin.ca/1034114 May 30 14:28:52 Sup3rkiddo: Hmm nope... mine says " fatal: failed to unpack tree object 3bf4cea81fe7dd81cad6f78019383c93653ba7f6" May 30 14:29:22 hmm..lemme rerun make openmoko-devel-image again May 30 14:43:30 openmoko: 03graeme 07org.openmoko.dev * r531c4c5849f5 10/packages/openmoko-projects/etk-theme-ninja_svn.bb: etk-theme-ninja_svn.bb : no need to confuse people by using https May 30 14:43:30 openmoko: 03graeme 07org.openmoko.dev * r9d67cb75bc24 10/packages/ipkg-utils/ (2 files in 2 dirs): ipkg-utils-native_1.6+cvs20050404.bb : rejig patches to renable Size: May 30 14:43:31 openmoko: 03graeme 07org.openmoko.dev * r0e8bc3d438d0 10/packages/tasks/task-openmoko-feed.bb: Merge branch 'org.openmoko.dev' of /home/dp/openmoko/openmoko/ into org.openmoko.dev May 30 14:46:45 openmoko: 03thomas * r4460 10/trunk/src/target/opkg/libopkg/opkg.c: May 30 14:46:45 openmoko: opkg: run pre-install check before listing upgradable packages to ensure all May 30 14:46:45 openmoko: data is valid. Fixes bug 1433. May 30 15:00:54 hi all May 30 15:02:38 Is there someone around who can provide some feedback on using qemu? May 30 15:03:14 i'm afraid you have to ask something more precise May 30 15:03:36 OK, I installed qemu as described on the wiki May 30 15:04:00 The qemu window starts correctly when I run make run-qemu-snapshot May 30 15:04:19 can anyone help me to get my moko to connect as a USB mass storage when i connect to my PC? May 30 15:05:06 vvb: That would be a good feature to add. May 30 15:05:27 When I boot the simulated device, everything looks quite normal, but when the device should display the main menu, it looks disturbed. Most of the screen is black. May 30 15:05:34 vvb: you'll have to rmmod g_ether and modprobe g_file_storage with some parameter May 30 15:05:39 i don't remember what May 30 15:06:23 jan_: have a screenshot at hand? May 30 15:06:45 I can try to make one. Where should I send it? May 30 15:07:36 http://www.imagebin.org/ possibly May 30 15:08:00 I'm giving it a try... May 30 15:08:37 balrog: ok.. let me try in that direction May 30 15:09:08 see http://imagebin.org/19100 May 30 15:10:27 wooo minimalistic :) May 30 15:10:30 i heard they went with a minimalistic theme approach May 30 15:10:41 :-) May 30 15:11:08 At the moment it is even more minimalistic. Completely back except a remainder of a cursor.... May 30 15:11:38 Is it possible that it has to do with the backlight settings. May 30 15:11:49 nope May 30 15:12:00 jan_: have you had a chance to run the image on a real neo1973 maybe? May 30 15:12:25 openmoko: 03thomas * r4461 10/trunk/src/target/opkg/tests/libopkg_test.c: opkg: add some command line arguments to libopkg_test May 30 15:12:26 Unfortunately not.... May 30 15:13:01 In the console I see: s3c_mmci_writew: Bad register 0x38 May 30 15:13:02 neo_bl_intensity: LCD Backlight now at 0/64. May 30 15:13:04 s3c_gpio_read: Bad register 0x94 May 30 15:13:05 s3c_gpio_read: Bad register 0x98 May 30 15:13:10 these are normal May 30 15:13:43 i'm not sure what may be causing this if it is qemu-related May 30 15:14:07 jan_: is it a more or less standard build? May 30 15:14:36 Completely standard. May 30 15:14:38 I just followed the instructions on the wiki May 30 15:15:05 How can I get a shell in the qemu? May 30 15:15:32 what is the problem jan_ ? May 30 15:16:20 I think there is something wrong with the xserver on my qemu emulation. May 30 15:16:21 I had a strange screen, now it is completely black. May 30 15:16:33 jan_: one of the categories in the launcher (the down arrow button i believe) should contain "terminal" May 30 15:16:52 I have the same problem first the screen is black and white May 30 15:17:19 then it turn completely black if you don't touch the mouse May 30 15:17:22 Is it the same as http://imagebin.org/19100 ? May 30 15:17:41 * balrog-kun will try it out later May 30 15:17:50 yep same things here May 30 15:18:19 avoine, what platform are you using to run qemu? May 30 15:18:21 I'm on Fedora9 64 bit May 30 15:18:35 I'm on ubuntu 32bit May 30 15:18:56 ok, so probably not platform specific. May 30 15:19:19 I had to build a local qemu image be able to see it running normally May 30 15:20:14 OK, I can try that as well. Did you simply follow the instruction on the wiki to do the build? May 30 15:20:33 I mean: make qemu-local was working for me with the mokomakefile in the svn May 30 15:20:55 OK I will try that... May 30 15:21:08 follow this: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile May 30 15:21:18 And take the svn makefile May 30 15:23:07 Thanks for the pointer. Trying this will take me some time. I will come back with the results. May 30 15:23:12 anybody here html/css skills in browser-interoperability? May 30 15:23:36 a webdesigners chance to help om out ;) May 30 15:25:29 * SpeedEvil uses the power of plain text websites with no CSS! May 30 15:25:37 * mjr too! May 30 15:25:48 only gets one into more troubles. May 30 15:25:51 jan_: my first guess would be that the latest OM is broken on gta01, not qemu May 30 15:26:15 but i'm biased :) May 30 15:27:00 design and content need to be seperated as much as possible, else maintaining the first will take too much manpower May 30 15:29:27 the problem is basically simple: ie and safari render the sidebar in the wiki shifted down at the end of the page instead from top. firefox 2, 3 and opera render fine. May 30 15:29:40 it does even validate now (even if that brought no change) May 30 15:30:43 balrog-kun: I do not understand with that statement, because I am running OM on qemu, not on gta01 ? May 30 15:31:23 jan_: qemu and gta01 are supposed to run identically May 30 15:31:29 if they don't then it's a qemu bug May 30 15:32:04 roh: you may have more luck in #ie or #safari as most people probably use firefox or something gtk based here May 30 15:32:23 on the other hand people in #ie won't have any idea about the differences :p May 30 15:33:13 or #html May 30 15:36:42 *sigh* May 30 15:47:49 where do i find g_ether and g_file_storage May 30 15:47:52 in openmoko May 30 16:00:31 can I move an object around with acts_as_nested_set? May 30 16:36:03 openmoko: 03roh * r4462 10/trunk/feeds/ (. community-repository/ community-repository/file-index.txt): May 30 16:36:03 openmoko: - add stub for community repository May 30 16:36:03 openmoko: - this file should later contain the list of tested and acknowledged files on projects, which then get assembled into the community feed May 30 16:56:39 cesarb__: Certainly no problem. It's not as if I've done a lot to make the neo nicer in the last few months :-) May 30 16:57:18 roh: the bluetooth in freerunner is identical to GTA01? May 30 17:33:07 Adding up the things listed in http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_GTA01_Power_Management that are normally active on my neo, I get about 335 mW of power used in normal, idle, settings May 30 17:33:25 but dividing 3500 mWh by 5 h of idle time before it dies, I get 700 mW May 30 17:33:34 Does anyone know why the big discrepancy? May 30 17:35:06 I'm adding: 140 mW for idle processor at 200 MHz, 45 mW for idle gsm, 80mW for LCD driver, ~72 mW for memory bus usage to send data to lcd May 30 17:35:47 (I got the 72mW figure from the 1mW/MB figure on the pm page, then multiplied 640x480x4 bytesx60Hz refresh rate) May 30 17:36:06 wurp2: maybe one should mesure May 30 17:36:17 Yeah, one should May 30 17:36:22 One with the equipment :-/ May 30 17:36:36 I only have crappy ammeters May 30 17:36:46 wurp2: i tried to build a dummy batery for that.... but had no time May 30 17:37:08 wurp2: shure, that's the next prob May 30 17:37:35 I just hoped someone had a clue what I was missing :-( May 30 17:38:32 I'll post the Q to the list. May 30 17:38:49 emdete: Have you tested battery life running Zad? May 30 17:39:04 afk 4 a bit... May 30 17:42:05 openmoko: 03roh * r4463 10/trunk/feeds/community-repository/file-index.txt: - add test May 30 17:43:29 wurp2: shure. no difference. i get around 5h incl gprs, gsm, gps on. May 30 17:43:39 wurp2: i am the steady-on guy ;) May 30 17:44:38 Yeah, I have been keeping my gps off May 30 17:44:50 But after actually looking at power usage, I think I'm gonna keep it on all the time May 30 17:44:55 doesnt seem to take too much May 30 17:45:00 Why do you list gprs and gsm separately? May 30 17:45:12 wurp2: it is seperated May 30 17:45:18 Separate hw? May 30 17:45:21 gsm means you receive calls and sms May 30 17:45:33 gprs is a steady on connection (more or less) May 30 17:45:38 so gprs makes the gsm radio more active May 30 17:45:44 some parts of zad make use of it May 30 17:45:47 yes May 30 17:46:03 so 5h without any pm in my app/daemons is quite good May 30 17:46:26 And on Zad, gprs gets disconnected while you're actually on a call, but reconnects automatically when you get off? May 30 17:46:34 yes. May 30 17:46:40 Or maybe reconnects automatically the next time it's asked for after you get off the call/sms May 30 17:46:50 yeah, 5h with gprs on all the time is very nice May 30 17:46:57 other phones are able to do different but the neo cant do gprs and a call at a time May 30 17:47:02 Considering that I only get 4-5 hrs with it off using OM stack May 30 17:47:25 Did someone got this segfault? http://pastebin.com/f186a9e30 May 30 17:51:17 otavio: I guess not :-) May 30 17:51:56 I'm building HEAD of opkg to see if it's still reproducable May 30 17:53:48 wurp2: my CPU runs 266 MHz (according to dmesg), not 200 May 30 17:58:42 wurp2, emdete: does anyone have documentation on the magic low-power modes for the Calypso? One of the big (huge, actually) power issues on the GTA01 is that even when suspended the GSM seems to suck way too much power. May 30 17:59:11 wurp2: my first tests where 3h, i think the battery need some charging cycles before havin full capacity May 30 17:59:59 mwester: i only know that signaling over serial line sux. May 30 18:00:21 signaling? May 30 18:00:48 mwester: i don't see a neo without a muxer, so the muxer has to do all the power mngmt but the modem does not implement it as specified May 30 18:00:52 mwester: wakeup May 30 18:01:14 mwester: the modem sleeps in general and on avery single channel... that weird May 30 18:01:44 mwester: there is no deterministic way to know when it slept away and when you have to wake it May 30 18:01:49 I don't understand -- why would it sleep on the channels? That seems ridiculous? May 30 18:02:10 (i.e. how could it sleep on one but not another?) May 30 18:04:07 emdete: did I see you open a bug on corrupted packets? May 30 18:06:25 yes May 30 18:06:43 mwester: yes, sleeping channels are braindead May 30 18:07:33 the packet problem apears after days of using the modem heavily. or after hours if you do alot with the modem. seems to get something corrupted over time May 30 18:08:28 how problematic would it be to get a palm/symbian software running on the om? May 30 18:08:36 the heavily obove was related to the bug: you get lots of truncated packages... May 30 18:09:23 tomboy64: you dont want to May 30 18:09:26 tomboy64: like writing wine i think May 30 18:09:37 * tomboy64 starts crying May 30 18:09:46 tomboy64: what do you miss? May 30 18:09:48 * tomboy64 wants some working navigational software on the om May 30 18:09:53 unless you use an emulator May 30 18:10:01 balrog-kun: i was afraid so :( May 30 18:10:23 emdete: i planned on using it as a navigational tool when i'm around on my bike/car May 30 18:10:52 until i found out roadnav and navit are the only ones supporting om so far - and both are unusable in their current state. May 30 18:10:57 tomboy64: so you are the guy implementing a open source navigation tool for biking... May 30 18:11:14 :-D May 30 18:11:33 tomboy64: i think, things will grow... it takes some time butyou will get what you want May 30 18:11:33 * tomboy64 is surprised he suddenly can program May 30 18:11:44 i think so, too May 30 18:11:57 but i need that navigation in 2 months May 30 18:12:05 tomboy64: you can help with other stuff too May 30 18:12:10 and i'm thinking about getting a smartphone with support for it :-/ May 30 18:12:14 hi all, just a thought regarding my GSoC project with odeviced...how about a GPS plugin that emits signals even the co.ordinates change? May 30 18:12:19 <--- noob May 30 18:12:22 no flames May 30 18:12:52 signals as in dbus signals May 30 18:13:04 gypsy already does so and the daemon suite in zad too May 30 18:13:19 i am already programming around with a navigational tool for public transportation - one that makes use of gps, shows the plan of the current city, contains all bus-/subway-/train lines of berlin as an example May 30 18:13:44 gonna take some time till it's remotely usable, though May 30 18:14:36 emdete: Is it possible that the corrupted packets are due to UART errors rather than the GSM itself? May 30 18:14:53 tomboy64: What's wrong with navit? May 30 18:15:08 mmontour: Thanks for the heads up about 266 - I thought the 1973 ran at 200 May 30 18:15:27 mwester: shure May 30 18:15:39 mwester: so i wrote modem/kernel :D May 30 18:15:48 mwester: it even can be my muxer ;) May 30 18:16:03 wurp2: to be honest, i need commercial support since i am occasionally in need of map-material of remote areas May 30 18:16:36 tomboy64: I think navit can accept maps from some commercial formats... May 30 18:16:37 :) Ok, just checking. We can find out which... is there a simple test I can run on a Neo with a pay-as-you-go SIM? May 30 18:16:41 and until now i couldn't figure out how to import (bought!) vector material May 30 18:16:41 tomboy64: what's the map you're using? May 30 18:16:52 You have to convert the maps to navit format either way :-/ May 30 18:17:06 wurp2: it can import "großer reiseplaner" maps - which are ... broken May 30 18:17:32 and garmin's NT-format isn't supported - apart from them being encrypted :-/ May 30 18:17:36 and the issue with tango is that it doesn't do routing? May 30 18:17:44 :) May 30 18:17:55 tango is just a moving map May 30 18:17:55 * tomboy64 sighs May 30 18:18:09 tomboy64: I assume OSM is useless? May 30 18:18:14 tango is just a moving picture May 30 18:18:29 of a map May 30 18:18:29 SpeedEvil: it isn't. in crowded areas it's quite usable May 30 18:18:38 but importing all of a country is impossible right now May 30 18:18:44 * SpeedEvil contemplates people loading the Mona Lisa into TangoGPS. May 30 18:18:49 plus remote areas are insufficiently mapped. May 30 18:19:05 roadnav is promising though. but it only supports pixel-maps of the u.s. May 30 18:19:15 'I'm just next to the left nostril'. May 30 18:19:26 mmontour: Holy crap! 266 MHz uses 450mw; 200 MHz idle uses 140 mW May 30 18:19:39 I need to find out how to underclock my neo May 30 18:19:44 :-D May 30 18:19:50 wurp2: where did you get that number? May 30 18:19:56 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_GTA01_Power_Management May 30 18:19:59 wurp2: ah - no May 30 18:20:22 That was way back - I think that was estimated from the datasheet. May 30 18:20:29 ah May 30 18:20:35 Do you know where I can find better figures? May 30 18:20:45 Does cesarb__ have some figures from his dynamic clock work? May 30 18:20:45 I need to make some measurements. May 30 18:20:50 I posted a bunch of stuff about power usage on the neo earlier hoping to bait you out May 30 18:20:58 :-) May 30 18:21:18 s/posted/commented about on irc/ May 30 18:21:47 wurp2: according to http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Bootloader_commands you can change the clock speed from the u-boot console May 30 18:22:03 wuwu: the relevant figures are # 320mW @ 200MHz May 30 18:22:04 # 450mW @ 266MHz May 30 18:22:05 openmoko: 03roh * r4464 10/trunk/feeds/community-repository/file-index.txt: testtest May 30 18:22:21 I see the 320, but it also says 140 if the cpu is idle May 30 18:22:38 I realize that I wasn't apples-to-apples there since there's no idle figure for 266 MHz May 30 18:23:13 wurp2: however, I think this may have been datasheet. I hope to get current measurement figures in the next few days. May 30 18:23:26 wurp2: life and lack of funds have been getting in my way. May 30 18:24:28 I'll try to remember this weekend to underclock my neo and document some of the experience May 30 18:24:57 especially battery life May 30 18:25:13 SpeedEvil: Life. Such a hassle. May 30 18:55:30 for an end user application what would be the sensible location to store an sqlite db file on the neo? May 30 18:58:11 im guessing /usr/share/{name of application}/ May 30 18:58:35 zedstar: or somewhere in /var ?! May 30 18:58:49 /media/card/? May 30 18:59:44 yeh media card be good for potentially big db May 30 19:00:08 zedstar: Make it user-configurable, with a default of /media/card/.system, /opt/whatever or /var/whatever May 30 19:00:47 Reason: If the rootfs is filled up there is *only* one way to recover: reflashing May 30 19:00:56 yeh sure May 30 19:02:34 i will add user configurable later but is just a silly little program to log bt device names and times May 30 19:08:38 zedstar: /var/lib/something is probably best if it's small or if the user has their rootfs on SD, otherwise /media/card/... May 30 19:09:50 yeh thanks...i think /var will do until i add command line options to configure it May 30 19:22:50 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey * re18fef3462c6 10/otapi/ (5 files): May 30 19:22:50 freesmartphone.org: otapi specs: apply first batch of change requests from May 30 19:22:50 freesmartphone.org: http://lists.linuxtogo.org/pipermail/smartphones-standards/2008-May/000060.html May 30 19:34:19 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * rc19a34228944 10/packages/qtopia-phone/qtopia-phone-x11_4.3.1.bb: [qtopia] Fix packaging and install the application icons again May 30 19:34:20 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r9f95120ec47b 10/packages/e17/e-wm_cvs.bb: e-wm_cvs.bb : Install the applications.menu as config file May 30 19:34:20 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r1c1bcef5b7b3 10/packages/tasks/task-openmoko-qtopia-x11.bb: [openmoko] Do not install the callhistory icon, it can be reached from the dialer May 30 19:34:21 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r3f6e54fca847 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): qtopia-phone-x11_4.3.1.bb : Update Qtopia, build a version with timezone fixes May 30 19:34:24 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r02d7eaeeaea9 10/packages/qtopia-phone/qtopia-phone-x11_4.3.1.bb: [qtopia] The -app-data packages depend on the actual application May 30 19:34:27 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r5d659f1d12cc 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): qtopia-phone-x11_4.3.1.bb : Upgrade Qtopia and make it work with png AND/OR May 30 19:34:30 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r97de5b4be64b 10/packages/qtopia-phone/qtopia-phone-x11_4.3.1.bb: [qtopia] Do not install the qtopia-qasteroids.desktop as we don't have a binary for that May 30 19:34:33 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r3b32661e45e8 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [qtopia] Update Qtopia to get better icons for illume May 30 19:34:36 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r38296eb3dd06 10/conf/distro/include/ (sane-srcdates.inc sane-srcrevs.inc): [sane-srcrev] Update illume and efl May 30 19:34:45 openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * r83a64086c9a9 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [sane-srcrevs] Update opkg, opkg-native, opkg-sdk to 4448 May 30 19:34:48 openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * r7798dd572f5a 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [sane-srcrevs] Update assassin to 135 May 30 19:34:51 openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * rc2563ddf4c55 10/packages/tasks/task-openmoko-qtopia-x11.bb: Add etk-theme-ninja into image May 30 19:34:54 openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * r1fe19f651211 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [sane-srcrevs] Update diversity-daemon to 386 May 30 19:34:57 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r10258792f173 10/packages/e17/e-wm/applications.menu: [e-wm] Do not show System;Settings categories for ASU/illume May 30 19:35:00 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r59fba4eaaa25 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): [qtopia] Upgrade and adjust packaging. More icons for Qtopia May 30 19:35:07 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.dev * r65c8c716d7e4 10/packages/dhcp/dhcp_3.0.2.bb: fix build to call 'make links' so dhcp compiles. May 30 19:35:10 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.dev * r0de0d222ce73 10/packages/efl1/epsilon_cvs.bb: upstream epsilon no-longer need imlib2. deprecation time as a dependency. May 30 19:35:13 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.dev * r55aabe78ae17 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: up illume to rev 98 - new config and config icons filtered out. May 30 19:35:16 o.O May 30 19:35:18 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r602594514e33 10/conf/distro/openmoko.conf: [openmoko] Install a small hint when a certain image was built and what was used May 30 19:35:21 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r16c4e5fb9b09 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [sane-srcrevs] Upgrade the kernel to the latest stable one May 30 19:35:24 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * rdc45b9986b4f 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): [qtopia] More recent version to get the life-cycle of Qtopia fixed May 30 19:35:29 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * rfd1e6e3b0c91 10/packages/openmoko-projects/etk-theme-ninja_svn.bb: NO AUTOREV! May 30 19:35:32 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r2575856dafe9 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): [qtopia] Increase the Qtopia version May 30 19:35:35 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r6c0f3483aced 10/conf/distro/include/ (moko-autorev.inc sane-srcrevs.inc): [srcrev] Add revs for the etk ninja theme May 30 19:35:40 openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * r7ff67720a036 10/packages/openmoko-projects/ (diversity-nav/switch-gps.patch diversity-nav_svn.bb): [diversity] Add patch to diversity-nav May 30 19:35:43 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * rde0704982e66 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [srcrev] Build a more recent version of illume May 30 19:35:46 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r6aed353b2551 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcdates.inc: [srcdate] Bump the EFL SRCDATE to the 28th of May May 30 19:35:53 openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * rc92c8e76037b 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [sane-srcrevs] update diversity-nav to 391 May 30 19:35:56 openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * rfe89911b035a 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [sane-srcrevs] Update opkg to 4452 May 30 19:35:59 openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * rdcd8afd795f1 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [sane-srcrevs] Update Assassin to 141 May 30 19:36:04 (1 lines omitted) May 30 19:39:01 SpeedEvil jap, afaik the same module used May 30 19:39:11 csr4 or such May 30 19:41:37 i hope they change the bluetooth chipset from csr4rom to csr4ext May 30 19:41:47 it would be so much better for bt devel May 30 19:42:43 whats the difference? May 30 19:43:00 upgradable firmware May 30 19:43:18 can't you upload it into ram and execute there? May 30 19:43:43 no its in the bluetooth chipset May 30 19:43:55 i mean.. these thingies say they speak DFU May 30 19:44:03 same with the one in my thinkpad May 30 19:44:42 but u didn't dare to upload something in hope there is a bootloader which survives May 30 19:44:57 yes the do but the one used in gt1 is read only, you cannot upload new dfu to the chipset May 30 19:45:39 is there some way to test that revision? May 30 19:45:41 yeah well you take the chance i guess :p May 30 19:45:56 Are there things we could do with bt that we're restricted from because of the closed firmware? May 30 19:46:25 lots May 30 19:46:35 flood 2.4ghz and make devices blow up? May 30 19:46:44 No - more interesting than that. May 30 19:46:49 monitoring but can be used for bad eg. sniffing data that are not to be sniffed :/ May 30 19:47:14 For example, waking the SoC only on interesting events. May 30 19:47:41 (neglecting that there is no wake-on-bt line) May 30 19:47:43 Isn't it connected via USB though? May 30 19:48:23 geez, please really care about the size of the audio plug May 30 19:48:24 dont know never had one May 30 19:48:37 ljp: bike shead :) May 30 19:48:40 im waiting for it :< May 30 19:50:48 i'm still waiting for the post where we get to choose the case :) May 30 19:51:12 cb22: yes May 30 19:51:51 and the usb can wake up the cpu? May 30 19:52:08 It's not quite that simple. May 30 19:52:18 With USB active, most of the CPU has to be up. May 30 19:52:23 Is the userspace muxer available in the standard OM build somehow? May 30 19:52:41 The BT chipset supports extra wires to wake the CPU from sleep - but these are not brought out to the CPU May 30 19:53:58 * mwester thinks that we should shrink one of these, and put it in the neo. Why waste time with crappy little bluetooth injection?!! http://www.emtron.com.au/amplifiers_dx3.php :p May 30 19:54:13 * cb22 seconds May 30 19:54:40 You can do much much more interesting things than injection with BT May 30 19:56:03 I still dunno what any of those things are that we could do w/ firmware. I can see that it could give more flexibility in wake-on-bt, but honestly that doesn't really do anything for me :-) May 30 19:56:04 Yeah, I know. The stock answer is just like the crew that wants packet injection on the wifi: "I'm just going to use it to do security testing on my personal wireless". Right-o. May 30 19:56:07 For example, pretend to be a BT headset. May 30 19:56:20 It can't do that right now? May 30 19:56:21 Your phone is suspended. May 30 19:56:28 Your carphone gets a call May 30 19:56:48 It talks to its BT paired headset - the neo - which wakes - and does whatever. May 30 19:57:07 That sounds like an edge case to me May 30 19:57:07 And no, it can't do that now - it has to be awake with USB on. May 30 19:57:32 (to be fair, it would have to have the wake-on-bt line too. Open firmware wouldn't fix that...) May 30 19:57:40 mwester: please, what else would you use it for :p May 30 19:57:43 You get into your car, and the phone wakes from suspend as the BT device that is the car appears May 30 19:57:54 It then configures into car mode - whatever that is. May 30 19:58:15 That would be cool, but I dunno anyone who has bt in their car May 30 19:58:17 cb22: Of course, of course. nobody would EVER use it to crack other people's wireless connections, now would they? That would be, well, "not-nice". May 30 19:58:40 However - at the moment - essentially all of these interesting apps require the wake on BT line May 30 19:58:57 wurp2: for muxer in om stack above: yes and no May 30 19:58:58 wurp2: it's in many cars as an option. May 30 19:59:03 I'm *so* pleased at so many people who are all *so* worried about their *own* wireless security, that they keep the equipment turned on in their cars as they drive about. May 30 19:59:07 wurp2: no: the muxer uses dbus, om does not May 30 19:59:24 I guess, so that they can test *their own* wireless as soon as they pull into their garage.! May 30 19:59:40 mwester: i fully agree, sometimes they like to help test their neighbours wifi for them May 30 19:59:44 such good citizens May 30 19:59:45 wurp2: yes: you can use a shellscript that uses dbus-send to allocate a channel and hang libgsmd on it. that is everything but reliable... May 30 19:59:55 wurp2, From my seat right now I can connect to two cars parked on the street. May 30 20:00:02 Via bluetooth, I mean. May 30 20:00:16 i am annoyed by 'wireless security' May 30 20:00:29 kdean06: Weird, I haven't heard of bt in cars other than in this room, and am not sure what I would use it for May 30 20:00:33 cb22: my eyes fill with tears of gratefulness at all those who have tried to help *me* out by personally testing my wireless connections and firewalls for me. I will certainly do everything I can to help them use the Neo to continue their wonderful kind efforts. May 30 20:00:39 ahah, I think I found the gta01 ASU segfaukt May 30 20:00:43 makes wifi unusable for guests and doesnt add security, yet people who do not get it/have no clue rely on it May 30 20:00:45 Other than diagnostics in a shop, and you can just physically connect then May 30 20:00:58 XorA|gone: so, to speak, it should be gone now ^-^ May 30 20:01:10 cb22: do you have a defive ready to tests? May 30 20:01:11 crypto is either end-to-end or useless... so.. use ssl/tls and free your accesspoints May 30 20:01:30 emdete: You're saying I can put libgsmd on the dbus, but it's very unreliable to do so? May 30 20:01:36 s/defive/device/ May 30 20:01:37 XorA|gone meant: cb22: do you have a device ready to tests? May 30 20:01:38 XorA|gone: unfortunatly not :( /me points at SpeedEvil May 30 20:01:40 roh: you are correct. I use VPNs internally where security matters. May 30 20:01:48 or anyone else that is lucky enough to have one May 30 20:02:01 wurp2, Okay, I suppose it's technically the other devices in the vehicle. Such as handsfree calling through the stereo system, song transfer to the stereo, maps downloads from the built in GPS... May 30 20:02:05 well, i just happen to live next to the chines embassy May 30 20:02:08 cb22: you dont have gta01? May 30 20:02:35 * mwester has a gta01... but his last gta01 asu build was many days ago. May 30 20:02:47 so i set up a wifi network with the ssid 'FreeTibet', and the only website accessable is www.freetibet.org no dns or icmp or anything else May 30 20:02:53 XorA|gone: nope May 30 20:03:03 wurp2: i say: alloc a channel from muxer (via dbus) that's a unix dev in /dev. tell this the libgsmd May 30 20:03:04 cb22: that's funny! :D May 30 20:03:22 hrhr May 30 20:03:28 mwester: doesnt matter, can you check whether ttf-dejavu-common_2.23-r0_all.ipk ttf-dejavu-sans_2.23-r0_all.ipk font-update-common_0.1-r0_all.ipk got installed May 30 20:03:29 wurp2: but if libgsmd crashes who takes care of the garbage May 30 20:03:43 mwester: and if not install them and reboot and see if qpe stays running? May 30 20:03:47 * mwester goes to check his build... May 30 20:03:57 ah, so the problem is that libgsmd is not stable enough? May 30 20:04:33 they've portscanned my server a few times - its an isolated pentium 2 running openbsd, so i dont think they are going anywhere, i'm gonna wait for them to come knocking on my door May 30 20:05:35 mwester: its gonna take me a couple of hours to make an image May 30 20:06:32 wurp2: yes and no: anyway i design things to be restartable.. this contruct is not May 30 20:07:03 emdete: Currently whenever my gsm flakes out on me, I have to restart my neo anyway :-( May 30 20:07:30 emdete: I need to try stopping gsmd, powering off the gsm, powering up gsm, starting gsmd May 30 20:07:47 emdete: But I know just restarting gsmd doesn't help :-( May 30 20:07:50 say, on the mailing lists there was a post about gta03 having otg, correct or mere typo? (considering i think 03 doesnt exist) May 30 20:08:03 wurp2: see... May 30 20:08:04 s/think/heard/ May 30 20:08:04 cb22 meant: say, on the mailing lists there was a post about gta03 having otg, correct or mere typo? (considering i heard 03 doesnt exist) May 30 20:08:21 wurp2: no comment on that... May 30 20:08:33 03 now exists again May 30 20:08:44 It used not to exist, then it exists again. May 30 20:09:11 There was internal debate as to drop it - hich seemed to have won, and push on with 04 May 30 20:09:24 Then that went the other way May 30 20:09:45 SpeedEvil: is this on any ML by any chance? May 30 20:10:04 No - stuff from IRC. May 30 20:10:07 i recommend not speculating about 03, 04, 05 as concrete devices May 30 20:10:09 Mainly raster I think May 30 20:10:52 But until we actually see shipping product, I'd hesitate on considering 02, 03, 04 concrete product :) May 30 20:10:55 mickey|berlin: Now you have us speculating about 05, which I hadn't heard mentioned before ;-) May 30 20:11:01 mickey|berlin: sounds wise :-) May 30 20:11:09 ah right, mickey|berlin 05? May 30 20:11:14 gta42 is the answer May 30 20:11:28 what are we getting in new devices? :) May 30 20:11:44 gta05 should be out in 2 months!! omg ponies!! May 30 20:11:55 cb22: 2 months?! I Want it last month damn it! May 30 20:12:07 also, don't forget the kitchen sink May 30 20:12:12 and the V8 May 30 20:12:31 I heard the 05 does augmented reality with high-resolution DGPS and gyro compass, plus retina-scanning laser HUD May 30 20:12:37 * cb22 spies a 3.2mp camera in 03 May 30 20:12:44 and the nuclear reactor! May 30 20:13:00 wurp2: rawr! May 30 20:13:05 * doc|work wants! May 30 20:13:09 and a 9800gt, so we will finally have enough video bandwidth May 30 20:13:13 hahaha May 30 20:13:18 cb22: crysis?! May 30 20:13:25 on a pci-x 2 32x bus, naturally May 30 20:13:29 of course May 30 20:13:33 i wouldnt want it connected via sdio :p May 30 20:13:37 heh May 30 20:14:35 but I want my batterysized nuclear reactors! May 30 20:14:41 * zash WANTS May 30 20:14:59 just take a lipoly battery and do bad things to it May 30 20:14:59 * SpeedEvil has fission-based keyring lightsource. May 30 20:15:05 you'll get the same effect May 30 20:15:22 dont need all that, just go solar May 30 20:15:36 Kinetic charging FTW. May 30 20:16:03 kdean06: The problem with that is that techies don't move much May 30 20:16:11 No comment. May 30 20:16:25 wurp2: speak for yourself, I regularly get up and go to the fridge May 30 20:16:33 doc|work: ;-) May 30 20:16:37 :) May 30 20:16:58 You obviously need a minifridge next to each of the places you sit, like me May 30 20:17:08 You're not being efficient May 30 20:17:17 hehe May 30 20:17:28 wurp2: but then I'd just never get any exercise May 30 20:17:32 wurp2, I just ran lines up from the basement, tapping right off the kegs. May 30 20:17:34 <- disciplined May 30 20:17:38 or better placement of your 'puter -- the kitchen is ideal. May 30 20:17:45 mwester: hah May 30 20:21:23 emdete: Do you have docs about the valid keys for your dbus method parameters? May 30 20:22:51 wurp2: there are examples in the c code... is that enough? May 30 20:23:34 wurp2: the parameter is a identifier which is not needed for the modem in the neo. May 30 20:23:41 wurp2: put any string into it May 30 20:24:38 emdete: ok, thx May 30 20:25:04 I meant in general, but the specific info for the muxer is much appreciated :-) May 30 20:25:38 wurp2: not only the muxer but the whole zad stack? May 30 20:26:26 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey * ra8c3382ff8cd 10/ (4 files in 3 dirs): ophoned: refactor yield support into own mixin class AbstractYieldSupport May 30 20:28:42 emdete: Yeah, I was wondering how one goes about finding out the parms for the dbus methods May 30 20:28:50 It sounds as if the answer is "look at the C code" May 30 20:29:52 hehe May 30 20:30:29 wurp2: It's all still in flux, so indeed looking at the python code would be the best way to find out May 30 20:31:10 abraxa_: So you're using/developing for Zad too? May 30 20:31:34 Somewhat :) May 30 20:31:43 The PIM daemon I'm writing will be used for both Zad and OM May 30 20:33:50 cool May 30 20:34:40 wurp2: no, the answer is: the api is still moving, so it takes some time to get documented May 30 20:34:43 :D May 30 20:35:10 sure May 30 20:35:26 But for now, if I wanna know how to use it I look at the code May 30 20:35:34 * mwester has a brilliant idea -- and dashes off to note that *he himself* is still moving, so his boss will have to wait a while for the status report. May 30 20:35:37 It wasn't meant to be a criticism, just getting the facts straight May 30 20:35:47 :p May 30 20:57:30 is there anyone who can help me out with the microfone on the openmoko May 30 20:58:26 ram__: I know how to use arecord off it; that's it :-) May 30 20:58:47 i used arecord..but there is jus silence3 May 30 20:58:57 i dumped the wav file and it only had NULL May 30 20:59:15 it comes through very quiet for me, but it definitely records May 30 20:59:19 sec, lemme check my script May 30 21:00:34 alsactl -f /etc/capturehandset.state restore May 30 21:00:52 arecord -f cd -t wav -d $dur $filename May 30 21:01:09 can u send the capturehandset.state May 30 21:01:18 i tried with the gsmhandset.state in the wiki May 30 21:01:18 alsactl -f /etc/stereoout.state restore May 30 21:01:22 it gives an error May 30 21:01:31 capturehandset should already be in /etc, no? May 30 21:01:51 /usr/share/openmoko/scenarios/*.state May 30 21:02:18 I haven't used my record script in a long time May 30 21:02:30 Did they move some of the .state files to the loc you just gave, XorA|gone ? May 30 21:02:56 wurp2: I moved them May 30 21:03:08 heh May 30 21:03:09 missing still May 30 21:03:15 there are a few state files though May 30 21:03:45 wurp2: they werent really config files for user editing to /etc/ seemed to be a bad place May 30 21:04:18 I see. Lemme note the new loc on the wiki page where I keep such things.. May 30 21:04:33 but it sounds as if ram__ is saying that capture is not there, either May 30 21:05:01 i dont have the capture*.state file May 30 21:05:11 i hav stereoout May 30 21:05:20 and gsmhandset in the scenarios dir May 30 21:05:51 ram__: do you have a gta02? May 30 21:06:10 yeah May 30 21:06:17 ram__: ah, I never made files for that May 30 21:06:32 ram__: use the gta01 files in svn as a base May 30 21:07:11 heh, all the info I was giving you was for the 1973 May 30 21:07:28 I'm not privileged enough to have a FR yet May 30 21:07:44 :) May 30 21:08:04 Are you doing the speech recog project? May 30 21:09:36 nope...iam working on my own May 30 21:11:23 So how did you get your hands on a FR, if I may ask? May 30 21:11:42 I bought it ?! May 30 21:11:57 In India? May 30 21:12:12 They are not generally for sale... May 30 21:12:44 Not generally for sale anywhere, as far as I know May 30 21:13:09 iam at rutgers May 30 21:13:18 we bought a few 1973s May 30 21:14:03 "a few", eh? May 30 21:14:04 ;) May 30 21:19:05 And then you bought a gta02/FreeRunner? May 30 21:33:41 openmoko: 03graeme 07org.openmoko.dev * r9651a8162591 10/packages/qtopia-phone/qtopia-phone-x11_4.3.1.bb: [qtopia-phone-x11] RDEPEND on dejavu-sans as without the font qpe segfaults May 30 21:37:13 yeah May 30 21:37:23 coz i wanted wifi May 30 21:37:33 gprs doesnt help in anywayz :) May 30 21:38:56 ram__: But *where* did you buy a gta02? May 30 21:39:29 we called them up! May 30 21:39:43 Called OM? May 30 21:39:47 yeah May 30 21:39:51 ! May 30 21:40:06 And steve keeps saying on the list how we shouldn't call him harassing him about it May 30 21:40:44 thats coz iam not an individual buyer May 30 21:40:49 ah May 30 21:40:50 we buy for the skool May 30 21:40:57 excellent May 30 21:41:00 How many did you get? May 30 21:41:25 (I don't actually want one right now, but it's still very interesting to hear how people are getting their hands on them) May 30 21:41:30 we got a few...cant talk say much abt it! May 30 21:41:35 heh May 30 21:43:26 * XorA|gone plays qtopia minehunt on gta01 ASU image May 30 21:43:42 :) cool! May 30 21:43:48 * mmontour imagines steve selling Freerunners from the trunk of his car in a shopping-mall parking lot :) May 30 21:43:54 XorA|gone: is there muxing for Qtopia on the ASU image? May 30 21:45:15 wurp2: no idea what else works, thats for the community to have fun with May 30 21:48:25 XorA|gone: You mean what else besides Qtopia minehunt? ;-) May 30 21:48:50 wurp2: yes, my work is done, the games work :-) May 30 21:50:13 XorA|gone: you're working on org.openmoko.dev, not org.openmoko.asu.dev? I have been unable to build qtopia-phone-x11 for GTA01 on o.o.asu.dev or o.o.asu.stable May 30 21:50:47 mmontour: there is no support the gta01 on the ASU branch, ASU official target is freerunner May 30 21:52:15 Will the org.openmoko.dev branch be kept up-to-date with changes that are done on the ASU branch? One of the messages on a mailing list suggested that active development would be on the ASU branch, and only merged into .dev when ASU was released. May 30 21:52:32 mmontour: I did a merge today on my own time May 30 21:53:25 XorA|gone: thank you :-) May 30 21:53:52 gfx rendering in E is buggered on my image, hopefully thats a local fsckup May 30 21:56:25 have a good weekend, everyone May 30 22:28:28 there's a flash demo of the new interface...does anyone know where? May 30 22:29:41 I want a Freeruner May 30 22:29:51 s/Freeruner/Freerunner May 30 22:29:59 but I am just a 17 year old May 30 22:30:01 :( May 30 22:30:02 don't we all :/ May 30 22:30:10 there's no legal age limit :) May 30 22:30:24 but I don't have any money :( May 30 22:30:45 back when I was your age (all of 9 years ago) we got jobs to buy things :) May 30 22:31:40 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U05kZfURPig&feature=related May 30 22:31:45 all the adult geeks get to play and learn with their new fanged toy May 30 22:32:00 oh, and the obligatory: we had no shoes and had to walk up hill to school both ways, and we were happy about it too! May 30 22:32:31 You forgot about the snow. It was always snowing when we were walking to and from school. May 30 22:32:44 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xReBKNxPy6Y&feature=related May 30 22:33:18 like any 17 years old programmer May 30 22:33:27 I wanna write games for openmoko May 30 22:33:37 s/programmer/programmers May 30 22:34:06 would be cool if we have geolocation gaming or something May 30 22:34:11 mwester: I lived in Ireland, snow was very very rare May 30 22:34:17 even back then before cars May 30 22:34:39 We wrote COBOL business applications, not games. In the snow. While walking to school. Uphill. Both ways. May 30 22:34:50 with no feet May 30 22:34:54 hahaha May 30 22:35:51 oh well May 30 22:36:28 linuxxr: not videos, there was a flash interactive asu mockup May 30 22:36:29 kiba: look at it this way, when you get to our age you'll have something the power of a desktop in your phone (that's how it's working out for me). Imagine that, crysis on your phone! May 30 22:36:32 kiba: there's a simulator. May 30 22:36:37 installer was there, etc. May 30 22:36:39 Qemu May 30 22:37:08 * doc|work had a 400mhz pentium II when he was 17 May 30 22:37:21 Runs rather too slowly for game development I suspect, but it might be adequate for parts of it... May 30 22:37:42 great machine it was too, even with windows 98 because redhat 5 wouldn't support the mouse I had May 30 22:37:44 mwester: you don't try to code a FPS on that thing May 30 22:37:50 I think RPG would be perfectly alright May 30 22:38:03 as long it is turn based May 30 22:38:05 you could probably get civ running on it May 30 22:38:19 and dopewars (addictive, even if it is about selling drugs) May 30 22:38:22 * mwester remembers when dirt was newly invented. He worked on a COSMAC ELF (1802-based) with 8 toggle switches and leds when he was 17 ;) May 30 22:38:37 mwester: hah May 30 22:38:41 also, you old fart May 30 22:38:45 * doc|work runs! May 30 22:38:57 mwester is so old, he farts dust May 30 22:39:03 I are a old fart. I have kids that are older than some folks on this channel. May 30 22:39:09 everything in the past pale in comparision to modern day computers May 30 22:39:16 mwester: heh May 30 22:39:33 kiba: but we still haven't matched the human brain in many areas. May 30 22:39:36 kiba: of course, otherwise we're doing something very very wrong. What do you think we are? politicians? May 30 22:39:41 I still have that functional 8 years old computer...ridicilously slow and ridiclious low on hard drive May 30 22:40:02 make me wonders how we managed to get a use of it May 30 22:40:04 kiba: sure, but then it ran like a dream. Remember, software had much less functionality/bloat May 30 22:40:13 no vista back in them days May 30 22:40:51 I used to play age of empires II on that 400mhz gateway, with its 8mb graphics card, and it wasn't even slightly slow May 30 22:40:53 minimalism is good, in a lot of cases. I think a lot of apps are guilty of "GUI-first" coding. "Let's write something really cool-looking, and then see if it does anythign useful!" May 30 22:41:01 mwester: yeah May 30 22:41:24 I don't care much for performances until it become a problem May 30 22:41:50 mine is a low-end computer May 30 22:41:53 Openmoko (the software) is kind of a study in extremes though -- it runs on a tiny little device, but needs a whopping big system to build it. May 30 22:41:55 kiba: sure, but 10 apps all running, each developed by someone who doesn't care much for performance leads to .... firefox.... May 30 22:41:58 * doc|work smacks May 30 22:42:19 yeah, firefox was nice while it lasted. Now IE starts up faster. May 30 22:42:35 well, ff3 is supposed to be nicer, although I think I'll be sticking with epiphany May 30 22:42:45 especially given its getting a webkit backend May 30 22:42:50 mmmm May 30 22:43:12 mwester: i am old enough to have a daught move to netherlands and get married May 30 22:43:22 daughter, that is May 30 22:43:54 ;) Next step is grandkids! May 30 22:44:41 hmmmm May 30 22:52:32 thats why slackwarem is so great May 30 22:53:28 erm, what? :) May 30 23:17:47 wellll... its trac now May 31 00:10:16 yay - finally got my openmoko-qtopia-x11-image to build (from the org.openmoko.dev branch) May 31 00:17:54 mwester: I don't have a current measuring rig, and didn't try measuring "time until death" or something like that, so no, I have no figures May 31 00:18:15 I am jealous of soon to be owners of Freerunner May 31 00:36:31 kiba: why? because they will soon get a wonderful new phone with a completely working software stack? ;-) May 31 00:38:58 yyyyyyyyyup May 31 00:50:52 balrog-kun, mmontour: Thanks much for your advice a few days ago about getting USSD data. By using the low level access to the gsm by cu, I got the info I was looking for. May 31 01:08:06 Does anyone know what to do to get gsmd working again after you use gprs? May 31 01:55:22 wurp2|away: What's the magic AT command to enable USSD data? May 31 02:02:06 AT%sudo USSD :) May 31 02:04:37 'at%sudo' is not recognized as an internal or external command, operable program, or batch file. May 31 02:04:45 C:\> May 31 02:06:07 haha May 31 02:06:41 mwester: did you have to remind everyone? the C:\> carries traumatic experience May 31 02:07:47 s May 31 02:09:27 * balrog-kun plays with the Glamo chip May 31 02:29:21 * mwester suggests he try 10,000 volts to see if will "voom" **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat May 31 02:59:57 2008