**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Jul 11 02:59:56 2008 Jul 11 03:00:28 ok Jul 11 03:00:35 air has no brokerage? Jul 11 03:00:55 but is $50 more? so it is the same? Jul 11 03:01:03 yeah Jul 11 03:01:11 it's really, really stupid Jul 11 03:01:17 can I haz phone now? Jul 11 03:01:17 #2039 i got no track # yet:) Jul 11 03:01:35 LetoTo: the same, but faster Jul 11 03:02:08 i have 8.19 us dollars tied up in shipping im very concerned about by the way Jul 11 03:02:23 http://www.ups.com/content/ca/en/shipping/cost/zones/customs_clearance.html Jul 11 03:02:35 handy reference for us Canuckistans Jul 11 03:02:37 damn, should have known that :P Jul 11 03:02:44 we all find out the hard way :p Jul 11 03:02:48 well, most of us Jul 11 03:02:51 to never use UPS Jul 11 03:03:11 USPS -> Canada Post is 5 bucks Jul 11 03:03:16 often times without gst/pst as well Jul 11 03:03:54 but USPS gives their stuff to Perulator Jul 11 03:04:04 which wont deliver to appartment buildings Jul 11 03:04:12 and you end up having to go to their deport Jul 11 03:04:33 i wanna go pick up a freefruune Jul 11 03:04:39 do they? I usually get it via Canada Post Jul 11 03:04:43 ... I think Jul 11 03:04:45 i dont understand the retarded mail and banking systems of North America. It's like I'm back in the stone age Jul 11 03:04:50 LetoTo: purolator have delivered to me in an apartment Jul 11 03:04:55 but i dont live in an apartment Jul 11 03:05:24 OK, it's been almost a week Jul 11 03:05:30 LetoTo: in any case, I'm having mine delivered to work so it's a moot point, purolator would have been fine :/ Jul 11 03:05:40 wurp2|truly_away: you're not truly away Jul 11 03:05:44 Why the fuck does the OM store server still throw a 500 when a CC payment is declined Jul 11 03:05:44 wurp|lying Jul 11 03:05:47 sorry Jul 11 03:05:47 I should have delivered mine to work Jul 11 03:05:55 haha Jul 11 03:05:57 that's better Jul 11 03:06:00 wonder if there is a larger scale image available of http://www.fsf.org/blogs/community/5-reasons-to-avoid-iphone-3g/iphone3g-small.png Jul 11 03:06:06 nah Jul 11 03:06:08 it sucks Jul 11 03:06:15 that won't go over well on digg :p Jul 11 03:06:20 try reddit Jul 11 03:06:29 much, much less Apple fanboys Jul 11 03:06:32 wurp2|lying: I think that's the fault of the processor, not OM, om hands off the processing to some third party Jul 11 03:07:10 That's one crappy processor Jul 11 03:07:15 "iPhone exposes your whereabouts and provides ways for others to track you without your knowledge." Jul 11 03:07:21 in fairness, so does *every* phone Jul 11 03:07:27 hahaha Jul 11 03:07:48 It's even worse than I thought, OM left it like that for 5 days... nope, someone who does it professionally left it like that for god knows how long Jul 11 03:08:01 Does anyone know where the "openmoko-keyboard" package can be found? Jul 11 03:08:09 rtm: Nowhere, afiak Jul 11 03:08:12 er, afaik Jul 11 03:08:21 But ScaredyCat has the matchbox-keyboard one Jul 11 03:08:31 pretty soon u wont even hit the ground with a heart attack an the ambulance will already be there Jul 11 03:08:33 which looks/works almost identically Jul 11 03:08:59 johnsu01: ping? Jul 11 03:09:09 wurp2: Do you know how I can make opkg check ScardyCat's repository? Jul 11 03:09:14 doc|home: yes, but if your phone is free software, you could prevent it from doing that (by turning it off) Jul 11 03:09:34 doc|home: proprietary phones allow the carrier to activate the phone remotely Jul 11 03:09:40 johnsu01: entirely a fair point. Maybe you could add that? Jul 11 03:09:52 LetoTo: I do have a larger scale image if you'd like Jul 11 03:10:12 johnsu01: I didn't know that; got a link handy? Jul 11 03:10:30 johnsu01: have you checked that when you disable gsm on the freerunner, it actually removes power from the chip with no triggering possible remotely? Jul 11 03:10:34 johnsu01:: did you make it? Jul 11 03:10:42 johnsu01: I'm not saying it doesn't, just, that'd rock :) Jul 11 03:10:53 freerunner: the phone for drug dealers :D Jul 11 03:10:58 http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2006/12/remotely_eavesd_1.html for example Jul 11 03:10:59 johnsu01: who has the copyright on it? I kinda want to put it on a tshirt for Hope next week :) Jul 11 03:11:14 * doc|home passes LetoTo a beer Jul 11 03:11:17 LetoTo: It's copyright FSF, you could certainly put it on a shirt if you like, give me your email and I'll send the svg Jul 11 03:11:19 rtm: its listed here http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Repositories Jul 11 03:11:48 That FSF article is really good stuff. Jul 11 03:11:58 KrisAbsinthe: Thanks! Jul 11 03:12:04 np Jul 11 03:12:13 Well OpenMoko should be immune to using the phone as a bug.. Jul 11 03:12:28 johnsu01: So I /have/ read that before, and had forgotten. *sigh* Thanks. Jul 11 03:12:33 even if the GSM modem is owned, all its audio depends on the mixer outside of it which is controlled by free software. Jul 11 03:12:54 it could still possibly be used as a tracking beacon, unless the phone can power the radio module down completely. Jul 11 03:12:55 johnsu01: s/and like other proprietary GPS-enabled phones/and like other proprietary phones/ perhaps? Jul 11 03:13:02 gmaxwell: dont use gsm, use voip :) Jul 11 03:13:03 johnsu01: GPS isn't necessary for location tracking Jul 11 03:13:19 * LetoTo is an openswan developer. guess what the first app is going to be :) Jul 11 03:13:20 doc|home: yeah, I considered that (and still am)... GPS just makes the tracking more accurate I guess Jul 11 03:13:25 LetoTo, right, but if power isn't turned off to the GSM modem completely.... Jul 11 03:13:31 johnsu01: aye Jul 11 03:13:44 johnsu01: now I kinda wish I did have time to read this earlier :) Jul 11 03:14:23 The only way to completly remove power from the GSM on the freerunner (and the neo, too) is to pull out the battery along with the external charger. Jul 11 03:15:12 johnsu01: very nice article Jul 11 03:15:49 mwester, the power traces to the gsm modem wouldn't happen to be on an outer layer of the board would they? Jul 11 03:16:03 :0 dunno, actually. Jul 11 03:16:10 * retracile likes the way gmaxwell thinks :) Jul 11 03:17:51 doc|home: thanks! Jul 11 03:18:12 also, how does the modem connect? does it have exposed pins or is it a bga part? ... if it has exposed pins someone could cut the power wire and redirect it giving the phone a kill switch. ;) Jul 11 03:18:20  gmaxwell: no just use GSM for transport, not for voice. use a data call with voip encryption, or a wifi call with voip encryption Jul 11 03:18:24 Just having instructions for doing that on the wiki would make some people very happy. :) Jul 11 03:18:45 LetoTo, that doesn't at all help you if someone is remotely enabling the GSM radio in order to use it to track your *location*. Jul 11 03:19:15 you can't help revealing location on gsm. Jul 11 03:19:24 Wrap it in aluminum foil, that'll work too. And don't forget to clip to ground wire to a nearby ground (that would be good for the tin-foil hats too). Jul 11 03:19:29 if you need that, buy an openmoko 10 pack :) Jul 11 03:19:35 LetoTo, you can't if you fully power off the gsm modem. Jul 11 03:19:55 er s/can't/can/ Jul 11 03:20:02 but then you cannot do GSM data calls or GPRS/EDGE either :P Jul 11 03:20:20 I'd rather talk encrypted, then not at all :) Jul 11 03:20:29 LetoTo, yes. But you could still use wifi. Ideally if you've disabled the modem it should be realllly disabled. Jul 11 03:20:37 and with more wifi/wimax, it will be required less and less Jul 11 03:20:50 well, with wifi you're also pretty detectable Jul 11 03:21:08 besides Jul 11 03:21:17 letoto: but not in a manner which would make it easy for someone to use your phone as a tracking device. ;) Jul 11 03:21:19 I am not so much worried for targetted attacks on my phone Jul 11 03:21:30 I am worried about blanket passive widespread monitoring Jul 11 03:21:33 if your so worried about being tracked then maybe your best off not carrying a phone or wifi capable device Jul 11 03:21:38 In any case this is not something that concerns *me*, but it does concern some others.. and it's not entirely unreasonable. Jul 11 03:21:43 Wimax is _quite_ detectable. Jul 11 03:21:51 i talked to a few human rights groups Jul 11 03:21:59 stevenSn, sure .. but it seems stupid to not be able to fully disable the radios. Jul 11 03:22:05 they really want a phone that they can dare make calls on in china or south america Jul 11 03:22:28 LetoTo, unless encryption is made a default thing the use of it will still put them at risk. :( Jul 11 03:22:35 so voip over ipsec to an asterisk PBX, then from there via some SIP/POTS to their US offices Jul 11 03:22:46 OTP-SMS is easy Jul 11 03:23:04 SMS should just die in favour of IM, and for IM we have things like OTR Jul 11 03:23:10 letoto, it's an ethical issue.. the authors of communication software should always build in automatic transparent encryption. .. but they don't.. oh well.. Jul 11 03:23:22 * LetoTo wants to have a look at the IM client shipped iwth openmoko and ensure OTR is on it Jul 11 03:23:50 No but OM device owners can make crypto for SMS and voice' Jul 11 03:23:51 gmaxwell: you're talking to one of the developers of IPsec Opportunistic Encryption. Trust me, we tried Jul 11 03:24:21 crypto on SMS is hard, due to the 160 chars. you end up either writing your own crypto (hard!) or using multiple sms'es per message Jul 11 03:24:29 Even if the crypto lacks good authentication (like OE without dnsec) it's still way better than nothing. Jul 11 03:24:35 besides, it is a telco milk cow, much more expensive then IM Jul 11 03:24:54 gmaxwell: not everyone, including Gilmore, was convinced of that Jul 11 03:24:56 even just a simple pigpen cypher is better than nothing lol Jul 11 03:24:59 but that is being made now anyway Jul 11 03:25:05 in the IETF BTNS working group Jul 11 03:25:12 Better Then Nothing Security. Jul 11 03:25:42 It is OE using inbond pub key exchange (vulnerable to MITM) but with channel bonding to upgrade from 'anonymous ipsec' to 'authenticated ipsec' Jul 11 03:25:48 LetoTo, meh. Even without good authentication, encryption kills passive attacks thus making attacking FAR harder and FAR more detectable. Jul 11 03:25:49 * mwester thinks the OM software currently is more secure than even encryption -- it seldom works in the first place! Jul 11 03:26:11 gmaxwell: yes, but there is the additional problem of both endpoints being behind NAT :) Jul 11 03:26:16 other than the defualt root pw being anything lol Jul 11 03:26:31 so you need some kind of trusted brokerage system Jul 11 03:26:43 also, if authentication happens POST encrypted setup, it would require a MITM to even determine of strong authentication is in use.. so it would be hard to single out people using better crypto. Jul 11 03:27:06 LetoTo, Well.. the loss of global reach-ability sucks. :( Jul 11 03:27:18 In any case, you can still do decent crypto a higher layers. Jul 11 03:27:19 Crypto on SMS is hard? Jul 11 03:27:25 What? Jul 11 03:27:37 You have 160 chars. Jul 11 03:27:46 speedevil: yes. cryptophone.de has made some protocol. rather Rudi Weiss (well known german crypto guru) wrote one Jul 11 03:27:59 You encrypt 160 chars, and send it to a recipient. Jul 11 03:28:08 They look up your phone number, and decrypt it. Jul 11 03:28:09 SpeedEvil, doing reasonable sized DH over SMS would be kinda hard. ;) Jul 11 03:28:16 * LetoTo gives SpeedEvil Applied Cryptography. Jul 11 03:28:29 Crypto without perfect forward secrecy is bad bad bad. Jul 11 03:28:37 OTP. Jul 11 03:28:40 yeah Jul 11 03:28:45 It encourages bad people to come and beat you up to get your keys. Jul 11 03:28:45 OTP is not crypto, its utopia Jul 11 03:29:02 and OTP's are even WORSE on portable, easilly lost/stolen devices Jul 11 03:29:52 There are ways round that. Jul 11 03:30:03 But they do require extra effort to use the device. Jul 11 03:30:18 Extra effort .. meh.. human factors determine security ultimately. Jul 11 03:30:27 Yep. Jul 11 03:30:30 Encryption needs to be painless.. so everyone uses it. Jul 11 03:30:39 No. Jul 11 03:30:48 It needs to be less painful than the alternatives. Jul 11 03:31:15 Otherwise two things happen (1) people who use it get singled out, (2) people who normally use it get tricked into not using it. ;) Jul 11 03:32:00 1) assumes that it's not illegal in the first place, with heavy penalties. Jul 11 03:32:18 hmmm, tracking numbers for up to 2267 but they're skipping some Jul 11 03:32:35 would it be a TOS offense with you service provider? Jul 11 03:32:50 me Jul 11 03:33:02 2039 Jul 11 03:33:24 SpeedEvil, well thats another reason it has to be ubiquitous.. to keep if from being made illegial. Jul 11 03:33:28 but i not sweat it Jul 11 03:33:38 gmaxwell: like, I dunno, alcohol? Jul 11 03:33:39 :) Jul 11 03:33:39 gmaxwell: you're assuming it already exists. Jul 11 03:33:45 gmaxwell: which it does not Jul 11 03:33:45 or recreational drugs? :) Jul 11 03:34:03 Can you turn off the GSM far enough to be able to use the FR on an airplane? Jul 11 03:34:08 retracile: yes Jul 11 03:34:20 just anothers ways to collect our monies Jul 11 03:34:21 retracile: in principle - if they'll let you use it... Jul 11 03:34:29 :) Jul 11 03:35:08 anyone with battery life reports on the FR Jul 11 03:35:09 SpeedEvil: Don't other such devices have an "airplane mode"? I'd have thought they'd be used to such by now... Jul 11 03:35:28 now theres a good idea Jul 11 03:35:38 oy Jul 11 03:35:44 Not more battery reports :p Jul 11 03:36:04 It's funny because I can affirmatively state that it won't matter how long it lasts, the OS won't keep up :P Jul 11 03:36:09 retracile: it fundaentally depends on the airline/captains policy Jul 11 03:36:29 oo noos Jul 11 03:36:37 does turning off the gsm modem kill the gps? Jul 11 03:36:39 SpeedEvil: Hm. Guess I've avoided travelling enough to learn that. Jul 11 03:36:59 * retracile -> bed Jul 11 03:37:36 ieatlint: no Jul 11 03:37:51 excellent... gps on planes is fun Jul 11 03:38:06 ieatlint: does it work? Jul 11 03:38:14 yep, you need a window seat though Jul 11 03:38:17 nice Jul 11 03:38:32 with a window seat, and the device near the window, i was able to get like 10 sats or something Jul 11 03:38:45 GPS may not work on planes travelling fast enough. Jul 11 03:38:55 * SpeedEvil stabs the petty beancounters that grounded Concorde. Jul 11 03:38:57 * SpeedEvil stabs the petty beancounters that grounded Concorde. Jul 11 03:39:01 we were going at speed Jul 11 03:39:05 * SpeedEvil stabs the petty beancounters that grounded Concorde. Jul 11 03:39:15 yeah, perhaps supersonic would be too fast :P Jul 11 03:39:21 we were 400-450mph Jul 11 03:39:24 * SpeedEvil cleans off his spoon. Jul 11 03:44:00 whee Jul 11 03:44:05 crap.. I'm quickly becoming the lowest number to not get a shipment notification :O Jul 11 03:44:26 I should stop worrying and go back to work :/ Jul 11 03:44:48 hah, I should try that! Jul 11 03:45:04 I'm bad though, so I'd probably smuggle a large collapsable antenna onboard :p Jul 11 03:45:07 take that, TSA! Jul 11 03:46:26 * SpeedEvil observes the overweight TSA employee snapping on a cold latex glove. Jul 11 03:46:40 :o Jul 11 03:46:53 to build the openmoko emulator image, do you need gcc3.x or will 4.x work? Jul 11 03:46:55 No, I don't keep the antenna in my pants :p Jul 11 03:48:03 what, you can't bring antennas onto planes now? Jul 11 03:48:21 haha Jul 11 03:50:07 Does anyone know how to enable the clock which used to show up on the initial page shown by 2007.2 images, on a Freerunner? Jul 11 03:50:33 Yeah I was wondering that myself at one point. Jul 11 03:58:15 rtm: abraxa does Jul 11 03:58:26 If you search the logs for the last coupla days he tells Jul 11 03:58:35 It's a gconfd thing Jul 11 03:58:53 You turn off minimal, or clean, or something like that Jul 11 03:59:32 damn 1.1v with a solar panel, inside with a 1.5X2 in panel Jul 11 04:02:10 Dammit, anyone know how to set the window manager you get when you start up? Jul 11 04:02:51 /etc/X11/Xsession/Xsession.d i believe Jul 11 04:03:00 KrisAbsinthe: thanks! Jul 11 04:14:41 john: got it :) Jul 11 04:15:09 chillywilly: you doing any dev? Jul 11 04:15:52 I don't have any hardware yet :) Jul 11 04:16:13 i dont either but thats not stoping me form building Jul 11 04:18:12 kd8ikt: what are ya working on Jul 11 04:18:41 i'm just practicing fartin with the build env Jul 11 04:18:44 KrisAbsinthe: OK, Xsession.d has a 90xXWindowManager in it, which kicks off x-windo-manager Jul 11 04:18:59 this is the first time i've heard of bitbake Jul 11 04:19:20 But in one case (FSO) all we see is the zhone app, and in the other case (2007.2) matchbox-window-manager is running Jul 11 04:20:04 wurp2: a quick hack would be to make x-window-manager a script that launches whatever WM you want Jul 11 04:20:32 I dont care for the FSO stuff yet Jul 11 04:20:46 DISTRO_VERSION = "P1-Snapshot-20080711" Jul 11 04:20:51 Me neither, that's why I'm building SHR Jul 11 04:20:59 SHR? Jul 11 04:21:02 sorry, we're building Jul 11 04:21:04 ~SHR Jul 11 04:21:09 methinks shr is Stable Hybrid Release, a combination of the FSO, some of the 2007.2 GTK software, and the ASU that provides all of the functionality of the 2007.2 software, but with the stability of the FSO. See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Stable_Hybrid_Release Jul 11 04:21:26 Hence the questions Jul 11 04:21:27 sweet ass Jul 11 04:22:10 heh sweet just got an email from devin Jul 11 04:22:32 the group sale word is they shipout tomorrow Jul 11 04:22:57 KrisAbsinthe: Thanks, you just answered my question Jul 11 04:23:11 x-window-manager is a link to matchbox/session in 2007.2 Jul 11 04:23:21 lol Jul 11 04:23:29 purchase number is that what everyone has been talkin about? Jul 11 04:23:41 1447 ;) Jul 11 04:23:55 i put matchbox-desktop on mine a while back it was nice Jul 11 04:25:08 Anyone know what opkg owns /usr/bin/matchbox-session in 2007.2 Jul 11 04:25:10 ? Jul 11 04:25:36 w00t shipped ground from CA to ohio Jul 11 04:26:15 moko party nextweek ;) Jul 11 04:26:30 you in akron right lol, im in dayton Jul 11 04:26:40 cincinnati Jul 11 04:26:54 though the group sales dudes are in lexington ky Jul 11 04:26:59 cool Jul 11 04:27:30 pretty sweet i got ahold of them like 2 days ago and they needed one more person Jul 11 04:27:39 im currently adding solar cells to my Neo1973 Jul 11 04:27:46 cincinnati [00:34] [kd8ikt(+ei)] [3:ipv6/#openmoko(+n)] [Act: 4] Jul 11 04:27:53 wtf Jul 11 04:28:22 damn touchpad mouse Jul 11 04:28:23 KrisAbsinthe: what wattage does your cell provide? it must be very small. Jul 11 04:28:30 KrisAbsinthe: Cool! Jul 11 04:29:13 not sure yet, still shaping the cell for the back Jul 11 04:30:17 looks like irssi :) Jul 11 04:31:07 so because of this group sale i'm prolly savin like 30$ Jul 11 04:31:15 yup Jul 11 04:31:24 KrisAbsinthe: I guess I'm skeptical that you can do any meaningful charging with a cell that size. Jul 11 04:31:30 whats a single ground shipped phone cost? Jul 11 04:31:41 420? Jul 11 04:31:55 pot jokes aside Jul 11 04:32:52 http://xkcd.com/303/ Jul 11 04:34:19 kd8ikt: depends where it's going. I think mine might have been 408 or something. Jul 11 04:35:27 kd8ikt: what freqs do you frequent down there Jul 11 04:36:02 145.35 would be the best repeater to hit dayton Jul 11 04:36:10 or 145.39 Jul 11 04:36:18 fairfield Jul 11 04:36:31 cool Jul 11 04:36:53 see if you can hear anything on those freq's if so i'll hop on Jul 11 04:37:14 i just got a scanner inside, but ill check Jul 11 04:37:25 awe Jul 11 04:37:45 might be able to hear it Jul 11 04:37:56 climb up on the roof ;) Jul 11 04:38:16 I can ssh my phone use usb,but the battery not inflating ,how to check it Jul 11 04:38:34 lol, ill check on the mobile in a little bit, but i cant talk yet lol Jul 11 04:38:43 no ticket? Jul 11 04:38:59 yup, taking my test on the 18th Jul 11 04:39:02 * kd8ikt is also in #hamradio Jul 11 04:39:14 ChandleWEi: apm can give you a basic idea of what is going on Jul 11 04:39:37 * jeffszusz wonders if he could change a freerunner with an onion and some gatorade Jul 11 04:39:51 charge* Jul 11 04:40:53 kandian: it show me off-line, battery status critical, but my usb already connected it Jul 11 04:45:50 jeffszusz: Sure. Eat the onion, drink the gatorade. Obtain hand-crank type generator. Turn crank. Jul 11 04:46:02 ChandleWEi: cat '/sys/devices/platform/s3c2410-i2c/i2c-adapter/i2c-0/0-0008/chgmode Jul 11 04:46:44 You mean to tell me they had these phones a week and couldn't be bothered to charge them?!??! (j/k) Jul 11 04:47:24 ChandleWEi: If it says pre or idle, then 'echo -n fast_cccv > '/sys/devices/platform/s3c2410-i2c/i2c-adapter/i2c-0/0-0008/chgmode' Jul 11 04:47:45 rivalarrival: Well, the probably *do* have thousands of them... Jul 11 04:48:05 :-) Jul 11 04:48:43 surp2: it say fast Jul 11 04:48:53 ChandleWEi: Then it's charging Jul 11 04:49:05 at 1 amp, I'd guess Jul 11 04:49:23 Since the gta01 never says just 'fast', and that's all I know about (gta01) Jul 11 04:49:52 wurp2: it's gta02 Jul 11 04:50:00 yeah, I figured Jul 11 04:50:07 It's charging at max rate Jul 11 04:50:15 Give it a couple of hours Jul 11 04:50:32 it should be almost full then, I'd guess Jul 11 04:52:21 off to bed Jul 11 04:52:27 rivalarrival, you can charge an ipod by soaking an onion in gatorade and then plugging the end of a USB cable into the onion Jul 11 04:52:29 wurp2: I always connect my computer by usb, suddenly I find the battery is low level and show me red !, I try wait it charging Jul 11 04:55:13 Hi all Jul 11 04:55:36 Does anyone know how to enable the clock which used to show up on the initial page shown by 2007.2 images, on a Freerunner? Jul 11 04:55:46 yay, my tracking page now shows more than "billing info received" Jul 11 04:59:41 I was flashing my Frerunner this morning and all was fine. I tryed the scaredy cat images without inconvenience but when I tried the qtopia ones I got an "Error during download" message. After that I can not boot in a correct image. I have reinstalled uBoot and I'm trying to go back to the scaredy cat image, but any time I tried the flashing I'm getting all the time "Starting download: [dfu_download error -62, Error during download" Jul 11 05:00:25 ieatlint: Yeah! Origin Scan! Jul 11 05:00:54 rtm: look at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Getting_Started_with_your_Neo_FreeRunner#Un-crippling_the_2007.2_image Jul 11 05:01:39 offray: Thanks a bunch! Jul 11 05:02:16 yep, pretty exciting! Jul 11 05:02:40 ieatlint: Yeah, except it's going to say the same damn thing for like three days straight. Jul 11 05:03:12 i dunno, the initial email for ups said delivery scheduled tomorrow Jul 11 05:03:21 i'm about 40 miles or something from sunnyvale... Jul 11 05:04:20 kind of ironic that the phone may arrive the same day the iphone comes out Jul 11 05:04:52 which reminds me, i was going to go throw water balloons at people standing outside the apple store Jul 11 05:05:51 anyone knows about the dfu_download error? Jul 11 05:08:59 ieatlint: How about bricks? Jul 11 05:09:14 offray_: If I knew, I'd tell you. Jul 11 05:09:23 no, i don't want to actually injure them Jul 11 05:09:40 the next phase of the plan is to call the police 30min before they open, and hint at some sort of bomb threat or something Jul 11 05:09:47 HAHAHA Jul 11 05:10:34 Dude, I've got it... Just go wait in line with them, with your new freerunner Jul 11 05:11:00 Be all like "Hey, check this out: Copy/Paste, bitches!" Jul 11 05:13:19 Yay! Netsplit! Jul 11 05:13:34 woah Jul 11 05:13:42 I thought I left EFNET Jul 11 05:14:03 It followed you. Jul 11 05:14:12 damnit JIM!!! Jul 11 05:18:24 whats the best image to use for an everyday phone on gta01 atm? Jul 11 05:23:21 535thats like the 100th time today i've heard that question psi Jul 11 05:23:37 heh Jul 11 05:23:39 maybe its time a wiki page about it be created Jul 11 05:24:15 have you tried the latest build? Jul 11 05:24:18 YES, we need something that lists the best openmoko and qtopia images for everyday use Jul 11 05:24:27 kd8ikt: trying now Jul 11 05:24:47 or something like that Jul 11 05:24:56 i always figure the newest is always the best Jul 11 05:25:14 yeah, but i often find the newest is also the most broken :P Jul 11 05:25:43 are there any db that run on the freerunner? Jul 11 05:26:05 can I take samples from the GPS and stuff them into a db on the freerunner? Jul 11 05:29:36 carrar: you can stuff them into a text file :P Jul 11 05:30:51 dude... when i get my own place... Jul 11 05:31:01 i'm gonna fill a room with http://www.playpenballs.com/ Jul 11 05:31:36 that would be fun for all of 10 seconds Jul 11 05:31:50 unless your thinking for your kids or something Jul 11 05:32:09 wow that expensive! Jul 11 05:32:20 Psi, no db app yet for the freerunner? Jul 11 05:32:28 be totally worth it Jul 11 05:32:39 kd8ikt: imitating xkcd? Jul 11 05:32:42 carrar: no idea Jul 11 05:32:47 yes Jul 11 05:32:48 xkcd > * Jul 11 05:32:49 text file is ok, but if I can tell people I am running PostgreSQL on phone Jul 11 05:32:54 thats kicksass Jul 11 05:32:57 heh Jul 11 05:33:19 http://xkcd.com/150/ Jul 11 05:34:13 So lets analize that Jul 11 05:34:18 Girl in APT Jul 11 05:34:26 surrounded by what Jul 11 05:34:29 LOTS OF BALLS Jul 11 05:34:53 sounds like debian to me Jul 11 05:34:58 yeah Jul 11 05:35:01 IRC Jul 11 05:35:15 playpen balls + girlfriend = fun Jul 11 05:35:30 ..... building ball room now Jul 11 05:36:10 * kd8ikt invisions AC/DC's big balls song playing during Jul 11 05:36:44 always bouncing! Jul 11 05:44:19 i suppose i shouldnt really question the multicolored play-pen ball room idea, after all, i completely replaced my room lighting with R,G,B,W leds :P Jul 11 05:45:23 girls keep setting it to bright pink :(, heh Jul 11 05:46:55 leds are awesome Jul 11 05:47:01 yep Jul 11 05:47:01 they last forever it seems Jul 11 05:47:25 none of mine have died yet Jul 11 05:48:47 i once burnt out an led Jul 11 05:48:50 and it didn't turn off Jul 11 05:49:15 everlasting light? :) Jul 11 05:49:23 pretty much Jul 11 05:49:48 oh god look what wiki told me about LED's http://www.uc.edu/news/NR.asp?id=7089 Jul 11 05:50:29 using DNA in salmon sperm has recently been discovered to amplify the effects and quality of a LED ligh Jul 11 05:50:58 and it had to be UC :P my city Jul 11 05:51:02 heh Jul 11 05:51:03 what a perv Jul 11 05:51:46 who takes salmon sperm and is like... hm lets put it in an LED! Jul 11 05:52:45 right after i bleep bleep bleep with it Jul 11 05:52:50 paste/69 Jul 11 05:53:00 heh Jul 11 05:53:05 woops Jul 11 05:53:07 wrong channel Jul 11 05:53:17 gotta hate that Jul 11 05:53:50 ok this compile has been going for like 2 hrs already my laptops about to reach critical mass Jul 11 05:54:06 TROBA! TROBA! TROBA! Jul 11 05:54:48 ok i saw it just now downloading and preparing to compile gcc thats where i draw the line Jul 11 05:55:02 ^C Jul 11 05:56:42 TROBA! Jul 11 05:56:57 kam tau ta troba? Jul 11 05:57:25 (Abort) Jul 11 05:57:49 :) Jul 11 05:58:34 well, latest qtopia build didnt work Jul 11 05:58:39 * Psi tries 2nd latest Jul 11 05:59:13 didnt work? Jul 11 05:59:25 booted to gui, but none of the buttons work Jul 11 05:59:44 Nah, it worked. He just wants to waste his damn time trying to find something a little less usable. Jul 11 05:59:49 (here's your sign) Jul 11 06:00:50 thats quite odd that a latest build would have such an issue Jul 11 06:01:48 how to check my battery problem or apm problem? Jul 11 06:02:05 kd8ikt: yeah, but i quite often find the latest builds dont work Jul 11 06:03:08 might be why i hear all this talk of SHR Jul 11 06:03:24 or whatever the stable image name is Jul 11 06:05:46 Why is it so damn difficult to find a stable build? Jul 11 06:05:55 ^ Jul 11 06:06:36 Not that I'm actually looking for one right now, but it seems that this shouldn't be that big of a problem. Jul 11 06:07:21 I guess the question is, If I'm having so many problems finding it, is it because I'm an idiot, or because they are idiots? Jul 11 06:07:53 heh, i often wonder that too Jul 11 06:07:53 wait Jul 11 06:07:59 I know what the problem is! Jul 11 06:08:54 Psi: Repeat after me: "the iphone is so much better than the GTA01 because the GTA01 doesn't even have a stable build" Jul 11 06:09:11 that doesnt make it better Jul 11 06:09:12 cant really compare the two Jul 11 06:09:17 ^^ Jul 11 06:09:29 Psi: Nah, I'm not making the comparison... Jul 11 06:09:36 I'm trying to help you get some support. Jul 11 06:09:55 rivalarrival: haha Jul 11 06:10:09 angry support isnt the good kind Jul 11 06:10:38 Don't ask for help, just say "This fucking thing sucks, I can't believe I wasted my money on it, it (insert symptoms here)!!! Jul 11 06:10:59 im not that mean :P Jul 11 06:11:15 Squeaky wheel, grease, grease, squeaky wheel. Jul 11 06:12:06 I was flashing my Frerunner this morning and all was fine. I tryed the scaredy cat images without inconvenience but when I tried the qtopia ones I got an "Error during download" message. After that I can not boot in a correct image. I have reinstalled uBoot and I'm trying to go back to the scaredy cat image, but any time I tried the flashing I'm getting all the time "Starting download: [dfu_download error -62, Error during download" Jul 11 06:12:11 Sorry Jul 11 06:12:23 I was reviewing the log Jul 11 06:12:28 cheers :) Jul 11 06:15:54 Let me tell you what - it works. I threatened to kill everyone involved in distributing the freerunner if I didn't get a tracking number. Couple hours later, it was in my inbox. Jul 11 06:16:07 heh Jul 11 06:16:32 I read too much BOFH. Jul 11 06:16:37 youll probably get an empty box tho :P Jul 11 06:16:49 Psi: They wouldn't dare. :-) Jul 11 06:16:57 with a note saying "we have kidnapped your freerunner" Jul 11 06:17:26 Nah, they need my $399 Jul 11 06:17:35 And all their teeth. Jul 11 06:17:37 :-) Jul 11 06:17:54 ng image, but any time I tried the flashing I'm getting all the time "Starting download: [dfu_download error -62, Jul 11 06:17:57 Error during download" Jul 11 06:18:00 02:20 < offray_> Sorry Jul 11 06:18:06 wtf Jul 11 06:18:25 kd8ikt: are you using a usb extention cable? Jul 11 06:18:31 i need to disable my laptops touchpad Jul 11 06:18:51 nah it must have been copied from somewhere i'm readin and accidently pasted Jul 11 06:18:52 I wish my eee-pc had a clit-mouse Jul 11 06:18:59 ah Jul 11 06:19:05 rivalarrival: heh Jul 11 06:19:12 yeah i could use a clit too Jul 11 06:19:28 touchpads suck donkey ass. Jul 11 06:19:39 I wonder if I could install one... Jul 11 06:19:39 :) Jul 11 06:19:40 same with CAPSLOCK Jul 11 06:19:40 yeah, i prefer the clit Jul 11 06:19:47 over a touchpad atleast Jul 11 06:20:23 + this shit laptop has a wireless button right behind left shift Jul 11 06:20:35 Anybody ever see a USB clit mouse? Jul 11 06:21:09 rivalarrival, how would that work? get out a drummel and drill the keyboard? Jul 11 06:21:27 primary advantage of clitmouse is that you don't have to move your hands out of the typing position... Jul 11 06:21:40 what a great idea lets put a wifi power button next to shift on the most used keys in an akward position Jul 11 06:21:51 one* of the Jul 11 06:23:13 gmaxwell: Yeah, pretty much. I'd stick it next to the touchpad, not in the keyboard. Jul 11 06:23:48 I dunno why the asus EEE doesn't have a model without the touchpad.. it would let them make the system smaller Jul 11 06:23:57 My X60 is clitmouse only. Jul 11 06:24:17 i think most ppl prefer touchpads over clits Jul 11 06:24:18 my T-22 was the same way. I hated the touchpad. Jul 11 06:24:27 newbs prefer touchpads to clits Jul 11 06:25:04 but, most people are newbs, so, yeah... Jul 11 06:25:35 clits need to be set with the right sen/accel but when they are they give you really good control Jul 11 06:25:59 Psi, it's an experience thing.. a little more learning curve on the clit. .. and a LOT of laptops come with the speed set all wrong on them. Jul 11 06:26:07 you get used to a nub-only setup in a few-days. promise. Jul 11 06:26:09 yeah Jul 11 06:26:17 budfive, Yep. Jul 11 06:26:39 it's also true with touchpads.. they suck too when you're not used to them. Jul 11 06:26:43 it really is nice to have both, though Jul 11 06:27:00 i use the touchpad as a regular mouse, and the nub as a dedicated bidirectional scrolling device Jul 11 06:27:04 i hate how the mouse wheel is part of them Jul 11 06:27:08 like a joystick Jul 11 06:27:21 budfive, I don't agree.. too easy to smack the pad with the ball of your hand and send things into crazy land.. Jul 11 06:27:36 they sould atleast put a plastic strip between the pad and wheel part Jul 11 06:27:37 again, you get used to not doing that very quickly. Jul 11 06:27:42 or if you spill the smallest amount of food on the laptop the touchpad is usually crazy. Jul 11 06:28:36 i've a friend who uses an inverse setup. Nub to move around, and touchpad as a dedicated scroller. Either way, it's nice to actually separate the two devices Jul 11 06:30:18 need to find bluetooth keyboard w/ clitmouse. Jul 11 06:35:47 hm.. does qtopia work without a sim? Jul 11 06:37:32 psi: very slowly Jul 11 06:38:09 maybe thats why im having so much trouble Jul 11 06:38:26 psi: and if it cant regiter to the network Jul 11 06:44:58 Need a bluetooth dingle - a device with a usb port on it, that converts your regular USB devices into bluetooth devices. Jul 11 06:50:22 hmm Jul 11 06:50:40 how might one convince the qemu emulator to go into sleep mode? Jul 11 06:52:07 sing it a lullaby Jul 11 06:55:46 I usually rub a little rum on its lips Jul 11 06:59:21 Whatever you do, never shake a qemu emulation. Jul 11 06:59:59 * rivalarrival = batshit insane Jul 11 07:00:09 Line : off Jul 11 07:00:09 Battery: -1% (?) Jul 11 07:00:19 above is my apm --monitor Jul 11 07:00:21 Hmmm... Jul 11 07:00:46 You have a battery composed of dark matter. Jul 11 07:01:22 my usb already connected for several hours Jul 11 07:02:13 rivalarrial: "You have a battery composed of dark matter." what's mean? I not enough english skill Jul 11 07:02:26 YAY! My freerunner has left Sunnyvale! Jul 11 07:02:41 ChandleWEi: Sorry, it was my attempt at humor. Jul 11 07:04:14 rivalarrival: I don't care ,I just poor english not understand :) Jul 11 07:08:00 hmhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_matter Jul 11 07:09:07 i don't get the joke and i speak english Jul 11 07:09:22 is it supposed to be a joke about it only existing in theory? Jul 11 07:09:39 eg, the phones using it, but we can't see it or detect it Jul 11 07:10:09 heh Jul 11 07:12:37 whoa the FR uses dark matter? Jul 11 07:12:43 ieatlint: I didn't say it was a GOOD joke Jul 11 07:13:00 walrustown: Yes, that's why the battery meter can read -1% Jul 11 07:13:02 no, i'm just curious if i got it right :) Jul 11 07:13:10 whoa nice Jul 11 07:13:36 no it actually runs on antimatter Jul 11 07:13:51 I wish it did, then maybe you could get more than 10-20 hours out of it :) Jul 11 07:14:08 Don't damage the case to the battery, or you'll put a dent in the earth. Jul 11 07:14:17 hey how long are you away from your computer? Jul 11 07:14:37 Ummm... Not very. Jul 11 07:14:42 FIC is distributing WMDs Jul 11 07:15:16 literally - anti-matter and matter combining would destroy mass. Jul 11 07:15:29 yup yup Jul 11 07:15:42 i wouldn't live to regret it, so not my problem Jul 11 07:15:56 That's the spirit! Jul 11 07:16:17 wikipedia says "the energy in a few grams of antimatter is enough to transport an unmanned spacecraft to Mars in a few minutes" Jul 11 07:16:19 ouch Jul 11 07:16:27 maybe we can use our FRs to go to mars Jul 11 07:16:32 Like I said: Dent in the earth Jul 11 07:16:37 well, linux got nasa there Jul 11 07:16:55 linux is stupid, it's all about dos Jul 11 07:17:02 hah Jul 11 07:17:10 how about a truer form of unix Jul 11 07:17:25 watch, i'll go install openbsd on my FR Jul 11 07:17:25 What were they running on the "Hey, let's program our equipment in meters, but feed it data in feet"? Jul 11 07:17:38 Hardy Heron on the FR. Jul 11 07:17:47 morning Jul 11 07:17:47 that would be linux, and the feet were manually entered Jul 11 07:17:54 i dont see how you can compare dos to linux Jul 11 07:18:03 Well, they both have command lines Jul 11 07:18:08 Other than that... Jul 11 07:18:10 yeah, and they both have "cd" Jul 11 07:18:11 dos is superior to linux in almost every way Jul 11 07:18:19 I wish I could get a dos phone Jul 11 07:18:19 dos very rarely crashes Jul 11 07:18:30 if i could ban you for saying that i would Jul 11 07:18:30 or has network vulnerabilities Jul 11 07:18:34 LOL Jul 11 07:18:46 NON SYSTEM DISK OR DISK ERROR - REPLACE DISK AND PRESS ANY KEY Jul 11 07:18:51 Honestly, I don't consider DOS an OS... It's more of a stack of code for dealing with the hardware Jul 11 07:19:00 It doesn't multitask or anything like that Jul 11 07:19:02 "Where's the "Any" key? Jul 11 07:19:11 just press a modifier Jul 11 07:19:16 shift, ctrl, esc Jul 11 07:19:49 I want to replace the key with the gay little flag on it with one that says "ANY" Jul 11 07:20:00 I always rip off the windows key Jul 11 07:20:01 so close.... my phone is in south san francisco and i'm in san francisco Jul 11 07:20:03 * zash writes "Any" on the windowskey Jul 11 07:20:06 it screws me up in games Jul 11 07:20:20 my keyboard doesn't have the win key Jul 11 07:20:26 you win Jul 11 07:20:27 i'm using a model m keyboard Jul 11 07:20:34 double win Jul 11 07:20:35 /ban !walrustown*@*.* Jul 11 07:20:38 my keys are dishwasher safe Jul 11 07:20:57 I'm invincible to bans, because I use DOS Jul 11 07:20:58 ieatlint: your keyboard is * safe Jul 11 07:21:16 not entirely, it's a "new" model m, built in 2004 by unicomp Jul 11 07:21:25 the "win" key on the eeepc has a little picture of a house. Jul 11 07:21:37 so it has the same feel, noise, etc of the originals, but it doesn't have like the steel body and such Jul 11 07:22:41 actually, my keyboard doesn't have a windows key on it, because I'm typing on an alphagrip Jul 11 07:23:23 i love my eee Jul 11 07:24:14 walrustown: That's the gayest thing I've ever seen Jul 11 07:24:14 I want to play with an eee Jul 11 07:24:20 hahaha Jul 11 07:24:53 I know, but it is actually pretty comfortable Jul 11 07:24:55 I love my eee, but If the freerunner does half the things I want it to, I might sell it. Jul 11 07:25:10 dude, comfort can be taken too far... Jul 11 07:25:52 It's got a trackball! It should have a clit-mouse! Jul 11 07:25:53 like that transportation method that mr garrison invented? Jul 11 07:26:12 The IT? Jul 11 07:26:28 I definitely prefer the trackball, although the resolution is low Jul 11 07:26:32 i see the FR as a phone and a toy, not a laptop Jul 11 07:26:39 lol, yeah, the it Jul 11 07:27:02 phone, toy, and command line. Jul 11 07:27:26 anyone else in here have a zaurus? Jul 11 07:27:34 Hell, if I can get IRC running on it, I'm set for life. Jul 11 07:27:53 yeah, commandline, but no easy way to type... and if i'm carrying a keyboard around with me, i might as well carry the eee Jul 11 07:28:23 Well, a bluetooth PDA keyboard is the size of a wallet, folded up. Jul 11 07:29:48 eh... Jul 11 07:29:58 what do you plan on typing? a book? Jul 11 07:30:02 I had a stowaway keyboard for my HP Jornada - a LONG time ago. Jul 11 07:30:15 Worked great. Jul 11 07:30:18 it seems that even the 850mhz 10units package is sold out from the openmoko store Jul 11 07:30:30 'old news Jul 11 07:30:41 probably this will expedite the availabilty of the 900mhz nits there Jul 11 07:30:45 hopefully Jul 11 07:30:52 Yep - last I heard, they had a total of 13 phones left. Jul 11 07:30:52 unlikely Jul 11 07:31:03 oh damn Jul 11 07:31:14 the phones are not being built on order, the arrival date of the 900mhz units was already set Jul 11 07:31:19 july 25 i heard Jul 11 07:31:31 who uses 900 Jul 11 07:31:37 I so hope they make enough money to keep the development clipping Jul 11 07:31:41 i don't know why they keep releasing stuff on fridays and then go home for the weekend Jul 11 07:31:50 my service provider uses 1900 so... anyone will work for me Jul 11 07:31:51 kd8ikt: everyone but the states? Jul 11 07:32:08 yeah, 900mhz would be preferred by me Jul 11 07:32:27 i use only 1900mhz in california, and i travel abroad regularly Jul 11 07:32:30 isnt it 800|850/1800/1900 Jul 11 07:32:47 the 800/850 ones (triband) Jul 11 07:32:50 850|900/1800/1900 Jul 11 07:33:07 no gsm uses 800 Jul 11 07:33:43 that mhz Jul 11 07:33:47 gsm is 850, 900, 1800, 1900... umts is 2100, 1900/2100 att US, 1700/2100 tmobile US Jul 11 07:33:47 ? Jul 11 07:33:54 all mhz Jul 11 07:34:09 cool glad CBW uses 1900 Jul 11 07:34:17 (the 1900/2100 and 1700/2100 means it uses both bands -- one for upstream and one for downstream) Jul 11 07:34:25 and the moko has a sim slot Jul 11 07:34:41 Tmobile uses 1900, at least in my area... Jul 11 07:35:11 tmobile US only runs 1900mhz gsm, however they have roaming agreements in some places for 850mhz Jul 11 07:35:17 anyone have a recommendation on a good service provider? or does it really depend on my location? Jul 11 07:35:36 plus, even if you can't roam onto an 850mhz network, you can still connect to it and dial 911 -- which could be useful Jul 11 07:35:52 Depends on if your provider has roaming agreements with the providers in your area. Jul 11 07:36:11 CBW just uses one band Jul 11 07:36:15 ieatlint: Yeah, could be. :-) Jul 11 07:36:25 walrustown: all cellphone service providers are evil Jul 11 07:36:44 yep, there are areas in the sierra nevada here in california where att has 850mhz coverage and tmobile has none... and there's no roaming agreement Jul 11 07:36:49 Yeah, but not for too much longer. Open Source will force them in line. Jul 11 07:36:57 thanks zash :) Jul 11 07:37:07 zash, that sounds about right Jul 11 07:37:11 walrustown, it's what works where you need it that's best Jul 11 07:37:12 tmobile has no agreement with ATT? Jul 11 07:37:12 kinda like all ISPs Jul 11 07:37:19 I see Jul 11 07:37:34 rivalarrival, they have an agreement with att for california and nevada dating back to like 2002 or something Jul 11 07:37:49 I've got nothing but good things to say about Time Warner's internet service... Their tech support, on the other hand, needs a little work. Jul 11 07:37:51 but the agreement only covered towers that existed in 2002, new towers are not shared Jul 11 07:38:12 ieatlint: That's gay as hell. Jul 11 07:38:55 You can pick up a prepaid sim card from any of them to try them out without getting stuck with a contract. Jul 11 07:38:55 eh... my only complaints about tmobile is how badly they're screwing up the 3g rollout Jul 11 07:39:15 actually, talk to the people at the store Jul 11 07:39:16 Oh, I've got bigger complaints with t-mobile. Jul 11 07:39:18 :-) Jul 11 07:39:41 in california, you have 14 days trial -- you can cancel a contract for any reason within 14 days, and you pay a prorated amount for the month Jul 11 07:40:08 lol i was talkin to my cousin and he's like i'm waiting for the gta03 series :P Jul 11 07:40:20 "cause i need a camera" :P\ Jul 11 07:40:39 hehe Jul 11 07:40:51 I advise against talking to the people in the store - between them and the people who will actually do the billing, there is a lot of "No, we would never do that" Jul 11 07:41:15 and a whole lot of them actually doing it. Jul 11 07:41:16 i was telling a friend about the phone and mistakenly called it gta02 .. "gta02 is out!" ... "uhm, yeah, gta4 came out like 2 months ago" Jul 11 07:41:55 rivalarrival, which is why it's all in writing here, and you have to sign a document (which you get a copy of) acknowledging the 14 day trial period Jul 11 07:42:13 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QR_codes Jul 11 07:42:36 ieatlint: Yeah... Still easier to get a prepaid and not deal with their bullshit about canceling. Jul 11 07:42:54 prepaid costs like $30+ though... spare phone though Jul 11 07:42:57 Or, even better, borrow a friend's sim card. Jul 11 07:43:03 yep Jul 11 07:43:43 I don't even want the company to be aware that I exist until I'm ready to sign the contract. I've gotten screwed a couple times. Jul 11 07:43:57 Verizon REALLY hosed me about 10 years back. Jul 11 07:44:17 yeah they gave me bad credit cause i defaulted on a phone contract when i was like 17 Jul 11 07:44:44 screw verizon Jul 11 07:44:58 its a phone for christsake not a car/house Jul 11 07:45:24 Same - Military transferred me from California, didn't have coverage in Texas. Federal law says they have to end the contract in this situation, they refused, it finally dropped off my credit a couple years ago. Jul 11 07:45:55 now i cant get a loan without a cosigner Jul 11 07:45:59 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * r7e3006a2fed8 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/modems/openezx/ (channel.py modem.py unsolicited.py): ogsmd: [OPENEZX] add unsolicited channel for /dev/mux0 and parse +CIEV as well as the proprietary +EOPER Jul 11 07:46:00 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * r4a334428e3c7 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/modems/openezx/ (modem.py unsolicited.py): ogsmd: [MOTOROLA EZX] add more docs Jul 11 07:46:00 eh, financial institutions are all the same Jul 11 07:46:09 kd8ikt: Try Prosper.com Jul 11 07:46:09 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07specs * r8fdabc0841cb 10/otapi/org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.xml.in: org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: make clear what's mandatory and what's optional Jul 11 07:46:16 tmobile hasn't fucked me over, and i'm 5+ years with them Jul 11 07:46:39 Only problem I have with t-mobile is tech support lying through their teeth. Jul 11 07:47:03 * ieatlint shrugs Jul 11 07:47:04 I think I like the prepaid idea :) Jul 11 07:47:06 they've never lied to me Jul 11 07:47:54 so its like, an community bank? i request and someone accepts and gets the profit? Jul 11 07:48:07 three years ago, they told me that to send an e-mail, I had to forward it to the shortcode for the sms-to-email gateway Jul 11 07:48:12 Ok, no problem Jul 11 07:48:18 Then, that stopped working Jul 11 07:48:37 morning everybody :-) Jul 11 07:49:25 So, called them up, asked what was going on, described how I had been doing things. "No, you have to use the actual e-mail address, not the shortcode" Jul 11 07:49:37 "We NEVER had you sending e-mail to a shortcode" Jul 11 07:50:12 * ieatlint shrugs Jul 11 07:50:18 as with everything, your results may vary Jul 11 07:50:20 I got qemu running yesterday. Means I get a small window that displays qtopia. I can switch to the console with Str-Alt-2. But cannot execute any commands. why is that? Jul 11 07:50:49 or "No, there is no way to shut off your number@tmomail.net address - so you have to deal with all that spam" Jul 11 07:51:05 that was a lie, you can do it on their website Jul 11 07:51:55 and then, a year later, when I wanted to turn it back on: "No, it's not turned off - you should be receiving anything sent to your number@tmomail.net" Jul 11 07:52:11 prosper looks great i'll keep that in mind when i need cash Jul 11 07:52:26 kd8ikt: Yes, I'm a lender there... It's VERY nice. Jul 11 07:52:49 I also cannot klick the icons on that screen, I just have a message telling me there is no network connection. did I forget something? :-) Jul 11 07:52:54 Well, for lenders anyway - never tried to borrow money from them. Jul 11 07:53:04 what happens when someone you lend to doesnt payup Jul 11 07:53:15 *disapears* Jul 11 07:53:33 I've got 1 out of 26 loans that has done exactly that. Jul 11 07:54:11 They've sent a collection agency after him, but if they can't collect, I write it off as a loss. Jul 11 07:54:31 hope it wasnt a lot Jul 11 07:54:36 50 bucks. Jul 11 07:54:42 well, 45. Jul 11 07:54:53 he paid back $5 before he left. Jul 11 07:55:11 what a dick Jul 11 07:55:18 Eh, it happens. Jul 11 07:55:18 My FR just arrived with a few of its brethren. Jul 11 07:55:37 hope 50 bucks was worth the massive screw over on his credit report Jul 11 07:55:49 oh, it wasn't 50 bucks to him Jul 11 07:55:56 It was like 5 grand. Jul 11 07:56:08 *I* lost 50 bucks, as did about 100 other people. Jul 11 07:56:39 Karrde: you got your phone>? Jul 11 07:57:02 so that means he has like 100 bad hits on his credit report? Jul 11 07:57:08 12 of them, actually Jul 11 07:57:12 no Jul 11 07:57:25 dang send me one Jul 11 07:57:35 The way it works, prosper actually writes the loan, and they service it. Jul 11 07:57:36 well, only seven left now Jul 11 07:57:54 The "lenders" are really loan purchasers. Jul 11 07:58:33 only one loan has actually been written, so only one hit on his report. Jul 11 07:59:03 hey guys, when will a 3g capable version arrive? would it really cost that much to add such an unit? Jul 11 08:00:11 3g? Jul 11 08:00:15 free-radical: Patience, grasshopper. Jul 11 08:00:38 EGPRS? Jul 11 08:02:51 rivalarrival: more verbose?! and not that harsh maybe?! Jul 11 08:03:54 free-radical: Ok, well, the 3G version of OpenMoko will be rolled out at a later date. Your call is important to us. Please continue to hold for the next available generation. Jul 11 08:04:11 :-) Jul 11 08:04:16 MWAHHHH. The beast is complete. Neo1973 with Solar panel Jul 11 08:05:33 what's the panels output? Jul 11 08:06:06 3 megawatts - it's really more of a solarpanel with a NEO1973 duct taped to it. Jul 11 08:06:27 Multimeter reported 1.1v inside with florecent office lighting. Jul 11 08:07:12 But, with a clear day, that 3 megawatts can (barely) supply enough power to keep your phone running overnight. Jul 11 08:07:27 KrisAbsinthe: show us a picture Jul 11 08:07:28 ;D Jul 11 08:07:39 It's photoshopped Jul 11 08:07:42 sure, going to upload it now Jul 11 08:08:00 if it were photoshoped it would be a little cleaner lol Jul 11 08:08:16 It is. I can tell by the pixels. :-) Jul 11 08:08:59 and from having seen a lot of 'shops in your time rivalarrival Jul 11 08:09:09 ^ Jul 11 08:10:55 ah yah did it Jul 11 08:11:04 hope it works and doesnt melt something Jul 11 08:12:16 I want to put a diode in line to prevent back flow Jul 11 08:12:29 With all the accelerometers, I'm surprised a "shake to charge" feature isn't present. Jul 11 08:12:46 heh dont think that would work Jul 11 08:12:49 like those dinky little flashlights. Jul 11 08:12:56 its not like those flashlights Jul 11 08:13:30 those have large copper coils and big ass magnets Jul 11 08:13:37 haha shake to charge Jul 11 08:13:46 I always move the hyphen one space to the right... Jul 11 08:13:49 http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l274/subfunction/PIC-0007.jpg Jul 11 08:13:50 big ass-magnets Jul 11 08:14:04 thats awesome Jul 11 08:14:22 whats that cell rated for output? Jul 11 08:14:26 What's that on there with, gaffer's tape? Jul 11 08:14:35 3.5v Jul 11 08:14:42 nice Jul 11 08:14:49 Super glue it melded with the plastic Jul 11 08:14:58 Nice. Jul 11 08:15:18 hope to add 1/3 the battery life Jul 11 08:15:25 Yeah, so, that thing would make a nice torpedo level. Jul 11 08:16:34 KrisAbsinthe_, all you really need is those big bags with solar panels and a usb socket... ;) Jul 11 08:17:13 *by bags i mean back packs... Jul 11 08:17:30 depends, the Neo1973 wont charge off any USB that isnt a smart charger Jul 11 08:17:36 http://www.voltaicsystems.com/ Jul 11 08:17:50 (solar backpacks) Jul 11 08:17:51 KrisAbsinthe_, really? what about the fr? Jul 11 08:18:05 w/usb outputs i believe Jul 11 08:18:27 that bag is bad ass Jul 11 08:18:42 I know nothing about the FR Jul 11 08:18:54 i sent em an email once asking for a "conversion kit" so i could take an existing pack and add the junk to it they said cool but it would cost a bit Jul 11 08:19:17 kd8ikt, what junk? Jul 11 08:19:27 solar backpack crap Jul 11 08:19:30 you can get a 12v solar panel for $100, remove the resistor and it WILL start a car Jul 11 08:19:46 kd8ikt, oh, re read and got you. :) Jul 11 08:19:52 KrisAbsinthe_: I'm waving a bullshit flag Jul 11 08:20:23 i felt they were full of crap to charge me almost more then a backpack for solar panels and charger Jul 11 08:20:31 KrisAbsinthe_, anyhow, cool mode :) i would really like to see some other cool mods in the future :) Jul 11 08:20:56 kd8ikt, you can just buy a backpack and disassemble, or does that cost even more? Jul 11 08:21:12 I used to charge car batteries to watch TV when my electric got cut off. Jul 11 08:21:16 kd8ikt, aren't there any nice solar panels in radio shack? Jul 11 08:21:23 i'll send em another email later saying my current pack broke and i need a replacement cell/power pack Jul 11 08:21:34 nah ratshack is crap Jul 11 08:21:49 Try tractor supply co. Jul 11 08:22:06 They had a solar kit, and a wind kit, looked fairly affordable. Jul 11 08:22:18 i'll have to check that at Jul 11 08:22:34 make myself a UPS for my computers/routers Jul 11 08:22:45 for power outages Jul 11 08:23:02 I have a UPS that I plug into my car battery. Jul 11 08:23:26 puts out plenty of power, but it does get pretty hot. Jul 11 08:23:52 probably too manny amps Jul 11 08:24:27 The UPS was designed for a 20 minute lifespan - I would run it all day. Jul 11 08:26:35 Alright, my freerunner is 5 hours out of Sunnyvale - where's it headed? Jul 11 08:27:40 http://xkcd.com/ Jul 11 08:27:51 This has been me for the past two weeks Jul 11 08:28:17 UPS says i'll get mine exactly next fri Jul 11 08:29:19 given that i drive down to lexington that day to meet/greet the group sales guy and pay him in person Jul 11 08:29:32 2hr drive give or take Jul 11 08:31:24 im outa here Jul 11 08:35:42 good morning Jul 11 08:48:48 why can't I execute "ifdown" in the qemu -> openmoko console? Not via ssh but changed into by ctr-alt-2. The command is unknown Jul 11 08:51:51 does nobody know? or is my question too stupid to be answered? :-) Jul 11 08:52:59 strange Jul 11 08:54:45 wizkoder: it works on the device itself.. Jul 11 08:55:54 edistar: I do not understand. what device? I do not own any hardware yet Jul 11 08:57:49 have Anyone know apm ? I exec apm --monitor that show me below message " line: off , Battery: -1%(?) .Why is -1%? Jul 11 08:58:04 wizkoder, "ifdown" is a script Jul 11 08:58:29 if the command is not found, you are either not running it as root or the script doesn't exist on that distribution of linux Jul 11 08:59:51 ChandleWEi, are you sure apm is supported? ... i'm not familiar with the openmoko software, but it may use acpi exclusively Jul 11 09:00:38 take a look in /proc/acpi/battery ... there should be a like "bat0" and then two files.. cat the one that says "state" and it'll give you battery info if acpi is supported Jul 11 09:00:50 ieatlint: yes it was installed before I get it . Jul 11 09:02:03 The Toolchain wiki page gives you only instructions for ubuntu 8.04. And states that older versions do not support libmokoui2. so I can't run it there? Jul 11 09:02:05 apm is one of those outdated/legacy things that was entirely replace by acpi i thought Jul 11 09:02:17 ieatlint: maybe I think not support acpi , opkg list|grep acpi not find ,and /proc/apci not find too Jul 11 09:03:06 yeah, that would mean no acpi Jul 11 09:03:28 as i said, i'm not at all familiar with any openmoko image Jul 11 09:03:38 ;) Jul 11 09:03:48 ieatlint: thx Jul 11 09:03:49 sounds like apm is incorrectly configured or lacks support for the specific hardware Jul 11 09:04:26 i'll know about GTA02's factory firmware next week when i toy with it Jul 11 09:04:39 ieatlint: It work fine yesterday , but know I don't know what happen Jul 11 09:04:41 i'm hoping i'll know tomorrow Jul 11 09:05:11 initially they told me it'd be delivered tomorrow, then they said monday... but the tracking page shows it arriving at midnight at the closest ups hub to me Jul 11 09:05:19 Damnit, I've got to wait until next thursday, earliest. Jul 11 09:05:21 so here's to hoping they put it on the truck tomorrow Jul 11 09:05:47 i saw a youtube video someone posted today of himself getting his freerunner today Jul 11 09:07:05 laughed the whole time watching him go ape nuts trying to figure out how to open the brown box Jul 11 09:07:20 picking at the tape with his fingers lawl Jul 11 09:07:28 noob Jul 11 09:07:52 this is why i have knives, box cutters, etc Jul 11 09:08:14 ieatlint: have a kuh nife handy and a webcam so you can post it on youtube ;) Jul 11 09:08:25 also have some scalpels Jul 11 09:08:43 yeah, i'll record myself accidently cutting my hand badly while trying to open the thing, it'll be hilarious Jul 11 09:09:06 i have health insurance... it'd be a waste not to get hurt every now and then Jul 11 09:09:32 i just hate how he stopped after it was open, i was like dang boot it!!! toy around a bit i wanna see! Jul 11 09:09:50 thats like having a stripper leave the room after she gets naked Jul 11 09:10:15 i think that's what strippers do, actually Jul 11 09:10:29 Yeah, you're thinking of "whores" Jul 11 09:10:34 holy crap she needs to dance around me a few min and put her poot in my face Jul 11 09:10:48 havent you ever had a lapdance? Jul 11 09:10:49 it's like you're reading my mind Jul 11 09:11:08 yeah, once... strippers don't do it for me Jul 11 09:11:22 I'd prefer "whores" to strippers. Jul 11 09:11:39 and i prefer my girlfriend Jul 11 09:12:39 Any way you go, it's going to cost a fortune. I figure I might as well get exactly what I'm paying for. Jul 11 09:12:41 :-) Jul 11 09:12:52 haha Jul 11 09:12:54 true enough Jul 11 09:13:01 muwahaha Jul 11 09:13:04 less chance of disease with my choice Jul 11 09:14:13 Eh, maybe, maybe not. When you're putting it a working woman, you know what you're getting yourself into. A girlfriend probably wouldn't want you to know about that time behind the gas station... Jul 11 09:14:38 lol Jul 11 09:14:45 Or on the band bus. Jul 11 09:14:53 my girl isn't the typical girl :) Jul 11 09:14:54 or that time she was called "finger cuffs" Jul 11 09:14:54 Or under the bleachers Jul 11 09:16:08 Besides, girlfriends have a nasty habit of becoming "wives" Jul 11 09:16:41 which are far more expensive. Jul 11 09:17:12 eh, she and i don't fit the stereotypes Jul 11 09:17:34 afterall, me myself... a geek that's not a virgin is somewhat rare in itself Jul 11 09:17:52 ... thats not a stereo type thats life Jul 11 09:18:09 the sexually transmitted disease called life Jul 11 09:18:50 fuck. Chirping of doom. Jul 11 09:20:24 Good morning, all. I need a nap. Jul 11 09:31:15 what software can be use under openmoko? Jul 11 09:31:48 which pdf software can be use under openmoko? Jul 11 09:32:05 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07specs * r1b65b2d657c1 10/otapi/ (3 files in 2 dirs): OTAPI: org.freesmartphone.GSM.SIM: document optional and require tuples for GetSimInfo() Jul 11 09:32:06 I can't find xpdf by opkg list|grep xpdf Jul 11 09:33:11 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * recb69ee99d97 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/ (modems/abstract/mediator.py objects.py): ogsmd: implement org.freesmartphone.GSM.SIM.GetInfo() -> a{sv}. Jul 11 09:53:48 does the 'first dim then lock' option tell gta01 to suspend or does the cpu keep running? Jul 11 10:02:45 Hiya, I'm considering buying a Freerunner phone but the store said that the hardware might change in the near future. What's the scope on this? Will the phone get some important new hardware in the next couple of months? Jul 11 10:02:59 hmmmm Jul 11 10:03:06 i just ordered two of them Jul 11 10:03:53 Lemmih: maybe u will see a HSDPA module on it instead of the GPRS it comes with now Jul 11 10:04:08 don't think so Jul 11 10:04:28 HSDPA, is very expensive Jul 11 10:05:14 it will be EDGE Jul 11 10:05:15 Psi: it dims the backlight and after i while it suspends the cpu Jul 11 10:05:40 So it's relatively safe to get one now? There aren't definite plans to add 3G or a better battery? Jul 11 10:05:48 they are working in a GTA03 which is a revision of the GTA02, only thing i remember reading about is ditching the Glamo and maybe a new screen Jul 11 10:05:58 but i do nto really know Jul 11 10:06:06 yeah, and a camera Jul 11 10:06:17 but that's coming who-knows-when Jul 11 10:06:31 and a personal massager Jul 11 10:06:52 any1 wanna see my rickroll link? Jul 11 10:06:53 no, it ain't comin with a massager Jul 11 10:08:40 diego_at_work: so i shouldnt use that option? Jul 11 10:09:07 its deadly Jul 11 10:09:13 for realiable operation i mean Jul 11 10:09:41 *reliable Jul 11 10:10:18 Psi: i have had some issues waking up again if it suspends for longer than 10 mins Jul 11 10:10:35 but i think that is a known issue being worked on Jul 11 10:13:27 think they plan on giving the video a dedicated bus? Jul 11 10:13:40 that can sure be a deal breaker Jul 11 10:34:34 trickie: ~GTA03 was added yesterday to help peeps like Lemmih :) Jul 11 10:34:49 ~GTA03 Jul 11 10:34:49 somebody said gta03 was preliminarily edge/quad/camera/new case/no gpu, but that's preliminary plans. No schedule, don't expect it too soon. Jul 11 10:35:40 hmm, edge? then there is somekind of hope :) Jul 11 10:35:53 there may be* Jul 11 10:40:01 what package was required to playback mp3-s with mediaplayer? Jul 11 10:55:21 abraxa_: ok good to know :) Jul 11 10:57:18 ahven: gst-plugin-mad Jul 11 10:57:27 It should be in the dependencies, though Jul 11 10:59:02 already installed but gstreamer refuses to play mp3-s Jul 11 11:00:44 glamo :P Jul 11 11:09:25 ahven: Okay, debugging mode then :) Jul 11 11:09:45 ahven: gst-launch-0.20 playbin file:///media/card/some.mp3 Jul 11 11:09:50 -0.10 I mean Jul 11 11:10:01 gnagha Jul 11 11:10:10 gst-launch-0.10 playbin uri=file:///media/card/some.mp3 Jul 11 11:10:11 There Jul 11 11:10:30 can I use openmoko neo as a regular phone in france ? Jul 11 11:10:42 dachary: yup Jul 11 11:10:52 hi Jul 11 11:11:04 any feedback with the freerunner in belgium? Jul 11 11:11:28 root@om-gta01:~# gst-launch-0.10 playbin file:///media/card/mp3/Justmade-Thrown\ Away.mp3 Jul 11 11:11:28 Setting pipeline to PAUSED ... Jul 11 11:11:28 ERROR: Pipeline doesn't want to pause. Jul 11 11:11:28 ERROR: from element /playbin0: No URI specified to play from. Jul 11 11:11:28 Additional debug info: Jul 11 11:11:29 gstplaybasebin.c(1632): gen_source_element (): /playbin0 Jul 11 11:11:31 Setting pipeline to NULL ... Jul 11 11:11:33 FREEING pipeline ... Jul 11 11:11:35 abraxa_: i should buy a mobile chip or something ? believe it or not, i've never had a mobile phone before. I was waiting for openmoko all these years :-) Jul 11 11:11:45 heya bigon - Last time I checked you have GSM, so no problem there :) Jul 11 11:11:51 :p Jul 11 11:11:57 aah Jul 11 11:12:08 half a string, just a sec.. Jul 11 11:12:23 well I was talking about 3g sim card (in)compatibility Jul 11 11:12:27 :p Jul 11 11:12:36 dachary: By "mobile chip" you mean a SIM card? Jul 11 11:12:51 yes, I guess Jul 11 11:12:57 ** Message: don't know how to handle application/x-apetag Jul 11 11:12:57 Pipeline is PREROLLING ... Jul 11 11:12:57 ERROR: from element /playbin0: You do not have a decoder installed to handle this file. You might need to install the necessary plugins Jul 11 11:14:15 ahven: Ah, that file has an Ape Tag. You need to install gst-plugin-apetag to load it Jul 11 11:14:59 how long does it take to see a single satilite with openmoko-agpsui on average? Jul 11 11:15:01 bigon: Honestly, I haven't heard of 3G problems related to the FR. Jul 11 11:15:51 abraxa_, thanks, seem to be playing Jul 11 11:16:01 device is in another building atm Jul 11 11:16:15 dachary: Well, you might want to check http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Openmoko_Local_Groups - maybe you can meet/get in touch with others in your area Jul 11 11:16:48 thanks Jul 11 11:16:59 bumbl: Anywhere from 30s - 6 minutes, depending on how borked your model is Jul 11 11:17:35 abraxa_ I haven't got a single one in over half an hour Jul 11 11:17:37 my 01 has a 3G SIM and no problems connecting to GSM with it Jul 11 11:17:56 bumbl: Then you got bitten by the GPS bug Jul 11 11:19:29 abraxa_: so is this inlcluded in the warrenty? Jul 11 11:19:31 hi Jul 11 11:19:48 anyone knows how to fix this problem: http://pastebin.ca/1069052 Jul 11 11:20:13 bumbl: You're German so you have warranty by law. Nothing to worry about. Jul 11 11:20:27 bumbl: Oh wait. Austrian. Hm, dunno the situation there :) Jul 11 11:20:54 Austria has 24 months warranty too Jul 11 11:22:01 playya: "not a git repository" - sounds awfully familiar. Jul 11 11:22:07 and I bought it in Germany -> 24 months Jul 11 11:22:27 abraxa_, are you saying there's a bug in the gps? what does it do? any official comments? am i not liable to get a new device? Jul 11 11:22:52 playya: Doing a "git pull" in the OE dir helped me but you tried that already... Jul 11 11:23:20 yes Jul 11 11:23:38 i also tried to remove openembedded and setup again Jul 11 11:23:58 Already up-to-date. Jul 11 11:24:06 TAsn: Yeah, the circuit switching between internal and external antenna is faulty for some. http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2008-July/020961.html Jul 11 11:24:40 abraxa_, but isn't that a DOA malfunction? Jul 11 11:24:48 TAsn: It is Jul 11 11:25:05 oh, ok :) Jul 11 11:25:07 TAsn: You might want to formally declare your Neo DOA, just to be safe. Jul 11 11:25:24 what do you mean? Jul 11 11:25:37 lets try again Jul 11 11:26:01 TAsn: Let the company you purchased it from know that the GPS of your Neo is DOA. Jul 11 11:26:17 dead or alive? Jul 11 11:26:25 playya: Dead on arrival Jul 11 11:26:32 ah ok Jul 11 11:27:24 abraxa_, i c. so even if i buy it from the official OM there's no worry? Jul 11 11:27:35 TAsn: You can rest assured, though - some people in Taiwan are running around with pretty pale faces for the past few days. Jul 11 11:27:46 abraxa_, hehe :) Jul 11 11:28:04 btw does using an external ant fixes the issue? Jul 11 11:28:37 since you did say the switching circuit is the problem :) Jul 11 11:28:41 TAsn: I don't think they're going to screw anyone over as Wolfgang said that they'll get everyone's phone working properly. Can never harm to be safe, though, and for that you need to make your claim known within the limited warranty period. Jul 11 11:29:10 abraxa_: who's going to pay for the shipping, then ? Jul 11 11:29:15 TAsn: Yes it does - all's well with external Jul 11 11:29:29 abraxa_, well my biggest problem is that my uncle is buying one for me, and i can't be sure i will get mine within the 14 days period. Jul 11 11:29:55 TAsn: "is buying" - did he buy it already? Jul 11 11:30:11 If he didn't, they are probably gone... Jul 11 11:30:16 abraxa_, nope, he will on the 25th when OM.com will sell 900s.... Jul 11 11:30:22 polz: I assume Openmoko since it's their fault. Jul 11 11:30:55 *are supposed to sell the 900s :) Jul 11 11:31:00 hmm.. too bad it took my neo more than 14 days to get to me. Jul 11 11:31:20 TAsn: Ah okay. Maybe they wiped out the problems by then Jul 11 11:31:30 abraxa_, i really do hope so :) Jul 11 11:31:33 polz: Doesn't matter. It's 14 days after arrival, not departure ;) Jul 11 11:31:40 is it a way to identify FR touched by the gps bug by looking at the serialnumber or something? Jul 11 11:31:42 oh, and has anyone successfully returned their non-working headphones ? I remember I wasn't the only one having problems with those Jul 11 11:31:54 bigon: Nope. Only hardware tests help Jul 11 11:31:56 abraxa_: a friend smuggled it across the atlantic :) Jul 11 11:32:10 polz: lol... okay, that's different ;) Jul 11 11:32:10 o Jul 11 11:32:10 abraxa_: is there any formal test to do ? Jul 11 11:32:11 k Jul 11 11:32:15 As I'll get mine today Jul 11 11:32:42 i remove everything and compile from the beginning Jul 11 11:32:49 hope this will fix it Jul 11 11:33:26 btw, what do you guys think will come first - a Nokia FreePhone or an Openmoko without hardware issues ? :> Jul 11 11:34:24 Maybe the android? Jul 11 11:34:41 Ainulindale: Yeah. ssh into the Neo, "opkg install openmoko-agpsui", start it, put the Neo next to a window (or outside) and wait. If you don't have a fix after 10 minutes, you got hit. Jul 11 11:34:50 MrShlee: the android is closed, I don't care about them :) Jul 11 11:35:13 abraxa_: ok, will try that then Jul 11 11:35:19 I care about the openmoko enough to live with minor hardware issues.. :) Jul 11 11:35:34 polz: Nokia... Free... who are you kidding Jul 11 11:36:14 abraxa_, actually nokia bought symbian to release it under Eclipse Public License Jul 11 11:36:14 abraxa_: well, they're paying for QTopia development, so they might as well produce a phone using that Jul 11 11:36:26 nokia bought Qtopia and they can still develop for OM Jul 11 11:36:29 abraxa_: perhaps with older and/or cheaper hardware Jul 11 11:37:01 i tried to run android on my n800 Jul 11 11:37:15 but the only thing i get is a complete freeze Jul 11 11:37:22 * polz personally doesn't give a *expletive* about Openmoko. Jul 11 11:37:34 I'll buy whatever is Free, regardless of the brand Jul 11 11:38:36 and at the moment, the phones produced by OpenMoko are the only ones that even get close Jul 11 11:38:46 So your a coder looking for a platform? Jul 11 11:39:48 MrShlee: actually, I'm a paranoid scrooge who is afraid that the producer of the phone might drop their support Jul 11 11:40:30 MrShlee: and I like to beleive that if I choose to do so, I can alter the hardware in my phone without too much trouble. Jul 11 11:41:13 hmm... OK, not really alter, but add hardware to the phone Jul 11 11:44:29 polz: Yeah, like adding UMTS to the Neo. It would look stupid but it *is* possible :) Jul 11 11:44:51 any one know why the qemu openmoko freezes on my system with a jffs2 notice and warning? Jul 11 11:45:09 abraxa_: I was thinking more along the lines of a keyboard, connected to I2C Jul 11 11:45:20 polz: if the hardware is dropped.. that would suck - but the development community will continue coding.. Jul 11 11:45:27 Anyone started SCUMMVM yet? Jul 11 11:45:45 MrShlee: sure, it's included in Scaredycat's builds by default Jul 11 11:46:14 newb: pastebin is your friend :) (though no, I have no experience with qemu) Jul 11 11:46:18 it doesn't work that well with only one mouse button, though :) Jul 11 11:46:43 polz: There's a patched version/fork out there who remedies that. I'll have to find it Jul 11 11:46:54 abraxa_ : will it hamper my s/w development when i do finally get the device? Jul 11 11:48:42 newb: "it"? Jul 11 11:50:17 abraxa_ will qemu not working hamper my s/w development? Jul 11 11:52:20 polz: If you can easily hold alt while clicking. should work Jul 11 11:52:32 newb: Honestly? qemu is not suitable for software development :) Jul 11 11:58:31 wow.. Jul 11 11:58:45 cpu usage has normalised :) Jul 11 11:58:52 ack Jul 11 11:58:59 load is still > 1:P Jul 11 11:59:42 load is not a great measure of system usage often as it never is instant Jul 11 11:59:47 it takes a while to average out Jul 11 12:00:29 Also it's a poor indication of CPU load. Jul 11 12:00:39 Run 500 sleep 1h's. Jul 11 12:00:51 The machine'll be just as responsive as before. Jul 11 12:01:02 With a load average of 500 Jul 11 12:02:42 its just a poor indication. full stop Jul 11 12:05:34 abraxa_ so it's fine as long as i have the toolchain built on my system right? :) Jul 11 12:05:41 Anyone with a stupidly fast computer able to report on comparable speed of qemu? Jul 11 12:06:29 SpeedEvil: Any idea if qemu is multithreaded? Jul 11 12:06:58 openmoko: 03graeme 07org.openmoko.dev * r55ac41aa33fe 10/packages/busybox/ (busybox-1.9.2/defconfig busybox_1.9.2.bb): [busybox] enable mdev to be able to experiment in OM Jul 11 12:06:59 newb: Yeah, though it still depends on what exactly you want to do. Jul 11 12:07:26 abraxa_: don't think so Jul 11 12:07:38 abraxa_: that'd be quite tricky to do Jul 11 12:07:58 abraxa_: make GTK+ applications Jul 11 12:08:08 abraxa_: with Cairo and OpenGL acceleration Jul 11 12:08:44 SpeedEvil: Hmm, so "stupidly fast" really just refers to the MHz count... Jul 11 12:08:58 newb: OpenGL acceleration? What for? Jul 11 12:09:30 abraxa_: i want to create some funky interfaces with Cairo :) Jul 11 12:09:42 Cairo on openGL is faster than with X Jul 11 12:09:55 newb: Hm okay... they'll be terribly slow, though, if you want them to run on GTA02/03 Jul 11 12:09:57 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.dev * ra33d11c36e6a 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: up exposure to srcrev 55 to fix blank vs suspend timeout. Jul 11 12:11:09 abraxa_: OpenGL embedded. i thought GTA02 has a built in 3d accelerator from S-Media? Jul 11 12:11:32 newb: that diddn't work out so well Jul 11 12:11:43 newb: it's not really a functional accellerator at 3D Jul 11 12:11:46 newb: I'll leave that to raster, he always enjoys breaking the news to people Jul 11 12:12:22 newb: raster has been driven utterly insane by it, and has been found telling rocks how bad it is, after trying to write drivers. Jul 11 12:12:22 abraxa_: you do the honors Jul 11 12:13:00 telling rocks?!?!!!!!11! Jul 11 12:13:00 newb: on balance, the glamo is probably a wash on performance in many areas. Jul 11 12:13:44 raster: Bummer... Jul 11 12:13:49 newb: there are some aspects in which it's good, but equal areas in which it just gets in the way by being a limit. Jul 11 12:14:10 does anyone know how slow is the opengl software fallback? Jul 11 12:14:15 the glamo is a gfx chip Jul 11 12:14:16 SpeedEvil: so u mean there is no scope for 3d on Gta02? Jul 11 12:14:17 Primarilyy that it's connected over a bus about the speed of a 16 bit ISA card. Jul 11 12:14:17 it can do accel Jul 11 12:14:29 but only to a certain limied extent envisaged by tis designers Jul 11 12:14:35 rememebr the glamo is about 4-5 years old Jul 11 12:14:37 newb: What SpeedEvil is trying to say is... there is no 3D. There's no driver, there won't be no driver because of stupid NDAs and it'll be removed in future hardware releases. Jul 11 12:14:37 as a chip Jul 11 12:14:53 VGA is at the absolute maximum limit of its output abilites Jul 11 12:14:57 i thought i saw qtopia doing a cover style shift on the GTA02 Jul 11 12:14:58 andwhen ti comes to 3d - it shows Jul 11 12:15:00 it cant even do vga Jul 11 12:15:08 max 3d buffer size is 511x511 Jul 11 12:15:18 newb: it's doing it in software Jul 11 12:15:36 u dont need hardware opengl to do simple 3d-ish effects Jul 11 12:15:43 people have been doing them for decades without it Jul 11 12:15:50 hell i have a 3d engine of my own Jul 11 12:15:58 i quickly compild it for my freerunner Jul 11 12:16:02 raster: so qvga 3d is possible in software? Jul 11 12:16:02 raster: oh :) i didn't know that Jul 11 12:16:05 it manages 7fps in 480x640 Jul 11 12:16:16 raster: hmmm... that's real bad Jul 11 12:16:18 abraxa_: why the heck was it included with such obvious problems? Someone need to dump some chips cheaply? :) Jul 11 12:16:20 with trexture mapping, gouraud shading lightsourceand even lens flare:) Jul 11 12:16:27 so if i can manage that Jul 11 12:16:37 qtopia can manage a simple little coverflow Jul 11 12:16:48 raster: wow... ur a genius Jul 11 12:17:15 raster: you're getting 7fps on the frerunner? Jul 11 12:18:08 newb: no. not at all. i simplywronga very simple 16bit color only 3d engine way back when i was a student to run on my p120. Jul 11 12:18:17 these were the days of "quake" and it had just come out Jul 11 12:18:21 raster: how much is bus bandwidth eating into that 7fps? Jul 11 12:18:25 and doing 3d - in software... no GL or hw at the time Jul 11 12:18:30 and so i jyst had to join the game Jul 11 12:18:36 so i wrote an engine of my own Jul 11 12:18:42 SpeedEvil: a lot Jul 11 12:18:43 raster: how much is bus bandwidth eating into the CPU for that 7fps? Jul 11 12:19:00 and are we talking of gta02? Jul 11 12:19:10 SpeedEvil: i did a test. if i didnt have the glamo (but instead had a dumb framebuffer that he 2442 already supports) Jul 11 12:19:14 i go from 7 to 12fps Jul 11 12:19:16 raster: fantastic :) can i use ur 3d engine? Jul 11 12:19:26 so that gives u an idea of the impact of the bus Jul 11 12:19:40 newb: unlikely. its not very "usable" Jul 11 12:19:46 and i have no license for it Jul 11 12:20:00 nor is it meant as a generic pluggable3d engine or 3d api Jul 11 12:20:10 its mroe to the point that it CAN be done Jul 11 12:20:15 raster: hmmm... and u say opengl embedded won't work on GTA02 Jul 11 12:20:16 btw - texsture mapping isnt perspective correct Jul 11 12:20:20 i took a shortcut :) Jul 11 12:20:25 so basically qvga @ 25 fps 3D is possible, my heart's at ease Jul 11 12:20:38 gmaxwell: Featuritis... and people in upper management without a clue. Jul 11 12:20:45 (quake managesto do perspective correct as it made use of the pentiums separate fpo unit and that u cna do an fp command while doing integer ones - no such luck on arm) Jul 11 12:21:09 igor321: yes. 7fps at 480x640 Jul 11 12:21:12 its a simple demo Jul 11 12:21:23 one day i should actually come back and fix up the code Jul 11 12:21:24 abraxa_, could have added a second cpu there instead! ;) Jul 11 12:21:27 fix a bug or 2 Jul 11 12:21:35 ad things like alpha blending Jul 11 12:21:41 who cares about VGA 3D on such a small screen? :) Jul 11 12:21:41 i dont hav e azbuffer Jul 11 12:21:54 so i need torely on backfaceculling and painters alog Jul 11 12:22:00 gmaxwell: Believe it or not, that was on the table for GTA04. Jul 11 12:22:14 i really should do pre-clipping ofobscured triangles too to avoid overdraw Jul 11 12:22:21 lots of things i should do with the engine Jul 11 12:22:25 but io just never got time Jul 11 12:22:49 igor321: that depends. if u are trying to use the 3d pipeline to accelerate 2d Jul 11 12:22:56 ie use textures instead of pixmaps Jul 11 12:22:58 etc. Jul 11 12:22:59 then it matters Jul 11 12:23:02 I'll just be happy if it makes phone calls and sends texts Jul 11 12:23:05 as it doesnt have render-to-textue Jul 11 12:23:11 there are blockages in doing that sanely Jul 11 12:23:18 other than the resolution limit Jul 11 12:23:41 maybe using all the "demo-scene" dirty tricks in sofware could help in gta02 Jul 11 12:23:54 GTA02 is fundamentally liited. Jul 11 12:24:01 i remember some very impressive graphics from back in the day Jul 11 12:24:08 The bus speed of the glamo is 16 bits ISAish. Jul 11 12:24:15 There is only so much you can do. Jul 11 12:24:35 in VGA, yes Jul 11 12:24:41 QVGA, i think you can do a lot Jul 11 12:24:46 And worse than any ISA video card, it cannot do DMA. Jul 11 12:25:16 abraxa_: "was" ? Jul 11 12:26:03 raster: why does the website say 3d acceleration ? :( Jul 11 12:26:12 raster: what m i supposed to use for that? Jul 11 12:27:22 newb: Marketing. Never rely on it. Jul 11 12:27:46 newb: what does it say exactly? Jul 11 12:28:01 who says 3D won't be available one day? Jul 11 12:28:10 igor321: thats kind of what the 3d engine i wrote is doing - partly. but it still hits a wal - it cant upload pixels to video ram that fast Jul 11 12:28:17 Psi: Speed ARM9 400Mhz Processor 2D/3D Acceleration Jul 11 12:28:27 thus thats why u go from 7 to 12fps if u "remove" the glamo's slow bus. Jul 11 12:28:40 newb: well technically thats true Jul 11 12:29:06 raster: yes, at VGA, but for games and such QVGA is more than enough on such a small screen Jul 11 12:29:16 newb: nothing. there are no drivers. the website is wrong Jul 11 12:29:34 there are no drivers for the 3d susbsyetm on the glamo Jul 11 12:29:37 Psi: I just read the mails again to give you a reference and it seems the second CPU wasn't meant as a "general purpose" CPU but for device/power management only. If you want to read the mails, they're filed under "GTA04 Block" on the hardware list Jul 11 12:29:41 u needan nda to get the chipset specs Jul 11 12:29:42 if only there was a way to switch seamlessly beetwen QVGA and VGA (for documents and such) Jul 11 12:29:44 raster: ok so they expect US to develop those drivers? :) KEWL that sounds like fun Jul 11 12:29:49 and the only peolpe with anndaright now are openmoko Jul 11 12:29:55 and we are not writign drivers for the 3d. Jul 11 12:29:57 abraxa_: thanks Jul 11 12:30:20 igor321: sure, but such a waste of a vga screen. Jul 11 12:30:32 raster: i didn't understand ur last statement Jul 11 12:30:47 newb: sorry Jul 11 12:31:01 newb: "the only people with an NDA right now are openmoko" Jul 11 12:31:22 newb: writing drivers for something without understanding how it works is pretty impossible Jul 11 12:31:39 raster: well if it can switch modes, its okay really, i guess the difference in price is no more than $50 between the qvga and vga Jul 11 12:32:14 igor321: add to that the $5? the glamo costs. Jul 11 12:32:18 hackers now and days they need manuals tsk tsk Jul 11 12:32:26 Psi: hmmmm.. so in the near future we may have drivers for this? Jul 11 12:32:56 newb: no one is writing opengl drivers Jul 11 12:33:10 newb: the peopole who have the docs to do so (openmoko) are not going to do so Jul 11 12:33:18 becsause the glamo is the end of a line Jul 11 12:33:22 there is no successor to it Jul 11 12:33:30 Well... Jul 11 12:33:36 it is even an EOL'd chipand we dont have guaranted supplies in the future Jul 11 12:33:36 raster: i wouldnt be blaming om for it Jul 11 12:33:40 so even if we wanted it Jul 11 12:33:42 raster: :( oh! then they should have included a newer chip from ATI or NVIDIA Jul 11 12:33:45 The new SoC has a inbuilt GPU. Jul 11 12:33:51 we dont have assurance we can BUY it for production Jul 11 12:33:53 * NooOne is writing drivers Jul 11 12:33:53 Which is a sort-of update. Jul 11 12:34:00 raster: WTF? Jul 11 12:34:03 heh @ ati/nvidia Jul 11 12:34:11 so for us it makes no enseto go writing drivers for something that has no future lifespan before freerunner :( Jul 11 12:34:13 Wander_w: you can't buy all announced chips in small volume. Jul 11 12:34:26 Wander_w: where small may be under 100000. Jul 11 12:34:28 newb: its embdded graphics. its very different from the desktop Jul 11 12:34:28 SpeedEvil: yes that's why it's called a SOC :) Jul 11 12:34:40 raster: i am aware :) Jul 11 12:34:55 newb: first allof ati's "embdded" chips are even weaker than the glamo Jul 11 12:34:59 nvidias stuff is all closed Jul 11 12:35:05 I just hope the openmoko is successful enough to interest the group to produce the next-gen release. Jul 11 12:35:05 raster: so that's why i was speaking about openGl embedded Jul 11 12:35:11 and pretty much everything else is PART of an SOC Jul 11 12:35:13 eg OMAP Jul 11 12:35:14 etc. Jul 11 12:35:16 goedmorgen :] Jul 11 12:35:16 what are they replacing the glamo with in gta03? or dont we know yet? Jul 11 12:35:27 Psi: ripping it out Jul 11 12:35:29 raster: ..but without the drivers.. isn't the glamo a very small paperweight? Jul 11 12:35:32 Psi: no glamo. back to dumb framebuffer. Jul 11 12:35:33 Psi: dumb framebuffer Jul 11 12:35:39 ok Jul 11 12:35:44 Wander_w: 2D accel, mpeg-4 decode Jul 11 12:35:45 Speaking of OMAP .. heck I'd rather have a FPU and a DSP than a GPU in my GTAn+1 Jul 11 12:35:50 Wander_w: those will be in Jul 11 12:36:01 haha Jul 11 12:36:10 Wander_w: there are drivers. forbasic framebuffer, for 2D fills and blits (copies) and for xvideo (yuv->rgb+ scaling) Jul 11 12:36:25 so... those bastards are EOLing the glamo and still won't give out docs? Jul 11 12:36:28 hmm ok Jul 11 12:36:36 Guys .. I'll buy the FreeRunner from the UK reseller and ship to somewhere inside the UK and my friend there will take it back with her to Egypt ... will she get the VAT in the airport ? Jul 11 12:36:38 igor321: they can't. Jul 11 12:36:53 igor321: OM are not in a legal position to copy and release the docs. Jul 11 12:37:02 VAT? Jul 11 12:37:02 igor321: they'd have to write new docs in order to release them. Jul 11 12:37:07 SpeedEvil: but what about the people producing the glamo? Jul 11 12:37:08 SpeedEvil: i'm not talking bout OM Jul 11 12:37:10 Value Added Tax Jul 11 12:37:11 i think he means the ppl who made the glamo Jul 11 12:37:15 oh Jul 11 12:37:21 SpeedEvil: i'm talking about s-media Jul 11 12:37:22 Wander_w: it's rare for EOLd chips to have the specs released. Jul 11 12:37:29 Ask Egypt :] Jul 11 12:37:33 doh Jul 11 12:37:36 fuck Egypt Jul 11 12:37:37 I can't off-hand thin of a topic. Jul 11 12:37:39 I can't off-hand thin of a topic. Jul 11 12:37:44 I can't off-hand thin of a chip where it's happened. Jul 11 12:37:51 +k Jul 11 12:37:56 NDA'd EOLd chips Jul 11 12:38:23 it's really crazy it is Jul 11 12:38:40 that they are EOLing it and still don't want to give out docs Jul 11 12:38:48 for an 8 years old chip Jul 11 12:38:58 its not 8 Jul 11 12:39:00 igor321: buisness as usual. Jul 11 12:39:00 its about 4-5 Jul 11 12:39:04 raster: is it possible for someone outside of openmoko to subscribe the glamo nda? (i think of http://www.linuxdriverproject.org/twiki/bin/view) Jul 11 12:39:06 its how 'things have always been done' Jul 11 12:39:14 hard to change peoples views on it Jul 11 12:39:19 SpeedEvil: well it sucks :) Jul 11 12:39:24 it makes me sad that there is a chip in the moko, using up power, PCB realestate and bandwidth to the SD card that goes unused for about 90% Jul 11 12:39:33 borg_: yes - but they will probably only be interested in signing a NDA with you if you buy many thousands. Jul 11 12:39:58 again - they EOLing it! crazy Jul 11 12:40:10 what thousands are they gonna buy? Jul 11 12:40:15 Units Jul 11 12:40:16 heh Jul 11 12:40:39 openmoko probably buys many thousand, the question is, if openmoko inc can help someone from outside to get the possibilitie to subscribe an nda Jul 11 12:40:43 igor321: the fundamental point of view of this sort of company is that they utterly do not want small - under 1000 say - orders. Jul 11 12:41:07 igor321: simply as they are complex, and the support to users would outweigh the benefits. Jul 11 12:41:19 from the faq of the linuxdriverproject: Jul 11 12:41:19 Q: What about drivers for video cards? Jul 11 12:41:20 A: Yes, we will be glad to work on the kernel side of video drivers for Linux. Jul 11 12:41:52 SpeedEvil: i understand that, but since they're about to stop production of the chip, i see no reason in hoarding the specs of a soon-to-be EOL'd chip :( Jul 11 12:42:21 igor321: they may not also have the rights to distribute the docs. Jul 11 12:42:27 igor321: - Smedia Jul 11 12:42:47 SpeedEvil: maybe so... but i doubt it Jul 11 12:43:02 glamo is the gpu with limited drivers? Jul 11 12:43:11 Hello Jul 11 12:43:12 Blamo! Jul 11 12:43:13 igor321: they may not have developed all the IP in that chip, and have agreed to only release docs under NDA Jul 11 12:43:16 MrShleee: yes Jul 11 12:43:31 q: why no camera on the FR? Just curious? Jul 11 12:43:45 borg_: trolltech tried Jul 11 12:43:51 Kango_V: because the case was fixed with no camera hole. Jul 11 12:43:57 LOL Jul 11 12:44:05 heh Jul 11 12:44:18 MORE HOLES PLEASE! Jul 11 12:44:24 Kango_V: also, there are reasons for not having a camera - soe people cannot use phones with cameras. Adn a camera is around $10. Jul 11 12:44:26 SpeedEvil: we could connect an USB camera to it though? Jul 11 12:44:30 is the 900MHz version available in the US or Canada ? Jul 11 12:44:33 newb: sure. Or bluetooth. Jul 11 12:44:41 newb: or wifi, or ... Jul 11 12:44:49 out with the Glamo, in with the camera! Jul 11 12:44:59 Glamo? Jul 11 12:45:00 ~_~ Jul 11 12:45:02 STOP DOING THAT! Jul 11 12:45:34 Kango_V: the "graphic card" Jul 11 12:45:42 apt, stop doing what? ~_~ Jul 11 12:45:43 i find it funny that the gta02 is already sold out... does anyone know FIC's capacity? Jul 11 12:45:44 * apt leaps to his feet and stops doing what? ~_~ Jul 11 12:46:04 like how much motherboards or whatever they manufacture per year? Jul 11 12:46:22 apt nickometer HauDyrArb Jul 11 12:46:24 'HauDyrArb' is 8.000% lame, dave Jul 11 12:46:25 aww Jul 11 12:46:27 igor321: IIRC hundreds of thousands of phones Jul 11 12:46:30 yay Jul 11 12:46:33 :D Jul 11 12:46:38 lol Jul 11 12:46:42 apt nickometer Wander_w Jul 11 12:46:44 'Wander_w' is 14.000% lame, wander_w Jul 11 12:46:46 igor321: i find it funny that the qualitiy of the devices differs (gps) that much Jul 11 12:46:49 * Dave pets apt Jul 11 12:47:21 bumbl: yeah, sad, good thing there is a DIY fix on the wiki now ;) Jul 11 12:47:21 igor321: the quality is probably an assembly issue. Jul 11 12:47:21 I just got my neo and I like to install python - is there a more recent rootfs or what the way to do it? Jul 11 12:47:23 SpeedEvil: soo... did they underestimate the popularity of the moko? Jul 11 12:47:27 apt, nickometer Dave Jul 11 12:47:28 'Dave' is 0.000% lame, haudyrarb Jul 11 12:47:35 Fuck yeah. Jul 11 12:47:40 apt botsnack Jul 11 12:47:41 Dave: aw, gee Jul 11 12:47:43 :) Jul 11 12:47:50 yes they probably did underestimate it, being sold out and all :) Jul 11 12:48:01 Wander_w: there is a couple of weeks at least delay it looks like between the PCB maker and the shop. Jul 11 12:48:12 HauDyrArb: should be lamer, it's awkward and has multiple caps :p Jul 11 12:48:13 igor321: have you tried it or has it been reported to be successful; i would rather replace it than destroy it myself Jul 11 12:48:39 Wander_w: it's more if you count fro the time the red button is pushed to the time it hits theshop. Jul 11 12:49:08 bumbl: still havent got the gta02, so i woulndn't know Jul 11 12:49:41 Dave, aah my n1ck 1s s0 1337 Jul 11 12:49:45 SpeedEvil: yeah, I understand all that... but didn't smart people made a guess and said "We need to have X number of phones before we launch and Y number of phones per week after that? Jul 11 12:50:10 From their standpoint, better not enough than too many Jul 11 12:50:12 Wander_w: because being stuck with a quarter of a million dollars of stock unsold is a scary thing. Jul 11 12:50:23 or did they go: "Hey, we got 10 phones! lets launch! Jul 11 12:50:38 probably more like 2000, but yeah. :-) Jul 11 12:50:40 Wander_w: my personal guess is that the first batch was 1500. Jul 11 12:50:42 igor321: there is information about the gps problem and a fix in the wiki? Can you point me into the right direction? I can't seem to find it Jul 11 12:50:50 Wander_w: split between US and EU Jul 11 12:51:06 bh Jul 11 12:51:09 ntwrk Jul 11 12:51:18 -_- Jul 11 12:51:32 eww Jul 11 12:51:39 igor321: you're not mentioning my 'reseat the antenna connection' suggestion? Jul 11 12:51:54 igor321: I have no idea that that will help - but it's reasonable to try. Jul 11 12:51:58 jakob__: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FreeRunner_GPS_antenna_repair_SOP , but i wouldn't suggest doing it right now Jul 11 12:52:07 \o/ Jul 11 12:52:15 SpeedEvil: is this your link? Jul 11 12:52:27 wiki whatever? Jul 11 12:52:54 igor321: I did not intend to do now. But it's might be of value to watch this article for further ideas :) Jul 11 12:52:58 igor321: thx. Jul 11 12:53:07 SpeedEvil: ok cool, so the moko is a raving succes then :) Jul 11 12:53:07 shortages all-round.. allmost like an Apple Iphone launch Jul 11 12:53:09 jakob__: np :) Jul 11 12:53:22 wiki wiki Jul 11 12:54:24 igor321: no Jul 11 12:54:53 the iphone was just launched in denmark, people went crazy Jul 11 12:55:26 haha, silly danes Jul 11 12:55:38 i guess gta02 will sell 10000 in its lifetime, before 03 comes, barring any OEM purchases and all Jul 11 12:56:18 igor321: where do you base that stat off? Jul 11 12:56:19 :) Jul 11 12:56:47 but not me i already have an iphone killer (when all the software is written) Jul 11 12:56:56 :D Jul 11 12:57:02 * Dave high-fives haudrarjsf Jul 11 12:57:29 raster: well i think there will bi some 5000 early adopters, and 5000 linux geeks who will buy it once the software is ready... very unscientific i know :9 Jul 11 12:57:46 i do belive it's too ugly for the consumer market Jul 11 12:57:52 but gta03 will fix that :) Jul 11 12:58:05 same with my mp3 player Sansa E280 with RockBox, Jul 11 12:58:12 I got a comment from a friend at a meeting the other day Jul 11 12:58:27 they said to me, wow, if they ever had to put linux on a phone, this is what it would look like Jul 11 12:58:42 igor321: aaah.. so... wild speculation :) Jul 11 12:58:43 bulky, black, unattractive, and unintuitive design :p Jul 11 12:58:50 I laughed. Jul 11 12:58:53 is the 900MHz version available in the US or Canada ? Jul 11 12:58:56 just was wondering where 10k comesfrom Jul 11 12:59:00 ie u've done surveys Jul 11 12:59:10 seen an indicator of # of peolpe saying they will buy Jul 11 12:59:19 I love the neo's design... Jul 11 12:59:20 raster: there are some surveys i believe :) Jul 11 12:59:24 ie - how big is this "i'm a linux nerd and want my open linux phone" market Jul 11 12:59:34 i know of no studies that indicate its size Jul 11 12:59:36 386 Jul 11 12:59:50 DX Jul 11 13:00:02 haha Jul 11 13:00:08 i was really surprised that there we're 14 people lined up for the group purchase in my (very small) country Jul 11 13:00:13 Tanuva :D Jul 11 13:00:19 newb: anything is possible. SMedia could be bought out tomorrow and the new company might release the docs. Or the docs may never be released. Or they might leak onto the net etc.. But i'd assume it's never going to happen if i was you, because if it ever does happen its most likely to be years from now. Jul 11 13:00:29 I think the closest thing it resembles is a shower radio Jul 11 13:00:34 not necessarily a hockey puck Jul 11 13:00:41 We should have an open survey about that! :D Jul 11 13:00:43 I was really astonished to find like 8-10 others interested in buying the Neo1973 and the FreeRunner in "Egypt" Jul 11 13:00:57 Dave: maybe its because I'm too geeky to think its ugly.. :D Jul 11 13:01:02 soap on a rope Jul 11 13:01:07 exactly! Jul 11 13:01:14 or something on a rope... :p Jul 11 13:01:21 well.... not that the FSF is pushing it... who knows? :) Jul 11 13:01:25 Anyone else plan on wearing it around their neck? Jul 11 13:01:26 oh man, I'm going to flash images this morning Jul 11 13:01:32 rivalarrival: I already have Jul 11 13:01:48 It didn't work as well as I would have liked in that department. Jul 11 13:01:49 :| Jul 11 13:01:49 Is that loop sturdy enough? Jul 11 13:01:58 yeah it's fine Jul 11 13:02:02 rivalarrival: plenty Jul 11 13:02:05 but I didn't have a lanyard Jul 11 13:02:10 :[ Jul 11 13:02:12 It's good to have the soap somewhere handy, provided you already know where your towel is. Jul 11 13:02:14 rivalarrival: it's an integral part of the case. Jul 11 13:02:16 * Dave disappointed. Jul 11 13:02:26 Yeah, a little paracord, and I'll have a lanyard Jul 11 13:03:08 Or maybe I'll use some UTP strands from a length of cat-5 Jul 11 13:03:35 meh - the fact the openmoko got this far is great, the community will grow and cores developers will grow. Once the next Openmoko is ready to rock, we should be able to hit up the soccer mums. Jul 11 13:04:18 np: Akon - smack that. Jul 11 13:04:41 Maybe not the soccer moms, but probably the Ubuntu community. Jul 11 13:04:58 rivalarrival, utp gives the final touch Jul 11 13:04:58 thats a pretty big community :) Jul 11 13:05:14 hahaha soccer mums :) Jul 11 13:05:15 Soccer moms don't tend to buy high-end phones Jul 11 13:05:32 gah Jul 11 13:05:34 Psi: And getting bigger by the hour. Jul 11 13:05:34 we'll make an image specially for them :) Jul 11 13:05:46 _unless_ somebody makes the killer soccer mom app for om Jul 11 13:05:57 heh Jul 11 13:05:59 Like what? A portable minivan? Jul 11 13:06:05 haha Jul 11 13:06:11 rivalarrival, hold on, I'm trying to think ;) Jul 11 13:06:14 gps tracker for your kids? Jul 11 13:06:20 Hold on, kids, let me whip out my phone so we can drive home! Jul 11 13:06:22 sounds like a typical one Jul 11 13:06:27 "kids minder 0.01" reminds you when to pick up your kids and such Jul 11 13:06:37 let me bust out my evil black tracking device! Jul 11 13:06:53 fun stuff for the kids to do with the moko in the back of the tractor Jul 11 13:07:02 Dave: +1 >:] Jul 11 13:07:10 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soccer_mom Jul 11 13:07:12 GossipTracker - lets you input gossip of a user. The gossip will automatically spread to everyone but the subject of the gossip Jul 11 13:07:14 yep Jul 11 13:07:20 In popular culture Jul 11 13:07:20 * Tanuva is just unpacking his shiny new C2D... Jul 11 13:07:22 An OM-light would be nice... an entry-level phone with a modest feature set, but easily programmable. Jul 11 13:07:31 Dave: Bingo - If someone codes a social network for Iphone/openmoko.. tracking locations of friends/kids Jul 11 13:07:33 :o Jul 11 13:08:18 I think I have alot of faith in software innovations on the hardware these phones offer. Jul 11 13:08:29 I guess that's OM-Lite... Jul 11 13:08:36 If OM doesn't get in the way software-wise. Jul 11 13:08:53 going to take a long while to hit soccermums Jul 11 13:09:03 I'd be astonished at 2010. Jul 11 13:09:05 Worst thing an FOSS community can do is attempt to restrict the software. Jul 11 13:09:10 u'll need to have the $0 phone that he telco subsidised with your plan Jul 11 13:09:15 raster, not with my GossipTracker 3000 Jul 11 13:09:25 as frankly they soccer mums are looking for the cheapest thing that makes calls Jul 11 13:09:26 :) Jul 11 13:09:40 and only looking for a fashion update Jul 11 13:09:43 or if their breaks Jul 11 13:10:04 Put killer apps on it, and that might change. Jul 11 13:10:11 a pink gta03 with mjr's gossiptracker 3000 would sell like crazy :) Jul 11 13:10:27 need aheh Jul 11 13:10:28 I imagine Tmobile and ATT are going to shit bricks when they find a few thousand completely opened phones on their networks. Jul 11 13:10:37 err, -need a Jul 11 13:10:58 und: those numbers were for $200/axis accels. Jul 11 13:10:59 oops Jul 11 13:11:00 rivalarrival: hehe Jul 11 13:11:14 Soccermom's will need a camera, a phone, and that's about it. Jul 11 13:11:26 Since it is cheaper to buy a simcard with infinite SMS, an app that periodically sent any positional data to mum's moko (public key stuff, of course) would be pretty good. Or would the large numbers of similar plaintext compromise the keys? Jul 11 13:12:00 Doh! sent over SMS, I should have added Jul 11 13:12:18 zmedico: not with ont-time-pad. Jul 11 13:12:23 Do it on demand - mom's moko pings the kids, the kids mokos pong silently Jul 11 13:12:51 mmyeaha, on sms they can wake up for it... Jul 11 13:13:06 "It's 10 o'clock - do you know where your kids are?" Jul 11 13:13:23 and then perhaps otherwise wake every hour or so and see if you can get a fix Jul 11 13:13:36 go back to sleep after a timeout Jul 11 13:13:41 Child tracking is one thing I've never understood. People can't trust their own kids a bit? Jul 11 13:13:44 I like the idea of ping-over-sms Jul 11 13:14:00 Rakshasa: I'd use it more for my car than my kids. :-) Jul 11 13:14:05 Rakshasa: it's easier in some comunities than others. Jul 11 13:14:13 But the idea is the same. Jul 11 13:15:58 rivalarrival: I use a steering wheel locking device... ? Jul 11 13:16:21 Rakshasa: I use an acetylene torch. Jul 11 13:17:24 The GPS problem is a faulty internal connector? Jul 11 13:18:11 Oh, and a loose solder joint. Jul 11 13:18:24 rivalarrival: Personally I'd doubt it but it's from Coolcat (who's an OM employee), so there has to be something to it Jul 11 13:18:59 Well, it would make sense based on the symptoms they were describing... Jul 11 13:20:43 does anybody know how this problem might be fixed? http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2008-July/021073.html Unfortunately the guy asking the question just says he solved the problem but not how it was done :( Jul 11 13:23:04 jakob__: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003492.html Jul 11 13:25:46 trickie: thx. thats sounds promising :) Jul 11 13:26:14 jakob__: np Jul 11 13:31:19 http://politiken.dk/archive/00269/China_Olympics_Secu_269518c.jpg Jul 11 13:31:58 HauDyrArb: ...funky ;) Jul 11 13:32:27 someone posted the link on another channel Jul 11 13:33:06 leinir! Jul 11 13:33:22 * leinir curtsies to Dave "Sir" :) Jul 11 13:34:17 :) Jul 11 13:34:27 hah, a curtsy, eh? Jul 11 13:34:45 my neod is consuming about 15% cpu although I'm doing nothing, that's ok? ;) Jul 11 13:34:52 yep! Jul 11 13:34:54 quickdev: no Jul 11 13:34:56 It's shitty like that :D Jul 11 13:35:02 quickdev: find out why it does that, and fix it. Jul 11 13:35:06 hahaha Jul 11 13:35:31 i saw the same around 8% all the time Jul 11 13:35:38 Speedevil, is it normal if my neod or hald is using 282M ? and using 90% CPU? Jul 11 13:35:54 I accept this as "normal" as of presently. Jul 11 13:36:00 Well - there is normal, and there is right. Jul 11 13:36:03 SpeedEvil, I'll try as soon I've got my development environment Jul 11 13:36:04 of course Jul 11 13:36:11 just like mozilla is not "right" :p Jul 11 13:37:07 but ideally shouldent it have 100% idle most of the time and then once a minute use 10% cpu ? Jul 11 13:37:29 meh Jul 11 13:37:37 It should be idle 100% of the time, and once an hour, use 10% Jul 11 13:37:40 btw, since the neo is using flash it doesn't use swap nor does it keep logs, right? Jul 11 13:38:27 TAsn: you can swapon to the SD Jul 11 13:38:40 eh, over it's projected 2-year lifespan, the chances of killing the flash memory are slim and none. Jul 11 13:38:51 but it will finish that off ;) Jul 11 13:39:32 http://svnweb.openmoko.org/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/daemons/neod/README?view=auto hm Jul 11 13:39:51 swap to the SD.. SD's are cheap and getting cheaper and easy to replace Jul 11 13:40:02 quickdev: There's a bug in neod. Jul 11 13:40:18 abraxa_: 'a'? Jul 11 13:40:24 abraxa_, yeah, but fixing it would be useless if it's replaced soon Jul 11 13:40:38 SpeedEvil: Good catch :) Jul 11 13:41:59 * twolife is away: Je suis occupé Jul 11 13:42:00 quickdev: "soon".. Jul 11 13:45:21 Any qtopia whores in here? Jul 11 13:46:03 was there ever any GSM900 versions of the Neo FreeRunner available? I saw openmoko-announce and the new webshop etc but GSM900 is listed as sold out... Jul 11 13:46:28 avtobiff, read on the bottom right corner Jul 11 13:46:41 will be available at 25th of july. Jul 11 13:46:56 Easly on, yes. Jul 11 13:47:29 TAsn, oh, thanks :) Jul 11 13:47:40 avtobiff, no problem Jul 11 13:47:53 though i should have lied and told you it will be out at the 26th Jul 11 13:48:00 TAsn, hehe Jul 11 13:48:05 since i don't want you to grab one before me :) Jul 11 13:48:10 lol Jul 11 13:48:25 TAsn, i surf in a window that is 640px wide so i didn't see that. i didn't scroll around either. Jul 11 13:48:36 i came here instead :D Jul 11 13:48:51 avtobiff, :) Jul 11 13:48:59 Anyone running Qtopia here? Jul 11 13:49:25 Dave: Yes, i am :) Jul 11 13:49:59 It's very snappy, the powermanagement makes the display funny, but generally it's good :) Jul 11 13:51:10 avtobiff, i have a 900 version Jul 11 13:51:23 waah, my phone has been lying at SAN PABLO for a day now. Damn UPC :) Jul 11 13:51:56 avtobiff, bourgt from germany handheld-linux.com Jul 11 13:52:19 HauDyrArb, what was the price? Jul 11 13:52:44 360 EUR Jul 11 13:52:59 anyone any suggestions how to get a freerunner in the UK? Jul 11 13:53:26 fionaw, i think there is an UK reseller check on openmoko.com Jul 11 13:53:34 they always just say out of stock Jul 11 13:53:37 and it has done since the release Jul 11 13:53:38 HauDyrArb, isn't that quite pricy? Jul 11 13:54:03 HauDyrArb, i can wait two weeks to save 100 EUR Jul 11 13:54:27 Leinir, ah good, so what kernel image do I reqire? Jul 11 13:54:29 require Jul 11 13:54:46 The tgz on qtopia.net includes a kernel image :) Jul 11 13:54:49 and yeh they want like £272 Jul 11 13:55:04 eh? Jul 11 13:55:18 OH, haha, right Jul 11 13:55:18 avtobiff, maby its pricy but its OpenMoko, and what about taxes and customs if you buy it from outside EU Jul 11 13:55:23 I assumed it was just a rootfs :P Jul 11 13:55:39 LetoTo: actually, if you look at the UPS tracking, it LEFT SAN PABLO then... Jul 11 13:55:45 Dave: Me too *giggles* but nope, it's got both :) Jul 11 13:56:21 I think I'm going crazy :D Jul 11 13:56:35 avtobiff, you could easily have to pay 100 EUR in taxes and customs Jul 11 13:56:37 <`pwgen`> mickey|lunch: Are you full? Jul 11 13:56:42 HauDyrArb, hmm. indeed Jul 11 13:56:56 er du full? Jul 11 13:57:12 Xaos: mine's probably on a truck somewhere in kansas by now, haha Jul 11 13:57:13 no i am sober Jul 11 13:57:56 ;D Jul 11 13:57:59 * kdubois gives HauDyrArb a gold star Jul 11 13:58:17 jag är också nykter... Jul 11 13:58:22 * HauDyrArb takes a bow Jul 11 13:58:55 snakker du til meg!? Jul 11 13:59:21 HauDyrArb, hmm. just the MOMS added would be make it about 300 EUR instead, almost the price from linux-handhelds.com Jul 11 14:00:02 avtobiff, and then you get 2 years of warranty because its from EU Jul 11 14:00:07 HauDyrArb, have you recieved it already? Jul 11 14:00:08 HauDyrArb, aah Jul 11 14:00:10 yes Jul 11 14:00:16 HauDyrArb, i'll probably void the warranty anyways Jul 11 14:00:19 I'd like to get the package gps-utils to check wether my gps is working? How do I obtain it? Jul 11 14:00:42 HauDyrArb, thanks for the input :) Jul 11 14:01:06 avtobiff, no prob. Jul 11 14:01:09 hehe Jul 11 14:01:17 haha Jul 11 14:03:31 good night Jul 11 14:04:04 * Dave hugs leinir Jul 11 14:04:18 * leinir hugs Dave right back :) Jul 11 14:04:23 :D Jul 11 14:04:39 cool, so now I have a freerunner of each image in front of me :P Jul 11 14:05:11 hopefully the qtopia image isn't as buggy as the others :D Jul 11 14:05:15 by and large Jul 11 14:05:56 It's not, it's quite solid and snappy :) Jul 11 14:06:05 Bar the dodginess with waking up from deep sleep :) Jul 11 14:07:03 what image is currently closest to actually being useful as a phone? Jul 11 14:07:17 leinir, yes, I've heard ALL about that... here -_- Jul 11 14:07:27 fionaw, haha, let's take a poll! Jul 11 14:07:30 :] Jul 11 14:08:07 <`pwgen`> does someone know how i can configure the modem wakup events ( wakeup on cell change, signal strengh change ) Jul 11 14:08:12 I'm just wondering because I need a new smartphone, and I'm really interested in this. I don't mind stuff being buggy, and I like to hack on things, but primarily I am an engineer not a software developer Jul 11 14:09:39 fionaw: in my opinion the gtk image Jul 11 14:09:52 fionaw, then you may enjoy the freerunner :p Jul 11 14:09:55 :] Jul 11 14:10:01 what I'm really after is, is there a working calendar image that I can sync with Kontact?? Jul 11 14:10:07 I guess that's asking a lot Jul 11 14:10:09 Oh Jul 11 14:10:13 Possibly ;) Jul 11 14:10:17 heh Jul 11 14:10:34 * Dave grabs leinir and jumps up and down... Jul 11 14:10:38 It's almost done, it's almost done! :D Jul 11 14:10:49 * leinir giggles and bounces with Dave "Weeh!" :) Jul 11 14:10:55 :D:D:D Jul 11 14:11:16 I'm a long time Palm OS user, and I'm looking for something to replace my T3 Jul 11 14:11:28 I'm not actually that bothered about phone calls, but wifi and stuff is needed Jul 11 14:12:37 it just worries me a bit that from the wiki etc, there seems to be nothing anywhere actually saying what is and is not useable/working on it yet Jul 11 14:12:55 half of it is saying "making a local phone call will eat your children" Jul 11 14:12:59 Right Jul 11 14:13:08 and half of it is saying "this is the freerunner automatically downloading and displaying openstreetmap data" Jul 11 14:13:12 We may eventually want to make a grand page like that :) Jul 11 14:13:24 Right now, I'd say it's really too early and, well, unfortunately -open- :D Jul 11 14:13:36 But that just gave me a great wiki page idea :) Jul 11 14:13:52 curse you people with freerunners. curse you :( Jul 11 14:13:58 hah Jul 11 14:14:02 like, I really really want a linux phone, I bought a motorola Razr2 as my normal phone just because it had linux Jul 11 14:14:08 sort of Jul 11 14:14:14 but this looks far more interesting Jul 11 14:14:40 hehe Jul 11 14:14:45 and whilst I love tinkering, and it is my job to tinker, it isn't my job/in my nature to spend all my time trying to get my phone to work in order to do other things on it Jul 11 14:14:45 Indeed, it is! Jul 11 14:15:05 wow Jul 11 14:15:12 You'd REALLY enjoy this phone then fionaw :) Jul 11 14:15:15 :D Jul 11 14:15:17 hmmm Jul 11 14:15:20 but like I said Jul 11 14:15:25 loads of things say it is unusable at the moment Jul 11 14:15:27 It's all about tinkering and getting things to work :P Jul 11 14:15:30 I don't want a phone that is unusable Jul 11 14:15:35 oh, heh Jul 11 14:15:38 I see Jul 11 14:15:48 I want a phone that is usable, basically, but I can, say, write my own C++ apps for Jul 11 14:15:57 which, incidentally, I can do with a palm Jul 11 14:16:05 but it is awful... Jul 11 14:16:10 you can cross-compile all your C++ apps for this phone :) Jul 11 14:16:19 I've had no problems in that department so far :) Jul 11 14:16:28 ok but Jul 11 14:16:30 also qt-using ones? Jul 11 14:16:32 I've even run *shudder* java apps :p Jul 11 14:16:39 I like Qt :-) Jul 11 14:16:48 anyway, the bottom line is, can it or can it not send and SMS? Jul 11 14:16:53 I couldnt figure out how to crosscompile qt apps yet :/ Jul 11 14:17:03 and does it or does it not work away from a power supply for a day? Jul 11 14:17:12 there is a lot of conflicting information Jul 11 14:17:17 Tanuva: build the cross compiler, use that to cross compile the app Jul 11 14:17:48 Wander_w: hmm... which do you mean? Is it in the qtopia-phone-src tgz? Jul 11 14:18:42 actually, to be fair I'm more interested in the PDA style applications than the phone. I don't mind carrying a separate phone Jul 11 14:18:54 fionaw: definitely does a day on a charge Jul 11 14:18:57 it's things like, is there a web browser? can it connect to encrypted WIFI networks Jul 11 14:19:04 can you send and receive emails Jul 11 14:19:13 fionaw: basically, it can. but there are many bugs left Jul 11 14:19:23 fionaw: I'm pretty sure it does SMS Jul 11 14:19:25 fionaw: the web browser isnt really usable imho Jul 11 14:19:28 leinir, wow, this *is* nice ;) Jul 11 14:20:07 fionaw: and theres no gui for wlan-configuration yet afaik Jul 11 14:20:16 also, is there a package management system that works in the traditional sense Jul 11 14:20:22 Tanuva: try the mokomakefile (available from the wiki) that downloads and builds a crosscompiler for you Jul 11 14:20:39 and can I connect a bluetooth keyboard to it Jul 11 14:20:48 fionaw: yes, package manager, yes. But if you want working browser & email then come back in a year Jul 11 14:20:50 Wander_w: but thats the om toolchain which doesnt really support qmake... Jul 11 14:21:15 fionaw: bt keyboard should work from what they say on the ml Jul 11 14:21:17 Tanuva: huh? what does qmake have to do with it? Jul 11 14:21:20 cool Jul 11 14:21:29 Wander_w: I need qmake to compile qt apps... Jul 11 14:21:31 but, a year? Doesn't qtopia already have things like this Jul 11 14:21:31 Dave: Indeed - functions as a phone and everything :) Not quite as fully-fletched-linuxey as the other images, but while we wait for those to get to working standard (and/or raster to launch openmoko-raster ;) ), it'll definitely do :) Jul 11 14:21:47 There really ought to be a page on the wiki for this Jul 11 14:21:47 fionaw: Here's a link you can look at to see what is/is not working: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Distributions Jul 11 14:21:56 Tanuva: ah.. um.. Jul 11 14:22:09 Leinir, any idea why it keeps complaining about battery low, when I've had it plugged in now for five minutes? :\ Jul 11 14:22:32 Wander_w: I dont want to install gtk libs, neither do I have any gtk knowledge :D Jul 11 14:22:37 Hi... compilation is over "NOTE: build 200807111620: completed" ... but I 'm not sure what has been built .... Where's the kernel & rootfs so I feed it to Qemu ? thx Jul 11 14:22:51 oh hah, they beat me too it, it would see then, Tanuva :p Jul 11 14:23:29 ahh Jul 11 14:23:32 Dave: the battery driver seems to be somehow broken, doesnt work on gtk and asu stacks here... Jul 11 14:23:34 there are still some things unclear though Jul 11 14:23:41 Dave: Not a clue... mine's good :) Jul 11 14:23:48 why is FSO listed as "Now" Jul 11 14:23:56 Ah okay Jul 11 14:24:03 I thought that wasn't very far along Jul 11 14:24:08 fso == the OM platform Jul 11 14:24:15 Tanuva, at the moment I was actually referring to Qtopia (burn me, I'm blaspheming at the moment) ;) Jul 11 14:24:31 Leinir, are there any special power issues I should be made additionally aware of? ;) Jul 11 14:24:33 you CAN download FSO "Now" at least milestone 1 Jul 11 14:24:34 * daMaestro plans to tri-boot the freerunner Jul 11 14:24:35 Dave: ah. I havent tried pure qtopia yet, just asu... Jul 11 14:24:37 I've heard mostly apm issues with it Jul 11 14:24:42 Tanuva, yeah me too Jul 11 14:24:44 daMaestro: that would be cool :D Jul 11 14:24:49 it blew, I went straight to gtk Jul 11 14:24:49 Dave: You'll want to fiddle with the power settings a bit :) Jul 11 14:24:52 If I was to order a freerunner tomorrow, what image would it arrive with? or would it arrive wthout any? Jul 11 14:24:52 Tanuva, you can do it Jul 11 14:24:53 yeah Jul 11 14:25:04 leinir, I hear suspend "breaks" a lot of things, inadvertently Jul 11 14:25:10 I guess that was the main issue Jul 11 14:25:14 Dave: Likely yes :) Jul 11 14:25:24 Tanuva, i plan on using the OM image, qtopia and ASU Jul 11 14:25:31 fionaw: a very slimmed version of the gtk stack, I recommend you to immediately flash something else to it :D Jul 11 14:25:36 as i want to be able to dev applications for all of them Jul 11 14:25:37 ok Jul 11 14:25:47 but a working suspend if it worked as well as one would ideally envision it on a phone, would likely be extremely advtangageous particularly for something running full-fledged linux :) Jul 11 14:25:54 What's up, Jon? Jul 11 14:25:59 daMaestro: my choice would be gtk,asu and fso - but how do you plan to do this? Jul 11 14:26:03 Tanuva, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Boot_from_sd_card Jul 11 14:26:13 OMGFGROFL is that DaveMan!? Jul 11 14:26:14 that would be two choices Jul 11 14:26:20 i've been wondering Jul 11 14:26:42 your PTR record is similar to what i recall Jul 11 14:26:55 also, I'm wondering, does anyone have any idea about the status of the company? Are they making a loss on these, or what? Jul 11 14:27:03 daMaestro: or is it possible to make uboot boot from a third sd-partition? Jul 11 14:27:17 If we end up in a year with working software stack and now no suitable device to run it on, what's the point? Jul 11 14:27:54 Tanuva, i'm hoping i have time to investigate a bootloader on nand Jul 11 14:28:00 FIC do a lot of other things besides Openmoko, fionaw Jul 11 14:28:01 Tanuva, and then everything boots from 8GB sd Jul 11 14:28:04 DaMaestro, muwahahahah >:) Jul 11 14:28:11 Dave, !!!! Jul 11 14:28:12 lol Jul 11 14:28:19 Dave, good to see you Jul 11 14:28:24 * Dave cackles maniacally Jul 11 14:28:26 daMaestro: hoh! sounds really interesting... Jul 11 14:28:27 lol Jul 11 14:28:29 doc|home: Heh, looks like the article got buried on digg :/ Jul 11 14:28:31 Damaestro, isn't it always? >:) Jul 11 14:28:32 ic Jul 11 14:28:41 Damaestro, I have been hiding. Jul 11 14:28:55 Dave, yeah; i've been wondering Jul 11 14:29:01 I thought it was time to flag you down, since I see you come and go 'round these here parts. Jul 11 14:29:02 hoping you didn't run off a cliff or something Jul 11 14:29:12 don't you mean, hoping I did? :) Jul 11 14:29:28 Maybe not, you never did exactly run with the rest of those... 'older gentlemen' :) Jul 11 14:29:32 does the GPS problem affect all devices? Jul 11 14:29:37 * daMaestro tries to not respond and walks slowly in the other direction Jul 11 14:29:40 Speaking of which, how are they, anyway? Jul 11 14:29:41 hahaha Jul 11 14:29:45 Yeah, that's what I thought... Jul 11 14:29:50 Dave, lol Jul 11 14:29:51 * Dave rolls his eyes Jul 11 14:30:06 Dave, they are doing well. i just met up with a few of them at FUDCon Jul 11 14:30:11 Ah, nice Jul 11 14:30:22 Well I'm sorry I didn't send wheaties this time... >:) Jul 11 14:30:56 Dave, so are you getting a freerunner or are you just trolling this channel also? Jul 11 14:30:58 ;-) Jul 11 14:31:31 Damaestro, I have many. Jul 11 14:31:40 I am developing with it! Jul 11 14:31:46 So :P~ Jul 11 14:31:48 * Tanuva thinks about getting in touch with fso-source... Jul 11 14:32:22 Who claims responsibility of maintaining the primary OM repos? Jul 11 14:32:30 dave has 4 of them Jul 11 14:32:58 We have many. Jul 11 14:33:15 i need a track #:) Jul 11 14:33:19 Ah Jul 11 14:33:35 2039 Jul 11 14:33:45 Leinir, I wish the power-related stuff would work :[ Jul 11 14:33:48 y maybe today Jul 11 14:33:57 What's with the 'Fast Charging' option in the DevTools app? Jul 11 14:34:17 Which appears to do absolutely nothing. Jul 11 14:34:43 UPS JUST GAVE ME MY NEO!!! W00T!!! Jul 11 14:34:59 * retracile applauds enviously Jul 11 14:35:23 ZOMG Jul 11 14:35:32 Congratulations, nuclear_wessels. Jul 11 14:35:35 * nuclear_eclipse goes back into hiding to play with it :) Jul 11 14:35:37 We all applaud your victory here. Jul 11 14:35:47 haha, exactly! Jul 11 14:36:18 openmoko: 03graeme 07org.openmoko.dev * r756c049b7992 10/ (5 files in 3 dirs): [busybox] add 1.11.0 which has device renaming which is essential I Jul 11 14:36:21 I'm so glad my vhost no longer shows up under this nick, after ident. Jul 11 14:36:40 Damaestro hooray for hiding! Jul 11 14:38:52 Dave, so.. i Jul 11 14:39:14 Dave, i'm planning on developing an interface to zenoss monitoring + func Jul 11 14:39:25 Dave, so when i get an alert.. i can actually do something about it when mobile Jul 11 14:39:36 Dave, like add servers to the load, restart services, etc Jul 11 14:39:51 Ah! Jul 11 14:39:58 Yep yep! Jul 11 14:40:08 johnsu01: not a massive surprise, iphone fanbois are everywhere :/ Jul 11 14:40:10 It's kind of musing actually, jon Jul 11 14:40:16 Dave, ? Jul 11 14:40:22 because as things curently stand, you'd need something like that for the freerunner itself :) Jul 11 14:40:28 hahhaa Jul 11 14:40:42 The longer it stays on, the more unstable it becomes, at least on a couple of primary images Jul 11 14:40:46 leaky and all Jul 11 14:40:53 That's why I found that amusing :) Jul 11 14:40:58 doc|home: yeah, true, but usually doesn't happen to our stories.. I guess we left it unattended too long overnight :) Jul 11 14:41:04 Though yeah, ideally, it'd be perfect for such things as that Jul 11 14:41:05 Dave, yeah.. i started hacking on it with the qemu toolkit i packaged for fedora, and then building images for my neo1973 Jul 11 14:41:15 Moreover, you could have a really sweet and concise interface :) Jul 11 14:41:17 Dave, things where unstable enough i needed to find something more productive to do Jul 11 14:41:29 :) Jul 11 14:41:32 right right Jul 11 14:41:36 right idea though Jul 11 14:42:00 Hey, honestly, I am somewhat relieved, since I now know that you didn't just come in here secretly planning to port FC to the FR :P Jul 11 14:42:13 Dave, i'm also going to spend a weekend and see if i can intercept how the RIM/blackberry "push" features work Jul 11 14:42:18 Dave, add some bits to gsmd Jul 11 14:42:27 and hey, the only reason I'd even think of that is because there have already been KDE people coming in here... (with similar intentions) Jul 11 14:42:46 Damaestro, okay good, I actually happen to know it's uncomplicated! :) Jul 11 14:43:02 johnsu01: hah Jul 11 14:43:07 * doc|home -> work Jul 11 14:43:10 Dave, i might do that academically (porting fedora) but the fedora stack is really not designed to be run on such a device Jul 11 14:43:22 Dave, i might just get the kernel to run and boot to a shell with transit + yum Jul 11 14:43:22 lol Jul 11 14:43:24 No kidding :P Jul 11 14:47:40 w/in 5 Jul 11 14:48:02 I can't type, don't mind me Jul 11 14:50:14 Seen on the Gentoo-user mailing list: The number of inodes can be specified at creation time with the "-N" Jul 11 14:50:14 parameter. AFAIK it cannot be changed afterwards. You can though, dd the partition to another drive, re-format, and dd it back. Jul 11 14:52:43 Hello. I have a few questions about OM. 1. Is Openmoko stack still supported or it will be moved into QTopia? 2. I'd like to program an application. a) Is there any OM-specific programming manual other then openmoko.org? b) I would like to have a OM run nativly (x86) - however on separate enviroment (to not mess up with the system libraries and other parts of enviroment) - is it possible? The guide on openmoko.org seems to require s Jul 11 14:52:44 ome changes in system... Jul 11 14:54:02 * Dave pokes leinir Jul 11 14:54:54 * leinir murrrs and pushes back like a good, little subby bitch ;) Jul 11 14:55:02 or something ;) Jul 11 14:55:06 In other words: Yes? ;) Jul 11 14:57:02 Hi all Jul 11 14:57:04 ljp: two quick questions, please. Is there a terminal/console application in the Trolltech Qtopia image, and is there a web browser available? Jul 11 14:58:02 uzytkownik: There are 3 current stacks. I recommend reading the mickey blog Jul 11 14:58:17 http://www.vanille-media.de/site/index.php/2008/06/28/gtk-asu-fso-tmtla/ Jul 11 14:59:08 heh Jul 11 14:59:24 yeah, that's a pretty good article for clueless people :) Jul 11 14:59:50 We really should eventually establish a glossary on the openmoko wiki, if we don't already have one . Jul 11 15:00:11 tmtla is great :D Jul 11 15:03:26 MrShleee: OK. So as far as I understood the ASU and FSO stacks will be developed? Jul 11 15:05:50 eh? Jul 11 15:05:59 gtk, as well :[ Jul 11 15:06:13 though yes Jul 11 15:07:43 I like the question marks in that page, haha. Jul 11 15:08:26 MrShleee: Try giving out this URL in the future... http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Distributions Jul 11 15:08:32 it has the one you gave as well Jul 11 15:08:40 yep Jul 11 15:08:48 kids Jul 11 15:08:52 That is actually what I was referring to. :) Jul 11 15:08:55 Chocky! Jul 11 15:09:08 well, got a phone call from UPS - delivery today. never got email though Jul 11 15:09:53 :) Jul 11 15:10:57 can only buy 4 in shop now :p Jul 11 15:11:18 Someone asked about UK distributor https://www.truebox.co.uk/trueboxportal/index.php?wk=Openmoko Jul 11 15:12:05 Stroller: I do hope you realize the dd advice doesn't do what they seem to think it does... Jul 11 15:13:33 * Chocky is clueless and reads article Jul 11 15:14:06 ;) Jul 11 15:14:32 Hmm? Jul 11 15:14:45 Bah, any other Qtopia fiends here? Jul 11 15:14:48 retracile: I posted it here because I thought the advice would be useful & helpful for those formatting SDcards for Openmoko. Jul 11 15:14:50 Oh Jul 11 15:14:52 Hang-on Jul 11 15:14:57 No I didn't Jul 11 15:15:22 * Stroller wonders if he posted the comment here because he thought it amusing. Jul 11 15:15:37 ~dtx Jul 11 15:15:42 oh Jul 11 15:15:48 I feel like a nobody Jul 11 15:16:07 ~openmoko Jul 11 15:16:08 [openmoko] a joint venture of FIC and the open source community creating a complete open source phone platform stack. see http://openmoko.com Jul 11 15:18:12 Stroller: Yeah, substitute a 'tar' command for the 'dd' in that, and it might do some good. But the dd isn't going to help you change the number of inodes in the filesystem. Jul 11 15:18:27 retracile: duh! Jul 11 15:18:36 I'm sorry Jul 11 15:18:42 I just thought this obvious Jul 11 15:19:28 yes, but is it Friday yet? Jul 11 15:20:23 Dave: what qualifies as a Qtopia Fiend? Jul 11 15:20:38 hello Jul 11 15:21:20 uggh, great -_- Jul 11 15:21:32 heh? Jul 11 15:21:35 abooo, you know, one of our local zealots. Jul 11 15:21:52 oh, in that case, plant me firmly in that column. Jul 11 15:22:47 Ah, excellent :P Jul 11 15:22:54 * Dave shackles ab0oo to his desk. Jul 11 15:23:01 Now you will help me... >:) Jul 11 15:23:23 Well I have to reboot now, since the "Internet Settings" just locked up the device. -_-; Jul 11 15:23:26 I'm still drooling over the latest trolltech qtopia image. Jul 11 15:23:51 The gta02 image? 4.3.2? Jul 11 15:24:29 qtopia-4.3.2-gta02.jffs2, yes Jul 11 15:24:39 I am using that one right now... Jul 11 15:24:48 it needs controls for the wifi and gps chips. and a browser. and a terminal Jul 11 15:24:52 This is my first time using it Jul 11 15:24:56 right Jul 11 15:24:59 well isn't there a terminal app? Jul 11 15:25:05 Qtopia Terminal Jul 11 15:25:07 I can't find it. can you? Jul 11 15:25:32 http://www.qtopia.net/modules/mydownloads/visit.php?lid=56 Jul 11 15:26:09 So far though, ab0oo, the power app seems bugged or simply broken. Jul 11 15:26:25 Furthermore, I cannot figure out how to conveniently connect to the phone -_- Jul 11 15:26:28 Set it up for networking. Jul 11 15:26:44 via USB? Jul 11 15:26:47 I just tried using the Internet Settings in the Configuration app and it locked up the phone. Jul 11 15:26:51 yes Jul 11 15:26:55 and I agree with the power app. Jul 11 15:26:56 I'd even use wifi if I had to. Jul 11 15:27:03 hmm, mine Just Worked (tm) Jul 11 15:27:20 ab0oo, as far as the power goes, it constantly tells me it's low on battery, and I have no indication that it's charging, despite being plugged in and actually charging ~_~ Jul 11 15:27:22 usb0 on my kubuntu hardy box picked it up. Jul 11 15:27:24 :| Jul 11 15:27:29 picked it up, yes Jul 11 15:27:35 dammit, when can I be a zealot? Jul 11 15:27:40 haha Jul 11 15:27:49 I was just typing a comment about the battery indicator. and /dev/apm is useless, imho Jul 11 15:27:59 I can't find a device that gives me good info on the battery Jul 11 15:28:16 I'm trying the ASU on a 1973, but the process qte is taking all cpu power.. Does anyone know why? Jul 11 15:28:18 multimeter :o Jul 11 15:28:19 Chocky: I really do feel for you. rEALLY. Jul 11 15:28:32 I mean a device entry in /dev Jul 11 15:28:34 so, where are the neat qtopia images that I should try in qemu while waiting for UPS? Jul 11 15:28:36 ab0oo: I wouldn't waste your energy Jul 11 15:28:39 s/qte/qpe/ Jul 11 15:28:39 ebbe meant: I'm trying the ASU on a 1973, but the process qpe is taking all cpu power.. Does anyone know why? Jul 11 15:28:42 oh yeah Jul 11 15:28:49 feeling sorry for you? It's a low-energy task. Jul 11 15:29:04 well, as long as I support ACPI Jul 11 15:29:07 :[ Jul 11 15:29:52 looks like I'll be doing some hacking when I get my device. just have to figure out _what_ to hack on - so many things, so confusing. Jul 11 15:30:16 haha yeah :p Jul 11 15:30:19 dang, Dave, I got an error installing qpe-qterminal Jul 11 15:30:25 :O Jul 11 15:30:26 rut roh Jul 11 15:30:32 That doesn't bode well for me. Jul 11 15:30:50 If it wasn't for those dang kids Jul 11 15:31:07 Goddamnit qtopia, shut up, my battery isn't low! Jul 11 15:31:10 grr Jul 11 15:32:25 An error ocurred, return value: 2. Jul 11 15:32:26 I am going to have to have another talk with those opkg guys... Jul 11 15:32:29 that's a HIGHLY useless message Jul 11 15:32:35 That's what it always says! :D Jul 11 15:32:43 See :p Jul 11 15:33:28 out of curiosity, what's the difficulty in supporting 3G? Is it expensive to get the hardware, or do we just not have drivers for it? Jul 11 15:33:44 jdavis_: find one with an open API Jul 11 15:33:46 expensive in low volume, not open Jul 11 15:33:49 jdavis_: both. Jul 11 15:34:00 Oh, ok, that makes sense. Jul 11 15:34:47 my wife played with an iPhone yesterday again, and now she wants a FR. I suggested she wait a few months. Jul 11 15:35:15 Chocky: that's interesting. So she didn't like the iPhone? Jul 11 15:35:40 Chocky: you mean wait for the openmoko software to stabalize? Jul 11 15:35:43 she likes it, but understand about the price, lock in, etc. plus the fact that I have 10 FRs being delivered Jul 11 15:35:47 jdavis_: aye Jul 11 15:36:06 10? You're a [hero] Jul 11 15:36:12 * Chocky knows Jul 11 15:36:27 hah Jul 11 15:36:46 Doesn't anyone know why qpe is constantly using all off the cpu? Jul 11 15:36:49 but given the brackets, I'm wondering if you selected the wrong option in the list ;-) Jul 11 15:37:41 ebbe: qpe? Jul 11 15:37:48 Yes, on ASU Jul 11 15:37:51 oh Jul 11 15:37:59 top shows it to me Jul 11 15:38:07 Chocky: you got the 900 or the 850 freerunners? Jul 11 15:38:29 ebbe: I have those same concerns. But I don't know the answer to the question. Jul 11 15:38:41 :/ Jul 11 15:38:52 850 of course :p Jul 11 15:39:01 Chocky: Anything you're particularly good at hacking on? Jul 11 15:39:10 everything Jul 11 15:39:20 except hardcore hardware stuff Jul 11 15:39:21 is there any "simple" way of recompiling the neod? Or do I need a complete OE environment for this? I need a version which does not open the accelerometer devices. Jul 11 15:39:31 and I don't speak python Jul 11 15:39:54 how can i load my sim contact's into openmoko? Jul 11 15:39:58 jakob__: Didn't someone do that on the ml? Jul 11 15:40:58 ebbe: yeah but he did not answer my appeal to send me over the solution, until now :) Jul 11 15:41:24 ebbe: Therefore I just patched the sources myself. But I am not able to recompile them :( Jul 11 15:41:38 jakob__: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003492.html Jul 11 15:41:44 oh. Jul 11 15:42:16 jakob__: Ahh, okay. Well I would try the toolchain first, and if it doesn't compile.. I would guess the makefile.. Jul 11 15:42:29 s/makefile/Mokomakefile/ Jul 11 15:42:29 ebbe meant: jakob__: Ahh, okay. Well I would try the toolchain first, and if it doesn't compile.. I would guess the Mokomakefile.. Jul 11 15:42:59 abraxa_: yeah I already read that :) The problem is I can't compile the patched neod :( Jul 11 15:43:24 apt: yeah... Unfortunately the toolchain does not work :( Jul 11 15:43:26 jakob__: Yeah, I read that you read it after I pasted the URL :) Jul 11 15:43:39 abraxa_: *g* Jul 11 15:43:45 jakob__: Maybe you could ask for the compiled version then? Jul 11 15:43:53 jakob__: That *g* makes me think you're German Jul 11 15:43:56 Am I right? Jul 11 15:44:28 YAWY Jul 11 15:44:43 abraxa_: yes you are. But why can you guess that by the "*g*" Jul 11 15:44:51 oh noes. can only buy 3 FRs in shop Jul 11 15:44:57 Hey, who do I talk to if you guys just charged me again? Jul 11 15:45:01 ebbe: I already did. No answer until now Jul 11 15:45:06 I just got charged a 2nd time for my phone :P Jul 11 15:45:08 jakob__: Cause only Germans use it :) - you're welcome to hop over to #neo1973-germany Jul 11 15:45:18 I'd like the 2nd $400 back =) Jul 11 15:45:28 sontek: I'd mail Steve Jul 11 15:45:35 sontek: this channel is not the company who charged you. call them up Jul 11 15:45:36 abraxa_: interesting. I didn't realize that :) Jul 11 15:45:40 or that Jul 11 15:45:57 Dave: I unpacked the qpkg by hand and got qterminal to run Jul 11 15:46:00 from the command line. Jul 11 15:46:16 yeah Jul 11 15:46:21 funny Jul 11 15:46:22 which is a chicken/egg issue: how do I get the command line to run something from the command line... :) Jul 11 15:46:25 right! Jul 11 15:46:26 :P Jul 11 15:46:31 ;) Jul 11 15:46:49 I've already found a couple things about the GTK image paradoxical Jul 11 15:46:51 :P Jul 11 15:47:08 Anyhoo, any idea if the powernotifier patch on their site pertains to 4.3 images? Jul 11 15:47:18 I would argue, most likely, I haven't really read into it though Jul 11 15:47:55 Hmm, I would tentatively say Yes. Jul 11 15:47:59 well, lorn put the new image up yesterday, so unless the patch is dated since then, I'd say no. Jul 11 15:48:06 Though I don't exactly want to rebuild Qtopia right now -_- Jul 11 15:48:23 Right it's quite dated, but from its description it seems like it would fix the issue. Jul 11 15:48:28 Unless it's a recurrance o.O Jul 11 15:49:39 ab0oo: http://www.qtopia.net/modules/mydownloads/viewcat.php?cid=5 Jul 11 15:50:01 I'll read it in a bit. boss wants to take me to lunch. Jul 11 15:50:19 :) Jul 11 15:50:22 Anyhoo, any idea if the powernotifier patch on their site pertains to 4.3 images? Jul 11 15:50:23 I would argue, most likely, I haven't really read into it though Jul 11 15:50:23 *** Signoff: andrenarchy ("Leaving.") Jul 11 15:50:49 o.O Jul 11 15:52:40 Give a man a computer program and you give him a headache, but teach him to program computers and you give him the power to create headaches for others for the rest of his life... -- R. B. Forest Jul 11 15:53:01 heh Jul 11 15:53:41 I wish for my computer to be as easy to use as my phone. That wish has come true, since I can no longer use my phone. Jul 11 15:53:55 hah! Jul 11 15:54:09 forget who said that Jul 11 16:01:45 openmoko: 03graeme 07org.openmoko.dev * r27cd6d55ab39 10/packages/busybox/ (busybox-1.11.0/defconfig busybox_1.11.0.bb): [busybox] update defconfig to enable device renaming in mdev Jul 11 16:07:25 Chocky: there isn't a number on the site except for Asia PR Jul 11 16:07:30 aw Jul 11 16:07:35 Chocky: do you know if there is a support/sales line ? Jul 11 16:07:36 best email them then Jul 11 16:07:42 * Chocky doesn't know Jul 11 16:07:50 maybe you're getting 2 ;-) Jul 11 16:07:59 Yeah, I sent off an e-mail already, I just need to get that money back before tomorrow, we were renting jet skis =) Jul 11 16:08:41 20? Jul 11 16:08:54 random? Jul 11 16:09:15 u gettin a group package arnt u? Jul 11 16:09:37 if sontek is, he hasn't said Jul 11 16:09:45 are there any (decent) instructions on how to patch qemu (from MokoMakefile) to gta02fake? Jul 11 16:10:00 o i yhouhg u said a group package Jul 11 16:10:17 * SpeedEvil notes that the store says '3'. Jul 11 16:10:20 heh Jul 11 16:10:21 SpeedEvil: aye Jul 11 16:10:29 sontek: In that case, a call to your credit company works wonders. Jul 11 16:10:29 jetskis? openmoko? wtf? :D Jul 11 16:10:29 linuxxr: are you confused? Jul 11 16:10:49 Dave: we've seen lawnmowers - why so surprised? Jul 11 16:10:58 hah Jul 11 16:11:15 This may be a dumb question, but is the stylus actually required, or can you just press the screen with your finger? Jul 11 16:11:32 it depends on how sharp your fingers are Jul 11 16:11:35 jdavis_: yes Jul 11 16:11:43 jdavis_: any object will work. Jul 11 16:11:45 Oh, ok. Jul 11 16:11:52 like knife? Jul 11 16:11:53 jdavis_: stylus is more accurate. Jul 11 16:11:54 +a Jul 11 16:11:55 And what do they mean "laser stylus"? Jul 11 16:12:02 jdavis_: it's got a laser in it. Jul 11 16:12:16 jdavis_: you can use it for whittling light materials, like balsa, pine or oak. Jul 11 16:12:17 so you can burn holes in your phone Jul 11 16:12:17 It as a headband for sharks Jul 11 16:12:23 jdavis_: it doesn't work for steel. Jul 11 16:12:31 jdavis_: I accidently used a regular ink pen, didn't leave a mark Jul 11 16:12:42 and for sharpening your fingers Jul 11 16:12:54 Haha Jul 11 16:13:18 It's also got a light on it. Jul 11 16:13:55 So they actually fit a battery in the stylus? Jul 11 16:14:11 jdavis_: there are a coupoe of little batteries. Jul 11 16:14:16 Actually - 3 I think. Jul 11 16:14:23 no, it's a very small hamster Jul 11 16:14:36 wow, that must be a big stylus Jul 11 16:14:46 _very_ small hamster Jul 11 16:15:03 jdavis_: the stylus is about 13mm in diameter at the thickest part. Jul 11 16:15:05 Oh, well, in that case, I better not feed it too much. Jul 11 16:15:22 Ok Jul 11 16:15:43 I don't think it's really going to affect me too much if I can just use any soft, pointy object. Jul 11 16:15:56 jdavis_: yeah - the screen is relatively soft plastic. Jul 11 16:16:16 SpeedEvil: four :) Jul 11 16:16:23 I'll save the stylus for whittling and in lieu of walking the hamster that powers it. Jul 11 16:16:45 (because the hamster would be getting exercise powering the laser) Jul 11 16:17:02 Thanks for the info. Jul 11 16:19:09 hm, what to do with 50 null modem cables. Jul 11 16:19:44 Feed them to /dev/null Jul 11 16:19:48 Get 49 gender changers and build your own overseas cable. Jul 11 16:19:52 * SpeedEvil just found a box of 8 serial mice. Jul 11 16:20:00 sweet Jul 11 16:20:16 ok, what to do with the 50 2.5" IDE cables? Jul 11 16:20:39 Chocky: RAID? Jul 11 16:20:52 * Chocky just has the cables Jul 11 16:21:24 Chocky: Put them back in the packard bells Jul 11 16:21:26 Hmm. Jul 11 16:21:34 * Chocky has no PBs Jul 11 16:21:34 400 debug boards in the shop. Jul 11 16:22:01 SpeedEvil: with the backup NOR ROM, is a debug board really "necessary" anymore? Jul 11 16:22:06 Xmas decorations it is Jul 11 16:22:11 nuclear_eclipse: almost unneeded Jul 11 16:22:30 nuclear_eclipse: you should basically never need it as a usual user, or even a kernel developer. Jul 11 16:22:38 JTAG however might be handy in soe instances. Jul 11 16:22:40 then, what would you need it for? Jul 11 16:22:53 <- not a hardware hacker, just curious Jul 11 16:23:05 JTAG is a debug port. Jul 11 16:23:13 nuclear_eclipse: if you want to replace the backup Jul 11 16:23:15 it looks good to have another piece of junk on your desk Jul 11 16:23:16 that'd be one reason Jul 11 16:23:20 lol Jul 11 16:23:22 You can do stuff like halt a running system, and inspect address 0xff12334dA Jul 11 16:23:27 ah Jul 11 16:23:37 SpeedEvil: that's what I was getting at :) Jul 11 16:23:42 Or set pin 43 of device 2 low Jul 11 16:23:45 *that* is useful Jul 11 16:24:08 you can do that in software, but it's a lot more hassle Jul 11 16:24:22 * nuclear_eclipse is poor now though, so no debug board for me Jul 11 16:24:32 Chocky: yeah - it involves kernel hacking though Jul 11 16:24:56 Chocky: whereas with JTAG, you can simply type the addresses in, and there you are Jul 11 16:25:01 magic. Jul 11 16:25:43 oh good. 6 security updates for Vista. I'm glad I have a secure OS Jul 11 16:26:13 That was almost as bad as saying iPh... Jul 11 16:26:32 DRM, lock in, proprietary apps. It's all the same Jul 11 16:26:38 wait 4 days to install that Jul 11 16:26:52 it's a fast machine. will only be a few mins :p Jul 11 16:26:59 mainly because I'm not using it Jul 11 16:27:17 it's purely for testing with IE, and various networking stuff. almost everyone here is Linux. Jul 11 16:27:24 er, everything. Jul 11 16:27:49 slackware comes out with patches i never install them as soon as they come out Jul 11 16:28:14 justincase Jul 11 16:28:33 hmm, why can't I see any understandable icons in Media Player Jul 11 16:28:40 like stop, play etc? Jul 11 16:28:47 only grey boxes Jul 11 16:28:49 althouge i only rember 1 time when that was useful Jul 11 16:29:10 it's all Patrick's fault Jul 11 16:29:15 yup Jul 11 16:29:44 friend of mine does the ARM Slackware stuff. He refers to him as "MMP" or "My Mate Patrick" Jul 11 16:30:00 port Slack to FR :p Jul 11 16:30:35 thats it Jul 11 16:30:45 oh noes. shop has _1_ FR left Jul 11 16:30:59 slack is faster than all Jul 11 16:31:29 slack is so fast that... Jul 11 16:31:41 Slack is still a full size distro. not as small as OE with busybox, etc. Jul 11 16:31:56 hac it Jul 11 16:32:23 well, yes. you could start by using busybox in Slack. That's your first big saving Jul 11 16:33:23 maybe slax an that unionfs Jul 11 16:34:28 whatever turns you on Jul 11 16:35:02 ahven: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Getting_Started_with_your_Neo_FreeRunner#Un-crippling_the_2007.2_image Jul 11 16:38:15 irony. http://www.mobilenewscwp.co.uk/News/83527/sony_ericssons_new_campaign.html Jul 11 16:38:28 kudos to google news for that one :p Jul 11 16:39:50 From where are the freerunners on the online shop shipped? or does that depend on where you live? Jul 11 16:40:07 mostly from Fremont, CA, USA Jul 11 16:40:20 dunno if from elsewhere Jul 11 16:40:47 ok :/ then I better order from some german shop or something. will be easier if it's inside the eu Jul 11 16:40:53 yes Jul 11 16:41:38 And I have been waiting for the shop to open :( I wonder if they have any 900 band models left in some european webshop.. Jul 11 16:41:42 besides, they only have 1 left :p Jul 11 16:42:12 oh.. I better order right away then :D Jul 11 16:42:43 no 900s in US shop though Jul 11 16:43:15 I know. thats what I have been waiting for. or will they be shipped from somewhere else since no one in the us will need them? Jul 11 16:43:26 25th July is the alleged date Jul 11 16:43:36 * Chocky knows not about shipping Jul 11 16:44:14 <`pwgen`> mickey|lunch: ping Jul 11 16:44:14 then you dont happen to know if those shops have the gifts (pen etc) ? Jul 11 16:44:50 faern: TRISoft does, GoldenDelicious does, Pulster doesn't - not sure about the others Jul 11 16:45:54 abraxa_: the gifts. then I better order from them Jul 11 16:46:41 too bad I cant understand most of the description.. maybe some google translate :D Jul 11 16:47:12 faern: They all speak English, too, if you need to get in touch Jul 11 16:47:29 faern: I would imagine the OM warehouse would want to ship the stock as fast as possible.. Wait until the shipping is confirmed and start hitting F5 Jul 11 16:48:13 see the xkcd link in topic Jul 11 16:49:20 Chocky: that xkcd is so true :D Jul 11 16:49:50 yes, problem is, I never got an email confirm. just a phone, and the tracking number didn't get noted Jul 11 16:50:04 anyway, here today if someone's home Jul 11 16:50:13 s/phone/phone call/ Jul 11 17:01:13 Oh Noes! Jul 11 17:01:27 No Phones! Jul 11 17:02:05 * mjr is holding an unwrapped freerunner Jul 11 17:02:05 did they add those couple hundred to throw off your graph? Jul 11 17:02:11 mjr: unwrap it! Jul 11 17:02:18 oh, unwrapped. Nevermind Jul 11 17:02:20 Qwell: I'm unsure what was going on there. Jul 11 17:02:38 Qwell: it is strange that the same amount seemed to go on and off in a block. Jul 11 17:02:38 actually, your reaction was correct and by original statement was a brain fart Jul 11 17:02:55 mjr: I answered what you meant. Jul 11 17:03:08 Oops - 1 left, my bad. Jul 11 17:03:26 unfreed wraprunner? Jul 11 17:04:05 well, the shop has been showing 1 left for the last hour. dunno what than means Jul 11 17:04:49 Chocky: nobody wants to take the last one Jul 11 17:04:51 was 4 earlier this morning. maybe sales are that slow, or they're just limiting sales of the last few Jul 11 17:04:56 it's like one piece of cheesecake left Jul 11 17:05:11 or the last Rolo Jul 11 17:05:19 right - nobody wants to be "that guy" Jul 11 17:05:35 it's like on Woot. They tell you the first and last suckers Jul 11 17:05:58 I don't suppose the openmoko store has change the payment methods they accept yet? Jul 11 17:06:51 Qwell: they have added 'shiny rocks' as a payment method. Jul 11 17:08:05 oh noes. http://shirt.woot.com/ Jul 11 17:08:13 * Chocky goes to refill his coffee Jul 11 17:11:00 Openmoko store accepts silver and gold? Jul 11 17:11:14 Is that what you mean by "shiny rocks"? Jul 11 17:11:23 no, making change is too much trouble. Jul 11 17:11:46 That's kind of the point of using hard money though, for ther barter. Jul 11 17:12:51 thang the god that the group sales is over maybe now they ship mine Jul 11 17:13:24 I still haven't gotten my shipment notification :/ Jul 11 17:13:28 I'm starting to get worried now Jul 11 17:15:10 well mahbe chockey hacked us Jul 11 17:15:37 dave has 4 maybe it was super dave Jul 11 17:16:23 linuxxr: you didn't get yours either? Jul 11 17:16:26 what number were you? Jul 11 17:16:34 2039 Jul 11 17:16:41 ah Jul 11 17:16:43 I'm 1724 Jul 11 17:16:59 they got the monies Jul 11 17:17:36 yeah, my CC was charged already Jul 11 17:17:54 they had to ship all those overnites,2nd day crap first with limited resources so we got pushed down Jul 11 17:18:28 my card was charged twice ;P Jul 11 17:18:38 on phone with cc company right now :( Jul 11 17:18:54 whats the address of the confire notice? Jul 11 17:19:11 confirm% Jul 11 17:19:20 mine was 2nd day :/ Jul 11 17:19:27 it makes no difference to Canada, you pay the same Jul 11 17:23:55 kelvie_work: no email here either, but UPS called yesterday to confirm delivery today Jul 11 17:24:27 How many days did they take to actually post the charge purchase? Jul 11 17:25:17 for me, my CC company showed the credit reduction next day, then the charge the next Jul 11 17:25:41 Chocky: ah.. strange Jul 11 17:25:45 why woul dthey call sometimes? Jul 11 17:25:52 I forgot which number I gave them even Jul 11 17:25:57 dunno. 10 pack perhaps Jul 11 17:25:58 assuming they're following the whole "law" thing, that may mean they've already shipped. :D Jul 11 17:25:58 same day here Jul 11 17:26:08 ah Jul 11 17:26:10 I only have one Jul 11 17:26:16 FINALLY, UPS just pulled up outside my house! :) Jul 11 17:26:29 sitwon: order #? Jul 11 17:26:31 so the monday after the 4th is the day Jul 11 17:26:36 maybe my email got lost Jul 11 17:26:52 Chocky: hehe.. tha'ts hard to do Jul 11 17:26:55 1669 Jul 11 17:26:57 unless there are several spam filters Jul 11 17:27:32 i t w ill be a pleasant suprise Jul 11 17:27:42 Cart Error: We only have 1 item(s) of Neo FreeRunner - GSM 850 left. Jul 11 17:27:47 I smell an off-by-one Jul 11 17:28:05 Qwell: could be Jul 11 17:28:09 no time to do server maintaince Jul 11 17:28:24 they might get more:) Jul 11 17:30:10 wow, it's smaller than I thought it would be Jul 11 17:30:40 ooo, bug in cart Jul 11 17:30:42 heh Jul 11 17:31:22 still only visa/mc. *sigh* Jul 11 17:31:54 sitwon: that's a good thing, right? Jul 11 17:32:03 serious DPI on screen Jul 11 17:32:08 retracile: yea, it's a plesant surprise Jul 11 17:33:32 Any info on alsa settings ? Jul 11 17:34:10 Ainulindale? Jul 11 17:34:29 abraxa_: yep ? Jul 11 17:34:39 Ainulindale: What's unclear? Jul 11 17:34:42 I know you already answered me but as I said, it says too low :-/ Jul 11 17:34:56 +t Jul 11 17:35:36 Did you use alsactl / alsamixer to increase the mic level? Jul 11 17:35:42 Which mic ? :-) Jul 11 17:35:50 Mic2 Jul 11 17:36:04 By default it's at 0 Jul 11 17:36:11 I can only increase it by 33% Jul 11 17:36:20 And when I do people hear buzzing Jul 11 17:37:18 Qwell: How are you looking to pay if not Visa/MC? Jul 11 17:37:43 Amex/Discover/Maestro Jul 11 17:38:11 Chocky: 850 or 900 MHz phone? Jul 11 17:38:19 dunno ;-) Jul 11 17:38:22 Chocky: Country? Jul 11 17:38:22 * Chocky just sayin' Jul 11 17:38:31 * Chocky paid by Visa Jul 11 17:38:41 Chocky: Gotcha. Jul 11 17:39:01 Ainulindale: Did you increase the playback or record level? (just making sure) Jul 11 17:39:22 store is out! Jul 11 17:39:24 sold out! fnar. Jul 11 17:39:41 or broken ;-) Jul 11 17:40:23 abraxa_: Nope, didn't find out a setting clear enough to set it Jul 11 17:40:39 I just sent an e-mail requesting a cancel of my order, so another will be available shortly :P Jul 11 17:40:41 I tried to fiddle with some things with no good result Jul 11 17:40:51 Ainulindale: When using alsamixer, press to switch between the playback/record controls Jul 11 17:41:15 Yep I know that, and still, no setting clear enough Jul 11 17:41:22 ah ok Jul 11 17:41:55 Usually I would set capture but it seems to do nothing Jul 11 17:42:28 It's a little tricky indeed as we don't know what's connected where Jul 11 17:42:51 no one wrote a GUI mixer yet? :o Jul 11 17:43:41 No, as there were more urgent problems to fix I suppose Jul 11 17:44:24 moo Jul 11 17:45:43 wife better be home for delivery today :p otherwise I'll have to drive to depot tomorrow. Jul 11 17:49:14 Dave: do you know the secret to adding an icon to allow qterminal to run from the opie menu? Jul 11 17:49:41 I mean qtopia menu. opie is dead. long live opie. Jul 11 17:53:10 ab0oo: 2002 is long gone, let it go :) Jul 11 17:53:35 at least I'm not pining for big hair and new episodes of the fresh prince of bel-air Jul 11 17:53:53 1) same 2) that'd rock Jul 11 17:54:07 at least we have Hancock. Jul 11 17:54:10 ab0oo: confusing your decades there Jul 11 17:54:21 when you've lived through as many as I have... Jul 11 17:54:38 then you're old? Jul 11 17:54:57 experienced. Jul 11 17:55:03 well put. Jul 11 17:55:29 hello Jul 11 17:56:16 but not experienced enought to add the qterminal icon to the qtopia applications page Jul 11 17:56:28 aw Jul 11 17:56:58 someone know's what i have to do? i open my text messaging i see it for 1 second than it goes back to home screen Jul 11 17:57:03 knows Jul 11 17:57:53 is it Friday yet? Jul 11 17:57:56 a link to the 'structions would be great. Jul 11 17:58:21 Chocky: did you get your shipping details yet? Jul 11 17:58:35 via a phone call yesterday, no email Jul 11 17:58:37 Chocky: and yes, it is :) Jul 11 17:58:39 Chocky: yey! Jul 11 17:58:57 will be here today Jul 11 17:59:01 nice Jul 11 17:59:07 10 pack? Jul 11 17:59:08 all 10! all mine! Jul 11 17:59:15 huh!? Jul 11 17:59:23 do the rest of the group know this? Jul 11 17:59:25 overexcited Jul 11 18:00:01 well, shop really does seem all out. Jul 11 18:00:52 oh wow Jul 11 18:00:57 \o/ Jul 11 18:01:12 I'm happy for them, hopefully they get some more in soon Jul 11 18:01:18 |o/ Jul 11 18:01:18 \o| Jul 11 18:01:18 |o| Jul 11 18:01:34 they better have mine however, or there'll be 10 unhappy canadians Jul 11 18:01:48 10 more? ;-) Jul 11 18:01:54 hah Jul 11 18:04:03 Which architecture version of ARM is in FreeRunner ? ARMv4T ? Jul 11 18:04:06 or ARMv6KZ Jul 11 18:04:14 v4t Jul 11 18:04:38 no CLZ for you Jul 11 18:05:07 hey, has anyone here bought the freerunner, did you get a tracking number? Jul 11 18:05:15 ow thanks I mixed up Family of ARM with architecture version Jul 11 18:05:16 heh. deja-vu Jul 11 18:05:27 sirkha: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Where_is_my_Freerunner%3F Jul 11 18:05:42 sirkha: what's your order number? Jul 11 18:05:42 the awesome, that is totally what i was looking for Jul 11 18:05:46 :) Jul 11 18:05:50 all my fault Jul 11 18:05:55 * doc|work points at Chocky Jul 11 18:06:18 it's kind of worrying that my order is dead last on that list :( Jul 11 18:06:22 um, 2014 Jul 11 18:06:23 aw Jul 11 18:06:59 people are putting too much info into the second column, makes it slower to read Jul 11 18:07:05 mmm can I run android on my freerunner ? Jul 11 18:07:09 yeah, waht is supposed to be there? Jul 11 18:07:47 hello all, has anyone from Canada ordered from Koloo/ Jul 11 18:07:49 just yes or no for shipping info received and if so. the date you received it rally Jul 11 18:08:02 Staticwave_Ace: considered it, but they didn't have stock :/ Jul 11 18:08:25 doc|work: yeah, open a storefront with no stock, now I'm waiting for who knows how long :-/ Jul 11 18:08:36 koolu's site now says 100 in stock Jul 11 18:08:36 Staticwave_Ace: you ordered? Jul 11 18:08:41 doc|work: I did Jul 11 18:08:46 Staticwave_Ace: you should contact them Jul 11 18:08:46 jandark: no, not without mega hacking. there's a page somewhere where someone documented their efforts Jul 11 18:08:51 besides, Andriod is closed Jul 11 18:09:15 Chocky, I got it , thanks Jul 11 18:09:22 doc|work: its still way cheaper than ordering from openmoko.com, UPS would screw me otherwise Jul 11 18:11:19 ugh. got updated to Firefox 3.01 beta automatically. Jul 11 18:12:15 Staticwave_Ace: yeah, ups = scum Jul 11 18:13:05 doc|work: scum doesn't even begin to describe it Jul 11 18:13:17 Staticwave_Ace: what's their warranty btw? Jul 11 18:13:33 *shrugs* i have had better luck with UPS than anyone else (and my dad owns a packaging and shipping store) Jul 11 18:13:44 (which does not mean that they don't suck) Jul 11 18:14:15 sirkha: yeah, but they have scam fees when bringing things into canada Jul 11 18:14:25 UPS in the US are supposed to be ok. UP here they suck Jul 11 18:14:53 Rogers _and_ sucky UPS. I'd be unhappy too ;-) Jul 11 18:14:54 mickeyl: Any idea on what's going to happen to 2007.2? I'm asking cause I'm wondering whether some people could get SVN access to add bugfixes and other enhancements Jul 11 18:14:59 Chocky: yeah Jul 11 18:15:01 at least the $CA is strong. Jul 11 18:15:12 Chocky: not as strong as it should be. Stupid Bank of Canada. Jul 11 18:15:16 ah. Jul 11 18:15:24 speaking of firefox. Does this page take down anyone else's firefox 3? Or just my ubuntu firefox thing? Jul 11 18:15:24 http://www.hecklerspray.com/top-20-non-american-war-movies/200815089.php Jul 11 18:15:37 I can just imagine all those Canadians writing polite letters saying how angry they might get. Jul 11 18:15:50 zmoll: no one was speaking of firefox, please don't spam Jul 11 18:15:52 sounds like the UN Jul 11 18:15:52 abraxa_: As far as I know, nothing will happen to it from Openmoko side. I rather suggest deprecating the Openmoko SVN and have people taking the sourcecode from there (+ ohand sources) and starting their work on SHR (or improving 2007.2) on the sources. That will put the community into control (granting access et. al) Jul 11 18:15:59 doc|home: I was, my fault Jul 11 18:16:09 I'll shut me big gob. Jul 11 18:16:22 zmoll: ok, he was, my bad Jul 11 18:16:27 abraxa_: I will change the SRC_URI in OE once anyone did that Jul 11 18:16:33 ab0oo: did you figure out the secret? Jul 11 18:16:34 mickeyl: Okay, good Jul 11 18:16:35 but there's no such thing as "Ubuntu Firefox", btw. Jul 11 18:16:47 Dave: no, I'm here right now: http://www.qtopia.net/modules/sections/index.php?op=viewarticle&artid=7 Jul 11 18:16:59 it just needs someone taking the wheel Jul 11 18:17:04 but I can't seem to crack the / code Jul 11 18:17:05 then we can all move Jul 11 18:17:15 I daren't say owt. Jul 11 18:17:39 opkg barfs on the .qpk file Jul 11 18:17:46 owt Jul 11 18:17:49 ^ seems safe Jul 11 18:17:51 and I'm simply too stupid to install it by hand. Jul 11 18:17:54 ok, well thanks for the info, i'll be sure to come back and chat when i am less tired and angry :) Jul 11 18:18:11 i guess eveyone is editing the Wheres my freerunner list when they get the phone right? Jul 11 18:18:23 linuxxr: hopefully Jul 11 18:18:43 im srtill outaluck Jul 11 18:18:49 well, they only need to edit when they get their notification Jul 11 18:18:54 * mjr pats his freerunner :] Jul 11 18:19:04 my preeeeeeeeecious :] Jul 11 18:19:07 linuxxr: order no? Jul 11 18:19:10 oooooooooh Jul 11 18:19:16 2039 Jul 11 18:19:19 odd Jul 11 18:19:25 why are they skipping some? :/ Jul 11 18:19:28 one distro to rule them all. one SVN to bind them. and in the darkness, one phone to call them all. Jul 11 18:19:37 Anyone want some bbq? :D Jul 11 18:19:37 well the list shows that Jul 11 18:19:40 one distro? nevar! Jul 11 18:19:50 Chocky, yeah, fuck git! :p Jul 11 18:19:54 git++ Jul 11 18:19:55 git blows Jul 11 18:19:57 huhu Jul 11 18:20:00 git so confusing. Jul 11 18:20:03 debian forever! Jul 11 18:20:05 and Mecurical can join it Jul 11 18:20:06 not confusing Jul 11 18:20:13 pain to set up Jul 11 18:20:15 \o/ Jul 11 18:20:16 easy after that Jul 11 18:20:16 svn mostly good. Jul 11 18:20:28 and yes, Debian forever. Jul 11 18:20:31 doc, it's definitely easier to get going for a simple small project :P Jul 11 18:20:37 ljp: you around? I could use some Troll love. Jul 11 18:20:57 though yeah, for something tiered with multiple branches and bastardized hierarchies, sure sure :p Jul 11 18:21:03 ab0oo: hah! Jul 11 18:21:04 :] Jul 11 18:21:21 * doc|work hungry :( Jul 11 18:21:57 have some Canadian moose Jul 11 18:22:07 Doc, you're always hungry! Jul 11 18:22:15 Have some canadian bacon Jul 11 18:22:19 I'm sure it comes in bags, too! Jul 11 18:22:20 mickeyl: Any reason that we shouldn't use git for the repo for our fork of 2007.2? Jul 11 18:22:22 * Dave giggles Jul 11 18:22:29 Dave: blame Alan Alda Jul 11 18:22:33 wurp2: no reason. sounds good Jul 11 18:22:48 dammit. I have to learn git now. Jul 11 18:22:54 mickeyl: k, thanks Jul 11 18:22:59 :P Jul 11 18:23:15 wurp2: git... where? Jul 11 18:23:24 wurp, see what you've done now!? Jul 11 18:23:53 so who all has their freerunners Jul 11 18:24:04 Who doesn't? :p Jul 11 18:24:10 <-me Jul 11 18:24:10 ;) Jul 11 18:24:20 sure am sad about the glamo Jul 11 18:24:27 Blamo! Jul 11 18:24:30 KABOOM! Jul 11 18:24:33 noshit Jul 11 18:24:36 http://kerneltrap.org/mailarchive/openmoko-community/2008/6/28/2283504 Jul 11 18:24:49 boohoo? Jul 11 18:25:41 some guy did a bunch of work, and has much more promising results with it Jul 11 18:25:47 hacked up mplayer, etc Jul 11 18:26:07 http://unadventure.wordpress.com/ Jul 11 18:26:24 read it ;) Jul 11 18:26:30 whysosad? Jul 11 18:26:48 ooo, -vo glamo Jul 11 18:27:25 all vid has to go through that glamo/bus right? Jul 11 18:27:29 ya Jul 11 18:27:30 X etc Jul 11 18:27:58 I think the result will be more than satisfactory. have patience young padawan Jul 11 18:28:05 kd8ikt: and all sd info Jul 11 18:28:09 er, data Jul 11 18:28:35 oh i'm still buying my from the group sales guys a state away thur Jul 11 18:29:17 just think - you can still get an iPhone ;-) Jul 11 18:29:18 wish that the GTA01 could use Mplayer Jul 11 18:29:30 heh Jul 11 18:29:33 iphone :P Jul 11 18:29:40 iJail Jul 11 18:29:40 iphone can suck my inutz Jul 11 18:29:44 heh Jul 11 18:29:57 * doc|work fines Chocky one testicle Jul 11 18:30:17 dammit, down to two. Jul 11 18:30:19 o.O Jul 11 18:30:22 haha Jul 11 18:30:23 O.o Jul 11 18:30:29 mickeyl: somebody should poke the sales guys, to add something besides visa/mc (read: amex) to the store :p Jul 11 18:30:36 * Dave offers doc some barbecue chicken Jul 11 18:30:43 hehe Jul 11 18:30:48 mmmchicken Jul 11 18:30:49 you can't imagine how complicated that all is Jul 11 18:30:56 Qwell, like six credit cards simultaneously? Jul 11 18:30:57 :p Jul 11 18:30:59 these shop systems suck so much Jul 11 18:31:02 Dave: That too Jul 11 18:31:04 it's insane Jul 11 18:31:10 mickeyl: oh, I know.. Jul 11 18:31:11 also, amex charge ridiculous fees to vendors Jul 11 18:31:21 so this guy was embarassed about having 3 testicles, and went to see his doctor. Doctor told him to boast about it. So the next guy he says in the street, he tells "you know, between the 2 of us, we have 5 testicles" Jul 11 18:31:29 I'd much rather they added alternative delivery options Jul 11 18:31:30 heh Jul 11 18:31:39 and the guy replies in a high voice "well, you must have quite a cluster" Jul 11 18:31:59 lol Jul 11 18:32:13 heh Jul 11 18:32:26 Is that the end of the story? Jul 11 18:33:23 * doc|work thinks Dave didn't get it Jul 11 18:33:36 so, who's gonna buy me that last phone, and let me send them some money through paypal? :P Jul 11 18:33:41 It's pretty weak. Jul 11 18:33:43 he laughs last ussually needs the joke explained Jul 11 18:33:46 hah Jul 11 18:33:50 Qwell :p Jul 11 18:33:51 he who* Jul 11 18:34:30 Qwell: it's gone. The OM store has no phones available for purchase now. Jul 11 18:34:36 aww Jul 11 18:34:46 * Dave consoles Qwell Jul 11 18:35:29 who do i email about my order Jul 11 18:35:47 what order # are you? Jul 11 18:35:53 2039 Jul 11 18:36:13 9.30 am jul 4 Jul 11 18:36:31 i'm 1313 i didn't hear anything until wed Jul 11 18:36:38 ok Jul 11 18:36:40 I'm 133t Jul 11 18:36:46 impatiance Jul 11 18:37:17 Dave: did you use bash for your console shell? Jul 11 18:37:35 What shell? Jul 11 18:37:38 on the freerunner? Jul 11 18:37:45 the one the console runs. Jul 11 18:37:50 in general? Jul 11 18:37:58 Do I use bash? Jul 11 18:37:58 * Dave/#openmoko consoles Qwell Jul 11 18:38:05 OH Jul 11 18:38:07 haha :p Jul 11 18:38:12 of course! Jul 11 18:38:14 ksh please Jul 11 18:38:20 bash bash bash! Jul 11 18:38:35 wouldn't you rather have tcsh, Qwell? ;) Jul 11 18:38:43 python :p Jul 11 18:38:44 since you seemed to be low on it, earlier :p Jul 11 18:39:02 tcsh? no thanks Jul 11 18:39:58 cash money? Jul 11 18:40:06 /bin/bush Jul 11 18:40:48 > /dev/flame Jul 11 18:41:00 zsh ftw! Jul 11 18:41:21 * Dave forces kd8ikt to use msh Jul 11 18:41:31 perl as a shell Jul 11 18:42:09 cat /dev/flame > /dev/war Jul 11 18:42:16 rm -rf /dev/war Jul 11 18:43:47 msh? you mean microsuck shell? Jul 11 18:44:08 Xaos: You know that removing the node won't do anything, since something is already accessing it, right? :D Jul 11 18:44:20 Wow, the solar cells from the solar garden light are very efficient Jul 11 18:44:26 with the GTK daily build, can I (and how do I) get it to 'suspend' when I don't want to use it but still want to get phone calls? Jul 11 18:44:28 there can be only one Jul 11 18:44:35 1.5x2 inch giving 5v Jul 11 18:44:36 Qwell: nice Jul 11 18:45:01 heh yeah KrisAbsinthe_that the cell on your 1973? Jul 11 18:45:10 sudo killall warmongers && rm -rf /dev/war Jul 11 18:45:15 dd if=/dev/zero of=/blah.dd& rm /blah.dd Jul 11 18:45:19 yeah, lol. May have to cover some of the cell Jul 11 18:45:20 watch your disk fill up quick like Jul 11 18:45:31 enough already Jul 11 18:46:07 Qwell, smartass :p Jul 11 18:47:11 nuclear_eclipse: With the "Dim, then lock" option on the power button menu Jul 11 18:48:51 wurp2: but then it 'wakes up' when I touch the screen; I'm talking about some way of suspending it, so that the screen wont wake it up, so I can put it in my pocket, etc Jul 11 18:49:09 nuclear_eclipse: hah, exactly! Jul 11 18:49:16 muwahahhaa finally someone else sees my issue ;) Jul 11 18:49:29 so many issues Jul 11 18:49:30 nuclear_eclipse: 'lock' used to mean suspend Jul 11 18:49:31 ha! I love mocking the iPhone people with their completely inoperative phones Jul 11 18:49:42 Staticwave_Ace: dude, iphone! Jul 11 18:49:44 with your incomplete freerunner? ;-) Jul 11 18:49:44 :P Jul 11 18:49:50 pretty much Jul 11 18:50:58 so what you all are saying is that what I want isn't possible yet? Jul 11 18:51:01 my mom has an iPhone, at least she can make a call. Jul 11 18:51:07 aye Jul 11 18:51:07 my boss was telling me his wife went to an iphone store and asked how much the iphone 3g was, they wouldn't tell her, it hadn't been launched yet or something. Anyway, she was a bit confused by this because they were advertising it. She said "why won't you tell me the price? it's just a phone" and the person there said "ma'am, it's not just a phone, it's an iphone" Jul 11 18:51:20 hah Jul 11 18:51:21 ... Jul 11 18:51:27 iFanBoi Jul 11 18:51:52 iHype. Jul 11 18:52:18 nuclear_eclipse: might not be possible yet Jul 11 18:52:30 the power management stuff is still being worked on Jul 11 18:52:31 poop Jul 11 18:52:35 Battery life at teh moment is very much a work in progress. Currently suspend is broken, so you get 6-12 hours depending on what's on. The hardware appears capable of doing a week standby, with 20 hours mp3, and 5 hours+ talk time. Jul 11 18:52:36 yep :/ Jul 11 18:52:53 SpeedEvil: you should script that :) Jul 11 18:52:54 also, is there a way to set tho clock without needing a terminal/ssh? Jul 11 18:53:01 ~FAQ Jul 11 18:53:02 well, faq is http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_(GTA02)_FAQ Jul 11 18:53:03 ntp :p Jul 11 18:53:11 nuclear_eclipse: see, now you're just asking for useful features. silly man. Jul 11 18:53:12 :) Jul 11 18:53:16 lol Jul 11 18:53:22 my apologies Jul 11 18:53:31 doc: oh man, that's rich. Jul 11 18:53:32 nuclear_eclipse: I have a gps-date script on my .desktop Jul 11 18:53:40 actually, this kinda makes the point of the gta01 moot, doesn't it? Jul 11 18:53:44 But not for you :-) Jul 11 18:54:51 Now now, everyone play nice :) Jul 11 18:54:58 * Chocky refuses Jul 11 18:55:13 nuclear_eclipse: see http://moko.mwester.net/fixes.html for suspend/resume stuff Jul 11 18:55:18 That's okay, you are exempt, Chocky. Jul 11 18:55:34 * Chocky has a "CA except" sticker Jul 11 18:55:36 lol idiot its nucular the s is silent -peter griffin Jul 11 18:55:53 mmontour: ty Jul 11 18:56:07 kd8ikt: I love that quote :) Jul 11 18:56:18 NUCLEAR WESSELS! Jul 11 18:56:35 Captain, it is the Enterprise Jul 11 18:56:38 there be whales here Jul 11 18:56:55 ENGAGE! Jul 11 18:57:11 * SpeedEvil wants a transparent aluminium neo case. Jul 11 18:57:11 energize i believe Jul 11 18:57:14 Sulu, feel free to ... indulge yourself Jul 11 18:57:20 haha Jul 11 18:57:29 SpeedEvil: such material exists. cost you about $10k though Jul 11 18:57:33 Or at least sapphire. Jul 11 18:57:43 now that's just selfish Jul 11 18:57:48 Moon sapphires!? Jul 11 18:57:49 mmmmm.... Transparent Aluminum... Jul 11 18:58:01 Chocky: I've contemplated HIP assembly of ruby, corundum, sapphire, in interesting patterns. Jul 11 18:58:03 haha Jul 11 18:58:06 SpeedEvil: speaking of cases, just found out the next line of Dell notebooks will NOT have plastic cases, but brushed aluminum Jul 11 18:58:09 did he really say that to sulu? (cause he's gay) Jul 11 18:58:10 whales, haha Jul 11 18:58:27 Xaos, ooh la la Jul 11 18:58:35 I'm sure they'll break all the same. Jul 11 18:58:38 still in memphis... Jul 11 18:58:39 probably Jul 11 18:58:39 still in memphis... Jul 11 18:58:40 still in memphis... Jul 11 18:58:47 Xaos: brushed aluminum-colored plastic. :) Jul 11 18:58:53 They're taking a page out of Apple's craptastic material engineering book. Jul 11 18:58:56 Xaos: Are they still "Dell"? Jul 11 18:58:59 haha Jul 11 18:59:02 yep Jul 11 18:59:03 they did a thing on Sulu on "The Soup". Mankini! Jul 11 18:59:04 Qwell hit it, correctly. Jul 11 18:59:09 iDell? :O Jul 11 18:59:12 Dave: I'm a realist. Jul 11 18:59:13 My manager had lunch with our account rep... Jul 11 18:59:15 anyone with a 1973 wanna sell me the silver trim from their case? Jul 11 18:59:18 Xaos: So, they suck, but now have a metal case? Jul 11 18:59:25 exactly Jul 11 18:59:32 It'll likely cost you $200 more Jul 11 18:59:37 * Chocky continues not buying Dell Jul 11 18:59:42 actually though, I kinda like the Dell laptops...at least the Lattitude line Jul 11 18:59:44 * Dave high-fives Chocky Jul 11 19:00:00 Xaos, it's been pretty good, over the years. Jul 11 19:00:10 Though ridiculously overpriced nowadays. Jul 11 19:00:22 true...but my company bought mine for me ;-) Jul 11 19:01:02 i'm on my acer aspire 4315 not a bad machine for only 400$ same stuff but cpu/drive size as a eeepc Jul 11 19:01:40 * Chocky gets the call. packages have arrived at home. Jul 11 19:01:49 heh, cute. Jul 11 19:01:54 just as long as the 4 year old doesn't open then, they'll be ok :o Jul 11 19:01:55 Chocky, release the hounds! Jul 11 19:02:05 well, the terrier. Jul 11 19:02:09 "boss i'm not feeling too good may i go home" Jul 11 19:02:14 :D Jul 11 19:02:18 Always suspect the wife. Jul 11 19:02:33 yes, but it's Friday and there's beer in the fridge outside my door. Jul 11 19:02:40 \o/ Jul 11 19:02:41 hear about hans reiser last week Jul 11 19:02:42 "... my wife just had a delivery" ;) Jul 11 19:02:49 haha Jul 11 19:02:52 Terrible :p Jul 11 19:02:55 took police to her body Jul 11 19:02:58 decisions, decisions. Jul 11 19:03:07 * Dave beers Chocky Jul 11 19:03:12 phone must wait for beer Jul 11 19:03:20 plus I actually have work to do before 4pm :p Jul 11 19:03:24 oh, heh Jul 11 19:03:29 Then you better get crackin' :p Jul 11 19:03:30 such as sit here and harass people. Jul 11 19:03:48 and a conference call at 2pm. fnar Jul 11 19:03:50 It's your job! Jul 11 19:03:52 according to my (incorrect) neo, it's already 4:01 :P Jul 11 19:04:04 haha Jul 11 19:04:17 oh shite has anyone worked on conf calling on the moko? Jul 11 19:04:26 first get calling working :P Jul 11 19:04:36 calling works for me Jul 11 19:04:42 then go go go! Jul 11 19:05:04 anything in the gsmlib to show that conf calling is possible Jul 11 19:05:08 kd8ikt: Speaking of Reiser...have you seen this table? http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Comparison_of_file_systems&oldid=220529437#Features Jul 11 19:05:15 check out the last column Jul 11 19:05:36 Xaos: that's just cruel... :P Jul 11 19:05:37 one gives you a free murder? Jul 11 19:05:38 heh Jul 11 19:05:49 thats terrible Jul 11 19:06:04 Hey, I was just guessing :) Jul 11 19:06:23 yeah...friend sent it to me earlier this week...it's very wrong! Jul 11 19:06:23 Nice Jul 11 19:06:41 I worked at a place where someone edited a wikipedia entry about Mr Wikipedia adding that he ate babies. Jul 11 19:06:56 does anyone know if the AT&T 3G sim was fixed with the Freerunnner? Jul 11 19:07:03 i have to show some freinds that before it gets edited by the wiki nazi's Jul 11 19:07:04 that's silly, file systems don't kill people, hans reiser kills people. Jul 11 19:07:10 good question. I have such a sim here to try later. Jul 11 19:07:14 doc|home: that's a low blow. Jul 11 19:07:22 doc|home: (with a hammer). Jul 11 19:07:30 kd8ikt: that's an old version, that link's going nowhere Jul 11 19:07:36 SpeedEvil: hahaha Jul 11 19:07:52 Chocky: I just tried but it seams unable to register out of the box, going to run some more tests once I get home though Jul 11 19:08:00 * SpeedEvil wonders if anythings happened with the plea negotiations. Jul 11 19:08:01 garnser, it works fine. Jul 11 19:08:15 Dave: did you have to do some black magic to get it working? Jul 11 19:08:21 No Jul 11 19:08:33 I activated it, stuck it in, it registered just fine. Jul 11 19:08:37 hm, I wonder why mine wouldn't work then Jul 11 19:08:38 I then placed a call, which also worked fine. Jul 11 19:08:39 SpeedEvil: Yeah, they reduced the charges from 1st degree manslaughter to 2nd degree. Jul 11 19:08:53 manslaughter?! Jul 11 19:08:59 After he was convicted, but before sentencing Jul 11 19:09:03 how did he even get just a manslaughter charge? Jul 11 19:09:06 this is a work one from a PCMCIA card. it's a data plan, so I dunno if I can make calls with it Jul 11 19:09:09 Dave: are you using the Go-contract SIM or a" regular" one Jul 11 19:09:26 why is it that someone kills another and they are charged with man's laughter? Jul 11 19:09:44 Xaos: oh come on, how could you not find this case entertaining? Jul 11 19:09:48 My bad Jul 11 19:09:48 A pay-as-you-go or Prepaid sim? Jul 11 19:09:51 ;-) Jul 11 19:09:54 I don't see the difference Jul 11 19:09:56 if hell existed, I'd be going there Jul 11 19:09:59 Dave: yeah Jul 11 19:10:01 I do Jul 11 19:10:02 It wasn't manslaughter, it was murder Jul 11 19:10:08 'On Monday, 7 July 2008, Reiser led police to what is believed to be the body of Nina Reiser in the Oakland hills.' Jul 11 19:10:09 Though they use the same network... Jul 11 19:10:11 Oh well. Jul 11 19:10:14 doc|work: I'll be first against the wall when the revolution comes Jul 11 19:10:21 But for informational purposes yeah, I add minutes to it, etc. Jul 11 19:10:31 Dave: I know for the 1973 the payasyougo SIM worked but not the "regular" Jul 11 19:10:38 That's really strange :p Jul 11 19:10:39 different batches Jul 11 19:10:42 Chocky: I'll ensure that Jul 11 19:10:45 They convicted him on 1st degree murder, and reduced the conviction to 2nd degree murder after he gave up the body. Jul 11 19:10:50 Chocky: er, forget I said that Jul 11 19:11:01 rivalarrival: did he give up the body? Jul 11 19:11:13 On Monday, 7 July 2008, Reiser led police to what is believed to be the body of Nina Reiser in the Oakland hills. Jul 11 19:11:19 ah Jul 11 19:11:23 I'd show the body too if I got 10 years less prison time.. Jul 11 19:11:24 Was it good? Jul 11 19:11:38 those open source hackers are so anti-social and violent... Jul 11 19:11:42 garnser: After being convicted on 1st degree murder, yeah. Jul 11 19:12:03 blame the danes Jul 11 19:12:09 ab0oo: Oh yeah, And we know where you live. :-) Jul 11 19:12:17 haha Jul 11 19:12:33 I keep waiting for someone to actually post their tracking number on the wiki. Jul 11 19:12:48 you gonna show up and steal it? Jul 11 19:13:04 ab0oo: a few have Jul 11 19:13:05 although, if one is smart, one could use the same database to find out exactly where kd8ikt and I live. Jul 11 19:13:09 well, it doesn't definitely translate to 10 years less prison Jul 11 19:13:09 haha Jul 11 19:13:18 (not that we live together, just found in the same DB) Jul 11 19:13:22 the min sentence for 2nd degree is 15, but the max is life Jul 11 19:13:26 fuck that, just jack the truck :p Jul 11 19:13:30 (1st is 25-life) Jul 11 19:13:34 check the fcc dbase for kd8ikt and you get my address Jul 11 19:13:47 but i'm not having it shipped here Jul 11 19:13:55 Dave: too many trucks :p Jul 11 19:13:56 I wasn't going to be quite so obvious, kd8ikt... Jul 11 19:13:57 kd8ikt, are you luring small children? Jul 11 19:14:01 google his handle, and you'll get enough info to steal his ID. That's why I stopped using my callsign Jul 11 19:14:01 however, 1st degree means you can't get parole, 2nd can be paroled (it will specify in the sentencing) Jul 11 19:14:05 or having them shipped overseas? Jul 11 19:14:10 i'm driving across state to pick it up from the group sales guy Jul 11 19:14:20 that doesn't sound cheap Jul 11 19:14:25 Qwell wanted one... Jul 11 19:14:29 its only like 2hr drive Jul 11 19:14:33 my callsign looks so unlike a callsign, even other licensee's don't recognize it Jul 11 19:14:34 at most Jul 11 19:14:35 huh? Jul 11 19:14:43 still $50 in gas Jul 11 19:14:49 ab0oo: Dude, that's a callsign? Jul 11 19:15:01 Jul 11 19:15:36 your right john it doesnt Jul 11 19:15:47 and there you have it. Jul 11 19:15:52 <- callsign Jul 11 19:16:01 <- nick Jul 11 19:16:05 Qwell: Fail Jul 11 19:16:08 #hamradio Jul 11 19:16:22 :D Jul 11 19:16:44 the best part is it's just a sequential call, not a vaity call. Jul 11 19:16:50 food time, later all, thanks for the help Jul 11 19:16:55 thats pimp Jul 11 19:16:56 ab0oo: Bullshit. Seriously? Jul 11 19:17:39 the funniest part is that, in KS (where the call was issued), I got a ham license plate with AB0OO, with a slash in the zero to make it look like a zero. Jul 11 19:18:09 I always wanted to get a vanity plate: 00o0ooo0 Jul 11 19:18:10 when I moved to GA, I found out they don't differentiate between zero and "oh" on license plates, so my license plate says "AB000" Jul 11 19:18:22 lol Jul 11 19:18:28 we saw one today at lunch that said "OMG WTF", no shit Jul 11 19:18:29 l0l Jul 11 19:18:33 ab0oo: your nick kind of sucks, anyway Jul 11 19:18:46 Mocky Jul 11 19:18:47 ORLY Jul 11 19:18:53 apt nickometer ab0oo Jul 11 19:18:56 'ab0oo' is 22.000% lame, dave Jul 11 19:18:59 huhu Jul 11 19:19:04 a boo boo Jul 11 19:19:05 apt nickometer paroneayea Jul 11 19:19:07 'paroneayea' is 0.000% lame, paroneayea Jul 11 19:19:12 that's totally untrue Jul 11 19:19:13 ~nickometer Dave Jul 11 19:19:15 'Dave' is 0.000% lame, rivalarrival Jul 11 19:19:17 I have the lamest of names Jul 11 19:19:22 Hardly. Jul 11 19:19:29 how do you calculate lame? Jul 11 19:19:35 stupid shit in a nick Jul 11 19:19:37 ab0oo: bot voodoo Jul 11 19:19:44 botsnack Jul 11 19:19:48 ~nickometer KrisAbsinthe Jul 11 19:19:51 'KrisAbsinthe' is 0.000% lame, krisabsinthe_ Jul 11 19:19:54 apt nickometer apt Jul 11 19:19:57 'apt' is 0.000% lame, mmontour Jul 11 19:20:03 apt be apt Jul 11 19:20:12 aww Jul 11 19:20:20 apt nickometer 1337_H@xxor$ Jul 11 19:20:22 '1337_H@xxor$' is 97.700% lame, rivalarrival Jul 11 19:20:25 ~botabuse Jul 11 19:20:26 botabuse is probably fun Jul 11 19:20:51 bqs Jul 11 19:21:04 ~apt Jul 11 19:21:05 apt is, like, not as cool as jbot Jul 11 19:21:10 ~jbot Jul 11 19:21:11 rumour has it, jbot is a hack!, or known to have only said one useful thing. a tool, or dating the fembots, or [TK]D-Fender's b*tch, or suck, or a pain in the ass Jul 11 19:21:20 ~ass Jul 11 19:21:21 somebody said ass was what you have to get a piece of Jul 11 19:21:23 ~reiser Jul 11 19:21:25 somebody said reiser was filed in my brain under "reiserfs". http://boudicca.tux.org/hypermail/linux-kernel/2001week19/0069.html Jul 11 19:21:30 ~moose Jul 11 19:21:32 i heard moose is elg Jul 11 19:21:34 ~~ Jul 11 19:21:35 Every moment in which I'm called upon is torture. Jul 11 19:21:38 ~~~ Jul 11 19:22:01 sometimes bots reply to commands Jul 11 19:22:53 ~iphone Jul 11 19:22:54 iSmoke, b*tch! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qg1ckCkm8YI Jul 11 19:22:58 irc.foonetic.net #bots - we had some Markov bots in there for awhile - anytime you try to teach a bot, the markov bots would "help" you Jul 11 19:24:19 ~Microsoft Jul 11 19:24:20 "The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck is the day they start making vacuum cleaners." Jul 11 19:24:33 SpeedEvil: hah, I'd love to see them try that on a freerunner and have the freerunner choke Jul 11 19:24:35 HAHAHAHA!!! Jul 11 19:24:38 er, the blender choke Jul 11 19:24:59 Windows broken, please use door. Jul 11 19:25:14 for a better vista? Jul 11 19:25:55 They say that if you play a Vista DVD backwards, you hear satanic messages. That's nothing. Play it forward, and it tries to install Vista. Jul 11 19:26:13 heh Jul 11 19:26:19 :D Jul 11 19:26:25 I love the grin on his face Jul 11 19:26:28 ~vista Jul 11 19:26:30 when I read blender + freerunner, I got excited for a second that someone had made a freerunner friendly build of blender Jul 11 19:26:31 as he blends Jul 11 19:26:40 paroneayea: give it time :) Jul 11 19:26:44 does the FR blend? Jul 11 19:26:55 Qwell: don't even think about it! Jul 11 19:27:02 waste of a good freerunner Jul 11 19:27:06 The fucker who blends an FR dies in his sleep! Jul 11 19:27:16 :o Jul 11 19:27:23 I may fully disassemble one Jul 11 19:27:26 paroneayea: have you tried blender on the FR? Jul 11 19:27:33 Remember to do it before the warranty expires. Jul 11 19:27:37 I actully was kinda sickened by that iphone blending, it's kinda a waste. It's nice hardware, even if it's locked down. Jul 11 19:27:43 And return it in a baggie, saying Fault: Blends. Jul 11 19:27:53 yeah, me too, but because of the chemicals and such. Jul 11 19:28:06 SpeedEvil: hahah Jul 11 19:28:10 What exactly are you doing to it? Jul 11 19:29:00 edistar_: no... I'm sure you could get it to compile somehow, but the problem is that blender is very 3 button mouse + keyboard centric Jul 11 19:29:07 rivalarrival: why, are they making no more? ;-) Jul 11 19:29:12 I don't think the freerunner would be very fun to use with it, input wise. Jul 11 19:29:21 paroneayea: true again.. Jul 11 19:29:45 then again there's a lot of work being done in blender to make the next big release much more customizable Jul 11 19:29:51 MORE GAMES Jul 11 19:29:53 MORE VIDEO Jul 11 19:29:56 MORE FREERUNNER! Jul 11 19:30:00 so you can really uniquely map keybindings much more easily, ala emacs Jul 11 19:30:05 more beer Jul 11 19:30:08 oh yeah, and making phone calls might be nice, too. Jul 11 19:30:12 more? I just want the one I've paid for :) Jul 11 19:30:13 Chocky, you have enough, thak you :p Jul 11 19:30:15 thank Jul 11 19:30:19 heh doc Jul 11 19:30:19 MORE UPTIME! ;) Jul 11 19:30:22 NO NO Jul 11 19:30:24 yes, but I haven't drunk it yet Jul 11 19:30:31 uptime is the last thing it needs Jul 11 19:30:45 eh Jul 11 19:30:48 *heh Jul 11 19:30:50 Anybody play with wii remotes for other than their intended uses? Jul 11 19:30:52 doesn't need more battery life uptime? Jul 11 19:30:56 lol blendtec is awesome Jul 11 19:30:56 it did last time I used it Jul 11 19:31:06 rivalarrival: pictures on the internet say yes. Jul 11 19:31:14 yes, but use of "lol" is not aweseom, kthanxbyte Jul 11 19:31:19 nor awesome Jul 11 19:31:24 anyone made a friimote out of it? Jul 11 19:31:45 yes, but can you make phone calls on it? Jul 11 19:32:29 That is the question! Jul 11 19:33:06 SpeedEvil: I was wondering if anyone in here had played with them. Lotsa hardware in that little device - I had one setup as a mouse for awhile. Jul 11 19:33:15 MOAR! Jul 11 19:33:21 rivalarrival: I buy the bits directly :) Jul 11 19:34:00 SpeedEvil: Yeah, but that takes all the fun out of it. :-) Jul 11 19:34:01 btw, 10 pack came in two boxes. I guess one is the extras Jul 11 19:34:04 rivalarrival: you should check out johnny lee Jul 11 19:34:20 ozzloy: Seen some of the stuff he did. Jul 11 19:34:33 rivalarrival: plus - I'm trying to build a 1Kg UAV, that can hit 2Km altitude. Jul 11 19:34:36 the whiteboard and the pseudo 3D display Jul 11 19:34:51 rivalarrival: wiimote won't cut it. Jul 11 19:35:26 SpeedEvil: We used to call them "RC Models" Jul 11 19:35:34 * Chocky laffs. Jul 11 19:35:38 rivalarrival: not quite. Jul 11 19:35:49 what's UAV? Jul 11 19:35:53 * Chocky laffs more. Jul 11 19:35:58 It's an over-glorified RC Model. Jul 11 19:36:05 SpeedEvil: wow, do you have any docs/website? Jul 11 19:36:09 with military implications Jul 11 19:36:25 Basically, a camera. Jul 11 19:36:38 rivalarrival: 1Kg, ascends to 2-4Km in 3 minutes or so, takes 100MP panorama, lands automatically back on base-station, you fold up suitcase, place back in car, and plug it into charger, and it is ready to go again in 15 mins. Jul 11 19:36:44 what are you going to be doing at 2000 meters? Jul 11 19:36:56 I see. Jul 11 19:36:59 rc planes, military style Jul 11 19:37:02 icic Jul 11 19:37:16 SpeedEvil: what kind of UAV? balloon? Jul 11 19:37:22 SpeedEvil: 100MP? Using several cameras? Jul 11 19:37:28 SpeedEvil: Yeah, everything but the "100MP" has been done. Jul 11 19:37:32 abraxa_: no - one and stitching. Jul 11 19:37:40 ah ok Jul 11 19:37:44 rivalarrival: not at the low, low price point of ~$1000 Jul 11 19:37:52 and then a huge TV to view it on Jul 11 19:37:54 paparazzi - the next generation. Jul 11 19:37:55 rivalarrival: and nearly no user skill needed. Jul 11 19:37:55 Ok, NOW you've piqued my interest. :-) Jul 11 19:38:11 SpeedEvil: what do you use? a plane? Jul 11 19:38:27 edistar_: http://www.mauve.plus.com/test.png - a render of it overhead Jul 11 19:38:37 actually it's a very tiny camera attached to the front of a bullet. Jul 11 19:38:38 edistar_: thrust vectored helicopter. Jul 11 19:38:51 Ok, you lost me again. Jul 11 19:38:58 SpeedEvil: okey :) Jul 11 19:39:10 and what does freerunner have to do with this? Jul 11 19:39:14 SpeedEvil: I want one of those! Jul 11 19:39:20 Chocky: it may use the same CPU. Jul 11 19:39:24 SpeedEvil: how much are you looking at per unit? Jul 11 19:39:25 pfft Jul 11 19:39:37 doc|home: of the order of $1000 minimum. Jul 11 19:39:47 doc|home: I'm unsure of the pricing really. Jul 11 19:40:01 You're probably aware of it, but did you know that most fixed wing aircraft fly using a different aerodynamic principal than helicopters? The F117 and the A-10 use the same principal as the helicopters too... Jul 11 19:40:18 SpeedEvil: interesting. where can I find your manifesto? Jul 11 19:40:46 SpeedEvil: I'd be interested in making one of those. Jul 11 19:40:47 http://www.engadget.com/2008/07/10/its-iphone-3g-tear-down-time/ Jul 11 19:41:16 Most aircraft rely on a concept called Bernoulli's principal that basically says faster moving air is at a lower pressure than slower moving air. Jul 11 19:41:30 But helicopters don't use this - Jul 11 19:42:05 what do they use? Jul 11 19:42:19 Helicopters (and F117, and A-10) don't really fly - they are so ungodly ugly that the earth actually repels them into the air. Jul 11 19:42:21 I thought they did, just rotationally Jul 11 19:42:27 hahaha Jul 11 19:42:35 I always liked the a-10 Jul 11 19:42:39 just because it was so ugly Jul 11 19:42:42 doc|home: it's horribly complex - the prototype has about 40 sensors. Jul 11 19:42:51 SpeedEvil: ouch Jul 11 19:43:13 * Chocky looks at the sad ppl queing for iPhone Jul 11 19:43:46 SpeedEvil: How about a blimp? Jul 11 19:43:53 http://live.ifixit.com/Guide/First-Look/iPhone3G Jul 11 19:44:12 much less complex, you could get it flying with about 4 sensors. Jul 11 19:44:34 Chocky: why do you keep linking to iphone stuff? Jul 11 19:44:37 * doc|work smells a spy Jul 11 19:44:41 I can't help it Jul 11 19:44:44 you haven't bought a freerunner at all! :) Jul 11 19:44:46 rivalarrival: the aim is not to make it easy, but to make it easy to use dor the end user. Jul 11 19:44:55 for Jul 11 19:45:10 oooo noooos our first channel kickee? Jul 11 19:45:14 SpeedEvil: why so many sensors, wouldn't you just need a gyro and a couple of accelerometers? Jul 11 19:45:18 lolol Jul 11 19:45:22 kiddin Jul 11 19:46:06 doc|home: gyros (3), accellerometers (3), magnetometer(3), barometer(6), thermal IR sensor(6), GPS, ... Jul 11 19:46:07 im afraid for my phone Jul 11 19:46:15 machine Jul 11 19:46:19 o.O Jul 11 19:46:24 why so many? Jul 11 19:46:27 SpeedEvil: What's the IR sensors for? Jul 11 19:46:35 rivalarrival: sky is cold, ground is hot Jul 11 19:46:55 I can understand a gyro, 2 accelerometers, barometer,gps and thermal sensor Jul 11 19:47:17 doc|home: multiple barometers are to measure relative wind. Jul 11 19:47:50 only 3 accellerometers? not 4? Jul 11 19:48:01 sitwon: for space-time? Jul 11 19:48:16 * retracile guess rotation Jul 11 19:48:27 retracile: that's what the gyros are for. Jul 11 19:48:33 doc|work: I don't think an accellerometer would detect changes to time or space Jul 11 19:48:38 * retracile displayed his ignorance ;) Jul 11 19:48:44 sitwon: I don't think you can detect a joke :) Jul 11 19:48:55 But they would pick up turbulence pretty well. Jul 11 19:48:58 lol Jul 11 19:49:02 could you not get rotation from the accelerometers? Jul 11 19:49:07 people are still queued up at Rogers in Toronto :) Jul 11 19:49:10 * LetoTo just biked past it Jul 11 19:49:13 doc|home: in theory, given ideal accelerometers. Jul 11 19:49:22 I did complain to Lenovo about no 1-uping Apple w/ a 4-D accellerometer for just that purpose Jul 11 19:49:27 doc|home: real ones are far from ideal. Jul 11 19:49:30 sitwon: heh Jul 11 19:49:33 SpeedEvil: fair enough Jul 11 19:49:49 The FR has 2 3 axis accelerometers, for no good reason. Jul 11 19:50:28 SpeedEvil: moar entropy? Jul 11 19:50:46 SpeedEvil: I'm doing the same thing, but with a gumstix and no accelerometers Jul 11 19:51:09 or gyros. I'm going to try to do it all with GPS and IR sensors Jul 11 19:51:10 ab0oo: the reason this is hard is that it's a dynamically unstable platform - for performance, and I want hands-offl. Jul 11 19:51:27 SpeedEvil: is this a work thing or a hobby? Jul 11 19:51:37 doc|home: hopefully work Jul 11 19:51:41 I'm using a fixed wing pusher plane, based on an RQ-7 Jul 11 19:51:45 doc|home: as in I intend to sell them. Jul 11 19:51:47 awww, was going to ask if you were documenting it :) Jul 11 19:52:09 doc|home: $40K+, and I might. Jul 11 19:52:15 I've got it working to the point where I can drive an RC car around over 802.11g and know where I am and my groundspeed. Jul 11 19:52:21 I want to make some use of my electronics stuff from uni and that looked like a nice (albeit difficult) project Jul 11 19:52:25 ab0oo: nice Jul 11 19:52:26 SpeedEvil: hah Jul 11 19:52:35 abo: 802.11a is my backup link Jul 11 19:52:36 wuh hahahah Jul 11 19:52:40 http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7501321.stm Jul 11 19:52:43 (sorry) Jul 11 19:52:47 abo: with a moderate dish. Jul 11 19:52:54 * doc|work fines Chocky his other testical Jul 11 19:52:56 *testicle Jul 11 19:52:56 802.11 cab service Jul 11 19:53:00 one left Jul 11 19:53:05 I'm stuck on my I2C A2D giving me weird readings Jul 11 19:53:10 SpeedEvil: When it has a 400km range, let me know. Jul 11 19:53:20 I think it's a grounding problem, but until I get it working, I'm not going to put anything in the air. Jul 11 19:53:28 rivalarrival: and a 40km camera range :) Jul 11 19:53:30 oh, and all the software is Java. :) Jul 11 19:53:36 SpeedEvil: is it going to be open source? :) Jul 11 19:53:51 I have a domain and some stuff set up, but it's way out of date. penguinpilot.org Jul 11 19:54:33 I only need a vga camera with a 10x zoom for my job. Jul 11 19:54:49 rivalarrival: it's not for that - it's more aimed at people who might otherwise go and buy an ariel photo. Jul 11 19:54:49 and it's going to get further back-burnered 'till this winter, when I don't have the distraction of actually going out and flying airplanes instead of soldering SMT pieces by hand. Jul 11 19:55:12 rivalarrival: but who have no inherent interest in learning to fly things. Jul 11 19:55:12 rivalarrival: is your job webcam porn star? Jul 11 19:55:21 SpeedEvil: Yeah, I need aerial photos across a 5 county area. Jul 11 19:56:04 ab0oo: Property inspector. Most of my work is shooting 3 pictures from the road and reporting "Yep, the house is still there - hasn't burned down" Jul 11 19:56:30 rivalarrival: you could just call the person in the house :) Jul 11 19:56:40 The problem with UAVs is that the FAA really doesn't like them. Jul 11 19:56:47 doc|work: Nope - they might lie to me. Jul 11 19:57:05 ab0oo: In the UK - as I understand it - keep it under 7Kg and there are no rules. Jul 11 19:57:07 rivalarrival: if the phone still works, it's a pretty safe bet :) Jul 11 19:57:21 ab0oo: I'm aiming for under 1Kg. Jul 11 19:57:33 right now, they tolerate them in small doses, but it's only going to take one idiot to crash a 5kg UAV into a daycare playground for the general public to go ape Jul 11 19:57:52 ab0oo: which is why all the sensors. Jul 11 19:57:53 doc|work: Yeah, these people are about to be foreclosed on... I start calling them and pissing them off, I end up with slashed tires and the house ends up with fish in the walls. Jul 11 19:58:04 rivalarrival: ah, ok Jul 11 19:58:36 ab0oo: I really want to avoid a device weighing 1Kg with three-quarters of a horsepower forgetting where up is. Jul 11 19:58:49 SpeedEvil: try flying a 6.5KG UAV over the heart of London and see how excited people get... :) Jul 11 19:59:04 ab0oo: one should try really.. Jul 11 19:59:15 can anybody tell me where I can find a more detailed error or log output of an openembedded build? I am trying to build the environment using the MokoMakefile and it crashes at some point giving me the following message: http://nopaste.info/027369b8e2.html Jul 11 19:59:16 Funny, it looks just like a clay pigeon. Jul 11 19:59:33 rivalarrival: pretty much similar shape. Jul 11 19:59:42 the problem is I am not able to make any sense out of it. And I can't seem to find any kind of detailed log Jul 11 19:59:50 Does it turn into powder the same way? :-) Jul 11 19:59:51 if I could afford to build one and lose it for good, I'd seriously consider it. After building it with parts purchased with cash, out of state, and while wearing rubber gloves and a hair net. Jul 11 20:00:34 ab0oo: or build it for someone like Bruce Schneier, and have him do it, publicly. Jul 11 20:00:38 So, $10 to the first person running Ubuntu on their OM Jul 11 20:00:50 I'm sure they have a cell on hot standby for him. Jul 11 20:01:02 heh Jul 11 20:01:08 $20 for Debian Jul 11 20:01:17 Chocky: debian works Jul 11 20:01:18 :) Jul 11 20:01:26 Chocky: I'm running it Jul 11 20:01:32 * Chocky high fives Jul 11 20:01:37 Chocky: pay josch Jul 11 20:01:40 did I mention that Dave was paying? Jul 11 20:01:58 I got a real nice look from a homeland security drone in DC last week, after I mentioned how much I enjoyed my tax dollars being spent protecting America from Americans. Jul 11 20:03:02 We need a constitutional amendment that eliminates pretty much the entire federal government. Jul 11 20:03:25 Oh wait - don't we already have one? Jul 11 20:03:43 the 2nd one? Jul 11 20:03:43 oh well, it's fitting that I get my FR on the same day as iPhone release Jul 11 20:03:52 i'd be happy with a small list on my federal tax for allowing me to pick and chose what government services my taxes could be used for. Jul 11 20:03:52 No, we don't have one. Jul 11 20:03:54 I'm having trouble following the instructions here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Getting_Openmoko_working_on_host_with_Xephyr and here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile It errors out during the 'make openmoko-devel-image' with: Jul 11 20:03:57 | Generating include/autoconf.mk Jul 11 20:03:57 | include/common.h:0: error: bad value (armv4t) for -march= switch Jul 11 20:03:57 | include/common.h:0: error: bad value (armv4t) for -mtune= switch Jul 11 20:03:57 | make: *** [include/autoconf.mk] Error 1 Jul 11 20:03:57 | FATAL: oe_runmake failed Jul 11 20:03:57 We have *two* Jul 11 20:04:01 NOTE: Task failed: /usr/local/openmoko/build/tmp/work/i486-angstrom-linux/u-boot-openmoko-1.3.1+svnr4297+gitb29661fc1151077776454288051bc9a488351ce8-r3/temp/log.do_compile.13600 Jul 11 20:04:04 NOTE: package u-boot-openmoko-1.3.1+svnr4297+gitb29661fc1151077776454288051bc9a488351ce8-r3: task do_compile: failed Jul 11 20:04:04 the 9th and 10th Jul 11 20:04:10 GoldenHawk: nopaste.org! Jul 11 20:04:11 The entire Constitution eliminates pretty much the entire Federal Government...what do you mean? Jul 11 20:04:15 Hm. Jul 11 20:04:18 Sorry. Jul 11 20:04:27 ab0oo: works for me! Jul 11 20:04:31 Xaos: ^ Jul 11 20:04:40 yeah, you need to use -mcpu with later GCCs Jul 11 20:04:50 IIRC Jul 11 20:05:02 http://nopaste.org/p/aEEl7tyG4 Jul 11 20:05:31 rivalarrival: good luck using 9th and 10th in court... you're better off with 2nd Jul 11 20:05:53 we're talking GPL, right? Jul 11 20:06:12 yes, the GPL has the right to bear arms Jul 11 20:06:24 don't tell stallman though Jul 11 20:06:28 hm Jul 11 20:06:35 he might throw his sandal or something Jul 11 20:06:39 big furry bear arms Jul 11 20:07:01 and then hide behind his beard Jul 11 20:07:06 , Jul 11 20:07:07 sitwon: The amazing thing about a Democracy is that if the people believe it, it's true... We just have to push the 9th and 10th to mean what we say, and the judges will have no choice but to agree. Jul 11 20:07:15 Best I can guess is the cross compiler that is downloaded by the makefile is broken. Jul 11 20:07:20 Or something. Jul 11 20:07:35 Is there a way to work around this? If I'm not mistaken, I don't need u-boot in order to run a test environment with Xephyr Jul 11 20:08:26 rivalarrival: two flaws in that... 1) you need people to belive it means what you say it means, and the executive branch has a strangle hold on the media. 2) The executive branch can (and has) completely disregard the judicial branch and do whatever the hell they want Jul 11 20:08:46 no one here who has a clue about the OE environment? Jul 11 20:08:47 Mmmm politics. Juicy ^.^ Jul 11 20:10:25 also... it's not a Democracy and never has been. That was propaganda used before the Constitution was ratified to get the people to support it Jul 11 20:11:29 This country has always been founded on the principal of the wealthy few manipulating the poorer masses. Jul 11 20:11:43 What are we arguing about? I want in ^.^ Jul 11 20:11:48 just look at them now Jul 11 20:11:50 sitwon: not entirely, republic = your representatives pick the president Jul 11 20:11:59 you pick the representatives Jul 11 20:12:28 ireland still has that system, the leader of the party with the most votes is prime minister Jul 11 20:12:38 the banks need bailed out because there ability to sell houses multiple times has shrunk Jul 11 20:13:41 doc|work: your vote doesn't pick the president. the electorate votes pick the president and the electorate is selected by the state officials who are voted into office by the populace Jul 11 20:13:47 sitwon: That's right, the people need to believe that it means what you say it means. Jul 11 20:14:13 * GoldenHawk still thinks the cross compiler provided by this MokoMakefile is broken :/ http://nopaste.org/p/aEEl7tyG4 Jul 11 20:14:20 * GoldenHawk isn't sure what to do. Jul 11 20:14:22 You heard it here first: Koolu has phones (silly customs) and will be shipping early next weel. Jul 11 20:14:27 Yay! Jul 11 20:14:38 sitwon: actually, the electoral college is chosen by each party's delegates at their state convention Jul 11 20:15:03 And while you are technically correct, regarding the republic-vs-democrat argument, the electors are chose because of who they have said they will vote for. Jul 11 20:15:10 Early next week. That's great ^.^ All models or just the north american ones? Jul 11 20:15:10 I was at the GOP convention in Texas this year as a delegate... Jul 11 20:15:38 Xaos: still, the electoral college is selected by delegates, not directly by the people. so the popular vote is (more or less) meaning less Jul 11 20:15:39 GoldenHawk: Just NA ones at first. Jul 11 20:15:41 can we return to iphone bashing yet? Jul 11 20:16:04 bricode: That's cool ^.^ Just wondering. I ordered an NA one, so I'm a happy camper now ^.^ Jul 11 20:16:18 iphone sux! Jul 11 20:16:31 yeah, iphone blows monkey balls! Jul 11 20:16:38 * SpeedEvil ponders. Jul 11 20:16:42 Iphone Sax. Jul 11 20:16:47 bricode: Hey, their site wasn't very specific. Will these phones be branded with W.E.and/or will they have the tartan weave faceplates? Jul 11 20:16:49 (or other phone with accellerometer) Jul 11 20:17:01 The virtual sax Jul 11 20:17:08 With the phone as the slide Jul 11 20:17:10 * rivalarrival is going to fit his eeepc into a hamsterball Jul 11 20:17:21 SpeedEvil: You mean trombone? Jul 11 20:17:27 sitwon: correct, the popular vote IS meaningless. Which is why you GET INVOLVED...BE a delegate...Government goes to those that SHOW UP! Jul 11 20:17:38 no more shouting, thanks Jul 11 20:17:38 GoldenHawk: The first few batches will be branded Freerunner until sufficient volume happens. Jul 11 20:17:46 ! #politics Jul 11 20:17:50 yes Jul 11 20:17:51 bricode: Okay that's fine by me too :) Jul 11 20:17:58 bricode: Thanks for the info bro ^.^ Jul 11 20:18:01 Xaos: the point was not democracy, not how to affect government Jul 11 20:18:06 whups. w/w Jul 11 20:18:11 GoldenHawk: gol: oops Jul 11 20:18:11 GoldenHawk: You need > 500 phones to be able to silkscreen anything else, and about the same for different cases. Jul 11 20:18:31 besides, the silkworms aren't ready yet Jul 11 20:18:35 GoldenHawk: It takes a lot of $$$ to front for 500+ phones. Jul 11 20:18:37 Xaos: I'm content with a broken system so long as it's just as broken as every other system of government (which it appears to be) Jul 11 20:19:03 * SpeedEvil votes for himself as benign dictator eleven billion times. Jul 11 20:19:08 bud. Jul 11 20:19:43 sitwon: I'm talking about prime minister Jul 11 20:19:47 * sitwon doesn't think an effective dictator would waste time w/ elections Jul 11 20:20:09 sitwon: in Ireland, the president is pretty much just a fluff position, no real power Jul 11 20:20:30 in Soviet Russia, President is you! Jul 11 20:20:41 bricode: I honestly am not a big fan of plaid. I was just curious :) Plus, if I understand the site correctly, the debian+android software isn't ready yet. So it would be kinda strange to have debian secretly encoded on my phone :p Jul 11 20:20:53 Chocky: I wish! Jul 11 20:20:56 In soviet Russia, President is whoever Mr Putin wants them to be. Jul 11 20:21:00 hah Jul 11 20:21:23 ahhhhh i aint gonna go there Jul 11 20:21:43 gonna stay here Jul 11 20:21:53 moo Jul 11 20:22:02 hai, canz I has presidency nao? Jul 11 20:22:03 * SpeedEvil barks. Jul 11 20:22:20 dammit. is it 4pm yet? Jul 11 20:22:34 err Jul 11 20:22:36 11pm :P Jul 11 20:22:47 4:21p Jul 11 20:22:52 EST Jul 11 20:23:01 wait for me device Jul 11 20:24:12 interesting.. Jul 11 20:24:18 no midnight commander? Jul 11 20:24:24 mc is no more Jul 11 20:24:26 harry emailed me said should recieve track # today thank you harry Jul 11 20:24:49 :D Jul 11 20:24:56 d. Jul 11 20:25:02 Any Qtopia users present? Jul 11 20:25:11 me Jul 11 20:25:16 Ah Jul 11 20:25:28 How do I install qtopia apps on the phone conveniently? Jul 11 20:25:37 or do I have to compile all of them? :| Jul 11 20:25:59 why would you need to do that? Jul 11 20:26:04 :) Jul 11 20:26:21 They off the apps as tarballs on their website Jul 11 20:26:27 i have not yet set up a feed. but there is a package manager in qtopia Jul 11 20:26:28 Most of them appear to be sources Jul 11 20:26:38 yeah I know, these aren't part of opkg Jul 11 20:26:48 i will set up the feed this next week Jul 11 20:27:07 opkg does not know about qpk's Jul 11 20:27:14 right :p Jul 11 20:27:19 guh Jul 11 20:27:33 if only they had information on their website about how to install the packages they offer :P Jul 11 20:27:45 qtopia's package management has somne security features Jul 11 20:27:51 oy Jul 11 20:28:02 such as not running scripts Jul 11 20:28:08 Does someone know if it's possible to synchronize evolution with a FR (or at least copy one's evolution directory to the fr ?) Jul 11 20:28:08 -_- Jul 11 20:28:15 and having them sandboxed Jul 11 20:28:30 Anyhoo, I have a directory full of tarballs Jul 11 20:28:36 someone put them on this freerunner while I'm gone :) Jul 11 20:29:14 Ainulindale: Evolution's a mail client, isn't it? Jul 11 20:29:32 Dave: just wait a few more days, and a feed will be setup Jul 11 20:30:09 Stroller: it's also the way contacts and all are stored on the freerunner Jul 11 20:30:11 Maybe Jul 11 20:30:27 Ainulindale: umm.... is it? Jul 11 20:30:32 It seems Jul 11 20:30:42 Ainulindale: for contacts it does not work (tested, copied the file and got an error on fr) , but you can access fr's stuff by debus like: http://www.openmoko.org/wiki/Import_Vcf_Contacts Jul 11 20:31:02 Thanks, will do then Jul 11 20:31:26 Ainulindale: Might wanna try conduit. Jul 11 20:32:31 Url ? Jul 11 20:32:45 http://www.conduit-project.org Jul 11 20:32:52 Thanks Jul 11 20:36:01 lpotter: thanks for your explanation to Dave. I've been waiting for hours for than answer. Jul 11 20:36:47 abraxa_: hmmm and on the freerunner side ? Jul 11 20:37:05 lpotter: but let's pretend I really trust Trolltech for a second, and I downloaded the qpk for Qtopie Terminal Jul 11 20:37:22 Ainulindale: I thought EDS would open a port or something. I have no idea myself, unfortunately Jul 11 20:37:23 I then extract it with gunzip and tar, and get to the qterminal application. Jul 11 20:37:29 heh Jul 11 20:37:30 abraxa_: nevermind :-) Jul 11 20:37:46 how do I add an icon for that application in the Qtopia interface on the Freerunner? Jul 11 20:38:12 haven't we been asking this question all day? ;-) Jul 11 20:38:18 I know that it will run, because I've run it from an ssh session... Jul 11 20:39:00 Chocky: you know it. I'm going to be a pain in the ass until someone helps me. I realize it's obnoxious and selfish, but .... please bear with me. Jul 11 20:39:04 heh Jul 11 20:39:05 qtopia package manager can only install from a webserver/feed Jul 11 20:39:07 just checking Jul 11 20:39:23 install web server -> localhost Jul 11 20:39:30 ab0oo: you would have to add it to the db Jul 11 20:39:38 the sqllite db? Jul 11 20:39:53 yes a localhost server works fine. that is how the sdk installs them Jul 11 20:39:57 yes Jul 11 20:40:29 like I said, I will set up a feed this week at qtopia.net for those apps... Jul 11 20:41:13 ab0oo: your not using the openmoko OS? Jul 11 20:41:17 ok. I can be patient. Jul 11 20:41:29 kd8ikt: no. Jul 11 20:41:31 awe Jul 11 20:41:43 * kd8ikt cries inside Jul 11 20:41:58 * Chocky too, at your/you're Jul 11 20:42:22 kd8ikt: do you have a vested interested in the openmoko project? Jul 11 20:43:09 we'll see this coming fri Jul 11 20:43:26 that sufficiently vague... Jul 11 20:44:27 Solar report: Neo1973 on for 1HR, Battery stable, no loss. Jul 11 20:45:07 dammit. want to go home and get FR Jul 11 20:45:18 has anyone used android on an openmoko in here? Jul 11 20:45:27 deja-vu Jul 11 20:45:31 no, it doesn't work Jul 11 20:45:32 Chocky: Would you say that if your wife would be home with a newborn? ;) Jul 11 20:45:45 ozzloy: is that possible? Jul 11 20:45:52 abraxa_: no, it'd be the wife wanting me home Jul 11 20:46:09 Stroller: i don't know Jul 11 20:46:18 Chocky: That's what I thought, hehe Jul 11 20:46:22 ~android Jul 11 20:46:22 i'm also curious about people's impressions of the android project Jul 11 20:46:23 android is, like, an Open Handset Alliance Project by Google or an alleged Open Source phone software stack that's really not open. http://code.google.com/android/ Jul 11 20:46:25 in here Jul 11 20:46:25 Stroller: No, it's not (fortunately( Jul 11 20:46:32 I think if you Googled it, ozzloy, you'd find it isn't Jul 11 20:46:33 ozzloy: We hate it. Jul 11 20:46:44 Thank you, abraxa_ Jul 11 20:46:45 it sucks Jul 11 20:46:47 ah, well then Jul 11 20:47:02 apt, android is also if it's sometime actually freed, someone might port it on the neo, but the provided binaries are incompatible Jul 11 20:47:03 must I add an repositorie to get mc installed? Jul 11 20:47:03 okay, mjr Jul 11 20:47:08 on the neo1973 Jul 11 20:47:22 "Android sucks" should be in the /topic Jul 11 20:47:34 Preferably alongside "go away & don't mention it here" Jul 11 20:48:01 Stroller: I dunno... people would still ask (people who ask annoying questions *never* read topics) and it would make people aware of it, which we don't want :) Jul 11 20:48:07 http://benno.id.au/blog/2007/11/21/android-neo1973 Jul 11 20:48:12 so, if a guy really wanted to get in on the openmoko development, FSO is probably the place to go? Jul 11 20:48:26 ab0oo: Depends on what you want to do. Jul 11 20:48:27 ozzloy: there was an article the other week about mobile phone stacks which concluded that Openmoko is the only free one Jul 11 20:48:48 yeah, I've read mickey's blog entry twice, and it's still clear as mud Jul 11 20:49:01 * Chocky understood it :o but I'm a long time ARM haxx0r Jul 11 20:49:17 basically, it'd need the sources to be available Jul 11 20:49:34 ab0oo: Yes, it seems that way :) (re FSO) Jul 11 20:49:45 It is, so to speak, the future :) Jul 11 20:50:42 ab0oo, if you just want to do some not-very-phone-related application, you can pretty much ignore the stack question. If more phone-related, well, yeah, seems going fso may be the most fruitful approach. Jul 11 20:51:41 I'm not even sure what I want to do, but what I don't want to do is spend time coding to a framework that is going to deprecate in the not-too-distant-future Jul 11 20:51:55 what would people recommend for a stable image? the 2007.2 it comes with? Jul 11 20:52:35 ieatlint: Try ASU, FSO and 2007.2, then pick which works best for you :) Jul 11 20:53:09 one hears fso to be the stablest but with only primitive phone functionality and nothing more :] Jul 11 20:53:24 I've stayed 2007.2 so far Jul 11 20:53:41 ieatlint: number four from the list abraxa_ suggested ;) Jul 11 20:53:53 well, i can't get wifi to work with 2007.2, and i haven't even attempted configuring pppd for gprs Jul 11 20:54:02 In other words, for a phone that works right now as a phone - qtopia :) Jul 11 20:54:13 hehe, alright Jul 11 20:54:23 If you've more patience, yeah, trying out them all is likely the better idea :) Jul 11 20:54:52 I've just gone down the "try them all" route Jul 11 20:55:06 not an issue of patience, but rather i got the phone like 30min ago and i have to leave somewhere soon and don't want to not have basic phone functions Jul 11 20:55:17 later tonight i plan on doing the fun stuff Jul 11 20:55:18 so whiche 1 ab0oo Jul 11 20:55:21 Ah, right, then go with qtopia for now :) Jul 11 20:55:23 the trolltech qtopia is by far the most polished... but it was written for the neo 1973, so has no wifi or gps functionality Jul 11 20:55:40 dangit man Jul 11 20:55:43 that would be the one from qtopia.net? Jul 11 20:55:53 the FSO stack LOOKS beautifuk, but is functionally useless save for the phone. Jul 11 20:55:56 ieatlint: yes Jul 11 20:55:59 ok, thanks Jul 11 20:56:34 the 2007.2 works, mostly. It's a little ugly, but it includes the ability to control the GPS and the wifi module Jul 11 20:56:46 ab0oo: wifi is working on the freerunner. except that wpa_supplicant on the system is broke Jul 11 20:57:02 the image on the phone out of the box is fugly. Jul 11 20:57:10 ab0oo: 4.4 will have a gps exampe app. as well, there is opencitymap that runs on qtopia Jul 11 20:57:43 hardly Jul 11 20:57:45 lpotter: I figured as much, but I couldn't find anywhere to power up/down either the gps or the wifi card in the 4.3.x Jul 11 20:57:52 an "on/off" toggle isn't really control Jul 11 20:58:19 Settings->Internet Jul 11 20:58:27 it is if you can get one installed on your kid... Jul 11 20:58:50 i don't see a settings selection Jul 11 20:59:03 i see like the gears icon, but that just goes to an empty page Jul 11 21:00:27 hmm, my events daemon just went nuts, driving load average to 4+ and making response on the gui molasses slow. Jul 11 21:01:22 sounds like a bunch of hackers have been slacking Jul 11 21:03:46 lpotter: my bad. I didn't realize I could ADD services under the internet tab. Jul 11 21:04:21 the docs sure look alot better Jul 11 21:04:30 linuxxr: which docs? Jul 11 21:04:35 all Jul 11 21:04:45 on the freerunner Jul 11 21:05:13 * ab0oo looks lost, so I just grin and shrug Jul 11 21:05:46 i hopew there are more to be had because my customers are gonna like this device Jul 11 21:07:05 i have to say that i'm not thrilled about the included stylus... the laser is not all too useful, and causes a rattling noise when moved Jul 11 21:07:36 lpotter: is there a way to trigger a wifi scan from that setup page? Jul 11 21:07:40 linuxxr: who are your customers? Jul 11 21:07:51 found it. Jul 11 21:07:52 computer shop stuff Jul 11 21:08:03 those Jul 11 21:09:00 you run an indie computer shop? I didn't know those still existed :) Jul 11 21:09:02 where you at? Jul 11 21:09:17 lol Jul 11 21:09:39 not all are hackers Jul 11 21:12:42 wat is an indie comp shop Jul 11 21:13:27 One that isn't taking it up the rear by Big Buy, Computer City, Electronic World or whatever ;) Jul 11 21:13:49 oo Jul 11 21:14:08 yea its just a snall shop Jul 11 21:14:11 they still exist out here Jul 11 21:14:12 ab0oo: yes. create a new wireless config. highlight it, and select WLAN detection. I dont have a 4.3 with me here to see if its in that version Jul 11 21:14:14 small Jul 11 21:14:54 lpotter: I stumbled on to it. Thank you. All of the networks here at work are WPA, so I'll wait to test it until I get home Jul 11 21:15:51 it did detect the networks, though. Jul 11 21:17:51 XorA|gone: when you'll be there, I have some issues with volume on the freerunner, loud buzzing I can't seem to find the reason of, someone told me to ask you Jul 11 21:18:34 has gcc/g++ been ported to the neo by anyone, or do I need to install a cross-compiling environment on PC? Jul 11 21:19:28 nuclear_eclipse: It's in the repositories, you can just opkg-install it Jul 11 21:19:29 nuclear_eclipse: you can install all of the standard development tools onto the neo (as long as you have enough disk space). Jul 11 21:19:49 hmm, what's the package nome? I tried looking and didn't see it Jul 11 21:20:34 It's pretty weird this echo/buzzing thing Jul 11 21:20:51 And I can't find anything on these settings, darn Jul 11 21:21:01 nuclear_eclipse: http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/packages/armv4t/g++_4.1.2-r13_armv4t.ipk for example Jul 11 21:21:21 ah, so not in the official Openmoko repo Jul 11 21:21:48 It's not actually that slow copiling. Jul 11 21:21:52 If you've got swap. Jul 11 21:21:58 Ainulindale: the audio circuits are picking up interference from the GSM radio transmitter Jul 11 21:21:59 alright then, the qtopia image doesn't seem to work... boots, goes to just a flashing cursor, cursor freezes for 10s, then i get the gui with the home screen Jul 11 21:22:09 then 5 seconds later it goes back to a flashing cursor indefinitely Jul 11 21:22:20 nuclear_eclipse: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily-feed/armv4t/g++_4.1.2-r13_armv4t.ipk if it makes you happier ;) Jul 11 21:22:40 * nuclear_eclipse thinks I need to update my repo list... Jul 11 21:22:54 mmontour: So what are we supposed to do in order to cope up with that ? Jul 11 21:23:54 Because as long as I lower Mono, it seems to go fine but as mentioned in a bug, it lowers my voice volume too Jul 11 21:24:01 ieatlint: there's a wiki entry, or something else (mailing list entry) about that very problem Jul 11 21:25:14 Ainulindale: there's not much you can do apart from tweaking the mixer settings. Maybe use a bluetooth headset. Jul 11 21:25:26 Ainulindale: I'm getting the same complaints from people that call me. Jul 11 21:25:52 mmontour: Errrrr.... So it's an unsolvable hardware problem ? Jul 11 21:25:58 it seems I can alter the feedback/interference with the way I hold the phone in my hand, but IMHO this is a MUCH more serious problem than the software Jul 11 21:26:13 I mean, it's impossible to amplify the input voice ? Jul 11 21:26:14 ab0oo: FR or 1973? Jul 11 21:26:18 FR Jul 11 21:26:39 that's not good. :( Jul 11 21:26:46 Ainulindale: Other GSM phones (e.g. my GF's Motorola Razr) have the same buzz, although not necessarily as loud as the Neo Jul 11 21:27:19 I just ditched my razr for the FR, and it never buzzed (it was 2+ years old) Jul 11 21:27:28 Ainulindale: as far as the WM8753 is concerned, the buzzing is part of the "input voice" (i.e. the voltage coming from the microphone) Jul 11 21:27:47 ditched= lost on the washington DC metro the day after I ordered my FR. Jul 11 21:28:12 In theory a more sensitive microphone (more mV/dB) would help, but that's probably not practical Jul 11 21:28:19 * SpeedEvil wonders where it comes fro. Jul 11 21:28:23 is the buzzing a problem on all the phones? Jul 11 21:28:31 RFI? Jul 11 21:28:38 Or noise on the power rail. Jul 11 21:28:49 mmontour: hmmm what is really a pain is that the echo is pretty loud Jul 11 21:29:01 Not so loud that we can't hear other things but loud enough to be a pain Jul 11 21:29:24 And as it's time shifted, it's difficult to continue to speak Jul 11 21:30:13 ok, yeah, the qtopia image is cool Jul 11 21:30:30 i had to restart the "qpe" service, but once i did, works perfectly Jul 11 21:31:02 hi Jul 11 21:34:06 Ainulindale: I know. The audio-quality concerns are one of the reasons that I haven't ordered a Freerunner yet. FYI the echo issue is filed as http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1267 Jul 11 21:34:54 Good I didn't hear about that sooner... :-/ Jul 11 21:35:22 The buzzing also depends on how far you are from the GSM tower (and probably depends on which band you're using). Jul 11 21:35:54 I think the echo is a bigger issue though Jul 11 21:36:01 I can corraborate that. the more "bars" (better signal strength), the less buzzing Jul 11 21:36:08 Ainulindale: what image are you using Jul 11 21:36:16 I did a test where I put a metal dish over the phone while it was on a call, and then un-covered it. The buzzing got quieter as the GSM chip stepped down the Tx power level (measured on a microwave-oven leakage tester next to the phone) Jul 11 21:36:30 Standard plus opkg upgrade Jul 11 21:36:58 having played with all of the images, the only one I noticed the echo on was the std image. Jul 11 21:37:29 i.e. the first calls I made as soon as I got the phone had echo. After I flashed the phone (5 or 6 times) the echo disappeared Jul 11 21:37:59 Which one are you using now ? Jul 11 21:38:01 that tells me it can be "fixed" with appropriate mixer settings. or at least mitigated. Jul 11 21:38:06 qtopia.net Jul 11 21:38:19 Hmmm too graphical for me :-P Jul 11 21:39:15 echo can be mitigated with mixer settings, but doing so will also affect the loudness of the intended audio signals. There's no control that adjusts only the echo. Jul 11 21:39:27 yeah, I'm a real sucker for eye candy. If I could run compiz on the FR, I would. Jul 11 21:40:04 echo control Jul 11 21:40:06 mmontour: so the only solution seems to be echo deletion algorithm ? Jul 11 21:40:57 not case vibration? Jul 11 21:40:58 Ainulindale: or filling the case with expanding foam to block the audio coupling from the speaker to the mic :) (note - don't do this) Jul 11 21:41:20 thats it but why the delay? Jul 11 21:42:00 mmontour: Would it work with beer ? Jul 11 21:42:08 maybe a round soft rubber mic tubu Jul 11 21:42:10 ooh, beer Jul 11 21:42:13 tube Jul 11 21:45:34 Hi all Jul 11 21:46:10 Can I ask a question about flashing your freerunner? If I run the command. It sais there are more then one usb devices... it sais something with --list Jul 11 21:46:34 Where to do this and how to know which one is the freerunner? Jul 11 21:47:21 Well... What command is telling you to use --list? :) Jul 11 21:48:03 dfu-util is, yes? :) Jul 11 21:48:37 So, do a dfu-util --list, and it should be fairly obvious which is used for flashing :) Jul 11 21:49:02 RXShorty: I found that if you just re-run the command immediately, it sorts it out and works the second time Jul 11 21:49:10 ahh Jul 11 21:49:12 ok Jul 11 21:49:35 And I have to start my moko in U-boot right? and have to select: set console to USB Jul 11 21:49:45 I've also found that if you snort vodka, all it does it hurt your sinuses, so you might not want to try everything I try. Jul 11 21:49:46 RXShorty: don't select anything Jul 11 21:49:53 ok Jul 11 21:49:54 thanks Jul 11 21:49:59 No, you just start it into u-boot, and then tap the AUX button to switch (make sure it doesn't auto-boot) Jul 11 21:50:13 yes, just boot to u-boot mode and start the transfer Jul 11 21:50:26 ok thanks people. Going to try it right now!! Jul 11 21:51:01 *sigh it keeps saying it Jul 11 21:51:38 RXShorty: what does dfu-util --list tell you? (nopaste.org) Jul 11 21:52:10 Well first edistart... the wiki tells me to set a patition, I left this blank? Jul 11 21:52:41 RXShorty: yes, no problem Jul 11 21:52:48 And now it sais: More the one DFU capable USB device found Jul 11 21:53:01 RXShorty: it should list several Jul 11 21:53:16 well it sais try --list Jul 11 21:53:24 RXShorty: So... do as it says :) Jul 11 21:53:25 RXShorty: try it then! ./dfu-util --list Jul 11 21:53:35 it gives 2 options Jul 11 21:53:44 RXShorty: which options? Jul 11 21:53:51 One of which is something like USB device for flashing :) Jul 11 21:53:56 sorry mean resultes Jul 11 21:54:07 RXShorty: which results/ Jul 11 21:54:08 ? Jul 11 21:54:10 come on.. Jul 11 21:54:21 Found Runtime: [0x1d50:0x5119] devnum=0, cfg=0, intf=2, alt=0, name="UNDEFINED" Jul 11 21:54:21 Found Runtime: [0x03f0:0x171d] devnum=0, cfg=0, intf=3, alt=0, name="UNDEFINED" Jul 11 21:54:26 those 2 Jul 11 21:54:49 note there is only 1 device really attached to my system Jul 11 21:55:09 Ooh... that's a bit odd... mine told me one was a device for flashing... Jul 11 21:55:26 hmm Jul 11 21:55:40 RXShorty: how did you get into uboot? power, then aux? Jul 11 21:55:44 RXShorty: 0x1d50:0x5119 is the Freerunner. The other one is probably a bluetooth adapter Jul 11 21:56:58 RXShorty: try flashing again, tell dfu-util to use the first device Jul 11 22:00:02 anyone have trouble with the qtopia image where every seems to work perfectly except i can't hear people when i call them and they can't hear me Jul 11 22:00:20 but sound otherwise works (and if i press numbers on the FR, the other phone can hear the tones, but nothing from the mic) Jul 11 22:00:31 ieatlint: ln -s /usr/share/openmoko/scenarios /etc/alsa Jul 11 22:00:36 then restart qtopia Jul 11 22:01:50 hi all Jul 11 22:02:05 sorry when my openmoko powerdup it took control of my wirless? Jul 11 22:03:03 But going into U-boot is doing the following right? Hold AUX and the press power Jul 11 22:04:05 great, that fixed it, thanks Jul 11 22:06:27 Have a good weekend all...I'm OUT! Jul 11 22:06:46 same! Jul 11 22:08:18 Well flashing doesn't seem to work Jul 11 22:08:22 it sais the following Jul 11 22:09:03 no such alternate setting "-R" Jul 11 22:10:56 nevermind! I think I got it working :) Jul 11 22:12:03 * Dave prods leinir Jul 11 22:12:18 *refresh* Aww, still in San Pablo. Jul 11 22:12:27 Hey, you're supposed to ask my owner for permission first, Dave ;) Jul 11 22:12:56 Can the Freeruner tether? Jul 11 22:13:03 tether? Jul 11 22:13:24 meaning your computer can use it as a modem Jul 11 22:13:41 yes Jul 11 22:13:53 But I don't think anyones configured that. Jul 11 22:13:56 :o Jul 11 22:14:02 Leinir, and just who would that be? Jul 11 22:14:08 <_newbie3> Sargun: the hardware can, the software could if someone writes that. Jul 11 22:14:24 Dave: Makenshi, he is sitting in the sofa behind me :) Jul 11 22:14:37 Oh, okay! Jul 11 22:14:38 Hm, should I buy a Freerunner. Jul 11 22:14:43 I'll make sure to ask him next time... *rolls eyes* Jul 11 22:14:43 I don't even have GSM Jul 11 22:14:49 Sargun, hah! Jul 11 22:14:52 <_newbie3> But i guess it wouldn't be hard to have the freerunner work as NAT router for the gprs connection... Jul 11 22:14:53 :] Jul 11 22:15:38 _newbie3, I'd like direct access to the PPP interface via BT Jul 11 22:15:44 hmm my download (flash gave an error and it doesn't boot anymore... does a reflash fix this? Jul 11 22:15:44 er, (modem) serial Jul 11 22:16:01 ooo nos Jul 11 22:16:15 ? Jul 11 22:16:28 Sargun, you can do it that ol' way too Jul 11 22:16:43 ? Jul 11 22:16:46 mjr, how Jul 11 22:17:07 if you have to ask, it's not ready for you Jul 11 22:17:09 <_newbie3> Sargun: needs software writing. But you can get access to a muxed channel to the modem in software, you just need to write the bluetooth routing etc. Jul 11 22:17:20 yeah. Jul 11 22:17:36 RXShorty_: As long as you didn't try and flash U-Boot, you're perfectly safe :) Yes, a re-flash will most likely fix it :) Jul 11 22:17:45 moo Jul 11 22:18:05 Thanks Leinir! Jul 11 22:18:10 going to retry it Jul 11 22:18:32 In general - never flash U-Boot, and you can't brick the device :) Jul 11 22:18:38 heh Jul 11 22:18:45 In general, you can't brick a freerunner. Jul 11 22:18:52 Unless you really, really try. Jul 11 22:18:59 SpeedEvil: Well, not everybody's got easy access to a debug board :) Jul 11 22:19:02 (flash u-boot 10000 times) Jul 11 22:19:08 hehe thanks speedevil Jul 11 22:19:09 * Chocky laffs Jul 11 22:19:22 So, stay away from u-boot and you're safe, even without a debug board :) Jul 11 22:19:24 You don't need a debug board - you can't alter the rescue ROM without the debug board. Jul 11 22:19:35 Its sold out. Jul 11 22:19:40 Yup. Jul 11 22:19:55 SpeedEvil: unless you have one of these - http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1568 (not sure if that was a production model or an earlier prototype) Jul 11 22:20:01 home yet Chocky ? Jul 11 22:20:03 but what can cause an error in a flash update? It error's at download Jul 11 22:20:05 not yet Jul 11 22:20:10 only 3.20pm Jul 11 22:20:15 counting the minutes still? Jul 11 22:20:17 * Chocky goes home at 5 Jul 11 22:20:22 SpeedEvil: Aah... righty then :) So, you can't actually brick it without a debug board, and even then it's a bit of a task to do :) Jul 11 22:20:33 not yet, just amusing myself here ;-) Jul 11 22:20:35 RXShorty_: I had such errors with a low battery Jul 11 22:20:40 AHHHHHHH Jul 11 22:20:46 that could cause it then Jul 11 22:20:51 isnt the begub board for doing bootloader etc stuff Jul 11 22:20:56 the battery is kind of totally empty and running on usb powerd Jul 11 22:21:01 leinir: I mean - if you write the NAND 10000 times, you can get it into a state where you corrupt block 0 of the NAND. It'd then only be bootable by holding down aux? Jul 11 22:21:03 thanks abraxa Jul 11 22:21:24 I have a ATT data plan for work stuff with a PCMCIA card. can remove the sim for weekend use. trying to see if it has any voice included Jul 11 22:22:05 well have to wait with flashing at the moment then :P Jul 11 22:22:28 then a question for you all. Is the latest daily build any good? Jul 11 22:23:20 * Chocky laffs. "Canadian Data" costs Jul 11 22:24:49 AT&T's website is stupidly confusing Jul 11 22:25:06 wtf is tethering Jul 11 22:26:57 Chocky: using your phone as external modem and connecting to the interwebz Jul 11 22:27:04 I see Jul 11 22:27:14 and they need to charge you extra for that. fnar. Jul 11 22:27:21 :P Jul 11 22:27:24 geez, they really got you wrapped up. Jul 11 22:30:15 http://www.denverpost.com/business/ci_9853884 Jul 11 22:33:53 moo Jul 11 22:34:49 Chocky: Always fun to see "normal" newspapers pick upp on Openmoko :) Jul 11 22:34:54 yeh Jul 11 22:35:13 won't matter though, will be overwhelmed with the iphone Tsunami Jul 11 22:35:28 For sure... Jul 11 22:35:30 Chocky: nice Jul 11 22:35:53 half my co-workers were sitting around all day with bricked iphones trying to get them to activate Jul 11 22:36:02 after upgradeing :] Jul 11 22:36:08 * Chocky laffs Jul 11 22:36:55 LOL Jul 11 22:37:06 How do I force my phone to reboot? Jul 11 22:37:10 it's frozen Jul 11 22:37:31 emacsen: If holding the power button for 10s doesn't help Jul 11 22:37:32 remove the battery, or try pressing the power but > 9 sec Jul 11 22:37:39 :) Jul 11 22:37:39 Taka outa battery! Jul 11 22:37:45 CM, I did hold power down for 20 Jul 11 22:37:51 okay bat it is... I wanted to let it charge tho Jul 11 22:38:21 So, I don't expect official help here, but what sort of status have you guys got when you purchased the FR? I had my order crash half way through, the CC was charged, but I've received no email or follow-up information. Jul 11 22:38:48 Okay, I seriously need to flash this Jul 11 22:38:54 argh, don't help mreynold Jul 11 22:38:55 because the default software is pretty awful Jul 11 22:38:56 what an idiot Jul 11 22:39:17 wurp2|away: Just because I turned your advances down, doesn't mean I'm an idiot Jul 11 22:39:24 wurp2|away: In most people's books, that makes me smart Jul 11 22:39:32 :-) Jul 11 22:39:38 Yo dude Jul 11 22:39:49 I emailed sales@openmoko. I'll see if they get back to me Jul 11 22:40:20 mreynold: I've emailed shop@openmoko and got a response the same day last time Jul 11 22:40:21 to cancel my order Jul 11 22:40:28 What's the right response when the CC company freezes the card, but the payment to OM went through Jul 11 22:40:43 kelvie_work: You decided not to get one? Jul 11 22:40:52 kelvie_work: I'll email shop as well Jul 11 22:41:36 wurp2|away: no, I'm very very eagerly waiting my shipping notification :p I wanted to change shipping methods Jul 11 22:41:37 kelvie_work: went for the faster delivery? Jul 11 22:41:42 doc|work: yep Jul 11 22:41:46 kelvie_work: you might have had it by now :) Jul 11 22:41:48 cause I live in Canuckistan Jul 11 22:42:02 ground takes.. 1-2 weeks to ship with UPS -> Canada Jul 11 22:42:05 ah, ok Jul 11 22:42:14 kelvie_work: ah Jul 11 22:42:15 even from Seattle Jul 11 22:42:18 it's pretty dumb Jul 11 22:42:19 * doc|work sniffles Jul 11 22:42:24 kelvie_work: Even after hearing people bitch about theirs? Jul 11 22:42:25 wants freerunner :( Jul 11 22:42:33 wurp2|away: it runs emacs Jul 11 22:42:35 'nuff said Jul 11 22:42:37 hahahaha Jul 11 22:42:54 Well, sheesh, if it runs emacs, it'll run Java great Jul 11 22:43:04 bwaha Jul 11 22:45:04 aww Jul 11 22:45:07 poor doc Jul 11 22:45:37 * doc|work sniffles Jul 11 22:45:57 still last on the "where is my f*&^ng freerunner?" Jul 11 22:45:59 * Dave comforts doc and offers him a juicy hamburger Jul 11 22:46:02 yey! Jul 11 22:46:03 haha Jul 11 22:46:17 :] Jul 11 22:46:28 kelvie_work: Koolu has stock and will start shipping next week. Jul 11 22:46:42 Dave: but if you take off your pants I'm outta here Jul 11 22:46:45 bricode_: I've already ordered :p Jul 11 22:46:50 I'm order #1724 Jul 11 22:46:52 What? Jul 11 22:46:54 so mine _shoudl_ have shipped Jul 11 22:46:55 kelvie_work: Gotcha. Jul 11 22:47:01 but I haven't gotten the notification :( Jul 11 22:47:10 Hey, are there any more 850's left in the openmoko shop? Jul 11 22:47:11 kelvie_work: the second one? Jul 11 22:47:13 s/dl/ld/ Jul 11 22:47:15 gah, so does this GPS issue affect all currently shipping devices? Jul 11 22:47:17 MrSkittle: nope Jul 11 22:47:19 doc|work: yeah Jul 11 22:47:27 MrSkittle: resellers are the best option for now, if they have any Jul 11 22:47:30 Really? They sold out? Jul 11 22:47:40 my CC has been charged already Jul 11 22:47:40 are they making more? Jul 11 22:47:42 and yeah they're out Jul 11 22:47:42 wurp2|away: apparently Jul 11 22:47:49 so if I don't get mine I'd be pretty hosed Jul 11 22:47:50 MrSkittle: yes, more in transit Jul 11 22:47:54 daMaestro, no Jul 11 22:48:00 daMaestro: looks like a few percent? Jul 11 22:48:02 doc|work: I'm out of the loop, I guess Jul 11 22:48:07 wurp2|away: :) Jul 11 22:48:10 doc|work: When will they be selling them? Jul 11 22:48:17 MrSkittle: 25th July Jul 11 22:48:23 have to try out my thingy's GPS soonish... Jul 11 22:48:23 according to the site Jul 11 22:48:29 gah, well i'll be exercising my 15 day warranty if i get one Jul 11 22:48:32 ok, thanks Jul 11 22:48:36 umm... quick question Jul 11 22:48:40 I took battery out of phone Jul 11 22:48:43 and plugged it back in Jul 11 22:48:53 now it's stuck again Jul 11 22:49:05 suck in spin_lock_irqsave and Jul 11 22:49:16 spin_unlock_irqrestore Jul 11 22:49:38 unknown_lamer: while we talked, my phone froze Jul 11 22:49:42 and taking bat out didn't help :) Jul 11 22:51:18 rebooting again Jul 11 22:51:23 reboot you son of a bitch Jul 11 22:51:30 * doc|work reboots Jul 11 22:51:33 hey! Jul 11 22:51:35 :( Jul 11 22:52:53 Man, sometimes linux is annoying. Sound capture is one of those times. I can't get anything to sample from a USB audio device. Or even the builtin mic on my laptop Jul 11 22:54:30 mreynold: No one has kicked you yet? Jul 11 22:54:37 theres nothing crazy going on, like an atnt gophone ban on openmokos, is there? Jul 11 22:54:52 juri_: AT&T GoPhone works fine on my neo1973 Jul 11 22:54:57 After I got the gsm firmware update Jul 11 22:55:01 mreynold: Nope, the longer I whine, the longer I stay, apparently Jul 11 22:55:03 i've NEVER had problems with associating, after more than 3 or 4 reboots. i've been trying all day, and my device just refuses to associate. Jul 11 22:55:05 The T-Mobile guy I talked to was cool with the openmoko Jul 11 22:55:15 mreynold: I am too linux retarded to get very far with sound capture Jul 11 22:55:18 wurp2: gsm firmware update? Jul 11 22:55:19 rivalarrival: do the dance Jul 11 22:55:19 Google is my friend Jul 11 22:56:21 juri_: Yeah, but that shouldn't be needed on a FreeRunner Jul 11 22:56:41 juri_: The gsm firmware version 5 or less won't support some SIMs Jul 11 22:57:07 juri_: It's somewhere in version 6-8 where it gets fixed, but all FRs should be higher than that Jul 11 22:57:08 wurp2|away: And I talk to myself. And yeah, you are. Jul 11 22:57:43 mreynold: Yeah, I was going to let that one slide. Jul 11 23:05:22 wait what timezone you in Chocky ? Jul 11 23:07:30 wurp2: i'm on a neo1973. Jul 11 23:07:44 but, mine has been working, when i kick it often enough. Jul 11 23:07:46 today, nada. Jul 11 23:07:53 no SIM change, no nothing. Jul 11 23:10:11 did everyone get their iphone 3g? :-) Jul 11 23:11:02 nnnnno Jul 11 23:11:18 dougt: yes. It comes with ASU. Jul 11 23:11:22 :) Jul 11 23:11:54 right! Jul 11 23:12:40 is anyone working on an sdk for ASU? Jul 11 23:15:41 * bricode flashes a FR. Jul 11 23:16:04 So it will soon be brickcode :-) Jul 11 23:16:27 I've already bricked and unbricked a few phones. Jul 11 23:17:20 bricode, if you unbricked them you did not really brick them *lol* Jul 11 23:17:59 hari: A debug board came in handy with some of the early revs. Jul 11 23:18:42 jtag? Jul 11 23:20:31 hari: Yeah. Handy to stop the processor when you're putting in fresh u-boot stuff. Jul 11 23:22:16 Anyone flashed the qtopia image from yesterday? Jul 11 23:22:34 The aux button likes to flash. Does it do anything else? Jul 11 23:23:43 moo Jul 11 23:24:45 bricode: I've got yesterday's qtopia Jul 11 23:25:28 ab0oo: Does it boot for you? Jul 11 23:25:38 indeed, it does Jul 11 23:25:50 ab0oo: blinky light on boot? Jul 11 23:25:59 never looked. Jul 11 23:26:02 sorry. Jul 11 23:26:23 ab0oo: No worries. Kernel? Jul 11 23:26:26 dang i gotta wait an entire week till i get my phone Jul 11 23:26:30 moo Jul 11 23:26:37 gotta wait 90 mins Jul 11 23:26:53 upload some youtube vids for me ;) Jul 11 23:27:05 using the camera on the phone? oh.. wait. Jul 11 23:27:05 no worries I've found. It's not as intuitive as I thought it would be, but lorn has been working with/for us Jul 11 23:27:22 which image is recommended for the neo? Jul 11 23:27:30 ab0oo: Cool. Thanks. Jul 11 23:28:45 np. I'm off to go play with it some more. lorn is planning on setting up a feed server so we can get updates and more software (terminal, mixer) from trolltech Jul 11 23:28:46 http://tinyurl.com/6j328s Jul 11 23:28:49 ^ off-topic Jul 11 23:29:03 oh dear Jul 11 23:29:04 how sad Jul 11 23:29:23 oh my. Jul 11 23:29:26 that's just mean. Jul 11 23:29:29 hehe Jul 11 23:29:40 I prefer to use an OS that's in development, however Jul 11 23:29:43 wget http://abraxa.dyndns.org:81/random/openmoko-mediaplayer-theme.tar.bz2 Jul 11 23:29:47 is it a rickroll? Jul 11 23:29:48 by the way, there's probably a law somewhere that says you are all now haxors! Jul 11 23:29:49 Woops ! Jul 11 23:29:53 kd8ikt: nope Jul 11 23:30:06 doc|home: I was already, don't worry Jul 11 23:30:12 heh Jul 11 23:30:12 no, but I do need to be more careful about clicking on random links in irc channels Jul 11 23:30:23 bbiab Jul 11 23:30:24 ab0oo: not in this case Jul 11 23:30:47 heh thats leet Jul 11 23:31:31 XSS Jul 11 23:31:41 http://tinyurl.com/6xdj84 Jul 11 23:32:48 ugh oh just tested that on my lil servers wiki and it works Jul 11 23:32:50 ok goys Jul 11 23:32:52 guys Jul 11 23:32:54 question Jul 11 23:33:03 Everytime my moko gives an error with flashing Jul 11 23:33:19 I'd still like the wifi to be a aircrack-ng supported one .. Jul 11 23:33:31 It gives the error: dfu_download error -110 Jul 11 23:33:41 no matter what image I use.\ Jul 11 23:33:58 RXShorty_: Using NOR or NAND u-boot? Jul 11 23:34:12 NOR Jul 11 23:34:20 Holding AUX and then press Power Jul 11 23:34:55 that's correct right? Jul 11 23:34:56 RXShorty_: Ah. Hm. Tried NAND yet, even if it shouldn't make a difference? Jul 11 23:35:09 Check out http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Dfu-util under Troubleshooting issues. Jul 11 23:35:22 Make sure you're writing to -a rootfs Jul 11 23:35:24 no not yet... going to try right now. I will check it bricode thanks Jul 11 23:36:03 RXShorty_: otherwise you'll have to reset your partition map, and that's a little more involved. Jul 11 23:36:13 ahh bricode Jul 11 23:36:17 I know what the problem is. Jul 11 23:36:22 I am writing to kernel Jul 11 23:36:35 RXShorty_: it'll get you every time ;) Jul 11 23:36:41 but how can I write it to my Micro SD-card? Jul 11 23:36:55 I mean, how do I know which partition it is? Jul 11 23:37:06 Yeah :) Jul 11 23:38:03 RXShorty_: do you have an SD adaptor? Jul 11 23:38:14 yups! :) Jul 11 23:38:29 ahhh have to mount it and put the SDA number in it? Jul 11 23:38:33 RXShorty_: If you drop the kernel image and filesystem image on it, it should work. Jul 11 23:38:41 RXShorty_: Hold on, I'm looking for directions. Jul 11 23:38:59 Ok Thanks very much! I will update the wiki if we found a solution Jul 11 23:40:45 copied the files to the micro card Jul 11 23:41:04 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Boot_from_sd_card Jul 11 23:41:26 Is suspend supposed to work on 2007.2 ? Jul 11 23:41:57 i am going to check it out bricode Jul 11 23:42:01 :) Jul 11 23:47:10 mickey|sofa: when you'll d available, could you tell me if ogsmd would be installable on 2007.2 ? Jul 11 23:50:08 Guys... I am going to try it tomorrow thanks! I will update you. Thanks Abraxa and Bricode Jul 11 23:50:15 Night! Jul 11 23:50:21 Good night Jul 11 23:54:32 Ainulindale: Sure thing. It will compete with the gsmd and suck in some dependencies (python et. al), but it should install fine. Jul 11 23:55:50 off home, to my FR Jul 11 23:56:12 mickey|sofa: I was intending to kill gsmd and use my wrapper in order to test it Jul 11 23:56:26 Because I don't feel comfortable with flashing my neo with FSO right now Jul 11 23:56:32 I kinda need my contacts :-) Jul 11 23:56:51 mickey|sofa: Well, how should I install it then ? Jul 11 23:56:51 right. that should work once you kill gsmd and install all the dependencies for frameworkd Jul 11 23:57:02 preferably from a feed Jul 11 23:57:07 so that all dependencies get installed Jul 11 23:57:12 so build yourself a feed Jul 11 23:57:16 and add it to your ipkg conf Jul 11 23:57:22 and then 'opkg install frameworkd' Jul 11 23:57:52 (alternatively scp all packages manually, but there maybe 15 or so) Jul 11 23:59:02 build myself a feed, hmm, yeah, hmmm Jul 11 23:59:09 Could you make yourself clearer ? :-) Jul 11 23:59:17 e.g. Jul 11 23:59:19 bitbake frameworkd Jul 11 23:59:21 bitbake ipkg-make-index Jul 11 23:59:26 then you have a feed Jul 11 23:59:37 in tmp/deploy/glibc/ipkg/ Jul 11 23:59:47 once you make this available to your neo Jul 11 23:59:49 you can install packages Jul 12 00:00:05 Ah sounds better :-) Jul 12 00:01:11 heh Jul 12 00:01:23 Hmmm weird state now Jul 12 00:01:30 I can call my answering machine Jul 12 00:01:37 But I can't call my girlfriend Jul 12 00:01:47 she blocked you Jul 12 00:01:52 And if I try to call me with her phone, it just terminate the call Jul 12 00:01:55 Qwell, beat me to it :] Jul 12 00:02:15 Oh, got it. Forgot that. Jul 12 00:02:33 She has a children service. Jul 12 00:02:36 (Because it's cheaper) Jul 12 00:02:39 Having some domestic issues, are we? :p Jul 12 00:02:40 She can't call at certain hours Jul 12 00:02:47 damn, I was close Jul 12 00:02:48 (or be called) Jul 12 00:03:00 OWell, QWell. Jul 12 00:03:22 or that's the base station borking who knows Jul 12 00:06:45 Ainulindale: Try dating someone over the age of 13 you prevert. Jul 12 00:08:13 rivalarrival: Nope, I prefer my wives as my wines, 10 to 14 years deep below the ground Jul 12 00:08:18 Fresher that way Jul 12 00:08:19 :) Jul 12 00:08:22 * mickey|sofa sleepy Jul 12 00:08:23 g'night Jul 12 00:08:26 Night mickey|sofa Jul 12 00:08:31 Like that austrian guy and his daughter? Jul 12 00:13:35 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07specs * rffe636743199 10/otapi/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Jul 12 00:13:35 freesmartphone.org: otapi: Jul 12 00:13:35 freesmartphone.org: * remove org.freesmartphone.GSM.Phonebook, the relevant methodds are in .SIM and high-level access will be covered by the ophoned Jul 12 00:13:35 freesmartphone.org: API. Jul 12 00:13:35 freesmartphone.org: * add first sketch for a cell broadcasting API: org.freesmartphone.GSM.CB.xml.in Jul 12 00:15:10 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * r2400050d35fc 10/ (9 files in 5 dirs): Jul 12 00:15:10 freesmartphone.org: ogsmd: Jul 12 00:15:10 freesmartphone.org: * rename Test API to Debug API and enhance it (List virtual channels + Inject arbitrary strings into a virtual channel) Jul 12 00:15:10 freesmartphone.org: * implement org.freesmartphone.GSM.CB.{Get|Set}CellBroadcastSubscriptions Jul 12 00:17:03 mickey|zzZZzz: hmmm, won't work it seems Jul 12 00:17:10 (bitbake ipkg-make-index) Jul 12 00:17:23 (and can't find the .ipk) Jul 12 00:18:11 bitbake package-index Jul 12 00:18:19 -> bed Jul 12 00:18:55 good night to you :-) Jul 12 00:21:10 *refresh* Aww, still in San Pablo. Jul 12 00:21:42 Scheduled Delivery: 17-July-2008 Jul 12 00:21:46 yay Jul 12 00:22:08 6 days Jul 12 00:22:44 what was your #? Jul 12 00:23:11 4hours on and 50% remaining YAY Jul 12 00:24:24 w00t, UPS notification!!! Jul 12 00:24:34 * chillywilly does a happy dance Jul 12 00:24:56 2039 Jul 12 00:25:04 * chillywilly is no. 3000 Jul 12 00:26:08 rock on Jul 12 00:27:53 1724 -- still nothing :( Jul 12 00:28:00 I think they just didn't send me an email Jul 12 00:28:17 nex week Tuesday! Jul 12 00:28:20 next* Jul 12 00:29:38 Scheduled Delivery: 15-July-2008 Jul 12 00:29:54 :-D Jul 12 00:36:35 kelvie_work: Did you check your spam filters? Jul 12 00:43:21 Does anybody know if the list of known working/not working SIMs at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Carriers/ATT is applicable to the freerunner, or neo1973 only? Jul 12 00:43:58 I've a known bad sim, and wondering if I should get a known-good one from ebay before my freerunner shows up Jul 12 00:46:17 /msg NickServ identify Jul 12 00:58:53 sweet UPS notification! added to http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Where_is_my_Freerunner%3F Jul 12 00:59:57 Solar pannel added 2hrs and woke up my deep discharged neo after 20 minutes Jul 12 01:02:02 no way! Jul 12 01:02:09 thats pimp dude Jul 12 01:02:14 deff but given the intoxicated state of the author during the its writing I think we can forgive him his passing fascination with certain minutiae. Jul 12 01:02:25 whoops accidental paste again Jul 12 01:03:37 so is that the walkway light solar cell? Jul 12 01:16:33 KrisAbsinthe_: Jul 12 01:17:51 steped away, yes it is Jul 12 01:18:37 hey check this http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Hardware:Neo1973:Alternate_Cases:Solar_power#Interest Jul 12 01:18:47 i dropped my name in the list Jul 12 01:19:28 you should make a lil homebrewd hack section detailing findings Jul 12 01:20:04 that was my first wiki edit for openmoko ew make me feel warm inside Jul 12 01:21:43 lol, maybe I will. It added 2 hours. I will make the proper circuts and use a diode to prevent backflow(Solar pannels can drain if there is no sun). Thinking about using electroconductive paint on the back of the back lid Jul 12 01:21:57 hey KrisAbsinthe_ you live up in dayton right? Jul 12 01:22:01 yeah Jul 12 01:22:13 my dad just invited me to the dayton airshow nextweek Jul 12 01:22:38 they are not bad, Ill be in NYC 17th-21st Jul 12 01:22:47 awe Jul 12 01:23:23 yeah ya def need a diode Jul 12 01:24:35 i wish those guys developing solar tape would release to the public already Jul 12 01:25:02 no shit, I could use it right now lol Jul 12 01:25:45 thin+flexible Jul 12 01:32:35 how is the shipping going? It's looking like i'll need to re-place my order... Jul 12 01:34:03 too late Jul 12 01:34:08 i think they are sold out Jul 12 01:34:40 anyone get a tracking number with their order? Jul 12 01:39:18 wah!?! Jul 12 01:39:56 Yeah, they only had 13 left at this time yesterday Jul 12 01:40:21 omg no.... Jul 12 01:40:27 * niklauz cries Jul 12 01:40:40 Tsing1: The tracking number will be coming - they've been shipping about 1000 per day. Jul 12 01:40:46 i ordered it last sunday but my fsckin credit card company blocked it Jul 12 01:40:57 niklauz: THAT sucks. Jul 12 01:41:25 kd8ikt: unless there store is broken you are right Jul 12 01:41:41 it doesn't have the neo as a purchase option Jul 12 01:41:58 i've waited for years Jul 12 01:42:33 Might try the distributors... Jul 12 01:42:38 niklauz: did you get an order number the first time? Jul 12 01:42:44 this is just going to cause me to sink ever deeper into my WoW addiction where i will hibernate until more are available again Jul 12 01:43:35 The 900 mhz phones are coming on the 25th. Jul 12 01:43:50 mmontour: no, this is really a cursed thing Jul 12 01:43:56 rivalarrival: ahh, thanks! Jul 12 01:44:37 when i called me cc company they said the original order would go through, that was tues/wedns then i sent OM an email on thursday Jul 12 01:44:42 Tsing1: I ordered on the 4th, just got my tracking number yesterday. But it seems like they've sped up the process. Jul 12 01:45:03 i saw that about the 900MHz, anyone know about the 850's? Jul 12 01:45:24 When they'll be getting more? Jul 12 01:45:44 Probably another month, at the earliest. Jul 12 01:47:06 It might be a blessing in disguise - there have been a couple hardware issues in this batch. GPS antenna connector got bent, killed the unit. Jul 12 01:47:06 this is one of the local distributors, http://www.koolu.com/ anyone know what this W.E. Phone is? Jul 12 01:47:29 "W.E. Phone" is a Freerunner Jul 12 01:47:51 In the future I think they're planning to re-brand them or ship custom software, but for now they're just re-selling the OM devices Jul 12 01:48:25 if it's exactly the same, why rebrand in that way... Jul 12 01:51:28 aw.. mine's shipping on monday Jul 12 01:52:58 how do i upgrade dropbear without it kicking me? Jul 12 01:53:00 niklauz: Looks like an up-and-coming service provider... GSM, VoIP, television... lotsa stuff Jul 12 01:53:20 i might just resell mine ;) Jul 12 01:53:31 YEAY! Jul 12 01:53:39 My PHONE SHIPPED! Jul 12 01:53:42 * tessier dances the dance of joy Jul 12 01:55:40 rivalarrival: hmm.. ok, i'll see if i can reach them on the phone Jul 12 01:55:46 mmontour, yesterday one of the WE guys was chatting with rwhitby .. said they are doing Andriod for the FR, couldn't say much, but seemed they were quite far along ... see logs for more Jul 12 01:55:49 hi everybody Jul 12 01:55:58 my name is martin, and... Jul 12 01:56:02 I've got a tracking number!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Jul 12 01:56:28 cannot believe it yet Jul 12 01:56:34 Hi, Martin Jul 12 01:56:43 they "are working with Google in some capacity" if I remember correctly Jul 12 01:56:44 When did you order? Jul 12 01:56:52 july 5th Jul 12 01:57:02 order no #2442 Jul 12 01:57:14 me too! :D Jul 12 01:57:24 order 3032 Jul 12 01:57:28 wah.. why's mine so late Jul 12 01:57:28 gonna update the wiki right now...:p Jul 12 01:57:35 I'm 1724.. but they said mine's shipping Monday Jul 12 01:57:38 kelvie: they just don't like you Jul 12 01:57:41 clearly Jul 12 01:57:46 lol maddog works for this company :) Jul 12 01:58:09 kelvie: You didn't threaten them with bodily harm. You have to do that if you want them to take you seriously. Jul 12 01:58:23 anyway, it says that they estimate july 17th to deliver Jul 12 01:58:30 rivalarrival: damn Jul 12 01:58:32 is it too late now? Jul 12 01:58:36 dvarnes: i'll search, do u knowwhere the logs are hosted? Jul 12 01:58:40 next thursday Jul 12 01:59:02 kelvie: Yeah, unfortunately. If you do it now, they'll know you're just trying to screw with them. Jul 12 01:59:12 damn Jul 12 01:59:19 You could try taking one of them hostage. Jul 12 01:59:24 will do Jul 12 01:59:28 plane tickets to Taiwan right? Jul 12 01:59:32 I think I can make it back by Monday Jul 12 01:59:42 Nah, Sunnyvale CA. Jul 12 01:59:45 the more you press refesh on tracking.UPS.com the faster it moves Jul 12 01:59:48 maybe you could threaten them Jul 12 02:00:04 sic /b/ on them. Jul 12 02:00:15 rivalarrival: I have it! woot! Jul 12 02:01:12 They day's take seems to get to UPS around 5:30 PM everyday. Jul 12 02:01:16 pacific time Jul 12 02:01:47 it looks like they are bundling google apps & maybe android(?) w/ these phones, possibly targeted at enterprise, but i remember in an interview maddog mentioned he was working to make mobile computing more accesible like perhaps in a cell phone form Jul 12 02:01:58 niklauz, sorry ... google is your friend :-) Jul 12 02:02:07 should I log in to MyUPS to see a detailed tracking? Jul 12 02:02:54 I don't think they have any additional information for the receiver, only for the sender. Jul 12 02:03:00 does the Freerunner work with AT&T? Jul 12 02:03:08 zacharym: Yes. Jul 12 02:03:13 excellent :D Jul 12 02:03:43 zacharym: Thre was something aboute a few AT&T sim cards not working, but I think it's been resolved. Jul 12 02:04:29 dantalizing: one trick is to run two dropbear instances, one on port 22 and the other on port 2222. Or run a telnetd to upgrade dropbear. Jul 12 02:04:30 rivalarrival: so...noone did it, right? Jul 12 02:06:40 how to swithching keyboard? Jul 12 02:07:16 I can't use http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Switching_Keyboards to change gta02's keyboards Jul 12 02:08:48 did you by chance read the "his doesn't work on official OM 2007.2 repositories. However, if you use a ScaredyCat..." part of that page Jul 12 02:09:43 this* Jul 12 02:14:42 a true sign of fail: http://lh6.ggpht.com/guillermo.castro/SHgPHhnvu5I/AAAAAAAABLY/bf9qdyvvIaA/DSC00426.JPG?imgmax=640 Jul 12 02:16:01 i remember when mac got butt hurt and faught linksys for rights to the name "iphone" Jul 12 02:16:58 when linksys clearly owned it first, well maybe not clearly but they did Jul 12 02:21:52 heh Jul 12 02:23:11 how do you protect the screen? did you use something to prevent it from scratches? Jul 12 02:24:14 2192 shipping today, arrives on 7/16, :) Jul 12 02:24:31 http://cgi.ebay.com/2-Screen-Protector-OPenmoko-Neo1973_W0QQitemZ110237137197QQcmdZViewItem Jul 12 02:24:42 is the only thing openmoko listed in ebay Jul 12 02:25:02 any of you bought it? Jul 12 02:28:17 don't screen protectors make it hard to draw with the stylus? Jul 12 02:28:22 at least the invisibleshield/bestskinsever ones Jul 12 02:31:31 cmon man dont be like my dad, his laptop still has that protective plastic covering it Jul 12 02:31:44 life is about scratches and dents Jul 12 02:31:49 its meant to be used Jul 12 02:32:14 pluss it'll give you reason to buy a new one when it gets overly worn Jul 12 02:32:20 yeah, a condom is a one-time use thing Jul 12 02:32:24 kelvie: no, they're fine, not noticeable on my n800, in fact, it's easier to use because I'm less afraid about scratching that Jul 12 02:32:26 hehe, ok Jul 12 02:32:29 ieatlint_: only if you're wealthy! Jul 12 02:32:34 damn rich kids Jul 12 02:32:37 what is this condom of wich you speak? Jul 12 02:32:40 i'm a geek, whats a condom Jul 12 02:32:48 d'oh! beat me too it Jul 12 02:32:50 too rich to walk your ass down to planned parenthood? Jul 12 02:32:55 foiled again! Jul 12 02:32:57 heh Jul 12 02:33:06 it's like a balloon Jul 12 02:33:07 only sailors use condoms Jul 12 02:33:12 lol Jul 12 02:33:28 they hand them out at a lot of parades and festivals in san francisco Jul 12 02:33:35 heheh Jul 12 02:33:41 hey checkout my userpage its got a few good points http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/User:Kd8ikt Jul 12 02:34:07 dont feel like tracking down where all the respective projects should go so it wrote in my userpage Jul 12 02:34:29 half the stuff i read in the softwawre wishlist Jul 12 02:35:55 my phone just departed from philly :D Jul 12 02:36:15 kelvie: email them, they might have sent it and the mail got spat out by your spam filters or something Jul 12 02:36:20 Arg0naut: philly? o.O Jul 12 02:36:42 Arg0naut: grats :) Jul 12 02:37:24 kd8ikt: u mentioned motion-gesture binding, i have a couple ideas for applications Jul 12 02:38:00 there's nothing funnier than seeing fully grown men (in their 40s+) excited about a piece of hardware :D Jul 12 02:39:00 hey i'm 25 so byte me Jul 12 02:39:26 26 Jul 12 02:39:31 hey i just turned 40, so thanks, and hell yeah i'm excited!!!! Jul 12 02:39:33 and also excited: o Jul 12 02:39:39 heh Jul 12 02:39:46 fuzzyt: laughing with you man, not at you :) Jul 12 02:39:51 1) authentication - hold 2 OM together and shake vigorously, have them generate an auth key based on accell data to validate ident and prevent MitM attacks Jul 12 02:39:56 doc|home: 27 here Jul 12 02:40:02 niklauz: nice Jul 12 02:40:11 its all good, just shipped today Jul 12 02:40:14 this could be used for transfering sensitive data in snoopable zones Jul 12 02:40:15 same :D Jul 12 02:40:17 19, here Jul 12 02:40:21 * doc|home giggling a little Jul 12 02:40:23 :/ Jul 12 02:40:23 i'm 28 :-P Jul 12 02:40:53 how old r u doc|home? Jul 12 02:40:55 is it me or is there no openmoko forum Jul 12 02:41:02 o o 26 Jul 12 02:41:09 yeah :) Jul 12 02:41:15 doc|home: I did email them Jul 12 02:41:18 they said monday :p Jul 12 02:41:23 Cool. "By the end of today every order will have gone out!" -- steve on the community ML Jul 12 02:41:26 kd8ikt: i've mentioned that to sean once Jul 12 02:41:28 kelvie: good :) Jul 12 02:41:45 doc|home: when's your expected arrival time? :) Jul 12 02:41:52 kelvie: the 15th :( Jul 12 02:41:59 ah Jul 12 02:42:07 so my guess would be mine's the 16 Jul 12 02:42:09 right, time for me to go play enemy territory Jul 12 02:42:41 quick question - what exactly is the dboard used for - what sort of program development requires it? Jul 12 02:43:28 mmontour: eh? every order? Jul 12 02:43:40 petriborg: only low-level bootloader hacking or possibly advanced kernel development. Most people don't need it. Jul 12 02:43:49 shop@openmoko said mine's shipping Monday :( Jul 12 02:43:56 ah thank you very much mmontour :-) Jul 12 02:44:24 That's what his email said (in the "Los Angeles group order is on its way!" thread) Jul 12 02:44:36 mm tasty microshake Jul 12 02:45:58 like those ones at ballparks when they give you a fricken wooden stick to eat with Jul 12 02:47:48 how accurate is the estimated delivery date? Jul 12 02:47:55 what happened to Chocky hadnt heard from him since he left work an hour ago to run home to his newly delivered moko Jul 12 02:48:03 I mean, it says I have to wait a week Jul 12 02:48:40 could it be here before that date? it happened before? Jul 12 02:49:16 what shipping did you get? Jul 12 02:50:49 ground, i guess Jul 12 02:50:56 the cheaper one Jul 12 02:51:27 same here get mine next fri Jul 12 02:51:41 mmaestri:i would say expect a week Jul 12 02:52:34 in the meantime http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Accelerometer_data_retrieval Jul 12 02:52:50 still hasnt been incorporated into the ui has it? Jul 12 02:52:59 X Jul 12 02:53:01 * cjb hopes his FR has working GPS Jul 12 02:53:48 * Jacen does too. Jul 12 02:54:17 and why wouldnt it? Jul 12 02:54:33 GPS prblem: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FreeRunner_GPS_antenna_repair_SOP' (set by HdR on Friday, July 11, 2008 08:17:00) Jul 12 02:55:13 *refresh* Aww, still in San Pablo. Jul 12 02:56:11 isnt that just one of those mcx? connectors what are those? i don't understand how after all that supposed testing before production could start, it still managed to ship with bad soldering/connections **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Jul 12 02:59:56 2008