**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Aug 11 02:59:57 2008 Aug 11 03:00:11 I thought I remembered NOR the last time I flashed but the wiki seems to say NAND now Aug 11 03:01:26 hmm, but the instructions are for booting into NOR Aug 11 03:01:30 heh Aug 11 03:01:31 oops Aug 11 03:01:31 linuxxr: whynot just get a 8 or 32 GB card? Aug 11 03:01:32 ;P Aug 11 03:01:57 does it support 32's? Aug 11 03:01:57 chillywilly: it doesnt matter Aug 11 03:02:09 There are no 32s Aug 11 03:02:12 so i can put on seperate cards Aug 11 03:02:21 both uboots get loaded into memory Aug 11 03:02:22 yea well the instructions are for the NOR boot menu but they say "NAND" on the page Aug 11 03:02:27 1/3 of my batteries failed Aug 11 03:02:40 chox Aug 11 03:02:51 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Dfu-util <-- talking about that page Aug 11 03:02:55 so just because some douchebag put it on the wiki doesnt mean its scripture Aug 11 03:03:22 so if i mess up the mbr i wont cause much damage Aug 11 03:03:50 kd8ikt: I am just stating that it is incorrect...can anyone edit the pages? Aug 11 03:04:13 looks like I need an account (duh) Aug 11 03:04:14 "IT DOESNT MATTER" just get into "A" u-boot and flash Aug 11 03:04:30 the nand version is what changes Aug 11 03:04:31 chillywilly: yeah, once you get an account you can edit Aug 11 03:04:40 kd8ikt: it could matter Aug 11 03:04:43 * kd8ikt hopes he doesnt edit the wiki Aug 11 03:04:43 boot from NOR Aug 11 03:04:58 arrrrrrhhhh Aug 11 03:05:21 blah, i think i ate too much Aug 11 03:05:28 i did once an it got removed right now Aug 11 03:05:33 hi all! Aug 11 03:05:42 but i was still correct Aug 11 03:05:42 fine, I won't touch it then Aug 11 03:05:43 ieatlint: lint is really that filling? Aug 11 03:06:22 it doesnt matter i swear nomatter where the uboot is loaded (NAND/NOR) its loaded into ram and either has no problem writing to NAND Aug 11 03:06:33 i updated uboot to a date of aug 6 i believe Aug 11 03:07:12 kd8ikt: correct that it always goes to nand... and nand loads into the ram before being executed, so in theory nothing bad can happen Aug 11 03:07:35 however, you will get screen anomalies, and there is the potential for failure Aug 11 03:07:44 it's one of those best to do in nor type deals Aug 11 03:08:01 i did Aug 11 03:08:26 Is there a higher capacity battery available for the GTA01? Aug 11 03:08:38 I was merely stating that the instructions were telling you one thing and you are actually booting into another Aug 11 03:08:54 i flashed 3 times before i figured how to get into nand to check the version Aug 11 03:08:58 but if no ones gives a crap then I suppose I won't either Aug 11 03:09:00 * RayDar lusts for 2008.8 on his GTA01 Aug 11 03:09:59 raydar it realy isnt all that great, most people complain its not "stable" and nothing works Aug 11 03:10:01 RayDar: the gta1 and 2 both use 1200mah batteries Aug 11 03:10:53 my phone would'nt work Aug 11 03:11:01 kd8ikt: Heh. It's got to be better than the stuff I have tried so far. Aug 11 03:11:08 might be the audio driver Aug 11 03:11:12 there's always qtopia ;) Aug 11 03:11:25 anyone here know how to get my brick to boot from a sd card Aug 11 03:11:56 chillywilly: Yeah, I have tried the latest QTopia images. They are nice. Aug 11 03:12:04 hold aux button then power an select boot to sd card Aug 11 03:12:27 doesn't boot when I do that jsut goes back to the boot menu Aug 11 03:12:57 then select "boot to sdcard" Aug 11 03:13:14 well sdcard is setup wrong Aug 11 03:13:23 I tired them all Aug 11 03:13:35 bah, I keep sneezing Aug 11 03:13:38 hey all, has anyone looked into building gentoo for the freerunner? Aug 11 03:14:29 when is another mfg. going to pick up on this is what i wanna know Aug 11 03:15:23 Staticwave_Ace: no one has specifically to me knowledge, but you go right ahead and let us know how it goes :P Aug 11 03:15:43 ieatlint: looking into it, heh Aug 11 03:16:01 linuxxr: gonna be a while Aug 11 03:16:26 hmm.....are the repos that we need to point to for updates on 2008.8 on buildhost.openmoko.org instead of download.openmoko.org? Aug 11 03:16:26 linuxxr: once the first million phones ship with a working stack is my optimistic guess. Aug 11 03:16:44 (majors that is) Aug 11 03:18:19 thanks linuxxr had to fix my fstab Aug 11 03:18:51 the wiki didn't adjust the fstab jsut had a defualt one and didn't mention to point the rootfs to the right place Aug 11 03:19:43 what repos should i be pointing to to get updates on 2008.8? The default ones at download.openmoko.org dont seem to be getting the daily updates Aug 11 03:20:03 can u pastebin your fstab for us Aug 11 03:20:48 i'll fstab you Aug 11 03:21:20 lol Aug 11 03:21:45 ill cfdisk u Aug 11 03:21:52 is there a way to set that menu entry as default now that I know it works linuxxr Aug 11 03:22:11 brian im a linux noob Aug 11 03:22:31 want to touch my mtab? Aug 11 03:22:48 NO Aug 11 03:23:00 it might be fun... Aug 11 03:23:05 apt wants to Aug 11 03:23:16 apt: touch my mtab Aug 11 03:23:17 This is Fendor's pleasure only Aug 11 03:23:24 :( Aug 11 03:23:27 you all suck Aug 11 03:23:31 lololol Aug 11 03:25:06 brian Aug 11 03:25:22 can u paste.bin Aug 11 03:26:24 u have a freerunner? Aug 11 03:27:09 hi Aug 11 03:27:16 lint who the hell is fendor?? Aug 11 03:27:24 ya I have a freerunner Aug 11 03:27:25 apt: who is fendor? Aug 11 03:27:27 I think you lost me on that one, ieatlint Aug 11 03:27:34 what would I be pasebing Aug 11 03:27:44 apt: touch fendor Aug 11 03:27:45 your fstab Aug 11 03:27:45 This is Fendor's pleasure only Aug 11 03:27:49 exactly Aug 11 03:27:52 can i see Aug 11 03:28:42 got a problem with makefile's target openmoko-devel-image Aug 11 03:29:41 can anyone help me troubleshoot it Aug 11 03:30:27 its proly small enough to post here:) Aug 11 03:30:42 cant get to understand the issue behind failure of glibc2.6.x.bb fail Aug 11 03:30:47 http://pastebin.com/d5057874e Aug 11 03:30:50 :) Aug 11 03:32:03 the file may be corrupt can u check it? Aug 11 03:32:25 md5sum thing Aug 11 03:33:21 how do i copy music to the freerunner im ssh in now Aug 11 03:33:45 scp? Aug 11 03:34:08 scp would be the simplest Aug 11 03:34:27 can u show me how im stupid i guess Aug 11 03:34:52 scp source destination Aug 11 03:35:04 ok Aug 11 03:35:19 the src/dest can be a local file, or a remote file ... remote files are user@host:/path/to/file Aug 11 03:35:32 user is implied to be your current if not specified Aug 11 03:35:58 what repos are people using to get updates on 2008.8? Aug 11 03:36:03 also note that both the src and dest can be remote and not local :P Aug 11 03:36:05 how do you get the face of the phone off without destroying it? Aug 11 03:36:16 are there updates already? Aug 11 03:36:19 because im not getting the kernel updates and such with the default repos Aug 11 03:36:43 2 screws artnt there Aug 11 03:36:53 there are the daily builds they release...i assume you can get those somehow... Aug 11 03:36:59 doc|home: there are instructions on the wiki... you need a torx t6 screwdriver and something to pry it (suggested would be a guitar pic, as the debug board includes) Aug 11 03:37:22 for purposes of disassembling the device, the 1973 instructions are identical Aug 11 03:37:22 a fingernail works Aug 11 03:37:32 arse, I don't have a screwdriver Aug 11 03:37:36 have it off 80% Aug 11 03:37:42 LINUXXR: how do I do the checking and correcting Aug 11 03:37:53 yeah, those two screws are kinda important to remove :P Aug 11 03:38:09 why do you want it off, anyway? Aug 11 03:38:23 A month or two ago I was doing this and got the same problem and then had to give it up due to another project Aug 11 03:38:36 ieatlint: to apply an oversized screen protector Aug 11 03:38:48 ah, good reason Aug 11 03:38:53 yeah, you need the screwdriver Aug 11 03:38:59 If the Freerunner goes into suspend mode under 2008.8, whileit is connected to the USB, does it continue charing while suspended? Aug 11 03:39:05 grrr Aug 11 03:40:03 :( Aug 11 03:40:21 sorry shaz... i've no real idea Aug 11 03:40:33 what arm does the freerunner have? arm4 or arm41? Aug 11 03:40:47 could be a localisation issue? but the log you posted basically has no real error message Aug 11 03:40:47 bad design choice to use torx :( Aug 11 03:40:57 Staticwave_Ace: arm9 Aug 11 03:41:00 could they have found a more obscure screw head? Aug 11 03:41:07 and it's arm v4 Aug 11 03:41:22 ieatlint: no problem am just expecting from those who are aware :) Aug 11 03:41:28 doc|home: it's actually pretty standard for this type of thing Aug 11 03:41:46 atleast its not a tamperproof t-6 Aug 11 03:41:53 yeah, everyone knows Robertson screws are the best Aug 11 03:41:55 shaz: see if you can get a more detailed error message... perhaps there's a verbosity setting or the like Aug 11 03:42:05 doc|home: Ever stripped out a phillips screw? Of course you have. Ever stripped out a torx? Probably not. Aug 11 03:42:22 adsllc: no, because nothing fucking uses torx :) Aug 11 03:42:26 k Aug 11 03:42:40 (ok, not true but still, they're rare enough that I can't even try!) Aug 11 03:42:44 lots of cell phones use t-6 Aug 11 03:42:54 yep, i think all my nokias use t-6 Aug 11 03:42:58 torx rock Aug 11 03:43:01 my housemate has a torx head set with two heads, neither of which fit Aug 11 03:43:07 I guess I'm just biased since I have a nice little torx kit handy. Aug 11 03:43:16 0 down pressure required Aug 11 03:43:18 sorry, 3 Aug 11 03:43:30 adsllc: can I borrow it? :) Aug 11 03:43:39 where do you live doc? Aug 11 03:43:43 canada :) Aug 11 03:43:55 that's not too specific :P Aug 11 03:44:03 Sure - just swing on by Northwest Ohio... Aug 11 03:44:11 how hard is it? go to a shop, spend $20 on a torx head screwdriver, be happy ever after. Aug 11 03:44:16 specific enough to know I'm far away from whereever adsllc's isp is :) I'm in vancouver Aug 11 03:44:24 kgoetz: $20 on something I'll use once? Aug 11 03:44:24 At work, Torx is great 'cause they don't strip out and everyone has a set on the workbench. At home, only some tool-obsessed geeks have good sets. Aug 11 03:44:39 doc|home: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Category:Openmoko_Local_Groups Aug 11 03:44:40 doc|home: you dont know that Aug 11 03:45:08 * kgoetz has used his torx' for doing laptops, and now the freerunner. Aug 11 03:45:10 I pride myself on always using the wrong tool for the job - but I still have a torx set. Aug 11 03:45:19 doc|home: what part of the city? I'm near 12th and Granville and I have an official Openmoko torx + guitar pick combo Aug 11 03:45:23 u going to use it again especially if u bought cheap screen protectors Aug 11 03:45:28 Rental rates start at $10/hour :) Aug 11 03:45:33 doc|home: every person with a debug board has that screwdriver, and odds are would be happy to let you borrow it in a coffee shop or the like for the 2min affair of applying the screen cover Aug 11 03:45:37 adsllc: anyone tool is probably wrong for most jobs Aug 11 03:45:55 ieatlint: only from teh first order - the Freerunners debug borads didnt ship with them Aug 11 03:45:56 mmontour: oh, cool, broadway and granville is on my route home every day Aug 11 03:46:21 kgoetz: uh, well, my freerunner debug board came with one Aug 11 03:46:26 You could just use Diversity to SMS each other your location. Aug 11 03:46:31 mmontour: heh, you charge by the second, right? :) Aug 11 03:46:37 ieatlint: mine didnt :/ Aug 11 03:46:55 just stop at a tool seller an spend 4 bucks Aug 11 03:47:00 ieatlint: did you get a 1973 or a frerunner? Aug 11 03:47:11 they are everywhere Aug 11 03:47:13 freerunner Aug 11 03:47:22 hm Aug 11 03:47:27 linuxxr: don't have much choice Aug 11 03:47:33 interesting, the contents listed on the official store indeed does not include a t6 Aug 11 03:47:34 i'd have a cry, but since i already hae a torx set i wont bother Aug 11 03:48:38 well 2008.8 is a lot more responsive than standard qtopia Aug 11 03:48:54 A suitable torx kit is $6 from Lowes: http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=239384-16878-60272&lpage=none Aug 11 03:48:56 I might be able to use this for a while ;P Aug 11 03:49:18 doc|home: send me an email to mail at mmontour.net - I can meet you somewhere tomorrow afternoon Aug 11 03:49:27 till u wanna make a call Aug 11 03:50:11 I'm interested to see a FR in person - mine hasn't arrived yet (ordered from koolu last week) Aug 11 03:50:58 linuxxr: calling my wife's phone and I hear it Aug 11 03:51:10 did make with debug and here's the error messages: http://pastebin.com/d385ba16f Aug 11 03:51:11 mmontour: sounds like it ... was going to say I might be better off getting one of my own but if you want to see it, then that's good. I have qtopia on mine, looks and works well-ish. Aug 11 03:51:22 not perfect but still not bad Aug 11 03:51:57 is there any #openmoko-newbie channel Aug 11 03:52:01 answer it an see if u can hear anything Aug 11 03:52:29 shaz: As far as I can tell - you're in it! :) Aug 11 03:52:40 shaz, I think this channel is the closest thing to it. Aug 11 03:52:41 I bought an logiix shield screen protector for the ipod touch (yes, yes, I know :) ) but it comes with two screen protectors. Anyone know why? Aug 11 03:52:43 im a noob Aug 11 03:52:53 i think there's #openmok-support or something Aug 11 03:53:05 a spare? Aug 11 03:53:05 heh, guess not Aug 11 03:53:34 linuxxr: yeah, but I've had an invisible shield one on my n800 and it hasn't gotten even a mark on it to date Aug 11 03:53:36 seems a bit odd Aug 11 03:54:31 i bouhgt the writeright kit from walmart an theres enough stuff there to do the freerunner 10 times an comes with grid backing for easy cutting Aug 11 03:54:43 ok Aug 11 03:55:02 these are very durable also Aug 11 03:55:05 doc|home: the invisibleshield does seem durable, but it seems to attract a lot more smudges and such Aug 11 03:55:39 i put this on and it looks like the glass Aug 11 03:55:55 its harder than the oem 1 Aug 11 03:59:49 beer good Aug 11 04:00:46 some jehova's witnesses came by today Aug 11 04:01:00 ieatlint: hmmm, haven't had that on my n800, although it does get dirty, it's easily cleaned Aug 11 04:01:04 ieatlint, Sell 'em any Freerunners? Aug 11 04:01:04 when you know it's them knocking, make sure you have alcohol in your hand, and offer them some Aug 11 04:01:55 just tell them you've been excommunicated from the church Aug 11 04:01:57 they'll run Aug 11 04:01:59 why does flashing over usb seem so slow? Aug 11 04:02:06 peepsalot: USB1.1 Aug 11 04:02:09 "if god created everything, and put so many evil temptations in the world, then isn't god just some sadist trying to constantly tempt you so you can burn in hell? and what kind of god is that, certainly not a nice one.." Aug 11 04:03:08 Staticwave_Ace, still, it is theoretically capable of 1.5MB/s Aug 11 04:03:23 ieatlint, Think of prayers as bug reports. Aug 11 04:03:36 i think the bottleneck is the internal flash write speed Aug 11 04:03:39 adsllc and ken-young: its still too complicated for me ;) Aug 11 04:03:48 peepsalot: could also be the system bus Aug 11 04:04:02 methinks the data goes over usb to the cpu and then to the flash Aug 11 04:04:11 shaz, DO you have any questions you need answers to? Aug 11 04:04:14 yeah CPU can't handle that Aug 11 04:04:15 and since it's sharing bandwidth... could be cut Aug 11 04:04:17 I'll check out #openmoko-support, seems to be relevant for me Aug 11 04:04:25 I have no problems making and receiving calls with 2008.8 Aug 11 04:04:47 cant figurte out what to do in this http://pastebin.com/d385ba16f situation Aug 11 04:04:50 in fact it's like the best of both worlds and the qtopia apps are more responsive than qtopia proper Aug 11 04:05:06 what's the package that watches battery vs AC status? Aug 11 04:05:45 shaz, Wo Nelly - What were you trying to do there? Aug 11 04:05:52 I've been trying mokomakefile for more then 5 or 6 times and never got it to work at the expense of costly bandwidth :) Aug 11 04:06:05 its make -d :) Aug 11 04:06:26 actually glibc2.6.something.bb is not working Aug 11 04:06:29 shaz, You might actually want to try the openmoko-cdevel channel. Aug 11 04:06:43 or the openmoko mailing list... Aug 11 04:06:52 there's a support mailing list that could be good Aug 11 04:06:57 k, thanx Aug 11 04:07:02 shaz, Have you tried mokomakefile? Aug 11 04:07:07 I've had intermittent success at best with MokoMakefile. I've had my best luck developing on the device itself. Aug 11 04:07:10 any other pointers Aug 11 04:07:13 ieatlint, you think it's possible to improve the speed in any way? Aug 11 04:07:32 peepsalot: i wouldn't know... but i would say it's likely not their top priority Aug 11 04:07:38 ya I did mokomakefile Aug 11 04:07:44 you can always use a sd card... Aug 11 04:08:12 shaz, mokomakefile is the only way I've ever managed to get the cross-development tools going. I've only run it from scratch 3 times, but it has worked on my ubuntu machine each time i tried it. Aug 11 04:08:13 yeah, not a huge deal, just a minor annoyance. it just feels like it *shouldn't* be that slow Aug 11 04:08:27 yeah, it is annoying, no doubt Aug 11 04:08:47 I am liking 2008.8 Aug 11 04:08:48 still, out of all the annoying things... that's definitely not #1 Aug 11 04:08:51 flashing om2008.8 right now Aug 11 04:08:53 ieatlint: is your FR working well Aug 11 04:09:08 KrisAbsinthe-kd8: yep Aug 11 04:09:12 Is anybody using the GPS in 2008.8? Aug 11 04:09:12 I am using fedora8 but tried ubuntu too but the same problem, lots of problems which I could'nt troubleshoot. Aug 11 04:09:13 takes a little longer to boot Aug 11 04:09:16 than I am used to Aug 11 04:09:17 * undrwate1 is missing some kind of "home screen" where phone is king Aug 11 04:09:33 adsllc, I am using GPS under 2008.8. Aug 11 04:09:42 well maybe not Aug 11 04:09:43 so all of a sudden i cant hear anything when i get a phone call on 2008.8....anyone seen this? Aug 11 04:09:48 just that inital boot was the longest Aug 11 04:09:52 anyone done speed tests of booting from sd vs internal flash? Aug 11 04:10:03 Any secrets? Mine worked great in 2007.2 but 'tail -f /dev/ttySAC1' doesn't even do anything in 2008.8. Aug 11 04:10:08 Anyways KEN-Young, I am going for the openmoko-cdevel and openmoko-support to see what can be done Aug 11 04:10:14 thanx guys Aug 11 04:10:24 shaz, Good luck! Aug 11 04:10:27 C - ya (pun intended) Aug 11 04:10:35 adsllc, Are you sure the GPS is on? Aug 11 04:10:54 I went into 'Settings' and toggled it on, if that's what you mean. Aug 11 04:11:01 adsllc, Ans have you checked that gpsd is running? Aug 11 04:11:13 :) Aug 11 04:11:37 adsllc: cat /sys/devices/platform/s3c2440-i2c/i2c-adapter/i2c-0/0-0073/neo1973-pm-gps.0/pwron Aug 11 04:11:38 Peeking at ttySAC1 shouldn't depend on gpsd. Aug 11 04:11:43 if it says 1, it is on Aug 11 04:11:46 if it says 0, it's off Aug 11 04:11:46 adsllc, Remeber that the /etc/defaults/gpsd file must be edited to point to the right port. Aug 11 04:11:49 ieatlint: thinking of getting one, but dont really want to deal with too many problems. I will fix stuff but want it to stay fixed lol Aug 11 04:12:16 I tried checking that sys file before, but I'll try again. Aug 11 04:12:58 adsllc, The default maps application under 2008.8 also can turn on the GPS. You could try using it to turn GPS on, in case the settings methos is defective. Aug 11 04:14:19 KrisAbsinthe-kd8: you don't want the FR yet Aug 11 04:14:43 the phone software is kinda hacked together, and isn't problem free Aug 11 04:14:49 quirks are prominent Aug 11 04:15:15 it's getting better.. quite quickly, in fact... but it's not an everyday phone really... Aug 11 04:15:47 'cat /sys/devices/platform/s3c2440-i2c/i2c-adapter/i2c-0/0-0073/neo1973-pm-gps.0/pwron' gives 1 but 'tail -f /dev/ttySAC1' gives nothing. Aug 11 04:16:44 ieatlint: probably not, like i said i dont mind writing some scripts and whatever, but need gprs for work, is that working ok? Aug 11 04:17:06 Anyone know if it's safe to swap batteries while the Freerunner is plugged in to a USB port? Aug 11 04:17:07 adsllc, For what it's worth, I've always used the "Locations" app under 2008.8 to turn the GPS on, and it has worked reliably. Aug 11 04:17:13 KrisAbsinthe-kd8: I agree with ieatlint - it's a neat toy but not much else it. If you "need" anything for work, forget it. Aug 11 04:17:19 * dingman has three batteries and no charger :-/ Aug 11 04:17:34 does anyone know where the script to copy vcf from evolution is? Aug 11 04:17:36 dingman: it won't damage anything, but the phone may shut itself off when you do it. Aug 11 04:17:50 mmontour, thanks. Aug 11 04:17:51 the one besides the wiki one Aug 11 04:18:18 Try turning off GSM and disabling charging (echo 0 > /sys/something/chgmode) before swapping. Might help, but I don't have a FR to test it Aug 11 04:18:21 adsllc: thanks, I had a ton of problems with my Neo Aug 11 04:18:33 if the phone is running, it'll stay that way if you've got usb plugged int Aug 11 04:18:34 is there some cheap charger out there, maybe meant for one of the similar Nokia batteries, that can charge these independednt of the phone? Aug 11 04:18:35 *in Aug 11 04:18:40 it's funny how the qtopia apps work better on the openmoko stack than they do on actual qtopia proper Aug 11 04:19:41 is it possible to get zhone running on 2008;8 like it does on fso? Aug 11 04:19:51 undrwate1: if GSM is transmitting, it may draw too much instantaneous current for just a USB power connection to support Aug 11 04:19:56 what is default 2008.8 password? Aug 11 04:19:58 i like fso to Aug 11 04:20:09 1234 Aug 11 04:20:13 rwhitby: didn't see that that was happening Aug 11 04:20:30 oh, nm i forgot to specify root as user Aug 11 04:20:30 undrwate1: it will depend on distance to base station Aug 11 04:20:37 linuxxr: yes...good screen lock idea Aug 11 04:20:46 peepsalot, the default password is nothing . Aug 11 04:21:09 Ken-Young, i figured it out, thanks. i was logging in as wrong user Aug 11 04:21:34 undrwate1: it's been well documented by OM engineers, hence the updated status that you need to have a battery in to guarantee operation Aug 11 04:21:54 rwhitby: oh yeah? draws more power the farther away from base station? Aug 11 04:22:01 yep Aug 11 04:22:12 wow...learned something new Aug 11 04:22:25 and GSM location updates happen without you doing anything every 20 minutes to 1 hour Aug 11 04:22:30 is the hardware capable of reporting power consumption information Aug 11 04:22:35 (which require a short transmission) Aug 11 04:23:06 Ken-Young: Figured the GPS out - turns out that 'tail -f' doesn't work for whatever reason. 'cat /dev/ttySAC1' works fine. Aug 11 04:23:45 adsllc, Thanks for closing that loop - I didn't know that either. Aug 11 04:23:47 anyone know how to copy contacts over from qtopia proper to 2008.8? Aug 11 04:23:53 so if u have all these gps devices showing up on your device it will eat more power ??? Aug 11 04:23:59 are the same database files used? Aug 11 04:24:20 peepsalot: try cat /sys/devices/platform/bq27000-battery.0/power_supply/bat/uevent Aug 11 04:24:50 all my contacts were found Aug 11 04:25:21 and you scp'd a backup of /home/root? Aug 11 04:25:27 back onto the phone? Aug 11 04:25:38 u have sdcard for 2008.8? Aug 11 04:25:44 yes Aug 11 04:25:53 I just flashed on the 2008-08-11 -qtopia-x11 daily, and my phone is going to sleep but refusing to wake up for anything less than unplugging it and removing the battery. Is this normal? Aug 11 04:25:55 I don't get the battery meter Aug 11 04:26:02 it's weird Aug 11 04:26:30 oh, maybe that's the signal meter that I am looking at? Aug 11 04:26:52 I still see a lightning bolt all the way on the top right Aug 11 04:26:58 chillywilly: i haven't seen the battery meter Aug 11 04:27:00 which I would think would indicate "AC" Aug 11 04:27:02 yep...same here Aug 11 04:27:06 anyone got any ideas the touch screen seems really messed up in debian when you press it pshs differen't palces Aug 11 04:27:11 oh well that sorta stinks Aug 11 04:27:13 so you can't login or anything Aug 11 04:27:15 :P Aug 11 04:27:19 chillywilly - I'm pretty sure those gfx are mostly useless at this point. Aug 11 04:27:42 doh...well why does the one meter fluctuate then? Aug 11 04:28:01 To keep you guessing? Aug 11 04:28:01 charging? Aug 11 04:28:01 it's a fake meter ;P? Aug 11 04:28:10 I have it on battery atm Aug 11 04:28:26 I'm not saying they really are useless, just that I haven't seen anything useful myself. Aug 11 04:29:25 that doesn't make sense Aug 11 04:29:34 that's got to be a high priority Aug 11 04:29:55 we need to know when the battery is going to die ( as mine did today without notice) Aug 11 04:30:07 why is there a map app in the default image, but no gpsd Aug 11 04:30:25 i mean in 2008.8 image Aug 11 04:30:41 yea like a cool rocked out ring warning like the fso ringer Aug 11 04:31:10 undrwate1: if you know c, you can create something in very little time that will sit in the background as a daemon and flash the leds or play a sound when the battery reaches a certain point Aug 11 04:31:56 ieatlint: i'll look into that Aug 11 04:32:11 is the monitor detailed on the wiki? Aug 11 04:32:32 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GTA02_sysfs is what you would need to know to write the app Aug 11 04:32:34 fix the monitor ;P Aug 11 04:32:44 I should look at it Aug 11 04:32:45 tells you how to get the battery status, and control the leds Aug 11 04:32:47 ieatlint: thanks... Aug 11 04:33:43 lovely page on how to use the installer. What package to I install with opkg to *get* the installer?? Aug 11 04:33:46 Anyone have any luck with playing music on 2008.8? I always get "/dev/dsp busy " with madplay and the media player isn't any better. Aug 11 04:34:03 dingman: installer is already installed - see the bottom of the home page. Aug 11 04:34:06 adsllc: it uses alsa, tell madplay to use alsa Aug 11 04:34:32 adsllc, huh? you mean where I don't have a black bar? Aug 11 04:35:34 dingman: Don't have a black bar? I don't know what you mean. Aug 11 04:36:12 OK, previous versions of this that I played with had black buttons across the bottom that had a tendency to disappear instead of work. Aug 11 04:36:13 ieatlint: I see no suitable command line option. Am I missing something or is another program recommended? Aug 11 04:36:30 dingman: What version are you using then? Aug 11 04:36:48 tonight's -qtopia-x11 daily Aug 11 04:37:12 openmoko-qtopia-x11-image-om-gta02.jffs2 Aug 11 04:37:16 dingman: Ah - no idea then. It works fine with the original 2008.8 is all I know. Aug 11 04:37:55 So you're just expecting an already-installed app that shows up like the others on the home screen, then? Aug 11 04:38:13 what does it take to get gsm to work on the 2008.8? Aug 11 04:38:32 does the graphical installer in 2008.8 work for anyone? for me it reports all programs as 0 Bytes, and when I click to install, it seems to do nothing and immediately return to the top menu of the installer Aug 11 04:38:43 dingman: Mine has "INSTALLER" centered across the bottom of the home page much like the arrow is centered across the top. Aug 11 04:39:17 Oh. No such thing. I've got background picture all the way to the edge of the display. Aug 11 04:39:26 peepsalot: mine works...but doesn't list all packages...not sure yet which it lists Aug 11 04:39:35 dingman: It's not quite like any other app, but it was there since I flashed. Aug 11 04:39:43 dingman: sounds like you're not using 2008.8 Aug 11 04:39:58 undrwate1, does it show correct download sizes for apps? Aug 11 04:40:22 yeah. i've no good suggestion for you adsllc Aug 11 04:40:32 K - thanks anyway! Aug 11 04:40:35 but /dev/dsp is oss Aug 11 04:40:40 peepsalot: hmm...didn't pay attention... Aug 11 04:40:49 undrwate1, it's definitely the -qtopia-x11 series of dailies. I suppose I could grab the original 2008.8 and opkg-update, but it seemed like coming to the party late I might as well start with today's image/ Aug 11 04:40:49 undrwate1, you install apps over USB with the installer? Aug 11 04:40:50 and something else has a file lock on it... so only it can use it (alsa oss emulation) Aug 11 04:41:00 peepsalot: no...wifi Aug 11 04:41:06 hmm Aug 11 04:41:15 i wonder if that has something to do with it Aug 11 04:41:38 no...you're right...says 0 bytes Aug 11 04:41:41 very small... Aug 11 04:41:43 adsllc: "lsof | grep dsp" will tell you what is using it... if you can stop it, then madplay can use /dev/dsp Aug 11 04:41:52 that's why i didn't see it beofre...but works OK for me Aug 11 04:42:00 ieatlint: I'm trying mplayer instead right now... Aug 11 04:42:06 hmm, i think i will enter a bug Aug 11 04:42:08 yeah, mplayer will work Aug 11 04:42:30 no ssh server installed by default on 2008.8? Aug 11 04:42:56 chillywilly: I've got dropbear Aug 11 04:43:18 oh I bet it's just failing beause of the info in my known_hosts file Aug 11 04:43:43 anyone else tried using 2008.8 installer over USB networking? Aug 11 04:45:09 peepsalot, I was having trouble with my NAT connection tracking when I did that, so I've just been downloading packages over wifi. Aug 11 04:45:17 ieatlint: mplayer -ao alsa whatever.mp3/ogg just seems to hang. Oh well. Aug 11 04:45:36 Tonights -qtopia-x11 can even set up a WPA2 network through the GUI :) Aug 11 04:45:38 well there's certain qtopia features I miss already ;) Aug 11 04:45:51 like the ability to turn the suspend off when plugged into AC Aug 11 04:46:26 dingman: I got that to work once on the original 2008.8 but the option hasn't been there since. Aug 11 04:47:01 what's the "original" 2008.8? Aug 11 04:47:16 adsllc, I just hit Settings->Wifi-> and typed in a password. Aug 11 04:47:50 dingman: I got that once - and ever since "Wifi" doesn't go any deeper. Aug 11 04:47:57 This would irc me at home, but the AP I carry with me on the road has a simple password so I can just tell my students to use my e-mail address Aug 11 04:48:05 chillywilly - the one from 2008-08-08. Aug 11 04:48:07 adsllc: what happens when run it without -ao? Aug 11 04:48:21 ieatlint: it uses oss. Aug 11 04:48:25 adsllc, try opkg-update now, then. Theoretically if you're using the daily feeds you should get the same version I have. Aug 11 04:48:26 heh Aug 11 04:48:38 try "mplayer -ao alsa:device=dmix file" Aug 11 04:49:17 dingman, undrwate1 *headslap* i was clicking the "install" text in the lower left corner, as opposed to the big "(Touch me to install)" image at the top. Aug 11 04:49:31 :) Aug 11 04:49:41 At least it's easy to fix! Aug 11 04:50:00 peepsalot: ahhh! :) Aug 11 04:50:03 i'm still considering entering as a bug, seems like poor interface design Aug 11 04:50:27 peepsalot: there's some text that says "click me to install" within that image...but not easy to see Aug 11 04:51:32 i wonder where they get all these crazy images that looks like they have nothing to do with any of the apps :-) Aug 11 04:51:46 Good heavens! the text showing the source of an incoming SMS is monstrously huge! Aug 11 04:52:19 dingman: it doesn't appear that the default 2008.8 image has the daily-feeds repo setup - any idea how to set it? I'm opkg illiterate. Aug 11 04:52:30 nevermind, that was apparently t-mobile's fault for embellishing what they sent from the web page. Aug 11 04:52:46 When I choose text-only display, it's perfectly fine. Aug 11 04:55:38 adsllc: you can create a new daily-feeds.conf in /etc/opkg...just borrow one of the others and rename with the correct pointer Aug 11 04:55:44 how can i switch to landscape in 2008.8? Aug 11 04:55:55 undrwate1: And what would that correct pointer be? Aug 11 04:56:00 adsllc, just a sec Aug 11 04:56:25 adsllc: dunno...where are the daily feeds? Aug 11 04:56:41 "src/gz om-dev-all http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily-feed/all" is what I've got in /etc/opkg/all-feed.conf. Aug 11 04:56:55 There's several though, and I'm not sure what's in each one. Aug 11 04:57:12 adsllc, are you familiar with apt-get? Aug 11 04:57:24 maybe borrow the celtune one f Aug 11 04:57:56 dingman: sorry, no. I'm a Fedora guy. Aug 11 04:58:14 adsllc, I've got that on the other laptop here :) Aug 11 04:58:34 but opkg is descended from apt, which is why I brought it up Aug 11 04:59:21 basically, it looks like /etc/opkg is to opkg as /etc/yum.repos.d is to yum Aug 11 04:59:38 but the file format is different. One line per repository. Aug 11 04:59:59 peepsalot: Rotate='xrandr -display :0 --output default --rotate left' Aug 11 05:00:25 Aug 11 05:00:46 I haven't seen a repo type of anything but src/gz yet for opkg Aug 11 05:00:54 the name is whatever you like Aug 11 05:01:11 dingman: thx - processing. Aug 11 05:01:17 and the URL seems to be a directory which contains ipkg files and a Packages.gz file Aug 11 05:01:47 Packages.gz seems to correspond to the repodata/ subdirectory of a yum repo Aug 11 05:02:39 hm, my ssh session seems to be frozen Aug 11 05:02:56 peepsalot: The touchscreen calibration is no good after rotation, unfortunately. Aug 11 05:03:04 the phone is still running fine, but I can't type anything into ssh Aug 11 05:03:48 peepsalot: Your network connection probably died - how are you connected? Aug 11 05:04:07 usb, yeah i think i slept and resumed that caused it Aug 11 05:04:07 dingman: that updated like 5 packages - nothing terribly consequential - digging deeper. Aug 11 05:04:36 there's nothing like #openmoko-support Aug 11 05:04:42 any idea what it might be Aug 11 05:04:45 adsllc, if you pm me an e-mail address, I'll send you all my feed config files. Aug 11 05:04:47 peepsalot: close your terminal window and start over - or press ENTER - tilde - ENTER to cancel ssh Aug 11 05:07:55 adsllc, ok i'm back in ssh. is there some way to change so I don't have to sudo ifdown usb0 && sudo ifup usb0 every time? Aug 11 05:07:56 * ieatlint could sure go for a terrorist fist jab about now Aug 11 05:08:49 a script Aug 11 05:09:23 peepsalot: use wifi. I hate dinking with the USB stuff. Aug 11 05:09:36 what do you use for wifi? Aug 11 05:10:14 On the network side I've got a Linksys router running DD-WRT with WPA. On the FR I have a little script I use. Aug 11 05:11:16 http://pastebin.com/d12f3acc8 Aug 11 05:11:26 i have no wifi Aug 11 05:12:10 ahh well Aug 11 05:12:20 theres better ways Aug 11 05:13:33 hell, now I can't ssh in FR for some reason :-( Aug 11 05:13:46 No route to host Aug 11 05:14:14 probably means it turned off and the usb0 interface disappeared from your computer. Aug 11 05:14:39 wifi Aug 11 05:14:43 ? Aug 11 05:14:50 usb Aug 11 05:14:53 er, Infoport, what OS is your computer running? My guess might only be applicable to Linux. Aug 11 05:15:21 it has been off, and disconnected too, but connected (USB) and ifconfig shows it, and I set the IP too Aug 11 05:15:49 running Ubuntu and currently booted to OM2007...and it WAS working before LOL Aug 11 05:15:56 then 'no route to host' could mean that the FR is not responding. Aug 11 05:16:15 There are a couple issues that can cause this. Aug 11 05:16:31 One is a u-boot issue, and can be dealt with by re-booting the FR Aug 11 05:16:48 (or better yet, flashing a newer u-boot that doesn't have the problem) Aug 11 05:16:53 I turned off wifi on the FR to try to avoid collisions in rules Aug 11 05:17:45 I'm running an Aug 5th uboot (but I guess I could just reboot again-- the all purpose wrench :-D ) Aug 11 05:18:15 Infoport, I'm not sure how new it has to be Aug 11 05:18:35 Mine was from April before I flashed it for another reason and I never saw the problem myself. Aug 11 05:18:57 dmesg on the computer will report if it's the uboot issue Aug 11 05:19:13 will give something like "rejected configuration" or the like Aug 11 05:19:21 and it pings on 192.168.0.200 Aug 11 05:19:21 I always figure if I'm rebooting to fix something, it's really a sign that there's something I don't know, and need to learn. Aug 11 05:19:46 how can it ping and give you a no route to host error? Aug 11 05:19:47 mmontour: er, I mangled typing the email and forgot that ctrl-enter = send. How about there after 6pm? if you'd prefer somewhere else, that's fine. Aug 11 05:20:10 Infoport, 192.168.0.200 is the address for your box, not your phone. Aug 11 05:20:11 what does the settings app says "WiFi: unknown" and there is nothing to set Aug 11 05:20:17 So of course you can ping yourself. Aug 11 05:20:27 Does it answer on 192.168.0.202? Aug 11 05:20:30 oh, right, hehe Aug 11 05:20:37 202 is the phone Aug 11 05:21:25 I think "no route to host" in this context means "I sent an ARP 'who-has' packet, and nobody answered". Aug 11 05:22:03 but it might mean "I sent a SYN packet, and got back icmp-host-unreachable", too. Aug 11 05:22:35 someone knows their network stuff :) Aug 11 05:22:57 dingman: On a local LAN connection it'd be option 1. Aug 11 05:23:05 anyone know how to do an up arrow on the keyboard? Aug 11 05:23:27 adsllc, iptables can send the ICMP message, too. Aug 11 05:23:44 But I haven't seen an openmoko kernel with netfilter yet. Aug 11 05:23:45 the phone isn't running iptables though Aug 11 05:23:59 it will be soon... the kernel dev list had a filled request for it Aug 11 05:24:07 :) Aug 11 05:24:10 to support ip masq so that people could turn the phone into a gateway Aug 11 05:24:21 dingman: true dat. Aug 11 05:24:59 Good to know. I hadn't gotten there yet, but it had struck me as a little odd that a device whose purpose in life is to connect to one or more networks wouldn't have netfilter. Aug 11 05:26:37 if it were a 3g phone and had the ability to quickly jump into a gateway/proxy... that would rule Aug 11 05:27:35 ieatlint, there's something about NetworkManager on the 2008.8 features page, and I know NetworkManager 0.7 is supposed to gain the ability to set up gatewaying. Aug 11 05:27:59 can the Atheros wifi chip operate in AP mode? Aug 11 05:28:08 well, i have the technical know-how to do it on a console... i just mean that it's not 100% useful with only gprs Aug 11 05:28:10 nope Aug 11 05:28:15 no ap mode, no monitor mode Aug 11 05:28:26 aw, shucks. Aug 11 05:28:42 Maybe for the GTA03 ;) Aug 11 05:29:38 ieatlint, sometimes, GPRS is way better than nothing. Aug 11 05:29:42 i wonder if i could integrate a zigbee transceiver... :P Aug 11 05:29:44 * RayDar will feel betrayed if I cannot get 2008.8 on my GTA01. Aug 11 05:29:57 Heck, sometimes it's way better than the Wifi at hotels Aug 11 05:30:01 dingman: oh, it is always way better than nothing Aug 11 05:30:10 ***RayDar: I understand that you can't do it today but they are working on it. Aug 11 05:31:32 is there a media player and what is the package name? Aug 11 05:31:47 openmoko-mediaplayer Aug 11 05:31:47 I think Aug 11 05:32:03 will that work on 2008.8? Aug 11 05:32:37 dunno Aug 11 05:32:38 i wonder if the phone freaks out if you try to drop it to qvga to play a video Aug 11 05:32:49 cjb: close - it's openmoko-mediaplayer2 Aug 11 05:33:24 hmm. I can get most of the way through sending an SMS, but on the page where I should be able to send it, the bottom buttons - send and options - are non-responsive. Aug 11 05:33:26 that drags a lot of packages with it Aug 11 05:33:50 ieatlint: I had good luck - see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Video_Player#Playback_helper_script Aug 11 05:33:53 wow, tons of packages Aug 11 05:34:09 :-/ Aug 11 05:35:52 ieatlint: That was with 2007.2, haven't tried with 2008.8 yet. Aug 11 05:36:05 no ping 192.168.0.200 works but not .202 "Destination Host Unreachable" Aug 11 05:37:00 Infoport: Is your FR plugged in and turned on (ie not suspended)? Aug 11 05:38:35 adsllc: yes on and screen up (and connected to network even, about every other time I cycle GSM) Aug 11 05:39:09 Infoport: Sounds like your usb0 on your FR is disabled or set to some oddball IP address. Aug 11 05:42:36 just did a test... choppy playback on mine Aug 11 05:42:52 but then, could be the compression Aug 11 05:44:20 ieatlint: I got Peach to play back just fine with the instructions to that page. Aug 11 05:45:39 I have had to set IP on host with sudo ifconfig 192.168.0.200 (it loses IP address when un/re-plugged) Aug 11 05:45:45 I dunno I prefer the qtopia media player but it'd not working by default (the reason I prefer it is that you can use your fingers to control it) Aug 11 05:46:29 ieatlint: Sorry - Big Buck Bunny - not Peach. Aug 11 05:46:43 am trying with my own... transcoding it this time, will see Aug 11 05:49:41 ieatlint individually one can hack in nearly every radio given enough space/small module.. but for mp i think zigbee will not happen Aug 11 05:49:53 to be frank.. zigbee is dead already Aug 11 05:50:25 eh... it gives you an encrypted stream at 250kpbs for long ranges Aug 11 05:50:45 still nobody in the CE world uses it. Aug 11 05:51:05 absolutely nice. not really in wide use at all Aug 11 05:51:26 eh.. its implementation is easy enough for custom uses though Aug 11 05:51:34 ive never even seen a device i could touch outside a sales fair booth Aug 11 05:51:49 turns out...my FR /etc/network/interfaces was borked, but removing a comment or two fixed it (glad I installed matchbox keyboard, but wish I had Duraflex keyboard) Aug 11 05:52:05 besides.. that what we wired i2c, spi and a irq line onto the debug con and the pads around it. Aug 11 05:52:10 well, for $40 you can buy a zigbee usb setup, but it draws something like 300mA Aug 11 05:52:20 300mA? bwahhhah Aug 11 05:52:39 you can nearly run the whole fr on it. everything on Aug 11 05:53:16 yeah, with just the screen and gsm modem on, the fr takes 200mA Aug 11 05:53:18 for comparison.. we count in micro ampere and micro and milli watt Aug 11 05:53:26 throw in wifi, gps, bt... probably is 300 :P Aug 11 05:54:07 e.g. we even searched for pullups which we could exchange for ones with higher ohm resistors to save power Aug 11 05:54:47 yeah, well, hehe Aug 11 05:55:10 perhaps a zigbee module and a 6Ah battery mod go hand in hand :P Aug 11 05:55:20 i really learned a lot of neat tricks and design rules one never would think of in the hobby electronics world Aug 11 05:55:26 whew! gotta be able to shell-in Aug 11 06:00:03 the differences between OM2007 and 2008.8, with buttons etc for ending programs, turn stuff on/off, shutdown, is driving me crazy Aug 11 06:00:42 oh yeah....how do you turn off wifi in 08.08 Aug 11 06:01:48 I think a mod to use BUG modules would be nice (BUG article in Aug 2008 Linux Journal) Aug 11 06:03:47 although the OM already has about half the BUG modules as hardware Aug 11 06:03:55 hi all. Aug 11 06:03:57 does anybody now about the plans for a external camera for the freerunner? Aug 11 06:04:53 I seem to recall a wrench icon in the top bar that's not there. Anyone know how to get it back? Aug 11 06:05:11 dingman: illume-config Aug 11 06:05:18 opkg install Aug 11 06:05:26 thanks Aug 11 06:05:42 is there a batter monitor applet as I see one in certain screenshots Aug 11 06:06:41 G'nite all. Aug 11 06:07:16 fdisk: WARNING: rereading partition table failed, kernel still uses old table: Device or resource busy Aug 11 06:07:32 this happens to the sdcard Aug 11 06:07:56 dingman: do you have any "leftover parts" after closing the case? Aug 11 06:08:23 no... Aug 11 06:08:34 unless you count the spare batteries Aug 11 06:08:34 well the mediaplayer plays like crap Aug 11 06:09:05 a case mod to accept the open-hardware of the BUG modules would accept BUG modules...including camera. and they use linux too of course Aug 11 06:09:45 dingman: I was just kidding (missing wrench). Aug 11 06:09:59 oh, right. Aug 11 06:10:02 buggy Aug 11 06:10:04 Noo much time lag Aug 11 06:10:17 s/N/T/ Aug 11 06:10:17 dingman meant: Too much time lag Aug 11 06:10:22 too many items Aug 11 06:10:35 Does apt speak sed? Aug 11 06:10:37 dingman: undrwate1 nailed it (you must be running 2008.8, or qtopia?) Aug 11 06:10:59 -qtopia-x11 daily, yup Aug 11 06:11:13 dingman: i've seen many articles on combining awk & sed Aug 11 06:11:41 I don't use awk much, but I love sed. Aug 11 06:11:53 dingman using them together for combined power of their abilities Aug 11 06:12:14 yeah, I know. I just usually sub in other tools. Aug 11 06:12:20 Long years of habbit. Aug 11 06:12:56 Though my co-workers keep adding awk references to courses they edit and I have to teach, so I better brush up ;) Aug 11 06:14:45 dingman: it is really better than hacks with grep to get the Nth column values from output, but I dont use it as much as some Aug 11 06:15:04 Infoport, so is cut Aug 11 06:15:33 Not knocking it, though. If nothing else, the combination of sed and awk inspired the creation of Perl. Aug 11 06:15:42 That alone is enough to justify its existence Aug 11 06:15:58 dingman I had a friend make a solution on one line with awk, sed and a few other bits, five or six pipes at least-- took some concentration to grok Aug 11 06:16:42 The Unix philosphy. Many small tools doing one thing well and communicating over text streams. Aug 11 06:18:25 installed illume-config, no wrench, and no such command. Aug 11 06:19:52 * raster sighs Aug 11 06:20:48 okay, let's do a poll... Aug 11 06:20:57 how many of you are wearing pants Aug 11 06:21:03 ? Aug 11 06:21:10 thankfully i am now Aug 11 06:21:10 should we? Aug 11 06:21:11 ieatlint, do shorts count? Aug 11 06:21:18 sin count. Aug 11 06:21:24 dingman: they count Aug 11 06:21:28 they are just short pants Aug 11 06:21:29 :) Aug 11 06:21:34 * dingman raises his hand Aug 11 06:21:38 hehe Aug 11 06:21:53 ok, that makes 3 people including myself.. and 369 people in the channel Aug 11 06:21:54 * dingman also protests that he's outgrown short pants! Aug 11 06:22:03 does anybody know about an upcoming freerunner with integrated camera? Aug 11 06:22:06 think about that. Aug 11 06:22:12 ieatlint: short too ;) Aug 11 06:22:18 noaXess, I know I won't buy such a thing Aug 11 06:22:22 protest schmotest Aug 11 06:22:24 PANTS ON! Aug 11 06:22:42 dingman: ? don't understand.. Aug 11 06:22:54 noaXess, historical reference. Aug 11 06:23:16 JFFS2 version 2.2. (NAND) (SUMMARY) © 2001-2006 Red Hat, Inc Aug 11 06:23:19 noaXess: no one knows the answer to your question, the next hardware revision is still just being discussed Aug 11 06:23:27 ok.. Aug 11 06:23:37 i think edge is the most sought after feature though Aug 11 06:23:48 noaXess, a couple centuries ago in the USA and possibly other places, you wore "short pants" until your parents decided you were old enough for grown-up clothes. Aug 11 06:23:50 but camera is definitely up on the list Aug 11 06:23:53 nice will be, if there is one external cam ;) Aug 11 06:24:59 ieatlint: thats cool.. Aug 11 06:25:42 right now, the only confirmed feature i've heard is that the hardware will be different, along with the case Aug 11 06:25:56 (that isn't meant as a joke -- the hardware between the gta01 and 2 is basically the same) Aug 11 06:26:36 noaXess, oh, you meant why I wouldn't buy a camera phone? Aug 11 06:26:57 dingman: yes.. :) Aug 11 06:27:07 Two reasons. One, phone cameras are inevitably out-of-date and useless while I'm still using the phone Aug 11 06:27:19 yup Aug 11 06:27:34 worldwide PANTS! Aug 11 06:27:34 Two, and more important, I sometimes work in high security environments where camera phones are not permitted. Aug 11 06:27:45 gov Aug 11 06:27:58 dingman: okay thats good reasons.. Aug 11 06:28:14 but a linux machine is inagine that Aug 11 06:28:22 government, sure, but also companies that are worried about industrial espionage. Aug 11 06:28:35 but if you are on a trip, where you can't get to much with you.. just a bag and your phone.. then it will be nice if there is a cam inside your pohone Aug 11 06:28:43 a camera would allow barcode scanning. its already done via webcams Aug 11 06:29:08 or if you are on a party.. and whant just mae snap shots.. Aug 11 06:29:15 and send them to friends.. Aug 11 06:29:53 or be a technical to take a pcture from a damaged server or router or what ever.. Aug 11 06:30:20 I found use for camera phone when neighbors pitsbulls kept getting out and attacking-- the phone is just so ubiquitous, always with you when you need it Aug 11 06:30:49 Infoport: right Aug 11 06:41:42 speaking of "with you when you need it" - anyone making a belt clip for the Neos yet? Aug 11 06:43:00 speaking of extensions, are there any case modifications available that can hold a nintendo ds touch screen pen Aug 11 06:43:05 dingman: i had brought that up earlier Aug 11 06:43:14 dingman: i really wish they made holsters for them Aug 11 06:43:51 I've got the predecessor to this (http://www.seidio.com/holster.html) for my Treo, and I want one just like it for my Neo! Aug 11 06:44:30 But I suspect there aren't enough people with Neos to get 3rd-party companies interested yet. Aug 11 06:47:34 freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * rac33ed13414b 10/ (6 files in 3 dirs): [opreferncesd] Added phone configurations Aug 11 06:47:34 freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * r3fd8b6a788ca 10/setup.py: Added opreferencesd phone configuration files into setup.py Aug 11 06:48:20 Installing illume-config doesn't seem to have helped get my wrench icon back. Anyone have a hint? Aug 11 06:55:33 alright, i just went from disliking xandros to hating it with a passion Aug 11 06:57:40 ieatlint, I suspect I'd agree if I ever tried it, so I haven't Aug 11 06:58:07 girlfriend has it on her asus eeepc... Aug 11 06:58:44 ieatlint: Oh, that's a @$^#%ized version of Xandros. Even worse than standard. Aug 11 06:59:14 There's a Fedora spin for Eeepc that a lot of my co-workers seem to like Aug 11 06:59:32 the atheros adapter randomly stopped working... spent 10min trying to figure out why (and i've dealt with these bastard modules a lot) Aug 11 06:59:34 ieatlint: i've found it somewhat pulse raising too Aug 11 06:59:41 so i decide to just upgrade all the packages Aug 11 07:00:09 heh... fucking thing fills up its hdd with packages and goes into a reboot loop Aug 11 07:00:43 ! Aug 11 07:00:48 gee... if we're customising it for a small hdd, maybe we should download, install, delete per package Aug 11 07:01:35 had to deal with their shitty ass busybox console that didn't give me du, df or find... so try locating the damn deb packages Aug 11 07:01:44 its a 4gb flash. hth does it fill that up when updating? Aug 11 07:01:56 it's a 2gb version Aug 11 07:02:04 :| Aug 11 07:02:37 ieatlint, on a normal debian system it's /var/cache/apt/archives Aug 11 07:02:45 ieatlint: busybox has du, doesn't it? Aug 11 07:02:49 yeah, and so it was there Aug 11 07:03:00 busybox can have du, but they didn't compile it Aug 11 07:03:26 ieatlint: oh, and it wasn't just missing symlink? Aug 11 07:03:27 anyway, i got it worked out, 387mb of deb files in a cache dir Aug 11 07:03:37 nope, it didn't support it Aug 11 07:03:40 ok Aug 11 07:04:04 i use a eeepc too (in fact, i'm on one now) Aug 11 07:04:18 but i got xandros off of it (and i bought the 8gb version) Aug 11 07:04:24 yuck. Aug 11 07:04:39 actually it serves its purpose really well Aug 11 07:04:40 yuck to the full cache, not eepc Aug 11 07:04:46 oh, hehe Aug 11 07:04:53 yeah, i love it... Aug 11 07:05:21 good morning Aug 11 07:05:31 i connect mine to a 19" lcd with a model m keyboard when i'm at my gf's apartment, so i forget i'm on it Aug 11 07:28:20 in the top menu of ASU, what does the small symbol with the star mean? Aug 11 07:28:42 that next to the clock Aug 11 07:28:44 beni_, I think that's GSM signal Aug 11 07:29:09 i have no SIM inserted and also see it... Aug 11 07:29:17 hm. Aug 11 07:29:29 to the left of the star, or under it? Aug 11 07:29:31 maybe GSM-module enabled? Aug 11 07:29:46 the symbol is a very small rectangle with a star over it Aug 11 07:29:57 s/over/above/ Aug 11 07:29:58 beni_ meant: the symbol is a very small rectangle with a star above it Aug 11 07:30:31 Ok, I would have interpreted that as "one bar" of signal strength. Aug 11 07:30:47 Mine has increasingly tall bars off to the right from there. Aug 11 07:31:04 Four, total, but I'm in downtown Chicago where I'd expect the signal to be strong. Aug 11 07:31:08 ok, then this is most probably GSM. Aug 11 07:31:13 At home, it varries Aug 11 07:31:32 Even without a SIM, you may be attached to a GSM network for 911-only Aug 11 07:31:37 it is ok htat i only have a flash icon and have no way to know battery charge level? Aug 11 07:31:47 flash icon? Aug 11 07:32:00 the lightning bolt thing? Aug 11 07:32:09 yes Aug 11 07:32:11 ligntning bolt Aug 11 07:32:23 means plugged in and probably charging Aug 11 07:32:29 argh, im not really awaken i think :) Aug 11 07:32:48 dingman: even if i am outdoor doing GPS stuff without to be even next to a socket? Aug 11 07:33:08 Doesn't mean it's right... Aug 11 07:33:09 i would expect that the bolt changes to some battery symbol telling me the battery level Aug 11 07:33:26 maybe i try some opkg upgrade. Aug 11 07:33:29 But it charges over USB, so if you're tethered to a laptop it might be true. Aug 11 07:33:44 no, standalone use Aug 11 07:33:47 no plug inserted Aug 11 07:34:27 then it's lying Aug 11 07:34:29 ok, thank you very much for all the information Aug 11 07:34:38 cat /sys/devices/platform/bq27000-battery.0/power_supply/bat/status Aug 11 07:34:43 that tells the truth :) Aug 11 07:34:44 i will play a bit with it hoping that it will work in the future Aug 11 07:35:02 ah thanks for the tip Aug 11 07:35:27 just trying to help. I certainly get enough of it myself in here. Aug 11 07:39:02 'morning Aug 11 07:41:11 ah, btw, i forgot to ask how to get a console back to ASU. I installed xterm, but it doesnt appear on the screen. Aug 11 07:41:25 do i need to add a .desktop file for it manually? Aug 11 07:41:37 or is there a better terminal app available? Aug 11 07:41:38 it doesnt provide a .desktop Aug 11 07:41:57 also irt has no way to get a keyboard unless u install an alternate theme that gives u a manual keyboard button Aug 11 07:42:12 also the qtopia keyboard doesnt provide all the keys u'll need to use a terminal Aug 11 07:42:59 i have a keyboard installed, that is not the problem Aug 11 07:43:06 the problem is to lauchn the terminal app Aug 11 07:45:34 aaah Aug 11 07:45:37 2009.9 is going to rock. hard. Aug 11 07:45:42 then u are just missing the .desktop file for xterm Aug 11 07:45:46 as it doesnt install one Aug 11 07:46:50 okay Aug 11 07:47:06 * beni_ was wondering if he did something wrong Aug 11 07:47:07 beni_, openmoko-terminal2 worked for me Aug 11 07:47:37 install illume-config and re-boot and it becomes possible with a little luck to get a decent terminal-compatible keyboard in that terminal app Aug 11 07:47:48 and it shows up on the home screen so you can launch it. Aug 11 07:48:42 k thanks Aug 11 07:48:55 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/ASU_Keyboard_Toggle Aug 11 07:49:26 * beni_ already did that Aug 11 07:50:11 beni_, I seem to have to select the terminal keyboard right before I launch the terminal to make it work. Aug 11 07:51:05 okay Aug 11 08:04:31 raster, you still there? Aug 11 08:04:42 or anybody else.. Aug 11 08:04:51 ja Aug 11 08:05:00 I don't know what happened, but in stead of booting into 2008.8 it boots into illume... Aug 11 08:05:10 ? Aug 11 08:05:30 i get an illume bootscreen (with sun and clouds) Aug 11 08:05:32 Dave: dingdong Aug 11 08:06:04 Dave: http://pictotweet.com/Detail.aspx?id=81 Qtopia *looks* nice, but the audio still doesn't work :p Aug 11 08:06:05 and then there is an OS with a taskbar and virtual desktops and everytthing.. Aug 11 08:07:06 it has also a button that has the same use as the "start" button in windows Aug 11 08:07:42 does anybody know how this came to happen? i did nothing special execpt installing a few apps like supertux and pidgin Aug 11 08:07:50 Zorkman: dunno - u didnt install 2008/8 (asu) Aug 11 08:07:58 yes it was a 2008.8 install Aug 11 08:08:11 i doubt it Aug 11 08:08:21 but I already booted a lot of time in 2008.8 Aug 11 08:08:24 u flashed Aug 11 08:08:27 oir upgraded? Aug 11 08:08:37 i ididn't run opkg upgrade or nothing Aug 11 08:08:48 I flashed two days agao to 2008.8 Aug 11 08:08:53 since then no upgrade or reflash Aug 11 08:09:02 then all of a sudden it changed? Aug 11 08:09:13 yes... Aug 11 08:09:28 strange Aug 11 08:09:34 i've booted it again now, i'll see if I can take a screenshot Aug 11 08:09:39 mv ~/.e ~/.e-old Aug 11 08:09:49 and restart e Aug 11 08:10:01 (killall -HUP enlightenment) Aug 11 08:10:07 or just reboot/hard reset Aug 11 08:10:46 but anotheer question: this illume seems like a full OS, with more settings that are easily configured than 2008.8 Aug 11 08:11:04 if all the functionallity is there, why is'nt it in 2008.8? Aug 11 08:11:14 settings like set wallpaper are there Aug 11 08:11:17 illume is a module for e Aug 11 08:11:33 it simply modifies e's standard desktop wm behavior to be more "gadget geared" Aug 11 08:11:42 e has the ability to be extended arbitarily by any code u like Aug 11 08:11:48 i.e - plugns/modules Aug 11 08:11:57 so u have a full install of e lurking there Aug 11 08:12:05 with everything its desktop install has Aug 11 08:12:33 it6 was desiced by the designer that in asu almost nothing of e's is really to be accessible or enabled Aug 11 08:12:45 i do realise a lot of e stuff doesnt make sense on a phone Aug 11 08:12:51 buty a chunk does Aug 11 08:12:55 and keeping that would have been good Aug 11 08:13:13 it would need some effort to replace cofnig dialogs to be more finger/moko screen friendly Aug 11 08:13:27 another thing: e seems to be faster... Aug 11 08:13:39 things like numptyphysics run smoother, even with a lot of textures, how can that be? Aug 11 08:14:11 ... e doesnt touch anythign inside an apps window Aug 11 08:14:15 thats the apps business Aug 11 08:16:02 well i can only state what i see, it really runs smooth when i have as much lines in that numpty would almost stall on 2008.8 Aug 11 08:17:06 is nympty's window the same size? Aug 11 08:17:25 when i "maximalise" it yeah Aug 11 08:19:38 hmm Aug 11 08:19:40 very odd Aug 11 08:19:55 it really shouldnt make a difference Aug 11 08:20:09 unless other processes are sitting around hogging cycles... Aug 11 08:20:10 ? Aug 11 08:20:37 rtyler: what do you mean by qtopia audio still doesnt work? Aug 11 08:20:50 you would know that better... i only know that on 20088 pulseaudio sometimes consumes some cpu Aug 11 08:21:05 lpotter: like, no audio on the calls, etc ;) Aug 11 08:21:10 in or out Aug 11 08:21:17 works for me Aug 11 08:21:24 1973? Aug 11 08:21:38 havent tried lately Aug 11 08:23:36 if it doesnt work, i'll fix it up. shouldnt be too much Aug 11 08:23:47 are you a troll? Aug 11 08:23:50 * rtyler grins Aug 11 08:24:22 not sure how to answer that now Aug 11 08:24:29 former troll Aug 11 08:24:31 as in trolltech Aug 11 08:24:35 * rtyler coughs Aug 11 08:24:45 Nokier? I dunno how to either Aug 11 08:24:48 there is no such thing as trolltech Aug 11 08:25:09 hmm.. well.. actually. there is still legally, but they have only one employee Aug 11 08:25:48 yes, i work on the neo device configuration' Aug 11 08:25:56 kewl beans Aug 11 08:26:01 got a 1973 handy? Aug 11 08:26:04 ok, since it is impossible for me to enter my pin I will try what you suggested raster Aug 11 08:26:22 rtyler: at work, and i just got home Aug 11 08:26:24 (the keyboard is a seperate app that take over focus when i press it) Aug 11 08:29:02 lpotter: ah right, you guys are still in Germany right? Aug 11 08:29:49 Zorkman: the problme is the qtopia kbd window has already taken the vkbd slot Aug 11 08:29:52 andis holding it Aug 11 08:30:04 so there isnt much u can do until qtopia gives up its ownership Aug 11 08:30:17 well i wrote the code with a first-come-first-served principle Aug 11 08:30:28 i.e. - first one to take the vkbd slot - wins Aug 11 08:31:24 rtyler: you mean still in Australia Aug 11 08:31:35 I thought trolltech was in germany/ Aug 11 08:31:36 raster, i mv my e-directory as yu told me and rebooted, and now it hangs during the bnooting process: " [90.660000] PM: Removing info for No Bus:vcsa3 Aug 11 08:31:42 i can ssh in though Aug 11 08:32:00 rtyler: we had offices all over the world. two in germany, Aug 11 08:32:05 ah righto Aug 11 08:32:14 Zorkman: whan on earth is going on... i have never seen that. is your flash full? Aug 11 08:32:20 qtopia development is done in Australia Aug 11 08:32:24 if it were e would be bitching about not being able to save config... Aug 11 08:32:25 The important question is.. has anyone compiled ScummVm for 2008.8 Aug 11 08:32:45 raster: no, I boot from sd card Aug 11 08:32:56 rootfs: 53% used Aug 11 08:32:57 oooh Aug 11 08:32:59 from sd card Aug 11 08:33:05 never done that Aug 11 08:33:08 tried it or anything Aug 11 08:33:15 yeah, but it alwayw worked, never had troubles with it Aug 11 08:33:19 only ever tested the jffs2 flashes of nand Aug 11 08:33:53 Still nobody there who worked with ncurses / mouse management ? :-) Aug 11 08:34:13 do you know anything that will bring my 2008.8 back to life raster? Aug 11 08:34:21 flash to nand? Aug 11 08:34:35 i have a working 2007.2 there.... Aug 11 08:35:08 it hangs on starting Xserver (and then two messages about No Bus vcs3 and vcsa3) Aug 11 08:36:12 can't help Aug 11 08:36:14 as i siad Aug 11 08:36:21 i have only ever flashed the jffs2 stuff to nand Aug 11 08:36:25 and never seen what u do Aug 11 08:36:42 its almost as if u lost files on the sd card Aug 11 08:36:55 i do understand there have been reports of sd card corruption due to suspend/resume Aug 11 08:37:05 and i might imagine u may have lost config files form e as a result Aug 11 08:37:22 and thus it's gone back to compiled-in defaults Aug 11 08:37:26 which end up being desktop ones Aug 11 08:37:32 thats all i can imagine Aug 11 08:37:56 k, thx, would i help if I alsek somebody for their e-folder and copied that one to my FR? Aug 11 08:38:03 *could Aug 11 08:38:28 well as such Aug 11 08:38:32 moving it out of the way Aug 11 08:38:36 or deleting it Aug 11 08:38:45 shoudl reset e to system defaults for a first time user Aug 11 08:39:02 as e will populate everything from system defaults stored (As opposed to compiled-in defaults) Aug 11 08:39:08 but e is very aggressive at saving Aug 11 08:39:11 so 1. kill e Aug 11 08:39:15 (killall enlightenment) Aug 11 08:39:23 2. rm -rf ~/.e/ Aug 11 08:39:25 3. reboot Aug 11 08:39:39 will ensure it will repopulate from system config Aug 11 08:40:00 other than that - i can only asssume u have instaleld something that broke existing packages Aug 11 08:40:06 or lost files in sf corruption on sd-card Aug 11 08:40:12 ("killall: enlightenment: no process killed") enligtenment is not even started this time Aug 11 08:40:47 rm: cannot stat '/home/root/.e': Input/output error Aug 11 08:40:48 is there anything on your screen? Aug 11 08:41:03 oooh Aug 11 08:41:05 IO error Aug 11 08:41:08 u are in trouble Aug 11 08:41:16 yeah, white text and black backgroud, from the booting process Aug 11 08:41:22 it hangs on Starting Xserver Aug 11 08:41:27 as i sas beginnign to suspect Aug 11 08:41:34 u may have sd corruption issues Aug 11 08:41:40 dont use sd for rootfs Aug 11 08:41:43 and then i get two messages about not Removing info for No Bus: vcs3 and one for vcsa3 Aug 11 08:41:43 flahs onto nand Aug 11 08:41:46 thats my advice Aug 11 08:42:07 never tested rootfs on sd Aug 11 08:42:25 dont trust it given the flow of glamo related suspend/resume, sd card corruption etc. issues that floiat about Aug 11 08:42:32 too bad one can not dualboot then :( Aug 11 08:42:35 thanks for the advice Aug 11 08:43:58 sorry - but i suspect the weirdness is fs corruptiuon Aug 11 08:44:10 the IO error alone makes me go "well.. your fs is fucked. all bets are off then" Aug 11 08:44:11 :( Aug 11 08:44:15 i guarantee u Aug 11 08:44:24 e reads and wrotes config files - a lot Aug 11 08:44:29 it relies on your fs being reliable Aug 11 08:44:38 e's display is dependent on lots of large datafiles Aug 11 08:44:40 (theme files) Aug 11 08:44:43 without them its helpless Aug 11 08:44:48 do you have any estimate about when the sd corruption will be fixed? (weeks vs moths) Aug 11 08:44:54 it is assumed the fs is reliable and exists Aug 11 08:45:08 in fact even more assumptions are lke u wont screw with theme files while in use Aug 11 08:45:12 e mmap()'s them Aug 11 08:45:19 if u go overwite them and truncate them Aug 11 08:45:21 e will segv Aug 11 08:45:35 as its mmap()ed in chunks of the file for string dictionaries Aug 11 08:45:36 etc. Aug 11 08:45:45 (to save memory and allow the kernel to page as needed) Aug 11 08:45:51 so if u do this Aug 11 08:46:05 echo "x" > /path/to/theme/file.edj Aug 11 08:46:09 that e is using as its theme Aug 11 08:46:13 u are in segv land Aug 11 08:46:41 (pretty much the same as would happen if u did that to a shared lib or executable) Aug 11 08:47:41 anyway - point is.. if your fs is having IO troubles.. e is in trouble no matter what and anything bizarre u see may just be io errors or fs corruption of some sort. Aug 11 08:48:30 do you have any estimate about when the sd corruption will be fixed? (weeks vs moths) Aug 11 08:48:40 no idea Aug 11 08:48:48 as i said Aug 11 08:48:55 u want a working os - run it off flash Aug 11 08:48:57 :( Aug 11 08:49:57 ok, thanks Aug 11 08:54:20 oh well, since it is bugged i might as wel risk an opkg upgrade :p Aug 11 08:56:27 i doubt u'll do well... Aug 11 08:56:32 if u have io errors Aug 11 08:58:51 just for the fun of it :) Aug 11 08:59:52 maybe if i force-reinstall e Aug 11 09:00:57 aslo, almost everything that is new comes from the rabenfrost.net/celltune feed; why are so many files in the openmoko feeds outdated? Aug 11 09:02:21 hi guys... Can we use in location other maps than openstreet maps? Aug 11 09:05:51 pyknite: I don't know, but I do hope so (although i guess there is about 0.1% chanse :)) Aug 11 09:08:06 Zorkman: ok thanks... because in switzerland openstreet map are not really complete :( Aug 11 09:08:19 pyknite: same in my area Aug 11 09:08:39 i have sucesfully used marco polo groser reiseplanner with navit (but failed at using garmin maps) Aug 11 09:09:05 but those marco polo maps only covered the big and i couldn't see streetnames Aug 11 09:09:39 :( Aug 11 09:10:28 but OSM uses tiles Aug 11 09:11:00 so i guess (i'm not a programmer) it can't be that difficult to generate tiles from garmin maps for example... Aug 11 09:13:42 hm.. why do i see a lot of "SHOULD NEVER COME HERE" debug messages when i run tangogps ;-/ Aug 11 09:28:26 yeah everything spams debug messages Aug 11 09:50:15 Aug 11 10:09:47 Aug 11 10:19:14 moo Aug 11 10:20:00 yawn Aug 11 10:20:32 whats your timezone Dave, you seem to always be here :) Aug 11 10:22:19 :D Aug 11 10:22:23 Yeah Aug 11 10:22:35 Probably because I'm in my own TZ :P Aug 11 10:28:33 Dave, http://xkcd.com/448/ :) Aug 11 10:29:47 i'm waiting for a cheap gps http://xkcd.com/407/ Aug 11 10:30:31 Test Aug 11 10:30:35 are there any geohashing clients on the openmoko? Aug 11 10:31:32 o.O Aug 11 10:31:44 geohashing client? Aug 11 10:32:43 lol Aug 11 10:32:50 geocaching? Aug 11 10:32:54 http://wiki.xkcd.com/geohashing/Main_Page Aug 11 10:33:00 -_- Aug 11 10:33:11 * Dave stabs dns53 Aug 11 10:37:27 oh btw, is it possible to get a dhcpd running on the moko? :0 Aug 11 10:37:43 raster: I've been thinking... Can't the openrisc be used to generate a vsync interrupt to avoid tearing? (And doesn't openrisc have a c compiler?) Aug 11 10:40:20 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07specs * r01fbb4502a63 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): otapi: document IncomingMessage(index) in org.freesmartphone.GSM.SIM Aug 11 10:40:28 spdr, supposedly, yes. Aug 11 10:40:46 Hello cesarb :) Aug 11 10:42:01 Dave: hi Aug 11 10:42:34 What's the latest from CesarB productions? :) Aug 11 10:43:23 Dave: ? Aug 11 10:43:52 What sort of exciting development changes have you been responsible for, lately? Aug 11 10:45:01 Dave: mostly playing with 2.6.26 on GTA01, fixed the MMC driver and the gllin compat symlink Aug 11 10:45:57 Dave: now porting the cpufreq code to 2.6.26, but moved parts of it to the cpufreq core in a way which really simplifies these parts and avoids having the drivers depend on the cpufreq cpu driver Aug 11 10:47:25 Cesarb, sounds like good progress :) Aug 11 10:47:52 in the qtopia image, is it possible to get a finger-usable keyboard (ie. like normal phones, numbers mapped to letters)? Aug 11 10:47:52 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07zhone * r2c5ec47e7b0f 10/src/zhone: zhone: s/NewMessage/IncomingMessage/ Aug 11 10:48:02 and of course, we appreciate all the hard work you've been doing in that area, and eagerly await your next milestone ;) Aug 11 10:48:18 zero_dogg, don't you mean, for normal fingers? :P Aug 11 10:48:26 hehe Aug 11 10:48:48 Zero_Dogg, you want something like GTK's multitap-pad? Aug 11 10:48:49 if you've got fingers small enough to type on that then you're probably still an infant :) Aug 11 10:49:12 :D Aug 11 10:50:58 yeah, I've installed qtopia on the SD card to test, but having the stylus always around isn't really an option :) Aug 11 10:51:08 Dave: actually, I'm still working on getting back to where I was (but this time ready to progress faster, due to the cpufreq core changes). I lost ~2 months to real life, and then several weeks while I tried the different distributions several times until I found something that worked (when I stopped, there was only one distro!) Aug 11 10:51:34 Aww :[ Aug 11 10:51:39 Dave: ended up settling on 2007.2 with the "august snapshot" u-boot (because newer ones were failing on qemu) Aug 11 10:51:49 yeah :) Aug 11 10:51:55 I did the same! Aug 11 10:52:16 * cesarb will try to edit the multitap config file to get a > to do the tests (a / would be nice too) Aug 11 10:52:28 hah, yeah Aug 11 10:52:43 cesarb, not a fan of matchbox? ;) Aug 11 10:54:36 haha, micro-emacs Aug 11 10:54:40 sick. Aug 11 10:55:34 Dave: well, the only keyboard on the neo I really liked so far was the old 2007.2 one (recently the fonts on it became uglier), but I didn't try raster's yet Aug 11 10:55:42 Dave: of course, it did need a stylus Aug 11 10:56:39 yeah :| Aug 11 10:56:46 check out FSO milestone2 Aug 11 10:56:49 you'll love raster's new one Aug 11 10:56:52 raster has a keyboard? or a font? Aug 11 10:57:18 (keyboard) Aug 11 10:57:27 ooh hot Aug 11 10:57:32 is it available yet? :D Aug 11 10:58:26 goddamnit, I am going to cc slocate for arm. This is too pissing. Aug 11 10:59:02 sure. fso milestone2 has been released 7/30. download from downloads.openmoko.org/framework/milestone2 Aug 11 10:59:03 also lynx. Aug 11 10:59:26 Mickeyl, features? Aug 11 10:59:32 telephony Aug 11 10:59:33 sms Aug 11 10:59:45 is there a gui packagemanager in fso like in 2008.8 ? Aug 11 10:59:46 but that's not what's it about Aug 11 10:59:56 the dbus framework underneath is what counts Aug 11 11:00:14 Corrected? Aug 11 11:00:34 (for the FSO-image, at least) Aug 11 11:00:50 ? Aug 11 11:00:59 okay Aug 11 11:01:01 yea Aug 11 11:01:05 ~_~ Aug 11 11:01:06 STOP DOING THAT! Aug 11 11:01:10 heh Aug 11 11:01:42 So far fso isn't batting very well with me... Aug 11 11:03:23 maybe it plays cricket instead of baseball Aug 11 11:03:36 even worse :( Aug 11 11:04:26 * Dave bribes raster for his keyboard Aug 11 11:10:22 friggin' gstreamer Aug 11 11:10:44 hehe, just copying 500mb of tangogps maps' worth to the neo Aug 11 11:10:51 ecraven :D Aug 11 11:10:55 why can't tangogps use navit .bin files ;( Aug 11 11:11:32 sad? Aug 11 11:11:57 I heard navit was crap Aug 11 11:13:43 well, it has routing (which tangogps doesn't have) Aug 11 11:13:48 what other programs are there? Aug 11 11:15:22 right Aug 11 11:15:29 but it kind of sucks at even that, right? Aug 11 11:15:32 or complications Aug 11 11:15:38 or that it has bad maps Aug 11 11:16:24 it has osm maps ;) Aug 11 11:16:45 oh, good Aug 11 11:16:53 then why is everyone complaining so? Aug 11 11:18:01 people like to complain Aug 11 11:18:14 duh Aug 11 11:18:17 :) Aug 11 11:19:38 holy crap, what's with all these gsmd plugins o_O Aug 11 11:25:41 ecravens Aug 11 11:31:30 Has anyone here tried gphoto2 yet? Aug 11 11:32:28 dammit i cant get X working Aug 11 11:34:01 masked_: what's the error message? Aug 11 11:35:50 maybe the toast just popped up :) Aug 11 11:37:30 what is the fbset-modes package? Aug 11 11:37:57 Does it not contain any package information/ Aug 11 11:38:57 I dunno, it's just that it fails to be downloaded every time I run "opkg upgrade"... Aug 11 11:39:18 o.O Aug 11 11:39:47 Description: Default display timings and resolutions for fbset Aug 11 11:43:25 haha, wow, EOD Aug 11 11:48:29 Hoenoes, I require additional flash memories! Aug 11 11:52:08 openmoko: 03graeme 07org.openmoko.dev * rac8bb7d7f3ae 10/packages/tasks/task-openmoko-feed.bb: [openmoko-feed] correct some merge errors Aug 11 11:52:08 openmoko: 03graeme 07org.openmoko.dev * r7356d70c8770 10/conf/distro/include/preferred-om-2008-versions.inc: [bluez] update all to same version Aug 11 11:57:40 woooooooooot Aug 11 11:57:47 Later joerg :P Aug 11 12:01:35 re you using msysgit? Aug 11 12:01:38 oops Aug 11 12:01:44 wrong channel :P Aug 11 12:02:06 nuclear eclipse! Aug 11 12:02:10 Now I'll never know what msysgit is... Aug 11 12:02:23 sounds naughty :p Aug 11 12:02:27 Ken-Young: http://code.google.com/p/msysgit/ Aug 11 12:02:34 hahaha, batmand Aug 11 12:02:37 nuclear_eclipse, THanks! Aug 11 12:02:38 nice Aug 11 12:03:23 what's up all? Aug 11 12:03:41 pimpin' packages yo Aug 11 12:04:07 while I'm here, anyone else having trouble (404's) when doing `opkg update` with the new ASU release? Aug 11 12:04:51 asu smells Aug 11 12:04:58 :P Aug 11 12:05:06 like chicken? Aug 11 12:05:39 the ASU UI is just kind of weird ;P Aug 11 12:05:45 no u Aug 11 12:05:55 the arrows to bring the menu down is too small for finger, IMHO Aug 11 12:06:11 nah, it's just fine Aug 11 12:06:20 * SpeedEvil passes chillywilly a jumbo pencil sharpener. Aug 11 12:06:20 ya Aug 11 12:06:26 you can make it larger Aug 11 12:06:34 with illume-config Aug 11 12:06:41 just grow smaller fingers in your next version Aug 11 12:08:04 I don't grok the openmoko media player Aug 11 12:08:17 what's preventing the qtopia one from working? Aug 11 12:08:28 I get no sound with it and it seems I cannot "remove" it Aug 11 12:10:23 chillywilly: perhaps an issue of using pulseaudio, which Qtopia doesn't have/expect Aug 11 12:11:56 Hi there Aug 11 12:12:14 Do you know if there's a parted package somewhere? Aug 11 12:13:09 nuclear_eclipse: can you redirect it to use pulseaudio somehow? I don't know the command... Aug 11 12:13:21 I couldn't read the microSD from the PC so I'd like to alter it from the FR itself... :\ Aug 11 12:15:30 chillywilly: no clue Aug 11 12:20:00 padsp? Aug 11 12:28:48 yeah... mediaplayers... Aug 11 12:29:05 what works? what doesn't? Aug 11 12:29:35 none. all. :) Aug 11 12:30:00 -_-; Aug 11 12:30:42 Thanks madwoota, that's really helpful. Aug 11 12:35:21 Speedevil Aug 11 12:42:40 any news, about the asu? Aug 11 12:42:46 aka 2008.8? Aug 11 12:43:16 it's nice, look at the link of the wiki Aug 11 12:43:22 yeah i tried it Aug 11 12:43:34 but i didnt like the keyboard, because i wasnt able to find out how to change it to a german wordlist Aug 11 12:43:53 but i didnt like the keyboard, because i wasnt able to find out how to change it to a german wordlist Aug 11 12:43:58 yeah i did like the april version Aug 11 12:44:10 dns53: meaning? Aug 11 12:44:52 the classic phone keyboard is easier to use than the qwerty one Aug 11 12:45:01 dns53: the classic phone is waht Aug 11 12:45:02 ? Aug 11 12:45:05 august, you mean Aug 11 12:45:11 ze germanz Aug 11 12:45:12 they're both qwerty xD Aug 11 12:45:23 Dave: :D Aug 11 12:45:39 Greetings! Aug 11 12:45:48 i like the new keybaord, i was typing english texts very fast, but for german sms'es its bullshit Aug 11 12:45:51 and i cant even change it to the old one Aug 11 12:45:59 :\ Aug 11 12:46:03 old german? Aug 11 12:46:10 Hoooooooooooi Zorkman :D Aug 11 12:46:10 theres a wordlist in /usr/share/dict/ but its not the one the qtopia(stable asu) isnt workin Aug 11 12:46:20 Dave: no, the old keybaord ( ASU-illume ) Aug 11 12:46:36 llo everyone Aug 11 12:47:04 there will be noone who can tell me how to change the wordlist ,, uh ?xD Aug 11 12:47:27 have you seend a pic of my 2008.8 corrupting the sd and causing it to boot into pure weirdness dave?: http://scap.linuxtogo.org/ (first photo, id 1168) Aug 11 12:47:30 someone, I'm sure Aug 11 12:47:40 ;o Aug 11 12:47:59 Zorkman, I heard about your plights of last night Aug 11 12:48:22 ah, flights you mean Aug 11 12:48:28 yeah, lazy bunch :) Aug 11 12:49:14 Holy shit, is THAT what 2008.8 looks like!? Aug 11 12:49:24 and no, plights :p Aug 11 12:49:30 nope, that is what enlightenment looks like Aug 11 12:49:44 my sd card got corrupted (i boot from SD) Aug 11 12:49:45 Ohhhh Aug 11 12:49:47 :( Aug 11 12:49:49 and it booted into this :) Aug 11 12:49:59 it even got virtual dekstops Aug 11 12:50:07 yeah I heard you bitching about enlightenment this morning Aug 11 12:50:21 yeah, it looks pretty spiffy Aug 11 12:50:28 but does it run like shit? :D Aug 11 12:50:28 Zorkman: u flashed onto nand? Aug 11 12:50:42 It's raster! Aug 11 12:50:49 i deny that! Aug 11 12:51:03 raster: not yet, because i like my 2007.2 in NAND, but later tonight i will btry to back-up nand to SD card, and install it on 2008.8 Aug 11 12:51:21 :) Aug 11 12:51:27 but not sure if i want 2008.8 at this moment... suspend still breaks resume, and a lot less works than in 2007.2 Aug 11 12:52:18 hey, can anyone tell me where I can get mdbus util ? Aug 11 12:53:29 Raster, I hear your keyboard is teh shit. Aug 11 12:53:32 Where do I sign up? :) Aug 11 12:53:39 Dave: HAHAHHAHAAH Aug 11 12:53:46 it's the bee's knees Aug 11 12:53:46 well theres a wiki page detailking how to swizzle Aug 11 12:53:53 frankly that is not how i intended it ro planned it Aug 11 12:54:13 if asu had used the config the way iplanned u'd alreayd have the ui availabelt o switch kbd's Aug 11 12:54:14 :) Aug 11 12:54:36 i tend to plan many steps in advance and what u see is normally only a fraction of what is actually lurking Aug 11 12:54:42 i like it that way Aug 11 12:55:10 "ooh - you want THAT feature.. well no need for code. just turn option a on, then turn b off, then turn value c to 200, then disable d" Aug 11 12:55:11 bingo Aug 11 12:55:12 :) Aug 11 12:55:20 so it ends up just being magic config recipies Aug 11 12:55:20 :) Aug 11 12:55:38 raster :) Aug 11 12:56:02 scary Aug 11 12:56:06 Mister Master Plan :P Aug 11 12:56:14 bah Aug 11 12:56:15 rasterspiracy Aug 11 12:56:15 not scary Aug 11 12:56:18 :P Aug 11 12:56:21 god, there must be a way to change the.. keyboard worldist man Aug 11 12:56:21 its just thinking and generalising Aug 11 12:56:23 eg Aug 11 12:56:31 just methodical magic by master raster? Aug 11 12:56:37 with some mojo here and there? Aug 11 12:56:37 you could make an option to have some graphical item on th left, right, top or bottom Aug 11 12:56:38 but me Aug 11 12:56:45 i tend to turn it into a series of numbers Aug 11 12:56:53 left/right align Aug 11 12:56:55 top/bottom align Aug 11 12:57:02 hstretch with min and max size Aug 11 12:57:05 vstretch with min and max Aug 11 12:57:05 right, that makes perfect sense Aug 11 12:57:07 etc. etc. Aug 11 12:57:18 it'd look good and work functionally in any view Aug 11 12:57:18 so "pane,l on the left" Aug 11 12:57:19 can anybody hear me, uh? Aug 11 12:57:27 is just a sequence of magic align/stretch min/max numbers Aug 11 12:57:31 Bish, no, we don't understand your strange foreign language! Aug 11 12:57:31 Bish, i can but i don't know the sollution Aug 11 12:57:31 etc. Aug 11 12:57:49 Dave: ..english? Aug 11 12:57:51 maybe raster knows it :) Aug 11 12:57:51 that also extends then to "centered left, left, but fill the whole edge, bottom-left, onyl as big as it needs to be.." Aug 11 12:57:52 etc. Aug 11 12:57:55 raster, so that must mean... your keyboard looks awesome in all orientations? :D Aug 11 12:58:01 and works well too! Aug 11 12:58:04 raster: could u help me :/? Aug 11 12:58:07 of course i agrtee Aug 11 12:58:15 * Dave agrees with raster Aug 11 12:58:16 u dont make all suche swizzle values fileds ina gui Aug 11 12:58:32 in a gui u proviode a basic mode that covers like 90% of what most people want as a stet of common options Aug 11 12:58:35 then u have an advanced mode Aug 11 12:58:42 where u get to swizzle all the little bits Aug 11 12:58:43 raster: could u help me :/? Aug 11 12:58:47 ahs orry,, Aug 11 12:58:47 if lots of config values scare u Aug 11 12:58:52 then dont look at the advanced "tab" :) Aug 11 12:59:03 hah, okay :D Aug 11 12:59:09 might be helpful though :) Aug 11 12:59:31 Dave: and yes - the kbd does work in both plandscape and portrait. it works ok - but if u dont like the layout.. its got .kbd files to define the layout Aug 11 12:59:32 :) Aug 11 12:59:34 Bish: with what? Aug 11 12:59:47 plandscape? sounds like a hybrid mode :P Aug 11 12:59:55 raster: the new qtopia keyboard in the first official ASU version Aug 11 12:59:58 raster - that's nice! Aug 11 13:00:08 raster: where is the wordlist located? Aug 11 13:00:24 Raster, I wish to subscribe to your newsletter. Aug 11 13:00:26 :) Aug 11 13:00:37 Bish: no idea.. qtopia keyboard. at that point my knowledge/interest ceases behind the qtopia blob of c++ code :) Aug 11 13:01:05 raster: would u tell me xD who included it in asu ? Aug 11 13:01:12 nobody really nobody is able to tell me :d Aug 11 13:01:24 raster: when will you develop accelerated ASCII ? I'm trying to build a ncurses phonegui library just for fun, it could be great to have accelerated letters for that :-) Aug 11 13:01:45 whee? Aug 11 13:01:58 Ainulindale: ncurses telephony :D? Aug 11 13:02:12 Yeah I'm bored Aug 11 13:02:25 And I want to build some kind of proof of concept software for libframeworkd-glib Aug 11 13:02:48 :D Aug 11 13:02:56 Bish: who decided to use the qtopia keyboard instead of some other one? Aug 11 13:03:20 yeeees, or why aren't they using both, the old fashioned qwerty keyboard and qtopia Aug 11 13:03:21 Ainulindale: HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH Aug 11 13:03:30 that's hot. Aug 11 13:03:45 the new keyboard is great, but u cant use it in any other language than english Aug 11 13:03:59 awesome! Aug 11 13:04:02 I like it already! Aug 11 13:04:10 >:) Aug 11 13:04:19 hahaha Aug 11 13:04:23 raster: seriously I think it's fun to do :-) Aug 11 13:04:28 u need to change the whole locale (*labgauge) Aug 11 13:04:33 no gui to do that i think Aug 11 13:04:42 .. hm , no wordlist file? Aug 11 13:04:46 raster: and by the way, it should be cheap in term of power and so on :-) Aug 11 13:04:48 Ainulindale: how about... i stick to my pixels :) Aug 11 13:04:52 ah i c .. Aug 11 13:04:54 raster: Yeah you should do that :-) Aug 11 13:04:55 and it wont make a difference Aug 11 13:05:01 as the screen is a bitmap anyway Aug 11 13:05:07 ncurses is just pixels anyway Aug 11 13:05:17 But nice hot pixels Aug 11 13:05:21 Bish: the dictionary is the one for the locale Aug 11 13:05:23 if it exists at all Aug 11 13:05:35 so change whole system lang to french, dict should be too Aug 11 13:05:37 for example Aug 11 13:05:43 raster: though I just tried to make a demo app and it runs nicely and is quite responsive to touch, and quite readable on terminal Aug 11 13:05:47 raster: .. i found a dict in /usr/share/dict/ Aug 11 13:05:50 With the keyboard popped up Aug 11 13:05:58 So I don't think it's as stupid as it looks Aug 11 13:05:59 but even if i remove that folder, there is a wordlist, for the qtopia keyboard :D Aug 11 13:06:00 Bish: thats the system dict Aug 11 13:06:06 qtopia uses some speciakl .qtree file Aug 11 13:06:10 i dont know where it puts it Aug 11 13:06:12 hm. Aug 11 13:06:15 okay thanks Aug 11 13:06:18 illume uses standard unix dict files Aug 11 13:06:27 Bah, I'm going to start mood then :P Aug 11 13:06:29 ie text file with words listed in sorted order Aug 11 13:06:39 raster: am i able to switch back to the old qwerty? Aug 11 13:06:59 well there is some env var for qtopia to not display its kbd Aug 11 13:07:06 if u can find the "wrench" icon Aug 11 13:07:08 and get that back Aug 11 13:07:13 hah Aug 11 13:07:14 which i thnk for asu means changing theme Aug 11 13:07:24 tho really it wasnt meant to and thats an accidental hack Aug 11 13:07:32 in there theres a keyboard config dialog Aug 11 13:07:45 where u can select no kd (default - ie qtopia's does the job) Aug 11 13:07:54 or internal one (illume's own one that i wrote) Aug 11 13:08:12 or any external kbds (like matchobx multitap, or werety or any other kbd apps u install) Aug 11 13:08:13 caveat Aug 11 13:08:17 kbd apps need to:" Aug 11 13:08:30 1. provide "Keyboard" in the Categories list in the .desktop file Aug 11 13:08:44 one of them does! Aug 11 13:08:47 2. they need to put some special properties on their window so illume will recognise it as a kbd window Aug 11 13:09:13 mb kbd/multitap dont have such patches but illume has special code to recognise those specific ones Aug 11 13:09:16 just a hack Aug 11 13:09:30 raster - preach it, baby! Aug 11 13:09:51 i intend to fork illume/e etc. off to have a "better ui" Aug 11 13:10:00 with better default config/theme/etcv. Aug 11 13:10:14 i am actually adding a dictionary lookup back into illume's kbd Aug 11 13:10:22 sounds sexy Aug 11 13:10:24 the way the kbd works it is of course not REQUIRED for all entry Aug 11 13:10:30 it depnds on the kbd layout file if its used Aug 11 13:10:42 and the fact it will be optional and selectable by the user! Aug 11 13:10:44 and i need to add soem so layouts can hint at preffered dict language Aug 11 13:10:56 and i need to allow the user to hand-select their preferred dict Aug 11 13:10:58 is the mokomakefile able to build 2008.8 ? Aug 11 13:11:01 i cant provide dicts for all languages Aug 11 13:11:04 raster, yeah, that'd be nice Aug 11 13:11:07 but i can at least code it to be ABLE to do it Aug 11 13:11:08 :) Aug 11 13:11:12 :D Aug 11 13:11:20 i'll let you users provide more dicts Aug 11 13:11:25 i can probably do some of them Aug 11 13:11:28 german, french etc. Aug 11 13:11:35 raster: the illume keyboard don't show up if the app is in fullscreen mode ? Aug 11 13:11:36 ugggh Aug 11 13:11:39 french Aug 11 13:11:49 VDVsx: correct Aug 11 13:11:53 thats currently a gotcha Aug 11 13:11:58 actually no vkbd will Aug 11 13:12:03 as illume handles the kbd show/hide Aug 11 13:12:05 oh shit Aug 11 13:12:12 raster, is that a bug? Aug 11 13:12:14 its basically a semantic clash Aug 11 13:12:18 yeah yeah Aug 11 13:12:19 well no Aug 11 13:12:25 semantic clash is more like it :) Aug 11 13:12:25 its a difference of opinion Aug 11 13:12:26 ok Aug 11 13:12:27 right Aug 11 13:12:30 app asks for fullscreen Aug 11 13:12:31 it gets it Aug 11 13:12:35 the same is true in the other images so far Aug 11 13:12:39 but now i take AWAY some of the "fullscreen" Aug 11 13:12:41 right so kbd appears behind it Aug 11 13:12:43 and slap a vkbd there Aug 11 13:12:47 app is no longer fullscreen Aug 11 13:12:48 haha some of the "fullscreen" Aug 11 13:12:49 geeze Aug 11 13:12:53 so i am not really honoring tis request Aug 11 13:12:56 ... Aug 11 13:12:57 soon we'll be talking about fullscreenification. Aug 11 13:13:05 :) Aug 11 13:13:16 I wish scummvm had a vkbd that could popup... :\ Aug 11 13:13:24 otherwise how will I ever save my progress! :P Aug 11 13:13:33 with fullscreen also uprobably want 2 vkbd modes Aug 11 13:13:41 one where fullscreen window is resized down to make room Aug 11 13:13:46 and another where vkbd is just layeres on top Aug 11 13:13:52 yeah! Aug 11 13:13:59 layering would be hot Aug 11 13:13:59 and app is informed of what bit of its window is obscured by the kbd to it can "account" for it Aug 11 13:14:01 raster: but in Om 2008.08 I can pop up the keyboard in fullscreen mode,and in some FSO old images Aug 11 13:14:20 VDVsx: that shouldnt be the case Aug 11 13:14:30 raster, yap layerring happens here Aug 11 13:14:38 in 2007.2 when you force the keyboard onto the display, it appears behind the fullscreen app, making it unusable for input :[ Aug 11 13:14:44 raster, if the app go fullscreen Aug 11 13:14:48 and I can't seem to emulate keystrokes into X :\ Aug 11 13:14:49 but i am not runing 2008.8 Aug 11 13:14:52 i am runign the dev branch Aug 11 13:15:06 raster, yap this is newer Aug 11 13:15:46 raster, and what is your idea for the final keyboard, allow layering and resizing of just resizing ? Aug 11 13:16:01 VDVsx: chances are i need to allow for both Aug 11 13:16:07 and let the app hint at whihc it prefers Aug 11 13:16:23 also in fullscreen mode i think i may need to allow for dragging the kbd to another spot Aug 11 13:16:24 raster, nice :) Aug 11 13:16:28 eg slidt it to the top of the screen Aug 11 13:16:30 instead of bottom Aug 11 13:16:31 etc. Aug 11 13:16:39 right now fullscreen + vkbd dont get along Aug 11 13:16:45 i know it Aug 11 13:16:50 so i dont consider it a bugt Aug 11 13:16:53 i've know about it Aug 11 13:17:08 its more of a "somethng i need to address but have yet to decide on the right approach" Aug 11 13:18:09 raster, I think the default option should be, resizing because of the entry fields, but if some option the app can also request layering Aug 11 13:18:10 hmm Aug 11 13:18:37 So ASU is becoming less crappy? Aug 11 13:18:39 maybe its also to do with layering Aug 11 13:18:47 i know when i do fullscrene i also ask to be on top Aug 11 13:18:52 not all apps do that Aug 11 13:19:16 I want to be on top! :D Aug 11 13:20:50 raster, but if you have a screen with entry fields at the bottom and you layer the keyboard in that screen, those fields will be invisible's right ? Aug 11 13:20:55 hjmm Aug 11 13:20:56 ok i dont Aug 11 13:20:59 thats separate hints Aug 11 13:21:11 VDVsx: correct Aug 11 13:21:13 * Dave proclaims raster the Keyboard King! Aug 11 13:21:18 that is why i see the need to have both mechanisms Aug 11 13:21:20 a resize Aug 11 13:21:31 raster: , am i able to switch back to the illume keyboard? Aug 11 13:21:35 as WELL as a way of informing the app that it is obscured Aug 11 13:21:41 depending on what the app prefers Aug 11 13:21:53 Bish: yes- the internal keyboard is illume's Aug 11 13:22:13 raster: ... and how , i dont get it Aug 11 13:22:14 im sorry Aug 11 13:22:29 raster, sounds like a very good plan for me :) Aug 11 13:22:29 Bish: what u are using and what i have coded are different Aug 11 13:22:38 i THINK if u install illume-config package Aug 11 13:22:43 u will get a different theme Aug 11 13:22:51 and the spanner config icon will be accessible Aug 11 13:22:57 VDVsx: so dont worry Aug 11 13:22:59 i know about it Aug 11 13:23:06 i just need to decide on my course of action Aug 11 13:23:19 skins! Aug 11 13:23:22 most bugts people find dont escape my attention long before the bug is found Aug 11 13:23:24 or the issue Aug 11 13:23:28 yeah, the spanner appears if you install it Aug 11 13:23:30 i tend to know about most Aug 11 13:23:34 i just have not fixed them yet Aug 11 13:23:40 or have not an adequate solution at hand Aug 11 13:24:16 raster: yes a different theme, but i sitll have the qtopia keyboard Aug 11 13:25:32 Bish: spanner icon - > Keyboards Aug 11 13:25:37 u can enable the intenral keyboard Aug 11 13:25:47 that alays takes preference over any external one Aug 11 13:25:55 even if the external one is there and running with a window Aug 11 13:26:16 Bish: there's info on how to change on the wiki Aug 11 13:26:23 if I'm allowed to speak to you know Aug 11 13:26:25 barely Aug 11 13:26:27 xt :P Aug 11 13:26:33 *now Aug 11 13:27:12 xt: oh cool thanks.. what do i have to search :P Aug 11 13:27:20 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Om2008.8_Keyboard Aug 11 13:27:31 hvordan går det? Aug 11 13:27:34 but i really like that keyboard, i just want another .. wordlist :p Aug 11 13:27:37 all the way at the bottom "Using the Full Qwerty keyboard" Aug 11 13:27:47 Dave: bra Aug 11 13:27:52 :] Aug 11 13:28:25 is the mokomakefile able to build 2008.8 ? Aug 11 13:29:56 hahaha http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/1f001f29d230b42fa6fefeca472a056c.png Aug 11 13:30:34 thats my wallpaper dave Aug 11 13:30:45 Cincinnati bell wireless Aug 11 13:30:56 hah, oh really? :) Aug 11 13:31:02 yes Aug 11 13:31:14 want a copy? Aug 11 13:31:29 haha, awesome Aug 11 13:31:50 damn, there's so many asu whores :| Aug 11 13:32:06 http://we.trekbeyond.org/~kd8ikt/moko/wallpaper.png Aug 11 13:32:10 what's an "ASU whore" Aug 11 13:32:12 hmm, why the heck did they have to kill the old ui :/ Aug 11 13:32:19 oh ahaahhahahahaahaha Aug 11 13:32:27 imho the old ui is far better than asu Aug 11 13:32:29 kd8ikt: you did steal that nasa/nsa image afterall haahha Aug 11 13:32:36 http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/bc382518637f884336d4464907ac02f3.png Aug 11 13:32:43 nice! :D Aug 11 13:32:56 Could anyone please guide me to a proper install-guide for building/running the most recent image (I guess the ASU 2008.8) on host? Either compiled as x86 or running prebuilt binaries on qemu? I have seen several guides on the wiki-page. Which one to follow? Which is the easier way? Aug 11 13:33:14 I see qemu doesn't really support gta02, is that still the case? Can it run the prebuilt binaries anyway somehow? Aug 11 13:33:28 Dave: awful wallpaper! Aug 11 13:33:28 So pidgin runs on gtk? o.O Aug 11 13:33:37 ike haha, well, I didn't make it :D Aug 11 13:33:37 Dave: yes Aug 11 13:33:40 shit Aug 11 13:33:46 oO Aug 11 13:33:47 I wish I had the space to install it! Aug 11 13:33:48 :P Aug 11 13:34:09 actually dave thats not nasa thats NAVSTAR The Global Positioning Systems Wing USAirforce Aug 11 13:34:16 pidgin rocks! I've even chatted on IRC via FreeRunner. Aug 11 13:34:38 Ah :P Aug 11 13:34:43 hmm, i hate pidgin Aug 11 13:34:46 haha Aug 11 13:35:06 cant do xmpp well enough Aug 11 13:35:19 Really? Aug 11 13:35:24 it can't? Aug 11 13:35:36 i also use that sheild as my agpsui icon Aug 11 13:35:37 Well it works well enough for me. Aug 11 13:35:38 dave Aug 11 13:35:38 then why is there libpurple-protocol-xmpp? Aug 11 13:35:47 kd8ikt, ah! Aug 11 13:35:49 :] Aug 11 13:36:00 Dave: as a placeholder prolly. Aug 11 13:36:03 yeah recently I've been going about and replacing fixme icons with cool appropriate icons :) Aug 11 13:36:14 http://we.trekbeyond.org/~kd8ikt/moko/buildz/agpsui_0.1_armv4t.ipk <-- i think its in my agpsui pkgz i made Aug 11 13:36:16 ike looks like :( Aug 11 13:36:27 Dave: barely works != propper xmpp Aug 11 13:36:57 ronny: it doesn't "barely works". It works just fine. What doesn't work in pidgin? Aug 11 13:37:05 haha :D Aug 11 13:37:05 I know it's not so complete as Psi... Aug 11 13:37:37 although admittedly msn barely works in pidgin Aug 11 13:37:38 ike: serverside transports ? Aug 11 13:37:53 however, it only works half the time in Windows(R) Live(R) Messenger(tm) Aug 11 13:37:54 :P Aug 11 13:37:59 these days im using a good jabber client, anything else is managed on the server Aug 11 13:38:30 i think clientside multiprotocol is bad shit thats supposed to die Aug 11 13:38:44 I'd like to install / run the latest software on host. what seems to be the easiest way to go about? Aug 11 13:39:07 xmpp + transports is superior in terms of implementation and design Aug 11 13:39:54 ronny: you're able to use such transports in pidgin. Aug 11 13:40:01 You're unable to configure them though. Aug 11 13:40:02 ;P Aug 11 13:40:39 ooh la la, well, aren't WE all high and mighty :P Aug 11 13:40:48 However I thought this was fixed recently. Aug 11 13:40:52 ike: sounds like gosh you are able to breath, but lets ducttape your mouth just to be sure you still die Aug 11 13:40:55 Dave: are WE? Aug 11 13:41:10 :O Aug 11 13:41:12 moidah! Aug 11 13:41:24 dave http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NAVSTAR Aug 11 13:41:26 well, personally i hope clientside multiprotocol will die off the next few years Aug 11 13:43:38 ronny, in your opinion, which are the biggest offenders? :P Aug 11 13:45:10 Dave: well, i dont see any point in having tonns of im clients around that implement 20 crappy shit protocols cause some providers wanted to play nih) just have those one be a jabber transport and be done Aug 11 13:45:40 nih) ? Aug 11 13:46:06 Though I agree with your sentiments. Aug 11 13:46:07 nih = not inventd here = the antipatter of people that like to reinvent things that are good, just with whorse results Aug 11 13:46:23 haha, yes Aug 11 13:46:24 whorseu_zero@gentoo/developer/lu-zero] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] Aug 11 13:46:30 fuck. Aug 11 13:46:41 It's a pitty though that some of those are backed by big bucks. Aug 11 13:46:53 So they're not likely to pitter off soon. Aug 11 13:47:16 kd8ikt: loser gentoo developer ricer whores!? Aug 11 13:47:21 What else is new, here :P Aug 11 13:47:24 yup, so jabber transports are a perfectly fine solution to handle it at a common place Aug 11 13:47:27 Sup Lorez Aug 11 13:47:50 roony, sure, just convert all the unbelievers first! Aug 11 13:47:51 :) Aug 11 13:49:33 Dave: thats easy, simply dont support clientsude multiproticol in new products and tell them how to do better Aug 11 13:50:03 Let's be friends :) Aug 11 13:52:39 nobody knows how to run ASU on host? Aug 11 14:02:37 hi ronny Aug 11 14:07:24 how is 20080811? Aug 11 14:07:52 rainy Aug 11 14:08:50 Yes Aug 11 14:08:51 :) Aug 11 14:09:18 Fucking storm :P Aug 11 14:13:31 Torikun: :D Aug 11 14:13:50 Torikun :o Aug 11 14:15:32 ehh, why do I suddenly not have a usb0 interface at all on 2008.8...:S Aug 11 14:16:57 hi, I've got some problems with the lint-wifi ipk on OM 2008.8, First I tried the old rc1 version but this failed because of the pygtk deps, later on I tried to install the new 0.1 version but this fails, because opkg thinks rc1 is newer and it will prefer it, it seems that it is in a kind of cache but couldn't find the rc1 package so install fails again... Aug 11 14:18:23 you could install the pygtk-package from the angstrom-repos Aug 11 14:18:59 Hey Bish Aug 11 14:19:05 :) Aug 11 14:19:07 Hey Dave Aug 11 14:19:14 whats up Aug 11 14:19:21 Extracinting 20080811 now Aug 11 14:19:24 i have pygtk allready installed, but: opkg install lint-wifi_0.1_armv4t.ipk Aug 11 14:19:24 Multiple packages (lint-wifi and lint-wifi) providing same name marked HOLD or PREFER. Using latest. Aug 11 14:19:24 Multiple packages (lint-wifi and lint-wifi) providing same name marked HOLD or PREFER. Using latest. Aug 11 14:19:24 Multiple packages (lint-wifi and lint-wifi) providing same name marked HOLD or PREFER. Using latest. Aug 11 14:19:24 Multiple packages (lint-wifi and lint-wifi) providing same name marked HOLD or PREFER. Using latest. Aug 11 14:19:24 Multiple packages (lint-wifi and lint-wifi) providing same name marked HOLD or PREFER. Using latest. Aug 11 14:19:26 Installing lint-wifi (rc1) to root... Aug 11 14:19:28 Collected errors: Aug 11 14:19:28 I missed a lot of phone calls this weeken Aug 11 14:19:30 * ERROR: Package lint-wifi (parent lint-wifi) is not available from any configured src. Aug 11 14:19:32 hah Aug 11 14:20:23 how can I delete lint-wifi rc1 from cache? Aug 11 14:21:46 Kev_: maybe you can try opkg flag hold Aug 11 14:22:51 nicve kev hey could you paste that again i think i missed that Aug 11 14:23:02 hm, Zorkman, do you mean something like this:opkg flag hold lint-wifi Aug 11 14:23:02 Collected errors: Aug 11 14:23:02 * Package lint-wifi is not installed. Aug 11 14:23:18 opkg remove lint-wifi Aug 11 14:23:43 lint-wifi isn't installed: opkg remove lint-wifi Aug 11 14:23:43 No packages removed. Aug 11 14:23:49 hmm Aug 11 14:24:10 i wonder if openmoko will actually manage to get its act together Aug 11 14:24:16 can someone who speaks french tell me if i order today from bearstech, when will i get it? Aug 11 14:24:51 TAsn: i speak french Aug 11 14:25:09 but you can mail the two people from bearstec (sara aguiton and lucas bonnet if i recall correctly) Aug 11 14:25:13 they both speak english Aug 11 14:25:14 Yep that's them Aug 11 14:25:22 I'll ask him he's on freenode Aug 11 14:25:22 i c. i will. Aug 11 14:25:24 I have ordered my FR there Aug 11 14:25:24 for opkg rc1 seems newer than version 0.1 (because of versioning), so it don't want to install 0.1, but rc1 fails, too because it wants to overwrite a lot of files that already there Aug 11 14:25:35 Zorkman, do they have in stock Aug 11 14:25:36 ? Aug 11 14:25:40 TAsn: no Aug 11 14:25:46 i see. Aug 11 14:25:47 TAsn: shipping is in progress though Aug 11 14:25:57 It was delayed on the OM side Aug 11 14:26:06 also to the us website? Aug 11 14:26:15 What ? Aug 11 14:26:17 i prefer buying there... Aug 11 14:26:23 Ainulindale, OM store that is. Aug 11 14:26:26 Why doest he phone not charge in standby? Aug 11 14:26:49 Torikun: because its in standby Aug 11 14:26:49 TAsn: where do you live? Aug 11 14:26:55 Zorkman, middle east Aug 11 14:27:09 I do not like having the phone on to charge Aug 11 14:27:30 TAsn: Israel IIRC ? Aug 11 14:27:35 indeed. Aug 11 14:28:02 my usb0 interface is gone on 2008.8, what can I do to fix that? Aug 11 14:28:02 i have relatives in the us, france and england Aug 11 14:28:08 so all are good Aug 11 14:28:10 can the input method in the qtopia image be changed to one more similar to the one in the 2007.2 gtk image? The keyboard it provides right now isn't usable with fingers Aug 11 14:28:21 us is the cheapest so i prefer ordering from there.p Aug 11 14:28:22 confidential1: unpolug the cable and instert it again Aug 11 14:28:35 confidential1: they have 20080811 now Aug 11 14:29:49 Torikun: I have tried unplugging and inserting again. Also, isn't om2008.8 the distribution name tho? Aug 11 14:29:55 Ainulindale, damn i need some inside info about shipping to stores. ;0 Aug 11 14:30:02 confidential1: they have daily builds Aug 11 14:30:06 I asked bearstech, TAsn Aug 11 14:30:17 I'll see what they'll say Aug 11 14:30:25 confidential1: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/freerunner/200808/ Aug 11 14:30:25 Ainulindale, thanks. Aug 11 14:30:37 damn waiting makes me ill. Aug 11 14:31:08 TAsn: "3rd week of August is our current estimate Aug 11 14:31:09 " Aug 11 14:31:19 Ainulindale, same as truebox Aug 11 14:31:20 i c. Aug 11 14:32:21 Lots of updates for 20080811 Aug 11 14:33:46 who was having python-gtk package issues? Aug 11 14:33:54 I got a solution Aug 11 14:34:10 me Aug 11 14:34:12 The repo: src/gz base http://www.angstrom-distribution.org/feeds/2007/ipk/glibc/armv4t/base/ has it Aug 11 14:34:16 I use that Ke Aug 11 14:34:37 yes, but pygtk isn't the problem, the problem is lint-wifi Aug 11 14:34:49 what is the error? Aug 11 14:35:10 opkg -force-overwrite -force-reinstall package name (I did that when I had issues before) Aug 11 14:35:15 rc1 version has a problem because of wrong dependencies, the newer version 0.1 has this fixed, but I can't install 0.1 because opkg wants to install rc2 Aug 11 14:35:21 eh I mean rc1 Aug 11 14:35:43 Kev_: The 200808.8 and up have built in wifi scanners Aug 11 14:35:52 I found that Mofi works better than lint Aug 11 14:35:57 and installs easier Aug 11 14:36:16 hm, you mean that one in settings? Aug 11 14:37:00 Yes Aug 11 14:37:20 It has never found anything on my freerunner... Aug 11 14:37:25 Weird Aug 11 14:37:40 and in 2007.2 I used lint-wifi and it worked quite well Aug 11 14:38:36 and I also tried to install mofi, but that didn't start Aug 11 14:39:38 mofi crashs on starting, and the log file contains no output Aug 11 14:40:12 I suggest updating to the newest image Aug 11 14:40:14 starting fresh Aug 11 14:40:40 reflashing? what image? Aug 11 14:41:06 http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/freerunner/200808/20080811/ Aug 11 14:41:11 ah and when I click on stettings -> wifi, there is only "unknown" Aug 11 14:41:20 usually a reboot will fix that Aug 11 14:41:30 no, trief already often :) Aug 11 14:41:35 tried^ Aug 11 14:41:43 Kev_: SInce no firmware is really useable, i suggest always staying up2date Aug 11 14:42:26 yes, thats always the way I go, but I thought opkg update and opkg upgrade does it...? Aug 11 14:42:31 Nopre Aug 11 14:42:43 if you look at the repo files, you will see it is only for your firmware Aug 11 14:43:05 hm Aug 11 14:43:15 so no updates like in 2..7.2? Aug 11 14:43:22 that is hella old Aug 11 14:43:24 not supported Aug 11 14:43:41 no, i mean the devel image... with latest update Aug 11 14:43:49 with 2007.2 I mean the distribution Aug 11 14:43:55 I do not think so, we are on 2008 now Aug 11 14:43:59 the orange one, you now... Aug 11 14:44:13 there was a upgrade to the gtk one on 200808 Aug 11 14:45:11 Is there anything I have to do to turn on the accelerometers? I'm trying the python test program from here http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Accelerometer_data_retrieval but I'm not getting any output. Aug 11 14:45:31 ok Aug 11 14:46:04 i will try the 20080811 qtopia-x11 image later on Aug 11 14:46:07 thanks Aug 11 14:46:24 np Aug 11 14:46:42 Kev_: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Repositories Aug 11 14:46:47 Important for additional packages Aug 11 14:46:52 save that link Aug 11 14:47:27 Can someone else try the python program here and tell me if they see accelerometer output? http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Accelerometer_data_retrieval ? Aug 11 14:47:46 ok Aug 11 14:47:48 saved Aug 11 14:47:50 I think cat /dev/input/event2 might show something too if it's working properly. Aug 11 14:47:57 Mine gets nothing. Aug 11 14:48:03 now I have to go for coffe & cake, bye :) Aug 11 14:50:55 GoldenHawk, how about event3? thats accel as well Aug 11 14:51:26 I tried catting it, and got no output. Do you get output when you cat it? Hold on, trying it with the test script. Aug 11 14:51:50 Nothing from either of them. Aug 11 14:54:44 anyone using 20080811 Aug 11 14:55:06 Torikun: .. man why the fuck arent u flashing it Aug 11 14:55:15 I am lol Aug 11 14:55:20 I jus got done flashing Aug 11 14:55:21 ah i c:P Aug 11 14:55:33 where did u get it.. ? mokomakefile? Aug 11 14:55:57 http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/freerunner/200808/ Aug 11 14:56:06 i snuck in a lil accelrandr.py script in that lint-wifi pkg Aug 11 14:56:24 so... the qtopia image is now ASU Aug 11 14:56:31 no its not.. fuck Aug 11 14:56:41 the.. "GTK" image is now asu xD Aug 11 14:56:43 it swaps display output using the accellerometer Aug 11 14:56:45 and qtopia is waht? Aug 11 14:56:46 asu - gtk _\+qtopia Aug 11 14:56:57 qtopia + gtk = asu Aug 11 14:57:30 ah i c Aug 11 14:57:41 and qtopia + gtk = asu = devel image Aug 11 14:57:56 GoldenHawk, don't cat it, use hexdump....you won't scramble your term that way (just a suggestion) Aug 11 14:57:57 and branch asu.stable in mokomakefile? Aug 11 14:58:54 Sup3rkiddo: Okay. It didn't scramble my term anyway though, because it gave me no output at all. :( Aug 11 14:59:38 GoldenHawk, ah,,right :), try flashing a newer uimage then..there were some issues with the accels a couple of weeks back Aug 11 14:59:54 sup3rkiddo: Okay thanks ^.^ Aug 11 15:01:32 So.. where's the best place to get a new uImage anyway? Aug 11 15:01:43 I'm getting confused by all the different download locations and feeds and stuff @.@ Aug 11 15:08:17 the openmoko jffs2 files in http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/freerunner/200808/ , are they daily builds of om2008.8 ? Aug 11 15:10:48 confidential1: look at topic Aug 11 15:10:55 Is there a developer program similar to the olpc project? Where someone could submit a development proposal, and be sent hardware? Aug 11 15:11:07 or is the only way to get hardware through purchase? Aug 11 15:11:25 summatusmentis: nothing official at the moment AFAIK Aug 11 15:11:59 XorA: oh, ok. I've been uber busy with SoC, but hopefully once school starts again I'll be able to get back into the OM world Aug 11 15:13:57 20080811 is working great! Aug 11 15:14:51 is there a big difference with 2008.8 Torikun? Aug 11 15:15:06 stable so far Aug 11 15:15:56 2008.8 was also stable for me... only that audio broke when comming out of suspend Aug 11 15:16:11 (and that my sd card from where i booted it got corrupted..- Aug 11 15:16:11 what is the difference between 2008.8 and 20080811? Aug 11 15:17:08 before i had a FR i saw almost daily revieuws of images (by kevin dean??) and there always was a recommended one.. Aug 11 15:17:14 too bad nobody's doing that now Aug 11 15:19:05 confidential1: one is official release, other is random stuff from a different branch Aug 11 15:20:14 XorA: you don't by any chanse have some "inside" information about the status of the GSM audio problems? Aug 11 15:20:26 Zorkman: no, I didnt know there were any Aug 11 15:20:37 zhone looks pretty Aug 11 15:21:25 Xora, min are minor: when i speak, the other person gets an annoying buzzing sound. the volume of my voice is also rather low, and whe nincreasing the other person gets an echo Aug 11 15:21:53 other persons have more serious issues that make making a phonecall impsibble or hell to go through (mostly for the person on the other side) Aug 11 15:27:39 Zorkman: oh those, still under investigation Aug 11 15:27:46 Who, what now? Aug 11 15:28:02 What sort of evil things are we up to now? >:) Aug 11 15:28:08 * Dave eyes Xora suspiciously Aug 11 15:29:32 did you know where find openmoko 07/22? Aug 11 15:32:16 should I get serial console Aug 11 15:32:20 if I plug in my debug board Aug 11 15:34:27 SDHC for cheat at dealhack: http://www.dealhack.com/archives/2008/08/4gb_sdhc_card_14_shipped_8gb_2.html Aug 11 15:35:15 ack, sorry, that's SD. micro SD are http://www.dealhack.com/archives/2008/08/sandisk_4gb_microsdhc_for_20_8.html Aug 11 15:37:28 Any idea what's coming out of /dev/ttyUSB4? Aug 11 15:37:45 (On the debug board) Aug 11 15:42:17 Sup3rkiddo: Tried this one: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/freerunner/200808/20080810/uImage-2.6.24+git32+2438a8c74c495c95f5b78301a44ed8e8d0b267d5-r2-om-gta02.bin .. Still didn't work :( I do hexdump /dev/input/event3 and I get nothing. I'm supposed to see stuff when I do that right? The test script from the wiki still doesn't work. Aug 11 15:43:09 kill neod Aug 11 15:51:22 hi Aug 11 16:01:09 hello Aug 11 16:03:38 How do I read the NAND with OpenOCD? Aug 11 16:10:38 can anyone confirm this bug, and help me convince raster that something is actually broken here. https://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1804 I think he misunderstood me somewhat. I have a hunch that the threshold is not being checked correctly. items seems to be activate even when scrolling past his supposed 24 px threshold. Aug 11 16:11:27 my hunch is that since the menu moves along with the stylus, it is reporting no movement for this threshold Aug 11 16:12:24 Anybody know how to use OpenOCD to boot a minimal image? Aug 11 16:12:52 Anybody know how to use OpenOCD to boot a minimal image? So I can poke around NAND. Alternatively, is there a way to read the NAND memory? Aug 11 16:13:04 and/or manipulate it? Aug 11 16:13:13 Hrmmm Aug 11 16:13:31 only when the end of the menu is reached, and the stylus moves away from its initial position on the menu, does it not register a click Aug 11 16:14:15 freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh 07openmoko-gsoc2008 * r572ab3d833b3 10/odeviced/src/plugins/input/ (input-helpers.vapi input.vala): Rename a helper function for clarity Aug 11 16:14:16 freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh 07openmoko-gsoc2008 * r1a075f819936 10/odeviced/src/daemon/plugin.vala: Add a debug message Aug 11 16:14:16 freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh 07openmoko-gsoc2008 * r1979d9124c08 10/odeviced/src/plugins/idlenotifier/ (4 files): Aug 11 16:14:17 freesmartphone.org: 1.) Move the IOFunc callback to C Aug 11 16:14:19 freesmartphone.org: See http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=546898 Aug 11 16:14:21 freesmartphone.org: 2.) TODO: make the timeouts asynchronous Aug 11 16:18:08 hello Aug 11 16:18:09 anyone here? Aug 11 16:18:20 just 403 Aug 11 16:18:24 right Aug 11 16:18:35 so what's the difference between andriod and openmoko? Aug 11 16:18:42 android is evil. Aug 11 16:18:47 Openmoko is good. Aug 11 16:19:21 Seriously. With android, you don't get access to the hardware, only mediated through the software. Aug 11 16:19:27 and only java. Aug 11 16:19:56 and they favorize some developers and are not completely open Aug 11 16:20:45 (and Freerunner is out already) Aug 11 16:21:14 Sup3rkiddo: it's really not - as user-ready phone. Aug 11 16:21:36 but sshing is still uber cool Aug 11 16:21:54 wtf Aug 11 16:23:11 :) Aug 11 16:23:31 kd8ikt?? :P Aug 11 16:33:57 Sargun: I don't know how to access NAND directly from OpenOCD. U-boot has "nand read" and "nand write" commands, and you can transfer data to/from RAM over JTAG. Aug 11 16:35:43 Montour :) Aug 11 16:53:47 I'm flashing to the ASU. Do I need to flash the boot loader to the NAND ? Aug 11 17:02:04 Hm, if I don't plug my device into the wall charger it shuts down on boot, any ideas? Aug 11 17:11:47 tiens, une news DLFP http://linuxfr.org/2008/08/11/24377.html Aug 11 17:13:13 is it safe to pick an image to develop for yet? Aug 11 17:19:48 mmontour, hi =) Aug 11 17:21:21 hmm didn't the freerunner have a *vga* screen ? :) Aug 11 17:22:12 hu Aug 11 17:22:16 mine does Aug 11 17:23:07 so ditch cga then! Aug 11 17:23:08 :D Aug 11 17:23:24 or change nick ;) Aug 11 17:23:25 I am using 20080811, How can I upgrade to new daily builds by using opkg instead of reflashing? Aug 11 17:23:28 gh! Aug 11 17:24:40 Torikum: i guess you tried opkg update && opkg upgrade ? Aug 11 17:24:53 that will not upgrade releases Aug 11 17:25:23 I think the multiverse repo will do what I want Aug 11 17:25:37 the time stamp seems up2date Aug 11 17:26:12 can you use the freerunnner in a daily routine now? or is it still to buggy? Aug 11 17:26:38 bipak_: I am Aug 11 17:26:50 the 2008-08-11 seems the most stable Aug 11 17:26:50 cool :) Aug 11 17:27:03 so you have no other phone, just the freerunner Aug 11 17:27:05 and it works? Aug 11 17:27:05 :> Aug 11 17:27:06 Yes Aug 11 17:27:13 I misses a lot of calls this weekend Aug 11 17:27:22 Hopefully the latest image is good Aug 11 17:27:27 oh ok Aug 11 17:27:29 It seems to be running better so far today Aug 11 17:27:46 http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/freerunner/200808/20080811/ Aug 11 17:28:30 so you can see if a call doesn't reach you? Aug 11 17:28:35 Yes Aug 11 17:28:40 That worked good this morning actually Aug 11 17:28:47 I was suprised Aug 11 17:28:50 :D Aug 11 17:29:19 almost software issues i think... Aug 11 17:30:27 I just sent a message about it on the mailing list Aug 11 17:31:30 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.asu.dev * rb1ee7a63d5b0 10/packages/openmoko-projects/illume-theme_svn.bb: [illume] Remove the leftover from the stable release Aug 11 17:31:30 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.asu.dev * r116b007f0a05 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [srcrev] Upgrade Xglamo with Chris Ball's xrandr patch Aug 11 17:31:31 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.asu.dev * r629c9cfbeabc 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [srcrev] Upgrade Qtopia with various GSM stability fixes Aug 11 17:32:32 great.. daily rootfs Aug 11 17:36:51 openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * r5d2f7fb0cb10 10/packages/tasks/task-openmoko-asu-feed.bb: [openmoko-asu-feed] Add illume-config theme to ASU-feed Aug 11 17:36:52 Does the Neo handle any micro-SD card well or should I look for something in particular? SDHC? Aug 11 17:36:52 openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * re36a542350c9 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [om-settings] Bump up the reversion of om-settings to 67 Aug 11 17:38:09 I've just received the answer to my question in another channel. The Neo seems to be rather forgiving. Aug 11 17:39:36 Laibsch: It should Aug 11 17:39:52 Though u-boot will be pickier than the kernel itself. Aug 11 17:40:02 hi cga Aug 11 17:40:48 Hello! Aug 11 17:45:09 Hi Dave. Any progress on your PMU/charger issues? Aug 11 17:57:26 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/2008.8 - the Headlines is in some weird language :S Aug 11 17:58:51 how do I roll it back to an earlier version? Aug 11 18:00:53 Hi everyone Aug 11 18:01:17 Hello. Aug 11 18:01:27 Can anyone help me to get going with Qtopia on Qemu? Aug 11 18:01:47 spydon: it's russian. Aug 11 18:01:50 I believe. Aug 11 18:02:00 right... :P Aug 11 18:02:03 The image seems to start up just fine, but it just sits there not doing anything Aug 11 18:02:40 (i.e. I can't provoke any reactions like starting an application or something...) Aug 11 18:05:27 spydon: it should be ok right now. Aug 11 18:05:42 ike, nice Aug 11 18:06:26 Does anyone of you use om2008.08 actually? Aug 11 18:07:20 i do Aug 11 18:07:59 Do you have troubles with nameserver ? I had dns working great on 2007 and nothing with 2008 ? Aug 11 18:08:00 i went back pretty quick to 2007.2 Aug 11 18:08:20 peter-b: do you use FR as a phone? Aug 11 18:08:40 yupp Aug 11 18:08:51 peter-b: and it works reliable? :-) Aug 11 18:09:04 but i dont really care if i miss a few calls or something Aug 11 18:09:42 didnt check sms since the update but calling works most of the time Aug 11 18:10:28 :-) ah. ok. So I'll update my FR to 2008.08 too. Aug 11 18:11:03 what is it running atm? Aug 11 18:13:31 om2007.02 Aug 11 18:13:57 It's quite reliable and games are awesome. Aug 11 18:14:25 The most of the time my gf takes FR and plays Net or Maps. Aug 11 18:14:26 ;-) Aug 11 18:14:29 do you still need to push the powerbutton 8s to power the freerunner on? Aug 11 18:14:37 or can you change the time somewhere? Aug 11 18:15:26 To power it up? Yea. I don't know if there is (an easy) way to change it. Aug 11 18:15:34 But it wakes from a suspend really fasat. Aug 11 18:15:36 fast even. Aug 11 18:15:50 bipak_: where is the problem? Aug 11 18:16:01 8s are too long Aug 11 18:16:06 no Aug 11 18:16:14 i disagree Aug 11 18:16:18 im sure 4s would be enough :) Aug 11 18:16:27 8s are perfect Aug 11 18:17:11 for me it's too long Aug 11 18:18:20 ike: ah ok, and in suspend it uses very low power? Aug 11 18:19:18 bipak: yup. Aug 11 18:20:31 ok, so you don't need to power it on very often... thats something i can live with :) Aug 11 18:21:04 who use 2008.8 ? Aug 11 18:21:08 please Aug 11 18:22:02 ike: do you use 2008.8 with dns wording ? Aug 11 18:24:08 erwin: I'm using om2007.02 atm. it's peter-b who use 2008.08. Aug 11 18:24:09 :-) Aug 11 18:25:18 get the new 20080811 Aug 11 18:25:21 dns wording ? Aug 11 18:26:32 ike: ok sorry Aug 11 18:26:54 peter-b: dns working ! Because if I edit /etc/resolv.conf : dns doesn't work Aug 11 18:27:24 peter-b: if I add "up echo nameserver 192.168.0.200 >/etc/resolv.conf" to the end of interfaces : dns doesn't work Aug 11 18:27:28 no problem here Aug 11 18:28:06 is there a dnsd running on your desktop ? Aug 11 18:28:30 peter-b: so I tried to add "dns-nameservers 192.168.0.200" to the iface usbo section it doesn't work Aug 11 18:29:03 peter-b: no Aug 11 18:29:15 what does the resolv.conf on your desktop say? Aug 11 18:29:31 cant work then Aug 11 18:29:39 erwin_: you could try using an opendns server address as your name server... use IP 208.67.222.222 rather than 192.168.0.200 Aug 11 18:29:52 peter-b: It works with the IP of my box (I'm stupid sorry) Aug 11 18:30:28 Because I saw some lines of "trouble" in the 2008.8 wiki, I thought it was his fault Aug 11 18:30:34 thank you two Aug 11 18:30:57 np Aug 11 18:32:04 peter-b: does the location work for you ? Aug 11 18:32:13 peter-b: because gps didn't work on 2007 for me Aug 11 18:32:18 sometimes Aug 11 18:32:35 try the agpsui to test your gps Aug 11 18:33:11 reboot Aug 11 18:34:17 ok I'm going to test on my terrace Aug 11 18:37:12 peter-b: is a gps antenna is mandatory to capt the location? Aug 11 18:37:46 i dont have one Aug 11 18:38:11 mmontour, the script is almost finished and in a working state! Aug 11 18:39:39 erik__: no Aug 11 18:39:43 win: Aug 11 18:40:19 The recent kernels contain fixes to make the flawed hardware not very noticable in most use-cases. Aug 11 18:42:26 peter-b: agpsui seems to bug on 2008 like gtk not nicely supported isn'it ? Aug 11 18:42:43 peter-b: some buttons or only black Aug 11 18:42:57 cga: nice, but the script won't be much use until bug #676 (dfu-util -U data corruption) is fixed. BTW, can someone please check whether or not they can reproduce that bug on a Freerunner? Aug 11 18:43:36 mmontour, well... it's true but at least is ready :P Aug 11 18:47:04 *sigh* My accelerometers just aren't giving me any information. Is it supposed to just work? Is there some daemon or kernel switch that needs to be done before it works? Aug 11 18:47:10 mmontour: i know it fails to -U rootfs on freerunner Aug 11 18:47:53 GoldenHawk: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GTA02_sysfs#Accelerometers Aug 11 18:48:06 torindel: in the #676 bug it appears to work (i.e. no error from dfu-util) but it corrupts the data. Aug 11 18:48:08 echo 1 into wakeup (and no, you don't want to read from dump) Aug 11 18:48:28 erwin_: works fine here Aug 11 18:48:43 idd you install the moko-gtk-theme ? Aug 11 18:48:53 dammit Aug 11 18:49:27 i just did an upgrade with buildhost feeds and now there is no keyboard to enter my pin :-( Aug 11 18:49:31 peter-b: it doesn't for me BUT i used the recommended "plastic cup" and make the phone straigt to capt better sattelites and it works ! I'm realy enjoyed now Aug 11 18:49:46 ieatIint: Neat thanks! I see it giving me information when I cat the 'dump' file specified there, but the /dev/input/event[23] interface still doesn't work. Aug 11 18:49:49 peter-b: Oh ok i juste have to install moko-gtk-theme. Thanks ;) Aug 11 18:50:00 mmontour: for me it just errors out Aug 11 18:50:42 i might check #676 later with kernel Aug 11 18:50:46 that sounds like a different bug Aug 11 18:51:19 openmap is impressive I'd never think i sould be so good Aug 11 18:51:30 torindel: trying to get a backup image ? Aug 11 18:51:53 peter-b: yea Aug 11 18:52:10 did that with dd Aug 11 18:52:31 it works fine for anything except rootfs from dfu Aug 11 18:52:52 dd if=/dev/mtd6 of=/some_nfs_mount Aug 11 18:52:54 hi, i am considering buying a freerunner, q, I do not plan on using a sim card. Other than the phone, what functionality will I lose? Aug 11 18:53:06 benjaminvm: just the phone, I guess Aug 11 18:53:09 will i lose agps? Aug 11 18:53:25 you will will only have gps then Aug 11 18:53:39 but i think there is no a atm anyway :-) Aug 11 18:53:53 benjaminvm: i guess you could help out with the voip efforts Aug 11 18:53:57 so ttff will be increased but other than that i will have no problems, right? Aug 11 18:55:00 i've been trying to writeup a quick iaxclient bitbake recipe Aug 11 18:55:05 kd8ikt: that sounds like something i can handle, where do you want me to start? Aug 11 18:55:45 well, all i care for is IAX (Inter Asterisk Exchange) Aug 11 18:57:22 need portaudio for that Aug 11 18:58:00 and speex both are already in the package list Aug 11 19:01:17 http://projects.openmoko.org/projects/mokoiax/ Aug 11 19:01:39 and we have a digium guy in our corner allready Aug 11 19:01:50 unofficially playing with it Aug 11 19:01:56 kd8ikt: there is a .bb file for mokoaix already Aug 11 19:02:10 oh really? i must have overstepped it Aug 11 19:02:27 thats because he fricken renamed it :P Aug 11 19:02:32 kd8ikt: I emailed it to devel@ a few days ago, a fixed up version of bkruse original Aug 11 19:02:33 iaxclient!!! Aug 11 19:02:45 not mokoiax :P Aug 11 19:02:53 nowonder i cant find jack Aug 11 19:03:47 and why isnt it in the dailyfeed? Aug 11 19:03:51 kd8ikt: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/devel/2008-August/000567.html Aug 11 19:03:57 kd8ikt: because it doesnt build yet Aug 11 19:04:33 bitbake recipe fubared? Aug 11 19:04:47 kd8ikt: recipe works, something wrong with autoconf in mokoaix I think Aug 11 19:05:04 kd8ikt: fails in do_compile because it does -I/usr/include Aug 11 19:05:15 wheres the recipe i cant find it Aug 11 19:05:28 kd8ikt: look at bottom of that mail, there is a link to attachment Aug 11 19:08:21 these fun size bags of chips aren't that fun Aug 11 19:11:20 is there any way to find out how much power a usb thing is using Aug 11 19:11:53 No. Aug 11 19:12:03 zash: you mean programatically on the FR? Aug 11 19:12:37 measure the current draw on the FR battery before and after plugging it in, if so Aug 11 19:12:44 that too. Aug 11 19:12:49 SpeedEvil: bold colon :( Aug 11 19:13:07 cjb: I know - I'm on a different computer and have forgotten the setting. Aug 11 19:13:39 SpeedEvil: Please remember it. Want me to look it up again? Aug 11 19:14:00 Why does it cause problems? Aug 11 19:16:28 cjb: if you bother, I'll apply it. The network appears to have fallen off the net Aug 11 19:16:53 you can infer actually how much power a usb device is using Aug 11 19:17:46 /sys/devices/platform/bq27000-battery.0/power_supply/bat/current_now reports the battery's current in ?A Aug 11 19:18:08 (note that is will continually fluctuate by say 20mA) Aug 11 19:18:33 who was it that could play supertux without keyboard? Aug 11 19:18:38 if you apply a usb device to the phone, you can make a reasonable guess based on the increased draw to the battery Aug 11 19:39:50 SpeedEvil: i don't have a fr :( Aug 11 19:40:18 SpeedEvil: if my laptop could report drawn current it would be asum Aug 11 19:41:37 SpeedEvil: i want to know if the fr can support a usb-to-rsr232-converterthingy Aug 11 19:41:52 mwester: any idea when the kern fixes for 2008.8 are coming up? Aug 11 19:43:13 it can Aug 11 19:43:26 zash, shouldn't be a reason why not Aug 11 19:43:35 i just loaded the firmware to my hta receiver with FR Aug 11 19:43:50 using pl2320 adapter and zmodem trans protocol Aug 11 19:44:03 fta* Aug 11 19:45:03 haven't seen you in a while mjr Aug 11 19:45:34 I have always been here Aug 11 19:45:38 a bit busy with other stuff Aug 11 19:46:04 yeah, me too... finally figured out these numbers on my microwave Aug 11 19:46:26 ... Aug 11 19:52:44 zash: less /proc/bus/usb/devices Aug 11 19:53:32 S: Product=USB2.0 Hub Aug 11 19:53:32 C:* #Ifs= 1 Cfg#= 1 Atr=e0 MxPwr=100mA Aug 11 19:53:54 for example means that (this configuration) of the USB2 hub requres at most 100mA Aug 11 19:54:08 All USB compatible devices will be usable by the FR Aug 11 19:54:13 It can supply up to 500mA Aug 11 19:54:29 Dave, ping Aug 11 19:58:00 err, is it even possible to play the snake game? :P Aug 11 19:59:16 is it easy to setup a bluetooth keyboard for use with OM? Aug 11 19:59:41 Hi guys Aug 11 20:00:00 Is 2008.8 still using openmoko-contacts2 or is it something else now? Aug 11 20:02:23 Lo-lan-do, something else but you can install openmoko-contacts2 too Aug 11 20:02:52 True question is: is the new thing also using eds as its backend? Aug 11 20:03:07 SpeedEvil: oh, i thougt it could only supply 100mA Aug 11 20:03:21 Lo-lan-do, I dont think so Aug 11 20:03:33 tnx then :D Aug 11 20:03:34 'kay, thanls Aug 11 20:03:38 thanks, even Aug 11 20:03:39 now i only need a freerunner! Aug 11 20:07:10 WMI event ID 0x1004 .. too big for IWEVCUSTOM Aug 11 20:07:17 after upgrading.. Aug 11 20:09:08 Ooohhh you broke it DieMumiee! Aug 11 20:09:39 mwester: Oh Aug 11 20:09:42 Did you upgrade everything -- was there perhaps an updated kernel as well? Aug 11 20:09:42 You're hiding ! Aug 11 20:10:09 Ainulindale: Yes, I'm hiding -- My employer seems to wish me to do other things, it's really quite annoying of them. :D Aug 11 20:10:11 hmmm Aug 11 20:10:14 maybe .. Aug 11 20:10:19 mwester: :-) Aug 11 20:10:25 Could I talk to you in private for a quick minute ? Aug 11 20:11:05 is there a way in the /etc/network/interfaces to fall back from static / wep to dhcp / open? I think i've got it figured out in wpa_supplicant.conf... Aug 11 20:11:14 Ainulindale: certainly. Aug 11 20:11:47 or...can you specify a static IP in wpa_supplicant? Aug 11 20:11:52 * kd8ikt wonders if Ainulindale is asking mwester what he's wearing Aug 11 20:12:17 UndrWater: last i checked wpa doesnt do that Aug 11 20:12:31 like all it does it "associate" Aug 11 20:12:41 thought so Aug 11 20:12:46 you either use ifconfig or udhcpc Aug 11 20:13:03 and setup a route Aug 11 20:13:13 no fallback from dhcp to static? or vice versa? Aug 11 20:13:33 nope i dont believe wpa_supplicant does any of that Aug 11 20:13:42 how about interfaces? Aug 11 20:14:04 kd8ikt: mwester is too much of a dude for me, unfortunately. Aug 11 20:14:07 gentoo has a fallback_ comment Aug 11 20:16:35 oh jeez Aug 11 20:16:45 flashed a gta01 image again Aug 11 20:17:11 * kd8ikt stress's *again* Aug 11 20:17:33 lol Aug 11 20:18:10 usb2 would be nice Aug 11 20:18:26 USB4! Aug 11 20:18:52 It's like USB3, but has a pipe to supply coffee. Aug 11 20:19:05 interesting Aug 11 20:19:11 can it supply other things as well? Aug 11 20:19:39 and is it more commonly known as an IV and/or feeding tube? Aug 11 20:21:27 Lint! Aug 11 20:21:50 USB5, so fat, you can send Americans through it! Aug 11 20:22:01 big bandwidth :p Aug 11 20:29:20 i need an offline rss reader or something like that for the mailing lists etc. Aug 11 20:30:08 a Aug 11 20:30:58 hi Aug 11 20:32:59 What is seen as the best (as in most stable, best battery liftime) image out there atm for the free runner? :) Aug 11 20:33:22 FSO milestone 2 seems pretty good Aug 11 20:33:31 If you don't look for loads of hype-super-cool functionnalities, you should try FSO MS2. Aug 11 20:33:50 (I use my freerunner as a day to day phone, and I use FSO MS2) Aug 11 20:34:01 (Which is greatly usable, despite its awful ringtone) Aug 11 20:34:10 (Which I should change but I'm too lazy to do that) Aug 11 20:34:32 seems better than 2008.8 in every way, at least Aug 11 20:34:36 ah cool, I'll guess I'll try out that one Aug 11 20:35:17 thanks :) Aug 11 20:35:30 cjb: I don't think so Aug 11 20:35:44 cjb: it just happens that lots of people (me included) have trouble with 2008.8 Aug 11 20:35:56 But other people don't, and seems to think that it's great Aug 11 20:36:06 I think it's just a matter of what you're looking for Aug 11 20:37:14 yeah, I don't understand anyone who thinks 2008.8 is usable. Aug 11 20:37:19 what's the battery life with FSO MS2? or the 2008.8 got my free runner 2 days ago, so just curious :) Aug 11 20:38:34 not very good because it doesn't have power toggles in the UI for gsm/wifi/gps Aug 11 20:38:45 and it doesn't seem to suspend ever Aug 11 20:38:54 but it does dim the screen aggressively Aug 11 20:38:56 cjb: there is power toggle in illume Aug 11 20:39:01 And it suspends Aug 11 20:39:09 Ainulindale: oh, where's the power toggle? Aug 11 20:39:14 And all these settings you're talking about are .. well, settings :-) Aug 11 20:39:27 Power toggle ? Aug 11 20:39:46 yes, for GSM and wifi Aug 11 20:40:00 Saw that in an illume menu Aug 11 20:40:08 Not GSM though :-) Aug 11 20:45:41 Hi! When I try rescan wifi network in qtopia, it dispays nothing. any ideas why? Aug 11 20:47:29 does the dfu for flashing the neo still gives problems on a 64 bit GNU/Linux OS? Aug 11 20:47:41 it works ok for me Aug 11 20:47:42 pjj__: nope Aug 11 20:47:54 I wasn't aware of problems, I've been using it on 64-bit Linux Aug 11 20:48:02 ok thanks cjb Aug 11 20:48:18 to qoute fromt the wiki "Note: dfu-util seems to consistently fail with a "-62" error on 64-bit Linux. If you have access to a 32-bit machine, use it instead! " Aug 11 20:48:41 url please? Aug 11 20:48:42 pjj__: you might see when that was added, and remove it if it's more than a few months old Aug 11 20:48:52 or rephrase it to "If you see a "-62" error.." Aug 11 20:50:01 well, I think that was added recently. I check (I edited that section 2-3 days ago and it wasnt there) Aug 11 20:51:15 http://wiki.openmoko.org/index.php?title=Flashing_the_Neo_FreeRunner&diff=45811&oldid=45738 Aug 11 20:51:21 2 days ago :) Aug 11 20:52:01 Ainulindale, are you available? Aug 11 20:52:16 dfu-util worked fine on my 64bit linux Aug 11 20:52:24 I could be avaialble Aug 11 20:52:28 It depends for what Aug 11 20:52:32 +on Aug 11 20:53:04 Helping me setup the toolchain so that I can properly cross-compile drivers :) Aug 11 20:53:44 I never built the toolchain Aug 11 20:57:11 -_- Aug 11 20:57:40 Ainulindale, but wasn't it you, a couple weeks ago giving me instructions and then [rightfully] berating me for not wanting to listen to your direction? :) Aug 11 20:57:48 Hi, I just flashed the 2008.8.11er image, but the package manager is not visible and the 2 buttons have no function, is that normal? Aug 11 20:58:45 DaveLab: Yes, for another stuff Aug 11 20:58:51 I use bitbake here Aug 11 21:17:42 are there any videos of multiple tasks like pidgin, minimo and so on? wonder whether it's a good idea to get a 02 already Aug 11 21:22:52 not that i know of Schugy Aug 11 21:23:05 pidgin and minimo work fine on my FR Aug 11 21:23:16 Does anyone know how I can stay up to date with the developer snapshits wihtout reflashing? Aug 11 21:23:21 and responsive? Aug 11 21:23:26 *snapshots Aug 11 21:23:26 haha, snapshits :) Aug 11 21:23:34 no, snapshits is more appropriate :) Aug 11 21:23:35 lol Aug 11 21:23:49 I hpoe there is a opkg way Aug 11 21:24:01 Torikun: :) Aug 11 21:24:06 20080811 is really useable Aug 11 21:24:21 Hallo! :D Aug 11 21:24:22 responsive...it's the first internet enabled handheld device i have used, but i find minimo quite fast and pidgin is also very usable, i've irc'd and msn'd with it Aug 11 21:24:30 hopefully the pppd, pidgin and the browsers are as stable as on a normal pc Aug 11 21:24:36 llo Davidov, you back at the lab? :p Aug 11 21:24:38 cough Aug 11 21:24:43 Zorkman, yep :p Aug 11 21:24:46 well, I have a siemens cf62 right now... Aug 11 21:24:53 rendering pages can take minutes Aug 11 21:24:57 Schugy: never had stability problems with those two apps Aug 11 21:25:11 and opera mini refuses as many pages as the builtin browser Aug 11 21:25:19 i haven't really browsed that heavy pages.. Aug 11 21:25:28 Ainulindale, is bitbake decent for GTK, wouldn't I have to create recipes? Aug 11 21:26:04 dave ou're in a lab, recipes belong there :) Aug 11 21:26:29 DaveLab: what do you mean ? Aug 11 21:26:33 is the fr soc in any other closed phone with full acceleration? Aug 11 21:26:41 Each package you can install on your device has a bitbake recipe Aug 11 21:27:59 can I get the 20080808 gui installer in 20080811? Aug 11 21:31:19 Zorkman, I think you have it mistaken with the kitchen :) Aug 11 21:31:20 Can I get the 20080808 gui installer in 20080811? Aug 11 21:31:32 Kev__: why not just compile it? Aug 11 21:31:47 the package is installed, but not visible.. Aug 11 21:32:00 it's assassin, isn't it? Aug 11 21:32:23 Ainulindale, I'm just looking for the most convenient and stable environment which I can quickly set up so that I may cross-compile drivers for arm :) Aug 11 21:32:38 I am open to your recommendations and suggestions. Aug 11 21:32:49 Kev_ : yes it is assasin Aug 11 21:33:06 Kev_: if it is not visible on the desktop, alter the assasin.desktop file Aug 11 21:33:34 ok Aug 11 21:33:51 Zorkman, how about the features of minimo and the default browser? any functions missing? Aug 11 21:33:52 and how can I get the aux button to lock my screen like in 20080808? Aug 11 21:34:07 Oops, I broke gmail again. Aug 11 21:34:11 Kev_ (hint: you have to edit the "categories", only some categories are allowed, look in other desktop files for what you can use) Aug 11 21:35:09 DaveLab: seriously, either mokomakefile or bitbake are good Aug 11 21:35:16 The one you feel the more comfortable with Aug 11 21:35:19 Hrm, alright. Aug 11 21:35:28 Probably mokomakefile, as I've used it a couple times before. Aug 11 21:35:35 DaveLab: I wrote instructions on how to build FSO with bitbake as an example Aug 11 21:35:40 and mokomakefile tutorial is good Aug 11 21:35:48 yeah, I know a few people who have built FSO with bitbake Aug 11 21:35:53 said it was a breeze Aug 11 21:35:55 I was jealous :p Aug 11 21:36:06 since compiling shit with the toolchain wasn't so easy :) Aug 11 21:37:58 What's the current expected batter life with 2008.8 ? Aug 11 21:38:20 *battery Aug 11 21:40:10 DaveLab: my advice is to start with MokoMakefile. Once it's set up and you've built a standard image, use "bitbake" directly to build the packages that you want. Aug 11 21:43:14 freesmartphone.org: 03abraxa 07openmoko-gsoc2008 * ra09de5cabfab 10/opimd/ (8 files): Initial commit of my work so far Aug 11 21:43:14 freesmartphone.org: 03abraxa 07openmoko-gsoc2008 * r855407389079 10/odeviced/src/ (7 files in 3 dirs): Merge branch 'master' of ssh://git@git.freesmartphone.org/openmoko-gsoc2008 Aug 11 21:43:18 DaveLab, are you Dave ? Aug 11 21:43:31 what formats can the qtopia media player play? Aug 11 21:47:16 * LetoTo is back from Vegas. what's the status on 2008.08 ? Aug 11 21:51:19 2008.8 was released 3 days ago but is still a bit buggy... Aug 11 21:53:52 does anyone know when the neo freerunner will become available again? Aug 11 21:55:41 I think some of the distributors still have some Aug 11 21:56:01 truebox gets a batch the 26. Aug 11 21:56:07 i think bearstech will have some 3rd week of august Aug 11 21:56:54 I'm really curious about the battery life of 2008.08 anyone can clear it up? like with normal use how many hours the battery with last Aug 11 21:57:34 sorry Pjj; havent used it long enough withouth plugging it in to usb Aug 11 21:57:59 ok Zorkman :) Aug 11 21:58:03 should there be updates for 2008.8? Aug 11 22:02:26 is FSO based on the new framework? Aug 11 22:03:07 does anyone know when the official store will have some? Aug 11 22:04:04 benjamin_, are they sold out already? Aug 11 22:04:24 HOw can I upgrade to the latest developers release via open PKG? Aug 11 22:05:57 apparently, the store says they will have some more July 25th. ?? Aug 11 22:13:31 XorA: mokoiax compiled fine for me using that .bb Aug 11 22:13:47 kd8ikt: cool Aug 11 22:14:44 i think i'm gonna take a nap though i'm expremely deprived of sleep Aug 11 22:20:09 anyone here use gmail and is it down for them? Aug 11 22:20:14 yep Aug 11 22:20:16 same Aug 11 22:20:18 :( Aug 11 22:21:10 google i dont let u read my email for nothing u know sort it out ! Aug 11 22:21:12 +1 :( Aug 11 22:22:25 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * r206df24088aa 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: new efl and illume versions - internal kbd now config option. code default is Aug 11 22:22:26 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * rba9d7e0753e1 10/ (3 files in 2 dirs): update efl and illume to match to have default configs as test src and Aug 11 22:22:26 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * rcc2a7a8b2dd6 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: update efl and illume to match to have default configs as test src and Aug 11 22:22:27 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * r1ee02a49efa9 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: up ot 178 of illume- fix window list issues. Aug 11 22:22:30 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * r77254938e5c8 10/conf/distro/include/ (sane-srcdates.inc sane-srcrevs.inc): update efl and illume to have config for removed spanner , asterisk moved, Aug 11 22:22:33 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * r38236d212062 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: ok. qwerty gone. Aug 11 22:22:36 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * r55b6aee312c2 10/packages/efl1/ (ecore.inc ecore_cvs.bb): ecore shoudl really get xdamag/composite support... if its ever used/desired... Aug 11 22:22:39 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * re1eba9994332 10/packages/xserver-kdrive-common/ (2 files in 2 dirs): turn on composite at runtime so it can be used.. if u run a compositemanager Aug 11 22:22:44 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * r293536c32b91 10/conf/distro/include/ (sane-srcdates.inc sane-srcrevs.inc): and update efl and illume to fix focus issues qith qtopia and softmenu etc. Aug 11 22:22:47 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * r89fb094a4815 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: and fix up suspend on initial boot if it's slow. final change for asu release Aug 11 22:22:50 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * read38ec155f7 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcdates.inc: and efl up - get batget changes to handle new "strange" 'not charging' state. Aug 11 22:22:55 openmoko: 03raster 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * re870c78994f4 10/conf/distro/include/ (sane-srcdates.inc sane-srcrevs.inc): update illume and efl - dockwin (softmenu) works better. looks to me to have Aug 11 22:22:58 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * r9a71a0934c97 10/packages/openmoko-projects/illume-theme_svn.bb: [illume] Remove the leftover from the stable release Aug 11 22:23:01 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * r18078e18b060 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [srcrev] Upgrade Xglamo with Chris Ball's xrandr patch Aug 11 22:23:06 openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.asu.testing * rcc04dbc69c9a 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [srcrev] Upgrade Qtopia with various GSM stability fixes Aug 11 22:26:53 what are those messages...? Aug 11 22:27:21 ConfidentiaL, Do you mean the CIA-47 messages? Aug 11 22:27:30 they're essentially logs for svn/git commits Aug 11 22:29:18 yeh, they seem to be status updates for the work on openmoko. Are they? Aug 11 22:30:03 ConfidentiaL, Yup, they are automatically generated commit messages, as ieatlint said. Aug 11 22:31:41 Can I use GPS with google maps ? Aug 11 22:32:37 KenYoung: so when can we expect to get them on 2008.8? Do we have to wait for the next release? Aug 11 22:32:55 ~lart gmail Aug 11 22:32:55 * apt beats gmail into protomatter with the andromeda galaxy Aug 11 22:33:58 ConfidentiaL, I'm afraid I don't understad what you're asking. As far as I know, some, perhaps most, of those CIA-47 messages do concern changes to the 2008.8 stack. Aug 11 22:36:48 ConfidentiaL, Sorry to be so dense. I think those changes will appear automatically in the daily builds. But I really don't know. Aug 11 22:37:57 but last time I cheked/ran "opkg upgrade" on 2008.8, nothing would be upgraded... and that was an unupgraded release image... Aug 11 22:38:35 maybe it's just me tho... Aug 11 22:38:57 are you supposed to get upgrades from opkg on 2008.8? Aug 11 22:39:24 * Kero blinks in surprise as `make fso-image` finally succeeded Aug 11 22:39:35 ConfidentiaL, I think do. Aug 11 22:39:46 ConfidentiaL, I think so. Aug 11 22:46:40 What was the name of this keyboard input technology ? Aug 11 22:47:08 the one where random characters appear and you select accordingly Aug 11 22:47:44 CVirus, I think it's an "enhanced interrogation technique". Aug 11 22:48:53 lol Aug 11 22:49:06 I can't remember the name Aug 11 22:49:35 the one with flying random characters Aug 11 22:53:53 anyone using mofi / lint / whatever with 2008.8 Aug 11 22:55:57 mmontour: cool Aug 11 22:56:06 Though I really just want to build drivers for arm, but sure :) Aug 11 22:56:10 I'll go for it Aug 11 22:56:37 dasher? Aug 11 22:56:41 CVirus Aug 11 22:56:47 indeed, dasher Aug 11 22:56:58 (and they aren't random, unless you're DOING IT WRONG) Aug 11 22:57:08 or typing in non-english :) Aug 11 22:57:59 night all Aug 11 22:58:28 dasher Aug 11 22:58:33 SpeedEvil: thanks alot Aug 11 22:58:47 truste Aug 11 22:59:02 Speedevil, what's going on now? Aug 11 22:59:42 I'm going all retro. Aug 11 22:59:56 heh Aug 11 22:59:59 I found a large RoDime branded anti-static mat, and am gluing it to my desk. Aug 11 23:00:10 I got it when they crashed and burne.d Aug 11 23:01:53 Wonderful. Aug 11 23:02:27 It's got a nice gold RoDime logo. Aug 11 23:04:02 does the front of the freerunner case come off too with a guitar pick, or just the back? Aug 11 23:04:22 Front comes off with a HAMMER! Aug 11 23:04:27 Seriously though. Aug 11 23:04:33 Remove teh back, remove the battery. Aug 11 23:04:35 two torx screws, isn't it? Aug 11 23:04:36 (remove USB) Aug 11 23:04:38 for the front Aug 11 23:04:40 ah, so Aug 11 23:04:42 thanks Aug 11 23:04:42 remove two torx screws. Aug 11 23:04:47 tada Aug 11 23:04:55 Now, hold the top and bottom of the phone in your left and right hands. Aug 11 23:04:59 is there some way in software to work out whether the aux button is pressed? Aug 11 23:05:00 And twist slightly. Aug 11 23:05:06 (and to print something when it is) Aug 11 23:05:31 now, press your thumbnail round the edge of the case, and try to get it to pop in. Aug 11 23:05:38 When it does, work it all the way round. Aug 11 23:07:12 when are there going to be updates for 2008.8 Aug 11 23:09:34 is the "dma2: channel has nothing loaded" error pretty common? Aug 11 23:09:47 should I just reinstall ? Aug 11 23:10:08 the whole screen is black just scrolling that msg Aug 11 23:23:18 hooray for bitbake Aug 11 23:23:19 hmmm... if i tell the usb controller on the neo that it is a host instead of a client, but don't update the pmu to give 5v out over the plug, can the neo still charge over usb? Aug 11 23:23:38 such that i could create a usb hub that also powered the neo... Aug 11 23:23:38 ieatlint nope Aug 11 23:23:42 ieatlint: yes Aug 11 23:23:58 :o Aug 11 23:24:01 i thought i remembered hearing yes, but couldn't find it again :P Aug 11 23:24:09 Dave: Ok - why do you think not? Aug 11 23:24:30 Well, granted I'm no expert, but I thought that once switched to host, it wouldn't charge. Aug 11 23:24:40 that is the battery capacity wouldn't increase :P Aug 11 23:24:42 modify an existing usb hub with a li-ion battery :) Aug 11 23:24:54 The battery circuitry is rather seperated from teh rest. Aug 11 23:24:58 Perhaps I was mistaken. Aug 11 23:25:10 I currently have a moko connected to a usb hub... Aug 11 23:25:10 It's pretty much off on its own. Aug 11 23:25:12 when are there going to be updates for 2008.8 Aug 11 23:25:29 yeah, after spending a good hour looking over usb hub schematics, the power stuff is mostly seperate from the controller Aug 11 23:25:42 the controller is basically data, and the power is just assumed to come from elsewhere Aug 11 23:26:01 yeah, too bad it doesn't have it's own CONNECTION Aug 11 23:26:04 grr ~_~ Aug 11 23:26:05 (mostly seperate, note entirely) Aug 11 23:26:12 stupid usb :[ Aug 11 23:27:47 on the logical USB host mode while getting external power, Andy answered me thusly: http://n2.nabble.com/USB-connector-not-Mini-AB--tp573409p574929.html Aug 11 23:27:47 i found a $15 dc step to output 5v at 1A... Aug 11 23:29:08 Yeah, I remember reading that. Aug 11 23:29:46 excellent :) Aug 11 23:29:53 are there any media players for the fso? Aug 11 23:29:56 Now, if only I can get these drivers compiled tonight, it'll make that whole setup actually useful. Aug 11 23:34:41 Does OM2008.8 have a multitap pad like 2007.2, or just the crappy predictive qtopia keyboard and the one requiring a stylus? Aug 11 23:35:28 haha crappy... Aug 11 23:35:29 qtopia Aug 11 23:35:36 It's all people talk about Aug 11 23:35:39 Oh hey raster :) Aug 11 23:35:46 I was just thinking of you... Aug 11 23:35:47 hehehee Aug 11 23:35:51 uh oh Aug 11 23:35:54 PANTS ON! Aug 11 23:35:58 :) Aug 11 23:36:01 ... well, in the sense that we both share similar visions towards the future of openmoko input ;) Aug 11 23:36:01 i was following http://andreasdalsgaard.blogspot.com/2008/07/openmoko-development-in-5-minutes.html and it works for the calculator, but for the browser i get configure.ac:37: error: possibly undefined macro: AM_PATH_CHECK Aug 11 23:36:04 heehee :P Aug 11 23:36:11 I thought you might say something like that - hah Aug 11 23:36:19 what is wrong with the qtopia keyboard? I find it excellent for text messaging. Admittedly it's so far only in english, but... Aug 11 23:36:28 well, I like a cellphone to be usable with fingers, right now I need a stylus to use the qtopia ones Aug 11 23:36:47 I don't like predictive input *at all* Aug 11 23:36:50 openmoko developement in five minutes? oh geeze, has openmoko already made it to the idiot's line? Aug 11 23:36:58 can u-boot only be updated via NAND? Aug 11 23:37:00 Like Learn C++ In 21minutes Aug 11 23:37:10 SAM's Openmoko.. hah Aug 11 23:37:26 ZeroDogg, well, I'm with you Aug 11 23:37:30 But most kiddies do Aug 11 23:37:31 davelab: it's setting up the correct environment to be able to do development Aug 11 23:37:36 OH :P Aug 11 23:37:38 not like the wiki is useful Aug 11 23:37:41 haha, pretty tricky :p Aug 11 23:37:44 haha Aug 11 23:37:46 hater :) Aug 11 23:37:51 it's totally outdated and completely wrong most of the time Aug 11 23:39:59 nice Aug 11 23:44:34 so, does anyone else have problems with autconf when runnning om-conf openmoko-browser2 ? Aug 11 23:45:25 probably Aug 11 23:46:03 heh Aug 11 23:46:32 I've had similar problems, just not with openmoko-browser2, as I haven't run it on it Aug 11 23:47:16 have you been able to fix them ? Aug 11 23:47:58 I don't remember, I didn't like them one bit Aug 11 23:49:29 weeee irc on moko :-) Aug 11 23:49:44 random nick? Aug 11 23:50:49 heh Aug 11 23:51:11 /kick mokofr2007 Aug 11 23:51:14 oops Aug 11 23:51:36 ~rape Aug 11 23:51:37 vt. 1. To screw someone or something, violently; in particular, to destroy a program or information irrecoverably. Often used in describing file-system damage. "So-and-so was running a program that did absolute disk I/O and ended up raping the master directory." 2. To strip a piece of hardware for parts. Aug 11 23:51:41 lol Aug 11 23:51:46 ~rape DaveLab Aug 11 23:51:47 * apt takes DaveLab behind the WallMart and makes a few grunts and screams Aug 11 23:52:39 mokofr2007: ssh to remote server running irssi in screen? Aug 11 23:52:45 (in a terminal) Aug 11 23:53:05 mokofr2007: otherwise it doesn't count Aug 11 23:53:16 what? Aug 11 23:53:26 no ssh Aug 11 23:53:37 just pidgin Aug 11 23:54:01 meh Aug 11 23:54:03 :D Aug 11 23:54:08 That's right, apt! Aug 11 23:54:15 apt: Who's your daddy? Aug 11 23:54:16 YOU are, Mr Sexy Pants! Aug 11 23:54:20 Damn right! ;) Aug 11 23:54:28 hahahaha Aug 11 23:54:36 hehe Aug 11 23:54:45 Can ya dig it? Aug 11 23:56:02 does pidgin support ssl+irc? Aug 11 23:56:37 Aug 11 23:57:12 * zash wants freerunner for xmpp and ssh Aug 11 23:57:24 and pidgin is a crappy jabber client Aug 11 23:57:51 i know, but thats what i can run on my moko :\ Aug 11 23:58:00 is there any other client ? Aug 11 23:58:55 xmpp/jabber-client or xmpp/jabber-client that runns on the fr? Aug 11 23:59:23 yeah Aug 11 23:59:40 both or either :) Aug 12 00:00:00 loads, and iduno Aug 12 00:00:19 bitlbee I guess ;) Aug 12 00:00:37 how about irc/icq/msn ? :0 Aug 12 00:00:38 ncurses based should probably run Aug 12 00:00:59 oh, included Aug 12 00:01:27 spdr_: built into my jabber server/pyicqt/pymsnt Aug 12 00:01:28 :D Aug 12 00:01:45 but, center(icq|whatever it renamed to) Aug 12 00:02:19 and the libpurple-textmode client Aug 12 00:02:28 and mcabber Aug 12 00:03:06 Damn, I guess it really does take a long time to build the entire OM tree from source :P Aug 12 00:03:36 imagine doing it .. on your freerunner Aug 12 00:03:47 I can! :D Aug 12 00:03:51 * DaveLab is sick like that. Aug 12 00:04:14 The day when you can recompile your kernel on the bus is comming! Aug 12 00:05:06 where are you getting the bus from/to... antiga to norway? Aug 12 00:20:33 soooo Aug 12 00:23:52 mmmm... unhealthy fried chicken Aug 12 00:24:23 okay Aug 12 00:24:27 this is definitely not gumbo Aug 12 00:24:33 hey ruly :P Aug 12 00:24:38 hey dave Aug 12 00:24:53 ieatlint: gimme summa dat kfc, nigga :p Aug 12 00:24:53 DaveLab: where do you live Aug 12 00:25:02 is gumo like a gumby/dumbo hybrid? Aug 12 00:25:03 Daveland Aug 12 00:25:20 nope Aug 12 00:25:22 sounds like a popular cajun dish Aug 12 00:25:24 ;P Aug 12 00:25:30 DaveLab: go get me some waffles and we'll talk Aug 12 00:25:36 for people with dentures Aug 12 00:25:41 ieatlint: deal! Aug 12 00:25:47 I make some pretty bangin' waffles Aug 12 00:25:48 it's a popular cajun dish Aug 12 00:26:00 but Aug 12 00:26:01 this Aug 12 00:26:02 and some pretty bitchin' pancakes Aug 12 00:26:03 is not gumbo Aug 12 00:26:07 hha Aug 12 00:26:09 clearly not Aug 12 00:26:19 perhaps it's just gumby Aug 12 00:26:29 kicking those commie bastard block heads' asses Aug 12 00:26:47 cambells "chicken gumbo" Aug 12 00:26:50 is not gumbo Aug 12 00:27:06 you just named the city i'm in right now Aug 12 00:27:20 * rooly|away should know...i live in the city that has the annual gumbo cookoff Aug 12 00:27:35 best gumbo in the world competes there Aug 12 00:28:10 this stuff is tomato soup with chicken and rice and water... Aug 12 00:28:12 yes, we all think colorado when we think gumbo Aug 12 00:28:22 * rooly|away lives in louisiana Aug 12 00:28:29 i'm only working in colorado right now Aug 12 00:28:35 oh Aug 12 00:28:44 well then :P Aug 12 00:29:11 back in da BAYOU Aug 12 00:29:34 so, note to any of you, if you want to taste real gumbo, find somebody from louisiana, south of I-10, west of the Mississippi, and older than 40 Aug 12 00:29:44 who can cook gumbo Aug 12 00:29:44 rooly, we don't have any of that redneck shit in NYC :P Aug 12 00:29:46 do you have one of those accents that only people from the south can comprehend? Aug 12 00:29:55 ieatlint :D Aug 12 00:29:55 according to most people i speak to, no Aug 12 00:29:57 oddly Aug 12 00:30:02 oddly? Aug 12 00:30:05 CONFESS! Aug 12 00:30:13 * rooly|away thinks he has one, but everyone else says i don't Aug 12 00:30:24 are most people you speak to in the south? Aug 12 00:30:34 not southerners Aug 12 00:30:35 hahahaha Aug 12 00:30:37 yeah Aug 12 00:30:40 lint :P Aug 12 00:30:42 i mean most people i speak to not from the south Aug 12 00:30:55 :P Aug 12 00:31:16 i'm from california, where we've no accent... just a dialect Aug 12 00:31:41 ...i've only met one californian who's company i enjoyed Aug 12 00:32:01 ah, must've met too many californians from socal.. Aug 12 00:32:12 quite possibly Aug 12 00:32:21 there's a big acting rush going on in my hometown area Aug 12 00:32:41 so...lots of californians Aug 12 00:33:05 as long as you're not a homophobe and hate bush (which doesn't mean you have to be a democrat), you probably would like norcal Aug 12 00:34:35 we have wine, mountains, temperate weather, no concept of the word humidity, and an abundance of geeks (and women who like geeks) Aug 12 00:34:38 meh, i don't enjoy the company of the more "flagrant" homo's, and i don't like big-government/big-spending aka no democrats or bush Aug 12 00:35:52 wine, mountains, weather... Aug 12 00:35:59 I'll bring my own woman ;) Aug 12 00:35:59 in louisiana... Aug 12 00:36:15 we have food, beer, parties, and perfectly predictable humid weather Aug 12 00:36:23 can almost predict rainstorms to the hour Aug 12 00:36:35 just need to find someone who'll multiply my sallary by enough that I can afford to live out there, and I'm game :) Aug 12 00:36:39 it doesn't rain here Aug 12 00:36:42 hasn't since march Aug 12 00:36:50 and we have awesome beer here Aug 12 00:37:02 perhaps the only beer style that is unique to the US has its home here Aug 12 00:37:16 what, horse-piss? Aug 12 00:37:20 (unless you count alcopops, light beer, non-alcoholic beer, and bud light lime) Aug 12 00:37:31 steam beer, aka california common Aug 12 00:38:01 oic Aug 12 00:38:16 you can have your beer, i'll happily take my "best food in the world" Aug 12 00:38:25 and the home of tobasco Aug 12 00:38:34 * rooly|away worked at the tobasco plant Aug 12 00:38:36 you keep telling yourself that, but sf is widely regarded as a culinary mecca :P Aug 12 00:38:46 rooly|away, I'll grant you best food in the world down there, but I can visit a couple times a year for that. Aug 12 00:39:15 anyone else getting more than the usual number of 404s from opkg update? Aug 12 00:39:32 i'm not getting any more package upgrades... Aug 12 00:39:36 * rooly|away sighs Aug 12 00:39:39 my os is outdated Aug 12 00:39:44 where is PIM data stored? Aug 12 00:39:48 in the home directory? Aug 12 00:41:19 dingman: it's up to you if you want to use all that gas Aug 12 00:41:37 rooly|away, with my job, I'm using all that gas anyway. Aug 12 00:41:45 ic Aug 12 00:41:51 back to the gumbo bit, Aug 12 00:41:59 if your gumbo is made with tomatoes, it's not gumbo Aug 12 00:42:29 same goes for any "cajun" dish Aug 12 00:42:52 If your gumbo is gumbo, it's not vegetarian, and therefore fails the first test. Aug 12 00:43:12 what about okra gumbo? Aug 12 00:43:20 * rooly|away loves hiim some goood okra gumbo Aug 12 00:44:50 but man, I've never had such good results telling the waiter "there's nothing vegetarian on your menu, so just have the chef make something up that's vegetarian" as I did in New Orleans Aug 12 00:45:13 hahahahaa Aug 12 00:45:18 i should try that Aug 12 00:45:31 Most places, that is an *idiotic* order. Aug 12 00:45:45 what about furgel Aug 12 00:45:45 it's something that's only doable in louisiana Aug 12 00:45:46 I had to be talked into it the first couple times down there. Aug 12 00:45:57 especially if the cooks are black Aug 12 00:46:19 I want to setup 2008.8 on my SD and have so far got some conflicting info regarding how to setup the SD. I do have an up to date uboot. should I setup as fat + ext2 or just one ext3 or ?? Aug 12 00:48:31 i love being from louisiana Aug 12 00:48:41 cause when i go everywhere else during the summer, it's nice and cold Aug 12 00:48:47 wtf Aug 12 00:48:52 ahhh Aug 12 00:48:53 nm Aug 12 00:48:56 lol Aug 12 00:49:07 wyze: do you think 98F is hot? Aug 12 00:49:15 i misread that Aug 12 00:49:24 heh ya, come to Queensland in the summer down here, it'll be much warmer than louisiana Aug 12 00:49:50 hai Aug 12 00:50:03 * rooly|away shrugs, i dunno Aug 12 00:50:06 I second ljp Aug 12 00:50:09 110 with 98% humidity... Aug 12 00:50:28 and it wasn't raining Aug 12 00:50:29 normal Aug 12 00:50:45 than i shall concede to you, sir Aug 12 00:50:53 en garde! Aug 12 00:50:59 *then for you goddam grammar nazis Aug 12 00:51:06 43C is not unhead of Aug 12 00:51:33 OVER 9000 °C Aug 12 00:51:34 lets see, double...add 30...115-ish? Aug 12 00:51:37 43 C is hot. Aug 12 00:51:40 plus, when it rains... it buckets Aug 12 00:51:55 what about winter? Aug 12 00:52:16 i live in scary place where it's about 17c all year around Aug 12 00:52:19 today is going to be about 20c. and its been cold. barely gets down to 4c Aug 12 00:52:21 really hot.. Aug 12 00:52:45 but the top end is different Aug 12 00:53:11 you could make a random number generator off of the louisiana winter temp measurements Aug 12 00:54:01 i've gone for weeks at a time where it's cycled in a day from 38F to 90F and back again Aug 12 00:54:04 quite fun Aug 12 00:54:13 with 98% humidity Aug 12 00:54:21 don't forget that constant Aug 12 00:54:39 and there's always a north wind in the winter, making it freezing colde at 40 Aug 12 00:55:33 anyway, enough about me Aug 12 00:55:37 more about the NEO Aug 12 00:55:38 bah! thats for nothing on Fairbanks Aug 12 00:55:54 thats got, that is :) Aug 12 00:57:41 why are the modules in the modules-2.6.24+*.tgz so big compared to the modules contained in the rootfs? Aug 12 00:57:55 can someone please give me a definitive as to how an SD should be partitioned/formatted to install and uboot a 2008.8 stack ? Aug 12 00:59:56 hipitihop: if its new uboot one ext partition will be fine Aug 12 01:00:20 if its stock uboot you need fat partition for kernel Aug 12 01:01:19 torindel, I have an updated uboot, so you are saying create one ext3 partion on sd ? Aug 12 01:01:42 get ext2 Aug 12 01:01:51 as it wont have journall Aug 12 01:02:05 do noatime also Aug 12 01:02:38 torindel, ok but don't I have to fluff with the uboot menu ? Aug 12 01:02:51 hipitihop: yep you have Aug 12 01:03:31 just get some terminal/modem program and connect with it via usb while in uboot Aug 12 01:03:34 torindel, is that the only way ? I was hoping to avoid all the setenv stuff, still a noob Aug 12 01:04:04 well if you're afraid you brake something you can always backup your current settings Aug 12 01:04:30 hipitihop: dfu-util -a u-boot_env -R -U good-u-boot_env.bin Aug 12 01:04:38 to save your current env Aug 12 01:04:58 ieatmint Aug 12 01:05:21 hipitihop: dfu-util -a u-boot_env -R -D good-u-boot_env.bin <- to write it back when you broke it Aug 12 01:05:43 (you just use nor uboot for that) Aug 12 01:06:21 torindel, thanks will do, not so much about breaking, just the wiki instructions seem a little involved but I'll have a go. Aug 12 01:07:02 torindel, they (wiki) talks about FAT+ext3 or FAT+ext2 or ext2+ext2 so I'm somewhat puzzled. Aug 12 01:07:24 just setup ext2 + nothing ;] Aug 12 01:08:35 hipitihop: just look at printenv Aug 12 01:09:09 torindel, so with one ext2 I don't need the .bin only the rootfs untared ? or both ? Aug 12 01:09:27 and add second entry exacly like that but useing ext2load on first partition and specifiing first partition as root Aug 12 01:10:07 normally only rootfs as most of them have kernels anyway Aug 12 01:10:21 just set it up to look for kernel in /boot instead of / Aug 12 01:10:58 torindel, I think I follow, I guess it will make more sense as I go through the steps. thanks Aug 12 01:11:14 * hipitihop crosses his noob fingers Aug 12 01:11:22 hipitihop: just look at printenv when you connect to uboot Aug 12 01:11:34 and add simmilar entry with ext2load Aug 12 01:11:50 changeing all partition numbers to first Aug 12 01:12:50 if I have existing SD setup with 8mg fat + ext2 can I just ingore the fat and go with what I already have on the ext2 ? (rootfs) Aug 12 01:13:13 yep Aug 12 01:13:24 just specify second partition then Aug 12 01:13:39 not that I mind starting over but seems like redundant copying about Aug 12 01:13:54 e.g. ext2load mmc 2 blablabla Aug 12 01:21:21 does anyone know why the daily builds of 2008.8 on buildhost.openmoko.org have a flower wallpaper and no installer? Aug 12 01:21:50 am i grabbing the wrong image? Aug 12 01:33:01 Pyrasi: buildhost does not contain 2008.08 Aug 12 01:33:41 XorA|gone, roh: Please get someone to remove all qtopia-x11 images from buildhost until buildhost is able to build them from the correct branch Aug 12 01:34:04 There is enough confusion about images without Openmoko itself adding to the confusion! Aug 12 01:34:46 thats crazy u know it seems almost on purpose Aug 12 01:34:56 oh...so what did I just get? Cause it seems to be more functional than 2008.8.... Aug 12 01:35:11 20080808 Aug 12 01:35:23 20080811? Aug 12 01:35:45 the flower is fso i thought Aug 12 01:35:55 wow. thats confusing Aug 12 01:36:24 yea...i mean thats what i downloaded....20080811...but is it just supposed to be the old ASU builds (prior to the 2008.8 release)? Aug 12 01:36:24 * ljp adds to the confision by starting a qtopia-x11 without efl :) Aug 12 01:36:25 has zhone an a working gps Aug 12 01:36:49 this does not have zhone....so im assuming it is not FSO Aug 12 01:36:54 what the fuck? Aug 12 01:36:55 ok Aug 12 01:37:07 What cheannel is this? Aug 12 01:37:12 time to merge Aug 12 01:37:23 lol Aug 12 01:37:32 lots o losers Aug 12 01:37:58 okay...well im gonna try this strange build that no one knows what it is out....cause it looks pretty functional Aug 12 01:38:10 and has daily updates Aug 12 01:38:17 which is more than i can say for 2008.8 Aug 12 01:38:25 is the daily build of 2008.8 working the phone yet? Aug 12 01:38:32 ljp: you need a three-letter acronym for it to start anything Aug 12 01:38:45 qtx Aug 12 01:38:48 bbq Aug 12 01:38:58 wtf Aug 12 01:39:02 OPM Aug 12 01:39:25 OPMO Aug 12 01:39:30 omg Aug 12 01:39:35 Pyrasi: what you got is a daily build of the org.openmoko.dev branch, which is different from the org.openmoko.asu.* branches Aug 12 01:39:53 mine had no terminal Aug 12 01:39:53 That 08/11 build is running quite nicely, actually Aug 12 01:39:54 effectively, you got a daily build of 2007.2 Aug 12 01:40:17 cthobs the phone work well? Aug 12 01:40:21 2007.2 with an ASU interface? Aug 12 01:40:21 but really, you got an abortion of a complete configuration management screwup Aug 12 01:40:55 oh yea? is there some reason i shouldnt be using it? Aug 12 01:40:58 and the fact that Openmoko know about this, but continue to do nothing about it EVEN AFTER 2008.08 IS RELEASED is reprehensible. Aug 12 01:41:02 Yeah, I loaded the Qtopia image from there dated today (I think). It goes into stand by, wakes on call, etc. Missing an installer and a term, but working well so far Aug 12 01:41:26 * wyze has his phone working with debian lenny :D Aug 12 01:41:33 yea...im with cthobs. AND the Settings program has a function wifi section! Aug 12 01:41:33 Pyrasi: you can use anything you like, but don't expect it to have any relationship to the image called 2008.08 Aug 12 01:41:47 Is the 2008.08 image better that that? Aug 12 01:42:04 all images are better than others in some areas and worse in others. Aug 12 01:42:15 it's a complete dog's breakfast Aug 12 01:42:26 rwhitby hum? why are that packages there? Aug 12 01:42:26 * ljp ports S60 to neo for extra added confusion Aug 12 01:42:51 roh: *please* remove all qtopia-x11 images from buildhost Aug 12 01:42:54 rwhitby thats indeed bad... hm.. somebody should propably open a bug about that for the distro team Aug 12 01:42:55 rwhitby: thanks for your answers. If you dont mind, could you explain the difference between 2008.8 and this? is this one the old ASU dev branch prior to 2008.8 or something? Aug 12 01:43:12 in what stage is openmoko and FR related to "consumer friendly use" ? Aug 12 01:43:15 Pyrasi: this one is from the branch that built 2007.2 Aug 12 01:43:22 rwhitby not of much gain.. i dunno why the get built at all, so they would be just rebuilt Aug 12 01:43:35 I had a daily build of that qtopia on my phone for a few days last week, now I have 2008.8, I find 2008.8 to be better than that image, the should pull them or replace them with a proper asu.dev image Aug 12 01:44:03 roh: yeah, whoever maintains the buildhost build script needs to stop them being built, and *then* all existing images should be removed Aug 12 01:44:20 and a daily of org.openmoko.asu.testing should be built instead Aug 12 01:44:21 i haven't followed the mailing list lately very carefully but all that wikipedia & openmoko.com say is that it's "intended for technically skilled consumers" Aug 12 01:44:38 is there a daily version of 2008.8 released? Aug 12 01:45:10 roh: sorry for the strong language on this, but it's been going on for too long, with too many OM people knowing about it, and nothing being done about it. Aug 12 01:45:30 piksi: openmoko isnt quite ready for end users yet. Wait a couple months and the software will be more mature =) Aug 12 01:45:34 bear down whitby Aug 12 01:46:14 linuxxr: ? Aug 12 01:47:01 put the pressure on em Aug 12 01:47:31 they said they need us to tell them wat to do ... so tell them Aug 12 01:47:42 rwhitby: is there a daily version of 2008.8 i can download instead? Aug 12 01:47:56 need better organization Aug 12 01:49:02 Pyrasi: not that I know of Aug 12 01:49:14 roh: I just raised https://admin-trac.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1502 Aug 12 01:50:04 where does the FR store it's PIM? Aug 12 01:50:31 and http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1809 for good measure Aug 12 01:51:41 Pyrasi: does that mean i get an usable phone by christmas? ;-) Aug 12 01:52:46 piksi: God willing =). To tell you the truth....its close to a usable phone atm....but it takes alot of work to get it there....definately not good for an end user. So id say wait a couple months and check back =) Aug 12 01:52:57 rwhitby thanks anyways... Aug 12 01:53:18 rwhitby should go into the other bugtracker i think, but still valid Aug 12 01:56:13 roh: I put it in both, so no-one can say they didn't see it ;-) Aug 12 01:56:45 https://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1810 Aug 12 01:56:54 i didn't catch an answer to my question Aug 12 01:56:57 was otherwise occupied Aug 12 01:58:51 * rooly|away slaps xhrit Aug 12 01:59:26 rwhitby i think the main problem is that people have the wrong feeds on the wrong branches builds installed. Aug 12 01:59:30 even by default propably Aug 12 02:00:18 as long as org.openmoko.dev org.openmoko.asu.dev and org.openmoko.asu.stable are not merged properly mixing feeds gives unreliable results anyways Aug 12 02:00:44 roh: I think the real problem is that there is no clear direction that end-users should be testing *this* image with *these* feeds, since such a decision could easily be encoded into the images by the distro team. Aug 12 02:01:17 rwhitby ack. Aug 12 02:01:26 and also be documented Aug 12 02:01:48 i remember some 'is compatible with' flag which somebody wanted to add to opkg Aug 12 02:01:52 Someone in authority in OM needs to say "Our daily builds should be done from the org.openmoko.asu.testing branch, should include only the qtopia-x11 images, and feeds should also be built from that branch using sane-srcrevs only" Aug 12 02:02:07 so feeds could be identified if compatible or not (with manual override of course) Aug 12 02:02:19 Then that decision by that person should be properly rolled out to buildhost. Aug 12 02:02:29 rwhitby please add that to the ticket. Aug 12 02:03:01 in fact i think we should provide all trees as extra builds with extra feeds for now (till the branches get merged) Aug 12 02:03:05 Done. Aug 12 02:03:42 the only people running .dev should be people who know how to build .dev from source. everyone else should be part of the QA testing of .testing Aug 12 02:04:21 daily images should never be created from .dev, only from .testing, and stuff on downloads should come from .stable only Aug 12 02:05:09 rwhitby, that seems like a good idea. Aug 12 02:05:30 dingman: I've run the nslu2-linux.org project that way for 4 years, and it works well. Aug 12 02:06:04 rwhitby i think so... xora is the buildhost/disto person Aug 12 02:06:57 rwhitby i can tell you that much that the devels are aware of 'its a mess' Aug 12 02:06:59 yeah, but XorA|gone is not the decision maker - he's following orders from above on what to build and release on buildhost as far as I know. Aug 12 02:07:31 and we will clean it up.. its just diffcult to explain people who make decisions how building a working distro works Aug 12 02:07:49 but we had a discussion about that scheduled for monday afaik Aug 12 02:08:41 and we already know that 2008.9 should be a bugfix only release for 2008.8 (even when some of the devs would rather have named it 2008.8.1 but that wasnt explainable to management) Aug 12 02:09:05 bbl (lunch) Aug 12 02:09:23 roh: thx for listening. Aug 12 02:09:28 Still, for what little it's worth, I'd appreciate a bit of clarity. I'll run anything from what I just patched myself to Debian Oldstable on the right system, but it's a lot easier when I know what the labels mean. Aug 12 02:10:04 alright, seriously Aug 12 02:10:23 the default keyboard for 2008.8 needs a backspace button Aug 12 02:11:09 rooly|away, swipe left Aug 12 02:11:16 orly Aug 12 02:11:24 yep Aug 12 02:11:39 sorry, that was my name typo'ed Aug 12 02:12:12 ok Aug 12 02:15:04 hey roh :) Aug 12 02:16:57 sweet! Aug 12 02:17:10 * rooly|away is snickering at dingman for actually believing that Aug 12 02:17:39 which - labels or the backspace ;) Aug 12 02:17:47 I've seen both fail... Aug 12 02:18:21 but I also run 'unstable' 'caus it seems to break les than 'testing' :) Aug 12 02:20:36 food sounds good Aug 12 02:21:03 is there a usable finger keyboard? Aug 12 02:28:22 if your patient, summatusmentis Aug 12 02:28:49 hehe, and have very small fingers :D Aug 12 02:29:50 * rooly|away agrees to a poing... Aug 12 02:29:54 better keyboard is needed Aug 12 02:30:08 Is there someway to redo the uboot if you somehow (hypothetically) brick it? Aug 12 02:31:05 genii, gta01 or gta02? Aug 12 02:31:29 more raster is needed. Aug 12 02:31:42 dingman: Don't know. Say gta02 Aug 12 02:31:58 02 you can't Aug 12 02:32:07 without a debug board brick it. Aug 12 02:32:08 Hmm Aug 12 02:32:18 gta02 has two uboots, so if you brick the one in NAND you can re-flash by booting into NOR Aug 12 02:32:19 unless you try real hard. (flash it several thousand times) Aug 12 02:32:33 In which case you'll need to always boot from NOR Aug 12 02:33:22 So I'll likely need a dboard then for this:? Aug 12 02:33:49 if you completely fuck it up, sure :D Aug 12 02:34:05 genii, either that or steal one from the 'lanteans ;) Aug 12 02:34:09 genii, as I understand it, that's pretty hard to do to the gta02 Aug 12 02:34:35 Crap. The seller in my location doesn't carry the debug boards yet Aug 12 02:34:39 genii: you don't need a debug board. Aug 12 02:35:03 does anyone know where the ringer sounds are located? Aug 12 02:36:36 /opt/Qtopia/etc/SystemRingTones/? Aug 12 02:37:20 haha, kd8ikt, replacing the wav files in /usr/share/openmoko/sounds is fun too :) Aug 12 02:37:35 :q Aug 12 02:38:25 ... Aug 12 02:38:44 Are there any planned hardware revisions for the latest FR? Aug 12 02:39:09 damn, why isn't my wireless working now :( Aug 12 02:39:17 fragged, and then some! Aug 12 02:40:06 Dave: hahaha Aug 12 02:40:19 Dave: unfortunately raster-- end of the month Aug 12 02:40:48 D: Aug 12 02:41:04 heh Aug 12 02:41:18 Dave, you mean by that, that there is gonna be plenty to come? Aug 12 02:41:45 well there's already been much hardware revision Aug 12 02:41:47 so I'd say, yes. Aug 12 02:42:29 hey dave :-) Aug 12 02:43:03 freerunner=gta02 neo=gta01 ? Aug 12 02:43:16 genii, yes Aug 12 02:43:23 nope 1973=GTA01 Aug 12 02:43:36 Neo == GTA01/02 Aug 12 02:43:50 OK Aug 12 02:43:56 there's Neo 1973 and Neo FR Aug 12 02:44:03 Yeah, yeah. His meaning was clear, even if my Freerunner says neo on the front. Aug 12 02:45:55 Can I boot it from the microSD? Aug 12 02:45:55 to make confusion even worse, there was a time where even FR was called 1973 internally. This is why there's such a mess in filenames and sources Aug 12 02:49:46 genii can u hold the power button down then hold the aux button for 8-9 secs to see? Aug 12 02:50:10 OK Aug 12 02:50:50 a smalkl menu? Aug 12 02:51:00 No some 17 error Aug 12 02:51:40 ok then try the au x down then the power button for sat 4 -6 seconds Aug 12 02:52:10 a small menu? Aug 12 02:52:19 Nothing Aug 12 02:53:08 predded the aux button an hold while pressing the power? Aug 12 02:53:22 pressed* Aug 12 02:53:29 linuxxr: Yeah I tried it both ways. Aug 12 02:53:37 ugly Aug 12 02:53:45 good battery i guess Aug 12 02:54:05 Lemme check, I have a multimeter Aug 12 02:54:08 AFK Aug 12 02:54:49 Hi. Does someone know off-handed if the FSO milestone2 kernel is supposed to have the SD-Card/GPS-fix-fix included? Aug 12 02:56:00 Does someone have a serial log of this: http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1682 Aug 12 02:56:14 I think I know what it might be. Aug 12 02:56:47 linuxxr: Theres some juice. Although 400 mA seems not enough Aug 12 02:57:10 Maybe the charger's screwed Aug 12 02:58:34 got an old nokia that may use the same batt charge it with that Aug 12 02:59:04 linuxxr: OK. I'll give it a shot and check in later Aug 12 02:59:21 Thanks **** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Aug 12 02:59:56 2008