**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Mar 22 02:59:57 2009 Mar 22 03:10:25 Is there any interest in an East Coast USA Buzz Fix Party? Mar 22 03:15:18 Yes :) Mar 22 03:15:25 I have already epressed some interest :) Mar 22 03:15:52 Do I have to come up to Boston, Ken? or would you like to come down to NYC? Mar 22 03:16:05 I might be able to wrangle up a couple users from Philly Mar 22 03:19:21 Dave, New York is probably more centrally located for the East Coast COmmunity, and I'm always looking for an excuse to drive down there anyway." Mar 22 03:20:27 That's what I figured anyway :) Mar 22 03:21:05 Should we start a Wiki page for signups, and post a message to the community list? Mar 22 03:21:12 I'm thinking about it Mar 22 03:21:19 Though we'd first need to locate a place to hold it. Mar 22 03:21:22 ;) Mar 22 03:21:30 And a person who Mar 22 03:21:52 ANd a person whi is good at soldering. I'm pretty sloppy at it. Mar 22 03:22:00 I can do it. Mar 22 03:22:05 Cooool Mar 22 03:22:11 Depends what kind of solder and with what implement. Mar 22 03:22:16 Though I am proficient with a few different kinds. Mar 22 03:22:20 ;) Mar 22 03:22:38 Let's contact a few different people... reach out Mar 22 03:22:42 see what we can get :) Mar 22 03:23:00 Goodie. I'll contribute some funding, if needed. Mar 22 03:23:02 there was even one person I believe who was willing to fly over here, if we were having a gathering/con here :P Mar 22 03:25:58 heh Mar 22 03:27:17 I've got a list of the Boston area Freerunner group purchase people. I can inquire if any of them want to do a road trip, or if they just want to send some with me to get fixed at the party. Mar 22 03:52:23 * Chocky wonders where Dave is located Mar 22 03:53:08 hahahahaha Mar 22 03:53:15 Ken, really? :D Mar 22 03:55:21 Dave, I don;t understand what you;re asking. Really *what*? Mar 22 03:58:10 You have a list of the purchaers Mar 22 03:58:24 Was this from the original group buy thing? Mar 22 04:00:35 * Chocky tries out his SHR silliness Mar 22 04:00:38 this Mar 22 04:01:17 oh, yeah, I had to recover my FR last month by using cellotape, wires and a razr battery. Mar 22 04:05:46 Dave - Yes, I have the list of our Boston 10-pack buyers. Mar 22 04:06:58 are they still alive? Mar 22 04:07:05 do any of them still have their freerunners? :P Mar 22 04:07:19 Yes, to both questions. Mar 22 04:07:35 :] Mar 22 04:08:04 It was really quite fun to see how excited the local buyers were to get their units. Mar 22 04:08:10 blah, no networking with SHR Mar 22 04:08:22 KenYoung: it was rather sad, IMO :o Mar 22 04:08:27 I organised the San Diego group Mar 22 04:08:58 one guy emailed me about 5 times asking if it was there yet. He was so over ethusiastic, and disorganised, he ended up being last Mar 22 04:10:01 * Chocky hums at illume. kinda odd. Mar 22 04:13:37 ew! Mar 22 04:14:00 which idiot chose green/blue as the colors for the shell? Mar 22 04:15:39 : Mar 22 04:15:40 :p Mar 22 04:16:14 why is it that there's always one broken opkg URL, no matter what the distro? Mar 22 04:20:12 it's more fun that way? Mar 22 04:24:42 I mean, it must be some effort to consistently get it that way. Mar 22 04:26:23 having said that, SHR does seem to be in reasonably shape. Mar 22 04:26:38 +good Mar 22 04:27:08 :| Mar 22 04:27:11 yeah Mar 22 04:27:17 and it's work is very active Mar 22 04:27:28 its too, I hope Mar 22 04:27:53 Shame it's taken so freakin' long. Mar 22 04:29:46 Yeah :( Mar 22 04:31:46 oh, and the time keeping is hopeless Mar 22 04:33:11 "Current: -216 mA". nice. Mar 22 04:33:33 Negative voltage, maybe. Negative current, I don't think so. Mar 22 04:34:30 dammit. who put "lol" in the config. Mar 22 04:34:35 hahaha Mar 22 04:34:38 * Chocky stabs them, repeatedly. Mar 22 04:34:43 YOU'RE GOING THE WRONG WAY! Mar 22 04:36:04 hell, that keyboard might actually be usable. Mar 22 04:38:10 hot damn! Mar 22 04:38:13 Welcome back, Ken :) Mar 22 04:39:26 Thanks, Dave. I'm stuck in my office, with flakey work WiFi." Mar 22 04:41:14 Ah Mar 22 04:41:21 Workin' late? :| Mar 22 04:41:43 Yup. All night. Mar 22 04:42:46 negative current: correct. Negative voltage: device dead Mar 22 04:44:07 :\ Mar 22 04:44:14 Joerg :D Mar 22 04:44:23 sounds like Dave's Freerunner dealings. Mar 22 04:44:30 how many has he killed so far? Mar 22 04:44:33 hahahahaha, sadly I was just thinking of that :( Mar 22 04:45:19 oh yeah. got one those screen protectors from ebay. "We have your device's specs". Mar 22 04:45:36 Well, that wasn't true. They were out by 1mm in each direction. Mar 22 04:45:38 idiots. Mar 22 04:46:41 supposed to be applied the professional way: removing front cover Mar 22 04:46:45 pythm is messed up Mar 22 04:47:01 the play button is the *wrong way around* Mar 22 04:47:25 And if my filename is too long, the window is off the screen, and it takes the end of the volume slider with it Mar 22 04:47:26 :) Mar 22 04:47:26 gah! Mar 22 04:47:29 noticed that did you? ;) Mar 22 04:47:43 * Chocky notices, and suffers with this sort of crap Mar 22 04:48:12 hm, nice delay when I plug headphones in. Mar 22 04:48:16 stupid python. Mar 22 04:48:34 At least the MP3 sounds okish. Mar 22 04:48:58 Is there a less stupid media player? And don't say madplay. Mar 22 04:49:00 :) Mar 22 04:49:08 I think there's a few now Mar 22 04:49:11 Did you check opkg.org? Mar 22 04:49:27 yes, but not recently Mar 22 04:49:34 gogogo Mar 22 04:50:24 I'm not sure that either of GPS or GSM are working. sigh. Mar 22 04:52:34 trying might help Mar 22 04:53:13 Chocky: Your critique of the current state is correct -- but you're depressing me more than I already am just by reminding us all how bad it really is. ;-) Mar 22 04:54:58 See folks? you all consider me to be pessimistic, but once someone comes back with a fresh and clear mind and looks, it turns out that even I am a complete optimist when it comes to the sorry state of this project! Mar 22 04:55:11 :) Mar 22 04:55:26 \o/ Mar 22 04:56:13 * mwester thinks one of his gta01's will make a dandy little swimming pool pump/heater monitor; the other will the recieving unit in the house (using bluetooth). That'll be a useful thing for them. Mar 22 04:56:18 * DocScrutinizer looking for another better project then Mar 22 04:56:43 mickey|zzZZzz is pretty postiive on the EZX devices. Mar 22 04:57:09 I'll be starting work on the SheevaPlug, which looks like a REALLY neat home device. Mar 22 04:57:17 There's a lot of cool hardware out there right now. Mar 22 04:58:39 * DocScrutinizer curses his N810 located next to his pillow. this has to change Mar 22 04:59:03 uh oh Mar 22 04:59:18 bat army: I summon you! Mar 22 04:59:40 dawn here. asleep Mar 22 05:02:37 so er, why isn't my GPS working? Mar 22 05:03:36 remove uSD ;-) Mar 22 05:03:47 very funny Mar 22 05:04:17 hm, I like the tangogps topo map. Mar 22 05:04:25 :] Mar 22 05:07:03 too funny? ok, update agpsd to latest then Mar 22 05:07:53 err wait, was this "update whole framework"? Mar 22 05:08:28 I did opkg upgrade, if that's what you're asking Mar 22 05:13:35 Debian Packages Mar 22 05:13:37 Search for Great Vacation deals. Compare Rates and Book today! Mar 22 05:13:47 nice one, Adwords Mar 22 05:14:59 what? in opkg? Mar 22 05:15:03 yessier Mar 22 05:15:04 -e Mar 22 05:17:28 * DocScrutinizer wonders whether to reanimate an old project of him, to put Neo on needlebed tester to finally get an accurate schem ;D Mar 22 05:18:12 * mwester has an image of a neo in an Iron Maiden, with an angry user slamming the door shut... Mar 22 05:18:29 hehehe Mar 22 05:22:03 creepy Mar 22 05:22:06 yet intriguing :p Mar 22 07:04:51 Sargun Mar 22 07:22:26 vininim: Hey, there is a way to debug kernel panic without dboard. Mar 22 07:24:12 vininim: but it requires compiling a patched kernel. Or soldering an uart converter. Choose your destiny :) Mar 22 08:36:08 11:30 ZDF-INFO neues spezial linux Mar 22 08:46:03 today? Mar 22 10:57:27 Hi, I just updated shr-unstable and now the settingsmanager seems to be partely deffect, did I do something wrong ? Mar 22 11:04:06 ow, now it's working again :d Mar 22 14:37:13 moin Mar 22 14:37:43 :o Mar 22 14:44:34 hello Mar 22 14:44:51 I just bought an openmoko Mar 22 14:44:57 :o Mar 22 14:45:00 and update to the last SHR release Mar 22 14:45:06 however it seems quite slow Mar 22 14:45:12 and I wanted to lnwot Mar 22 14:45:13 heh. Mar 22 14:45:26 know if someone could point me to the right wiki page Mar 22 14:45:43 the page that tells you how to supercharge your freerunner? Mar 22 14:45:45 it looks like t Mar 22 14:45:57 ah I didn t see this page Mar 22 14:47:45 chocky: do you know which is the fastest UI distribution ? Mar 22 14:48:07 well, the "fastest" is probably a purely command line based one. Mar 22 14:49:12 Chocky: umh strange when I ran htop it took 15% of the CPU Mar 22 14:49:18 heh Mar 22 14:49:20 if I remember well or understood well they started reimplementing the framework or part of it in C Mar 22 14:49:30 i thought in 'vala'? Mar 22 14:49:31 but i'm realy not shure Mar 22 14:49:53 henk, you may be right and I may be wrong then Mar 22 14:50:05 I think that would be clever, the other test I did was with qt, and it respond really fast Mar 22 14:50:10 but anyway vala is translated to C isn't it Mar 22 14:50:10 ? Mar 22 14:50:26 but the SHR, it so slow that it doesn t seem to be usa Mar 22 14:50:27 le Mar 22 14:50:30 usable Mar 22 14:50:36 Yes, there is a bug where something in the window manager consumes 10 - 30 % of the CPU constantly. there are workarounds. Mar 22 14:50:57 Gnutoo: ah, that might be. Mar 22 14:50:58 sebastie1: for the moment, Qtopia is probably the most useful and responsive as a phone. Mar 22 14:51:09 Andriod is not far behind, but needs a little more work Mar 22 14:51:11 sebastie1: SHR is the most useful distro at the moment; the philosophy seems to be that it should work first, and then later it can be tuned. Mar 22 14:51:46 so, all the distros do something good, but there isn't a magic one ;-) Mar 22 14:51:54 and all of them do nasty stuff Mar 22 14:52:17 e.g, how the hell do I get rid of the "MPlayer" icon from SHR? Mar 22 14:52:35 umh, in fact it looks like there is a lot of work to be done on the shr Mar 22 14:52:56 when I add a look at the e-wn video on the website, it looks fast Mar 22 14:53:03 sebastie1: it all in development -- I hope you didn't expect that there was a completed software set for the device! Mar 22 14:53:07 The "unstable" SHR is a bit faster. Mar 22 14:53:16 but the shr UI is not respomding rapidly Mar 22 14:53:25 the release SHR sucks Mar 22 14:53:54 also, I bought a 4Go sd card Mar 22 14:54:01 but I have a lot of I/O erros Mar 22 14:54:06 :o Mar 22 14:54:13 and the mount swith back to RO after sometime Mar 22 14:54:18 some random no-name brand? Mar 22 14:54:25 I have to perform a remount Mar 22 14:54:32 Something tells me that sebastie1 should return the phone to where he bought it... Mar 22 14:54:34 umh german one: takeMS Mar 22 14:54:50 but I recognize, a cheap one : 13 Eur Mar 22 14:54:50 I wonder when the kernel patch that is in 2.6.29,that permit the usage of the phone will be backported to 2.6.28...it prevent me from using the phone and the settings functionalities right now... Mar 22 14:54:56 hm is that mini usb or micro usb on the fr? Mar 22 14:55:40 mwester: no, I wanted to know if I performed the first steps correctly Mar 22 14:55:49 mini-b Mar 22 14:55:57 sebastie1: you did. Mar 22 14:56:15 mjr: thanks Mar 22 14:56:29 mwester: when I did the conference in milan on the openmoko, it looks like the distribs were a lot faster on the mobile of the others Mar 22 14:56:36 that s the reason Mar 22 14:56:37 sebastie1: the phone is slow, many hardware flaws, the software stacks are also slow, with numerous problems. Consider it a good day if it boots, and if you can do anything more than that, it's a wonderful day! :D Mar 22 14:57:14 It's only been two years -- give openmoko a break. They ALMOST have a phone that can make a phone call correctly! Mar 22 14:57:18 Mar 22 14:57:39 mwester: careful! Mar 22 14:57:40 mwester: yes the qt distrib looks usable for every days use Mar 22 14:57:47 mwester: you forgot the tag. Mar 22 14:57:52 mwester: you might run out Mar 22 14:58:00 mwester, I think that's a bit harsh. There are many owners, myself included, who use their Freerunners as phones. Mar 22 14:58:33 KenYoung: I know - there are different expectations for the device. I bet you know how to do SMD sodering, and have the buzz fixed too. Mar 22 14:58:56 I can't fiind anyone to do that, so even if the sofware worked, I can't use it as a work-capable phone. Mar 22 14:59:09 I did the GPS solder-job, but not the buzz fix (yet). Mar 22 14:59:24 :D Mar 22 14:59:25 mwester: you're in .de? Mar 22 14:59:31 Good morning, Ken :) Mar 22 14:59:38 * Dave nods to mwester Mar 22 14:59:41 Good morning, Dave! Mar 22 14:59:56 I guess if one purchased it expecting an experimental device that would be fun to hack on as a linux device that can, oh by the way, also make phone calls, then it's a MARVELOUS device. Mar 22 15:00:01 So, where are we holding this thing? Mar 22 15:00:09 If anyone's still interested :) Mar 22 15:00:13 But if you bought it as a phone, then there's nothing to say except that it sucks. Mar 22 15:00:19 SpeedEvil: US Mar 22 15:01:00 We don't have repair shops for cell phones here; we have shops with big garbage bins into which they toss your "broken" phone, so they can sell you a new one. Mar 22 15:01:14 brokenmoko Mar 22 15:03:42 The fact that people are not in the habit of treating a cell phone as if it were something worth repairing does not mean that's the ideal way for the world to work. Mar 22 15:04:24 Dave Mar 22 15:05:03 CHOX Mar 22 15:05:17 Dave: San Diego, kthxbyte Mar 22 15:05:17 Ken, much like laptops today Mar 22 15:05:20 -t Mar 22 15:05:23 hah Mar 22 15:05:30 bayarea or nothing Mar 22 15:05:34 KTHX Mar 22 15:05:50 hm., Bay Area is a possibility. Mar 22 15:05:54 would depend on dates. Mar 22 15:05:54 \o/ Mar 22 15:05:58 Okay Mar 22 15:06:01 Agreed Mar 22 15:06:02 :p Mar 22 15:06:09 KenYoung: You're completely correct. It's wasteful, and needless, and it's a sad part of American culture. But it's the reason why the "unofficial" just-take-the-phone-to-your-phone-shop-at-the-corner-to-have-them-solder-it solution that Openmoko seems to be promoting just won't work. Mar 22 15:06:39 hm, I've yet to try out the fancy soldering iron I got for Xmas Mar 22 15:06:54 oooh! Mar 22 15:06:59 Break that bitch iiiiiiiiiin ;D Mar 22 15:07:04 * mwester has a 150 Watt Weller soldering gun. Would that work? Mar 22 15:07:06 * Dave high-fives Chocky Mar 22 15:07:12 Well, the "get some friends together, one of whom can solder" method seems to be catching on, and that might be a good model, even in the US. Mar 22 15:07:15 Mwester, woohoo, woldering guuuuuuuuuuuun! Mar 22 15:07:17 I only solder about 3 times a year, but it's a PITA having a crappy one Mar 22 15:07:27 We here, in America, like our guns... in any shape size or form :D Mar 22 15:07:36 and big wheels. Mar 22 15:07:55 and guns. See Oakland yesterday. Mar 22 15:08:34 hahahaha Mar 22 15:08:36 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=250392812172 \o/ Mar 22 15:08:36 KenYoung: you have any idea how big the US is? :-D $300 Airfare + hotel to fly to Boston, or $500 plus double-the-hotel-rates for the bay area isn't really practical -- rather expensive compared to, for example, sending the phone back to Om for repair -- which is what they should do. Mar 22 15:08:39 AsAlways Mar 22 15:08:56 mwester: yes, but beer is implicated Mar 22 15:09:07 mwester... but think of the PARTY! \o/ Mar 22 15:09:10 * mwester can't afford beer anymore either. Mar 22 15:09:13 :[ Mar 22 15:09:24 We're in a depression, you know! Mar 22 15:09:29 yeah yeah *rolls eyes* Mar 22 15:09:32 cellphones be damned Mar 22 15:09:35 At least that's what our politicians keep telling us. Mar 22 15:09:44 that's a "recession" Mar 22 15:09:55 Om repari funding should go in the next stimulus package. Mar 22 15:10:20 hahaha Mar 22 15:10:24 I'll call Obama. :p Mar 22 15:10:31 Ok, how can I remove permanently the Mplayer icon from SHR? Mar 22 15:10:33 Om is too big to fail! Mar 22 15:10:35 Heh! Om might have been able to use the money that wasted on the automakers. Think of what opensource could have done with that kind of funding! Mar 22 15:10:48 TO THE MOOOOOOON!! Mar 22 15:10:56 AND BEYOND! Mar 22 15:11:26 Hurd could finally be made into a working OS. Mar 22 15:11:39 Hurd/Sugar Mar 22 15:11:43 yes, but people still wouldn't use it, given Linux Mar 22 15:12:13 Hurd was designed to work best with bubble memory. Mar 22 15:12:20 Ah. Mar 22 15:12:23 Bubble memory. Mar 22 15:12:33 that's going back a ways. Mar 22 15:12:38 but someone answer my question Mar 22 15:12:48 That goes back almost as far as 'Flash will be cheaper than hard disks next year'. Mar 22 15:12:58 or "year of the network" Mar 22 15:13:04 Chocky: sorry - nope. Mar 22 15:13:15 Chocky: you want me to give you the pathname? Mar 22 15:13:26 mwester: if it helps Mar 22 15:13:28 Or the Japanese Fifth Generation Computing initiative. Mar 22 15:13:33 :o Mar 22 15:13:33 Hurd can't even deciden on a micro-kernel Mar 22 15:13:51 (having said that, flash actually _is_ getting there. I'm about to redo my desktop with a 16GB SD as main storage. Mar 22 15:14:01 desktop? Mar 22 15:14:17 haha Mar 22 15:14:18 99.5% of the stuff I use is in that 16G Mar 22 15:14:18 and try fitting a harddrive to the insider of your freerunner ;-) Mar 22 15:14:33 chocky, I did :D Mar 22 15:14:35 choc: I have some 1*4*3cm hard drives Mar 22 15:14:40 Chocky: 20Mb Mar 22 15:14:50 * Chocky shakes head. Mar 22 15:15:09 Chocky: Don't remember it off the top of my head - sorry! You'll have to do a little searching. It's a file in a directory for each icon that appears on the desktop - the path is referenced on the wiki in a number of places, but a bit of digging about will find it as well. That's all the help I can offer; that's how I do it, and yes it should be better documented. And yes, it should all work after two years. And yes, it's all quite painful Mar 22 15:15:09 ! :-D Mar 22 15:15:10 anyway, 20 Megabit is not that big. Mar 22 15:15:21 choc: byte Mar 22 15:15:54 Chocky: though IIRC 4G CF hard disks are/were available Mar 22 15:16:09 mwester: well, I know there's a .e file you can remove, but it gets regenerated Mar 22 15:16:10 :o Mar 22 15:17:21 Am I right in thinking pythm is really the only music player? Mar 22 15:17:49 SpeedEvil: http://channel.debian.de/netiquette/ch-rules.html#s-bitchx one of those rules is for removing the bold : after nicks. all the other settings are for other fscked up annoyances in bitchx... Mar 22 15:17:58 iirc, /usr/share/applications Mar 22 15:18:27 * Chocky greps for it. nothing in applications. Mar 22 15:18:28 ... /usr/share/pixmaps? Mar 22 15:18:49 it was something like that Mar 22 15:19:03 /usr/share/applications/whatever.desktop IIRC Mar 22 15:19:16 * Chocky thinks you're all wrong :| Mar 22 15:19:37 * mwester thinks Chocky hasn't given us the _whole_ question. Mar 22 15:20:06 mwester: most likely; but how can I expand? Mar 22 15:20:27 clearly the MPlayer icon as it is is useless. It just runs it with no commands. Mar 22 15:20:44 and I did remove the mplayer package Mar 22 15:20:48 Perhaps you can tell us what you have tried, and what you have observed when you do so. Mar 22 15:20:54 and mplayer-common Mar 22 15:21:25 ah, perhaps it's the .local/share/applications/ Mar 22 15:21:54 yes, good. Mar 22 15:22:06 \o/ Mar 22 15:22:27 Now, I want to get rid of "Elementary Test Application" :p Mar 22 15:22:41 Where did you get this stuff?? Mar 22 15:22:43 which _is_ in /usr/share/applications Mar 22 15:22:57 ETOOMANY? Mar 22 15:23:08 I got this stuff as part of the SHR snapshot yesterday Mar 22 15:23:20 strange stuff in the dev snapshots! Mar 22 15:23:28 no kidding Mar 22 15:23:30 * mwester uses the SHR-lite distro. Mar 22 15:23:50 * vininim uses uboot dfu-util Mar 22 15:23:59 Now, the most important question. Why isn't duke3d running? Mar 22 15:24:05 much cleaner... and I really have no use for mplayer or video apps -- because I know that the hardware and kernel can't do it anyway. Mar 22 15:25:06 yes, but it's more than capable of MP3 - if I can find a less shitty media player :-( Mar 22 15:25:27 the one in Qtopia was just about sensible. As is the android one. Mar 22 15:25:30 does it use tremor and mad? Mar 22 15:25:49 vininim: yes, but that's not the point. Mar 22 15:25:58 the point is the incredibly bad UI that pythm has. Mar 22 15:26:45 Chocky: You'll need to mod the hardware to do MP3, unless you use Bluetooth. Mar 22 15:26:54 yes, understood Mar 22 15:27:19 Or just listen to the BeeGees Mar 22 15:27:22 let's assume that quality is sufficent (for me) (just) for listening on the train Mar 22 15:27:27 hehe!! Mar 22 15:27:46 * SeligArkin dies laughing Mar 22 15:28:00 "Tragedy" Mar 22 15:29:34 actualy, I can't attest one way or the other Mar 22 15:29:54 but from what I heard its pretty bad Mar 22 15:30:40 mwester: s/do mp3/enjoy audio playback/ Mar 22 15:31:23 :) DocScrutinizer, that's implied -- I do mp3 in order to enjoy audio playback; there's little other purpose! :-D But yes, you are technically correct. Mar 22 15:32:04 mwester: you can however try to enjoy audio without using any mp3 Mar 22 15:32:38 irrespetive of the hardware issues, actually getting something to play is too challenging right now. Mar 22 15:32:43 Yes, but a wav file played back won't sound any better. Mar 22 15:33:14 mwester: that's my point Mar 22 15:33:18 Nevertheless, a lot of evils are fixed if we can just get Openmoko to do the GSM buzz fix, and use bluetooth for everything else. Mar 22 15:33:49 so, are there suggested bluetooth stereo headsets? Mar 22 15:34:13 Bluetooth development has (astonishingly) not been done, until very very recently. Mar 22 15:34:27 * Chocky takes that as a no. Mar 22 15:34:33 HCI principles people: feedback! Mar 22 15:34:35 DocScrutinizer and Paul did a lot of work, I think, with ALSA and may have some ideas. Mar 22 15:35:01 I would prefer a slow text-all-over boot than a black screen that I don't know if it's booting or not working Mar 22 15:36:03 They seemed to have little trouble getting the audio playback working, the challenge seemed to be in making a bluetooth phone headset working -- or maybe I have that all wrong. I just saw the conversation on the email aliases... Mar 22 15:36:05 vininim: you're talking strange Mar 22 15:36:37 * Chocky tries deforas-player. could the buttons be any smaller? Mar 22 15:36:56 No vininim makes sense. That was another battle on the Om kernel list. Many people seemed to think that a black screen, and hiding all feedback, was "good". Mar 22 15:37:14 mwester: Chocky: A2DP playback seems to work Mar 22 15:37:16 yes, some feedback is good, but clearly the scrolling makes it take forever. Mar 22 15:37:23 and frankly, the text looks crappy Mar 22 15:37:34 Yes. for everything. Mar 22 15:38:01 well, *at this point*, fast booting is of no use Mar 22 15:38:16 The problem is that some folks (the ones in charge, clearly) felt that the phone was "finished" and therefore speed was important instead of displaying any faults or failures at boot. Mar 22 15:38:21 anyway, I'm not one of the blackscreeners ;ßl Mar 22 15:38:29 stupid insular geeks Mar 22 15:38:32 ;-) Mar 22 15:38:54 We are told the hardware can speed the scrolling, but nobody had implemented that. Mar 22 15:38:55 dammit. don't make me port a usable MP3 player from somewhere :o Mar 22 15:39:38 Chocky: I think you'll have to. The rest of us are just happy it functions as well as it does at this point. Welcome aboard the development team; we're glad to have you! Mar 22 15:39:46 :D Mar 22 15:39:47 no volume control. good grief. Mar 22 15:39:57 edit the alsa state file. Mar 22 15:40:06 That's the solution offered on the mailing lists ;) Mar 22 15:40:11 muahahaha Mar 22 15:40:58 * Chocky stabs someone. Mar 22 15:41:12 alsamixer will work :p Mar 22 15:41:19 yup Mar 22 15:41:20 "just fire up a console" Mar 22 15:41:24 useless Mar 22 15:41:38 ok, let me try some video Mar 22 15:41:48 * mwester waits for the screams Mar 22 15:42:11 anyway, it's a pity there's no funding for my alsa-api project Mar 22 15:42:12 * Chocky scps over Shrek. Mar 22 15:42:49 heeheeheehehehehhe muahaha Mar 22 15:42:50 I guess what I'd like is some kind of autosync with podcasts and stuff. that might be some kind of cron script, which would be acceptable Mar 22 15:43:53 there's cofondos project for that Mar 22 15:44:01 but no one made offers yet Mar 22 15:44:27 Chocky: don't forget to install patched mplayer, and to transcode shrek to a reasonable format prior to scp Mar 22 15:46:37 Chocky: then you might actually get video on FR Mar 22 15:47:09 slideshow otherwise ;-) Mar 22 15:47:22 shrek is transcoded to hell and back Mar 22 15:47:35 480x234 for my GPS Mar 22 15:47:55 your gps can play videos? Mar 22 15:47:58 I have mplayer from unstable feeds. is that sufficient Mar 22 15:48:10 yessir. it's wince, and I hacked stuff onto it. Mar 22 15:48:29 but it can only understand a 2GB USB drive, so I pushed the compression really high. Mar 22 15:48:53 anyway, shrek seems to play ok. Except for the orientation being unhelpful, and not actually fullscreen Mar 22 15:49:54 I'd change the preferences, except there's nothing in the preferences popup. fnar. Mar 22 15:51:48 hm, stupid. I have to rotate as part of my transcoding. sigh. Mar 22 15:56:56 sigh Mar 22 15:57:04 stupid idiot putting mistakes in the wiki Mar 22 15:57:13 the mencoder command has spaces after the slashes Mar 22 15:57:21 might be the wiki reformating it Mar 22 15:57:27 nope Mar 22 15:57:40 * Chocky fixes Mar 22 15:58:51 good :) Mar 22 15:58:56 sigh Mar 22 15:59:05 * Chocky tries reencoding Shrek. Mar 22 15:59:54 what's the most stupid about this project is not the hardware issues and such, but all the very very obvious software and documentation crap that could easily have been fixed months ago. Mar 22 16:09:41 Chocky: it could all have been put into perfect shape in 7 day (even free sunday) given god or an *army* of gifted developers did it Mar 22 16:10:19 :p Mar 22 16:10:49 or just people not putting random crap in the wiki Mar 22 16:11:23 so wiki would be mostly epty then ;D Mar 22 16:11:39 s/ep/emp/ Mar 22 16:11:39 DocScrutinizer meant: so wiki would be mostly empty then ;D Mar 22 16:11:40 on the contrary. it would have 1/2 as much stuff in it. Mar 22 16:12:03 and I wouldn't have to sift through reams of stuff that is irrelevant or should never have been added Mar 22 16:12:26 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07libeflvala * re8d00151688e 10/ (3 files in 2 dirs): thread skeleton Mar 22 16:12:28 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07libeflvala * r0b1fede33849 10/.gitignore: add executables to gitignore Mar 22 16:12:29 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07libeflvala * re48e4525905f 10/examples/library/mainloops.vala: E and G threads Mar 22 16:12:57 ack. admittedly too few decent entries of core staff in wiki Mar 22 16:13:40 I rewrote the USB networking page last year, but within days it began to accumulate the same old crap Mar 22 16:13:48 I daren't look at it now Mar 22 16:15:53 what OM would have needed was a technically savy editor writing real manpages or some other sort of manual Mar 22 16:18:14 how's the situation with openmokos in sweden? Mar 22 16:18:35 well, that mplayer is borked. green screen. Mar 22 16:20:27 * shellevil thinks 'Brave Sir Kevin' would be a good manual writer. Mar 22 16:24:03 looks like I hosed glamo driver, and will need to reboot Mar 22 16:28:30 * Chocky sobs Mar 22 16:28:40 duke3d script doesn't work, cos no bash installed Mar 22 16:29:02 bd2: Hi there! Congratulations with your eSDHC support finally accepted mainline! Cool work :) Mar 22 16:30:11 Checking sound inits. Mar 22 16:30:12 Unknown Multivoc error code Mar 22 16:30:13 nice Mar 22 16:34:15 dialer crashes when I dial Mar 22 16:34:17 sigh. Mar 22 16:38:43 Chocky: probably you hosed glamo itself Mar 22 16:39:07 Chocky: and wtf is "sound inits" ? Mar 22 16:39:28 and "Unknown Multivoc error code"? Mar 22 16:39:32 Log from duke3d crash. Mar 22 16:39:43 After I installed bash :p Mar 22 16:39:58 well seems doesn't help much to paste it here Mar 22 16:40:09 not at all Mar 22 16:40:14 someone may know Mar 22 16:40:20 There are many people here. Mar 22 16:40:34 hmm :-/ Mar 22 16:40:35 Yes, and don't lecture me about bug reporting. Mar 22 16:42:50 nah, just watching this rant for he last 12h and feeling not as good as I did 12h ago, but still all the time thinking "WTF??". Posting unrelated details and rant most likely doesn't help anybody Mar 22 16:43:16 Whoa, back up the guilt trip. Mar 22 16:43:31 I fail to see what the "unrelated details" are. Mar 22 16:44:04 In any case, it helps me, and will help others, no matter what your feelings. Mar 22 16:44:18 I'm not just someone bitching it doesn't all work. I'm trying to get a complete picture. Mar 22 16:44:40 just everybody else here already did Mar 22 16:45:01 That makes no sense. Mar 22 16:45:44 Would you prefer I stfu, and leave the channel and project? I already did that for 10 months cos it was so messed up. Mar 22 16:46:04 I'll do for now Mar 22 16:46:06 bye Mar 22 16:46:09 do you think we should pretend there are no problems? Mar 22 16:46:19 that seems to be the attitude that is on the lists, as mentioned earlier Mar 22 16:46:54 Chocky: constructive feedback is needed. Talking about all the random things at once just confuses everybody. Mar 22 16:47:13 I don't think the project has a lack of disgruntled users Mar 22 16:47:24 paulproteus: I strongly assert that that is not what I'm doing. Save such comments for the noobs. Mar 22 16:47:32 * Chocky beats bitchx. Mar 22 16:47:58 right now ``the project'' could use more developers Mar 22 16:48:27 vininim: no doubt. but it's far from clear which distro any developers should contribute to, since it's so very splintered. Mar 22 16:48:35 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07libeflvala * r47afbc8b440d 10/examples/library/mainloops.vala: add some logic for proper shutdown Mar 22 16:49:47 lulz, what is up with the applications in shr-unstable Mar 22 16:49:51 I am a developer, and probably have more experience than just about anyone here - especially with ARM and embedded development. However, it's not something you can just jump into. Mar 22 16:49:53 do we really have firefox and X-jed? Mar 22 16:50:24 vininim: :o that's the kind of comedy that is everywhere in the project Mar 22 16:51:56 _Moreover_, note the number of questions I've been asking. Many don't seem to have answers - not even "I don't know" from someone. Mar 22 16:52:06 it's sunday Mar 22 16:52:10 troo. Mar 22 16:52:24 but it's no less busy that it is during the week, IME Mar 22 16:52:48 Chocky: there's not that much distros: FSO is a demo for framework; SHR is actively developed community maintained distro; Debian is Debian using FSO middleware; Gentoo is Gentoo, using FSO, aimed at cross-compiling everything. What's the confusion? Mar 22 16:53:10 PaulFertser: oh boy, 10 points for over simplication. Mar 22 16:53:24 Chocky: out of how many? Mar 22 16:53:25 Chocky: A lot of the questions you "ask" read like complaints, and we've all asked them, and most of the die-hards here on the channel are quite weary of answering them again and again... Mar 22 16:53:30 there is also qt-extended-improved Mar 22 16:53:49 mwester: sorry for not knowing the the answers :p Mar 22 16:53:58 /help ignore Mar 22 16:54:08 Sorry for not realizing that you were really interested in answers. Mar 22 16:54:10 PaulFertser: there's at least 3 Debian distros for starters. And a proliferation of FSO variants Mar 22 16:54:22 there's 3 versions of Android Mar 22 16:54:31 and ? Mar 22 16:54:33 Chocky: 3 Debian distros? I know only pkg-fso Debian, H:1 and fyp. Mar 22 16:54:34 at least 2 of Qtopia Mar 22 16:54:35 as a experienced ARM developer, does that really matters? Mar 22 16:54:44 choose what you like most Mar 22 16:54:57 vininim: it's not even clear what they all _are_ Mar 22 16:55:17 Do like everyone else, try, get dissapointed, change, then go back SHR Mar 22 16:55:29 Chocky: if you were really interested in some guidance, someone would have pointed you to the only Android distro being worked, the only real FSO project being worked (SHR), and pointed you to the qt-extended stuff. That's three, it really has become that simple. Mar 22 16:55:33 Chocky: H:1 is not active, neither here, nor at common ML. fyp is some inadequate initiative, not exposed to the users too. Mar 22 16:55:43 vininim: or, I could ask, and not waste huge amounts of time that might otherwise be put into development. Mar 22 16:56:00 maybe #openmoko-android may help Mar 22 16:56:13 #openmoko-debian may help Mar 22 16:56:15 Since you're asking, SHR is where it's at. That's all. :) Mar 22 16:56:18 Chocky: you'll get oversimplifications =P Mar 22 16:56:25 mwester: I already went through all those. but again, there's several variants of each. It took me agues to figure out what combos "worked" Mar 22 16:58:44 You'll always go back to SHR, I promise =P Mar 22 16:58:56 again, this situation would be enormously clearer, with the wiki in better shape. But someone has to ask Mar 22 16:59:05 vinimin: Qtopia, at this point. Mar 22 16:59:18 Qtopia is dead Mar 22 16:59:25 it's clearly not. Mar 22 16:59:44 irrspecitve of Trolltech Mar 22 17:00:02 true, seems like qtopia is even more active since it's community driven Mar 22 17:00:21 anyway, didn't quite follow the discussion, but at this point i'm fairly content with SHR-testing Mar 22 17:00:39 I can use it as a daily phone, and use a lot of things that qtopia doesn't yet let me enjoy Mar 22 17:01:11 my SHR dialer crashes, so that is a nope for me. Mar 22 17:01:32 are you on unstable Chocky? because on shr-testing it works fine for me.. Mar 22 17:01:46 * Chocky is on unstable, and with all the caveats for that. Mar 22 17:01:50 and you can use zhone also if you want Mar 22 17:01:56 ew ;-) Mar 22 17:02:01 i know :) Mar 22 17:03:41 Zorkman: to me current OM qtopia community seems to be quite toothless. Mar 22 17:04:22 So does OM development in general, to the causal outsider. What's your point? Mar 22 17:05:42 it's true it probably lacks any real direction, unlike perhaps Android, but there's interest in resolving some of its issues. Mar 22 17:10:38 Chocky: don't count on OM-the-company, count on the community. SHR is the major community-driven distro. Mar 22 17:12:30 Chocky: have you checked paroli? what are your thoughts (i don't like it, but might be judging too fast) Mar 22 17:16:54 Say, which wifi manager can connect to open, wep and wpa connections and works in a good and stable way on SHR ? Mar 22 17:18:27 Bert_2: tbh I didn't find any for my desktop even Mar 22 17:18:46 DocScrutinizer: lol, i even never tried to do that :) Mar 22 17:19:11 Windows XP has one that pretty much works. Mar 22 17:19:17 DocScrutinizer: lol, you hate wifiradar, wicd and nm-applet ? Mar 22 17:19:31 mwester: really, I hate it Mar 22 17:20:00 Ah, but you didn't say that you had to like it - you just wanted one that could connect and worked with SHR. Mar 22 17:20:07 :P Mar 22 17:20:27 mwester: good luck trying to copy password hash from one windows pc to another. ;) Mar 22 17:20:38 mwester: I want one that works ON SHR and that I can use to connect to my school and work wifi etc. Mar 22 17:20:41 mwester: windows won't :P Mar 22 17:20:56 Works as well on SHR as most of the other do! Mar 22 17:21:14 mwester: I only found mofi and it always crashes Mar 22 17:21:25 BTW, what is the one that's on the Nokia tablets? Why have we never considered porting that? Mar 22 17:21:33 * mirko|busy is still waiting for Chocky 's devastating comment ;) Mar 22 17:21:35 My n800 works REALLY well with wifi. Mar 22 17:22:12 mwester: but connecting PAN is a PITA Mar 22 17:22:36 Hmm... I always blamed that on me being stupid and not knowing enough about bluetooth. Mar 22 17:22:59 So it's not just me then, the PAN is a pain to set up... Mar 22 17:23:20 yup, on maemo it is Mar 22 17:24:23 I have xchat on my n800, and I intended to use it when mobile via my cell phone, it just doesn't behave very well. So that's one thing I'd like to be able to do with the FR at some point - Xchat or similar IRC client over GPRS. Mar 22 17:24:27 does anyone know how to read wikipedia offline on the fr, without a sqashfs kernel module? (evopedia needs it, and the recent kernels don't have it) Mar 22 17:24:53 mwester: but otherwise I agree maemo wifi manager "just woks"(TM) Mar 22 17:25:41 mwester: this conv done via xchat/N810 ;-) Mar 22 17:25:49 cool. Mar 22 17:26:30 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07libeflvala * r357b572cafe7 10/examples/library/mainloops.vala: layout plan Mar 22 17:27:12 mwester: PAN also kinda works once setup correctly Mar 22 17:28:30 I couldn't get it to hold a connection with my treo. Might be the treo, though - I have no other phones to test with (just my FR... :P ) Mar 22 17:28:54 gotta run out for a bit -later. Mar 22 17:29:05 hmm windoof6.1 here Mar 22 17:30:19 Zorkman: I did check the description, but to be honest, I couldn't figure out what the hell the point was, or what it did. there's no info on the main wiki about it, just the mystery builds. Mar 22 17:30:30 same story with some of the other builds, like "nox" Mar 22 17:30:53 but it's what "om-the-company" is going to support... Mar 22 17:31:10 that's news to me. like I say, nowt on the wiki. Mar 22 17:31:29 Zorkman: what's the company doing ? Mar 22 17:31:30 yeah, it was on the ml list, that future om plans were fso + paroli Mar 22 17:34:24 mirko-paroli: hi :) Mar 22 17:34:31 hi DocScrutinizer Mar 22 17:34:35 how is life? Mar 22 17:35:04 nah, kinda weekend fatigue ;) Mar 22 17:35:41 i know the feeling Mar 22 17:35:45 how's paroli ? :D Mar 22 17:36:07 want an honest answer :P Mar 22 17:36:28 hmm, not sure Mar 22 17:36:38 let's put it this way: you probably don't ;) Mar 22 17:36:55 enough rumors to scare me ;) Mar 22 17:37:10 looks like I have to run to CostCo. oh joy. Mar 22 17:37:23 that's what I anticipated :-/ Mar 22 17:37:30 ? Mar 22 17:37:53 then it looks like I will have to build a Lego castle. Mar 22 17:38:04 * PaulFertser imagines OM-the-company takes now-abandoned qtopia again to base gta03 stack on the industry-proven rock-solid commercial-grade distro. Mar 22 17:38:22 Android ;-) Mar 22 17:38:25 PaulFertser: how did you know :P Mar 22 17:38:26 anyway, bbl. Mar 22 17:38:35 * mirko-paroli shivers Mar 22 17:38:39 mirko-paroli: I shouldn't ask questions I probably don't like the answer Mar 22 17:38:41 mirko-paroli: i'm good at getting hints ;) Mar 22 17:38:44 http://th30z.netsons.org/2009/03/openmoko-my-phone-video-preview/ <-- What, like that? ;) Mar 22 17:39:04 DocScrutinizer: yeah, I stopped asking a while back as well ;) Mar 22 17:39:15 PaulFertser: indeed, you see right through it all ;) Mar 22 17:40:53 DocScrutinizer: to give a metaphoric answer, paroli breathing, and fighting feever and we are not over the hill yet Mar 22 17:40:54 ;) Mar 22 17:41:58 oh, that's actually better news than what I expected, taking in account all other recent "changes" Mar 22 17:43:17 mmm... vibrator seems to be fixed in unstable (at least in my mini testing :D ) Mar 22 17:43:53 vininim: fixed?? Mar 22 17:44:05 i haven't quite understood what paroli is. a framework for writing guis that use fso or something like that? Mar 22 17:44:43 The only MS product that won't suck will be a vacuum-cleaner. Mar 22 17:44:51 DocScrutinizer: race conditions led ophonekitd to vibrate the phone endlessly Mar 22 17:45:08 PaulFertser: yeah!!! \o/ Mar 22 17:45:25 or framework, but it seems to be fixed on my calling myself tests =P Mar 22 17:45:34 vininim: ok thnx Mar 22 17:45:36 vininim: now it still vibrates longer than the ringtone Mar 22 17:46:09 henk: a plugin-based python process that allows for easy application development Mar 22 17:46:12 at least that is the goal Mar 22 17:46:21 admitedly we are far from easy Mar 22 17:46:30 Bert_2: no ringtone here o_o Mar 22 17:46:39 although the problem is not the "core" it is the apps Mar 22 17:46:51 as they follow the spec seen on the webpage Mar 22 17:46:56 the core is stable Mar 22 17:47:03 vininim: I had that problem until I downloaded the latest kernel, I found out the kernel I had didn't have the same md5 as the one on the site, altough the date was the same Mar 22 17:47:04 oh my shr-settings is so beautiful now *_* Mar 22 17:47:07 and makes calls, messaging, calllogs etc Mar 22 17:47:15 Zorkman: my kernel has a squashfs module (andy-tracking branch) but I haven't tried evopedia yet Mar 22 17:48:41 mirko-paroli: ok, thanks. Mar 22 17:48:43 mmontour: based on what version is it? Mar 22 17:49:02 haven't seen an .28 that had one... Mar 22 17:49:08 henk: i hope that helps, will probably go for moving to vala as fso does Mar 22 17:49:10 'uname -r' is 2.6.29-rc3 Mar 22 17:49:30 and move lots of functions "closer" to fso and only have the "applets" in python Mar 22 17:49:37 or any other lang for that matter Mar 22 17:50:03 andy-tracking has squashfs since "Feb 24" Mar 22 17:50:31 mirko-paroli: is there a repository for debian yet? Mar 22 17:50:59 henk: no as there is no etk package and elm crashes on me a lot so I can't complete the move from etk to elm Mar 22 17:51:19 mmontour: can i download it from somewhere withouth having to build it? Mar 22 17:51:33 mirko-paroli: uhm, ok :) Mar 22 17:53:32 Bert_2: shr-unstable kernel md5 is bd1b52ceffbafe5dda8629c743a910f5 uImage-om-gta02-latest.bin Mar 22 17:53:34 ? Mar 22 17:53:47 I don't know where you can find a pre-built one. I used "bitbake linux-openmoko-devel" with OE Mar 22 17:54:16 vininim: yeah, that one has sound for me Mar 22 17:54:32 ok, reflashing Mar 22 17:54:48 Zorkman: wait for the kernel that'll be prepared for testing really soon. Mar 22 17:54:54 vininim: I'm using it on an SD card, I don't know if that makes a difference Mar 22 17:54:57 Zorkman: (end-user testing) Mar 22 17:56:12 PaulFertser: i hoped for a recent kernel by tonight 10 o'clock :) is there no image i can reflash right away? Mar 22 17:56:22 when the new kernel for end-users come iu can always reflash Mar 22 17:56:45 Zorkman: why don't you want to try the kernel from andy's drawer? Mar 22 17:57:13 you mean build it myself? because i'm currently on a windows pc... Mar 22 17:58:10 Zorkman: no, i mean http://people.openmoko.org/andy Mar 22 17:58:48 i see it's >2MB, will modify uboot then Mar 22 17:59:26 or would you already recommend qi for stable use as daily phone? Mar 22 18:00:16 Zorkman: i used only Qi Mar 22 18:02:37 * Weiss also Mar 22 18:20:42 PaulFertser: which kernel do you recommend from http://people.openmoko.org/andy/ ? there are two differend uimage-moredrivers from 7march for the gta02 Mar 22 18:20:51 *different Mar 22 18:21:50 what is the meaning of sidetone playback? Mar 22 18:22:42 Zorkman: i'd try the latest. Mar 22 18:23:20 hi Mar 22 18:23:56 oh nevermind, wikipedia explains it Mar 22 18:23:59 i need some help Mar 22 18:24:06 just wondering just bought this openmoko Mar 22 18:24:20 do you reckon its worth while buying the debug board along with it? Mar 22 18:24:42 SomeT: no Mar 22 18:24:49 good Mar 22 18:25:03 its just taken me about a year to find someone who will deliver to my country, haha Mar 22 18:25:16 SomeT, Save your money for capacitors. Mar 22 18:25:23 why? Mar 22 18:25:30 hehe! Mar 22 18:25:38 does it blow up a lot then? Mar 22 18:25:46 SomeT, No. Mar 22 18:26:01 to be honest I am not to good with electronics Mar 22 18:26:05 i am more into programming Mar 22 18:26:27 but even then I aint the most advanced as I have just got back into it after 10 years Mar 22 18:26:34 SomeT, It's a very fun programming platform. Mar 22 18:26:35 and have always liked messing with linux Mar 22 18:26:40 cool Mar 22 18:26:56 i am doing some studying soon in network security as well Mar 22 18:27:05 just wondering i know there is one called NeoPwn Mar 22 18:27:16 but the guy aint released it for us to download free Mar 22 18:27:34 is it easy to just run the normal applications used in that under Debian do you reckon? Mar 22 18:27:49 or it would be a different way of running, haha Mar 22 18:28:25 * rooly is rather late to the game it seems... Mar 22 18:28:35 i thought hurd was abandoned Mar 22 18:29:26 SomeT: for wifi hacking you need to use some supported external usb module. Mar 22 18:29:40 i know Mar 22 18:29:50 my testing plan for volume setting: turn on music, call FR from landline, leave phone near speakers, move to next room. =P Mar 22 18:29:53 but wanted to get to grips with actually gettings the apps on first Mar 22 18:29:56 or even making my own Mar 22 18:30:29 you know the GPS on it Mar 22 18:30:39 do you have to put an aerial into it or something? Mar 22 18:30:53 vininim: don't forget about AGC Mar 22 18:31:01 AGC? Mar 22 18:31:17 agc setup Mar 22 18:31:22 vininim: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_gain_control Mar 22 18:31:23 on the wiki Mar 22 18:31:30 vininim: active inside calypso by default. Mar 22 18:32:14 so this GPS does anyone know how specific it works Mar 22 18:32:23 in regards to physical interaction? Mar 22 18:34:01 mm.. I need some spoken text Mar 22 18:35:57 vininim: with varying volume. And it'd be nice if you could compare freerunner with any regular dumb cell phone. Mar 22 18:36:48 i once owned a sony ericson phone a few years ago Mar 22 18:36:54 and the volume on it was terrible Mar 22 18:37:16 the only line of phones ive owned where I believe they have degraded in quality over time Mar 22 18:37:31 my last phone went bonkers, will see if my brother isn't using his Mar 22 18:38:22 vininim: and btw, the operator can perform some AGC itself too, so this all is getting a bit too imprecise. But i guess it's still worth trying. Mar 22 18:39:39 gotta go Mar 22 18:39:42 c u all later Mar 22 18:39:43 SomeT: so you've never owned a razr Mar 22 18:39:55 no i hate motorolas anywa Mar 22 18:39:57 y Mar 22 18:40:12 i have been waiting for a phone like this for years Mar 22 18:40:19 bye Mar 22 18:40:21 im dead specific in general anyway Mar 22 18:40:24 you've gots to go, remember? Mar 22 18:40:37 dont u want to talk to me now then? Mar 22 18:40:38 lol Mar 22 18:41:20 i was just insulting razr's using your comment Mar 22 18:41:26 to be honest Mar 22 18:41:30 ah ok cool Mar 22 18:41:32 I need two sound systems Mar 22 18:41:33 sorry Mar 22 18:41:35 np Mar 22 18:41:42 anyway i am definitly going now Mar 22 18:41:42 cya Mar 22 18:41:48 Personally, I prefer not to talk to people who use "lol" and "im". But that's just me. Mar 22 18:41:51 because it's OK to listen to it on a non-noisy ambient Mar 22 18:41:56 :p Mar 22 18:43:19 sorry, chocky. this is a casual internet chat, not a publication. proper grammar is not a total necessity beyond basic communication requirements Mar 22 18:43:56 I strongly disagree. And I know that's not just me. Mar 22 18:45:50 its obviously a personal preference, and i'll agree to disagree. but refusing to engage someone in discussion or conversation because of the words they use is exactly the same as how northern 'educated' americans treat southern ones, british treat americas, and france treats everyone Mar 22 18:46:17 anywho, that's the last i'm going to say onthat Mar 22 18:46:24 I didn't say "refuse" Mar 22 18:46:27 I said prefer. Mar 22 18:46:44 then i concede that specific point Mar 22 18:47:00 And in my considerable experience, people who insist on using such lanuage, especially in forums like this, take much more effort to deal with, due to laziness on their part. Mar 22 18:47:12 where any degree of accuracy is required. Mar 22 18:49:04 rooly: France is not faulty for its president Mar 22 18:50:25 It's enough to edit state files right? Mar 22 18:50:47 you have to reload them as well Mar 22 18:50:59 but usually reloading is done automatically on state change Mar 22 18:51:18 If you're doing any serious work with GSM audio you also have to adjust a few controls inside the Calypso Mar 22 18:52:46 not serious, just trying to raise volume to listenable on a noisy environment Mar 22 18:53:13 man1: you'll have to justify that statement for me...a president is elected by the people isn't he/her? Mar 22 18:53:20 heh. Mar 22 18:53:33 it's on max and I could use a little more Mar 22 18:53:42 does voice come from the same speaker as ringtones? Mar 22 18:53:45 rooly: some of the people. Mar 22 18:54:39 ringtone is from a different speaker Mar 22 18:54:58 rooly: I didn't vote for him, as million other people Mar 22 18:55:11 millions* Mar 22 18:55:15 hmmm maybe voice speaker can't go louder :/ Mar 22 18:55:34 Audio tuning is really hard because you are fighting against the echo problem (louder volume = more echo) Mar 22 18:56:01 could go into a voting debate and say that everyone is responsible for the person chosen in a democratic system, regardless of whether or not they voted; the choice to have no say is a vote in itself. only those who vote for someone else get repreive Mar 22 18:56:11 ...so don't blame for for obama... Mar 22 18:56:35 mmontour: are you sure there's still some echo after properly using %N0187? Mar 22 18:56:37 *me Mar 22 18:56:43 ^^ that Mar 22 18:57:26 PaulFertser: no, I have not repeated my testing since that was discovered. However I did see at least one ML post reporting that normal mic audio was being cut off (if he didn't talk loudly enough) with that setting Mar 22 18:57:31 yeah...someone's gonna have to explain to me how the microphone picks up that little bitty headset speaker Mar 22 18:58:02 but the voice speaker at max settings is kind of clicking, don't know if it's at its limits Mar 22 18:58:05 rooly: most of the coupling seems to be inside the case. If you put your thumb over the earpiece hole, the coupled audio gets louder Mar 22 18:58:12 or if some interal processing is clipping Mar 22 18:58:29 so it's a question of an unintentional echo chamber Mar 22 18:58:36 aka acoustics Mar 22 18:59:01 mmontour: it's not the normal mic audio btw, looks like default state files don't feed calypso with loud enough signal for AGC to work properly. Mar 22 18:59:18 rooly: the acoustic feedback is conducted by the plastic case. Mar 22 18:59:33 hey, I'm still testing speaker, moving to mic later =P Mar 22 19:00:25 * rooly needs to open up his case and hack around a little Mar 22 19:01:17 see if i can't apply a presidential solution like a bit 'o cotton around the mic Mar 22 19:04:49 intwresting Mar 22 19:04:50 okay, I tested mic, and it's kind of clipped too Mar 22 19:04:54 I had a friend send me a mms Mar 22 19:05:10 and now openmoko-message won't run, it segfaults Mar 22 19:05:14 but couldn't reproduce echo, maybe even the way you hold influences it (it was on a table) Mar 22 19:05:55 thats rather amusing Mar 22 19:07:08 Presidential solution like a bit 'o cotton? Wouldn't that be a teleprompter? Mar 22 19:07:49 I wish I still had access to a proper audio lab for working on the FR. A couple of jobs ago I worked for a place that made computer speakers and they had some nice test gear Mar 22 19:08:22 Didn't someone suggest that you could reduce the echo by minor alteration of the case around either the speaker or the mic? Anyone try that? Mar 22 19:11:29 opkg upgrade on shr-unstable, wish me luck! xD Mar 22 19:18:34 vininim: without %N setting echo is reproducible even when FR is laying still on the table. Mar 22 19:18:41 vininim: but it can also depend on the carrier. Mar 22 19:19:09 * SeligArkin installs bitbake to get hacking Mar 22 19:19:26 mwester: i think i was suggesting case alterations in general, but i don't know any particular way to get good results. Mar 22 19:20:16 SeligArkin: just use the super-duper Makefile, let it get all the bits and parts for you -- easier than tracking down which bitbake to use, etc. Mar 22 19:20:27 indeed, thats what I did Mar 22 19:20:43 Now I am trying to learn how to work this beast of a code mess. :P Mar 22 19:21:04 Oh you want to know how it works! Mar 22 19:30:38 PaulFertser: couldn't reproduce it with me on landline, freerunner on a table next to a speaker(with a rms speech =P) Mar 22 19:31:17 * mwester suspects it was the phone company's RMS suppression logic that kicked in; they didnt' want to hear about GPL anymore! Mar 22 19:31:30 lol Mar 22 19:32:30 cinteresting Mar 22 19:34:08 howdy guys Mar 22 19:34:12 hi guys Mar 22 19:34:28 I've just got my neo1973 back after having it posted around devs for the past 18 months :) Mar 22 19:35:02 what's the best flash image to put on it (re qtopia/openmoko/qt extended.. not so bothered about phone func Mar 22 19:35:06 mainly sat nav + tangogps Mar 22 19:35:49 anyone modified uboot so it can boot larger kernels? Mar 22 19:35:55 andylockran: i guess SHR testing Mar 22 19:35:58 andylockran: fso or shr Mar 22 19:36:04 Zorkman: there is no need to. Mar 22 19:36:13 because of qi? Mar 22 19:36:16 Zorkman: it's just an environment variable Mar 22 19:36:23 Zorkman: because it works without modifications Mar 22 19:36:26 mmontour: yes i know, i tried to change it Mar 22 19:36:29 PaulFertser: no it doesn't... Mar 22 19:36:43 Zorkman: nandread should get an additional arg, that's all. Mar 22 19:37:00 in neocon i type in setenv bootcmd bootargs ${bootargs_base} ${mtdparts}; nand read.e 0x32000000 kernel; bootm 0x32000000 Mar 22 19:37:14 * rooly1 wants to slap whoever the hell figured that booting the phone in debug mode by default was a smart idea... Mar 22 19:37:14 and then the phone starts to boot right away, i don't get a chanse to type "saveenv" Mar 22 19:37:25 Zorkman: without escaping ";"s? nice Mar 22 19:37:26 missing a \ escaping the ';' Mar 22 19:37:39 rooly1: it is Mar 22 19:38:06 maybe if your running debug operations, vininim Mar 22 19:38:12 vininim: so, you placed your freerunner near the speakers, called from landline, tried to talk into landline but didn't hear any echo? How did you ensure %N is not active? Mar 22 19:38:31 The '$' also needs to be escaped in that setenv command Mar 22 19:38:47 PaulFertser: the idea is that %N is active because of framework on shr and that it should fix the echo problem Mar 22 19:38:48 i guess i also nee da \before the "$" ? Mar 22 19:38:52 that's right, escape with your $ intact Mar 22 19:38:54 PaulFertser: sorry.. so out of date with development I don't know what SHR/FSO is ? Mar 22 19:39:00 ah thank mmontour: didn't read it already Mar 22 19:39:03 vininim: and it did fix it for you it seems? Mar 22 19:39:08 seemed so Mar 22 19:39:38 andylockran: http://freesmartphone.org is the FSO description. There's a "reference" implementation. SHR is community-driven project to build dialer, sms apps etc on top of that. Mar 22 19:39:43 andylockran: FSO "freesmartphone.org" and initiative to build a working dbus infrastructure to all the major hardware interfaces including gsm, wifi, gps, bluetooth, etc Mar 22 19:40:07 vininim: so, what's your point? %N helps, we all know that already ;) Mar 22 19:40:08 rooly1: you're supposed to debug sooner or later. =P Mar 22 19:40:32 Lies! Mar 22 19:40:33 vininim: sure...but i'm trying to use a phone atm. i don't have time to program on it Mar 22 19:40:35 PaulFertser: heh, just to make sure someone said about ML reports, i was mainly testing speaker volume Mar 22 19:40:42 just release it, someonen else will find the problem and fix it! Mar 22 19:41:36 rooly1: I mean, at the current state of affairs, it's supposed to break so often that you ought to have debug handy Mar 22 19:42:27 meh...fso works fine, qtopia 4.4.1 works fine, so Mar 22 19:43:23 wheee segfault Mar 22 19:43:38 * SeligArkin will have to look into thie Mar 22 19:43:40 this Mar 22 19:49:36 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yr821OgnvYc Mar 22 20:06:35 vininim: btw, the earpiece volume is very different between A6 and A7 FYI Mar 22 20:08:30 PaulFertser: i installed the andy uImage from 7march, but i still get: Mar 22 20:08:30 * ERROR: Cannot satisfy the following dependencies for evopedia: Mar 22 20:08:30 * kernel-module-squashfs * Mar 22 20:09:48 Zorkman: don't care about that Mar 22 20:10:08 Zorkman: zgrep SQUASH /proc/config.gz Mar 22 20:10:11 ok, sorry, to bother you Mar 22 20:10:22 Zorkman: to make sure you have the necessary module. Mar 22 20:10:41 thanks, i will, after the phone is restarted, because with this kernel i'm seeing a few "random shutdowns" :) Mar 22 20:10:57 A6 here Mar 22 20:11:13 vininim: i know, but i thought that we want a general solution ;) Mar 22 20:12:04 is it normal that the latest andy-tracking kernel (http://people.openmoko.org/andy/uImage-moredrivers-GTA02_andy-tracking-15ca3dafb2662db4.bin) does not support the battery level in shr-testing? can't see it in illume or in shr-settings Mar 22 20:12:52 Zorkman: i guess it can be normal, yes. And that can be a reason for shutdowns too (framework shutdown on low battery). Mar 22 20:13:06 does anyone know what make and type this keyboard is: http://telepixel.ch/openmoko-freerunner/images/usb-mini-keyboard-and-adapter-Af-Bm.jpg ? Mar 22 20:29:20 I forgot my one of my SIM card's PIN... Is there a known way of using the FR to reset it somehow? Mar 22 20:30:33 lymeca: like with any other gsm modem. You need to know PIN2 or ask your provider to give you a new SIM. AFAIK. Mar 22 20:32:33 andy is no longer a member of openmoko it seems, didn't know that Mar 22 20:34:04 where did you find that out from? Mar 22 20:34:10 kernel ML today Mar 22 20:35:19 Zorkman: andy-tracking did have a battery-reading bug for a while. It's fixed now but it might affect the snapshot you tried Mar 22 20:35:59 bjdooks: yep, Andy left :( Mar 22 20:36:54 bjdooks: How are you doing? Great to see you here btw :) Mar 22 20:40:06 I'm sort of tied by an NDA and not having head much from Andy Mar 22 20:40:36 bjdooks: werner said it on the list Mar 22 20:41:08 mmontour: and what about shutdown after xmin ? (it's plugged in) Mar 22 20:43:21 I think the shutdown is frameworkd's reaction to the unreadable battery Mar 22 20:43:24 or mmontour: do you have a newer snapshot than 7 march available? Mar 22 20:44:02 I have the one I built myself, but it's not on a public http server Mar 22 20:44:19 PaulFertser: s/pin2/puk/ Mar 22 20:44:37 DocScrutinizer: yup, i obviously know too little about gsm, i hope he got the idea :) Mar 22 20:44:39 * mmontour is afk for lunch Mar 22 20:45:31 mmontour: would it be possible for you to upload it to somewhere please? Mar 22 20:45:44 Zorkman: seems to me werner mentioned it here in this channel. there was a posting to a list as well? Mar 22 20:45:55 yes, let me get the topic name Mar 22 20:46:26 DocScrutinizer: on the openmoko kernel list: topic [PATCH] Forced shutdown for GTA02 Mar 22 20:47:12 DocScrutinizer: yes, Werner "officially" announced it. I guess he felt it's unfair to hide it anymore from independent kernel devs. Mar 22 20:47:21 DocScrutinizer: or he just doesn't read NDA's :) Mar 22 20:48:16 PaulFertser: I don't think there's a particulr NDA about that Mar 22 20:49:30 DocScrutinizer: too bad Andy left 10 days ago without any "transitional" period. It seems that now nobody knows how (and what for) to further maintain the kernel. Mar 22 20:55:16 ah, missed that Mar 22 20:56:22 PaulFertser: ack Mar 22 20:57:05 can jalimo repository be added to shr? Mar 22 20:57:15 bjdooks: what's your recent status? with OM? Mar 22 20:57:31 DocScrutinizer: ok, let's not think about bad things this evening again. I'm going to watch a good movie soon; i hope you'll find some good way to spend the end of the WE too :) Mar 22 20:57:43 hmm, it's fluffy Mar 22 20:57:45 mutter, nda, mutter... Mar 22 20:57:57 ahh Mar 22 20:58:11 did werner talk to you? Mar 22 20:58:30 in private, so can't add anything more Mar 22 20:58:52 Looks like bjdooks was once bitten badly by some NDA. Mar 22 20:58:57 np :) Mar 22 20:59:16 i Mar 22 20:59:31 i just prefer to let the client make the info public Mar 22 21:14:42 PaulFertser: getting me a couple of latte macchiato and brandy in my pub next by. think that's just good enough Mar 22 21:15:34 mwester: (using N810 & PAN) Mar 22 21:15:34 DocScrutinizer: yeah, enjoy :) Mar 22 21:21:22 PaulFertser: I'm about. Just some of the other guys here looking quite puzzled :D Mar 22 21:22:17 not exactly a geek pub here ;) Mar 22 21:34:24 Zorkman: http://www.mmontour.net/moko/uImage.bin and http://www.mmontour.net/moko/modules.tgz (just did a fresh build, haven't tested it so try at your own risk) Mar 22 21:40:52 :) Mar 22 21:43:41 I just installed OM 2008.12 on my Freerunner a week ago, looking at the bugs dealing with the echo and 1267 says it's been resolved. I definitely still have the problem. Thoughts? Mar 22 21:45:59 whoever managed to install gvsig on SHR should write on the wiki Mar 22 21:49:06 balleyne: Do you lower the volume just a little when in a call? Otherwise you can still have a echo if the other end is loud.. Mar 22 21:50:52 TeLLuS: I don't have an echo on my end, but anyone calling me gets a strong echo. Haven't tried lowering the volume at all -- should I? Mar 22 21:51:58 balleyne: The most left setting is sound off, next to the right is the one I used the most.. YES you have to lower if the other end is loud, as I said. Mar 22 21:52:44 TeLLuS: ok, thanks, I'll give that a shot Mar 22 21:56:14 TeLLuS: balleyne: nope, echo has to be fixed with AT%Nxxxx command to modem. Lowering volume isn't the solution Mar 22 21:57:18 DocScrutinizer: lowering volume just reduced it, didn't fix. How can I use the AT%Nxxxx command (or where can I find more information)? Mar 22 21:58:42 search [hw], [devel] and [community] for "AT%N" or "echo" Mar 22 22:01:43 balleyne: it's "work in progress" as patches to fix echo issue been committed last four weeks or so Mar 22 22:20:13 is there any step for step 'Hello World' tutorial for the FSO/SHR Toolchain? Mar 22 22:20:38 echo "Hello World" Mar 22 22:23:16 Chocky: well.. that helped me a lot. now i can really echo Hello World to the console.. really great.. thank you very much Mar 22 22:24:03 Chocky: this was a question because I was thinking about writing one.. not to get any useless answers. Mar 22 22:26:09 openembedded has a document to do the hello world app in OE. Mar 22 23:04:41 network not coming up unless USB was plugged in at power on. Is that a u-boot issue? Mar 22 23:08:40 ew, buzzy Mar 22 23:12:42 balleyne: You need to use a modern supported distribution, not OM2008.x to get an echo-free operation. Mar 22 23:13:26 DocScrutinizer: the patch to FSO to finally fix the echo on all calls was committed in january, iirc. Mar 22 23:15:32 PaulFertser: "modern supported" as in... devel version of OM 2009? or not OM? Mar 22 23:18:02 PaulFertser: there was some patch in january. Anyway there are delays for other distris to catch up. and there seem to be constant tweaking as to get cmd issued after every call and modem-powerup Mar 22 23:18:07 balleyne: i can't say anything definite about OM2009, as it is tested primarily by Sushama (OM employee) and friends. I know that SHR testing (based on FSO) is used by many end-users and it includes the echo fix for sure. Also it works in all other distros using FSO (Debian and Gentoo). Recently some community-driven qtopia development took place (fixing echo too) but i'm not exactly sure it will last for long. Mar 22 23:21:01 PaulFertser: OM2009? Mar 22 23:21:53 DocScrutinizer: i think that's the future name for the images that Angus regurarly builds with paroli. Mar 22 23:22:40 ahh, maybe. Mar 22 23:22:48 maybe never happens though Mar 22 23:22:49 DocScrutinizer: at least that's how "the testing team" calls it. Mar 22 23:23:17 duh, need to have a closer look to ML occasionally ;-) Mar 22 23:23:47 OTOH I'm not sure it bothers me at all Mar 22 23:23:53 It was after my rant about weird entries on OM trac. Mar 22 23:24:17 anyway nice to hear Sushama still at OM ;) Mar 22 23:24:32 I asked wtf is OM2009 and what are they talking about (something written by the testing team didn't make sense at all). Mar 22 23:25:10 I'm not sure she(?) is still there, the last trac message was in February probably. Mar 22 23:25:16 PaulFertser: testing team msgs seem to be google translated chinese more often than not Mar 22 23:25:29 she Mar 22 23:26:01 even sorta darkskinned girl. very unusual for TPE Mar 22 23:28:21 well honestly a lot of msgs from TPE seem to be google translated Mar 22 23:28:24 DocScrutinizer: is it easy enough for Nicolas Dufresne to sign NDA to get jbt6k74 specs? I guess he's the most capable guy to finally fix lcm problems and he should have full specs (wtf they're closed anyway, that's not gsm or some other heavy proprieatry shit) for sure. Mar 22 23:28:46 DocScrutinizer: i mean it was easy some 3 months ago, do you think he has a chance to do it now? Mar 22 23:29:03 send me a mail Mar 22 23:29:06 ;) Mar 22 23:29:54 Is Andy still with Openmoko? Mar 22 23:29:59 nope Mar 22 23:30:23 I figured as much from some of the email traffic. When did that happen? Mar 22 23:30:40 03.12 it seems Mar 22 23:31:09 Is Openmoko going to employ mwester as a replacement? ;-) Mar 22 23:31:26 TPE remarkably quiet since 2009.03.12 Mar 22 23:31:34 * mwester chokes on his coffee Mar 22 23:31:44 rwhitby: dunno ;D Mar 22 23:31:51 loool Mar 22 23:32:04 giggle Mar 22 23:38:37 DocScrutinizer: sent him a letter (cc'd you). I think i forgot to write to him that if he will need to tweak userspace driver, it'd be better to concentrate on xorg, not kdrive. Mar 22 23:38:56 s/sent/i've just sent/ Mar 22 23:38:57 PaulFertser meant: DocScrutinizer: i've just sent him a letter (cc'd you). I think i forgot to write to him that if he will need to tweak userspace driver, it'd be better to concentrate on xorg, not kdrive. Mar 22 23:41:43 * bjdooks wanted to get on with fixing the usb-gadget code, but i've managed to generatet usb traffic that crashes the bus analyser... awaiting analyser soft-fix to stop it going titsup Mar 22 23:42:37 Yeah, OM-the-company certainly needs/needed a community manager, a guy who knows what's going on in all the core projects (kernel, X, FSO, OE) on both the company and the community side and coordinates the efforts. Mar 22 23:44:35 Would they have the power of life and death though. Mar 22 23:44:35 AH! gnome alarm clock stopped working! Mar 22 23:45:00 Now I don't have any alarm clock, I just hope SHR one works! o_o Mar 22 23:48:24 (will set a cron job as a backup) Mar 23 00:04:17 vininim: `at` is the word Mar 23 00:08:18 Hello, I am looking to obtain access to general 'open source' project figures. I'm trying to find correlation between the no. of projects started in a particular year and the hot topics in IT. Has anyone any helpful suggestions they could recommend? Mar 23 00:09:33 chomchom: googletrends? Mar 23 00:10:35 Google trends is a bit thin on the ground sadly Mar 23 00:10:47 it provides ratios instead of hard numbers Mar 23 00:10:56 and only has aggregate info from 2004 Mar 23 00:14:33 DocScrutinizer: it seems at is a one time only thing Mar 23 00:16:39 vininim: oh, wasn't that what you needed? so for repeated "things" cron surely is more appropriate Mar 23 00:18:50 crontab -e to be precise ;) Mar 23 00:25:02 * DocScrutinizer hates crontab btw, as it needs a stupid `touch /etc/cron.deny` and invocation without option is the most dangerous variant Mar 23 00:25:33 CVirus! Mar 23 02:04:48 Hmm... Mar 23 02:04:59 yup Mar 23 02:05:05 you sure are right on that one SeligArkin Mar 23 02:05:18 rooly1: guess what I broke Mar 23 02:05:28 okay, lets see Mar 23 02:05:34 i have to ask first which distro Mar 23 02:06:00 because each one breaks differently Mar 23 02:06:04 ;-) Mar 23 02:06:05 SeligArkin: hey :) Mar 23 02:06:12 each with their own comedy. Mar 23 02:06:17 lol, yeah Mar 23 02:06:19 ahhha Mar 23 02:06:29 and if qtopia, which version Mar 23 02:06:35 because they all break differently too Mar 23 02:06:41 well I found a problem with the phonegui_*_show() functions Mar 23 02:06:44 and if X, then which version Y, and which kernel Z Mar 23 02:06:51 they can't handle not havin DISPLAY set Mar 23 02:06:58 but no, I broke openmoko-messages Mar 23 02:07:01 in SHR Mar 23 02:07:07 man Mar 23 02:07:08 no fair Mar 23 02:07:09 it didn't l ike me getting a MMS it seems Mar 23 02:07:11 i wanted to guess so bad Mar 23 02:08:03 Rooly! Mar 23 02:08:10 yo dawg Mar 23 02:08:10 SeligArkin: after all MMS isn't supported. but sure it shouldn't break Mar 23 02:08:23 * rooly1 is writing an event receiver for his favorite 3d engine Mar 23 02:08:25 ** (process:2083): DEBUG: ogsmd_sim_retrieve_messagebook_callback() Mar 23 02:08:25 Failed to handle dbus error: Resource Device is not enabled, current status is 'disabled', 71 (dbus-glib-error-quark), code 32 Mar 23 02:09:02 now that I see the actual error, I am going to guess it was a coincidence Mar 23 02:09:21 haha Mar 23 02:09:32 yeah...unless the mms came from one of your contacts Mar 23 02:09:42 no contacts setupp uet Mar 23 02:10:19 I am not happy about it just being name-number to be honest Mar 23 02:10:36 how could it tell whether it's been from a contact? ;-) Mar 23 02:10:44 btw, DocScrutinizer, i was thinking, the gprs functions in frameworkd seem rather limited, don't you think Mar 23 02:10:47 hmm Mar 23 02:10:55 rooly, how's your distro coming along bro? Mar 23 02:11:00 lol Mar 23 02:11:22 i work 10 hours a day and sleep another 8... Mar 23 02:11:38 so writing a distro is mostly a pipe dream Mar 23 02:11:41 shit Mar 23 02:11:47 should hire some mexicans, methinks Mar 23 02:11:50 lol Mar 23 02:11:51 ... Mar 23 02:11:56 ...i do work with some of those Mar 23 02:12:00 rooly1: no idea about that. what's it you are missing? Mar 23 02:12:01 I have no clue how I broke it Mar 23 02:12:13 Or at least, someone who doesn't say "lol" every second sentence :-( Mar 23 02:12:33 well doc, dial number for one thing Mar 23 02:13:09 Chocky: i aint sayin that every second one. its every 3rd Mar 23 02:13:14 lol Mar 23 02:13:21 heehee Mar 23 02:13:32 see what I did there? Mar 23 02:13:49 bitchx ... | grep -v lol Mar 23 02:13:52 rooly1: dial number for gprs? don't get it, sorry Mar 23 02:14:13 different carriers have a different AT dial number for gprs connectivity Mar 23 02:14:26 for instance, AT&T is something like ***99* Mar 23 02:14:46 whereas the mostly standard one is something like *99 Mar 23 02:14:55 ah you're talking about that "*99#" Mar 23 02:14:59 yeah, that Mar 23 02:15:35 hmm, this for sure should be a config option Mar 23 02:15:59 I'm not aware that *99* does anything different with AT&T. An I wrote the software for my company's product that dials for many different GSM modems Mar 23 02:16:05 cHOX Mar 23 02:16:11 DaveBitch Mar 23 02:16:13 but as I said, I have no idea about details of FSO implementation Mar 23 02:16:45 then maybe i'm misinformed Mar 23 02:16:53 wouldn't be the first time Mar 23 02:17:11 IME, both numbers work fine. But of course, I wouldn't put anything past AT&T Mar 23 02:17:13 rooly: hm, missinformed? Mar 23 02:17:26 Rooly!? Misinformed!? NO WAI! Mar 23 02:17:31 so there could well be some ill-documented difference Mar 23 02:17:42 Selig - chill Mar 23 02:17:50 :P Mar 23 02:19:41 why oh why does windows always run my harddrive so much Mar 23 02:19:53 rooly1: I never was in charge of FSO Mar 23 02:20:00 oh i know Mar 23 02:20:08 i just thought you might know about it some Mar 23 02:20:26 hmm, who told you? Mar 23 02:20:29 DocScrutinizer: you are now! Mar 23 02:20:37 nobody did Mar 23 02:20:44 i'm a good guesser Mar 23 02:21:06 DocScrutinizer: you work at openmoko.. as do the fso team... thus as u both work there on the same procuct.. u'd probably know Mar 23 02:21:09 guess != information Mar 23 02:21:11 rooly1: guess what I'm going to do now that I broke SHR Mar 23 02:21:17 * raster nudges DocScrutinizer Mar 23 02:21:19 reflash? Mar 23 02:21:37 I'll get bacvk to you Mar 23 02:21:42 because I don't know yet Mar 23 02:21:56 * rooly1 avoids lol, "haha, good to know" Mar 23 02:22:02 raster: you very well know I'm *not* working for om anymore ;) Mar 23 02:22:04 :o Mar 23 02:22:15 * raster points to the nudge Mar 23 02:22:22 :) Mar 23 02:22:48 oh! Mar 23 02:22:52 I un-broke it! Mar 23 02:22:59 lol Mar 23 02:23:11 heh Mar 23 02:23:15 "This is a binary message" Mar 23 02:23:19 (borrowed from rooly ) Mar 23 02:24:15 * Chocky frowns at vagalume Mar 23 02:24:16 I love my notify script Mar 23 02:24:29 Notify -sms "Something that took all night is done!" Mar 23 02:24:35 and it will text me Mar 23 02:24:47 sounds great Mar 23 02:25:17 it secretly uses the AT&T email -> txt interface Mar 23 02:25:47 though I guess its not much of a secret now... Mar 23 02:25:48 * Chocky frowns even more at Mofi Mar 23 02:25:51 does nothing! Mar 23 02:27:40 how can I easily change orientation from within SHR? Mar 23 02:27:45 without using command line :p Mar 23 02:29:35 Chocky: make a desktop icon to rotate Mar 23 02:29:45 e has a config dialog for that Mar 23 02:29:48 remove the lcd, rotate, and reattach. Mar 23 02:29:50 but it doesnt quite fit on screen Mar 23 02:29:51 :) Mar 23 02:30:28 mwester wins. Mar 23 02:31:39 :D Mar 23 02:32:03 Chocky, better not, your face will stay that way :p Mar 23 02:37:50 Chocky: there is also omnewrotate, which uses accelerometers to rotate screen (if that is what you want..) Mar 23 02:38:01 kinky Mar 23 02:40:45 bow chicka wow wow Mar 23 02:40:56 pfft, you wish :p Mar 23 02:43:09 :P **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Mar 23 02:59:57 2009