**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Apr 25 02:59:57 2009
Apr 25 03:21:38 <slaxxer> a friend says he buys iphone replacement screens out of china for 10 dollars each
Apr 25 03:21:45 <slaxxer> 1 at a time
Apr 25 04:12:52 <slaxxer> latest fso-paroli-unstable
Apr 25 04:27:37 <slaxxer> all i saw was paroli
Apr 25 04:27:59 <slaxxer> fast in an out of suspend
Apr 25 04:28:27 <slaxxer> no bar at top to access fso
Apr 25 04:28:51 <slaxxer> i guess shr unstable is broken?
Apr 25 04:54:03 <beer_> morning
Apr 25 05:44:27 <PaulFertser> allagator: Hey :) I guess if you're extremely careful and is not afraid of soldering to a testpoint, you can flash NOR without dboard.
Apr 25 07:03:28 <feitingen> Just wondering, has the debian u-boot hack ever worked for anyone?
Apr 25 07:13:08 <zeroedout> ......I can boot into debian from NOR, so yes?
Apr 25 07:17:25 <gustavold> how do I disable the "guessing" feature of the keyboard. I couldn't type my wifi password
Apr 25 07:21:59 <PaulFertser> gustavold: swipe up to change to the terminal keyboard
Apr 25 07:29:28 <gustavold>  PaulFertser: I'm using the Om 2008.12, what you said just change the keyboard type (numeric, symbols, etc.)
Apr 25 07:30:04 <PaulFertser> gustavold: and in terminal keyboard you'll have no prediction that'll allow to enter whatever password you have.
Apr 25 07:35:31 <gustavold> PaulFertser: I dont know what you mean "terminal keyboard"
Apr 25 07:36:43 <PaulFertser> gustavold: the one with all the keys you usually find on a regular full-size keyboard (ctrl, alt, pgup, pgdn, ins, etc)
Apr 25 07:37:52 <gustavold> PaulFertser: it doesn't appear here. Stroking upward just changes to capital letters
Apr 25 07:39:10 <PaulFertser> gustavold: it should be there. After the keyboard with numbers. You can also try to press some button in upper right corner to see the list of available keyboards and choose from there.
Apr 25 07:39:21 <feitingen> zeroedout: can you boot debian from NAND?
Apr 25 08:04:36 <PierreN> does anyone know where to find a tutorial for FSO (how to get the contact list from the sim, how to dial, send an sms...) please ? also which languages bindings are available please ?
Apr 25 08:05:53 <lindi-> PierreN: it's dbus
Apr 25 08:06:11 <lindi-> PierreN: i don't think you need any language bindings
Apr 25 08:11:18 <PaulFertser> PierreN: http://freesmartphone.org has API description
Apr 25 08:16:09 <gustavold> Does openmoko support wifi with WPA?
Apr 25 08:16:38 <gustavold> I'm getting "Unable to join network" after supplying the password
Apr 25 08:17:23 <gustavold> my router is configured to use WPA Personal
Apr 25 08:19:40 <PaulFertser> gustavold: it does
Apr 25 08:20:40 <PierreN> PaulFertser: thanks for the link, that's what i needed
Apr 25 08:20:49 <PaulFertser> gustavold: but. There're some known wifi issues with .24 kernels (that are fixed in .28/.29, otoh the recent kernels rarely can't connect to APs that used to work with .24).
Apr 25 08:20:57 <PierreN> lindi-: but... how to call dbus in ... bash for example ?
Apr 25 08:21:46 <PaulFertser> gustavold: also i've never seen wpa_supplicant saying anything like your quote, probably you use some "fancy" obscure gui instead of using wpa_supplicant directly.
Apr 25 08:21:52 <PaulFertser> PierreN: there's mdbus utility
Apr 25 08:22:01 <PaulFertser> PierreN: and more generic dbus-send.
Apr 25 08:22:47 <gustavold> PaulFertser: yes, I've just bought a new openmoko, and it came without a shell application
Apr 25 08:23:22 <PierreN> PaulFertser: ok thanks
Apr 25 08:23:36 <PaulFertser> gustavold: nobody cares what it came for (and i highly doubt it lacks terminal in any distro out there), you're free to install any app/distro you like.
Apr 25 08:24:13 <PaulFertser> PierreN: btw, "mdbus -s" will provide you with a way to see dbus introspection data, so you can see bus names, then after supplying bus name you'll see interface names etc.
Apr 25 08:25:40 <PierreN> ok
Apr 25 08:27:00 <gustavold> PaulFertser: I'm trying to make wifi working to install new cool applications like terminal :)
Apr 25 08:28:00 <md2k7> gustavold: why not just attach the phone via USB and SSH in?
Apr 25 08:28:13 <PaulFertser> gustavold: if you have a usb-equipped internet-enabled host computer nearby, it's much easier (and failproof) to use usb networking instead.
Apr 25 08:28:43 <gustavold> PaulFertser, md2k7: I'll try it
Apr 25 08:33:44 <PaulFertser> gustavold: and btw, you'll soon understand that using freerunner while you have a good ssh connection to it is much more fun than trying to type all lengthy commands, read logs etc with tiny virtual keyboard.
Apr 25 10:58:25 <Wonka> where does e look for .desktop files? currently, i don
Apr 25 10:58:33 <Wonka> 't get any icons...
Apr 25 10:59:04 <Q-Master> /usr/share/applications
Apr 25 10:59:23 <Q-Master> try to mv ~/.e ~/.e.old
Apr 25 10:59:29 <Q-Master> then restart e
Apr 25 11:17:08 <Wonka> i did rm -rf .e before...
Apr 25 11:17:59 <Wonka> mh, the .desktop files are all there
Apr 25 11:20:01 <rhaeder> I hope today the DHL man will come. pulster wrote on 20th that they have delivered it
Apr 25 11:38:35 <lord-carlos> i got an error while upgrading shr unstable: 
Apr 25 11:38:36 <lord-carlos> * ERROR: The following packages conflict with e-wm-menu-shr:
Apr 25 11:38:38 <lord-carlos>          *  e-wm-menu *
Apr 25 11:41:03 <dns53> i removed the package with the old name and installed the one with the new name
Apr 25 11:41:22 <lord-carlos> i try that right now
Apr 25 11:41:26 <lord-carlos> looks like it works
Apr 25 11:49:39 <lord-carlos> i think i gonna sell my OpenMoko :/
Apr 25 11:49:52 <lord-carlos> i need something more stable 
Apr 25 11:50:18 <lindi-> *cough* debian
Apr 25 11:50:33 <dns53> shr is finally stable for me
Apr 25 11:50:36 <Wonka> i want gvsigmobile on debian
Apr 25 11:50:43 <lord-carlos> debian is nice .. i got it on all my computers .. but its to slow on the FR
Apr 25 11:50:56 <lindi-> Wonka: got link to source code? I can make a package
Apr 25 11:51:28 <lindi-> lord-carlos: it all depends on the apps you use
Apr 25 11:51:50 <lord-carlos> Some one from Denmark/Germany around who wont to buy a allmost new FR with headset for ~ 250 euro ?
Apr 25 11:52:06 <Wonka> lindi-: maemo has a debian package already - but you'd need libswt-gtk for debian arm first...
Apr 25 11:52:28 <Mononoke> lord-carlos: I would take it for 200 :P
Apr 25 11:53:22 <lindi-> Wonka: libswt-gtk-3.4-java-gcj is available for armel
Apr 25 11:53:48 <lord-carlos> lindi-: i tried neovento. It was too slow for me.
Apr 25 11:53:49 <lindi-> Wonka: libswt-gtk-3.4-jni and libswt-gtk-3.4-java are too
Apr 25 11:53:56 <lindi-> lord-carlos: what's that?
Apr 25 11:54:06 <lindi-> lord-carlos: i don't that is in debian
Apr 25 11:54:17 <lord-carlos> lindi-: a debian based Distributions
Apr 25 11:54:32 <lord-carlos> "neovento is a Debian for Freerunner based distribution which uses LXDE and Zhone on top."
Apr 25 11:54:54 <lindi-> lord-carlos: lxde surely is more heavy-weight than icewm for example
Apr 25 11:55:11 <lindi-> lord-carlos: so don't use lxde
Apr 25 11:55:34 <lord-carlos> Mononoke: you get a free laserpointer if you buy it for 250 ;-)
Apr 25 12:00:30 <Mononoke> lord-carlos: nah sorry no, I'm out of your area anyway
Apr 25 12:02:59 <bruce_c> I don't know if it's the WM that affects it but I find the UI to be really laggy with shr-unstable
Apr 25 12:03:32 <bruce_c> i.e scrolling requires you to hold the new position for a few seconds until the UI catches up
Apr 25 12:03:43 <lindi-> bruce_c: try different wm?
Apr 25 12:03:47 <bruce_c> TangoGPS is still awesome though
Apr 25 12:04:30 <bruce_c> lindi-: how? I need something that integrates well with the touchscreen
Apr 25 12:04:50 <lindi-> bruce_c: just to test your hypothesis?
Apr 25 12:05:01 <bruce_c> oh, ok
Apr 25 12:06:21 <bruce_c> well personally I think it's a problem with python
Apr 25 12:07:12 <bruce_c> actually that wouldn't work because scrolling will be handled by native code
Apr 25 12:07:13 <bruce_c> hmm
Apr 25 12:07:56 <lord-carlos> i also dont like the laggy UI
Apr 25 12:26:09 <rhaeder> does someone know a good online store where I can buy an US-layout keyboard?
Apr 25 12:33:59 <lord-carlos> where is the config for tango gps?
Apr 25 12:36:04 <shellevil> rhaeder: ebay?
Apr 25 12:36:10 <shellevil> where are you
Apr 25 12:37:04 <rhaeder> Germany, but I prefer US for better coding experiences :)
Apr 25 12:37:21 <Wonka> rrraaaah!
Apr 25 12:37:24 <Wonka> opkg install -force-downgrade ...
Apr 25 12:37:37 <Wonka> Package ... installed in root is up to date.
Apr 25 12:37:50 <Wonka> b0rked
Apr 25 12:39:41 <lord-carlos> mhh, i allways get segfault if i try to change the chache folder for the tango gps maps
Apr 25 12:39:52 <lord-carlos> and i cat find the damn config file
Apr 25 12:40:53 <shellevil> http://shop.ebay.co.uk/items/__us-keyboard-laptop_W0QQ_nkwZusQ20keyboardQ20Q2dlaptopQQConnectionQ2520TypeZCordedQQ_dmptZUKQ5fComputingQ5fComputerComponentsQ5fKeyboardsMiceQQ_flnZ1QQ_ssovZ1QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em282
Apr 25 12:40:57 <shellevil> forex
Apr 25 12:49:15 <Wonka> lord-carlos: ~/.gconf/apps/tangogps/%gconf.xml
Apr 25 12:50:28 <lord-carlos> ah thanks
Apr 25 12:50:35 <lord-carlos> i also found this: http://lists.openmoko.org/nabble.html#nabble-td2603221
Apr 25 12:50:43 <lord-carlos> looks like i am not the only one having this bug
Apr 25 13:03:24 <bruce_c> lord-carlos: my solution was to rm -rf ~/Maps && ln -siv /media/card/Maps
Apr 25 13:03:47 <bruce_c> actually not -siv but ln -s
Apr 25 13:03:55 <DocScrutinizer> Matthias Felsche around here? someone knows where to IRC him?
Apr 25 14:12:30 <PBeck> ahoi
Apr 25 14:13:35 <beer_> hi
Apr 25 14:16:56 <hjking> Hi. does anyone know when SHR will be able to lookup the name of an incoming number from contacts? I hear it's to do with ologicd... Its a shame because It's the only major problem I have with SHR - it's getting embarrassing to have to ask who i'm talking to each time I get a call!
Apr 25 14:25:13 <max_posedon> hm... it works for me
Apr 25 14:25:17 <max_posedon> just right now
Apr 25 14:50:28 <bxyrk> anyone have one of the freedom slimpads?
Apr 25 14:52:03 <bxyrk> i have one, but everytime i disconnect, i need to remove the pairing, and repair it to use it again....
Apr 25 15:01:54 <WhiteAnt> anybody have any info for debian on GTA01
Apr 25 15:02:27 <lindi-> WhiteAnt: wiki has
Apr 25 15:02:31 <lindi-> WhiteAnt: and #openmoko-debian
Apr 25 15:02:43 <lindi-> WhiteAnt: and the pkg-fso mailing list
Apr 25 15:03:18 <WhiteAnt> i want debian image for GTA)01
Apr 25 15:12:39 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03seba.dos1 07framework * r6bfd89af907e 10/framework/subsystems/opimd/ (__init__.py pimb_sqlite_contacts.py): opimd: add sqlite contacts backend by Heinervdm and modify it to work
Apr 25 15:16:20 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03seba.dos1 07framework * r12de19b81e0f 10/framework/subsystems/opimd/pimb_sqlite_contacts.py: opimd: convert sqlite backend from windows to unix format
Apr 25 16:33:21 <badcloud> hey all
Apr 25 16:37:37 <Blu3> 'allo
Apr 25 16:50:02 <badcloud> what's up Blu3?
Apr 25 16:51:02 <slaxxer> dammit man growth is painful
Apr 25 16:51:12 <badcloud> which type, slaxxer?
Apr 25 16:51:22 <badcloud> and which distro are you stuck on now?
Apr 25 16:51:34 <slaxxer> http://planet.openmoko.org/
Apr 25 16:51:56 <slaxxer> shr unstable an .29 kernel
Apr 25 16:51:56 <badcloud> by the by, how can I access the sms's on the sim card via shr?
Apr 25 16:52:00 <badcloud> me too
Apr 25 16:52:05 <badcloud> not bad so far
Apr 25 16:52:18 <slaxxer> can u ssh in
Apr 25 16:52:39 <slaxxer> is it the usb0eth0 problem?
Apr 25 16:53:09 <slaxxer> rm -rf ~/Maps && ln -s /media/card/Maps
Apr 25 16:53:27 <slaxxer>  i did that an cant see my maps in tango
Apr 25 16:53:38 <slaxxer> still cant*
Apr 25 16:54:25 <bruce_c> how much have you downloaded into /media/card/Maps ?
Apr 25 16:56:07 <Blu3> hey bc.  driving down the road, relaxing for a bit
Apr 25 16:56:11 <slaxxer> i will check
Apr 25 16:56:58 <slaxxer>   its a 4 gig
Apr 25 16:57:06 <Blu3> badcloud, use mdbus
Apr 25 16:57:25 <slaxxer> it cant have more than 1/3 of the usa on it
Apr 25 16:57:38 <Blu3> mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.ogsmd /org/freesmartphone/GSM/Device org.freesmartphone.GSM.SIM.RetrieveMessagebook 'all'
Apr 25 16:57:43 <Blu3> retrieves all messages
Apr 25 16:58:24 <Blu3> use "mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.ogsmd /org/freesmartphone/GSM/Device" to find the methods to fetch individually, delete, etc
Apr 25 17:02:21 <badcloud> thanks Blu3
Apr 25 17:02:27 <badcloud> wow, nice knowhow
Apr 25 17:03:03 <Blu3> y/w :)
Apr 25 17:04:53 <badcloud> space between 'Device' and org.free...?
Apr 25 17:05:29 <Blu3> yes
Apr 25 17:05:44 <Blu3> there's three blobs there
Apr 25 17:05:50 <badcloud> noted
Apr 25 17:06:55 <Blu3> it's the $bus, $object, and $method
Apr 25 17:08:21 <badcloud> wonder how that can be utilized to make a delete all sms script...
Apr 25 17:09:23 <Blu3> for i in $(seq 1 30); do <~above>.DeleteMessage '$i'; done
Apr 25 17:10:04 <Blu3> bbiab
Apr 25 17:15:20 <badcloud> bbia what?
Apr 25 17:19:13 <badcloud> trying to figure that one out though... what is the bash binary that is actually executed?
Apr 25 17:26:08 <shellevil> which bash
Apr 25 17:27:30 <badcloud> ash
Apr 25 17:29:32 <badcloud> not sure though
Apr 25 17:29:56 <badcloud> what is the full command essentially to make this sms deletion sequence work?
Apr 25 17:29:58 <badcloud> in shr
Apr 25 17:32:23 <Blu3> bbiab == be back in a bit
Apr 25 17:32:32 <badcloud> gotcha
Apr 25 17:32:58 <Blu3> for i in $(seq 1 30); do mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.ogsmd /org/freesmartphone/GSM/Device org.freesmartphone.GSM.SIM.DeleteMessage '$i'; done
Apr 25 17:33:14 <Blu3> deletes all msgs on your sim card
Apr 25 17:36:21 <badcloud> trying it now
Apr 25 17:37:52 <badcloud> ERROR:dbus.connection:Unable to set arguments ('$i',) according to signature u'i': <type 'exceptions.TypeError'>: an integer is required
Apr 25 17:38:11 <Blu3> ah, remove the ''
Apr 25 17:38:13 <Blu3> sorry
Apr 25 17:41:56 <badcloud> worked, thanks
Apr 25 17:48:46 <Blu3> you're welcome
Apr 25 17:51:29 <gustavold> I'm getting the following errror when I type "opkg update":
Apr 25 17:51:29 <gustavold>  * Could not obtain administrative lock
Apr 25 17:51:42 <gustavold> there is no open application on the pone
Apr 25 17:56:13 <md2k7|afk> gustavold: are you still using some old ASU distro?
Apr 25 17:56:16 <md2k7|afk> http://lists.openmoko.org/nabble.html#nabble-td682310 then
Apr 25 17:57:39 <gustavold> md2k7|afk: Om 2008.12
Apr 25 17:58:25 <md2k7|afk> mhm, still try killall packagekit
Apr 25 17:58:43 <md2k7|afk> gustavold: i don't know if that is fixed, I'm using SHR now
Apr 25 18:02:56 <slaxxer> or reboot
Apr 25 18:16:28 <DocScrutinizer> bah, nable
Apr 25 18:17:03 <DocScrutinizer> js-junk
Apr 25 18:17:42 <DocScrutinizer> could you use pipermail instead?
Apr 25 18:18:03 <DocScrutinizer> at least for URL-links for the masses
Apr 25 18:26:26 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * r9f17c047cb47 10/ (ChangeLog framework/resource.py): ousaged: Serialize resources with an asynchronous worker queue. This should ease fixing FSO #404.
Apr 25 18:36:59 <alphaone> yay
Apr 25 18:37:02 <edje> hi all, i seem to have lost my ability to boot into nand. i recently flashed to 2009.1, but it might have happend before or after that too. any hints ?
Apr 25 18:37:14 <DocScrutinizer> alphaone: yay?
Apr 25 18:37:48 <alphaone> DocScrutinizer: mickeys commit 9f17c047cb47
Apr 25 18:38:14 <DocScrutinizer> hmm, maybe I need to look at 404 to appreciate
Apr 25 18:39:11 <alphaone> DocScrutinizer: Been a real potential PITA for a while now?
Apr 25 19:19:31 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03mok 07libframeworkd-glib * r6f2e7ce113a0 10/ (13 files in 4 dirs): 
Apr 25 19:19:31 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: opimd: start implementation of wrappers for opimd calls
Apr 25 19:19:31 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: This is completely untested... Should compile though.
Apr 25 19:19:31 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Klaus Kurzmann <mok@fluxnetz.de>
Apr 25 19:19:33 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03mok 07libframeworkd-glib * re945a1ff12ca 10/src/ (7 files in 3 dirs): 
Apr 25 19:19:34 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: opimd: add wrappers fro sources interface
Apr 25 19:19:36 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Klaus Kurzmann <mok@fluxnetz.de>
Apr 25 19:19:38 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03mok 07libframeworkd-glib * raae989c07be4 10/src/ (frameworkd-glib-dbus.c frameworkd-glib-dbus.h): 
Apr 25 19:19:41 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: dbus: const correctnes for connect_to_interface
Apr 25 19:19:43 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Klaus Kurzmann <mok@fluxnetz.de>
Apr 25 19:19:45 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03mok 07libframeworkd-glib * r8176de3c87f0 10/src/opimd/ (2 files): 
Apr 25 19:19:47 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: opimd/contacts: keep the DBusGProxy for queries
Apr 25 19:19:49 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: This is needed, because opimd remembers the query cursor
Apr 25 19:19:51 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: for each client connection...
Apr 25 19:19:53 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Klaus Kurzmann <mok@fluxnetz.de>
Apr 25 19:19:55 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03mok 07libframeworkd-glib * r9c43c1aa4116 10/src/opimd/ (frameworkd-glib-opimd-dbus.c frameworkd-glib-opimd-dbus.h): 
Apr 25 19:20:00 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: opimd/sources: add missing dbus connect functions
Apr 25 19:20:02 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Klaus Kurzmann <mok@fluxnetz.de>
Apr 25 19:20:04 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03mok 07libframeworkd-glib * r32aca2c5a5c4 10/src/opimd/dbus/ (contacts.h contacts.xml): 
Apr 25 19:20:07 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: opimd/contacts: implement GetMultipleResults
Apr 25 19:20:09 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Klaus Kurzmann <mok@fluxnetz.de>
Apr 25 19:20:13 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03mok 07libframeworkd-glib * r8abecf8adf5e 10/src/opimd/frameworkd-glib-opimd-contacts.c: 
Apr 25 19:20:16 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: opimd/contacts: fix messages/contacts typo and add missing cast
Apr 25 19:20:18 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Klaus Kurzmann <mok@fluxnetz.de>
Apr 25 19:20:20 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03mok 07libframeworkd-glib * r9c2bae8f2a12 10/ (20 files in 4 dirs): Merge branch 'opimd'
Apr 25 19:20:27 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03mok 07libframeworkd-glib * r7301d4e1ec7f 10/src/opimd/ (4 files): 
Apr 25 19:20:29 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: opimd: add G_BEGIN_DECLS / G_END_DECLS
Apr 25 19:20:31 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Klaus Kurzmann <mok@fluxnetz.de>
Apr 25 20:32:53 <gustavold> I'm planning to do a opkg upgrade, but opkg update gives me some download errors (404). Is it normal?
Apr 25 20:33:30 <gustavold> some are just signatures, but there is some Packages.gz missing too.
Apr 25 20:37:28 <axel_> Hello! I want to get started with the Freerunner. So far I'm trying to get an internt-connection. As OM2008.8 didn't have any SSH-server running and a connection to a WIFI-network could not be established. I upgraded to OM2008.12. Bot in this distribution tehere is no SSH server either, there isn't even a way to set up a WIFI-connection. How can I connect the Freerunner to the internet?
Apr 25 20:40:07 <PaulFertser> gustavold: which distro?
Apr 25 20:40:07 <CIA-45> freesmartphone.org: 03seba.dos1 07framework * ra100a6b73023 10/framework/subsystems/opimd/backend_manager.py: opimd: don't fail when default backend isn't specified. Use some, which supports specified domain.
Apr 25 20:40:20 <gustavold> Om 2008.12
Apr 25 20:40:24 <PaulFertser> gustavold: do an opkg update beforehand
Apr 25 20:40:24 <gustavold> PaulFertser: 
Apr 25 20:40:55 <PaulFertser> gustavold: and i'd suggest to stop using a deprecated distro anyway.
Apr 25 20:41:32 <gustavold> PaulFertser: will opkg upgrade solve it?
Apr 25 20:42:05 <PaulFertser> gustavold: using a deprecated system -- no; 404 errors -- i guess, it should.
Apr 25 20:43:31 <gustavold> PaulFertser: what you mean a deprecated system? Which one is up-to-date?
Apr 25 20:43:51 <PaulFertser> axel_: most probably you're doing something wrong. Even deprecated distros like OM2008.x all had sshd (dropbear) installed and run by default.
Apr 25 20:45:22 <PaulFertser> gustavold: nobody is supporting Qtopia-on-X development line. So as i see it OM2008 has no future. SHR or OM2009; Debian and (probably) Gentoo are based on FSO and are in active development.
Apr 25 20:48:28 <max_posedon> Gentoo isn't "probably")
Apr 25 20:49:31 <axel_> PaulFertser: The steps I did so far: Plugged in the USB-Cable. Mounted the USB-device (sudo mount -t usbfs usbfs /proc/bus/usb).Checked wether there was an USB-entry in the ifconfig-answer. "Connected" the USB-device to a IP-Adress (sudo ifconfig usb0 192.168.0.200 netmask 255.255.255.0). Tried to ssh (ssh root@192.168.0.200), Answer: ssh: connect to host 192.168.0.200 port 22: Connection refused.
Apr 25 20:50:05 <PaulFertser> max_posedon: it's just i don't really know the current status. Feel free to correct me :)
Apr 25 20:50:28 <PaulFertser> axel_: what address FR should have in your opinion?
Apr 25 20:50:50 <gustavold> PaulFertser: from the bellow url I understood the best choice (as a new user) would be OM2008. I'll study changing my system. thank you.
Apr 25 20:50:51 <gustavold> http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Distributions
Apr 25 20:51:03 <axel_> PaulFertser: 192.168.0.200
Apr 25 20:51:28 <PaulFertser> axel_: how can you assume that after you run "ifconfig usb0 192.168.0.200 netmask 255.255.255.0" on host?!
Apr 25 20:52:56 <max_posedon> Current status is far away from usable for even for most  Gentoo users, but it has worked fso/shr stack, and even Xorg+xf86-video-glamo
Apr 25 20:53:10 <PaulFertser> max_posedon: wow, what's missing then?
Apr 25 20:53:54 <axel_> PaulFertser: I'm quite new to Linux. I assumed that this command sets the IP-adress. It's also described in the Wiki: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Getting_Started_with_your_Neo_FreeRunner/de#Manuelle_Methode (Sry. German)
Apr 25 20:54:40 <PaulFertser> axel_: yes, this command sets the IP address. Of host!
Apr 25 20:54:57 <max_posedon> cross compilation steps aren't works as should, and many configuration steps should be done manully
Apr 25 20:55:17 <PaulFertser> axel_: and afaik it's no different to many other unix-like OSes. 
Apr 25 20:55:56 <PaulFertser> max_posedon: ok, so my (probably) wasn't that misaligned with the reality :-/
Apr 25 20:57:21 <max_posedon> I hope we will prepare per-night building images soon, then we will have may be big announce. I hope it will be before FSOSHRCON)
Apr 25 20:59:57 <axel_> PaulFertser: If I worked with Unix-systems before, I'd had less problems understanding what I do. So I have to rely on the wiki
Apr 25 21:00:36 <PaulFertser> axel_: ifconfig sets ip address of the computer it's performed on. You need to connect via ssh to freerunner, not to your host.
Apr 25 21:02:22 <axel_> Paul#
Apr 25 21:03:09 <axel_> PaulFertser: No I've tried "sudo ip address add 192.168.3.200/24 dev usb0". The same problem with ssh root@192.168.3.200.
Apr 25 21:03:22 <PaulFertser> axel_: that's expected
Apr 25 21:05:25 <max_posedon> axel_: do you know your FR ip address?
Apr 25 21:05:42 <PaulFertser> axel_: you set ip address of you host computer to 192.168.3.200, then you try to connect to it. Obviously you fail (because your intention is to connect to FR).
Apr 25 21:06:34 <axel_> PaulFertser: OK. I've got this. But how to connect to the FR then?
Apr 25 21:06:37 <max_posedon> you know, FR's and Host's ip differnent!
Apr 25 21:07:17 <PaulFertser> axel_: and btw, i doubt FR in default configuration will like to see usb host at anywhere except 192.168.0.x. So stick to the well known 192.168.0.202. FR's default address is 192.168.0.202.
Apr 25 21:07:19 <max_posedon> axel_: Once more, do you know FR's ip?
Apr 25 21:07:25 <axel_> max_posedon: I'm aware of that. The question is: How to set the IP-adress of the freerunner.
Apr 25 21:07:59 <PaulFertser> axel_: you first connect to it via well-known ip address. Or you change it in the properties using virtual keyboard beforehand.
Apr 25 21:09:28 <PaulFertser> axel_: so, the host address that is set as default gw on FR is 192.168.0.200. The FR's address is 192.168.0.202.
Apr 25 21:11:28 <axel_> max_posedon, PaulFertser: Thanks for your help. It semms that I've messed up the IP-adresses. To get a clean start. I'll perform a reboot. BRB
Apr 25 21:11:37 <PaulFertser> axel_: ?
Apr 25 21:11:40 <PaulFertser> Fuck
Apr 25 21:12:27 <PaulFertser> It's fucking easy to setup usb networking following correct (to some degree) insturctions, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking
Apr 25 21:13:02 <PaulFertser> Why the hell anyone will read outdated probably mis-translated german variant of the same information?
Apr 25 21:13:43 <PaulFertser> If i made decisions, i'd removed all stupid "localised" version from the OM wiki altogether. Screw that.
Apr 25 21:15:41 <PaulFertser> axel_: you missed all my rants! I suggest you (and everybody) to read actual insturctions, not some german mis-translation. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking
Apr 25 21:17:28 <PaulFertser> And to stop fucking translating efforts altogether not to continue to mislead people with outdated/wrong/inaccurate information.
Apr 25 21:21:18 <max_posedon> PaulFertser: keep it easy, some people just forgot his reading skills after school)
Apr 25 21:22:07 <PaulFertser> max_posedon: having semi-translated outdated copies can't help anybody sane. And puts a burden of support on those who can do something more useful.
Apr 25 21:24:11 <max_posedon> Yes you are right, but I'm sure many people still prefer asking, then reading
Apr 25 21:25:13 <max_posedon> and yes, wiki traslations always crap, just because it is separate pages
Apr 25 21:25:35 <max_posedon> and doesn't work like gettext
Apr 25 21:26:48 <PaulFertser> I have LC_MESSAGES=C everywhere i work too. Just because it's stupid imho to have it any other way.
Apr 25 21:40:37 <bruce_c> PaulFertser: isn't it so lucky that openmoko chose English as the primary language :)
Apr 25 21:41:22 <leinir> bruce_c: Seeing as English is the lingua franca of computer science, not really ;)
Apr 25 21:41:28 <PaulFertser> bruce_c: Yeah, toki pona wouldn't work as well :)
Apr 25 21:43:53 <bruce_c> I've come across a fair number of non-English articles recently and always appreciate any translations
Apr 25 21:46:39 <PaulFertser> bruce_c: why?
Apr 25 21:46:51 <PaulFertser> bruce_c: what translations are useful for?
Apr 25 21:48:29 <max_posedon> translations usefull for poiting people(which doesn't want/can't read original) there,
Apr 25 21:49:15 <PaulFertser> If they don't want to read original, i think we don't want to see them here.
Apr 25 21:50:14 <max_posedon> yes, this is main reason for avoid any russian-speaking openmoko "communities"
Apr 25 21:50:57 <bruce_c> PaulFertser: so everyone should be able to read English?
Apr 25 21:51:19 <max_posedon> (big, red font) YES!
Apr 25 21:51:35 <PaulFertser> bruce_c: yes, at least technical English.
Apr 25 21:52:00 <PaulFertser> bruce_c: it's like asking if everyone should be able to read arabic numbers.
Apr 25 21:52:33 <shellevil> It makes sense to have efforts split over languages for _huge_ communities.
Apr 25 21:52:39 <shellevil> For little ones, ...
Apr 25 21:52:59 <PaulFertser> How splitting efforts for useless things ever makes sense?
Apr 25 21:53:03 <Sharwin_F> I think it's good to have local communities
Apr 25 21:53:12 * PaulFertser can't spell :-/
Apr 25 21:53:13 <Sharwin_F> it makes more a feeling of comunity
Apr 25 21:53:26 <Sharwin_F> I fell that when I was on the buzz fix party at Barcelona
Apr 25 21:53:38 <shellevil> PaulFertser: If meetings, or - for example - hardware fix parties - makes sense
Apr 25 21:54:02 <max_posedon> hardware fix parties related to region where you live
Apr 25 21:54:04 <PaulFertser> shellevil: yeah, but no tranlating needed for that
Apr 25 21:54:22 <max_posedon> it just very different questions that software related
Apr 25 21:54:35 <Sharwin_F> of course there has to be an english-speaking comunity which moves all, but it's grate to have some local comunities.
Apr 25 21:55:03 <max_posedon> compare `City A community` and `City B community` with
Apr 25 21:55:35 <Sharwin_F> I agree with that
Apr 25 21:55:43 <max_posedon> `City A commounity speaking about X on en` and `City A community speaking about X on ru`
Apr 25 21:55:46 <bruce_c> PaulFertser: well I for one was glad when the CellHunter app was translated into English, because I don't understand German very well :P
Apr 25 21:56:06 <bruce_c> but hey, if you can speak a multitude of languages then that's great
Apr 25 21:57:19 <Sharwin_F> I think using English as a dev is a must, but not as a user
Apr 25 21:57:36 <bruce_c> yeah, definitely
Apr 25 21:57:55 <bruce_c> as has been pointed out, technical docs are English and they won't get translated
Apr 25 21:58:00 * DocScrutinizer hates datasheets translated from chinese to english by some google translate or a octopus or sth with similar knowledge of precise english
Apr 25 21:58:25 <axel_> Meanwhile I could establish a SSH-connection to the FR. The Host can ping the FR and the FR can ping the host. So far so good. The next problem is, that I can't access the internet from the FR. It seems that masquerading does not work (Kubuntu 8.04.2). The masquerading paragraph (http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking#Masquerading_support) doesn't tell me anything.
Apr 25 21:58:49 <bruce_c> I just get frustrated by the attitude that English is the only language that matters for end-user devices
Apr 25 21:58:59 <max_posedon> axel_, try follow instructions
Apr 25 21:59:00 <PaulFertser> bruce_c: no, i can't speak many languages. :( Only Russian and some English. But English is a must for any IT-related activities anyway.
Apr 25 21:59:24 <Sharwin_F> yes, but local comunities are usually user-related
Apr 25 21:59:57 <shellevil> axel_: you've configured masq on the host?
Apr 25 22:05:57 <axel_> shellevil: I haven't configured it jet, as I don't know where to start. "Masquerading options are found in Networking ---> Networking options ---> (tested on Linux 2.6.26.3)." Seems to be a advise for a GUI (GNOME I suppose). I use KDE.
Apr 25 22:06:31 <PaulFertser> axel_: use iptables directly as per wiki instructions.
Apr 25 22:07:18 <DocScrutinizer> it's just c&p of two or three lines
Apr 25 22:07:43 <PaulFertser> Unless a distro has some tricky incompatible default iptables setup.
Apr 25 22:08:10 <DocScrutinizer> axel_: but don't forget to check any firewall you might have on buntkuh
Apr 25 22:08:53 <DocScrutinizer> prior to executing the cmdline masquerading foo
Apr 25 22:09:14 <shellevil> axel_: if you haven't set it up on the host, it's guaranteed not to work
Apr 25 22:10:50 <axel_> PaulFertser: The more advanced way worked (http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking#The_more_advanced_way). Thanks for the hint.
Apr 25 22:11:06 <DocScrutinizer> :-)
Apr 25 22:11:21 <axel_> DocScrutinizer: I've checked them before. Thanks for the advise.
Apr 25 22:11:25 <PaulFertser> axel_: :)
Apr 25 22:14:51 <Weiss> PaulFertser: spot on! opkg remove (-force-depends) hal -> problem fixed
Apr 25 22:15:01 <Weiss> grr, ECHAN
Apr 25 22:54:46 <axel_> It seems that I'm running from one poroblem to the next. Now I can connect to the internet but I don't succeed to update the repository information. When starting the installer it's refreshing almost up to 100% but then an error occurs. "Cannot access repository. Please check your network." The shell-way didn't work either "Could not obtain administrative lock.", although I quit the installer in the GUI.
Apr 25 22:56:30 <PaulFertser> axel_: probably unrelated but it's good to know that opkg sucks anyway. Check with "ps ax" that you have no other opkg instance running before trying to start "opkg update".
Apr 25 23:03:29 <Sharwin_F> DocScrutinizer, if you haven't give it a try, xchat looks good on fr :)
Apr 25 23:03:41 <Sharwin_F> you jut need to change the font size
Apr 25 23:03:46 <axel_> PaulFertser: Now it works and now I know the reason for the error-msg above: 404. At least the URL is not correct.
Apr 25 23:04:46 <PaulFertser> axel_: yes, it's quite possible you need to change some repos in opkg config to something other. Can't provide you with exact instruction because i never cared about this qtopia-on-x nonsence.
Apr 25 23:06:41 <axel_> PaulFertser: Thank you very much for your hints and advises.
Apr 25 23:06:56 * PaulFertser makes too many mistakes to blame typos it seems. Not that good for a learn-English-you-lazy-lusers advocate :-/
Apr 25 23:08:18 <PaulFertser> axel_: you're welcome :)
Apr 25 23:09:26 <axel_> PaulFertser: I care about the qtopia-on-x nonsense, but on another day. I badly need some sleep. CU!
Apr 25 23:09:30 <PaulFertser> I prefer hints wherever reasonable because they give more opportunities to learn instead of dumb copying.
Apr 25 23:09:51 <PaulFertser> axel_: CU :)
Apr 26 00:02:02 <b0ef> every time I plug in my freerunner, it seems to have a new mac address
Apr 26 00:02:16 <shellevil> It's random
Apr 26 00:02:35 <b0ef> pretty hard to make a udev rule, then..;)
Apr 26 00:02:36 <CVirus> random mac address ??
Apr 26 00:03:33 <b0ef> I also see this with a USB link cable
Apr 26 00:03:53 <b0ef> I think maybe it's random on every such USB network thing
Apr 26 00:03:59 <b0ef> though I don't understand why..
Apr 26 00:06:12 <b0ef> if you can't count on anything, how can you then make a rule?
Apr 26 00:07:01 <CVirus> bluetooth pairing maybe ?
Apr 26 00:07:04 <shellevil> I think it's possible to pass a MAC to the kernel module on the FR side.
Apr 26 00:07:11 <shellevil> It's not done as far as I know.
Apr 26 00:08:28 <CVirus> b0ef: write a python script that using pybluez that would scan for the presence of the FR's mac address and do what you want when it's around :-p
Apr 26 00:08:40 <b0ef> right, but in the case of a USB ethernet device, this wouldn't work
Apr 26 00:08:58 <b0ef> , because what if I insert 3 or 4 such cables
Apr 26 00:09:18 <b0ef> if you can't identify a piece of hardware, you're fubar
Apr 26 00:10:20 <CVirus> lulz
Apr 26 00:10:52 <CVirus> b0ef: what does lsusb tell you when you plug in the FR ?
Apr 26 00:11:11 * shellevil stabs the USB standard specifiers.
Apr 26 00:11:24 <shellevil> Serial numbers not being mandatory is _deeply_ annoying.
Apr 26 00:13:37 <b0ef> hmm, yeah, it does show an ID there, but is this id from the device?
Apr 26 00:13:47 <b0ef> is it supposed to show up in udevinfo?
Apr 26 00:14:05 <CVirus> I'm not sure to be honest .. I don't even own a FR
Apr 26 00:14:35 <b0ef> right, thanks; I'll check it out
Apr 26 00:15:19 <b0ef> btw, mine shows ID 1457:5122
Apr 26 00:15:22 <V45Purple> anyone else have an issue with connecting to WiFi?  I've tried various distros (now on android) and I see my wireless networks, but it won't connect (WPA-PSK/AES).  The AP(s) also seem to go in and out of visibility even though I'm 2 feet away from them.
Apr 26 00:15:31 <b0ef> please, someone else, tell me you don't see the same..!;)
Apr 26 00:16:23 <CVirus> b0ef: http://www.newlc.com/en/freerunner-mobile-which-support-android-cupcake
Apr 26 00:16:27 <shellevil> 1457:5122 should be everyones GTA02
Apr 26 00:16:33 <CVirus> lsusb | grep "ID 1457:5122 First International Computer, Inc. OpenMoko Neo1973 kernel cdc_ether USB network"
Apr 26 00:16:36 <CVirus> exactly
Apr 26 00:18:10 <b0ef> right, so it's fixable with freerunner, but still leaves USB ethernet cables questionable
Apr 26 00:42:10 <b0ef> hmm, so these devices don't even really have mac addresses
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Apr 26 02:59:57 2009