**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun May 10 02:59:57 2009
May 10 04:24:49 <slaxxer> As of release 12.2, Slackware is now officially supported on the Neo Freerunner  
May 10 04:24:51 <slaxxer>    yea
May 10 05:51:20 <hackerb9> Hi.  I'm trying to dial a phone number that ends in a # (hash mark) and I keep failing.  I've tried with FDOM, FSO, and SHR.  When I press "Dial" the button lights up but no call is made.  I've also tested using mdbus (no call is made if the number ends in #) and with mickeyterm ("ATD123#" returns ERROR twice).
May 10 05:53:30 <hackerb9> Does anybody know how I can work around this?  I need to dial various numbers that end in # to access my carrier's services (T-mobile in the US).
May 10 05:55:04 <hackerb9> Um... hello?  Anybody home?
May 10 05:55:37 <KenYoung> Yes, but I'm afraid I don't know the answer to your question.
May 10 05:55:57 <hackerb9> Thank you KenYoung.
May 10 05:56:11 <KenYoung> Sorry I can't help.
May 10 05:56:33 <hackerb9> That's okay.  Maybe I'll try the developer's channel.
May 10 05:57:06 <KenYoung> hackerb9, I think an email to the community list will get more eyeballs.
May 10 05:57:31 <mwester> you could try waiting, too.  After all, it's past midnight in half the US, and very very early on Sunday morning in Europe....
May 10 05:57:55 <hackerb9> mwester, good idea
May 10 05:58:42 <hackerb9> KenYoung, thanks, I'll look into the mailing list.
May 10 05:59:31 <KenYoung> hackerb9, http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
May 10 06:00:47 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: do you want to use USSD?
May 10 06:01:44 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: then you're supposed to use dedicated frameworkd method for USSD access (and listen for signals, USSD message is fully shown in a USSD received signal).
May 10 06:04:15 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: FYI zhone decides to send USSD in case the number starts with "*"; i don't know about ophonekitd.
May 10 06:10:40 <hackerb9> PaulFertser, after reading the wikipedia article it does sound like I'm trying to do USSD.  All I know is that to reset my voicemail password, I have to call #973# and T-mobile will send me an SMS with the new password.
May 10 06:11:30 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: well, most USSD numbers start with *, so the number you use is not auto-detected as Ussd. Just do it manually with mdbus.
May 10 06:12:33 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: you need SendUssdRequest method
May 10 06:12:44 <hackerb9> Oh, okay.
May 10 06:13:02 <hackerb9> I was trying AT+CUSD but that was getting me nowhere.
May 10 06:16:56 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: if it requires some kind of interactivity, you need to call mdbus method manually and at the same time use "mdbus -l" to listen to the signals emitted by frameworkd, among them there should be a reply.
May 10 06:21:02 <hackerb9> When I call SendUssdRequest I get this error "Error org.freesmartphone.GSM.SIM.NotReady: Antenna powered off or SIM not unlocked yet".  I did SetAntennaPower true with a previous dbus-send command.
May 10 06:21:44 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: no, you're supposed to be running zhone or ophonekitd or any other phone application before you try.
May 10 06:22:17 <hackerb9> Yup, I'm running ophonekitd.
May 10 06:22:27 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: can you make calls?
May 10 06:22:32 <hackerb9> Yes.
May 10 06:22:44 <hackerb9> I can even make calls using my dbus script.
May 10 06:23:04 <hackerb9> I just can't do it when the number ends in a "#".
May 10 06:23:48 <hackerb9> Would it help if I pasted in exactly the dbus command I used?
May 10 06:25:24 <ndnihil> did you try escaping the #?
May 10 06:25:40 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: hackerb9 http://rafb.net/p/z2tHY040.html
May 10 06:25:42 <hackerb9> /usr/bin/dbus-send --system --print-reply  --dest=org.freesmartphone.ogsmd   /org/freesmartphone/GSM/Devicee   org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.SendUssdRequest  string:"#973#"
May 10 06:25:58 <hackerb9> ndnihil, what's the escape character for GSM?
May 10 06:26:14 <ndnihil> you're not escaping it from GSM, you're escaping it from the shell
May 10 06:26:30 <ndnihil> in that case, single quotes should fix it
May 10 06:26:45 <ndnihil> vs the double quotes you have around the #973#
May 10 06:26:52 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: haha, i send you the wrong example :)
May 10 06:27:07 <hackerb9> ndnihil, nope, same error.
May 10 06:27:32 <ndnihil> double quotes and a \ before each #?
May 10 06:28:17 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: here's the example that works for me: http://rafb.net/p/mEyJ8X48.html
May 10 06:28:25 <ndnihil> or no quotes and a \ maybe
May 10 06:29:43 <PaulFertser> My example works with bash. And to disable any shell expansion single quotes should be enough.
May 10 06:31:08 <hackerb9> Fails on my phone.  Could I have a bum modem?
May 10 06:31:48 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: how exactly it fails? with SIM error? Hm, i'm afraid i'm out of ideas here...
May 10 06:31:54 <hackerb9> Though, I notice that calling SendUssdRequest *always* fails for me, even on numbers without # marks.
May 10 06:32:28 <PaulFertser> /org/freesmartphone/GSM/Devicee <- this has a typo
May 10 06:33:07 <PaulFertser> And you shouldn't do SetAntennaPower manually at all, ophonekitd does that for you on startup.
May 10 06:33:19 <hackerb9> I'm thinking I can test if the modem is at fault by using mickeyterm and sending the raw AT+CUSD command if I could get the syntax right.
May 10 06:35:03 <hackerb9> I've tried without turning on the antenna power and it still fails.  I made a call immediately before so I know ophonekitd works.
May 10 06:35:33 <hackerb9> Could someone please try ATD123# in mickeyterm for me?
May 10 06:35:58 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: here's how frameworkd send USSD requests: AT+CUSD=1,"002A0031003000320023",15\r\n
May 10 06:36:44 <hackerb9> That gives an error unless I turn the 15 into a 72.
May 10 06:37:46 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: http://rafb.net/p/Cl2ALP73.html
May 10 06:39:27 <hackerb9> How is the data in the string encoded?  Can I just change it to "#973#"?
May 10 06:40:13 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: it's UCS2
May 10 06:40:36 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: and 15 is constant, frameworkd always sends 15.
May 10 06:41:02 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: my request is *102# , you can easily compute yours
May 10 06:41:47 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: 00230039003700330023
May 10 06:42:10 <hackerb9> Is there a command line tool for UCS2 encoding?
May 10 06:42:22 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: dude
May 10 06:42:32 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: 00230039003700330023
May 10 06:43:50 <hackerb9> AT+CUSD=1,"00230039003700330023",15  gives me  ERROR
May 10 06:44:15 <hackerb9> Changing 15 to 72 gives me OK, but I haven't received any SMS reply yet so I'm not sure it worked.
May 10 06:44:25 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: http://rafb.net/p/BnbwIx87.html
May 10 06:44:50 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: where do you get 72 from?
May 10 06:46:09 <hackerb9> From random google searches on the openmoko list.
May 10 06:47:27 <hackerb9> Could you please try "ATD123#"?
May 10 06:48:32 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: http://rafb.net/p/82R6QR61.html
May 10 06:49:10 <hackerb9> Well, shoot... that's not what mine says.
May 10 06:49:29 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: Docs say the last parameter is language and references GSM 03.38, 15 means unspecified.
May 10 06:51:03 <hackerb9> ATD123# gives me   "+CME ERROR: unknown"  (and then the same operation not allowed that you get)
May 10 06:52:52 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: sim-specific behaviour, it seems.
May 10 06:54:14 <hackerb9> Could you please try AT+GMR?
May 10 06:54:16 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: btw, for pasting "cat | nc paste.dyndns.org 1234" is mad cool
May 10 06:55:09 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: sure, +CGMR: "GSM: gsm_ac_gp_fd_pu_em_cph_ds_vc_cal35_ri_36_amd8_ts0-Moko11b1"
May 10 06:55:12 <hackerb9> I'll try that, but I think I'll use "xsel", which is like "cat" for the X copy buffer.
May 10 06:55:40 <hackerb9> Weird!  You've got a later revision even though I just received my phone.
May 10 06:55:52 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: no, full output: http://rafb.net/p/AV6gqo19.html
May 10 06:56:04 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: of course you must upgrade your GSM firmware!
May 10 06:56:40 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: some important bugs were fixed there since factory flashing, read the changelog.
May 10 06:57:21 <hackerb9> Okay, where's the ChangeLog?
May 10 06:57:50 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: just upgrade ;) there's a link to the changelog on the GSM/Flashing wiki page.
May 10 06:58:17 <hackerb9> Thank you.  I bet that will fix my problem.
May 10 06:58:22 <PaulFertser> hackerb9: but i'm afraid there're no fixes for your particular problem... Still, upgrading to moko11 is the right thing to do.
May 10 07:05:11 <hackerb9> The "lobotomy" procedure at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GSM/Flashing looks too dangerous to be doing when I should be sleeping.  I'll get back to it tomorrow.  Thanks for all your help!
May 10 07:08:41 <PaulFertser> shit
May 10 07:08:49 <PaulFertser> In fact it's not dangerous.
May 10 07:08:59 <PaulFertser> Everything is written on the wiki...
May 10 09:19:37 <PBeck> ahoi
May 10 09:58:11 <Psi_> is there an irssi package in the angstrom feed anywhere?
May 10 10:02:50 <Psi_> nevermind, found it
May 10 10:06:38 <badcloud> anyone here tried adding a bin file to navit and successfully loading navit?
May 10 10:06:52 <badcloud> I get 'sh: gdb: not found'
May 10 10:09:54 <badcloud> never mind, for future users, specify the entire path to the bin file, not the directory
May 10 10:11:02 <badcloud> now it loads, but the bin file I made from http://maps.navit-project.org/download/ doesn't show anything
May 10 10:31:27 <azaghal_> badcloud: Did you disable the built-in silly map that came with it?
May 10 10:31:39 <badcloud> yup
May 10 10:31:43 <azaghal_> Hm...
May 10 10:31:57 <azaghal_> Did it manage to get a GPS lock?
May 10 10:32:02 <badcloud> it just comes out blank
May 10 10:32:13 <badcloud> I did in tangogps
May 10 10:32:20 <azaghal_> Yes, but did navit pick it up?
May 10 10:32:27 <badcloud> not sure what it does in navit when it finds a lock
May 10 10:32:31 <azaghal_> It should show the coords in the bottom of window.
May 10 10:32:43 <azaghal_> At least do you have the buttons in the top of window?
May 10 10:32:49 <azaghal_> Or it looks like unresponsive app?
May 10 10:33:37 <azaghal_> Basically, navit has some default location it shows on startup. If you downloaded bin file that's not containing it, it will show blank screen (until it gets a gps lock and repositions the view).
May 10 10:33:41 <badcloud> not unresponsive
May 10 10:33:51 <badcloud> zoomed out and got something
May 10 10:33:52 <azaghal_> Does it show just zeros as coords then?
May 10 10:34:16 <badcloud> no
May 10 10:34:25 <azaghal_> So it managed to get gps lock then.
May 10 10:34:31 <badcloud> looks like streets, but it's difficult to see much
May 10 10:34:37 <azaghal_> Hm...
May 10 10:34:55 <azaghal_> I didn't have such problems, to be honest :)
May 10 10:35:05 <azaghal_> Could you post ~/.navit/navit.xml on some pastebin?
May 10 10:35:29 <badcloud> sure
May 10 10:35:40 <azaghal_> Btw, which distro?
May 10 10:35:52 <badcloud> shr testing
May 10 10:36:28 <azaghal_> I'm using Debian here. Still, it should work :)
May 10 10:36:56 <badcloud> well, considering there weren't any coords displayed
May 10 10:37:00 <badcloud> maybe it didn't lock
May 10 10:37:39 <badcloud> by the way, are you using pidgin under debian?
May 10 10:37:44 <azaghal_> Nah
May 10 10:37:50 <azaghal_> I actually haven't played much with it.
May 10 10:38:01 <azaghal_> I'm actually using hackable:1
May 10 10:38:48 <badcloud> didn't you just say you're using navit under debian?
May 10 10:39:58 <azaghal_> Yes, but hackable:1 is basically debian with an extra repo.
May 10 10:40:05 <azaghal_> Sorry for missunderstanding :)
May 10 10:40:25 <badcloud> ah
May 10 10:40:32 <badcloud> nice
May 10 10:40:53 <badcloud> how's it running?
May 10 10:42:13 <azaghal_> Well, somewhat good.
May 10 10:42:26 <azaghal_> To be honest, I still haven't found something that pleases me completely :)
May 10 10:43:34 <badcloud> have you tried standard debian?
May 10 10:44:31 <azaghal_> Yes, but it was some time ago.
May 10 10:44:59 <azaghal_> What I've been hunting so far was good phone-functionality :)
May 10 10:46:23 <badcloud> tricky business
May 10 10:50:13 <azaghal_> Next thing to try would be paroli for me.
May 10 10:51:55 <badcloud> can't remember if I did that
May 10 10:52:14 <PaulFertser> azaghal_: is there a program/device/activity/whatever that you're _completely_ happy with?
May 10 10:52:21 <badcloud> back in my mass-flashing days I rarely kept track of anything
May 10 10:52:27 <azaghal_> PaulFertser: Yes! I have the source :)
May 10 10:53:00 <azaghal_> PaulFertser: I know I sound a bit bitchy, but I'm not against the community efforts at all :)
May 10 10:53:01 <PaulFertser> azaghal_: having source is nice but it doesn't always lead to ultimate solution.
May 10 10:53:13 <azaghal_> Could be, but it's better than not having the source?
May 10 10:53:49 <PaulFertser> azaghal_: no, i'm asking a general quazi-philosophy question: do you know of anything that has no drawbacks in your opinion?
May 10 10:54:22 <azaghal> PaulFertser: The answer would be no - because saying 'yes' would mean perfection is possible.
May 10 10:54:53 <PaulFertser> azaghal: well, you may say smth like "i'm very happy with vim, it has everything i need and does everything as i want it to", i don't think it's impossible.
May 10 10:55:27 <azaghal> Yes, I have those.
May 10 10:55:31 <PaulFertser> Share
May 10 10:55:33 <azaghal> emacs, openbox, claws-mail etc
May 10 10:55:41 <azaghal> VirtualBox
May 10 10:55:59 <azaghal> There's actually a lot of apps I like that do what I need them to do.
May 10 10:56:12 <PaulFertser> I'm not happy with emacs as it's not multi-threaded, emacs-w3m is not fast enough, emacs in general has some annoying bugs...
May 10 10:56:42 <azaghal> Btw, is this just chit-chat, or you're annoyed that I whine a bit here?
May 10 10:57:10 <PaulFertser> Keyboard handling is ad-hoc and i needed to provide special translation tables to use russian layout (as my main layout is dvorak, not qwerty).
May 10 10:57:22 <PaulFertser> azaghal: (annoyed) not a bit.
May 10 10:57:36 <azaghal> Ok, I appologise for annoying people here.
May 10 10:57:41 <azaghal> It was actually never my intention.
May 10 10:57:44 <PaulFertser> azaghal: just i was surprised you're hoping to get anything that would "pleases me completely".
May 10 10:58:07 <azaghal> Heheh, you'd be surprised what could please me in this case :)
May 10 10:58:49 <badcloud> I'm still looking for a pim that supports yahoo calendar
May 10 10:59:09 <azaghal> I'd actually like to find some time to dig into hacking some things together for the phone, for start elementary stuff.
May 10 10:59:17 <PaulFertser> badcloud: are you sure that outsourcing your calendar like that is the right thing to do?
May 10 10:59:33 <badcloud> in terms of privacy?
May 10 10:59:35 <azaghal> badcloud: Back to the topic - does navit work now?
May 10 11:00:15 <PaulFertser> badcloud: not only that, but also convenience. They have API, but can you change it? Can you have any influence on it? Can you extend it? Was it designed with real hackers in mind? Etc...
May 10 11:00:19 <badcloud> not really, even after configuring default coord in the navit.xml file
May 10 11:01:11 <badcloud> I just get a blank screen, and then zooming out 4-5 times gives me something vaguely resembling a map
May 10 11:01:28 <SpeedEvil> badcloud: where are you
May 10 11:01:35 <badcloud> norway
May 10 11:01:42 <badcloud> I see what you mean, Paul
May 10 11:02:10 <badcloud> that in one way is why I prefer google services to yahoo, even though I have a wary eye about their intentions
May 10 11:02:19 <PaulFertser> badcloud: don't forget that web-companies design everything with stupid browser-is-ultimate-thin-client paradigm in mind and don't care much about correctness/extensibility of the API.
May 10 11:02:33 <badcloud> true
May 10 11:02:50 <badcloud> a very closed box
May 10 11:02:51 <azaghal> What was that project that makes something like Google Docs? But under GPL/AGPL license?
May 10 11:03:01 <azaghal> I think they had some kind of calendar thing as well.
May 10 11:03:12 <PaulFertser> badcloud: so, i'd say the same about google. Do you know how long did it take to fix an obvious bug in their IMAP implementation? A year! An obvious and easily reproducible standard violation. They just don't care about it.
May 10 11:03:42 <badcloud> I agree
May 10 11:03:53 <PaulFertser> Nah, IMHO web-apps is the wrong thing to do, that's defective by design, no matter how they're licensed.
May 10 11:04:20 <badcloud> but google providing the services such as pop3 access, etc
May 10 11:04:33 <badcloud> while not maintaining it properly
May 10 11:04:40 <badcloud> is better than not providing at all
May 10 11:04:44 <badcloud> in yahoo's case
May 10 11:04:45 <PaulFertser> Heh, first they make incredible mess by abusing browsers, then they try to get some decent JS performance to workaround conceptual problems.
May 10 11:05:39 <badcloud> I've been waiting for months for yahoo to put up their new version of mobile calendar
May 10 11:05:40 <azaghal> JavaScript is getting overused nowadays.
May 10 11:05:49 <PaulFertser> Modern internet sucks because of those fuckers
May 10 11:05:50 <azaghal> And nobody's trying to make fallback options to plain html.
May 10 11:06:18 <badcloud> I think that's because computer companies need excuses to sell machines too fast for the average user
May 10 11:06:37 <badcloud> otherwise, why make the same site heavier and heavier
May 10 11:06:45 <azaghal> Actually, it's because the quality of coders has become worse, I thik :)
May 10 11:06:46 * SpeedEvil passes out the pitchforks and flaming torches.
May 10 11:06:46 <azaghal> *think
May 10 11:06:49 <SpeedEvil> Let's get them!
May 10 11:06:57 <badcloud> haha
May 10 11:08:03 <PaulFertser> In fact, there's plenty of things in common use that suck. WIMP paradigm, for once. But how many even honorable devs use it? A lot!
May 10 11:08:31 <SpeedEvil> yeah. Takes a lot of energy to start out in a completely solitary direction.
May 10 11:17:32 <PaulFertser> One of the most recognised (by general public) free software project is OO.org, well that's the same WYSIWYG crap as MSO conceptually. Or take Ubuntu: i'd say let them shove their stupid "fail-safe" X-server and other useless "improvements" along with their ubuntuforums up their asses.
May 10 11:18:14 <PaulFertser> azaghal: Hahah, it seems it's me who intents to annoy people here :)
May 10 11:18:24 * SpeedEvil hugs his slaackware.
May 10 11:18:49 <azaghal> PaulFertser: Hey, I'm not too fond of automagical either ;)
May 10 11:26:45 * badcloud hugs his soon to be fully usable debian phone
May 10 11:40:20 <messerting> anyone knows the status of the planned/suggested mythtv-frontend/advanced control for openmoko?
May 10 11:41:21 <messerting> I'd like to use my freerunner as a streamplayer (ie. play music over wlan from my local mediaserver)
May 10 11:47:01 <messerting> I can't boot my freerunner when it is attached to USB. Anyone else had that problem?
May 10 11:47:29 <messerting> When I attached it (powered off), my laptop reports "hub 6-0:1.0: unable to enumerate USB device on port 2"
May 10 11:47:56 <messerting> when I powerup the freerunner, I get:
May 10 11:48:01 <messerting> cdc_acm 6-2:1.0: This device cannot do calls on its own. It is no modem.
May 10 11:48:03 <messerting> cdc_acm 6-2:1.0: ttyACM0: USB ACM device
May 10 11:48:29 <PaulFertser> messerting: that shows that you started u-boot
May 10 11:48:29 <messerting> but the freerunner doesn't boot, all I see is "openmoko" in the display
May 10 11:48:40 <PaulFertser> messerting: is it the latest u-boot you're using?
May 10 11:48:54 <messerting> I have "usb 6-2: Product: Neo1973 Bootloader U-Boot 1.3.2-rc2-dirty-moko12"
May 10 11:49:24 <messerting> Do I need a newer version? or Qi?
May 10 11:49:42 <PaulFertser> messerting: well, if you never flashed bootloader, you should do it anyway. Just to make sure what version (and where it comes from) do you use.
May 10 11:49:55 <PaulFertser> messerting: i use Qi, but recent u-boot should work too.
May 10 11:50:27 <messerting> don't remember when I flash (if I did at all), but I have uboot 1.3.2-rc2-dirty-moko12
May 10 11:50:40 <PaulFertser> messerting: date unknown?
May 10 11:51:16 <messerting> yep - my freerunner has been collecting dust for some time now... :)
May 10 11:51:27 <messerting> well - I'll try to upgrade to Qi anyway
May 10 11:51:40 <der-lehmann> hey, is it a problem that D43
May 10 11:51:51 <alphaone> der-lehmann: Hi
May 10 11:51:51 <der-lehmann> 01 are missing?
May 10 11:52:03 <PaulFertser> messerting: in case you go Qi route, read the wiki page carefully to understand it.
May 10 11:52:13 <alphaone> der-lehmann: Talked to DocScrutinizer and he agrees that it's more or less useless
May 10 11:52:16 <messerting> http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Qi <- yes
May 10 11:53:00 <alphaone> Since you don't have a high risk of ESD on the mic
May 10 11:53:28 <der-lehmann> hi alphaone: okay thanks a lot for killing the buzz! :)
May 10 11:53:30 <alphaone> der-lehmann: Do you have any problems with voice quality?
May 10 11:53:49 <alphaone> der-lehmann: np. Your phone gave me some headaches, though :-)
May 10 11:54:02 <alphaone> I tried to resolder D4301 (from a spare phone)
May 10 11:54:14 <alphaone> But it wouldn't work
May 10 11:54:26 <alphaone> And I don't have these parts in new
May 10 11:54:52 <alphaone> so I have to desolder/resolder which can really be a pain
May 10 11:55:09 <DocScrutinizer> D4301 is inner contact of MIC AIUI. There's still D4302 eating ESD to case of mic
May 10 11:55:29 <alphaone> ah, heh
May 10 11:56:28 <alphaone> right
May 10 11:56:48 <DocScrutinizer> if they didn't leave that out in fab due to uselesness because of R4303 = 0R ;-)
May 10 11:56:55 <alphaone> DocScrutinizer: So D4301 is necessary?
May 10 11:57:20 <DocScrutinizer> I'd say D4302 is mandatory
May 10 11:57:36 <DocScrutinizer> D4301 can't see direct ESD
May 10 11:57:51 <alphaone> But the mic isn't exposed...
May 10 11:57:59 <alphaone> What are the rules for ESD?
May 10 11:58:03 <der-lehmann> http://wiki.openmoko.org/images/a/a4/Gta02a5_pcba_ps.JPG on this are D4301 also missing
May 10 11:58:03 <DocScrutinizer> not exactly
May 10 11:58:12 <alphaone> Better safe than sorry? ;-)
May 10 11:58:23 <DocScrutinizer> chances for mic catching ESD are very low
May 10 11:58:34 <alphaone> okay
May 10 11:58:40 <alphaone> der-lehmann: http://totalueberwachung.de/~alphaone/openmoko/buzzfix/missing-D4301.JPG
May 10 11:59:04 <alphaone> right, fun
May 10 11:59:06 <DocScrutinizer> nayway IF it catches ESD surge, D4302 would help (to some extent). D4301 looks rather useless to me
May 10 11:59:22 <alphaone> der-lehmann: On your PCB one could see, though, that it was there
May 10 11:59:44 <alphaone> On the solder pads
May 10 12:01:13 <alphaone> der-lehmann: Please don't hesitate to contact me if you experience some hickups.
May 10 12:03:47 <der-lehmann> alphaone: do you think that D4301 getting lost after leaving the factory?
May 10 12:07:07 <alphaone> der-lehmann: not sure
May 10 12:07:16 <DocScrutinizer> probably it didn't simply fall off the pcb
May 10 12:08:06 <DocScrutinizer> tho otoh with *our* fab, even this seems possible ;-D
May 10 12:10:04 <alphaone> Hehe
May 10 12:11:33 <der-lehmann> was i the only one with this problem?
May 10 12:12:31 <alphaone> upto now
May 10 12:12:55 <alphaone> Well, D4302 was soldered diagonal as well
May 10 12:13:05 <alphaone> So there probably was some sort of bump
May 10 12:15:33 <DocScrutinizer> that's the result of soldering 0402 with machines not designed for that
May 10 12:15:46 <der-lehmann> http://www.der-lehmann.de//openmoko/DSC01884.JPG ;)
May 10 12:17:00 <der-lehmann> i hope that will be much better with the future devices!
May 10 12:17:05 <alphaone> der-lehmann: Ich hätte da wohl noch was zu schreiben sollen...
May 10 12:17:10 <alphaone> Eh, english
May 10 12:17:29 <DocScrutinizer> ~alphaone/openmoko/buzzfix/missing-D4301.JPG  OMG!!! :-O
May 10 12:17:31 <alphaone> But I somehow forgot via the buzzfix party
May 10 12:17:38 <alphaone> DocScrutinizer: Yeah :-)
May 10 12:22:06 <der-lehmann> alphaone: yes that would be nice, but np
May 10 12:22:09 <DocScrutinizer> alphaone: I'm not sure about MIC4301 being reflow or manual soldering
May 10 12:23:47 <alphaone> Ah, so maybe someone blew it away?
May 10 12:26:57 <der-lehmann> are there other pictures of this buzzfix party?
May 10 12:32:01 <der-lehmann> ok bye 
May 10 12:32:23 <DocScrutinizer> alphaone: btw by using input MIC2[wm8753:41] for sole input, via #53-#49-#63, you easly can check for success of buzzfix. Should be NO audio anymore after fix
May 10 12:42:46 <DocScrutinizer> for #53 this should be "mic2" aka MIC1 trace at offsheet-symbol (yeeha, THAT'S A MESS :-) whereas MIC2N[pin42] is "mic3"). See WM8753_Rev3.4.pdf Figure8
May 10 13:00:46 <m_abs> I have a problem charging my GTA02s battery. I don't think it's the problem with the battery being fully discharged, since I tried to recharge it at 14% (according to the UI in SHR). I've tried both connecting a usb-cable to my computer and using the adapter, nothing.
May 10 13:01:33 <DocScrutinizer> well, then this chan
May 10 13:01:52 <DocScrutinizer> m_abs: what's happening exactly
May 10 13:01:55 <DocScrutinizer> ?
May 10 13:02:25 <DocScrutinizer> m_abs: 1): why do you think it doesn't charge
May 10 13:02:28 <DocScrutinizer> ?
May 10 13:03:12 <m_abs> The battery keep loosing its charge. I turned of the phone then it got to 2%.
May 10 13:03:25 <m_abs> With the usb-cable connected.
May 10 13:04:14 <DocScrutinizer> m_abs: what's settings-power telling about voltage %charge and current?
May 10 13:04:44 <DocScrutinizer> m_abs: can you boot your device without bat inserted?
May 10 13:05:45 <m_abs> I can't turn it on right now it suspends the moment the interface loads. But as far as I remember, status was discharging and power usage was around 330
May 10 13:07:08 <DocScrutinizer> m_abs: even if you remove bat?
May 10 13:07:30 <DocScrutinizer> yes this seems to be a bug in frameworkd
May 10 13:07:34 <m_abs> Yes normally.
May 10 13:08:20 <m_abs> But not right now.
May 10 13:08:51 <DocScrutinizer> you can kill frameworkd with a ssh
May 10 13:09:08 <DocScrutinizer> should stop the shutdown issue
May 10 13:13:54 <DocScrutinizer> m_abs: if you're logged in, please read out the bat current and voltage and charge
May 10 13:14:31 <m_abs> I must remember it wrong. I can't get it to boot without the battery.
May 10 13:15:34 <DocScrutinizer> not at all or does it abort halfway?
May 10 13:16:00 <m_abs> But could it be a problem with the hardware? Normally then I plug in the usb-cable and the battery is in, the phone turns on by it self, that doesn't happen right now.
May 10 13:16:03 <DocScrutinizer> m_abs: (readout): cat /sys/devices/platform/bq27000-battery.0/power_supply/bat/current_now
May 10 13:16:14 <DocScrutinizer> voltage_now
May 10 13:16:21 <DocScrutinizer> capacity
May 10 13:17:32 <DocScrutinizer> m_abs: can you boot to NAND/NOR uBoot menu? (with or without bat)
May 10 13:21:52 <m_abs> Without: no. With: yes
May 10 13:25:48 <DocScrutinizer> m_abs: please boot to uboot menu, attach openmoko wallcharger, then remove bat. Device must NOT go down same moment you remove bat
May 10 13:26:15 <DocScrutinizer> don't do this on a GTA01 Neo 1973!!!
May 10 13:27:42 <dos1> DocScrutinizer: why gta01 users can't do that?
May 10 13:28:18 <DocScrutinizer> dos1: scream-of-death
May 10 13:29:14 <dos1> DocScrutinizer: hmm? i don't have gta01 ;)
May 10 13:29:59 <DocScrutinizer> dos1: this warning wasn't addressed to you exclusively
May 10 13:30:25 <dos1> DocScrutinizer: i know, i just want to know ;D
May 10 13:31:04 <DocScrutinizer> m_abs: what's result of test suggested above?
May 10 13:31:23 <m_abs> DocScrutinizer, it seems I wasted your time. Both my wallcharger and the usb-cable must be broken. I just tried another cable with success. The phone is charging with this cable.
May 10 13:31:41 <DocScrutinizer> :-D
May 10 13:32:17 <m_abs> Thought I had tested it good enough by trying both the usb-cable and the wallcharger...
May 10 13:32:21 <DocScrutinizer> m_abs: np. I'm glad you don't suffer from a real hw-breakage :-))
May 10 13:40:43 <badcloud> anyone know how to install debian packages to a filesystem containing debian, but from within shr?
May 10 13:41:06 <badcloud> (so I wouldn't have to boot debian from uSD each time I want to install a package)
May 10 13:41:27 <badcloud> right now debian isn't working the way I want it to
May 10 13:43:25 <dos1> badcloud: chroot
May 10 13:45:37 <badcloud> I'm at the man page
May 10 13:45:41 <badcloud> trickyicky
May 10 13:50:36 <badcloud> you wouldn't happen to know the full syntax, would you?
May 10 13:50:54 <badcloud> seems like I need to set up a whole environment
May 10 13:51:13 <dos1> chroot /directory/with/mounted/debian
May 10 13:51:19 <dos1> and nothing more
May 10 13:51:25 <badcloud> really?
May 10 13:51:26 <badcloud> wow
May 10 13:51:30 <dos1> maybe mount --bind /dev /debian/dir/dev
May 10 13:51:33 <dos1> and the same with proc, sys
May 10 13:51:47 <dos1> and then chroot
May 10 13:51:52 <badcloud> WICKED
May 10 13:51:57 <dos1> and then apt-get/aptitude/dpkg/everything else
May 10 13:52:30 <badcloud> and then to apt out of the chroot?
May 10 13:52:32 <badcloud> logout?
May 10 13:52:34 <badcloud> exit
May 10 13:52:35 <badcloud> ?
May 10 13:52:38 <dos1> exit
May 10 13:53:03 <badcloud> wickED
May 10 13:55:12 <m_abs> badcloud, chroot /path/to/debian
May 10 13:55:35 <badcloud> WOW
May 10 13:56:06 <badcloud> I never cease to be amazed with the flexibility, versatility and simplicity of linux
May 10 13:56:20 <badcloud> I'm sure there are lots more *ities
May 10 13:57:02 <badcloud> except for titties
May 10 13:57:20 <badcloud> sorry, had to :P
May 10 13:57:24 <czaks> why not? ;p
May 10 13:57:30 <czaks> hi btw.
May 10 13:57:43 <badcloud> ha
May 10 13:57:51 <czaks> do you happen to know something about accelerometers?
May 10 13:57:58 <badcloud> me, not really
May 10 13:57:59 <badcloud> sorry
May 10 13:58:08 <czaks> when I put the mobile phone on the flour
May 10 13:58:16 <czaks> it says something about 940
May 10 13:58:28 <czaks> when I turn it upside down
May 10 13:58:34 <czaks> it says something about 1100
May 10 13:58:42 <czaks> -1100 to be exact
May 10 13:59:00 <czaks> do I need to callibrate them someway?
May 10 14:00:35 <DocScrutinizer> czaks: as I don't know the kernel module for gmeter, all I can recommend is "read the chip datasheet"
May 10 14:00:48 <czaks> thanks :p
May 10 14:01:02 <dos1> RTFChipDatasheet ;)
May 10 14:09:26 <m_abs> I just tried to install NavIt, but it doesn't appear in the menu. I'm running SHR testing. How do I get navit into the menu?
May 10 14:09:48 <czaks> m_abs, modify /usr/share/applications/navit.desktop
May 10 14:09:56 <czaks> and add Application as category
May 10 14:14:15 <m_abs> czaks, thanks. Unfortunately it just crashes.
May 10 14:14:45 <czaks> m_abs, read wiki for instructions how to fix it
May 10 14:19:52 <khiraly1> re
May 10 14:24:37 <badcloud> re?
May 10 14:24:46 <badcloud> dos1, you still there?
May 10 14:26:57 <badcloud> even after doing 'mount --bind /dev /mnt/debian/dev', I still get 'Can not write log, openpty() failed (/dev/pts not mounted?)' after 'apt-get install <package>'
May 10 14:28:33 <badcloud> (after chroot /debian/dir)
May 10 14:57:35 <CIA-53> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07specs * raba44ae3bebc 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): 
May 10 14:57:35 <CIA-53> freesmartphone.org: org.freesmartphone.Device.LED / org.freesmartphone.Network: fix fso:throws type to raise an error category, not a specific error
May 10 14:57:35 <CIA-53> freesmartphone.org: NOTE: This is tentative and not final and may change at any time
May 10 15:38:10 <slaxxer> yo mommas
May 10 16:03:19 <Blackhex> hello, plese how to get fso-gpsd working on 2009.0 Release 3? 
May 10 16:03:41 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: how it doesn't?
May 10 16:04:08 <Blackhex> I tried tangogps, openmoko-agps but none works
May 10 16:04:31 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: more debugging info needed...
May 10 16:04:47 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: and that is?
May 10 16:06:04 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: are you sure fso-gpsd running? Have you tried to use any "native" app like zhone gps pane or other?
May 10 16:06:11 <Blackhex> "connection to gpsd SUCCEEDED"
May 10 16:06:16 <Blackhex> in tangogps log
May 10 16:06:25 <Blackhex> I have paroli image so no zhone
May 10 16:06:26 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: have you tried to look at frameworkd log?
May 10 16:06:44 <PaulFertser> You can download zhone
May 10 16:06:48 <Blackhex> but there is no info about satellites comming
May 10 16:09:06 <Blackhex> this is tail /var/log/frameworkd.log http://rafb.net/p/1h2Afn83.html
May 10 16:09:08 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: check frameworkd log. Is GPS resource gets enabled at all after you connect to fso-gpsd?
May 10 16:10:47 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: well, your frameworkd log looks ok...
May 10 16:11:03 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: you just don't have a fix yet.
May 10 16:11:46 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: It seems, but even when I was outside there was no bars on agpsui
May 10 16:12:13 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: agpsui? Are you sure it properly uses fso-gpsd, not direct access to the serial port?
May 10 16:12:31 <Blackhex> and in tangogps on the bottom line there is 0/0/0.0 everytime
May 10 16:12:33 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: i'm sure it doesn't use gpsd.
May 10 16:12:42 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: probably because you don't have a fix.
May 10 16:13:02 <Blackhex> I used agpsui on 2009 Release 2 without problems
May 10 16:13:30 <Blackhex> and botom line of tangogps showded everytime i. e. 10/0.0.0 before fix
May 10 16:13:38 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: does it access serial port directly? Does it power the gps chip itself?
May 10 16:14:25 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: I don't know how to check that, but I notice that there is missing /etc
May 10 16:14:36 <Blackhex> /default/gpsd file form Release 2
May 10 16:15:00 <Blackhex> so I tried to created it but without luck
May 10 16:15:08 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: i don't think it's needed, at least i never had it and fso-gpsd worked for me.
May 10 16:16:50 <Blackhex> I had no problems to get fix inside after some time but now there is even no signal from single satellite 
May 10 16:19:25 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: afaict agpsui doesn't prove anything but you constantly bring it back into consideration.
May 10 16:20:09 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: I think that first number in tangogps bottom line is number of sattelites seen
May 10 16:21:26 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: i'd do like that: start tangogps, then read frameworkd logs. If it has ubx packets coming, ok, i'd go outside to ensure good reception and wait still looking at frameworkd log. After i saw the fix in the log i'd look at tangogps and then if it didn't work complain.
May 10 16:21:54 <Blackhex> I now  installed zhone but it's fighting with paroli, how do I disable paroli to start, please?
May 10 16:22:12 <mirko-paroli> Blackhex: fighting?
May 10 16:22:18 <Blackhex> on dbus
May 10 16:22:22 <mirko-paroli> Blackhex: you want to disable the auto-start?
May 10 16:22:27 <Blackhex> yes
May 10 16:22:32 <PaulFertser> Why can't paroli and zhone co-exist?
May 10 16:22:39 <mirko-paroli> good question ;)
May 10 16:22:48 <mirko-paroli> Blackhex: in your home-folder
May 10 16:22:52 <PaulFertser> frameworkd was designed with many consumers in mind.
May 10 16:22:56 <mirko-paroli> is a .e folder
May 10 16:23:12 <mirko-paroli> and somewhere in there is a startup folder which contains a hidden file
May 10 16:23:15 <mirko-paroli> remove that file
May 10 16:23:18 <PaulFertser> mirko-paroli: Hey, do you have "paroli" hilighted in your irc client? ;)
May 10 16:23:21 <mirko-paroli> and paroli won't autolaunch
May 10 16:23:27 <khiraly11> mirko-paroli: hi! 
May 10 16:23:30 <mirko-paroli> PaulFertser: nope
May 10 16:23:41 <mirko-paroli> but I see every message on irc in a passive window
May 10 16:23:59 <mirko-paroli> so I have learned to read quickly ;)
May 10 16:24:02 <mirko-paroli> hi khiraly11
May 10 16:24:38 <khiraly11> mirko-paroli: I have sended two emails do you. Did you get it?
May 10 16:24:41 <Blackhex> .e/e/applications/startup/ 
May 10 16:24:42 <Blackhex> ?
May 10 16:24:46 <mirko-paroli> khiraly11: let me check
May 10 16:24:52 <mirko-paroli> Blackhex: I believe so
May 10 16:25:04 <Blackhex> mirko-paroli: this one is empty
May 10 16:25:08 <mirko-paroli> khiraly11: yepp found them
May 10 16:25:16 <mirko-paroli> Blackhex: no .XXX file?
May 10 16:25:41 <Blackhex> ls -al .e/e/applications/startup/ -> nothing
May 10 16:25:55 <mirko-paroli> Blackhex: k one sec
May 10 16:27:10 <mirko-paroli> Blackhex: /usr/share/enlightenment/data/applications/startup/.order
May 10 16:28:07 <Blackhex> mirko-paroli: thx
May 10 16:28:14 <mirko-paroli> Blackhex: np
May 10 16:28:42 <Blackhex> now I try to reboot  and see what happens...
May 10 16:29:13 <khiraly11> mirko-paroli: let me know if the email was helpful, or how can I help it further debug. (saving eg: frameworkd.log with paroli.log?)
May 10 16:29:41 <mirko-paroli> khiraly11: I'll try to find the issues and send you an answer :)
May 10 16:30:06 <mirko-paroli> with log is always better and also how I can reproduce the "bug"
May 10 16:30:14 <mirko-paroli> and maybe even put it in the paroli trac
May 10 16:30:29 <mirko-paroli> others can then also see it and test it etc
May 10 16:31:09 <khiraly11> most of them are pretty random
May 10 16:31:17 <mirko-paroli> and also which image and which kernel you run, with dates etc
May 10 16:32:15 <khiraly11> ok, reply to me (by confirming which bugreport makes sense) and I'll put in the trac
May 10 16:32:17 <mirko-paroli> I do appreaciate and use every input i get
May 10 16:32:48 <khiraly11> individually
May 10 16:32:48 <slaxxer> is the latest om-paroli image   just paroli    ,,or can i access fso in there?
May 10 16:33:03 <mirko-paroli> slaxxer: paroli uses the frameworkd
May 10 16:33:04 <khiraly11> slaxxer: there is fso in there, as paroli use it
May 10 16:33:30 <slaxxer> i can only see the paroli part
May 10 16:33:41 <mirko-paroli> you are looking for illume?
May 10 16:33:50 <mirko-paroli> the desktop with neat little icons ?
May 10 16:33:55 <slaxxer> yup
May 10 16:33:56 <khiraly11> slaxxer: are you missing the top bar? (illume)
May 10 16:33:56 <mirko-paroli> ah
May 10 16:34:09 <mirko-paroli> slaxxer: access settings in paroli
May 10 16:34:10 <slaxxer> yes im missing the top
May 10 16:34:15 <mirko-paroli> go to display
May 10 16:34:17 <khiraly11> slaxxer: hold the aux button for 2 sec, and go to the settings of paroli
May 10 16:34:29 <slaxxer> ok
May 10 16:34:29 <mirko-paroli> k, I'll just listen from hereon in ;)
May 10 16:34:48 <slaxxer> well    i seek the truth:)
May 10 16:35:11 <mirko-paroli> slaxxer: khiraly11 is a truth-teller
May 10 16:35:19 <slaxxer> yall are here   , thats why i asked   thanks
May 10 16:35:25 <khiraly11> hehh, ther eis a race condition
May 10 16:35:33 <khiraly11> ;)
May 10 16:35:38 <khiraly11> between me and mirko
May 10 16:35:40 <PaulFertser> Oh no!
May 10 16:35:43 <PaulFertser> Races again
May 10 16:35:48 <PaulFertser> Get me out of here!
May 10 16:36:01 <mirko-paroli> nah, I gladly lean back and look at my code :)
May 10 16:36:16 <khiraly11> but yeah, in display you can find "illume" and "paroli" as profile. If you click on it it will cahnge from illume to paroli
May 10 16:36:23 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: strange, obviously it's getting something since it was able to get gps time...
May 10 16:36:52 <khiraly11> and from paroli to illume. So you want illume for the top bar (ie. no fullscreen)
May 10 16:37:04 <mirko-paroli> Blackhex: btw how did you know there was a prob between zhone and paroli? got a log or sth ?
May 10 16:37:08 <khiraly11> slaxxer: got it?
May 10 16:37:09 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: yes, that's why i told you to wait for the fix first.
May 10 16:37:19 <slaxxer> yes
May 10 16:37:23 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: and then complain about non-working fso-gpsd.
May 10 16:37:28 <khiraly11> if nothing happens reboot the device. Just make sure "illume" is selected
May 10 16:37:43 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: but I should get fix long time ago
May 10 16:38:00 <slaxxer> im on fso-unstable currently
May 10 16:38:09 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: inside? It depends on sattelites in view...
May 10 16:38:10 <khiraly11> slaxxer: me too
May 10 16:38:19 <slaxxer>   may just add paroli
May 10 16:38:44 <Blackhex> mirko-paroli: there was some gui messages about connecting to dbus resoruces in paroli, since zhone started a bit sooner
May 10 16:38:50 <khiraly11> doh. Im on fso-paroli-image-om-gta02.tar.gz     
May 10 16:39:00 <slaxxer> i had zhone an paroli together on 1 image
May 10 16:39:13 <slaxxer> paroli is quick
May 10 16:39:30 <mirko-paroli> Blackhex: hmm that is odd, as PaulFertser said, that shouldn't happen ... 
May 10 16:39:35 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: Now I'm inside but I'm using external antenna. I was outside but result was the same. I'll try to go outside once more
May 10 16:40:11 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: fyi zhone has a pretty informative window with GPS status
May 10 16:40:35 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: but there is missing info about number of sattelites cathcing
May 10 16:40:43 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: and don't forget that if you just flashed the filesystem you don't even have an almanac data, so it might take as long as 15 minutes to get a first fix.
May 10 16:41:01 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: no, zhone has info about sattelites, on the second pane.
May 10 16:41:38 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: ah, maybe that's it, so I'll go outside; whau, I didn't notice that
May 10 16:42:15 <Blackhex> because there are arrow icons missing
May 10 16:43:04 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: what are those black dots in alm and emph columns?
May 10 16:43:51 <khiraly11> mirko-paroli: I hope the top 1 priority is the reliable phone call/receive. If not I will force you;)
May 10 16:44:16 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: If there's a dot in alm column, it means the cheap knows alamanac for this sattelite, same for ephemeris. iirc.
May 10 16:44:18 <mirko-paroli> khiraly11: for paroli itself yes
May 10 16:44:32 <mirko-paroli> khiraly11: I have this school-related project I also need to do
May 10 16:44:43 <PaulFertser> s/cheap/chip/ :))
May 10 16:45:24 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: ALM is full of dots, EPH is empty. Couldn't be possible that I have outdated ALM, but it's thinking it's actual?
May 10 16:46:05 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: it might be possible... If the reception is good and almanac is good then it should get at least some ephemeris in about 1-2 minutes.
May 10 16:46:28 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: It's starting to show up
May 10 16:46:48 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: well, good for you ;)
May 10 16:47:27 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: OK, then you were probably right, but it seems odd to me anyway, I had no such long time to fix before.
May 10 16:48:25 <Blackhex> PaulFertser: Thank you for help, I'm going outside and If i get fix  I'll go bike... See you...
May 10 16:49:54 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: have you got a fix now?
May 10 16:53:12 <PBeck> hallo
May 10 17:01:54 <CIA-53> freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07framework * redbe2cecece9 10/framework/subsystems/otimed/otimed.py: otimed: handle the case when we have no GSM time zone and are in a multi zone country
May 10 17:27:33 <PaulFertser> Blackhex: is lucky cycling... Probably i should cycle for a bit again until it's too dark outside.
May 10 17:29:39 <Digital_Pioneer> So are we ever going to see Remoko or something like it for Bluez 4? :\
May 10 17:32:38 <PaulFertser> Digital_Pioneer: what's cool in remoko? I've never tried it. (no sarcasm, just interest)
May 10 17:33:26 <dos1> PaulFertser: with remoko neo can act as bluetooth keyboard, touchpad and presentation pilot
May 10 17:33:58 <PaulFertser> dos1: ah, cool, nothing i need :)
May 10 17:34:45 <Digital_Pioneer> PaulFertser: I used it as a remote to my set-top box.
May 10 17:35:26 <Digital_Pioneer> And it was supposed to function as a wireless mouse eventually, using the accelerometers.
May 10 17:35:45 <Digital_Pioneer> Right now it's just a touchpad, and it deps Bluez3, which is useless to me.
May 10 17:36:27 <PaulFertser> Digital_Pioneer: cool, but i don't need set-top box :) Too bad remoko author is too conservative, otoh former OM distro maintainers are guilty of keeping bluez3 for too long too.
May 10 17:37:01 <messerting_> Digital_Pioneer: Does it work with MythTV?
May 10 17:37:51 <Zorkman> i would find it a nice extra if it acted as a remote/bluetooth keyboard/wireless mouse
May 10 17:39:50 <Digital_Pioneer> messerting_: It works with Linux. :) You just need something that will set up a bluetooth keyboard.
May 10 17:40:06 <messerting_> cool, might try that
May 10 17:40:31 <Blu3> heheh, well, now text messages show dec 31, 1969 20:00 for the timestamp instead of jan 1 1970, 00:00
May 10 17:40:39 * messerting_ looking around for stuff that will make my Neo "useful" and not a dust collector..
May 10 17:40:49 <Blu3> so the TZ is getting honored, 'tis a step of improvement
May 10 18:17:17 <Blu3> ruh roh, text message composition is wrapping at around 8 letters
May 10 18:29:39 <thrashold> Using qemu images on a FUSE filesystem might have been a bad idea. File access on my arm VM is terribly slow. :D
May 10 18:30:05 <thrashold> I almost compiled E, though :)
May 10 18:39:02 <Digital_Pioneer> rasterman _made_ enlightenment? Wow, I had no idea.... :P
May 10 18:40:04 <Laibsch> when was the decision made to put further phone models on hold?
May 10 18:44:54 <SpeedEvil> Laibsch: when the money ran out
May 10 18:46:14 <Laibsch> which was when?
May 10 18:46:43 <Laibsch> were sales disappointing?
May 10 18:49:04 <SpeedEvil> Laibsch: well - software didnpt proceed as well as some might have hoped.
May 10 18:49:37 <SpeedEvil> This lead to sales being lower than they might be.
May 10 18:50:46 <Laibsch> Again, around what time was this decision made?  Or was there no official announcement?
May 10 18:55:00 <SpeedEvil> there wasn't an official announcement, the news basically leaked
May 10 18:56:39 <Blu3> i can't really say i'm surprised, we're sort of lacking in the feature/function department both in hardware and software
May 10 19:00:40 <Weiss> so, turns out that designing hardware and software for a mobile phone is actually quite difficult.. :)
May 10 19:02:57 <Blu3> well.  we're on 3G going to 4G service for cellphones, the gta02 is gprs.  there's no camera and most commodity cells have cameras these days
May 10 19:03:35 <Blu3> for software, we have a functional dialer, contacts, and text message app, but they're limited and not too pretty
May 10 19:04:03 <Blu3> the phone works for basic things but only appeals to geeks that get into the guts of things
May 10 19:04:30 <Blu3> so demand is going to be very low
May 10 19:04:37 <Wonka> but now we have hardware we can _work_ and _test_ on
May 10 19:05:26 <Blu3> yes.  but the point i am making is that development has moved too slow for this to be a sustainable product
May 10 19:05:28 <lindi-> we have the buggy gsm chip and graphics chip :(
May 10 19:06:01 <lindi-> but other than that the hardware seems quite ok to me
May 10 19:06:29 <DocScrutinizer> lindi-: buggy gsm-chip?
May 10 19:06:42 <lindi-> DocScrutinizer: crashes on heavy gprs traffic for example
May 10 19:06:46 <Blu3> slow development means we don't make it appeal to non-geeks, and the company doesn't get enough buyers to continue business
May 10 19:06:56 <DocScrutinizer> seems to be a sw-issue
May 10 19:06:58 <Blu3> lindi, hmm
May 10 19:07:05 <lindi-> DocScrutinizer: ok ok, "chip" was wrong here :)
May 10 19:07:11 <DocScrutinizer> ok
May 10 19:07:13 <lindi-> DocScrutinizer: we have buggy proprietary OS
May 10 19:07:18 <Blu3> i do a lot over gprs but it only crashes when i run pidgin
May 10 19:07:22 <DocScrutinizer> YES
May 10 19:07:32 <usr> i don't like the touchescreen
May 10 19:07:37 <mirko-paroli> DocScrutinizer: which part of sw is resp for failing on gprs traffic?
May 10 19:07:53 <lindi-> mirko-paroli: the one inside calypso
May 10 19:08:01 <mirko-paroli> lindi-: ah
May 10 19:08:01 <DocScrutinizer> either muxxer, or moko11
May 10 19:08:02 <Blu3> mirko, not sure the real perpetrator, but it causes a kernel oops
May 10 19:08:25 <lindi-> Blu3: ah, that's different bug then. have you reported it?
May 10 19:08:47 <Blu3> no, because the information i have is too vague to be useful atm.
May 10 19:08:55 <lindi-> Blu3: oops message would be useful
May 10 19:08:58 <DocScrutinizer> mirko-paroli: or, as usual, a combination of both not playing nicely ;-)
May 10 19:09:02 <Blu3> which i don't yet have
May 10 19:09:08 <mirko-paroli> DocScrutinizer: hehe
May 10 19:09:27 <dos1> ANNOUNCEMENT: do you have nice splash screen concept? Do you have nice gimp skills? Do you just want to try? Send 480x640 PNG file to shr-user maillist! We are waiting for your splash! :)
May 10 19:09:36 <Blu3> i have to balance fixing bugs with using it :)
May 10 19:10:54 <lindi-> dos1: who needs a splash screen? ;)
May 10 19:11:17 <dos1> lindi-: people using Qi and loglevel=0 ;)
May 10 19:32:03 <bernt> dos1: if this situation comes, I would boot my fr only if the battery drains to zero ;-)
May 10 19:33:34 <DocScrutinizer> lindi-: dos1: isn't there always a short splashscreen at least for the time uboot is loading the kernel? of course for Qi this seems useless as afaik Qi isn't even powering up display
May 10 19:34:49 <dos1> DocScrutinizer: i'm talking about shr-splash, which is displayed 2-3 seconds after powering up display by kernel
May 10 19:35:09 <slaxxer> how much trouble is it to replace the buggy hardware an proceed to the next hw revision?
May 10 19:35:29 <slaxxer> seems t o be  next
May 10 19:35:33 <DocScrutinizer> well here the uboot-splashscreen pov ;ßl
May 10 19:35:47 <dos1> DocScrutinizer: i'm using Qi ;)
May 10 19:36:11 <lindi-> DocScrutinizer: not if you don't issue that u-boot command?
May 10 19:36:35 <DocScrutinizer> lindi-: huh?
May 10 19:36:44 <lindi-> DocScrutinizer: nand read.e 0x32000000 splash 0x5000; unzip 0x32000000 0x8800000 0x96000
May 10 19:37:06 <lindi-> DocScrutinizer: I think that's the u-boot command to read splash image from flash and decompress it to the framebuffer?
May 10 19:37:26 <DocScrutinizer> yeah, you can disable this by tweaking eNV
May 10 19:37:32 <lindi-> eNV?
May 10 19:37:35 <lindi-> ah, env
May 10 19:40:56 <usr> would one like to write an ide in here?
May 10 19:41:09 <lindi-> usr: ?
May 10 19:41:33 <usr>  an ide for pygtk
May 10 19:42:20 <usr> written in python using pygtk for gui, to create gui's or apps
May 10 20:08:14 <sypher71> are the modules .tgz files for shr meant to be extracted to the base system after install?
May 10 20:08:37 <sypher71> i mean i see that they are kernel modules... i'm just not sure what they are for if i should get them :-P
May 10 20:12:37 <bernt> sypher71: I think, some are for devices you could connect via usb
May 10 20:13:21 <sypher71> bernt: i can get them on my freerunner fine... i'm just not sure if i'm meant to extract that file or not (as the phone seems to run fine without them)
May 10 20:14:33 <bernt> sypher71: yes, the things which are ncessary for the phone, are compiled into the kernel, the rest are modules.
May 10 20:15:16 <sypher71> bernt: ok... so they are optional modules for additional support, etc. got it. thanks
May 10 20:16:22 <bernt> sypher71: for example, I have connected an usb ethernet adapter: the driver for this adapter is in a modul.
May 10 20:16:37 <sypher71> bernt: ah i see
May 10 20:18:41 <DocScrutinizer> yes but there's a set of modules in image and in .jffs as well. It seems not entirely clear which modules are preinstalled ans which are introduced to system by the modules.tgz
May 10 20:20:19 <DocScrutinizer> maybe some of the distro maintaines could shed some light on this
May 10 20:20:23 <sypher7> DocScrutinizer: yeah, that's what prompted my asking... i couldn't find a description of the file anywhere
May 10 20:21:56 <DocScrutinizer> Ainulindale: any comments on SHR wrt this?
May 10 20:25:09 <Blu3> anyone have a better BtHeadset.py?  the one on the openmoko wiki makes dbus calls for invalid objects/methods
May 10 20:26:29 <Weiss> you shouldn't need to untar any modules if you're using the uImage that you downloaded at the same time as the rootfs
May 10 20:27:01 <Weiss> if you change the uImage, you'll need to untar the matching modules before flashing the kernel, otherwise the modules won't work
May 10 20:27:30 <sypher7> Weiss: oh okay. thanks for the explanation
May 10 20:28:04 <Weiss> (how bad "the modules won't work" is depends on how the kernel was configured, which varies from distro to distro)
May 10 20:28:27 <DocScrutinizer> a word on *nosummary files would be fine as well
May 10 20:29:46 <DocScrutinizer> and I have to admit I didn't find any of these topics anywhere in wiki or in a readme file next to the dl-folder
May 10 20:34:30 <Weiss> aiui nosummary is just the same image without a JFFS2 summary block in the filesystem. slightly smaller image, but will boot much more slowly. no reason to use it..
May 10 20:35:28 <Weiss> and then there's a load of short filename things which are just symlinks to the full filenames
May 10 20:37:49 <DocScrutinizer> Weiss: seems to be a good idea to place all this on the flashing-your-neo or/and distros wikipage
May 10 20:49:05 <em_> hi all
May 10 20:49:36 <badcloud> hey there, em_
May 10 20:50:01 <em_> I am a master student, and I am looking for "real netlists/PCB designs to compare to a model I made
May 10 20:50:11 <em_> for my thesis
May 10 20:50:45 <em_> I looked at the archives I can download for the openmoko project (which has some _real_ designes )
May 10 20:51:01 <em_> what I am looking for is some routing statistics
May 10 20:51:22 <em_> number of nets, number of routes, fanout repartition...
May 10 20:52:05 <em_> I found PDF files with schematics... not really easy to extract informations from hem !
May 10 20:53:13 <em_> does anyone know where I can get such informations from openmoko designs ?
May 10 20:54:00 <Serdar> hi
May 10 20:54:46 <Serdar> how much does this FSOSHRUDCON'09 costs?
May 10 20:55:14 <Serdar> I don't need a room, I live not far away from Essen.
May 10 20:57:48 <DocScrutinizer> em_: OM policy isn't including to publish gerber. netlists were no problem if we had any
May 10 20:58:30 <em_> ? I understand the beginning of your sentence, not the end :  netlists were no problem if we had any ???
May 10 20:58:52 <DocScrutinizer> Serdar: sorry afaik it's "sold out"
May 10 20:59:16 <Serdar> oh
May 10 20:59:42 <DocScrutinizer> em_: the tool we use to do schem and layout seems to have no simple way to generate netlists
May 10 20:59:59 <em_> But the netlist comes from schematics !!
May 10 21:00:08 <DocScrutinizer> I know
May 10 21:00:10 <Serdar> there are only 20 seats?
May 10 21:00:21 <Serdar> that sucks :/
May 10 21:00:25 <DocScrutinizer> actually 22 iirc
May 10 21:00:35 <em_> there are no way to export some protel or such files, and extract only some infrmation ? I mean some specifics statistics ?
May 10 21:01:15 <DocScrutinizer> maybe there are ways, but for sure there is no manpower to do such a job
May 10 21:02:01 <em_> ok.. And OM does not want to share any design ?
May 10 21:02:29 <em_> even with some NDA : all I would like to do or my researches ais matching my model to at least one real design
May 10 21:02:56 <DocScrutinizer> em_: if you could create a detailed instruction, even batch file, to do this with mentor-pads logic projects, I could probably create netlists for you
May 10 21:02:57 <em_> it's barelly impossible to find one publicly aailable (except some very ,very small university designes :-( )
May 10 21:03:04 <em_> ok
May 10 21:03:12 <em_> I have access to pads
May 10 21:03:17 <em_> here in my university
May 10 21:03:57 <em_> I will have a look at pads and try to get something
May 10 21:04:02 <em_> it would be sooo great
May 10 21:04:12 <DocScrutinizer> so write a keypress level detailed instruction and send to me, so you'll probably get the netlists
May 10 21:04:21 <em_> keypress ?
May 10 21:04:29 <SpeedEvil> what keys to press
May 10 21:04:33 <em_> ok !
May 10 21:04:34 <em_> sorry
May 10 21:05:00 <em_> probably in a few... weeks :-( Maybe a few days, but I personnalynever used pads !
May 10 21:05:27 <DocScrutinizer> em_: I need to check back with wolfgang, but I think it can be done
May 10 21:05:43 <em_> all I need is some statistics... not the design
May 10 21:05:51 <DocScrutinizer> yup
May 10 21:06:18 <em_> perfect
May 10 21:06:21 <DocScrutinizer> even complete netlists are no more data/info than pdf schem
May 10 21:06:23 <em_> thanks a lot
May 10 21:06:32 <em_> yes, but automatic extraction is possible
May 10 21:07:00 <em_> couning manually each net, looking for their fanout, ... that's a strange sens of having fun !
May 10 21:07:05 <DocScrutinizer> I don't think OM cares as long as I won't
May 10 21:07:25 <DocScrutinizer> so no problem to publish netlists
May 10 21:07:32 <em_> hmmm
May 10 21:07:51 <em_> ok : so for you only a keypress doc to extract netlist is OK É?
May 10 21:07:59 <DocScrutinizer> yup
May 10 21:08:13 <em_> I was thinking of sending you a full batch to extract only stats I want
May 10 21:08:17 <em_> ahh that's easier
May 10 21:08:55 <em_> as I can then extract stats. by myself
May 10 21:09:05 <em_> ok
May 10 21:09:14 <DocScrutinizer> em_: provision all I need to generate a clean netlist, that's all I need
May 10 21:09:16 <em_> thanks _a lot_
May 10 21:09:23 <em_> yup ! Understood
May 10 21:23:49 <usr> i've an idea how this ide could work... as i'm not that into hacking i would write it in simple modules. one could just create the code for a button and echo all this into a file named after the button. afterwards you read the file echo it and among different rules (which do the framework) into the final-script... is this a good idea?
May 10 21:25:34 <messerting> Hi folks - how can I make my phone visible over bluetooth? In SHR-testing, the switch always swaps back to off...
May 10 21:25:56 <messerting> Is there anything I can try over ssh?
May 10 21:27:51 <lindi-> messerting: lsubs?
May 10 21:27:54 <lindi-> messerting: lsusb?
May 10 21:28:20 <messerting> Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001
May 10 21:28:42 <messerting> I have it connect to the power adaptor
May 10 21:29:35 <lindi-> messerting: bluetooth is connected via usb
May 10 21:30:02 <messerting> aha. Hm - so SHR doesn't see the bluetooth adapter?
May 10 21:30:02 <lindi-> messerting: you should see 'Bus 001 Device 002: ID 0a12:0001 Cambridge Silicon Radio, Ltd Bluetooth Dongle (HCI mode)'
May 10 21:30:10 <lindi-> messerting: i don't know about shr
May 10 21:30:17 <messerting> ok, thanks - will check the shr wiki
May 10 21:31:26 <kakaprout> hi
May 10 21:32:10 <messerting> lindi-: hehe, a simple /etc/init.d/bluetooth start seems to help :)
May 10 21:33:27 <messerting> at least, now I've got "Bus 001 Device 003: ID 0a12:0001 Cambridge Silicon Radio, Ltd Bluetooth Dongle (HCI mode)"
May 10 21:33:47 <kakaprout> i tried a testing image of Om2009, the gui is very simple, with white text on black screen, and i found it very nice, is it a redesign or just a testing gui ?
May 10 21:34:40 <PaulFertser> kakaprout: redesign of what?
May 10 21:34:50 <usr> kakaprout: it's paroli
May 10 21:35:03 <messerting> yep, there it is "om-gta02-0", thanks lindi-
May 10 21:35:05 <kakaprout> PaulFertser: redesign of the gui
May 10 21:35:16 <kakaprout> usr: thanks
May 10 21:35:35 <PaulFertser> kakaprout: no, paroli looks like that from the beginning...
May 10 21:36:00 <kakaprout> PaulFertser: i never tried before, and it was a very good surprise
May 10 21:36:25 <PaulFertser> kakaprout: then git clone the sources and help mirko to fix bugs ;)
May 10 21:36:51 <kakaprout> PaulFertser: i'd like to, though i'm quite coding impaired
May 10 21:37:07 <usr> later on it shell be used to provide some featerphone like functionality, but it's not a replacement 
May 10 21:37:37 <usr> it's a fork of tichy...
May 10 21:38:27 <kakaprout> never heard of tichy
May 10 21:39:00 <usr> tichy was most of used in fso
May 10 21:40:09 <kakaprout> i tried some distribs but not so much in fact
May 10 21:41:15 <usr> there is a web side http://www.paroli-project.org/ and a youtube-video about tichy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysS7OuuY0Z4&feature=PlayList&p=68EE787286A24275&index=3 
May 10 21:41:23 <kakaprout> thanks again
May 10 21:42:34 <kakaprout> the motorola f3 had a very simple interface like this, but not much usable, i'd like something like that on the freerunner
May 10 21:42:44 <usr> the idea is good, but when i used it on fso it just crashed every time i used it 
May 10 21:44:42 <SpeedEvil> kakaprout: it's approaching the 'not usable' at least.
May 10 21:44:57 <SpeedEvil> (though seriously, recent stuff is getting better)
May 10 21:45:39 <kakaprout> usr: in fact i saw before the tichy video, it's nice, and fun to hear the french accent :)
May 10 21:46:22 <kakaprout> SpeedEvil: i'll be watching the progress
May 10 21:49:04 <lindi-> -
May 10 21:50:13 <usr> who does use the freerunner frequently?
May 10 21:50:29 <lindi-> usr: does daily use count? ;)
May 10 21:50:54 <usr> shure... i wrote an app for torrent
May 10 21:51:05 <em_> no: you need at least o use it every minute (24H of course !!!) ;-)
May 10 21:51:07 <usr> it's more an gui for ctorrent
May 10 21:51:11 <kakaprout> i'd like to
May 10 21:51:33 <lindi-> usr: i'm happy with btdownloadcurses
May 10 21:51:59 <usr> wtf is btdownloadcurses?
May 10 21:53:01 <lindi-> usr: written by Henry James, part of the 'bittorrent' package in debian
May 10 21:53:40 <lindi-> usr: like 6 years ago
May 10 21:54:40 <Laibsch> I flashed my FR with http://shr.bearstech.com/shr-testing/images/om-gta02/uImage-om-gta02-latest.bin and http://shr.bearstech.com/shr-testing/images/om-gta02/shr-image-om-gta02.jffs2
May 10 21:54:48 <Laibsch> dfu-util finished without error
May 10 21:55:11 <Laibsch> I then shut down the FR and rebooted, but the FR hangs at the openmoko splash
May 10 21:55:17 <usr> lindi: does it provide a gui?
May 10 21:56:17 <lindi-> usr: ncurses
May 10 21:56:47 <lindi-> usr: there's btdownloadgui too if you want graphics
May 10 21:57:26 <usr> lindi: yes ok.
May 10 21:58:30 <lindi-> usr: i wouldn't reinvent the wheel without testing the original wheel first :)
May 10 21:58:47 <kakaprout> Laibsch: try reflashing
May 10 21:59:20 <usr> lindi: but my app is still nice and provides some killer features like automated import of new torrents and save settings
May 10 22:01:48 <usr> lindi: but i still have to fix some things like where to save, not all in the same folder to use sub-folders instead and to make it more reliable 
May 10 22:02:09 <usr> lindi: i meant even more reliable ^^
May 10 22:02:17 <lindi-> usr: does it support --help command line argument? ;)
May 10 22:03:08 <usr> lindi: hmmm, as it is just a gui for ctorrent... you could use ctorrent --help
May 10 22:03:25 <lindi-> usr: does it have man page?
May 10 22:03:47 <usr> lindi: look up for ctorrent man
May 10 22:04:04 <lindi-> usr: all binaries need to have a man page
May 10 22:04:42 <usr> lindi: it's a python script 
May 10 22:04:51 <lindi-> usr: executable anyway
May 10 22:05:10 <lindi-> usr: user shouldn't need to care what programming language you used
May 10 22:05:52 <usr> lindi: there are some commends in the script itself ^^
May 10 22:06:24 <usr> comments
May 10 22:06:38 <lindi-> usr: no manual page => can't be even accepted to distro, sorry :)
May 10 22:07:25 <usr> lindi: but i can tell you it kicks ass on x64 quadcore
May 10 22:09:42 <usr> lindi: it's annoying to type in long torrent names
May 10 22:11:37 <usr> so it checks either the old torrent is completed ore if there are new one's in the watchfolder
May 10 22:18:54 <CIA-53> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * rc6f066eaf035 10/docs/frameworkd.conf.sample: docs: document current state of frameworkd.conf
May 10 22:18:55 <CIA-53> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r08db9ea98922 10/fsodeviced/src/plugins/kernel26_powersupply/plugin.vala: fsodevice: kernel26_powersupply: compute status if we're AC-powered
May 10 22:18:56 <CIA-53> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * ra2a8359b0e50 10/libfsoframework/fsoframework/ (fsoframework-2.0.vapi interfaces.vala): fsoframework: interfaces: add org.freesmartphone.Device.PowerSupply.GetType() -> s
May 10 23:06:02 <frankS2> can anyone recommend me a distro that just works?
May 10 23:07:49 <em_> android
May 10 23:08:54 <frankS2> em_: crashed during boot here
May 10 23:09:08 <em_> there are several images
May 10 23:09:12 <em_> some are more advanced
May 10 23:09:16 <em_> this is a port of android
May 10 23:10:35 <frankS2> em_: do you have one to recommend me please? Im just sick and tired of switching firmware... nothing is good enough
May 10 23:11:04 <em_> what about these images http://www.fragcom.de/android/
May 10 23:11:51 <em_> a video link for images uImage-v15-ext3.bin/freerunner-v14.6.jffs2
May 10 23:11:51 <em_> http://www.dailymotion.com/user/superzell/video/x8s22b_android-sur-un-openmoko-freerunner_tech
May 10 23:13:17 <frankS2> em_: which one of those should i choose?
May 10 23:15:11 <em_> more info here : http://panicking.kicks-ass.org/blog/index.php
May 10 23:16:03 <em_> try uImage-v15-ex3.bin
May 10 23:16:04 <em_> and
May 10 23:16:24 <em_> freerunner-v14.6.jffs2
May 10 23:17:02 <em_> but I did not personnaly tested them ( I don't even have a freerunner !!!)
May 10 23:23:30 <slaxxer> 04162009 shr
May 10 23:34:27 <frankS2> em_: ok thanks mate, checking it out now :) why are you here if you dont have the phone then? hehe
May 10 23:34:34 <frankS2> em_: just curious about the projeect?
May 10 23:34:58 <em_> yes and no : I asked openmoko dev if I could access the freerunner netlists
May 10 23:35:17 <em_> to extract some statistics, I created a model for my thesis, and would like to compare to real netlists
May 10 23:35:31 <em_> but these are _very_ very hard to have (for universities)
May 10 23:35:57 <em_> even openmoko does not publish netlists files (even if some pdfs are equivalent in terms of information)
May 10 23:36:07 <em_> and it should be possible !
May 10 23:36:11 <SpeedEvil> have you contacted pcb manufacturing firms in your area
May 10 23:36:12 <em_> ^^
May 10 23:36:21 <em_> yup : impossible
May 10 23:36:25 <em_> to get anything
May 10 23:36:33 <SpeedEvil> I'll generate a netlist for you from the pdfs for $100. :)
May 10 23:36:56 <em_> even close partners to my project (quiet big one) don't want to share their shcematics/netlists/etc...
May 10 23:36:59 <em_> ahah
May 10 23:37:04 <em_> the pdf are drawings
May 10 23:37:19 <SpeedEvil> yes - generating a netlist from them is boring, but quite doable.
May 10 23:37:29 <em_> It is possible to extract netlists by hand... but if I can get an automatic one !
May 10 23:37:39 <em_> from drawings ?
May 10 23:37:49 <SpeedEvil> sure
May 10 23:37:55 <em_> hmm interstin
May 10 23:38:20 <em_> I don't think they are vectorials...
May 10 23:38:30 <em_> How would you proceed  (just curious)
May 10 23:38:44 <SpeedEvil> write down a net name. Say
May 10 23:39:03 <em_> ok and try to match each name by say autocorrelation
May 10 23:39:07 <em_> but damn slow
May 10 23:39:10 <SpeedEvil> Vibrator Mot-1 FET23-2
May 10 23:39:15 <SpeedEvil> or rather
May 10 23:39:32 <SpeedEvil> VibratorPower Mot-1 FET23-2
May 10 23:39:33 <em_> and you probably have to extract each net name by hand (which is much more than boring)
May 10 23:39:54 <SpeedEvil> VibratorGnd Mot-2 GND
May 10 23:39:55 <SpeedEvil> ...
May 10 23:40:05 <em_> extracting netlists from pads will be much more efficient
May 10 23:40:12 <SpeedEvil> of course
May 10 23:40:55 <em_> I really want to publish my paper before the end of the year ^^
May 10 23:41:03 <em_> I meant sumit
May 10 23:41:05 <em_> submit
May 10 23:47:39 <em_> @SpeedEvil : 100$ for this work is not a lot ;-) : extracting each name by hand, waiting for scilab to finish its computations, compiling results (I want a readable netlist)... will take more than a full day !
May 10 23:48:12 <SpeedEvil> scilab? you type it into a text editor.
May 10 23:48:45 <em_> to make autocorrelation
May 10 23:48:56 <em_> this is a bitmap...
May 10 23:49:43 <SpeedEvil> don't follow what scilab's got to do with extracting
May 10 23:50:36 <em_> if you want to detect automagically each time each net appears in your schematic image (this is wat is available from openmoko, schematics are screenshots from pads !)
May 10 23:51:44 <frankS2> moment of truth....... booting android
May 10 23:51:49 <SpeedEvil> It is annoying and tedious to do by hand - but quite possible. 
May 10 23:52:04 <em_> ywa, I know... but boring and subject to errors
May 10 23:52:12 <em_> I am checking the pdf in text mode
May 10 23:52:24 <em_> yes, binary image
May 10 23:53:16 <frankS2> omgggggggg
May 10 23:53:26 <SpeedEvil> have you gone and looked at the open-source schematics you can find?
May 10 23:53:28 <frankS2> i im booting up the phone and i only get the "Openmoko" display
May 10 23:53:30 <frankS2> stops there
May 10 23:53:46 <SpeedEvil> I can think of several off-hand
May 10 23:56:49 <frankS2> does anyone know how i can fix this?
May 10 23:56:52 <frankS2> it wont boot
May 10 23:56:53 <frankS2> :(
May 10 23:57:37 <SpeedEvil> have you tried running around the room screaming?
May 11 00:19:09 <qknight> my graphics seems to be very slow
May 11 00:19:18 <qknight> as using a nvidia card with the nv driver
May 11 00:19:22 <qknight> is that 'normal'?
May 11 00:19:30 <qknight> neo freerunner i'm using
May 11 00:23:52 <SpeedEvil> umm
May 11 00:24:00 <SpeedEvil> you mean in qemu?
May 11 00:27:35 <qknight> no on the moko
May 11 00:27:46 <qknight> for example if i try to move a menu slider on shr
May 11 00:27:54 <qknight> from off to on
May 11 00:28:03 <qknight> it seems to last ages until the graphic is drawn
May 11 00:29:44 <frankS2> WHY WHY WHY
May 11 00:29:46 <frankS2> OM 2008...
May 11 00:29:47 <frankS2> ofcourse i cant type in my pin code
May 11 00:29:55 <frankS2> when the keyboard only have a-z
May 11 00:29:57 <frankS2> and not 0-9
May 11 00:30:11 <ndnihil> no terminal keyboard?
May 11 00:30:31 <qknight> frankS2: don't use OM maybe?
May 11 00:30:44 <frankS2> ndnihil: no
May 11 00:31:02 <frankS2> qknight: what other distro then? why did they even make a distro that dont allow you to type in PIN
May 11 00:32:33 <qknight> shr
May 11 00:33:24 <frankS2> qknight: tried that, it wont allow me to make calls, only receive
May 11 00:34:12 <frankS2> this phone seriously... sucks
May 11 00:34:12 <frankS2> its going in the trash bin
May 11 00:37:49 <qknight> it is no phone
May 11 00:37:56 <qknight> it still has development satus
May 11 00:37:58 <qknight> status
May 11 00:42:55 <frankS2> yes but as you read on topic too "models continius with limited forces"
May 11 00:42:57 <frankS2> so i guess
May 11 00:43:02 <frankS2> maybe in 1 year it will be usable
May 11 00:43:06 <frankS2> if its not dead
May 11 00:45:55 <frankS2> if only everyone could just focus on 1 distro instead of making theyr own
May 11 00:46:01 <frankS2> it would be a uber phone by now
May 11 00:47:02 <qknight> that is an illusion
May 11 00:47:30 <qknight> if you want a phone just buy a nokia
May 11 01:34:06 <frankS2> contacts and dialer segfaults
May 11 01:34:08 <frankS2> great
May 11 01:35:48 <frankS2> lets try another distro
May 11 01:36:44 <frankS2> ok when i hit "call" in SHR
May 11 01:36:47 <frankS2> it dials
May 11 01:36:52 <frankS2> but then hangup 2seconds later
May 11 01:37:00 <frankS2> anyone else has this problem?
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon May 11 02:59:57 2009