**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Oct 14 02:59:56 2009
Oct 14 02:59:58 <slaxxer> atleast the cupcake keyboard is the correct color
Oct 14 03:00:24 <Cristianpark> the question is: AFAIK, if I have SHR installed via dfu-util, if I want to try Android, I lost that SHR installation?
Oct 14 03:01:01 <slaxxer> no
Oct 14 03:01:18 <slaxxer> :)
Oct 14 03:01:51 <DocScrutinizer-8> I have no idea about android, but iirc it's installed to uSD, so no, you probably won't lose the SHR installation
Oct 14 03:02:33 <Cristianpark> in the link I paste says: This install process overwrites *everything* on the NAND inthe phone, including the bootloader. If this is not what you would like to do, please don't install this release!
Oct 14 03:02:43 <Cristianpark> that's why I'm confused
Oct 14 03:03:10 <DocScrutinizer-8> hmm, as well as I am
Oct 14 03:03:54 <DocScrutinizer-8> sounds rather scary anyways
Oct 14 03:05:36 <Cristianpark> hehehe....yeah, it does
Oct 14 03:08:04 <Cristianpark> well guys, I have to go to bed. See ya, thanks for the help
Oct 14 03:08:04 <mostly_useless> if anyone's interested: it also says that it destroys everything on the uSD, but that's not true with current releases. (my pictures/music sit comfortably on the card even after flashing a new build).
Oct 14 03:09:07 <slaxxer>  the installer is copied to the sdcard  then runs from  there to install onto the nand
Oct 14 03:09:18 <slaxxer> kills qi an all
Oct 14 03:09:38 <slaxxer>     with a different qi
Oct 14 03:10:01 <slaxxer> so hows it work  anyways?
Oct 14 03:10:16 <slaxxer> u have the buxx fix?
Oct 14 03:19:49 * SpeedEvil sighs, and tries to remember to duct-tape the rf-kill-switch.
Oct 14 03:29:29 <slaxxer> they want that fbreader to be like a toaster   --  they wish
Oct 14 03:29:53 <slaxxer> maybe walmart will pick up the ball
Oct 14 03:34:26 <slaxxer> http://thewikireader.com/
Oct 14 03:39:13 <slaxxer> maybe if they make 1.2 million   then  the gta03 will arrive
Oct 14 03:40:27 <slaxxer> attachable personal device
Oct 14 03:40:53 <slaxxer> lets help advertize
Oct 14 03:49:20 <slaxxer> http://www.crunchgear.com/2009/10/13/wikireader-packs-all-of-wikipedia-in-a-power-sipping-portable/
Oct 14 03:55:51 <mostly_useless> really?
Oct 14 03:56:06 <mostly_useless> that's what they canceled gta03 for, isn't it?
Oct 14 03:58:14 <ndnihil> sadly, yes
Oct 14 03:58:42 <slaxxer> naaa
Oct 14 03:59:02 <raster> slaxxer:  gta02 isnt never going to happen.
Oct 14 03:59:18 <raster> openmoko has no more software or hardware staff
Oct 14 03:59:20 <slaxxer>    core could though
Oct 14 03:59:21 <ndnihil> my gta02 happened, kinda
Oct 14 03:59:33 <raster> last i checked it was sean+will
Oct 14 04:00:06 <SpeedEvil> no - gta03 was cancelled as they ran out of funding for it.
Oct 14 04:00:09 <slaxxer> use the same case an build a good board
Oct 14 04:00:34 <slaxxer> thats why they are selling these  wikireaders
Oct 14 04:00:52 <slaxxer> to make mo money
Oct 14 04:00:57 <SpeedEvil> Well...
Oct 14 04:01:12 <SpeedEvil> There is the _huge_ problem that the n900 sets a top-end of the market
Oct 14 04:01:35 <SpeedEvil> and than many customers that may have wanted a gta03 will - instead of getting a gta03 - get a n900.
Oct 14 04:01:43 <SpeedEvil> So you'd have to price it considerably down from that
Oct 14 04:02:11 <raster> slaxxer: sean ceased being interested in linux and phones.
Oct 14 04:02:35 <raster> spoe yup. the target customers for a gtya02 are those that want top-end
Oct 14 04:02:51 <raster> they want powerfl, runs linux and all the stuff they want to. not limited.
Oct 14 04:03:22 <raster> gta03 had its dat and opportunity. that day is coming to an end as the big boys are not going there
Oct 14 04:03:35 <raster> and they can do it better and cheaper thanks to volumes and existing product runs.
Oct 14 04:03:48 <SpeedEvil> So you either have to compete directly with nokia, undercut them - and live with small margins - or do something they aren't.
Oct 14 04:03:49 <slaxxer> were Doomed
Oct 14 04:03:51 <raster> om had a chance to enter the market before everyone else woke up.
Oct 14 04:04:26 <raster> slaxxer: no. you just need to make some compromises for some closed things - like telephony and some drivers and proprietary ui apps
Oct 14 04:04:27 <SpeedEvil> And the undercut them thing is horribly risky, as chinese vendors can do that too. 
Oct 14 04:04:33 <raster> and work with what the big boys ship
Oct 14 04:04:37 <raster> replace/add/modify what u can
Oct 14 04:05:02 <raster> SpeedEvil: yup. undercutting is a game om cant really do becaue the software is open and free
Oct 14 04:05:11 <raster> someone else can udnercut u and take all your software work for free
Oct 14 04:05:21 <raster> u only stay in that game by not undercutting but by just being better
Oct 14 04:05:40 <slaxxer>  i know it seems bad  but its not
Oct 14 04:05:44 <raster> ie making the better devices first with the best components and with the best device+software integration and newest features
Oct 14 04:06:08 <SpeedEvil> Which regrettably equals huge up-front funding.
Oct 14 04:06:30 <slaxxer>   then selling them for a loss
Oct 14 04:06:45 <slaxxer> how do they do it
Oct 14 04:06:51 <SpeedEvil> Phones are not sold at a loss.
Oct 14 04:07:07 <SpeedEvil> They are sold subsidised by the networks after very careful and detailed analysis.
Oct 14 04:07:44 <slaxxer> considering a 2 year contract for 100 bucks a month
Oct 14 04:08:20 <SpeedEvil> For example - yes - your n900 on a 12 month contract may be free - and the first year actually very good value.
Oct 14 04:08:53 <SpeedEvil> But if you don't cancel immediately and move onto a new contract - you're vastly overpaying.
Oct 14 04:08:59 <raster> sle the phone maker doesnt take the loss
Oct 14 04:08:59 <SpeedEvil> And many people simply won't cancel.
Oct 14 04:09:03 <raster> the telco does
Oct 14 04:09:10 <raster> it pays for part or all of the phone cost for u
Oct 14 04:09:11 <SpeedEvil> And it's not a loss.
Oct 14 04:09:21 <raster> gets a volume discount for buying like 1 million phones
Oct 14 04:09:29 <SpeedEvil> Or rather - averaged over the market it's not a loss.
Oct 14 04:09:34 <raster> and then it triews to get the money back from u through monthyl fees over time
Oct 14 04:09:52 <SpeedEvil> There may be individual phones or plans or ... that don't make money - iphone forex.
Oct 14 04:10:06 <raster> SpeedEvil:  its a loss if they didnt lock u in :)
Oct 14 04:10:40 <SpeedEvil> Only if they don't have a contract with an appropriately set minimum term - and almost all do.
Oct 14 04:11:00 <SpeedEvil> The remainder that I've found seem to have relatively small buy-in bonuses. 
Oct 14 04:11:22 <SpeedEvil> Seemingly based on the fact that you're going to stay at least 3 months on average.
Oct 14 04:11:33 <raster> SpeedEvil: oh of course. iw as just using the terms slaxxer did so it fits in with his idea of selling at a loss
Oct 14 04:11:38 <raster> not the phone companies loss
Oct 14 04:11:42 <raster> its all in the telcos hands
Oct 14 04:12:08 <raster> like sony, xbox .. they sell to you at a loss.. or at cost in the hope of making profits on games and peripherals
Oct 14 04:12:23 <SpeedEvil> The 'skype on mobiles' - is typically not the normal skype - but goes via calls?
Oct 14 04:12:24 <SpeedEvil> to take this off at a tangent.
Oct 14 04:12:26 <raster> its a long-term strategy you need a fat mountain of cash to start doing
Oct 14 04:12:40 <raster> dont know
Oct 14 04:13:53 <SpeedEvil> Wondering as one telco here is offering 'free skype forever' - no need to even top up
Oct 14 04:14:01 <SpeedEvil> also free MSN forever.
Oct 14 04:16:10 <raster> well one thing i think the android skype does it make your incoming calls real calls for skype
Oct 14 04:16:21 <raster> as an ip session wont work as the cpu is suspended
Oct 14 04:16:27 <raster> but outgoing is data calls
Oct 14 04:17:10 <raster> and skyp charge YOU via the skype out or in system for the redirected call
Oct 14 04:17:19 <raster> as the call goes to them then gets passed onto your mobile number
Oct 14 04:17:31 <raster> and the telco has a deal with skype to share that income?
Oct 14 04:17:53 <raster> (in many ways this is awesome for telcos as YOU no longer control your spending. everyone who calls YOU does)
Oct 14 04:20:29 <slaxxer> so this n900 works on all networks  at&t    sprint?
Oct 14 04:21:38 <AntonTakk2> slaxxer: specs i saw said quad band gsm + 3.5g and hsdpa data
Oct 14 04:22:43 <AntonTakk2> so are all the known hardware problems supposed to be fixed in the A7?
Oct 14 04:24:13 <slaxxer> where can u buy an a7?
Oct 14 04:24:34 <AntonTakk2> i thought the web store was going to sell them once the A6s were gone
Oct 14 04:27:13 <slaxxer> http://openmoko.com/index.html
Oct 14 04:29:31 <AntonTakk2> wow....somebody fire the web developer
Oct 14 04:29:38 <AntonTakk2> quick
Oct 14 04:29:45 <AntonTakk2> er, designer
Oct 14 04:30:38 <SpeedEvil> It's not a designer.
Oct 14 04:30:46 <SpeedEvil> They will call themselves an artist.
Oct 14 04:30:49 <SpeedEvil> It's a concept.
Oct 14 04:31:43 <slaxxer> its the KISS standard
Oct 14 04:32:21 <AntonTakk2> hrm
Oct 14 04:33:31 <slaxxer> http://www.idasystems.net/
Oct 14 04:33:36 <slaxxer>   theres an a7
Oct 14 04:37:04 <AntonTakk2> well, anyways, i only ask because i was thinking i might buy an a7 if it has all the known hardware issues fixed so I could make a case more to my liking with the 3d printer and laser cutter i am considering buying for making my robots
Oct 14 04:39:21 <_Andrew> The web desigjn is ugly
Oct 14 04:49:39 <slaxxer> moko robot brain
Oct 14 04:59:35 <_Andrew> The worse thing about this design is the the text is images
Oct 14 05:00:33 <chx_afk> Hey! this wikireader stuff looks awesome. LCD or electronic ink?
Oct 14 05:02:37 <SpeedEvil> LCD
Oct 14 05:03:08 <slaxxer> etch n sketch
Oct 14 05:03:25 <chx_afk> LCD :( oh well. it still is great
Oct 14 06:00:59 <slaxxer> http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B002N5521W/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&condition=new
Oct 14 06:41:47 <raster> slaxxer: check specs. for calls it is quad-band for gsm, tri-band wcdma (hspa etc.)
Oct 14 06:41:56 <raster> so u'll only get high speed data on 900, 170 and 2100mhz
Oct 14 06:42:23 <raster> but calls and up to edge should work on 850/900/1800/1900
Oct 14 06:43:39 <raster> http://www.nokiausa.com/find-products/phones/nokia-n900/specifications
Oct 14 06:43:48 <raster> there in details
Oct 14 06:54:54 <CIA-44> openmoko: 03werner * r5690 10/trunk/gta02-core/ (docs/ecn/STATUS docs/ecn/ecn0008.txt gps.sch): 
Oct 14 06:54:54 <CIA-44> openmoko: - gps.sch and ECN0008: added value for C7601
Oct 14 06:54:54 <CIA-44> openmoko: - ECN0008: added some more components removals (already implemented)
Oct 14 06:54:54 <CIA-44> openmoko: - moved ECN0008 to "Execute"
Oct 14 07:46:31 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03baruch 07framework * r6b345558913d 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/ubx.py: 
Oct 14 07:46:31 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: ogpsd: Correct the comment about usage of SBAS
Oct 14 07:46:31 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: We set mode to 1 which means we use SBAS but not if its in test-mode.
Oct 14 07:48:53 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03baruch 07framework * r043cef6d2122 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): 
Oct 14 07:48:53 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: ogpsd: Set NAV2 parameters to define the static threshold to reduce movement noise
Oct 14 07:48:53 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: when the GPS is stationary.
Oct 14 09:05:37 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r0b15555f96ff 10/fsogsmd/ (6 files in 4 dirs): fsogsmd: rename plugin gsm_device to dbus_service
Oct 14 09:28:24 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * rdc9f049fa4e8 10/libfsoframework/fsoframework/interfaces.vala: libfsoframework: interfaces: add well-known GPS prefixes
Oct 14 09:29:03 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r3484d0a4368a 10/fsogpsd/ (14 files in 8 dirs): fsogpsd: rename gps_device to dbus_service; rename protocol_nmea to device_nmea; add tests skeleton
Oct 14 11:01:58 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r6c774ac55ec5 10/fsogpsd/src/lib/receiver.vala: fsogpsd: receiver: add some logic from fsogsm modem class
Oct 14 11:05:40 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r64ba87e46e99 10/fsogsmd/src/lib/modem.vala: fsogsmd: modem: data is now a class in the modem interface, not a toplevel class
Oct 14 11:14:47 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r008b6608a79d 10/ (4 files in 4 dirs): add fsogspd to top-level Makefile
Oct 14 12:13:51 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * rea0928984658 10/libfsobasics/fsobasics/types.vala: libfsobasics: add missing file, thanks heinervdm
Oct 14 13:12:05 <spaetz> wikireader is shipping worldwide BTW, for those that were concerned about Europe...
Oct 14 13:12:16 <spaetz> just discovered that on their web
Oct 14 13:27:33 <DocScrutinizer> [2009-10-14 09:46:29] <mstevens> they seem to have updated the shipping rules, worldwide now    (#openmoko-wikireader)
Oct 14 13:29:59 <jcc> DocScrutinizer: new channel?
Oct 14 13:30:43 <DocScrutinizer> hmm, kinda. yes
Oct 14 13:31:15 <DocScrutinizer> hi jc btw :-)
Oct 14 13:31:21 <CIA-44> openmoko: 03werner * r5691 10/trunk/gta02-core/docs/ecn/ (STATUS ecn0038.txt): 
Oct 14 13:31:21 <CIA-44> openmoko: - moved ECN0019 (Buzz fix) to "Done"
Oct 14 13:31:21 <CIA-44> openmoko: - reviewed ECN0038 (speaker EMI filter) and moved it to "Execute"
Oct 14 13:32:18 <PaulFertser> jcc: hey :) do you think it'd be nice we could Cc openmoko-kernel ML when submitting upstream patches so interested parties will see the status and discussions around that?
Oct 14 13:33:08 <jcc> PaulFertser: I think yes.
Oct 14 13:33:20 <DocScrutinizer> PaulFertser: hi! hehe your fav topic ;-P
Oct 14 13:34:03 <PaulFertser> jcc: but you know we can't do that, can we?
Oct 14 13:34:13 <jcc> PaulFertser: Should I go subscribe something use that e-mail address?
Oct 14 13:34:32 <PaulFertser> jcc: sorry?
Oct 14 13:34:33 <DocScrutinizer> PaulFertser: I think everybody registered with [kernel] actually can
Oct 14 13:35:26 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer: if we put Cc on upstream patches there's a high probability unregistered people will comment and face that ugly "awaiting moderation" messages and such.
Oct 14 13:35:34 <DocScrutinizer> PaulFertser: obviously not for the discussion though
Oct 14 13:35:44 <DocScrutinizer> yep
Oct 14 13:36:53 <jcc> PaulFertser: let me going in mailman first.
Oct 14 13:37:15 <DocScrutinizer> jcc: I think paul wants to ask you to enable anonymous posts to [kernel]
Oct 14 13:37:35 <jcc> haven't login that for a long long time. and I will let you know what is the setting on that one.
Oct 14 13:37:35 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer: and no linux kernel MLs work like that obviously, they all accept mails from everybody, sometimes with a bit of greylisting/silent moderation. But i'm yet to see a single spam message that passes SPF test so for now it seems that letting those mails that pass it is reasonable.
Oct 14 13:38:16 <PaulFertser> jcc: TIA
Oct 14 13:38:46 <DocScrutinizer> PaulFertser: I do no moderation of any of the OM lists. So I dunno about the actual amount of moderated mails
Oct 14 13:39:01 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer: i know :)
Oct 14 13:40:02 <jcc> PaulFertser: give me couple minutes to get the info.
Oct 14 13:40:08 <DocScrutinizer> for any moderator it should be easy to estimate how many mails will become "false accepts" if we change policy to anonymous posting enabled
Oct 14 13:40:33 <DocScrutinizer> (aka spam)
Oct 14 13:40:35 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer: not really. I propose enabling strict SPF checking first.
Oct 14 13:43:20 <jcc> PaulFertser: the problem is how much mail will pass the SPF check?
Oct 14 13:43:48 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * rd638a04abec1 10/libfsotransport/fsotransport/ (Makefile.am parser.vala): libfsotransport: add generic Parser class (from fsogsmd)
Oct 14 13:43:56 <DocScrutinizer> jcc: do you ask about false positives or false negatives?
Oct 14 13:44:36 <PaulFertser> jcc: if your legit mail doesn't pass SPF it means you should change your mail provider, just that. Sane devs should be able to do that easily.
Oct 14 13:46:13 <jcc> PaulFertser: like openmoko.org?  this seems no SPF record setting.  well, I am shooting myself.
Oct 14 13:49:14 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r1e0da4c1dacf 10/fsogsmd/ (5 files in 2 dirs): fsogsmd: catch up with parser moving to libfsotransport
Oct 14 13:50:43 <DocScrutinizer> jcc: I didn't dare to speak out loud, but that's been exactly my suspicion XD
Oct 14 13:53:09 <jcc> 90 mails(spammy) in last month
Oct 14 13:57:26 <jcc> PaulFertser: average 90 mails in moderated list every month.
Oct 14 13:59:57 <CIA-44> openmoko: 03werner * r5692 10/trunk/gta02-core/docs/ecn/ (STATUS ecn0010.txt): - reopened ECN0010 (as "Discuss") and added summary of power supply discussion
Oct 14 14:22:59 <DocScrutinizer-8> jcc: will you join 26C3 in Berlin, end of year?
Oct 14 14:26:40 <jcc> DocScrutinizer: low possiblilty to be there, why?
Oct 14 14:27:16 <DocScrutinizer-8> just curious
Oct 14 14:28:28 <jcc> DocScrutinizer-8: I would like to join that again.
Oct 14 15:05:23 <PaulFertser> jcc: how many of those 90 mails would pass SPF test?
Oct 14 15:10:19 <objorn> PaulFertser: i had to wait until today to purchase the phon
Oct 14 15:10:29 <objorn> what's the diff of gsm 850 and 900?
Oct 14 15:10:34 <PaulFertser> objorn: MAJOR
Oct 14 15:10:50 <PaulFertser> objorn: you need to buy the one that will work with your cellular carrier.
Oct 14 15:12:52 <objorn> thank you much, will keep you updated
Oct 14 15:43:22 <jcc> PaulFertser: about 0 will pass.
Oct 14 15:47:39 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * re5b50df81947 10/ (9 files in 4 dirs): libfsotransport: commandqueue moves to here, comes from fsogsmd
Oct 14 15:51:28 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r885f3b0859c6 10/libfsotransport/tests/ (Makefile.am testcommandqueue.vala): libfsotransport: add test for command queue
Oct 14 15:51:28 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * rf2fb7f79434a 10/fsogsmd/ (4 files in 2 dirs): fsogsmd: catch up with commandqueue moving to libfsotransport
Oct 14 15:53:55 <PaulFertser> jcc: exactly what i expected ;)
Oct 14 16:05:33 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07libeflvala * r5ef80503aaaa 10/vapi/elm.vapi: elm.vapi: catch up with Photocam API as per upstream rev 43072
Oct 14 16:17:06 <PBeck> hi
Oct 14 18:24:56 <freegurj> hi anyone now how to reboot FR without removing battery
Oct 14 18:25:41 <freegurj> my phone hangs often so i need to reboot it by removing battery
Oct 14 18:26:56 <beer> I know how to reboot it from qtmoko
Oct 14 18:27:49 <beer> press the right hardware button and then there will come som gui where you can reboot fr
Oct 14 18:27:51 <beer>  about the Openmoko, will they make a GTA03 now when the have made Plan B (The wikireader)
Oct 14 18:28:37 <SpeedEvil> beer: Unlikely.
Oct 14 18:28:49 <johnsu01> hmph we need a mute button on calls
Oct 14 18:29:02 <SpeedEvil> beer: To make GTA03 they'd need >$1M really. 
Oct 14 18:29:20 <beer> so the FR is still the best open phone this dayes?
Oct 14 18:29:32 <SpeedEvil> For the next week.
Oct 14 18:29:51 <SpeedEvil> FR is the most open phone - and is likely to be so for the immediate future.
Oct 14 18:30:05 <SpeedEvil> N900 - though shiny - has considerable closed portions.
Oct 14 18:32:59 <beer> with the n900 can I easly shift the OS out with another?
Oct 14 18:33:17 <SpeedEvil> No - there are some elements that are closed.
Oct 14 18:33:30 <SpeedEvil> It is very open compared to almost any other phone though.
Oct 14 18:33:39 <SpeedEvil> you get root, and can run your own programs for example.
Oct 14 18:34:16 <beer> also compared to those androids phone (magic, hero ets)?
Oct 14 18:37:17 <SpeedEvil> yes
Oct 14 18:37:28 <SpeedEvil> android - you can - basically only run java programs
Oct 14 18:39:44 <radekp> freegurj: if you hold the POWER button for 8s it will power off Freerunner - it's builtin function in kernel so it should work on every distro
Oct 14 18:42:17 <freegurj> eadekp: I see thanks
Oct 14 18:43:13 <freegurj> In linux there is alt+sysrq+r,e,i,s,u,b  I thout FR have something like that 
Oct 14 18:43:27 <SpeedEvil> If you plug in a USB keyboard :)
Oct 14 18:43:41 <freegurj> wellwell holding powe button is still ok for me
Oct 14 18:43:43 <panicking> you can use echo on the proc filesystem
Oct 14 18:44:26 <DocScrutinizer-8> SpeedEvil: are you sure magickeys is enabled?
Oct 14 18:44:38 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: no. 
Oct 14 18:45:02 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: and you'd need to turn on host mode and setup the keyb first anyway
Oct 14 18:45:15 <DocScrutinizer-8> lol, sure
Oct 14 18:45:42 <DocScrutinizer-8> btw the 8sec hard shutdown even is a hw function of PMU basically
Oct 14 18:46:17 <DocScrutinizer-8> zhough needs some bits of support from kernel
Oct 14 18:46:41 <DocScrutinizer-8> like enabling the bit in the right reg in PMU
Oct 14 18:57:23 <radekp> can anyone help me how can i see modem AT log in SHR?
Oct 14 19:17:27 <DocScrutinizer-8> mwester has a kernel patch for tty logger
Oct 14 19:17:50 <DocScrutinizer-8> otherwise you have /var/log/*.log only
Oct 14 19:17:56 <DocScrutinizer-8> afaik
Oct 14 19:32:01 <Blu3> freegurj, yes, FR can do that
Oct 14 19:32:40 <Blu3> but you need to echo 1 > ...
Oct 14 19:32:47 <Blu3> eg. how to forcibly reboot a linux server:
Oct 14 19:32:47 <Blu3>    Enable sysrq:
Oct 14 19:32:47 <Blu3>      echo 1 > /proc/sys/kernel/sysrq
Oct 14 19:32:47 <Blu3>      reboot:    echo b > /proc/sysrq-trigger
Oct 14 19:32:47 <Blu3>      poweroff:  echo o > /proc/sysrq-trigger
Oct 14 20:22:35 <zear> hey guys
Oct 14 20:23:08 <zear> say, is this channel in any way related to the newest creation from openmoko - the wikireader?
Oct 14 20:24:50 <max_posedon> #openmoko-wikireader
Oct 14 20:25:13 <zear> max_posedon, thank you
Oct 14 22:13:27 <CIA-44> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r7ef85123e3e2 10/fsogpsd/src/ (4 files in 2 dirs): fsogpsd: create channel
Oct 14 23:10:37 <objorn> trying to figure out how i would attach the device to something like this: http://www.fentek-ind.com/kbmwrusb.htm ...a portable keyboard
Oct 14 23:11:49 <SpeedEvil> You need a cable, and you plug it in
Oct 14 23:12:29 <objorn> SpeedEvil: brilliant!
Oct 14 23:12:43 <objorn> actually, i was trying to figure out how to make it more like...
Oct 14 23:13:29 <objorn> http://www.amazon.com/Stowaway-Ultra-Slim-Bluetooth-Blackberry-Handhelds/dp/B0002OKCXE/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=wireless&qid=1255561990&sr=1-1
Oct 14 23:13:42 <objorn> or one of the foldable keyboards with a docking bay for the particular phone
Oct 14 23:14:18 <objorn> maybe if i cut out a channel or whatever it's called and the make the device myself which slides into the keyboard
Oct 15 02:20:03 <objorn> how many bluetooth devices at once does the freerunner support?
Oct 15 02:25:08 <KenYoung> DocScrutinizer, I see you mentioned the N900 has been postponed until 10/30?   Did you find that online somewhere?   I've got one on pre-order, and I'm going nuts waiting for it.   Some rumors have the shipping date pushed to *December*.
Oct 15 02:31:34 <objorn> http://www.amazon.com/Flexible-Foldable-Resistant-WIRELESS-MULTIMEDIA/dp/B002BUEBJ8/ref=sr_1_23?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1255570952&sr=8-23 looks nice if it's a rigid foldable and not a flexible rollable
Oct 15 02:32:52 <objorn> was looking for something like http://www.amazon.com/HP-Foldable-Keyboard-for-Ipaq/dp/B000J4BPOC/ref=sr_1_34?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1255573116&sr=8-34
Oct 15 02:34:08 <raster> KenYoung: boo!
Oct 15 02:34:26 <KenYoung> raster, Boo?   Why?    
Oct 15 02:34:41 <raster> boo to n900 being delayed
Oct 15 02:34:59 <KenYoung> raster, Oh *that*.   I couldn't agree more.
Oct 15 02:35:42 <raster> :(
Oct 15 02:36:48 <KenYoung> raster, If it shows up in their brick-and-mortar shop before my order ships, I'm driving to New York to get one.
Oct 15 02:37:38 <raster> ahahhaahhaahahah
Oct 15 02:38:05 <KenYoung> Better to risk ending up with two than go an extra day without even one.
Oct 15 02:41:39 <objorn> the n900 isn't open hardware though :-(
Oct 15 02:42:17 <raster> does it matter?
Oct 15 02:42:32 <KenYoung> objorn, Yes, but what can you do.   OM will probably never make another phone.
Oct 15 02:42:43 <raster> om never will
Oct 15 02:43:03 <raster> om doesnt even do linux anymore
Oct 15 02:43:10 <objorn> what?
Oct 15 02:43:14 <objorn> how so
Oct 15 02:43:35 <raster> 1. they dont make any gta02's or 01's anymroe
Oct 15 02:43:47 <KenYoung> I hope someday some (former) insider writes a tell-all book about Openmoko.
Oct 15 02:43:51 <raster> they made stock are trying to sell off stock. they have no staff who do linux onboard anymore
Oct 15 02:43:55 <raster> in facthave almost no staff
Oct 15 02:44:50 <raster> the wikireader runs some microcontroller - the kind u find in microwaves
Oct 15 02:45:13 <raster> it isnt a real cpu with an mmu- it cant run linux. it doesnt. they use some custom minimal rtos that can run.
Oct 15 02:45:19 <raster> there is no "userspace" etc. on it
Oct 15 02:45:35 <raster> its probably not even as advanced as the original gameboy
Oct 15 02:45:46 <raster> it is a VERY simple device
Oct 15 02:45:47 <raster> VERY
Oct 15 02:45:47 <objorn> wowzers, that n900 is $750
Oct 15 02:46:10 <KenYoung> If they had included the magnetron with the wikireader, they'd have had something.
Oct 15 02:46:12 <raster> and i dont see a market for the wikireader at $99 if its is so primitive.
Oct 15 02:48:09 <raster> objorn: in $US its $645 i thought
Oct 15 02:48:17 <raster> tho they have removed the preorder option
Oct 15 02:49:05 <raster> thats quite cheap actually
Oct 15 02:49:15 <raster> most phones when new are about $700-$1200
Oct 15 02:49:17 <raster> or so
Oct 15 02:49:27 <raster> smartphones...
Oct 15 02:49:42 <KenYoung> raster, Nokia removed their pre-order?   I think Amazon still accepts them.
Oct 15 02:50:30 <raster> nokia has - all their sites
Oct 15 02:50:34 <raster> (well uk, de and usa)
Oct 15 02:50:47 <KenYoung> That's not good.....
Oct 15 02:51:19 <KenYoung> I'm going to have to stalk one of the guys who's written an early review.
Oct 15 02:51:37 <raster> wow
Oct 15 02:51:42 <raster> amazon.com is at $589
Oct 15 02:52:08 <raster> err $583
Oct 15 02:52:11 <raster> much better
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Oct 15 02:59:56 2009