**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Jan 09 02:59:57 2010
Jan 09 03:12:21 <rhaeder> 4:11am here, getting tired. gn8 all :) and naught101__: good luck with your FR->host routing :)
Jan 09 03:20:53 <naught101__> ok, thanks
Jan 09 03:37:08 <rhaeder> now my FR is messed up. :( one update...
Jan 09 03:37:48 <rhaeder> openSSH is not starting
Jan 09 03:39:43 <rhaeder> flashing again, SHR unstable is to very unstable and SHR testing is crashing/freezing in welcome wizard
Jan 09 03:43:34 <slaxxer> using the 20100103 shr testing?
Jan 09 03:47:51 <rhaeder> using unstable, recent update :)
Jan 09 03:48:10 <rhaeder> testing was freezing somewhere before or while welcome screen (language selection, I recall)
Jan 09 03:48:42 <rhaeder> because of initial package setup ("Configuring foo-package") was not yet finished
Jan 09 03:49:53 <rhaeder> is this http://build.shr-project.org/shr-unstable/images/om-gta02/full-om-gta02.jffs2 an alias to recent shr-*.rootfs.jffs2 file?
Jan 09 03:50:11 <rhaeder> or symlink :)
Jan 09 03:50:52 <rhaeder> I'm flashing now shr-full-eglibc-ipk--20100106-om-gta02.rootfs.jffs2
Jan 09 03:51:01 <rhaeder> let's see :)
Jan 09 04:03:59 <slaxxer> i tried to opkg upgrade an got nothing
Jan 09 04:05:13 <slaxxer> dictator needs to be fixed
Jan 09 04:05:27 <slaxxer> doom needs to be fixed
Jan 09 04:05:32 <rhaeder> the first thing I notices what that the bottom navigation has a lot more buttons and looks messed :(
Jan 09 04:05:52 <slaxxer> where/
Jan 09 04:05:54 <slaxxer> ?
Jan 09 04:06:09 <slaxxer> 4-5?
Jan 09 04:06:25 <rhaeder> start SHR and at the bottom of the screen you will see a navigation "Contact" "Foo" "Bar" or so
Jan 09 04:06:55 <rhaeder> when I update (and restarted) there where more buttons that 3, 6-8 or so
Jan 09 04:07:13 <slaxxer> other options lijke?'
Jan 09 04:07:14 <rhaeder> ok, flashed :)
Jan 09 04:07:45 <rhaeder> and the boot splash image got overprinted by boot messages
Jan 09 04:08:01 <rhaeder> but that is not so bad
Jan 09 04:09:40 <slaxxer> a phone log bar is needed for npw
Jan 09 04:09:58 <rhaeder> while first initial configuration of packages, the xserver got configured as well but also launched. can't you make it "pending for launch" or so?
Jan 09 04:10:07 <rhaeder> ?
Jan 09 04:11:11 <slaxxer> are there extra tabs at the bottom?
Jan 09 04:11:26 <rhaeder> ok, launching welcome wizard
Jan 09 04:11:32 <rhaeder> slaxxer: yes
Jan 09 04:11:41 <slaxxer> what they say?
Jan 09 04:11:53 <rhaeder> "Dialer", "Messages","???"
Jan 09 04:12:08 <rhaeder> welcome wizard launches faster than me typing :/
Jan 09 04:12:56 <slaxxer> theres only 3 right?//
Jan 09 04:13:02 <rhaeder> yes
Jan 09 04:13:04 <slaxxer> tabs
Jan 09 04:13:10 <rhaeder> but after the update I got 8 or so
Jan 09 04:13:31 <slaxxer> naaaa
Jan 09 04:13:38 <rhaeder> very small, no text readable. It looks very strong like a bug
Jan 09 04:13:53 <slaxxer> 06 unstable?
Jan 09 04:14:30 <rhaeder> shr-full-eglibc-ipk--20100106-om-gta02.rootfs.jffs2
Jan 09 04:35:09 <rhaeder> AAAHAHAHAHAHHAH!!!!
Jan 09 04:35:44 <rhaeder> again that auto-dim/auto-suspend bug :(
Jan 09 04:37:13 <rhaeder> and no response on "clicks" on the touch screen with my finger
Jan 09 04:38:10 <rhaeder> shot SHR to hell, garbage #failed
Jan 09 04:39:15 <hipitihop> anyone can give me a start on putting a desktop icon/command on shr-t ?
Jan 09 04:42:23 <rhaeder> hipitihop: /usr/share/applications/ :)
Jan 09 04:42:30 <rhaeder> strange path, but true
Jan 09 04:42:43 <rhaeder> I try now SHR-T before I switch back to paroli
Jan 09 04:43:05 <hipitihop> :-)
Jan 09 04:43:44 <hipitihop> rhaeder: how is paroli these days ?
Jan 09 04:44:01 <hipitihop> rhaeder: you running paroli on shr ?
Jan 09 04:46:02 <rhaeder> I have now SHR and ran paroli before. paroli is way slower that SHR but better stability
Jan 09 04:46:15 <rhaeder> at least an OpenSSH server is working :)
Jan 09 04:46:24 <hipitihop> qwhen you say stbaility what do you mean
Jan 09 04:47:11 <rhaeder> that, e.g. when I click with my stick on the touch screen, it will come back
Jan 09 04:47:19 <rhaeder> or that the desktop is working
Jan 09 04:49:56 <hipitihop> hmm, at the moment, I'm on shr-t and it is not unusual to have calls not even give an indication, caller goes streight to voice mail and no indication of missed call. I also find frequently the dialier just quits while establishing a call. To make things worse, inbound sms seems to have a delay but haven't quite put my finger on the symptoms
Jan 09 04:52:18 <rhaeder> paroli: call works, missing calls are recorded in log, contact works, SMS works :)
Jan 09 04:52:26 <rhaeder> maybe wifi isn't really stable
Jan 09 04:52:33 <rhaeder> but that's ok, compared to SHR-U :(
Jan 09 04:52:36 <rhaeder> :)
Jan 09 04:52:44 <rhaeder> SHR-U is faster, ok
Jan 09 04:53:00 <rhaeder> but lesser bug-free
Jan 09 04:54:01 <rhaeder> contact=contact book
Jan 09 04:54:06 <rhaeder> so better contacts ;)
Jan 09 04:54:18 <hipitihop> I thought I had tried paroli before, very minimalist but I liked it, but for the life of me I can't remember what I ran it on, I thought shr-u but but earlier version Aug ?
Jan 09 04:55:51 <rhaeder> I used the illume-paroli theme to have at least a desktop ;)
Jan 09 04:56:53 <rhaeder> also some dbus things are not working on SHR, but on paroli. like enabling Display (prevents auto-suspend) and Bluetooth
Jan 09 04:58:23 <rhaeder> and auto-dim/suspend is way to fast on SHR :/
Jan 09 04:58:35 <rhaeder> on paroli I have more time to react
Jan 09 05:07:12 <hipitihop> PaulFertser: you about ?
Jan 09 05:09:53 <hipitihop> rhaeder: doe this look correct to you ? "fso-raw -r WiFi -- wpa_supplicant -c /etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf"
Jan 09 05:10:11 <rhaeder> not sure
Jan 09 05:10:29 <hipitihop> I'm particularly concerned about the <space> between "--" and "wpa_supplicant"
Jan 09 05:19:18 <rhaeder> sry, don't know it. I use fsoraw, but not wpa
Jan 09 05:19:23 <rhaeder> nor wifi
Jan 09 05:21:20 <rhaeder> I hope someday, SHR will store the values setup in "Power" :(
Jan 09 05:43:51 <Undrwater> rhaeder: you can set the timeouts in a config file, where they will persist
Jan 09 05:44:07 <Undrwater> give me a sec, and i'll find that for you
Jan 09 05:45:18 <rhaeder> ok :D
Jan 09 05:50:32 <hipitihop> anyone know if maemo has made any progress on the fr ?
Jan 09 05:50:49 <Undrwater> rhaeder: /etc/phonefsod.conf
Jan 09 05:51:25 <Undrwater> rhaeder: that's timer for dimmer
Jan 09 05:51:32 <Undrwater> there's another for suspend
Jan 09 05:58:53 <Undrwater> rhaeder: having a hard time finding that file...
Jan 09 06:01:10 <Undrwater> rhaeder: it's /etc/frameworkd.conf
Jan 09 06:01:16 <Undrwater> rhaeder: under fsodevice.kernel_idle
Jan 09 06:01:40 <Undrwater> rhaeder: also check here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/SHR_User_Manual#Settings:_Power
Jan 09 08:31:24 <hipitihop> anyone know the path to gms handset state file on qtmoko ?
Jan 09 09:44:42 <Kamping_Kaiser> whats the recommended way of downloading all osm data? as raw trails, or post processed somehow?
Jan 09 12:30:09 <rhaeder> the file /etc/frameworkd.conf has very less comments. is there a wiki page available? e.g. fsodevice.kernel_idle, which are these values? seconds? thanks to Undrwater
Jan 09 12:32:48 <rhaeder> *what are these values for?
Jan 09 12:32:59 <rhaeder> last question fix
Jan 09 13:13:11 <rhaeder> again and the same with SHR-unstable :(
Jan 09 13:13:34 <rhaeder> screen turns black (auto-suspend), doesn't react on stick press or button press
Jan 09 13:13:51 <rhaeder> *with=like
Jan 09 13:14:02 <rhaeder> SSH daemon is not started
Jan 09 13:16:42 <rhaeder> I'm switching back to paroli
Jan 09 13:17:54 <PaulFertser> Hey, i edited Manually using Bluetooth page finally, hope the instructions now work for everybody.
Jan 09 15:17:28 <fredrin> how can i send sms from CLI? can some one give me a oneliner? 
Jan 09 15:32:25 <PaulFertser> fredrin: you know about FSO api specs, right?
Jan 09 15:34:11 <playya_> fredrin, there's cli-framework
Jan 09 15:34:17 <playya_> an interactive shell
Jan 09 15:45:39 <supermagnum> http://www.msextra.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=131&t=34596
Jan 09 16:01:59 <fredrin> PaulFertser: more or less, but can't someone paste me the oneliner
Jan 09 16:02:01 <fredrin> make use of the wonders of Linux
Jan 09 16:02:11 <lindi-> fredrin: it's not linux that does this :)
Jan 09 16:02:32 <fredrin> jeje, i know, but windows dont have fancy oneliners in the same way as linux does 
Jan 09 16:02:33 <lindi-> fredrin: it's quite unfortunate that there are no cli commands for sending sms indeed
Jan 09 16:03:01 <PaulFertser> lindi-: there's a well documented api that allows that, what's the problem?
Jan 09 16:03:04 <fredrin> I've got birthday today and need to send out mass sms'es about a party, and the Neo Fails when i try to add many contacts 
Jan 09 16:03:08 <fredrin> easier to make a script 
Jan 09 16:03:13 <lindi-> PaulFertser: api is for programmers
Jan 09 16:03:19 <PaulFertser> lindi-: i can't agree
Jan 09 16:03:26 <fredrin> PaulFertser: i need to do it now and i can't spend time on it
Jan 09 16:03:47 <PaulFertser> fredrin: so you want somebody else to spend that 5 minutes for you?
Jan 09 16:03:48 <fredrin> i can make it work, but i hoped that some one could have a oneliner that thay could share 
Jan 09 16:04:02 <fredrin> PaulFertser: share is caring, but you got to ask for it 
Jan 09 16:04:16 <fredrin> sharing is careing :D 
Jan 09 16:04:22 <lindi-> PaulFertser: and the documentation is not in a man page
Jan 09 16:04:22 <fredrin> imho
Jan 09 16:04:53 <PaulFertser> lindi-: yes, but debian still doesn't have a policy to require man pages for cli-usable apis.
Jan 09 16:04:54 <fredrin> jeje, worth a try anyway
Jan 09 16:05:05 <fredrin> i'll use a workaround with skype, but it cost more 
Jan 09 16:05:05 <lindi-> PaulFertser: but i do :)
Jan 09 16:05:47 <fredrin> lindi-: :D
Jan 09 16:06:14 * PaulFertser thought sending a message through sms with FSO is a matter of using mdbus to introspect for 2 minutes and then just doing that.
Jan 09 16:08:12 <lindi-> PaulFertser: mdbus does not have a manual page either? ;)
Jan 09 16:08:47 <PaulFertser> lindi-: well, dbus-send has one but i bet any user will find mdbus 10x friendlier ;)
Jan 09 16:09:48 <lindi-> PaulFertser: hmm, did introspection work as non-root?
Jan 09 16:10:24 <PaulFertser> lindi-: no idea :(
Jan 09 16:11:47 <lindi-> and we have no manual page to tell :P
Jan 09 16:12:16 <lindi-> (I could use the manual page on my PC easily as non-root)
Jan 09 16:15:51 <Defiant-> lindi-: congratulations for -O2
Jan 09 16:16:02 <lindi-> Defiant-: -O2 where?
Jan 09 16:16:09 <Defiant-> lindi-: your optimazations
Jan 09 16:16:19 <lindi-> Defiant-: hmm, which ones?
Jan 09 16:16:30 <lindi-> (are you confusing them to gena's?)
Jan 09 16:16:36 <Defiant-> optimizations, the kernel config
Jan 09 16:16:44 <lindi-> Defiant-: thank gena
Jan 09 16:17:48 <Defiant-> lindi-: oops, only watched for the mail author
Jan 09 16:27:52 <DocScrutinizer51> fredrin: http://git.freesmartphone.org/?p=specs.git;a=blob_plain;f=html/org.freesmartphone.GSM.SMS.html;hb=HEAD#SendMessage
Jan 09 16:30:19 <DocScrutinizer51> PaulFertser: actually I had to confess I'm as clueless wrt mdbus calls as fredrin seems to be. Maybe even more. Missing examples in doc.fso.org are a pita, as is general lacking of manpages
Jan 09 16:30:52 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer51: yes, examples would be nice to have
Jan 09 16:31:53 <DocScrutinizer51> PaulFertser: see above URL. A nice 3-liner in either shellscript or python would go a long way
Jan 09 16:32:11 <DocScrutinizer51> for a real life example how to use
Jan 09 16:32:42 <DocScrutinizer51> mickeyl: ^!
Jan 09 16:33:22 <DocScrutinizer51> mickeyl: all those examples would concat for a nice testsuite 
Jan 09 16:34:38 <DocScrutinizer51> mickeyl: we had that issue with resource allocation / resource-available signal before
Jan 09 16:35:37 <mickeyl> lindi-: feel free to convert the wiki page i wrote into a man page
Jan 09 16:36:18 <mickeyl> (mdbus)
Jan 09 16:37:08 <mickeyl> DocScrutinizer51: yes, there's quite a bunch of stuff in frameworkd/tests
Jan 09 16:37:30 <mickeyl> unfortunately it's somewhat complicated to write some tests due to the async nature
Jan 09 16:37:40 <DocScrutinizer51> ouch
Jan 09 16:39:16 <mickeyl> and things like sending yourself an SMS, check whether what you received has the same contents as what you sent would even cost money
Jan 09 16:39:33 <mickeyl> (unless you operate your own BSC)
Jan 09 16:41:11 <DocScrutinizer51> yup. but a automated unittest should do that nevertheless
Jan 09 16:41:57 <mickeyl> yep
Jan 09 16:42:23 <DocScrutinizer51> anyway my main concern is to have real code examples in the docs
Jan 09 16:43:25 <DocScrutinizer51> U know I'm a c+p coder largely
Jan 09 16:43:44 <DocScrutinizer51> ;-;
Jan 09 16:43:50 <DocScrutinizer51> )
Jan 09 16:43:56 <mickeyl> yeah, more code would be fine, but...
Jan 09 16:43:58 <mickeyl> what language
Jan 09 16:44:47 <mickeyl> python or vala
Jan 09 16:44:51 <mickeyl> C is madness wrt. dbus
Jan 09 16:45:01 <DocScrutinizer51> as I said prolly pythonn just fine
Jan 09 16:46:08 <DocScrutinizer51> or shellscript where feasible
Jan 09 16:46:53 <DocScrutinizer51> so' always shellscript. maybe calling python ;-P
Jan 09 16:48:08 <DocScrutinizer51> prepare for roaming noise ;-)
Jan 09 17:07:00 <pespin> mickeyl, which is the state of efl vala bindings? I mean if they are complete enough to write some app with e_dbus + elementary in vala
Jan 09 17:07:42 <pespin> if they are I might have a look at vala :)
Jan 09 17:17:52 <mickeyl> pespin: yes, and no
Jan 09 17:17:52 <mickeyl> you can't use edbus
Jan 09 17:17:54 <mickeyl> but you don't need to 
Jan 09 17:18:05 <mickeyl> thanks to unified mainloop, you can use glib dbus 
Jan 09 17:18:12 <mickeyl> which is supported nicely by Vala
Jan 09 17:18:55 <pespin> mickeyl, ok :)
Jan 09 17:19:43 <pespin> mickey|bbl, where do you recommend me to get compiler and efl libs?
Jan 09 19:02:29 <PaulFertser> lindi-: i know you're good at testing :) How to reproduce a crash on my laptop that i suspect is related to video driver? I already know about x11perf and piglit.
Jan 09 19:26:31 <Guest79631> hi all
Jan 09 19:27:13 <Guest79631> i tried to upgrade my SHR-U a few days ago, but now it does not boot anymore...
Jan 09 19:27:50 <Guest79631> I would like to recover the data (contacts, sms etc.), any idea on how to do this?
Jan 09 19:27:51 <JaMa> Guest79631: please read shr-devel first
Jan 09 19:28:01 <JaMa> Guest79631: you can repair whole system
Jan 09 19:31:57 <Guest79631> JaMa: do you mean the thread with title: [Shr-Devel] HeadsUp! Read this before opkg upgrade ?
Jan 09 19:34:22 <JaMa> Guest79631: yes
Jan 09 19:34:54 <JaMa> Guest79631: where is your broken distro on NAND or uSD?
Jan 09 19:35:11 <JaMa> Guest79631: do you have some other distro on neo?
Jan 09 19:35:12 <Guest79631> NAND
Jan 09 19:35:19 <Guest79631> no
Jan 09 19:35:39 <JaMa> ah and do you have some uSD?
Jan 09 19:35:44 <Guest79631> yes
Jan 09 19:36:09 <JaMa> then it would be easiest to install something on uSD from your computer, boot from uSD and fix it from there
Jan 09 19:36:24 <Guest79631> actually, that is what I tried
Jan 09 19:36:35 <JaMa> Guest79631: first opkg install -force-reinstall sysvinit
Jan 09 19:36:36 <Guest79631> I tried to install Hackable1
Jan 09 19:36:39 <JaMa> then reboot to nand
Jan 09 19:36:50 <JaMa> and use workaround from ML
Jan 09 19:37:40 <JaMa> or just opkg update && opkg upgrade && opkg install -force-reinstall busybox should fix it
Jan 09 19:38:11 <Guest79631> but, if I manage to boot from uSD will opkg then fix the NAND?
Jan 09 19:38:39 <JaMa> read what I wrote again :)
Jan 09 19:38:56 <JaMa> 20:36:36 < JaMa> then reboot to nand
Jan 09 19:39:07 <JaMa> ah sorry first step
Jan 09 19:39:19 <Guest79631> sorry, i will first read it precisely before I come back...
Jan 09 19:39:20 <JaMa> if you have it mounted as /media/nand or whatever
Jan 09 19:39:35 <JaMa> then you can use chroot /media/nand
Jan 09 19:39:39 <JaMa> and fix it from there
Jan 09 19:39:53 <Guest79631> ok
Jan 09 19:40:04 <Guest79631> I understand this...
Jan 09 19:40:34 <Guest79631> what do you advice to install on the NAND? SHR-T?
Jan 09 19:42:56 <JaMa> Guest79631: is you have any problem with it then replace first step with "cd /media/nand; ln -sf /sbin/init.sysvinit /sbin/init;
Jan 09 19:43:29 <JaMa> Guest79631: I never used SHR-T but if you don't want lots of upgrades then its probably better choice then SHR-U
Jan 09 19:45:05 <Guest79631> ok thanks for your info, I will first install SHR-U on NAND and then try to fix it as suggested by you.
Jan 09 19:46:12 <JaMa> Guest79631: no :) the fix was for fixing your existing image :)
Jan 09 19:46:35 <JaMa> no need to reflash because of this issue
Jan 09 19:47:12 <PaulFertser> JaMa: it's mad funny how he intepreted your words
Jan 09 19:47:19 <PaulFertser> Guest79631: no offense meant
Jan 09 19:48:01 <JaMa> PaulFertser: sometimes I have feeling that my English is really bad :)
Jan 09 19:48:40 <PaulFertser> JaMa: i've never had a feeling like that about you :)
Jan 09 19:49:31 <JaMa> but it takes so much words to describe even quite simple issue ..
Jan 09 19:49:46 <JaMa> I must do something wrong with my words
Jan 09 19:50:45 <JaMa> PaulFertser: and yes you had :P in that dfu_error e-mail.. but well I didn't understand myself later too :)
Jan 09 19:51:09 <PaulFertser> JaMa: it's rather lack of understanding. For other people it's obvious that to fix a broken NAND rootfs one should just boot from uSD and chroot there.
Jan 09 19:51:25 <PaulFertser> But for some it's not that obvious, unfortunately.
Jan 09 19:56:33 <Guest79631> JaMa: indeed, it was not obvious for me that I had to boot from uSD and chroot to NAND, thas's why I did not understand your email.
Jan 09 19:56:59 <Guest79631> JaMa: your English is perfectly fine for me
Jan 09 20:07:01 <lindi-> PaulFertser: xtrace?
Jan 09 20:07:21 <PaulFertser> lindi-: i can't reproduce the crash in the first place
Jan 09 20:07:28 <PaulFertser> lindi-: it just happens "randomly".
Jan 09 20:07:31 <lindi-> PaulFertser: well you run everything under xtrace :)
Jan 09 20:07:57 <PaulFertser> lindi-: and save logs syncing all the time? heh, probably that's a solution. Thanks for the hint.
Jan 09 20:07:58 <lindi-> (xtrace acts as a proxy X server)
Jan 09 20:08:39 <lindi-> PaulFertser: does it crash X or something more?
Jan 09 20:10:11 <PaulFertser> lindi-: well, until i switched to KMS it crashed only X (after that GPU was in an inoperable state, so restarting X was impossible). After i switch to KMS (with 2.6.32 kernel and intel driver doesn't support non-KMS anyway anymore) i think i could ping the laptop but couldn't ssh in.
Jan 09 20:10:43 <lindi-> PaulFertser: if ping works you can use netconsole
Jan 09 20:12:28 <PaulFertser> lindi-: well, probably so.
Jan 09 20:13:09 <lindi-> PaulFertser: but that is of course only good for reporting a bug. not reproducing it
Jan 09 20:13:39 <PaulFertser> lindi-: indeed. Moreover probably even netconsole doesn't help if all userspace is not working. Ping will work nevertheless.
Jan 09 20:13:49 <PaulFertser> regardless
Jan 09 20:13:52 <lindi-> PaulFertser: netconsole is kernel stuff?
Jan 09 20:14:31 <PaulFertser> lindi-: well, the one i used to debug boot problems (failing to compile in the appropriate hdd controller module) was kernel level :)
Jan 09 20:15:01 <PaulFertser> lindi-: but when the userspace doesn't work all i can hope is to get kernel messages over that.
Jan 09 20:17:10 <PaulFertser> lindi-: anyway, thanks for the hints :)
Jan 10 00:58:15 <Guest22909> Jama: thanks again, at least my FreeRunner is booting again.
Jan 10 01:17:41 <PaulFertser> It'd be interesting to know if he reflashed or had actually followed Jama's advice.
Jan 10 01:17:44 <PaulFertser> :)
Jan 10 01:43:54 <mjr> OM mention: http://www.gpf-comics.com/
Jan 10 01:45:38 * tim_abell has insomnia thanks to a head full of ideas for the neo 
Jan 10 01:46:01 <CVirus> tim_abell: spare me some for my bachelor project :-D
Jan 10 01:46:53 <tim_abell> lol 
Jan 10 01:47:45 <tim_abell> finish PodPooch for me ?!
Jan 10 01:48:08 <CVirus> link ?
Jan 10 01:48:16 <tim_abell> :-D
Jan 10 01:48:23 <CVirus> got it http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/PodPooch
Jan 10 01:49:29 <CVirus> i'm not sure if one of my professors would approve that :-D
Jan 10 01:49:40 <tim_abell> that would have taken me a while to type on the fr keyboard !
Jan 10 01:50:22 <tim_abell> how about mesh networking then 
Jan 10 01:50:35 <tim_abell> always a winner 
Jan 10 01:51:14 <tim_abell> or zigbee home automation 
Jan 10 01:52:01 <tim_abell> what's your subject?
Jan 10 01:52:14 <CVirus> I'm thinking or proposing something
Jan 10 01:52:38 <CVirus> there is another guy working on home automation and zigbee already
Jan 10 01:52:57 <CVirus> thinking of*
Jan 10 01:53:56 <tim_abell> sorry i meant your degree subject . computer science i presume 
Jan 10 01:54:15 <CVirus> oh yeah
Jan 10 01:55:06 <tim_abell> i did cybernetics and control engineering at reading uni 
Jan 10 01:55:28 <CVirus> nice
Jan 10 01:58:31 <CVirus> I really want something that is software engineering related
Jan 10 01:58:38 <CVirus> but can't think of any thing so far
Jan 10 01:59:29 <SpeedEvil> I'm wondering about using my neo1973 for a microwave oven controller.
Jan 10 01:59:55 <tim_abell> new os that is more appropriate to the platform than linux ?
Jan 10 02:00:10 <SpeedEvil> That's a hell of a lot of work.
Jan 10 02:00:25 <SpeedEvil> Also - the FR and neo1973 are quite large enough for linux.
Jan 10 02:00:31 <SpeedEvil> there isn't any real problem there.
Jan 10 02:00:35 <tim_abell> lol ;-)
Jan 10 02:02:27 <tim_abell> control an rc car with the accelerometers ?
Jan 10 02:02:47 <tim_abell> would be fun 
Jan 10 02:02:49 * SpeedEvil has no accels.
Jan 10 02:03:04 <CVirus> hehe .. that's nice
Jan 10 02:03:36 <CVirus> implemented http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdMVS1jIwrE
Jan 10 02:05:59 <CVirus> this is going to be too much of hardware work if I'll implement it for the Neo
Jan 10 02:06:14 <CVirus> i have no experience with RC cars
Jan 10 02:06:32 <CVirus> I'll need interface with its controllers and so
Jan 10 02:06:33 <CVirus> hmm
Jan 10 02:06:37 <CVirus> need to*
Jan 10 02:06:46 <SpeedEvil> generally you simply apply PWM to a servo
Jan 10 02:06:50 <SpeedEvil> 50ms period
Jan 10 02:07:20 <SpeedEvil> 0.2ms high = left/low-throttle/backwards, 1.2ms high = right/high-throttle/forwards
Jan 10 02:07:27 <CVirus> hmm
Jan 10 02:07:42 <SpeedEvil> so you need maybe 2 servos for a typical car, or up to 6 for some helis or planes.
Jan 10 02:07:54 <CVirus> nice
Jan 10 02:08:18 <SpeedEvil> And you can read servo outputs from the reciever module similarly.
Jan 10 02:08:26 <CVirus> and a bluetooth module
Jan 10 02:08:32 <SpeedEvil> there exist also usb-servo drivers
Jan 10 02:08:40 <SpeedEvil> for the robotics crowd
Jan 10 02:10:55 <CVirus> SpeedEvil: got more ideas for a bachelor project ?
Jan 10 02:11:11 <SpeedEvil> CVirus: get married?
Jan 10 02:11:17 <CVirus> LOL
Jan 10 02:11:24 <CVirus> I have a gf already
Jan 10 02:11:59 <SpeedEvil> Not really. Depends what field you're in really.
Jan 10 02:12:59 <CVirus> i'm into software engineering
Jan 10 02:13:03 <CVirus> I love software engineering
Jan 10 02:13:57 * SpeedEvil is currently poking round inside of n900 kernel. Fun.
Jan 10 02:14:07 <SpeedEvil> Or annoying, I haven't decided yet.
Jan 10 02:14:22 <SpeedEvil> And wishing I could take it apart to solder crap to it.
Jan 10 02:14:51 <CVirus> hehe
Jan 10 02:15:21 <SpeedEvil> I want a compass and a gyro.
Jan 10 02:16:01 <SpeedEvil> For the neo - I have a lovely big stainless steel featureful microwave - with a broken controller. 
Jan 10 02:16:28 <SpeedEvil> With some smarts it could do interesting things like boil off water at a preset rate
Jan 10 02:16:52 <SpeedEvil> Keeping the humidity in the output air constant
Jan 10 02:21:20 <tim_abell> thanks for the chat , eh
Jan 10 02:22:12 <tim_abell> think i'll be able to sleep now 
Jan 10 02:22:21 <tim_abell> zzz 
Jan 10 02:22:32 <tim_abell> laters 
Jan 10 02:22:50 <tim_abell> and good luck 
Jan 10 02:23:13 <tim_abell> let me know what you choose 
Jan 10 02:23:21 <SpeedEvil> night!
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Jan 10 02:59:56 2010