**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Mar 29 02:59:57 2010
Mar 29 06:47:26 <brolin_empey> Why are usb_mode and hostmode missing from sysfs on QtMoko v18? (fail)
Mar 29 06:57:58 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: hi
Mar 29 06:58:17 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: can you tell me the kernel version you're using, and also if it's "nodebug" kernel or not?
Mar 29 06:58:30 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: your letter didn't specify this most important info, unfortunately.
Mar 29 07:34:33 <raster> burrp
Mar 29 07:34:51 <nullix> cheers
Mar 29 07:40:08 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: 2.6.32, how do I know if it is nodebug?
Mar 29 07:41:39 <JaMa> brolin_empey: if you mean 2.6.32 built in shr buildhost, it's "nodebug"
Mar 29 07:42:13 <JaMa> brolin_empey: you can check kernel config "modprobe configs; zcat /proc/config.gz | grep -i DEBUG"
Mar 29 07:43:32 <brolin_empey> JaMa: it is from QtMoko v18, not SHR.
Mar 29 07:45:42 <brolin_empey> JaMa: "FATAL: module configs not found."
Mar 29 07:47:45 <PaulFertser> JaMa: it's you who should know about the usb host/device controls in recent kernels btw
Mar 29 07:48:55 <brolin_empey> JaMa: same for "config" instead of "configs".
Mar 29 07:50:13 <JaMa> PaulFertser: why me? because of pushing 2.6.32 as new default SHR kernel? or because of using it (I used usb only for eth@usb)..
Mar 29 07:50:45 <JaMa> brolin_empey: sorry don't know about QtMoko kernel config
Mar 29 07:51:10 <JaMa> brolin_empey: maybe is configs already included in kernel (not as module) -> /proc/config.gz would exist
Mar 29 07:51:33 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: I think I did not mention which kernel I am using because it is part of radekp's QtMoko v18 images, so presumably everyone who uses QtMoko v18 uses the same kernel unless they build their own, but why would they need to if radekp's kernel is properly configured?
Mar 29 07:51:56 <PaulFertser> JaMa: yeah
Mar 29 07:52:43 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: i do not think any of the folks interested in low-level stuff are using QtMoko
Mar 29 07:53:28 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: to me it looks like usb host control is not implemented in .32 yet.
Mar 29 07:53:47 <brolin_empey> JaMa: there is no /proc/conf* :(
Mar 29 07:54:05 <PaulFertser> In fact i was a bit demotivated to work on .32 because it didn't properly suspend/resume so i couldn't use it on a daily basis.
Mar 29 07:54:26 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: ask radekp why he disabled that option, it's usually useful.
Mar 29 07:54:52 <PaulFertser> JaMa: i mean i thought you might know something because i know you're using it.
Mar 29 07:54:59 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: radekp is not answering my e-mails. (fail)
Mar 29 07:55:43 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: I do not even receive MDNs, so I do not even know if he is reading my e-mails. :(
Mar 29 07:55:44 <PaulFertser> I took a look at gta02_devices_pmu_children and it doesn't list the device that should control power for usb host, so i guess it's reasonable to assume it's just nobody did that already.
Mar 29 07:57:31 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: mdn? i do not think it's reasonable to assume all the servers in chain support sendmail's way of delivery confirmation.
Mar 29 07:58:50 <PaulFertser> But that is called "dsn".
Mar 29 07:58:59 <Wonka> DSNs are... not supported by everything
Mar 29 07:59:20 <PaulFertser> Wonka: but sendmail?
Mar 29 07:59:33 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: No, I mean I have requested an MDN on e-mails sent personally (off-list) to radekp, but I have not received any MDNs from radekp.
Mar 29 07:59:45 <Wonka> PaulFertser: does support it, if new enough, but can be configured off, iirc
Mar 29 07:59:59 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: probably he's just busy and haven't read that yet, or his mua doesn't support the feature.
Mar 29 08:00:54 <Wonka> when my Thunderbird at work asks if it should send a "has been read" notification, I only swear there's no "remember" checkbox and hit "no"
Mar 29 08:01:38 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: I mean MDN, not DSN.  I frequently request MDNs, but do not think I have ever requested a DSN.
Mar 29 08:01:46 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: got it
Mar 29 08:03:18 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: please, next time when you're reporting a kernel-related issue, specify the version exactly. Just in case. And btw, i do not think you'll be happy with n900, it's too constrained and runs ancient kernel.
Mar 29 08:03:38 <brolin_empey> Wonka: Thunderbird does not need a "remember" checkbox because you can configure it to always ignore MDN requests.  The default config is to always ask.  I know because I have used Thunderbird for years, after Mozilla Mail, after Netscape Messenger. :)
Mar 29 08:04:31 <Wonka> oh, didn't find that yet then
Mar 29 08:05:45 <brolin_empey> Most of my colleagues who use a real (= desktop application) MUA instead of crappy Web mail use Thunderbird too.  Thunderbird is my favourite MUA. :)
Mar 29 08:06:12 <JaMa> PaulFertser: suspend/resume is quite reliable here now (after Weiss's fix for WSOD during resume with DRM kernel)
Mar 29 08:06:19 <PaulFertser> Wonka: i'm not suprired it's hard to find any useful settings in that bloated counter-inuitive piece of software, same goes about firefox obviously.
Mar 29 08:06:37 <brolin_empey> I mean at work.  Some use other MUAs at home.
Mar 29 08:06:43 <PaulFertser> JaMa: it's good to hear, probably i should finally switch...
Mar 29 08:07:55 <PaulFertser> JaMa: anything i'll be desperately missing? Phone functionality? And btw, i remember larsc wanted to get rid of all in-kernel drivers that only touch regulators/gpio to switch devices on/off. What happened with that idea? How is e.g. gsm modem controlled nowadays?
Mar 29 08:08:24 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: Sorry, I was in rant mode (Really?  Can you tell? ;)) when I wrote my e-mail.
Mar 29 08:08:58 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: That is also why I did not break it into separate paragraphs. (fail)
Mar 29 08:09:15 <JaMa> PaulFertser: not sure how debian userspace is ready for .32, for SHR we have script adjusting few configs/alsa states to make it compatible with .32
Mar 29 08:09:46 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: i'm sure you'll success with at least breaking into paragraphs then next time, np
Mar 29 08:10:11 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: Define "ancient kernel".  I was still using 2.6.29 on QtMoko v14.
Mar 29 08:10:11 <PaulFertser> JaMa: heh, that's not exactly what i was asking about ;)
Mar 29 08:10:21 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: .28
Mar 29 08:10:22 <JaMa> PaulFertser: but it's still not out-of-the-box phone functionality (hopefully in next week or so there will be fso already using new configs and phonefsod/phoneuid adjusted too)
Mar 29 08:10:58 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: and many non-free components, starting with telephony, pulseaudio plugin etc etc. It's not nearly as flexible. And also you have no hope to get usb host on it.
Mar 29 08:11:36 <PaulFertser> JaMa: in fact i'm considering compiling natively all recent framework+shr on my FR but i'm afraid it'll be too much work :(
Mar 29 08:11:45 <JaMa> PaulFertser: and modem power I'm not sure, fso has rfkill plugin, and I remember that mickey asked larsc to have that option for every driver..
Mar 29 08:12:08 <PaulFertser> JaMa: i'm strongly opposed to rfkill now :|
Mar 29 08:12:19 <JaMa> why?
Mar 29 08:12:20 <PaulFertser> JaMa: useless subsystem, only to confuse users. 
Mar 29 08:12:32 <PaulFertser> JaMa: and abusing it for power control won't bring much good imho.
Mar 29 08:13:19 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: The MDN policy is easy for me to find in Thunderbird's Account Settings, but I also frequently set up Thunderbird for people at work, so maybe I am too familiar with it. ;)
Mar 29 08:13:20 <PaulFertser> JaMa: you've no idea how many problems were due to even properly working rfkill support, not mentioning driver bugs when it wasn't working. So many hours of developers and end-users wasted, for a really useless stuff.
Mar 29 08:13:20 <JaMa> ah.. IIRC mickey sort of liked it.. 
Mar 29 08:13:32 <PaulFertser> JaMa: it shouldn't have existed in the first place, since it's really pointless.
Mar 29 08:13:47 <PaulFertser> JaMa: you know how is PM is supposed to be done with modern wifi drivers?
Mar 29 08:14:32 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: i'd always prefer something more tweakable and also something that can run in a GNU Screen session.
Mar 29 08:16:02 <PaulFertser> JaMa: the official notion is: when all "VIFs" (virtual interfaces) of a particular hardware are "down" (ip l s wlanX down), it should be brought to the least consuming state.
Mar 29 08:16:13 <PaulFertser> JaMa: that's sane and reasonable.
Mar 29 08:17:10 <PaulFertser> JaMa: if you want a sane solution for a serial attached devices, the only "real" option is a dedicated line discipline, i'd say. Probably it can be written to be generic enough to accomodate various devices and call PM hooks.
Mar 29 08:17:20 <PaulFertser> JaMa: that would be reasonable thing to do in fact.
Mar 29 08:17:29 <PaulFertser> JaMa: hm, probably i should try to spend time on that.
Mar 29 08:19:30 <JaMa> Ah, but still some unified interface for PM is better than random sysfs nodes for controling devices, isn't it? So you can improve the implementation with same API?
Mar 29 08:19:47 <PaulFertser> JaMa: rfkill is not an interface for PM.
Mar 29 08:19:48 <JaMa> PaulFertser: or do you see the API wrong and not fixable?
Mar 29 08:20:16 <JaMa> then I should clearly read something about rfkill first :)
Mar 29 08:20:22 <PaulFertser> JaMa: i think the idea of rfkill is pointless, and that is something that is the cause for all other things.
Mar 29 08:20:39 <PaulFertser> JaMa: i've read the official page in documentation many times. I found no sense in it tbh ;)
Mar 29 08:22:07 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: .28 is probably still sufficiently recent for me.  I already knew the N900 lacks USB Host support;  I can probably live without it.  I know the N900 has many non-free components;  they do not bother me as long as they work.  I know it can make upgrading the kernel difficult without Nokia's support, though.  Why would I prefer Windows 7 over Linux (Ubuntu) on my PC if non-free components bothered me? ;)
Mar 29 08:23:19 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: my Linux PC at home is still running Ubuntu v8.04, which uses .24. :P
Mar 29 08:25:53 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: I was afraid .32 lacked USB mode control.  This situation is completely my fault, though, because I did not properly back up my QtMoko v14 installation by saving a NAND image I could have restored after I discovered QtMoko v18 is unusable. (epic fail)
Mar 29 08:41:31 <brolin_empey> radekp: Why did you not enable /proc/config.gz support in QtMoko v18's kernel? :(
Mar 29 08:42:13 <radekp> brolin_empey: i just took config from lars
Mar 29 08:42:20 <radekp> brolin_empey: btw have wifi fixed now
Mar 29 08:42:38 <radekp> brolin_empey: i can upload newer kernel if you want to try
Mar 29 08:43:30 <brolin_empey> radekp: Does that imply you read (redd) my FR unusability rant? :)
Mar 29 08:43:47 <radekp> yup, just minute ago
Mar 29 08:44:21 <radekp> but my wife is ill and i have to take care of two childeren, so sorry there is not much time...
Mar 29 08:45:44 <brolin_empey> radekp: I am surprised you are married with children (I assume they are your children?). :) 
Mar 29 08:46:08 <radekp> yup they are - i hope :)
Mar 29 08:46:44 <radekp> btw the kernel config is git
Mar 29 08:47:03 <brolin_empey> radekp: Are they QTs (cuties)? ;)
Mar 29 08:47:23 <radekp> sure :)
Mar 29 08:48:19 <brolin_empey> radekp: Did you read the e-mails I sent to you personally?  I forgot what they were about, though. :P
Mar 29 08:48:46 <radekp> brolin_empey: i think you wanted me to try on windows 7
Mar 29 08:49:00 <radekp> brolin_empey: i think i will be able to try it now
Mar 29 08:49:16 <brolin_empey> radekp: Yes, that is correct. :)
Mar 29 08:50:32 <brolin_empey> radekp: Yes, I definitely want the kernel with working WLAN since WLAN seems to be my only hope for being able to ssh into QtMoko v18.
Mar 29 08:51:47 <radekp> brolin_empey: there was problem that wifi driver sometimes failed to initialize
Mar 29 08:52:28 <radekp> brolin_empey: i applied patch from openmoko bug tracker and tested it - booted like 40times and same number of suspends and it was always ok
Mar 29 08:52:52 <radekp> brolin_empey: before it failed like 1 of 3 boots
Mar 29 08:56:00 <radekp> brolin_empey: http://activationrecord.net/radekp/pub/uImage-v18.1.bin
Mar 29 08:56:08 <radekp> brolin_empey: should be with fixed wlan
Mar 29 09:00:04 <Gabrys> in which shr package qmake resides?
Mar 29 09:01:52 <Gabrys> i've installed almost all qt4 packages, but qmake is not present :/
Mar 29 09:05:51 <brolin_empey> radekp: Thanks, let me try it.
Mar 29 09:06:35 <radekp> i will try windows 7 now ;)
Mar 29 09:06:57 <brolin_empey> radekp: Do you use QtMoko for your own FreeRunner (I mean as a daily phone, not just for testing.)?
Mar 29 09:07:19 <brolin_empey> :(
Mar 29 09:17:40 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: i guess he rebooted to test win7 ;)
Mar 29 09:18:34 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: Yes, I figured. ;)
Mar 29 09:30:05 <radekp> brolin_empey: hmm no luck on windows 7
Mar 29 09:30:34 <radekp> brolin_empey: it does not want to take rndis.inf - i have no idea why, i used to work on XP
Mar 29 09:31:35 <brolin_empey> radekp: Did you try Neo1973.inf from the Openmoko wiki?
Mar 29 09:31:44 <radekp> yes
Mar 29 09:32:08 <radekp> brolin_empey: i saw a few inf files on internet - but they are for win7 64bit - i have just 32bit
Mar 29 09:32:34 <brolin_empey> radekp: Is your Windows 7 (US) English?
Mar 29 09:32:43 <radekp> yes
Mar 29 09:33:15 <radekp> although it was talking to me sometimes in some arabic or hebrew language ;-)
Mar 29 09:33:44 <brolin_empey> OK, so same as me.  I thought maybe you had a localised version because you are in Europe.  I have Win7 Pro 32-bit.
Mar 29 09:34:00 <PaulFertser> radekp: i think windows has some log file where it outputs details about inf installation, you might get some hints there
Mar 29 09:35:07 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: can you try this: http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/en/w7itprohardware/thread/8586f612-d96e-4fde-8533-8aa1ffdaa8ce
Mar 29 09:35:35 <brolin_empey> radekp: Do you use QtMoko for your own FreeRunner (I mean as a daily phone, not just for testing.)?
Mar 29 09:35:37 <PaulFertser> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobile/en-us/downloads/microsoft/device-center-download.mspx
Mar 29 09:36:31 <radekp> brolin_empey: daily phone
Mar 29 09:38:12 <brolin_empey> radekp: Good, so you /do/ eat your own dog food! ;)
Mar 29 09:38:12 <PaulFertser> It looks like ms decided to rip out the generic rndis driver. Well, who cares, those fuckers are insane :/
Mar 29 09:39:27 <brolin_empey> radekp: Coincidentally, I use my FreeRunner with Fido in Canada. :)
Mar 29 09:39:30 <PaulFertser> radekp: (wifi patch from the ticket) i'm a bit reluctant to push it to the repo because the issue is not investigated thouroughly, i hope someone will come with a more convincing solution.
Mar 29 09:39:46 <radekp> PaulFertser: i was happy when i could press the "Power off" windows button :-)
Mar 29 09:40:16 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: can you try installing that update to see if rndis driver appears?
Mar 29 09:40:36 <brolin_empey> Coincidentally, Fido in Canada = FIC = First International Computer. ;)
Mar 29 09:40:43 <radekp> PaulFertser: yup, i am now applying it manually before compiling kernel - IMO it belongs to the "dirty hacks" category
Mar 29 09:42:17 <PaulFertser> radekp: well, probably it doesn't, as an idea that device needs some time to initialise right after powering on is sensible. Probably i should really make it an option so lindi can make some extensive testing with various values, after that we can assume it works.
Mar 29 09:43:24 <radekp> PaulFertser: but the delay can be depended on actual kernel config and other factors
Mar 29 09:43:42 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: RNDIS already worked for me with Win7 + QtMoko v14, but not with QtMoko v18.
Mar 29 09:43:56 <radekp> PaulFertser: e.g. on 2.6.32 it has been 100% working with 10ms for me
Mar 29 09:45:36 <PaulFertser> radekp: then probably we should put it to workqueue (to not slow down resume of other parts) and use a bigger delay.
Mar 29 09:46:25 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: "not working" is too vague. radekp said he had problems installing .inf and described it in enough detail for me to find out Win7 lacks generic RNDIS driver in default installation.
Mar 29 09:46:31 <brolin_empey> radekp: I flashed uImage-v18.1.bin, but the WLAN behaviour did not appear to change. :(
Mar 29 09:46:52 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: have you read my mail about "reliable wifi"?
Mar 29 09:47:09 <radekp> PaulFertser: yes the idea with workqueue and bigger delay sounds good
Mar 29 09:48:11 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: On the community mailing list?  Yes, weeks ago, but I forgot what it said.
Mar 29 09:48:57 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: it said use wpa_supplicant directly and report the results
Mar 29 09:49:11 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: Then how did RNDIS work for me with Win7 + whichever .inf file I used + QtMoko v14?
Mar 29 09:49:43 <radekp> brolin_empey: i think the USB networking in win7 could be because i dont have CONFIG_USB_NET_RNDIS_HOST compiled for v18
Mar 29 09:49:50 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: probably you did some reinstall/reconfiguration or something, and i've no idea how it doesn't work now...
Mar 29 09:51:39 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: wpa_supplicant appears to work for me, but "# udhcpc eth0" never gets a DHCP lease.
Mar 29 09:52:37 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: have you tried the maxperf trick?
Mar 29 09:53:03 <brolin_empey> Fox_Muldr: My e-mail address was fmulder@hotmail.com in 1999, when I was 12. :)
Mar 29 09:54:06 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: No, I do not think so.
Mar 29 09:55:34 <PaulFertser> Also i'd expect more oddities with wifi on "nodebug" kernel because the driver is extremely racy :/
Mar 29 09:57:32 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: racy = has many race conditions?
Mar 29 09:57:34 <PaulFertser> radekp: yeah, looks like this option is needed to work with windows in general, not just win7.
Mar 29 09:58:07 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: yes, i think the driver was written by a person that has only approximate understanding of race conditions and methods to prevent them.
Mar 29 09:58:14 <PaulFertser> To put it mildly
Mar 29 09:59:15 * brolin_empey really needs to go to bed because it is almost 03:00 and I have to be at my place of employment by 09:30. (fail)
Mar 29 09:59:16 <radekp> brolin_empey: i have enabled USB_NET_RNDIS_HOST http://activationrecord.net/radekp/pub/uImage-v18.2.bin
Mar 29 09:59:22 <radekp> brolin_empey: if you want to try
Mar 29 09:59:36 * radekp has to go to lunch now :)
Mar 29 10:04:04 <brolin_empey> radekp: OK, thanks.  I will test it after I sleep.
Mar 29 10:05:25 <brolin_empey> radekp: Can you make a release checklist for QtMoko to prevent mistakes such as missing kernel config options?
Mar 29 10:10:20 <brolin_empey> [brolin@brolin-V13] [0] [2] ~/
Mar 29 10:10:21 <brolin_empey> $ dfu-util -a kernel -R -D c:/Users/brolin/Downloads/uImage-v18.2.bin
Mar 29 10:35:31 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: btw, i usually sleep after work, so i can stay awake in the late evening, i do not think it's exactly fail.
Mar 29 10:39:24 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: The fail is my lack of self-control.  If I indefinitely continue deferring my bedtime, I end up staying up all night and getting no sleep, which I know from far too much experience does not work well for me.
Mar 29 10:40:33 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: i doubt getting no sleep works well for anybody :) So yes, better go to sleep right after testing this new kernel.
Mar 29 10:40:36 <PaulFertser> :)
Mar 29 10:46:18 <brolin_empey> PaulFertser: that thread is from "Monday, January 12, 2009", which is before Win7 final was released.  Maybe Microsoft removed the generic RNDIS driver during Win7's development, then added it again before the final release?
Mar 29 10:46:51 <PaulFertser> brolin_empey: no idea, and in fact i do not care much...
Mar 29 10:59:06 <brolin_empey> Bedtime for Brolin™!
Mar 29 18:10:03 <badcloud> does latest shr-t always take two boots until gsm registers?
Mar 29 18:11:55 <tomcatek> mine registers every time
Mar 29 18:13:54 <badcloud> tomcatek: ummm, k... thanks
Mar 29 18:16:05 <brolin_empey> radekp: I flashed uImage-v18.2.bin, but my RNDIS still does not work:  there is nothing about USB networking in dmesg on QtMoko.  Win7 says "USB device not recognized: A USB device attached to this computer has malfunctioned, and Windows does not recognize it." and does not create the Neo Connection. :(
Mar 29 18:16:34 <badcloud> also, I'm having a bitch of a time trying to input text into a new contact
Mar 29 18:16:43 <badcloud> and http://www.shr-project.org/trac/ticket/1020 is not helping
Mar 29 18:17:36 <brolin_empey> radekp: I checked my FR's USB socket too:  it is still OK, so it is not a hardware problem like last time. ;)
Mar 29 18:18:56 <radekp> brolin_empey: can be something with 2.6.32 kernel, could you try it with qtmoko v19?
Mar 29 18:19:11 <radekp> brolin_empey: it uses 2.6.29 kernel (same as in v14)
Mar 29 18:19:27 <badcloud> anyone know what I'm missing here?
Mar 29 18:19:43 <Gabrys> anyone tried 2.6.32 on openmoko any distribution BTW?
Mar 29 18:20:14 <Gabrys> it would be interesting to see if BFS scheduler works much better on it :-)
Mar 29 18:21:21 <badcloud> nm, I'll come back later
Mar 29 18:21:47 <brolin_empey> Gabrys: Yes, me:  QtMoko v18 uses 2.6.32. ;)
Mar 29 18:22:10 <Gabrys> and v19 falls back to .29? ;-)
Mar 29 18:22:28 <Gabrys> brolin_empey: how it qtmoko, I was going to try it
Mar 29 18:22:35 <Gabrys> I mean is it usable?
Mar 29 18:23:23 <brolin_empey> radekp: Does QtMoko v19 have the same incoming SMS workaround as v18?  That was one of my most important reasons for upgrading QtMoko.
Mar 29 18:24:07 <brolin_empey> Gabrys: v19 was released before v18. ;)
Mar 29 18:24:54 <Gabrys> brolin_empey: aaah, how I could have not though about it
Mar 29 18:24:59 <Gabrys> :D
Mar 29 18:26:01 <brolin_empey> Gabrys: Yes, it is definitely usable:  it is the best distro I have tried.  I do not know why SHR is still more popular than QtMoko. :(
Mar 29 18:26:31 <Gabrys> maybe it's just looking better, lol
Mar 29 18:26:48 <Gabrys> brolin_empey: what about graphical choosing wifi networks and entering WPA keys?
Mar 29 18:26:51 <Gabrys> in qtmoko?
Mar 29 18:28:03 <brolin_empey> Gabrys: Actually, the WLAN almost never works for me in QtMoko.  I forgot about that "issue". (fail)
Mar 29 18:28:27 <Gabrys> brolin_empey: even with hand-editing wpa_supplicant.conf?
Mar 29 18:29:41 <brolin_empey> Gabrys: wpa_supplicant appears to work when I run it on QtMoko v18, but udhcpc never gets a DHCP lease.
Mar 29 18:29:53 <Gabrys> argh :(
Mar 29 18:30:20 <Gabrys> I'm going to try qtmoko anyway ;-)
Mar 29 18:30:42 <brolin_empey> Gabrys: Maybe the WLAN actually works on QtMoko v19, though.
Mar 29 18:30:56 <Gabrys> I wonder I could compile Arora for it
Mar 29 18:31:08 <Gabrys> it's QtWebkit based
Mar 29 18:31:25 <Gabrys> and I wonder if it gets better performance on Qt rather than on X11
Mar 29 18:32:01 <brolin_empey> Gabrys: QtMoko v18 includes Arora in the base installation.  I forgot if v19 includes it, but if not, you can add it without building it yourself.
Mar 29 18:32:08 <Gabrys> I mean, in QtMoko, Qt writes directly to framebuffor
Mar 29 18:32:24 <Gabrys> ha, but I want to compile MY arora ;-)
Mar 29 18:32:36 <Gabrys> I mean, I have a little mod of Arora ;-)
Mar 29 18:32:52 <Gabrys> I'm compiling it on hackable:1 now
Mar 29 18:34:18 * brolin_empey (peeks and) pokes radekp.
Mar 29 18:35:00 <brolin_empey> ***radekp segfaults. ;)
Mar 29 18:35:56 <brolin_empey> Now that I think about it, I cannot remember seeing a segfault on my FR!
Mar 29 19:09:43 <brolin_empey> Wow, I seem to have somehow really killed the conversation! ;)
Mar 29 19:11:15 * brolin_empey will download QtMoko v19 while he waits for radekp to reply.
Mar 29 19:22:16 <TomaszD> qtmoko v18 works great here, even with WPA2, all configured via GUI
Mar 29 19:24:58 <Gabrys> TomaszD: nice
Mar 29 19:25:28 <TomaszD> it's the only usable distribution I've found
Mar 29 19:27:22 * brolin_empey wonders if he can flash uImage-v19.bin and extract /lib/modules/ from the QtMoko v19 tarball to his QtMoko v18 installation instead of having to reflash QtMoko v19 to NAND.
Mar 29 19:27:24 <radekp> brolin_empey: sorry was away
Mar 29 19:28:00 <radekp> brolin_empey: v18 will not work with v19 kernel
Mar 29 19:28:24 <brolin_empey> radekp: You were away?  Really?  I never would have guessed! ;)
Mar 29 19:30:58 <brolin_empey> radekp: Have you compared the kernel configs for v14 (or v19?) and v18 to see if something else is missing for RNDIS support in v18?
Mar 29 19:31:29 <radekp> brolin_empey: v14 and v19-debug should be the same
Mar 29 19:31:57 <radekp> brolin_empey: v18 was probably made from sratch - i took it from larsc
Mar 29 19:33:05 <radekp> brolin_empey: v18 supports just basic hardware - we should go through packaging config in andy-tracking and enable back all the modules
Mar 29 19:35:01 <brolin_empey> radekp: Does QtMoko v19 have the same incoming SMS workaround as v18?  That was one of my most important reasons for upgrading QtMoko.
Mar 29 19:35:22 <radekp> brolin_empey: yes
Mar 29 19:40:45 <brolin_empey> radekp: Is QtMoko supposed to be able to set the clock from GSM?  That has not worked for me for months, so I have to manually set it in the QtEI GUI or use ntpdate-debian.
Mar 29 19:41:56 <radekp> brolin_empey: i tried it too, but IIRC it didnt work, but you can set time using NeronGPS
Mar 29 19:42:24 <brolin_empey> radekp: It is annoying, though, because the FR's RTC is reset every time I remove the battery, which is required to access the SIM + microSD cards.
Mar 29 19:43:32 <radekp> brolin_empey: yup aggree
Mar 29 19:45:16 <brolin_empey> radekp: it is also impossible to change the QtEI input method from Phone Keys (I think?) in the date selector, so I have to e.g., open a contact, then choose Text to change the input method to Docked Keyboard before I can enter the year in the date selector to set the date. (fail)
Mar 29 19:46:26 <radekp> brolin_empey: sure, but i have like 5 hours/week for QtMoko - it's impossible to do it all in this time :(
Mar 29 19:46:57 <brolin_empey> radekp: Is there any chance you can make QtEI's input method persistent so I do not have to change it to Docked Keyboard every time I boot or restart QtEI?
Mar 29 19:47:41 <radekp> brolin_empey: these are good idea, but my time is too limited :( You can put them in bug tracker
Mar 29 19:47:59 <radekp> brolin_empey: when i have time i can implement it or someone else can :)
Mar 29 19:48:11 <brolin_empey> radekp: Have you seen how many QtMoko bugs I have reported? :P
Mar 29 19:48:57 <brolin_empey> radekp: I already reported that bug. :)
Mar 29 19:48:57 <radekp> yup, i know, great work
Mar 29 19:49:26 <radekp> i hate Qtmoko input methods myself, but dont have time to fix it...
Mar 29 19:50:26 <brolin_empey> radekp: Do you have a (paid) job too?  I am guessing it is something computer related.
Mar 29 19:50:59 <radekp> yup
Mar 29 19:51:50 <radekp> i used to had quite a lot of spare time at job, but now it's awful
Mar 29 19:52:03 <brolin_empey> radekp: What is your job?  I guess I could try Googling your name, but it is easier to ask you here. ;)
Mar 29 19:53:22 <radekp> we have new people - and i have to check and help them with their work, we have old people - they are getting demented and cant remeber anything - i have to help them, and i have boss which is now totaly crazy - unable to estimate any task - he gives you two days for something that takes 10
Mar 29 19:54:24 * radekp is doing software for ticket issueing on czech railways and selling food on czech airlines
Mar 29 19:56:44 * brolin_empey has never been to Europe, but apparently I look Czech to at least one person.
Mar 29 19:59:22 <Martix> brolin_empey: now two :-)
Mar 29 19:59:52 <brolin_empey> http://www.flickr.com/photos/brolin_empey/sets/72157623558304899/
Mar 29 20:00:54 <Martix> btw. http://www.openmobility.cz conference will be on 24 April :-)
Mar 29 20:01:49 * radekp has to prepare his papers :)
Mar 29 20:02:23 <brolin_empey> Martix: Did you Google me to find photos of me? :)
Mar 29 20:02:54 <Martix> brolin_empey: no, why you asking?
Mar 29 20:04:32 * brolin_empey hates crappy TN LCD panels. :(
Mar 29 20:06:08 <brolin_empey> Martix: Then how do you know I look Czech?  I assume you found photos of me.
Mar 29 20:07:02 <Martix> brolin_empey: no, I misunderstand
Mar 29 20:07:59 <Martix> I thought, you was talking about radekp :-)
Mar 29 20:11:21 <brolin_empey> Martix: Here is me 9 days ago: http://www.flickr.com/photos/brolin_empey/4459494306/sizes/l/
Mar 29 20:18:57 <brolin_empey> Martix: Do I look Czech? :)
Mar 29 20:20:49 <Martix> maybe
Mar 29 20:26:16 <brolin_empey> Fossi: I guess you are not the FOSI of Windows warez fame (or notoriety)? ;)
Mar 29 20:26:51 <Fossi> nope
Mar 29 20:45:42 * brolin_empey is flashing uImage-v19-nodebug.bin
Mar 29 20:50:17 * brolin_empey is flashing qtmoko-debian-v19.jffs2
Mar 29 22:25:48 <badcloud> is there a guide for giving the fr a factory reset (or something similar) using the debug board? I just got the board in the mail and have *no* idea how to use it
Mar 29 22:27:07 <badcloud> or otherwise, could someone take a gander at my last dmesg output?
Mar 30 00:27:49 <noxchat_tester> hola desde el FR
Mar 30 00:53:48 <Slaxxed> xfhzgn
Mar 30 01:04:18 <DocScrutinizer> ~ping
Mar 30 01:10:18 <Slaxxed> d
Mar 30 01:33:21 <DocScrutinizer> ~flashing
Mar 30 01:33:22 <apt> i heard flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware
Mar 30 01:36:10 <DocScrutinizer> ~#openmoko xxx is yyy
Mar 30 01:36:12 <apt> okay, DocScrutinizer
Mar 30 01:36:15 <DocScrutinizer> ~xxx
Mar 30 01:36:16 <apt> well, xxx is yyy
Mar 30 01:42:36 <DocScrutinizer> ~no, #openmoko xxx is yyyXXX
Mar 30 01:43:05 <DocScrutinizer> apt: ??
Mar 30 01:43:18 <DocScrutinizer> ~botsnack
Mar 30 01:43:18 <apt> DocScrutinizer: :)
Mar 30 01:43:36 <DocScrutinizer> ~#openmoko xxx is yyyXXX
Mar 30 01:43:38 <apt> ...but #openmoko xxx is already something else...
Mar 30 01:43:44 <DocScrutinizer> ~no, #openmoko xxx is yyyXXX
Mar 30 01:44:06 <DocScrutinizer> ~forget #openmoko xxx
Mar 30 01:44:06 <apt> i forgot #openmoko xxx, DocScrutinizer
Mar 30 01:44:13 <DocScrutinizer> ~#openmoko xxx is yyyXXX
Mar 30 01:44:14 <apt> okay, DocScrutinizer
Mar 30 01:44:50 <DocScrutinizer> ~xxx
Mar 30 01:44:51 <apt> well, xxx is yyyXXX
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Mar 30 02:59:57 2010