**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Sep 12 02:59:57 2010
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Sep 12 04:52:32 2010
Sep 12 09:15:14 <PBeck> hi
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Sep 12 11:57:28 2010
Sep 12 12:03:17 <PBeck> re
Sep 12 12:28:00 <ThibG> hm, what would cause my FR to boot itself in the middle of the night...?
Sep 12 12:28:10 <PBeck> ghosts
Sep 12 12:28:26 <PBeck> ghost of the first mobile handset pioneer in 1973
Sep 12 12:32:33 <gena2x> ThibG: usb supply toggle
Sep 12 12:32:52 <gena2x> ThibG: or alternatively spirit of DocScrutinizer 
Sep 12 12:33:23 <DocScrutinizer> who summoned me??? (with low voice and a cloud of sulfur)
Sep 12 12:34:00 <ThibG> unplugged
Sep 12 12:34:33 <DocScrutinizer> a kernel panic?
Sep 12 12:34:45 <DocScrutinizer> low battery?
Sep 12 12:34:54 <DocScrutinizer> static electricity?
Sep 12 12:35:24 <DocScrutinizer> some weird madness in any of the founding system components?
Sep 12 12:35:29 <Defiant> low battery forces a wakeup?
Sep 12 12:35:47 <ThibG> story: I run QtMoko from NAND, power off my FR before sleeping
Sep 12 12:35:56 <ThibG> try to sleep, actually manage to sleep
Sep 12 12:35:57 <DocScrutinizer> err yep should wake up from suspend to shutdown cleanly :-D
Sep 12 12:35:59 <ThibG> wake up
Sep 12 12:36:19 <gena2x> my 2cent idea: while you powering off, it is not really power off
Sep 12 12:36:29 <ThibG> and find my FR booted on my µSD system
Sep 12 12:36:34 <gena2x> may be sometimes
Sep 12 12:37:08 <gena2x> so you see black screen, but battery still charging
Sep 12 12:37:29 <gena2x> so - my idea unfinished shutdown
Sep 12 12:37:41 <DocScrutinizer> umm, FR shouldn't do this. This is a maemo invention
Sep 12 12:38:15 <DocScrutinizer> on FR shutdown should really mean shutdown
Sep 12 12:38:44 <ThibG> one thing is that my µSD system isn't configured to suspend, so, maybe I can run uptime next time, to see when it waked up...?
Sep 12 12:38:53 <DocScrutinizer> and actually FR hw should charge just fine when shutdown
Sep 12 12:40:01 <gena2x> ThibG: hang camera over it :)
Sep 12 12:40:09 <DocScrutinizer> another possible scenario is mains blackout: FR runns from battery, discharges, dies, and on mains return boots up again
Sep 12 12:40:40 <gena2x> ah
Sep 12 12:40:45 <gena2x> one more possibility
Sep 12 12:40:49 <ThibG> mains?
Sep 12 12:41:02 <DocScrutinizer> ThibG: install decent syslog, with *MARK* every 5 min ;-D
Sep 12 12:41:12 <gena2x> you waked up and booted it :)
Sep 12 12:41:37 <ThibG> hm, DocScrutinizer not a bad idea
Sep 12 12:41:40 <gena2x> camera will help in this case too
Sep 12 12:41:43 <ThibG> I should have logs...
Sep 12 12:41:52 <DocScrutinizer> syslog file (usually /var/lg/messages) should tell you the whole story
Sep 12 12:43:43 <ThibG> the whole story? I don't think so
Sep 12 12:43:54 <DocScrutinizer> but actually I've seen FR boot up and reboot out of thin air occasionally (actually one or 2 times)
Sep 12 12:44:16 <ThibG> it happened two times in the middle of the night
Sep 12 12:45:06 <gena2x> i saw sudden reboots, but only then wdt is on
Sep 12 12:45:17 <gena2x> ThibG: ah, rtcwake!
Sep 12 12:45:17 <DocScrutinizer> :nod:
Sep 12 12:45:32 <DocScrutinizer> rtcwake shouldn't cause reboots
Sep 12 12:45:32 <gena2x> alarms and etc
Sep 12 12:45:44 <ThibG> I think it's rtcwake...
Sep 12 12:45:49 <ThibG> just checked out syslog
Sep 12 12:46:03 <gena2x> DocScrutinizer: i am about ThibG situation - he told about shutdown
Sep 12 12:46:08 <ThibG> the first syslog entry is at 0206
Sep 12 12:46:18 <ThibG> each time
Sep 12 12:46:19 <DocScrutinizer> why should system shutdown on rtcwake?
Sep 12 12:46:30 <ThibG> no, no
Sep 12 12:46:35 <ThibG> my system is already shut down
Sep 12 12:46:37 <ThibG> and wakes up
Sep 12 12:46:40 <DocScrutinizer> ooh
Sep 12 12:46:58 <DocScrutinizer> yes ofcourse, that's obviously hwclock then 
Sep 12 12:47:03 <DocScrutinizer> RTC
Sep 12 12:47:45 <gena2x> eh, so nice mistery
Sep 12 12:47:46 <DocScrutinizer> somebody might have set a recurring daily alarm @ 02:05
Sep 12 12:47:51 <gena2x> demistified...
Sep 12 12:48:20 <DocScrutinizer> RTC hw stores up, even over boot and short main bat removal
Sep 12 12:48:53 <gena2x> if you didn't desolder your backup battery
Sep 12 12:49:27 <DocScrutinizer> or remove main battery >60s and are one of the 95% with a borked backup bat ;-P
Sep 12 12:50:11 <ThibG> hm, and how do you check the hardware clock settings and remove it?
Sep 12 12:50:30 <gena2x> qtmoko has alarm settings
Sep 12 12:50:36 <DocScrutinizer> e.g ffalarms should use rtc
Sep 12 12:50:45 <SpeedEvil> 0206 is 127 minutes after midnight
Sep 12 12:50:56 <SpeedEvil> or maybe 128
Sep 12 12:50:57 <DocScrutinizer> also there are linux cmdline tools 
Sep 12 12:51:04 <gena2x> UTC +2 is default timezone in qtmoko
Sep 12 12:51:11 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: nice catch
Sep 12 12:51:17 <SpeedEvil> Or that
Sep 12 12:52:12 <gena2x> something not really excellent with alarm in qtmoko, so you may find bugs.
Sep 12 12:52:26 <DocScrutinizer> rtcwake (8)          - enter a system sleep state until specified wakeup time
Sep 12 12:52:36 <gena2x> DocScrutinizer: yes, sorry
Sep 12 12:53:02 <gena2x> hm.
Sep 12 12:53:24 <gena2x> bad idea
Sep 12 12:53:33 <gena2x> can it boot on rtc?
Sep 12 12:56:10 <gena2x> i think yes, if it can wake on rtc?
Sep 12 12:56:23 <gena2x> but is this implemented?
Sep 12 12:57:34 <gena2x> or back to camera idea :)
Sep 12 12:59:33 <ThibG> set an alarm in QtMoko and powered off my FR...
Sep 12 13:01:32 <ThibG> my FR is booting!
Sep 12 13:03:07 <gena2x> nice
Sep 12 13:03:21 <gena2x> i didn't thought about this.
Sep 12 14:10:09 <DocScrutinizer> told ya ffalarms does 
Sep 12 14:10:29 <DocScrutinizer> it's been tested to work since day 1 iirc
Sep 12 14:10:51 <DocScrutinizer> that's what fsoatd is all about afaik
Sep 12 14:11:50 <gena2x> DocScrutinizer: ok, i didn't use it as it is only in shr
Sep 12 14:12:12 <DocScrutinizer> I see, your discretion :-)
Sep 12 14:41:11 <viric> Hello all
Sep 12 14:41:45 <viric> I think I'm a bit pushed to buying a phone, and wanting most freedom on software/hardware, I'm thinking about buying a Neo FreeRunner
Sep 12 14:42:58 <viric> is there anything I should know about it?
Sep 12 14:43:03 <viric> (anything bad)
Sep 12 21:40:32 <Gabrys> hi guys
Sep 12 21:40:41 <Gabrys> I've done a new browser for SHR unstable 
Sep 12 21:40:57 <Gabrys> opkg install http://ffbrowser.com/ffbrowser-latest.ipk
Sep 12 21:41:13 <Gabrys> it's more or less working, but some things just doesn't work yet
Sep 12 21:41:17 <Gabrys> please try anyways
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Sep 13 02:59:57 2010