**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jul 06 02:59:57 2011 Jul 06 13:23:58 Hi, I have two quick questions about the Freerunner. We can use fingers on the touch screen instead of the digitizer pen right? And if I were to use a digitizer pen, will any kind do? Jul 06 13:27:34 gkwhc, you can touch it with anything Jul 06 13:27:36 anything will do Jul 06 13:28:00 zear: ok thanks! Jul 06 13:28:06 i personally don't like to use fingers because it leaves fingerprints and on the disto i use everything's so tiny i prefer to use a stylus instead Jul 06 13:28:18 but fingers naturally work Jul 06 13:28:40 it also doesn't have a multitouch, in case you're wondering Jul 06 13:28:45 i wonder how tiny it is compared to other phones Jul 06 13:29:06 gkwhc, it's quite bulky, but fits to the pocket Jul 06 13:30:12 zear: yeah thats my otheer concern on getting a freerunner..plus the tiny screen/font Jul 06 13:30:16 what i dislike about the design is the screen is kind of "sunked" into the screen Jul 06 13:30:26 which means, it's about 3-4mm below the case level Jul 06 13:30:38 ah right Jul 06 13:30:50 so it's hard to touch near the edges of the screen if you use your fingers to type Jul 06 13:31:19 yeah Jul 06 13:32:13 *sunken :P Jul 06 13:32:21 zear: what are other pros you like about freerunner? Jul 06 13:32:50 zear: *sunk :) Jul 06 13:32:59 Kamping_Kaiser, ;P Jul 06 13:33:12 gkwhc, i don't really like it tbh Jul 06 13:33:21 i like how it runs linux Jul 06 13:33:22 (: Jul 06 13:33:30 but that's pretty much all Jul 06 13:33:36 i see Jul 06 13:33:38 the fps is low Jul 06 13:33:45 about 1-2fps in 480x640 mode Jul 06 13:33:54 oh Jul 06 13:33:56 but that's a hardware issue Jul 06 13:34:09 so you can't really fix that Jul 06 13:34:25 there are no real drivers for the gpu Jul 06 13:34:52 hmm Jul 06 13:34:54 it can make calls and send sms, but that's what a $10 phone can do as well Jul 06 13:35:51 oh yeah how is the texting? is it fast? and does it need a digi pen? Jul 06 13:36:01 depends on the software Jul 06 13:36:11 what's a digi pen, btw? A stylus? Jul 06 13:36:46 for example, the distro i use is SHR and it has a very tiny on-screen keyboard Jul 06 13:36:47 er yeah Jul 06 13:36:57 oh okay Jul 06 13:37:05 but you can install other on-screen keyboards Jul 06 13:37:08 or even write your own one ;) Jul 06 13:37:23 nice Jul 06 13:37:57 i prefer to have something that works, is easy to use, and very configurable/customizable/hackable Jul 06 13:38:19 freerunner matches only the last one Jul 06 13:38:26 yeah thats whati thought too Jul 06 13:38:36 there are distros that are easy to use Jul 06 13:38:38 like qtmoko Jul 06 13:38:43 but they don't run on X11 Jul 06 13:38:54 so 90% of software written for the freerunner won't work with it Jul 06 13:39:21 gkwhc, also, freerunner boot time is sloow Jul 06 13:39:31 a couple of minutes Jul 06 13:39:36 WHAT?! Jul 06 13:39:56 well, it has to boot the whole operating system, deamons and stuff Jul 06 13:40:48 gkwhc, i'd say you ask some other guys here though, i'm pretty much only familiar with the SHR distro Jul 06 13:40:55 maybe some other distros are more usable/faster Jul 06 13:41:24 i see Jul 06 13:42:00 i am still debating whether I should get one or not. its priced fairly high for a phone thats only hackable Jul 06 13:45:19 i just got one for 50EUR few days ago Jul 06 13:45:39 a second one that is, the one i bought at the release day was quite expensive ;) Jul 06 13:48:21 the one im looking at in the US is $100 Jul 06 13:48:24 used Jul 06 13:50:41 that's still a fair price i guess Jul 06 13:51:31 about 70EUR Jul 06 13:52:25 although, freerunner is slow and it doesn't have any fancy 3d apps like android or iphone Jul 06 13:52:36 so if you decide to buy it, you have to remember about that Jul 06 13:52:59 and a basic linux knowledge is recommended Jul 06 13:53:04 okay. im not much of a gamer, so not having 3d is fine Jul 06 13:53:05 if only to flash the firmware Jul 06 13:53:44 i wonder if itt could let me hack the low level stuff, like the microprocessor, etc Jul 06 13:53:48 i personally use it for a good 3 years as a phone + gps device Jul 06 13:53:51 and it works well as that Jul 06 13:54:16 gkwhc, it can let you do as much, as a desktop linux does Jul 06 13:54:35 thats good Jul 06 13:55:05 besides the cpu architecture (x86 vs arm), it's like a normal desktop linux Jul 06 13:55:26 and you even have a usb host for plugging external devices Jul 06 13:55:37 haha yeah Jul 06 14:04:49 I just found out it has a 2.5mm stereo jack, not the popular 3.5mm Jul 06 14:06:20 ah yea, and it doesn't really work tbh ;) Jul 06 14:06:43 lol would you please clarify? Jul 06 14:07:11 like, i think (i might be wrong) that the channels are switched and in the headphones where the left and right channels should be, left and microphone are, or something among these lines Jul 06 14:07:44 oh Jul 06 14:07:48 because the music plays for both channels only if i plug the headhones half the way in (so only the first 2 "pins" touch) Jul 06 14:08:02 interesting Jul 06 14:08:07 but maybe that's something wrong with my freerunner/headphones Jul 06 14:08:25 have you looked up any bugs on that? Jul 06 14:08:45 not really, since i have a separate device for music listening ;) Jul 06 14:08:57 mhm Jul 06 14:09:25 and it doesn't mute the speakers by the hardware when you plug the headphones in Jul 06 14:09:36 so it's up to the system to detect the headphones and mutethe speakers Jul 06 14:09:49 i see Jul 06 14:10:13 so there's a chance sometimes the system might not mute them for some reason Jul 06 14:10:36 yeah Jul 06 14:10:37 or perhaps some systems don't have that feature at all ;D Jul 06 14:10:55 lets hope it doesnt/wont happen at all Jul 06 14:11:01 yea ;) Jul 06 14:13:18 does it have volumee buttons? Jul 06 14:13:23 nope Jul 06 14:14:11 ok Jul 06 14:36:12 hmm.. i got a kernel panic after flashing my freerunner with qtmoko Jul 06 14:37:50 uhoh Jul 06 14:38:04 "can't get kernel image" is the message Jul 06 14:38:19 this is a new freerunner i just got by mail, maybe the nand is damaged? Jul 06 14:38:30 i just reflashed the kernel, but it still panics Jul 06 14:39:03 quick question, can a triband of 900/1800/1900 be used in the US? Jul 06 14:39:59 no idea Jul 06 14:40:12 ok Jul 06 14:41:58 gkwhc, I remember seeing in the ML that they work (but I don't remember who reported it) Jul 06 14:42:13 jluis: okay, thanks! Jul 06 14:42:40 oh, nevermind with my panic issue, i had to reflash qi with the one from qtmoko repo Jul 06 14:45:09 gkwhc, yes, _but_ a 850/1800/1900 would have better coverage especially outside cities and such Jul 06 14:45:57 mjr: ah i see, thanks! Jul 06 16:23:54 guys, can you recommend me a stable gta02 distribution with full hardware support (phone, gps, wifi, bt, etc) Jul 06 16:24:04 i just tried qtmoko, but that pretty much freezes once in a while Jul 06 16:34:36 zear: I fould my qtmoko freezing problems were fixed by making sure it uses swap, without swap I think it'll freeze if you use too much memory Jul 06 16:39:11 after making that fix I find qtmoko to be the most stable and mature distro Jul 06 17:28:48 Sazius, ah, thanks for the hint Jul 06 17:29:06 any particular steps i need to take to create swap for qtmoko? Jul 06 17:31:50 zear: I don't have it close by now, but I think I had setup the swap on the SD card, then you just need a swap partition on the card then enable it from the command line with swapon... Jul 06 17:32:13 ah Jul 06 17:32:32 so it involves messing with the boot scripts Jul 06 17:32:41 not really Jul 06 17:32:53 well, you have to execute swapon at some point Jul 06 17:33:18 I think it's enough to have the swap partition in /etc/fstab Jul 06 17:33:24 also, are there any decent on-screen keyboards for qtmoko? Jul 06 17:33:28 and then run swapon once Jul 06 17:33:56 qtmoko has several, decent or not, it's for you to decide :) Jul 06 17:34:02 i'm trying to set up a working system on a freerunner i'll give to my brother (he's a regular user who doesn't know about linux) Jul 06 17:34:13 and he's been complaining alot about qtmoko's keyboard Jul 06 17:34:23 all of the default ones are sucky tbh Jul 06 17:34:53 need something that can be typed with fingers and that is positioned correctly in different apps (the default keyboard is something displayed partially out of the screen) Jul 06 17:35:03 yeah, I'm afraid you're right :) and I don't know of any others unfortunately Jul 06 17:35:11 *something/sometimes Jul 06 17:35:26 there are several default once, that you can switch between Jul 06 17:35:33 yes, we've tried them all Jul 06 17:35:36 they all sucked Jul 06 17:35:36 ok Jul 06 17:36:04 we also trying making a call, but the system freezed on answering an incoming call :OP Jul 06 17:36:04 you can also run Android on the freerunner, which is otherwise pretty nice but rather slow Jul 06 17:36:06 * :P Jul 06 17:36:15 we've tried android as well Jul 06 17:36:21 so far it was the worst of all the systems Jul 06 17:36:39 currently we're testing hackable, but it's very unstable Jul 06 17:36:57 and i thought SHR i use on my freerunner for years was terrible Jul 06 17:37:04 heh :) Jul 06 17:37:06 but so far SHR is ultra stable compared to the other distros ;P Jul 06 17:37:12 oh :) Jul 06 17:37:27 I've settled for qtmoko myself, has been pretty stable for me Jul 06 17:37:30 like, it's slow, but it has never freezed for me Jul 06 17:37:44 but I don't use it as my main phone Jul 06 17:39:04 i hope we can find something that's decent as a phone distro Jul 06 17:39:16 i wouldn't like my brother to return to his crappy lg cookie Jul 06 17:42:47 some people use Debian but that requires a lot of setup to get it right **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Jul 07 02:59:56 2011