**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Sep 06 02:59:57 2009
Sep 06 03:00:33 <tinker-f595> Keep it simple
Sep 06 03:01:22 <tinker-f595> basically how is income going to exceed expenses
Sep 06 03:01:26 <SDuensin> It's very simple.
Sep 06 03:01:37 <SDuensin> I have that, but I need to add a "time" element to it.
Sep 06 03:02:15 <tinker-f595> and if you have any established industry figures to cite on which you can base demand estimates
Sep 06 03:03:35 <SDuensin> Kinda hard.  These plug things are pretty new.
Sep 06 03:04:36 <tinker-f595> well you look for some analogue
Sep 06 03:05:19 <tinker-f595> for example if I was going to use it for a prepackage application server for blogs I would look at what the blog market is
Sep 06 03:06:07 <SDuensin> That'll look good.  Mine is targeted at homes.  There's LOTS of homes!   :-P
Sep 06 03:06:29 <tinker-f595> yes but what does it do for homes?
Sep 06 03:07:16 <tinker-f595> point out the low incremental cost of running it as well.   Under 10 to 5 watts
Sep 06 03:07:37 <tinker-f595> monetize the figure
Sep 06 03:07:51 <SDuensin> Customers will care.  I doubt the bank will.
Sep 06 03:08:32 <tinker-f595> but the bank will want to know why the customers will want to buy
Sep 06 03:08:53 <SDuensin> Yea, I have that kind of blurb in there.
Sep 06 03:09:19 <tinker-f595> market opportunity
Sep 06 03:11:13 <SDuensin> Maybe I should hire you to do this.  :-P
Sep 06 03:14:50 <SDuensin> That's awesome!  The PDF export completely botched the final figure of my financial sheet.  And the answer is...  Gibberish!
Sep 06 03:26:06 <tinker-f595> SDuensin: never had a problem with export to pdf...
Sep 06 03:26:49 <tinker-f595> sounds like you have a special talent ;)
Sep 06 03:29:01 <SDuensin> I told you!  :-)
Sep 06 03:29:15 <SDuensin> Exporting to PDF mangles it.  Printing it through OSX to a PDF worked fine.
Sep 06 03:30:18 <tinker-f595> oh your using OSX
Sep 06 03:30:50 <tinker-f595> On OSX I use NeoOffice instead of OpenOffice
Sep 06 03:30:56 <SDuensin> I used to.
Sep 06 03:31:42 <tinker-f595> In fact I just updated my NeoOffice installation to the latest patch level
Sep 06 07:35:29 <bear_> Anyone runnint Ubuntu 9.04 on their sheevaplug and have mysql installed from the package system?
Sep 06 17:43:31 <morfic> what's a good binary package distro to run on the sheeva plug?
Sep 06 17:52:57 * christoph_debian likes emdebian :)
Sep 06 17:53:45 <morfic> emdebian == http://www.cyrius.com/debian/kirkwood/sheevaplug/unpack.html or is it another effort?
Sep 06 17:54:03 <morfic> ah, .org
Sep 06 17:54:21 <christoph_debian> depends on whether you want it on the NAND or on a stick
Sep 06 17:54:46 <christoph_debian> if you want a stick it's really similar to md's and cyrius' implementation
Sep 06 17:55:26 <christoph_debian> for nand I used the plug installer alpha, you just have to replace upstart event.d stuff with inittab for the tarball creation
Sep 06 17:55:36 <morfic> i have room for the OS on the 2 drives i have on my slug right now, the largest partitions are for md0, but slug runs off of the disk's unraided partition right now
Sep 06 17:58:49 <morfic> i still got some reading to do, about u-boot and building a kernel, heck any cross compiling in general, no longer have a system that is ready for cross compiling.....been too long to even recall what to use as cross compiler "String"
Sep 06 18:03:16 <morfic> christoph_debian: do you use the sheeva.with-linux.com kernels with your emdebian?
Sep 06 18:05:18 <christoph_debian> I'm currently using the -rcsomething that was included in the installer back then but it's probably the same source
Sep 06 18:06:38 <morfic> i was gonna be happily using ubuntu, since i thought ubuntu+arm was gone already, but i realize now it was gone after 9.04, so i don;t want to spend too much time with it
Sep 06 18:09:26 <morfic> emdebian may be the ticket
Sep 06 18:09:58 <morfic> unless i fall off the waggon and set something up with gentoo
Sep 06 18:11:39 <Md> morfic: unless you are tight on disk space there are no major reasons to prefer emdebian to plain debian
Sep 06 18:12:53 <morfic> Md: it may be nice to boot off the Nand, in case disks are spooked, i like booting off the disks too though, guess i need to make up my mind on that
Sep 06 18:13:51 <Md> you can easily install plain debian on the nand flash (but it is recommended to use UBIFS, so IIRC you need unstable)
Sep 06 18:14:41 <christoph_debian> for NAND I'd really prefer emdebian, NAND's already half-full with emdebian and there isn't much yet, for a extra disk, I agree debian proper is just fine
Sep 06 18:16:22 <morfic> thanks christoph_debian, w/o the comment i may have missed crush/grip, if i got this right i could put emdebian into nand, then configure u-boot to boot install off disks, if things poop out, connect and setup u-boot to boot the ready emdebian....
Sep 06 18:19:30 <morfic> i hope my pre-receiving days are not to hypothetically-chatty, i;d rather tinker on the actual device than theorize about it, but alas, it's all i can do right now ;)
Sep 06 18:27:04 <morfic> sheeva is armel?
Sep 06 18:27:17 <Md> yes
Sep 06 18:28:42 <morfic> you know one thing i never thought about, the armeb host does nothing to the setup/data on a md0 that would cause a armel to not be able to mount it, does it? i hope FS stuff is not affected by the hosts endianess
Sep 06 18:33:18 <Md> not that I know
Sep 06 18:38:13 <christoph_debian> hm aren't the ARM CPUs capable to do both, little and big endian?
Sep 06 18:38:31 <christoph_debian> at least I parsed recent discussion on #debian-release that way ;)
Sep 06 18:40:20 <ShadowJK> my NSLU2 can run in both modes
Sep 06 19:45:41 <morfic> the slug can, and i run mine BE, i guess i take down the slug and hook up the disks to this laptop, which is LE as well, if i can assemble and mount i should be good anyway, it's just one of those "hm, never thought about that" things
Sep 06 19:54:37 <morfic> i think the slug is mad at me
Sep 06 23:29:05 <morfic> well, i guess i got my answer, endianess does seem to make moving md0 from slug to sheeva fun
Sep 06 23:31:21 <morfic> -update=byteorder may be my ticket though
Sep 06 23:39:27 <morfic> score
Sep 06 23:39:45 <morfic> playing music off the md0 on a little endian (intel) laptop
Sep 06 23:40:04 <morfic> i guess i won't be using the slug again until sheeva gets here ;)
Sep 06 23:57:51 <e-squizo> do the admins at plugcomputer.org have an e-mail address? I can't register because I don't get the registration e-mail (and no, it's not in my spam trap)
Sep 06 23:59:15 <e-squizo> meanwhile... has anybody managed to get Debian to boot in the last batch of Sheevaplugs?
Sep 06 23:59:34 <e-squizo> I tried following http://blog.bofh.it/debian/id_265 to no avail
Sep 06 23:59:46 <e-squizo> "Kernel panic - not syncing: Attempted to kill init!"
Sep 07 00:00:38 <e-squizo> when I try to boot with init=/bin/bash
Sep 07 00:05:41 <Md> e-squizo: check the earlier messages
Sep 07 00:06:11 <Md> are you still trying to boot the second stage debootstrap or did you finish the install?
Sep 07 00:06:57 <e-squizo> Md: Still trying to boot the second stage debootstrap
Sep 07 00:07:36 <e-squizo> earlier messages look OK: http://pastebin.com/d5da6ea08
Sep 07 00:21:32 <Md> e-squizo: remount sda1 somewhere else and check that everything is where it is supposed to be, there is a /sbin/init and the related libraries, etc
Sep 07 00:22:00 <e-squizo> I'm not really startin init
Sep 07 00:22:10 <e-squizo> since i'm booting with init=/bin/bash
Sep 07 00:22:12 <Md> indeed
Sep 07 00:22:26 <Md> and I think it is there, or you would get a different error
Sep 07 00:22:30 <e-squizo> and I already tried checking the disk... looks fine
Sep 07 00:22:47 <Md> I am not sure right now about what you could do to debug this, it should work...
Sep 07 00:23:04 <e-squizo> I'm kind of confused, I'm still very insecure about UBoot and the whole thing
Sep 07 00:23:22 <e-squizo> in particular how to deal with the device's flash storage...
Sep 07 00:23:50 <Md> you don't, because right now you only need the kernel on the flash
Sep 07 00:23:51 <e-squizo> I'm trying Martin Miclhmayr's instructions now...
Sep 07 00:24:06 <Md> at the top of the boot messages you will find the kernel command line, double check it
Sep 07 00:26:08 <e-squizo> Kernel command line: console=ttyS0,115200 mtdparts=nand_mtd:0x400000@0x100000(uImage),0x1fb00000@0x500000(rootfs) rw root=/dev/sda1 rw rootdelay=10 init=/bin/bash
Sep 07 00:26:14 <e-squizo> looks good to me :-(
Sep 07 00:26:58 <Md> indeed
Sep 07 00:40:00 <e-squizo> for the record: Martin's instructions work
Sep 07 02:08:32 <tinker-f595> e-squizo:  that looks wrong
Sep 07 02:28:40 <e-squizo> tinker-f595: exactly what looks wrong?
Sep 07 02:28:58 <tinker-f595> one of the offsets
Sep 07 02:29:33 <tinker-f595> are you trying to boot from USB device or just run the RFS from there?
Sep 07 02:29:39 <e-squizo> tinker-f595: I was wondering what they meant (is there any info on that?)
Sep 07 02:29:51 <e-squizo> but also without the offsets, the result is the same
Sep 07 02:29:55 <tinker-f595> yes lots of info
Sep 07 02:30:06 <e-squizo> tinker-f595: URL?
Sep 07 02:30:23 <tinker-f595> first what are you trying to do?
Sep 07 02:30:43 <tinker-f595> so I can point you the correct place
Sep 07 02:30:52 <e-squizo> tinker-f595: I'm getting started in this whole Sheevaplug bussiness
Sep 07 02:31:17 <e-squizo> at this particular point, I'm trying to get a Debian system running off an USB drive
Sep 07 02:31:19 <tinker-f595> well have you looked at plugcomputer.org and the wiki?
Sep 07 02:31:23 <e-squizo> and I seem to have succeeded
Sep 07 02:31:32 <e-squizo> with Martin's instructions
Sep 07 02:31:38 <tinker-f595> running or booting?
Sep 07 02:31:39 <e-squizo> yep, I have looked there
Sep 07 02:32:05 <e-squizo> booting first, then running... (I'm not sure I understood the question)
Sep 07 02:32:20 <e-squizo> somehow I can't seem to be able to reguster in the forums
Sep 07 02:32:39 <e-squizo> But I looked in them and in the Wiki
Sep 07 02:32:48 <e-squizo> most of the pages look incomplete
Sep 07 02:32:55 <tinker-f595> http://plugcomputer.org/plugforum/index.php?topic=75.0
Sep 07 02:33:01 <e-squizo> And I don't know enough to fix them
Sep 07 02:33:02 <tinker-f595> registering is easy
Sep 07 02:33:11 <e-squizo> tinker-f595: should be
Sep 07 02:33:14 <tinker-f595> the pages are complete
Sep 07 02:33:20 <e-squizo> but I don't get the confirmation mail
Sep 07 02:33:35 <e-squizo> and no, it is not in my spam trap
Sep 07 02:34:01 <tinker-f595> I never got a confirmation email
Sep 07 02:34:15 <tinker-f595> you just create your account
Sep 07 02:34:21 <tinker-f595> unless they have changed it
Sep 07 02:34:36 <tinker-f595> here is a debian thread http://plugcomputer.org/plugforum/index.php?topic=3.0
Sep 07 02:34:46 <e-squizo> yes, I got it running now
Sep 07 02:34:59 <e-squizo> with these instructions: http://www.cyrius.com/debian/kirkwood/sheevaplug/unpack.html
Sep 07 02:35:29 <e-squizo> tinker-f595: the web sites says I should get a confirmation e-mail
Sep 07 02:35:37 <e-squizo> but I never got one
Sep 07 02:36:12 <tinker-f595> I guess they changed it
Sep 07 02:36:18 <tinker-f595> can you log in anyway?
Sep 07 02:36:22 <tinker-f595> http://www.openplug.org/plugwiki/index.php/Main_Page
Sep 07 02:36:36 <tinker-f595> worth reading the stuff at the wiki
Sep 07 02:37:20 <e-squizo> nope, cannot log in
Sep 07 02:37:25 <e-squizo> "Your email address needs to be validated before you can login."
Sep 07 02:37:44 <tinker-f595> interesting
Sep 07 02:37:45 <e-squizo> tinker-f595: yes, I have been readin it
Sep 07 02:38:00 <tinker-f595> sure you typed your email address in correctly
Sep 07 02:38:05 <e-squizo> unfortunately, it's a bit spotty
Sep 07 02:38:10 <e-squizo> yes, I am sure
Sep 07 02:38:51 <e-squizo> I haven't found information on how the internal flash memory interfaces to the system, for instance
Sep 07 02:39:13 <e-squizo> anyway, I'm off to bed
Sep 07 02:42:09 <tinker-f595> it is there.  you jsut have not read enough yet.  Plus a lot of that information is on the CD
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Sep 07 02:59:57 2009