**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Sep 08 02:59:57 2009 Sep 08 07:05:58 hi Sep 08 07:10:05 hello world. Sep 08 07:10:14 does SheevaPlug have a miniusb port? Sep 08 07:10:35 yep, to access the das u boot thingy. Sep 08 07:11:02 storage is to be plugged on the regular usb socket. May be things can be changed out, i have no idea (just got mine yesterday) Sep 08 07:11:31 is the line on miniusb socket an RS232 ? Sep 08 07:12:00 no idea, i dont even know what rs232 looks like. Sep 08 07:12:21 it's a communication protocol specification Sep 08 07:13:09 I'm asking as I read the instructions to use debug cable and those are for Windows Sep 08 07:14:01 it says to install an usb to serial driver so I was wondering if the mini-usb was used only due to its small size with the line actually being a regular rs232 Sep 08 07:15:15 is the debug cable just a cable or does it have some logic in it? Sep 08 07:16:10 looks like just a cable Sep 08 07:17:44 once the correct kernel module is loaded (wich was automatic here on a ubuntu) on the desktop, you get some new serial device. That behave just like regular serial line. Sep 08 07:18:27 you got two of those, one related to uboot (i think), the other is the serial console used by the plug's kernel. Sep 08 07:18:58 two serial lines on same cable? Sep 08 07:19:18 yop. Sep 08 07:19:30 so maybe it's actually software drive over regular USB Sep 08 07:19:34 driven* Sep 08 07:20:19 I still haven't bought it, and I'm on OS X anyway so I'm tasting the water before diving in Sep 08 07:21:12 btw in commercials from Marvell I read about a future price drop to 49$, is just a future "in a galaxy far far away" or there is a planned date? Sep 08 07:21:46 http://plugcomputer.org/plugwiki/index.php/Serial_terminal_program Sep 08 07:21:55 there are some words about osX Sep 08 07:25:17 "you'll need to download a kernel driver for the USB to serial chipset in the plug" Sep 08 07:25:36 so it seems there is a Prolific usb-to-serial chipset inside the Plug Sep 08 07:26:30 I wonder how comes you get two serial lines, maybe it's using all five mini-usb pins to get 2x(RX+TX) and commond GND Sep 08 07:26:50 I saw a schematic file on plucomputer.org but couldn't find mini-usb schematic Sep 08 07:27:46 plugcomputer.org* Sep 08 07:32:42 maybe an open-rd is better suited Sep 08 07:37:59 anddam, afaik it is just the std ftdi_sio driver Sep 08 07:38:05 and openrd uses the same mechanism Sep 08 07:38:34 eFfeM: but is the actual electrical communication an RS232? Sep 08 07:38:38 i'm on linux, loaded ftdi_sio with the right vendor id etc, then poof, I had two tty devices Sep 08 07:38:56 electrically it is usb ofc Sep 08 07:38:59 from what I read there's a PL2303 inside the SheevaPlug and therefore mini-usb is just used because it's small connecter Sep 08 07:39:01 connector* Sep 08 07:39:06 ofc = ? Sep 08 07:39:13 of course Sep 08 07:39:17 got it Sep 08 07:39:53 not too sure what they do, I'm sure there is a schematic Sep 08 07:40:17 and it works with any usb cable (with the right connectors) Sep 08 07:40:31 so guess the pl2303 is internal onthe daughterboard Sep 08 07:40:44 like the link melmoth pasted seems to imply Sep 08 07:40:46 pl2303 does serial to usb, your computer gets the usb side Sep 08 07:40:55 oh right Sep 08 07:41:02 yup Sep 08 07:41:04 I was looking at it up-side down Sep 08 07:41:26 the serial line ends at the pl2303 that in turns send it over usb to the user's computer Sep 08 07:41:39 in turn* Sep 08 07:41:44 and sends* Sep 08 07:41:50 (wtf today?) Sep 08 07:42:54 so there is no a plain serial line accessible from connectors present out-of-the-box Sep 08 07:43:02 plain serial line == not USB Sep 08 07:44:00 so the GPIO is accessed via SDIO, isn't it? Sep 08 07:44:50 non, mais c est pas con comme idée. Sep 08 07:44:52 oups Sep 08 07:45:33 anddam: there is no serial out on sheeva except for usb Sep 08 07:45:49 and I've seen people hacking up sdio to function as serial Sep 08 07:45:53 thanks for clarify it Sep 08 07:46:05 if you want heavy hw adding or so, have a look at openrd Sep 08 07:46:37 yes and that would lift the price too Sep 08 07:46:52 if ALIX hadn't only 256Mb RAM I'd be already using those Sep 08 07:48:38 eFfeM: anything about the price? iirc I read about the 49$ future price line, was it really an official annnounce? Sep 08 08:25:11 anddam: for sheeva? it might end up at that price, but then i think some price drops are needed Sep 08 08:25:46 not sure what marvell asks for the cpu, then there is the mem etc, guess the bill of materials for a sheeva is around usd 50-60 Sep 08 08:26:06 openrd has more hw and connectors so will be more expensive Sep 08 08:30:08 thanks Sep 08 08:30:09 bye Sep 08 08:34:57 I'm using the default ubuntu os that came with the plug. Anybody knows how to deal with kernel updates ? Sep 08 08:35:24 i mean, is it just a recompilation of the main ubuntu and shall i expect a new kernel each time there is a new i386 one ? Sep 08 08:35:39 and as there is no grub, is there anything to do to change the default kernel ? Sep 08 08:36:25 melmoth: you can change the default kernel in u-boot Sep 08 08:36:32 but the kernel then needs to be on sd (or usb) Sep 08 08:36:49 typically ubuntu does not upgrade the kernel that often Sep 08 08:37:08 what about the local escalation privileges from last week or two ? Sep 08 08:37:40 and for sheeva it defnitely needs some user interaction as the upgrade process of ubuntu will not touch the nand or your fat partition Sep 08 08:37:47 no info on local escalation, sry, missed that Sep 08 08:38:09 ok. Sep 08 08:41:12 actually, there two of those (privileges escalation) recently. Sep 08 08:41:25 CVE-2009-2692 and CVE-2009-2698 Sep 08 16:50:14 tinker-f595: i'm back Sep 08 16:55:43 rektide: trying to remember what I was trying to get in touch with you about. Sep 08 16:56:04 Probably worked it out on my own Sep 08 17:01:55 been a while; i hope so Sep 08 17:23:02 rektide: I think it was a question about the low level boot sequence for kernel built for kirkwood but I found common-head.S. Reading this code answered my question. Sep 08 17:44:29 w/win 15 Sep 08 18:16:05 hi :) Sep 08 18:16:55 so, when installing openvpn on the stock system (added all jaunty repos except proposed and did dist-upgrade) I am missing *any* kernel modules .. Sep 08 18:17:28 how would I get them (except compiling own kernel)? I don't exactly understand *where* the running kernel has its modules ?! Sep 08 18:17:39 basically, I'd be happy with tap.ko :) Sep 08 18:17:55 phaidros: kernel modules have to be built for the specific kernel you're running Sep 08 18:18:32 lennert: uh, ok. so the stock kernel from ubuntu comes without modules?? Sep 08 18:19:52 and there is no package to just get the modules quickly? .. doesn't exaclty feel like my usually linux experience :) Sep 08 18:21:31 you're not running the stock ubuntu kernel, cause it doesn't support the sheevaplug :) Sep 08 18:22:00 well, the one shipped with the sheeva :) Sep 08 18:22:12 which is in this case stock'ish Sep 08 18:23:05 so lennert you basically say, the 2.6.22.18 kernel has no modules? Sep 08 18:23:12 (on sheeva) Sep 08 18:23:32 i'm not sure if the 2.6.22.18 one comes with modules Sep 08 18:24:06 there is no /lib/modules/2.6.22.18/ Sep 08 18:24:20 but that's your filesystem Sep 08 18:24:26 it's just a directory on your root partition Sep 08 18:24:27 uh? Sep 08 18:24:37 if you move to a different root partition, the modules won't magically appear in that directory Sep 08 18:25:13 I am still on my standard root partition (as was installed when shipped) and do not intend to change to a sd or usb device Sep 08 18:25:35 where are the modules there? Sep 08 18:26:43 in the package list is a backports-modules package, but one for imx51 ond for iop32x and one for ixp4xx, and finally one for versatile Sep 08 18:26:52 so I wonder which would fit the sheeva system Sep 08 18:27:12 sheeva is kirkwood Sep 08 18:27:21 kirkwood_defconfig Sep 08 18:27:23 hm, seen that on debian docs Sep 08 18:27:46 phaidros: seen what? Sep 08 18:27:48 why isn't ubuntu (or marvell?) shipping a complete kernel .. Sep 08 18:27:55 it is complete Sep 08 18:28:13 tinker-f595: that the plattform is kirkwood, debian even has packages named for kirkwood devices, ubuntu obviously not Sep 08 18:28:21 tinker-f595: I cannot find the tap module Sep 08 18:28:57 well is it statically linked? Sep 08 18:29:16 tinker-f595: the modules? the kernel? Sep 08 18:29:17 statically linking in ARM kernel saves memory Sep 08 18:29:29 ic, then /dev/tap should be there .. Sep 08 18:29:43 take a look and see if it is there Sep 08 18:29:47 not Sep 08 18:29:55 so build your own kernel Sep 08 18:30:09 I build kernels on my sheevaplug Sep 08 18:30:20 tinker-f595: well, I came here to find out if the shipped kernel is incomplete or has a modules package. Sep 08 18:30:27 atm I do not intend to build kernel :) Sep 08 18:30:40 what you consider incomplete is complete to others Sep 08 18:30:48 project here needs quick solutions ;) Sep 08 18:31:06 well if you do not intend to build a custom kernel then that is your problem Sep 08 18:31:08 hm, kernel without tun/tap is rather incomplete .. i'd say Sep 08 18:31:19 building a kernel is fairly easy Sep 08 18:31:34 tinker-f595: as usuall I intend to stick to package on all my systems and I deeply *know* how to build kernel Sep 08 18:31:40 phaidros: depends on what you are suing the device for Sep 08 18:31:47 hehe, true Sep 08 18:32:03 but vpn is a fairly standard use ;) Sep 08 18:32:22 tinker-f595: so finally: there is no tap module in any package for the shipped kernel, right? Sep 08 18:32:24 phaidros: depends on what you are using the device for Sep 08 18:32:42 suing would be insufficient anyways ;) Sep 08 18:32:49 haha Sep 08 18:32:54 fumbel fingers Sep 08 18:33:08 no tap in any package? Sep 08 18:33:49 anyway my understanding is the kernel it is shipped with is just to get it up and running so you can customize it Sep 08 18:33:54 what package? Sep 08 18:34:00 you build the kernel Sep 08 18:34:34 yeah, I know, it's a developer kit. Sep 08 18:34:38 ^^ Sep 08 18:34:48 so then, no way around compiling :/ Sep 08 18:35:15 * phaidros loves aptitudes powers .. especially on units without fpu .. Sep 08 18:38:05 http://sheeva.with-linux.com/sheeva/ what about these kernels? any good? Sep 08 18:38:39 morfic: eh, no deb, but nice! Sep 08 18:38:40 thx Sep 08 18:38:58 phaidros a kernel is a kernel Sep 08 18:39:06 who needs a deb, it's a kernel ;) Sep 08 18:39:14 tinker-f595: Ino, but dist-upgrade is dist-upgrade ;) Sep 08 18:39:21 different Sep 08 18:39:28 slightly .. Sep 08 18:39:33 much Sep 08 18:39:36 http://plugcomputer.org/plugwiki/index.php/Compiling_Linux_Kernel_for_the_Plug_Computer Sep 08 18:39:45 http://computingplugs.com/index.php/Building_a_custom_kernel Sep 08 18:39:52 http://computingplugs.com/index.php/Building_a_custom_kernel Sep 08 18:39:56 yaya Sep 08 18:40:36 again, I am not to dumb to compile, I just don't want. as long as there is packages .. coz I need the little time I have left here for configuring not compiling :) Sep 08 18:40:49 * phaidros goes punching gcc now Sep 08 18:41:49 well does not take long to compile Sep 08 18:42:00 i gave you a link to binaries, the README helps you install it Sep 08 18:42:08 if you just want to modprobe tap it takes too long ;) Sep 08 18:42:20 morfic: he wants a specific module Sep 08 18:42:23 morfic: yay, nearly forgot that, thank! Sep 08 18:42:23 tinker-f595: how long does it actually take *ON* the plug? Sep 08 18:42:49 tinker-f595: i figured go check if it has what he needs, if not, oh well, he can always compile one ;) Sep 08 18:43:12 took me 55 minutes but I am compiling with a bit more stuff patched in Sep 08 18:43:43 you need buildessentials Sep 08 18:43:55 and an ncurses lib Sep 08 18:44:15 can't remember which ncurses lib I installed Sep 08 18:44:43 tinker-f595: as usual for building kernels :) Sep 08 18:44:49 but I have an external hdd I placed in a usb enclosure Sep 08 18:44:59 yep as usual Sep 08 18:45:04 morfic: any know issues with the 30.5 version? Sep 08 18:45:34 I built on 2.6.31.7 Sep 08 18:46:11 I am planning on rebuilding with 2.6.31.9 Sep 08 18:47:26 phaidros which module did you want? Sep 08 18:47:34 phaidros: i do not know Sep 08 18:47:35 tap.ko Sep 08 18:47:48 morfic: not in your builds, but thanks anyways Sep 08 18:48:20 tinker-f595: what about your external hdd in usb enclosure? sounded like you are building kernel because of it.... Sep 08 18:48:45 nope Sep 08 18:49:04 do not need to build a kernel for that Sep 08 18:50:33 so, on one of the pages is a bug mentioned for orion, is that still in .31 ? Sep 08 18:50:50 tinker-f595: you build vanilla or marvell? Sep 08 18:51:39 with marvell and eInfochips patches Sep 08 18:51:44 ic Sep 08 18:51:59 I have both sheevaplug and OpenRD Client Sep 08 18:52:00 what kinda patche is that? are they necessarry for standard use? Sep 08 18:52:12 so need to get code for both in kernel Sep 08 18:52:44 my client is still in shipping :) Sep 08 18:52:46 well if you have just the sheevaplug then you need only the sheevaplug stuff Sep 08 18:53:09 -ENOIDEAABOUTEINFOCHIPS Sep 08 18:55:01 phaidros: huh? Sep 08 18:56:23 me dunno about eInfochips :) Sep 08 18:56:38 looks like the sheevaplug stuff is in the mainline 2.6.31.9 but not sure about the crypto patch Sep 08 18:57:03 ah, crypto there was something. what was it about? the sheeva has a crypto chip? Sep 08 18:57:10 phaidros: eInfoChips makes the OpenRD boards Sep 08 18:57:18 ah! Sep 08 18:57:44 kirkwood is a SOC and has hardware crypto Sep 08 18:58:10 hmmm sounds like you never looked at the specs Sep 08 18:58:13 nice, did you test it? Sep 08 18:58:19 others have Sep 08 18:58:20 tinker-f595: I did, months ago Sep 08 18:58:33 your memory has faded ;) Sep 08 18:58:43 plug is lying around, got openwrt running on it, did some streaming experiments so far Sep 08 18:58:49 mumbled alot about no fpu Sep 08 18:59:06 seems a waste putting openwrt on it Sep 08 18:59:17 now I have a usecase where the ubuntu is quick and dirty, but enough. and needs to be up soon Sep 08 18:59:23 why a waste? Sep 08 18:59:49 because you could use a more general distro and do routing as well Sep 08 19:00:11 it is far more powerful than your typical hardware router box Sep 08 19:00:31 that people put openwrt on Sep 08 19:03:39 depends, I ve seen people using openwrt on thinkpads :) Sep 08 19:04:11 having X, and CF card instead of hdd and with a fairly old battery a lifetime of 10-12hours .. Sep 08 19:04:47 tinker-f595: was just not sure how the usb disk comment fit Sep 08 19:05:15 all i need is a kernel with raid 1 in it, aside from gigE and i'm golden Sep 08 19:05:27 morfic: just gives me a lot of space for source and compiling Sep 08 19:06:04 compiling a kernel is something i could see myself "do natively", start it, walk away Sep 08 19:06:46 did that for years while doing gentoo and bsd Sep 08 19:07:10 package based systems give you time for more interesting things than wathcing compiling code passing by :) Sep 08 19:08:02 * morfic had gentoo on his slug while he had gentoo on desktop.... Sep 08 19:08:24 crosscompiling: which is faster marvell or code sourcery ? Sep 08 19:09:11 tinker-f595: regarding general purpose systems: why isn't there a tap module on such a general purpose system? Sep 08 19:09:33 openembedded does sheevaplug for cross compiling ;) Sep 08 19:09:41 ask one of the marvell guys Sep 08 19:10:08 lol Sep 08 19:10:43 phaidros except with package based systems you get the kitchen sink which eats up space and memory Sep 08 19:11:04 true, but for general purpose. Sep 08 19:11:11 phaidros: plugcomputing.org/forum and ask Sep 08 19:11:16 precisely that is what "general purpose" means ;) Sep 08 19:12:44 phaidros: I think you want tun.ko Sep 08 19:13:48 not tap Sep 08 19:13:57 tinker-f595: how come? Sep 08 19:14:07 isn't there an tap module? Sep 08 19:14:12 I did a search and all the results said the driver name is tun.ko Sep 08 19:14:23 and it is on my system /lib/modules/2.6.30.5/kernel/drivers/net/tun.ko Sep 08 19:14:44 hm, seems you are right Sep 08 19:14:49 I was sure there was tap *and* tun Sep 08 19:15:01 but obviously tun does both Sep 08 19:15:18 so were do I send the invoice for consulting services ;) Sep 08 19:15:44 wait, I am not conviced yet Sep 08 19:16:23 did you say convicted? Sep 08 19:16:30 http://plugcomputer.org/plugforum/index.php Sep 08 19:16:41 convinced ;) Sep 08 19:17:05 and yes, I have seen the forum and you pointed alraedy to it. Sep 08 19:17:06 morfic: http://www.openplug.org/plugwiki/index.php/External_Hard_Drives Sep 08 19:17:30 well I am supposed to be on vacation so need to get away from computers Sep 08 19:17:41 hehe Sep 08 19:17:43 ciao Sep 08 19:17:46 have fun Sep 08 19:17:50 so, now I am convinced, all done via tun Sep 08 19:17:55 *grmbl* Sep 08 19:19:38 and well, TUN is module in morfics link .. yay Sep 08 19:22:32 tinker-f595: where are you at? i'm on break myself. Sep 08 19:22:53 California Sep 08 19:22:55 and you? Sep 08 19:23:05 New Hampshire Sep 08 19:23:24 3 hours difference Sep 08 19:23:51 well need to get out and go for a hike Sep 08 19:23:54 & universally vacation time. Sep 08 19:24:01 ahh, excellent. have a great hike, cheers. Sep 08 19:24:03 work vacation Sep 08 20:11:16 um Sep 08 20:11:17 fuck yes Sep 08 20:11:32 a marginally newer kernel and this ubiattach command worked Sep 08 20:12:27 i've been trying to put on my own ubifs image for a week now Sep 08 22:33:17 oh great fscking scott. :( Sep 08 22:39:22 oh haza! Sep 08 22:39:38 for the first time i plugged in a crap ton of usb devices Sep 08 22:40:02 i was getting an infinite series of USB Disconnect errors Sep 08 22:40:16 isolated the device-- my sound card, the #1 most important components Sep 08 22:40:27 but after changing the cable, it worked Sep 08 22:40:30 miracles really do happen **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Sep 09 02:59:56 2009