**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Jan 09 02:59:57 2010 Jan 09 11:09:17 hi Jan 09 11:09:43 I'm thinking about getting one of these babies. I wanted to ask some questions if I may Jan 09 11:14:08 for now I would want to use it as a router besides a linksys router. can it do vlan/trunking? can I run openvpn on it with say 20-30mbps encrypted traffic? Jan 09 11:15:02 sheevaplug has only one network interface but you could add a usb one,openrd client has two but has a substantially higher price tag Jan 09 11:15:26 not sure about vlan capabilities and trhoughput bu tyou definitely can run openvpn as it is just a unix box Jan 09 11:16:49 yeah. main problem is, I am running openvpn on my linksys router with openwrt installed, but the processor of that can run about 3mbps through openvpn, not to mention I can't run another instance. this sheevaplus seems to be 'a bit' more powerful tho :) Jan 09 11:17:45 and I'm happy with one network interface as long as it supports vlans/trunking Jan 09 11:18:44 if it runs ubuntu, that shouldn't be a problem from the OS standpoint, I'm not sure if the nic should have support for it too or not Jan 09 11:19:57 vpn is a layer 4 or so function so the nic should not matter Jan 09 11:20:32 I know, was talking about vlans Jan 09 11:20:44 for the router part ;0 Jan 09 11:22:14 oh you can run multiple ip addresses on an interface if you want to Jan 09 11:22:33 never really tried to make a 1 port router, but I don't really see a problem technically speaking Jan 09 11:22:43 btw i did play a little bit with netfilter Jan 09 11:22:58 you might even be able to get openwrt running on it (not sure if I tried that) Jan 09 11:23:14 what is installed on it by default? Jan 09 11:23:42 what os/distribution? Jan 09 11:24:55 just found plugcomputer.org/plugwiki, I guess I'll read it up there first :) Jan 09 11:26:14 ubuntu 9.04 with no way to go to 9.10 as 9.10does not support armv5 Jan 09 11:26:35 plugcomputer.org has various images for you Jan 09 11:26:53 and ofc you can always test on a regular PC (or perhaps in a virtual machine) Jan 09 11:27:47 is the 9.04 ubuntu on it modified a lot? Jan 09 11:28:07 or basically it's the same as any ubuntu installations, I can install packages, configuration is the same etc? Jan 09 11:28:29 not as far as I know, it is the standard arm distro from ubuntu, only the kernel ofc is platform specific Jan 09 11:28:57 yes, it all works the same, with the exception that you do not have a display so everything is through ssh or remote X or terminal Jan 09 11:29:06 of course Jan 09 11:29:12 but you can type apt-get install php etc Jan 09 11:29:22 mhm Jan 09 11:30:22 is it possible to brick it? if I mess up my ubuntu install/forget the passwords, delete the kernel "by accident" :) Jan 09 11:31:11 can I "reset" it, or reinstall the stock ubuntu through some means? Jan 09 11:31:39 and by stock I mean the version it came with initially Jan 09 11:32:41 if you buy a standard sheeva you can always unbrick it. see plugcomputer (and maybe elinxu.org) Jan 09 11:33:00 and yes, I know this from first hand experience Jan 09 11:34:34 standard as in say: http://www.globalscaletechnologies.com/p-26-sheevaplug-dev-kit-europe.aspx ? Jan 09 11:36:54 yup, note the small usb connector below the card slot. It is to connect serial and jtag. products based upon sheeva (e.g. pogoplug) often do not have that. Jan 09 11:37:13 i have the thing you mention, only the us model (the eu model was not availalbe when i purchased it) Jan 09 11:37:35 afk for lunch .... Jan 09 11:37:59 eFfeM1: enjoy, and thanks for the info Jan 09 11:56:14 re Jan 09 11:56:43 eFfeM1: can you show me a cat /proc/cpuinfo on one ? Jan 09 11:57:32 not now, mine is not up, will provide some info later Jan 09 11:58:48 ok, np Jan 09 11:58:56 probably in a few hrs, and from my openrd board, need to finish something else first Jan 09 12:00:47 cemc:http://www.pastebin.org/73055 Jan 09 12:01:48 comradekingu: thanks! Jan 09 12:03:27 :) Jan 09 12:17:01 which reminds me.. I wanted to move the system on my sheeva to an sd card Jan 09 12:20:09 ;) Jan 09 12:22:50 hm, actually.. half of the rootfs is still free. not worth the hassle at the moment Jan 09 12:24:12 probably slower too Jan 09 12:24:17 (sd that is) Jan 09 12:26:15 I would be curious how well would an openvpn connection work, or a scp for that matter Jan 09 12:27:46 guess someone could give you some scp trhougput data Jan 09 12:28:47 it's just me, or is the marvell sheeve site not working? Jan 09 12:28:52 sheeva* Jan 09 12:36:30 scp is a tad on the slow side.. Jan 09 12:36:59 should be around what openvpn would do, right? Jan 09 12:37:26 how slow ? Jan 09 12:37:59 I haven't included that in my simple benchmark, as I was comparing samba and nfs speeds Jan 09 12:38:15 and how are those? Jan 09 12:38:33 scp in fact is benchmarking the cpu, not so much the network, that's what i'm curious about, the cpu Jan 09 12:39:00 how well would it handle 1-2 openvpn connections Jan 09 12:39:11 but while samba and nfs are at slighly over 20MB/s to a usb disk and over 30MB/s to tmpfs, I seem to recall scp being about factor 10 slower Jan 09 12:39:38 that's because of the encryption which would be cpu-bound. Jan 09 12:40:00 on my linksys I have a 400KB/s limit on copying over openvpn Jan 09 12:40:12 right Jan 09 12:40:34 when I did my test, I was mostly intersted in the speed impact the usb disk had Jan 09 12:41:06 and also, that gbit nic, just how close to gigabit do you get? :) Jan 09 12:41:26 did you test that by any chance? Jan 09 12:41:39 iperf clocked ~630 Mbit/s iirc Jan 09 12:41:41 with say a laptop directly connected to it, and running iperf Jan 09 12:41:43 nice Jan 09 12:41:54 that sounds fine Jan 09 12:42:16 that was on a small netgear gigabit hub, only other system being my test pc Jan 09 12:42:33 that's fine, anything above 500mbps is nice :) Jan 09 12:42:48 yeah Jan 09 12:42:50 not that I need it, but just in case :) Jan 09 12:43:12 I'm actually thinking that samba might be even faster if you can do multiple transfers in parallel Jan 09 12:43:26 but tmpfs size was limited :) Jan 09 12:43:30 how fast is samba right now? Jan 09 12:43:34 oh, sorry Jan 09 12:43:38 you said that alreadty Jan 09 12:45:55 you can probably boost the speed a bit if you fiddle with some options, but I didn't have that much time to play with it Jan 09 12:46:09 mhm. anything else you tested? Jan 09 12:47:41 hm, I seem to remember I did "common active directory operations" with samba4 a while back, but I'm not sure what would be the performance bottleneck there Jan 09 12:54:47 anybody know a distributor in europe? Jan 09 15:35:38 cemc: did a quick test with scp, copied a 175 mb file to my openrd board (which has the same soc as sheevaplug, transferred 174 MB in 25 sec, avg speed 6.7 MB/s Jan 09 15:37:19 would be too slow for whole hdd, but for smaller back up is just fine Jan 09 15:40:32 btw fwiw, this was to a hard disk, not an SD card or internal nand Jan 09 15:40:36 eFfeM1: that's nice Jan 09 15:40:59 very nice in fact Jan 09 15:41:31 hm, but... Jan 09 15:41:55 does it use compression by default? Jan 09 15:43:07 rsync has compression Jan 09 15:43:35 I know. I just wanted to be sure that that 6MB/s is real, and not compressed Jan 09 15:43:50 the downward is to install rsync on the plug, especially if no space on nand Jan 09 15:44:36 my idea was to use rsync, but with squeezeserver and update, space would be pretty tight Jan 09 15:45:13 not to mention additional files and logs, that have to have space... Jan 09 15:47:10 eFfeM1: did you by any chance take a look at 'top' or something, to see the cpu usage? Jan 09 15:48:23 eFfeM1, what is fs on the hdd? Jan 09 16:33:13 good evening all Jan 09 16:33:35 hola! Jan 09 16:33:40 anyone here can help me a bit with uboot? Jan 09 16:34:21 I can boot from SD if I keep uImage in the root and use this command: mmcinit; ext2load mmc 0:1 0x800000 /uImage; bootm 0x00800000 Jan 09 16:34:51 but I can't if I try to boot from /boot/. this fails: mmcinit; ext2load mmc 0:1 0x800000 /boot/uImage; bootm 0x00800000 Jan 09 16:35:20 any reason why ext2load can see the file if it's in / but not if it's in /boot/? Jan 09 16:35:56 shouldn't it be in one place only? Jan 09 16:36:54 what was the command? "run bootcmd"? Jan 09 16:37:54 it's bit complex, since it's setup for dual boot Jan 09 16:38:27 bootcmd_mmc=setenv bootargs $(bootargs_console) $(bootargs_root_mmc); mmcinit; ext2load mmc 0:1 0x800000 /uImage; bootm 0x00800000 Jan 09 16:39:04 bootargs_console=console=ttyS0,115200 Jan 09 16:39:32 bootargs_root_mmc=bootargs_root_mmc=root=/dev/mmcblk0p1 rootfstype=ext3 rootdelay=7 Jan 09 16:40:09 hmm, I think I just spotted something wrong there Jan 09 16:41:09 syntax? Jan 09 16:41:30 bootargs_root_mmc=bootargs_root_mmc doesn't make a lot of sense Jan 09 16:41:41 should start from root= Jan 09 16:41:57 still doesn't explain why I can boot from / Jan 09 16:42:17 you saved it with changes? Jan 09 16:42:27 if no, nothing could happen Jan 09 16:43:22 yep, I saved it Jan 09 16:43:51 however, if I init the mmc and run ext2ls on /boot/ I still get nothing back Jan 09 16:44:19 while it can read / fine Jan 09 16:44:22 u-boot is on nand and it calls sd card with ext2 fs... Jan 09 16:44:36 for some reason /boot/ is not visivble to ext2ls or ext2load Jan 09 16:44:39 it looks for root... Jan 09 16:44:48 k, maybe fstab? Jan 09 16:45:22 probably. What should it look like? Jan 09 16:45:32 I could guess Jan 09 16:45:45 for /boot/, I mean. Considering it's within / Jan 09 16:46:04 /dev/mmcblk0p1 /boot/ ext2 defaults 0 0 Jan 09 16:46:05 I didn't set aside a partition for it Jan 09 16:46:34 hmm, but /dev/mmcblk0p1 is already on fstab as / Jan 09 16:47:01 you have /boot made on sd card? Jan 09 16:47:21 where it is physically? Jan 09 16:47:28 on the SD card Jan 09 16:47:51 what you see if you go to / and do ls Jan 09 16:49:02 or repartition sd, make /, /usr/ var etc Jan 09 16:49:55 if you have /boot under /, then boot sequence should see it. maybe it needs separate flag to u-boot? Jan 09 16:49:57 http://pastebin.ca/1744256 Jan 09 16:50:01 sec Jan 09 16:50:39 uImage is teh kernel? Jan 09 16:50:51 where it should live normalu? Jan 09 16:50:58 in /boot or else? Jan 09 16:50:59 cemc: you were asking for samba performance data before.. I just did a small netbench-like test simulating the typical workload of 5 clients, and it seems like throughput suffers a bit with real load :) Jan 09 16:51:38 zoran: it should normally live in /boot, but apparently ext2load can't load it from there. that's why I put a copy in the root Jan 09 16:51:52 Brandano, I'm not sure what is wrong, but I think kernel should be in boot Jan 09 16:52:04 and it boots fine if I do that. But it's ugly to say the least Jan 09 16:52:10 cemc: it's more like 10MB/s Jan 09 16:52:28 zoran: it should. but ext2ls can't see the content of any subfolder, it seems Jan 09 16:52:36 k, just add further location to u-boot for /boot? Jan 09 16:52:48 hm Jan 09 16:53:13 k, what if that file is simlink? Jan 09 16:53:24 and point so /boot/kernel Jan 09 16:53:29 they are both phisical copies Jan 09 16:53:54 remove uImage and make ln -s to the real kernel in /boot? Jan 09 16:53:58 another guy I know that has an overo has the kernel in a separate fat32 partition Jan 09 16:54:26 heh... messy, though Jan 09 16:54:46 must to say that I need time to google first Jan 09 16:55:03 linux is not my first live, bsd is Jan 09 16:55:11 s/live/love/ Jan 09 16:55:26 os reincarnation ftw Jan 09 16:56:56 kernel looks for particular architecture. inside /boot all seems fine. outside? no way Jan 09 16:57:22 I'd try to make simlink outside first, for dirty trick Jan 09 16:57:41 in fact, it is all the trick, isn't it? :) Jan 09 17:01:27 I'll give it a shot Jan 09 17:01:45 however it seems to work fine with the two files in boot and / Jan 09 17:04:07 I suppose I could just modify fstab so that /boot is on the nand Jan 09 17:04:29 or on a separate partition onn the SD card Jan 09 17:06:38 doesn't like the symlink Jan 09 17:10:03 kblin: thanks for the update :) appreciate it Jan 09 17:10:36 I can't understand why ext2ls can see the content of, for example, /sbin, but not that of /boot Jan 09 17:11:02 I just read up on this stuff a bit and if I understand correctly, Ubutnu 9.04 is the last release that will work on the plug ? Jan 09 17:11:06 cemc: system load was up to ~5, though Jan 09 17:11:23 :) Jan 09 17:11:23 yeah, but debian will keep supporting armv5 Jan 09 17:11:36 cemc: s/will work/was compiled and is maintained for/ Jan 09 17:12:17 Brandano: maintained for how long? Jan 09 17:12:22 cemc: didn't look at top, compressed or not didn't really make a difference, I tried the same file compressed and got roughly the same rate Jan 09 17:12:37 it's not an LTS, so until 2010/10 Jan 09 17:12:43 actually the speed seems to drop a little bit as times passes by Jan 09 17:13:08 cemc: and the fs on the hd is ext3 iirc Jan 09 17:13:39 Brandano: and after that, you kinda have to switch distro if you want to keep it up-to-date, correct? Jan 09 17:14:54 I imagine Jan 09 17:15:14 cemc: and did a quick top test for you, sshd is > 90 % Jan 09 17:15:16 eFfeM1: that's very nice then, 6-7MB/s, looks promising ;) Jan 09 17:15:32 but I also think that if this sort of thing takes momentus, purpose made distros will become more frequent Jan 09 17:16:02 Ubuntu is nice, but not quite ideal for a headless system Jan 09 17:16:12 Brandano: that may be, but I don't want another distro ;) I want 1 that works ok Jan 09 17:16:19 * eFfeM1 prefers openembedded Jan 09 17:16:21 debian Jan 09 17:16:22 Ubuntu server is ok even headless :) Jan 09 17:16:24 * eFfeM1 is biased though Jan 09 17:16:29 or ubuntu server Jan 09 17:17:20 cemc: nothing stops you from forking Ubuntu in, I don't know, ARMbuntu Jan 09 17:18:05 yeah, that is what this world needs, another linux flavor ;) hehe Jan 09 17:18:41 for every device, every two years, another distro ;) Jan 09 17:19:27 there is already something called armubunutu (name might vary a little bit), they even have their own channel here on irc Jan 09 17:19:29 when will sheevaplug with armv6 come out? "_ Jan 09 17:19:49 they announded a new one at ces but guess it is still the same core Jan 09 17:19:59 should be 2 Ghz, no idea on timing though Jan 09 17:22:06 zoran: it appears I am not alone: http://plugcomputer.org/plugforum/index.php?topic=307.0 Jan 09 17:24:06 #ubuntu-arm Jan 09 17:25:51 eFfeM1: and inbuilt wifi and bluetooth Jan 09 17:26:10 though I'd have probably preferred 2 additional USB ports instead Jan 09 17:26:19 feature creep is dangerous Jan 09 17:26:37 next thing they'll add a monitor and keyboard... Jan 09 17:26:50 :) Jan 09 17:26:58 Brandano: thought it also comes with a disk, don't think i like that Jan 09 17:27:05 and windows support :)) Jan 09 17:30:03 is debian working ok too on the plug? Jan 09 17:32:00 yes Jan 09 17:32:25 and fedora and openembedded; guess gentoo will work too Jan 09 17:35:42 you can run Linux on a cash register, I can't see why any linux couldn't run on a 1.2ghz arm processor Jan 09 17:36:09 gentoo is almost assured to run by definition Jan 09 17:36:20 you have to compile half the thing yourself Jan 09 17:40:38 yup :-) Jan 09 17:45:18 hmm, odd thing. I have home belonging to 1001:1001. Shouldn't it belong to root:root? Jan 09 17:55:53 yay! managed to make a copy of /boot that is actually readable by uboot Jan 09 17:56:35 I just renamed /boot to /oldboot, then made a bunch of copies /boot1 /boot2 /boot3 ... Jan 09 17:57:09 rebooted and checked which one was not 0 length from uboot, booted and changed the name of that one to /boot **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Jan 10 02:59:56 2010