**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Jul 09 02:59:56 2009 Jul 09 03:01:43 I've learned its very useful to initctl stop LunaSysMgr and manually run LunaSysMgr. stderr for the win Jul 09 03:04:12 FORUMS DISABLED FOR AN HOUR!!THE HORROR! Jul 09 03:04:21 NOOOOOOOO Jul 09 03:05:04 * joesmith goes to corner of the lair and cries Jul 09 03:05:44 huh? Jul 09 03:06:22 stderr is good to get Jul 09 03:06:48 also if it crashes you can look around Jul 09 03:06:48 rather than immediate respawn Jul 09 03:09:51 very good Jul 09 03:10:23 did everyone but me know that holding down orange made the screen act like a trackpad for scrolling around textboxes and stuff? Jul 09 03:10:51 kind of like the android's trackball Jul 09 03:11:08 yeah i think so Jul 09 03:11:38 I was wondering why they didn't add a trackball until that, then, whoa, that might even be better Jul 09 03:12:24 Your the only one destinal :P Jul 09 03:12:26 join #webos Jul 09 03:12:28 oops Jul 09 03:12:33 fail Jul 09 03:13:53 destinal -- that's in the OWNERS GUIDE..... Jul 09 03:14:02 === AND the videos. Jul 09 03:14:05 oh, you read that? Jul 09 03:14:29 <-- old -- learned that "I don't need no stinking manuals" is for children. Jul 09 03:14:42 I was just eager to play with shiny new toy Jul 09 03:14:47 LOL Jul 09 03:15:33 yeah, i was about to open it up - and then i typed "./novaterm" Jul 09 03:15:33 :( Jul 09 03:15:44 open the manual that is Jul 09 03:16:25 What manual? Jul 09 03:16:34 pre's manual Jul 09 03:16:38 What does this word mean manual? Jul 09 03:16:54 :with the hands" Jul 09 03:16:57 ok whats the deal with patches and are the neccesary? Jul 09 03:17:03 heh, like rboatright said - reading the manual is a good idea in most situations Jul 09 03:17:14 Not when it comes to sex LOL Jul 09 03:17:24 oops that should be in the watercooler Jul 09 03:18:49 does everything you do to your phone need to be removed prior to ota updates? then re applied? Jul 09 03:19:04 depends Jul 09 03:19:14 destinal: Just thought I'd check in, I'm still hacking away at firstuse, it's more comments than code now! :) I seem to get something slightly different happen each time I flash it. Jul 09 03:19:42 adns-pre: what if you just changed the piece that prevents it from being minimized? Jul 09 03:20:11 oh and yeah you still need to get past that error scene Jul 09 03:20:26 prevents what from being minimized? Jul 09 03:20:33 nevermind Jul 09 03:20:50 I was thinking, most apps allow you to get back to the cardview. firstuse doesn't Jul 09 03:20:56 still doesn't help you though Jul 09 03:21:03 you have to complete it to get your profile in Jul 09 03:22:52 ok so I added the addons today and the new page/delete page if I were to update my phone would I have to redo those? Jul 09 03:23:10 It sure would be useful in this case to have an image that was already rooted that I could just SSH in right away without ever needing to mess with the activation Jul 09 03:26:40 adns-pre: so why not do that? Jul 09 03:26:59 adns-pre: just figure out what enables dev mode and do it to the image Jul 09 03:27:27 then you can novacom in regardless of what firstuse is doing Jul 09 03:28:47 If I can't figure out firstuse then I'll move on to something like that. I'm not much of a coder but with time I can figure it out Jul 09 03:30:29 am I the only one that wants to watch what's going on while my phone's booting? The glowing Palm logo was only cool the first time. Jul 09 03:30:36 yeah we definitely need a good firstuse patch that makes it work regardless of modem failure or cdma activation status, the one on the wiki only goes through the activation piece Jul 09 03:31:15 adns-pre: good idea, we need a text boot mode Jul 09 03:31:24 shouldn't be too hard Jul 09 03:31:54 I also wan android's cylon boot animation, for no particular reason other than it looks cool Jul 09 03:32:34 since I've been rebooting so much this evening it's one of my many constructive thoughts Jul 09 03:39:03 anyone running the smartreflex script? Jul 09 03:51:55 is there anyway to change a bookmarked icon on the launcher to a png image? Jul 09 03:53:37 bookmarked icon Jul 09 03:53:57 which one is that/ Jul 09 03:54:37 destinal yes, and someone figured it out about a week ago in here, but I don't remember what he did. Jul 09 03:54:55 great thanks for the help Jul 09 03:55:14 joesmith: check the logs, if it was discussed here it should be there Jul 09 03:55:18 I am sure I can get it if I lurk long enough around here Jul 09 03:55:30 good idea destinal Jul 09 03:59:01 do any of you know how to make http://m.ebay.com/ searchable from the addons search? Jul 09 04:00:52 joesmith: from universal search? Jul 09 04:01:05 joesmith: check here http://predev.wikidot.com/global-search-addons Jul 09 04:01:41 I checked there that is for regular ebay Jul 09 04:01:45 is "showergel" here? Jul 09 04:02:15 this new page http://predev.wikidot.com/installing-apps-without-rooted-pre doesn't make any sense to me Jul 09 04:02:46 I changed the "shop" part to "m" which took me to mobile ebay, but it wouldnt search for my query from universal search Jul 09 04:03:51 rwhitby: I am confused too? Jul 09 04:08:05 gkatsev, you still here Jul 09 04:08:42 A2NY|home: yes Jul 09 04:08:48 ok Jul 09 04:08:52 smartreflex Jul 09 04:09:00 though, for not longer than 30 mins Jul 09 04:09:15 ok, not problem i need to add this to the wiki Jul 09 04:09:39 but smart reflex works if the OPP are set to VDD1 =1 and VDD2 =2 Jul 09 04:09:49 A2NY|home: yes, im wondering because i just enabled it and looking at the time_in_state, im getting 90% of time spent at 600MHz Jul 09 04:10:02 VDD1 has a range 1-5 and VDD2 is 2-3 Jul 09 04:10:19 Evening... Jul 09 04:10:25 now using VDD1&VDD2 should be used with on demand Jul 09 04:10:40 BUT Jul 09 04:10:51 VDD1 in our kernal is set to 4 Jul 09 04:10:59 and has a value of 3 )default) Jul 09 04:11:11 and VDD2 is at 3 (default) Jul 09 04:11:51 so just because you enable vdd1 and vdd2 doesnt mean it is doing anything Jul 09 04:12:00 all you are doing is running the system at 600mhz Jul 09 04:12:08 right Jul 09 04:12:22 VDD? Jul 09 04:12:23 so what you see in the wiki is BS Jul 09 04:12:32 it auto regulates votage Jul 09 04:12:36 Ah. Jul 09 04:12:43 A2NY|home: so, what should i do? Jul 09 04:12:44 VDD auto changes though if you put autodemand on Jul 09 04:12:53 no it doesnt. Jul 09 04:12:58 I've been comparing diffs on vdd1_opp and vdd2_opp for hours now Jul 09 04:13:10 and vdd2_opp changes between 2 and 3 Jul 09 04:13:10 you need the OPP tables set correctly to work Jul 09 04:13:42 ok, what needs to be changed? Jul 09 04:13:42 VDD is used with ondemand Jul 09 04:13:50 the kernel itself Jul 09 04:13:56 im fine messing around a bit, since i need to reset the phone soon anyway Jul 09 04:13:57 oh I agree, you need to but I've been forcing vdd2_opp per some documentation I've read on omap and even when ondemand is enabled it overwrites the value with ondemand Jul 09 04:14:00 we need to make a kernal Jul 09 04:14:09 that's where i was going next ;) Jul 09 04:14:18 have to make a kernel to use the right values Jul 09 04:14:39 our kernel is set for vdd1 at 4 xD fail Jul 09 04:14:51 it needs to be at one, with VDD2 at 2 Jul 09 04:14:54 ok, so, meanwhile i should just get rid of the script? cuz in fact it will lower battery life, right? Jul 09 04:15:02 yes Jul 09 04:15:04 ok Jul 09 04:15:15 all you are doing is OC Jul 09 04:15:17 Yeah I haven't been able to find clear documetntation on what the values for vdd1 1-5 are unfortunately, it looks like 2 and 3 on vdd2 just set 83mhz or 166mhz respectively on the clock Jul 09 04:15:29 a2ny, it's from the ti documentation that it needs to be set to 1/2 ? Jul 09 04:15:35 yes, correct Jul 09 04:15:46 interesting Jul 09 04:16:01 a2ny|home, can you gimme a link to the ti documentation you're reading? Jul 09 04:16:05 the kernel is set up ass backwards really Jul 09 04:16:19 i am in a hotel room at the moment Jul 09 04:16:23 have you guys seen the 1330mAh battery? Jul 09 04:16:26 its on my work computer Jul 09 04:16:40 i found a PPT that had some good knowledge Jul 09 04:16:42 gkatsev, yes but that only gives you 25% extra battery at best ;) Jul 09 04:16:44 and a DOC from TI Jul 09 04:16:56 not even Jul 09 04:17:00 a2ny|home, I have a ppt myself but not sure if it is the same one ;) Jul 09 04:17:02 psykoz: right, but that would mean that the battery will definitely last me the full day, and not just maybe Jul 09 04:17:06 the stock battery is 1180mah Jul 09 04:17:17 sorry, 1350mAh Jul 09 04:17:22 run grep BATTERY: /var/log/messages Jul 09 04:17:28 yeah, stock is 1150mAh Jul 09 04:17:50 the cool thing is that its the same size as the 1150mAh battery Jul 09 04:17:50 you will see what you are currently at Jul 09 04:17:53 gkatsev, the problem there is not your usage, Palm really has rushed out this OS and hasn't really done any fine tuning of its power consumption, they just have the processor running at 85% maxed out all the time unfortunatel Jul 09 04:17:55 http://gizmodo.com/5310166/extended-battery-shoves-20-more-capacity-into-the-palm-pre Jul 09 04:18:10 psykoz: yeah Jul 09 04:18:15 gkatsev, I suspect either an update from Palm after they spend some time on this issue (or home brew community) will come up with a stable 3day idler Jul 09 04:18:38 yeah, hopefully Jul 09 04:18:41 I'd invest in more power adapters for where you spend your time the most than a battery to be honestly Jul 09 04:18:43 honest8 Jul 09 04:18:46 honest* Jul 09 04:18:55 somewhat surprised that 1.0.5 isnt out yet Jul 09 04:19:03 we need a new kernel Jul 09 04:19:09 to power the OMAP Jul 09 04:19:11 thats it Jul 09 04:19:14 i think i might get another touchstone for work Jul 09 04:19:28 check out your /boot/system*kernel name Jul 09 04:19:37 sorry i dont have the pre hooked up Jul 09 04:19:47 a2ny|home, have we figured out how to compile kernel with working power button yet? Jul 09 04:19:57 no Jul 09 04:20:30 again, in the hotel room, 7:30 meeting, im not going to start, lol Jul 09 04:20:36 hrmm I wonder if we can just hexedit the kernel to our liking then for setting the vdd1 value :/ Jul 09 04:20:37 ill be up all night xD Jul 09 04:21:29 we need more than that Jul 09 04:21:37 there are two other settings i would like to use Jul 09 04:21:44 powersave & conservitive Jul 09 04:21:54 besides ondemand and user Jul 09 04:22:03 Yeah, they scrapped those in the kernel, which is like "wtf? yo" Jul 09 04:22:39 but ondemand is probably top priority, right? Jul 09 04:22:40 a2ny|home, have you taken any time to look at cpuidle_deepest_state ? Jul 09 04:22:43 yes Jul 09 04:23:04 that powerpoint is wrong per TI Jul 09 04:23:11 TI has 6 levels Jul 09 04:23:23 I actually saw 7 in some documentation I was reading Jul 09 04:23:34 i wish i wasnt drunk xD Jul 09 04:23:46 6 per TI doc i saw Jul 09 04:24:12 and if you use ondemand it seemed as if you cannot let anything go OFF Jul 09 04:24:15 are you talking about the celinux TI_OMAP3430_Linux_PM_reference.ppt being wrong? Jul 09 04:24:17 MPU or CORE Jul 09 04:24:23 A2NY|home: any script thing youd like me to try on my pre tomorrow? Jul 09 04:24:35 well you have to release all clocks to do OFF Jul 09 04:24:36 no, we need a new kernel Jul 09 04:25:05 sadly :\ Jul 09 04:25:20 ok, so, basically hold tight till we get a new kernel or palm releases ondemand mode? Jul 09 04:25:31 * psykoz nods to gkatsev Jul 09 04:25:44 palm to release ondemand, i doubt it Jul 09 04:25:50 not for a while if they do Jul 09 04:25:57 they cant have users phones go down Jul 09 04:26:07 gkatsev, the settings palm is using right now are incompatible with ondemand, and if you force the right settings there, the kernel overwrites them shortly Jul 09 04:26:23 when i just enable ondemand and try and do something even setting OPP to correct vals my pre crasges Jul 09 04:26:43 crashes* Jul 09 04:26:46 right, yeah, i noticed that when settings the cpu_governer it kept changing to userspace Jul 09 04:26:48 I've only been enabling ondemand + altering vdd2, I haven't touched vdd1 yet Jul 09 04:26:59 it doesnt matter Jul 09 04:27:09 OPP needs to be at 2 for VDD2 auto to work Jul 09 04:27:15 is it just me, or does the pre strip linebreaks from incoming texts? Jul 09 04:27:36 makes them spaces Jul 09 04:27:44 yeah, makes sense Jul 09 04:27:54 a2ny|home, nod, ondemand still alternates that between 2 and 3 on my phone Jul 09 04:28:03 hmmm... i have mixed feelings about that. Jul 09 04:28:07 I've tried keeping it forced to 2 Jul 09 04:28:17 i cant even run ondemand with my phone hanging and do a batt remove to get back Jul 09 04:28:41 ondemand works on my phone for about 7-10 hours Jul 09 04:28:44 testimage at 6-19 FYI Jul 09 04:28:53 and then while watchign a video or playing music it'll crash Jul 09 04:28:59 I forget where test image is at Jul 09 04:29:14 var/logs Jul 09 04:29:22 * i think * Jul 09 04:29:50 testimage 5-31 Jul 09 04:30:34 yup Jul 09 04:30:43 so kernel needs to be fixed Jul 09 04:30:53 all people are doing is OC the pre Jul 09 04:31:03 even if default OMAP3430 is 600mghz Jul 09 04:31:30 well doing the /sys/devices/system/cpu method my pre definitely wasn't overclocking Jul 09 04:31:42 but it was also not doing much of anything, wasn't getting me notifications etc ;) Jul 09 04:31:49 and was crashing after about 10 hours Jul 09 04:32:00 ondemand isnt Jul 09 04:32:03 but 600000 is Jul 09 04:32:21 oh, I don't know why anyone wouldn't realise 600000 isn't overclocking? :) and if so they shouldn't be touching their phone Jul 09 04:33:47 with on demand Jul 09 04:34:10 we could easily see 750 with ondemand with VDD autos setup Jul 09 04:35:43 ok, im gonna head to sleep now Jul 09 04:35:45 night Jul 09 04:35:50 but untill we get a ner kernel we aint seen nothing Jul 09 04:35:52 night Jul 09 04:36:21 I don't care for 750, I want 125 that does notifications still, doesn't crash and scales up to 500 when I need it to ;) Jul 09 04:37:19 yew Jul 09 04:37:21 yes Jul 09 04:37:39 what is System.map-2.6.24-palm-joplin-3430 ? Jul 09 04:37:40 in /boot Jul 09 04:38:00 the kernel Jul 09 04:38:19 config is what we need to change and make a new one Jul 09 04:38:33 read to omap Jul 09 04:38:47 i posted in the webos pastebin too for freq Jul 09 04:40:35 gnight Jul 09 04:41:17 later Jul 09 04:41:19 im out too Jul 09 04:41:41 psykoz, ill be on tomorrow or the next day, office has me busy all day tomorrow Jul 09 04:42:05 'k ;) see you around Jul 09 04:42:52 forums are still down, OH THE HUMANITY Jul 09 04:49:06 folks Jul 09 04:49:52 Can a device like this be even more cool or what ? Jul 09 04:50:24 * bhuey had a chance to look through a rooted device extensively over the last few days Jul 09 04:51:20 bhuey: that's what we're working on Jul 09 04:51:29 Yeah, it would not have dead pizels, oreo problems, heat issues, stable OS, run Crysis Jul 09 04:51:30 making it more cool, or what Jul 09 04:51:33 :P Jul 09 04:54:54 it's the "what" part that can be dangerous Jul 09 04:55:05 or interesting or funny Jul 09 04:57:13 destinal: mine was a rhetorical comment :) Jul 09 04:57:31 was there a bluetooth problem with the pre ? Jul 09 04:57:32 bhuey: yeah, but too good to pass up :) Jul 09 04:57:44 there was a discussion that the radio turns off and doesn't turn back on Jul 09 04:57:52 I've encountered that Jul 09 04:58:15 and got a replacement anyways because the screen had a bubble in it Jul 09 05:00:00 something might have happened when the poured the epoxy or something Jul 09 05:02:59 hi all - I'm trying to find a way to completely disable the dtmf sounds. I can stop them on the dialpad before the call, but once the call starts, if you dial, you can still hear the dtmf Jul 09 05:04:16 new web doctor not working for anyone else? Jul 09 05:06:45 new web doctor? Jul 09 05:06:49 * destinal snarfs Jul 09 05:07:23 agh! Jul 09 05:07:23 no but all of a suddeon the old version of the jar file for web doctor is not found....Hmmmmm Jul 09 05:07:29 --2009-07-08 23:06:45-- http://palm.cdnetworks.net/rom/pre_p100eww/webosdoctorp100ewwsprint.jar Jul 09 05:07:29 HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 404 Not Found Jul 09 05:07:43 Unable to load resource: http://palm.cdnetworks.net/rom/pre_p100eww/webosdoctorp100ewwsprint.jar Jul 09 05:07:49 Seems interesting Jul 09 05:08:10 uh Jul 09 05:08:18 every request to that server does it Jul 09 05:08:25 even /rom and / Jul 09 05:09:15 well if i go to pal.com/rom it makes me download the jar that tries to load the jar and fails, they must be changing things Jul 09 05:09:24 palm.com* Jul 09 05:11:34 i was going ot reload my phone ( i borked my gmail oddly)( Jul 09 05:11:58 destinal, new one :P Jul 09 05:13:02 hey destinal or tharris: do either of you know where the dtmf controls are being set? Trying to eliminate them completely. Jul 09 05:13:15 check the wiki Jul 09 05:13:21 yeah - isn't there Jul 09 05:13:53 O rly? http://predev.wikidot.com/stock-application-mods Jul 09 05:14:10 Eguy: eh? Jul 09 05:14:20 new webos doctor Jul 09 05:14:21 sorry Jul 09 05:14:24 ah Jul 09 05:14:25 1.0.4 Jul 09 05:14:26 I've got that one Jul 09 05:14:32 in jar format? where Jul 09 05:14:33 eguy where from Jul 09 05:14:43 They are probably adding it Jul 09 05:14:49 eguy: but once you connect, the dtmf still plays Jul 09 05:14:50 oh Jul 09 05:14:52 yeah i think so Jul 09 05:15:11 Did you comment out the lines? Jul 09 05:15:14 yep Jul 09 05:15:33 but perhaps I goofed it? do you get dtmf tones at all when you are actually in a call? Jul 09 05:15:48 Oh yes' Jul 09 05:15:52 you can't change that Jul 09 05:16:26 why not? most winmo phones still pass the dtmf, but you don't hear the tones through the speaker or headset Jul 09 05:16:57 Or maybe you can and I don't know which file it's in :P Jul 09 05:17:14 ;) That's what I'm trying to find this eve Jul 09 05:17:25 I do appreciate your help though Jul 09 05:17:44 np Jul 09 05:18:17 destinal: I read in a precentral.net forum that there's a bluetooth hardware bug, is this true ? Jul 09 05:18:37 It is lacking in profiles, I will tell you that lol Jul 09 05:19:29 bhuey: could be Jul 09 05:19:36 bhuey: I haven't heard ofi t Jul 09 05:19:38 it Jul 09 05:19:42 Me neither Jul 09 05:19:52 Do you know what it is about? Jul 09 05:20:17 there was a mistracking of the power on state bits in that hardware Jul 09 05:20:29 I've found that my bluetooth will turn off and I have to manually restart it Jul 09 05:20:30 Ah Jul 09 05:20:38 known problems ? Jul 09 05:20:41 know problem ? Jul 09 05:20:44 bah Jul 09 05:20:48 known problem ? Jul 09 05:20:52 I did noticed sometimes my car kit won't pair and I have to power cycle the BT Jul 09 05:20:56 can't type Jul 09 05:21:03 On an iPhone? Jul 09 05:21:05 :P Jul 09 05:21:08 yeah, I just swapped for the new unit Jul 09 05:21:33 bzhou * r10431 optware/trunk/make/libelf.mk: libelf: 0.8.9 -> 0.8.12 Jul 09 05:21:33 testing it out now, it hasn't dropped in a way that forces me to restart it Jul 09 05:21:37 yet Jul 09 05:23:06 I thought I had a similar problem with my z9i headset, but a firmware update fixed all my odd disconnect issues Jul 09 05:23:42 what firmware update Jul 09 05:23:44 ? Jul 09 05:24:25 There's there a way of shutting down the app layer and just basically bring the machine into single user with only the networking and bluetooth up ? Jul 09 05:24:43 something in /etc/init.d ? Jul 09 05:24:54 sorry, should have been more clear: a firmware update for the z9i Jul 09 05:25:13 Noob help with the pre root please? Jul 09 05:25:27 Yep? Jul 09 05:25:56 What's up RG? Jul 09 05:26:08 it's possible that they've just eliminated the jar version and they're going totally to the jnlp thing Jul 09 05:26:23 get to step 14 on http://predev.wikidot.com/using-novaproxy, putty window opens for a second, gets an error beep and closes Jul 09 05:26:30 how do I do a forced restart of the device ? Jul 09 05:26:56 bhuey: from where? putty? Jul 09 05:27:01 Thanks, eguy Jul 09 05:27:10 sushi2: from external physical controls Jul 09 05:27:26 mine if frozen at the moment because I brought into single user mode Jul 09 05:27:30 if=is Jul 09 05:27:31 destinal, right now a change seems odd unless they are going to update the launch from palm.com/ROM Jul 09 05:27:47 RG: did you install python26? Jul 09 05:28:03 bhuey: how about a battery pull? Jul 09 05:28:07 yup, 2.6.2, the script runs just like it said Jul 09 05:28:15 sushi2: thinking about doing that now Jul 09 05:28:17 It says listening on port ...... Jul 09 05:28:23 8023 Jul 09 05:28:26 ok Jul 09 05:28:53 tharris-: I think they updated the ROM link to be a jnlp a while back Jul 09 05:28:54 set localhost, 8023, force off *2 Jul 09 05:28:55 and in putty it should be localhost and port 8023 connection: raw Jul 09 05:29:06 +raw, yup Jul 09 05:29:30 local echo and editing force off? Jul 09 05:30:32 yuppo, tried it twice. vista problem? Jul 09 05:30:53 It doesn't even create a log, just closes. Jul 09 05:31:07 can you connect to anything else via Putty? Jul 09 05:31:18 hmm Jul 09 05:31:20 puzzling Jul 09 05:31:29 How you have another computer? Jul 09 05:31:32 do* Jul 09 05:31:32 I'm not even sure what putty is. Is it telnet? Jul 09 05:31:39 it's a client Jul 09 05:31:49 bzhou * r10432 optware/trunk/make/apr.mk: apr: 1.3.5 -> 1.3.6 Jul 09 05:31:50 for telnet, and other bits Jul 09 05:31:55 bzhou * r10433 optware/trunk/make/apr-util.mk: apr-util: 1.3.7 -> 1.3.8 Jul 09 05:32:26 Last time I used telnet I was playing a MUD... sorry rminiscing. Jul 09 05:32:41 you can always ssh or telnet in Jul 09 05:32:42 I'll try it on another pc then. Jul 09 05:32:42 hahaha Jul 09 05:32:47 try this RG: Jul 09 05:32:54 in the Putty window Jul 09 05:33:05 host name: smtp.gmail.com Jul 09 05:33:11 port: 25 Jul 09 05:33:14 telnet Jul 09 05:33:17 wait 1 Jul 09 05:33:30 eh? gmail? Jul 09 05:33:42 and see if you get connected to the google mail server (checking to see if putty is freaking out on his system) Jul 09 05:34:13 ah Jul 09 05:34:26 sushi2: do you know of a way of doing some /etc/init.d script invocation stop all webos services minus the Linux stuff ? Jul 09 05:34:37 to stop and start Jul 09 05:35:03 bhuey: alas, my script skills are poor these days. I'm just starting to remember most of the linux commands Jul 09 05:35:14 anybody then ? Jul 09 05:35:24 The window doesn't close on the mail server. just freezes on a still cursor Jul 09 05:35:27 bhuey: but you can issue stop commands on the running services, if that's what you are wanting to do Jul 09 05:35:31 RG: Good Jul 09 05:35:42 that it fine Jul 09 05:35:42 you can kill that box - putty seems to be working Jul 09 05:35:44 RG Jul 09 05:35:48 sushi2: yes, which one will stop those services ? Jul 09 05:35:48 is* Jul 09 05:35:53 holy crap I can't type either Jul 09 05:36:11 bhuey: depends on which one you stop. ;) Jul 09 05:37:15 all things that relate to the GUI and the DB ops Jul 09 05:37:27 as if I was about to restart just the GUI Jul 09 05:37:34 RG: you downloaded 2.6 version of python, right? Jul 09 05:37:44 2.6.2 Jul 09 05:37:46 bhuey: isn't there a command to restart luna? Jul 09 05:37:52 yes Jul 09 05:37:53 That is the right ver Jul 09 05:37:56 rg: ok - that's what I have Jul 09 05:38:06 rg: have you tried just rebooting? Jul 09 05:38:15 what ver of windows rg? Jul 09 05:38:18 sushi kill LunaSysMgr Jul 09 05:38:33 ps -ef | gpre LunaSysMgr, then kill the PID Jul 09 05:38:39 grep* Jul 09 05:38:44 can you issue a "stop LunaSysMgr" ? Jul 09 05:38:58 i have not tried Jul 09 05:38:59 or /sbin/stop LunaSysMgr Jul 09 05:39:00 initctl stop LunaSysMgr iirc Jul 09 05:39:11 yeah Jul 09 05:39:11 HAHAHA! I spent 6 years in tech support. I always laught when someone suggests that to me. I was going to try reboot next. Jul 09 05:39:12 if you kill it it will respawn Jul 09 05:39:15 that looks better Jul 09 05:39:22 LOL RG, I know Jul 09 05:39:22 it auto respawns as tharris mentions though Jul 09 05:39:26 sushi2: yeah, that's what I'm looking for Jul 09 05:39:32 so I just do killall LunaSysMgr Jul 09 05:39:38 haha Jul 09 05:39:39 It is vista sp1 Jul 09 05:39:51 hey, does anyone know if the Jul 09 05:39:53 12 hours to 23% on the Seidio 1350mah... FAIL Jul 09 05:39:54 reboot and try again is what I would try RG Jul 09 05:40:03 gotcha, thanks! Jul 09 05:40:08 'random wallpaper switching' will the battery? Jul 09 05:40:15 eguy: that's a fail? what were you getting before? Jul 09 05:40:22 i mean, does it switch when the phonce screen is not on? Jul 09 05:40:24 The same Jul 09 05:40:28 ah Jul 09 05:40:30 sad Jul 09 05:40:35 Eguy, the things a2ny and myself have been discussing have some real valid chance at fixing power consumption issues on the pre Jul 09 05:40:40 *will kill the battery? Jul 09 05:40:44 how do I restart the luna system ? Jul 09 05:40:44 hopefully though Palm will beat us to it Jul 09 05:40:55 Yeah psykoz, I hope so Jul 09 05:40:58 bhuey: apparently it restarts on it's own Jul 09 05:41:01 Apple did it...eventually Jul 09 05:41:09 well... it is still not great LOL Jul 09 05:41:15 it's having problems restarting right now Jul 09 05:41:20 or > initctl start LunaSysMg Jul 09 05:41:25 ok Jul 09 05:41:34 well the things they've implemented with the OMAP are sorta out of spec in some ways, and actually also look sort of rushed ;) Jul 09 05:41:37 that's using psykoz bits Jul 09 05:42:05 there's a lot in the code that looks rushed Jul 09 05:42:13 random comments about future cleanup and the like Jul 09 05:42:15 sushi2: doesn't work Jul 09 05:42:15 No kidding, we all know webOS was rushed :P Jul 09 05:42:22 looking at the code Jul 09 05:42:26 works remarkably well, considering Jul 09 05:42:36 A lot of things are in it but not finished Jul 09 05:42:56 initctl doesn't exist Jul 09 05:43:21 it does, you probably didn't create a proper home directory with the appropriate paths Jul 09 05:43:57 ah try /sbin/initctl... Jul 09 05:44:13 I rebooted it instead, gonna have to wait for it Jul 09 05:44:25 http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/08/google-names-chrome-os-compatriots-dell-noticeably-absent/ Texas Instruments :D Jul 09 05:44:28 I have the same problem - haven't adjusted my paths yet either Jul 09 05:44:36 Pre + Chrome :D Jul 09 05:44:42 need to remember how Jul 09 05:44:44 ha Jul 09 05:45:08 I <3's me some TI Jul 09 05:45:15 * psykoz hides the fact he's from Texas ;( Jul 09 05:45:25 LOL Jul 09 05:51:31 Stupid FIA Jul 09 05:56:49 stupid dtmf tones - where are you Jul 09 06:04:13 http://predev.wikidot.com/browser-plugins Jul 09 06:04:25 working sample browser plugins that draw to the screen ftw Jul 09 06:08:11 destinal = awesom Jul 09 06:08:12 e Jul 09 06:08:35 nice work dest Jul 09 06:08:49 thanks Jul 09 06:09:16 destinal = my father Jul 09 06:09:22 :O Jul 09 06:09:29 NO! That can't be Jul 09 06:09:30 not literally Eguy Jul 09 06:09:40 it's a term of deep respect towards men without crossing the homo-suggestive barrier Jul 09 06:09:46 ROFL Jul 09 06:10:20 not that this has anything to do with webos development so i will proceed to shoot myself in the face Jul 09 06:10:37 i was interested today though, the 1.0.4 update seems to make my pre GPS update faster - not sure if it's in my head or two loads of awesome too Jul 09 06:10:39 to go* Jul 09 06:10:58 i ran google maps in an underground bar today after the phone slept in my pocket for like since before i went in and didn't run maps at all the entire day Jul 09 06:11:04 when i launched it, BAM, intersection where I was Jul 09 06:11:04 AgentSmith: lol browser plugins inside luna aren't webos now? Jul 09 06:11:20 Yup, pre is pretty cool Jul 09 06:11:28 naw destinal i mean my off-topic crap isn't :-D Jul 09 06:11:32 aha Jul 09 06:11:48 watercooler Jul 09 06:11:50 :P Jul 09 06:11:57 hahahaha Jul 09 06:12:06 yeah, i just wanted to give destinal props and also share my interesting presperience tofday Jul 09 06:12:08 so if anyone's interested on working on a terminal app let me know Jul 09 06:12:15 me too Jul 09 06:12:15 so im guessing palm.com/rom not working Jul 09 06:12:18 i am interested but not sure if time is allowed Jul 09 06:12:28 that's kind of where I want to go with this Jul 09 06:12:43 destinal: I'd love a terminal app Jul 09 06:12:55 destinal: but I'm not a helpful coder Jul 09 06:13:06 sushi2: I think it's high on everyone's list, yeah Jul 09 06:13:06 destinal: testing and bug hunting, yes Jul 09 06:13:11 What sushi said :P Jul 09 06:13:14 i'd be all over helping where i can though Jul 09 06:13:19 i can write comments ;) Jul 09 06:13:27 The commander app does not cut the mustard for me Jul 09 06:13:33 LOL Jul 09 06:13:38 ok, well once I get something worth testing and commenting I'll make sure to ask :) Jul 09 06:13:47 / This function is WACK, it does backflips over weiner dogs in the snow Jul 09 06:13:54 lol Jul 09 06:13:54 i mean seriously, can that comment be any more clear? Jul 09 06:14:00 also IRC ate my first slash Jul 09 06:14:12 oh Jul 09 06:14:18 I was going to say you need 2 slashes LOL Jul 09 06:14:29 / /river Jul 09 06:14:32 that works hmm Jul 09 06:14:34 //bay Jul 09 06:14:38 leading space Jul 09 06:15:05 anyrate, i got nothing to contribute here so I"ll go back to lurking :) - lemme know on the terminal though, i can try to contribute where i can Jul 09 06:17:00 lol Jul 09 06:17:01 destinal: how are plugins? I've been busy with something else Jul 09 06:17:21 tmzt: you were right about draw events. I capture them and draw now :) Jul 09 06:17:43 cool Jul 09 06:17:54 could you port vte now? Jul 09 06:18:15 vte? Jul 09 06:18:47 the base widget for gnometerminal, etc. Jul 09 06:18:53 maybe it's zvte Jul 09 06:19:16 it's mostly gdk based I think Jul 09 06:19:18 I'll check it out Jul 09 06:19:37 you can use pixbuf as a rendering destination Jul 09 06:19:43 yes Jul 09 06:19:58 do you have test code? Jul 09 06:20:08 what have you been able to draw? Jul 09 06:20:20 zvt is the old one, vte is the new one :-) Jul 09 06:20:35 ("new") Jul 09 06:20:36 ok, thanks Jul 09 06:20:36 I didn't spend much time on it, I got a blue card tonight and packaged it up figuring the higher the fewer Jul 09 06:20:45 or uh, the more accessible the code the better people can help Jul 09 06:20:46 http://predev.wikidot.com/browser-plugins Jul 09 06:21:40 it's in the git repo Jul 09 06:22:13 destinal: pretty win however cheesy the test code might be ;-) rockin' stuff! Jul 09 06:22:41 jdub: thanks Jul 09 06:24:53 ugh - there is dtmf code everywhere Jul 09 06:24:53 jdub: what's up? Jul 09 06:25:16 just found the actual tones Jul 09 06:25:39 sushi2: why care you about the dual tones? what do you seek in the multiple frequncies? Jul 09 06:25:48 You can try rename the sounds Jul 09 06:26:06 renaming* Jul 09 06:26:10 well, they are the base sounds, so I renamed the dtmf.txt file Jul 09 06:26:15 man wtf is with me spelling and grammar Jul 09 06:26:15 rebooting to test Jul 09 06:27:15 my? :) Jul 09 06:27:34 denied Jul 09 06:27:36 sigh Jul 09 06:27:50 you renamed the files? Jul 09 06:29:03 it's just one file Jul 09 06:29:25 it's under /etc/audio/dtmf.txt Jul 09 06:29:46 of course, it may not be calling that file, but the details of the file contain the dtmf tones Jul 09 06:30:13 I seriously doubt there are wav/mp3/wma files for the dtmf tones Jul 09 06:30:15 sadly Jul 09 06:30:20 bzhou * r10434 optware/trunk/ (make/php.mk sources/php/php-5.2.10-date.patch): php: patch for http://bugs.php.net/bug.php?id=48276 Jul 09 06:30:52 Why not? It plays a tone Jul 09 06:31:36 what are you trying to do anyway? Jul 09 06:32:09 egads Jul 09 06:32:24 tmzt: trying to completely silence the dtmf Jul 09 06:32:45 I can give you a rm command but you don't want it Jul 09 06:32:47 eguy: there are sounds Jul 09 06:32:48 wait Jul 09 06:33:04 what plays them? Jul 09 06:33:08 under /usr/share/systemsounds/dtmf_... Jul 09 06:33:11 the dialer Jul 09 06:33:20 after a call is in session Jul 09 06:33:26 yeah, generating sine wavs just for that makes no sense Jul 09 06:33:35 if you can already playwavs Jul 09 06:33:37 funny that they have them listed Jul 09 06:33:40 play wavs Jul 09 06:33:41 but you are right Jul 09 06:34:06 you want to silence them in a call? Jul 09 06:34:17 yep Jul 09 06:34:58 but not when dialing? Jul 09 06:35:04 is dialer js? Jul 09 06:35:09 no, silence always Jul 09 06:35:22 I've got them silienced in the dialer Jul 09 06:35:39 but once you initiate a call, the tones become audible Jul 09 06:36:01 just moved all the dtmf*.pcm files to another dir and rebooting Jul 09 06:36:16 you sure switchside/baseband isn't echoing DTMF back to you and it's unavoidable? Jul 09 06:36:26 ah Jul 09 06:36:36 maybe Jul 09 06:36:39 that could be, but haven't experienced that in a long time Jul 09 06:36:51 the sprint winmo phone I have doesn't do that Jul 09 06:37:01 hmm Jul 09 06:37:03 this is easy I think though Jul 09 06:37:10 you would think, right? Jul 09 06:37:11 get the pa spy program Jul 09 06:37:17 but the dtmf is all over the map Jul 09 06:37:26 mentions of it all over the place Jul 09 06:37:49 I thought it was like what AgentSmith said Jul 09 06:37:56 sorry: don't know about the spy program Jul 09 06:38:39 pactl list Jul 09 06:38:47 g'night all Jul 09 06:38:50 write a program that realtime notch-filters the audio to remove any freq used by DTMF ;) Jul 09 06:38:51 see if the samples are in there Jul 09 06:38:52 night destinal Jul 09 06:38:54 moving the pcm files didn't help Jul 09 06:39:01 Cya destinal, good work today! Jul 09 06:39:08 destinal_sleep: gitweb please? Jul 09 06:39:19 boggle - why are they even in there? Jul 09 06:39:41 tmzt: gitweb as opposed to gitorious? Jul 09 06:39:52 no, the url Jul 09 06:39:54 sorry Jul 09 06:39:58 oh Jul 09 06:40:04 it's on the wiki I thought, hang on Jul 09 06:40:06 same as everything else? Jul 09 06:40:31 it's part of the applications repository Jul 09 06:40:33 http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications Jul 09 06:40:44 ok, night Jul 09 06:41:00 directories are basicplugin for the .so and org.webosinternals.helloplugin for the app that calls it Jul 09 06:42:07 tmzt: good luck, I have a feeling it'll be pretty easy to do cool stuff from here Jul 09 06:42:50 If I didn't have to sleep I would use pthreads and seperate the plugin from backend processing and port an app Jul 09 06:43:09 ChanServ does not have to sleep :P Jul 09 06:43:20 too* Jul 09 06:43:23 let's make ChanServ write the code then Jul 09 06:43:27 :P Jul 09 06:43:28 you find PGSurface? Jul 09 06:43:34 Good idea Jul 09 06:43:42 tmzt: yes, I haven't dug into it yet but that would be the next logical step Jul 09 06:43:44 He's not doing anything now :P Jul 09 06:43:52 ok Jul 09 06:44:03 is there a way of enabling usbnet on the pre ? Jul 09 06:44:04 tmzt: be warned, there are missing headers Jul 09 06:44:04 cool, tomorrow then Jul 09 06:44:11 I intend to write and ask Jul 09 06:44:14 about them Jul 09 06:44:26 I've seen some howtos from a Google search but I'm having problems with the OS X driver for doing this Jul 09 06:44:56 cdc-ether? Jul 09 06:45:02 usbnet enable ? Jul 09 06:45:12 yeah, tried to do that Jul 09 06:45:21 Worked for me Jul 09 06:45:21 tmzt: if you get a chance to hack on it in the next several hours, let me know what you find Jul 09 06:45:26 the interface doesn't show up. this is a 10.5.7 machine Jul 09 06:46:04 Ohhhhh, I'm sorry Jul 09 06:46:13 :P Jul 09 06:49:56 great Jul 09 06:50:04 + unsigned int *screenBuffer = (unsigned int*) drawEvent->dstBuffer; Jul 09 06:50:04 + // Draw a blue card - w00t Jul 09 06:50:04 + for(int i = 0 ;i < 320*480 ; i++) screenBuffer[i] = 0xaabbccdd ; Jul 09 06:50:10 yay de*st Jul 09 06:51:36 I guess that's full screen then Jul 09 06:51:42 yea Jul 09 06:51:53 will the UI still crop it at corners? Jul 09 06:52:13 I think it's composited Jul 09 06:52:45 hey guys, have a listen to the PreCentral PalmCast Episode 67 - we get a mention at 29:45 onwards ... Jul 09 06:52:47 directories are basicplugin for the .so and org.webosinternals.helloplugin for the app that calls it Jul 09 06:53:00 Woot! Nice going Rod Jul 09 06:53:09 I don't know if that means a binary though Jul 09 06:53:10 I just downloaded it, I still gotta listen Jul 09 06:53:40 Dieter mentions running quilt :-) Jul 09 06:53:52 sushi2: did you get it? are the tones listed in pactl list ? Jul 09 06:53:56 He knows it :D Jul 09 06:54:18 ? Jul 09 06:59:52 big mention of apache running on the Pre Jul 09 07:00:24 Good PalmCast Jul 09 07:01:00 apple must love having the palmcast in the itunes store Jul 09 07:01:08 hahaha Jul 09 07:05:54 Mention of the media player bookmark hack Jul 09 07:06:45 noob help, palm hack, please? Jul 09 07:10:28 Dieter wants a mod so that after you delete a message, it goes to the next unread. Jul 09 07:11:30 Me too :D Jul 09 07:11:45 I would like a tick box... PALM Jul 09 07:11:45 * button nods. Jul 09 07:12:23 well, there's a lot of netscape stuff in that code we probably don't need Jul 09 07:12:52 and draw event stride and dstBottom should be used for drawing Jul 09 07:13:25 it's also not clear whether scale factor is needed or if the compositor handles that stuff Jul 09 07:13:52 a simple npapi which is abi compatible should be usable Jul 09 07:14:59 this will give us a simple build environment, no webkit or mozilla source or headers needed Jul 09 07:15:29 XP_UNIX is used? Jul 09 07:15:47 I guess I need to check Makefile Jul 09 07:15:59 Eguy: I think it's a one line change in the email app Jul 09 07:16:06 anybody here know how to get the ipkg openssh to allow root login ? Jul 09 07:16:16 bhuey: add an ssh key Jul 09 07:16:25 and a root password Jul 09 07:16:31 XP refers to xpfe which is mozilla stuff not netscape Jul 09 07:16:46 bhuey: then use the ssh key to log in as root Jul 09 07:16:54 can anyone build and test a ram based sketch pad? Jul 09 07:17:10 that will verify pen events work Jul 09 07:17:22 tmzt I didn't look at the pactl list yet - I'll check that tomorrow - thx Jul 09 07:17:56 rwhitby: should this stuff be part of optware or oe feeds? Jul 09 07:18:07 tmzt: which stuff Jul 09 07:18:28 native plugins/apps Jul 09 07:18:36 native plugins/js apps Jul 09 07:18:46 anyone famillier with account managment on the PRE? Jul 09 07:19:01 vi /etc/passwd Jul 09 07:19:05 tmzt: we're putting them in the gitorious repo at the moment, and someone can write a gui app which installs them from there (e.g. with ipkg-opt) Jul 09 07:19:48 well, sketchpad looks like the next step Jul 09 07:20:16 then clean up headers Jul 09 07:21:54 that becomes hello world and needs to be packaged with appropriate scripts and other infrastructure Jul 09 07:22:07 as well as bitbake files Jul 09 07:23:53 so we have some consistency in building native plugins Jul 09 07:25:07 rwhitby: what about enabling root login ? Jul 09 07:25:19 I did that and I was hoping for password based authentication Jul 09 07:25:54 don't you have to permit that to happen before you can even pretend that you can do a root login ? Jul 09 07:26:10 bhuey: we don't support password based root login, only ssh key based. Jul 09 07:27:04 if you really want password based root login, you'll need to read up on the options for dropbear or openssh - I won't be writing how here, cause we don't want to lower the security of the device compared to what it has out of the box Jul 09 07:27:22 shadow passwords aren't supported? Jul 09 07:28:02 isn't shadow passwords orthogonal to password-based root login ? Jul 09 07:28:35 I thought passwordless login and su wouldn't be supported Jul 09 07:28:57 I mean how are they insecure? Jul 09 07:29:21 tmzt: who's talking about passwordless login or su? Jul 09 07:29:42 we we're two weeks ago Jul 09 07:29:53 rwhitby: I need it for rsync Jul 09 07:30:01 when the descision to use pk was made Jul 09 07:30:04 bhuey: you can rsync with keys Jul 09 07:30:14 yeah, in that case Jul 09 07:30:28 the problem here is that root login doesn't work and i don't know why yet Jul 09 07:30:49 bhuey: have you set a root password, and installed an authorized_keys file with the correct permissions? Jul 09 07:31:19 I've set the root passwd, but not used the key yet Jul 09 07:31:33 I have to dig through logs next Jul 09 07:31:39 bhuey: right, we only support login via keys. Jul 09 07:31:42 (for root) Jul 09 07:32:00 but for every other user, it can be passwd based, right ? Jul 09 07:32:24 you need to set a root password (which is then not used for anything) because ssh daemons correctly refuse to allow root logins at all if root has no password. Jul 09 07:32:33 yes, any other user can use password logins Jul 09 07:32:33 right Jul 09 07:32:35 I set that Jul 09 07:32:49 bhuey: ok, so install some keys. Jul 09 07:33:38 * bhuey tries to remember how to do this Jul 09 07:33:43 and then use agent forwarding so you don't need to store your private ssh key on the Pre. Jul 09 07:34:38 bhuey: have a look in http://predev.wikidot.com/applying-patches for how to generate and install keys Jul 09 07:38:15 I accidently set a root password trying to set a user password. how screwed am I? Jul 09 07:38:30 Didn't work? Jul 09 07:39:07 worked fine, but will normal device operations be messed up if root is changed? Jul 09 07:39:29 rwhitby: thanks, works perfectly. I wouldn't have been able to get it going without your bit of information Jul 09 07:39:32 I thought you reset it Jul 09 07:39:42 rwhitby: I did the old school way. Jul 09 07:40:07 I set it to blank, but they're saying that blank and ssh don't mix Jul 09 07:41:20 RGandhi3k: should be fine Jul 09 07:41:49 RGandhi3k: unless you're using keys, you won't be logging is as root anyway Jul 09 07:42:46 ok Jul 09 07:42:51 thx Jul 09 07:42:59 That is what I figured Jul 09 07:43:25 Getting my puck tomorrow, very excited :) Jul 09 07:44:03 you should be. So to putty in, just the ip addr and the port, no special settings? Jul 09 07:45:15 does webos doctor work in linux? Jul 09 07:45:41 RGandhi3k: which wiki page are you following? Jul 09 07:46:02 analog1: no Jul 09 07:46:07 dropbear install, sorry Jul 09 07:46:25 RGandhi3k: url please, just to be sure. Jul 09 07:46:36 anyone tried webos doctor in wine? Jul 09 07:46:54 haha, wrong host :) Jul 09 07:46:57 predev.wikidot.com/dropbear-install Jul 09 07:55:52 rofl wtf http://www.precentral.net/email-landscape-mode-no-rooting-required Jul 09 07:56:04 rwhitby: hmm, new problem, ssh works but rsync doesn't Jul 09 07:56:12 it keeps prompting me for a passwd Jul 09 07:56:17 and fails Jul 09 07:59:05 can you try ssh -v Jul 09 07:59:13 oh Jul 09 07:59:30 is rsync in your path? Jul 09 07:59:30 can you try ssh -v Jul 09 07:59:30 bhuey: you'll need to give me some more context. which OS are you coming from, what are source and target devices, which ssh daemon on the target, where are your private keys, where are your public keys, what exact command line are you using, etc etc Jul 09 08:02:15 * bhuey thinks Jul 09 08:02:27 rwhitby: os x which is basically a BSD Jul 09 08:02:33 I think I I figured it out Jul 09 08:02:43 I need to play with identity files on the -e with rsync Jul 09 08:02:57 bhuey: yep, that would do it. Jul 09 08:03:23 ...os x which is basically BSD that you have to pay for Jul 09 08:03:29 :D Jul 09 08:03:44 whats up pplz Jul 09 08:04:34 rwhitby: ok, still a no go... Jul 09 08:04:51 I've passed -e "ssh -p 222" in my rsync command line Jul 09 08:05:00 the ssh root login works perfectly Jul 09 08:05:12 and -v Jul 09 08:05:23 also -vvr on rsync Jul 09 08:05:49 "-e ssh -p 222 -v" Jul 09 08:06:34 rsync either needs to be in the path or somwhere specific Jul 09 08:09:34 something with the remote identification failed Jul 09 08:09:36 the log is long Jul 09 08:09:43 right Jul 09 08:10:00 tmzt: you're talking about the remote rsync right ? Jul 09 08:10:22 yes Jul 09 08:10:35 indntification failed? Jul 09 08:10:49 then ssh is still broken Jul 09 08:11:19 yeah Jul 09 08:11:38 it works with the regular keys and allows me to login otherwise perfectly Jul 09 08:11:52 so I'm at a loss Jul 09 08:12:09 it Jul 09 08:12:30 it's normal for some methods to fail Jul 09 08:12:32 bhuey: which remote ssh daemon is being used to start rsync? Jul 09 08:12:37 read the log carefully Jul 09 08:12:48 rwhitby: not sure Jul 09 08:12:54 that's a good point Jul 09 08:13:08 I have /opt/bin/.... stuff so maybe it's not using the right one, right ? Jul 09 08:15:56 crap Jul 09 08:16:37 wait, this is a two way link, right ? Jul 09 08:16:42 * bhuey goes to look Jul 09 08:18:00 no good Jul 09 08:19:17 ? Jul 09 08:22:36 nailed it :) Jul 09 08:22:42 I'm a loser Jul 09 08:22:47 Censored Count FTW Jul 09 08:23:20 I sudo the command so it was really root that was running it. :) Jul 09 08:23:31 so O blew the keys by getting the wrong user authenticated Jul 09 08:23:36 duh Jul 09 08:23:54 :) Jul 09 08:24:10 keys? Jul 09 08:24:18 thanks for the hand holding Jul 09 08:24:24 ah Jul 09 08:24:28 yeah, i need to put the root key in Jul 09 08:24:29 got it Jul 09 08:24:45 no the key of the user that executing the sudo Jul 09 08:24:47 your local private key? Jul 09 08:24:56 *not* the key of the user that executing the sudo Jul 09 08:25:15 yeah, wrong user for the local private key, it needed to be root as well Jul 09 08:25:27 er, local public key Jul 09 08:25:37 thanks Jul 09 08:25:41 * bhuey bails for a bit Jul 09 08:29:01 palm implement its own 2d and 3d graphics stack by /usr/lib/libPiranha.so, hehe Jul 09 08:30:56 oh? Jul 09 08:31:23 hardware 3d at all? Jul 09 08:32:12 yeah Jul 09 08:32:27 what kernel interface? Jul 09 08:32:47 I looked in the kernel and didn Jul 09 08:32:57 didn't see any Jul 09 08:32:59 on x86 emulator i saw class PSoftMatrix3D in the lib Jul 09 08:33:30 how is that hardware? Jul 09 08:35:10 some chip manufactured by a UK company Jul 09 08:36:24 ? Jul 09 08:37:53 I mean where did you find that lib uses gpu other than framebuffer and page flipping? Jul 09 08:39:48 indeed i do not have a pre. i only looked into the x86 emulator Jul 09 08:40:11 ah Jul 09 08:40:21 is piranah used on device? Jul 09 08:42:12 i think so , you can take a look using : /lib/ld-linux.so.2 --list /usr/lib/libWebKitLuna.so Jul 09 08:42:47 yeah Jul 09 08:43:03 I think we have source for that Jul 09 08:43:21 really? Jul 09 08:45:10 you can look the functions in libPiranha on your device using : nm -C -A /usr/lib/libPiranha.so Jul 09 08:45:13 opensource.palm.com 1.0.4 Jul 09 08:45:27 I don't have a pre either Jul 09 08:47:20 I did not find the libPiranha source in it, palm only opened the GPL source Jul 09 08:47:44 no Jul 09 08:47:48 webkitluna Jul 09 08:48:01 can you give me a nm Jul 09 08:48:56 i install it via optware. you can find a howto on predev.wikidot.com Jul 09 08:54:15 tmzt: when is opengl going to come on the pre ? do you know ? Jul 09 08:54:18 that's a major API Jul 09 08:54:51 no Jul 09 08:55:08 I don't know Jul 09 08:55:27 I mean it looks to me like kernel support is missing Jul 09 08:55:45 for opengl ? Jul 09 08:55:52 why not just use mesagl ? Jul 09 08:56:08 btw, is there a more sensible way of resetting the pre without having to pull the battery Jul 09 08:56:11 ? Jul 09 08:58:51 got it :) Jul 09 08:59:05 hold the power button down and flip the ringer switch 6 times Jul 09 08:59:30 I'm really impressed with how this is basically just a plain Linux box and how much you can do with it Jul 09 08:59:46 it's just unbelievable that all of this hardware is driven by really great software Jul 09 09:01:27 tmzt: in x86 emulator ,its obviously a software implement Jul 09 09:01:41 right Jul 09 09:02:37 and I dont think palm will open the source Jul 09 09:04:14 of what? Jul 09 09:04:50 the graphics codes Jul 09 09:05:02 right Jul 09 09:05:21 do you have nm of webkitluna? Jul 09 09:05:32 paste that please, five days Jul 09 09:05:48 palm have opened the webcore source Jul 09 09:06:07 yes Jul 09 09:06:13 they had to Jul 09 09:06:43 depending on your reading og lgpl Jul 09 09:07:04 they did have to release source for their .o Jul 09 09:07:52 what have they released source for that they didn't have to release? (apart from webOS, which is not a source release since it's under NDA) Jul 09 09:08:50 and i looked into their webcore to find how in hell they implement the cool ui, and i found that the core graphic part missing and put in libPiraha Jul 09 09:09:17 ameng: what's the API between webcore and libPirahna ? Jul 09 09:10:27 it seems that in a header file called PContex.h Jul 09 09:12:19 ameng: have you found PPixmap.h ? Jul 09 09:16:42 now I dont have source at hand Jul 09 09:17:16 I think PPixmap.h is also missing Jul 09 09:17:42 I haven't been able to find PPixmap.h ... Jul 09 09:18:40 tmzt: if I make the root volume writable, I can do what I want with /var right ? Jul 09 09:19:03 it seems they implement their own graphics stack on framebuffer just as qt embedded done Jul 09 09:19:13 I'm running that rsync and it seems to be doing nothing Jul 09 09:21:34 crap Jul 09 09:23:33 i think it's possible to port the cool webos to some armv7 compatible boards Jul 09 09:23:46 is there some funky write permission stuff with the pre that I don't know about ? Jul 09 09:23:51 regarding the volumes ? Jul 09 09:24:01 where something like a big rsync would fail ? Jul 09 09:25:06 we have context Jul 09 09:25:14 not pixmap Jul 09 09:25:49 look under applications on git Jul 09 09:25:52 bhuey: / is ro by default Jul 09 09:25:54 orius Jul 09 09:25:56 tmzt: I just tried to an rsync of some date to var but the rsync isn't showing the file changes Jul 09 09:26:06 rwhitby: is that what you think is going on ? Jul 09 09:26:07 -vvr ? Jul 09 09:26:25 bhuey: if you haven't made it rw, you won't be able to write. Jul 09 09:26:30 rootfs_open -w Jul 09 09:26:31 ? Jul 09 09:26:34 oh ok Jul 09 09:26:36 if you're just reading from the Pre it should be fine Jul 09 09:27:15 yeah, I thought that the above command line would do it, but I guess not. Jul 09 09:27:22 rwhitby: are you a palm dev ? Jul 09 09:27:55 bhuey: nope, I won't sign the current NDA (haven't seen it myself, but have seen excerpts) Jul 09 09:28:20 current NDA prevents development of homebrew apps outside of the Palm app catalog Jul 09 09:28:43 (according to report on PreCentral with excerpts from the NDA text) Jul 09 09:29:12 even in hard economic times you say "no" ? Jul 09 09:29:41 bhuey: I wouldn't call myself an app developer, Jul 09 09:29:55 and I have a 150% full time job already ... Jul 09 09:30:04 crap, still no writing via rsync Jul 09 09:30:13 rwhitby: do we have a textual description of the requirements for a js app Jul 09 09:30:36 rwhitby: I use to live in the valley Jul 09 09:30:38 like what it needs to contain Jul 09 09:30:38 tmzt: gitorious repo has sample apps Jul 09 09:30:40 and the book is not under NDA Jul 09 09:30:45 I'd like to avoid it again if I can Jul 09 09:31:19 bhuey: I lived in SJ for a year. Much prefer my country of birth (.au) Jul 09 09:31:42 (well, Mountain View, not San Jose, and worked in Santa Clara) Jul 09 09:31:46 SJ is a crap hole, I use to live in Palo Alto, but that's suburban hell Jul 09 09:31:52 MV is better Jul 09 09:32:38 AU is best ;-) Jul 09 09:33:25 never been there Jul 09 09:33:28 I live in San Diego Jul 09 09:33:34 SD is nice Jul 09 09:33:42 the live style here is very different but I miss the San Francisco bay are culture and diversity Jul 09 09:33:52 * rwhitby bbl (dinner) Jul 09 09:33:59 SD is my home town Jul 09 09:34:00 later Jul 09 09:34:24 MV? Jul 09 09:34:29 any suggestions on the getting the the files over ? a simple rsync should just work right assuming that I have all of the ssh bits in place, eh ? Jul 09 09:34:35 mountain view Jul 09 09:34:38 ok Jul 09 09:34:55 add -vvr remove -v from ssh Jul 09 09:34:59 this has taken 12x more time that I thought it should have Jul 09 09:35:09 yeah, rsync should work Jul 09 09:35:19 or just scp -r Jul 09 09:35:24 tmzt: I don't have additional options other than -p in my ssh parameters Jul 09 09:35:28 would have been faster Jul 09 09:35:30 rsync is better Jul 09 09:35:33 bhuey: you're sshing direct as root, rather than doing any sudo stuff, right? Jul 09 09:35:47 right, directly as root Jul 09 09:35:55 but it's not syncing the files over, bizarre Jul 09 09:36:41 dropbear should work, but you might want to try openssh as the daemon on the pre, and change the optware-openssh upstart script to use the normal port 22 Jul 09 09:38:16 I'm using openssh Jul 09 09:38:25 it works but this rsync thing doesn't help Jul 09 09:38:38 right, good idea Jul 09 09:38:51 then it really will be standard linux stuff Jul 09 09:38:51 we use rsync with dropbear from optware on embedded routers and NAS boxes all the time and it works fine. Jul 09 09:39:21 yeah, something about this environment is kind of crazy Jul 09 09:39:39 I should be working on the Linux scheduler but this Palm thing has kind of temporarily taken over my mind Jul 09 09:40:56 schedular? Jul 09 09:41:07 in the kernel? Jul 09 09:42:17 yeah Jul 09 09:42:32 how do I restart the ssh process simply ? Jul 09 09:42:49 initctl Jul 09 09:43:06 specifically and correctly ? Jul 09 09:43:26 to tired for that Jul 09 09:43:35 wiki? Jul 09 09:44:03 url ? Jul 09 09:44:22 got it Jul 09 09:45:00 bhuey: initctl stop optware-dropbear Jul 09 09:45:08 initctl start optware-openssh Jul 09 09:45:08 etc Jul 09 09:45:13 they don't have a restart Jul 09 09:45:15 ok thanks Jul 09 09:46:51 it's not liking it Jul 09 09:47:03 and I changed it to port 22 Jul 09 09:49:47 bah Jul 09 09:58:34 weird. if I had a Pre I'd try and replicate what you're doing. Jul 09 09:58:56 because you find it to be interesting ? Jul 09 09:59:07 might be a firewall thing or something like that Jul 09 10:02:09 well, a single file copy works Jul 09 10:02:17 let's start adding options Jul 09 10:02:56 work as root as well for a single file Jul 09 10:02:58 interesting Jul 09 10:05:28 single files write to the / as well, nice Jul 09 10:05:32 let's up the options Jul 09 10:06:58 it's working Jul 09 10:07:00 bizarre Jul 09 10:07:32 wifi is 10x faster than bluetooth Jul 09 10:07:41 100KBytes/sec Jul 09 10:07:54 versus a megabyte per second **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Jul 09 10:11:52 2009 Jul 09 10:14:00 ok, looks like I need quotes for sudo Jul 09 10:26:44 ok, big moment now Jul 09 10:26:52 see if this palm has completely crapped out Jul 09 10:27:06 rebooting Jul 09 10:28:29 taking a while to boot, give it more time Jul 09 10:28:56 * bhuey wonders if there's console access for this device Jul 09 10:28:58 damn, it looks like it worked Jul 09 10:33:31 still verifying this Jul 09 10:33:40 but it looks like it worked perfectly Jul 09 10:37:28 rwhitby: you there ? Jul 09 10:37:53 this is what I did, I didn't want to be called a crank before but it looks like it works perfectly now Jul 09 10:38:06 I di a full image backup of the Palm Pre using rsync Jul 09 10:38:12 di=did Jul 09 10:38:18 correction Jul 09 10:38:35 a partial image back up using rsync and find -mtime Jul 09 10:38:56 I backed it up as root so that all of the ownership permissions, etc... would be preserved Jul 09 10:39:19 I was just successful at restoring the contents of the old phone over to the new one, it works perfectly Jul 09 10:39:26 I have the scripts for it for my setup Jul 09 10:39:34 * bhuey is completely happpy :) Jul 09 10:59:47 hey Jul 09 11:23:38 bhuey: nice work Jul 09 11:24:15 bhuey: want to put the procedure on the wiki? Jul 09 11:26:09 whats nice work? Jul 09 11:35:26 lol none of the built in apps use radio buttons? Jul 09 11:36:47 does sometimes your gps work sometimes not? Jul 09 11:37:14 especially in sprint nav Jul 09 11:38:34 yeah Jul 09 11:38:43 sometimes i think the allow/dont allow gets screwed up Jul 09 11:38:47 because google maps will be working Jul 09 11:38:51 and sprint nav wont Jul 09 11:40:55 blau-mikeDG: right Jul 09 11:42:15 ive been meaning to do some testing Jul 09 11:42:22 but i dont know how to retrigger that allow/disallow dialog Jul 09 11:45:00 i hope palm know about the issue Jul 09 11:45:30 i was hoping that it was just my finger missing the allow button Jul 09 11:45:35 or canceling the dialog somehow Jul 09 11:45:40 nah Jul 09 11:45:47 u allow it and it cant get the location Jul 09 11:46:07 and if u close the app and reopen it it won't ask u for the access to gps Jul 09 11:46:10 again Jul 09 11:46:44 so what i did yesterday was to allow autolocate and restarted the pre Jul 09 11:47:06 and then it worked Jul 09 11:47:20 some ppl reported that they have to restart pre to get sprint nav working again Jul 09 11:47:24 which is a bummer Jul 09 11:48:57 grr icant find an emial in gmail Jul 09 11:49:22 maybe gmail screws up if you only have bcc Jul 09 11:50:34 rwhitby: sure, how ? Jul 09 11:51:19 it's not going to be a generic case, it's got to be customized for the situation and how many files you alter and stuff Jul 09 11:52:40 i have a bunch of formatting issues with radio buttons :( Jul 09 12:06:13 fuck Jul 09 12:06:16 data loss again grrr Jul 09 12:12:29 sigh :( Jul 09 12:13:37 bhuey: create an account at wikidot.com, and then join the predev wiki using the password I /msg'd you Jul 09 12:28:05 stupid web os calendar alerts dont let you view the event :/ Jul 09 13:26:49 any forsight into if they are going to do an update this week ? Jul 09 13:29:33 I enabled timestamps on all messages on the Pre by following the steps on this page: http://predev.wikidot.com/stock-application-mods. Is it possible to remove the regular timestamps that the Pre adds at various intervals and just use the ones added by the hack? It's a bit redundant with both. Jul 09 13:49:38 I wish someone at Palm would give us just the smallest heads up about OS updates... last time, the 'support' web page was ambiguous about the 'several updates for apps' or some such wording Jul 09 13:49:51 Sorry, it's off topic. :: end rant :: :) Jul 09 13:55:58 FreeTim3: You can rant off topic in #webos-watercooler Jul 09 13:59:13 heh Jul 09 14:00:19 Thanks DjK Jul 09 14:10:51 Did we start any wiki listing the file structure, is that allowed - ? Or are we mostly keeping just to the apps folder. I want to go to specific IPs sometimes so I want to edit /etc/hosts for example Jul 09 14:11:12 anyone was playing with the mms? Jul 09 14:11:30 when you try to send the pic to normal phone the pic is too big and it shows only 1/10 of a picture Jul 09 14:13:21 i wonder if we can use imagemagick Jul 09 14:13:26 to convert the pic to smaller size Jul 09 14:14:38 looks like sprint fixed MMS messaging last night :) Jul 09 14:15:01 i was just talking about mms Jul 09 14:15:29 and how they fixed it coz what bothers me most is that pre is sending too big picture for non-smartphones Jul 09 14:15:36 and u can only see 1/10 of a pic Jul 09 14:23:24 anyone even have google calendar take forever to sync? Mine seems like it hung Jul 09 14:25:09 now if only they could fix a2dp quality and wildcard ssl certificate support, my life would be complete. Jul 09 14:25:48 you never figured out bitpool stuff? Jul 09 14:26:16 also, what headphones do you use for a2dp? Jul 09 14:27:00 I have some motorola 805 Jul 09 14:27:43 d'you like them? they seem big Jul 09 14:28:28 helloo Jul 09 14:29:11 hi Jul 09 14:29:34 is anyone here using the Pre in 1x territory? Jul 09 14:29:54 has anyone thought about adding 'find' to the web browser? Jul 09 14:30:13 like the one in the pdf viwer? Jul 09 14:30:54 or could the webpages not be searched like the documents can Jul 09 14:31:25 well, if they're cached, they could arguably be searched Jul 09 14:32:19 I am looking at /usr/palm/applications/com.palm.app.pdfviewer/app/controllers/document-assistant.js Jul 09 14:32:42 I was wondering if anyone thought it was possible Jul 09 14:36:47 its probably possible Jul 09 14:41:24 can I port my bookmarks from my pc browser to the pre? Jul 09 14:41:45 write an app? Jul 09 14:42:51 I was wondering if anyone knew Jul 09 14:43:46 joesmith: try xmarks if all you want is to have access to your bookmarks in multiple locations Jul 09 14:44:29 thanks Jul 09 15:02:20 wats the directory for databases again? Jul 09 15:03:04 somewhere in /var ? Jul 09 15:03:41 var palm data Jul 09 15:06:28 oh the state location based on phone # is kewl Jul 09 15:10:48 what is the "home" button? Jul 09 15:11:17 center button? Jul 09 15:12:54 lol Jul 09 15:12:57 your right Jul 09 15:13:01 ty Jul 09 15:16:04 u fail Jul 09 15:16:04 ;P Jul 09 15:23:24 I do fail :( Jul 09 15:24:00 hmm they should get rid of the center button Jul 09 15:24:24 I didnt know what it was I never use it Jul 09 15:24:36 thats why I was so confused Jul 09 15:24:41 ;) Jul 09 15:25:41 i used to use it on the beginning Jul 09 15:25:54 but nut anylonger double swipe up is better Jul 09 15:26:23 I have been trying to remove the launcher button Jul 09 15:26:32 I want to put another app there Jul 09 15:26:35 bsiegel: elaborate on that MMS fix byt sprint Jul 09 15:26:46 u cant or maybe can who know Jul 09 15:27:10 the launcher icon is useless there Jul 09 15:27:20 when you can just swipe up Jul 09 15:27:21 :) Jul 09 15:27:31 yep Jul 09 15:27:43 my thoughts from day one Jul 09 15:27:59 I think you might be able to though Jul 09 15:28:01 http://forums.precentral.net/web-os-development/189712-my-home-screen-work-progress.html Jul 09 15:28:22 yes Jul 09 15:28:23 but look Jul 09 15:28:27 I dont know how he added all of the apps Jul 09 15:28:27 http://twitpic.com/9nikc at the pic Jul 09 15:28:43 it looks like this up is killing the orginal launcher Jul 09 15:28:56 hmm it says mhs Jul 09 15:28:58 because u have MHS top left not sprint Jul 09 15:29:08 must be an app then or something Jul 09 15:29:17 not the actual homescreen Jul 09 15:29:26 so it looks like this is app that works on the homescreen or something Jul 09 15:29:31 i didnt got access to it Jul 09 15:29:34 so idk how it works Jul 09 15:29:48 probably you can see that homescreen in card view Jul 09 15:29:49 hehehe Jul 09 15:30:16 playing tricks with alpha ? Jul 09 15:31:00 no :( Jul 09 15:31:38 i wanted an access but the guy was like no u from boston Jul 09 15:31:44 and yet u r polish Jul 09 15:31:45 ;( Jul 09 15:31:55 j/k Jul 09 15:31:56 looks like the palm.cdnetworks.net 404's last night were a temporary outage Jul 09 15:32:15 update is coming Jul 09 15:32:22 app catalog will go out of beta Jul 09 15:32:23 ;) Jul 09 15:32:27 i got this feeling Jul 09 15:32:29 [; Jul 09 15:32:30 en0x, i meant the image looks like they are playing tricks with the alpha of the card ... to see through it ? Jul 09 15:32:53 to me it looks like a nasty hack Jul 09 15:33:07 and alpha too Jul 09 15:33:12 u need alpha Jul 09 15:33:18 anyway u can do that in css Jul 09 15:33:41 so u can put a css on top of css so you can have alpha on alpha Jul 09 15:33:42 hehe Jul 09 15:34:02 looks like a nice work Jul 09 15:34:12 but still it doesn't replace real homescreen Jul 09 15:34:20 can you change the icon of palms stock apps Jul 09 15:34:21 to start out they were coming out with updates about every week on friday, so I could see a 1.0.5 tomorrow, possibly Jul 09 15:34:41 joesmith, there is an icon.png i believe which just changes Jul 09 15:35:00 ok thanks Jul 09 15:35:00 you can also rotate icons as the calendar app shows Jul 09 15:35:17 what you can't do, on the other hand, i believe is use css selectors on icons Jul 09 15:35:30 oh bad Jul 09 15:35:52 do you know where the icons are stored? Jul 09 15:35:53 eg, for the calendar icon they have 31 icons - one for each date .. as opposed to having a blank calendar and some css to layer the numbers on top Jul 09 15:36:00 joesmith, in the application directory Jul 09 15:36:15 joesmith, you should try exploring - and using 'find' in the filesystem Jul 09 15:36:21 it's a very good program Jul 09 15:38:19 I have been looking through the images but I can find the actual icons used for the launcher Jul 09 15:38:28 i see Jul 09 15:42:14 Found it Jul 09 15:42:42 yay Jul 09 15:44:24 where on sprint.com i can find if 15% discount was applied to my account? Jul 09 15:44:56 you have to check your bill...not sure if it shows online or not Jul 09 15:45:20 if you look at your bill online it should Jul 09 15:46:03 Employee Discount Sprint 15% -$10.50 Jul 09 15:46:05 yap got it Jul 09 15:49:37 * sugardave|work sports a hefty 25% discount. Jul 09 15:50:41 how'd you manage that? Jul 09 15:50:56 I'm sponging off my corporation Jul 09 15:50:59 oh Jul 09 15:51:03 who do you work for? Jul 09 15:51:05 I have a 25% also, from my credit union Jul 09 15:51:09 IBM Jul 09 15:51:14 IBM :) Jul 09 15:51:17 cool Jul 09 15:51:36 Though it seems sprint also accidentally applied it to my other old SERO line as well :) No complaints here Jul 09 15:51:36 * sugardave|work hopes he can get ahead of the IT guys on the Pre. Jul 09 15:51:46 bsiegel: nice! Jul 09 15:52:01 bsiegel: so you kept your sero line? Jul 09 15:52:07 in addition to an everything data? Jul 09 15:52:44 My partner is on the same bill as me, he's still using the good ol' sero plan Jul 09 15:52:57 hey LG, did you ever get past the "erase some shit" problem with the app catalog, or did you have to reflash? Jul 09 15:53:23 I converted mine to get the Pre... but at least it kept my plan addons (including PAM, which makes this whole tethering issue a non-starter for me) Jul 09 15:54:06 bsiegel: oh, I see. I'm contemplating if I want to upgrade to get the Pre Jul 09 15:54:14 * summatusmentis is on sero 500 Jul 09 15:54:28 but there's only 1x speeds + wifi where I am most of the time Jul 09 15:54:34 not sure the $60/mo is worth it Jul 09 15:54:38 if you don't use a lot of voice minutes, you may want to try to get the deaf plan . Jul 09 15:54:42 i think it's $40/mo ? Jul 09 15:55:08 That's what I had. In theory if you can get the everything employee plan which is $50, and the discount on top of it's only $37.50 a month Jul 09 15:55:53 but either way - plans are a bit off topic .. #webos material Jul 09 15:55:56 bpadalino|work: sorry, say that again? Jul 09 15:56:00 true Jul 09 15:56:04 oh, fair enough Jul 09 15:56:05 #webos-watercooler :D Jul 09 15:56:09 maybe #sprint material Jul 09 15:56:23 true Jul 09 15:58:36 in more on-topic news, smartreflex by itself seems to be working fine for me so far Jul 09 15:58:53 what is smartreflex? Jul 09 15:59:06 I'm not sure if it has resulted in any battery savings, but there hasnt been any instability so far Jul 09 15:59:06 cpu throttler Jul 09 15:59:07 :p Jul 09 15:59:31 it cuts back the cpu voltage when the cpu is doing less work Jul 09 15:59:46 bsiegel: so what was wrong with the MMS? Jul 09 16:00:42 en0x: there were a number of people who were unable to receive MMS messages at all. They "failed to download" - the common thread was that everyone that reported this issue had a replacement Pre Jul 09 16:01:12 I'm not sure what the problem was, but one user reported that sprint told him they were rolling out a fix last night and it should be working properly today, and sure enough, it does work Jul 09 16:02:01 i see Jul 09 16:02:14 anyway i'm looking into a tweak for MMS Jul 09 16:02:22 it sends too big picture Jul 09 16:02:26 a fix send to their pre? Jul 09 16:02:45 djk: no i believe it was sprint server side fix Jul 09 16:03:16 bsiegel: when you send mms to razor or other non smart phones the picture does not fit :P and u only see 1/10 of pic Jul 09 16:03:35 I figured. Just wondered. I'm having trouble getting my google calendar to display that was working yesterday Jul 09 16:03:39 idk what the issue is too big resolution for pic or does the messaging app scale the picture down? Jul 09 16:04:02 hm.. well that is sort of a problem on the receiving phone's end. I mean the Pre has no way to know what the receiving phone's requirements are Jul 09 16:04:26 coz i was sending few MMS to tmobile Jul 09 16:04:31 and they got only 1/10 pic Jul 09 16:04:35 on their screen Jul 09 16:04:47 so the workaround for them is to plug the phone to pc and copy the picture Jul 09 16:04:50 to pc Jul 09 16:05:14 they only got or could only view Jul 09 16:05:37 view Jul 09 16:07:47 which still sucks Jul 09 16:07:47 :P Jul 09 16:12:13 the doctor jar has been updated to 1.0.4 Jul 09 16:12:16 32852c4b57d938e85f0fc819e57eacb7 webosdoctorp100ewwsprint-1.0.4.jar Jul 09 16:13:55 en0x: so the suggestion of plug into the pc might work. I agree it might be good to have the option to scale the image size Jul 09 16:14:23 destinal: does that hint at a another update coming out ;-) Jul 09 16:15:16 djk: not necessarily. usually the doctor gets updated shortly after the release it is for. 1.0.3's was updated within a day or so of its release Jul 09 16:16:14 so they were just slow to catch it Jul 09 16:17:31 so it seems (not that it was very urgent as someone restoring with the 1.0.3 doctor will get prompted for the 1.0.4 OTA immediately now) Jul 09 16:19:01 just a reminder for everyone to keep the doctor jar's they have in case there's ever a need for those files. palm doesn't host anything but the latest and we can't legally distribute them Jul 09 16:21:46 hehe Jul 09 16:21:52 funny stuff i found Jul 09 16:22:09 http://wstaw.org/p/1977/ Jul 09 16:22:10 :) Jul 09 16:22:51 lol Jul 09 16:37:56 ok I have offically looked through every line of code under the browser app and I cant find where the actual bookmarks ar stored? Jul 09 16:39:23 destinal: there was conversation about pactl last night to help trace the dtmf tones - where can I find that tool? Jul 09 16:40:06 joesmith: probably the same db that my messed up google calendar is in Jul 09 16:40:13 lol Jul 09 16:40:22 sorry about that djk Jul 09 16:40:29 :-( Jul 09 16:40:46 wahoo Jul 09 16:40:49 Welcome to the Palm webos early access program Jul 09 16:40:53 finally Jul 09 16:41:03 :) Jul 09 16:41:18 I have deleted and added I have removed a shared calendar but still nothing displays. I get the alerts Jul 09 16:41:56 Exstatica: we expect you do start pushing some good stuff ;-) Jul 09 16:43:27 haha Jul 09 16:43:44 I have a term client i've been already working on, but now its going to be much easier Jul 09 16:44:02 yay Exstatica Jul 09 16:46:47 http://predev.wikidot.com/webos-doctor-version-1-0-4 Jul 09 16:47:39 how can I open a link in a new card? Jul 09 16:48:36 Exstatica: how are you going to do a terminal in mojo? Jul 09 16:49:32 also be aware last I heard there was a clause that early access developers agree never to distribute their apps any other way but the palm catalog :( Jul 09 16:50:24 destinal: is that only for apps they develop with the SDK or is it general enough to try and limit them completely? Jul 09 16:51:04 I think it's general, applications created by developer or some such thing Jul 09 16:51:12 suck Jul 09 16:51:53 well hopefully that will just get more apps in the catalog quicker Jul 09 16:53:01 yeah but what if you're developing an app for internal use within your company, it looks like you'd have to get that written exception. also, it prevents you from running a typical open source project because that would still be distributing your app Jul 09 16:53:20 Spaz was a typical open source project Jul 09 16:53:26 and palm seemed to be helping them Jul 09 16:53:32 dont know if they got an exception or what though Jul 09 16:53:35 written by an early access developer under the NDA? Jul 09 16:53:44 dest: correct Jul 09 16:53:51 Spaz was one of the first apps in the catalog Jul 09 16:54:00 its a twitter client Jul 09 16:54:12 ok, I suspect it's a one hand may not know what the other hand is doing, or they haven't considered the impact of those clauses Jul 09 16:54:19 im working on an app now that wont be able to be released in the catalog :( Jul 09 16:54:25 maybe palm will revisit the language and open it up a bit Jul 09 16:54:59 they should remove that clause completely, people will use the catalog but shouldn't be forced to use it exclusively. Jul 09 16:55:01 blau-mikeDG: is that because it is for internal use? Jul 09 16:55:36 no its because it requires to be named com.palm Jul 09 16:55:46 blau-mikeDG: private bus? Jul 09 16:55:51 yeah Jul 09 16:56:07 im not sure if it needs to be or listlaunchpoints is just broken Jul 09 16:56:16 we need a way to more granularly define what can get access to the private bus Jul 09 16:56:21 but the service im trying to use, gives an error Jul 09 16:56:27 but still that wouldn't get in the catalog I imagine. Jul 09 16:56:43 ** Message: serviceResponse Handling: 2, {"returnValue":false,"errorCode":-1,"errorText":"Method \"listLaunchPoints\" with signature \"s\" on int erface \"org.json\" doesn't exist\n"} Jul 09 16:56:56 destinal: probably typical conservative first release language while they determine how to maintain 'security' Jul 09 16:57:01 that doesnt look like the general "you shouldnt be doing this" error Jul 09 16:57:22 djk: if you say so, I do security for a living and don't think you have to infringe on rights Jul 09 16:57:58 but I note the quotes, so I'm probably not alone :) Jul 09 16:59:57 one other thing that bothered me was, what if you write an app under the agreement and palm rejects it from the catalog. Do you have to terminate your agreement (either side can in writing) to distribute your app via whatever community methods exist? Jul 09 17:01:24 this app im on now rules :) Jul 09 17:01:48 both of em do Jul 09 17:02:13 blau-mikeDG: what app Jul 09 17:03:00 1 is personal finance Jul 09 17:03:13 the other lets you create a variety of shortcuts in the launcher, and copy existing shortcuts Jul 09 17:03:31 so you can have a shortcut that directly calls a number, or creates a new contact Jul 09 17:03:46 sweet Jul 09 17:03:57 did you guys have questions about Spaz? Jul 09 17:04:02 I was away, sorry Jul 09 17:04:17 where can I find the plus + symbol when typing? Jul 09 17:04:25 on the pre of course Jul 09 17:04:34 destinal: I think the concern is how to control malware type apps and giving Corp IT/CISO the confidence the Pre is good for business. not that is possible anything Jul 09 17:04:37 do you have a special agreement with palm to distribute the source? the agreement i read seems to indicate you can only distribute on the market Jul 09 17:04:40 funkatron: we were trying to figure out since the palm NDA agreement requires exclusive distribution via the palm catalog, how do you run an open source project? Jul 09 17:04:45 does that only apply to the fully packaged app? Jul 09 17:06:19 djk: but is the pre good for business if I can't deploy my own custom apps and use their SDK at the same time without written permission? Jul 09 17:06:35 businesses really need custom apps Jul 09 17:06:42 and they're not going to put them on the catalog Jul 09 17:06:48 hello, this is my first time on this chat Jul 09 17:06:59 i have a big problem however Jul 09 17:07:36 i just rooted my pre today, everything was fine but now the computer wont recognize my pre Jul 09 17:07:46 djk: getting developers to give palm exclusive distribution rights doesn't give Cop IT / CISO any warm fuzzies Jul 09 17:08:32 can anyone help me? Jul 09 17:08:34 destinal: I wasn't meaning that it would Jul 09 17:09:02 djk: so the concern you mentioned doesn't apply for this clause Jul 09 17:09:08 cmucooper are you connecting through usb or wifi Jul 09 17:09:16 usb Jul 09 17:09:20 destinal: well, I'm distributing test builds, and Palm knows this Jul 09 17:09:40 if you didn't install any tcp/IP on the usb then you'll still need develloper mode on and Novaproxy running, i think Jul 09 17:09:50 I suspect their intent is to not do full, public distribution of "finished" apps outside of the app catalog. Jul 09 17:09:51 funkatron: did you get written permission or are you just violating the agreement with their tacit approval? Jul 09 17:10:18 yeah novaproxy isnt recognizing it at all either Jul 09 17:10:30 dev mode is still on Jul 09 17:10:47 if they only mean ipkg's through the app store they should say so, the agreement says "application" Jul 09 17:10:52 Well, previously there was no such verbage in the NDA. I suppose I am violating the agreement with their tacit approval Jul 09 17:11:01 if they try to stop me I'd raise a pretty big shitstorm. Jul 09 17:11:05 I doubt they would. Jul 09 17:11:10 I don't think that's their intent Jul 09 17:11:10 well we need to push back as a community Jul 09 17:11:28 yes, I agree Jul 09 17:11:36 to have them clarify their intent as opposed to having an agreement that means something stricter than everyone interprets it to mean Jul 09 17:11:40 you may want to also contact Ryan Paul at Ars Technica Jul 09 17:11:43 he can do a story on this Jul 09 17:11:44 ok, unplug USB, set screen timeout to 3mins, plug it back in, choose "charging only" and wait 1 min then run Novaproxy again... it takes a short bit for Windows to recognize the device once plugged in. Only then does Novaproxy function. Jul 09 17:12:03 thx i'll try that Jul 09 17:12:13 Ok CmuCooper and good luck, we'll be here Jul 09 17:12:22 as it is, my distribution of .ipk files to testers, even those within Palm, seems to be a violation Jul 09 17:12:51 funkatron: ok, that's what I was thinking as well. Jul 09 17:12:53 I'm looking for a way to trace when the dtmf tones are being passed durnig a call. I believe this is a pactl app, but I'm not sure where to find it? Jul 09 17:13:01 I was pretty surprised by the addition of that clause, really Jul 09 17:13:11 I was too Jul 09 17:13:28 I would also contact Chuq directly. he's a good guy and an advocate of openness and transparency inside Palm Jul 09 17:14:14 do you know whether the intent is to have the SDK EULA everyone into this agreement when it's public? Jul 09 17:14:45 Still not doing anything Jul 09 17:15:16 obviously not an NDA, but the distribution parts Jul 09 17:15:35 cmucooper, you're using Putty, and localhost, and port 8023 ? Jul 09 17:15:53 b/c I think that trying to dictate to a developer how they can use their own apps at all is something I haven't seen before Jul 09 17:15:54 What happens exactly - does novaterm say any error Jul 09 17:16:28 well, it's not as bad as what Apple does, but it's closer than I'm comfortable with Jul 09 17:16:38 novacomd couldn't find your pre Jul 09 17:17:04 cmucooper: go to your device manager, and see if you have a "Palm Novacom" device Jul 09 17:17:51 Ya that's a driver issue for sure--- as bsiegel saidl Jul 09 17:18:14 yes its there Jul 09 17:19:19 should i try uninstalling that driver and then reinstalling it? Jul 09 17:20:53 You can - I had this problem once with WinXP, for some reason it just never showed up properly. i never found out what was causing it Jul 09 17:20:57 hah simplified javascript = chickenfoot Jul 09 17:21:06 but removing and reinstalling the device is a good place to start Jul 09 17:21:12 and the driver package Jul 09 17:21:27 Can also try a different USB port if you have one, also restarting windows may reinit the port Jul 09 17:21:27 funkatron: sad part about all this is I think it was a knee jerk reaction to the email ipk issue Jul 09 17:21:40 not the right one, but one nonetheless (probably by palm legal) Jul 09 17:21:49 without it plugged in by the way! Jul 09 17:21:58 thx Jul 09 17:22:04 destinal: definitely legal. Their engineering staff seems top notch Jul 09 17:22:05 i'll try and let you know Jul 09 17:22:17 destinal: could be, I dunno. Yeah, the engineering guys are pretty straight-up. Jul 09 17:22:19 bzhou * r10435 optware/trunk/make/php-fcgi.mk: php-fcgi: force rebuild Jul 09 17:24:50 I just don't see how, "wait, people are distributing their apps via emailed ipk to non-dev-mode folks. this is bad" turns into "make legit developers agree not to distribute that way" Jul 09 17:25:27 it's a legal attempt at what should be a technical control to allow the user to accept risk Jul 09 17:26:43 and also seems to be more about controlling developers (which does seem odd since palm has been really straight up and non-control-freak up until now) Jul 09 17:29:06 also, the email ipk thing's fixed, users have to turn on dev mode to get unsanctioned apps, so no more ipk issue, if that was what started it. oh well Jul 09 17:30:09 Jul 09 17:31:23 another case of 'bussiness' and 'risk' getting in the way of the 'good' Jul 09 17:31:59 Robi_: and not actually mitigating risk. :) Jul 09 17:32:14 false ASSumptions ;] Jul 09 17:34:20 destinal: where can I find the pactl list that tmzt was talking about last night? Jul 09 17:35:53 hello again Jul 09 17:36:08 trying to install the optware package, and when using tar to extra the ipk tar says invalid gzip magic... Jul 09 17:36:16 it worked Jul 09 17:36:31 my computer recognizes it again. thank you! Jul 09 17:37:08 sushi2: I haven't played with that much, there seems to be a pulseaudio-misc package in webOS that includes /usr/bin/pactl Jul 09 17:37:16 hello folks! completely new to the whole rooting, etc... and in need of a little help. i followed the pre dev wiki on using the novaproxy to gain root access but when i get to step # 9 i'm unsure what exactly to type into the command line to make sure everything is connecting and listening. Any help would be greatly appreciated!!! Jul 09 17:37:22 destinal: thx Jul 09 17:38:23 i have vista 32 by the way Jul 09 17:38:26 cmucooper : wake up the pre from sleep (btw; one way is to prevent sleep is to play mp3s) and then connect it to USB... next wait 1 min for windowsXP driver to wake up and detect it before attempting to run Novaproxy. Jul 09 17:38:29 Slickjames: just double click the novaproxy.py file to launch it. It should write some text to its window which will tell you what is going on Jul 09 17:38:36 anyone know how to correctly unpack the optware ipk Jul 09 17:38:50 alphakamp: ar -x Jul 09 17:39:07 alphakamp: it's also in the wiki under the post-root steps Jul 09 17:39:18 ok...it's normally been asleep when i tried before. trying again now. Jul 09 17:40:42 FreeTim3: everything is working great ty Jul 09 17:40:51 Great to hear! You're welcome Jul 09 17:41:23 bsiegel: i assume you meant tar -x Jul 09 17:41:35 alphakamp: "ar" is an archiver Jul 09 17:41:57 separate from tar Jul 09 17:42:03 TypeError: Object # has no method 'clear' anny idea what that is Jul 09 17:42:15 lol still says invaild ar magic Jul 09 17:42:31 ar -matey Jul 09 17:42:45 alphakamp: no need to do this from scratch, the proper command is on the wiki Jul 09 17:43:04 http://predev.wikidot.com/next-steps-after-rooting Jul 09 17:43:37 destinal: thats what im following taht isnt working... Jul 09 17:43:47 alphakamp: open the ipk in an editor and make sure you didnt accidentally download an HTML page (as I did once) Jul 09 17:43:50 alphakamp: how specifically is it not working? Jul 09 17:43:55 if its a valid ipk, ar -x will extract it Jul 09 17:43:55 alphakamp: what error? Jul 09 17:44:09 bsiegel: looks like this ipk is a tarball Jul 09 17:44:09 Is there ANYWAY to copy text form emails!?! >:( Jul 09 17:44:27 joesmith: pencil and paper Jul 09 17:44:31 destinal: step 4.. tar: invalid gzip magic Jul 09 17:44:54 ARGH!!! I thought so :/ Jul 09 17:45:15 nevermind Jul 09 17:45:22 alphakamp: ls -hl ipkg-opt_0.99.163-10_arm.ipk Jul 09 17:45:33 alphakamp: maybe the download is corrupt then, if the wiki says to use tar xvzf then that's right Jul 09 17:45:49 k ill redownload it Jul 09 17:45:51 ^^ my ls command there Jul 09 17:46:04 alphakamp: try ls -hl ipkg-opt_0.99.163-10_arm.ipk see how large it is Jul 09 17:47:02 3.1k Jul 09 17:47:08 it should be 73K Jul 09 17:47:10 joesmith: hit the reply button, and copy the quoted text from the email. Jul 09 17:47:17 hmmm Jul 09 17:47:19 cat ipkg-opt_0.99.163-10_arm.ipk Jul 09 17:47:24 it's probably HTML / text Jul 09 17:47:49 "cat" will display it Jul 09 17:48:33 usually this will happen if there was an error from the web server and you can see what it was Jul 09 17:49:08 destinal: yup its text Jul 09 17:49:31 does it explain what the problem was? Jul 09 17:50:15 ah it actually uses the wireless connection to download! Jul 09 17:50:35 and i have to accept the terms of service on our wireless connection Jul 09 17:51:01 ah, ok, you can turn off wifi (assuming you're coming in over USB) and avoid that whole issue Jul 09 17:52:03 well i just accepted the terms and it downloaded fine Jul 09 17:52:21 hey, that works too. :) Jul 09 17:52:47 i double clicked on the novaproxy.py file to launch it. it pops up for a split second and then disappears. Jul 09 17:55:34 Slickjames: as long as you have a recent copy it should always pause for you to see the output Jul 09 17:55:53 try grabbing the latest and if its still quits right away, we will try to figure out whats going on Jul 09 17:56:52 ok. gonna get the latest now. i had been trying to use the 2.6.2 version Jul 09 17:58:24 destinal: thanks for the help, in the user creation step is that all one line excluding the comments or two? Jul 09 18:00:00 ah i see two Jul 09 18:00:02 one export to set the user name variable and a second line to add Jul 09 18:00:04 right Jul 09 18:03:52 hm now the questions is to use dropbear or openssh Jul 09 18:04:53 zomg this app is amazinggish Jul 09 18:04:54 I recommend dropbear -- it has a lower memory (and maybe CPU) requirement Jul 09 18:04:55 destinal: another question - is there a way to kill pulseaudio without it restarting? Jul 09 18:05:04 :) Jul 09 18:05:53 sushi2: I haven't tried it but it's probably upstart recycling it for you -- try initctl stop pulseaudio Jul 09 18:06:14 hehe - that's exactly what I just tried thx Jul 09 18:06:38 blau-mikeDG: one you're working on? Jul 09 18:06:41 destinal: does dropbear support keys? Jul 09 18:07:37 yup Jul 09 18:07:43 alphakamp: yes. the main thing it doesn't support is sftp (though scp works fine). if you really need sftp as opposed to scp, you can apparently use the sftp-server binary from openssh to provide it without having to run the heavier openssh service Jul 09 18:08:18 * blau-mikeDG hopes his ajax crap works, i nee dto go home to test it though hrm Jul 09 18:08:32 blau-mikeDG: so why aren't you sharing? :) Jul 09 18:08:43 Hmm. Stopping pulseaudio doesn't stop the dtmf, but stopping audiod does (of course, it stops all sound) Jul 09 18:08:45 we need good apps, that's for sure Jul 09 18:09:17 nda :( Jul 09 18:09:28 poppycock! Jul 09 18:09:29 blau-mikeDG: thought you might say that Jul 09 18:09:30 ;) Jul 09 18:09:33 alas Jul 09 18:09:35 can't wait to see it then Jul 09 18:10:25 destinal: anything in the wiki detailing that (sftp for dropbear) Jul 09 18:10:46 alphakamp: I don't think so, I didn't know it until last night when rwhitby mentioned it Jul 09 18:11:12 alphakamp: not sure the best way to get there, ie install openssh and disable its upstart script, probably Jul 09 18:11:26 alphakamp: if you do get that going, wiki it! :) Jul 09 18:11:32 hehe Jul 09 18:11:34 please do Jul 09 18:11:34 destinal: thats sounds logical Jul 09 18:11:59 have you used openssh and noticed a performance hit? Jul 09 18:12:16 im gonna post some pics Jul 09 18:12:25 alphakamp: we've noticed a larger resident memory size Jul 09 18:12:45 dropbear was made to be a tiny alternative for embedded devices so it makes sense Jul 09 18:12:53 hmm potential.. it might be harder to open more cards ... Jul 09 18:13:02 blau-mikeDG: that would be cool (as long as it doesn't violate the nda) Jul 09 18:13:24 screenshots are ok now the way i understand it Jul 09 18:13:36 wish they would make a nda for dummies faq :) Jul 09 18:13:49 alphakamp: for really no major benefit over dropbear IMO. anyway I use scp from linux and pscp -scp on windows and it works fine. I think winscp does as well Jul 09 18:14:00 lol - I usually go for the "share nothing" approach, just to be safe Jul 09 18:14:33 no sense destroying your rep just so we can get excited about an app we'll probably see in the near future anyway Jul 09 18:15:03 oh :( Jul 09 18:15:10 destinal: So are you saying one can scp to dropbear? Jul 09 18:15:29 destinal: i like the lazyness availble with sftp/filezilla :p Jul 09 18:15:41 but im sure scp isnt complicate.... Jul 09 18:15:47 who has admin priviledges on wiki? Jul 09 18:16:26 this one app requires message over private bus :( Jul 09 18:16:52 nm - looks like scp works - excellente Jul 09 18:17:42 i lied Jul 09 18:17:58 just a little - gives a couple errors Jul 09 18:18:00 i guess I could try openssh... ipk-opt clean up after itself pretty well? ipk-opt remove ? Jul 09 18:18:01 but looks like I'm in Jul 09 18:18:31 alphakamp: yes Jul 09 18:19:31 ah thats good then, ill just try open ssh and if it dont like it...ill try dropbear :) Jul 09 18:20:11 http://webos.mikedg.com second batch of pics is on the bottom Jul 09 18:20:22 destinal: I finally got around the activation by editing firstuse a bit more. It was really easy once I got some sleep! Jul 09 18:21:10 adns-pre_: sleep tends to help sometimes, yeah. :) can you elaborate (maybe wiki) the change that was needed to get around the cdma modem issue? Jul 09 18:21:14 blau-mikeDG: Looks very interesting =) Jul 09 18:21:38 I posted what I did here: http://www.mobile-files.com/forum/showpost.php?p=557481&postcount=29 Jul 09 18:21:42 adns-pre_: unfortunately you probably won't be the last to experience their modem in an unusable state Jul 09 18:21:46 now i just need to take the time to go through all the apps and review their launch parameters (volunteers would be nice :)) Jul 09 18:22:38 hmm, I wonder why if (PalmSystem.version.match("desktop")) couldn't have just been changed to if (true) Jul 09 18:23:23 did you try that? Jul 09 18:23:56 blau-mikeDG: I'd be happy to test Jul 09 18:24:07 I don't see why that wouldn't work as well Jul 09 18:24:15 okay i am back. i have another problem Jul 09 18:24:19 blau-mikeDG: But not sure that's what you are looking for *grin* Jul 09 18:24:20 adns-pre_: I think I recommended it yesterday :) Jul 09 18:24:37 lol not yet :) Jul 09 18:24:52 well you know maybe I didn't do it in both places? Jul 09 18:24:53 i am trying to do the text message time/date hack Jul 09 18:24:54 if I'm not too late, you can just ipkg-op install openssh-sftp-server after your dropbear is installed....works great Jul 09 18:24:56 adns-pre_: congrats on getting back in btw Jul 09 18:24:57 theres not too much to test only 2 useful shortcuts + the copy function Jul 09 18:25:06 adns-pre_: were you then able to get your modem happy? Jul 09 18:25:16 I'm about to find out Jul 09 18:25:47 when i try to open /usr/palm/applications/com.palm.app.messaging/app/controllers/chatview-assistant.js it says permission denied. i tried searching the wiki but didnt find anything on this Jul 09 18:26:00 cmucooper: r u root? Jul 09 18:26:08 yes Jul 09 18:26:12 hmm only 14mb free while nothing is open? ouch dont think openssh is gonna leave you much room to do things Jul 09 18:26:27 ^and thats before ive installed it... Jul 09 18:26:35 i need to reformat my phone, ive made it a mess Jul 09 18:26:41 it takes 5 minutes to restart Jul 09 18:26:51 it doesnt come off of usb mode correctly Jul 09 18:27:31 when i safely eject it, the usb mode grapahic stays up, then when i phycially remove it, it goes to the palm logo Jul 09 18:27:54 any ideas? Jul 09 18:29:38 cmucooper: did u remouted / to rw? Jul 09 18:30:51 not sure sorry i'm new to this, i followed step by step the whole wiki on rooting Jul 09 18:31:11 whoops Jul 09 18:32:56 i don't know why but i never have to remout / to rw Jul 09 18:34:24 i just did and it still says permission denied Jul 09 18:35:02 adns-pre_: updated http://predev.wikidot.com/bypassing-activation with the technique Jul 09 18:35:06 thanks Jul 09 18:35:35 what is ESN and MEID for? Jul 09 18:35:51 en0x: MEID is a CDMA phone identifier number Jul 09 18:37:11 en0x: I think the most common way of getting your CDMA modem hosed is people trying to reconfigure them for other providers -- in this case I'm not nitpicking the details, I think it's worthwhile to be able to get through firstuse even with a dead CDMA modem for whatever reason Jul 09 18:37:33 ugh, on the phone now with Palm trying to get an update regarding wildcard certificates.... Jul 09 18:38:14 destinal: i see Jul 09 18:39:46 nebula: the browser doesn't accept them? Jul 09 18:40:36 cmucooper: you can't edit a readonly file system. Do the mount root readwrite thing Jul 09 18:40:46 destinal: imap email Jul 09 18:41:15 our company doesnt use microsoft products ;) Jul 09 18:41:31 Here is what happens: Jul 09 18:41:31 root@castle:/# /usr/palm/applications/com.palm.app.messaging/app/models/messagin Jul 09 18:41:31 g-luna-service.js Jul 09 18:41:48 oops Jul 09 18:42:22 http://forums.precentral.net/web-os-development/185795-little-hack-add-date-time-all-sms-texts-3.html#post1741348 Jul 09 18:42:31 there is where i posted what i am getting Jul 09 18:42:48 nebula: aha Jul 09 18:43:04 nebula: are you able to manually accept the cert inside the certificate manager? Jul 09 18:43:11 as a workaround? Jul 09 18:43:15 cmucooper: show me your output from "mount" command Jul 09 18:43:24 put it on pastebin.com or something like that Jul 09 18:43:42 not sure, cert mgr may only work with the browser app Jul 09 18:43:56 destinal: makes no difference :/ Jul 09 18:44:13 time for tier 2 ;) Jul 09 18:44:58 http://pastebin.com/m237a7d7e Jul 09 18:45:01 they had me reboot, should i tell them i have a flashing penguin? Jul 09 18:45:46 lol Jul 09 18:46:13 yeah, reboot, that'll help you fix the certificate handling code all right Jul 09 18:46:35 good ol' flowchart support Jul 09 18:46:36 gotta love tier 1 Jul 09 18:47:03 x -> step a -> y -> step b -> y -> step c Jul 09 18:47:15 z -> tier 2. Jul 09 18:47:51 has anyone tried Iphone bookmarklets on the pre ? Jul 09 18:48:20 i feel bad for tier 1 Jul 09 18:49:18 nebula: I bet you could get your own CA cert on the pre and sign just that cert for the imaps instance on that box, but that wouldn't help everyone who wasn't you and doesn't have the CA cert loaded on their box lol Jul 09 18:50:16 cmucooper: weird Jul 09 18:50:33 oh i know why Jul 09 18:50:38 ? Jul 09 18:50:43 a lot of companies do that internally (use a company wide internal CA, put their cert in their default PC image and don't pay verisign for certs) Jul 09 18:50:57 hey that's a good idea for an app Jul 09 18:50:58 how the f... u want to edit a file just by executing it?!!??! Jul 09 18:51:02 vi /usr/palm/applications/com.palm.app.messaging/app/models/messagin Jul 09 18:51:14 looks like u never used linux before Jul 09 18:51:15 a GUI mode for downloading and installing CA certs Jul 09 18:51:23 i said i was new haha Jul 09 18:52:16 you know like born yesterday Jul 09 18:52:25 then u should not mod Jul 09 18:52:26 ;( Jul 09 18:54:12 * blau-mikeDG needs to revist his messaging mod Jul 09 18:54:17 now that i know what im doing :) Jul 09 18:56:20 has anyone attempted to hack the email app to offer an option to delete all items in trash Jul 09 18:56:58 support is like... imap? you mean exchange? i'm like... no... we don't use microsoft products. Jul 09 18:57:06 i havent deleted anything from trash for like 3 years Jul 09 18:57:41 Well I prefer not to keep email that I intentionally deleted for a reason >.> Jul 09 18:57:50 especially not taking space on my pre Jul 09 18:57:58 w00t Jul 09 19:00:06 i hope they fix the imap auth to send problem Jul 09 19:02:34 does it bother anyone else that the stupid google maps app is entirely web based? Jul 09 19:02:45 which makes the menu take forever to pop up Jul 09 19:02:48 almost entirely Jul 09 19:02:57 i dont use it Jul 09 19:03:08 is there a way to access the app store through the web? Jul 09 19:03:21 or is there a list somewhere of apps available? Jul 09 19:03:36 actually, ignore that, better for #webos Jul 09 19:03:55 en0x: I am trying to learn Jul 09 19:04:53 I have done a lot i just dont know how to edit this Jul 09 19:05:26 make a backup of the file FIRST Jul 09 19:05:58 like; issue cp command cp oldfile.txt oldfile.txt.backup Jul 09 19:06:11 only then, edit using vi oldfile.txt Jul 09 19:06:15 cmucooper, you should spend some time learning about vi (or nano), filesystem permissions, basic Linux commands, etc. Jul 09 19:11:23 maybe im over my head Jul 09 19:12:40 that is a possibility, but nobody was born knowing this stuff Jul 09 19:13:36 i mean i understand the basics i come from the days of writing webpages from strain html... Jul 09 19:14:52 hmm i have open-ssh running but i cant connect, I change the port from 222 to somethign elses edited the event.d file in ssh and iptables section.. Jul 09 19:15:27 restarted sshd, I assume? Jul 09 19:16:55 stupid notes app doesnt have a parameter for a new note :( Jul 09 19:17:45 sugardave|work: tried taht couldnt connect over wife, was able to over evdo, my guess my access point here at work is blocking ports Jul 09 19:17:51 wifi* Jul 09 19:18:15 over wife lol Jul 09 19:18:22 summatusmentis: you've given me another idea for an app. an OSS client for the palm app catalog Jul 09 19:19:04 is anyone working on an OSS app catalog? Jul 09 19:19:04 anyone wanna make the alarm clock app not allow the screen to turn off during an alarm Jul 09 19:19:13 it makes it a pain to turn off the alarm quickly Jul 09 19:19:22 tru.dat Jul 09 19:19:34 mikeDOTd: I've heard there were some efforts but not what progress has been made Jul 09 19:19:42 destinal: thanks Jul 09 19:20:53 mikeDOTd: I think peopel are waiting to see how receptive Palm is to putting apps in their catalog Jul 09 19:21:58 i wonder if palm ppl will steal the homebrew apps and put it in their catalog for free Jul 09 19:22:01 hehehehe Jul 09 19:22:54 en0x: I really doubt it Jul 09 19:23:13 not that it would be stealing, mind you Jul 09 19:23:28 but that they want the developer / maintainer of the app to submit them Jul 09 19:24:18 hmm evdo ip should change that often should it? Jul 09 19:25:05 it depends how its setup on sprint dhcp servers Jul 09 19:25:10 mine changes pretty frequently when I'm at home, bad signal and all Jul 09 19:25:16 specifically we are talking about dhcp release time Jul 09 19:25:57 has anyone called up Sprint to try and get a static IP for their Pre yet? Jul 09 19:27:04 dyndns for the win Jul 09 19:27:10 forget the static just dynds Jul 09 19:27:11 dyndns Jul 09 19:27:16 heh Jul 09 19:27:18 :) Jul 09 19:27:20 so i have a question, is vi a seperate editor all together? or is it the way of editing inside python? Jul 09 19:27:28 i know im dumb sorry Jul 09 19:27:39 vi is an editor Jul 09 19:27:42 my ip must have changed because i cant ssh.. Jul 09 19:27:47 nothing to do with python per se Jul 09 19:27:51 vi is the default text editor in linux...you run 'vi somefile' after you are logged into the shell Jul 09 19:28:32 oh so i dont need another program Jul 09 19:28:39 i just need to learn the commands Jul 09 19:29:06 right Jul 09 19:29:06 yeah Jul 09 19:29:07 cmucooper: yeah, I'm assuming that you're logged into your phone now? if so everything you run is software installed on the phone Jul 09 19:29:14 you don't need to add any for most things Jul 09 19:29:28 besides the optware, ssh, etc Jul 09 19:29:44 yeah i have all that, i just need to learn to edit Jul 09 19:30:03 cmucooper: there is a good oreilly book on vi and a bunch of docs online Jul 09 19:30:11 nano might be easier to work with, or VIM (my pref) Jul 09 19:30:48 yeah I recommend vim the default vi is just busybox's implementation IIRC, very limited Jul 09 19:31:16 yeah, it's a bit painful to use vi without knowing all the shortcuts Jul 09 19:31:38 hmmmm Jul 09 19:31:53 u should take a look at vimtutor Jul 09 19:31:54 :) Jul 09 19:32:03 ty all so much i think i just dont get it Jul 09 19:32:11 [; Jul 09 19:33:50 where do i find vimtutor i did a google search and found a bunch of bs Jul 09 19:33:54 "nano -w file" may be easier Jul 09 19:34:02 more graphical Jul 09 19:34:33 and control keys etc, more like an old fashioned dos editor Jul 09 19:35:01 cmucooper: vimtutor is installed by default on most linux distributions wherever vim is installed Jul 09 19:37:33 okay thank you all Jul 09 19:38:36 heh Jul 09 19:42:03 hey if im applying patches and i get "**** malformed patch at line 125: " Jul 09 19:42:15 what does it mean? Jul 09 19:42:21 sounds like a malformed patch Jul 09 19:42:24 and how can i fix it Jul 09 19:42:25 ? Jul 09 19:42:25 guessing around line 125 or so Jul 09 19:42:39 lol Jul 09 19:42:42 hahaha Jul 09 19:43:04 i just want to know what was malformed so i can correct it Jul 09 19:43:04 good question ... i'd say making sure the patch is wellformed is a good start Jul 09 19:43:22 if i were to debug this problem .. Jul 09 19:43:28 i'd look at line 125 of the patch in question Jul 09 19:43:40 and go "hrmmm ... does this look malformed?" Jul 09 19:44:23 i vi'ed to the file in question and its blank Jul 09 19:44:46 so, i ask: "hrmmm ... does this look malformed?" Jul 09 19:45:29 well maybe there is an ^M Jul 09 19:45:34 on the end and u can't see it Jul 09 19:45:35 ;] Jul 09 19:45:55 those damned invisible characters ... Jul 09 19:46:05 } catch (e) { Mojo.Log.logException(e, 'PageAssistant#setup'); } Jul 09 19:46:23 that s lines 122 to 129 Jul 09 19:46:31 125 only has } Jul 09 19:47:19 i just wanted help Jul 09 19:47:34 not ridicule Jul 09 19:48:21 your patch file is 0 characters in length ? Jul 09 19:48:42 no Jul 09 19:49:22 i vi'ed to the file in question and its blank Jul 09 19:49:26 what does that mean ? Jul 09 19:49:43 i meant the line was blank Jul 09 19:49:48 it only has a } Jul 09 19:50:12 what is on line 125 of the patch file ? Jul 09 19:50:33 the .patch file or the file im trying to patch? Jul 09 19:50:39 the .patch file Jul 09 19:51:04 else { Jul 09 19:51:08 thats it Jul 09 19:51:24 weird ... what patch file is it ? Jul 09 19:52:04 enable-browser-downloads.patch Jul 09 19:52:41 where did you grab it from ? Jul 09 19:52:55 Anyone one else having their google calendar not work? my wife is now having the problem too Jul 09 19:53:02 opt Jul 09 19:53:08 using quilt Jul 09 19:53:49 seekis, you're going to have to help me out here - i have no idea where this random file came from - and telling me opt and quilt means nothing ... commands - urls .. anything is better than short answers which just lead to more confusing questions Jul 09 19:54:09 ok Jul 09 19:54:09 sorry Jul 09 19:54:17 it's ok - so where did you get the file from ? Jul 09 19:54:21 djk: i never had any probs with calendar Jul 09 19:54:52 i used quilt import /opt/src/modifications/browser/enable-browser-downloads.patch Jul 09 19:54:58 and then quilt push Jul 09 19:55:11 using the applying patches wiki on predevwiki Jul 09 20:00:02 seekis, paste the whole error you get from your quilt message Jul 09 20:14:05 I think he's referring to this patch... http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/modifications/blobs/raw/master/browser/enable-browser-downloads.patch Jul 09 20:14:08 en0x: The calendar is an oddity. if I delete the google one event from my exchange one show up but if the google is added nothing is displayed. Alerts still come up though Jul 09 20:14:15 (seekis) that is. Jul 09 20:15:19 Khidr, i found it .. i was curious if he was in / and what the exact error is Jul 09 20:16:09 cool. Jul 09 20:16:44 thanks tho Jul 09 20:17:10 that's the type of thing i was looking for originally Jul 09 20:18:23 time to go to Home Depot....see y'all later Jul 09 20:23:08 assuming the "}" isn't there in the original code, wouldn't it need a "+" to indicate to quilt that it should add that line? that's the only problem I could see, I did the browser mod by hand and it worked great. Jul 09 20:23:24 (I'm talking about his line 125 error) Jul 09 20:24:33 Khidr, well - i thought that at first - but apparently quilt has context associated with it .. so it includes some lines +/- the patch .. Jul 09 20:24:45 yo seekis Jul 09 20:24:48 so if some other patch is applied .. you can still see the context in which to apply this patch Jul 09 20:24:50 you get it figured out? Jul 09 20:24:56 I got it yesterday after some fiddling Jul 09 20:24:59 but i didn't get his full error message Jul 09 20:25:02 tweak, what did you have to do Jul 09 20:25:18 let me pull up the wiki page again and tell you what I did Jul 09 20:25:19 1 sec Jul 09 20:25:50 ok, so I did this: find /opt/src/modifications -name *.patch Jul 09 20:26:09 and then this (substituting for the browser patch): quilt import /opt/src/modifications/application_name/patch_name.patch Jul 09 20:26:13 that didn't work Jul 09 20:26:18 i got error 130 and error 125 Jul 09 20:26:29 so I did cd /opt/src/modifications/browser Jul 09 20:26:39 then wget of the patch file from the wiki entry Jul 09 20:27:00 so wget http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/modifications/blobs/raw/master/browser/enable-browser-downloads.patch Jul 09 20:27:06 then applied the patch per instructions Jul 09 20:27:09 it worked fine that way Jul 09 20:27:14 dunno why it wouldn't work the other way Jul 09 20:27:18 so the patch wasn't actually downloaded ? Jul 09 20:27:58 no it would download but it was corrupted or something Jul 09 20:28:06 does putty keep a log? Jul 09 20:28:10 i could give you the exact errors I got Jul 09 20:28:22 not unless you set it to do so, i don't think it does Jul 09 20:28:45 git clone git://gitorious.org/webos-internals/modifications.git - does that create a directory called modifications or modifications.git ? Jul 09 20:29:00 putty doesn't by default. You can change your settings under Session, Logging, change to all session output and then give a logfile name Jul 09 20:29:32 yeah, then I don't have a log of it Jul 09 20:29:56 tweak, so the patch file was there - but it was a corrupt download ? Jul 09 20:30:02 but it then will only log going forward, not capture scrollback. You can send scrollback by right-clicking the blue header bar, and selecting Copy All To Clipboard option Jul 09 20:30:09 yes, I think it was corrupt, it wouldn't apply, said error reading a line Jul 09 20:30:26 when I did the wget trick it worked fine Jul 09 20:30:40 strange Jul 09 20:30:44 indeed Jul 09 20:31:50 the patch is compatible with 1.04 right? Jul 09 20:32:24 hmm, yeah it didn't actually work when I did it yesterday. Even after rebooting Jul 09 20:32:51 i have no idea if it is compatible with 1.0.4 Jul 09 20:33:12 i'm going to run this once more and see if the error is the same Jul 09 20:33:22 it is. Jul 09 20:33:27 working great on 1.04 Jul 09 20:33:59 ok Jul 09 20:34:05 to answer your earlier question Jul 09 20:34:19 git clone git://gitorious.org/webos-internals/modifications.git makes a dir called "modifications" Jul 09 20:34:48 interesting - so it should work Jul 09 20:35:14 yeah Jul 09 20:35:26 strange the file gets an error Jul 09 20:35:42 maybe there should be a list of md5sums as well ? Jul 09 20:40:20 looks like it's working fine now Jul 09 20:40:56 strange Jul 09 20:41:34 the patch still isn't taking effect though Jul 09 20:42:05 if I tap an mp3 link in the browser it should prompt to stream or download? Jul 09 20:42:10 it should Jul 09 20:42:13 what are you getting? Jul 09 20:42:15 yeah it's just streaming it Jul 09 20:42:21 i rebooted the phone Jul 09 20:42:28 we'll see if that makes a difference Jul 09 20:48:26 damn Jul 09 20:48:30 still just does streaming Jul 09 20:48:44 whatever error happened yesterday has affected it such that the new patch doesn't hold Jul 09 20:49:23 sup everyone? Jul 09 20:49:26 hi all Jul 09 20:49:39 two things, can you pop -f what you've done so far Jul 09 20:49:49 i am looking for info on tethering my pre, is that possible? Jul 09 20:50:25 HAHA Jul 09 20:50:36 check it: Patch /opt/src/patches/enable-browser-downloads.patch appears to be empty, removing Jul 09 20:50:36 No patches applied Jul 09 20:50:49 :/ Jul 09 20:50:53 nice. Jul 09 20:50:58 no wonder Jul 09 20:51:25 so, I'd try to reapply the patch, download it again via git... Jul 09 20:52:30 you may have to force it to import over your old patch Jul 09 20:52:49 is there a flag to do so? Jul 09 20:52:53 -f? Jul 09 20:52:56 I think so. Jul 09 20:52:58 k Jul 09 20:53:43 and I'm sure you can guess where I'm going with this... when you push the patch... stick an -f on that for good measure and see if we get any further. Jul 09 20:53:57 right Jul 09 20:54:09 you want me to pm you the result of that Jul 09 20:54:13 I got error at line 140 Jul 09 20:54:21 Patch /opt/src/patches/enable-browser-downloads.patch appears to be empty; applied Jul 09 20:54:23 not good. Jul 09 20:54:53 O_o Jul 09 20:56:39 line 140 is a closed "div" tag in page-scene.html and unfortunately I don't know a ton about quilt, but the gitorious site seems to have it highlighted as a potential error. Jul 09 20:56:41 http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/modifications/blobs/4c3fcd9ca5a9c1c812b76f6baf53c74aec5f6d68/browser/enable-browser-downloads.patch Jul 09 20:56:52 rwhitby: ran into problems with my backup just now, the phone doesn't work because it says that I've been logged out of my profile Jul 09 20:56:58 so, I'm thinking you might just want to do this by hand. Jul 09 20:57:40 rwhitby: so I don't recommend doing this and I might have to try and get his back from a recovery image Jul 09 20:57:55 but I have to log into the device first which could be a pain in the ass Jul 09 21:00:48 how long would this take by hand? Jul 09 21:02:20 ok, so I downloaded the raw blob patch file Jul 09 21:02:24 ran quilt push -f Jul 09 21:02:32 File series fully applied, ends at patch /opt/src/patches/enable-browser-downloads.patch Jul 09 21:02:38 so I'll see if it worked now Jul 09 21:03:23 it would take about 10 minutes maybe, depends on your typing speed :) but hopefully that worked. Jul 09 21:04:30 nah it didn't Jul 09 21:04:39 did quilt pop -f and got the same message as earlier Jul 09 21:04:47 patch appears to be empty, removing Jul 09 21:04:51 argh! Jul 09 21:05:35 hmm Jul 09 21:06:40 i ran quilt push -a that may have actually done it Jul 09 21:07:34 did you have any other patches in there? Jul 09 21:09:46 FreeTim3: (from backlog) wiki listings of file structure are completely allowed Jul 09 21:12:42 @ Rod: Thanks Jul 09 21:13:21 destinal: thx for the doctor update page Jul 09 21:14:12 since there seems to be quite a group of folks on I'll send out my request again: anyone find a way to turn off dtmf completely (specifically after the call is already in progress, dtmf still plays through the speaker/headset) Jul 09 21:19:19 quick question Jul 09 21:19:33 anywone was playing with the "my tether" app on pre and osx? Jul 09 21:22:29 en0x: what does the app do? Jul 09 21:24:09 rwhitby: allows you to tether the phone for internet access Jul 09 21:24:23 works quite well in windows Jul 09 21:24:38 ok, so unfortunately during the Sprint exclusivity period discussion of that is off-topic for this channel. Jul 09 21:24:54 affirmative! Jul 09 21:25:19 * rwhitby wishes an unlocked rest-of-world GSM version will come out soon. Jul 09 21:26:13 I was messing around with my pre, and changed some of the NV items, can anyone tell me what NV 4 is on their pre? Jul 09 21:27:05 Yojl: If you tell me where to look, happily' Jul 09 21:28:48 pmmodemfactory PmModemFactory -n read 4 0 Jul 09 21:29:31 Yojl: pmmodemfactory: not found Jul 09 21:30:28 it's in /usr/bin Jul 09 21:31:04 case sensitive Jul 09 21:31:14 I've got PmModemInfo PmModemUpdater Jul 09 21:31:22 in /usr/bin Jul 09 21:33:51 palm might have removed with with the 1.0.4 update Jul 09 21:34:01 ahh Jul 09 21:34:11 its still in the webosdoc Jul 09 21:34:45 I'm running 1.0.4 Jul 09 21:35:18 I checked, don't have it either. Also on 1.0.4 Jul 09 21:35:40 * rwhitby updates http://predev.wikidot.com/installing-apps-without-rooted-pre so that it doesn't link to the SDK and risk a take-down notice for the wiki ... Jul 09 21:37:10 does anyone still have pmmodemfactory on their pre (either by putting it back, or for some reason still being on 1.0.3)? Jul 09 21:37:13 Yojl: FYI, there is a separate channel for discussion of modem firmware stuff (#webos-unlocking) set up by the guys at mobile-files.com - we'd prefer discussion of modem modifications to happen there rather than here. Jul 09 21:38:25 * rwhitby reminds people of the channel policy at http://predev.wikidot.com/webos-internals-irc-channel-policy - thanks. Jul 09 21:38:49 no one is in there, and im looking to do anything harmful, I changed a number of item on my pre, and i just want to set it back to factory settings Jul 09 21:39:01 lots of webos channels .. so we need a #webos-channels to list the webos channels ? Jul 09 21:39:06 rwhitby you've become the ultramod keeping the channels straight :) Jul 09 21:39:15 haha bpadalino|work Jul 09 21:39:37 bpadalino|work: lol Jul 09 21:40:04 AgentSmith: just making sure that when the GSM Pre is released, this channel doesn't get swamped by "how do I unlock this from my carrier" discussion, since that's quite a separate /topic to what this channel was founded to discuss. Jul 09 21:40:11 bpadalino|work: we should have a wiki page at least Jul 09 21:40:28 related channels or something Jul 09 21:40:36 heh Jul 09 21:40:41 destinal: http://predev.wikidot.com/webos-internals-irc-channel-policy lists them all I believe. Jul 09 21:41:33 it's cool rwhitby - glad someone's stepping up :) Jul 09 21:41:35 rwhitby: ah. so it does Jul 09 21:42:45 Yojl: it's always a good idea to keep your webdoctor jars (since palm doesn't publish anything but the latest) Jul 09 21:43:08 rwhitby: I posted the md5sum and diff for 1.0.4 doctor Jul 09 21:43:14 destinal: yep, just downloaded and renamed 1.0.4 :-) Jul 09 21:43:58 destinal: did you see my notes yesterday? Jul 09 21:44:10 can you build it natively on pre yet? Jul 09 21:44:29 destinal: saw that, thx. anything really interesting? Jul 09 21:44:33 tmzt: you mean cross compile for pre? Jul 09 21:44:49 tmzt: don't know why you'd want to build on that tiny box Jul 09 21:45:07 because it's easier than cross Jul 09 21:45:20 with the netscape stuff stripped it will be tiny Jul 09 21:45:32 rwhitby: they updated the browser plugin, so I assume some of the security fixes were there Jul 09 21:45:54 i have the 1.0.3 jar, i just want to restore nv 4 to its factory setting and i dont know what that is Jul 09 21:46:23 Yojl: we don't have source for that Pm stuff right? Jul 09 21:46:39 the protocol is know (qualcomm DM) Jul 09 21:46:43 known Jul 09 21:46:52 but not the mux or other channel it uses Jul 09 21:47:01 strace would be helpful Jul 09 21:47:39 my curse, I keep coming up with cool apps I want to chase down, but I shouldn't start more until I've got the one I'm working on right now to some logical usable state. Jul 09 21:47:52 ? Jul 09 21:47:52 good idea Jul 09 21:48:00 any extra work done with the plugins ? Jul 09 21:48:30 destinal: anyway, I think we should get a simple build environement and work on a sketchpad plugin Jul 09 21:48:50 raster suggested using rxvt or xterm as a base for our terminal stuff Jul 09 21:49:12 app ideas: "webos image tool" (modify / prepatch images before flashing, including installing / removing ipkgs and hiding / unhiding apps). a palm catalog client to be used outside the phone and a mojo-based certificate manager app. Jul 09 21:49:16 I added maybe the linux fbcon font would be easier than writing parser code Jul 09 21:49:37 you dont need any source, all you need to enter is PmModemFactory -n read 4 0 Jul 09 21:50:01 Yuji: I don't have a pre, so I can't help you Jul 09 21:50:02 tmzt: I agree, what libraries talk directly to a pixbuf and are supported by standard (small) term programs? Jul 09 21:50:11 gd? Jul 09 21:50:27 just look at the xterm source Jul 09 21:50:58 but I thought the x* apps talk to X constructs for network transparency Jul 09 21:51:04 actually pixbuf and linux framebuffer are similar enough we could just use the htcfb terminal from msm or fbcon itself Jul 09 21:51:09 ah, ok Jul 09 21:51:20 sure, but the render t5o shared pixmaps Jul 09 21:51:46 nice thing about a graphical app is it would understand mouse clicks which we can feed pen events to Jul 09 21:52:12 but really, you should fix your blue box to use the proper coordinates first so we don't mess up clipping Jul 09 21:52:16 yes Jul 09 21:52:48 tmzt: yeah I saw that -- there was an issue at first where it wasn't reporting sane values but that was a mistake on the app side instantiating the plugin with the wrong size Jul 09 21:52:53 destinal: blue box phreaking on the Pre, hey ;-) Jul 09 21:53:00 which is why I think a ram based sketchpad should be the next demo Jul 09 21:53:01 lol Jul 09 21:53:18 you can draw outside your window, but it causes collisions and makes luna angry Jul 09 21:53:31 that would respond to pen events Jul 09 21:53:33 it's composited and has the rounded windows btw Jul 09 21:53:42 yeah Jul 09 21:53:46 looks like a standard card, you can shrink / grow normally Jul 09 21:53:49 just a regular card Jul 09 21:53:54 I would have thought so Jul 09 21:54:03 yay Jul 09 21:54:10 and spin? Jul 09 21:54:16 animations Jul 09 21:54:20 all work? Jul 09 21:54:34 probably, I've been testing on emu so I dunno :) Jul 09 21:54:43 I mean when you switch card Jul 09 21:54:48 oh, yeah Jul 09 21:55:09 the thing I wonder about Jul 09 21:55:26 is whether the buffer is composited by the browser in real time or only on draw eventts Jul 09 21:55:29 I hope the former Jul 09 21:55:53 I should say by luna probably Jul 09 21:56:05 pushed by the browser but composited by luna Jul 09 21:56:30 if it's only on draw events then we have to arrange to get a lot more of them Jul 09 21:58:18 when I get home I'll try spawning a thread to draw in realtime and passing the drawEvent to it Jul 09 21:58:24 then return Jul 09 21:58:43 easy way to find out Jul 09 21:59:29 Sargun: have you been following our graphical plugin efforts? Jul 09 22:00:21 it seems the browser is a luna plugin Jul 09 22:00:31 destinal, nope Jul 09 22:00:42 Sargun: I can paint on cards! :) Jul 09 22:00:48 simple but I'm happy about it Jul 09 22:01:10 destinal, awesome! Jul 09 22:01:44 does anyone know where the launcher button app is located it isnt in /usr/palm/applications Jul 09 22:01:47 ?? Jul 09 22:02:35 Sargun: here's where my total inexperience using graphics toolkits shows through.. I want to get a terminal going but I have to go from a RGBA array (pixbuf) that gets composited to the browser window into a useful program Jul 09 22:02:44 preferably an OSS one someone has already written Jul 09 22:04:16 interestingly most of the plugins are called "adapters" meaning I think that they basically just want to be gateways from the browser / nsapi to other code. classic actually spawns a seperate binary and passes it a drawing context somehow Jul 09 22:04:19 what user do plugins run as? Jul 09 22:04:34 tmzt: root I believe Jul 09 22:04:36 oh Jul 09 22:05:03 then is should be easy to open a pty Jul 09 22:05:09 sure Jul 09 22:05:34 Its interesting that there are messenger.png all over the place and no msn account support? :/ Jul 09 22:06:03 so add it Jul 09 22:06:07 to libpurple Jul 09 22:06:16 I'd prefer to call login instead of dropping to a root shell.. don't know about you guys :) Jul 09 22:06:50 well, I think we should keep the X way Jul 09 22:06:56 ah Jul 09 22:07:05 just open pty as current user Jul 09 22:07:10 well users can always su - safeuser Jul 09 22:07:11 but you approach works as well Jul 09 22:07:27 the pty process can drop privs Jul 09 22:08:10 tmzt: so do you want to start hacking on this too? what do you need, a working cross compile or way to build it on the pre? I could definitely use help Jul 09 22:08:12 you could even make it configurable Jul 09 22:08:25 time :) Jul 09 22:08:35 ah, that one's harder Jul 09 22:08:48 well, I think we should clean up the headers Jul 09 22:09:13 oh? Jul 09 22:09:42 finally got that browser patch working Jul 09 22:09:48 quilt push -a fixed it Jul 09 22:10:08 tmzt: what about the headers specifically? Jul 09 22:10:33 tmzt: I know there are a lot of NSAPI functions we're defining in cpp and h files but I don't know for certain they're not used yet Jul 09 22:10:35 remove the netscape stuff Jul 09 22:10:42 get down to the basic abi Jul 09 22:10:49 well the API _is_ NSAPI Jul 09 22:10:56 NPAPI Jul 09 22:11:01 err NPAPI Jul 09 22:11:04 but the engine is webkit Jul 09 22:11:16 and you don't have xpfe Jul 09 22:11:55 yeah, some of the XP_UNIX platform stuff isn't at all applicable Jul 09 22:11:59 how are you building it exactly? Jul 09 22:12:08 make Jul 09 22:12:21 on linux on the latest ubuntu Jul 09 22:12:30 the scripting stuff is probably completely different Jul 09 22:12:47 command line Jul 09 22:12:47 what do you use to build the plugin Jul 09 22:12:50 Man part of me wishes I could dig deeper into this stuff, but programming just isn't my calling in life Jul 09 22:12:57 g++ Jul 09 22:13:12 we also have json stuff to add, someone said it's based on an open library Jul 09 22:13:19 hi Jul 09 22:13:33 destinal: I've finally got a Linux VM set up on the new laptop, so I can do OSX and Linux cross compile stuff now ... Jul 09 22:14:02 rwhitby: cool. if you're willing to grab basicplugin and try to build it that would be very useful Jul 09 22:14:34 but only for emu Jul 09 22:14:39 targeting linux-arm of course Jul 09 22:14:50 I think it can be built natively Jul 09 22:15:05 well, does it need any libraries to work Jul 09 22:15:08 tmzt: using optware-devel? Jul 09 22:15:14 even stdlib Jul 09 22:15:25 I guess, do you have working g++? Jul 09 22:24:22 Props to palm for busting their butts on webOS updates Jul 09 22:24:41 1.1 due within 30 days? I wish Apple was dedicated to the iPhone like that two years ago Jul 09 22:25:10 Even more justification for my Pre purchase. ^^; Jul 09 22:27:43 Have they said what will be in 1.1? Jul 09 22:29:19 enterprise stuffs Jul 09 22:29:25 Ah. Jul 09 22:29:29 we have a new update? Jul 09 22:29:38 tmzt, i have a working cpp yes Jul 09 22:29:44 prethinking.com or precentral.com has it forget which Jul 09 22:29:49 not g++ no Jul 09 22:29:50 er precentral.net Jul 09 22:29:54 i always do that lol :) Jul 09 22:30:19 is there a solution includes everything to bypass net guard, retrieve SPC, enable WAP cricket Jul 09 22:32:34 net guard? Jul 09 22:32:50 use on other carriers is offtopic Jul 09 22:32:59 is wap even supported? Jul 09 22:35:40 hey ok Jul 09 22:35:45 i got a retard question Jul 09 22:36:03 i didnt have my pre on lock and some how lost my contacts icon and its not in the list Jul 09 22:36:17 any idea what menu that i can pull that back up from to put it in the bar? Jul 09 22:46:31 tmzt: the three piece model really appeals to me Jul 09 22:46:58 ? Jul 09 22:47:14 tmzt: one, the mojo app (of course), embeds the plugin and sends it events in JS. two, the browser plugin, and three a native binary that it starts and communicates with. Jul 09 22:47:22 npapi.h npruntime.h Jul 09 22:47:23 or I guess it could just be another thread Jul 09 22:47:26 ah yes Jul 09 22:47:37 classic starts a native binary Jul 09 22:47:47 but then it has to pkill it on shutdown event Jul 09 22:47:58 I don't see why it needs to be a seperate process though Jul 09 22:48:09 yeah, another thread would be fine Jul 09 22:48:10 it needs to fork a shell but that should be enough Jul 09 22:49:18 then the plugin thread gets callback with events, it in turn sends them to the plugin and receives any it has to send back Jul 09 22:50:21 anyway, can you do the sketchpad plugin? Jul 09 22:52:26 tmzt: sure Jul 09 22:53:51 tmzt: how much functionality does it need, just the ability do draw freehand? ie, place a point where the pen goes down? Jul 09 22:54:38 or do you want a full paint style app? Jul 09 22:55:31 just the free hand Jul 09 22:55:40 not even saving state Jul 09 22:55:47 ok, that fits with basicplugin Jul 09 22:55:53 it's just to test pen events Jul 09 22:55:54 it's still demo code Jul 09 22:55:55 yeah Jul 09 22:55:56 right Jul 09 22:56:15 I'll have to add pen events to the mojo app too Jul 09 22:56:20 they don't come free Jul 09 22:56:34 that I was surprised by Jul 09 22:56:44 classic has tons and tons of code to take UI stuff and send events Jul 09 22:56:49 in their JS Jul 09 22:56:55 wow Jul 09 22:57:04 yeah, that's suprising Jul 09 22:58:25 oh destinal Jul 09 22:58:33 I looked into the EULA stuff with loading Jul 09 22:58:33 funkatron: hey Jul 09 22:58:46 err, loading apps outside of the app store Jul 09 22:58:52 right Jul 09 22:58:53 in a testing environment, it's okay Jul 09 22:59:18 and the interpretation I got was that a "testing environment" is not limited by physical boundaries Jul 09 22:59:33 so, what I'm doing is officially kosher Jul 09 22:59:46 apparently Jul 09 23:01:47 well. that's good news. Jul 09 23:01:56 so all you have to do is define "testing"? Jul 09 23:02:41 ah Jul 09 23:02:58 ok, so just declare that your OSS project is the test build of the app officially available -> catalog Jul 09 23:02:59 :) Jul 09 23:03:32 man Jul 09 23:03:36 i cant find the damn menu :/ Jul 09 23:03:41 which menu Jul 09 23:04:07 yo Jul 09 23:04:41 The Classic menu is the tiny grey button on the right, which isn't there on the Treo acual unit Jul 09 23:04:58 yes.... Jul 09 23:05:39 I need help with an app i'm trying to make Jul 09 23:05:51 it's probably a simple fix Jul 09 23:05:58 but i cant figure iit out Jul 09 23:06:01 Lacutis: or are you talking about the little bar on the bottom of the Pre ? Jul 09 23:06:17 HebrewzHammer what's wrong? Jul 09 23:06:53 funkatron: so does that make things like the email ipk method a violation if it were to pop up again? or just basically make selling apps via that type of method a violation Jul 09 23:07:22 can you give an app away to everyone in the world as a "test" or does that also violate it? Jul 09 23:07:25 I'd say it makes selling apps outside of the app store a violation Jul 09 23:07:41 Is it possible to put apps into the little bendy-bar at the bottom of the Pre? I dislike the stock choices Jul 09 23:08:01 but I'll say that I'm quite certain this is really because of concern about malicious apps, and not some desire to exert extreme control Jul 09 23:08:24 when i run my app, for some reason I think it looks for the "main-scene.html" file in "views/main/" when it should just look in "views/" Jul 09 23:08:32 so I think some give and take is there, and to continue talking about what you want to see as a dev from Palm is a good idea Jul 09 23:09:11 after i run my app, i just get a blank card that says "template load failed: main/main-scene.html" at the top Jul 09 23:09:12 the email ipk thing was just a flat-out security flaw. No matter what platform you're on, it was a bad idea Jul 09 23:09:40 ok Jul 09 23:09:50 what does your sources.json say? Jul 09 23:10:01 [ Jul 09 23:10:02 { Jul 09 23:10:02 "source": "app/assistants/stage-assistant.js" Jul 09 23:10:02 }, Jul 09 23:10:02 { Jul 09 23:10:02 "source": "app/assistants/main-assistant.js" Jul 09 23:10:04 } Jul 09 23:10:06 ] Jul 09 23:10:08 crap, srry about that Jul 09 23:10:08 ack Jul 09 23:10:21 Pastebin: http://webos.pastebin.com/ Jul 09 23:10:24 ok, next time, let's use pastebin. Jul 09 23:10:31 but that's fine. Jul 09 23:10:53 I love this dude giving me shit about Spaz using email to post photos Jul 09 23:11:07 could it something in the stage-assistant? Jul 09 23:11:16 Yeah, no shit it should be simpler. You think I wanted to write a goddamn photo emailer? Jul 09 23:11:25 yes. Jul 09 23:12:43 stage-assistant --> http://webos.pastebin.com/d49fdd9fe Jul 09 23:13:15 http://webos.pastebin.com/d1aa1609a Jul 09 23:13:47 ok Jul 09 23:13:59 I'm going to set fire to everything Jul 09 23:14:17 your scene assistant is expecting to find main-view.html in /apps/views/main/main-view.html Jul 09 23:14:39 I don't know why but the standard scene pusher code you copied wants the scene view in a directory with the name of the scene UNDER the views folder Jul 09 23:14:43 You could change that.... Jul 09 23:14:48 or, accept the default Jul 09 23:14:51 amd move main Jul 09 23:15:12 main-scene not main-view -- my bad Jul 09 23:16:01 exit Jul 09 23:16:07 heh... Jul 09 23:16:23 so would this be correct? --> http://webos.pastebin.com/d2b9822f1 Jul 09 23:16:34 i somehow lost my contacts icon lol Jul 09 23:16:42 and its not in with all the other apps etc Jul 09 23:16:46 lizardo: lol Jul 09 23:17:00 you also have not listed the "scenes": "main" piece in your sources.json Jul 09 23:17:56 to HebrewzHammer Jul 09 23:17:56 isn't this more a #webos thing? Jul 09 23:18:01 yes Jul 09 23:18:05 yes it is. Jul 09 23:18:14 and yes, there's a line missing from his sources.json Jul 09 23:19:42 okay, internals talk Jul 09 23:20:01 oh, i thought this was the place to discuss programming Jul 09 23:20:10 anyone who can help with an adapter for a painting/sketchpad plugin? Jul 09 23:20:22 that's #webos Jul 09 23:20:25 HH: that's what #webos is for Jul 09 23:20:36 rwhitby: I really borked this pre btw. It's going to take time to recover it. It's a learning experience Jul 09 23:21:09 the problem came when it tried to do an update/backup and seemingly tried to log into the palm account Jul 09 23:21:18 bhuey: doctor doesn't take that long to run Jul 09 23:21:22 we'll see Jul 09 23:21:31 destinal: I'm on OS X Jul 09 23:21:35 will it run on that ? Jul 09 23:21:56 the good thing is that I've got root Jul 09 23:22:16 the bad thing is that I don't know how to start the networking and restore the image to the back up that I made before my adventures Jul 09 23:22:50 bhuey: yes, OSX is supported in doctor Jul 09 23:23:07 is there a way to completely back up a pre so it can be restored al la Doctor, but with your own customizations? Jul 09 23:23:55 destinal: I have the image but couldn't find out to run it or install it Jul 09 23:24:20 I was able to extract the novacom stuff to root but I have little other information Jul 09 23:24:42 bhuey: if you have http://palm.cdnetworks.net/rom/pre_p100eww/webosdoctorp100ewwsprint.jar Jul 09 23:24:50 yes, I do Jul 09 23:24:50 just java -jar webosdoctorp100ewwsprint.jar Jul 09 23:25:02 so it's a java jar, ok Jul 09 23:25:04 thanks Jul 09 23:25:29 no problem, but yeah that exact command from a shell should do it Jul 09 23:26:21 I wonder what it would take to add linux support to the doctor Jul 09 23:26:23 it's running now Jul 09 23:26:41 as easy as a linux novacom? or is there more Jul 09 23:27:10 destinal: I've been trying to restore the luna image from another palm pre but I think I blew it out since a .db might have the wrong or old information from the previous pre. Jul 09 23:27:45 it was wildly sucessful last night when I saw it running, but claims shortly after trying to do the automated backup that it can't log into it's own user Jul 09 23:28:35 other than that, i've completely bonded with this device Jul 09 23:28:48 it's such a killer phone for so many reasons Jul 09 23:29:21 I don't know how folks put up with the iphone Jul 09 23:29:27 any breaking news lately in the homebrew community? Jul 09 23:29:49 sushi2: regarding restoring like doctor but with your customizations, I have a plan Jul 09 23:29:58 sushi2: I'm calling the idea webos Image tool (WIT) Jul 09 23:30:00 native plugins are coming Jul 09 23:30:22 eta? Jul 09 23:31:04 sushi2: the idea is you have a gui app that lets you load a doctor image, then customize it by installing / removing packages, hiding / unhiding apps, and maybe applying patches . then you "save" and you have a modified doctor jar Jul 09 23:31:27 yeah, hey destinal, get on that, m'kay? Jul 09 23:31:43 sugardave: but I care more about a terminal app right now :) Jul 09 23:31:56 destinal: That sounds fantastic. Jul 09 23:32:00 destinal: good app idea Jul 09 23:32:07 destinal: on which platform will it run? Jul 09 23:33:18 rwhitby: I'd like it to be multiplatform but I don't know whether python or java or c++ / gdk Jul 09 23:34:39 I'm guessing python will be quickest Jul 09 23:34:49 python FTW Jul 09 23:34:49 how long does this reburn take ? Jul 09 23:34:51 15 minutes ? Jul 09 23:36:05 the other app idea I've been kicking around is a multiplatform palm catalog client, enabling browse/search/download Jul 09 23:36:22 since someone mentioned there's no web interface for catalog Jul 09 23:36:27 though maybe there will be later Jul 09 23:36:47 destinal, we need a good terminal app Jul 09 23:36:58 timboy: yeah, that's what I'm focused on now Jul 09 23:37:07 sweet Jul 09 23:38:15 timboy: right now I have a graphical browser plugin that paints a blue card natively. kind of my plugin "hello world". tonight I'm going to try to get a simple freehand sketch demo Jul 09 23:38:28 just to get pen events and drawing working together Jul 09 23:38:34 destinal, make sure to have a shortcut for tab somehow for the terminal app Jul 09 23:38:40 destinal, sounds sweet Jul 09 23:39:03 timboy: there's probably existing terminal programs we can just port once we get the interfaces worked out Jul 09 23:39:16 faster than writing one from scratch Jul 09 23:39:44 but yeah any keyboard keys we don't have we'll have to figure out gestures or radial menus for or something Jul 09 23:40:17 yes forward gesture for tab would rock Jul 09 23:40:24 we're kind of short on keys also. Jul 09 23:40:32 we have control Jul 09 23:40:35 (orange) Jul 09 23:41:38 I guess with sym support we could be ok Jul 09 23:41:42 timboy: +1 on the tab gesture Jul 09 23:42:01 and trackball mode for arrow keys Jul 09 23:42:12 ie hold down orange and gesture a direction Jul 09 23:43:45 and we actually have sym and orange+sym if we get different events for them Jul 09 23:44:46 hmmm... hey, the volume buttons could maybe be rigged to send events through the js assistant into the plugin Jul 09 23:45:29 I know someone was using them to switch music tracks Jul 09 23:46:01 destinal, or better yet for directions hold down orange and gesture on screen for direction to move cursor. just like when moving cursor left and right while holding orange Jul 09 23:46:17 yes that's what I said I thought Jul 09 23:46:26 it's called trackball mode by the palm devs, incidentally Jul 09 23:47:04 destinal, oh i thought you meant in gesture area Jul 09 23:47:15 oh, nah Jul 09 23:47:21 but yeah forward gesture could be tab Jul 09 23:47:41 then we could still use drawing gestures on the screen area without orange as radial menus Jul 09 23:48:08 i'm drooling already Jul 09 23:48:48 I love that the irc log has already made notes for me for when I get there :) Jul 09 23:51:36 destinal: looks like one could take advantage of rsync for that backup app Jul 09 23:51:43 going to run a command line test Jul 09 23:51:45 no need to manage terminal "tabs" at least, the card view already does that Jul 09 23:51:59 sushi2: check the irc logs from last night, someone was talking about rsync Jul 09 23:52:13 where do I look at them? wiki? Jul 09 23:52:28 topic has the URL Jul 09 23:53:58 topic? Jul 09 23:54:03 oh Jul 09 23:54:05 nm Jul 09 23:54:07 lol Jul 09 23:54:14 :) Jul 09 23:55:57 destinal: Hmm - did a find on the webos-internals from today and yesterday - didn't see any rsync mentions Jul 09 23:57:48 hmm, maybe he was using another tool, but it sounded like a similar concept Jul 09 23:58:35 at any rate I don't know if he ever wrote it up in detail. if you do get it going, feel free to. Jul 09 23:59:27 another cool thing to do and a lot easier than my ultimate installer tool app Jul 09 23:59:44 would be to just tar up the rootfs the right way and then inject it into a doctor jar Jul 09 23:59:53 so you can restore an exact backup as it were Jul 10 00:00:38 your "ultimate installer tool app" ? Jul 10 00:00:59 or figure out the protocol it uses to write then ew filesystem Jul 10 00:01:02 new Jul 10 00:01:03 summatusmentis: uh, check the log. I contemplate something i'm calling "wit" or webos installer tool. Jul 10 00:01:13 I thought chron was working on that Jul 10 00:01:17 and away rsync goes... Jul 10 00:01:21 no, see, I just want you to tell me so I don't have to read :) Jul 10 00:01:23 summatusmentis: basically a doctor image editor Jul 10 00:01:35 oh, that's cool :) Jul 10 00:01:41 I'll go back and read the logs later Jul 10 00:02:01 it's a backburner priority for me now that I've got browser plugins drawing stuff Jul 10 00:02:07 I want a terminal app first Jul 10 00:02:58 maybe someone else will write it for me first :) Jul 10 00:03:21 (the webos doctor image editor I mean) Jul 10 00:03:38 wait, that's die Jul 10 00:03:43 oh well Jul 10 00:03:47 when will you be home? Jul 10 00:03:59 I finally decided to root!, but now I need help, for I am not the premaster Jul 10 00:04:19 tmzt: leaving in a few minutes but I have 1hr commute Jul 10 00:04:32 what do you need help with PreMan? Jul 10 00:04:52 I want to use usbnet as my way to get inside my pre... I have it setup to the point where on my 'network connections' it says the connection is connected, firewalled Jul 10 00:05:15 i set it up with the exact same IP's the person who wrote the step by step guide did, but when i try to use putty to ssh in, it says connection refused Jul 10 00:05:20 Did you setup DHCP? Jul 10 00:05:30 no, it said optional, is that necessary? Jul 10 00:05:31 ugh don't have people install dhcpd's on their phones Jul 10 00:05:49 It was just a question destinal ;) Jul 10 00:05:51 it has dnsmasq already I think Jul 10 00:05:54 just static IP your workstation 192.168.0.2 . the phone is 192.168.0.202 Jul 10 00:06:06 Thanks destinal Jul 10 00:06:12 yes, thats the ip Jul 10 00:06:13 Typed it before I could :P Jul 10 00:06:19 standard port for ssh 22 is used right? Jul 10 00:06:21 no Jul 10 00:06:23 222 Jul 10 00:06:33 well i tried both to be safe, both fail Jul 10 00:06:51 do you still have eth0 in your dropbear upstart script? Jul 10 00:07:14 wow.... nvm.... I feel like the biggest PreFail ever Jul 10 00:07:23 just because you said 222 it worked, i am so sure i tried it Jul 10 00:07:47 heh, awesome. I always wanted an aura effect Jul 10 00:08:33 ok, now i did init... STOP dropbear-w/e instead of 'start'... that shuts down dropbear right? Jul 10 00:08:46 i just want to make sure i am protected as far as outside connections go, i just want to stick with usbnet Jul 10 00:08:47 right Jul 10 00:08:53 well Jul 10 00:08:59 and with dev mode off i am extra protected anyway? Jul 10 00:09:05 I would go back into the upstart script where it mentions eth0? Jul 10 00:09:23 and change it, I think to usb0 Jul 10 00:09:31 iptables? Jul 10 00:09:33 that way only usbnet ssh is allowed Jul 10 00:09:37 tmzt: yes Jul 10 00:09:48 +destinal: okay let me try that Jul 10 00:09:49 then you can keep it running Jul 10 00:10:09 "ifconfig usb0" on the phone first to make sure I'm right on the interface name Jul 10 00:11:02 uhhhhh -sh: ifconfig: not found Jul 10 00:11:09 sudo su - Jul 10 00:11:11 that was working with novaproxy and all that Jul 10 00:11:17 it's your path Jul 10 00:11:46 if you "su -" you get root to run .profile and get /sbin and /usr/sbin Jul 10 00:11:55 err /etc/profile not .profile Jul 10 00:12:21 you can always type /sbin/ifconfig usb0 Jul 10 00:12:26 but having a path can be nice Jul 10 00:12:32 yeah true Jul 10 00:12:52 when i ifconfig i see usb0, but upon 'ifconfig usb0' it says bad address Jul 10 00:13:01 nvm Jul 10 00:13:07 i fail again, it is correct usb0 it is Jul 10 00:13:20 cool Jul 10 00:13:24 now you want me to change that script you say? Jul 10 00:13:30 measure twice, cut once and all that Jul 10 00:14:07 where is that upstart script, i don't see it in the step by step Jul 10 00:14:25 so check out the dropbear install page Jul 10 00:14:30 http://predev.wikidot.com/dropbear-install Jul 10 00:14:51 optware-dropbear? Jul 10 00:14:57 yeah Jul 10 00:15:37 I wonder if this has been changed on the wiki. hmmmm Jul 10 00:15:55 i never removed the -i eth0 lines Jul 10 00:16:20 change it to -i usb0 Jul 10 00:16:40 okay, and then i should be safe? Jul 10 00:17:17 you may have to turn off dev mode to return iptables to normal, I don't remember Jul 10 00:17:28 okay, i shall turn off dev mode Jul 10 00:18:03 you can always try coming in on your wifi network if you have one after restarting the phone .. make sure it accepts connections on usb0 and refuses them on eth0 (wifi) Jul 10 00:18:14 my friend just sent me this wallpaper for my pre lol http://yfrog.com/4gunknown20090907191548j Jul 10 00:19:07 http://img160.imageshack.us/img160/7089/unknown20090907191548.jpg Jul 10 00:19:28 lol Jul 10 00:19:52 hes got a knife Jul 10 00:20:26 once you make sure taht you can ssh in, turn off dev mode. Jul 10 00:20:34 well he's a knight Jul 10 00:20:44 I'd think he'd have a sword also Jul 10 00:21:09 hahaha Jul 10 00:21:36 +destinal: Thanks for all the help!! Jul 10 00:21:44 PreMan: you're welcome Jul 10 00:22:51 back later Jul 10 00:22:53 hello.. Jul 10 00:22:56 splat - rysnc rebooted the pre Jul 10 00:23:11 how do I create a script while in ssh with my pre? Jul 10 00:23:23 vi? Jul 10 00:23:29 do any of you know if it's safe to run the pre over 500mhz? Im worried about the ram speed ratio not being synched with the upscaled processor.. Jul 10 00:23:38 vi? Jul 10 00:23:48 datafirm: I've been using ondemand for a few days, seems fine Jul 10 00:24:19 czarphanguye: heh. :) i was using the smarflex at 600.. but I was just worried about the ram Jul 10 00:24:33 smartflex? Jul 10 00:24:44 tmzt: volatge regulation Jul 10 00:24:49 to save battery power Jul 10 00:25:19 after typing in vi and then entering my script, how do I close/save it? Jul 10 00:25:24 where is that set? Jul 10 00:25:47 commandercup, [esc]:wq[enter] Jul 10 00:25:48 the samrtreflex script on the wiki doesnt do anything, since because the kernel will just change ondemand to userspace whenever anything happens Jul 10 00:25:57 and then you should look for a vi command reference Jul 10 00:26:36 gkatsev: im not sure ondemand. Jul 10 00:26:39 it says no current filename Jul 10 00:26:41 how do i set one? Jul 10 00:26:43 just smartflex. Jul 10 00:27:17 neverind Jul 10 00:27:22 found a reference :P Jul 10 00:27:58 oh, I never get the 'no filename' thing because I always give a filename to vi Jul 10 00:28:59 tmzt: you can set smartflex like so: echo -n 1 > /sys/power/sr_vdd1_autocomp; echo -n 1 > /sys/power/sr_vdd2_autocomp; Jul 10 00:29:34 ah, ok Jul 10 00:29:43 datafirm: unfortunately, as A2NY|work-MIA told me, the kernel will just reset vdd1 and vdd2 when you reboot the phone or stuff... Jul 10 00:29:55 well yes Jul 10 00:30:07 add that to a startup script Jul 10 00:30:24 sysfs is a virtual flesystem, it only exists in ram Jul 10 00:30:34 so, until we get a new kernel that can support on demand out of the box, we are pretty much SOL in terms of ondemand Jul 10 00:30:46 gkatsev: ondemand is different. Jul 10 00:30:59 gkatsev: and as tmzt said, you can setup a startup script. Jul 10 00:31:10 right Jul 10 00:31:17 ondemina is for scaling. Jul 10 00:31:51 does anyone know if bestbuy or radioshack sells either usb to micro or micro - mini adapters? Jul 10 00:32:07 they should Jul 10 00:32:22 commandercup: a radioshack I went to did not have micro usb Jul 10 00:32:23 best buy probably even has the palm ones, if you wish Jul 10 00:32:28 maybe others do. Jul 10 00:32:32 hmm Jul 10 00:32:38 yeah, not all will have it in stock Jul 10 00:32:40 how much do the palm ones cost at the sprint store? Jul 10 00:32:56 um... i think they are like 20 bucks online... Jul 10 00:32:58 i got mine from newegg for ~$4 Jul 10 00:33:06 well I lost my only one... so I need one ASAP Jul 10 00:33:11 I don't think I can wait for one from newegg Jul 10 00:33:26 prob. not since these batts. only last about .5 days Jul 10 00:33:34 lol Jul 10 00:33:36 :( Jul 10 00:33:38 I'm down to 20% Jul 10 00:33:47 I guess I'll call my local bestbuy/radioshack and see if they have anything Jul 10 00:33:57 I'm worried the person won't even know what it is... heh Jul 10 00:34:11 so, at sprint its probably around 20 Jul 10 00:34:17 ridiculous :( Jul 10 00:34:31 if you need to just charge it, you could probably go into a sprint store and ask them to charge it for you Jul 10 00:34:53 I guess that's a last resort heh Jul 10 00:36:37 yes, the palm microUSB cable is 19.99 Jul 10 00:36:47 but it is actually a really well made cable Jul 10 00:37:04 but then again, $20 for a cable? Jul 10 00:37:07 thats a lot.. Jul 10 00:38:36 all cheap micro usb cables work with pre? Jul 10 00:39:52 just about Jul 10 00:40:04 charging is a seperate issue Jul 10 00:42:32 but the ones from monoprice work fine Jul 10 00:42:40 I ordered 5 for about $5 Jul 10 00:42:51 but _probably_ any decent microusb will work. Jul 10 00:46:42 Yeah I ordered 10 cables from monoprice and they work fine Jul 10 00:48:14 * bhuey looks at the keys via "string" in the palmaccount db Jul 10 00:48:36 sqlite3 Jul 10 00:49:04 select * frome table; Jul 10 00:49:10 select * from table; Jul 10 00:49:19 .list tables Jul 10 00:49:24 I think it is Jul 10 00:59:43 yeah im enabling the optware package Jul 10 00:59:51 but the connection to gitorious.org is timing out Jul 10 01:00:00 ie.. wget http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/bootstrap/blobs/raw/master/etc/profile.d/optware Jul 10 01:00:00 fails Jul 10 01:00:58 is this hosted anywhere else besides gitorious.org ? Jul 10 01:01:45 it works over here Jul 10 01:02:13 http://pastebin.com/m7ece5fa2 - the result Jul 10 01:05:55 word Jul 10 01:06:03 just hosted it onto my server Jul 10 01:06:04 ty Jul 10 01:07:18 evening Jul 10 01:11:56 evening Jul 10 01:18:16 hey everyone Jul 10 01:18:53 hrmmm reformatted my pre and installed drop bear but now its reallly slow when connected via ssh Jul 10 01:19:09 i cannot get novaproxy.py to run on windows vista Jul 10 01:19:20 the script told me to come here for help! Jul 10 01:20:42 i have rooted my pre to work on my xp machine but my workstation is giving me trouble... anyone care to help? Jul 10 01:21:05 i am following predev's wiki Jul 10 01:27:25 Am I in the wrong channel? Jul 10 01:27:39 no Jul 10 01:28:07 no one can help then? Jul 10 01:29:30 I guess I don't understand why the wiki says to come here for help? Jul 10 01:32:56 noones here Jul 10 01:33:01 and im not qualified to help Jul 10 01:37:40 do ppl just chill in here? Jul 10 01:42:56 Chris_: just chill out, it's evening in the US, stick around Jul 10 01:43:44 tmzt: I tried '.list tables' but that doesn't seem to get me anything. so, I try '.tables ?pattern?' but I'm not sure how to construct the wildcard for it Jul 10 01:44:00 summatusmentis ok thanks. i actually got it working. switched the Pre to a USB 2.0 port instead of my dongle. so far so good Jul 10 01:45:23 ah, yeah Jul 10 01:45:33 I just use strings, much easier Jul 10 01:49:36 hello all Jul 10 01:49:49 hi Jul 10 01:50:10 duh, you have to start with 'sqlite3 [dbname]' and then things work! Jul 10 01:50:16 anyone get cpu scaling or smartrelex to work? Jul 10 01:50:25 *smartreflex Jul 10 01:50:41 I was playing around with the web app and I changed the icon, I know I am a fanboy :/ http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/4269/preekm.jpg Jul 10 01:51:11 hoping someone can help, I think I corrupted my dnsmasq.palm.conf file while trying to install usbnet Jul 10 01:51:47 I am getting unable to resolve host name when trying to open web pages Jul 10 01:52:06 just download webos doctor, open up the OSes tar file and find that file to look at what you need out of it Jul 10 01:52:16 we unfortunately can't paste anything to you Jul 10 01:52:43 ah, Ok looking now Jul 10 01:56:22 once i find the file I could just copy it over right? Jul 10 02:02:29 anyone know where the launcher icon for the dialer is? Jul 10 02:09:40 good question Jul 10 02:10:23 .... Jul 10 02:11:07 looking -- wait one Jul 10 02:11:18 k thx Jul 10 02:12:15 you found the launcher CODE? Jul 10 02:12:23 'cause it's gonna be called out in there.... Jul 10 02:12:46 put this another way, where have you looked? Jul 10 02:14:25 thanks psykos I copied via usb then replaced the file in /etc Jul 10 02:15:43 no i Jul 10 02:15:57 no i'm trying to edit the png to change the color of it on the launcher Jul 10 02:17:04 tbird02 -- try usr\palm\applications\com.palm.app.firstuse\images Jul 10 02:17:05 ugh, ISP problems Jul 10 02:19:05 or perhaps usr\palm\sysmgr\images Jul 10 02:19:41 or usr\palm\applications\com.palm.app.phone Jul 10 02:20:33 or usr\palm\applications\com.palm.app.phoneprefs\images Jul 10 02:21:39 but if you're changing the color in the launcher, you probebly want to change the ANSWER notification icon in usr\palm\applications\com.palm.app.phone\images as well Jul 10 02:21:50 rboatright: the gods frown on backslash as a path seperator Jul 10 02:22:32 and so do penguins :) Jul 10 02:23:19 yeah, Jul 10 02:23:54 and I'm searching the untar'ed rootfs on my windows box for png's visually looking at tiles, so go jump. -- ment in the kindest way of course. . . :-) Jul 10 02:24:06 tbird02 did that help? Jul 10 02:24:23 :) Jul 10 02:26:54 i changed the png is inthe phone app images folder, n/h Jul 10 02:26:58 no help Jul 10 02:37:19 anyone hacking anything interesting? Jul 10 02:37:27 i guess no answer for me. Jul 10 02:37:48 that's a pretty severe NDA ;) Jul 10 02:38:39 no...i meant i didnt get an answer to my question Jul 10 02:38:47 oh Jul 10 02:38:54 * destinal checks logs Jul 10 02:39:28 destinal: with ssh running I dogged the crap out of the thing an noticed no diff... Jul 10 02:40:33 oh openssh? Jul 10 02:40:55 this is related to the openssh vs dropbear thing we were talking about earlier? Jul 10 02:42:48 hello Jul 10 02:42:57 can someone help me make an ssh connection? Jul 10 02:43:05 nickserv Jul 10 02:45:20 hello Jul 10 02:45:26 can someone help me? Jul 10 02:45:28 hey guys, i just want to get an example pre app to work... Jul 10 02:45:40 preman Jul 10 02:45:47 have you succesfully ssh to ur pre? Jul 10 02:45:59 I use usb Jul 10 02:46:02 i am having some trouble with that Jul 10 02:46:07 i am trying usb too Jul 10 02:46:18 help with what? Jul 10 02:46:19 so if i use usb i don't need to ssh? Jul 10 02:46:29 i have installed Jul 10 02:46:31 usbnet Jul 10 02:46:34 i mean enabled Jul 10 02:46:42 yeah you have to setup a network connection and stuff, are you following the tutorial? Jul 10 02:46:50 yes i set up a network Jul 10 02:46:53 we dont talk about tethering here Jul 10 02:46:56 changed the settings Jul 10 02:47:00 unchecked the box Jul 10 02:47:05 it says connected Jul 10 02:47:10 LOL this is not tethering Jul 10 02:47:10 then i try to use putty Jul 10 02:47:17 port 222? Jul 10 02:47:20 not 22! Jul 10 02:47:20 ya ya ya :P Jul 10 02:47:24 let me try that Jul 10 02:47:24 i know what u mean Jul 10 02:47:35 hehehehe Jul 10 02:47:58 hey so has anyone successfully loaded 'first scene' on a pre app? Jul 10 02:48:01 man! Jul 10 02:48:06 u did it hahahaha Jul 10 02:48:11 i feel so stupid Jul 10 02:48:13 i just did the same thing earlier Jul 10 02:48:19 i was in exact same situation Jul 10 02:48:29 +destinal deserves all the credit Jul 10 02:48:42 PreMan: hey. firstscene? Jul 10 02:48:42 now i'd like to do the cpu scaling thing Jul 10 02:48:47 would u recommend it? Jul 10 02:49:01 you'd have to ask the guys with the '+' about that Jul 10 02:49:13 destinal would u recommend cpu scalinig? Jul 10 02:49:16 +destinal: yeah, i'm trying to get the example application to run Jul 10 02:49:18 i dont watch a lot of videos Jul 10 02:49:26 Sebastian85: I haven't tried CPU scaling Jul 10 02:49:54 Sebastian85: some people say it manages to save battery and improve performance at once, but it's one of those things that's somewhat advanced IMO Jul 10 02:50:06 destinal: yeah, sry zoned out there Jul 10 02:50:16 +destinal: when I load the application on the pre, it showed the index.html originally, so i took out the body of that file, and it says the framework is supposed to know to use the stage-assistant which will load the "first-scene.html"? Jul 10 02:50:22 oh ok Jul 10 02:50:29 i am going to give it a shot Jul 10 02:50:36 should i jsut copy and past whats here? Jul 10 02:50:38 http://predev.wikidot.com/processor Jul 10 02:53:55 copying and pasting doesn't work Jul 10 02:54:01 Sebastian85: again, haven't tried it, YMMV. Jul 10 02:54:02 sebastian85, a2ny|work-mia and myself have been working on reading the docs over OMAP3 and really this is not the greatest idea Jul 10 02:54:02 +destinal: do you know what i'm talking about? Jul 10 02:54:02 PreMan: I've made simple apps before Jul 10 02:54:02 PreMan: are you following a walkthrough on the wiki? Jul 10 02:54:02 hello everybody. Jul 10 02:54:02 +destinal: did you use a stage-assistant.js? Jul 10 02:54:03 +destinal: no i'm using a different one i googled up Jul 10 02:54:03 sebastian85, the overclocking to 600mhz + vdd1/2 adjustments are offspec for OMAP and what other settings the pre kernel enforces, it basically keeps trying to overwrite your settings so the cpu voltages hop back and forth Jul 10 02:54:03 sebastian85, on the battery savings/ondemand mode, that doesn't actually also fit well within the omap's spec and while it works for some people it's very prone to crashing and really shouldn't be used Jul 10 02:54:29 PreMan: http://predev.wikidot.com/building-webos-mojo-applications Jul 10 02:54:31 a2ny|work-mia and myself are eyeing settings in the kernel we can adjust to fix both of these methods, but the only problem right now with using a custom kernel is your power button doesn't work Jul 10 02:54:40 PreMan: can't vouch for stuff not on the wiki Jul 10 02:55:18 are there any cool modifications i should try? Jul 10 02:56:53 hmm, we need better apps on there actually Jul 10 02:57:12 that one is ok but something a little more advanced... Jul 10 02:57:18 I folowed the walkthrough and rooted my Pre and installed dropbear everything worked ok so i turned off developer mode, when i rebooted my SSH session over wifi can't find the server. I rebooted in Developer mode and now the novaproxy.py script says it can't locate the pre. any sugestions on what to do next? Jul 10 02:59:26 hmm **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Jul 10 02:59:57 2009