**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Jul 20 02:59:57 2009 Jul 20 03:00:50 I'll try "install inside windows" and see what happens! :-) Jul 20 03:05:33 Remailednet: I may have to make one more change, but let me know how the current revision works first Jul 20 03:06:27 The script finished with no other issues, rebooting the pre to make sure dropbear starts up right Jul 20 03:07:09 cool Jul 20 03:10:32 Rebooted just fine. Looks like it is working great... Thanks Jul 20 03:13:08 bclancy: why 8.04? use 9.04! Jul 20 03:13:28 typo maybe? Jul 20 03:13:29 a lot of good improvements IMO Jul 20 03:13:49 tont: he might be following the number palm lists on the sdk but 9 works just as well as 8 for SDK Jul 20 03:13:50 destinal_: The SDK said to use 8.04 Jul 20 03:14:08 bclancy: use 9.04 for the SDK. trust me. Jul 20 03:14:18 http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_sdkdownload&view=home Jul 20 03:14:24 I know what they say Jul 20 03:14:37 OK, so I';; start downloading that ISO, thx Jul 20 03:14:42 but I and many others are using 9 with no problems Jul 20 03:14:48 I think they just need to update their recommendations Jul 20 03:15:04 destinal_: I appreciate the advice. Jul 20 03:15:27 Remailednet: if you'd like, you can try quilt-bootstrap.sh, which will install git and quilt (basically automates the setup of http://predev.wikidot.com/applying-patches) Jul 20 03:16:25 I've been so in the dark lately on the pre developments Jul 20 03:16:34 can someone bring to light what has happened so far? Jul 20 03:16:36 Me too Jul 20 03:16:44 I have no idea what is going on Jul 20 03:16:55 There is a new wiki Jul 20 03:16:59 destinal_: You caught me just in the nick of time, I had to free up some space, and I was just about to start the 8.04 install before you caught me. :-) Jul 20 03:18:05 JackieRipper: Sure, where is quilt-bootstrap.sh at? Jul 20 03:18:19 same path as the bootstrap Jul 20 03:18:46 just replace "optware-bootstrap.sh" with "quilt-bootstrap.sh" Jul 20 03:19:58 Hi everyone, I need about a 5 minute window sometime soon (like the next hour) to reboot the wiki (a 5 minute window) so I can get some backend things consistent and more memory for the wiki. Jul 20 03:20:38 ka6sox: which wiki? Jul 20 03:20:54 www.webos-internals.org Jul 20 03:21:49 [ka6sox runs the machine that we're using at OSUOSL] Jul 20 03:23:57 cool Jul 20 03:24:25 okay hearing no objections I'm going to reboot @ 03:30UTC Jul 20 03:26:12 ShadeS is there anythhing in particular you're interested in or do you want the 10000 foot overview? Jul 20 03:26:29 hehe Jul 20 03:26:45 well I recall the opt-ware and the upupdowndown deal but uh, has anything came to light since? Jul 20 03:27:00 I also think I fucking forgot to send out my rebate, totally a $100 in the hole now >8o Jul 20 03:27:02 due to the fact that there are > 200 pages of stuff on the webos-internals wiki already, and a LOT of stuff in the logs that hasn't gotten there yet. Jul 20 03:27:08 i couldn't find a stamp then i couldn't find the receipt Jul 20 03:27:12 and now i think it's past due Jul 20 03:27:21 ShadeS -- 10K overview then. Jul 20 03:27:47 Rick__: I'd love to do it to my pre, but I gotta finish fixing up these boxes before i can back up my pre and messw tih it Jul 20 03:27:51 Some people have successfully compiled replacement kernals for the Pre with extra abilities. Jul 20 03:28:09 JackieRipper: Close :) 'ERROR: Failed to change directory to /opt/src/patches' it looks like mkpatchdir is not called anywhere Jul 20 03:28:18 the folks here have figured out how the mojo front end communicates with the linux back end over the dbus and can write code which allows mojo to talk to linux Jul 20 03:28:18 hmm Jul 20 03:29:27 Others of the team have discovered that the binary apps that classic and pdf viewer and doc viewer use are set up as standard mozilla npapi browser plugins, they have reverse engineered the process for producing those, and have successfully written plugins which accept input from mojo apps and do things in binary and return information Jul 20 03:29:56 That team has also -minimally- figured out how to draw on the screen from binary processes, although a complete understanding still eludes them due to missing files. Jul 20 03:30:12 and Palm's decision to use a freaking weird graphics library. Jul 20 03:30:49 processes or in-process libraries? Jul 20 03:30:52 let's see... We've learned how to produce custom webosDoctor jar's so that you can restore a Pre to a Pre-doctored state with your options all in place.... Jul 20 03:31:33 on another front, Gregg reverse engineered the app installation process and has a white-hat clean third-party app installer. Jul 20 03:32:03 the webos-internals team will be announcing a third-party not-an-app-store place to put your apps that Palm doesn't want within the next few days. Jul 20 03:32:15 webOS 1.1 Might Drop on July 22 Jul 20 03:32:36 We've developed a complex patching system and a repository for those patches which allow community members to upload and download patches to the os and to mojo software. Jul 20 03:32:43 There's more, but that's a 10K overview. Jul 20 03:32:44 Remailednet: fixed. Please try it again Jul 20 03:33:03 ShadeS??? Jul 20 03:34:02 i'm here sorry Jul 20 03:34:35 JackieRipper: Finished just fine that time Jul 20 03:34:48 Awwsome! Jul 20 03:34:56 thanks for testing, Remailednet! Jul 20 03:35:00 i like to read all at once versus line at a time Jul 20 03:35:02 so i made some ramens Jul 20 03:35:52 Rick__: sweet, but why doesn't palm just open it up for everybody instead of leaving it quazi open? Jul 20 03:36:14 okay its back. Jul 20 03:36:18 more memory etc. Jul 20 03:45:11 ShadeS: it /is/ rather open already Jul 20 03:45:33 JackieRipper: why did Rick__ need to use words like 'reverse engineer' then? Jul 20 03:45:46 reverse engineer && open source == does not compute Jul 20 03:45:58 luna is not open Jul 20 03:46:03 the base operating system is Jul 20 03:46:03 ahh... I was thinking "open" in a different sense Jul 20 03:46:27 yea, open as in a bottle of beer, not open as in a female bending over ;) Jul 20 03:46:39 looks like they only opened what they're required to Jul 20 03:46:47 'required to' Jul 20 03:46:51 they should just leave it ALL open Jul 20 03:46:57 what harm is there Jul 20 03:47:04 none. Jul 20 03:47:12 "trade secrets" :-P Jul 20 03:47:22 People can spend time developing stuff, instead of reverse engineering them Jul 20 03:47:36 booooooooooooooo@trade secrets then Jul 20 03:47:49 bzhou * r10473 optware/trunk/ (Makefile make/ulogd.mk): ulogd: userspace logging daemon for netfilter/iptables. Added & promoted Jul 20 03:48:20 ShadeS: competitors can't use it Jul 20 03:50:56 ShadeS: It is not too late to file your rebate. (If you bought on launch day, the rebate must be postmarked by July 25th. http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/192865-rebates-expire-july-25th.html Jul 20 03:53:32 bclancy: SWEET. Jul 20 03:53:35 are there any other more active channels for webos development than webos? Jul 20 03:53:37 you own so hard Jul 20 03:53:42 i bought it launch date Jul 20 03:53:45 i have less than a week left, right? Jul 20 03:54:00 brontos: uh, there's the #palm channel, which has had more people in it since the release of the palm Jul 20 03:54:05 but most of those people are directed here lol Jul 20 03:54:24 ShadeS: Thanks I'll try it Jul 20 03:54:30 #palm seems to a club for 3l33t d00dz Jul 20 03:54:59 brontos: this and #webos seem to be the most active Jul 20 04:03:52 Anyone knows how to enlarge pre emulator's disk size? Jul 20 04:05:43 http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=iphone Jul 20 04:07:05 ameng: just create a new virtual disk, and then mount i Jul 20 04:07:06 it Jul 20 04:07:38 (I created a 2GB disk and mount it as /opt in /etc/fstab) Jul 20 04:08:59 rwhitby: thanks Jul 20 04:10:07 rwhitby: how to mount the new created one from a ssh terminal of the emulator? Jul 20 04:10:35 ameng: ah, you will need to mke2fs -j it, and then mount -t ext3 /dev/sdb1 /opt Jul 20 04:10:55 ameng: the tools you need are not on the emulator by default Jul 20 04:11:25 you can either mount the disk on a normal Linux VM and format it there, or you can install the e2fsprogs packages from optware to do it in the Pre emulator Jul 20 04:11:59 rwhitby: got it Jul 20 04:13:34 Eguy: too funny (but sadly true). Thanks for sharing the link Jul 20 04:13:50 np :) Jul 20 04:13:55 I love that link Jul 20 04:15:57 Yes I especially liked how it runs putty on the phone Jul 20 04:22:21 did anyone else install the sdk and screw up their novaproxy Jul 20 04:22:35 It keeps saying Pre is not connected Jul 20 04:22:58 blah blah blah, I uninstalled all of it and reinstalled novaproxy but still no luck Jul 20 04:38:49 no Jul 20 04:42:33 how can i request the devices meid# to make sure my application doesn't get copied and activated on other pres? Jul 20 04:43:24 has anyone tried the new optware-bootstap.sh ? ssh does not work afterwards - over evdo or wifi Jul 20 04:45:08 nhahn -- it should, and yes LOTS of people tested it, along with a detailed code review by about 10 people the other night Jul 20 04:45:32 can you still ssh in over the usb? Jul 20 04:46:35 i can get in with novacomm, but thats it Jul 20 04:46:41 i can ping the world too.. but can't seem to get in Jul 20 04:46:56 hmmmm Jul 20 04:46:59 nhahn: did the script error at all? Jul 20 04:47:07 oh good. Jul 20 04:47:09 He wrote it. Jul 20 04:47:11 :-) Jul 20 04:47:14 heh Jul 20 04:47:39 nope, not at all. said everything was fine Jul 20 04:47:50 there was one bug fix tonight... but the script was erroring... if it says it succeeded, I'm not sure Jul 20 04:48:08 JackieRipper can you check his ports to see if they're open? Jul 20 04:48:30 nhahn what port were you using to ssh to the pre? Jul 20 04:48:34 my novacomm isn't working correctly after installing that damn webos sdk... anyone else get this? Jul 20 04:48:35 222 Jul 20 04:48:40 nhahn: if you can get in via novacomm, can you see if dropbear is running? Jul 20 04:48:58 actually, nhahn, did you reboot after running the script? Jul 20 04:48:59 DSouljah - you're the second person to report it. What os? Jul 20 04:49:12 xp Jul 20 04:49:18 ok Jul 20 04:49:31 and if you go to device manager, is there a novacomm device? Jul 20 04:50:01 as I was installing, I seen a script run and it said, stopping novacomm and I don't know what else it did... I uninstalled all that crap and stilll nothing Jul 20 04:50:09 JackieRipper: no, is a reboot needed? Jul 20 04:50:13 i also see this in the logs: /opt/sbin/sshd: no process killed Jul 20 04:50:14 how can i request the devices meid# to make sure my application doesn't get copied and activated on other pres? Jul 20 04:50:27 nhahn: the script doesn't start the ssh daemon (though maybe it should) but it sets it to start on boot Jul 20 04:50:29 DSouljah -- I understand that, do you know how to get into device manager? Jul 20 04:50:36 yeah Jul 20 04:50:37 so as written, it requires a reboot Jul 20 04:50:38 looking now Jul 20 04:51:07 What would it be under? Jul 20 04:51:08 rolle I'm not sure that's exposed in the current version of hte sdk Jul 20 04:51:09 Rick__: what do you think? Should the bootstrap script start dropbear? Jul 20 04:51:11 ah ha - that's the gap then. the old set of instructions had it starting.. assumed the script would too Jul 20 04:51:35 DSouljah is the pre plugged in? It would be under novacomm and the device name would be palm-novacomm Jul 20 04:51:36 rwhitby: what do you think? Should the bootstrap script start dropbear? Jul 20 04:51:40 but only if it was plugged in Jul 20 04:52:08 JackieRipper it should, or it should say, "we're going to reboot now, or all this was for nought... can I reboot now please?" Jul 20 04:52:26 JackieRipper: yeah, the script should start dropbear if that is the only reason for a reboot Jul 20 04:52:39 Hell, I think that stupid sdk even messed up the processor listing under the 'Computer' Jul 20 04:52:39 alrighty Jul 20 04:52:41 thats why i'm asking Jul 20 04:52:50 DSouljah it couldn't Jul 20 04:53:05 really, no way for it to not by just installing some exe's and a novacomm driver. Jul 20 04:53:15 and LOTS AND LOTS of people have been running it. Jul 20 04:53:16 I don't ever remember it saying 'ACPI Multiprocessor PC Jul 20 04:54:01 never-the-less, since XP is booting, the question is, assuming the palm is plugged in, which is has to be for this to show, is there a novacomm device? Jul 20 04:54:32 initctl dropbear start correct? Jul 20 04:54:43 or is it initctl start dropbear ? Jul 20 04:56:20 2nd one Jul 20 04:56:37 *sigh* is there a mklink fix for x64 vbox/emu Jul 20 05:00:21 set env path may be Jul 20 05:00:36 he speaks Jul 20 05:00:54 nhahn: run: "initctl start dropbear" and you'll be set. I've updated the script to do this automatically, and version bumped it to 1.0. Jul 20 05:03:43 aye jrip Jul 20 05:04:24 can i make a recommendation for the boot script, Jul 20 05:04:44 was thinkin of making the default suid account have a /opt/bin/bash shell Jul 20 05:05:05 that being said, an entry in /etc/shells is required Jul 20 05:05:19 ran in that today and rw and i ran into that fix Jul 20 05:06:18 oc80z: that would also require installing bash Jul 20 05:06:33 JackieRipper: thanks man. got it working. good script. Jul 20 05:06:46 nhahn: thanks! Jul 20 05:06:58 nhahn: good catch! Jul 20 05:07:23 i kept fucking up my pre... replacing the db3 file with an old one doesn't always work Jul 20 05:07:29 oc80z: I use bash myself, but I'm not sure it belongs in the bootstrap script Jul 20 05:07:32 especially if you changed your palm profile password Jul 20 05:07:48 after back to back mornings of waking up and not being able to get into my pre, i finally put it all together Jul 20 05:08:28 ok Jul 20 05:08:35 um. Jul 20 05:08:42 after i ran the script, bash was installed. Jul 20 05:08:43 I think it could be scripted, though Jul 20 05:08:43 oc80z: perhaps ia32libs stuff on ubuntu? Jul 20 05:09:00 destinal im in a vista/64 env now. Jul 20 05:09:49 JackieRipper: i flashed and execd the bootstrap, great job Jul 20 05:09:57 hmm, don't know how Windows on Windows (WOW) deals with the palm 32 bit stuff. I would think it would just work, assuming the system had access to the 32 bit versions of the dlls needed Jul 20 05:10:34 yeah it should, i think its an environment path issue, i think i need a reboot after the paths were changed.... wow.. Jul 20 05:10:54 does ipkg-opt, dropbear, sudo, openssh or openssh-sftp-server have bash as a dependency? Jul 20 05:10:59 Rick, no there is no novacomm device Jul 20 05:11:21 JackieRipper thats my suggestion. Jul 20 05:11:28 i can check real quick ig uess Jul 20 05:11:35 The process is running, but I don't see a device in the manager Jul 20 05:11:48 oc80z: So the script installed bash? Jul 20 05:11:55 yes Jul 20 05:12:00 weird Jul 20 05:12:03 /opt/bin/bash Jul 20 05:12:14 I wonder which package depends on it Jul 20 05:12:17 but i was unable to log in. Jul 20 05:12:19 i will check that Jul 20 05:13:11 nothing in ipkg-opt show Jul 20 05:13:20 quilt? Jul 20 05:13:32 +-(~/.ssh)--> $ oshow quilt | grep bash Jul 20 05:13:39 /opt/etc/bash_completion.d/quilt Jul 20 05:13:43 hrm Jul 20 05:13:47 oc80z: you may have been running an older version of the script? Jul 20 05:14:11 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 20470 Jul 16 06:44 optware-bootstrap.sh Jul 20 05:14:17 rwhitby asked me to remove git and quilt from the bootstrap script, as they have a billion deps Jul 20 05:14:42 yeah we calcd it to be like 64mb after the script Jul 20 05:14:49 grep "# version" optware-bootstrap.sh Jul 20 05:15:08 its .09 Jul 20 05:15:12 er.. .9 Jul 20 05:15:26 0.9.2 Removed installation of git and quilt. Will be a separate script (rwhitby) Jul 20 05:15:30 hmm Jul 20 05:15:42 theres a quilt-bootstrap.sh script alongside it Jul 20 05:15:56 went all the way to 0.9.7 before bumping to 1.0 Jul 20 05:15:58 Ah nice! Jul 20 05:16:21 1.0 was a few minutes ago Jul 20 05:16:27 yea i heard i haerd Jul 20 05:16:55 can i push a profile.custom script on git? Jul 20 05:17:12 I've tried to keep up the change log in the comments... and I ask that anyone who makes changes does the same. Jul 20 05:17:18 oc80z: sure - in the bootstrap repo, in /etc/profile.d/ Jul 20 05:17:40 (i.e. "custom" is not a good functional name ;-) Jul 20 05:18:27 yea i was thinking of profile.webos Jul 20 05:18:39 omfg Jul 20 05:18:53 oc80z: what things does your custom profile script achieve? Jul 20 05:18:54 a porche GT3 just buzzed my lobby door Jul 20 05:19:02 HEH Jul 20 05:19:21 i.e. /etc/profile.d/dos-compatible-aliases Jul 20 05:19:23 Paths, PS1 varible, aliases.. Jul 20 05:19:46 heh nah we need ppl not to use dos compatible aliases :P Jul 20 05:19:56 or /etc/profile.d/bash-perfect-settings Jul 20 05:20:03 somthing like that Jul 20 05:20:22 ok, that's what I'm thinking of as a good functional name ... Jul 20 05:20:28 http://predev.wikidot.com/profile-d Jul 20 05:20:30 may I suggest: Jul 20 05:20:36 PROMPT_COMMAND='echo -ne "\033]0;${USER}@${HOSTNAME%%.*}:${PWD/$HOME/~}\007"' Jul 20 05:21:09 or even: Jul 20 05:21:53 my thinking is that the default bootstrap script should be as unintrusive as possible, not changing anything from the default webOS installation that it does not need to change. Jul 20 05:22:12 then you have a library of other scripts and files in the bootstrap repo from which you can choose your own personal preferences Jul 20 05:22:32 yea Jul 20 05:22:36 ah Jul 20 05:22:56 then everyone gets to have what they want, but no-one gets forced to have what someone else thinks is the best thing since sliced bread Jul 20 05:23:17 ls -la /usr Jul 20 05:23:20 whoops ;) Jul 20 05:23:27 alt-tab fail Jul 20 05:23:37 yea, offering a variaty of 3rd party junk would def be a plus, eg, apply all patches. Jul 20 05:23:50 apply all/selected applications Jul 20 05:23:58 u know.. Jul 20 05:24:29 if i see anyone w/ a pre, and it aint rooted, i'd like to just USB 1,2, Done them. Jul 20 05:24:54 if we could maintain an updated, updater.. Jul 20 05:25:34 somthing the underground can use to catch up to speed seemlessly after a flash Jul 20 05:26:07 going away to reboot for my ubuntu 9.04 install - (wish me luck :-) Jul 20 05:26:14 i dunno Jul 20 05:26:38 i agree 100 % with what you said rw Jul 20 05:26:51 oc80z: maintain a script in the bootstrap repo which does your own personal set of ipkg-opt installs and wgets, and then you just run the optware-bootstrap.sh and then your script. Jul 20 05:27:16 yea Jul 20 05:27:38 argh I need to turn on dev mode again :( Jul 20 05:27:44 keep your script up to date by having the bootstrap repo cloned to your pre and kept up to date in-place with git push Jul 20 05:28:11 I will give someone $1,000,000,000,000,000 if they can figure out how to use novaproxy/novaterm without turning dev mode on Jul 20 05:28:16 yea git is solid+ Jul 20 05:28:23 * of monopoly money Jul 20 05:28:28 Is there any way to remove patches from the modifications repo? Jul 20 05:28:48 there's a duplicate - "phone-enable-roam-only" and "roam-control" Jul 20 05:29:18 think those are different - i think one lets you turn it on and off, and one is roam only Jul 20 05:29:28 im not so sure if wikidot.com is solid+ looks like someone is anti wdot and spawned their own? Jul 20 05:29:35 hmm Jul 20 05:29:42 w/ aint a bad idea Jul 20 05:29:56 oc80z: where's that? Jul 20 05:30:01 WYSIWYG is good... Jul 20 05:30:02 but ah Jul 20 05:30:07 linking off us, unofficially? Jul 20 05:30:14 /www.webos-internals.org Jul 20 05:30:22 oc80z: ah, that's the new official one Jul 20 05:30:24 I guess noone wants money Jul 20 05:30:28 :D Jul 20 05:30:32 Sick. Jul 20 05:30:59 do you run ah, OpenOffice? Jul 20 05:30:59 Time to change the channel topic Rod? Jul 20 05:31:08 There is a nice wysiwyg addon Jul 20 05:31:13 its beta no? Jul 20 05:31:31 nhahn: no, they're the same Jul 20 05:31:36 oh hrm Jul 20 05:32:28 Eguy: I don't know if it's moved enough yet Jul 20 05:32:32 a diff of the 2 patches: http://predev.pastebin.com/m4617f2cc Jul 20 05:32:46 guess so.. :) Jul 20 05:32:46 hmm - I should cname logs too. Jul 20 05:33:25 we have an irc:// now Jul 20 05:33:25 OK, I'm getting a damn invalid literal for int() with base 10 when I run the talk.py which never happened before Jul 20 05:33:57 brb Jul 20 05:34:06 Yipee! Jul 20 05:34:10 I double check, installed the palm driver 3 times and it still gives me that error after I follow the rooting directions Jul 20 05:34:16 http://web.ukonline.co.uk/matthew.jennings/images/real_networks.jpg :) Jul 20 05:34:20 I'm off to bed Jul 20 05:34:27 have a good one, guys n gals Jul 20 05:34:30 DSouljah: there are lots of references to that in the logs Jul 20 05:34:34 caio Jul 20 05:34:35 (chat logs) Jul 20 05:34:40 oc80z: http://forums.precentral.net/web-os-development/193627-wiki-moving-predev-wikidot-com-moving-www-webos-internals-org.html#post1761807 Jul 20 05:34:55 where are the logs because I don't have them on here Jul 20 05:35:04 ciao** Jul 20 05:35:19 DSouljah: URL for logs is in topic Jul 20 05:36:11 I see it, thanks, I'll see what I can find... Jul 20 05:36:22 DSouljah: can you just use novaproxy instead? Jul 20 05:36:40 may be easier Jul 20 05:36:47 I'm trying that, but it keeps saying can't find the Pre Jul 20 05:37:18 once I installed the sdk it hasn't worked since Jul 20 05:37:27 try running "services.msc" (start,run) and then look for Palm Novacom service Jul 20 05:37:34 stop and restart that Jul 20 05:37:46 ok, I'll try that again Jul 20 05:38:52 ok restarted the service Jul 20 05:39:05 try novaproxy again and see if that helped Jul 20 05:39:43 still no go, it's in dev mode and plugged in Jul 20 05:39:59 yeah rboat is right about the wiki Jul 20 05:40:00 and can the sdk's tools find it? Jul 20 05:40:29 I didn't get that far... I uninstalled all that Jul 20 05:40:55 it was working fine until I installed the sdk Jul 20 05:41:16 I would try installing it again, maybe that will fix your novacom or at least you can check to see what the sdk's tools report when you try palm-install or palm-launch for instance Jul 20 05:41:58 failing that I might try uninstalling and reinstalling your novacom service Jul 20 05:42:15 I also did that Jul 20 05:42:43 ugh Jul 20 05:42:50 haha, still no luck... I've tried to start over from the beginning and rooting again Jul 20 05:42:53 I don't know, that's bizarre Jul 20 05:43:07 I know... it's been 6 hours and I'm pretty p'd Jul 20 05:43:17 try another computer? :P Jul 20 05:43:39 haha, I might have to but that sucks Jul 20 05:43:40 or at least perhaps a virtual machine with the usb connected into it Jul 20 05:43:51 Linus Torvalds visits Google to share his thoughts on git, the source control management system he created two years ago. Jul 20 05:43:55 ^-- oh yea Jul 20 05:47:39 * destinal_ watches. Jul 20 06:00:17 I've just installed Ubuntu 9.04 and Chatzilla (to speak to you). Want to install the SDK next, but ... Jul 20 06:01:06 ... I have a question. I should find a VirtualBox for Ubuntu 9.04 intead of the link from on developer.palm.com. Right? Jul 20 06:05:00 ughk Jul 20 06:05:10 can i get that other key authorized Jul 20 06:05:51 any way i can edit the css on the new wiki? the background color of the code tag needs to be darker. Jul 20 06:06:16 fnt color? Jul 20 06:06:52 is a generic inline text container. Jul 20 06:07:03 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Html_in_wikitext Jul 20 06:07:15 it talks about css. Jul 20 06:07:20 i'm talking about the tag Jul 20 06:08:23 looks depreciated Jul 20 06:08:36 there's already css for it, but it only changes the background color to #f9f9f9, which is almost indiscernible from white Jul 20 06:09:06 it's used for inline code, as opposed to
Jul 20 06:09:34  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTML_element#Computer_Phrase_Elements
Jul 20 06:10:15  gl
Jul 20 06:10:28  Thanks for the keything.
Jul 20 06:20:11  bclancy84: virtualbox, go to virtualbox.org
Jul 20 06:20:23  works great
Jul 20 06:20:26  3.x
Jul 20 06:20:59  destinal, I started installing 2.2 instead - install is in progress now
Jul 20 06:21:12  eh, should work ok too
Jul 20 06:23:18  destinal_:  It said it couldn't find a kernel for Linux 2.6.something ...
Jul 20 06:23:58  destinal_:  Its asking "Should the vboxdrv kerenel module be compiled now?"
Jul 20 06:24:32  destinal_:  I guess I should just continue with the 2.2 install rather than backing out and doing a VB 3 install
Jul 20 06:24:42  bclancy84:  I would bail out of that install and just grab the binary package on virtualbox.org site
Jul 20 06:25:16  otherwise you'll have to be concerned with having all the right build and headers stuff ready
Jul 20 06:25:19  destinal_:  I'll try and bail out
Jul 20 06:25:35  you can just say no and continue then uninstall
Jul 20 06:28:53  destinal_:  I ctrl c'd out and now I have complications
Jul 20 06:29:07  ack
Jul 20 06:29:32  how did you install, does whatever feature you used to install let you remove?
Jul 20 06:29:44  root@ubuntu:~# apt-get remove virtualbox-2.2
Jul 20 06:29:46  E: dpkg was interrupted, you must manually run 'sudo dpkg --configure -a' to correct the problem.
Jul 20 06:29:48  root@ubuntu:~#
Jul 20 06:30:10  so, yeah, do what it said
Jul 20 06:31:08  the "sudo dpkg --configure -a" is now working (once I remembered how to cut and paste)
Jul 20 06:31:22  :)
Jul 20 06:32:04  destinal_:  what command do I use to uninstall it (or to list whether it is there)?
Jul 20 06:32:54  $ dpkg -l|grep -i lbox
Jul 20 06:32:54  ii  virtualbox-3.0                             3.0.2-49928_Ubuntu_jaunty                 Sun VirtualBox
Jul 20 06:34:09  destinal_:  2.2 was listed (so I'd doing a "dpkg -r virtualbox-2.2" now
Jul 20 06:34:22  destinal_:  done
Jul 20 06:34:52  http://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Linux_Downloads
Jul 20 06:35:15  i386 (32 bit) or AMD64 versions are there
Jul 20 06:35:49  Just click on the right one?
Jul 20 06:36:15  you can download it and then dpkg -i   it
Jul 20 06:36:21  err sudo dpkg -i
Jul 20 06:36:22  destinal_:  OK
Jul 20 06:37:02  who knows what ipkg package fdisk live in?
Jul 20 06:37:38  ameng: to find packages I generally dpkg -S `type -path fdisk`   on my ubuntu box
Jul 20 06:37:57  $ dpkg -S `type -path fdisk`
Jul 20 06:37:57  util-linux: /sbin/fdisk
Jul 20 06:38:09  so util-linux is the ipkg you want to install from optware
Jul 20 06:38:10  who were the homebrewers in here
Jul 20 06:38:15  (as in beer)
Jul 20 06:38:24 * destinal_ raises a hand
Jul 20 06:38:33  u extract or all grain
Jul 20 06:38:43  destinal_:yeah, i fount that on ubuntu ,but ipkg has no util-linux
Jul 20 06:38:46  seigex: right on the edge of conversion
Jul 20 06:38:51  just made the move :)
Jul 20 06:38:56  i'm making a stone ruination ipa clone
Jul 20 06:39:07  made a mash tun out of a 48 qt ice chest :)
Jul 20 06:39:15  anywho i'm starting my app
Jul 20 06:39:16  for home brewing
Jul 20 06:39:55  seigex:  your making a Pre homebrew app for bomebrew (Ale) recipes?
Jul 20 06:40:04  yeah
Jul 20 06:40:11  its gonna be geared towards all grain
Jul 20 06:40:18  and i'll have an all-grain to extract converter
Jul 20 06:40:21  and a clone recipe guide
Jul 20 06:40:37  seigex:  that would be very cool - I've only done extract once or twice
Jul 20 06:41:39  gotta move to all grain
Jul 20 06:41:41  so much more fun
Jul 20 06:41:50  you get control over all flavors and colors
Jul 20 06:42:34  I got an err (but I have an idea).  First the error:
Jul 20 06:42:36  dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of virtualbox-3.0:
Jul 20 06:42:37   virtualbox-3.0 depends on libcurl3 (>= 7.16.2-1); however:
Jul 20 06:42:39    Package libcurl3 is not installed.
Jul 20 06:42:40  dpkg: error processing virtualbox-3.0 (--install):
Jul 20 06:42:42   dependency problems - leaving unconfigured
Jul 20 06:42:43  Errors were encountered while processing:
Jul 20 06:42:45   virtualbox-3.0
Jul 20 06:42:54  idea is:
Jul 20 06:42:56  sudo apt-get install virtualbox-3.0
Jul 20 06:43:17  bclancy84: weird, I just downloaded the package and installed it
Jul 20 06:43:18  destinal_:  is that OK to try?
Jul 20 06:43:33  yeah just apt-get install libcurl3
Jul 20 06:43:41  OK
Jul 20 06:43:42  then install the package you downloaded
Jul 20 06:43:48  dpkg -i not apt-get
Jul 20 06:48:25  destinal_:  I think I got it correct (after doing "sudo apt-get install virtualbox-3.0")
Jul 20 06:48:27  root@ubuntu:~# dpkg -l|grep -i lbox
Jul 20 06:48:29  rc  virtualbox-2.2                             2.2.4-47978_Ubuntu_hardy          Sun VirtualBox
Jul 20 06:48:31  ii  virtualbox-3.0                             3.0.2-49928_Ubuntu_jaunty         Sun VirtualBox
Jul 20 06:48:32  root@ubuntu:~#
Jul 20 06:48:58  i ran into an interesting problem, hopefully the solution can save someone else the time it took me to figure out
Jul 20 06:49:32  i was getting a "sorry, not enough memory" error when trying to download apps from the app catalog
Jul 20 06:52:38  destinal_:  I hope you are not staying up for me?
Jul 20 06:52:52  destinal_:  downloading the SDK now
Jul 20 06:52:54  bclancy84: I'm going to bed in a few minutes
Jul 20 06:53:04  destinal_:  good!
Jul 20 06:53:21  destinal_:  thx 4 ur help!
Jul 20 06:53:37  bclancy84: you're welcome.
Jul 20 06:54:01  destinal_:  I'll probably hit the hay soon too
Jul 20 06:56:53  destinal_:  I think I'd rather d/l the JDK rather than the JRE (what do you think)?
Jul 20 06:56:56  sudo apt-get install sun-java6-jre
Jul 20 06:57:24  I'd do that, yeah
Jul 20 06:58:18  destinal_:  thx, I'll try not to ask any more questions tonite  :-)
Jul 20 07:11:32  wouldnt' be much of a room if people didn't ask questions
Jul 20 07:19:49  bclancy84: good luck, but yeah, ask if you need it
Jul 20 07:19:56  I'm going to bed though :)
Jul 20 07:32:59  hmmm, run  python dbus program got error on emulator
Jul 20 08:00:14  ameng: what error?
Jul 20 08:03:27    File "dteeth.py", line 3, in 
Jul 20 08:03:28      import dbus
Jul 20 08:03:28    File "/opt/lib/python2.5/site-packages/dbus/__init__.py", line 79, in 
Jul 20 08:03:28      import dbus.types as types
Jul 20 08:03:28    File "/opt/lib/python2.5/site-packages/dbus/types.py", line 6, in 
Jul 20 08:03:28      from _dbus_bindings import ObjectPath, ByteArray, Signature, Byte,\
Jul 20 08:03:30  ImportError: /opt/lib/python2.5/site-packages/_dbus_bindings.so: undefined symbol: PyUnicodeUCS2_DecodeUTF8
Jul 20 08:06:25  heh
Jul 20 08:20:31  it seems palm close the file:// protocol in browser. we can install a lightweight webserver (eg. lighttpd) to browse local html files
Jul 20 08:30:42  ameng: lighttpd and some other browsers are in optware
Jul 20 08:44:31  hrm rw u usin /opt/libexec/git-core/git-push?
Jul 20 08:50:00  ugkck
Jul 20 09:20:46  hehe, got lighttpd work
Jul 20 09:23:26  yep
Jul 20 09:28:07  oc80z: I'm just using "git push"
Jul 20 09:28:22  which probably calls that libexec file
Jul 20 09:28:49  h4ma
Jul 20 09:28:49  y3q
Jul 20 09:28:53  uck.. hrm yeah
Jul 20 09:29:14  git push the remote .git no?
Jul 20 09:29:24  *sigh*
Jul 20 09:34:23  r/o
Jul 20 09:42:17  may be its not readin my key
Jul 20 09:44:53  may be theres a global config for that hhe
Jul 20 10:11:12  better just smack me with te syntax before i break sothin
Jul 20 11:26:47  oc80z: check the applying-patches wiki page - it should show how to push
Jul 20 11:28:31  oc80z: how do you like boston?
Jul 20 11:28:42  and what's up with that nickname u pillhead haha
Jul 20 11:28:52 * jcrawford lives in Lynn'
Jul 20 11:29:37  only know you are in the boston area from looking at local groups for webOS and remember your nickname on a list :)
Jul 20 11:30:59  good morning
Jul 20 12:10:53 * rwhitby encourages everyone to read http://forums.precentral.net/showthread.php?p=1762553
Jul 20 12:30:47 * jcrawford goes to rea it
Jul 20 12:30:49  *read
Jul 20 12:32:34  hmm what does this offer? org.webosinternals.services
Jul 20 12:36:58  hmm you state that accessing linux does nothing to your pre but on the main page of the wiki you say this
Jul 20 12:36:59  Enacting any set of instructions from this site is very likely to void your warranty.
Jul 20 12:41:09  jcrawford: yep.  Sprint will take any opportunity to tell you that you have voided your warranty.
Jul 20 12:41:52  damn so for servicing i should reload with webOS Dr.?
Jul 20 12:42:03  and not tell them that i enacted in any of these activities
Jul 20 12:42:31  In reality, as long as you use the webOS Doctor before you take it to them, and as long as they haven't searched the logs of the uploads that your Pre does whenever an applications crashes to see whether you were running any unauthorised program or not, then you should be fine.
Jul 20 12:42:59  but if they really want to screw you, they have all the information they need.
Jul 20 12:48:23  what is that weos-internals service i mentioned above, what does that give you?
Jul 20 13:01:37  If you have a game up make sure it's on the list: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Portal:webOS_Applications_All , I just went through and formatted it a bit, about to put it in alphabetical order.
Jul 20 13:01:47  s/game/application/
Jul 20 13:01:48  Templarian meant: If you have a application up make sure it's on the list: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Portal:webOS_Applications_All , I just went through and formatted it a bit, about to put it in alphabetical order.
Jul 20 13:02:31  thanks infobot
Jul 20 13:10:06  nice
Jul 20 13:38:13  Technobabble: ping
Jul 20 13:38:19  errt
Jul 20 13:38:21  Templarian: ping
Jul 20 13:38:57  PuffTheMagic: pong
Jul 20 13:40:19  i was hoping you could help me out
Jul 20 13:40:26  i started a new main page last night
Jul 20 13:40:33  but my html/css sucks
Jul 20 13:40:45  go to Main_Page_beta
Jul 20 13:40:59  would you be able to make all the cells in that table equal size
Jul 20 13:41:07  one of them does not want to be like the rest
Jul 20 13:49:38  PuffTheMagic: its because you don't have 2 lines of text.
Jul 20 13:49:43  right
Jul 20 13:49:56  but how do I make it expand
Jul 20 13:50:06  there has to be a wayto make all cells in a row the same height
Jul 20 13:52:27  PuffTheMagic: lay out the rest of the page and I'll go through when your done and format it all up nice, don't worry about the little things.
Jul 20 13:52:50  ok
Jul 20 13:54:24  PuffTheMagic it can be set to a fixed height in the css.
Jul 20 13:54:44  Rick_: k
Jul 20 13:55:01  it's a little messy 'cause mediawiki doesn't put class ID's on templates...  I wish they did.   But it's do-able
Jul 20 13:55:44  if the template was encased in a div with an name of the template as a class, or as the "name" of the div, then this would be cake.  As it is, it takes slight trickyness.
Jul 20 13:55:50  but don't worry, totally doable
Jul 20 13:56:19  well if you guys want to clean up that nav-block template too go a head
Jul 20 13:56:29  btw  that's very very attractive.  butI think we _need_ some verbage on the front page.
Jul 20 13:56:30  does anyone know anything about how the contacts are stored on the pre
Jul 20 13:56:39  in a database.  why?
Jul 20 13:56:43  Rick_: thats not even close to being done
Jul 20 13:56:50  In that database with 100 something tables.
Jul 20 13:56:58  so its a sqlite db?
Jul 20 13:57:03  or is it in a mixed db
Jul 20 13:57:08  with other non contact stuff
Jul 20 13:57:12  yes, but it doesn't matter, you can't query it like that.
Jul 20 13:57:19  you have to use the api calls to query it.
Jul 20 14:00:11  why wouldnt i be able to edit it manually
Jul 20 14:01:28  You can probably on a rooted device, but not in a regular webOS app.
Jul 20 14:01:56  i need a way to bulk import some contacts
Jul 20 14:02:01  i refuse to use gmail
Jul 20 14:02:06  i want the contacts in the palm profile
Jul 20 14:03:00  PuffTheMagic  simple dimple
Jul 20 14:03:18  import to palm desktop and use the data transfer assistant
Jul 20 14:03:41  hmm
Jul 20 14:03:45  download the palm desktop from palm.com.  Lie and say you have  a Zire or a tungston.
Jul 20 14:04:05  use the csv or outlook or whatever import facilityin palm desktop
Jul 20 14:04:39  then, as X1011 said....
Jul 20 14:06:10  k, i just told my dad that
Jul 20 14:06:49 * rwhitby just finished an interview with PreCentral
Jul 20 14:07:06  YIPPEE!!!!
Jul 20 14:07:08  o snap
Jul 20 14:08:31  jcrawford: org.webosinternals.service installs a dbus service which allows a GUI card application to run a single Linux command as root.
Jul 20 14:09:48  Rick_: i cant get the data trasnfer assistant to work
Jul 20 14:09:54  what mode should the phone be in
Jul 20 14:10:02  just charge, usb storgage, media sync?
Jul 20 14:10:37  usb storage
Jul 20 14:10:42  and it says something about pressing a hotsync button on the cable... that silver circle is really a button
Jul 20 14:10:44  ?
Jul 20 14:12:01  the dta doesn't require you to hotsync
Jul 20 14:27:25  rwhitby: what is the point of a card executing a command as root?
Jul 20 14:27:31  not sure why one would want to do that
Jul 20 14:27:59  jcrawford: to be able to do all the things that the existing webOS framework does not allow you to do.
Jul 20 14:33:40  X1011: THANKS
Jul 20 14:33:45  my dad is a retard
Jul 20 14:33:48  cant follow directions
Jul 20 14:33:52  he had something else open
Jul 20 14:33:55  not the DTA
Jul 20 14:34:25  jcrawford: yeah that would be useful right now
Jul 20 14:35:10  PuffTheMagic: what would be useful right now?
Jul 20 14:35:27  being able to execute arbitrary commands within luna
Jul 20 14:35:54  ah
Jul 20 14:36:41 * rwhitby bbt
Jul 20 14:48:22 * PuffTheMagic is making a patch for the screen&lock app to enable/disable the "power on while charging" option
Jul 20 14:56:03  You know what'd be cool - you know that battery saver script - a way to toggle it to off (back to factory default)
Jul 20 14:56:49  Your discussion of power on while charging reminded me that the battery save thing works, but makes Pandora lock up my phone.  Otherwise it is definately cool.
Jul 20 15:00:58  PuffTheMagic: cool, so just a nice checkbox to call the setprefs for onWhenConnected? That'll be nice.
Jul 20 15:01:17  well im gonna use the toggle slider widget
Jul 20 15:01:18  but yeah
Jul 20 15:01:22  nice and simple
Jul 20 15:01:27  er, yeah, toggle right.  :)
Jul 20 15:03:40  not sure how i am gonna set this value yet though
Jul 20 15:06:48  nm... gotta use dbus
Jul 20 15:17:55  ohh found a bug with the sounds system i think
Jul 20 15:18:06  i patched my messaging app to use a ringtone
Jul 20 15:18:13  when you get a message it plays fine
Jul 20 15:18:37  but if you get another message while it is playing....  it plays the ringtone again but the old one is still playing so you get overlap
Jul 20 15:18:45  it should stop the first one methinks
Jul 20 15:19:01  jcrawford: thats a bug in your code
Jul 20 15:19:10  PuffTheMagic: it's not my code :)
Jul 20 15:19:10  you need to use the bounce function
Jul 20 15:19:23  to prevent dup events from hammering it
Jul 20 15:19:24  also would be nice if the sound stopped when you entered the message
Jul 20 15:19:39  PuffTheMagic: it's the code i found in the patch :) i did not create it
Jul 20 15:19:59  we need a wiki page for patches so that we can list issues etc for certain patches :)
Jul 20 15:20:32  guess i will work on that modification next :)
Jul 20 15:20:37  make it better
Jul 20 15:21:31  puff can you direct me to docs for the bounce function?
Jul 20 15:21:38  PuffTheMagic: when you say "gotta use dbus", you're not referring to running luna-send via org.webosinternals.services are you?  You're just talking about using Mojo.Service.Request/this.controller.serviceRequest, right?
Jul 20 15:21:49  yeah
Jul 20 15:22:01  thats just mojo dbus wrapper ;)
Jul 20 15:22:56  yeah, with the added frustration of public/private busses...
Jul 20 15:22:59  oh it's not accessable via mojo directly have to use the dbus stuff?
Jul 20 15:23:32  jcrawford: we're talking about the onWhenConnected mod to screen&lock
Jul 20 15:23:57  oh ok
Jul 20 15:26:02  what he is doing is available to mojo directly, but only if you are a com.palm application.  this.controller.serviceRequest("palm://com.palm.display/control/", {method:"setProperty", parameters: {"onWhenConnected":true}}); or something like that.
Jul 20 15:26:05  bzhou * r10474 optware/trunk/make/hdparm.mk: hdparm: reverted to 9.15, MAP_POPULATE undeclared on a couple of platforms
Jul 20 15:28:24  finally
Jul 20 15:28:30  hello
Jul 20 15:28:43  hi palm pre owners
Jul 20 15:29:35  its so quiet in here. im not sure how to use the irc but it seems similiar to aim n yahoo
Jul 20 15:29:43  infobot, say hi to thecakeman
Jul 20 15:29:45  hi to thecakeman
Jul 20 15:30:00  hello
Jul 20 15:30:09  ~botsnack
Jul 20 15:30:09  :), drnull
Jul 20 15:30:23  lol. i made the name up.. i couldnt think of any good screen names
Jul 20 15:30:37  thecakeman: irc is... well, it's a multi-user chat
Jul 20 15:30:39  vs. IM
Jul 20 15:31:16  i need help. if anyone can assist? ive alrready rooted the pre but i couldnt get the shell installed. thats the problem
Jul 20 15:31:48  i gotta go.. but I'll be back in few mins..
Jul 20 15:36:22  thecakeman: what do you mean when you mention you're trying to get "the shell installed"?
Jul 20 15:44:23  thecakeman and what set of instructions were you following?
Jul 20 15:44:58  IRC FTW
Jul 20 15:47:35  predev.wikidot.com/rooting
Jul 20 15:47:57  but its all changed now.. last time I worked on this was last weekend
Jul 20 15:48:54  now the instruction seem different. when I tried to enable usbnet or wifi.. it give me "permission denied" i forgot what command line I used before
Jul 20 15:48:55  yeah, they're doing some serious wiki modifications
Jul 20 15:49:38  but check this..
Jul 20 15:50:02  i got the pre tool installed on my virtual xp windows
Jul 20 15:50:31  with pretool lets me drop ipk files in the icon to install the apps
Jul 20 15:50:55  i didnt have to root the palm pre
Jul 20 15:52:14  but when i wanna install he shell. i rooted first but still didnt install. what did I do wrong? I tried the easy method but that didnt work so I tried manually typing it in.. I got permission denied
Jul 20 15:53:26  so whats the new  method of installing apps
Jul 20 15:54:15  destinal: what if we made a ext3 loop image on the vfat and mount/binded it
Jul 20 15:54:29  for /opt
Jul 20 15:57:01  okay.. i gotta admit. i know little about linux and but Ive been the most frequent user on windows. right now I have 64bit window vista premium with virtual xp window and ubuntu linux sitting on my desktop
Jul 20 15:57:09  PuffTheMagic: you could.  trying to avoid repartitioning?
Jul 20 15:57:25  yeah i dont feel like messing with that yet
Jul 20 15:57:40  and then we could supply pre seeded img files
Jul 20 15:57:47  and backup them easily
Jul 20 15:58:00  depends on how much overhead loop and vfat add, but I don't imagine it's that much
Jul 20 15:58:09  loop shouldnt be much
Jul 20 15:58:12  if anything
Jul 20 15:58:26  i know people that run reiser4 and btrfs loops on other fs's with good performance
Jul 20 15:59:39  how many of you guys here ever rooted your pre via novaproxy?
Jul 20 16:01:18  or is such discussion allowed?
Jul 20 16:01:49  thecakeman: such discussion is encouraged, it's what we're here for :)
Jul 20 16:01:58  I think someone here wrote novaproxy, so... :)
Jul 20 16:02:32  thecakeman: I think just about all of us here with pre's have gotten access to a root shell on our pre's
Jul 20 16:02:38  it's very very easy
Jul 20 16:04:04  ok great. that i want to make sure
Jul 20 16:04:55  that i'm not going off topic
Jul 20 16:05:31  you'll be told if you are
Jul 20 16:05:32  :)
Jul 20 16:05:47  thecakeman -- just ignore what you had before a week ago.
Jul 20 16:05:52  we've come a long way in a week.
Jul 20 16:06:02  Pick up with the new instructions and start from scratch.
Jul 20 16:06:05  it will be ok
Jul 20 16:06:18  really.   We wrote the scripts so that they fail safe.
Jul 20 16:06:34  well the only other method Ive used other than novaproxy
Jul 20 16:06:45  nodnod
Jul 20 16:06:51  pretool
Jul 20 16:06:56  but really really, just use the novaproxy
Jul 20 16:06:59  it's ok
Jul 20 16:07:07  written by um...
Jul 20 16:07:10  just go step  by step through the novaproxy part
Jul 20 16:07:15  we know, it'swritten by greg
Jul 20 16:07:30  we have a big wiki page on that too.
Jul 20 16:07:40  ok
Jul 20 16:08:09  but look,  getting access to the linux command line is a very very very different thing from installing apps.
Jul 20 16:08:15  well i got to the part where I can see castle on putty
Jul 20 16:08:19  ok
Jul 20 16:08:24  you're all good then.
Jul 20 16:08:29  just stop there for a moment.
Jul 20 16:08:46  okay i didnt know that
Jul 20 16:09:37  if you have root@castle - then you're IN.
Jul 20 16:09:41  now, do this  http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Next_steps
Jul 20 16:09:48  and you'll be all set.
Jul 20 16:11:12  ok.. give me just a minute while I kick this up with my pre
Jul 20 16:11:43  anyone know what the ipkg for pythong dbus bindings were
Jul 20 16:11:51  i had it installed before i rand the doctor
Jul 20 16:11:56  and now i cant remember / find it
Jul 20 16:27:30  okay...
Jul 20 16:27:44  i done typed in those commands
Jul 20 16:28:03  now what.. its still at root@castle:/tmp#
Jul 20 16:28:47  after typing in commands from  http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Next_steps
Jul 20 16:29:42  how do I confirm the webos internals are working?
Jul 20 16:34:13  so um.. how is your day everybody?
Jul 20 16:34:43  early; didn't sleep last night
Jul 20 16:35:18  on the old wiki, one of the hacks involving luna-send had a check
Jul 20 16:35:24  it made sure some bit was set
Jul 20 16:35:33  i bet your neck is aching calling your hands to "rub me rub me"
Jul 20 16:35:35  does anyone remember which hack that was
Jul 20 16:35:58  PuffTheMagic: ipkg-opt list | grep dbus
Jul 20 16:36:10  eno: got it already, thanks though
Jul 20 16:36:29  i cant figure out how to get the value of onWhenConnected
Jul 20 16:36:42  thecakeman you can make sure that everything installed properly by typing ipkg-opt list  and it should list the packages.
Jul 20 16:36:58  ipkg-opt list_installed
Jul 20 16:37:17  PuffTheMagic: there's a getValue method along with the set one
Jul 20 16:37:28  haven't tried it but that should be the way to go
Jul 20 16:37:35  getValue or getProperty
Jul 20 16:37:57  the page u sent has only 2 commands posted.. comparing to the one I did before.. had a whole lot more commands to put in
Jul 20 16:38:04  when i try luna-send getValue i get an error
Jul 20 16:38:12  saying method dont exist
Jul 20 16:38:26  but when i try getPropery
Jul 20 16:38:32  it says couldnt get property
Jul 20 16:38:38  so i think getProperty is correct
Jul 20 16:38:44  but my string format is wrong
Jul 20 16:39:11  err getProperty
Jul 20 16:39:12  right
Jul 20 16:39:40  at rick how many strings are u looking at right now?
Jul 20 16:41:34  hmm i think my mojo code is working when I set the value
Jul 20 16:41:40  but i still cant read the value
Jul 20 16:41:51  to set the toggle model in the right position
Jul 20 16:42:21  at rick.. no I didnt do the ipkg install..
Jul 20 16:42:36  thecakeman: so u have optware installed
Jul 20 16:42:36  its not showing how to do it on that page
Jul 20 16:42:41  you probably want ot install dropbear now
Jul 20 16:42:44  and then turn off dev mode
Jul 20 16:42:55  i did install dropbear
Jul 20 16:43:06  did you test to make sure it works?
Jul 20 16:43:06  but i was not able to test it working
Jul 20 16:43:14  no
Jul 20 16:43:15  did you start it?
Jul 20 16:43:23  i dont know how
Jul 20 16:43:38  initctl start optware-dropbear
Jul 20 16:43:49  all i did was follow instructions from last week somewhere after i install dropbear i got lost
Jul 20 16:45:18  thanks.. hold
Jul 20 16:45:37  yes it looks like its already install
Jul 20 16:46:08  i says waiting.. starting.. prestart process 23523
Jul 20 16:46:16  right so now its started
Jul 20 16:46:23  you could have also restarted the pre
Jul 20 16:46:28  and it would start automatically
Jul 20 16:46:30  spawned process 23526
Jul 20 16:46:51  now its running
Jul 20 16:47:38  well.. i cant tell if its start automatically.. when i take it off developers mode
Jul 20 16:47:44  i just assume it works
Jul 20 16:47:54  it "will" start automatically
Jul 20 16:47:57  just reboot it
Jul 20 16:48:04  and see if u can ssh in after reboot
Jul 20 16:48:12  but how
Jul 20 16:48:18  how what?
Jul 20 16:48:19  ssh?
Jul 20 16:48:22  or reboot
Jul 20 16:48:28  u mean orange key.. sym and r?
Jul 20 16:48:42  hold down power button
Jul 20 16:48:43  or
Jul 20 16:48:45  in the console
Jul 20 16:48:49  type 'reboot'
Jul 20 16:48:59  ok
Jul 20 16:50:12  okay i typed reboot and now its rebooting my pre
Jul 20 16:50:23  but also shut down the console too
Jul 20 16:50:52  well, yeah
Jul 20 16:51:11  you can't stay connected to something that is shut down
Jul 20 16:51:21  lol
Jul 20 16:51:26  duh.. right
Jul 20 16:52:23  okay now its back up\
Jul 20 16:52:44  where do i see dropbear on the pre?
Jul 20 16:52:54  what do you mean?
Jul 20 16:53:34  well. how do I know dropbear is running?
Jul 20 16:53:42  you were ssh'd in?
Jul 20 16:54:32  ssh'd well i dont even know how to get that
Jul 20 16:55:07  i typed drop bear from the console so it was running like u said
Jul 20 16:55:35  then i rebooted it from the console.. it rebooted my pre
Jul 20 16:55:37  sorry, I haven't been watching what you were doing, hold on, let me read the backlog
Jul 20 16:56:23  ok, if you're back in the console, and can type commands on the Pre, dropbear is running
Jul 20 16:56:47  dropbear is what lets you remotely login to your pre, via ssh
Jul 20 16:56:50  (secure shell)
Jul 20 16:57:08  so if you're into the console, dropbear is running
Jul 20 16:57:58  okay cool. can u show me how to log in remotely.. i had to create a user and password but after i did that. i didnt know how to use it
Jul 20 16:58:45  shh -p 222 @
Jul 20 16:59:10  yeah, listen to PuffTheMagic, he was helping you before
Jul 20 16:59:23  I should stop walking into the middle of conversations
Jul 20 17:00:14  wait I didn't know u was walking into the middle of conversation. thank you puffthemagic
Jul 20 17:00:29  np
Jul 20 17:00:31  all of you are helpful anyways
Jul 20 17:00:48  can someone help me figure out how to read the value of onWhenConnected
Jul 20 17:02:03  do i need to include <> in username ?
Jul 20 17:02:08  please :D
Jul 20 17:02:12  thecakeman: no
Jul 20 17:02:54  PuffTheMagic: I tried and failed yesterday and don't have time now but might later if you're still working on it
Jul 20 17:03:02  and what ipaddress .. my palm pre ipaddress? do i need to look it up myself on myipaddress.net
Jul 20 17:03:14  thecakeman: the wifi address
Jul 20 17:03:19  or usbip if you have that setup
Jul 20 17:03:28  or evdo if you enabled that in dropbear
Jul 20 17:03:29  ok
Jul 20 17:04:09  PuffTheMagic: luna-send -n 1 palm://com.palm.display/control/getProperty '{"properties":["onWhenConnected"]}'
Jul 20 17:04:28  NICE
Jul 20 17:04:29  thanks
Jul 20 17:04:32  no prob
Jul 20 17:04:33  you saved the day
Jul 20 17:04:50  it's just cool that you're making a patch for the screen&lock app.  I like that idea.
Jul 20 17:05:13  well that should be it...
Jul 20 17:05:20  last reboot to confirm it works
Jul 20 17:05:27  reboot of Luna that is
Jul 20 17:05:28  heh, if it's never been set, it might return null, no idea
Jul 20 17:06:02  whoooo
Jul 20 17:06:03  it works
Jul 20 17:06:09  cool  :)
Jul 20 17:06:16  maybe i did something wrong
Jul 20 17:06:36  said /bin/sh: shh: not found
Jul 20 17:06:36  thecakeman: ?
Jul 20 17:06:41  ssh
Jul 20 17:06:43  not shh
Jul 20 17:07:02  my bad
Jul 20 17:08:59  same thing... now it said /bin/sh: ssh: not found
Jul 20 17:09:24  do you not have ssh intalled?
Jul 20 17:09:29  what distro are you using?
Jul 20 17:09:34  or are you on windows?
Jul 20 17:09:43  PuffTheMagic  I think he typed that ON THE PRE.
Jul 20 17:09:46  you cant be windows if you got that error
Jul 20 17:09:47  he's on windows on his pc.
Jul 20 17:09:49  :/
Jul 20 17:10:03  thecakeman: dont be doing this from ON the pre
Jul 20 17:10:12  if you are in windows use Putty to ssh into it
Jul 20 17:10:20  thecakeman  on windows, in putty, you tell it to connect TO the pre... to the pre's ip address, check theSSH box, and tell it port 222
Jul 20 17:10:27  i typed that on putty on virtual windows xp
Jul 20 17:10:33  no
Jul 20 17:10:41  on my 64bit vista machine
Jul 20 17:10:45  you need to tell putty to make a NEW CONNECTION
Jul 20 17:11:02  ((click the upper left corner and there's an option in the menu that comes up.))
Jul 20 17:11:45  oh okay
Jul 20 17:11:50  i see new session?
Jul 20 17:12:19  nodnod
Jul 20 17:12:45  ok then what. im at the putty configuration now
Jul 20 17:13:29  you tell it where to connect to (the pre's wifi ip) you click the ssh box,  and you tell it port 222
Jul 20 17:15:09  ok
Jul 20 17:16:07  its already on ssh and port number by default was 22.. so I add 2 to make it 222
Jul 20 17:16:34  what name should I save the settings by
Jul 20 17:17:19  okay im gonna call it rick_config
Jul 20 17:17:54  I saved it by that name. now whats next?
Jul 20 17:21:00  maybe i'm doing it wrong?.. i follow novaproxy but simply want me  to change it to port 222?
Jul 20 17:21:12  hi can anyone suggest me a software to make and manage a website directly on line?
Jul 20 17:21:12  a software that makes the base of a website and have as well a control panel on line to modify everything
Jul 20 17:25:05  what package in optware has 'patch'
Jul 20 17:25:36  riky123123: wrong chan....
Jul 20 17:27:13  riky123123 this is channel for palm pre owners. so unless you're talking about developing a website with your palm pre. awesome lol
Jul 20 17:27:45  ahh patch is in patch package ;)
Jul 20 17:28:23  well puff..
Jul 20 17:28:53  thecakeman: you figure out putty yet?
Jul 20 17:28:54  i just wanna say forget the shh part. how do I know if i have webosinternals installed?
Jul 20 17:29:52  I'm trying to get mytether app to work.. so far i only have the mytether app installed but not doing anything.
Jul 20 17:31:03  for old times sake. the last 3 years I've own the palm treo from att.. then to htc touch pro w/ sprint.. now back to palm.. pre
Jul 20 17:32:08  I shouldve stayed with the htc touch pro until all this tethering thing had sorted out
Jul 20 17:33:03  PuffTheMagic: this bounce thing you were talking about earlier, where can i read about it :)
Jul 20 17:33:20  jcrawford: i saw it in the api list on palms site i think
Jul 20 17:34:48  Templarian --  I just realized something stupid.
Jul 20 17:35:02  We don't have a place to put "Modifying existing apps - Patches."
Jul 20 17:35:24  Templarian do we need a different portal, a page off WebOs apps, or a page off accessing linux?
Jul 20 17:35:43  Patches is going to end up being abig area, and sugardave is linking them into misc for now, to avoid orphans.
Jul 20 17:35:45  No we could just create pages for those?
Jul 20 17:36:00  Application pages specific to each app?
Jul 20 17:36:40  where would you put  http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Tutorials_webOS_Add_Or_Delete_Pages_In_The_Launcher
Jul 20 17:36:43  that one.
Jul 20 17:37:11  currently it's under misc.   but there are going to be a BUNCH of that category.
Jul 20 17:37:25  rick i did not type anything on my pre (backlogged) u mistook me for error
Jul 20 17:37:52  or consider  Add_Ability_To_Choose_Snooze_Length
Jul 20 17:38:08  it's a structure question
Jul 20 17:39:54  I didn't type anything on my palm pre except 1 time using upupdowndown...etc commands to turn on developer mode. after that it rebooted the pre and i left it alone
Jul 20 17:40:22  everything else is done on windows
Jul 20 17:41:33  via novaproxy. how else did I get an error? was told if ever got error then come join the IRC group
Jul 20 17:41:47  no thecakeman
Jul 20 17:41:53  let me try to explain again....
Jul 20 17:42:04  and I apologize for my poor explanation earlier.
Jul 20 17:42:16  I got a few errors and managed before I decided to come here
Jul 20 17:42:23  apparently my tech-support-karate is weak today.
Jul 20 17:42:39  thecakeman --  no offense was intended.
Jul 20 17:43:26  ok
Jul 20 17:43:28  coffee anyone?
Jul 20 17:43:40  no offense taken
Jul 20 17:43:42  when you used the novoproxy to talk to the pre, and you were at the root@castle prompt
Jul 20 17:44:04  yes
Jul 20 17:44:06  you were typing INTO the pre,  not "on"the pre, but anything you typed there was a command that was _sent_ to the pre....
Jul 20 17:44:15  right?
Jul 20 17:44:39  so,  if in that terminal session, you said something like ssh 192.168.1.210
Jul 20 17:44:54  the pre -itself- would attempt to run an ssh program and go to that ip address
Jul 20 17:45:05  because you were typing that command _to_ the Pre.....
Jul 20 17:45:36  Puff assumed that you were on a linux box, because he is,  and he told you to type _to the linux box_ to run ssh to connect to the pre.
Jul 20 17:45:46  but you can't do that.   You have to use putty to do that.
Jul 20 17:46:17  he was confused by what you wrote.  And so, I told him you were typing "on" the pre, which you weren't.  You were typing "to" the pre.  Precision in speech is important.
Jul 20 17:46:24  --stopping for a moment
Jul 20 17:46:51  so puff is on linux?
Jul 20 17:47:14  and I'm on windows using putty? he can't help me correct?
Jul 20 17:48:35  he can.  But he has to KNOW you're on linux.
Jul 20 17:48:42  windows
Jul 20 17:49:26  so
Jul 20 17:49:37  let's review where you are,and where you want to go.
Jul 20 17:49:48  you've got a successful novacomm connection to the pre.
Jul 20 17:49:54  You've run the optware script
Jul 20 17:49:56  and it worked.
Jul 20 17:50:08  So,  now you want to reach the pre over wifi.   Right??????
Jul 20 17:50:17  at least i think i did.
Jul 20 17:50:27  yes
Jul 20 17:50:31  ad hoc mode
Jul 20 17:51:01  ok
Jul 20 17:51:06  we don'tcareabout that.
Jul 20 17:51:18  ok
Jul 20 17:51:21  now, on the pre,  click the upper right corner and get the menu, and go to wifi.
Jul 20 17:51:38  then, choose wifi preferences.
Jul 20 17:51:51  what does it say your ipaddress is?
Jul 20 17:52:46  192.168.1.42
Jul 20 17:52:55  ok
Jul 20 17:53:04  so, now on your windows box,  open a new putty session.
Jul 20 17:53:24  you get the configuration screen.
Jul 20 17:53:33  ok
Jul 20 17:53:34  in the host name space type that ip address
Jul 20 17:53:48  immediately under it, choose SSH for the connection type
Jul 20 17:53:59  and to the right of that, put in port 222 for the port instead of 22.
Jul 20 17:54:04  and press open
Jul 20 17:54:12  it should connect and ask you for a user name
Jul 20 17:54:42  ok
Jul 20 17:55:22  ok it did?
Jul 20 17:55:30  or ok you'll try....
Jul 20 17:55:36  oh shit. i fucked up
Jul 20 17:55:41  what?
Jul 20 17:55:51  do   NOT  PANIC
Jul 20 17:55:54  you can't break this.
Jul 20 17:55:56  really
Jul 20 17:56:19  i changed the port and ssh and localhost name while it was still saved in novaproxy settings
Jul 20 17:56:39  like u said but I need to start a new connections
Jul 20 17:56:49  i gotta fix this.. hold on
Jul 20 17:56:54  brb 2mins
Jul 20 17:57:49  So I'm really new to all this... but I was able to follow the directions on the wiki, and gain Linux access.. and complete a username/password, However when I 'quilt push' a patch I get the error: "cannot create directory '.pc' : Read only file system" and I ran the sudo remount -o rw,remount/ code before hand... any ideas?
Jul 20 17:58:25  if you have a webos related blog please pm me the url
Jul 20 17:58:27  thecakeman  you can have more-than-one-putty-session at  a time in multipe windows
Jul 20 17:58:39  even to the same pre....
Jul 20 17:59:42  yea but i changed the host name to my ipaddress and port from whatever it was before to 222 and switched from raw to ssh and it says connfection refused
Jul 20 18:00:03  so now I need to go back to undo that change so I can still have root access
Jul 20 18:01:09  damn.. what was it before I changed to 222?
Jul 20 18:01:23  23 probably
Jul 20 18:01:25  telnet
Jul 20 18:01:27  not ssh
Jul 20 18:02:50  I never had it on telnet
Jul 20 18:02:59  i had it on raw
Jul 20 18:03:08  oh  right
Jul 20 18:03:09  raw
Jul 20 18:03:13  novacomm
Jul 20 18:03:25  now I gotta do instructions all over again to configure my putty for root access
Jul 20 18:03:37  Novaproxy uses localhost and port 8023 methinks ?
Jul 20 18:03:42  8023
Jul 20 18:03:53  and raw
Jul 20 18:04:14  got it
Jul 20 18:04:25  http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/PalmAppMods:screenlock
Jul 20 18:04:29  did you not save them with a name?
Jul 20 18:04:30  ^^^ there it is :D
Jul 20 18:04:38  now im back in root@castle:/# thanks
Jul 20 18:04:46  ok
Jul 20 18:04:53  now   OPEN A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PUTTY WINDOW
Jul 20 18:04:56  to do your ssh in
Jul 20 18:05:06  okay now Im going to create new putty window
Jul 20 18:05:35  actually... moved to http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/PalmAppMods:screenlock-onWhenConnected
Jul 20 18:06:42  i put my ip address in the host name.. port 222.. selected SSH
Jul 20 18:07:06  the PRE's ip address.  not the windows IP address.
Jul 20 18:07:16  then I saved it as rick_config so I dont have to mess with it again :-)
Jul 20 18:07:28  i did
Jul 20 18:07:29  except that the ip address may change.
Jul 20 18:07:37  you should get a login prompt
Jul 20 18:08:05 * PuffTheMagic gave my pre a static ip on router
Jul 20 18:08:09 * PuffTheMagic loves dd-wrt
Jul 20 18:08:21  PuffTheMagic: cool, you added a checkbox for the on when connected setting?
Jul 20 18:08:21  That all sounds good. And it should work.  If you want to get fancy enable keepalives in Connection catagory (like 30 seconds.)
Jul 20 18:08:31  and double fancy you can enable dyndns
Jul 20 18:09:30  its same as before looked in preference in wifi from my pre
Jul 20 18:09:45  i got a prompt window
Jul 20 18:10:10  now Putty fatal error.. Network error: connection refused
Jul 20 18:10:19  then ssh isn't running on the pre.
Jul 20 18:10:25  go back to the novacomm window.
Jul 20 18:10:41  okay let me check the ip address again..
Jul 20 18:11:25   is nice
Jul 20 18:11:39  oh i know what happened
Jul 20 18:12:08  it 9 digits not 10 digits ipaddress i missed 1 number
Jul 20 18:12:35  let me try again
Jul 20 18:13:28  destinal: yup... toggle switch, you see the screenshot i added for it :D
Jul 20 18:13:44  not at first but now I do
Jul 20 18:13:51  it's kind of off to the side with my resolution
Jul 20 18:14:07  ahh
Jul 20 18:14:10  it didnt work.. got same error
Jul 20 18:14:16  destinal: we should make a nicer template
Jul 20 18:14:21  for posting patches for mods
Jul 20 18:14:30  okay im back at the novacomm window
Jul 20 18:14:34  a description, screenshot and codeblock
Jul 20 18:14:40  yeah, agree
Jul 20 18:14:45  something that is friendly to lots of browers
Jul 20 18:14:59  what to do next to get ssh running?
Jul 20 18:16:05  rick_im back at novacomm
Jul 20 18:16:13  thecakeman: where are you having problems in the instructions?
Jul 20 18:17:43  he can't get an ssh connection after running next-steps
Jul 20 18:17:45  before I had my ip address typed like this 192.168.142 by error.. so I corrected it when I looked at my pre again its 192.168.1.42
Jul 20 18:17:53  can you debug with him for a moment I gotta get something to eat.
Jul 20 18:18:05  he's in via novacomm, and ran next-steps.
Jul 20 18:18:39  destinal I'm still at root@castle:/#
Jul 20 18:18:45  okay rick.. thanks for the help
Jul 20 18:18:56  I look forward to seeing u again
Jul 20 18:19:24  may I suggest the pasta side dish from pizzahut is really good.
Jul 20 18:19:41  thecakeman:  ok, so what's going on?  did you try running the script?
Jul 20 18:20:07  or did you install dropbear at the command line?
Jul 20 18:20:45  yes
Jul 20 18:20:55  dropbear is installed already
Jul 20 18:21:02  he ran the script
Jul 20 18:21:07  as far as I got then I got lost
Jul 20 18:21:36  ok cool.  so you should be able to find the IP address of the pre and ssh to it, port 222?
Jul 20 18:22:26  after I installed dropbear i wasnt able to test it. but puff showed me how. then I typed in the console showing dropbear started
Jul 20 18:23:16  my goal here is to get webosinternals installed.. I did follow the instructions fromhttp://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Next_steps
Jul 20 18:23:32  but thats another issue.
Jul 20 18:23:45  I don't know if I did it right or not
Jul 20 18:24:07  thats all.
Jul 20 18:24:09  thecakeman: so on the pre in your window via novacom
Jul 20 18:24:12  ifconfig eth0
Jul 20 18:24:38  look for the IP address after "inet addr"
Jul 20 18:25:34  cool.  finally see some actions.. n the windows it says 192.168.1.42
Jul 20 18:26:53  I dont know commands like this but I remembered typing that in before. at one point trying to enable connection sharing.. i got permission denied.
Jul 20 18:27:18  hmm
Jul 20 18:27:57  you're on windows?   go to the command prompt and run  "putty -ssh 192.168.1.42 222"  (without the quotes)
Jul 20 18:28:00  so thats what I see after inet addr: 192.168.1.42
Jul 20 18:28:56  yes I'm on windows xp (the virtual pc)
Jul 20 18:29:25  wait when u said command prompt you mean in putty?
Jul 20 18:30:25  thecakeman: what's the host OS outside of xp?
Jul 20 18:30:29  just making sure u mean typing that in the same window as I typed "etho 0
Jul 20 18:30:34  what's your base os
Jul 20 18:31:02  vista
Jul 20 18:31:07  64bit
Jul 20 18:31:11  ok
Jul 20 18:32:18  so bring up a command prompt  (start, run, "cmd" [no quotes])
Jul 20 18:32:41  then type "ping 192.168.1.42"
Jul 20 18:33:31  do that where? virtual pc or host?
Jul 20 18:33:55  whichever one you want to use to ssh to the pre.  either one.  both.
Jul 20 18:34:18  i'll start with virtual xp windows
Jul 20 18:35:37  okay
Jul 20 18:36:04  pinging 192.168.1.42 with 32 bytes of data
Jul 20 18:36:30  what information am I looking for?
Jul 20 18:37:05  I wish I could screenshot what I'm doing otherwise it gonna be alot of work typing everthing exactly as I see it
Jul 20 18:37:05  thecakeman: do you get replies?
Jul 20 18:37:17  but the command worked. yes I got replies
Jul 20 18:37:39  ok try on the xp box    "telnet 192.168.1.42 222"   without the quotes
Jul 20 18:37:42  in the command prompt
Jul 20 18:37:44  destinal yes I got replies
Jul 20 18:38:08  if dropbear's running we'll get a banner back
Jul 20 18:39:08  like SSH-2.0 .. .
Jul 20 18:39:46  connecting to 192.168.1.42... could not open connection to the host, on port 222: connect failed
Jul 20 18:40:31  was it awake, like playing an mp3 - ?
Jul 20 18:41:31  no I have the palm pre right next to me its sleep peacefully the whole time. nothing happening.
Jul 20 18:42:17  destinal_ connect failed
Jul 20 18:42:35  thecakeman: you want to wake it up and plug it into usb
Jul 20 18:42:53  it IS plugged into the usb, right, or you wouldn't have novacomm connectivity...
Jul 20 18:42:55  right?
Jul 20 18:43:10  rick_correct
Jul 20 18:43:18  ok
Jul 20 18:43:23  so sleepisn't an issue
Jul 20 18:43:33  now.... ((( got a gyro.  Much better now.)))
Jul 20 18:44:00  now.   destinal  is there ANY CHANCE IN THE WORLD  that the problem is that he's on an ad-hoc connection?
Jul 20 18:44:05  so connect failed and not refused sounds like a network issue or iptables issue to me, but maybe not
Jul 20 18:44:06  what? no pizzahut? lol
Jul 20 18:44:14  wait
Jul 20 18:44:15  wait
Jul 20 18:44:24  thecakeman  -- do you have windows firewall running?
Jul 20 18:45:37  actually nevermind windows xp returns connect failed on refusal also
Jul 20 18:45:39  yea I had the verizon internet security running before. i uninstalled it because it discconnected me from the internet. but now. i just have zone alarm. works much better now
Jul 20 18:45:43  but guess what..
Jul 20 18:45:59  when I ran the ping test...
Jul 20 18:46:54  on the host machine.. it asked me if I want to allow virtual pc to connect to 192.168.1.42
Jul 20 18:47:11  so I click "yes" allow it
Jul 20 18:47:38  and then the ping test started to work on the virtual pc
Jul 20 18:47:45  so it cant be the firewall.
Jul 20 18:47:55  you have to either turn off zone alarm,  or you have to tell zone alarm to allow port 222
Jul 20 18:48:05  all you've done with a ping is to let ping-packets through
Jul 20 18:48:10  which don't _have_ ports.
Jul 20 18:48:48  hmmm. let me see.. hold on a sec thrre
Jul 20 18:50:52  PuffTheMagic: i am still not seeing anything related to bounce in sounds :(
Jul 20 18:53:16  awww shucks. whats the best firewall can use that allow configure your posts
Jul 20 18:53:20  *ports
Jul 20 18:53:59  I had to install the free version of the zonealarm until I can find a good one
Jul 20 18:54:50  because the one I had before somehow disconnected me from wifi.. im going to temporarily disable it for 5mins
Jul 20 18:54:54  then try again
Jul 20 18:55:47  i just found out that zonealarm is not letting me configure ports. which sucks man
Jul 20 18:56:30  the built in windows firewall works fine
Jul 20 18:56:52  destinal... Im gonna try it again with the guards down
Jul 20 18:59:58  jcrawford: maybe he was referring to: http://developer.palm.com/palm-sdk/jsdoc/symbols/Mojo.Function.html ?  I guess you would do something akin to Mojo.Function.debounce(undefinded, playSoundFunction, lengthOfSound);
Jul 20 19:00:24  still not work
Jul 20 19:00:32  says connect failed
Jul 20 19:01:28  drnull: any idea how to tell the device to stop playing a sound that is playing?
Jul 20 19:01:42  jcrawford: sorry, no
Jul 20 19:01:54  no you don't know or not there is not?
Jul 20 19:01:59  rick.. i took off the firewall and it still say "connect failed to 192.168.1.42 port 222
Jul 20 19:02:11  heh, I'm no expert.  I don't know if there is one.
Jul 20 19:02:18  thanks dreadchicken
Jul 20 19:02:21  err drnull
Jul 20 19:02:23  haha
Jul 20 19:03:13  jcrawford: how long is your sound anyway?
Jul 20 19:04:46  drnull: well personally i was using a 20 sec sound
Jul 20 19:04:53  theme song to 24 the show heh
Jul 20 19:05:07  so it would not matter for short sounds
Jul 20 19:05:14  haha, awesome.  That's got to be cool in a "round"  :)
Jul 20 19:05:14  but I would like to be able to have it not matter :D
Jul 20 19:05:25  "round"?
Jul 20 19:05:46  round... offset singing of the same words?  Hrmph, not sure how to describe it.
Jul 20 19:06:09  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Round_(music)
Jul 20 19:07:13  So you could just set a var that you are playing, and a timeout (who knows, 30 seconds later) to clear that variable?  No idea.
Jul 20 19:08:18  well this is the ringer: http://josephcrawford.com/pics/24%20Hours%20CTU%20Mix.m4r
Jul 20 19:11:27  but that might just be too long
Jul 20 19:11:51  i figured if there was a way to find out if a sound event was happening then it would work because i could say dont execute this sound event
Jul 20 19:12:05  \or stop this current event etc.
Jul 20 19:17:51  jcrawford: i have an idea for your program
Jul 20 19:18:12  cant you just set a bit when you start playing the sounde
Jul 20 19:18:14  sound
Jul 20 19:18:23  then set the bit off when the playing it complete
Jul 20 19:18:42  and wrap that in a if statement that only allows playing if the bit is not set?
Jul 20 19:19:28  "when playing is complete" is the difficult part. Not sure we have any way to be notified about that.
Jul 20 19:20:40  jcrawford: its debounce
Jul 20 19:20:42  not bounce
Jul 20 19:20:43  jcrawford: http://developer.palm.com/palm-sdk/jsdoc/symbols/Mojo.Function.html
Jul 20 19:21:14  that is what i was thinking of
Jul 20 19:21:20  idk if it will be useful for you or not
Jul 20 19:24:01  thanks
Jul 20 19:24:33  well i have 2 palm pre.. i only rooted 1 so far
Jul 20 19:24:33  PuffTheMagic: that could be done, but that wont work for other "system" sounds which is why i was asking about the methods
Jul 20 19:25:00  i hope my pre isn't a defect.
Jul 20 19:25:07  jcrawford: maybe you can put a lock on the sound defice
Jul 20 19:28:00  anyone notice the wiki acts weird randomly... doesnt render properly
Jul 20 19:28:19  hey guys, is there a way to give my user read/write perms over sftp on MAC
Jul 20 19:28:54  if i take the "-g" out of the dropbear upstart i can use root for read/write, but i would like to be able to leave root out of it
Jul 20 19:31:56  hello?
Jul 20 19:32:14  like i've said before, im new with linux
Jul 20 19:32:52  would " bind /var/home/root /var/home/user" do the trick?
Jul 20 19:33:27  ......
Jul 20 19:33:37  why have channel if no one will help
Jul 20 19:34:11  puffthemagic_ i did
Jul 20 19:37:58  seekis: I don't know of a way to do it. I telnet in, and turn readwrite on the file system mount
Jul 20 19:38:11  and then my sftp works since the read/write is on
Jul 20 19:38:24  when I'm done I use telnet to again mark the system as read-only
Jul 20 19:38:28  This is the method that I use.
Jul 20 19:39:39  seekis: I have a key generated using puttygen in root's .ssh/authorized_keys file, then I can sftp in fine.
Jul 20 19:39:55 * drnull smacks forehead.
Jul 20 19:43:26  Could just sftp files into the home directory of the user you are logging in to.
Jul 20 19:44:49  He left... hate when that happens.
Jul 20 19:46:57  seekis you still here....
Jul 20 19:47:01  sorry
Jul 20 19:47:08  people DO help
Jul 20 19:47:21  but mostofusareatwork  and have to space out irc
Jul 20 19:47:35  seekis
Jul 20 19:47:41  Irc requires patience
Jul 20 19:47:44  Rick_: he left us...
Jul 20 19:47:56  well then...  foo on him
Jul 20 19:48:09  And who spaces irc out at work hehe.
Jul 20 19:48:15  right
Jul 20 19:48:24  me for example.   20 minute supprot call
Jul 20 19:48:30  and I have to make another now.
Jul 20 19:48:56  Idiot user deleted office web components off their server, so the graphing functions in the web-app now fails.  :-)
Jul 20 19:48:58  Weheeeeeee
Jul 20 19:49:12  "I didn't know what that was so I deleted it."
Jul 20 19:49:54 * Rick_ looks for the soft spot on the wall so he can get a rythem going.
Jul 20 19:53:17  when you are applying patches and it give you this what should i do
Jul 20 19:54:18  quilt push Applying patch /opt/src/patches/enable-dev-mode-icon.patch patching file usr/palm/applications/com.palm.app.devmodeswitcher/appinfo.json Hunk #1 FAILED at 5. 1 out of 1 hunk FAILED -- rejects in file usr/palm/applications/com.palm.app.dev     modeswitcher/appinfo.json Patch /opt/src/patches/enable-dev-mode-icon.patch does not apply (enforce with -     f)
Jul 20 20:00:17  Templarian: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Getting_started
Jul 20 20:00:21  ^^ this could use a template
Jul 20 20:00:29  to show a thumbnail
Jul 20 20:00:34  instead of the full image
Jul 20 20:00:44  and maybe some better justification
Jul 20 20:03:30  PuffTheMagic: there already is one.
Jul 20 20:03:41  I'll edit it in as a learning excercise.
Jul 20 20:04:26  on *:JOIN:#: {   set %.ch $chan   CTCP $nick VERSION } on 1:CTCPREPLY:VERSION*:/onotice #channelname $nick is using IRC client: $1-
Jul 20 20:04:27  also thanks PuffTheMagic for using readable image names. very rarely does one see that.
Jul 20 20:05:39  Templarian: its a wiki... that sorta seemed to make sense
Jul 20 20:07:24  PuffTheMagic: I edited your page... but I might make a new template when I get out of work an an hour... never thought how that would look with such few text lol.
Jul 20 20:10:00  cool thanks
Jul 20 20:10:16 * PuffTheMagic starts to ponder how to make a dropbear interface
Jul 20 20:10:20  in mojo
Jul 20 20:14:23  PuffTheMagic: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Getting_started i'm busy at work might want to flip it so that the instructions are on the left.
Jul 20 20:17:05  nvm, I did it.
Jul 20 20:18:41  PuffTheMagic: a dropbear interface?
Jul 20 20:18:56  what's that
Jul 20 20:19:27  PuffTheMagic: revert those changes on the main page.
Jul 20 20:20:23  wow this page is broken at the bottom :( http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1742
Jul 20 20:20:51  Sorry puff but that front screen is no where near ready.
Jul 20 20:21:16  jcrawford: unescaped html?
Jul 20 20:21:56  jcrawford: most of their docs are... they did a strait copy and paste from the early access and are still making changes.
Jul 20 20:22:07  ah
Jul 20 20:22:14  Templarian: does the early access still exist seperately?
Jul 20 20:24:04  destinal: sort of, not really active.
Jul 20 20:35:59  how do you take screenshots in the emulator?
Jul 20 20:38:43  Destinal: How is the plugin work going?
Jul 20 20:39:57  jcrawford: orange-sym-p
Jul 20 20:40:11  drnull: haha i dont have the pre keyboard on the emulator :"D
Jul 20 20:40:20  hahah, just read the end of the sentence.  :)
Jul 20 20:40:24  :)
Jul 20 20:40:43  anyone here going through the webOS book at all?
Jul 20 20:40:49  stuck on some bad code methinks
Jul 20 20:40:54  I did until I got so fed up with ... yep.
Jul 20 20:41:09  drnull: yea i cannot get the list to work properly figure 3-10
Jul 20 20:41:22  well I did get past that at least.... lemme check.  :)
Jul 20 20:41:26  adding the ajax feeds, my version still shows the NYT and the previous feeds
Jul 20 20:41:36  s/feeds/stories
Jul 20 20:41:42  i cannot see the list of all feeds at all
Jul 20 20:41:50  is what i am getting at :)
Jul 20 20:42:10  comment i posted on safari
Jul 20 20:42:12  http://pastie.org/552525
Jul 20 20:42:21  "The feedList Scene with style improvements" that one?
Jul 20 20:42:32  i got a question for the wiki gods
Jul 20 20:42:42  the section about webos applcations and tutorials
Jul 20 20:42:53  is that for palm default apps
Jul 20 20:42:56  or home brew
Jul 20 20:42:58  So after applying different patches one still doesn't work: The one to have developer mode icon in launcher... I didn't see any error messages anyone have any clues?
Jul 20 20:43:00  or everything in the app catelog
Jul 20 20:43:09  drnull: that would be it
Jul 20 20:43:29  i still get results similar to 3-9 but with not as many results :D
Jul 20 20:44:02  wow, he definitely doesn't mention the need to change stage-assistant, does he?
Jul 20 20:44:07  nope
Jul 20 20:44:18  i tried changing mine to feed-list also that did not work either left me with a white card
Jul 20 20:44:25  also mine looks more like 3-8
Jul 20 20:44:31 * jcrawford might have missed a step
Jul 20 20:45:20  this.controller.pushScene("feedList")
Jul 20 20:45:25  no i have all the stuff in place
Jul 20 20:46:56  that leads to a white card with nothing in the error log
Jul 20 20:46:57  :(
Jul 20 20:47:16  Anyone know who "hopspitfire"(wiki name) is in IRC?
Jul 20 20:47:35  yeah he was around here earlier i believe
Jul 20 20:48:45  that
Jul 20 20:48:45  http://pastie.org/552532
Jul 20 20:48:49  that's the log
Jul 20 20:48:53  Can anyone see my text? I'm new to IRC and I keep seeing info: register your network's nick name with NickServ message... and have no idea how to do that.
Jul 20 20:49:15  MLJones8: yes we see you
Jul 20 20:49:26  MLJones8: type this /ns help register
Jul 20 20:49:37  Thanks
Jul 20 20:49:45  MLJones8: then you will also need to identify when you come back later so get familiar with /ns help identify
Jul 20 20:52:12  on the new wiki, how do we keep code blocks as working as before
Jul 20 20:52:33  hey all
Jul 20 20:52:33  jcrawford: why are you using feed-list?  Doesn't the book say feedList?  Also, try putting Mojo.Log.error statements into feedListAssistant.setup and the constructor.  And maybe surrounding the push statement with try{ } catch(e) {Mojo.Log.error("Caught exception %o", e);}
Jul 20 20:52:56  oh nevermind, looks like space as first character does something similar
Jul 20 20:52:59  drnull: will try that
Jul 20 20:53:17  i am using feed-list because that is how the framework sets them up now when you use palm-generate
Jul 20 20:53:43  ive read the wiki page on changing the enter key to not send text msgs... could that be changed to shift-enter?
Jul 20 20:54:51  no exception thrown in the feed-list call
Jul 20 20:55:27  anyway have to leave work now
Jul 20 20:55:29  ttyl guys
Jul 20 20:57:58  Anyone familiar with applying the patches from the wiki? All of them worked besides the add dev icon to launcher...
Jul 20 20:59:19  MLJones8, theres an app for that... oh jeez, did I just type that?
Jul 20 20:59:58  in the precentral homebrew forums, someone made an app that locates an icon in the launcher for you
Jul 20 21:00:32  Yes, I saw the .ipk... but I figured the less stuff on there the better.
Jul 20 21:01:56  DarthPooh: is that what the majority of users have reverted to (the app that is)?   Having the dev icon I would think is the preferred method.
Jul 20 21:04:08  DarthPooh: it's funny to see apple's there's an app for that thing, after they spent so long denying that anyone should need to run local apps on the iphone.   sorry, off topic
Jul 20 21:04:32  just couldn't help myself
Jul 20 21:09:37  if i create a browser plugin, is it something that could be distributed in the app catalog with my app and used by non-rooted pre users?
Jul 20 21:15:44  dinner time, bbl
Jul 20 21:16:00  someone should checkout the Main_Page_beta and tweak it if they feel
Jul 20 21:20:01  When applying a patch, can you only do one at a time? i.e. one quilt import then one quilt push? or can you import multiple patches and have them all push at once?
Jul 20 21:23:15  josh|home: palm has given no indication of whether or not they'll distribute browser plugins in catalog.  so far, they have not, afaik
Jul 20 21:24:03  I wouldn't be surprised if they don't allow it, at least for a while
Jul 20 21:24:26  well, how is Classic distributed?
Jul 20 21:24:33  Classic the mojo app is on the catalog
Jul 20 21:24:34  or whatever the Palm OS emulator is called?
Jul 20 21:24:41  but I think the plugin is already in the base image
Jul 20 21:24:46  that's a browser plugin isn't it?
Jul 20 21:24:46  oh
Jul 20 21:26:25  Hunk #1 FAILED at 5. 1 out of 1 hunk FAILED -- rejects in file usr/palm/applications/com.palm.app.devmodeswitcher/appinfo.json     Now I am getting an error  (when trying to apply this patch)... any ideas?
Jul 20 21:26:36  destinal oh bummer, so no way to create socket interfaces then>
Jul 20 21:26:52  the only apps i really want to make require sockets (ssh, irc, whatever)
Jul 20 21:27:02  and i refuse to use a central server platform because that defeats the purpose
Jul 20 21:27:08  services would work as well
Jul 20 21:27:15  but I don't think they distribute those either
Jul 20 21:27:19  in catalog
Jul 20 21:27:25  yeah so nothing workable :\
Jul 20 21:27:40  the API seems rather limited currently :-/
Jul 20 21:27:41  i dont want to spent the time making something only rooted users would have access to
Jul 20 21:27:54  guess i'll just wait until they support native code
Jul 20 21:28:21  you could make it available directly to users too
Jul 20 21:28:47  what do you mean?
Jul 20 21:28:48  josh|home: I hate the term rooted, what part is bad?
Jul 20 21:29:17  in the future the idea is that people flip on dev mode and run a program, is that too much?
Jul 20 21:29:19  people who have terminal access to the linux subsystem i mean
Jul 20 21:29:27  yes
Jul 20 21:29:44  josh|home: because preware users may or may not have terminal access
Jul 20 21:29:46  they don't need it
Jul 20 21:30:01  but they will need to turn on dev mode to install the installer
Jul 20 21:30:12  then there will be an on-device gui installer that does the rest
Jul 20 21:30:44  think cydia but easier than jailbreaking
Jul 20 21:30:52  i guess ill just wait until they support native code in the app catalog
Jul 20 21:31:19  thanks for the answers
Jul 20 21:31:23  ok, just trying to figure out if that was too much of a hurdle
Jul 20 21:31:30  it's not like the "rooting" stuff now
Jul 20 21:32:43  that's a huge barrier to entry.  this will be, flip on dev mode, run the preware program, it installs a preware gui installer app on the phone.   but if that's too much to ask for users, I understant
Jul 20 21:32:45  understand
Jul 20 21:34:04  any sort of timetable on native code?
Jul 20 21:34:15  josh|home: for what
Jul 20 21:34:31  distribution & support in the app catalog
Jul 20 21:34:34  josh|home: you mean a palm announcement of  a native sdk?  there's been nothing
Jul 20 21:34:35  and interfaces to webos
Jul 20 21:34:52  ah ok
Jul 20 21:35:12  well maybe ill check back in a few months heh
Jul 20 21:35:14  thanks again :]
Jul 20 21:35:20  you're welcome
Jul 20 21:35:49  stupid anti-sideload roadblocks.. grumble..
Jul 20 21:45:26  yo guys... just an fyi... my java skillz are like 1000x better than my c++ skilz so if if/when it comes time to making any user friendly installer apps or what not
Jul 20 21:45:32  i cant whip shit up in java in no time
Jul 20 21:46:30  PuffTheMagic: we should do it in java for sure
Jul 20 21:47:22  PuffTheMagic: only thing we should need native code for is usb
Jul 20 21:47:43  but for as much as possible cross platform is what we should do
Jul 20 21:48:26  and maybe we compartmentalize the usb stuff in a novacomd and just make an OSS one that's a drop in replacement for the palm one
Jul 20 21:48:29  so they can use either
Jul 20 21:49:30  or maybe a daemon is overkill for something many will use once in a blue moon
Jul 20 21:49:31  hmm
Jul 20 21:50:47  novacom is neat for sure
Jul 20 21:51:00  bpadalino|work: we need to use the protocol regardless
Jul 20 21:51:02  i really wish i had the ambition to do an entire daemon replacement
Jul 20 21:51:13  instead of just stopping where i did
Jul 20 21:51:14  :(
Jul 20 21:51:15  but a daemon may be more than we need
Jul 20 21:51:45  my idea is a mojo preware installer, then a cross platform host side installer-installer
Jul 20 21:52:15  neat
Jul 20 21:52:18  do it up
Jul 20 21:52:18  so you download the preware package thing and click it and it sets it up on your phone, then you go from there on the phone
Jul 20 21:53:16  bpadalino|work: so long as you're willing to pitch in with novacom knowledge as I go :)
Jul 20 21:53:39  I can look at the code you did and traces and all but I expect that (and making that cross-platform) to be the hard part
Jul 20 21:53:59  it uses libusb
Jul 20 21:54:01  so it should be fine
Jul 20 21:54:11  have people gotten it working under windows ?
Jul 20 21:54:19  under cygwin maybe ?
Jul 20 21:54:22  your precomd project?
Jul 20 21:54:27  yeah
Jul 20 21:54:32  it runs on linux and os x
Jul 20 21:54:44  and i thought if you install libusbwin32
Jul 20 21:54:49  it would work under cygwin
Jul 20 21:54:55  but i haven't tried
Jul 20 21:55:17  i have never done anything with mingw - so maybe that's a better way
Jul 20 21:55:20  if only palm's novacomd was oss
Jul 20 21:55:20  but i have no idea
Jul 20 21:55:22  :-/
Jul 20 21:55:25  heh
Jul 20 21:55:42  i don't think geist has a problem with it .. but palm might
Jul 20 21:55:56  if we can rely on the user having the sdk that makes things way easy, but I don't want to assume that
Jul 20 21:56:13  it's another thing to download and install and then there are potential eula issues
Jul 20 21:57:10  and also there's a lot of other junk that comes with it.  you shouldn't need an sdk to drop preware on your phone
Jul 20 22:00:50  novacom tcp support would be nice but I don't think it's an important feature at least for the first release.  emulator users already have palm-install
Jul 20 22:00:57  so I'll focus on usb
Jul 20 22:02:11  do you expect the users to be able to install the novacom drivers for windows at least ?
Jul 20 22:02:35  bpadalino|work: I think it takes away from the ease of use and one step download
Jul 20 22:02:38  what do you think?
Jul 20 22:03:04  barrier to entry is HIGH right now
Jul 20 22:03:06  i think you could write a program which checks for the driver, downloads the web doctor jar, pulls out the drivers and starts that install
Jul 20 22:03:08  for most users
Jul 20 22:03:20  the doctor jar is >> 200 << megabytes
Jul 20 22:03:23  nah
Jul 20 22:03:23  so it would still be a single download by the users perspective
Jul 20 22:03:29  yeah, it is pretty large
Jul 20 22:03:59  did anyone take the plugin stuff and run with it ?
Jul 20 22:04:31  bpadalino|work: raeb and mrvt and PuffTheMagic are working on it
Jul 20 22:04:47  but they may take a stop on the way and implement anyterm over dbus
Jul 20 22:05:00  some of them anyway
Jul 20 22:05:16  bpadalino|work: do you have the sdk yet?
Jul 20 22:06:06  if so you should check out the current git repository (it imports nicely in eclipse) -- mrvt has point drawing based on screen taps
Jul 20 22:06:16  in basicplugin / helloplugin
Jul 20 22:06:22  destinal: we have no way to do patching without installing something as root, even if they are in ipkgs
Jul 20 22:06:26  destinal: is any of the novacom stuff OSS
Jul 20 22:06:57  destinal: cause then we could repackage the stuff we need with installer
Jul 20 22:07:03  rwhitby: I assume for that discussion the existence of an ipkg -o /var  dbus service
Jul 20 22:07:24  which doesn't exist yet to be sure, but is realistic
Jul 20 22:07:29  destinal: we need more than that to patch
Jul 20 22:07:47  dependency on a patch package
Jul 20 22:08:11  destinal: so you're saying we recompile all of optware to run under /var ?
Jul 20 22:08:38  that ain't gonna happen
Jul 20 22:08:40  hmm.. ok, that's a good question and one I have to think about, but the theory is still sound
Jul 20 22:08:53  destinal: I fully agree with the goals you are setting, however.
Jul 20 22:08:58  destinal: i dont think dbus is gonna be good for binary transfer
Jul 20 22:09:13  PuffTheMagic: control over dbus
Jul 20 22:09:16  destinal: I just don't have a known path to meet those goals for patches and new services.
Jul 20 22:09:18  oh
Jul 20 22:09:39  ah, mrvc is the man - great guy
Jul 20 22:09:47 * PuffTheMagic is about to start on a mojo for stating/stoping upstart services
Jul 20 22:10:02  i did download the sdk and have it running on my mac ..
Jul 20 22:10:07  but haven't done anything with it
Jul 20 22:10:17  PuffTheMagic: I think you'd do well with a dbus service to list, stop, and start upstart items
Jul 20 22:10:22  destinal: for normal homebrew that just uses webOS, we should be able to achieve the goals you have defined
Jul 20 22:10:53  destinal: maybe i could use dbus, but then i would have to write a daemon in C to expose upstart events via dbus
Jul 20 22:11:08  it might just be easier to make a plugin that executes arbitrary commands first
Jul 20 22:11:28  that was one of the first services written in java
Jul 20 22:11:29  PuffTheMagic: I don't follow you at all
Jul 20 22:11:29  and that could be usefull for many apps
Jul 20 22:11:38  there's already a service for arbitrary commands
Jul 20 22:11:41  there is no dbus binding for upstart that I know of
Jul 20 22:11:42  It's a huge security risk IMO
Jul 20 22:11:50  destinal: where is it?
Jul 20 22:12:00  git repo
Jul 20 22:12:15  it's just as easy to modify it to call initctl
Jul 20 22:12:15  ohhh
Jul 20 22:12:29  well then 1/2 my work is done
Jul 20 22:12:35  but if you dont like that method
Jul 20 22:12:39  I want to really hammer on the "one interface for one job" thing
Jul 20 22:13:02  generic command execution "services" are clearly something palm's avoided for security reasons
Jul 20 22:13:08  http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/trees/master/org.webosinternals.services
Jul 20 22:13:11  well right
Jul 20 22:13:30  I don't want to have to code review all my apps to make sure they don't happen to call it
Jul 20 22:13:35  and execute stuff on my pre
Jul 20 22:13:50  ok fine
Jul 20 22:14:09  but making arbitrary methods to call initctl should be easy
Jul 20 22:14:13  hmm
Jul 20 22:14:22  upstart might actually have dbus support
Jul 20 22:14:26  and I'm not as worried about an app stopping and starting things
Jul 20 22:14:51  you could make it private bus only and make your app a com.palm.whatever, ugly as that is
Jul 20 22:14:52  i know
Jul 20 22:15:01  there's got to be a way of customizing what can use the private bus
Jul 20 22:15:04  i was just trying to think about how I would communicate with upstart
Jul 20 22:15:11  and i didnt realise it already had dbus bindings
Jul 20 22:15:17  heh, cool
Jul 20 22:15:32  rwhitby: what of postinst
Jul 20 22:15:57  we should be able to install anything if we wrap a service around calling the full blown ipkg
Jul 20 22:17:16  YES
Jul 20 22:17:25  com.ubuntu.Upstart
Jul 20 22:17:31  ^^ dbus interface :D
Jul 20 22:17:34  whoa
Jul 20 22:17:38  this is gonna be CAKE!
Jul 20 22:17:40  is it public bus or private?
Jul 20 22:17:51  I'm guessing private
Jul 20 22:18:21  PuffTheMagic: are you familiar with public vs private bus on webos?
Jul 20 22:18:21  yes private
Jul 20 22:18:23  opk
Jul 20 22:18:24  ok
Jul 20 22:18:33  no i am not
Jul 20 22:18:41  destinal: yeah, we need to get that service installed first though
Jul 20 22:19:12  rwhitby: can't novacom over usb do anything?
Jul 20 22:19:12  rwhitby: come up with a way to use the sdk binaries to install optware and i can make a java gui for it
Jul 20 22:19:16  arbitrary gets and puts, etc
Jul 20 22:19:18  there's no getting around that the end-user needs to access Linux and install at least one package while there.
Jul 20 22:19:33  bpadalino|work: can novacom put files anywhere in the filesystem?
Jul 20 22:19:35  rwhitby: do _they_ have to?  or does a program have to
Jul 20 22:19:43  rwhitby: i can do that all with nova* packages witha java gui
Jul 20 22:19:49  rwhitby, yes
Jul 20 22:19:50  if you come up with the method for it
Jul 20 22:19:52  i will implementi ti
Jul 20 22:20:11  rwhitby, it can execute commands too
Jul 20 22:20:24  destinal: ok, that is the way forward.
Jul 20 22:20:26  destinal: the upstart is avail on the system bus
Jul 20 22:20:41  bpadalino|work: we need that open source nova driver, cross-platform and easy to install for an end-user.
Jul 20 22:20:46   A private D-Bus connection to the address unix:abstract=/com/ubuntu/upstart
Jul 20 22:20:57  PuffTheMagic: can you get there with luna-send?
Jul 20 22:20:58  (i.e. with windows .msi and macosx .dmg and linux .rpm and .deb)
Jul 20 22:21:02  rwhitby, does it need to be a daemon, or just enough to do something once
Jul 20 22:21:07  destinal: idk yet
Jul 20 22:21:24  bpadalino|work: just do something once, just bonus points if it can do a terminal connection
Jul 20 22:21:33  (or proxy one)
Jul 20 22:21:38 * PuffTheMagic start up emulator to test dbus w/ luna-send
Jul 20 22:21:46  rwhitby, terminal connection works great for me and mrvc .. so do the file transfers
Jul 20 22:21:56  i haven't tried it for windows
Jul 20 22:22:03  and i've heard of issues with linux - but can't figure them out
Jul 20 22:22:31  does the emulator come up as a USB device ?
Jul 20 22:22:44  bpadalino|work: no, it uses novacomd's tcp mode
Jul 20 22:22:49  gotcha
Jul 20 22:22:51  bpadalino|work: novacom over tcp for the emulator
Jul 20 22:23:17  should be same protocol minus the usb encapsulation though, right?
Jul 20 22:23:22  yeah
Jul 20 22:23:26  it's all the inner stuff
Jul 20 22:23:33  decafbad stuff
Jul 20 22:23:42  no one answerted my question about the wiki mainpage and the portals
Jul 20 22:24:04  is the webos tutorials for palm base apps, home brew, everything in app cat?
Jul 20 22:27:07  i hear crickets
Jul 20 22:27:09  PuffTheMagic: in preware you mean
Jul 20 22:27:10  ?
Jul 20 22:27:12  I don't know
Jul 20 22:27:21  PuffTheMagic: what's the question?
Jul 20 22:27:35  the Main_Page_beta that I am working on
Jul 20 22:27:37 * rwhitby hasn't read the backlog yet this morning
Jul 20 22:27:40  it says Required Portals
Jul 20 22:27:44  and one of them is
Jul 20 22:27:47  bpadalino|work: decafbad, really?
Jul 20 22:27:48  webOs tutorials
Jul 20 22:27:54  is that for base palm apps
Jul 20 22:28:02  or for all app store apps
Jul 20 22:28:07  or jsut for home brew apps
Jul 20 22:28:14  PuffTheMagic: I believe it's for any webOS application
Jul 20 22:28:20  that is crazy
Jul 20 22:28:31  why would we have tutorials for things like the Nascar app
Jul 20 22:28:36  destinal, yeah - read the little documentation associated with the novacom replacement stuff
Jul 20 22:28:37  or Pandora
Jul 20 22:28:40  i put it all in there what i found
Jul 20 22:28:45  PuffTheMagic: we wouldn't
Jul 20 22:28:47  0xdecafbad
Jul 20 22:28:50  nice little magic word
Jul 20 22:28:51  hehe
Jul 20 22:29:02  PuffTheMagic: why do you think that portal means that?
Jul 20 22:29:23  ?? i dont think it means anyhting... i am asking what it means
Jul 20 22:29:30  someone else said ALL apps
Jul 20 22:29:31  not me
Jul 20 22:29:38  "webOS Tutorials" says to me "a place where we put tutorials about how to do stuff in webOS"
Jul 20 22:29:52  ok fine
Jul 20 22:29:58  how to do stuff that is relevant to "any" type of app
Jul 20 22:30:11  core os functionality included I imagine
Jul 20 22:30:20  then do the categories i have on Main_Page_beta meet the min requirements....
Jul 20 22:30:27  touchscreen ui, buttons, how do i make my phone a bomb
Jul 20 22:30:28  i know i need to link them to meaning full stuff still
Jul 20 22:30:32  j/k
Jul 20 22:31:09  if someone wants to add tutorials about how to do stuff that is already documented in Palm's official webOS documentation, I'm not going to stop them, as long as they don't infringe any copyright.
Jul 20 22:32:34  destinal: it seems like Palm included upstart dbus stuff
Jul 20 22:32:44  might have to add the .conf files for it manually
Jul 20 22:32:51  I think Templarian represents well the developer who is going to use just the official webOS APIs and not go further below at the moment.
Jul 20 22:35:43  yep.
Jul 20 22:36:05  I'm also the developer helping other developers... hehe.
Jul 20 22:40:04  On the other hand I did do the email thing while it was around, just not the whole rooting thing... hmm. So like half.
Jul 20 22:53:50  rwhitby: cool, I'm glad that others agree regarding the direction I was brainstorming.   It's part of the reason I'm trying to hammer home that installing custom apps doesn't require what people are thinking of as rooting.  just dev mode and something to talk over novacom protocol
Jul 20 22:54:06  rooting is scary, installing an installer, not so muchj
Jul 20 22:55:11  we should have started down this path a while ago, but our methods were good enough for most of us at that time :)
Jul 20 22:57:15  also we can probably avoid the need to enter konami code if people don't mind holding up and plugging in USB (bootie recovery mode)
Jul 20 22:58:14  I'm trying to come as close to a clean easy sideloading process as possible with the way webos is built
Jul 20 22:58:27  sideloading, not root access
Jul 20 22:58:50  though I would think people could then easily install stuff to give them ssh if they want
Jul 20 22:59:07  and novaterm always exists
Jul 20 22:59:49  this is to meet the sideloading need without the requirement of interactive root access
Jul 20 23:01:21  or even sdk
Jul 20 23:02:28  or even knowing what an .ipk is :P
Jul 20 23:03:32  and only sideloading transparently to then allow gui downloading from preware
Jul 21 00:00:13  http://xerq.net/pre_scrot.png
Jul 21 00:00:55  hopspitfire: haha, nice
Jul 21 00:02:07  Available to help copy wiki stuff over if the help is needed.
Jul 21 00:03:58  tehnoir: that would be very helpful, looks like a lot still need it:   http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Pages_to_be_Transferred
Jul 21 00:04:12  I know hopspitfire's working on it and a few others
Jul 21 00:04:17  but the more the merrier
Jul 21 00:04:37  destinal: My hands are sore from it, any more help will be greatly appreciated :)
Jul 21 00:04:55  All right, I'll try to plug away between working :)
Jul 21 00:05:47  hopspitfire: welcome, and thanks for the help with the wiki.  tehnoir: thanks for the offer, we'll definitely take it up :-)
Jul 21 00:06:49  rwhitby: Not a problem. I've taken so much from the Wiki, glad to have an opportunity to give a little back.
Jul 21 00:07:17  rwhitby: Thank you, I'm glad to be a part of this.
Jul 21 00:08:59  Ironically, I seem to have just killed my Pre after following a page on the wiki. Haha.
Jul 21 00:10:20  tehnoir: how killed?
Jul 21 00:10:55  Had to run the webos doctor on my phone the other day, so I'm going back through and doing all the stuff to it that I had before.
Jul 21 00:11:45  So I changed the carrier string, got down to stopping LunaSysMgr, got distracted for a minute before I had started it, and now the screen is black and my SSH session timed out.
Jul 21 00:11:49  Don't seem to be able to SSH back into it.
Jul 21 00:12:17  tehnoir: did you have usb plugged in?
Jul 21 00:12:24  Yes.
Jul 21 00:12:42  hmm, that should have prevented timeout.  do you have usbnet enabled?
Jul 21 00:12:50  ie are you trying to manage over wifi or usbnet
Jul 21 00:12:51  woohoo
Jul 21 00:12:57  Wifi
Jul 21 00:13:08  I have the emulator running on gentoo!  NOT ubuntu!
Jul 21 00:13:09  from doing it for a while I strongly recommend usbnet
Jul 21 00:13:34  JackieRipper: congrats!  btw if you want to compare notes,  I think PuffTheMagic does the same
Jul 21 00:13:55  cool
Jul 21 00:14:07  JackieRipper: was it hard to do?
Jul 21 00:14:32  JackieRipper: I'm running Gentoo, how'd you do it?
Jul 21 00:14:34  not too bad... virtual-box is in portage
Jul 21 00:14:50  JackieRipper: and did you get novacomd, etc running so you can palm-install stuff?
Jul 21 00:15:07  destinal: I'll be sure to try usbnet if I get my phone back up and going :)
Jul 21 00:15:12  destinal: not yet
Jul 21 00:15:23  tehnoir: pull out your battery and put it back in, then start her up
Jul 21 00:15:26  The "Pages to be Transferred" page doesn't seem quite up to date. Anybody know where we're at?
Jul 21 00:15:57  tehnoir: Rick__ and Templarian are the guys to talk to
Jul 21 00:15:59  hopspitfire: I installed sun-jdk-1.6, app-emulation/virtualbox-bin, app-emulation/virtualbox-guest-additions and alien
Jul 21 00:16:13  Thanks, rwhitby.
Jul 21 00:16:17  converted the deb to a tar with alien
Jul 21 00:16:24  and untarred in /
Jul 21 00:16:28  JackieRipper: howto's for installing the SDK on other Linux distros would make great wiki pages :-)
Jul 21 00:16:32  destinal: Pulling the battery on my Treo was old hat, but I haven't had to do it yet on the Pre.
Jul 21 00:16:40  What's the best way to get it to pop out?
Jul 21 00:16:43  tehnoir: I'm on GUI Text Editors, I skipped Graphics and Global Search Addons Collection (too time consuming at the moment)
Jul 21 00:16:50  rwhitby: heh... not sure I could reproduce it, but I can try
Jul 21 00:16:56  Thanks, hopspitfire.
Jul 21 00:17:08  yeah, easy enough, turn it over thenfind the clip on the bottom and push it in while pulling the cover forward
Jul 21 00:17:12  (off)
Jul 21 00:17:12  JackieRipper: Sweet, that's pretty awesome.
Jul 21 00:17:14  if anyone uses F5 for their work VPN, here ya go: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/F5VPN
Jul 21 00:17:19  hopspitfire: You still working down the list or are you taking a break for now?
Jul 21 00:17:45  tehnoir: I'm just going to finish up GUI Text Editors, then I'm leaving work and having a nap :)
Jul 21 00:18:11  Ah ha! I pull tab! I feel like an idiot. Thanks, destinal. heh.
Jul 21 00:18:18  Sounds good, hopspitfire.
Jul 21 00:19:05  tehnoir: ah I didn't realize you had the backplate off already lol, yeah the tab's the easy part
Jul 21 00:19:11  hopspitfire: just incase you missed it, can you please not use /'s in page titles Please.
Jul 21 00:19:36  Templarian: I got your message, sorry about that.
Jul 21 00:19:50  There were no rules about it before, so nothing big.
Jul 21 00:20:02  Templarian: I wasn't manually creating pages though, just using the links already provided.
Jul 21 00:20:22  Yea I figured. Most are doing that.
Jul 21 00:21:43  Eguy-angry: why angry?
Jul 21 00:22:57  fine then, be that way :P   I have to drive home anyway.  bbl
Jul 21 00:24:33  greetings
Jul 21 00:24:43  I'll catch you guys later.
Jul 21 00:24:59  I think I'm going to integrate some light JS into the front of the wiki's new main page soon. Try and seperate the (webOS Internals portion of the visitors from the  webOS only people). It will default to the webOS-Internal page of course. http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Main_Page_beta
Jul 21 00:25:37  lol
Jul 21 00:25:44  cuz the url
Jul 21 00:25:48  is webos-internals.org
Jul 21 00:25:50  'just sayin
Jul 21 00:26:24  I know, but the site has quite a bit webOS connect that is pretty much just SDK related now.
Jul 21 00:26:31  thats true
Jul 21 00:26:57  The applications page for instance is huge (while it's may not be SDK, you can't really tell the difference)
Jul 21 00:27:22  Do I need special permissions on predev.wikidot.com to edit pages so I can copy the source?
Jul 21 00:27:43  yeah, edit perms
Jul 21 00:28:10  feel free to just blurt out the password we've moved most pages now lol.
Jul 21 00:28:32 * Templarian uses most litely of course... so many pages.
Jul 21 00:28:32  mmm i dont remember what it is lol
Jul 21 00:28:39  me either... lol
Jul 21 00:29:08  i think its funny that the old site is pw'ded but the new one? not so much
Jul 21 00:29:42  Heh.
Jul 21 00:29:44  raeb: we have a lot more admin control over the new one.
Jul 21 00:30:03  tehnoir: when someone remembers what it is you will be the first to know lol.
Jul 21 00:30:12  Haha. Sounds like a plan.
Jul 21 00:30:33  In the mean time, I'll try to get some actual work done so I don't feel as bad later when I get distracted with copying over the pages.
Jul 21 00:30:53  o
Jul 21 00:31:10  guh i copied some pages
Jul 21 00:31:18  the replacements
Jul 21 00:31:22  sux
Jul 21 00:31:27  could use a nice script for that
Jul 21 00:33:11  sed and awk are two wonderful tools that would make my life so much easier if only I used them frequently enough to remember how to use them.
Jul 21 00:33:15  I've /msg'd tehnoir the pwd
Jul 21 00:33:27  yeah i always wonder if i'm doing it too much
Jul 21 00:33:37  u know multiple awk/sed/grep statmenets
Jul 21 00:33:42  maybe could be combined into less
Jul 21 00:34:01  if someone does write a script, please put it in a repo so that we can all improve on it ...
Jul 21 00:35:18  So um...dumb question.
Jul 21 00:35:33  Now that I have the password, how would I go about giving myself edit perms? :)
Jul 21 00:36:49  tehnoir: use it when creating your account on the wikidot site
Jul 21 00:37:03  On the left column.
Jul 21 00:37:25  Can't give permissions to an existing account?
Jul 21 00:37:50  Oh, I see.
Jul 21 00:38:06  ...maybe.
Jul 21 00:38:14  This is why I really shouldn't quit caffeine.
Jul 21 00:41:31  Templarian: actually, you don't use it when you create your account, you use it to add your already-created account to the predev access list.
Jul 21 00:42:30  raeb: do you have an example?
Jul 21 00:42:54  hey dudes
Jul 21 00:42:57 * JackieRipper has his copy of "sed & awk" right here...
Jul 21 00:43:06  hiya gordian
Jul 21 00:43:16  Yeah, I'm not finding it.
Jul 21 00:43:44  so like an idiot i was following the old wiki instructions to install the arm version of ipkg on my emulator
Jul 21 00:44:28  i know there's now a quicker way to do it
Jul 21 00:44:37  but i just want to undo everything i did
Jul 21 00:46:51  All I'm finding are places that tell me that I'm not an admin, but nowhere to enter a password to give myself edit permissions.
Jul 21 00:51:41  gordian: delete everything under /opt and start again
Jul 21 00:51:57  what's the quickest way to do that?
Jul 21 00:52:10  rm -rf /opt
Jul 21 00:52:27  hah
Jul 21 00:52:29  then run the optware-boostrap.sh script
Jul 21 00:52:34  well problem is i made it to step 7 in the guide
Jul 21 00:52:54  gordian: the script checks to see which steps were already done
Jul 21 00:52:58  so dont i need to get rid of it in fstab?
Jul 21 00:53:07  shouldn't
Jul 21 00:54:06  rm gave me an error that a file was in use
Jul 21 00:54:23  JackieRipper: yeah getting the sdk running on gentoo was cake
Jul 21 00:54:29  ahh yes... dropbear is running
Jul 21 00:54:30  i was thinking of whipping up an ebuild for it in THE overlay
Jul 21 00:54:51  PuffTheMagic: did you get novacomd running, too?
Jul 21 00:55:00  i didnt get my init script working
Jul 21 00:55:07  but yeah i just run it manually
Jul 21 00:55:19  are you running 32 or 64bit?
Jul 21 00:55:23  32bit
Jul 21 00:55:27  ahh
Jul 21 00:55:29  i got rid of the ref in /etc/fstab and now the rm succeeded
Jul 21 00:55:34  kewl
Jul 21 00:55:38  i feel like i know what i'm doing
Jul 21 00:55:41  I'm running 64
Jul 21 00:55:54  Do we even know how to really brick a Pre if we really wanted to try hard enough to do so?  I personally don't.
Jul 21 00:55:56  nice... in  a chroot or do they have 64bit bin too?
Jul 21 00:56:09  just ran it and it seemed to work
Jul 21 00:56:12  no chroot
Jul 21 00:56:18  well the emu is java
Jul 21 00:56:23  so it "should" work
Jul 21 00:56:26  though I just have the emulator running
Jul 21 00:56:35  64bit java, too
Jul 21 00:56:47  sun-jdk-1.6
Jul 21 00:56:50  the sdk useland in virtualbox is 32bit though
Jul 21 00:56:55  yes
Jul 21 00:57:56  so I'm not a java guy at all... how do you start novacomd manually?
Jul 21 00:58:09  java /opt/PalmSDK/0.1/share/jars/novacom.jar or some such?
Jul 21 00:58:53  tehnoir: ah, someone removed the "join this wiki" link on the old wiki
Jul 21 00:59:02  it was something like system:join I think?
Jul 21 00:59:21  how can i manually edit $PATH?
Jul 21 00:59:37  is it in /etc/profile?
Jul 21 01:00:01  Good memory, rwhitby :)
Jul 21 01:00:17  gordian: temporarily for this session, or so it sticks?
Jul 21 01:00:23  so it sticks
Jul 21 01:00:37  I would create a file in /etc/profile.d
Jul 21 01:00:40  i'd just assume eliminate the /opt references in PATH
Jul 21 01:01:00  cool
Jul 21 01:01:01  that's probablt /etc/profile.d/optware
Jul 21 01:01:38  I posted my first vulnerability from  1.0.3  ->>> http://tlhsecurity.blogspot.com/
Jul 21 01:02:29  gordian: our scripts automatically add a file in /etc/profile.d to modify your path
Jul 21 01:03:14  even for the emulator?
Jul 21 01:03:29  yep
Jul 21 01:03:41  cool
Jul 21 01:03:41  same script for both.  it works out what it should do.
Jul 21 01:03:44  i'll just give it a go
Jul 21 01:03:54  JackieRipper: it should be in your path
Jul 21 01:03:56  err
Jul 21 01:03:57  i'm just such a noob that i'd like to be learning
Jul 21 01:03:57  i just run
Jul 21 01:04:02  so i know what i'm doing
Jul 21 01:04:08  Note that you will want to mount a separate virtual disk on the emulator for /opt to give yourself some space.  we don't have a wiki page for that, so please feel free to contribute one.
Jul 21 01:04:10  and not just following mindless instructions
Jul 21 01:04:31  JackieRipper: /opt/Palm/novacom/novacomd
Jul 21 01:04:35  just start that
Jul 21 01:04:43  PuffTheMagic: doesn't exist for me.... hmmmm
Jul 21 01:04:51  did u download that extra package
Jul 21 01:04:59  there was link on the palm page
Jul 21 01:05:09  I don't have /opt/Palm... I have /opt/PalmSDK
Jul 21 01:05:14  right
Jul 21 01:05:16  ohhh no
Jul 21 01:05:18  heh
Jul 21 01:05:22  u only download 1 of2 things then
Jul 21 01:05:48  ' /dev/hdb1 does not exist '
Jul 21 01:05:54  is that a standard error for install on the emu?
Jul 21 01:06:21  i got that error but everything else seemed to complete
Jul 21 01:06:26  ' Setup complete '
Jul 21 01:06:41  PuffTheMagic: did you install virtualbox from palm's site, or from portage?
Jul 21 01:06:49  portage
Jul 21 01:06:51  err
Jul 21 01:06:54  an overlay
Jul 21 01:06:55  actually
Jul 21 01:06:56  im using 3
Jul 21 01:06:58  not 2.x
Jul 21 01:07:31  JackieRipper: http://omploader.org/vMjBkaw
Jul 21 01:07:39  thats novacomd
Jul 21 01:07:50  cd / and untar it
Jul 21 01:09:27  just grabbed it from palm... palm-novacom-0.3-svn177284.tgz
Jul 21 01:09:53  PuffTheMagic: 3.0.2 is in portage
Jul 21 01:10:06  it wasnt a week ago ish then
Jul 21 01:10:08  in the main portage, that is
Jul 21 01:13:32  On the wiki, should [[ text ]] be replaced with 
 text 
? Jul 21 01:14:13 tehnoir: use the Jul 21 01:14:31 Okay. Jul 21 01:15:03 anyone see A2NY lately? Jul 21 01:15:22 ~seen A2NY Jul 21 01:15:24 a2ny was last seen on IRC in channel #webos-internals, 1d 6h 7m 38s ago, saying: 'so i got the location and emailed it to myself'. Jul 21 01:15:42 ~botsnack Jul 21 01:15:43 rwhitby: thanks Jul 21 01:15:45 lol, thanx Jul 21 01:15:53 sup Hammer Jul 21 01:16:05 anyone know much about the actual percentage mod? Jul 21 01:16:25 I was wondering if the puck does trickle charge Jul 21 01:23:49 PuffTheMagic: working great. Thanks! Jul 21 01:25:09 Templarian: did you just change the nav-block Jul 21 01:27:49 ok when i ran the bootstrap script on the emu it didn't prompt me for anything Jul 21 01:29:05 and now sudo throws me an error Jul 21 01:29:15 whats the easiest/best way to install gomebrew on a rooted Pre? Jul 21 01:30:07 SDK and palm-install Jul 21 01:30:14 k, thanx Jul 21 01:30:31 if it requires access to linux to do something as root, use SDK and novaterm Jul 21 01:36:58 aaaaarrrrrrrrrrgggggggg Jul 21 01:37:24 i uninstalled and reinstalled the bloody SDK but everything is the same as it was before the uninstall Jul 21 01:37:30 would the only way to install homebrew through wifi be to copy the ipk to the PRE using sftp then instaal using putty? Jul 21 01:37:38 Well, only got three pages moved over, but now that I've got the hang of it, hopefully I can get a bunch done tomorrow. Jul 21 01:37:54 thank you tehnoir Jul 21 01:37:57 we appriciate it. Jul 21 01:38:08 did you put the redirects in place on the old wiki? Jul 21 01:38:10 Sure thing, Rick__. I appreciate the great wiki you guys have put together :) Jul 21 01:38:26 HebrewzHammer Jul 21 01:38:35 have you stuck sftp on your emu? Jul 21 01:40:07 ? no, i have it rooted, and I use PuTTY to do everything on it. It is just a pain in the butt for me to plug my Pre into my computer b/c I only have one micro usb cable and I use it for the puck and it all tucked away. Jul 21 01:40:32 can u install homebrew through wifi using the sdk? Jul 21 01:40:37 no Jul 21 01:40:40 dam Jul 21 01:40:43 didn't think so Jul 21 01:41:07 i was just gonna use command line in Jul 21 01:41:20 Putty but i forgot the ipk install command Jul 21 01:41:27 HebrewzHammer http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=103&cp_id=10303&cs_id=1030307&p_id=5456&seq=1&format=2 Jul 21 01:41:38 Rick__: lol, thanx Jul 21 01:41:47 i really need to get another cab;e Jul 21 01:42:24 actually, I bought 5 of these http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=103&cp_id=10303&cs_id=1030307&p_id=5457&seq=1&format=2 Jul 21 01:42:29 for 99 cents each Jul 21 01:42:32 they work GREAT Jul 21 01:42:35 one in the laptop bag Jul 21 01:42:40 One on the desk at home Jul 21 01:42:45 one on the desk at work Jul 21 01:42:57 one in the car plugged into the cheap-ass car usb power adaptor Jul 21 01:43:08 one in my suitcase in the road warrier kit. Jul 21 01:43:35 tht way, I never forget and leave a cable behind. I _always_ leave the cables where they are. :-) $5 well spent Jul 21 01:45:38 how can i get the dir structure on the emu back to the default way it was? Jul 21 01:45:46 got it, just used "ipkg-opt install ..." Jul 21 01:45:47 i tried uninstalling and reinstalling but that did not work Jul 21 01:46:02 delete the entire sdk folder and reinstall Jul 21 01:46:17 k Jul 21 01:46:23 HebrewzHammer: for normal webOS apps, "ipkg -o /var install ..." is better Jul 21 01:46:30 damn it all Jul 21 01:46:32 uh, being sure that you deleted the disk images for the vitualbox. Jul 21 01:49:11 gordian http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1650 Jul 21 01:49:25 this is the walk through to be sure you uninstalled everything Jul 21 01:50:19 being able to point to Palm doco is nice. Jul 21 01:50:25 nodnod Jul 21 01:50:39 and note that if you have saved a snapshot in the emulator YOU HAVE TO DISCARD THAT FIRST Jul 21 01:50:45 or you can NOT overwrite the emulator Jul 21 01:50:52 this is a sun virtualbox "feature" Jul 21 01:50:59 and probably what happend to gordian Jul 21 01:51:06 what happened to me? Jul 21 01:51:10 yeah, I struggled with that one for an hour some days ago :-) Jul 21 01:51:45 i've just uninstalled the SDK Jul 21 01:52:07 but there's no SDK dir left on my machine Jul 21 01:52:12 did you delete the palm emulator from virtualbox? Jul 21 01:52:18 because if you didn't it won't overwrite it Jul 21 01:52:32 you have to run virtualbox, and select the palm emulator, and right click and choose delete Jul 21 01:52:33 uninstall virtualbox, and delete it's install dir too Jul 21 01:52:42 shittt Jul 21 01:52:42 and if you have saved a snapshot, then it won't do it. Jul 21 01:53:00 i haven't saved snaps Jul 21 01:53:03 and MINE will not discard the snapshot Jul 21 01:53:07 but i have to uninstall virtualbox? Jul 21 01:53:13 damn it all Jul 21 01:53:14 good. then just delete it FROM WITHIN VIRUTUALBOX and you'll be ok Jul 21 01:53:19 run virtualbox Jul 21 01:53:24 choose the emulator Jul 21 01:53:24 i've just done that Jul 21 01:53:26 and delete it. Jul 21 01:53:29 yeah i did it Jul 21 01:53:32 ok Jul 21 01:53:35 then you're good to go Jul 21 01:53:41 just reinstall? Jul 21 01:53:56 fuck, sorry for being such a noob Jul 21 01:54:20 aright gonna give this another shot Jul 21 01:54:28 brb Jul 21 02:00:15 ok Jul 21 02:00:28 everything on the emu appears to be running normally now Jul 21 02:00:30 back to default Jul 21 02:00:55 my goal is just to install optware, a non root user, sudo, and sftp Jul 21 02:01:12 following the steps on the wiki gets me into trouble Jul 21 02:01:19 everything worked fine on the device itself Jul 21 02:01:39 i just want the emu = device Jul 21 02:01:54 :/ Jul 21 02:03:21 how can i flash the pre? where can i find info on doing that? Jul 21 02:03:50 uh Jul 21 02:03:59 you want to restore the Pre to factory defaults mark__ Jul 21 02:04:01 ??? Jul 21 02:04:29 no, have a webOS.jar file I want to upload to phone Jul 21 02:05:17 which one? Jul 21 02:05:55 oy Jul 21 02:06:04 gordian: when you get to the step of running optware-boostrap.sh on the emulator, let me know and we'll walk through it together Jul 21 02:06:14 ok Jul 21 02:06:46 rwhitby: i'm there Jul 21 02:06:56 i mean, i'm in a putty session and ready to go Jul 21 02:07:09 last time i ran the boostrap though i was never presented with any prompts Jul 21 02:07:35 gordian: wget the latest optware-bootstrap.sh script from the bootstrap gitorious repo Jul 21 02:07:41 just did that Jul 21 02:07:55 then run it with sh -x optware-bootstrap.sh, and be prepared to pastebin the output for me to look at. Jul 21 02:08:09 gordian: have you created a separate virtual disk for /opt ? Jul 21 02:08:16 no Jul 21 02:08:35 mark__ the procedure is here: http://www.palm.com/us/support/downloads/pre/recoverytool/webosdoctor_sprint.html Jul 21 02:08:43 should i ? Jul 21 02:08:51 ehh, too late now anyway Jul 21 02:08:53 assuming you have a good webos.jar, follow those instructions using your jar and you're good to go. Jul 21 02:08:55 I downloaded this one: http://palm.cdnetworks.net/rom/pre_p100eww/webosdoctorp100ewwsprint.jar Jul 21 02:09:05 ok no problem Jul 21 02:09:11 follow those instructions then. Jul 21 02:09:24 but mark__ --- BE AWARE Jul 21 02:09:30 this will TOTALLY ERASE YOUR PHONE Jul 21 02:09:36 so please, if you have photos or something on it Jul 21 02:09:43 BACK THEM UP TO YOUR PC FIRST Jul 21 02:09:43 I just thought it strange that there's absolutly no info on how fo flash it.. Jul 21 02:09:50 OK, that's no problem. Jul 21 02:09:55 there's a full page on the sprint site about it. Jul 21 02:10:04 we just point there, 'cause heck, that's how you do it. Jul 21 02:10:08 rwhitby: Jul 21 02:10:09 anyway to do it from linux? Jul 21 02:10:12 rwhitby: all done Jul 21 02:10:13 gordian: the optware-boostrap.sh script will expect a /dev/hdb1 partition in virtualbox Jul 21 02:10:31 yeah i'm not sure how to do that Jul 21 02:10:34 no diff mark__ run the jar and it will execute. follow the instructions on the sprint site. Jul 21 02:10:38 and i've already run the script Jul 21 02:10:43 the jar is a java executable. Jul 21 02:10:48 gordian: ok, pastebin the output, just for laughs. Jul 21 02:10:51 and i think my putty buffer is set too low to paste all of it Jul 21 02:10:58 OK.. yeah, asked it before I read the site. Jul 21 02:11:10 :/ Jul 21 02:11:56 yipee for Swine Flu! Jul 21 02:12:03 sorry, i warned you i was a noob Jul 21 02:12:09 i have no prob following directions Jul 21 02:12:13 i just wasn't given any Jul 21 02:12:17 :/ Jul 21 02:12:41 rwhitby: want me to uninstall and reinstall again? Jul 21 02:12:48 mark__ if it won't connect to the doctor... turn the phone off and hold the volume up button while turning the phone on. Jul 21 02:12:59 gordian: paste what you've got first Jul 21 02:13:04 k Jul 21 02:13:07 That _always_ works. We have not yet found a pre that won't do that. (well a few required a battery out first...) Jul 21 02:13:24 Rick__: have we converted that page over to the new wiki yet? Jul 21 02:13:37 OK.. trying to figure out a way to get the battery out.. do you just pull that strip? Jul 21 02:13:55 OK, got it Jul 21 02:14:07 then we can link to the Palm user manual for how to get the battery out ;-) Jul 21 02:14:13 rwhitby: http://webos.pastebin.com/m41580138 Jul 21 02:15:21 test Jul 21 02:15:40 finally Jul 21 02:15:40 gordian: what on earth did you do there? Jul 21 02:15:58 i pasted the output Jul 21 02:15:59 hehe Jul 21 02:16:05 gordian: what was the actual single command you typed to run the script? Jul 21 02:16:07 i did exactly as you said Jul 21 02:16:17 sh -x bootstrap.sh Jul 21 02:16:38 and then you took the output from the running of that script and pasted that into webos.pastebin.com and did nothing else? Jul 21 02:16:47 yup Jul 21 02:16:52 I think you pasted the output back into PuTTY Jul 21 02:17:20 ehh shit Jul 21 02:17:24 i might have done that Jul 21 02:17:35 and the script does not create /tmp/optware-bootstrap.sh.log so you did something else too Jul 21 02:17:36 fawk Jul 21 02:17:42 no man Jul 21 02:17:52 gordian: unless you tell me specifically and precisely what you are doing I can't help. simple as that. Jul 21 02:17:53 i literally did the wget Jul 21 02:18:03 then ran sh -x as you said Jul 21 02:18:11 and i keep thinking i need to right click to copy Jul 21 02:18:24 so when i tried to copy first time i actually pasted Jul 21 02:18:27 :x Jul 21 02:18:29 ok, the script does the log. Jul 21 02:18:55 gordian: ok, please paste the contents of the optware-boostrap.sh.log file to webos.pastebin.com and nothing else. Jul 21 02:19:17 ok Jul 21 02:21:35 rwhitby: http://webos.pastebin.com/m7d8963ff Jul 21 02:21:44 sorry to be such a mincer Jul 21 02:21:45 :/ Jul 21 02:21:53 thanks for being patient Jul 21 02:22:30 gordian: ok, that's good. Jul 21 02:22:40 gordian: please tell me the output from "df -k /opt" Jul 21 02:23:01 Filesystem 1k-blocks Used Available Use% Mounted on Jul 21 02:23:09 rootfs 402949 335288 47181 88% / Jul 21 02:23:41 gordian: how about "df -k /var" ? Jul 21 02:24:02 same Jul 21 02:24:05 identical Jul 21 02:24:14 good, that's expected Jul 21 02:24:32 excellent Jul 21 02:24:37 So you have 47MB left on your emulator disk before you need to create a new virtual disk and mount it. Jul 21 02:25:01 ok Jul 21 02:25:04 depending on what you want to do, that might be either plenty of room or a tiny miniscule amount Jul 21 02:25:23 atm it seems like plenty Jul 21 02:25:44 not looking to develop apps, just mod some stock apps Jul 21 02:26:41 ah, if you want to install quilt to mod stock apps in the correct way, you may need more than that. let's try it out, if you're willing to reinstall the emulator if it doesn't work. Jul 21 02:27:18 gordian: get the quilt-boostrap.sh script from the same site, and run it in the same way and pastebin the output Jul 21 02:31:54 * PuffTheMagic has 1gig ext3 loopback image on /media/internal for all his optware Jul 21 02:32:43 ok Jul 21 02:32:47 use the -x switch as well? Jul 21 02:37:37 rwhitby: http://webos.pastebin.com/m1d8e74a1 Jul 21 02:38:51 gordian: that's a run of optware-boostrap.sh Jul 21 02:39:26 seriously mate, you need to following instructions carefully or you're gonna get into a right mess. Jul 21 02:40:25 sorry rwhitby Jul 21 02:40:30 just been a long day Jul 21 02:40:33 i know it's no excuse Jul 21 02:40:39 but thanks for being patient Jul 21 02:44:13 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Tutorials_Linux_opt_on_loopback Jul 21 02:46:04 gordian: got the pastebin of quilt-bootstrap.sh yet? Jul 21 02:46:22 it keeps freezing on "Installing quilt: + ipkg-opt install quilt" Jul 21 02:46:29 restarted the emu a few times Jul 21 02:46:58 the virtual disk shows activity still Jul 21 02:47:03 but it's taking a bloody while Jul 21 02:48:08 PuffTheMagic: yeah, the reason why we don't do that by default is cause it stuffs up the mounting of /media/internal as a USB slave drive for the desktop Jul 21 02:48:26 gordian: it'll take some time - it's big. Jul 21 02:48:42 ok Jul 21 02:48:45 rwhitby: "stuffs up"? Jul 21 02:48:59 there is 7gig free Jul 21 02:49:12 but anyway, i wouldnt expect it as default Jul 21 02:49:24 but its there for those who are gonna go optware crazy Jul 21 02:50:41 PuffTheMagic: yep, going into media access usb mode requires unmounting /media/internal, and your loopback stops that happening, so that user usb mode will no longer work Jul 21 02:52:38 eww Jul 21 02:53:53 that is something that should be noted on the wiki if its not already Jul 21 02:54:18 PuffTheMagic: agreed Jul 21 02:55:00 anyonehere an admin for the new wiki? Jul 21 02:55:48 rwhitby: how does /media/internal get unmounted if its still in use? Jul 21 02:55:53 does it force it something? Jul 21 02:56:25 HebrewzHammer: just state what needs doing on http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Admin_Changes Jul 21 02:56:41 rwhitby: http://webos.pastebin.com/m518b9c15 Jul 21 02:56:43 PuffTheMagic: it doesn't - that's the problem. Jul 21 02:56:55 so i cant go into usb mass storage mode? Jul 21 02:57:21 rwhitby: it was more of a feature request Jul 21 02:57:26 gordian: good, that's successful. df -k again now please Jul 21 02:57:41 HebrewzHammer: just state it in channel here then Jul 21 02:58:23 Filesystem 1k-blocks Used Available Use% Mounted on Jul 21 02:58:24 rootfs 402949 383077 0 100% / Jul 21 02:58:46 bzzt. ran out of room. Jul 21 02:58:57 heh Jul 21 02:59:03 gordian: ok, looks like we need to enforce creating a new virtual disk. Jul 21 02:59:14 btw... did anyone install bash from optware and get it working with ssh Jul 21 02:59:19 it keeps asking me for a passwd Jul 21 02:59:25 when I ssh in Jul 21 02:59:29 ok Jul 21 02:59:32 even though i have ssh key Jul 21 02:59:42 and i probably need to uninstall/reinstall Jul 21 02:59:44 yeah? Jul 21 02:59:49 rwhitby: I was wondering if in "date and time" preferences, a custom format could be chosen. B/c I don't like a 24-hour clock. **** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Jul 21 02:59:57 2009