**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Aug 26 02:59:57 2009
Aug 26 03:00:05 <destinal> first I've heard of foleo
Aug 26 03:00:37 <destinal> Also, what's up with ZepFloyd?
Aug 26 03:01:27 <destinal> anyone else think it is/was intended to be a non-phone webos device ala ipod touch?
Aug 26 03:01:49 <rwhitby> dunno
Aug 26 03:02:09 * rwhitby researches how to do printf in java, being a java newbie
Aug 26 03:02:24 <destinal> I've heard various quiet references among palm folks to gearing up for the "next thing"
Aug 26 03:02:33 <destinal> and it makes me wonder
Aug 26 03:03:17 <egaudet> rwhitby, isn't it system.println("")
Aug 26 03:03:42 <rwhitby> destinal: I've been hoping they were referring to the GSM Pre release
Aug 26 03:04:09 <destinal> Nah, I think the GSM pre is still castle
Aug 26 03:04:29 <destinal> it's not a big enough change that it would have to be a totally different board layout
Aug 26 03:04:44 <destinal> just a bit different really
Aug 26 03:05:05 <destinal> And I'm guessing there will be GSM and CDMA pixies
Aug 26 03:05:31 <destinal> the zepfloyd thing makes me think music player
Aug 26 03:06:02 <destinal> castle, big, imposing,   pixie, tiny, lightweight,   etc
Aug 26 03:07:43 <destinal> and despite what Dieter seems to think, I'm certain they'll have lots of different images for the different castle models
Aug 26 03:07:57 <destinal> the one we have is clearly a sprint image, there will be a new one for bell
Aug 26 03:08:38 <destinal> rwhitby: System.err.println
Aug 26 03:09:02 <rwhitby> ok, so running java-serviceboot manually, and using System.err.println gets me debug printfs from java services
Aug 26 03:09:26 <rwhitby> now to work out why my thread is asleep and not waking up
Aug 26 03:09:48 <atlanta> have a good night guys ttyt
Aug 26 03:10:24 <destinal> atlanta: good night
Aug 26 03:16:21 <JackieRipper> good morning
Aug 26 03:20:56 <HattCzech> any word on the 1.2 release?
Aug 26 03:21:13 <HattCzech> supposedly by the end of the week, right?
Aug 26 03:31:12 <destinal> Rumors point to Thursday but no way to know for sure
Aug 26 03:31:25 <HattCzech> fair enough, rumors is all i expect :)
Aug 26 03:31:56 <HattCzech> destinal, by any chance have you played with background apps?
Aug 26 03:32:48 <psykoz> I dunno what their plans are for 1.2, but I suspect they'll have to be pushing out an update for the phones and their app store changes if they're really going to do a good ecommerce solution
Aug 26 03:32:58 <psykoz> Especially with september around the corner
Aug 26 03:33:06 <HattCzech> yeah, very true
Aug 26 03:46:19 <Ikyo> back to a blank phone....this is going to suck
Aug 26 03:54:39 <tmzt> http://www.intomobile.com/2009/08/25/palm-pre-due-in-uk-on-friday-october-30th-apparently.html
Aug 26 03:54:52 <tmzt> rwhitby: gsm!
Aug 26 03:55:48 <rwhitby> tmzt: just another rumour
Aug 26 03:56:42 <tmzt> ah
Aug 26 03:56:56 <tmzt> hard to track these things
Aug 26 04:03:02 <Rick_away> I got a comment from Palm to expect Othello in the app cat by Sept 9
Aug 26 04:03:08 <Rick_away> I have no idea what THAT means
Aug 26 04:05:20 <rwhitby> Rick_away: so they didn't through the SDK EULA book at you for distrbuting it elsewhere first?
Aug 26 04:05:29 <rwhitby> s/through/throw/
Aug 26 04:05:29 <infobot> rwhitby meant: Rick_away: so they didn't throw the SDK EULA book at you for distrbuting it elsewhere first?
Aug 26 04:10:33 <Rick_away> no
Aug 26 04:11:17 <Rick_away> like everyone else they contacted ME basedon having seen it on the precentral list
Aug 26 04:11:32 <AnOutsider> smart movew
Aug 26 04:11:36 <egaudet_> New keyboard update
Aug 26 04:11:41 <AnOutsider> s/move/move
Aug 26 04:11:49 <AnOutsider> s/movew/move
Aug 26 04:11:50 <AnOutsider> fail
Aug 26 04:11:51 <AnOutsider> lol
Aug 26 04:14:18 <Rick_away> what's it do egaudet_
Aug 26 04:14:20 <Rick_away> ???
Aug 26 04:15:08 <notbenh1> hello all does any one know where I can get a clean copy of usr/lib/luna/system/luna-applauncher/stylesheets/launcher.css (1.1) I was tweaking it to get more icons before I found the patch, seems my backup is not pristine enough as patch still does not apply cleanly post roll back?
Aug 26 04:15:47 <egaudet_> Well i fixed some minor nuisances
Aug 26 04:16:00 <Rick_away> like???
Aug 26 04:16:34 <egaudet_> The dragger was operating inside of the scene's drop container by default operation of the dragger class, that caused ugly things like blank spots in the messaging app background
Aug 26 04:16:46 <Rick_away> ugh
Aug 26 04:16:56 <egaudet_> There was a duplication problem because of the dragger not cleaning up (using the scene drop container by default ruining my element)
Aug 26 04:18:22 <egaudet_> I modified it so that the container is dynamically re-sized when dragging capabilities are activated, and the keyboard content is dragged within my container, not messing with anything in the scene
Aug 26 04:18:58 <egaudet_> You can also now interact with the scene not covered by the keyboard without dismissing the keyboard (e.g. moving text cursor by clicking in text box at position you desire)
Aug 26 04:23:08 <egaudet> Oh and fixed a problem with the keyboard showing some symbols in the tasks app
Aug 26 04:23:26 <egaudet> updated wiki and precentral post
Aug 26 04:29:36 <egaudet> does quick install run postinst?
Aug 26 04:30:00 <rwhitby> egaudet: yes
Aug 26 04:30:10 <rwhitby> it's the only thing currently that does
Aug 26 05:08:51 <tmzt> egaudet: do the webkit patchess explain the scene hierarchy
Aug 26 05:09:32 <tmzt> particularly how ui/chrome is kept in a seperate domain for security purposes, assuming it is
Aug 26 05:11:04 <egaudet> I haven't actually gone through the webkit patch yet
Aug 26 05:11:18 <egaudet> but I probably should
Aug 26 05:11:34 <tmzt> I didn't see anything
Aug 26 05:11:48 <tmzt> but I was looking at plugins/rendering
Aug 26 05:11:52 <tmzt> not that
Aug 26 05:18:39 <psykoz> egaudet, any luck we'll see it work with browser fields?
Aug 26 05:18:57 <psykoz> egaudet, also google maps search, enter button doesn't work there
Aug 26 05:21:01 <egaudet> the web browser fields are handled by the browser adapter plugin, which is a closed binary
Aug 26 05:21:28 <egaudet> and the only method they expose to the Mojo that I can see is inserting a string at the current cursor position for textfields within the web browswer
Aug 26 05:21:31 <egaudet> browser*
Aug 26 05:22:19 <egaudet> That functionality doesn't look like it will be done any time soon.  At this point it looks like a plugin will probably be necessary
Aug 26 05:22:55 <Zuchmir2> destinal, mrvc: while tinkering, i think i found a fix that avoids the need for    addEventListener("keydown", this.onKeyDown, true);
Aug 26 05:23:11 <destinal> Zuchmir2: cool
Aug 26 05:23:15 <egaudet> however, the keyboard now allows interaction with the scene behind it, so you should be able to tap the enter/submit button in the web page without dismissing the virtual keyboard
Aug 26 05:24:15 <destinal> egaudet: I know this may sound crazy but have you thought of making a plugin based on screen keyboard and have your plugin talk to a hidd plugin so you can send real keystrokes to anything?
Aug 26 05:24:23 <Zuchmir2> i think: this.termplugin.setAttribute(Mojo.Gesture.consumesEnterAttribute,true); does it
Aug 26 05:24:56 <Zuchmir2> ... although shift+enter is ignored
Aug 26 05:25:43 <egaudet> destinal, yea I was actually thinking of that the other day when I kept running into issues that would be easily solved if I could get a keystroke generated
Aug 26 05:26:34 <destinal> you'd have to make sure you didn't steal focus somehow and of course we have to work out hidd plugins
Aug 26 05:27:17 <rwhitby> mere implementation details ;-)
Aug 26 05:27:19 <Zuchmir2> the framework has: if(!Mojo.Gesture.handlesReturnKey(selection)||keyupEvent.shiftKey) Event.stop(keyupEvent);
Aug 26 05:27:42 <Zuchmir2> ... in /usr/palm/frameworks/mojo/builtins/palmInitFramework191_15.js
Aug 26 05:27:44 <egaudet> Yes and the keyboard would probably lag a lot less as a plugin
Aug 26 05:28:11 <Zuchmir2> well for all the keys we assume we have focus, so why should enter be diff?
Aug 26 05:29:01 <destinal> Zuchmir2: sorry two different streams of conversation
Aug 26 05:29:10 <destinal> I think you're right re consumesEnterAttribute being it
Aug 26 05:29:20 <Zuchmir2> yeah, just realised, we are both talking about kbd :)
Aug 26 05:29:57 <egaudet> are you considering modifying the framework?
Aug 26 05:30:04 <Zuchmir2> yeah, just tested, and now seeing those messages in plugin
Aug 26 05:30:52 <egaudet> Is it something I can add to the kb patch so we don't conflict?
Aug 26 05:30:53 <destinal> cool, I should have thought of checking the framework earlier for any interesting attributes we hadn't set
Aug 26 05:31:29 <Zuchmir2> but as above shift+enter they will not pass (according to that code)
Aug 26 05:31:43 <destinal> shift enter isn't important IMO
Aug 26 05:31:57 <Zuchmir2> ok, but at least as note in the app
Aug 26 05:32:08 <destinal> egaudet: we're not modifying the framework in this case, just learning of the new attributes we need from it to make term happy
Aug 26 05:32:57 <destinal> Zuchmir2: nice find
Aug 26 05:33:36 <Zuchmir2> .. was also hoping:  this.termplugin.setAttribute("x-palm-cache-plugin", true)   would cause cache of term window after prefs-screen
Aug 26 05:34:16 <Zuchmir2> ... was actually looking for something else, but, yeah nice to find these kinda things
Aug 26 05:35:00 <Zuchmir2> ... the framework refrences 'x-palm-cache-plugin', as well as "nppalmdefs.h"
Aug 26 05:36:05 <egaudet> any desire for the virtual keyboard to work with terminal?
Aug 26 05:36:14 <Zuchmir2> ... also tried:    case npPalmCachePluginValue: *(int *)value = 1;    didn't either help
Aug 26 05:36:40 <Zuchmir2> sure, we were talking about this... although nothing was done
Aug 26 05:37:57 <egaudet> was that sure to my question Zuchmir2?
Aug 26 05:39:30 <Zuchmir2> egaudet: yes
Aug 26 05:40:13 <egaudet> Does the terminal use gesture area for functionality?
Aug 26 05:40:16 <destinal> egaudet: we also wanted to get the regular symbol keyboard working in terminal
Aug 26 05:40:37 <destinal> egaudet: yeah we use gesture as a metakey
Aug 26 05:40:59 <destinal> holding it down is like holding down alt
Aug 26 05:41:08 <destinal> well some alt-like key that isn't alt :PO
Aug 26 05:41:40 <egaudet> what is orange and sym?
Aug 26 05:41:50 <destinal> orange is normal orange, sym is control
Aug 26 05:42:22 <Zuchmir2> ok, just compiled without sendEnter(), it works fine
Aug 26 05:42:34 <destinal> Zuchmir2: excellent, glad to see that hack gone
Aug 26 05:43:21 <egaudet> Well we'd have to think about another way to get the virtual keyboard up, but the symbol popup shouldn't be too hard
Aug 26 05:43:22 <ameng1> destinal:do you figure out how to use hidd?
Aug 26 05:44:22 <Zuchmir2> are you talking about in term, or in general?
Aug 26 05:44:51 <ameng1> general
Aug 26 05:45:26 <destinal> ameng1: not yet, right now there's the one function in a plugin that appears to be a callback table
Aug 26 05:46:01 <egaudet> In your terminal app, what would putting "-webkit-user-modify: read-write" in the style do
Aug 26 05:46:03 <destinal> I'm pretty new to the whole reverse engineering shared libraries thing and it's easier with c++ due to the extra information c++ adds to the binary than with c (which this is)
Aug 26 05:46:13 <Zuchmir2> hmm: ERROR:gitosis.serve.main:Repository read access denied
Aug 26 05:46:26 <Eguy> woohooo what a great bday present.... a working pre!
Aug 26 05:46:30 <Eguy> and preware!
Aug 26 05:47:31 <ameng1> destinal: oh, is the event the browser forward to plugin not enough?
Aug 26 05:48:12 <destinal> ameng1: hidd plugins
Aug 26 05:48:16 <destinal> ameng1: not browser plugin  :)
Aug 26 05:48:29 <ameng1> i know
Aug 26 05:49:06 <ameng1> i mean the plugin window
Aug 26 05:49:09 <destinal> hidd isn't needed for browser plugins in general
Aug 26 05:49:16 <ameng1> i know
Aug 26 05:49:24 <destinal> I guess I'm confused then
Aug 26 05:49:41 <destinal> "is the event the browser forward to plugin not enough" -- I don't understand the context of that question
Aug 26 05:50:07 <ameng1> heh, i mean if the browser plugin window can get all input event
Aug 26 05:50:24 <Zuchmir2> destinal: do i have write access to termplugin on new server?
Aug 26 05:50:39 <Zuchmir2> just pushed terminal, but couldn't push termplugin
Aug 26 05:50:40 <destinal> ameng1: oh yeah, basically everything.
Aug 26 05:51:28 <egaudet> Both the sym and virtual keyboards will only come up if isTextField(element) returns true on the target element when the event happens (i.e. sym key pressed).  isTextField will return true if the the style "-webkit-user-modify" is equal to "read-write"
Aug 26 05:51:46 <destinal> I was thinking of a hidd plugin for a virtual keyboard egaudet was working on mainly
Aug 26 05:52:02 <ameng1> oh, that's enough for my dfb project. i figured out how to do dfb stuff with browser plugin.
Aug 26 05:52:15 <destinal> ameng1: cool.  is it fast enough?
Aug 26 05:52:43 <ameng1> coding now...
Aug 26 05:52:55 <destinal> ameng1: so you'll have some penguins in a plugin soon?  :P
Aug 26 05:53:12 <ameng1> maybe this weekend
Aug 26 05:53:30 <destinal> ameng1: amazing work, I wish I had more time to help this week
Aug 26 05:54:23 <destinal> let me know if you have any questions I can help answer
Aug 26 05:54:27 <rwhitby> Zuchmir2: applications/terminal and plugins/termplugin have the same access list on the new git server
Aug 26 05:54:49 <Zuchmir2> hmm, so why can't i push?
Aug 26 05:54:50 <ameng1> Generally, the plugin and dfb prgrame live in their own process, communicate with unix sockets
Aug 26 05:55:01 <rwhitby> Zuchmir2: I'm debugging further
Aug 26 05:55:10 <ameng1> that mean we need not modify any dfb program's code
Aug 26 05:55:30 <Zuchmir2> ok
Aug 26 05:55:35 <rwhitby> Zuchmir2: what exact URL are you using for termplugin?
Aug 26 05:55:39 <destinal> ameng1: yeah, that's what I was thinking of
Aug 26 05:55:51 <Zuchmir2> git@git.webosinternals.org:applications/termplugin.git master
Aug 26 05:55:56 <destinal> ameng1: palm did something similar with adapters
Aug 26 05:56:03 <rwhitby> Zuchmir2: plugins/termplugin.git
Aug 26 05:56:03 <Zuchmir2> oh, ok, i see the error
Aug 26 05:56:04 <ameng1> oh
Aug 26 05:56:26 <destinal> ameng1: but since they didn't give us code we've had to build our own.  I don't thing theirs uses directfb though
Aug 26 05:56:29 <Zuchmir2> ok, just pushed the plugin
Aug 26 05:56:32 <destinal> this may be better
Aug 26 05:57:09 <ameng1> The dfb need some tmpfs space from their primary surface. and plugin side can read  it into their drawing buffer
Aug 26 05:57:20 <ameng1> for
Aug 26 05:57:51 <egaudet> Where should I start with learning how to write a plugin
Aug 26 05:57:56 <destinal> ameng1: your approach should mean we can just run dfbterm directly
Aug 26 05:58:12 <ameng1> yeah
Aug 26 05:58:34 <destinal> and well, lots and lots of apps
Aug 26 05:58:36 <destinal> :)
Aug 26 05:59:03 <ameng1> yeah ,you kown qt and gtk can be based on dfb
Aug 26 05:59:59 <ameng1> i noticed webos use tmpfs as their /dev, but that's only 2MB. I need to create more
Aug 26 06:00:10 <Ikyo> anyone know which of the patches for alert tones can not be removed?
Aug 26 06:00:25 <egaudet> ok I need some sleep, night all
Aug 26 06:00:46 <destinal> ameng1: in /dev?  for what purpose?
Aug 26 06:01:16 <ameng1> it's a ram fs
Aug 26 06:01:24 <destinal> right, but there's a much bigger one in /tmp
Aug 26 06:02:28 <ameng1> i just looked at the emulator
Aug 26 06:02:47 <ameng1> you mean pre's /tmp is a tmpfs
Aug 26 06:02:50 <destinal> yeah
Aug 26 06:03:05 <ameng1> cool
Aug 26 06:03:16 <destinal> root@castle# df -m
Aug 26 06:03:16 <destinal> tmpfs                       64         0        64   0% /tmp
Aug 26 06:03:55 <ameng1> enough
Aug 26 06:04:28 <destinal> wow, there's also a /media/ram that's 120m I never noticed before...
Aug 26 06:04:40 <destinal> but I'd stick with /tmp if possible
Aug 26 06:04:53 <ameng1> agree
Aug 26 06:05:36 <destinal> egaudet_zzzz: sorry I missed your question on plugins, check out basicplugin in the repository
Aug 26 06:10:59 <ameng1> destinal: your hidd plugin idea is interesting. i wonder if  some input method  program can be implemented via it
Aug 26 06:12:22 <Ikyo> that was a complete pain in the ass
Aug 26 06:12:43 <destinal> yeah I was thinking things like usb keyboards, bluetooth keyboards, external multitouch devices, external accelerometers and other things, as well as maybe the software keyboard program egaudet_zzzz is working on
Aug 26 06:13:40 <ameng1> cool
Aug 26 06:13:50 <destinal> it could be used to make the emulator useful for testing things you can't test right now, for instance
Aug 26 06:14:02 <destinal> there's no light sensor or proximity sensor or multitouch in the emulator today
Aug 26 06:14:13 <destinal> but you could use custom hidd plugins to make them
Aug 26 06:15:43 <destinal> also I have this palm centro bluetooth keyboard that's sitting next to my desk that would be great to interface via bluez and a hidd plugin
Aug 26 06:17:15 <destinal> but for now i need to sleep :)
Aug 26 06:17:25 <ameng1> so you need do some reverse work for the hidd api
Aug 26 06:17:26 <destinal> ameng1: good luck on the directfb hacking
Aug 26 06:17:44 <destinal> ameng1: exactly
Aug 26 06:17:58 <ameng1> ok, good night
Aug 26 06:18:14 <destinal> ameng1: I've started, enough to know that there's one PluginTable function that seems to return a callback table of pointers to functions
Aug 26 06:18:51 <destinal> just have to map that out and then make a test harness
Aug 26 06:19:04 <ameng1> nice and hard job, heh.....
Aug 26 06:19:42 <ameng1> excellent
Aug 26 06:20:03 <destinal> cool, have fun on the plugin / directfb thing, you're making great progress
Aug 26 06:22:15 <tlp> directfb stuff in webOS?
Aug 26 06:22:51 <Ikyo> destinal: do you use the patches to change the alert tones?
Aug 26 06:23:21 <destinal> tlp: ameng1 is working on a directfb system (and eventually input) drivers that talk to a browser plugin which should let us run directfb apps with input and output connected to luna
Aug 26 06:24:37 <destinal> which is way better than the way we're doing it now and lets the app be a separate process also
Aug 26 06:25:32 <destinal> not to mention make it really easy to run (or trivially port) all kinds of cool GUI apps
Aug 26 06:26:06 <tlp> cool
Aug 26 06:27:05 <tlp> do directfb apps work with luna at all right now?
Aug 26 06:27:08 <destinal> Ikyo: no, I haven't sorry
Aug 26 06:27:37 <destinal> tlp: no, you have to kill luna to run directfb apps currently (they'll render direct to the hardware frame buffer)
Aug 26 06:27:43 <tlp> that's what I thought
Aug 26 06:28:04 <tlp> which makes it almost useless :)
Aug 26 06:28:47 <destinal> tlp: yeah, ameng1's concept is to make a virtual framebuffer that's actually sync'd to a browser plugin's display buffer
Aug 26 06:28:53 <tlp> awesome.
Aug 26 06:29:52 <tlp> I guess you might be able to write a script that kills luna, launches your app, and then re-starts it upon completion
Aug 26 06:30:06 <destinal> tlp: yeah, but then you have no phone in between
Aug 26 06:30:14 <tlp> right
Aug 26 06:30:53 <destinal> tlp: I think PuffTheMagic was playing with trying to make a plugin switch virtual consoles and thus make luna share the screen
Aug 26 06:31:02 <destinal> but I think there were problems with that approach
Aug 26 06:31:22 <destinal> don't recall the details
Aug 26 07:12:46 * rwhitby has just got preware to do the rudimentary things required to run postinst scripts
Aug 26 07:16:36 <Ikyo> rwhitby: you are pretty good with JS right?
Aug 26 07:16:43 <rwhitby> Ikyo: nope
Aug 26 07:17:18 <rwhitby> I've written no javascript from scratch ever, and only ever modified about 10 lines total.
Aug 26 07:17:40 <Ikyo> okay, looks like no one else is around eiether
Aug 26 07:17:53 <rwhitby> I've written no java from scratch ever, and only ever modified perhaps a couple of hundred lines total.
Aug 26 07:19:14 <rwhitby> C, Makefile, Scripts, OO Perl - hundreds of thousands of lines, perhaps millions.
Aug 26 07:19:41 <rwhitby> Python, perhaps 500 lines from scratch - want to do more in Python.
Aug 26 07:20:15 <rwhitby> Verilog, VHDL, tens of thousands probably.
Aug 26 07:20:49 <rwhitby> Ikyo: I can read and debug JS though.
Aug 26 07:21:36 <Ikyo> take a look at http://webos.pastebin.com/d3cdafd7f
Aug 26 07:22:15 <Ikyo> I wanted to try and make it a percentage, but I am so tired it keeps dieing.  I was also going to try to do a IF/ELSE on it, but that doesn't work either.
Aug 26 07:22:22 <Ikyo> the width
Aug 26 07:25:20 <rwhitby> yeah, sorry, don't know anything about that.
Aug 26 07:25:50 <Ikyo> thought about removing it and putting it in the stylesheet, but not sure which one it is calling
Aug 26 07:56:28 <rwhitby> Decimation: 0.6.7 in the feeds and fixes the category drop-down regressions
Aug 26 09:24:12 <jauderho> so any preware people on?
Aug 26 09:24:31 <jauderho> what is this "secure consent demo" ?
Aug 26 11:16:00 <rwhitby> jauderho: it gets called when you install something with a prerm or postinst script
Aug 26 12:31:04 <Dogy> Hi can u help me?
Aug 26 12:31:15 <Dogy> Cant connect to palm_emulator using winscp
Aug 26 12:31:23 <Dogy> localhost port:5522 root/root
Aug 26 12:31:25 <Dogy> what to do?
Aug 26 12:31:26 <Dogy> check?
Aug 26 12:37:39 <Dogy> here? anybody?
Aug 26 12:44:30 <atlanta> Good morning
Aug 26 13:27:04 <AnOutsider> mornin
Aug 26 13:28:36 <atlanta> another day another dollar
Aug 26 13:28:52 <AnOutsider> holla
Aug 26 14:01:23 <rwhitby> Preware 0.7.0 is now available, with alpha postinst and prerm support, including secure informed user consent.
Aug 26 14:03:07 <muchtall> So I had kind of a wild idea the other day
Aug 26 14:03:29 <v4lyfe_> where are the service implementation binaries stored on the device's filesystem/
Aug 26 14:03:34 <muchtall> You know how the proximity sensor is IR? Anyone think it would be possible to program an IRDA stack for that?
Aug 26 14:04:37 <rwhitby> v4lyfe_: /usr/lib/luna/java/
Aug 26 14:08:36 <atlanta> Finally found where text messages are stored
Aug 26 14:20:27 * rwhitby bbt
Aug 26 14:27:18 <v4lyfe_> thank you
Aug 26 14:27:38 * atlanta thinking about making a text message backup solution
Aug 26 14:43:43 <destinal> Dogy: I don't know of any way to fix it, it's an issue between WinSCP and VirtualBox's port forwarding
Aug 26 14:44:32 <destinal> rwhitby: nice, will check it out, bang on it, etc
Aug 26 15:03:06 <egaudet_work> http://www.palminfocenter.com/news/9879/palm-pre-webos-virtual-keyboard-install-guide/
Aug 26 15:08:11 <atlanta> egaudet_work: oh lalala nice
Aug 26 15:08:23 <atlanta> anyway we can try some new layouts like spacing etc?
Aug 26 15:08:37 <atlanta> not like we have space to anyway
Aug 26 15:08:38 <atlanta> lol
Aug 26 15:10:18 <atlanta> egaudet_work: did you take out landscape mode?
Aug 26 15:10:27 <egaudet_work> no?
Aug 26 15:12:21 <egaudet_work> There is info on the wiki how to create new themes, in which you could create any images you want for the keys (for example smaller key image inside of a transparent box to give spacing)
Aug 26 15:51:51 <branded> is it me or is github droping a deuce on itself?
Aug 26 15:51:57 <branded> or dropping even
Aug 26 16:13:35 <branded> anyone else experiencing an issue with github?
Aug 26 16:13:37 <branded> :)
Aug 26 16:52:54 <branded> fucking github
Aug 26 16:53:04 <branded> bah!
Aug 26 16:54:21 <atlanta> what problem are you gaving
Aug 26 16:54:50 <AnOutsider> he's gone
Aug 26 16:54:56 <AnOutsider> well ig uess he is too haha
Aug 26 17:12:57 <jettero> lotta you guys use this file coaster application?
Aug 26 17:13:21 <en0x> i used to
Aug 26 17:13:50 <jettero> why did you stop?
Aug 26 17:14:01 <Eguy> backdoor access
Aug 26 17:14:14 <jettero> woah, really?
Aug 26 17:14:19 <Eguy> Preware is way better
Aug 26 17:14:21 <jettero> removing
Aug 26 17:14:22 <AnOutsider> backdoor?
Aug 26 17:14:32 <AnOutsider> I stopped because preware is the shit
Aug 26 17:14:35 <en0x> jettero: because preware is better
Aug 26 17:15:07 <Eguy> Preware made my newly webos dr'd Pre go back to what it was with all my homebrew in less than 20 minutes :D
Aug 26 17:15:17 <en0x> ;D
Aug 26 17:16:00 <jettero> uninstalled
Aug 26 17:16:05 <jettero> ... but seriously, it has a backdoor?
Aug 26 17:16:08 <Eguy> yep
Aug 26 17:16:13 <Eguy> in the service
Aug 26 17:16:14 <jettero> what an asshole
Aug 26 17:16:25 <Eguy> not to mention it is not open source
Aug 26 17:16:29 <jettero> like so he can remotely access your pre? or that it uses to install things?
Aug 26 17:16:48 <en0x> filecoster uses palms service to install apps
Aug 26 17:16:52 <Eguy> I don't think so, I don't know the exact details
Aug 26 17:16:59 <Eguy> rwhitby knows
Aug 26 17:19:15 <Dogy> hi rwhitby...
Aug 26 17:19:43 <Dogy> Is there any other program rather than winSCP connect the emulator/Device ?
Aug 26 17:19:56 <Dogy> for FileTransfer?
Aug 26 17:20:01 <AnOutsider> was it a malicious backdoor by the user? or jsut an insecure service?
Aug 26 17:20:11 <Eguy> pscp
Aug 26 17:20:17 <Eguy> nope, not malicious
Aug 26 17:20:19 <AnOutsider> I dont see it not being opensource as a deterrent though. Some people just don't like having their code out there
Aug 26 17:21:05 <jettero> but then how do you know what it does?
Aug 26 17:21:12 <jettero> I very nearly didn't install it becuase it was obsfucated
Aug 26 17:21:21 <jettero> now I really wish I hadn't. :)
Aug 26 17:21:33 <Eguy> ahhhh I love google voice
Aug 26 17:21:43 <jettero> what app do you use for google voice?
Aug 26 17:22:01 <jettero> I don't see preware on precentral.net ... where do you get that?
Aug 26 17:22:05 <Eguy> gdial pro
Aug 26 17:22:11 <Eguy> the only one that works for me
Aug 26 17:22:29 <gkatsev> yeah, dkgooglevoice doesnt work for me..
Aug 26 17:22:31 <Eguy> http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Application:Preware
Aug 26 17:23:33 <AnOutsider> jettero, if the issue was with the service, it wouldnt have mattered if it were obfuscated or not
Aug 26 17:24:16 <Eguy> I love not having to give out my real phone #'s :D
Aug 26 17:25:40 <gkatsev> mine is (area code)-GKA-TSEV
Aug 26 17:26:00 <Eguy> hahaha
Aug 26 17:26:06 <Eguy> that is pretty 1337 there
Aug 26 17:26:09 * jettero tries all the areacodes
Aug 26 17:26:20 <Dogy> Is there any other program rather than winSCP connect the emulator/Device ?
Aug 26 17:26:20 <Dogy> for FileTransfer?
Aug 26 17:26:21 <gkatsev> heh
Aug 26 17:26:32 <gkatsev> Dogy: pscp, as Eguy said
Aug 26 17:26:48 <jettero> the preware page says you *need* to use webos quick install?  you really can't just use ipkg install file.ipk?
Aug 26 17:26:49 <Dogy> and the port number is 5522?
Aug 26 17:26:51 <gkatsev> Eguy: a friend of mine actually has 1337 as the last 4 digits of his gvoice number
Aug 26 17:26:53 <Eguy> Oh, I should of made that clear
Aug 26 17:27:13 <gkatsev> i brb
Aug 26 17:27:29 <Eguy> gkatsev: I saw a guy with 1337 as his tag on his car, and I also saw n00b
Aug 26 17:27:41 <egaudet_work> jettero, need postinst script to run
Aug 26 17:28:02 <jettero> ipkg supports postinstall scripts..
Aug 26 17:28:05 <jettero> pretty sure...
Aug 26 17:28:05 <en0x> mine is (area code ) 466-9692
Aug 26 17:28:06 <en0x> ;D
Aug 26 17:28:13 <Eguy> Dogy: pscp -scp -P 5522 [file] root@localhost:[dir]
Aug 26 17:28:15 <Dogy> Eguy, cant find it on web
Aug 26 17:28:24 <Dogy> is it in graphic mode?
Aug 26 17:28:28 <Eguy> nope
Aug 26 17:28:30 <Eguy> command line
Aug 26 17:28:30 <egaudet_work> jettero, you can do anything manually from the command-line.  Most users don't know/want to do things from command line
Aug 26 17:28:44 <jettero> I prefer using the commandline...
Aug 26 17:28:50 <Eguy> http://the.earth.li/~sgtatham/putty/latest/x86/pscp.exe
Aug 26 17:28:53 <Dogy> I need to trasfer files from my coputer to the palm folders
Aug 26 17:29:04 <jettero> In fact, I don't htink I need preware at all... just scp the files over and install them
Aug 26 17:29:05 <Dogy> what to use for?
Aug 26 17:29:33 <jettero> oh, the cli method is listed at the bottom
Aug 26 17:29:34 <Dogy> i want it in graphic mode, like regular ftp
Aug 26 17:29:34 <jettero> :)
Aug 26 17:29:38 <Eguy> jettero: why? Preware is so much easier
Aug 26 17:29:55 <Eguy> downloads, installs, erases the ipk
Aug 26 17:30:19 <Dogy> Eguy?
Aug 26 17:30:24 <jettero> I prefer to grab the ipks by hand and look inside them first
Aug 26 17:30:32 <Eguy> ah
Aug 26 17:30:45 <jettero> I'm pretty much going to do that regardless, so preware wouldn't really save me anything
Aug 26 17:30:51 <Eguy> Dogy: well if you want graphic mode, you need winscp
Aug 26 17:31:11 <Eguy> I am lazy so I use preware :D
Aug 26 17:31:13 <Dogy> but winscp
Aug 26 17:31:16 <Eguy> and it shows updates
Aug 26 17:31:36 <Dogy> doesnt work me.. getting always network error: conection refused
Aug 26 17:31:47 <Dogy> cant deal with it any more
Aug 26 17:31:56 <Dogy> got an easy solution for it?
Aug 26 17:32:35 <Eguy> hmm
Aug 26 17:32:47 <Eguy> try doing a pscp tranfer and see if you get the same error
Aug 26 17:32:50 <Eguy> transfer*
Aug 26 17:32:56 <Dogy> want to log in my computer to check it?
Aug 26 17:33:23 <Dogy> check the palm configurations, and the winSCP
Aug 26 17:33:24 <Dogy> ?
Aug 26 17:33:47 <bpadalino|work> which IP are you trying to scp to ?
Aug 26 17:33:51 <bpadalino|work> evdo or local wifi ?
Aug 26 17:33:57 <Dogy> localhost
Aug 26 17:34:05 <Dogy> it's connection to the emulator
Aug 26 17:34:17 <bpadalino|work> ah, emulator
Aug 26 17:34:28 <Dogy> I get connected to it using PUTTY
Aug 26 17:34:39 <Dogy> with the same port number and host
Aug 26 17:35:02 <AnOutsider> Dogy did you try what I suggested yesterday?
Aug 26 17:35:05 <AnOutsider> and use the loopback IP
Aug 26 17:35:16 <Dogy> sorry,
Aug 26 17:35:22 <Dogy> can u repeat it?
Aug 26 17:36:20 <Eguy> I gotta go, hopefully someone else can take over
Aug 26 17:36:33 <Dogy> Thanks...
Aug 26 17:36:41 <Dogy> when u're coming back?
Aug 26 17:36:54 <en0x> tomorrow
Aug 26 17:36:54 <en0x> ;d
Aug 26 17:36:59 <Eguy> hahhha
Aug 26 17:37:03 <Eguy> Late this evening
Aug 26 17:37:05 <Dogy> hhh :->
Aug 26 17:37:14 <Eguy> I didn't get to celebrate my birthday yesterday
Aug 26 17:37:28 <Dogy> Oh.. go to celebrate it
Aug 26 17:37:28 <en0x> thats a bummer
Aug 26 17:37:40 <Eguy> Tonight is the night
Aug 26 17:37:44 <Dogy> Congratulations
Aug 26 17:37:51 <Dogy> how old r u?
Aug 26 17:38:00 <Eguy> 25,000,000,000
Aug 26 17:38:17 <Dogy> :-)
Aug 26 17:38:18 <Eguy> Thank you
Aug 26 17:38:32 <Eguy> I am a bot from the planet zorgtion
Aug 26 17:38:34 <Dogy> So what u'r doing here?
Aug 26 17:38:40 <Dogy> goto party
Aug 26 17:38:53 <Eguy> at 10:30 in the morning?
Aug 26 17:38:54 <Dogy> AnOutsider, can u help me?
Aug 26 17:38:56 <Dogy> hhh..
Aug 26 17:39:00 <oil> only 25000000000?
Aug 26 17:39:05 <en0x> west coast?
Aug 26 17:39:10 <Eguy> Si senior
Aug 26 17:39:19 <en0x> quick question will my pre work in cancun?
Aug 26 17:39:25 <Dogy> So, stay here more few hours and try to help me..
Aug 26 17:39:26 <Eguy> I think so
Aug 26 17:39:27 <Dogy> Ok?
Aug 26 17:39:40 <Eguy> Oh
Aug 26 17:39:46 <Dogy> AnOutsider?
Aug 26 17:39:50 <Eguy> I don't think mexico has cdma
Aug 26 17:40:05 <Dogy> yea, sure.. why not?
Aug 26 17:40:13 <AnOutsider> Yeah you might wanna check sprints coverage maps I guess
Aug 26 17:40:41 <Dogy> AnOutsider?
Aug 26 17:40:53 <Eguy> http://www.cdg.org/worldwide/index.asp
Aug 26 17:40:53 <Dogy> can u repeat about what u suggest me yesterday?
Aug 26 17:40:56 <Dogy> for solution?
Aug 26 17:41:00 <Eguy> list of countries with cdma
Aug 26 17:41:04 <Dogy> roolbackIP and stuff?
Aug 26 17:41:12 <oil> rollbackIP ftw?
Aug 26 17:41:24 <Eguy> Nein, no cdma in mexico
Aug 26 17:41:26 <Dogy> dont know
Aug 26 17:41:29 <Eguy> only gsm
Aug 26 17:41:34 <Dogy> what he told me yesterday
Aug 26 17:42:02 <Dogy> AnOutsider?
Aug 26 17:42:05 <Dogy> u ignore me?
Aug 26 17:42:32 <Eguy> see ya gents
Aug 26 17:42:46 <AnOutsider> my god man
Aug 26 17:42:58 <Eguy> LOL
Aug 26 17:43:00 <AnOutsider> I AM working here, I'm sorry I can't instantly bend to your whim
Aug 26 17:43:09 <Dogy> ok.
Aug 26 17:43:11 * oil wants to see more bending
Aug 26 17:43:11 <Dogy> sorry
Aug 26 17:43:26 <Dogy> can u repeat about ur solution to my problem with winSCP?
Aug 26 17:43:43 <AnOutsider> I suggested you try the loopback ip since localhost doesnt always interpret right
Aug 26 17:43:49 <AnOutsider> i believe it's 127.0.0.1
Aug 26 17:44:01 <AnOutsider> this is if you're trying the emulator
Aug 26 17:44:02 <Dogy> good idea
Aug 26 17:44:42 <Dogy> i'll do that in few minutes
Aug 26 17:45:39 <AnOutsider> it works for me. I had to fight with localhost rejecting my connection
Aug 26 17:46:06 <FreeTim> May I ask about the emulator, do I just use putty to it in the same way? localhost? Same port?  Normally I ssh2 into my physical Pre.
Aug 26 17:47:18 <AnOutsider> yeah
Aug 26 17:47:29 <AnOutsider> go to localhost with root/root on the proper port and you should be good to go
Aug 26 17:48:22 <FreeTim> Thanks, tried port 23 telnet, tried port 222, so far, 8023 next
Aug 26 17:48:48 <egaudet_work> 5522
Aug 26 17:49:06 <AnOutsider> mmhmm
Aug 26 17:50:23 <FreeTim> Yep - thanks all, that worked great with ssh2 on port 5522 - I really appreciate it
Aug 26 17:51:04 <FreeTim> I will add this minor detail to the  /putty   page on wiki
Aug 26 17:51:28 <HattCzech> so i found an interesting way for my app to run in the background...
Aug 26 17:51:36 <Dogy> Where is the definition of which font will be use to each language pack?
Aug 26 17:51:50 <HattCzech> if i don't push my scene in the app controller, i can see that it runs... but it just won't do anything :)
Aug 26 17:55:09 <Dogy> How can I check the SMS application using the emulator..
Aug 26 17:55:11 <Dogy> send
Aug 26 17:55:13 <Dogy> recive?
Aug 26 17:55:14 <Dogy> can I?
Aug 26 17:56:52 <AnOutsider> lol
Aug 26 17:57:10 <Dogy> How to switch between language while texting?
Aug 26 17:57:49 <HattCzech> you can't
Aug 26 17:58:02 <HattCzech> well, at least with checking the SMS
Aug 26 17:58:26 <Dogy> Ok..
Aug 26 17:58:28 <Dogy> what about
Aug 26 17:58:31 <Dogy> Switch between language while texting?
Aug 26 17:58:47 <HattCzech> i'm not aware of that capability, either
Aug 26 17:58:58 <jettero> I'm tempted to change the "castle" hostname...
Aug 26 17:59:03 <jettero> I imagine it'd break things though
Aug 26 17:59:25 <HattCzech> i saw that someone else did, but i didn't care enough :)
Aug 26 18:00:22 <jettero> dunno that it's worth it... castle is a pretty cool name, and it's not like anyone else at my house has a Pre
Aug 26 18:01:40 <psykoz> if changing the host name breaks things
Aug 26 18:01:46 <psykoz> then Palm did something seriously wrong
Aug 26 18:02:07 <jettero> :)(
Aug 26 18:02:22 <jettero> I would tend to agree... but did they really indend for people to get bash on there and use it like a linux box?
Aug 26 18:02:49 <HattCzech> surprisingly, yes, they did
Aug 26 18:03:09 <jettero> :)
Aug 26 18:03:11 <HattCzech> well, i'm not sure to what extent... but they did expect people to use it that way
Aug 26 18:03:12 <jettero> it does seem so
Aug 26 18:03:27 <psykoz> absolutely that was their intention (for developers)
Aug 26 18:06:12 <HattCzech> has anyone played with app-assistant stuff?
Aug 26 18:08:04 <AnOutsider> haha u now my answer to that :(
Aug 26 18:08:39 <HattCzech> yeah, and i made SOME progress, but that was with a dashboard... which i don't really need
Aug 26 18:08:48 <HattCzech> and when the dashboard closes, so does my app :(
Aug 26 18:08:57 <HattCzech> (after the card is closed)
Aug 26 18:13:21 <destinal> psykoz: changing the hostname on the emulator does in fact break things
Aug 26 18:13:29 <psykoz> wow
Aug 26 18:13:38 <psykoz> what if you put castle in /etc/hosts ?
Aug 26 18:13:41 <destinal> there are some hostname checks used to determine if it's on an emulator
Aug 26 18:13:52 <destinal> I don't think anything checks for castle though
Aug 26 18:13:57 <psykoz> gotcha
Aug 26 19:05:38 <HattCzech> anyone here good with sed?
Aug 26 19:06:29 <DraX> HattCzech: what are you trying to do?
Aug 26 19:07:04 <HattCzech> i'm trying to remove a section of text that starts with 'file' and ends with 'html:0'
Aug 26 19:07:21 <HattCzech> this is for debugging... trying to read the logs easier
Aug 26 19:07:37 <DraX> so like /$file(.*)html:0/ ish?
Aug 26 19:07:47 <DraX> m
Aug 26 19:07:48 <DraX> erm
Aug 26 19:07:50 <HattCzech> that might work
Aug 26 19:07:52 <DraX> s/$/^/
Aug 26 19:07:58 <DraX> and throw a $ after the 0
Aug 26 19:08:05 <HattCzech> k
Aug 26 19:08:08 <HattCzech> let met try that
Aug 26 19:09:39 <HattCzech> sed 's/$/^/$file(.*)html:0$//g' ?
Aug 26 19:09:48 <DraX> erm no
Aug 26 19:10:19 <DraX> sed -e (or -E) 's|^file(.*)html:0$||g'
Aug 26 19:10:22 <HattCzech> still trying to get sed figured out... i can only do simple stuff at the moment :)
Aug 26 19:10:25 <muchtall> DraX: Do you have an example line before/after you could share?
Aug 26 19:10:32 <HattCzech> sure...
Aug 26 19:10:52 <muchtall> (What is it with me always getting the wrong named)
Aug 26 19:11:06 <HattCzech> 2009-08-26T19:04:47.701876Z [241167] qemux86 user.info LunaSysMgr: {LunaSysMgrJS} com.palm.hattczech.txtmanager: Info: ==[AppAssistant_handleCommand]==, file:///var/usr/palm/applications/com.palm.hattczech.txtmanager/index.html:0
Aug 26 19:11:25 <HattCzech> and i want to get rid of that last part... with the file:///
Aug 26 19:11:49 <DraX> oh, just do
Aug 26 19:12:04 <DraX> cat log | cut -d, -f1
Aug 26 19:12:35 <HattCzech> the cut will still work with a tail -f, right?
Aug 26 19:12:52 <DraX> should
Aug 26 19:12:56 <muchtall> This works for me... sed 's/.*file:\/\/\(.*\):0.*/\1/g'
Aug 26 19:13:18 <DraX> i prefer to avoid sed if at all possible. :)
Aug 26 19:13:36 <muchtall> Unless you want to include "file://", then...
Aug 26 19:13:55 <muchtall> sed 's/.*\(file:\/\/.*\):0.*/\1/g'
Aug 26 19:13:57 <DraX> so, what kind of audio codec support do these things have?
Aug 26 19:14:14 <HattCzech> you're replacing with a \1... what's that?
Aug 26 19:14:24 <muchtall> \1 is a backreference
Aug 26 19:14:27 <DraX> what's in ()
Aug 26 19:14:30 <DraX> it's the capture of that
Aug 26 19:14:33 <muchtall> it replaces with whatever is in ()
Aug 26 19:14:43 <HattCzech> gotcha
Aug 26 19:14:51 <DraX> regex cause brain damage
Aug 26 19:14:52 <muchtall> If you have 2, then the second is \2 and so on
Aug 26 19:14:57 <HattCzech> okay, so it should work the way programmer's notepad is supposed to work
Aug 26 19:16:08 <HattCzech> sed 's/\(.*\)moretexthere\(.*\)/\1\2/g' would get rid of the 'moretexthere', right? with \1 and \2 being the stuff that was kept?
Aug 26 19:16:17 <muchtall> BTW, if you want to know regex a bit better... http://www.addedbytes.com/cheat-sheets/download/regular-expressions-cheat-sheet-v2.pdf
Aug 26 19:16:27 <DraX> mainya: yeaa should
Aug 26 19:16:37 <DraX> berm
Aug 26 19:16:41 <DraX> HattCzech: ^^^
Aug 26 19:16:46 <DraX> muchtall: look i do it too. :)
Aug 26 19:16:47 <HattCzech> heheh, okay
Aug 26 19:17:04 <HattCzech> i don't even know how you select and do that, i just type people's names :)
Aug 26 19:17:09 <DraX> tab
Aug 26 19:17:18 <DraX> or some irc clients will support like ha: blah blah
Aug 26 19:17:22 <DraX> and do the completion in that case
Aug 26 19:17:36 <HattCzech> ahhh, but how do i change who it selects when i hit 'tab'?
Aug 26 19:17:57 <gkatsev> HattCzech: keep hitting tab untill you get the one you want
Aug 26 19:18:20 <HattCzech> gotcha... just like tab completion for a command window or shell
Aug 26 19:18:22 <HattCzech> sweet
Aug 26 19:18:26 <HattCzech> thanks
Aug 26 19:18:39 <gkatsev> HattCzech: yep, just like it
Aug 26 19:19:40 <DraX> can the pre play ogg, and if not has anyone figured out how to extend the audio service? :)
Aug 26 19:20:23 <gkatsev> DraX: i dont think it can by default
Aug 26 19:24:43 <DraX> I see a page on adding your own java services on the wiki
Aug 26 19:24:52 <DraX> so i guess if nothing else you could add an extra service for playing ogg
Aug 26 19:25:04 <DraX> would be nicer if the audio service could be extended
Aug 26 19:25:07 <DraX> but oh well
Aug 26 19:26:58 <HattCzech> 2009-08-26T19:24:23.605917Z is there an easy way to shorten that date?
Aug 26 19:27:43 <gkatsev> DraX: you also could possibly get something like vlc-nox and output it to /dev/dsp or something in the terminal, lol
Aug 26 19:28:16 <DraX> gkatsev: yes.. i could...
Aug 26 19:28:41 <destinal> gkatsev: or any player that plays in alsa or pulseaudio
Aug 26 19:28:57 <gkatsev> right, was just an example
Aug 26 19:29:38 <destinal> does anyone know how the existing player even works?
Aug 26 19:29:50 * gkatsev touches nose
Aug 26 19:30:07 <DraX> i didn't see anything about it on the wiki
Aug 26 19:30:11 <DraX> dug around for a while
Aug 26 19:30:13 <destinal> service, browser plugin, something else?
Aug 26 19:30:23 <DraX> there is an audio service
Aug 26 19:30:26 <DraX> in the mojo docs
Aug 26 19:30:49 <DraX> http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1741
Aug 26 19:31:36 <DraX> oh, maybe not a proper service
Aug 26 19:31:46 <DraX> seems to use application manager to launch another app
Aug 26 19:32:01 <Ikyo> If I wanted to change the width after this function has been run (http://webos.pastebin.com/d64ddb654) , how what would I put into this.controller.get('?').setwidth
Aug 26 19:32:04 <muchtall> HattCzech: You could try something like: date --date="2009-08-26 19:24:23.605917 Z" +%s
Aug 26 19:32:25 <DraX> can date parse iso8601?
Aug 26 19:33:33 <HattCzech> hahaha, i got it to work with sed, but that's painful :)
Aug 26 19:33:57 <Ikyo> I tried urbar-input and it spits out saying it is null
Aug 26 19:34:17 <HattCzech> muchtall: i'm trying to shorten the date to read the logs easier... would date do that?
Aug 26 19:35:19 <HattCzech> and i just realized my emulator has a weird date...
Aug 26 19:35:46 <destinal> DraX: actually it's unusual, it seems to use application manager to launch a media URL or path directly
Aug 26 19:36:06 <destinal> or well open rather than launch
Aug 26 19:37:02 <destinal> oh actually it does both, the other mechanism can launch com.palm.app.streamingmusicplayer
Aug 26 19:37:07 <HattCzech> slow, but it works... tail -f /var/log/messages | grep txtmanager | cut -d, -f1 | sed 's/\[\(.*\)\] qemux86.*txtmanager: //' | sed 's/\(.*\)T\(.*\)Z //'
Aug 26 19:39:41 <DraX> destinal: yeah i just started reading all the sdk stuff today
Aug 26 19:39:54 <DraX> destinal: i had ignored the pre until about a week ago. :)
Aug 26 19:41:19 <destinal> DraX:  ah, welcome aboard, it's quite amusing to hack on
Aug 26 19:41:34 <HattCzech> hmmm, using sed seems to slow down the log displaying quite a bit... like it waits until after i return to my main scene before outputting to the log... any thoughts on why it might do that?
Aug 26 19:41:37 <DraX> yeah i want one now. :)
Aug 26 19:41:49 <DraX> HattCzech: probably waiting for the buffer to be flushed
Aug 26 19:42:22 <HattCzech> is there a way for it to not wait? :)
Aug 26 19:43:26 <HattCzech> cut works pretty quick... could i use that instead of sed?
Aug 26 19:43:45 <DraX> i prefer cut to sed, because i think regex are a last resort
Aug 26 19:44:57 <HattCzech> let me look up how to use cut...
Aug 26 19:45:18 <egaudet_work> sed & awk are magical
Aug 26 19:45:19 <lmorchard> "Some people, when confronted with a problem, think ``I know, I'll use regular expressions.'' Now they have two problems."
Aug 26 19:45:27 <egaudet_work> lol
Aug 26 19:46:27 <DraX> don't get me wrong, sometimes you need them
Aug 26 19:46:35 <DraX> but, why use them if you don't have to
Aug 26 19:46:47 <HattCzech> heheh, yeah, they are a bit longer than i would like
Aug 26 19:47:24 <HattCzech> 2009-08-26T19:42:38.614200Z [243438] qemux86 user.info LunaSysMgr: {LunaSysMgrJS} com.palm.hattczech.txtmanager: Info: ==[TxtmanagerAssistant_activate]==
Aug 26 19:47:42 <HattCzech> i want to cut EVERYTHING up to Info: ==[
Aug 26 19:48:09 <HattCzech> so all i want to see is 'Info: ==[TxtmanagerAssistant_activate]=='
Aug 26 19:48:25 <DraX> cut -d: -f2-
Aug 26 19:48:28 <lmorchard> cut -d':' -f2-
Aug 26 19:48:30 <lmorchard> heh
Aug 26 19:49:02 <lmorchard> Oh wait, there was a line break there
Aug 26 19:49:16 <destinal> lmorchard: actually that quote originally related to sed, jwz repurposed it for regexes in general
Aug 26 19:49:36 <DraX> lunch!
Aug 26 19:49:37 <lmorchard> might want cut -d: -f5-
Aug 26 19:49:45 <HattCzech> haha, the f2 didn't work... i got the date stuff
Aug 26 19:49:48 <HattCzech> hehehe yeah
Aug 26 19:50:15 <Dogy> Hi
Aug 26 19:50:27 <lmorchard> YEah, regexes have escaped from sed and taken over the rest of the world
Aug 26 19:50:41 <HattCzech> yeah, f5 worked... but now using 2 cut commands is slow as well :/ urg
Aug 26 19:51:17 <HattCzech> would i need to pipe the 2nd cut? or can i do 'cut -d... -d...
Aug 26 19:51:46 <lmorchard> I think you need to pipe
Aug 26 19:52:20 <HattCzech> yeah, sadly, which slows it down
Aug 26 19:52:41 <HattCzech> tradeoff between speed and readability
Aug 26 19:53:49 <lmorchard> hmm.. I've never noticed it to be very slow. can you read that fast? :)
Aug 26 19:54:07 <HattCzech> well, it delays after i do events when i add that 2nd cut
Aug 26 19:54:23 <HattCzech> so i can do like 5 things, go back to the main scene, THEN it shows in the log
Aug 26 19:54:36 <lmorchard> and it doesn't do that without the cuts?
Aug 26 19:54:48 <HattCzech> nope :/
Aug 26 19:54:49 <Dogy> I show that in com.palm.app.phone the keypads (of the numbers) comes without the letters under each number
Aug 26 19:54:56 <Dogy> where it's add?
Aug 26 19:55:08 <Dogy> those letters under each number?
Aug 26 19:55:32 <en0x> what EST time is 1pm PT?
Aug 26 19:55:39 <destinal> en0x: lol
Aug 26 19:55:50 <HattCzech> 4pm, i think?
Aug 26 19:55:54 <en0x> idk
Aug 26 19:55:55 <en0x> :D
Aug 26 19:55:56 <lmorchard> in 5 minutes?
Aug 26 19:56:12 <en0x> Q&A for palm
Aug 26 19:56:15 <HattCzech> it's 2:55pm CST
Aug 26 19:56:16 <destinal> what is the speed of gravity?
Aug 26 19:56:16 <Dogy> ?
Aug 26 19:56:18 <Dogy> ?
Aug 26 19:56:21 <en0x> support starts at 1pm PT
Aug 26 19:56:23 <Dogy> ?
Aug 26 19:56:31 <en0x> via twitter
Aug 26 19:56:44 <Decimation_> 0.7.0: Initial support for post-install and pre-remove scripts, including secure informed user consent. Does not work properly with dependencies yet, so please install dependencies one at a time.
Aug 26 19:56:46 <HattCzech> that's in 5min i believe
Aug 26 19:56:47 <Decimation_> :O:O:O:O:O
Aug 26 19:56:49 <destinal> someone please calculate the radius of a circle for me with a circumference of two meters.
Aug 26 19:57:08 <lmorchard> destinal: Only if you say please and give me a cookie
Aug 26 19:57:31 <HattCzech> which twitter account should i be watching?
Aug 26 19:57:39 <destinal> lmorchard: :)  I'm just commenting on how much everyone's asking in here that either nobody knows or they should google
Aug 26 19:57:45 <en0x> HattCzech: palm
Aug 26 19:57:53 <en0x> HattCzech: http://twitter.com/palm :p
Aug 26 19:57:53 <lmorchard> Oh, yeah, I know.  I'm just random
Aug 26 19:58:17 <HattCzech> will they be answering questions ON twitter? those'll be some short answers ;)
Aug 26 19:58:43 <en0x> HattCzech: thats what they say hahaha
Aug 26 19:58:52 <HattCzech> hahahaha
Aug 26 19:59:34 <en0x> its gonna be like:
Aug 26 19:59:39 <HattCzech> customer support, not development?>
Aug 26 19:59:40 <en0x> Q: fix for aac+?
Aug 26 19:59:43 <en0x> A: no
Aug 26 19:59:43 <en0x> ;P
Aug 26 19:59:52 <en0x> HattCzech: development support
Aug 26 19:59:56 <en0x> or something like that
Aug 26 19:59:59 <destinal> when developing the kind of application you describe, you should make a service call to palm://com.palm.someservice/someMethod oops no room
Aug 26 20:00:05 <destinal> :)
Aug 26 20:00:18 <HattCzech> hahahahahahaha
Aug 26 20:00:21 <gkatsev> 1pm pacific is now, right?
Aug 26 20:00:27 <HattCzech> correct
Aug 26 20:00:43 <gkatsev> sets seesmic desktop to follo @palm
Aug 26 20:01:05 <HattCzech> http://blog.palm.com/palm/2009/08/can-i-tweet-a-friend-regis.html
Aug 26 20:01:24 <HattCzech> "Just send a tweet on any customer support questions or comments you might have to @palm, and Dave will answer as many as he can."
Aug 26 20:02:31 <gkatsev> s/follo/follow/
Aug 26 20:02:31 <infobot> gkatsev meant: sets seesmic desktop to follow @palm
Aug 26 20:02:31 <HattCzech> do the questions begin now?
Aug 26 20:02:39 <gkatsev> HattCzech: i guess so?
Aug 26 20:03:00 <gkatsev> HattCzech: yes, people have started asking questions
Aug 26 20:03:03 <HattCzech> who's going to ask about the wobbly-ness of the original pres? :)
Aug 26 20:03:09 <gkatsev> ooh, voice dialing, good question
Aug 26 20:03:56 <en0x> http://search.twitter.com/search?q=%40palm
Aug 26 20:05:12 <en0x> lol some guy is getting 6hrs of battery life
Aug 26 20:05:56 <HattCzech> hahahah, NOT BAD ;)
Aug 26 20:06:06 <Dogy> Can u help me with my question?
Aug 26 20:06:10 <Dogy> I show that in com.palm.app.phone the keypads (of the numbers) comes without the letters under each number
Aug 26 20:06:35 <Dogy> whre it's add?
Aug 26 20:06:42 <Dogy> those letters under each number?
Aug 26 20:08:25 <tharris> wonder who will ask the security questions =p
Aug 26 20:08:46 <en0x> what security question?
Aug 26 20:09:05 <Dogy> u all ignore me..
Aug 26 20:09:07 <en0x> :}
Aug 26 20:09:26 <Dogy> not funny
Aug 26 20:09:43 <HattCzech> Dogy, look through the source... that's what most of us would do
Aug 26 20:09:54 <Dogy> did looked
Aug 26 20:09:57 <HattCzech> we're not sure, and it'll take us just as much time to figure it out...
Aug 26 20:10:19 <gkatsev> http://twitter.com/hattczech/statuses/3563445102
Aug 26 20:10:45 <HattCzech> hehehe, now if i can get a response, that would be nice
Aug 26 20:10:56 <en0x> lol
Aug 26 20:11:07 <en0x> theres been like 10 questions when we get 1.2
Aug 26 20:11:09 <en0x> lol
Aug 26 20:11:22 <gkatsev> HattCzech: haha, totally didnt notice that it was you
Aug 26 20:11:38 <HattCzech> LOL
Aug 26 20:11:51 <HattCzech> hahhah you were wondering the same thing, or what?
Aug 26 20:12:05 <lmorchard> Palm's going to get swamped if they try to follow those questions
Aug 26 20:12:16 <gkatsev> HattCzech: well, you asked above if anyone will ask, so, i saw someone asking that and posted here
Aug 26 20:12:18 <HattCzech> they already are... and we're only 10min in :)
Aug 26 20:12:26 <HattCzech> ahhh, yeah... hehe
Aug 26 20:13:01 <HattCzech> i figure someone needed to... i'm irritated with that issue... and sprint keeps telling me "they all do that"
Aug 26 20:13:08 <HattCzech> which is BS
Aug 26 20:13:44 <gkatsev> yeah
Aug 26 20:13:56 <Decimation_> rwhitby, oil: so it seems the post-inst support is there finally :D
Aug 26 20:14:05 <en0x> lmorchard: not a lot i thought that tere would be a lot more
Aug 26 20:14:22 <en0x> HattCzech: same shit happened to me
Aug 26 20:14:29 <en0x> they wont replace mine because all of them wiggles
Aug 26 20:14:30 <en0x> :S
Aug 26 20:14:39 <oil> lol @ all those questions
Aug 26 20:15:27 <HattCzech> yeah, but the ones i saw in the store didn't... so i'm just like WTF?
Aug 26 20:15:40 <gkatsev> has palm answered any questions yet? or are they just gonna collect questions for an hour and then follow it with a stream of answers for an hour?
Aug 26 20:16:11 <en0x> they answered one
Aug 26 20:16:13 <gkatsev> i hope they will replace mine, the screen wiggles but it also has a crack
Aug 26 20:16:15 <HattCzech> they've answered a few... vaguely
Aug 26 20:16:22 <HattCzech> http://twitter.com/palm for responses
Aug 26 20:16:55 <Dogy> when I got this line in html code: <div class="pincode-key pincode-glassbutton pincode-zero" id="zero_button_pincode">
Aug 26 20:17:00 <gkatsev> HattCzech: yeah, have @palm and a search for @palm open in seesmic desktop
Aug 26 20:17:02 <en0x> Ringtone customization: may be a small usability issue here. Please consult onboard help on this regarding play vs saving.
Aug 26 20:17:05 <en0x> lol
Aug 26 20:17:15 <Dogy> where is id refere to?
Aug 26 20:17:18 <HattCzech> i'm working on txt sound customization :)
Aug 26 20:17:26 <oil> "Sorry, no updates for now on new products or features."
Aug 26 20:17:40 <HattCzech> en0x: the person you're talking to heard the notification?
Aug 26 20:17:44 <oil> thats going to be the answer to 90% of the questions
Aug 26 20:18:02 <gkatsev> :( seesmic desktop only updated the search...
Aug 26 20:18:11 <Dogy> ????????
Aug 26 20:18:25 <en0x> HattCzech: yes
Aug 26 20:18:35 <oil> whereis id refere to?
Aug 26 20:18:47 <en0x> HattCzech: or it was maybe some random crap
Aug 26 20:19:02 <HattCzech> hmmm, interesting... i don't think i've tested that
Aug 26 20:19:23 <HattCzech> nobody i've talked to has made any comments...
Aug 26 20:20:54 <Dogy> u're not nice today.
Aug 26 20:20:54 <HattCzech> wow... please give us feedback... please go to our support forums... urg... no answers
Aug 26 20:21:10 <oil> you shouldnt be shocked
Aug 26 20:21:25 <HattCzech> hehehe, yeah, i shouldn't be :)
Aug 26 20:22:07 <HattCzech> time to advertise my program! :) hahaha
Aug 26 20:22:45 <en0x>  Exstatica: @palm What kind of soft drink do you give your programmers?
Aug 26 20:22:48 <en0x> r0tfl
Aug 26 20:23:19 <en0x> @jaydiz Notification sounds: We have heard the message loud and clear on this. We know you want it.
Aug 26 20:23:23 <en0x> good they heard
Aug 26 20:23:46 <Dogy> where is the best webOS development forum u know beside precentral.net?
Aug 26 20:23:57 <HattCzech> i responded to jaydiz
Aug 26 20:23:58 <oil> there is another one?
Aug 26 20:24:10 <oil> developer.palm.com?
Aug 26 20:24:13 <HattCzech> developer.palm.com
Aug 26 20:24:26 <Dogy> and they'll answer my questions?
Aug 26 20:24:33 <HattCzech> holy jesus! my app has been downloaded ~6500 times!!!
Aug 26 20:24:34 <oil> maybe?
Aug 26 20:24:52 <ProfJonathan> Good afternoon, all.
Aug 26 20:25:00 <gkatsev> HattCzech: you made the txt manager app? cool
Aug 26 20:25:01 <HattCzech> now if only i could get it to run in the background!!
Aug 26 20:25:14 <Dogy> is it legal to access the root and add / change things?
Aug 26 20:25:23 * ProfJonathan is desperately interested in getting Bluetooth keyboard support running...any word?
Aug 26 20:25:37 <gkatsev> Dogy: "rooting" is legit since the sdk gives you root access
Aug 26 20:25:39 <HattCzech> gkatsev: yeah, still getting some things tweaked... like storage and running in the background
Aug 26 20:25:44 <HattCzech> then i plan to submit it to palm
Aug 26 20:26:13 <oil> though palm probably wont answer your questions about rooting at developer.palm.com
Aug 26 20:26:17 <en0x> ProfJonathan: nothing
Aug 26 20:26:18 <HattCzech> Dogy: and yes, it's legal, most of us have done something to our phones
Aug 26 20:26:18 <Dogy> So I can ask there everything..
Aug 26 20:26:34 <Dogy> So where lese to ask oil?
Aug 26 20:26:40 <HattCzech> i've added a character counter to messaging and changed some images so the phone app is blue
Aug 26 20:26:42 <oil> what?
Aug 26 20:26:42 <Dogy> which good other forum u know?
Aug 26 20:26:47 <oil> i know of no other
Aug 26 20:26:52 <oil> i havent rooted my phone
Aug 26 20:27:00 <Dogy> me also
Aug 26 20:27:08 <HattCzech> oil: why not? :)
Aug 26 20:27:12 <oil> lazyness
Aug 26 20:27:14 <gkatsev> HattCzech: character counter? does txt manager supply that? or is it anothe rpatch?
Aug 26 20:27:16 <ProfJonathan> en0x: Sorry to hear that.
Aug 26 20:27:21 <Dogy> oil?
Aug 26 20:27:24 <oil> what?
Aug 26 20:27:31 <Dogy> where U suggest me?
Aug 26 20:27:31 <HattCzech> it's a patch, since i had to modify the messaging application
Aug 26 20:27:34 <egaudet_work> what is rooted?
Aug 26 20:27:37 <Dogy> another forum to ask
Aug 26 20:27:41 <oil> i have no suggestion
Aug 26 20:27:48 <gkatsev> HattCzech: well, with the newest WQI you dont need to root your phone
Aug 26 20:28:01 <HattCzech> WQI?
Aug 26 20:28:04 * oil has done a few modifications through webosquickisntall
Aug 26 20:28:06 <gkatsev> webos quick install
Aug 26 20:28:10 <HattCzech> gotcha
Aug 26 20:28:19 <oil> the multiple pages / carrier string
Aug 26 20:28:19 <egaudet_work> :sigh:
Aug 26 20:28:23 <gkatsev> HattCzech: is it available via WQI or git?
Aug 26 20:28:26 <oil> (before he added that patches page)
Aug 26 20:28:28 <Dogy> know about forums?
Aug 26 20:28:31 <ProfJonathan> Jason Robitaille has done a great thing with WebOSInstall, by including the patches.
Aug 26 20:28:51 <HattCzech> it's available as a patch... i used diff and patch to do it... ummm, i could probably make it (or someone else could) into a git patch
Aug 26 20:29:05 <egaudet_work> a patch is a patch is a patch
Aug 26 20:29:10 <HattCzech> then it should work
Aug 26 20:29:19 <gkatsev> anyone know if the pre supports wpa2 atm?
Aug 26 20:29:24 <egaudet_work> But please use quilt or backup your files
Aug 26 20:29:31 <en0x> gkatsev: ask palm
Aug 26 20:29:31 <en0x> ;D
Aug 26 20:29:35 <HattCzech> i didn't add any new files, and it modifies maybe like 3 files?
Aug 26 20:29:45 <gkatsev> en0x: yeah, was gonna ask but if someone knew, why bother?
Aug 26 20:29:56 <en0x> i dont
Aug 26 20:30:00 <HattCzech> i wasn't a fan of quilt, but apparently there's a quilt-lite now, so i may not be too against it
Aug 26 20:30:10 <gkatsev> HattCzech: i mean, if it was available from the webos-internals git for patches
Aug 26 20:30:20 <egaudet_work> the good thing about quilt is it backs up your files before touching them
Aug 26 20:30:23 <oil> normal quilt has too many carbs?
Aug 26 20:30:27 <egaudet_work> so you always have a path back to before your patch(es)
Aug 26 20:30:41 <HattCzech> it's on webos-internals, but i don't think it's in the repository...
Aug 26 20:30:52 <HattCzech> oil: WAY TOO MANY carbs
Aug 26 20:30:56 <oil> lol
Aug 26 20:31:12 <HattCzech> if diff and patch works... why bloat it?
Aug 26 20:31:29 <gkatsev> oh, right, its mschapv2 or w/e the standard is which the pre doesnt support atm
Aug 26 20:31:31 <HattCzech> i was working on a shell script to do that stuff... but too many people were using quilt already
Aug 26 20:31:37 <en0x> egaudet_work: u can you patch -R file and it will reverse the patch
Aug 26 20:34:41 <oil> woah
Aug 26 20:35:44 <oil> huh
Aug 26 20:35:54 <en0x> hehe
Aug 26 20:35:55 <egaudet_work> wth
Aug 26 20:36:11 <oil> i just saw like everyone leave except for a few people
Aug 26 20:36:14 <oil> then everyone came back
Aug 26 20:36:30 <gkatsev> oil: netsplit?
Aug 26 20:36:39 <oil> i dont know shit about irc
Aug 26 20:36:48 <HattCzech> yeah, netsplit
Aug 26 20:36:56 <gkatsev> oil: you were probably part of a netsplit
Aug 26 20:37:16 <oil> sounds dangerous
Aug 26 20:38:20 <atlanta> yup yup i split the net
Aug 26 20:38:26 <gkatsev> harmless mostly, just annoying. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netsplit
Aug 26 20:38:41 <oil> yeah, it was a joke
Aug 26 20:38:46 <DraX> splitnode!
Aug 26 20:39:55 * oil is going to see district 9 in a couple hours
Aug 26 20:40:48 <HattCzech> oil: it was a good movie :)
Aug 26 20:41:29 * gkatsev needs to see district 9
Aug 26 20:42:34 <en0x> i want answers to my questions :(
Aug 26 20:42:49 <oil> "Sorry, no updates for now on new products or features."
Aug 26 20:42:58 <Dogy> what about messanger is it supported or not?
Aug 26 20:43:13 <oil> msn?
Aug 26 20:45:14 <HattCzech> gkatsev: here's what i did... http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Patch_Messaging_Character_Counter
Aug 26 20:45:23 <HattCzech> got distracted for a bit, but that's everything
Aug 26 20:46:49 <gkatsev> HattCzech: cool. though, i guess it isnt as useful for me anymore since im using a twitter app and not texting to twitter.
Aug 26 20:47:17 <HattCzech> i just liked seeing when i was about to hit the limit for multiple messages
Aug 26 20:47:32 <egaudet_work> Keep it with the same method as the rest of the patches
Aug 26 20:47:43 <egaudet_work> http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Applying_Patches
Aug 26 20:48:04 <HattCzech> but that requires quilt, which i had a strong dislike towards...
Aug 26 20:48:36 <egaudet_work> But if you are releasing the patch to the public, it should be with supported methods :D
Aug 26 20:49:02 <gkatsev> i could do "quilt import charcounter.patch" and then "quilt push -a", no?
Aug 26 20:49:13 <egaudet_work> sure as long as it accepts -p1
Aug 26 20:49:25 <egaudet_work> which it will, looking at your patch now
Aug 26 20:49:50 <egaudet_work> you can get your patch into the git repo (build it however you like and never use quilt)
Aug 26 20:50:04 <egaudet_work> I don't use quilt to build my patches either, I generate them from git diffs
Aug 26 20:50:10 <HattCzech> okay
Aug 26 20:50:20 <HattCzech> i may do that...
Aug 26 20:50:32 <HattCzech> i'm guessing i would need to register a git account?
Aug 26 20:50:46 <egaudet_work> It's just better for the users that will inevitably use the patches that do not have any knowledge of this stuff ya know
Aug 26 20:51:09 <egaudet_work> http://gitorious.org/webos-internals
Aug 26 20:52:01 <egaudet_work> the modifications repo is where the patches are held, I think for now you would need to make a personal clone on gitorious, push it up there and merge request.  Or talk to rwhitby about pushing
Aug 26 20:54:58 <egaudet_work> wow there are 5 messaging patches heh.  Wonder how many conflict
Aug 26 20:55:45 <HattCzech> hehehe, that's a good question
Aug 26 20:56:01 <HattCzech> if the always show timestamp one is in there... i know that DOES NOT conflict
Aug 26 20:56:05 <gkatsev> well, once you apply a patch, would the other patches not work anymore?
Aug 26 20:56:56 <egaudet_work> gkatsev, depends what lines of what files they touch
Aug 26 20:57:14 <gkatsev> right, and then what order you apply the patches
Aug 26 20:57:35 <egaudet_work> if they don't touch the same line, there is enough context to figure out the line adjustment.  But if tehy touch the same line, then it's one or the other unless one was made based off the other which would mean then you have to do it in specific order
Aug 26 20:57:45 <HattCzech> yeah, there should be an order to the patches or something
Aug 26 20:58:09 <HattCzech> unless they're modifying the same thing, which sucks
Aug 26 20:58:12 <rwhitby> HattCzech: just let me know your username on gitorious, and send me an ssh key for the new server.
Aug 26 20:58:27 <egaudet_work> ideally, but then you have patches that are just flat out incompatible.  Liek for instance say there are 2 patches that do the more apps per row, but one preference is 4 per row the other 5 per row, etc.. etc..
Aug 26 20:58:45 <rwhitby> HattCzech: there are a couple of patches that modify the same thing, and really should be turned into preferences - e.g. week view and month view defaults in calendar
Aug 26 20:59:14 <HattCzech> i haven't registered on gitorious... i'll do that
Aug 26 20:59:59 <HattCzech> i think that was why i got deterred from doing all this patch stuff... TOO MUCH to do :)
Aug 26 21:00:20 <rwhitby> Decimation_: yep, initial version of post-inst support is there - have you tested it?
Aug 26 21:00:32 <egaudet_work> We need to come up with strict patch creation guidelines
Aug 26 21:00:46 <Decimation_> rwhitby: i have it installed, but i don't know what to use to test
Aug 26 21:00:57 <Decimation_> can i just uninstall the terminal and plugin through the preware
Aug 26 21:01:01 <Decimation_> then reinstall and see if it works?
Aug 26 21:01:27 <HattCzech> i lied, i had registered on gitorious
Aug 26 21:01:35 * oil tried to install termplugin but it failed
Aug 26 21:01:41 <egaudet_work> well if postinst isn't working then prerm isnt' working and uninstalling wouldn't tell you if it worked, right?
Aug 26 21:02:01 <gkatsev> i should updated my onscreen keyboard, newest changes look awesome
Aug 26 21:02:35 <egaudet_work> gkatsev, which do you have now.  The current version really cleans things up too, so less bugs and cleaner scene interaction
Aug 26 21:02:55 <egaudet_work> (minor issue being the margin isn't dynamic and thus you can't interact with the scene in the margin just above the keyboard, but will fix that tonight)
Aug 26 21:03:14 <rwhitby> jettero: if you like breaking open ipkgs, you'll love the "View " option for postinst and prerm scripts in Preware :-)
Aug 26 21:03:17 <gkatsev> egaudet_work: i have the version that just added enter and bs. it has the orange key that inputs "orange" when you press it.
Aug 26 21:03:34 <egaudet_work> I am thinking about allowing the virtual keyboard to stay open even after keypresses
Aug 26 21:03:43 <en0x> rwhitby: tell as more about the backdoor in filecoster ;D
Aug 26 21:03:53 <egaudet_work> and have gesture-tap the only dismissal method (aside from card minimize etc..)
Aug 26 21:04:24 <gkatsev> egaudet_work: perhaps add a pref page? ala wifi/location if possible
Aug 26 21:04:32 <rwhitby> Eguy: fileCoaster does not have a backdoor.
Aug 26 21:04:42 <rwhitby> jettero: ^^
Aug 26 21:05:11 <egaudet_work> rwhitby, the messagelandscape.patch modifies email app not messaging app
Aug 26 21:05:21 <egaudet_work> but is in messaging/ directory fy
Aug 26 21:05:23 <egaudet_work> fyi*
Aug 26 21:05:43 <HattCzech> rwhitby: what do i need to do to get this patch uploaded? i'm guessing something involving an ssh key?
Aug 26 21:05:59 <en0x> this shit is bull
Aug 26 21:06:04 <HattCzech> this is why i gave up before ;) my way is easier... create patch... post patch... done
Aug 26 21:06:09 <rwhitby> Decimation_: test it on any service or plugin
Aug 26 21:06:57 * gkatsev -> home
Aug 26 21:06:57 <atlanta> rwhitby: whats the order i should update the package amanger servicer and preware
Aug 26 21:06:58 <atlanta> ?
Aug 26 21:07:00 <egaudet_work> HattCzech, easier for you, not for others that may use it ;)
Aug 26 21:07:02 <rwhitby> HattCzech: see the second half of the Applying_Patches page
Aug 26 21:07:43 <gkatsev> en0x: @palm replied to you
Aug 26 21:07:55 <rwhitby> egaudet_work: I'd say just move it then
Aug 26 21:08:02 <gkatsev> http://twitter.com/palm/statuses/3564539275
Aug 26 21:08:02 <en0x> yeah seen it they answer is a bs
Aug 26 21:08:18 <gkatsev> yeah
Aug 26 21:08:25 <gkatsev> anyway, going home now
Aug 26 21:08:27 <gkatsev> bye, ttyl
Aug 26 21:09:03 <Decimation_> rwhitby: okay, i uninstalled the plugin and it gave me the user consent warning.. and uninstalled fine, but its been about a minute and the terminal app wont uninstall.
Aug 26 21:09:06 <rwhitby> atlanta: service first, then preware, but updating preware with itself may still not be 100% - best to use webos quick install unless you want to be an alpha tester of that functionality
Aug 26 21:09:40 <atlanta> rwhitby: ok yea i use to update it self before it worked but now it wont update itself
Aug 26 21:11:07 <HattCzech> ahh yes, the reason i got irritated before... the openssh thing...
Aug 26 21:11:37 <HattCzech> rwhitby: am i going to have to recreate my patch using quilt methods? or will my charactercounter.patch work fine?
Aug 26 21:12:08 <rwhitby> HattCzech: if you created the patch from / so that the paths are the same as the other patches, it will be fine.
Aug 26 21:12:30 <Zuchmir2> oil: what failed? the install or runing termplugin?
Aug 26 21:12:39 <oil> installing it with preware
Aug 26 21:12:48 <rwhitby> otherwise, do quilt new, then quilt add the files that it touches, then do patch manually, then quilt refresh
Aug 26 21:13:11 * atlanta going to reinstall preware
Aug 26 21:13:15 <rwhitby> oil: which part failed?  Can you watch with dbus-util --capture to see the traffic?
Aug 26 21:13:20 <HattCzech> http://hattczech.homeip.net/webos/scripts/patches/charcounter.patch
Aug 26 21:13:38 <HattCzech> can you tell by looking at that?
Aug 26 21:13:38 <oil> my phone isnt rooted
Aug 26 21:13:39 <rwhitby> HattCzech: perfect
Aug 26 21:13:48 <HattCzech> okay cool
Aug 26 21:13:56 <rwhitby> HattCzech: oh, hang on
Aug 26 21:14:02 <HattCzech> uh oh
Aug 26 21:14:06 <rwhitby> HattCzech: that patch will create files under app-modified
Aug 26 21:14:28 <HattCzech> i can fix that
Aug 26 21:14:33 <rwhitby> if you did app-orig and applications instead, it would be fine
Aug 26 21:14:44 <HattCzech> i can edit that
Aug 26 21:15:31 <rwhitby> the best thing to do then is quilt import that patch, then quilt refresh it, then copy it into the modifications repo and commit and push it
Aug 26 21:15:37 <Decimation__> rwhitby: when you click the "view" button when it alerts you of a script
Aug 26 21:15:40 <Decimation__> it takes you to view it
Aug 26 21:15:50 <Decimation__> but the "okay" and "cancel" buttons don't do anything on that screen
Aug 26 21:16:27 <Decimation__> installing terminal and the plugin worked though.
Aug 26 21:17:36 <HattCzech> refresh it, see if that works
Aug 26 21:21:58 <rwhitby> Decimation__: yeah, the buttons on the view screen aren't working for some reaon.  oil: any ideas?
Aug 26 21:22:09 * oil looks
Aug 26 21:22:38 <oil> note: it still shows up even though visible is false
Aug 26 21:23:25 <rwhitby> what do people think about that screen? should it have OK and Cancel (which do the same as the previous screen, but aren't really marked as such so you have to remember what they do from the previous screen) or should you just swipe back to close a button-less view screen and get back to the previous screen to perform the OK or Cancel ?
Aug 26 21:24:16 <egaudet_work> huh?
Aug 26 21:24:47 <egaudet_work> what screen
Aug 26 21:24:58 <rwhitby> egaudet_work: the view script screen that pops up when you use Preware to install something with a postinst script
Aug 26 21:25:08 <rwhitby> the one Decimation__ is talking about
Aug 26 21:25:15 <egaudet_work> how do i get at it
Aug 26 21:25:26 <rwhitby> try to install or remove termplugin
Aug 26 21:25:29 * egaudet_work really wants a progress bar/pill/anything when updating an app
Aug 26 21:25:47 <atlanta> was just going to say that
Aug 26 21:25:50 <atlanta> a progress bar
Aug 26 21:26:23 <rwhitby> yeah, let's focus on actually getting the things installed properly before working out what feedback to give during the process?
Aug 26 21:26:29 <oil> lol
Aug 26 21:26:31 <atlanta> true
Aug 26 21:26:32 <atlanta> lol
Aug 26 21:26:49 <atlanta> how do we make the alert screen show
Aug 26 21:26:52 <Ikyo> anyone seen JackieRipper lately?
Aug 26 21:26:53 <atlanta> oh nevermin
Aug 26 21:26:56 <atlanta> read up some
Aug 26 21:27:21 <oil> the packageid realy messes up the look of the confirm popup
Aug 26 21:27:25 <atlanta> rwhitby: cant see the bottom line of text
Aug 26 21:27:53 <rwhitby> egaudet_work: accelservice postinst script is an issue at the moment (an issue I've created by restarting the java-serviceboot in the postinst script)
Aug 26 21:28:04 <rwhitby> atlanta: yep, I'm hoping oil knows how to fix that one
Aug 26 21:28:16 <atlanta> :-)
Aug 26 21:28:33 <oil> rwhitby:
Aug 26 21:28:36 <rwhitby> oil: yeah, we need to pass up the name somehow as well as the packageid
Aug 26 21:28:50 <oil> when you copied the confirmCallback from the popup to the script view
Aug 26 21:28:57 <oil> you forgot to chnage the name
Aug 26 21:29:02 <egaudet_work> I have to make an event.d for accelservice
Aug 26 21:29:10 <oil> ConfirmWindowAssistant.prototype.confirmCallback
Aug 26 21:29:12 <oil> needs to be ScriptViewAssistant.
Aug 26 21:29:15 <rwhitby> oil: I didn't copy it :-)
Aug 26 21:29:19 <oil> when in the scripe view assistant
Aug 26 21:29:21 <rwhitby> oil: do you want to fix it or me?
Aug 26 21:29:25 <atlanta> rwhitby: probably stuff you know but ok and cancel button dont work
Aug 26 21:29:35 <oil> atlanta: welcome to the party
Aug 26 21:29:39 <egaudet_work> hey i got tux in a box now :D
Aug 26 21:29:42 <atlanta> oil: lol why thank you
Aug 26 21:30:04 <oil> rwhitby: yeah, with the name, itl look ok
Aug 26 21:30:15 <rwhitby> oil: I'll take a look at the view screen buttons - do you want to review the subscription stuff I added to Preware?
Aug 26 21:30:27 <rwhitby> oil: thx for the pointer on the buttons
Aug 26 21:30:42 <oil> im about to push the fix for it
Aug 26 21:32:01 <rwhitby> ok, I'll revert my changes.
Aug 26 21:33:11 <egaudet_work> ok going home now
Aug 26 21:34:45 <rwhitby> oil: can you pass down the package name as well as the package id when calling install or remove from Preware?
Aug 26 21:34:54 <oil> yeah
Aug 26 21:34:56 <rwhitby> then I can pass it back up to the consent window
Aug 26 21:35:26 <oil> call it, description?
Aug 26 21:35:55 <rwhitby> how about name or title, no need to propagate the strange palm usage of the description field name
Aug 26 21:36:03 <oil> lol
Aug 26 21:36:03 <oil> ok
Aug 26 21:36:05 * atlanta following oil and rwhitby  in git. learning a little something
Aug 26 21:36:14 <oil> lol
Aug 26 21:36:16 <oil> dont learn from me
Aug 26 21:36:19 <oil> i dont know shit about git
Aug 26 21:36:30 <atlanta> i mean coding wise lol
Aug 26 21:36:38 <oil> oh
Aug 26 21:36:42 <atlanta> just seeing how this work logically
Aug 26 21:36:48 <oil> i know a little something about javascript
Aug 26 21:36:49 <oil> lol
Aug 26 21:36:52 <atlanta> lol
Aug 26 21:36:53 <rwhitby> atlanta: don't take my webos coding as any reference, I suck at it.
Aug 26 21:37:10 <atlanta> aww knock it off
Aug 26 21:37:10 <atlanta> lol
Aug 26 21:37:13 <oil> so, title?
Aug 26 21:37:18 <rwhitby> yeah
Aug 26 21:37:41 <atlanta> any good git clients for windows i tried msysgit but it didnt wanna play nice
Aug 26 21:38:11 <rwhitby> oil: for some packages (e.g. "Preware Patch Utility") it will be just as long as the current id - do we need to adjust the script warning text, or adjust the size of the black popup?
Aug 26 21:38:22 <oil> spaces will wrap
Aug 26 21:38:30 <oil> it looks screwed because the id doesnt
Aug 26 21:38:32 <rwhitby> ah, cool.
Aug 26 21:38:38 <oil> so it goes below the warning image
Aug 26 21:38:43 <oil> instead of to the right
Aug 26 21:39:00 <rwhitby> will we still lose the bottom for a really long title?
Aug 26 21:39:08 <oil> if its real long
Aug 26 21:39:27 <oil> if its a problem on the majority, we can make it taller
Aug 26 21:39:34 <rwhitby> can we scroll it?
Aug 26 21:39:55 <oil> when i tried, i couldn't get scrollers to work in the popup
Aug 26 21:40:01 <rwhitby> ok
Aug 26 21:40:02 <oil> or there wouldnt even be a scriptView scene
Aug 26 21:40:06 <oil> it would be right in the popup
Aug 26 21:40:12 <atlanta> wondering is egaudet can make the virtual keyboard show up in the black area
Aug 26 21:40:26 <oil> srsly, popup scene = win
Aug 26 21:41:01 <HattCzech> what should i put as the commit message when submitting, rwhitby?
Aug 26 21:41:26 <HattCzech> (how much detail should i put in there?)
Aug 26 21:41:29 <rwhitby> HattCzech: the function of the patch - please match the filename conventions of the other patches too
Aug 26 21:41:47 <rwhitby> a link to any wiki pages and stuff is good too
Aug 26 21:42:57 <HattCzech> hmmm, didn't add that in there... not sure if it's totally committed yet
Aug 26 21:43:09 <atlanta> oil: think it would be difficult to put it down ther e?
Aug 26 21:43:11 <oil> rwhitby, are you going to pass it to the confirm script as 'title' also?
Aug 26 21:43:19 <rwhitby> yes
Aug 26 21:43:22 <oil> atlanta: idk how the keyboard works
Aug 26 21:43:25 <oil> so i dont know
Aug 26 21:43:29 <atlanta> okie dokie
Aug 26 21:46:02 <HattCzech> push origin master? or just push?
Aug 26 21:47:00 <oil> rwhitby: so i pushed a version of preware that sends the title
Aug 26 21:47:06 <oil> and an update to the confirm all to display the title
Aug 26 21:47:11 <oil> confirm app*
Aug 26 21:47:16 <rwhitby> ok, I'm doing the java now
Aug 26 21:47:55 <HattCzech> rwhitby: do i 'git push origin master' or 'git push' ?
Aug 26 21:50:47 <Ikyo> origin master if it is your first push
Aug 26 21:51:22 <HattCzech> boooo "fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly"
Aug 26 21:51:45 <Ikyo> doing it on your phone?
Aug 26 21:51:55 <HattCzech> no, from my nas
Aug 26 21:52:03 <Ikyo> Did you setup a openssh key for it?
Aug 26 21:52:16 <HattCzech> i setup a key, not sure about openssh
Aug 26 21:52:37 <Ikyo> did you remember to send it to git and also change the email to reflrect the one you registered with?
Aug 26 21:53:30 <Ikyo> The one you generate will probably be something like: root@blah
Aug 26 21:53:42 <Ikyo> you need to change root@blah to what you registered with on git
Aug 26 21:53:53 <HattCzech> ahhh
Aug 26 21:55:14 <HattCzech> uhhh... okay... i need help with this...
Aug 26 21:55:19 <HattCzech> i have the ssh public key
Aug 26 21:55:39 <HattCzech> i changed the admin@NAS to my email
Aug 26 21:56:58 <rwhitby> HattCzech: you need to configure git with your name and email
Aug 26 21:57:06 <rwhitby> and the email address has to match the one on gitorious.org
Aug 26 21:57:30 <HattCzech> i did the git config --global with my info
Aug 26 21:57:32 <rwhitby> the comment at the end of the actual ssh key text is irrelevant
Aug 26 21:57:45 <rwhitby> HattCzech: where are you pushing to?
Aug 26 21:58:02 <rwhitby> oil: 0.7.1 pushed to the feeds
Aug 26 21:58:25 <HattCzech> beats me... following the instructions here...
Aug 26 21:58:36 <HattCzech> http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Applying_Patches#Pushing_the_change_back_to_gitorious.org
Aug 26 21:58:45 <rwhitby> HattCzech: what's your username on gitorious?
Aug 26 21:58:53 <HattCzech> hattczech :)
Aug 26 21:59:00 <HattCzech> not sure if case matters
Aug 26 21:59:52 <HattCzech> just got added to something ;)
Aug 26 22:00:02 <rwhitby> HattCzech: ok, so you've uploaded your ssh public key to the server, and you have the matching private key where you're pushing from, and you've told git the same email address as you gave gitorious?
Aug 26 22:00:12 <HattCzech> yup
Aug 26 22:00:26 <rwhitby> I've now given you push access, so it should work.
Aug 26 22:00:52 <HattCzech> same error... "fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly"
Aug 26 22:01:10 <rwhitby> HattCzech: what does "ssh -v git@gitorious.org" say?
Aug 26 22:01:26 <rwhitby> HattCzech: and did you pull before pushing?
Aug 26 22:01:38 <HattCzech> The authenticity of host 'gitorious.org (87.238.52.168)' can't be established.
Aug 26 22:01:40 <HattCzech> RSA key fingerprint is 7e:af:8d:ec:f0:39:5e:ba:52:16:ce:19:fa:d4:b8:7d.
Aug 26 22:01:41 <HattCzech> Are you sure you want to continue connecting (yes/no)?
Aug 26 22:01:48 <rwhitby> yes
Aug 26 22:01:55 <HattCzech> i didn't use a pull command...
Aug 26 22:02:05 <rwhitby> and what is the exact url that is in your .git/config file?
Aug 26 22:02:46 <HattCzech> git@gitorious.org:webos-internals/modifications.git
Aug 26 22:03:35 <HattCzech> hmmm, my branch master got erased
Aug 26 22:04:10 <HattCzech> does that matter? it was there before... (as described in the tutorial)
Aug 26 22:04:33 <HattCzech> shit, missed the git pull
Aug 26 22:08:08 <Decimation> lol, what...
Aug 26 22:08:16 <Decimation> rwhitby: whats with the new preware update?
Aug 26 22:08:46 <rwhitby> Decimation: read the changelog
Aug 26 22:09:02 <Decimation> 0.7.1: Fixed buttons and title on script view screen.
Aug 26 22:09:05 <Decimation> woot :P
Aug 26 22:09:17 <bpadalino|work> can you update preware inside preware ?
Aug 26 22:09:44 <atlanta> bpadalino|work: it worked a for the updates before now but with the new update it didnt work for me
Aug 26 22:09:51 <atlanta> i had to go in and do it via cli
Aug 26 22:10:05 <Decimation> it used to work for me also...now it doesnt.
Aug 26 22:10:47 <rwhitby> bpadalino|work: once we have "update all" working, it should work.  until then, it may fail if the API between the service and the app changes.
Aug 26 22:11:38 <rwhitby> as you can imaging, updating and restarting the service that is actually managing the updating of the service is a bit tricky ...
Aug 26 22:11:44 <rwhitby> s/imaging/imagine/
Aug 26 22:11:45 <infobot> rwhitby meant: as you can imagine, updating and restarting the service that is actually managing the updating of the service is a bit tricky ...
Aug 26 22:12:42 <rwhitby> In 0.7.1 there was an api change, so it will probably break.
Aug 26 22:12:45 * atlanta trying to figure out why Luna just restarted itself
Aug 26 22:12:57 <rwhitby> need to use quick install for 0.7.1 update
Aug 26 22:13:13 <rwhitby> atlanta: did you look in the postinstall script?
Aug 26 22:13:13 <atlanta> will cli be fine also
Aug 26 22:13:14 <atlanta> ?
Aug 26 22:13:26 <rwhitby> atlanta: yeah, should be
Aug 26 22:13:29 <atlanta> ok cool
Aug 26 22:13:34 <atlanta> give me a second going to upgrade
Aug 26 22:13:34 <atlanta> it
Aug 26 22:13:56 <HattCzech> so ssh -v works... but i still get the error when trying to pull
Aug 26 22:14:35 <Decimation> you know how when you are in cardview.. and you press the background and it makes the cards even smaller
Aug 26 22:14:42 <Decimation> would it be possible when they are that small
Aug 26 22:14:47 <Decimation> to show two rows of them
Aug 26 22:14:51 <Decimation> just to view more at once..
Aug 26 22:15:33 <atlanta> rwhitby: was it me or the ipkg package link wasnt on the wiki
Aug 26 22:15:49 <rwhitby> atlanta: what ipkg link?
Aug 26 22:16:00 <atlanta> for preware
Aug 26 22:16:10 <Decimation> atlanta: go here to download preware/ipkgservice
Aug 26 22:16:10 <Decimation> http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/preware/all/
Aug 26 22:16:43 <atlanta> ok might want to through that up on the wiki
Aug 26 22:18:05 <rwhitby> atlanta: it's in the feed - you don't need to get the ipkg manually
Aug 26 22:18:22 <rwhitby> just ipkg -o /var update on the command line
Aug 26 22:18:31 <rwhitby> and ipkg -o /var upgrade
Aug 26 22:18:49 <rwhitby> doesn't the wiki say that?
Aug 26 22:19:03 <rwhitby> you should never need to refer to an ipk file directly
Aug 26 22:19:25 <rwhitby> that's the whole point ;-)
Aug 26 22:19:36 <atlanta> no no i understand that
Aug 26 22:19:49 <atlanta> im saying the installation of preware is kinda narrow in the wiki
Aug 26 22:20:07 <atlanta> it says install via webos quick install
Aug 26 22:20:10 <atlanta> but doesnt explain how
Aug 26 22:20:21 <HattCzech> yeah, it's very vague
Aug 26 22:20:36 <rwhitby> please feel free to expand it, or link to the quick install usage instructions
Aug 26 22:21:13 <rwhitby> that sort of thing is exactly why you guys get early access to this stuff - you are the guys who are meant to fill in the blanks on the wiki
Aug 26 22:21:27 <atlanta> :-)
Aug 26 22:21:31 <HattCzech> hahahah, oh, so that's how it works :)
Aug 26 22:21:48 <rwhitby> absolutely.
Aug 26 22:22:11 <rwhitby> it's the only way that a community can scale
Aug 26 22:22:14 <atlanta> since i never used webos quick install for preware do they need to download the ipkg from the feed
Aug 26 22:22:14 <atlanta> ?
Aug 26 22:22:52 <rwhitby> click the third button on the right hand side
Aug 26 22:23:17 <rwhitby> select Package Manager Service and Preware
Aug 26 22:23:20 <rwhitby> install
Aug 26 22:23:30 <atlanta> oh ok
Aug 26 22:23:37 <atlanta> will update the wiki in a few
Aug 26 22:24:18 <rwhitby> a future version of quick install will do the dependency automatically, and you'll only need to select Preware and it will install both
Aug 26 22:24:33 <atlanta> ok cool
Aug 26 22:25:02 <rwhitby> the info is already there in the feed metadata, Jason just has to start using it.
Aug 26 22:26:08 <rwhitby> I love how everyone is now saying that "rooting is no longer required" when in fact both installers that can install such advanced homebrew packages specifically still run exactly the same commands as root as were always run, it's just that the user no longer has to type them manually.
Aug 26 22:26:26 <HattCzech> hahha
Aug 26 22:26:53 <rwhitby> exactly the same technology.  add a bit of automation and it can be marketed as a technological breakthrough!
Aug 26 22:27:25 <HattCzech> automation makes things easier :)
Aug 26 22:27:53 <rwhitby> yeah, but you need to get the thing you are automating correct first.
Aug 26 22:28:01 <rwhitby> automating the wrong process is not good ...
Aug 26 22:28:20 <HattCzech> very true
Aug 26 22:29:14 <HattCzech> urg, i wish i could get this app of mine to run in the background... soooo frustrating
Aug 26 22:29:28 <jauderho> rwhitby: I ran the preware install via command line and now i see an icon for secure consent demo. safe to remove?
Aug 26 22:29:54 <rwhitby> no
Aug 26 22:30:10 <rwhitby> if you rescan it should go away
Aug 26 22:30:33 <jauderho> it does not
Aug 26 22:30:43 <jauderho> I tried running rescan a bunch of times
Aug 26 22:30:47 <rwhitby> how about after a reboot?
Aug 26 22:30:48 <jauderho>  Iguess i could reboot
Aug 26 22:30:53 <atlanta> stop luna
Aug 26 22:30:55 <atlanta> and start it
Aug 26 22:31:00 <atlanta> worked for me
Aug 26 22:31:07 <HattCzech> pkill luna
Aug 26 22:31:23 <jauderho> just rebooted.
Aug 26 22:31:46 <jauderho> will report after it comes back.... (after forever)
Aug 26 22:31:51 <jauderho> that boot is seriously sloooow
Aug 26 22:32:19 <atlanta> lol
Aug 26 22:32:24 <atlanta> meet the palm pre
Aug 26 22:32:25 <atlanta> lmao
Aug 26 22:32:30 <rwhitby> yeah, once I actually get a Pre I expect I'll stop telling people to reboot so often ;-)
Aug 26 22:33:10 <jauderho> it just feels wrong to reboot so often under unix/linux =)
Aug 26 22:33:20 <atlanta> stop LunaSysMgr && start LunaSysMgr
Aug 26 22:33:21 <atlanta> works also
Aug 26 22:33:51 <jauderho> okay icon is gone
Aug 26 22:33:52 <rwhitby> HattCzech: did you see my /msg to you?
Aug 26 22:34:05 <HattCzech> yeah, let me do that
Aug 26 22:34:16 <HattCzech> or i could paste it?
Aug 26 22:34:24 <rwhitby> HattCzech: I'd prefer an email
Aug 26 22:34:31 <rwhitby> HattCzech: did your push work?
Aug 26 22:34:38 <jauderho> since there is an update out for preware, is there a "correct" way to update via command line?
Aug 26 22:34:43 <HattCzech> push and pull don't work
Aug 26 22:34:48 <jauderho> just ipkg -o /var update?
Aug 26 22:35:06 <rwhitby> jauderho: then ipkg -o /var upgrade
Aug 26 22:35:15 <rwhitby> then run the postinst script manually
Aug 26 22:35:21 <jauderho> alright
Aug 26 22:35:22 <jauderho> y
Aug 26 22:35:50 <jauderho> BTW has anyone tried vaccuming their sqlite databases?
Aug 26 22:36:34 <jauderho> I tried on a couple copies of databases and it seemed to save anywhere from 10-200k
Aug 26 22:36:37 <jauderho> per db
Aug 26 22:37:39 <atlanta> jauderho: found how to retrieve text messages from it
Aug 26 22:39:02 <HattCzech> rwhitby: sent
Aug 26 22:40:31 <jauderho> cool
Aug 26 22:48:30 <HattCzech> yay firefox crashing :/
Aug 26 23:03:06 <zsoc> So I think I got a live video stream going between 2 pres
Aug 26 23:03:38 <zsoc> of course neither pre knows what's going on, and there's no guis
Aug 26 23:04:07 <zsoc> So in other words, I've done nothing new :<
Aug 26 23:04:15 <destinal> zsoc: heh, still c ool
Aug 26 23:04:26 <destinal> s/c /c/
Aug 26 23:04:27 <infobot> destinal meant: zsoc: heh, still cool
Aug 26 23:04:27 * zsoc thinks he should start playing with the sdk
Aug 26 23:04:51 <zsoc> Hey that's a nifty sed-based script :)
Aug 26 23:05:09 <destinal> jauderho: even 200k per db is small change IMO
Aug 26 23:05:28 <destinal> cool to know though
Aug 26 23:09:36 <zsoc> I have an absolutely ridiculous question, that will show how little I know about the SDK / interactivity of the GUI in general. Is someone ready to field it without me feeling like a complete imbecile?
Aug 26 23:13:50 <atlanta> destinal: got it?
Aug 26 23:15:26 <atlanta> zsoc:
Aug 26 23:15:30 <atlanta> go for it
Aug 26 23:16:31 <destinal>  atlanta: yup
Aug 26 23:16:33 <destinal> :)
Aug 26 23:17:22 <atlanta> :-)
Aug 26 23:17:32 <Decimation> finally - got my windows 7 rtm to think its genuine :D
Aug 26 23:18:14 <zsoc> There are commands I find myself typing regularly into the Terminal app.. for a specific functionality. Would it be a _large leap_ to create an app that had buttons that would run these commands for me? I guess my question is, how difficult is it to have an app that can just run straight shell commands in the background after pressing buttons?
Aug 26 23:18:19 * atlanta is calling micro$oft on Decimation klol
Aug 26 23:18:46 <atlanta> zsoc: Not that hard few guys here have mastered it
Aug 26 23:18:56 <atlanta> they could be of further help
Aug 26 23:19:06 <zsoc> I see.
Aug 26 23:19:10 <atlanta> think creating a service would be the route to go
Aug 26 23:19:20 <zsoc> Makes sense :)
Aug 26 23:19:25 <zsoc> Right, and then throwing commands at it
Aug 26 23:19:34 <atlanta> service request
Aug 26 23:19:34 <atlanta> yup
Aug 26 23:19:40 * Decimation lols at atlanta :D
Aug 26 23:20:03 <destinal> driving home, bbl
Aug 26 23:20:46 <linuxkidd> Hey guys.... accept my apologies if this has been discussed ad-nauseum before...
Aug 26 23:20:49 <Decimation> destinal: meh.. drive and chat :D
Aug 26 23:21:03 <destinal> haha, irssi ftw  (or well ftl maybe)
Aug 26 23:21:11 <linuxkidd> but.... I purpose we put some way to tell what version of code the patches are good for in the quilt git repo
Aug 26 23:21:30 <linuxkidd> specifically, the patch name needs to have a version number in it.
Aug 26 23:23:00 <zsoc> I suppose that makes sense.
Aug 26 23:23:43 <linuxkidd> I've reloaded my Pre 3 times in the past 24 hrs....
Aug 26 23:23:52 <linuxkidd> first one had a dead pixel, so Sprint sent me a new one...
Aug 26 23:23:55 <linuxkidd> loaded that one
Aug 26 23:24:12 <linuxkidd> tweaked WebOS Dr to double my /var for more app install space...
Aug 26 23:24:13 <linuxkidd> flashed
Aug 26 23:24:15 <linuxkidd> loaded again
Aug 26 23:24:37 <linuxkidd> that one had a faulty ear speaker... ( first test call was made with bt earpiece )
Aug 26 23:24:47 <linuxkidd> replaced today.. flashed, reloading now..
Aug 26 23:25:05 <linuxkidd> it's a PITA to figure out what patches work and what don't.. ( aside form try'n and watch'n them crash and burn )
Aug 26 23:25:32 <linuxkidd> </rant>
Aug 26 23:26:46 <zsoc> ouch
Aug 26 23:26:50 <zsoc> my pre is fine :/
Aug 26 23:26:53 <linuxkidd> lol
Aug 26 23:27:05 <zsoc> er, minor charging problems, but i think i caused them
Aug 26 23:27:35 <linuxkidd> i was probably being picky about the 1 dead pixel... but cummon... I know a ton of them have had dead pixels..
Aug 26 23:28:02 <linuxkidd> Didn't think it was gonna go anywhere after my local store told me they don't replace until *25* dead pixels!!!
Aug 26 23:28:27 <zsoc> all products with lcds have a good chance of dead pixels.. replacement for that size screen tho is generally 6. pretty bogus any way you look at it
Aug 26 23:28:36 <zsoc> anyway, amoled will hopefully fix that
Aug 26 23:28:46 <linuxkidd> amoled?
Aug 26 23:29:10 <linuxkidd> am oled... I know oled.. but hadn't heard of am...
Aug 26 23:29:19 <linuxkidd> is that what the ZuneHD is using?
Aug 26 23:29:42 <zsoc> Active-Matrix
Aug 26 23:29:50 <zsoc> there's a samsung phone that has it.. the impression i think
Aug 26 23:29:54 <zsoc> maybe zunehd also
Aug 26 23:31:44 <linuxkidd> gotcha
Aug 26 23:37:14 <branded> Is Mr. Dragon present?
Aug 26 23:37:57 <branded> i have a question that is presumably PM worthy
Aug 26 23:46:02 <rwhitby> zsoc: ping
Aug 26 23:46:18 <zsoc> rwhitby, p..oan..gu?
Aug 26 23:47:16 <rwhitby> zsoc: are you cpcrook?
Aug 26 23:47:55 <zsoc> should i be?
Aug 26 23:48:16 <zsoc> isn't he a john mayer fan?
Aug 26 23:48:21 <rwhitby> I'm looking for Cpcrook who has been writing the video wiki pages, and has the svn repo.
Aug 26 23:50:59 <rwhitby> zsoc: are you contributing to that page or svn repo?
Aug 26 23:51:16 <fritos1406> hello im looking for some help. can anyone help me in resizing the urlbar, i have made it to show on any orientation. Ikyo from precentral has helped me alot but still not luck. anyone?
Aug 26 23:51:42 <zsoc> no.. more like reading it.. then using what i know about gstreamer to bounce ideas of a genius friend of mine.. who suggestions syntax which i try blindly till i get things to sort of work
Aug 26 23:54:26 <zsoc> er.. out of curiosity.. what svn repo?
Aug 27 00:06:00 <zsoc> rwhitby, not sure if i have to mention your name to get your attention :) I suppose this is recursively related to my last question..
Aug 27 00:08:23 <egaudet> i haven't seen cpcrook since he first started that video recording
Aug 27 00:10:27 <rwhitby> zsoc: yeah, I'm developing at the same time, so highlighting is needed.
Aug 27 00:11:46 <zsoc> rwhitby, additional silly question. is needing to contact cpcrook directly related to the svn repo or the gstreamer work? (also, what svn repo?)
Aug 27 00:12:13 <rwhitby> zsoc: both - getting you the repo address now
Aug 27 00:12:30 <rwhitby> http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/VideoRecording
Aug 27 00:12:37 <rwhitby> http://devel.ccrook.com/webos/camcorder
Aug 27 00:12:47 <branded> if i were to say "MSL" what kind of reaction would i get here?
Aug 27 00:13:13 <zsoc> branded, a phone number?
Aug 27 00:13:27 <rwhitby> branded: best to take a look at the policy in the /topic
Aug 27 00:13:39 <branded> rwhitby: thanks!
Aug 27 00:13:59 <zsoc> rwhitby, holy crap. how far along is that little app?
Aug 27 00:14:04 <branded> re: http://forums.precentral.net/showthread.php?p=1848707
Aug 27 00:14:19 <branded> rwhitby: no problem :)
Aug 27 00:14:49 <rwhitby> branded: hmm - policy link has gone missing from topic
Aug 27 00:15:02 <branded> no i see it... do not worry
Aug 27 00:15:12 <branded> done and done
Aug 27 00:15:33 <rwhitby> branded: in general we prefer that "phone carrier transition" discussions happen elsewhere - mobile-files.com seems to be a good place.
Aug 27 00:16:17 <rwhitby> there are legitimate reasons for needing an MSL, but unfortunately there are too many non-legitimate reasons (or dark grey areas) that we don't want all that to swamp the discussion in here (especially when the GSM pre comes out)
Aug 27 00:16:17 <branded> okay cool... yes, it appears to have been... but may not be now... thanks ;)
Aug 27 00:16:20 <zsoc> oh.. right.. well msl's aren't secret... but i get the point :)
Aug 27 00:16:40 <branded> yea i understand man, i'm not into all that... but just want to help this guy out
Aug 27 00:16:57 <rwhitby> any process that your existing cellular carrier is happy to tell you about is fine for discussion here ;-)
Aug 27 00:17:31 <zsoc> rwhitby, er.. that svn repo.. is there a discussion about it anywhere? a forum topic maybe?
Aug 27 00:17:47 <branded> so, can what's the liklihood I'll get my water damaged pre raplaced under warranty?
Aug 27 00:17:48 <rwhitby> zsoc: not that I've found - that's why I'm trying to get in touch with cpcrook
Aug 27 00:17:49 <branded> hah!
Aug 27 00:18:11 <rwhitby> branded: I believe they have a water damage sensor on the PCB
Aug 27 00:18:20 <branded> what's PCB?
Aug 27 00:18:21 <branded> the board?
Aug 27 00:18:24 <rwhitby> yep
Aug 27 00:18:31 <branded> (primary circuit board?)
Aug 27 00:18:42 <branded> humm... too bad
Aug 27 00:18:51 <branded> well, who needed $600 anyway
Aug 27 00:19:32 <zsoc> rwhitby, do you have a specific question about it? looking through it quickly.. it seems pretty legit :) don't see why it wouldn't work. code is simple enough.
Aug 27 00:19:57 <rwhitby> zsoc: oh, it's fully legit - just want to help the guy get his app packaged and into the feeds
Aug 27 00:20:34 <rwhitby> branded: fourth bullet point in step 16 on http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Palm-Pre/809/2
Aug 27 00:20:34 <zsoc> rwhitby, so.. would it be.. inappropriate for me to package it for my personal use?
Aug 27 00:20:55 <rwhitby> zsoc: depends on the licensing of his code
Aug 27 00:21:05 <zsoc> tell rwhit although now that i'm looking at it.. it's going to have the same issue with playback
Aug 27 00:21:09 <rwhitby> (which I haven't looked at yet)
Aug 27 00:21:12 <zsoc> whoops, that was mud syntax, lol.
Aug 27 00:21:27 <zsoc> Yeah, that'll work.. but shouldn't playback on the pre. although should in totem or the like
Aug 27 00:21:36 <branded> rwhitby: oh well.. thanks... i think i may try anyway... it's worth it
Aug 27 00:21:44 <rwhitby> zsoc: anything you've learnt that you can add to that wiki page?
Aug 27 00:21:52 <rwhitby> branded: it's always worth a shot :-)
Aug 27 00:22:19 <rwhitby> branded: just do the doctor on it first, for your privacy and for removing any homebrew modifications
Aug 27 00:22:27 <rwhitby> (if it's still working that is)
Aug 27 00:23:23 <zsoc> rwhitby, it's all sort of.. heresay. just messing with ports and the tcpserversink piping in gstream
Aug 27 00:23:30 <branded> the problem is it won't turn on at all
Aug 27 00:23:38 <branded> i put it in damprid
Aug 27 00:23:41 <branded> no luck
Aug 27 00:23:49 <zsoc> branded, put in a bowl of rice overnight
Aug 27 00:24:01 <branded> the damprid is a diseccant, better than rice
Aug 27 00:24:08 <zsoc> branded, then submerge it in 91% or greater rubbing alchohal (without the battery)
Aug 27 00:24:17 <zsoc> i see
Aug 27 00:24:19 <zsoc> well then, lol
Aug 27 00:24:31 <branded> what is this rubbing alcohol?
Aug 27 00:24:52 <zsoc> high proof rubbing alcohol... both disapates water as well as removing corrosion
Aug 27 00:24:52 <branded> i mean, what does it do/
Aug 27 00:25:15 <branded> i'll see if I can get it replaced under warranty, then try that
Aug 27 00:25:20 <zsoc> :)
Aug 27 00:25:26 <branded> interesting
Aug 27 00:26:16 <Decimation> helloooo
Aug 27 00:26:33 <branded> why don't you go deciminate some information or something
Aug 27 00:26:55 <Decimation> deciminate?
Aug 27 00:26:59 <zsoc> rwhitby, to be honest.. this bud of mine (not really interested in the pre directly) was helping me out with a few things. i'm going to dissect what he told me and try to put it to good use :) then will edit if it makes sense.
Aug 27 00:27:03 <Decimation> thats not my name :P
Aug 27 00:27:05 <branded> or decimate even
Aug 27 00:27:09 <zsoc> disseminate ?
Aug 27 00:27:18 <branded> decimalaltetion
Aug 27 00:27:25 <Decimation> decimate.
Aug 27 00:27:27 <Decimation> simple word.
Aug 27 00:27:32 <Decimation> decimate
Aug 27 00:27:34 <branded> decimal
Aug 27 00:27:39 <Decimation> no, decimate.
Aug 27 00:27:53 <branded> decimolation
Aug 27 00:28:06 <zsoc> decspaminate?
Aug 27 00:28:07 <branded> setting numbers of fire
Aug 27 00:28:22 <Decimation> branded: lolll.
Aug 27 00:30:31 <Decimation> whoa
Aug 27 00:30:33 <Decimation> in the app catalo
Aug 27 00:30:34 <Decimation> g
Aug 27 00:30:51 <Decimation> pandora updated their app
Aug 27 00:30:54 <Decimation> i think
Aug 27 00:31:57 <Decimation> yeah, says 8/26/09 but the version number didnt change
Aug 27 00:33:16 <Decimation> same thing with espn zoom
Aug 27 00:34:10 <zsoc> So.. basically palm reuploaded the same app? :P
Aug 27 00:34:29 <Decimation> it seems so
Aug 27 00:34:43 <Decimation> maybe they are testing stuff for a new app catalog version?
Aug 27 00:35:07 * Decimation knows its is most likely not true, but can still dream.
Aug 27 00:35:20 <rwhitby> zsoc: thanks - it will be good to keep that wiki page up to date with the latest knowledge
Aug 27 00:35:52 <zsoc> It's just very strange that there is no video encoder on the pre that can encode in a format that the pre can play back :P
Aug 27 00:36:10 <zsoc> I'm wondering.. i know there's a bunch of open source mp4 converters.. maybe something that's in the optware repos...
Aug 27 00:37:09 <rwhitby> zsoc: if it's not already in optware, it's reasonably straight forward to add things
Aug 27 00:37:35 <zsoc> rwhitby, cool i'll keep that in mind :) also, if i may ask, what are you working on? and have you published anything that's currently in filecoaster?
Aug 27 00:37:52 <Decimation> filecoasterr... *snickers*
Aug 27 00:38:00 <zsoc> ...
Aug 27 00:38:03 <Eguy> lol
Aug 27 00:38:18 <rwhitby> zsoc: I work on webos-internals.org and preware.org
Aug 27 00:38:32 <zsoc> I don't see how filecoaster is funny...
Aug 27 00:38:38 <Eguy> teehee
Aug 27 00:38:38 <zsoc> rwhitby, ah, web dev :>
Aug 27 00:38:43 <zsoc> ...
Aug 27 00:38:44 <Ikyo> rwhitby doesn't do anything....he hires a ton of people to code for him
Aug 27 00:38:47 <rwhitby> zsoc: nope
Aug 27 00:38:55 <rwhitby> Ikyo: "hire" them and pay them nothing
Aug 27 00:39:00 <Eguy> rwhitby is very lazy, he sits and listens
Aug 27 00:39:04 <Eguy> and makes fun of us
Aug 27 00:39:10 <zsoc> Clearly I'm confused here :(
Aug 27 00:39:11 <Eguy> from his home
Aug 27 00:39:20 <Decimation> he called me fat last week actually.
Aug 27 00:39:21 <Eguy> and points and laughs
Aug 27 00:39:22 <Eguy> :D
Aug 27 00:39:23 <Decimation> it hurt.
Aug 27 00:39:26 <Eguy> hahahah
Aug 27 00:39:58 <Ikyo> what does he expect when we have to code 12 hours a day and don't get exercise
Aug 27 00:40:21 <zsoc> zsoc, i'm going to work on patching zsoc to support a decent mpeg recorder. might be a possibility.
Aug 27 00:40:59 <zsoc> hey, i targeted myself
Aug 27 00:41:02 <zsoc> i'm officially crazy
Aug 27 00:41:41 <Eguy> you are crazy when you type /join webos-internals ;)
Aug 27 00:41:45 <Eguy> hahaha
Aug 27 00:42:25 <rwhitby> zsoc: have a read of www.nslu2-linux.org/presentation.pdf and project that to webos-internals.org
Aug 27 00:42:51 <rwhitby> http://forums.precentral.net/web-os-development/196977-towards-open-interoperable-homebrew-ecosystem.html is what I am currently focused on
Aug 27 00:43:57 <zsoc> rwhitby, I will have a go at that :) also, off the top of your head if you know, does the pre run a fairly standard version of alsa?
Aug 27 00:45:30 <rwhitby> zsoc: the reason for the sniggers about fileCoaster is that Preware is a superset of it's functionality.
Aug 27 00:46:43 <zsoc> rwhitby, yes.. but all the "non techy" preowners I know, have fileCoaster installed ;) just trying to make the point of "commonly used homebrew software" in the context of my question :) but i suppose i get it now
Aug 27 00:46:45 <rwhitby> and preware.org was created specifically to get away from the proprietary package metadata feed paradigm that fileCoaster currently uses with PreCentral (but which will hopefully change soon)
Aug 27 00:47:30 <zsoc> rwhitby, but isn't that "proprietary package metadata feed" the reason why fileCoaster works so well / is kept up to date?
Aug 27 00:47:32 <Decimation> zsoc: preware is just as easy to install as filecoaster
Aug 27 00:47:47 <zsoc> Decimation, I didn't say it was any less easy, just has less user friendly documentation :)
Aug 27 00:47:54 <rwhitby> Decimation: preware is not yet ready for non-techy owners
Aug 27 00:47:56 <Decimation> zsoc: filecoaster just gets data from the precentral feed
Aug 27 00:48:09 <Decimation> rwhitby: no aunt mimmie?
Aug 27 00:48:13 <Eguy> LOL
Aug 27 00:48:16 <Eguy> aunt mimmie
Aug 27 00:48:18 <rwhitby> Decimation: not until 1.0.0
Aug 27 00:48:19 <Eguy> hahahah
Aug 27 00:48:43 <Eguy> I just updated to the new preware a second ago...I love it
Aug 27 00:48:48 <zsoc> rwhitby, also, on the linksys stuff, pretty cool :) i'm pretty familiar with ddwrt myself (Although not half as indepth as what's going on in there)
Aug 27 00:49:00 <rwhitby> zsoc: Preware has access to all homebrew feeds available, PreCentral, PimpMyPre and the three WebOS Internals feeds.  fileCoaster only access the PreCentral feed
Aug 27 00:49:40 <rwhitby> zsoc: donations from the nslu2-linux.org project paid for the hardware at OSUOSL that webos-internals.org is now running on (and which is in the same rack as master.kernel.org)
Aug 27 00:50:12 <rwhitby> zsoc: any package that fileCoaster has access to and can install, Preware can do the same.
Aug 27 00:50:28 <zsoc> rwhitby, I see.. are there any conflicts between using both preware and filecoaster on the same unit? I mean ultimately they are both interacting with ipkg right? just don't open them at the same time lol
Aug 27 00:50:48 <zsoc> rwhitby, also, very cool on the interconnections between projects/servers. good to learn these things :)
Aug 27 00:50:56 <rwhitby> zsoc: but don't get me wrong - fileCoaster holds an important place in the history of Pre homebrew
Aug 27 00:50:58 <Decimation> zsoc: i think since preware uses its own service, there are no problems?
Aug 27 00:51:05 <Eguy> Preware > all
Aug 27 00:51:21 <rwhitby> Eguy: not yet, but soon.
Aug 27 00:51:31 <Eguy> can you update the service from preware rwhitby?
Aug 27 00:51:35 <Decimation> rwhitby: i'd say at this point it is the best.
Aug 27 00:52:12 <rwhitby> zsoc: Preware and fileCoaster can both work at the same time.  Just don't run an install in both at exactly the same moment.
Aug 27 00:52:39 <zsoc> rwhitby, what i figured :) so preware just updated.. er.. recently?
Aug 27 00:52:42 <rwhitby> Eguy: when we get dependencies sorted you will be able to.  Right now, you can if you're lucky, otherwise use quick install.
Aug 27 00:53:09 <rwhitby> zsoc: Preware is under constant open development.  you can watch it happen in this channel :-)
Aug 27 00:53:21 <rwhitby> or follow the git commit log
Aug 27 00:53:57 <zsoc> rwhitby, I see. I don't have a windows machine. So installation would be following the instructions on webos-internals preware page right? I'm just confused because it says to skip steps if running Terminal app, and i don't see why skipping any of those steps would matter in that case
Aug 27 00:54:14 <rwhitby> zsoc: you don't need a windows machine for quick install - it's cross platform
Aug 27 00:54:31 <rwhitby> zsoc: where does it say to skip steps?
Aug 27 00:54:39 <Eguy> Yeah, it didn't work. I got the prompt for the script and nothing happens when I hit ok
Aug 27 00:54:42 <zsoc> rwhitby, at the bottom of the page with the CLI instructions :)
Aug 27 00:54:57 <Decimation> zsoc, just go here and download webos quick install
Aug 27 00:54:58 <Decimation> http://forums.precentral.net/homebrew-apps/194832-webos-quick-install.html
Aug 27 00:55:17 <Decimation> then go here: http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/preware/all/ and download the ipkgservice and preware
Aug 27 00:55:23 <rwhitby> Decimation: NO
Aug 27 00:55:27 <Eguy> LOL
Aug 27 00:55:33 <Decimation> rwhitby: :O
Aug 27 00:55:34 <Eguy> a BIG no from rwhitby
Aug 27 00:55:45 <Decimation> it was all caps, i mustve done something wrong
Aug 27 00:55:46 <Eguy> I could feel the tension from here
Aug 27 00:55:49 <rwhitby> click on the third button on the right in quick install, and it accesses the feeds directly
Aug 27 00:56:04 <Eguy> Oh yes, that is a pretty sweet feature
Aug 27 00:56:05 <Decimation> ahh. forgot quick install had feeds.
Aug 27 00:56:11 <rwhitby> you should never have to manually download an ipkg from preware.org
Aug 27 00:56:25 <rwhitby> that's the whole point of having feeds :-)
Aug 27 00:56:26 <Eguy> I do sometimes if I am too lazy
Aug 27 00:56:33 <Eguy> and install it with terminal
Aug 27 00:56:35 <Eguy> on the pre
Aug 27 00:56:43 <zsoc> rwhitby, but CLI is so much easier :( I actually find it that way and i'm super lazy lol
Aug 27 00:56:55 * oil has to manually download internalz and the filemanager service
Aug 27 00:56:57 <rwhitby> CLI on the Pre accesses the feeds directly too
Aug 27 00:57:02 <Eguy> I really should leave dev mode on
Aug 27 00:57:05 <oil> cause 'rooting' apps aren't in pc's feed
Aug 27 00:57:23 <Eguy> I just got internalz yesterday... it's great
Aug 27 00:57:28 <rwhitby> oil: yeah, I should talk to Jason about adding them to a feed
Aug 27 00:57:43 <rwhitby> Eguy: even with terminal you do *not* need to manually download ipkgs from preware.org
Aug 27 00:57:49 <zsoc> rwhitby, i'm  just confused as to why i should download some java app when i can just run a few lines of code that i mostly understand... is there a good reason?
Aug 27 00:58:02 <Eguy> ah yes, ture
Aug 27 00:58:05 <Eguy> true*
Aug 27 00:58:14 <rwhitby> zsoc: for someone like you, as long as you remember to run the postinst there is no reason.
Aug 27 00:59:23 <rwhitby> those CLI instructions are wrong for the emulator too
Aug 27 00:59:33 <rwhitby> needs to be i686 instead of armv7 for the emulator
Aug 27 00:59:52 <rwhitby> and no need to remount, since the emulator is always rw
Aug 27 01:08:54 <oil> preware still doesn't install termplugin on my pre ;(
Aug 27 01:09:00 <oil> but
Aug 27 01:09:01 <zsoc> rwhitby, hm.. what exactly does that postinst script do, anyway?
Aug 27 01:09:05 <oil> neither does quickinstall, so whatever
Aug 27 01:09:31 <rwhitby> zsoc: a postinst script can do anything.  it's a shell script - have a read.
Aug 27 01:09:54 <rwhitby> in essence, anything outside of /var has to be done in a postinst script
Aug 27 01:09:56 <zsoc> rwhitby, .. er.. i see you have a high opinion of me.. heh. i mean what does _that one_ do :)
Aug 27 01:10:17 <rwhitby> zsoc: well, you're a cli man, so you must be able to read shell scripts ;-)
Aug 27 01:10:34 <zsoc> rwhitby, yes, but i was curious while waiting for it to .. er.. do whatever it's doing. :P
Aug 27 01:11:03 <rwhitby> it's need to slot the new service into webOS
Aug 27 01:11:47 <zsoc> well it broke ssh :P i suppose i shouldn't have run it not being connected and all. script ran fine.. just seemed to reset the transmitter in the phone, among other things
Aug 27 01:13:15 <rwhitby> zsoc: another reason to use quick install - it only works over usb :-)
Aug 27 01:13:59 <zsoc> rwhitby, Maybe I should make a note... the postinst script resets something involving the ppp0 connection.. so if you're on ssh you'll have to exit and reconnect to do the rescan etc :)
Aug 27 01:14:14 <zsoc> preware looks.. very good.
Aug 27 01:14:27 <rwhitby> yep, connectionmanager is a service, and the service manager gets restarted in the postinst
Aug 27 01:14:51 <zsoc> makes sense.
Aug 27 01:15:08 * zsoc wonders how long preware will take to update the first time.
Aug 27 01:15:09 <rwhitby> zsoc: it's the result of open community development, including a group of women aged 45 to 72 who had not previously used a Pre.
Aug 27 01:15:18 <zsoc> Also, weren't a lot of devs removing the word 'pre' from their software name?
Aug 27 01:15:22 <rwhitby> (see http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Preware_Design)
Aug 27 01:15:54 <zsoc> rwhitby, it's sad, people who work on open source projects are generally just plain more intelligent than others, and get much less recognition :)
Aug 27 01:15:55 <oil> the pre in preware does not mean pre as in the phone
Aug 27 01:16:01 <rwhitby> zsoc: oh, the "Pre" in preware has nothing to do with a Palm device.  Preware is software that is *before* (pre) being submitted to the Palm app catalog.
Aug 27 01:16:20 <zsoc> ah, got it.
Aug 27 01:16:31 <zsoc> that's.. bs, lol. but i got it ;)
Aug 27 01:16:43 <zsoc> convenient, i guess i should say.
Aug 27 01:16:48 <rwhitby> zsoc: that's our story, and we're sticking to it ;-)
Aug 27 01:17:29 <rwhitby> and Palm's trademark does not cover the word "Pre" in isolation - we've checked it.
Aug 27 01:18:06 <rwhitby> Preware will never be accepted into the Palm app catalog anyway (since it needs a custom service), so there's no problem with the name from that point of view ...
Aug 27 01:18:23 <zsoc> rwhitby, again, too intelligent. Also, now i'm going to have to find a way to explain to my wife why my pre does things hers doesn't do (she already whines about the battery % patch)
Aug 27 01:19:02 <zsoc> Hm.. what would cause preware to hang on the 'updating' screen..
Aug 27 01:19:38 <destinal> It covers Prë  probably, or wait, it's pre with a line, I don't even think that's in ascii anywhere
Aug 27 01:19:40 <oil> not installing the package service
Aug 27 01:20:22 <zsoc> oil, i was thinking more "broken installation of the package service", but we'll go with your thought first.
Aug 27 01:20:41 <destinal> It's definitely not prê or pré or prè
Aug 27 01:21:18 * destinal is touchstoned.
Aug 27 01:21:40 <destinal> no idea why I waited so long to get the kit, it's worth it for the new backplate alone
Aug 27 01:21:55 <oil> touchstone = ftw
Aug 27 01:22:25 <oil> its such a good idea, the fact no other phone has the option baffles me
Aug 27 01:22:40 <zsoc> oil, so get this. i ran the "Secure consent demo", and then reran preware, and it worked. nice coincidence right? :>
Aug 27 01:22:46 <destinal> and the implementation between the magnets and the nanotube stuff is just great.
Aug 27 01:23:02 <oil> zsoc, there is problems there
Aug 27 01:23:10 <destinal> the base sticks on a _vertical_ surface
Aug 27 01:23:10 <oil> considering that icon shouldn't even appear
Aug 27 01:23:38 <zsoc> oil, awesome :D well it totally works lol. i can try rescanning again. I mean I get the point of the secure consent idea (i read the thread)
Aug 27 01:23:58 <destinal> does everyone like the word consent as opposed to confirmation?
Aug 27 01:24:11 <zsoc> destinal, whatever is farthest from the terminology in the DAC
Aug 27 01:24:37 <destinal> I guess it's more precise
Aug 27 01:24:39 <zsoc> should 'available patches' be grayed out?
Aug 27 01:25:26 <zsoc> also... no progress bar during application updates.. i assume this is known? ok i should shut up now or all this obvious crap is going to spam the channel worse than i already have :P
Aug 27 01:25:26 <oil> ys
Aug 27 01:25:35 <oil> there is no patch support yet
Aug 27 01:25:41 <oil> and there is no progress bar because there isnt
Aug 27 01:25:53 <zsoc> You mean because there is no progress? ;)
Aug 27 01:25:57 <oil> right
Aug 27 01:26:05 <zsoc> Program feels very.. open source. I like that part of it.
Aug 27 01:26:07 <oil> it says "install this"
Aug 27 01:26:10 <oil> and the service says
Aug 27 01:26:12 <oil> "ok, its done"
Aug 27 01:26:43 <zsoc> Howabout a way to sort programs by what 'feed' or site they come from?
Aug 27 01:27:00 <oil> the service doesn't provide that to teh app
Aug 27 01:27:06 <oil> (if it even knows)
Aug 27 01:27:11 <zsoc> i see
Aug 27 01:27:17 <zsoc> well aren't you slick
Aug 27 01:27:52 <destinal> I keep wondering if we're going to have to go beyond what ipkg the utility will tell us
Aug 27 01:28:11 <destinal> but then again I don't think even the info files show where from :(
Aug 27 01:28:13 <zsoc> no direct information on the download page... have to click to the link about the app.. not so sure i like that
Aug 27 01:28:28 <oil> its not in the feeds yet
Aug 27 01:28:35 <oil> once it is, the app will support it
Aug 27 01:29:40 <rwhitby> destinal: we can add origin information in the Source: json easily
Aug 27 01:30:25 <zsoc> hm.. wait... so preware even has the packages for the apps that are in the official palm catalog?
Aug 27 01:30:29 <rwhitby> zsoc: there's an ecosystem that is being built around all this, and it relies on negotiations and agreements with the originating sites to provide open metadata feeds.
Aug 27 01:30:41 <rwhitby> zsoc: only the ones you have installed
Aug 27 01:30:56 <zsoc> rwhitby, i caught that briefly reading over the thread you forwarded me too :) and yes i see that now, thank you.
Aug 27 01:31:29 <rwhitby> everything is heading in the right direction, it just a matter of people finding free time to do stuff.
Aug 27 01:31:45 <rwhitby> (e.g. dieter was fishing on the weekend, and I was camping :-)
Aug 27 01:32:01 * oil waits
Aug 27 01:32:08 <rwhitby> in other news, we're going to add a canucksoftware feed to preware.org
Aug 27 01:32:22 <oil> thats good
Aug 27 01:32:25 <zsoc> oh god, terminal update broke it ^_^
Aug 27 01:32:39 <oil> i can't even get terminal installed on my pre
Aug 27 01:32:47 <oil> webos quick install and preware both fail
Aug 27 01:33:03 <zsoc> mine worked perfectly lol... going to go back to the way i installed it the first time D:
Aug 27 01:33:11 <zsoc> should i make steps for you oil? it's really very useful
Aug 27 01:33:17 <rwhitby> heh
Aug 27 01:33:26 <rwhitby> zsoc: oil wrote most of the Preware app
Aug 27 01:33:27 <destinal-away> bbl
Aug 27 01:33:29 <zsoc> especially if you need to remove pictures from /media/internals and place them elsewhere that isn't scanned ;)
Aug 27 01:33:39 <zsoc> rwhitby, i assumed the way he was talking about it.. it was more of a joke :P
Aug 27 01:33:48 <oil> but my pre is virgin
Aug 27 01:33:49 <rwhitby> :-)
Aug 27 01:33:51 <zsoc> i have a feeling the preware app or the service borks the terminal
Aug 27 01:34:01 * oil blames the service
Aug 27 01:34:14 <zsoc> i suppose i could stop the service and try it again..
Aug 27 01:34:15 * rwhitby blames Canada
Aug 27 01:34:19 <zsoc> er... what's the service called again?
Aug 27 01:34:24 <zsoc> Canada is America's hat.
Aug 27 01:34:57 <zsoc> doesn't the guy who wrote the term plugin hang out here?
Aug 27 01:35:01 <rwhitby> America is just the other offshoot from England (along with Australia)
Aug 27 01:35:17 <oil> except we're not all criminals
Aug 27 01:35:25 <rwhitby> zsoc: that would be destinal-away, Zuchmir2 and mrvc
Aug 27 01:35:31 <oil> xD
Aug 27 01:35:36 <rwhitby> oil: well, not at the beginning ;-)
Aug 27 01:35:41 <oil> lol
Aug 27 01:35:53 <oil> just our politicians
Aug 27 01:36:02 <rwhitby> one might say that the two societies have gone in opposite directions ;-)
Aug 27 01:36:08 <rwhitby> (America and Australia)
Aug 27 01:36:15 <BrettQ_> anyone get irssi up and running on the Pre? I can't seem to find libperl for it to work
Aug 27 01:36:46 <rwhitby> but that's enough yank ribbing from me for today :-)
Aug 27 01:38:39 <psykoz> heh
Aug 27 01:38:46 <psykoz> Canada is like a loft apartment over a great party
Aug 27 01:38:48 <psykoz> nuff said ;)
Aug 27 01:39:16 <zsoc> hmm.. is running '/usr/bin/ipkg -o /var update && /usr/bin/ipkg -o /var upgrade' irresponsible at the current level of stability?
Aug 27 01:42:19 <rwhitby> no, that should be fine as long as you run the postinsts manually afterwards
Aug 27 01:43:16 <zsoc> howabout just the luna refresh :P
Aug 27 01:46:56 <zsoc> me now thinks cat'ing postinst files before running them is a good idea
Aug 27 01:48:48 <zsoc> what would be the command to launch an app from a remote shell?
Aug 27 01:51:17 <rwhitby> zsoc: luna-send to palm's applicationManager's launch method
Aug 27 01:52:01 <zsoc> makes sense... know when i can find slightly more specific syntax?
Aug 27 01:52:25 <zsoc> nevermind
Aug 27 01:52:25 <rwhitby> those search terms on the wiki should get some
Aug 27 01:52:30 <zsoc> like usual, answered by own question
Aug 27 01:52:33 <zsoc> i should just stop talking
Aug 27 01:54:02 <zsoc> er.. should i be able to pipe output into grep?
Aug 27 01:54:08 <zsoc> wait, that's a bash feature isn't it
Aug 27 01:55:45 <rwhitby> pipe works in /bin/sh
Aug 27 01:56:31 <zsoc> got it, again, spoke too quickly
Aug 27 01:56:40 <zsoc> it's like i type my pre-thoughts before my brain analyses them
Aug 27 01:56:42 <zsoc> so backwards
Aug 27 01:57:05 <zsoc> destinal-away, stop being away, also why did you break terminal? :P
Aug 27 01:59:01 * oil wants to know why it doesnt work as well
Aug 27 02:01:56 <zsoc> ok oil, guess we'll have to fix it ourselves :P
Aug 27 02:02:26 <zsoc> So I'm unfamiliar with the normal debugging process on a pre. Generally I'd start by running an app from terminal and looking for errors... luna-send isn't very verbose however.
Aug 27 02:04:58 <zsoc> i mean technically it's not crashing it seems.. can run it normally.. play with the preferences.. and close it. There's just no.. er.. terminal.
Aug 27 02:06:35 <oil> thats because of the plugin
Aug 27 02:07:00 <Ikyo> rwhitby: why would preware not upgrade form the command line?
Aug 27 02:07:19 <Ikyo> did ipkg -o /var update
Aug 27 02:07:29 <Ikyo> then ipkg -o /var ipgrade and says all uptodate
Aug 27 02:07:38 <Ikyo> when I got into preware it says there are 3 packages
Aug 27 02:08:05 <rwhitby> Ikyo: "/usr/bin/ipkg -o /var info" will give you the same info that Preware uses.
Aug 27 02:08:24 <rwhitby> Ikyo: and the feeds update every 15 minutes, so you might have caught an update
Aug 27 02:10:56 <oil> (and preware could certainly be thinking something has an update when it doesnt)
Aug 27 02:11:12 <oil> check by seeing what version you have installed, and what version it says it wants to install
Aug 27 02:11:29 <analog`> oil, did you create the blocked app?
Aug 27 02:11:33 <oil> yeah
Aug 27 02:11:42 <analog`> cool i love that game
Aug 27 02:11:52 <Ikyo> I was an idiot and used ipkg not /usr/bin/ipkg
Aug 27 02:11:57 <oil> damn
Aug 27 02:12:01 <oil> i made it to not be fun
Aug 27 02:12:05 <oil> xD
Aug 27 02:12:59 <zsoc> oil, you familiar with gstream at all? :D
Aug 27 02:13:05 <rwhitby> Ikyo: /usr/bin/ipkg is the normal one.  Do you have /opt/bin first in your path or something?
Aug 27 02:13:30 <oil> no
Aug 27 02:14:15 <zsoc> sigh.. and now novacom isn't finding my pre
Aug 27 02:18:26 <analog`> dev mode on?
Aug 27 02:21:30 <zsoc> analog`, thanks.. you must not know me. i ask ridiculous questions i know the answers to already :)
Aug 27 02:21:41 <zsoc> analog`, but thank you :)
Aug 27 02:33:53 <zsoc> hm.. this would seem to be an issue.
Aug 27 02:38:33 <zsoc> would decompiling /usr/lib/gstreamer-0.10/libgstcamsrc.so violate.. er.. anything.. y'know.. bad?
Aug 27 02:42:09 <bpadalino> no - reverse away
Aug 27 02:42:27 <zsoc> if this works, i will be awesome
Aug 27 02:42:44 <bpadalino> the awesomest
Aug 27 02:42:45 <zsoc> and by awesome, i mean .01 percent more awesome then anyone who isn't already in here.
Aug 27 02:43:15 <rwhitby> zsoc: everyone in here is awesome :-)
Aug 27 02:43:44 <rwhitby> zsoc: have you checked to see if the source is already available on palm's opensource site
Aug 27 02:45:05 <zsoc> rwhitby, that is a wonderful suggestion
Aug 27 02:45:12 <zsoc> er.. i should know where that is..
Aug 27 02:45:35 <rwhitby> opensource.palm.com
Aug 27 02:47:49 <zsoc> Thank you. Also please correct my if I'm wasting my time. I'm trying to figure out why the pad template default for the camera is degraded to 480x320, if the hardware is confirmed to encode at 720x480@30fps
Aug 27 02:49:01 <zsoc> I'm probably going to find that the answer is in the limitations of the palmvideoencoder (which smells fishy.. like it's just a copy of some cheap encoder i'm familiar with)
Aug 27 02:49:10 <rwhitby> zsoc: dunno, I don't have  Pre and the Emulator doesn't do cameras.
Aug 27 02:49:24 <zsoc> rwhitby, you.. don't.. have.. a pre? oh. i'm really, really sorry :(
Aug 27 02:49:35 <rwhitby> zsoc: cdma stuff don't work in .au
Aug 27 02:49:40 <zsoc> right
Aug 27 02:50:17 <Ikyo> have you guys ever put your pre in test mode and turned on the camera?
Aug 27 02:50:17 <rwhitby> I'll happily accept a donation of one to use as a PDA until they release the rest-of-world UMTS .eu bands version
Aug 27 02:51:34 <zsoc> Ikyo, i'm not quite sure what you mean?
Aug 27 02:53:12 <zsoc> rwhitby, ugh, you're right. we need to find this cpc whatever fellow that did the current work. i need to bounce ideas off of him.
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Aug 27 02:59:57 2009