**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Sep 09 02:59:56 2009 Sep 09 03:00:02 cause postinst/prerm can be robust Sep 09 03:00:04 they can check for errors Sep 09 03:00:11 revert if things fail Sep 09 03:00:35 idk how preload is gonna handle stuff Sep 09 03:00:54 but just applying a patch seems like a bad idea Sep 09 03:01:04 and if we dont use ipks Sep 09 03:01:09 how are they gonna get in a catalog? Sep 09 03:01:18 "you only want to support people who know what they are doing" ... What about those earnestly trying to learn? Sep 09 03:01:34 fine with patches as ipk's Sep 09 03:01:57 no problemo Sep 09 03:01:59 superduperpre: like i said i dont want to support anyone, i just want to make things i need :D Sep 09 03:02:06 and put them out there for people to use if they want Sep 09 03:02:14 superduperpre, no time ;) Sep 09 03:02:47 oh... yeh. sorry, I didn't mean "support" I gues.. I meant help on irc and forums I guess. is that no good also? Sep 09 03:02:49 OK fine well how do we get all these patches out there into preware Sep 09 03:03:04 is Preload/filecoaster ever gonna support services/plugins/binaries? Sep 09 03:03:18 As ipkg's, OK fine well how do we get the patches into ipk's? Sep 09 03:03:35 egaudet: rwhitby answered that Sep 09 03:03:46 Do we create a tutorial for the patch creators, do we tell them to submit it to an autobuilder, do we grab them and do it ourselves? Sep 09 03:03:51 superduperpre: PuffTheMagic's intentions are not representative of the rest of the Preware development team ;-) Sep 09 03:04:06 (with regard to supporting users of Preware) Sep 09 03:04:31 egaudet: I'd suggest we get the autobuilder to do it, then we can build in the quality in the postinst/prerm Sep 09 03:04:54 I do understand though that uninformed n00bs like myself can be a real drain on time!! thats what forums and searching are for... irc is fo' da cool cats Sep 09 03:05:08 superduperpre, nah, i'm a super noob Sep 09 03:05:13 well crap Sep 09 03:05:17 I'd better leave then. Sep 09 03:05:31 don't pay attention to the man behind the curtain! Sep 09 03:05:41 rwhitby: does ipk work with X.Y verions Sep 09 03:05:43 How does one address an irc "post" to an individual?! sometimes someone posts and their name is red and I hear a sound... how to do? Sep 09 03:05:44 or is .Z required? Sep 09 03:05:57 btw, I haven't looked too deeply... Sep 09 03:06:02 But is there a donation link for preware? Sep 09 03:06:12 superduperpre: the community needs all types of people. those that forge ahead with new technology without regard for how it gets to users. those that package and make things avaiable to experienced users. those that take that and document how to use it for non-experienced users. all are important. Sep 09 03:06:14 superduperpre, generally type their name. some clients support "tab complete" Sep 09 03:06:35 zsoc: test Sep 09 03:06:41 superduperpre, it's red here ;) Sep 09 03:06:44 PuffTheMagic: the intention is to support (N:)?N(.N)*(-N)? but I don't think it's there yet. Sep 09 03:06:51 sweet! Thanks! Sep 09 03:06:54 lol Sep 09 03:07:09 what do you mean intention... ipk suports it or not right? Sep 09 03:07:22 PuffTheMagic: ipkg supports it, ipkgservice and Preware may not. Sep 09 03:07:32 (yet) Sep 09 03:07:43 why wouldnt it Sep 09 03:08:08 as I said, the intent is that it does. but the code does not yet match the intent. Sep 09 03:08:23 rwhitby: yeh... i just hope that I can contribute somehow in ways additional to $ donations! Sep 09 03:08:43 Speaking of donations... Sep 09 03:08:50 why does there need to be special code in preware/ipkgservice Sep 09 03:08:53 Well, I'll be non-lazy for a minute. Sep 09 03:09:03 what part is hardcoded to x.y.z Sep 09 03:09:06 heisenman: the wiki has a donation link on the side. read the page for our position on donations. Sep 09 03:09:25 So... If find it ironic that lots of folks here are chomping at the bit for the new update... Sep 09 03:09:34 Because I need a quick answer and this is the busiest Pre channel I know of, I'll ask this here: Anyone have a link to cheap USB to Micro USB Pre charging cables? Sep 09 03:09:46 ... but I came here specifically to prevent updates!!! http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Blocking_Updates Sep 09 03:10:03 ultra, monoprice Sep 09 03:10:32 heisenman: the server hardware for webos-internals.org was forward-paid for by the nslu2-linux.org project community that I founded 5 years ago Sep 09 03:10:33 ultraBlack: the answer is in the wiki Sep 09 03:10:42 ultra: I saw ones for 5 bucks from presomething... Sep 09 03:10:51 Lemme look it up, I bought two Sep 09 03:11:05 Rick_home: ok Sep 09 03:11:07 heisenman: and we have free hosting courtesy of osuosl.org Sep 09 03:11:23 prethinkingstore Sep 09 03:11:37 MyTether... MyTether (said in that creepy "my precious my precious they stole it from us" voice) Sep 09 03:11:40 5 bucks, it's a 4" mini to microusb that works with the pre port. Sep 09 03:11:45 no update for me yet!! Sep 09 03:12:06 ultraBlack: monoprice.com has microusb cables that work great for under a dollar each Sep 09 03:12:23 heisenman: and the webos internals developers donate their time altruistically at the moment. Sep 09 03:12:27 rwhitby: Donating, for me, is less about the money and more about the support. Sep 09 03:12:37 Rick_home: That's the one I was thinking of. Saw it before but didn't have it bookmarked. Thanks. Saves me time looking at the wiki Sep 09 03:12:50 I wouldn't spend $5 on a micro usb cable :) Sep 09 03:13:03 rwhitby: same error with installing the compiler, the native pre one installs just not the emulator one. Any chance the downloaded files are corrupt at the host? Sep 09 03:13:07 and by altruistically, he means 'because they learn a lot about cool things as they go' :> Sep 09 03:13:10 heisenman: best way to support webos internals at the moment is to move information from forums and irc to permanent well-written pages on the wiki, and then point people in those other forums to those wiki pages. Sep 09 03:13:14 I can help with being a beta tester and opening up ssh for those who don't have hardware access currently, but if the money can go to helping things along, or even just demonstrating my happiness with the work, then it's money well spent. Sep 09 03:13:32 hm Sep 09 03:13:43 I may look into the wiki part. Sep 09 03:13:50 heisenman: and anything else which lessens the support load on the developers. Sep 09 03:14:16 ultraBlack: http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=103&cp_id=10303&cs_id=1030307&p_id=5457&seq=1&format=2 Sep 09 03:14:29 I bought 5 of those. Great cables $0.99 :-) Sep 09 03:14:37 Rick_home: That does the trick. Thank you so much Sep 09 03:14:49 Rick_home: a lot better than $20 a pop at PreCentral Sep 09 03:14:59 hm. Sep 09 03:15:06 I probably should have bought those. Sep 09 03:15:08 if you only want 1.5 footers they're 71 cents.... Sep 09 03:15:23 Rick_home: yea good to know, thank you! Sep 09 03:15:34 Adapting from mini-usb is useful in reducing my total materials sop, but those would have been spiffier. Sep 09 03:15:40 yeah I was looking at a 1.5' before. i wanted a retractable but those might do Sep 09 03:15:41 Time to stock up :P Sep 09 03:16:38 I bought 10 monoprice cables and just chunked them everywhere, at my desk, at home, in my laptop bag, in my car, I'm never having a problem finding a cable :) Sep 09 03:16:43 out of 6, 1 was bad...but at ~$1/ea I can handle those failure rates. +1 monoprice cables. Sep 09 03:17:46 i almost feel like there's not much point in documenting the quirks of 1.1 now :P Sep 09 03:18:03 ajames, how's your bin going? :P Sep 09 03:18:24 If anyone here knows the precentral news poster, could they get them to stop using brick the way they are? The device really isn't remotely that fragile Sep 09 03:18:46 chrisa, if i knew the precentral news poster, i'd punch him in the face Sep 09 03:19:00 chrisa: yeah, you'll see my comments on exactly that point on both those articles. Sep 09 03:19:04 zsoc: whoa now Sep 09 03:19:10 maybe that was a little harsh Sep 09 03:19:16 i've got one foot in hand-rolling a new file and one foot in making a palm-compatible gst-inspect that does write back Sep 09 03:19:30 i'm not sure which is the better solution wrt packaging Sep 09 03:19:50 i'm constantly upset by news items posted on that site that really mislead the general public in terms like "brick", "root", "linux", etc. maybe i have an anger-management problem Sep 09 03:19:53 anyone ever seen the error: com.palm.mediaevents is not running Sep 09 03:20:44 PreCentral is very alarmist Sep 09 03:21:01 I think they are trying to be the fox news of Palm Sep 09 03:21:33 zsoc: well, I did a whole podcast interview (40 mins) with PreCentral about how rooting is not the right term and how the pre is not brickable by an end user, but still they persist in using those terms (http://media.libsyn.com/media/treocentral/palmcast68-5.mp3) Sep 09 03:21:36 the news commenters are also in a huff about Bricking their Pre Sep 09 03:21:44 That's getting into politics :P But again, I retract my violent statement, was the scotch talking I'm sure. Sep 09 03:21:51 rwhitby: and i said PLEASE Sep 09 03:21:56 but they still did Sep 09 03:22:52 rwhitby, i was always afraid to listen to that. i feel like i'd super rage for some reason. Sep 09 03:23:06 rwhitby: "how the pre is not brickable by an end user" ... and your "Rooting" thread over their cleared up that misconcepttion for me as well! Sep 09 03:23:20 zsoc: my mellifluous tones will calm you down ... Sep 09 03:23:54 I htink its cause n00bs like me wanna use cool techie terminology... and Brick is so coool of a term!. its impactful and visual! Sep 09 03:23:55 they've used the word "nerd" in various ways now 4 times already Sep 09 03:24:17 superduperpre, true that, i suppose coming here is the first step to recovery :P Sep 09 03:24:34 i tried explaining to someone once that calling a geek "nerd" is like calling someone of color the n-word Sep 09 03:24:37 rwhitby, the accent is really the best part honestly Sep 09 03:24:44 acylord: Thank you! Sep 09 03:24:44 zsoc: indeed... but everybody talks so fast! Sep 09 03:24:58 I guess PreCentral has really gone downhill. Sep 09 03:26:17 he literally just said "other operating systems run on linux". what is this i don't evne. Sep 09 03:26:22 s/evne/even Sep 09 03:27:13 rwhitby: brick can be temporary, and is probably valid when data loss will result from recovery Sep 09 03:27:22 superduperpre: Use Bork instead of brick Sep 09 03:27:24 rwhitby, in their defense using the term rooting makes people feel special, even if the feature is already there for them ;) Plus it also relates the concept to the iPhone and Android ways of gaining root access Sep 09 03:27:31 it's our in house term of art. Sep 09 03:27:36 To be honest brick can't be temporary Sep 09 03:27:51 I hope the bricks in my house are not too temporary ... Sep 09 03:27:52 So while it definitely isn't correct in technicality, it's sorta like a generic term Sep 09 03:27:54 because the term originated in the device being nothing more than a paperweight Sep 09 03:27:56 i often turn bricks into other useful things .. paperweights .. door-knockers .. Sep 09 03:28:17 it's a generic term for norms, not for us geeks Sep 09 03:28:21 rwhitby, seriously i actually enjoy listening to you talk, is that creepy? Sep 09 03:28:21 Rick_home: lol... but then the commenteers would just abuse Bork also! Sep 09 03:28:21 psykoz: it's that implied relationship which is the problem. Palm decided to be different. Sep 09 03:28:38 zsoc: it's an aussie thing ... Sep 09 03:28:45 rwhitby, you have a point Sep 09 03:29:11 rwhitby, you also tend to say *Sensical things*. *in order*. Doesn't happen often these days. Sep 09 03:29:12 rwhitby: rwhitby said "well, I did a whole podcast interview"... Thanks for the link, I missed that before... listening now! Sep 09 03:29:49 Kudos on pronouncing Ubuntu correctly. Sep 09 03:29:57 superduperpre: it's listed on our Press Page at http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Press_Room Sep 09 03:30:24 thanks... looks like I got some learning to do! Sep 09 03:31:29 looks like a hackerspace is opening up near me soon Sep 09 03:31:31 Secret Sauce!!! Sep 09 03:31:38 if i play my cards right i can get some slave labor =x Sep 09 03:33:29 superduperpre: BTW, I doubt that Palm nuked MyTether intentionally. They updated the wireless driver to no longer support ad-hoc, which is sensible from a security point of view for a phone. Sep 09 03:34:01 oh they removed the ad-hoc capability ? Sep 09 03:34:03 (http://www.precentral.net/prepping-your-pre-webos-12-remove-those-tweaks#comment-23542) Sep 09 03:34:06 rwhitby: is their a way to maintain security and still tether? They shouldn't be mutually exclusive right? Sep 09 03:34:07 ad-hoc was made with extra failsauce on my pre Sep 09 03:34:23 and usb tether keeps my phone charged while i have internet Sep 09 03:34:40 honestly ad-hoc tether is just a terrible idea. Sep 09 03:34:54 isn't tethering common technology, so why can't it be secure? any way other than adhoc? Sep 09 03:35:03 superduperpre: well, the fact that the free version of mytether doesn't even use WPA is criminal in my book. Sep 09 03:35:22 ahhhh... I see. so it Could be made safe? Sep 09 03:35:29 vpnc is on there by default Sep 09 03:35:33 I deleted that application once I notice anyone can connect thru my phone wireless. Sep 09 03:35:40 it could also be damaging to the hardward of the phone. Sep 09 03:35:46 i paid for mytether, and ended up always using usbnet anyway Sep 09 03:35:56 but MyTther has a WEP2 passwd, is that not good enough? Sep 09 03:36:13 wep is good for about 30 seconds Sep 09 03:36:23 acydlord, be nice, about 6 minutes if it's good Sep 09 03:36:26 zsoc: howcan tethering be bad for the *hardware* Sep 09 03:36:56 zsoc, alright, i forgot to count collecting the packets Sep 09 03:37:20 So... could someone theoretically mahe aMyTether with WPA? Sep 09 03:37:22 superduperpre, 1.) be in 3g area 2.) ad-hoc tether 3.) download gigantic file 4.) watch your phone reset from overheating in 25 minutes Sep 09 03:37:56 zsoc: Lol, so true. Sep 09 03:38:05 zsoc: oh... ok. but who really DLs gigantic files on the pre? what about for normal use? Sep 09 03:38:10 i've never had my pre reboot due to overheating ... Sep 09 03:38:15 i try Sep 09 03:38:29 superduperpre, why can't you plug it in and use usb drivers? i don't understand Sep 09 03:38:32 i really wish identi.ca would catch on for the tech crowd the same way twitter did for the friendwhores Sep 09 03:38:41 superduperpre: Someone connected to your ad-hoc connection Sep 09 03:38:45 cause i'd like to leave twitter and keep in touch with the geeks Sep 09 03:38:46 bpadalino, me neither, but i actually had it corrupt a few files from overheating, no joke Sep 09 03:39:02 zsoc: I use it for travel and need wireless! Sep 09 03:39:05 * ajames 's pre overheats at least once a day Sep 09 03:39:13 but i push it Sep 09 03:39:14 i use mine for travel too Sep 09 03:39:18 superduperpre: Unless they finally made ad-hoc secure where you would need to use a key. Sep 09 03:39:20 ajames, i can only imagine :P Sep 09 03:39:21 i use it with an aspire one Sep 09 03:39:38 zsoc: should I tether through bluetooth instead? Sep 09 03:39:53 you should tether through A WIRE Sep 09 03:40:16 what if that isn't possible... what is the next best bet? Sep 09 03:40:16 i need to get a retractable micro-usb and a cheap case so i can mount a case on my laptop lid by my webcam clip Sep 09 03:40:19 rwhitby, you still don't have a pre? Sep 09 03:40:29 lol Sep 09 03:40:43 zsoc: nope. no Pre released in Australia yet, and no-one has donated a CDMA one for me to use as a non-phone here. Sep 09 03:40:44 oil, lol yourself :P Sep 09 03:40:49 then i can just clip my pre to the laptop when i'm out Sep 09 03:41:00 are you guys listening to the rwhitby cast as well right now? Sep 09 03:41:05 rwhitby, wow, i don't even have $600. your calming voice is slowly convincing me tho Sep 09 03:41:14 must be so! lol Sep 09 03:41:19 See, now THAT is a good reason to donate. Sep 09 03:41:26 yeah, when i got my pre i had the option of paying rent or getting my phone Sep 09 03:41:30 so i got the phone Sep 09 03:41:32 whit, throw us a direct link so we can donate 20 bucks. Sep 09 03:41:46 doesn't take that many people to get you a CDMA pre that way. Sep 09 03:42:06 heisenman, the idea, i think, is the gsm one will be out shortly enough for him :) otherwise i'd be right in there lol Sep 09 03:42:09 wish palm would do a developer network discount Sep 09 03:42:19 When is the Aussie release date? Sep 09 03:42:20 How come people don't look at "installed packages" Sep 09 03:42:28 and kinda miffed that nokia didnt offer one for the n900 lide they did for the n800 and n810 Sep 09 03:42:36 heisenman: unknown, unlikely this year according to rumours Sep 09 03:42:41 (More importantly, why didn't we start this vaca months ago?) Sep 09 03:42:46 See, not this year. Sep 09 03:42:49 That's a LONG TIME. Sep 09 03:42:51 rwhitby, but even a non-aussie gsm version will work right? Sep 09 03:42:55 We should take up a collection. Sep 09 03:43:01 zsoc: .eu gsm version will work Sep 09 03:43:25 when the gsm version comes out he'll end up with one i'm sure :> Sep 09 03:43:43 heisenman: I'm too humble to lead such a collection myself, but will happily supply a paypal address to someone else who wants to do such a thing. Sep 09 03:43:58 Now I just need to figure out how to edit the wiki. Sep 09 03:44:00 :) Sep 09 03:44:16 heisenman, not tough, just don't break anything ;) Sep 09 03:44:39 i like how you say "secret code" and "key sequence" but refuse to actually say upupdowndownleftrightleftrighbastart ;) Sep 09 03:44:45 muchtall, you Sep 09 03:44:48 "edit the wiki"... what is the protocol for asking advice before performing an edit of a wiki page? Sep 09 03:45:11 super: In theory, a wiki is "open editable" which means no permission necessary. Sep 09 03:45:13 You just do it. Sep 09 03:45:27 hmmm... I hope I am right! Sep 09 03:45:40 dos the bot know it? Sep 09 03:45:44 Not only that, but wikis are supposed to have deep version control, which means that if an administrator doesn't like what you wrote, they can roll back to a previous incarnation of the page. Sep 09 03:45:45 heisenman: http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/201710-palm-wont-australia-months.html is my concern at the moment. Sep 09 03:46:17 don't read the rumors, rwhitby .. Sep 09 03:46:19 positive thinking Sep 09 03:46:41 a cdma non-phone to hack on in the meantime would be handy ... Sep 09 03:46:48 That's the point/ Sep 09 03:46:53 Screw the damn carriers. Sep 09 03:46:56 You need hardware. Sep 09 03:47:04 if you goof on a wiki edit there is revision tracking so it can be reverted Sep 09 03:47:16 rwhitby: just use usb host connected wcdma modem Sep 09 03:47:16 I remember opening a port so someone could ssh into my phone a while back, but that is just not a good answer. Sep 09 03:47:17 :) Sep 09 03:47:32 heisenman: I believe that was me. Sep 09 03:47:40 maybe we should all push palm to make device hardware available for people accepted to the pdn Sep 09 03:47:56 Acydlord: The wiki code base (the original from wikipedia guy) has very deep revision tracking. Sep 09 03:48:04 To the sentence level, I believe. Sep 09 03:48:07 rwhitby, ok mate, we'll get you a phone :P Sep 09 03:48:08 Possibly the word level. Sep 09 03:48:19 heisenman, it was to the word level Sep 09 03:48:34 i actually had someone fix a typo using revision tracking lol Sep 09 03:49:02 Well, I'm too stupid to have the money I'm sitting on. Sep 09 03:49:13 So I say 20 bucks goes to rwhitby getting a pre. Sep 09 03:49:17 and we're running the exact same code base that wikipedia is running (albeit on much less hardware) Sep 09 03:49:53 i still like the wikimedia base much better than any others I have tried Sep 09 03:49:56 well i may or may not be able to purchase one at cost from a sprint dealer. Sep 09 03:50:01 tiki-wiki was a close second Sep 09 03:50:01 when the pre goes on sale in England in a couple of months, we'll buy one of those and ship it to rwhitby hidden inside a large metal casting.... Sep 09 03:50:14 dokuwiki ftw Sep 09 03:50:24 docuwiki is way too limited Sep 09 03:50:26 Rick_home, a ticking one? Sep 09 03:50:41 and i'm not much a fan of deki-wiki even though i use that one at work all the time Sep 09 03:51:06 media wiki isn't perfect, but it's far and away the most flexible Sep 09 03:51:27 if someone has the time.. can you look at my comment on the discussion page? there appears to be missing info in the article re: how to "creat an /etc/shells file" --- is my link and suggested edit approriate? Sep 09 03:51:43 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Talk:Next_steps Sep 09 03:52:51 i like the way rwhitby turned "OS" from two syllables into one!! Sep 09 03:52:51 superduperpre, makes sense to me Sep 09 03:53:23 zsoc: cool... that page I linked to appears to provide the info "missing" on the article Sep 09 03:53:40 nodnod Sep 09 03:54:14 OK... I am going for it! I will edit and then wait to see if their is any fallout... Sep 09 03:56:05 gizmodo has really gone down hill Sep 09 03:56:19 they are now quoting techcrunch Sep 09 03:56:37 Brightness Unlinked just released an update to run in dashboard, it's quite genius and i love it. Anyone know who made it? Sep 09 03:56:55 zsoc, check the details on it? Sep 09 03:56:58 acydlord: they all work as filterable input, but I take my commentary from elsewhere Sep 09 03:57:19 heisenman: buy-rod-a-pre@rwhitby.net is the paypal address I just created Sep 09 03:57:33 lulz Sep 09 03:57:43 techcrunch is 100% speculation and rumor and 150% arrington's ego Sep 09 03:57:57 gizmodo seems to be an extention of the marketing arm of apple anymore Sep 09 03:58:36 not to mention the fact that gizmodo doesnt research anything anymore Sep 09 03:58:50 /walloftext Sep 09 03:59:05 heisenman: I pledge that any donations to that address will go towards buying a CDMA Pre that will work as a non-phone in Australia for webos-internals.org hacking. Any left over donations will be forwarded to webos-internals.org Sep 09 03:59:08 superduperpre, looks good Sep 09 03:59:39 *shrug* Sep 09 03:59:44 zsoc: thanks for checking... it helped me, so hopefully it will help others Sep 09 03:59:57 No trouble. Sep 09 04:00:13 Money... Sep 09 04:00:15 sent Sep 09 04:00:22 Peeps, give this man some cash. Sep 09 04:00:31 if i wasnt beyond flat broke i would Sep 09 04:00:34 He should be working the hardware. Sep 09 04:00:57 Now I need to figure out my frakking bank routing number again. Sep 09 04:01:10 someone was nice enogh to donate $150 when i was trying to gather cash to buy my n810 at launch, and it ended up costing me $140 Sep 09 04:01:26 Man, I saw the specs on the N900... Sep 09 04:01:29 Scary. Sep 09 04:01:35 haha Sep 09 04:01:41 heisenman: donation received - thank you. Sep 09 04:01:46 nokia does some good work with hardware Sep 09 04:01:52 Happy to help. Sep 09 04:04:28 rwhitby: paypal only accepts .com domains not .net?? "Please enter a valid address in the format name@domain.com" Sep 09 04:04:56 superduperpre: worked for heisenman Sep 09 04:05:15 Yeah, I didn't have a problem there... Sep 09 04:05:36 Send money, type in the address, send the correct number of the correct denomination. Sep 09 04:05:54 maybe you typo'd Sep 09 04:06:05 it's a weird address name. Sep 09 04:06:06 Heh. Sep 09 04:06:09 Nope! no typo... Sep 09 04:07:08 Ahhh! I tried it as "personal" not "purchase"... that does NOT work. "personal" transfers are limited to .com domains! Sep 09 04:07:31 rwhitby: if its done as a purchase, not as personal then it works Sep 09 04:07:54 interesting. Sep 09 04:08:00 I did it as a personal gift... Sep 09 04:08:03 But hey. Sep 09 04:08:21 paypal just doesnt like me... Sep 09 04:08:30 apparently so Sep 09 04:08:58 rwhitby: so.. have you Pimped you Emulator? Sep 09 04:09:39 superduperpre: nope, I really only use the emulator to debug and test, so I don't look at it that often. I've only installed about 5 non-webosinternals apps eve Sep 09 04:09:48 oil, you have a pre right? Sep 09 04:10:13 has anyone here attempted the "Privacy Protector" mod published by joey sometime back? http://kitenet.net/~joey/blog/entry/Palm_Pre_privacy/ Sep 09 04:10:44 i read that.. actually all of his palm relevant rants.. smart guy, someone should get him in here Sep 09 04:11:29 Palm Pixi, holy crap Sep 09 04:11:39 yeah, that's what i thought Sep 09 04:11:54 How in the hell did Precentral get the press release so early??!! Sep 09 04:11:56 I wanna try it... gonna have to figure out how to edit text to "comment out" those lines. Anybody got a relevant link to an article here on wiki for file editing? I mean beyond just the basic commands page? Sep 09 04:12:18 freakout, calm down tim, you'll have your chance to make fun of it ;) Sep 09 04:12:30 superduperpre, vi? Sep 09 04:12:33 zsoc: lol Sep 09 04:12:47 Still, this is rather blatant favourtism on Palm's part Sep 09 04:12:47 zsoc: yes... via vi Sep 09 04:12:56 Unless my editor has been keeping secrets... Sep 09 04:13:31 freakout, it's also odd to favor such a bunch of... people.. like that. i think possibly they are bullies ;) Sep 09 04:13:54 They've even got hands-on video. WTF Sep 09 04:13:58 Palm Pixi looks sexy Sep 09 04:14:18 no wifi though Sep 09 04:14:39 Why the heck did PreCentral publish a private video that I ned to sign on to see on their front page? Shameless... Sep 09 04:14:40 Yeah... Sep 09 04:14:46 It looks...like an interesting toy. Sep 09 04:15:03 zsoc: I worked with Joey on the Debian armel port - he's a great guy. Sep 09 04:15:04 But not something you'd want to develop on, or use for work. Sep 09 04:15:20 how can you watch the video... it says that it is private and I can't watch it Sep 09 04:15:48 rwhitby, i can actually tell that from his style of writing. don't ask me how. he just seems really awesome. Sep 09 04:20:49 oh man, acer is releasing a new laptop under the packard bell name Sep 09 04:20:54 i should go buy it =x Sep 09 04:22:22 Huh, so the Palm Pixi looks like an extended and flattened Pre Sep 09 04:22:59 with lower screen res and no wifi ? Sep 09 04:23:10 and a bif Sprint logo on the front? Sep 09 04:23:16 *big Sep 09 04:24:43 Huh. No wifi seems like a ubmmer Sep 09 04:24:45 and a bummer too Sep 09 04:24:50 Agreed. Sep 09 04:24:57 It's a toy pre. Sep 09 04:25:56 My wife's waiting for november when her next discount pops, she might be sold if there's a pink one Sep 09 04:25:56 but she covets my pre Sep 09 04:26:08 rofl Sep 09 04:26:18 I can't extract my gf from her treo 755p Sep 09 04:26:21 I hate that thing. Sep 09 04:26:40 We'd both gotten centros at the same time when they came out Sep 09 04:26:55 well, actually, I got mine first and she held out for pink Sep 09 04:27:02 I see history repeating Sep 09 04:27:05 heh Sep 09 04:27:12 no need to hold out... just skin it? Sep 09 04:27:14 I got the centro after she got the treo Sep 09 04:27:22 Like the centro, love the pre. Sep 09 04:27:29 Well, the pink Centro even had pink keys, so there's no skinning that Sep 09 04:27:37 http://www.palm.com/us/products/phones/pixi/index.html Sep 09 04:27:51 ahhh pixi Sep 09 04:28:06 I guess there's no danger of oreos with the pixi Sep 09 04:28:12 lol Sep 09 04:28:27 Oreo! For that sidekick feeling! Sep 09 04:28:28 looks like no home button either Sep 09 04:28:44 lmorchard: indeed... pink keys is too cool. erm. well ... not for me, but I would like colored keys of some sort. wasn't the pre supposed to have some Blue keys? Sep 09 04:28:50 Single buttons are so June 2007. Sep 09 04:29:00 I don't actually get the point of the home button. I never press it Sep 09 04:29:10 i hate the home button Sep 09 04:29:11 Agreed. Sep 09 04:29:13 i do quite often Sep 09 04:29:27 There's no point in that button once the gestures are all figured out. Sep 09 04:29:43 home button is for collecting lint and grease Sep 09 04:29:50 And someone mentioned having a different wave launcher drop down, as another way of breaking up app lists. Sep 09 04:29:52 LOVE that idea. Sep 09 04:29:52 what a freaking time not to have blog server access Sep 09 04:29:56 in case you need it later ala macgyver Sep 09 04:30:15 i like rubbing my home button, but i have ocd Sep 09 04:30:29 Umm Sep 09 04:30:40 sometimes i run my fingers around it in a circle Sep 09 04:30:41 oh and theres a video Sep 09 04:30:47 and the girl sounds sexy Sep 09 04:30:47 oh, finally, the press release turns up in my inbox Sep 09 04:31:00 you can never have too many buttons Sep 09 04:31:12 lol Sep 09 04:31:13 don't listen to apple Sep 09 04:31:23 People. Sep 09 04:31:24 I like the Minority Report factor on the pre Sep 09 04:31:35 Someone start a "Rod needs a phone" thread at precentral. Sep 09 04:31:49 I go back to my iPod and get all flummoxed that I can't throw things around Sep 09 04:31:49 Anyone know where the files that make up the wave launch bar are? I'm wondering if it's possible to remove the launcher icon on the end and replace it with something useful. Sep 09 04:31:54 heisenman++ Sep 09 04:31:58 Give the address buy-rod-a-pre@rwhitby.net, let them donate! Sep 09 04:31:59 freakout, you're always last, you should complain about it in the PIC post ;) Sep 09 04:32:10 I don't have an account at precentral, and I'm in the middle of some stuff. Sep 09 04:32:17 zsoc: Lol Sep 09 04:32:21 I keep trying to throw things around and scroll with flick on my desktop. Sep 09 04:32:21 But I donated, LETS GET THIS BALL ROLLING! Sep 09 04:32:29 That man needs some hardware, even if it doesn't work on a carrier yet Sep 09 04:32:29 comes from running the emulator too much Sep 09 04:32:30 yeah no joke, rod needs a phone, seriously, not something to joke about. Sep 09 04:32:44 what's infuriating is tht it's STILL sprint-exclusive Sep 09 04:32:49 WHERE IS THE GSM WEBOS DEVICE Sep 09 04:32:59 WHERE PALM, WHERE /bitterness Sep 09 04:33:29 ird, it's been looked into i believe, but not sure why it doesn't work Sep 09 04:33:36 Pixi comes with native Facebook app Sep 09 04:33:43 No wonder they wouldn't talk to me about such a thing Sep 09 04:34:10 zsoc, any idea about what files to look at? Sep 09 04:34:16 by native facebook app, you mean link to x.facebook.com? Sep 09 04:34:20 Anybody? Starting a thread? Sep 09 04:36:07 Wow, Precentral just bombarded a ton of Pixi articles ;) Sep 09 04:36:10 what does the "+" in front of some folks names here mean? Sep 09 04:36:47 It'd be nice for Pixi to be $50 or even free phone subsidized Sep 09 04:36:54 no wifi? Sep 09 04:36:56 lame Sep 09 04:37:00 That'd get WebOS out there in people's hands Sep 09 04:37:09 at 50, I'd buy one. Sep 09 04:37:14 Even with a pre. Sep 09 04:37:47 Yeah, the problem here is converting a lot of those $40/month cell phoen bill types into "internet/data" bills Sep 09 04:37:54 heisenman: you sound like me and dell mini9s... Sep 09 04:37:59 Which is why I think there needs to be virtually a free smartphone Sep 09 04:38:17 one for MacOSX one for ubuntu! Sep 09 04:38:19 the sales pitch is "sure you're going to spend $20-30/month more, but your'e going to love being on the internet" Sep 09 04:38:32 until your capped! Sep 09 04:38:37 ird, unfortunately no, i'm sure someone here can help tho Sep 09 04:38:39 superduperpre, they are super :> Sep 09 04:38:47 * zsoc wonders if he's in #webos-hardware Sep 09 04:38:57 superduperpre, they haven't capped me, lord knows i use more than 5G Sep 09 04:38:59 superduperpre, http://www.ircbeginner.com/ircinfo/mirc.html Sep 09 04:39:24 ird: thanks... i needed that! Sep 09 04:39:37 That's what google is for. Sep 09 04:39:52 or bing, if you're a ms fanboy. :) Sep 09 04:40:01 zsoc: good to hear about your usage not being capped... I worried about that although I haven't gotten anywhere near 5gb yet Sep 09 04:40:42 bing, ha Sep 09 04:41:24 ird: i am an ixquick kinda guy myself... Sep 09 04:41:35 windows7 fail Sep 09 04:42:31 zsoc: nope, I mean native webOS app Sep 09 04:42:48 ird: thankls for the info, and perhaps I should have searched before asking. I will next time, but "google it" is a pretty tired refrain. Sep 09 04:42:50 freakout, really. interesting. Sep 09 04:43:05 superduperpre, 'google it' will never get old, really. Sep 09 04:43:09 freakout: so Dieter got his hands on a Pixi and you didn't? That's gotta hurt ... Sep 09 04:43:17 unfortunately, your right Sep 09 04:43:28 super my right? Sep 09 04:43:32 until BING takes over mwahahahahaha Sep 09 04:43:34 superduperpre, Perhaps. But this channel isn't meant for questions about IRC usage. Sep 09 04:43:38 oh yay, we finally got pixi out there Sep 09 04:43:46 been waiting for that for weeks Sep 09 04:43:56 ird: yes. point taken. i'll think before doing that again. Sep 09 04:43:58 geist good job man !!!! Sep 09 04:44:06 * zsoc sighs Sep 09 04:44:13 as you can see, weve been busy Sep 09 04:44:15 400px screen. going to be REALLY SQUEEZING to get my aps on there. Sep 09 04:44:15 still are Sep 09 04:44:32 geist we understand that. Sep 09 04:45:10 qualcomm processor -- how much slower is it than a pre? Sep 09 04:45:18 pretty comperable Sep 09 04:45:24 rwhitby: seems that way Sep 09 04:45:25 lies Sep 09 04:45:28 outperforms it in some stuff Sep 09 04:45:32 engadget & gizmodo and the rest I can understand Sep 09 04:45:38 geist -- lighter on ram? 8 gig flash I saw Sep 09 04:45:39 but yeah, kernel team has had a lot of work on our hands Sep 09 04:45:43 but precentral are a fansite just like us Sep 09 04:45:48 And we've never been excluded before Sep 09 04:45:56 since were now going to ship on two different socs families Sep 09 04:45:58 there's something rotten in the state of Denmark Sep 09 04:46:19 geist, what's the model number of the pixi? i don't see it anywhere in those articles Sep 09 04:46:25 geist which two? Sep 09 04:46:35 Rick_home: hrm? Sep 09 04:46:41 oh, omap and msm Sep 09 04:47:08 geist: now I'm really peeved that you guys have been working on the Pixi instead of my .au GSM Pre!!!! ;-) Sep 09 04:47:15 hah Sep 09 04:47:28 how many people are in .au? Sep 09 04:47:30 mmmm... Sep 09 04:47:33 like 20 million? Sep 09 04:47:34 2 Sep 09 04:47:37 Geist is software, right? Sep 09 04:47:43 geist: quality, not quantity ;-) Sep 09 04:47:45 no, i am a real person Sep 09 04:47:49 i am not a bot Sep 09 04:47:51 lol Sep 09 04:47:51 GSM should be a VERY simple software tweak. Sep 09 04:47:53 rwhitby: (high-fives) Sep 09 04:48:03 in fact, sitting at a coffee shop here in MV Sep 09 04:48:09 bout to get kicked out probably Sep 09 04:48:12 MV.... Sep 09 04:48:14 ahhh Sep 09 04:48:15 closes in 10 minutes Sep 09 04:48:16 welll Sep 09 04:48:17 mountain view Sep 09 04:48:21 geist: La Boulangerie? Sep 09 04:48:23 interesting. Sep 09 04:48:24 we're happy you popped in Sep 09 04:48:33 Castro street? Sep 09 04:48:34 meh, not a big fan of lb Sep 09 04:48:37 and happy to be able to congratulate the kernal team on another rollout Sep 09 04:48:39 yeah, red rock coffee Sep 09 04:48:42 hah Sep 09 04:48:43 nice. Sep 09 04:48:48 book store right down the street. Sep 09 04:48:54 geist: (I love the sourdough bowl soups there) Sep 09 04:48:56 I'm at rengstorff and california currently :) Sep 09 04:48:58 hah, that Sep 09 04:49:01 thats nuts Sep 09 04:49:09 how late does the bookstore stay open? Sep 09 04:49:13 geist: I lived in MV in 91 for a year. Sep 09 04:49:14 9 or 10 Sep 09 04:49:30 oh that bookstore Sep 09 04:49:30 the used one has a GREAT scifi selection Sep 09 04:49:35 thought you were a block away Sep 09 04:49:46 I was lusting after the first editiong signed Moon is a Harsh Mistress. Sep 09 04:49:46 MV is not a bad place Sep 09 04:49:48 *sigh* Sep 09 04:50:10 * rwhitby enjoyed living in MV and working in SC Sep 09 04:50:24 so were there substantial kernal changes in 1.2 ???? Sep 09 04:50:25 but anywya, the pixi cpu is quite fast Sep 09 04:50:31 I'd rather do the opposite :) Sep 09 04:50:36 the 7227 has L2 cache Sep 09 04:50:37 SC is a nice town. Sep 09 04:50:38 since you guys were doing THREE things at once.... Sep 09 04:50:48 so its actually in the same league as the cortex in the omap Sep 09 04:51:01 * zsoc likes l2 cache Sep 09 04:51:14 (btw this is all stuff that you could figure out on your own) Sep 09 04:51:28 destinal, please, throw in your pixi comment to get it out of the way. Sep 09 04:51:43 yes, but asking you is so much EASIER Sep 09 04:51:54 zsoc: not much comment, we've known it was coming for a long time Sep 09 04:51:56 :) Sep 09 04:52:17 ah destinal, always the head-on-his-shoulders type ;) we need more of you :> Sep 09 04:52:25 its aq strange case where we ended up using the same name as the codename Sep 09 04:52:34 thats not common Sep 09 04:52:35 We need more donations for rwhitby. Sep 09 04:52:45 Come on, people. Sep 09 04:52:45 that is rare Sep 09 04:52:48 Measly 600 bucks. Sep 09 04:52:55 * destinal looks around for zepfloyd Sep 09 04:52:56 it's never happend to me that the product shiped with the code name Sep 09 04:53:04 Can come from a lot of different people. Sep 09 04:53:07 hm... Sep 09 04:53:19 Yeah, frankly, MS should have stuck with Longhorn in the current OS release. Sep 09 04:53:20 most of us only heard the pixi name today as well Sep 09 04:53:22 hi all Sep 09 04:53:29 summatusmentis: wb Sep 09 04:53:31 Vista somehow didn't take off that well as a name. Sep 09 04:53:33 summatusmentis, yo Sep 09 04:53:38 okay, gotta get it off my chest Sep 09 04:53:44 go ahead man Sep 09 04:53:47 zepfloyd is a treo 800w Sep 09 04:53:48 drumroll .... Sep 09 04:53:49 we're here for you... :-) Sep 09 04:53:52 that's what we're here for mate Sep 09 04:53:55 geist: lol Sep 09 04:54:05 rwhitby: thanks, GSoC got got heavy, and then school started Sep 09 04:54:09 it all makes sense now Sep 09 04:54:11 -got Sep 09 04:54:12 did early webos stuff on it Sep 09 04:54:18 before we had pres Sep 09 04:54:28 freakout: there's your scoop Sep 09 04:54:32 lol Sep 09 04:54:36 sssshhhhh Sep 09 04:54:36 HAHAHAHAHA!!!! That makes SO MUCH SENSE !!!!! Sep 09 04:54:39 let the man speak! :P Sep 09 04:54:42 geist: hehe, I guess it makes sense that you'd use existing hardware as a prototype Sep 09 04:54:45 thats it Sep 09 04:54:58 So, rwhitby HAS a treo, we could slip him a webos release for the phone HE HAS !!!! Sep 09 04:55:01 the 800w processor... Sep 09 04:55:07 its an omap2430, so its close to the pre Sep 09 04:55:08 Rick_home: Treo 650 Sep 09 04:55:25 rwhitby: we can FIND an 800w gsm Sep 09 04:55:36 that code is dead though Sep 09 04:55:40 if we're rolling our own distros for old PalmOS devices, I'm game Sep 09 04:55:41 havent maintained it for a year or so Sep 09 04:55:47 geist just needs to sneak out an email using an anonymous coffee shop ip and an anonymous mail account Sep 09 04:55:56 nah, thats it today Sep 09 04:56:09 I mean, I know it'd cut into market share but that would be a sweet OS to release... Sep 09 04:56:15 but yeah, been waiting all day for the pixi announcement Sep 09 04:56:16 well, it's still funny. Sep 09 04:56:17 Old webos framework for the 800w... Sep 09 04:56:18 knew it was coming Sep 09 04:56:35 i think it was 800w, its one of the treos Sep 09 04:56:40 I didn't expect the "e" dropped but I wondered if it might not use the codename Sep 09 04:56:52 we need to get a sprint equivalent to geist in here Sep 09 04:57:00 yeah, that was a surprise to most of us Sep 09 04:57:44 sta Sep 09 04:57:53 well, except for the zepfloyd thing, i havent told you anything Sep 09 04:57:55 any idea how the battery life will compare on the pixi? Sep 09 04:58:13 since you're the master of power managmenet? Sep 09 04:58:17 geist: perhaps not Sep 09 04:59:01 well, off for a bit Sep 09 04:59:04 kicking us out now Sep 09 04:59:10 k bye bye Sep 09 04:59:13 maybe ill find some more wifi Sep 09 04:59:13 thx geist - nice release. Sep 09 04:59:32 geist: congrats Sep 09 04:59:36 does tied house have wifi? :) Sep 09 04:59:45 thanks geist Sep 09 04:59:46 I think it does Sep 09 04:59:47 Um. Sep 09 04:59:52 go pixi go Sep 09 04:59:54 I don't see a donate thread on precentral... Sep 09 05:00:15 destinal: put helloPluginApp.focus() before helloPluginApp.initialize(), I can get key event , but still no pen event Sep 09 05:00:18 so now everyone with pre-something as their name will rue the day Sep 09 05:00:20 :) Sep 09 05:00:23 * heisenman pouts. Sep 09 05:00:28 Man, I miss living in CA... at least I get to visit regularly and work from MV Sep 09 05:00:54 we've known for a long time webos was always going to be more than just the pre, but maybe now people will listen Sep 09 05:01:17 There've been doubts about that? Sep 09 05:01:27 Sep 09 05:01:28 - Sep 09 05:01:31 one good thing is that apps will be resolution-independent from the get-go. Sep 09 05:01:53 lizardo: tied house ... mmmmmm Sep 09 05:01:53 rwhitby, how does that work anyway? is it 'cause of the html/css/javascript base Sep 09 05:01:55 rwhitby: ugh, terminal Sep 09 05:02:08 there should be a #webos event at TH sometime Sep 09 05:02:25 Dammit, now I want In-N-Out and it's 3000 miles away Sep 09 05:02:27 yeah Sep 09 05:02:30 th is great Sep 09 05:02:40 destinal: luckily the "Pre" in Preware means "Before" and not "Palm Pre (TM)" ... ;-) Sep 09 05:02:45 we do a lot of palm stuff there, cdm loves it Sep 09 05:03:01 we'll call it "buy your favorite kernel engineer | homebrewer a beer night" Sep 09 05:03:02 rwhitby: I guess i should get a hold of a pixi as a test platform for plugins now Sep 09 05:03:16 or at least reconfigure my emulator with the right res Sep 09 05:03:26 destinal: superduperpixi just doesnt ring as well Sep 09 05:03:36 superduperpre: lol Sep 09 05:03:56 * summatusmentis is hoping pixi will be available on sero, but stay on topic! Sep 09 05:04:13 what is sero? is that some carrier> Sep 09 05:04:23 grr, still havent gotten used to the keyboard on this netbook Sep 09 05:04:31 lmorchard: i would love to have in n out... I used to live up the street from the one by UCLA and would eat 5 singles "animal style" often Sep 09 05:04:35 geist: an old sprint plan Sep 09 05:04:44 geist: which netbok? Sep 09 05:04:48 mini 9 Sep 09 05:04:48 mmm... animal style Sep 09 05:04:58 destinal: wonder what the bluetooth bit-thingo will be for the pixie ... Sep 09 05:05:00 geist: ah, I just got an eee 900a a couple weeks ago Sep 09 05:05:19 it was 199, figured thats within my toy budget Sep 09 05:05:32 that deal is back up Sep 09 05:05:40 yes! i got the min9 for $199 notice as well Sep 09 05:05:42 SERO = Sprint Employee Referral Offer Sep 09 05:05:49 ^^ that Sep 09 05:06:00 and they've not been allowing new smartphones on it Sep 09 05:06:00 i want antother mini9 for windows7 Sep 09 05:06:12 superduperpre: available again, in case you missed that Sep 09 05:06:39 yeah, i got ubuntu on this one Sep 09 05:06:44 its been okay Sep 09 05:06:53 summatusmentis: yep... but had to pay rent for a couple months... not gonna happen :-/ Sep 09 05:06:54 most of the time im just sshing into my box to pick up irc anyway Sep 09 05:07:15 Ubuntu rocks, but not Dell's bloatware version Sep 09 05:07:15 superduperpre: I geet it Sep 09 05:07:28 ameng: I'm sorry, I've had very little time this week. real life getting in the way :( Sep 09 05:07:38 Is there any array copy function in js? Sep 09 05:07:40 geist: check out crunchbang, the hd footprint is significantly smaller Sep 09 05:07:50 okay might have to Sep 09 05:08:04 so far the dell version isnt pissing me off enough Sep 09 05:08:27 anyhoo, heading home Sep 09 05:08:35 kicked me outm, now im on the sidewalk outside Sep 09 05:08:36 and its cold Sep 09 05:08:44 dells ubuntu is limited to 1gb ram Sep 09 05:08:58 kernel mod for windows sake Sep 09 05:09:13 that's stupid Sep 09 05:09:24 tragic Sep 09 05:09:33 destinal: nevermind, i think i should get pen event from npruntime Sep 09 05:10:09 ameng: focus will get you key events thought Sep 09 05:10:15 s/ght/gh/ Sep 09 05:10:16 destinal meant: ameng: focus will get you key events though Sep 09 05:10:29 just saw the note about the pixi.. Sep 09 05:10:38 any news on webos 1.2 or anything? Sep 09 05:10:46 yeah .i checked termplugin, it also can not get pen event from NPP_HandleEvent Sep 09 05:11:21 yeah even classic had to deal with the pen event forwarding craziness IIRC Sep 09 05:11:44 seems key works with my dfb input driver Sep 09 05:11:54 ameng: nice Sep 09 05:13:13 * rwhitby adds PayPal: buy-rod-a-pre@rwhitby.net to his PreCentral signature ... Sep 09 05:14:07 well... looks like 1.2 isn't coming out tonight after all... unless the Grinch who stole MyTether sneaks in the chimney while I am sleeping Sep 09 05:14:35 * rwhitby wonders if there is a new emulator release for the Pixi Sep 09 05:14:49 what is pixi? Sep 09 05:15:05 new webos phone? Sep 09 05:15:09 no Sep 09 05:15:15 rwhitby: it's easy enough to change the display area height in luna (emulator or pre, either) Sep 09 05:15:32 but emulators can't be skinned!! Sep 09 05:15:44 or touchstoned Sep 09 05:15:50 whats the fun then? Sep 09 05:15:58 in luna.conf Sep 09 05:16:03 DisplayWidth=320 Sep 09 05:16:03 DisplayHeight=480 Sep 09 05:16:08 Buy Rod a Phone thread added to general discusson. Sep 09 05:16:16 just change Height to 400 and you may have a good approximation for app development Sep 09 05:16:23 I'm so gonna get banned from that site on the first day I register. Sep 09 05:16:30 heisenman: good on ya mate! Sep 09 05:16:44 good thing we left that blank area at the bottom of Preware so it would fit on the Pixi without scrolling .... Sep 09 05:17:22 oh... so can Pixi access linux and mod like the Pre? Sep 09 05:17:28 anything with webOS? Sep 09 05:17:42 superduperpre: uh, yeah, it's webos Sep 09 05:17:49 superduperpre: I'm assuming that novacom can be used on the Pixi just like the Pre. Sep 09 05:18:09 i know its webOS i wanna know if any webOS phone can inherently be "rooted" Sep 09 05:18:12 The OS is the same, it's just the hardware build and carrier image that are different Sep 09 05:18:12 and we don't do anything SoC-specific in ipkgservice Sep 09 05:18:19 cool! Sep 09 05:18:28 is the new SOC armel also? Sep 09 05:18:52 i would assume so Sep 09 05:19:06 We need some hardware pages on the wiki to capture stuff Sep 09 05:19:23 that we do Sep 09 05:19:35 aww poo Sep 09 05:19:44 my Pre has finally gotten its first defect to show up Sep 09 05:19:46 hmm, guess I'm wrong about height working on the emu, I was sure I tested that at some point... Sep 09 05:19:49 crack near the usb port Sep 09 05:19:50 they just said that pixi has bluetooth... lol but does it connect to cars or push to computers or is a glorified headphone jack? Sep 09 05:19:51 which defect? Sep 09 05:19:51 still looks the same Sep 09 05:19:58 on the screen side Sep 09 05:20:23 I really baby this phone too, has its own dedicated pocket, never shares itself with anything Sep 09 05:20:26 thank god for putty so i dont have to put that pesky usb cable in that delicate port Sep 09 05:20:27 * psykoz cries Sep 09 05:20:30 http://www.qualcomm.com/news/releases/2009/090212_Qualcomm_Targets_Sub_Smartphones.html Sep 09 05:20:35 psykoz, you know which build it is? Sep 09 05:20:45 acydlord, bought it launch day Sep 09 05:20:45 "sub" smartphones? Sep 09 05:20:58 psykoz, sprint is replacing those i believe Sep 09 05:21:07 reasonably intellegent phones? Sep 09 05:21:14 cool, I'll go talk to the sprint store then Sep 09 05:21:40 not gona get a Nobel, but gonna get the job done phones? Sep 09 05:22:06 average phones Sep 09 05:22:15 sub-smart covers a lot of turf Sep 09 05:22:19 oh... just followed the link. its sub $150, not sub smart Sep 09 05:22:32 maybe sub-smartphone is the politically correct term for dumbphone? Sep 09 05:22:38 lolz Sep 09 05:22:43 averagefone Sep 09 05:23:04 slackjawed yokel its not though Sep 09 05:23:32 it aint ignert Sep 09 05:24:34 rwhitby: ok, you can get the pixi feel by changing your palm emulator vbox xml machine file Sep 09 05:24:47 destinal: yeah, I figured so. Sep 09 05:24:51 rwhitby: good link Sep 09 05:25:06 Sep 09 05:25:06 Sep 09 05:25:08 you just check the "sub" box? Sep 09 05:25:15 i was actually gonna hold out for the pixie till i saw the screen was quite a bit smaller Sep 09 05:25:25 I can't get used to it Sep 09 05:25:31 it just feels too small :) Sep 09 05:25:45 thats what she said Sep 09 05:25:51 acydlord: lol Sep 09 05:26:01 destinal: if you've been using a 320x320 PalmOS device for the last few years like myself and rwhitby... Sep 09 05:26:08 i was hoping i could get back to this window in time Sep 09 05:26:18 i went from a centro to the pre Sep 09 05:26:26 i dont know how i got shit done on there Sep 09 05:26:43 probably cause i had the n810 tethered to it to do anything but call or text Sep 09 05:30:07 precentral's forums are getting slooooooow. lots of anticipation for the pixi and the 1.2 Sep 09 05:30:41 can anyone in here with 1.2 check something for me? Sep 09 05:34:14 boo pixi Sep 09 05:34:19 It's a crappy Pre Sep 09 05:35:15 oil: you around? Sep 09 05:35:36 no Sep 09 05:35:42 lol Sep 09 05:35:44 (im looking into it right now :) Sep 09 05:35:49 Eguy: i wouldn't say that..more like an affordable alternative to a pre Sep 09 05:35:51 hehehe aight Sep 09 05:35:53 oil: I was wring again :( Sep 09 05:36:01 wrong Sep 09 05:36:26 daybreak1199: Right....a crappier Pre without the oreo ;) Sep 09 05:37:43 I am enjoyinhg the people going crazy over removing patches hahah Sep 09 05:38:56 rwhitby: ping Sep 09 05:39:05 oil: syn|ack Sep 09 05:39:20 HattCzech's app doesn't show much for a description Sep 09 05:39:24 is it still that cdata problem? Sep 09 05:40:30 i would pastebin it Sep 09 05:40:35 but it thinks im a spammer Sep 09 05:40:40 cause there is urls in it Sep 09 05:40:45 or something Sep 09 05:41:20 oil: what's the app id? Sep 09 05:41:29 com.palm.hattczech.txtmanager Sep 09 05:43:26 quick contacts does it as well Sep 09 05:44:00 com.quickcontacts Sep 09 05:44:06 oil: there are other pastebin services Sep 09 05:44:09 just noticed that as i'm about to update it Sep 09 05:44:24 yeah Sep 09 05:44:26 but im too lazy Sep 09 05:45:32 oh, sprint, why did you get my hopes up that 1.2 would be released today? how i hate thee Sep 09 05:47:08 HattCzech: the deal is that we use a python sax parser to grab the info from the PreCentral xml file at http://www.precentral.net/precentral-ipkg-feed.xml Sep 09 05:47:29 still no <[CDATA[ tags? Sep 09 05:47:32 /sigh Sep 09 05:47:40 oh Sep 09 05:47:41 it does Sep 09 05:47:42 just... Sep 09 05:47:43 wrong? Sep 09 05:47:47 haha Sep 09 05:47:54 HattCzech: the script is at http://git.webos-internals.org/?p=preware/build.git;a=blob;f=scripts/precentral-scraper.py Sep 09 05:47:58 okay Sep 09 05:48:04 1.2 will never come out Sep 09 05:48:12 if you can work out what needs to be changed to support your desciption, I'm happy to fix it. Sep 09 05:48:14 time for my to refresh my python :) Sep 09 05:48:20 me* Sep 09 05:48:31 rwhitby: its ]]> Sep 09 05:48:54 not ]]> Sep 09 05:49:44 HattCzech Sep 09 05:49:52 so does that solve the problem? Sep 09 05:50:02 your html is bubcus also Sep 09 05:50:14 you've got a
  • tag outside of
      Sep 09 05:50:17 i don't see that CDATA in the python Sep 09 05:50:27 hmmm... let me check that Sep 09 05:50:34 or Sep 09 05:50:38 maybe im just looking at it wrong Sep 09 05:50:39 you sure? Sep 09 05:50:43 i have a lot of lists Sep 09 05:53:14 i did miss an in there Sep 09 05:53:24 huzzah Sep 09 05:55:20 hmmm, still one bullet :/ Sep 09 05:55:31 well Sep 09 05:55:38 its not real time Sep 09 05:55:45 15 minute lag on generations? Sep 09 05:56:14 ahhh... okay Sep 09 05:56:25 the xml updated... it doesn't pull that when i close and reopen the app? Sep 09 05:56:51 no Sep 09 05:57:02 rwhitbys python script takes the xml Sep 09 05:57:08 and converts it into a package feed for ipkg Sep 09 05:57:11 a standard Sep 09 05:57:18 which it only does every 15 Sep 09 05:57:22 ahhh, and that okay... Sep 09 05:57:24 * rwhitby kicks the autobuilder Sep 09 05:57:36 check now Sep 09 05:57:43 rwhitby: thanks for that qualcoom chip link earlier Sep 09 05:57:54 http://www.palminfocenter.com/news/6718/inside-the-pixi-processor/ Sep 09 05:58:08 And geist: thank *you* for that inside info :D Sep 09 05:58:16 http://www.palminfocenter.com/news/6722/not-coming-the-palm-zepfloyd/ Sep 09 05:58:19 looks the same for me, just the one bullet Sep 09 05:59:07 yeah Sep 09 05:59:08 still nothing Sep 09 05:59:09 lol Sep 09 05:59:16 that precentral xml is huge and takes a bit to load... is there a way to segment it so it pulls only when you choose an app? Sep 09 05:59:17 * oil has no answer Sep 09 05:59:33 HattCzech: Preware does not read the xml Sep 09 05:59:34 preware doesn't ever touch that xml Sep 09 05:59:46 the problem with your description is not preware Sep 09 05:59:58 okay, so the info stored after running the script...? Sep 09 06:00:27 (i'm just thinking about load time of the app, not directly about my description issue) Sep 09 06:00:38 the app is so much faster then it was before Sep 09 06:00:41 its STILL not fast enough? Sep 09 06:00:58 Too slow oil ;) Sep 09 06:00:59 i just see it struggle with precentral every time :) the rest is good Sep 09 06:01:06 it doesn't "struggle" Sep 09 06:01:13 precentrals feed is 100x larger then all the rest Sep 09 06:01:15 it takes a little longer Sep 09 06:01:18 and by a little Sep 09 06:01:20 that's my point... Sep 09 06:01:23 i mean 2 or 3 seconds Sep 09 06:01:23 Precentral has over 180 apps so yeah it will be "longer" Sep 09 06:01:28 is there a way to segment it? Sep 09 06:01:33 only pull titles or something? Sep 09 06:01:33 it IS segmented Sep 09 06:01:38 oh, damn Sep 09 06:01:40 so you dont want icons? Sep 09 06:01:48 yeah, icons too Sep 09 06:01:52 lol Sep 09 06:01:56 it loads at first Sep 09 06:01:59 then you never have to load again Sep 09 06:02:01 maybe when you get to THAT page? Sep 09 06:02:03 i dont understand your trouble Sep 09 06:02:09 valid Sep 09 06:02:11 id rather have it load at first Sep 09 06:02:14 then load every page Sep 09 06:02:21 once its done, its done Sep 09 06:02:25 good point Sep 09 06:02:39 and its still faster then pandora Sep 09 06:02:48 and palms app catalog Sep 09 06:02:54 hahahh that is true Sep 09 06:03:14 so is my description still borked, or do i just need to wait? Sep 09 06:03:22 its the xmls fault Sep 09 06:03:26 for not doing cdata right Sep 09 06:03:38 xD Sep 09 06:03:42 that or its the parser Sep 09 06:03:58 HattCzech, the parser basically takes that xml file Sep 09 06:03:59 and turns it into Sep 09 06:04:00 http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/precentral/Packages Sep 09 06:04:03 the parser can be fixed... what about the xml? Sep 09 06:04:41 nice Sep 09 06:04:42 * oil made new lunamanager icon Sep 09 06:05:00 I am enjoying that oil ty Sep 09 06:05:34 hahhaha FullDescription: "
      • Initial release

    " Sep 09 06:05:37 Pixi, hehe Sep 09 06:05:38 excellent ;) Sep 09 06:05:39 lame Sep 09 06:05:40 no wifi Sep 09 06:05:45 and no gsm :( Sep 09 06:05:50 booo gsm Sep 09 06:05:58 AT&T sucks Sep 09 06:06:03 i'm on tmob Sep 09 06:06:07 um. GSM != AT&T Sep 09 06:06:10 and i like traveling with my phone Sep 09 06:06:17 oh t-blow Sep 09 06:06:20 literally the LAST line of my description :) haha Sep 09 06:06:20 heh Sep 09 06:06:29 um, GSM != US Carriers Sep 09 06:06:36 exactly Sep 09 06:06:39 i like traveling with my phone Sep 09 06:06:48 gsm in the US sucks though Sep 09 06:06:50 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Icons Sep 09 06:06:53 I like my phone to work where I live. Sep 09 06:06:53 speeds are poor ad signal is bad Sep 09 06:06:54 new lunamanager icon? Sep 09 06:06:54 yes it does Sep 09 06:06:59 yes? no? total crap? Sep 09 06:07:11 rwhitby: does the parser check for newlines? and remove them? Sep 09 06:07:12 oil: nice Sep 09 06:07:24 (i'm assuming it does, just a bit odd that it only pulls my last line) Sep 09 06:07:27 HattCzech: you've got the source for the script :-) Yes. Sep 09 06:07:48 process monitor? Sep 09 06:07:49 WHEN? Sep 09 06:07:52 do want Sep 09 06:07:57 when puff gets it done Sep 09 06:08:17 just don't push the red button ... Sep 09 06:08:25 * oil pushes Sep 09 06:08:28 oh Sep 09 06:08:29 dont? Sep 09 06:09:02 * Eguy pushes the red button Sep 09 06:09:10 well that wasn't so ba.... BOOOM Sep 09 06:10:17 whenever i push the red button it just says "That was easy" Sep 09 06:10:34 and apparently the lady fold get upset when you put it on their back and press it Sep 09 06:11:10 lol Sep 09 06:16:38 hahahaha, fan-fing-tastic Sep 09 06:16:41 i figured it out Sep 09 06:16:52 ? Sep 09 06:16:57 \r\n vs \n Sep 09 06:17:04 lol Sep 09 06:17:06 yeah Sep 09 06:17:07 i'm using windows and it's storing those end lines Sep 09 06:17:20 damn windows users Sep 09 06:17:20 :D Sep 09 06:17:31 though Sep 09 06:17:33 hehehehe Sep 09 06:17:34 the parser should be fixed Sep 09 06:17:39 not just your description Sep 09 06:17:44 right Sep 09 06:17:52 i think it's this line... Sep 09 06:18:01 self.data = ch.encode('utf-8').replace('"', '\\"').replace(': ', ': ').replace('\n', '') Sep 09 06:18:15 slap on a .replace('\r\n', '') Sep 09 06:18:37 eh Sep 09 06:18:42 dont you want to do \r\n first Sep 09 06:18:49 then clean up any solo \n Sep 09 06:19:10 cause after \n is replaced, there wont be any \r\n Sep 09 06:19:11 just \r Sep 09 06:19:27 oh good point Sep 09 06:19:57 self.data = ch.encode('utf-8').replace('"', '\\"').replace(': ', ': ').replace('\r\n', '').replace('\n', '') Sep 09 06:20:02 rwhitby: ping Sep 09 06:20:06 rwhitby: got that? Sep 09 06:23:40 didn't fix it Sep 09 06:23:53 you can now install nano from preware Sep 09 06:23:53 ;( Sep 09 06:23:54 next... dropbear :D Sep 09 06:24:02 lol Sep 09 06:25:00 * rwhitby waits for the "Where's the icon in the launcher" posts on the Preware thread on PreCentral .... Sep 09 06:25:07 no Sep 09 06:25:12 thats after "what does this do?" Sep 09 06:25:15 lol Sep 09 06:25:19 or Sep 09 06:25:28 "i installed this and now messaging doesnt work" Sep 09 06:25:31 or Sep 09 06:25:35 "this makes my phone slow" Sep 09 06:25:48 brb Sep 09 06:25:51 "my phone goes all laggy and offline but comes back after a while" Sep 09 06:25:56 Scientific RPN Calculator, Soundboard, Dope Wars, Shopping List, Reversi (aka Othello), TipCalc, simple bible, Quick Contacts, Net2Streams SHOUTcast Radio, BlockDrop, FileMgr Service, m:Mafia, m:Vampire, TXT Manager, LaunchPoint (prev. LaunchPad), Nutrition Facts, Polar Bowling, PREtty Cute Suite, Zip Codes, Screamager, demConvert, Active Home Screen 0.3.0b (PREVIEW), Debt Free Sep 09 06:26:00 wow, that's a long list Sep 09 06:26:05 What's java? Sep 09 06:26:11 (those are all the ones that will have problems Sep 09 06:26:13 ) Sep 09 06:26:24 Eguy: What does coffee have to do with my phone? Sep 09 06:26:38 hahahhaah Sep 09 06:27:44 i guess i need to download python and get to fixin' :) Sep 09 06:27:48 HattCzech: adding the \r\n didn't change the output - did you test it yourself? Sep 09 06:28:14 no, don't have python... hmmm, but i might on my NAS Sep 09 06:28:47 yay! nas has it... now to figure out how to debug :/ Sep 09 06:29:06 HattCzech: just comment out the download line, otherwise you'll end up with a cache of all the PreCentral ipkgs. Sep 09 06:29:51 line numbers? Sep 09 06:30:51 line 79 should do it Sep 09 06:31:01 thank you Sep 09 06:34:00 am i good if i run this in it's own directory? Sep 09 06:37:02 with the ch.encode ... is that one character at a time? Sep 09 06:37:20 cuz i noticed all of the other replace statements were for one character Sep 09 06:40:22 ch is the data Sep 09 06:40:28 ch.encode is encoding the string ch Sep 09 06:40:41 i dont think its per-character Sep 09 06:40:55 alrighty... Sep 09 06:41:48 is python specific about characters and strings? (characters being in 'a' while strings being in "a") Sep 09 06:42:00 i have no clue Sep 09 06:42:02 i dont know python Sep 09 06:42:09 excellent, then we're on the same page Sep 09 06:42:14 lol Sep 09 06:42:47 damnit, nope, it doesn't care Sep 09 06:44:57 HattCzech: BTW, that's my second ever python script ;-) Sep 09 06:45:02 xD Sep 09 06:45:14 AWESOME... we are all on the same page :) hahahaaha Sep 09 06:45:40 I had to force myself not to write it in Perl. Sep 09 06:46:00 what arguments do i need to pass it? Sep 09 06:46:15 it errored out on me because i didn't give it one :) Sep 09 06:46:22 rwhitby, and then there is always ruby, the bastard child of python and perl Sep 09 06:46:24 damn the pixi is tiny Sep 09 06:46:25 looks like it needs 2? Sep 09 06:46:52 HattCzech: second param is a directory where it would put the downloaded ipkgs Sep 09 06:47:10 (which has been commented out, hopefully) Sep 09 06:47:26 acydlord: I need to learn to write Python for other reasons, so this was my first foray. I can read it fine, but haven't written much. Sep 09 06:47:36 i'll throw it a directory anyway... what's the first arg? Sep 09 06:48:00 i hear ya there rwhitby, i started out in python writing simple AI scripts Sep 09 06:48:43 HattCzech: http://git.webos-internals.org/?p=preware/build.git;a=blob;f=feeds/precentral/Makefile line 36 Sep 09 06:49:24 * rwhitby wonders if anyone is noticing how I'm training HattCzech to take over Preware feed management .... ;-) Sep 09 06:49:48 hahahaah i ain't got no job, so it gives me something to do until i find one ;) Sep 09 06:50:22 and i don't mind learning new languages... hopefully that'll help me out in the long run Sep 09 06:50:28 lol, i wish i had the money to be unemployed for awhile Sep 09 06:50:37 so many projects id like to start and catch up on Sep 09 06:50:51 NAS box. Sep 09 06:51:13 Got the damn electronics, need to design the chassis and figure out the OD. Sep 09 06:51:15 OS, rather. Sep 09 06:51:19 Someone fire me :P Sep 09 06:51:25 in theory, i'm "good" until the end of the year, but i'm not going to try that Sep 09 06:51:38 i'd rather find something and buy some toys Sep 09 06:51:55 heisenman: what kind did you get? Sep 09 06:52:06 the... Sep 09 06:52:11 J&W? Sep 09 06:52:12 well im off to bed Sep 09 06:52:20 MIni-itx socket am2 780g mobo. Sep 09 06:52:28 gotta sleep so i can deal with pebkacs and pebmacs tomorrow Sep 09 06:52:33 I'll turn off the graphics once I've got everything installed. Sep 09 06:52:38 lol, enjoy acydlord Sep 09 06:52:50 oh, so you're building one Sep 09 06:53:00 rocketraid 4000 series card, 2xmini-SAS connectors for up to 8 SATA drives. Sep 09 06:53:17 i like the SFF, which is why i bought one... costs an arm and a leg, though :/ Sep 09 06:53:24 I'll run it off a mini-itx PSP, 150W DC-DC converter and a brick. Sep 09 06:53:58 The WD drives are about 11W under load, so I should be able to keep under a 100W total power consumption, assuming I ever completely populate the raid card. Sep 09 06:54:13 But I need to do a lot of work to find out where I'm going to crash everything, Sep 09 06:54:21 yeah, you should be good... processor? that might be an issue? Sep 09 06:54:35 I've already got a ReadyNAS as my primary. I'd just like to replace it with something a little more versatile. Sep 09 06:54:53 i thought about Infrant/Netgear, but they're a bit pricier... Sep 09 06:55:03 same with Synology, but nice as well Sep 09 06:55:04 Netgear upped the price a TON. Sep 09 06:55:14 I bought the 4-bay for 650 3 years ago. Sep 09 06:55:15 yup, which is why i didn't get one of theirs Sep 09 06:55:18 yeah Sep 09 06:55:27 i got the 4-bay QNAP for $600 Sep 09 06:55:32 and i've been pleased Sep 09 06:55:48 now i want the one with the core processor, which is even pricier :( Sep 09 06:56:01 new job = new toys :) haha Sep 09 06:56:07 QNAP... Sep 09 06:56:09 Need to look it up Sep 09 06:56:13 But 4 bays is the kicker Sep 09 06:56:33 The readynas is wonderful, cept for the 450mhz powerpc (not a big deal) and the 4 bay limit (big deal) Sep 09 06:56:35 they have 5, 6, and 8 Sep 09 06:56:43 but you pay a premium for it Sep 09 06:56:48 rwhitby is choosing his apprentice Sep 09 06:56:51 Yeah... Sep 09 06:57:05 I dunno if it'll be cheaper to roll my own or buy something Sep 09 06:57:13 But I've already put a LOT of cash down for parts. Sep 09 06:57:16 probably to roll your own Sep 09 06:57:29 style-wise, i like the ones i can buy, though Sep 09 06:57:29 So unless I refocus and turn this into a tiny HTPC for the gf... Sep 09 06:57:31 I'm stuf. Sep 09 06:57:35 can't get anything else that small Sep 09 06:57:35 stuck rather. Sep 09 06:58:08 oh god! there went the script Sep 09 06:58:46 hmmm, now to figure out how to debug :/ Sep 09 06:59:42 * rwhitby uses a QNAP-TS409 which he got freebie due to optware stuff that QNAP liked Sep 09 06:59:52 what python version you using? Sep 09 06:59:58 rwhitby: that's exactly what i have Sep 09 07:00:02 is there any more web sites for boot themes/dialer thmese other than the wiki? Sep 09 07:00:04 (pro version) Sep 09 07:00:10 2.5.1 Sep 09 07:00:22 winpdb installer it is... Sep 09 07:00:29 HattCzech: yep, I have a 209 and a 109 as well, all running optware stuff. Sep 09 07:01:04 and a synology DS209 and DS408 Sep 09 07:01:08 rwhitby: think there's a way to sweet-talk QNAP into giving me a TS-439? :D Sep 09 07:01:28 4TB max? Sep 09 07:01:30 Hmf Sep 09 07:01:35 They have a firmware update coming? Sep 09 07:02:12 HattCzech: if you can match http://cia.vc/stats/author/bzhou (eno's work on Optware), yep. Sep 09 07:02:55 heisenman: should be 8TB (with 4 2TB drives) Sep 09 07:03:36 *cracks knuckles* what needs to be done? :) Sep 09 07:04:12 Yeah, ok. Sep 09 07:04:24 So 4tb is the limit based on the date of the page creation, not a limit within the device. Sep 09 07:04:35 Readynas had a 2TB limit for a while which was software. Very stupid. Sep 09 07:04:38 (not useable, that'd be like 6TB (with RAID 5)) Sep 09 07:04:39 But 1700 bucks for an 809? Sep 09 07:04:49 heisenman: http://forums.precentral.net/showthread.php?p=1879598#post1879598 Sep 09 07:04:51 like i said, PRICEY Sep 09 07:05:00 Yeah... Sep 09 07:05:05 Already got a 4-bay.. Sep 09 07:05:15 I could just have multiple 4-bay readynas's, and probably come out ahead. Sep 09 07:05:58 rwhitby: Wow. Sep 09 07:06:04 That was an avenue I hadn't thought of. Sep 09 07:06:16 Well, you're on your way to a reasonable money egg... Sep 09 07:06:25 See what the guy wants, and we'll add that in as your target. Sep 09 07:06:38 damn, rod... you get all sorts of free shit thrown at you, huh? Sep 09 07:06:59 what's a good ESN vs a bad ESN? (I know nothing about CDMA, lots about GSM) Sep 09 07:07:16 from what i can tell, sprint can block out the ESN Sep 09 07:07:27 I assume it means the phone is identified as Legit, as opposed to You Were Supposed To Return This. Sep 09 07:07:31 they can recognize it when accessing the network Sep 09 07:07:35 kinda like a sim card Sep 09 07:07:49 Again, useless for you because you have no network that'll communicate with the phone to validate the ESN. Sep 09 07:07:56 yeah Sep 09 07:08:03 So it's back to wifi for you :) Sep 09 07:08:04 bypass the activation, BAM pre Sep 09 07:08:10 bpadalino found this earlier: http://cgi.ebay.com/Palm-Pre-in-box-with-accessories-2-batteries-BAD-ESN_W0QQitemZ320421595471QQcmdZViewItemQQptZCell_Phones?hash=item4a9a9d894f&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14 Sep 09 07:08:17 (without cell service) Sep 09 07:08:22 Btw, mytether is an unbelievably easy app. Love that thing. Sep 09 07:08:38 i dislike mytether... it doesn't do what i want it to :) Sep 09 07:08:42 Jeez... Sep 09 07:08:49 concept it great, just doesn't give me all the features i want Sep 09 07:08:51 260 is a little high, but... Sep 09 07:09:03 hmm, the new pixi looks not to bad, but I still prefer the pre Sep 09 07:09:03 For what rwhitby needs, it's actually perfect. Sep 09 07:09:35 Man, the guy selling this must be bitter as hell... Sep 09 07:10:12 Ah well. Sep 09 07:10:25 Bedtime; warehouse work is tiring. Sep 09 07:10:44 Peace all. Sep 09 07:10:50 Hope the phone shows soon. Sep 09 07:11:03 adios, heisenman_zzZZzz Sep 09 07:11:41 well, rwhitby, i am off to sleep... 2am is a bit later than i should stay up (even w/o a job) Sep 09 07:11:54 Are there any technical details known about the pixi yet? /me finds nothing on the palm site Sep 09 07:11:56 i'm going to try to fix that feed issue tomorrow, and i'll let you know Sep 09 07:13:18 and i'm serious about that QNAP stuff... let me know what i need to do to work my way up in their ranks for them to send me one :) Sep 09 07:13:33 stefan_schmidt: msm7227 Sep 09 07:13:43 rwhitby: *sigh*, thanks Sep 09 07:13:50 stefan_schmidt: http://www.palminfocenter.com/news/6718/inside-the-pixi-processor/ Sep 09 07:13:57 oh, well, then it is the pre for sure Sep 09 07:14:04 freakout: thanks Sep 09 07:14:21 tell your friends, we need the buzz ;) Sep 09 07:14:59 freakout: heh, will do Sep 09 07:28:20 hmmm http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/202043-lunaservice-manager.html Sep 09 07:28:22 LOL Sep 09 07:29:37 Eguy: you called it Sep 09 07:29:53 Now you have to post "WUT IZ JAVE" Sep 09 07:30:31 CAN I HAZ RETARD MANAGER LOLZ Sep 09 07:30:37 I MEAN RESTART Sep 09 07:30:52 did anyone figure out why we didnt get the update today Sep 09 07:31:03 Palm didn't push it Sep 09 07:31:11 Pixi came out instead Sep 09 07:31:25 it will probably come tomorrow afternoo Sep 09 07:31:26 n Sep 09 07:31:29 well.. it was anounced its not out Sep 09 07:31:35 ya.. hum Sep 09 07:31:40 yes, that is what I meant Sep 09 07:32:32 thnk they are having problems on their end? Sep 09 07:32:59 "RETIRED MANAGER" Sep 09 07:33:41 lol Sep 09 07:33:56 http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a22/kat-illac/temp/retired-retarded.jpg Sep 09 07:34:43 Jack87: hey - now's your chance to get me back with some donation jibes ;-) http://forums.precentral.net/palm-general-chat/202126-rwhitby-needs-pre.html Sep 09 07:34:47 oil: lol Sep 09 07:35:17 rwhitby: basic analysis... sax.parser is messing up Sep 09 07:35:29 so i'm going to look into that further after sleeping Sep 09 07:35:36 oil: I have seen that but thanks for the memories! Sep 09 07:35:46 lol Sep 09 07:36:29 * Eguy thinks rwhitby is a dontation whore.... ;) Sep 09 07:36:38 lol rod Sep 09 07:36:39 hahaha, aren't we all? :) Sep 09 07:36:56 * ajames passes out Sep 09 07:37:04 rwhitby: if you score one, I may have to fly over to Adelaide and stalk you Sep 09 07:37:10 LOL Sep 09 07:37:16 Jack87: I dare you to go into that thread and post "How can it be a donation if you get a Pre out of it?" ;-) Sep 09 07:37:33 frakout: I thought you already do? Sep 09 07:37:43 Eguy: SSSSSSHHHHHH Sep 09 07:37:58 * freakout is hiding in rwhitby's backyard with telephoto lens right now Sep 09 07:38:24 bbl, have to pick up my car from mechanic Sep 09 07:38:41 dude lucked out an extra pre? Sep 09 07:38:50 Happen to break down in front of Rod's house? Sep 09 07:39:00 * oil thinks rwhitby should pm kennyidaho right away Sep 09 07:39:10 done Sep 09 07:39:13 go eguy lol Sep 09 07:39:38 :D Sep 09 07:39:42 goot Sep 09 07:39:43 good* Sep 09 07:39:48 very goot Sep 09 07:39:53 the first post clearly labels rwhitby as the developer of preware Sep 09 07:40:01 rwhitby: so back to where to install linux binary stuff Sep 09 07:40:05 Don;t we all know that? Sep 09 07:40:08 Don't* Sep 09 07:40:14 rwhitby: i agree regular apps should be in /var Sep 09 07:40:26 but what about stuff that provide libs Sep 09 07:40:27 like ruby Sep 09 07:40:35 There is a cardboard cutout of Rod at Palm HQ in the lobby and it says that guy rules Sep 09 07:41:03 Eguy: i've seen it, it's true Sep 09 07:41:05 hahah Sep 09 07:41:43 oil: "a" developer ... Sep 09 07:41:58 night all! Sep 09 07:42:02 one amongst many. Sep 09 07:42:03 "a" Sep 09 07:42:39 did you pm the idaho guy Sep 09 07:42:42 Oil? Developer? PAH Sep 09 07:42:55 ;) Sep 09 07:42:57 PuffTheMagic: in optware, we put them in /opt/lib, and use -rpath then linking the apps. Sep 09 07:43:18 PuffTheMagic: dunno whether that's best here or not. Sep 09 07:43:21 * oil gets him to change it to "sole" developer Sep 09 07:44:02 * rwhitby wonders what the other apps that heisenman refers to ... Sep 09 07:44:13 all of them Sep 09 07:44:17 wiki? Sep 09 07:44:19 lol Sep 09 07:44:23 i fixed my quote Sep 09 07:45:07 look at all the disappointed people that expected 1.2 LOL Sep 09 07:45:46 30,000 views Sep 09 07:47:11 im sad it will break wifi tethering Sep 09 07:47:22 It will? Sep 09 07:47:34 its probably not there because the update server was getting ddos'd all day from people constantly checking if it was there Sep 09 07:47:36 haha but at same time dont care i never use it lol Sep 09 07:47:51 I use it Sep 09 07:48:04 ya eguy atleast the web os 1.2 leak people tried wifi didnt work Sep 09 07:48:08 Good for hotels Sep 09 07:48:09 usb and bt still work Sep 09 07:48:15 Well that is good Sep 09 07:48:23 bt is too slow usb is good Sep 09 07:48:46 i cant use the bt... bugs me Sep 09 07:49:30 america's got talent is making me disy Sep 09 07:49:38 dizzt* Sep 09 07:49:42 dizzy* ahhh Sep 09 07:49:49 question... what do most people ise to access linux for pre on computer Sep 09 07:50:00 connection wise Sep 09 07:50:01 what OS Sep 09 07:50:14 windows Sep 09 07:50:44 I use putty Sep 09 07:51:06 to connect phone though Sep 09 07:51:08 wifi? Sep 09 07:51:14 usb via usbnet? Sep 09 07:51:16 oh yes wifi and wired Sep 09 07:51:22 nah just dev mode Sep 09 07:51:27 wired how Sep 09 07:51:28 no usbnet Sep 09 07:52:03 how do you use putty when wired to usb Sep 09 07:52:23 localhost Sep 09 07:52:42 i dont understand Sep 09 07:52:43 with novaproxy Sep 09 07:52:48 oh Sep 09 07:53:01 or I use novaterm on me mac Sep 09 07:53:26 i either do wifi or usbnet Sep 09 07:53:31 i like usbnet best Sep 09 07:54:01 Anybody buying the pre now because the price dropped to $149? Sep 09 07:54:03 not a big fan of novaterm atleast on windows Sep 09 07:54:15 im pissed i paid 199 Sep 09 07:54:27 haha. but sprint did not renew my contract Sep 09 07:54:45 didnt you run into the same thing eguy Sep 09 07:55:49 huh? Sep 09 07:55:58 ok home again Sep 09 07:56:09 didnt they not renew your contract either Sep 09 07:56:33 oh yes they did Sep 09 07:56:52 oh ok. i guess i got lucky Sep 09 07:56:53 off to install more mem in the mac mini Sep 09 07:56:56 bbl Sep 09 07:57:08 I did get it on the 5th though Sep 09 07:57:46 i got mine on the 10th Sep 09 07:58:10 but i changed my contract on the 6th for the pre told them not to renew it till i buy the pre Sep 09 07:58:10 ooo 2 R8's on the ring Sep 09 07:58:21 went to get the pre didnt get renewed and they sent me a check Sep 09 07:58:32 They don't renew your contract when you change your plan Sep 09 07:58:35 not anymore Sep 09 07:58:40 i know Sep 09 07:58:57 but when i bought the pre at lower price they were supposed to do it than Sep 09 07:59:36 for some reason they never did. ha i can actually go get another pre at 150 now Sep 09 07:59:52 but it would require a new contract at this point im sure they wont mess up twice Sep 09 07:59:57 why would you get another one? Besides for rwhitby anyway.... Sep 09 08:00:19 haha thats what i was going to imply. but i really dont want a new contract sorry rod Sep 09 08:00:29 If you have a pre already there are other webos products to consider Sep 09 08:00:38 not yet Sep 09 08:00:52 Says you, I've had one for months Sep 09 08:00:54 :) Sep 09 08:01:01 In november though or whenever the pixi is released Sep 09 08:01:06 chrisa is sprint rep Sep 09 08:01:09 oh yah! I forgot you were a 007 at palm Sep 09 08:01:10 ? Sep 09 08:01:13 or palm Sep 09 08:01:21 Just a grunt, nothing 007 Sep 09 08:01:27 haha Sep 09 08:01:32 But pixie was my project Sep 09 08:01:35 soooo chrisa..... Sep 09 08:01:42 WHERE IS OUR 1.2??????????????????? Sep 09 08:01:42 how do you like it chrisa Sep 09 08:01:45 hahah just kidding Sep 09 08:02:06 I prefer it, but I'm a bit bias since I'm a bit vested in it Sep 09 08:02:07 who knows maybe chrisa will tell us Sep 09 08:02:22 now tell us is wifi built in just not enabled Sep 09 08:02:26 I mean, I spent a couple weeks in china for a prototype build even Sep 09 08:02:31 chrisa: as I said to geist - how come you weren't working on my GSM Pre! ;-) Sep 09 08:02:39 I like the form factor a lot better but the screen is a bit small :( Sep 09 08:02:46 because indian guy said it does not have wifi at this time Sep 09 08:03:01 hahaha looks like you are getting a CDMA Pre rwhitby! Sep 09 08:03:12 The screen does not seem small in person Sep 09 08:03:20 there is too much space between the keyboard and bottom.. its too long it could of had more screen Sep 09 08:03:22 LOL indian guy Sep 09 08:03:29 yeah, it's a better res than my current Treo 650 .. Sep 09 08:03:43 rwhitby: We do have multiple engineering teams Sep 09 08:03:49 I wanted to ask him for a slurpy Sep 09 08:03:50 chrisa are you choosing not to answer my question? Sep 09 08:03:57 chrisa: yeah, I know - just kidding :-) Sep 09 08:03:59 I didn't see you ask one Sep 09 08:03:59 He is not allowed Sep 09 08:04:09 Palm has a kill switch on chrisa Sep 09 08:04:23 could you now tell us is wifi built in just not enabled? Sep 09 08:04:29 Kill switch is a bit too advanced, we still have irish men with clubs Sep 09 08:04:34 hahahahah Sep 09 08:04:56 you will get the kill switches from apple soon enough, thye will leave Sep 09 08:05:08 also why did sprint think 1.2 was being released yesterday Sep 09 08:05:09 I don't believe our announced specs include wifi, as opposed to saying "It has wifi, but we turn it off" Sep 09 08:05:27 Also, why would we include a chip if we weren't turning it on? That just wastes money Sep 09 08:05:28 nice answer :-) Sep 09 08:05:35 hahah well put Sep 09 08:05:47 hey! the Pre has 4G Sep 09 08:05:49 ;) Sep 09 08:05:49 haha chrisa there is a lot of stuff in the pre included and not turned on.. thats wasted coding? Sep 09 08:06:07 Jack87: no, that's just Pre-coding Sep 09 08:06:08 geist is more of a pre guy, bug him Sep 09 08:06:18 I joined well into pre's development Sep 09 08:06:39 what's in a name chrisa? Sep 09 08:06:46 Where did pixi come from Sep 09 08:06:50 just that he said "at this time it does not have wifi" thanks for clearafying i figured he just worded it wrong Sep 09 08:07:03 chrisa picked it Sep 09 08:07:05 I didn't say "at this time" Sep 09 08:07:18 I quoted you the press release Sep 09 08:07:29 Jack87 was referring to indian guy Sep 09 08:07:35 ah, oops Sep 09 08:07:40 yes the prrrrrrrrrrrrrree Sep 09 08:07:47 I lol'd Sep 09 08:07:55 Eguy: I have no idea where names come from. For both pixie/pre I didn't know the names until the public did Sep 09 08:07:56 haha ya not you chrisa Sep 09 08:08:09 sounds like a candy line Sep 09 08:08:09 intresting Sep 09 08:08:16 chrisa you are our hero by the way Sep 09 08:08:29 or line of candy I should say Sep 09 08:08:33 chrisa: I figured they couldn't find the accent for the e in pixie, so just left it off .... Sep 09 08:09:17 I'm quite surprised we named it Pixi though Sep 09 08:09:28 http://forums.precentral.net/web-os-development/202141-building-applications-webos-not-pre.html Sep 09 08:09:42 kesne_: just read that one - nice post Sep 09 08:09:48 Yeah Sep 09 08:09:51 It's handy Sep 09 08:09:51 rwhitby: Píxíé Sep 09 08:10:07 Well designed apps shouldn't really need much modification Sep 09 08:10:08 pi|xi|ay Sep 09 08:10:15 Just a way to let users know there is something further down Sep 09 08:10:15 That is true Sep 09 08:10:18 SMS from my friend after reading today's blog: "You do know you can never own a phone called a pixie, right?" Sep 09 08:10:19 an arrow, a screen fade, anything Sep 09 08:10:32 Checkers needs some mods Sep 09 08:10:36 Most apps do Sep 09 08:10:39 but SMALL things Sep 09 08:10:47 which the topic discusses. Sep 09 08:10:58 Scrollers, other stuff Sep 09 08:11:04 Good job kesne Sep 09 08:11:07 so why did sprint say yesterday was 1.2? Sep 09 08:11:15 leak Sep 09 08:11:15 Sprint didn't say it Sep 09 08:11:16 does pixi use the same web os Sep 09 08:11:20 It originally was supposed to Sep 09 08:11:23 Pixi has 1.2 Sep 09 08:11:28 yup Sep 09 08:11:28 but not the leaked version Sep 09 08:11:35 You're confusing a leaked document for a press release Sep 09 08:11:38 I "further along" version Sep 09 08:11:46 *a Sep 09 08:11:47 with a facebook app Sep 09 08:11:50 Yes Sep 09 08:11:59 A "very beta" facebook app Sep 09 08:12:03 but an app nonetheless Sep 09 08:12:05 bleh Sep 09 08:12:08 x.facebook.com Sep 09 08:12:20 I really like the timing with HTC claiming small capacitive screens are bad for users Sep 09 08:12:20 You know what sucks worse than that? Sep 09 08:12:32 haha Sep 09 08:12:33 yes Sep 09 08:12:35 yes Sep 09 08:12:35 That is funny Sep 09 08:12:42 the new one has a resistive Sep 09 08:12:43 But honestly, I love HTC Sep 09 08:12:57 The TP2 looks nice Sep 09 08:13:05 htc makes good hardware, though I question their decisions with the Hero (or was it magic, whichever is the new one) Sep 09 08:13:23 Cramming those changes on old hardware is no good Sep 09 08:13:24 although $350 for TP2 on Sprint??? pfft Sep 09 08:13:51 Haha Sep 09 08:13:58 HTC Hero on sprint Sep 09 08:14:01 I'm getting Sep 09 08:14:02 it Sep 09 08:14:10 Though, I already have too many phones sitting around Sep 09 08:14:11 chrisa: any idea on price? I reckon $99? Sep 09 08:14:15 I feel like a reviewer Sep 09 08:14:18 since the Pre just went down to $149 Sep 09 08:14:29 Eguy: if the press release doesn't say, then I have no comment Sep 09 08:14:43 $79/$50 would sell massive amounts Sep 09 08:14:44 chrisa: what if we compliment your manliness? Sep 09 08:14:48 LOL Sep 09 08:14:51 Or get you drunk? :) Sep 09 08:14:52 Haha Sep 09 08:15:09 Fun fact: back when engadget posted rumors about the Pre being delayed due to switching to the msm7x27, it was amusing Sep 09 08:15:17 Since pixie did change chipsets midway Sep 09 08:15:27 Wait, is chrisa from Palm? Sep 09 08:15:29 (pain in the ass, by the way) Sep 09 08:15:31 yes Sep 09 08:15:32 cost or size reasons? Sep 09 08:15:38 sprint had it on theri site.. im so going to find it Sep 09 08:15:45 (i won't quote you on this :P ) Sep 09 08:15:53 Palm needs a Core i7 in their next phone Sep 09 08:16:01 xD Sep 09 08:16:03 technical, the 7x27 better suited our needs Sep 09 08:16:05 That would be amazing Sep 09 08:16:17 the battery would last the boot up and die LOL Sep 09 08:16:38 I wonder what tegra battery life is like when you enable all the cores/gpus Sep 09 08:16:46 ha the site has been taken down Sep 09 08:16:50 yup Sep 09 08:16:56 Sprint took it down Sep 09 08:17:02 actually, that is one thing I've been wondering: has Pixi battery size been mentioned anywhere? Sep 09 08:17:10 quite a few slip ups by Sprint lately Sep 09 08:17:11 It's the same exact battery Sep 09 08:17:11 Same as the Pre's Sep 09 08:17:15 its same batter as the pre freakout Sep 09 08:17:15 YEah Sep 09 08:17:15 yup 1150 Sep 09 08:17:29 Echo in here folks? heh Sep 09 08:17:33 haha Sep 09 08:17:53 Also: the new HTC tatoo IS capacitive Sep 09 08:17:54 Does this mean we're all going to have go through the "can I use my Centro battery" nonsense again? Sep 09 08:18:08 THey said the tattoo was resistive Sep 09 08:18:15 They* Sep 09 08:18:15 Er Sep 09 08:18:21 You're correct Sep 09 08:18:21 * rwhitby bbl Sep 09 08:18:24 I just misread Sep 09 08:18:25 my bead Sep 09 08:18:27 *bad Sep 09 08:18:29 "Screen too small for capacitive" Sep 09 08:18:31 Read it backwards Sep 09 08:18:32 XD Sep 09 08:18:33 xD Sep 09 08:18:37 Lies Sep 09 08:18:46 inexperienced Sep 09 08:18:55 freakout: actually, a centro battery technically can work (same form factor), but I don't recommend it because I recall centro configured some settings on the battery related to sleep Sep 09 08:19:02 sprint's entire support page is down Sep 09 08:19:06 I heard about this laptop with a tiny touchpad at the top, 2 inch display Sep 09 08:19:10 It was capacitive Sep 09 08:19:43 lol my Dell XT is capacitive but the digitizer is a piece of _______ Sep 09 08:19:50 worst drivers in history Sep 09 08:19:59 chrisa: Yep, that's what I meant. the short answer was "Yes, with a but" but it didn't stop 70 gazillion forum threads on it.... Sep 09 08:20:00 Don't work in Win7 Sep 09 08:20:03 i believe they claimed pre battery has settings configured in it Sep 09 08:20:23 i use my centro to charge my spares Sep 09 08:20:24 Reminds me of a great quote from the credits of Gears of War 2 Sep 09 08:20:31 "What is best in life? The lamentations of the forums." Sep 09 08:21:00 LEEEEROYYYY JENKINSSSS Sep 09 08:21:16 hey will palm parenty cover that stupid door from falling off Sep 09 08:21:26 because i kept damn good care of it and still fell odd Sep 09 08:21:27 off* Sep 09 08:21:42 Jack: it looks much more secure from the india guy video he had a hard time opening it Sep 09 08:21:54 im talking about the pre Sep 09 08:22:03 Oh Sep 09 08:22:06 Mine is okay Sep 09 08:22:24 battery door falling off what? Sep 09 08:22:28 I've never seen mine do that Sep 09 08:22:32 no usb cover Sep 09 08:22:34 no... charge port door Sep 09 08:22:36 ohhh Sep 09 08:22:42 It is kinda cheap Sep 09 08:23:00 but the Pre isn't exactly the highest quality phone Sep 09 08:23:00 pixi's is made differently, it's a magnetic flap rather than a hanging chad Sep 09 08:23:03 Pixi looks like it has very nice doors Sep 09 08:23:04 well its beyonf jsut the door Sep 09 08:23:12 my little thin plastic bellow the door Sep 09 08:23:23 like a little britdge that broke Sep 09 08:23:38 I had no idea about these designer backs Sep 09 08:23:45 oh yes Sep 09 08:23:50 probably $80 LOL Sep 09 08:24:05 I wonder if employees can get them. I like the swirly looking one Sep 09 08:24:21 i like the black touchstone one lol Sep 09 08:24:24 chrisa, they are quite purty Sep 09 08:24:24 why is the siffy inside though Sep 09 08:24:26 Hmm, probably not inductive though Sep 09 08:24:32 they are inductive Sep 09 08:24:37 siggy* Sep 09 08:24:37 oh? Good deal Sep 09 08:24:44 I went to a great deal of trouble to import a red Treo when they came out Sep 09 08:24:49 Jack87: the inductive back for pixie is nice, yes Sep 09 08:24:51 the siggy and number should be on the outside Sep 09 08:24:53 Eguy: siffy? Sep 09 08:25:00 Hopefully these designer doors will see international release too Sep 09 08:25:05 of the artist Sep 09 08:25:07 so is palm trying to kill the tetehring work around chrisa? Sep 09 08:25:08 siggy Sep 09 08:25:11 signature Sep 09 08:25:15 I like the "Red Barn" Sep 09 08:25:24 Jack: that is the carrier's decision Sep 09 08:25:31 i know that Sep 09 08:25:38 "By drawing from personal experience and an emotional reaction to the American landscape, I confront themes of isolation, fear, destruction and resilience. Sep 09 08:25:39 - Melissa Hutton" Sep 09 08:25:47 Sounds like my life Sep 09 08:25:51 I just do bootloader/kernel/charging stuff, I have no idea about os level like whether we hate kittens, tethering or your rights as a person Sep 09 08:26:02 is palm looking to close the work around to thats my question. becaue palm never enabled it Sep 09 08:26:04 lol Sep 09 08:26:29 they did include the dun app in 1.1 but it requires msl i have not tested it Sep 09 08:26:40 i know eguy hates kittens Sep 09 08:26:45 Yes Sep 09 08:26:52 egal *eats* kittens Sep 09 08:27:04 if that were the case he would love them Sep 09 08:27:10 http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/11/God-kills-kitten.jpg Sep 09 08:27:11 You heard him growling on that vid he posted the other day, didn't you? Sep 09 08:27:18 lol Sep 09 08:27:20 No, it's like when you eat your pears Sep 09 08:27:21 lol Sep 09 08:27:24 *peas* Sep 09 08:27:36 pears are good, too Sep 09 08:27:56 jesus christ @ that link Sep 09 08:28:00 I don't believe it Sep 09 08:28:05 you've never seen that before? Sep 09 08:28:07 "at this point we do not have wifi on the pixi line" Sep 09 08:28:13 Were it true, the great kitten genocide would have occurred when I turned 13 Sep 09 08:28:14 its almost as old as the internet itself Sep 09 08:28:24 Yesh it's like teh most famous internetz pic ever Sep 09 08:28:27 yeah* Sep 09 08:28:37 does that mean more pixi's will comput later with wifi.. ahhah so tricky Sep 09 08:28:37 goatse? Sep 09 08:28:46 lol freakout how inapproiate Sep 09 08:28:49 right after goatse Sep 09 08:29:00 does the pixi come with sticks? Sep 09 08:29:03 haha its funny he did not want to reveal how much ram the pixi had Sep 09 08:29:10 Eguy: and dust? Sep 09 08:29:12 palmpreNew blog post: Sprint Pulls $100 Palm Pre Special Offer http://url.ag/miecp0 Sep 09 08:29:21 but than he said storage memory is 8 gigs Sep 09 08:29:25 so chrisa confirmed wifi for pixi? Sep 09 08:29:28 oc80z: welcome to yesterday Sep 09 08:29:30 * oil kids Sep 09 08:29:51 * Eguy wonders what the var partition is on the pixi Sep 09 08:29:53 * freakout starts blogging Sep 09 08:30:28 "Palm Employee Confirms Pixi Wi-Fi, Civil Liberties Activist Features" Sep 09 08:30:51 lol Sep 09 08:30:53 chrisa Sep 09 08:30:56 http://support.sprintpcs.com/help.do?m=showHelp&selectedDeviceId=11160&leftMenu=Check%20for%20Software%20Updates Sep 09 08:31:14 check it out... Sep 09 08:31:26 official sprint site Sep 09 08:31:28 hey its still 9/8 somewhere, right? Sep 09 08:31:32 hawaii? Sep 09 08:31:33 I work for Palm, not sprint Sep 09 08:31:34 no Sep 09 08:31:42 i know Sep 09 08:31:42 lol Sep 09 08:31:47 yes hawaii Sep 09 08:31:51 and alaska Sep 09 08:31:55 haha... i jsut had to show it was announced Sep 09 08:31:56 oh wait no Sep 09 08:32:03 but nobody cares about alaska Sep 09 08:32:09 true dat Sep 09 08:32:10 oil: stop livin' in the past, man Sep 09 08:32:13 not my palm Sep 09 08:32:16 what Sep 09 08:32:17 but still :) Sep 09 08:32:20 its already thursday in au, right? Sep 09 08:32:21 what about japan Sep 09 08:32:23 what time is it Sep 09 08:32:27 nooo oil Sep 09 08:32:28 lol Sep 09 08:32:32 * freakout 's messages are brought to you... FROM THE FUTURE!! Sep 09 08:32:34 only 630 Sep 09 08:32:43 pm Sep 09 08:32:53 6.30 PM wednesday. Sep 09 08:32:59 lol Sep 09 08:33:06 so the world hasnt ended yet? Sep 09 08:33:08 good to know Sep 09 08:33:16 lol Sep 09 08:33:18 just so odd that list doesnt have anything about facebook Sep 09 08:33:20 Indeed. Sep 09 08:33:24 bah Sep 09 08:33:28 who cares about facebook Sep 09 08:33:29 11:59pm 9/9/09 BOOOOOOOOOOOOM Sep 09 08:33:30 but than again it says it was released yesterday so ha Sep 09 08:33:32 i dont Sep 09 08:33:38 oil: I do Sep 09 08:33:44 you dont even have a pre Sep 09 08:33:46 just like y2k Sep 09 08:33:46 There are single girls I need to cyberstalk Sep 09 08:33:50 you gonna check on facebook in the emulator? Sep 09 08:33:57 lol Sep 09 08:33:58 xD Sep 09 08:34:03 * freakout cries Sep 09 08:34:05 just the fact that its different than whats on what we know of for the 1.2 pixi Sep 09 08:34:07 * oil consoles Sep 09 08:34:09 * freakout just wants to be in on the fun Sep 09 08:34:10 1.2 will be released today and brick all pres in honor of 9/9 lol Sep 09 08:34:26 eguy you confuse me Sep 09 08:34:34 * oil hopes his pre doesnt update overnight Sep 09 08:34:40 freakout is not allowed within 100 yards of a school Sep 09 08:34:42 -Support Amazon MP3 over WAN (not just WiFi) Sep 09 08:34:43 i havent removed any patches Sep 09 08:34:49 chrisa: pass it on to your coworkers that many of us admire Palm's balls Sep 09 08:34:54 remember my thread i made eguy Sep 09 08:34:55 Not in a sexual sense Sep 09 08:34:57 Jack87: thats cause the pixi doesnt have wifi Sep 09 08:34:58 the one with all the flaming Sep 09 08:35:08 haha Sep 09 08:35:09 But in the "Wow, pre-empting Apple's cult meetings" sense Sep 09 08:35:25 oil maybe because every other phone in the world lets you download straight from 3g? Sep 09 08:35:26 I think this just happened due to the fashion week timing Sep 09 08:35:28 dont forget the "no, you cant use itunes anymore" "wanna bet?" Sep 09 08:35:37 Its dates were decided before apple's "rock and roll" event I suspect Sep 09 08:35:55 oh yes Sep 09 08:35:56 pixi is aimed to market girls for webos Sep 09 08:36:03 chrisa: really? the timing seems a bit suspicious Sep 09 08:36:04 you guys bet your asses itunes 9 will break sync Sep 09 08:36:07 to take all the chicks using blackberries Sep 09 08:36:13 only because of the Pre's timing too Sep 09 08:36:18 released as it was so close to the 3GS Sep 09 08:36:18 and will be the shittiest version of tunes yet Sep 09 08:36:22 itunes* Sep 09 08:36:22 * oil goes to sleep Sep 09 08:36:24 later Sep 09 08:36:27 freakout: our plan has been fashion week for a while supposedly, that's all I know Sep 09 08:36:31 later oil Sep 09 08:36:37 see ya oil Sep 09 08:36:43 I am gonna go to sleep also Sep 09 08:36:51 Eguy got work tomorrow Sep 09 08:36:51 * freakout waves to Eguy Sep 09 08:36:51 quesition is who really cares about itunes lol Sep 09 08:37:03 Personally, I despise it Sep 09 08:37:06 i want itunes sync to break so no one relys on it Sep 09 08:37:07 Jack: obviously alot because people are bitching about it Sep 09 08:37:15 But Palm'd be crazy not to build in iTunes sync in some form Sep 09 08:37:16 but.. i like the cat and mouse fight Sep 09 08:37:20 It's too popular to ignore Sep 09 08:37:24 It is the worst software ever programmed besides norton Sep 09 08:37:29 and aol Sep 09 08:37:37 and Flash... Sep 09 08:37:39 new northon isnt so bad Sep 09 08:37:44 yes it is Sep 09 08:37:54 norton will never be good Sep 09 08:37:58 haha i dunno thats what i hear. i dont use anti v is that bad Sep 09 08:38:06 yup Sep 09 08:38:13 I bet you have a lot of viri Sep 09 08:38:16 ill live :) Sep 09 08:38:22 www.eset.com Sep 09 08:38:27 highly doubt it Sep 09 08:38:43 freakout has a lot of viruses from the stuff he downloads Sep 09 08:39:16 * freakout checks for Eguy-branded spyware Sep 09 08:39:19 I can't say in public what it is because it contains filthy material Sep 09 08:39:39 say it in watercooler all goes there Sep 09 08:39:47 oh god Sep 09 08:39:48 not that place Sep 09 08:39:52 hehe Sep 09 08:40:01 hah Sep 09 08:40:08 alrighty see ya tomorrow guys Sep 09 08:40:10 but i dont think apple will be stoping itunes sync anytime soon Sep 09 08:40:10 for 1.2 Sep 09 08:40:13 Later! Sep 09 08:40:16 adios Sep 09 08:40:19 I need to pull the eject handle too Sep 09 08:40:39 you mean later today? Sep 09 08:40:45 this afternoon Sep 09 08:40:49 chrisa: if Pixi was your project you must be chuffed at the positive reception. Kudos Sep 09 08:40:53 * freakout pulls handle Sep 09 08:41:52 chrisa pixi is really nice great work Sep 09 08:42:12 id like to get my hands on one at some point Sep 09 08:45:17 chrisa.. palm had a program that allowed you to sync your webos device with your old palm os back up stuff like note pads and such. where is it now Sep 09 08:46:30 ok found it nm Sep 09 08:48:25 http://forums.precentral.net/web-os-development/202103-1-2-do-we-need-remove-my-flashlight.html great read before I go to sleep Sep 09 08:50:02 http://www.palm.com/us/support/downloads/pre/migration/dta_windows.html Sep 09 08:50:39 there is like 2 posts eguy? Sep 09 09:30:35 interesting Sep 09 09:30:42 there is a new game on the pre pixie Sep 09 10:51:35 feds Sep 09 10:52:14 ...i dont want my pre to be up2date Sep 09 11:05:18 why? Sep 09 11:06:01 I think with almost any commercial platform, there's people that don't want to upgrade. Eventually they give up and upgrade because they're missing this feature or that feature... Sep 09 11:06:18 ... if you give in earlier, then you'll have the latest copy and all those features. Sep 09 11:06:25 you will be assimilated .... Sep 09 11:06:34 kinda what I was saying. Sep 09 11:07:11 I was really hoping they'd push 1.2.0 to my phone some time this week. I'm beginning to lose hope though Sep 09 11:07:49 so, a question to the channel. if we were to package dropbear/openssh in Preware - how would you expect to give it your ssh key? Sep 09 11:24:15 out of 193 PreCentral homebrew apps, only 6 have correct email addresses in the maintainer field ... Sep 09 11:37:49 I'd expect a simple text field where I could paste it in... or possibly select a txt file from /media/internal/ Sep 09 11:38:10 if I ever finish the app I'm working on, it'll have a correct email address. Sep 09 13:21:34 * DeCiBeL laughs until he cries.... Sep 09 13:22:41 ok, now the other 187 PreCentral homebrew apps that have palm@palm.com for the maintainer have a html link to the PreCentral user page instead. Sep 09 13:23:13 good show rwhitby .. smart idea. Sep 09 13:23:48 Now to get Preware to display them as an email or html link Sep 09 13:23:55 Anyway, about my laughing.. I can't believe the amount of people that "stayed up all night" waiting on the update. Sep 09 13:24:20 * freakout is insulted that DeCiBel is laughing at me Sep 09 13:24:27 :D Sep 09 13:24:29 * freakout has been waiting all night for the emulator to alert him Sep 09 13:24:33 I knew it wasn't coming. Sep 09 13:24:52 I just went to bed like normal.. and whenever I would wake up, I would check it. Sep 09 13:25:10 Like, the dog whining that he wanted outside.. the thunder cracking a couple times, the wife slapping me to roll over, etc. Sep 09 13:25:24 * FreeTim thinks DeCiBel ought to be committed :) Sep 09 13:25:45 hehe. yep, nothing like watching disappointed fanboys cry ;) Sep 09 13:25:48 So I got my full nights sleep.. AND didn't get the update. Oh well. Sprint always lies. Sep 09 13:26:08 If PALM would have announced it, I would have waited. Sep 09 13:26:28 I'm putting together a big roundup of Pixi press coverage for a blog today. anyone got any good links to share? Sep 09 13:27:16 Sure.. you can quote me: "The Pixie will bring about an end to the Sprint Pre" Sep 09 13:27:37 Why? You ask? Sep 09 13:28:14 Because the Pixie won't go to Sprint, therefor it will go to a larger network and more people will use it and be demanding more updates.. Which means Palm will be more opt to develop for a larger audience. Sep 09 13:28:16 interesting .. $150 for the pre now .. and palm announced the pixi officially .. yesterday at 9pm even Sep 09 13:28:20 man, where have i been Sep 09 13:28:40 Now now.. the Pre is only $150 in IPCS markets Sep 09 13:28:41 they keep this up I might start to think they remember what a product line looks like Sep 09 13:29:46 pixie got rid of the physical button in the middle of the gesture area .. interesting Sep 09 13:30:26 good Sep 09 13:30:58 did you see the videos on engadget ? facebook app and yahoo messenger along with linkedin for synergy Sep 09 13:30:58 Anyone give this post any credit? http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/202049-1-2-coming-out-today-12.html#post1878868 Sep 09 13:31:15 yeah, that's cool. hoping to see those in webos 1.2.1 :) Sep 09 13:31:19 yeah, the facebook app looks quite nice Sep 09 13:31:28 Albeit bare-bones, but you can't expect much from 1.0 Sep 09 13:31:32 linkedin for synergy on a device targetted at teens/tweens seems odd Sep 09 13:31:43 mikewx, surely it's coming to the Pre as well Sep 09 13:31:45 mikewx, i think it's a general webos update Sep 09 13:31:55 of course Sep 09 13:32:02 the "artistic covers" seem to be the teen/tween thing Sep 09 13:32:12 heh Sep 09 13:32:15 http://blog.palm.com/palm/2009/09/introducing-palm-pixi-the-newest-member-of-the-palm-webos-family-1.html Sep 09 13:32:16 Red Barn is pretty Sep 09 13:33:37 the lower-rez screen is somewhat interesting, it's a non-standard part at 320x400. seems to be would have been cheaper to keep with standard panels that the oems already make Sep 09 13:33:46 2.63" display is a little paltry Sep 09 13:34:08 not if you've been living with a 320x320 Centro ;) Sep 09 13:34:50 http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/4/2009/09/500x_palmpixi.jpg - good size comparison shot Sep 09 13:40:46 wow - pixi is taller - I didn't realise that. Sep 09 13:41:37 anyway pre looks better ;D Sep 09 13:42:06 pixi looks more durable. it's case halves prolly don't shift :) Sep 09 13:42:36 hehe Sep 09 13:43:03 well i'm trying to go to sprint store for two weeks to fix my battery issue and didnt had a chance yet Sep 09 13:43:20 i just used a piece of paper to tighten the battery Sep 09 13:43:34 i've only had that happen to me once or twice Sep 09 13:43:41 i had it once Sep 09 13:43:45 now is second time Sep 09 13:44:09 i noticed my antennas are corroding though~ I don't much like that. they're turning green Sep 09 13:44:56 oh thats bad Sep 09 13:45:47 i wonder when they gonna fix that web browser bug when you have a link let say with a date 09.09.2009 it will think that this is a phone # and will open up a dialer Sep 09 13:45:50 :S Sep 09 13:48:14 Why the hell did they leave WiFi out of the Pixie? Sep 09 13:48:39 I mean, it was rumored to be left out, but I didn't think they would actually do it. Sep 09 13:49:03 no room for it? Sep 09 13:49:05 price. feature differentiation, target audience… Sep 09 13:49:08 if i had to hazard a guess DeCiBeL, I'd say it was to avoid cannibalizing the Pre Sep 09 13:49:36 en0x: they have room for it.. the new QC chipset they put in there greatly reduced the room Sep 09 13:49:53 needed by the processor, which adds room for other parts. :) Sep 09 13:49:55 but they greatly reduced the volume of the device Sep 09 13:50:01 tis true Sep 09 13:50:06 which uses that space savings for asthetics Sep 09 13:50:26 wifi radio is small though. In fact, i know there is a WiFi radio out there that doubles as a BT radio. Sep 09 13:50:43 several of them Sep 09 13:50:48 * rwhitby bbt - only $30 raised so far at http://forums.precentral.net/palm-general-chat/202126-rwhitby-needs-pre.html Sep 09 13:50:52 but I guess that would limit the quality. Sep 09 13:50:55 night all Sep 09 13:51:05 but bt is already built into the chipset, plus you'd need supporting circuitry for it, an antenna, etc Sep 09 13:51:07 LOL.. rwhitby still tryin to raise money Sep 09 13:51:45 You could use the same antenna as the other radios.. as long as they don't operate on the same freq. Sep 09 13:52:10 Oh well.. I wouldn't jump ship..you can tell who they are targetting on this one. Sep 09 13:52:22 no you can't Sep 09 13:52:33 specifically if they don't operate on teh same frequency Sep 09 13:52:37 just from the "PC Demo" where the Easterner talks.. he hit on it.. Blackberry's. Sep 09 13:52:43 antennas (that work well) are very frequency specific Sep 09 13:52:52 night rwhitby Sep 09 13:53:26 the actual transmitters, yes, but the wires used to broadcast/receive, no. Sep 09 13:53:32 you're wrong Sep 09 13:53:41 Mmk. Sep 09 13:53:48 by omitting wifi they make it clear: the Pre is for the hardcore techies like us Sep 09 13:54:00 The Pixi is for texting teenyboppers and blackberry converts Sep 09 13:54:01 LOL.. Yes, that's obvious. :D Sep 09 13:54:08 heh Sep 09 13:54:13 Right.. They are targetting blackberry converts. Sep 09 13:54:36 and really they should do nicely in that respect Sep 09 13:54:41 besides, honestly, why do we really need wifi? it has an always on data connection and doesn't come without a data plan Sep 09 13:54:43 Pixi is prettier than most blackberries IMO Sep 09 13:54:43 I think they will. Sep 09 13:54:53 much, much thinner Sep 09 13:54:58 Mikewx: for people like me that live in fringe areas. Sep 09 13:55:07 yeah that's a problem Sep 09 13:55:16 so you get a pre! :) see, product line at work Sep 09 13:55:19 Unless I am 5 miles further into town, I get no EVDO.. I BARELY get 1xRTT Sep 09 13:55:48 Right, but that won't be a selling point made by a store associate. Sep 09 13:56:08 Store associates are horrible about understanding product lines and then translating that to the needs of the customer. Sep 09 13:56:08 wifi will be his point, you'll have to know why you need it Sep 09 13:57:14 Oh well.. Pixie sure is pretty.. But it won't replace my Pre. Sep 09 13:57:37 yeah, thats the point though. it's not supposed to Sep 09 13:57:46 which is cool actually. options! Sep 09 13:57:57 multiple webos devices Sep 09 13:58:45 at this point i'll just be taking the first bloody GSM one i can get, whichever it turns out to be Sep 09 13:59:26 I wonder how much truth there is to the rumor that Palm is stating 1.2 has been delayed "until a later date". Sep 09 13:59:44 well since it's not out, there is much truth to the rumor that it has been delayed... Sep 09 14:00:00 and every moment is later than the prior moment.. Sep 09 14:00:02 Obvious statement. Sep 09 14:00:27 In other words "closer to the end of the month". Sep 09 14:00:44 did they actually give a date? i missed that Sep 09 14:00:47 but as you said.. "every moment is 'closer to the end of the mont'" Sep 09 14:00:51 No, they didn't. Sep 09 14:01:01 They said, "Sometime before the end of the month" Sep 09 14:01:08 "possibly" Sep 09 14:15:30 interesting that so many people are jonesing for the 1.2 update Sep 09 14:28:45 bpadalino|work: tell them to call Palm. ;) Sep 09 14:33:51 hmm Sep 09 14:34:02 bet2streams is a little behind in preware feeds Sep 09 14:34:08 net2streams* Sep 09 14:34:20 oh wait Sep 09 14:34:23 my fault Sep 09 14:34:52 bpadalino|work: Or tell them to just run webosdoctor. :) Sep 09 14:35:57 bpadalino|work: which I am thinking about doing for the heck of it. I have had my Pre since 06/06 and have never FULLY cleaned it. Sep 09 14:37:56 oh wait.. I don't have that webosdoctor.. Anyone have that "leaked" version? Sep 09 14:41:28 i think there are links in the channel logs Sep 09 14:42:11 * DeCiBeL clicks the link above.. Sep 09 14:42:43 bpadalino|work: Would you consider going to that "leaked" version? Or would you just stick with the "released" webosdoctor and wait for the official OTA? Sep 09 14:42:49 IYHO... Sep 09 14:49:11 wait Sep 09 14:49:21 i wouldn't do the leaked stuff Sep 09 14:49:25 but that's just me Sep 09 14:53:47 bpadalino|work: Yeah.. I was HUGE in the WinMo world for leaked roms. I was one of the frontrunners for developing, tearing downing, reconstructing, etc for WinMo.. It got really really nasty towards teh end. Then I decided one day, "I have had it with trying to make my phone be what I want it to be.. i want something more simple.. Something that "just works".. Something that acts as a PHONE... Sep 09 14:53:49 ...first, device second.." Sep 09 14:54:09 So I sold my two Touch Pro's and bought a Pre. Sep 09 14:54:23 Sold my Mogul too. Sep 09 14:54:43 All I have left is my Q9c sitting here.. just to play tetris. That's all. Sep 09 14:56:32 while i like all the modifications that people are doing - i just prefer knowing what's going on and exploring different ideas .. i know some people want to put a whole new stack on it - and i think that's great .. just not the thing for me at the current time Sep 09 14:59:42 dopewars, it's all abotu dopewars :) Sep 09 15:01:02 i am really not that big into playing games, either .. never been very good at them Sep 09 15:01:58 a nice multi-game multi-player chess game might be nice Sep 09 15:02:08 has anyone done Go for the pre yet ? i haven't looked Sep 09 15:02:16 i like simple games that you can put down.. what most gamers claim as "lame" I like Sep 09 15:03:47 I really want a port of SmartGo Pro to the pre, but running GNU Go would be a battery killer Sep 09 15:07:08 bpadalino|work: I completely agree.. I think I am like the only person in the world that uses their Pre as basically a Phone with a couple fun apps on it.. then has an iTouch 32GB for music only. I don't have ANY apps or crap on it.. I have 20GB's of music and 1 picture (background). Sep 09 15:08:10 lmorchard, would it be that difficult to write Go in js ? Sep 09 15:08:15 maybe the AI i guess? Sep 09 15:08:45 DeCiBeL, i use mine mainly for calendar, mail and web .. i am not a big phone talker .. but i like the persistent data connection Sep 09 15:08:46 Well, the AI is exceedingly difficult, but you could port GNU Go Sep 09 15:08:58 at that point it would mainly be very slow compared top native C Sep 09 15:09:17 is the AI really that hard? interesting Sep 09 15:09:34 Go is known as one of the most challenging AI problems Sep 09 15:09:44 bpadalino|work: Aye.. I forgot that part. I have my own personal dedicated server in Tampa, FL. I installed Exchange 2007 on it. So I use my Pre for my Email/Calendar/Alarm Clock. Sep 09 15:10:24 Hmm... http://go.davepeck.org/ seems to work on the pre browser, so-so Sep 09 15:10:27 lmorchard, ah - that does ring a bell .. have people been able to test js algorithms in v8 since it does native compilation of some loops ? Sep 09 15:10:33 I used to use it for maintaining the server(s), but anymore sMMS has basically become self sufficient. Sep 09 15:11:42 Hmm, not sure, haven't seen Go in particular in JS Sep 09 15:11:50 Whoa.. did I get knocked out?? When did the Touch2 release? Sep 09 15:12:01 TouchPro2.. Sep 09 15:14:20 lmorchard, i think, beside the AI, it would be nice to have a subscription based game .. where the notifications get pushed to you when your opponent makes a move Sep 09 15:14:26 and you can have multiple games pending Sep 09 15:14:49 go.davepeck.org does that as a browser based game... I think there are a few other play-by-mail/web versions Sep 09 15:14:54 you could then host the "opponent" of GNU Go on a server somewhere Sep 09 15:14:55 but a nice app would be better Sep 09 15:15:14 Hmm, though go.davepeck.org doesn't host GNU Go I don't think Sep 09 15:15:44 If we had socket access, could make a client for http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1487 Sep 09 15:15:45 do they have the ability to play against the computer or just another human component ? Sep 09 15:15:51 er http://www.pandanet.co.jp/English/ Sep 09 15:16:01 Haha, nevermind the web comic I just sent my wife Sep 09 15:16:20 i was thinking of what a socket interface might look like .. Sep 09 15:16:27 that might be interesting to try to make Sep 09 15:16:46 IGS/PandaNet has a mostly text-based protocol over a socket Sep 09 15:16:57 you could telnet in and play by commands if you wanted to Sep 09 15:17:06 sounds perfect for a socket style connection Sep 09 15:25:10 OK gurus Sep 09 15:25:18 does webosdoc rewrite the part tables? Sep 09 15:25:36 in other words, with internal be overwritten/re-written? Sep 09 15:25:39 will* Sep 09 15:26:58 kewoo hoo Sep 09 15:27:03 just ordered my pre Sep 09 15:27:06 \o/ Sep 09 15:27:21 Congrats! Sep 09 15:27:49 Order me one.. Sep 09 15:27:50 Oh wait.. Sep 09 15:27:57 lol. Sep 09 15:28:21 * punzada does a dance similar to a conga chanting 'no more windows mobile, no more windows mobile' Sep 09 15:28:56 DeCiBeL yes media internal will be wiped. Sep 09 15:29:19 Dang. Sep 09 15:29:30 * DeCiBeL loves rsync.. Sep 09 15:29:42 tiem to fire up rsync before this wipe Sep 09 15:35:59 i need to play with that rsync stuff... anyone know if i can keep all my messages and everything after a wipe? Sep 09 15:36:14 HattCzech: I'll let you know. Sep 09 15:36:20 I think you should be able to. Sep 09 15:36:22 cool, thanks Sep 09 15:36:41 i thought so too, but with the chatThreadIds and all, i wasn't completely sure Sep 09 15:36:41 I wonder if Palm will be adding the ability to sync text messages to Exchange 14 Sep 09 15:39:06 so i'm looking at precentral, and it's telling me i should remove my tweaks before updating to 1.2 ... Sep 09 15:39:12 should i take that seriously? Sep 09 15:39:28 i went through like 3 other updates with no issues... :/ Sep 09 15:39:52 HattCzech: yes take it seriously or just backup your photos and everything. Sep 09 15:40:11 Can I question that "seriousness"? Sep 09 15:40:29 In all reality, the hack you apply would be overwritten if the file involved was updated. Sep 09 15:40:35 really if you're chaning anything in the OS (esp. in the root fs) you should back out the changes Sep 09 15:40:36 DeCiBeL yea but don't advise others against it Sep 09 15:40:40 Palm's updates are entire files, not "diff" files. Sep 09 15:40:42 that's how it worked with the previous updates Sep 09 15:40:46 Of course I am not. Sep 09 15:40:51 i just had to re-tweak after the update Sep 09 15:40:55 I would never advise against it.. Sep 09 15:41:05 There might be a reason they're making a particular point to mention it this time Sep 09 15:41:16 the changes at best are likely to get stomped and at worst could break the update process Sep 09 15:41:29 Hey.. look on the brightside though.. Sep 09 15:41:37 Palm COULD change their update methods Sep 09 15:41:41 These OTA updates aren't making you set EVERYTHINg back up again.. Ie. Apps, etc. Sep 09 15:41:47 Like the folks in WinMo world. Sep 09 15:42:02 and I also have no idea how WOSQI handles the patches, so it may run into the problem of not being able to "uninstall" the patch Sep 09 15:42:12 egaudet_work: Yes they could. But from what I have noticed, it won't be this time. :D Sep 09 15:42:28 Yeah, that is the more important thing there.. Sep 09 15:42:39 once quilt has installed the patch, it thinks its installed. Sep 09 15:43:01 If you update to a newer version of the file affected, quilt will no longer be able to "remove" the patch as it has already been deleted by the udpate. Sep 09 15:43:12 therefor quilt will be like.. "umm.. no love. Manually remove me." Sep 09 15:43:15 the novice quilters will have un fun times when they all start going "quilt pop -f" after the OTA Sep 09 15:43:50 LOL Sep 09 15:44:00 * DeCiBeL can see it now. Sep 09 15:44:13 "Why are all my hunk's failing.. WHY?" Sep 09 15:44:17 "How do I fix it?" Sep 09 15:44:35 hahaha Sep 09 15:44:56 that's why i did diff/patch and just copied the originals Sep 09 15:44:59 "format / -q -f | /sbin/shutdown die now" Sep 09 15:45:21 I do something a little better.. Sep 09 15:45:25 quilt pop -f will use the backup I believe, so people are going to have 1.2 updates, then try to quilt pop -f, replacing a file with a 1.1 file and break things Sep 09 15:45:30 I rsync my entire rootfs BEFORE the update Sep 09 15:45:33 then do it again after Sep 09 15:46:03 Then I run my fav program, "Beyond Compare" on the two directory structures to get the differences.. then apply those to the patches. Sep 09 15:46:12 It teaches me what all palm changed as well. Sep 09 15:46:45 I have entire rootfs in git Sep 09 15:46:56 on my local PC Sep 09 15:47:11 egaudet_work: Yeah, quilt pop -f moves the ORIG file over the existing. Sep 09 15:47:21 I just rsync it and hold onto it that way. Sep 09 15:47:32 I have 1.0.1, 1.0.2, 1.1 Sep 09 15:47:41 or something like that.. I haven't looked Sep 09 15:48:25 I keep it in git because it makes developing the keyboard easier Sep 09 15:48:42 Or like most uswers that come her efor help "rooting" their pre Sep 09 15:48:59 * DeCiBeL is in love with the keyboard btw. Sep 09 15:49:19 I just wish the touchscreen was a little more forgiving, like the iTouch/phone. Sep 09 15:49:47 but tbf, the itouch/phone have a larger screen to work with Sep 09 15:51:04 I think some of the smaller-key themes with spacing might help in the keyboard accuracy Sep 09 15:51:19 Is anyone developing a VOX program? Sep 09 15:51:30 or does the BT profile not support it? Sep 09 15:51:34 PuffTheMagic: finally got a compiled version of sysfsbatteryservice! Sep 09 15:51:46 now will have to play a bit more Sep 09 16:06:11 ello ello Sep 09 16:06:25 hey Sep 09 16:06:58 ? Sep 09 16:07:00 Oh.. hey Sep 09 16:07:02 What do you think of hosting keyboard themes on prethemer? Sep 09 16:07:18 Hmm Sep 09 16:07:36 Good idea.. But why not build your own repos? Sep 09 16:07:45 too much bw? Sep 09 16:07:53 I have a dedicated box you know. 1.5TB/mo Sep 09 16:08:28 talking to me eg? Sep 09 16:08:36 I'm up for it, won't be too hard to add another section Sep 09 16:08:50 what's the file structure/installation process like? Sep 09 16:09:01 It usually just a zip/rar file Sep 09 16:09:30 you unzip/unrar to a sep directory in /media/internal/onscreen-keyboard/ Sep 09 16:10:19 ok then Sep 09 16:10:36 yea right now themes are just a directory that gets unzipped to /media/internal/virtual-keyboard/themes/ Sep 09 16:10:42 to apply it, you have change the theme in the .json file Sep 09 16:10:44 I never got the ipkg installer running on ym server over the weekend :( so 1-click insallable jars won't be happening for now Sep 09 16:10:51 sorry, virtual-keyboard Sep 09 16:11:14 AnOutsider: where do you have your server hosted? Sep 09 16:11:26 company called Choopa in NJ Sep 09 16:11:28 why? Sep 09 16:11:39 Themes will be packaged into ipk's to be installed. Sep 09 16:12:22 Soon we'll have an app to modify the kb_config.json so that users can use a mojo app to change themes/preferences Sep 09 16:12:45 Just wondered.. I have always had my dedicated boxes hosted by Sago in Tampa Bay, FL/Atlanta, GA/Miami, FL Sep 09 16:13:27 Sago isn't bad. I think they're a reseller of uhh, crap what's that company Sep 09 16:13:41 the one karl zimmer owns Sep 09 16:14:02 No, Sago owns the datacenters. Sep 09 16:14:18 Steadfast that's it. I thought sago was a sub company of Steadfast Sep 09 16:14:30 maybe it's the other way around. Either way, never heard anything bad about em Sep 09 16:14:34 They ahve pics of the building with "Sago Networks" right on it. Sep 09 16:14:40 Choopa and The Planet are my main hosts. Choopa for high-bandwidth sites Sep 09 16:14:43 Yeah, always lightning fast for me. Sep 09 16:15:09 i am down to just one box that I am running vm's on Sep 09 16:15:42 got main os as CentOS for msot of ym smms.vision5.com hosting.. then 1 Windows 2k3 Enter with Exchange 2k7 Sep 09 16:15:54 then another win 2k3 enter for a filehost Sep 09 16:16:10 ah no windows boxes here. All centos Sep 09 16:16:12 all 3 have dedicated 100mbit ports Sep 09 16:16:21 yea, I wanted exchange. Sep 09 16:16:31 MOSt of my stuff in is CentOS. Sep 09 16:16:37 ah ok Sep 09 16:17:34 but sMMS has really fallen off so that box is basically just maintaining users Sep 09 16:18:34 you build websites? Sep 09 16:20:46 Hey all Sep 09 16:21:16 Sorry, yeah I do. Sep 09 16:21:34 I am not a pretty person.. In other words, I don't do graphics and stuff. Sep 09 16:21:58 I am a PHP, SQL, HTML, CSS, kinda person Sep 09 16:22:01 I do all the programming. Sep 09 16:22:06 haha I thought you were describing your physical appearance Sep 09 16:22:07 I let other people make it pretty. Sep 09 16:22:11 HAHAHA Sep 09 16:22:11 I was going to remind you this wasnt match.com Sep 09 16:22:46 But PHP/SQL are my languages of preference. Sep 09 16:23:01 I started to learn asp, asp.net, etc.. but no thanks. Sep 09 16:24:21 Agreed Sep 09 16:24:31 I wrote all the server side stuff for sMMS. Sep 09 16:24:37 I'm a mysql guy myself. Kinda stuck with the LAMP setup since a lot of clients preferred it Sep 09 16:24:40 serves me well enough Sep 09 16:25:02 (Postgresql is better, but for basic stuff mysql is fine. hehe) Sep 09 16:25:27 The database management, authentications, storage, key creation, deletion, modification, key management, user based key management, update notifys, etc) Sep 09 16:25:39 postgresql is faster Sep 09 16:25:56 It's just so hard to let go Sep 09 16:26:24 Not really replace a few functions in your head with the other ones and done. Sep 09 16:26:49 when soemthign serves you well for a long time, it's hard to switch without necessity Sep 09 16:28:44 Anyone here like Caroline's Spine? Sep 09 16:30:13 DeCiBeL: might want to include a description of what it is... Sep 09 16:30:52 Oh sorry.. The rock group called Caroline's Spine.. sang a lot in the 90's.. "Sullevin", etc. Sep 09 16:31:08 never heard of 'em Sep 09 16:31:17 creative (or creepy) name tho Sep 09 16:31:24 Yeah. Sep 09 16:31:44 they really only had 2 famous songs Sep 09 16:31:52 Attention Please and Sullevin Sep 09 16:32:17 Sullevin is kind of about the Saving Private Ryan thing.. 5 kids all go to war. Sep 09 16:32:43 So she puts 5 blue stars in the window.. then all 5 are killed and she is told to change them to gold. Sep 09 16:33:26 Anyway.. I am missing 1 fricken song from their "Attention Please" album and can't find it anywhere.. I guess Amazon.com is about to get another 99 cents from me. Sep 09 16:35:15 haha Sep 09 16:35:20 i actually dont feel bad buying from amazon Sep 09 16:35:24 DRM-free, instant download Sep 09 16:35:26 not much to dislike Sep 09 16:35:38 lot easier than scouring shady websites and torrents too Sep 09 16:35:44 AnOutsider: I found a WONDERFUL tool for iTunes m4a Sep 09 16:35:56 It strips DRM instantly, and no need for itunes login Sep 09 16:37:03 id rather nto deal with it to begin with heh Sep 09 16:37:23 * Templarian meh who uses public torrent sites Sep 09 16:37:34 Yeah, I as well like Amazon over iTunes.. However, when it comes to FullCD's, iTunes beats Amazon on certain things.. Like most recently on a Cross Canadian Ragweed Album (Released 9/1, they are Red Dirt, or Y'allTernative).. Their album had a video file you could download (if you bought the cd in store) and 3 bonus live tracks. Sep 09 16:37:35 just an hour ago an employee of mine wasripping a CD and it pissed me off that it defaults to something other than MP3. Apple touts so much about not being like MS but MS is more open than they are these days Sep 09 16:37:54 iTunes allowed you to get the 3 bonus AND the video download, where Amazon you couldn't.. Sep 09 16:38:14 was it ripping to alac? that's fine Sep 09 16:38:26 even if its apple's thing, its lossless Sep 09 16:38:57 Unfortunately, I use public torrent sites. I have lost all my memberships to private trackers because of "non-use". I was newsgrouping it for a long time. Sep 09 16:39:05 AnOutsider: MS is very open with most of their new projects I think they are changing their ways (even going as far as royalty free under licence some of their large stuff) Sep 09 16:39:06 Now I can't get into any good private music trackerw. Sep 09 16:39:12 geist: I'd prefer to use MP3 Sep 09 16:39:31 Templarian: yeah, I'm really impressed with MS lately. Windows 7, Winmo 6.5/7, the new xbox live Sep 09 16:39:49 sticking to my iphone over the zune tho haha. Too many things ahve pre-existing connectors for it Sep 09 16:39:50 Mp3 is the most compatible with the least amount of loss from compression. Sep 09 16:39:51 (I was talking development side of things, but yea those are nice). Sep 09 16:40:04 MP3 320 is what all my music is in. Sep 09 16:40:19 I just down-sampled all mine to VBR 256 Sep 09 16:40:26 192-256 Sep 09 16:40:41 Why? I am running out of room on the 32gig iTouch. Sep 09 16:40:59 And I can't tell that large of a diff between 320 and VBR256 Sep 09 16:41:07 DeCiBeL: just use pandora on your Pre. Sep 09 16:41:21 Templarian: I need a better battery for that. Sep 09 16:41:39 I work for a telecommunications company here in Tulsa, OK.. I work outside all day long. Sep 09 16:41:49 No acccess to chargers throughout the day. Sep 09 16:42:45 I wish I had better numbers on the 1350 mAh perfomance. Sep 09 16:43:09 Get yourself a charging kit. Very useful. Sep 09 16:43:12 Then again, I wonder how much 1.2 will increase/decrease batt.. Sep 09 16:43:35 I have an incar charger.. Touchstone at that.. but I am rarely in the car. Sep 09 16:43:49 Now, if there were a Solar attachment.. mmhmm Sep 09 16:44:04 All you need is a mini usb battery pack. Sep 09 16:44:39 They have them online and they are fairly compact and would probably give your device easily enough power for the day. Sep 09 16:45:06 hmm Sep 09 16:45:16 might be worth it Sep 09 16:45:24 pandora works through BT? Sep 09 16:46:59 No, just use 3G. Sep 09 16:47:12 erf? lol Sep 09 16:47:25 I think he was asking if it worked through bluetooth no? Sep 09 16:47:26 lo all Sep 09 16:47:32 sup silver Sep 09 16:47:40 AnOutsider: he was... wasn't he? Sep 09 16:48:11 lol thought so Sep 09 16:48:11 (i don't think the pre can use a networks internet through bluetooth since it doesn't have obex) Sep 09 16:48:28 oh thought he meant listening to it Sep 09 16:48:32 im curious, did anyone get replies from palm marketing regarding thier app idea submission Sep 09 16:48:36 as in, leave it in the car, carry the headset Sep 09 16:51:44 AnOutsider, Templarian: Yes, I was referring to pandora supports stereo bluetooth headsets../ Sep 09 16:53:32 (that went right over my head was doing work stuff and not paying attention) Sep 09 16:53:50 heh Sep 09 16:54:01 that's why I was like.. what the heck does 3G have to do with BT Sep 09 16:54:56 Yeah, me too. Sep 09 16:55:01 I should have clarified. Sep 09 16:55:20 Nope, it was good if I were actually reading instead of skimming. Sep 09 16:55:55 Does the Pre support Voice Activation over Bluetooth? (I Know the OS doesn't have it built in, I just wonder if the protocol support is there.) Sep 09 16:57:39 I'm waiting for this project http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/New_Bluetooth to get more focus. Replacing palm's bluetooth with a open source version. Sep 09 16:57:44 Hmm, precentral makes a few assumptions they shouldn't Sep 09 16:57:54 they sure did Sep 09 16:58:11 in that latest post"? Sep 09 16:58:31 More the memory limitations they mentioned for the pixie Sep 09 16:59:02 kinda disappointed the pixi is another sprint phone. Limitations aside, if it were GSM I'd jump all over it Sep 09 17:00:10 I'm glad to see it is a CDMA .. Let the bugs get worked out then send it over to the big dogs. Sep 09 17:00:41 Palm is a small company.. I don't think they are capable of developing a 1.0 device for the GSM monsters. Sep 09 17:00:54 im sure they are Sep 09 17:00:59 I mean, sure they are capable.. But the demand from the masses would be so high, they would be overwhelmed. Sep 09 17:00:59 palm isnt that small Sep 09 17:01:03 How big does a company need to be to use a gsm radio? Sep 09 17:01:06 we'll see. I just don't like Sprint Sep 09 17:01:15 I don't either. Sep 09 17:01:25 chrisa: sparkfun.com - you can get your own gsm radio and program your own phone Sep 09 17:01:27 one thing I'd like to see on webos tho: visual voicemail. Oh man never knew 'd miss it so much Sep 09 17:01:33 But every other provider wants me to give them $500+ to start a line of service. Sep 09 17:01:37 carrier exclusivity is helpign palm work out the kinks this time Sep 09 17:01:43 listenign to that stupid woman and her prompts Sep 09 17:02:07 Here is a thought to ponder.. See if you all agree.. Sep 09 17:02:16 silveR: yeah, and sprint isnt in the best financial situation either Sep 09 17:02:25 I work for a company who has to work with allt he major carriers....sprint and tmobile are actually very awesome itnernally Sep 09 17:02:51 AnOutsider: the boost mobile unlimited stuff is helping out big time right now Sep 09 17:03:03 but id ont belive sprint sold off thier towers. stupidstupidstupid Sep 09 17:03:11 its like thier marketing guys are outsourced to verizon Sep 09 17:04:13 and say what you will, i LOVE the iDEN network. Sep 09 17:04:24 Palm wanted to announce the Pixie before Apple's big day (Palm 2, Apple 0). Therefor, Palm announced it on the 8th and doing so, PreCentral got almost unbelievable access to record a demo of it.. along with a side by side comparison, and a palm rep giving a speech about it. I think this video inside is why Sprint or Palm (one or the other) decided to pull the 1.2 update from the Pre. In fear... Sep 09 17:04:26 ...there would be an uprising from the people asking why the Pixie has certain apps already and the pre doesn't. Sep 09 17:04:34 I mean, it's a long shot. But it's just an idea. Sep 09 17:05:30 You guys are so cute with your baseless speculation Sep 09 17:05:37 yeah doubtful. users are stupid but the iPhone has taught peopel that updates do come and they will get features if they wait Sep 09 17:05:42 coughMMScough Sep 09 17:05:52 ha Sep 09 17:06:02 if my company didnt provide me with two ATT lines id be on sprint right now Sep 09 17:06:09 I still can't believe it took 3 1/2 gens for MMS. Sep 09 17:06:26 Decibel: technically, it's still not here yet Sep 09 17:06:30 i have a first gen iPhone, and a blackberry. the blackberry is so awesome, yet so ugly Sep 09 17:06:35 Really? Sep 09 17:06:35 AnOutsider: yes it is Sep 09 17:06:46 AnOutsider: just not in USA Sep 09 17:06:47 I'm impressed that in all the CNET prizefights and reviews, the Pre is holding it's own against the 3GS Sep 09 17:06:50 gen 1 vs Gen 3 Sep 09 17:06:59 I thought 3gs added MMS support for foreigners? Sep 09 17:07:06 Correct, which is where most of their userbase is Sep 09 17:07:07 AnOutsider: MMS is enadbled in 3.0 for other carriers Sep 09 17:07:14 yes I know Sep 09 17:07:20 I actually just tricked mine into doing MMS Sep 09 17:07:23 just Ma Bell cant seem to get thier towers off lifesupport Sep 09 17:07:32 and let's be real, MMS has been available through Cydia for over a year Sep 09 17:07:40 and through att for many years Sep 09 17:07:42 Apple + ATT = clustercuck Sep 09 17:07:59 Verizon wouldve been a better entwork I think Sep 09 17:08:06 all my older phones on att have mms, my blackberry does Sep 09 17:08:09 I don't liek non-gsm networks, but I think VZW is solid Sep 09 17:08:20 yeah, they claimed it was because the iphone was so media heavy Sep 09 17:08:33 so absically they're saying, they had it, but no one used it so they never had to upgrade their network to handle it Sep 09 17:08:50 AnOutsider: i dont like verizon draconian policies, but the network is solid. Sprint has a very reliable and solid network, just, not the best publicity as of late Sep 09 17:09:15 You also have to remember it depends on the area you are in too. Sep 09 17:09:17 tmobile is an awesome VOICE network. Sep 09 17:09:20 For good reason, I've seen first hand how horrible their customer service is Sep 09 17:09:27 (sprint) Sep 09 17:09:42 and see, ive only seen good customer support from sprint Sep 09 17:09:49 Like for example.. Cox.. (I know something about them.. hint hint)... They are building out their own cell network and wanting to start out at 4g level. Sep 09 17:09:54 though ive heard the thousands of horror stories Sep 09 17:10:14 great, another media congolomerate wanting to start thier own network Sep 09 17:10:19 But in terms of frequency.. IN tulsa they won the 700MHz band.. but in Oklahoma City, they got the 1900MHz Sep 09 17:10:24 no offense DeCiBeL Sep 09 17:10:28 None taken. Sep 09 17:10:46 700MHz is like the prime jewel of cell phone freq's. Sep 09 17:10:58 Because no one uses it as of now? Sep 09 17:11:07 The lower the frequency, the better it travels.. and drum roll... Penetrates walls. Sep 09 17:11:16 or is 700mhz that good at penetrating it Sep 09 17:11:28 700MHz is darn good at penetration. Sep 09 17:11:38 i mean, im on 850mhz with att, and it can barely get through my new house Sep 09 17:11:51 and im not in a congested area Sep 09 17:12:03 Depends on wall composite too Sep 09 17:12:12 brick house = not as easy as wooden.. Sep 09 17:12:22 lots of windows / no windows Sep 09 17:12:22 yeah, this place aint brick... Sep 09 17:12:37 line of sight to tower Sep 09 17:12:39 half my office is window, the other half drywall and im hopign decent concrete Sep 09 17:12:40 lots of factors Sep 09 17:12:46 * DeCiBeL is a telecommunications engineer. :) Sep 09 17:13:08 <- former network engineer, used to intern at motorola Sep 09 17:13:25 now im more on the software side of things Sep 09 17:13:30 * Templarian lives in michigan so has a perfecty connection eveywhere :) Sep 09 17:17:22 Templarian: lucky. Sep 09 17:17:22 I am more into Data engineering. Sep 09 17:17:41 Data transport, routing, long-haul, etc. Sep 09 17:17:51 is that a fancy way to say you decide what guage wire to use Sep 09 17:17:53 ;-) Sep 09 17:17:58 LOL Sep 09 17:18:02 No, i make the directions. Sep 09 17:18:50 Someone else makes the map of all the roads int he world (makes the long haul transport, tiered backbone fiber), I make the directions between point A and B, depending on what tie ins there are. Sep 09 17:19:12 oh man, you must be amazing on roadtrips Sep 09 17:19:21 Nope.. garmin. Sep 09 17:19:32 lol Sep 09 17:20:23 But here lately I am just learning about HFC plants.. Hybrid Fiber Coaxial networks.. how fiber nodes talk with the head ends and data gets relayed through the network.. how video carriers are modulated into freq's on the line, etc. Sep 09 17:20:43 nice. not a bad line of work to be doing Sep 09 17:38:52 Nice going Sprint + Palm *claps* Sep 09 17:39:08 Eguy: ??? Sep 09 17:39:48 1.2 was delayed (of course) Sep 09 17:40:01 sonofa! Sep 09 17:40:25 * Eguy goes to reapply patches Sep 09 17:40:27 :P Sep 09 17:40:42 * oil never took them off Sep 09 17:41:05 :O Sep 09 17:41:09 bad oil! Sep 09 17:41:16 there was no update! Sep 09 17:41:20 * egaudet_work will never patches off to update Sep 09 17:41:26 Well, it's not like it's going to update without a watning Sep 09 17:41:27 * egaudet_work will never take patches off to update Sep 09 17:41:30 s/watning/warning/ Sep 09 17:41:30 lmorchard meant: Well, it's not like it's going to update without a warning Sep 09 17:41:42 lol Sep 09 17:41:51 botsnack Sep 09 17:41:55 oops Sep 09 17:41:56 heheh Sep 09 17:41:58 ~botsnack Sep 09 17:41:58 aw, gee, Eguy Sep 09 17:44:22 why doesn't it ever work for me? Sep 09 17:44:29 s/work/love Sep 09 17:44:35 s/work/love/ Sep 09 17:44:36 AnOutsider meant: s/love/love Sep 09 17:44:40 hahaha Sep 09 17:44:49 no snack for joo! Sep 09 17:44:55 lol Sep 09 17:45:08 You haev to maek typoes first Sep 09 17:45:17 s/haev/have Sep 09 17:45:23 and end it with a / Sep 09 17:45:29 Oh yeah, that's right Sep 09 17:45:37 this ain't vim here Sep 09 17:46:11 anyone played with notifications on the pre? (appcontroller.playSoundNotification) Sep 09 17:47:30 no irc app for the pre eh? that's upsetting >> Sep 09 17:48:57 I hope I don't sound incredibly stupid by asking this.. but why am I getting so many Hunk errors when trying to apply the patches with quilt? (Got the patches from the webos-internals git repo) Sep 09 17:49:43 it's only on certain ones, others apply without any issues. Sep 09 17:50:16 DeCiBeL areyou sure the versions match? Sep 09 17:50:32 i was assuming they did.. Sep 09 17:50:49 I made sure I updated with git pull first Sep 09 17:51:02 then I had nothing in my series and nothing applied Sep 09 17:51:32 most notably is the "enable-dev-mode" icon in launcher one. Sep 09 17:51:43 then a couple of the messaging app ones Sep 09 17:53:09 anyone here good with python? Sep 09 17:53:33 i need to know if there's a s/this/that/g sort of function for a file Sep 09 17:54:52 You mean a regex parser? Sep 09 17:55:16 yeah, kinda Sep 09 18:03:01 woops.. sorry.. Chatzilla doesn't like private mode Sep 09 18:03:18 last thing I sent was "then a couple of messaging app ones" Sep 09 18:04:18 kinda regex ? Sep 09 18:05:22 lol Sep 09 18:05:45 hi folks - is the app catalog unavailable for you all? Sep 09 18:05:54 palms? Sep 09 18:05:55 I'm wondering if there is an update in the works... Sep 09 18:05:59 yup palms Sep 09 18:06:11 doesnt work for me Sep 09 18:06:13 They have an app catelog? Sep 09 18:06:19 catalog* Sep 09 18:06:27 a pale imitation of preware... Sep 09 18:06:34 Quite.. Sep 09 18:06:37 lol Sep 09 18:09:58 bpadalino, i'm trying to replace newlines in a file Sep 09 18:10:39 ah, regex will work well! Sep 09 18:10:54 on a file? Sep 09 18:11:12 and if so, how? Sep 09 18:11:44 on the contents of a file ? Sep 09 18:12:12 yeah, replace all \r\n with \n in a file Sep 09 18:12:17 in which language? or are we on a shell ? Sep 09 18:12:28 file = open(filename, "r") ... Sep 09 18:12:31 python Sep 09 18:12:42 i wish it was shell, i'd be done Sep 09 18:12:59 python: read the entire file into a string, perform the substitution and then output it back ? Sep 09 18:13:31 hmmm, yeah, that would work Sep 09 18:13:35 i have a none internals question i through out in the two other chats. Sep 09 18:13:54 string.rstrip won't do it ? Sep 09 18:14:06 there you go Sep 09 18:14:14 is a file a string? Sep 09 18:14:21 i tried a .replace on it, it didn't like it Sep 09 18:14:58 no, you need to read the file contents Sep 09 18:15:33 why are you doing it in python, just wondering ? Sep 09 18:15:50 bpadalino|work hes working on the parser for the feeds Sep 09 18:15:55 its already in python Sep 09 18:16:57 hehehe yup Sep 09 18:17:34 interesting Sep 09 18:18:15 i still blame the saxparser, but i can't fix that, so i'm trying to get around it Sep 09 18:20:16 hey who has 1.2 on their pre? Sep 09 18:20:40 anyone? Sep 09 18:20:55 * chrisa raises his hand Sep 09 18:21:12 * lizardo laughs Sep 09 18:22:11 can someone send me /usr/lib/liblunaservice.so Sep 09 18:22:13 please Sep 09 18:22:57 you didnt get the leaked doctor? Sep 09 18:23:09 no Sep 09 18:23:13 didnt bother Sep 09 18:23:27 but i want to see if tehre are some new functions it Sep 09 18:23:37 cause the header they gave me references stuff on in the current one Sep 09 18:25:56 arg, sonofa! Sep 09 18:28:13 ok so who got mac and pre? Sep 09 18:28:53 chrisa: so can you send me that .so please? Sep 09 18:29:28 i have a mac at home that i use with my pre Sep 09 18:30:06 heh i have one at home too Sep 09 18:30:06 :p Sep 09 18:30:32 why do you as k? Sep 09 18:31:36 well i thought that you can access it right now Sep 09 18:31:38 nvm then Sep 09 18:33:17 argh Sep 09 18:33:24 prototype is so weird sometimes Sep 09 18:34:18 en0x, weird - why can't you just ask your question ? Sep 09 18:34:49 im basically copying the ajaxsend function from the Data demo. all i want to do is run the send() function at the end of setup. its currently being attatched to my go_button, where this.send.bind(this) works fine, but the second i put this.send.bind(this) at the end of the setup function, my program freezes Sep 09 18:35:04 id think i should be able to just call send() at the end, but any idea why i wouldnt be able too Sep 09 18:39:17 http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/202221-itunes-9-now-up-download.html Sep 09 18:39:20 lol Sep 09 18:39:57 does it work with the pre? Sep 09 18:41:03 lol, that whole thing today was a joke. Laughing through the comments on engadget. Sep 09 18:42:44 basically, they announced itunes 9, ipod nano is now flip mino with music and lower priced ipods. they also mentioned 3.1 in passing Sep 09 18:43:56 I take this as a nice plus should set the Zunes advertising up for a win when it starts up soon. Sep 09 18:47:13 So no tablet eh Sep 09 18:49:07 nah Sep 09 18:49:16 tablet is no go Sep 09 18:49:17 :p Sep 09 18:50:31 01:03 < lizardo> we'll call it "buy your favorite kernel engineer | homebrewer a beer night" Sep 09 18:50:32 hah webOs 1.2 was taken off the sprint site :P Sep 09 18:50:34 Seconding this Sep 09 18:50:52 Decimation__: long time ago Sep 09 18:50:53 :p Sep 09 18:50:55 Decimation__: will u send me liblunaservice.so Sep 09 18:50:58 chrisa wont send it Sep 09 18:50:59 upsetting to see it seems they've disabled tethering at the driver level Sep 09 18:51:48 only wifi tetherng Sep 09 18:52:15 i dont care i use it sometimes when i dont have access to wifi from my laptop Sep 09 18:54:48 oh, usb and bluetooth still work in 1.2? Sep 09 18:56:34 PuffTheMagic: is that 1.2 thing? Sep 09 18:56:45 u have 1.2 right? Sep 09 18:56:51 i need the .so form 1.2 Sep 09 18:56:51 nope Sep 09 18:56:54 i thought u had it Sep 09 18:56:55 wtf Sep 09 18:56:57 did Sep 09 18:57:08 Decimation__: u didnt save the jar/ Sep 09 18:57:09 ? Sep 09 18:57:15 wheres the file located. Sep 09 18:57:25 /usr/lib/liblunaservice.so Sep 09 18:58:09 PuffTheMagic: thats correct Sep 09 18:58:09 i dont see that file? Sep 09 18:58:19 en0x: ? Sep 09 18:58:20 punzada: ^ Sep 09 18:58:25 PuffTheMagic: tabfail Sep 09 18:59:05 wrong file Sep 09 18:59:06 :P Sep 09 18:59:47 PuffTheMagic: ping Sep 09 18:59:54 ? Sep 09 19:01:32 where does Mojo.log get store on the pre when im sshd in? Sep 09 19:02:14 i sent the file on irc puff Sep 09 19:02:19 but you didnt accept. Sep 09 19:02:36 Decimation__: i dont have file transfer Sep 09 19:02:38 ompload it Sep 09 19:04:52 http://www.cheatzcity.com/liblunaservice.so Sep 09 19:06:06 PuffTheMagic: no problem ;) Sep 09 19:07:04 thanks Sep 09 19:07:36 damn still undefined Sep 09 19:09:28 1.2 in the air Sep 09 19:09:30 i can sniff it Sep 09 19:14:41 oil, rwhitby` ... either of you around? Sep 09 19:21:08 no Sep 09 19:21:22 didn't think so Sep 09 19:21:40 so, you want to update the scraper for me? Sep 09 19:21:54 it works? Sep 09 19:22:04 if you add some lines, yes Sep 09 19:22:16 the xml is fubared, so you have to fix it Sep 09 19:22:28 then use it and works Sep 09 19:23:13 lol Sep 09 19:23:44 http://webos.pastebin.com/d4adcd80f Sep 09 19:23:57 probably best to wait for rwhitby to wake up Sep 09 19:23:59 its his baby Sep 09 19:24:02 AND there can't be any []'s in the CDATA Sep 09 19:24:17 or it fubars even more Sep 09 19:24:36 that doesnt make any sense Sep 09 19:24:41 you should be able to put whatever in the cdata Sep 09 19:24:47 stupid sax parser doesn't agree Sep 09 19:24:47 as long as its not ]]> Sep 09 19:24:58 i agree with you Sep 09 19:25:01 lol Sep 09 19:25:04 sax parser doesn't agree with us Sep 09 19:27:07 what time does he usually pop in here? Sep 09 19:27:25 uh Sep 09 19:27:47 i dont know Sep 09 19:27:49 lol Sep 09 19:27:51 heheh okay Sep 09 19:28:00 i'll check back in a bit, got some errands to run Sep 09 19:28:15 i think its what, 7 am thursday there right now? Sep 09 19:29:37 i know why they delayed webos 1.2. they wanted to see if itunes 9 would break syncing and then add it into 1.2 before rereleasing it Sep 09 19:29:39 i don't know what part of australia he lives in Sep 09 19:29:55 does it break it? Sep 09 19:30:04 engadget says so Sep 09 19:30:11 http://www.engadget.com/2009/09/09/itunes-9-breaks-pre-media-sync-what-did-you-expect/ Sep 09 19:30:12 lol Sep 09 19:30:14 yap Sep 09 19:30:40 * oil hopes they fix it Sep 09 19:30:43 * oil likes this battle Sep 09 19:30:54 yeah, it most likely is the reason for the delay, especially since they market this as a feature of the phone Sep 09 19:34:05 yep, that was my assumption too, for that same reason. Sep 09 19:34:10 i hate that Sep 09 19:34:20 * oil doesnt care about itunes Sep 09 19:34:34 neither do I Sep 09 19:34:35 they could have released 1.2 then 1.2.1 when they fixed it Sep 09 19:34:36 why is palm making users relient on itunes when its a game Sep 09 19:34:46 itunes sucks Sep 09 19:34:46 I just drop my music on the Pre via ssh Sep 09 19:34:50 i tunes sucks bad Sep 09 19:34:57 i just drag and drop it with usb Sep 09 19:35:01 i put other shit on there too Sep 09 19:35:05 use it like a portable hd Sep 09 19:35:06 dito oil Sep 09 19:35:17 it really doesnt get any easier than that Sep 09 19:35:23 it doesnt Sep 09 19:35:34 people are morons though Sep 09 19:35:37 ssh++ Sep 09 19:35:47 no offence to you itunes sync folk lol Sep 09 19:35:53 never having to plug the phone into anything++ Sep 09 19:35:59 lol Sep 09 19:36:01 yeah Sep 09 19:36:03 except to set it up in the first place? Sep 09 19:36:06 xD Sep 09 19:36:51 s/++/ anymore++ Sep 09 19:36:53 :D Sep 09 19:37:05 lol Sep 09 19:37:06 the only prob with just drop/drag music, is we really NEED a playlist creation ability.. Sep 09 19:37:06 crap... i keep forgetting the closing / Sep 09 19:37:31 i havent used a playlist in so log i cant remember the last time Sep 09 19:37:42 i either listen to a single song, or an album Sep 09 19:37:46 or shuffle all Sep 09 19:37:49 I dont even use itunes for my ipod,. I use media widget much better/easier Sep 09 19:37:49 you can use winamp to make playlists if you really want it Sep 09 19:37:59 i do the same oil Sep 09 19:38:09 i am too lazy to make and organize a playlist haha Sep 09 19:38:19 I like playlists, Sep 09 19:38:44 lol Sep 09 19:38:45 yeah Sep 09 19:38:55 i dont care about music enough to create a playlist Sep 09 19:39:03 "no, i want this song after this song, NOW its perfect!" Sep 09 19:39:09 xD Sep 09 19:39:34 before i got my pre i never listened to music in my car Sep 09 19:39:48 mostly because the cd player was broken Sep 09 19:39:53 and the radio only picked up one channel Sep 09 19:39:54 country Sep 09 19:40:02 so i would drive in silence Sep 09 19:40:14 >> cannot drive without TUNES :) Sep 09 19:40:28 its really nice sometimes Sep 09 19:40:34 silence isnt a bad thing Sep 09 19:40:45 you hear all sorts of other shit going on in the world Sep 09 19:41:47 oil...haha my thoughts exactly Sep 09 19:42:02 anyways Sep 09 19:42:05 time to go get lunch Sep 09 19:42:13 i listed to audio books and podcasts mostly Sep 09 19:42:17 ya thats why well organized music, can soothe some of that crap in the rest of the world, as long as MY car domain is my own! Sep 09 19:42:23 not used pre for it because it cant do 150% playback speed Sep 09 19:43:26 "why are the chipmunks narrating this book?" Sep 09 19:43:35 hah, new itunes has exactly what i want for the pre Sep 09 19:43:45 a desktop app location management Sep 09 19:43:55 oil: lol, if its done right, the pitch doesnt change much so it sounds pretty damn normal Sep 09 19:43:57 change icon order from the desktop Sep 09 19:44:03 lol Sep 09 19:44:04 and i get done with it 150% as fast Sep 09 19:45:01 so, an hour podcast i finish in 45 minutes Sep 09 19:46:19 let me try podshifter.com again, it has yet to work for me... Sep 09 19:47:02 wel back to working for me.. thoughtd Id pop in here to see if there was any new news, on any of it.. but guess not. tataaaaaaaa all Sep 09 20:06:49 Is there any currently patches that add key combinations? Sep 09 20:11:56 key combinations ? Sep 09 20:12:09 Like if you press shift + backspace Sep 09 20:12:14 it would do a certain command Sep 09 20:12:21 Kind've like a key bind then? Sep 09 20:12:49 by do a certain command, you mean execute something - launch something, etc ? Sep 09 20:13:07 I wonder how feasible it would be to plugin to universal search, and make give an option to "execute" Sep 09 20:13:14 Well shift backwards would do a delete command Sep 09 20:13:23 or maybe delete all current text Sep 09 20:13:51 no patch that i know of .. but sounds interesting Sep 09 20:13:57 Kind've like how the downloading tweak in Quick Install has keybinds thats do certain commands Sep 09 20:14:08 Like spacebar makes the page go down one Sep 09 20:14:14 and period is one line Sep 09 20:19:06 that's interesting Sep 09 20:20:34 I suppose you could patch the framework so that scene's do certain things with different key-combos Sep 09 20:20:57 you wouldn't be able to get it into the web browser until hidd plugins are figured out Sep 09 20:21:30 The main thing I want to implement in to select all text in the current field and delete it, because often I will type a lot into a text message and then decide to write something different. Sep 09 20:21:40 The web browser keybinds already work Sep 09 20:22:12 web browser keybinds work? Sep 09 20:22:39 According to Quick Install Sep 09 20:22:50 Press spacebar while broswing and it will scroll down a page Sep 09 20:22:57 peroid is one line Sep 09 20:23:01 and theres others Sep 09 20:23:49 That depends on what the web browser exposes. And for textfields within a webview, only insertStringAtCursor() is supplied to the javascrit Sep 09 20:24:15 as far as I can tell Sep 09 20:24:29 I also thought select all was a feature coming in 1.2 Sep 09 20:24:47 it is isnt it? Sep 09 20:27:11 I'm guessing that keybind tweak just modifies the web browser app to listen for key events Sep 09 20:28:42 but the app only has minimal control over the webview (most of it is handled in browserAdapter plugin) Sep 09 20:46:42 I didn't even know our browser had keybinds Sep 09 20:46:46 I should read our docs sometime Sep 09 20:46:52 haha Sep 09 21:04:51 chrisa, I don't think it does Sep 09 21:06:39 welcome to the msm world :) Sep 09 21:08:05 looking forward to another kernel source release at some point, I guess based on the aurora tree not the google/android one? Sep 09 21:25:27 hello all....i am trying to learn how to add patches to my palm pre can anyone help me? Sep 09 21:26:04 What have you done so far Sep 09 21:26:29 <-- emoney_33 Sep 09 21:26:38 i have virtualbox and the emulator...but was told i should not use them for patches... Sep 09 21:26:55 hey Sep 09 21:27:09 ok...so i am vista 32 bit Sep 09 21:27:28 but how do i get access to my pre? Sep 09 21:29:31 i am still confused as to how to figure out where the patches go.. Sep 09 21:29:42 gwalker_: who told you that you can't use the emulator for patches? Sep 09 21:29:51 The emulator is run inside VirtualBox. The emulator is a separate entity from the Pre. You can install patches to either of them Sep 09 21:30:02 rwhitby, I think he misunderstood a message from me Sep 09 21:30:12 i think i did also... Sep 09 21:30:17 hey rwhitby, i have a fix for your script :) Sep 09 21:30:57 gwalker_ you have downloaded the SDK from palm? And the novaterm.zip from the wiki? Sep 09 21:31:09 well when i start then virtualbos the emulator starts.. Sep 09 21:31:10 rwhitby: http://webos.pastebin.com/d4adcd80f Sep 09 21:31:18 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Portal:Accessing_Linux Sep 09 21:31:27 Which portion of the wiki procedure are you stuck at? Sep 09 21:31:28 not the novaterm.zip... Sep 09 21:31:42 Follow the Wiki procedure Sep 09 21:33:56 ok...novaterm is open.... Sep 09 21:34:17 is this where i put the patches? Sep 09 21:37:10 have you followed the next steps? Sep 09 21:37:13 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Next_steps Sep 09 21:38:23 is that the optware setup? Sep 09 21:40:20 and quilt yes Sep 09 21:41:16 Once that is done you can go to the "Importing and Applying Patches" portion of... Sep 09 21:41:17 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Applying_Patches Sep 09 21:41:57 says can not ope read only file Sep 09 21:42:10 when you do what step? Sep 09 21:42:20 mount -o remount,rw / Sep 09 21:42:30 rootfs_open Sep 09 21:42:45 or that ^ Sep 09 21:43:11 do you need the -w Sep 09 21:43:16 where is rootfs_open? Sep 09 21:43:36 i dont see that on the steps... Sep 09 21:43:52 it's not on the steps Sep 09 21:44:01 mount -o remount,rw / is Sep 09 21:44:10 HattCzech: are you sure that fixes it - didn't seem to work here. Sep 09 21:44:17 awww Sep 09 21:44:21 don't think there's a difference Sep 09 21:44:45 it fixed it when i ran it locally Sep 09 21:44:51 I have to head home Sep 09 21:44:59 what system are you running it on? Sep 09 21:45:12 ok...i will be here...trying to figure it out.. Sep 09 21:46:08 after you do the optware and quilt steps, following the applying patches. Make sure to do mount -o remount,rw / as root Sep 09 21:46:10 bbl Sep 09 21:46:34 HattCzech: macosx Sep 09 21:47:03 hmmm... and the server is running linux, correct? Sep 09 21:47:40 HattCzech: yep Sep 09 21:47:51 can you try it with the server? Sep 09 21:47:52 needs to work on both Sep 09 21:48:06 ahhh Sep 09 21:48:26 it should, in theory... but then again, everything works in theory :) Sep 09 21:48:54 what happens when you run it? same thing? Sep 09 21:49:01 yep Sep 09 21:49:09 * rwhitby notices that http://forums.precentral.net/palm-general-chat/202126-rwhitby-needs-pre.html is now at $75 Sep 09 21:49:46 how are you getting the xml from precentral? Sep 09 21:50:25 lol Sep 09 21:51:52 HattCzech: curl Sep 09 21:52:31 hmmm, i wonder if that parses newlines differently... Sep 09 21:53:09 ohhh, saxparser, how i hate thee... if only you would work the way you're supposed to Sep 09 21:59:48 urg... even with a curl get, that should have worked Sep 09 22:00:11 any options when grabbing it? Sep 09 22:00:31 has the link been removed for the unofficial 1.2 doctor? Sep 09 22:00:46 it was on some fileshare website Sep 09 22:03:43 can I just run FileCoaster to run the PreWare install ? Sep 09 22:04:02 :) please don't shoot me for asking this :) Sep 09 22:04:30 nope, you can't Sep 09 22:04:49 is preware even in the list from filecoaster? Sep 09 22:05:02 No, but it can open IPKs from any URL directly Sep 09 22:05:12 good point, but no, you can;t Sep 09 22:05:14 can't Sep 09 22:05:34 you have to install the service, which you'll need to do through webos quick install Sep 09 22:06:07 rwhitby: can you post the xml (after you grab it) somewhere i can access it? Sep 09 22:06:43 do you guys think we can use the wifi driver from 1.1 to be able to do adhoc still? Sep 09 22:07:49 FreeTim: see the wiki page. those are your only options. fileCoaster cannot install advanced homebrew. Sep 09 22:08:14 Yep sounds good I'll do that, thanks all Sep 09 22:08:24 rod... advanced homebrew is more so true homebrew wouldnt you say ;) Sep 09 22:08:56 Jack87: if it were up to me, I wouldn't say homebrew at all. Sep 09 22:09:09 the rest of "homebrew" just waiting for app catalog doors to open Sep 09 22:09:28 they are all just linux applications and webOS applications Sep 09 22:09:29 :) okay i am glad we are on the same page Sep 09 22:10:05 I don't even know where homebrew came from. it's certainly not a term in the embedded linux space. Sep 09 22:10:16 rod, can you post the xml somewhere after you grab it? Sep 09 22:10:20 hey how can i back up the physical image of my pre's filesystem Sep 09 22:10:29 (when i use curl to grab it, it still works) Sep 09 22:10:31 the first time i saw homebrew used, it was in xbox1 hacking Sep 09 22:10:35 so i want to see if the xml differs at all Sep 09 22:10:40 homebrew games written in someones home Sep 09 22:10:45 not in a game studio Sep 09 22:10:55 psp has homebrew Sep 09 22:10:55 i am trying to do the quilt setup ...and it is telling me to do the optware first...i thought i did that already...help!!! Sep 09 22:11:00 HattCzech: curl -R -L -o ... Sep 09 22:11:21 yeah, I've seen homebrew in Wii stuff Sep 09 22:11:32 but none of those things is embedded Linux Sep 09 22:11:46 atleast they didn't call it "jailbreaking" wherever that came from Sep 09 22:11:51 so is there a way i can save my pre file system or is it just as simple as sftp and copy paste over to my computer Sep 09 22:12:09 Jack87 rsync is your friend Sep 09 22:12:37 how exactly does rsync work rick. and would it allow for restoring as well Sep 09 22:12:40 oil: oh, that term is used on PreCentral ... Sep 09 22:13:40 for example... have an image of my pre the way i want it backed up.. if i run iinto any issues to webos dr than use that back up image to restore my custom settings and such Sep 09 22:14:30 that's the point Jack87 rsync can do all that Sep 09 22:14:38 rwhitby: same thing... it's working for me Sep 09 22:14:48 can you send me the xml file? Sep 09 22:14:56 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Backing_Up_via_Rsync Sep 09 22:15:01 HattCzech: /pm me your email Sep 09 22:15:05 my newlines are the same each way Sep 09 22:15:20 perfect rick.. you were reading my mind Sep 09 22:15:22 Jack87 if you are on windows on your desktop you will need a windows rsync Sep 09 22:15:24 see http://www.aboutmyip.com/AboutMyXApp/DeltaCopy.jsp Sep 09 22:16:04 HattCzech: don't worry, we'll get this sorted out today, it's just breakfast time here ... Sep 09 22:17:09 hehehe, that's good... evening here, about to head out to go coach... and the issue is still that saxparser... i'm just trying to get around it :) Sep 09 22:17:42 now when back up is made and compressed i am guessing Sep 09 22:17:53 can i extract files on my desktop as needed? Sep 09 22:18:06 rather than doing an entire restore Sep 09 22:19:59 HattCzech: sent - xml file, script, output (even put a print of the modified xml in the output file) Sep 09 22:20:10 okay cool Sep 09 22:23:43 Jack87 yes, but you need to read up in the links I sent you Sep 09 22:25:02 rwhitby: heheh, it still need to be \r\n for the replace Sep 09 22:27:36 oh i am Sep 09 22:27:53 thanks again Sep 09 22:27:55 rwhitby: i do like your syntax a bit better, though :) hahaha Sep 09 22:39:54 rwhitby: did that work? Sep 09 22:42:14 HattCzech: nope Sep 09 22:42:36 now i'm just getting confused Sep 09 22:43:34 line 97 now reads... data = open(sys.argv[1],'r').read().replace('\r\n', '') ??? Sep 09 22:45:57 The rsync binary is part of Palm's original package, so it is possible to make a wrap-around gui-based ipk for users who do not want access to linux Sep 09 22:46:16 sorry thats quote from the rsync page of the wiki Sep 09 22:46:25 HattCzech: yep Sep 09 22:46:43 so... it is possible to perhaps write an app to back up your pre to your computer Sep 09 22:46:46 *scratches head* Sep 09 22:46:50 HattCzech: and I added it to line 91 since sending to you too Sep 09 22:46:51 working for me... Sep 09 22:46:52 an image of your pre at a time you like it most. Sep 09 22:47:05 line 91 won't do anything Sep 09 22:47:16 it has to be done before making it to the sax parser Sep 09 22:47:20 how do you unsubscribe from a service? palm://blah {subscribe:flase} ? Sep 09 22:47:32 who is up for the task. i am lacking the programming skill needed sadly. but stuff like that is homebrew :) Sep 09 22:47:44 you can only trust palm's back up as far as you can throw it right? Sep 09 22:48:04 Zuchmir2: that's a good question... another thought might be if you had this.subevent = servicerequest... set this.subevent = null ?? Sep 09 22:48:30 Jack1987: i might be up for that Sep 09 22:48:55 i need to figure out the lower end of stuff anyway Sep 09 22:49:02 (from an app standpoint) Sep 09 22:49:04 Jack1987: cancel Sep 09 22:50:17 what rod? Sep 09 22:51:08 Jack1987: there is a cancel method Sep 09 22:51:12 would guess you have to notify the service that you are unsubscribing, otherwise the service will keep responding Sep 09 22:51:22 Jack1987: look in the Preware source - search for subscribe and it will be in the same file Sep 09 22:51:55 * rwhitby bbl Sep 09 22:52:00 pkg-view.js Sep 09 22:52:09 Zuchmir2: rwhitby was telling you about that Sep 09 22:52:48 oil: is this all in the git repo? Sep 09 22:52:51 oh ok.. ya zuchmir.. look at what he said to me.. it was ment for you Sep 09 22:53:05 yes Sep 09 22:53:26 http://git.webos-internals.org/?p=applications/preware.git;a=blob;f=app/assistants/pkg-view-assistant.js;h=87055825fc7937b3785ffc9cfb153736b58ddc84;hb=HEAD Sep 09 22:55:08 line 230 starts the subscription Sep 09 22:55:16 for an update Sep 09 22:55:47 368 would stop it Sep 09 22:55:59 http://git.webos-internals.org/?p=applications/preware.git;a=blob;f=app/models/IPKGService.js;h=856e1d43452638124e8d24290b3dbc55750cf006;hb=HEAD Sep 09 22:56:07 line 31 Sep 09 22:56:38 ak Sep 09 22:56:41 not 31 Sep 09 22:56:45 123 Sep 09 22:58:06 ok, so basically you have 2 methods in the service, 1) install, 2) remove Sep 09 22:58:17 2 that support subscriptions Sep 09 22:58:45 what about killing the app? does that work? :) Sep 09 22:58:52 so the the java is doing the real unsubscribe Sep 09 22:59:20 no, the app closes it Sep 09 23:00:16 where? in IPKGService.remove = function(callback, pkg, title) { Sep 09 23:00:19 can anyone help with optware install?? Sep 09 23:00:33 in pkg-view Sep 09 23:00:52 this.installSubscription = IPKGService.install(th.... Sep 09 23:01:12 gwalker_, still here Sep 09 23:01:19 yes... Sep 09 23:01:21 lol Sep 09 23:01:24 this.installSubscription.cancel(); Sep 09 23:01:42 Does anyone know if the new update addresses the lag in answering a call? Sep 09 23:01:47 did you define the cancel function or is it built-in? Sep 09 23:01:48 still having issues? Sep 09 23:01:57 its part of Mojo.Service.Request Sep 09 23:02:06 i followed the steps you told me..but it told me i still need to install optware.. Sep 09 23:02:26 okay, so if i do a request this.blah = Mojo.Service... later i can do a this.blah.cancel() Sep 09 23:02:28 correct? Sep 09 23:02:54 when i did quilt setup it said i still need to install optware... Sep 09 23:03:19 right Sep 09 23:03:22 excellent Sep 09 23:03:33 but i thought i did that...gitorious.org...right? Sep 09 23:03:40 ok, wondering what the service sees when that happens Sep 09 23:03:40 but killing the app (or scene or card or whatever) also cancels the request, correct? Sep 09 23:04:10 yeah Sep 09 23:04:24 idk if it does it automatically Sep 09 23:04:26 I'm confused as to how some of these internal .js files reference functions that they don't define, without other includes. Is this the mojo magic people speak of? Sep 09 23:04:34 but we cancel them all in the cleanup function Sep 09 23:04:55 i hope it does, cuz my app doesn't to a cancel... Sep 09 23:05:00 lol Sep 09 23:05:01 i'll be adding it shortly :) Sep 09 23:05:04 zsoc? Sep 09 23:05:05 hello everyone..havent been on here in a while but i just had to exchange my pre and for some reason rooting just isnt working..tried regular talk.py and novaproxy.py as well Sep 09 23:05:11 dunno whats wrong Sep 09 23:05:17 Tell me exactly what you did gwalker_ , did you run the optware setup (all 3 steps)? Sep 09 23:05:30 Just enable dev mode, the concept of 'rooting' doesn't really make much sense on a pre Sep 09 23:05:39 4 steps Sep 09 23:05:41 and i tried doing the sdk way but the emulator freezes when installing the sun usb drivers Sep 09 23:05:48 yes... Sep 09 23:05:57 4 steps... Sep 09 23:06:03 * HattCzech out for a bit... back later Sep 09 23:06:12 and you didn't receive any errors? Sep 09 23:06:16 pastebin the output gwalker_ Sep 09 23:06:47 pazookie, http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Portal:Accessing_Linux Sep 09 23:06:57 oil, specifically refering to palmInitMedia.js, there's fairly well 'commented' lines including functions (or what i assume are called functions in js) that i don't see defined or elsewhere explained. it basically calls the preview sink, but there's no actual code here. where's the back end of this stuff? is it compiled somewhere hidden? Sep 09 23:07:31 i'd be interested in "un-rooting" my pre; running most processes as a normal user Sep 09 23:07:51 ajames, alarmist ;) Sep 09 23:08:06 oh, idk about that, i thought you were talking about what we were talking about Sep 09 23:08:07 carry on Sep 09 23:08:10 nah, it's a good practice Sep 09 23:08:23 sorry, not trying to change the subject Sep 09 23:08:34 been there..ive been with webosinternals since before they updated and they removed all the easy rooting instructions like through terminal and so..but like i said ive tried EVERYTHING and ive rooted my pre at least 5 times now (many exchanges) Sep 09 23:09:03 oil, or, i was more hoping someone would have an answer ;) Sep 09 23:09:13 pazookie: What do you mean by rooting exactly? Sep 09 23:09:23 I mean, if you just enable dev mode you should be done Sep 09 23:09:40 more like "enabling root mode" Sep 09 23:09:47 logging in as root so i can setup users and optware Sep 09 23:10:04 right, the dev mode enabler is all you need for that Sep 09 23:10:05 and ssh Sep 09 23:10:43 yah but i cant get in via putty or terminal to send commands Sep 09 23:11:07 egaudit... Sep 09 23:11:23 dev mode enabler allows you to send commands via usb like using the talk.py script and so on Sep 09 23:11:33 it say before running script i must set up optware.. Sep 09 23:11:34 Doesn't the sdk come with novaterm? Sep 09 23:11:38 Just use that Sep 09 23:12:01 gwalker_, pastebin me the output of what you have done Sep 09 23:12:02 so far Sep 09 23:12:02 yah but i get get the sdk to load because when i install the emulater (not the actual sdk package) it rolls back cause it freezes Sep 09 23:12:21 so therefore i cant run the sdk Sep 09 23:12:43 what OS Sep 09 23:13:13 virtualbox thats it Sep 09 23:13:55 You're installing the sdk itself in a virtualbox contained os? Sep 09 23:13:56 i dont understand Sep 09 23:14:30 copy and paste the output from novaterm to webos.pastebin.com gwalker_ Sep 09 23:14:49 ? i installed the sdk in vista then tried installing virtual box..thats how it listed it on the sdk page to install Sep 09 23:14:53 hit send and then copy and paste the resulting link here Sep 09 23:14:59 chrisa: what do you do at palm? Sep 09 23:15:10 bootloader/kernel/charging Sep 09 23:15:11 pazookie, if you downloaded the sdk just use novaterm Sep 09 23:15:31 novaterm is installed before installing the emulator, as I understand it Sep 09 23:15:32 im not very familiar with the sdk..i never used it to install homebrew when with my last pre..i used winscp and copied the extracted files using 7ip from the ipk files Sep 09 23:15:37 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Portal:Accessing_Linux Sep 09 23:15:50 procedure Sep 09 23:15:51 it is not letting me the only thing it is pasting is the web address gitorious.org Sep 09 23:16:13 take a screenshot and put it on imageshack Sep 09 23:16:52 gwalker_, if you just want to install patches and don't care about accessing linux just use webos quick install Sep 09 23:17:38 ok...that might be better...but how do i install patches that way...like for forwarding text messages... Sep 09 23:18:34 if "rooting" is an issue i cant imagine what is gonna happen when you try patching Sep 09 23:18:58 there's a tweaks menu somewhere Sep 09 23:19:11 http://forums.precentral.net/homebrew-apps/194832-webos-quick-install.html Sep 09 23:19:40 yeah i have that...but my tweaks menu only has 9 thngs on it Sep 09 23:19:47 im just so stumped..everytime ive gexchanged my pre..ive had it rooted, users and optware setup, dropbear installed and winscp going and already copying over all my apps and applying patches in less than 10 mins Sep 09 23:19:48 PuffTheMagic, be nice now :) Sep 09 23:19:50 you have the latest version? Sep 09 23:20:12 but now it just wont find my pre Sep 09 23:20:20 pazookie, put it in dev mode and run novaterm... Sep 09 23:20:45 zsoc: im in my after dinner haze, had a mojito before dinner and 1/2 bottle of wine for dinner and some Tia Maria in my coffee :D Sep 09 23:21:27 PuffTheMagic, ah, i getcha. the booze is generally how my violent comments come out, lol. speaking of which, i should get started. Sep 09 23:22:01 zsoc: this is all on the wiki... like cut an paste pratically Sep 09 23:22:10 tru tru Sep 09 23:22:16 yes Sep 09 23:22:32 but at the same time it makes me fear to ask you my noob questions ;) Sep 09 23:23:10 its in dev mode of course and i get failed to connect to novacomd Sep 09 23:23:18 ive told you guys ive tried everything Sep 09 23:23:22 :( Sep 09 23:23:34 its prolly something really stupid Sep 09 23:23:37 zsoc: i will answer anything i can if its dev related... something that is gonna result in new code or new apps/patches... which is different for help about applying a patch Sep 09 23:23:39 but im stumped Sep 09 23:23:52 zsoc: if i went into a windows ce channel asking how to run a msi file i would be shot im sure Sep 09 23:23:56 Failed to connect means you likely don't have the novacomd service running on your system Sep 09 23:24:19 ive uninstalled it and reinstalled the service multiple times Sep 09 23:24:26 but the wiki is pretty damn over-verbose Sep 09 23:24:39 and could get to the info much quicker Sep 09 23:24:44 but i dont want to edit it Sep 09 23:25:00 as im afraid of aunti minnie fans :D Sep 09 23:25:15 PuffTheMagic, my question is more about the general build of the source structure, which I fear I might get shot for :P I was looking into an app, the app included or referenced certain source .js files, all of which i've examined (although admittedly not knowing much js). They seem to make things "happen" on the phone, well commented, but with out invoking any backend. Ultimately, what are these .js files going back to? The core has to be C right Sep 09 23:25:15 ? Or is it a compiled language? Sep 09 23:25:20 its started in services Sep 09 23:26:04 zsoc: that statement made no sense to me... Sep 09 23:26:11 it might be the alcohol Sep 09 23:26:12 idk Sep 09 23:26:28 PuffTheMagic, ok, instead of generalisms, i will reference a specific file :) one moment Sep 09 23:26:33 seemed like you were beating around the bush for your realquestion Sep 09 23:26:42 zsoc: if they're commented out how do you know they even reference existing files anymore? Sep 09 23:27:19 chrisa, no no, i mean there are comments _about_ the functions i'm referencing. as in the devs are saying that they are doing this or that Sep 09 23:27:21 zsoc: im really not a js expert. im a linux guru in general and i have some i can program a little in a bunch of langs Sep 09 23:27:50 zsoc: the pre is the first time i've dont js/css really Sep 09 23:28:07 which is why i focus on the services/plugins etc. Sep 09 23:29:00 oy http://josephcrawford.com/2009/09/09/targus-support-experience/ Sep 09 23:30:08 Maybe I need to bother a js channel :P or just go learn js, heh. Basically, the only function in palmInitMedia.js that I can see, that sinks the video preview to the screen, is "this.VideoSink = function(sink, context)", but the driver for the camera is a compiled C driver. i'm just confused as to where these 2 things connect. Sep 09 23:31:46 ok, I see now it's referencing "capture://audio_video", which is even more foreign to me. I guess I really just have to get to know the structure of the filesystem before i ask stupid question. I should just read all of the SDK docs :P Sep 09 23:32:14 where is capture://audio_video from Sep 09 23:32:51 am i the only one that thinks the pixes looks like a pos? Sep 09 23:32:55 that a service request Sep 09 23:33:37 zsoc: it dont matter whre they connect Sep 09 23:33:49 if they expose functionality in js then use it Sep 09 23:33:53 egaudet, I suppose that's the question. but I can't find the service or what it's referring to. Sep 09 23:34:12 where is it? Sep 09 23:34:14 So, I guess, like when luna-send refers to 'addresses' like palm://, what exactly is going on there? Sep 09 23:34:29 palm:// is for addressing service uris Sep 09 23:34:32 egaudet, er.. /usr/lib/luna/luna-media/palmInitMedia.js Sep 09 23:34:36 egaudet...it says sudo not found... Sep 09 23:34:52 chrisa, ok that makes sense, where does that call go to tho? dbus? Sep 09 23:35:11 gwalker_, if you're root you don't need sudo, if you're logged in as a user you've created, install sudo Sep 09 23:35:28 zsoc: yeah probably over dbus to a service Sep 09 23:35:30 or Sep 09 23:35:40 something exposed by the luna/mojo framework directly Sep 09 23:35:45 either way Sep 09 23:35:51 you shouldnt worry about that Sep 09 23:36:06 and services, luna/mojo frame work, in general, are compiled and closed source, so i couldn't poke through the code anyway right? Sep 09 23:36:27 mojo is js Sep 09 23:37:06 Hm... problem is just mimicing what's going on in the native software won't get me too far. can't record video if your pipeline is already synced to whatever "capture://" is/calls Sep 09 23:37:59 do uris have to be invoked with luna-send? or are there other gateways? Sep 09 23:39:00 oh well...i give up...thanks for helping everyone.....just gonna leave my pre the way it is... Sep 09 23:39:27 gwalker_, did you do what i suggested? Sep 09 23:39:40 usr/lib/BrowserPlugins/LunaMediaAdapter.so Sep 09 23:39:47 i dont' know how Sep 09 23:40:24 zsoc ^^ Sep 09 23:40:24 gwalker_, whatever command you were running, do it without sudo in front of it Sep 09 23:40:31 it's a plugin Sep 09 23:40:37 zsoc: why do u care about the internals part Sep 09 23:40:37 egaudet, wonderful. the camera app uses a browser plugin? heh Sep 09 23:40:42 what are you trying to do in js? Sep 09 23:41:05 i am not typing sudo... Sep 09 23:42:22 PuffTheMagic, because I need to simulate whatever is happening when the camera app runs, but not the same way. I need to know how "capture://" invokes gstreamer and what plugin it uses for a sink. working with luna is like being on an alien planet, doesn't interface anything like X Sep 09 23:42:46 yes its not X Sep 09 23:42:56 but i still dont get what you are trying to accomplish Sep 09 23:43:04 The media stuff like the camera is a bit more complex when it comes to how things are invocated Sep 09 23:43:07 There be dragons there Sep 09 23:43:09 which would make me better able to direct you in the right dir Sep 09 23:43:34 I'm going to guess that zsoc is doing something with video recording? Sep 09 23:44:03 egaudet, er, the videosink is going to be neccesary for a lot of things, recording is a very small part of it (considering palm i'm sure is going to release a recorder at some point anyway) Sep 09 23:44:16 chrisa, more like magical dragons :P Sep 09 23:44:47 Puff that magic dragon :D Sep 09 23:45:09 do you live by the sea? Sep 09 23:45:37 no i live "down by the river" Sep 09 23:45:50 lol Sep 09 23:45:52 and i live in a van Sep 09 23:46:00 lol Sep 09 23:46:16 and im thrice divoriced Sep 09 23:47:18 Underneath the bridge, my tarp has sprung a leak, and the animals i've trapped, have all become my pets, and i'm living off of grass, and the drippings from the ceiling, but it's ok to eat fish, cos they don't have any feeling. Sep 09 23:47:39 zsoc: want me to give you a clue Sep 09 23:47:45 the camera is a standard v4l device Sep 09 23:47:57 you should be able to use any userland camera app with it Sep 09 23:48:03 so if u find a lib you like Sep 09 23:48:11 a service can be written around it Sep 09 23:48:18 or if there is an app Sep 09 23:48:27 it can be converted into a service Sep 09 23:48:27 * zsoc facepalms Sep 09 23:48:47 so you dont have to abuse the camera interface Sep 09 23:48:53 it's v4l2, not v4l, and it's far from "standard" after palm is done patching it. Sep 09 23:49:34 so what if its v4l or v4l2 Sep 09 23:49:35 dont matter Sep 09 23:49:48 Every 'userland camera app' invokes gstreamer. Gstreamer can only sink to a file or a display. Sep 09 23:49:53 you have /dev/video* interfaces Sep 09 23:50:01 * zsoc quirks an eyebrow Sep 09 23:50:04 everyuthing does not use gstreamer Sep 09 23:50:17 you tie your self to gstreamer cause palm did Sep 09 23:50:47 you could use mplayer to stream from /dev/video direcly i beleive Sep 09 23:50:50 if u wanted Sep 09 23:50:53 So what you're saying is, is there are other arm compatible libs/apps that can invoke v4l2. Sep 09 23:50:56 mplayer uses gst... Sep 09 23:51:11 no Sep 09 23:51:15 * zsoc boggles Sep 09 23:51:18 mplayer can be built to work with gst Sep 09 23:51:25 but mplayer has lots of interfaces Sep 09 23:51:29 When then, you've learned me Puff. I'll go back to school. Sep 09 23:51:30 i think it support v4l directly Sep 09 23:54:23 Your ideas are abstract and outside the box. You should play chess :P Sep 09 23:54:48 zsoc: just build mplayer/mencoder with v4l/v4l2 support Sep 09 23:54:56 and you can view/encode from /dev/video devices Sep 09 23:55:07 and i dont think it has anything to do with gst Sep 09 23:55:58 Well, I honestly don't know the slightest thing about mplayer, other than using it a few times :P so I can't possibly refute that idea (yet). Sep 09 23:56:02 but still there's a big issue Sep 09 23:56:38 sinking to luna is alien. even invoking to get the output of mplayer display on the screen seems nearly impossible Sep 09 23:56:57 or atleast i wouldn't know where to start Sep 09 23:57:07 Again, recording/encoding the video isn't the issue really. Sep 09 23:57:33 zsoc: http://www.pcxperience.com/james/ivtv/testing/20041017/record-v4l2.pl Sep 09 23:57:36 Although, I suppose I could try using the existing 'preview' mechanisms, and use mplayers direct access to /dev/video in the background with a service Sep 09 23:57:59 That guy looks familiar :P Sep 09 23:58:10 zsoc: you probably wont have much luck turning a camera service into a video service Sep 09 23:58:16 you will probbaly need a new service Sep 09 23:58:27 so find alibrary that works with v4l Sep 09 23:58:37 and i can probably make a service wrapper for it Sep 09 23:58:47 and give you what ever functions you need Sep 09 23:59:22 if the camera service was capable of doing video stuffim sure there would be a video app already Sep 10 00:00:07 PuffTheMagic, the camera service sort of handles video, it's in the code, but they prolly had the same issue with sinking preview and target file at the same time Sep 10 00:01:27 what exactly is the situation regarding C apps on the palm pre? the webos-internals wiki seems to indicate that various apps have been ported already.. Sep 10 00:01:32 they support video as far as giving you a view finder and have access to a camera Sep 10 00:01:42 but officially palm says it only does html/css/javascript Sep 10 00:01:54 zsoc: if a regular camcorder and record and give a preview so can the pre Sep 10 00:02:09 zsoc: the camera on my lapop can record and give me a preview too Sep 10 00:02:17 No one has a C app working in Luna outside of a service, Azalyn Sep 10 00:02:18 PuffTheMagic, that's an incredibly good point. Sep 10 00:02:30 Azalyn: what are you tlaking about Sep 10 00:02:36 Azalyn: what have we "ported" Sep 10 00:03:08 Azalyn: we have written services and plugins Sep 10 00:03:13 services in C and Java Sep 10 00:03:25 which extend functionality into the mojo framework Sep 10 00:03:27 over dbus Sep 10 00:03:31 and plugins Sep 10 00:03:37 which are embedded into html Sep 10 00:03:47 but we didnt "port" anything Sep 10 00:04:11 well, i'm not familiar with the way the development works, which is why i asked. seeing things like doom and the nes emulator seemed to imply that those were native C apps running on the pre. Sep 10 00:04:32 They are, but via killing off the native ui and using the framebuffer directly Sep 10 00:04:33 Azalyn: the pre is a linux box at heart Sep 10 00:04:37 running in a debian chroot, so not ported Sep 10 00:04:47 Azalyn: they are running on the pre, just not through luna. Sep 10 00:04:53 Azalyn: if you want to leave the luna environment you can run anything you want Sep 10 00:05:18 so luna is what the pre uses for display? like what X is on desktops? Sep 10 00:05:20 Azalyn: you could run debian or gentoo or ubuntu if you wanted Sep 10 00:05:48 Azalyn: no really Sep 10 00:05:59 X is an interface between sw and hw Sep 10 00:05:59 Azalyn, don't try to wrap your head around it, Apparently what luna/mojo does it pretty much magic to us non-genius folk :P Sep 10 00:06:09 Azalyn: luna is more like gnome/kde Sep 10 00:06:13 than it is like X Sep 10 00:06:35 gnome could use direcfb or X Sep 10 00:06:39 luna uses directfb Sep 10 00:06:44 no X Sep 10 00:07:02 Although that would be interesting, if you could load luna over X Sep 10 00:07:15 zsoc: if you had the source Sep 10 00:07:27 zsoc: and wrote an X driver for or the pre hw Sep 10 00:07:34 Right, I assumed that would be necessary :P Sep 10 00:07:34 or used the fb driver in X Sep 10 00:07:37 then u could run X Sep 10 00:07:50 * zsoc reverse engineers luna Sep 10 00:07:56 good luck Sep 10 00:07:59 lol Sep 10 00:08:03 i'd rather run qt4/kde4 Sep 10 00:08:03 :D Sep 10 00:08:05 heh Sep 10 00:08:10 in fact, i might make that happen Sep 10 00:08:23 PuffTheMagic: Theoretically, we could create a service that somehow relays pixel information through to mojo, then redraw the pixels using canvas, but that's assuming the Pre's canvas implementation is good enough, and also it would perform HORRIBLY, so it would be no good for NES, Doom, etc... just a thought. Sep 10 00:08:42 EvanDotPro: no not a service Sep 10 00:08:44 a plugin maybe Sep 10 00:08:50 Plugin, yeah. Sep 10 00:09:00 if you stop luna and start X from debian it works fine, doesn't it? Sep 10 00:09:05 EvanDotPro: palm already has a graphics lib Sep 10 00:09:09 call Pirahana Sep 10 00:09:14 that uses glib Sep 10 00:09:17 or wx Sep 10 00:09:25 or what ever exists on the system Sep 10 00:09:33 to do 2d stuff Sep 10 00:09:34 hm, so is this just a current situation due to lack of info, or is luna really designed in a way that will never allow a native C app to display within webos? Sep 10 00:09:39 but they didnt give us the headers Sep 10 00:09:45 so we cant really use it Sep 10 00:09:49 libpirahana Sep 10 00:09:49 will we always have to kill luna to get native stuff working? Sep 10 00:09:50 the problem with X on the Pre for most users is the lack of mouse driver. Sep 10 00:10:04 Azalyn: no, not if you use a plugin Sep 10 00:10:16 i don't care about that, ratpoison/stumpwm work fine on it. Sep 10 00:10:21 hm Sep 10 00:10:23 and they don't need the rodent. Sep 10 00:10:28 A C app is not going to directly integrate with Luna at this time, whether support will be added is something no one knows Sep 10 00:10:46 but a C/C++ plugin already can Sep 10 00:10:54 would a plugin have any performance issues, like EvanDotPro mentioned? Sep 10 00:10:58 so if you can convert an app to a plugin framework it wworks fine Sep 10 00:11:02 thats how terminal works Sep 10 00:11:10 Azalyn: yeah, it would perform pretty bad I would assume. Sep 10 00:11:15 Azalyn: depends on how you do it Sep 10 00:11:36 Azalyn: are you using palms libpirahana or direcfb or are you drawing to the pixbuf pixel by pixel Sep 10 00:11:40 it all depends Sep 10 00:11:46 plugins have potential Sep 10 00:11:54 i fell asleep :/ Sep 10 00:11:58 but the graphics interface in them needs work Sep 10 00:12:06 Yeah, how _does_ Terminal work anyway? Sep 10 00:12:13 Decimation__, no one asked you ;) Sep 10 00:12:17 chrisa: so they'd have to explicitly allow this.. i just figured maybe luna had some undocumented api, that could be used or something.. i don't know. Sep 10 00:12:22 zsoc: there is a plugin for terminal Sep 10 00:12:31 which is like xterm wrapped up in a ns/gecko plugin Sep 10 00:12:38 which draws to a pixbuff Sep 10 00:12:51 and listens for events from the browser Sep 10 00:12:53 terminal passes commands over the bus that are captured via a plugin service using a bunch of old mozilla/yahoo code to run commands and pass the buffers back Sep 10 00:12:54 then there is the mojo part Sep 10 00:12:58 which embeds the plugin Sep 10 00:13:10 chrisa: no we dont use a bus here Sep 10 00:13:10 That's actually ridiculous. Sep 10 00:13:23 plugin != service Sep 10 00:13:26 services us dbus Sep 10 00:13:30 plugins "could" Sep 10 00:13:32 but dont need to Sep 10 00:13:34 Yeah Puff, correct those devs, then they'll come back ;) Sep 10 00:13:39 PuffTheMagic: ohh, the terminal uses a pixel buffer, not just JS? Sep 10 00:13:51 according to this.. it seems all the kernel stuff is open, except for those three binary modules. http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Custom_Kernels#Download.2C_patch.2C_configure.2C_and_build_the_kernel. Sep 10 00:13:59 * EvanDotPro checks out terminal in git. Sep 10 00:14:00 I was under the impression it was a service, not specifically a plugin. Considering how people use 'brick' and 'root' in here I never know Sep 10 00:14:05 EvanDotPro: yeah termpluin draws directly to a pixbuf that represend some area of the card Sep 10 00:14:14 chrisa: :D Sep 10 00:14:30 chrisa: haha Sep 10 00:15:00 chrisa: naa termplugin is a real browser plugin, just about everting else we have done non-mojo based is a service though Sep 10 00:15:05 PuffTheMagic: well that's interesting... sounds like pretty much what I was saying about passing pixel data through. Sep 10 00:15:09 am i correct in assuming that if someone implements free/libre versions of those three drivers, that we could have a full free software system on it? Sep 10 00:15:21 EvanDotPro: someone is trying to make a direcfb wrapper for the plugin stuff Sep 10 00:15:35 so directfb apps would work easily Sep 10 00:15:39 with out changes Sep 10 00:15:55 and i beleive the pixbuf is glib/gdk Sep 10 00:15:55 does anyone know how the icons on the launcher pages are stored? Sep 10 00:16:03 since there is no other graphics libs on the pre Sep 10 00:16:04 like, the order they are in Sep 10 00:16:17 so if you can fiture out how to reverse enginerr the libpirahana headers Sep 10 00:16:25 we could use glib for 2d also Sep 10 00:16:33 s/fiture/figure/ Sep 10 00:17:24 i'm also wondering if there's an irc client on webos. :| Sep 10 00:17:36 PuffTheMagic: hmmm interesting. Sep 10 00:17:40 i want to rearrange the icons on my launcher pages, i think it will take me about 20mins to do what i want, there has to be a easier way!? Sep 10 00:17:53 Azalyn: im about to start an irc service Sep 10 00:18:11 Azalyn: and oil and i have already designed/planned/discussed the mojo gui for it Sep 10 00:18:14 irssi *does* work Sep 10 00:18:16 stay tuned Sep 10 00:18:25 zsoc: irssi is crap Sep 10 00:18:30 * PuffTheMagic hides from the irssi fanboys Sep 10 00:19:08 well, if that terminal app works.. i'm guessing irssi could run.. Sep 10 00:19:13 but yeah.. heh Sep 10 00:19:35 oh ok, so people just built over the NPAPI terminal plugin for webkit Sep 10 00:19:50 chrisa: what do you mean built over? Sep 10 00:20:09 well, I don't want to say port since that's a misnomer Sep 10 00:20:57 by the way, how is the keyboard? people seem conflicted over it. Sep 10 00:21:13 chrisa: we took a generic NPAPI plugin template and added the missing mojo functions to it Sep 10 00:21:18 then added terminal functionality Sep 10 00:22:21 PuffTheMagic: do you happen to know where the code for the lock screen is? Sep 10 00:22:31 i wanna see if there's a way to remove that emergency call button Sep 10 00:22:32 lol Sep 10 00:22:53 yeah is in the applications folder Sep 10 00:22:57 palm/applications Sep 10 00:23:00 screenandlock Sep 10 00:23:02 something like that Sep 10 00:23:05 tlz, that would be illegal according to the FCC. Sep 10 00:23:25 damnit Sep 10 00:23:40 ive dialled 911 like 3 times today Sep 10 00:23:47 tlz, you could probably further lock it, or have it be like a "switch", or have it ask you "Are you sure" or have it bring up a dialer that only accepts "911" as an entry Sep 10 00:23:49 the top switch silencing the camera noise is technically illegal :P Sep 10 00:23:55 ajames, no it isn't Sep 10 00:24:02 isn't it? Sep 10 00:24:02 ajames, that's a bill, and it'll never get passed Sep 10 00:24:07 ah Sep 10 00:24:09 ajames, in Japan it's illegal :P Sep 10 00:24:09 i hope not Sep 10 00:24:50 There's also a bill in congress right now that would force every home to keep 3 years worth of internet data on file, logs of every packet. It's so unfeasible it's laughable at best. Congress is full of great things. Sep 10 00:25:10 zsoc: wtf! Sep 10 00:25:43 thatdude, unfortunately, they figure "no harm no foul" if a bill floats around that's ridiculous. But it makes America look like clowns. just imho i suppose. Sep 10 00:26:02 so would the fcc be pissed if i removed the button completely Sep 10 00:26:03 lol Sep 10 00:26:13 And sorry, apparently it was 2 years, not 3. Sep 10 00:26:59 tlz, the point is not that they could find out. But if you happen to pull out your phone on a train with a bigshot government guy next to you, it could get messy :) prolly not on topic anyway. Sep 10 00:27:04 People propose bunk bills all the time Sep 10 00:27:08 But they'll not pass Sep 10 00:27:37 lol Sep 10 00:33:33 and my debian chroot is now up to 2G Sep 10 00:37:31 or will be if resize2fs ever finishes Sep 10 00:41:27 hmmm Sep 10 00:41:36 where is that file full of emoticons? Sep 10 00:42:04 yeah, i want to make a patch that rm's it Sep 10 00:42:21 why does it catch ^_^? the image doesn't even look like it Sep 10 00:42:40 also, if you're typing IN ALL CAPS. The auto correct, corrects in lowercase letters. That's a bug I'd say. Sep 10 00:43:44 Does anyone know how compositing is handled on the Pre? Should I assume it's Indirect Rendering? Sep 10 00:48:24 Can anyone see any reason why I should not purchase a "bad esn" Pre from Ebay ? Is there any stigma attached (like it being stolen or something)? Sep 10 00:49:49 * oil has no clue Sep 10 00:49:54 could be stolen.... suppose you could ask the seller why the esn is bad Sep 10 00:50:24 hmm Sep 10 00:50:34 * zsoc doesn't blame rwhitby for being cautious Sep 10 00:51:17 Other "bad esn" devices are ones where the previous owner didn't pay their bill and don't want to. Sprint won't release the phone til they do Sep 10 00:51:17 rwhitby: either stolen or an insurance claim. Sep 10 00:51:27 fell off a truck Sep 10 00:51:40 rwhitby: or "found" if you distinguish that from stolen.... Sep 10 00:52:07 rawdr, actually, the esn gets released once it's written off Sep 10 00:52:18 hmm - all of those things sound like something that one might not want to be associated with ... Sep 10 00:52:27 listen to raw, atleast the first part of his answer was right Sep 10 00:52:35 when does it get written off? Sep 10 00:52:38 * zsoc insists bad esns have nothing to do with theft or insurance claims Sep 10 00:53:02 zsoc: really? why do you say that? Sep 10 00:53:23 EvanDotPro, because that's the correct answer? Sep 10 00:53:37 zsoc: I'm considering not only the actual facts of bad esn's but also the general stigma that people not in the industry may associated (perhaps incorrectly) with bad esn devices. Sep 10 00:53:51 I don't want to need to be in a position of justifying something to someone ... Sep 10 00:53:59 rwhitby, so buy a not bad esn device that just happens to have a bad esn unbeknownst to anyone? Sep 10 00:54:35 nevermind, i keep forgetting you have to consider these things when you're important. Sep 10 00:54:47 zsoc: haha, well i believe you, but i was wondering how come sprint wouldn't blacklist an esn on a phone that was claimed to the insurance or reported stolen Sep 10 00:54:48 zsoc: that's a very good point - how does one verify that an esn is good or bad before purchase? Sep 10 00:55:10 EvanDotPro, because the esns aren't tracked Sep 10 00:55:11 you can call sprint and ask Sep 10 00:55:21 rwhitby, you call sprint, say "hey i want to buy a phone with this esn, is it free for activation" Sep 10 00:56:16 zsoc: ok, so it's well known that phones with good esn's are traded openly and freely, and sprint has no problem activating one of those? Sep 10 00:56:25 zsoc: interesting, i did not know that. Sep 10 00:56:53 yeah Sep 10 00:57:21 you can call anytime and do an esn swap, no questions asked Sep 10 00:57:41 unless it's blacklisted Sep 10 00:57:46 rwhitby, yes, very well known, and Sprint is better about it than other american wireless carriers Sep 10 01:00:12 zsoc: and is there any problem with a phone esn remaining inactive for a very long time? is that flagged in any way? Sep 10 01:00:21 (a good esn that is) Sep 10 01:00:42 I presume ESNs are not tied to carriers but to hardware manufacturers? Sep 10 01:00:53 Carriers Sep 10 01:01:10 rwhitby, the answer to the first question is no, the answer to the second question is both, techincally, but only the carrier in actuality Sep 10 01:01:11 doubtful they would care to notice.... for instance I could buy two phones and have one as a backup, sitting in my drawer for years Sep 10 01:01:17 so the ESN programmed into a device is a number which is allocated to a specific carrier? Sep 10 01:01:20 The ESN is like the IMEI Sep 10 01:01:24 * zsoc enjoys the rolereversal of rod asking him questions Sep 10 01:01:25 of CDMA Sep 10 01:01:58 right - IMEI is tied to the hardware manufacturer, not a specific carrier - it is mapped to a carrier by a sim card in GSM Sep 10 01:02:08 er, actually most CDMA phones have MEIDs, which is an IMEI, more or less. ESN is rather an antiquated term Sep 10 01:02:10 and I presume an ESN is mapped to a carrier by activation in CDMA land Sep 10 01:02:22 Yes Sep 10 01:02:34 thanks for the correction Sep 10 01:02:50 there is the ESN, MEID, and MSID Sep 10 01:02:53 for CDMA Sep 10 01:02:54 but the actual ESN number is allocated by the hardware manufacturer, and can be used on any carrier (assuming the carrier is willing to activate it)? Sep 10 01:03:01 Yes sir Sep 10 01:03:47 Uh, no. Sep 10 01:03:51 No? Sep 10 01:04:07 you can use a Sprint phone on VZW if they will take the ESN Sep 10 01:04:17 So a Palm Pre ESN will come from a different number range depending on whether it will be distributed through Sprint or BellMo? Sep 10 01:04:45 Or is the ESN just imprinted in the phone with no knowledge of which carrier it will be activated on? Sep 10 01:04:46 Eguy, No you can't Sep 10 01:04:54 zsoc: i have 4 verizon phones activated on alltel (long before the merger) Sep 10 01:05:05 yes you can zsoc Sep 10 01:05:08 I have done it Sep 10 01:05:13 Only if they are reprogrammed Sep 10 01:05:25 Yeah Sep 10 01:05:38 but they will still work Sep 10 01:05:55 Well it's similar to unlocking, which is in the realm of "fishy" that rod is trying to avoid Sep 10 01:06:03 MEID = new version of ESN btw for you un-cdma folk Sep 10 01:06:21 They ran out of ESN numbers Sep 10 01:07:17 The only 2 CDMA carriers left in America or Sprint and Verizon, and neither will activate the other's phone, regardless of whether it'll work or not. Sep 10 01:07:48 not knowingly ;) Sep 10 01:08:03 I have used a Sprint 700wx on VZW and it worked fine Sep 10 01:08:11 I wouldn't say you have any allegiance to the carrier regarding the actual phone, so I wouldn't call it fishy Sep 10 01:08:54 zsoc: the master dealer web interface for sprint doesn't absolutely reject "bad" ESN's last time i checked about 7 or 8 months ago (friend is a dealer), it just warns them but lets them continue. Sep 10 01:08:55 Clearly the device is provided, by the manufacture, for a specific carrier. Most phones are even _branded_. How would you say there is no allegiance there? Sep 10 01:09:39 Because you buy the phone, it's yours. Even if there's a contract it's only tied to your account Sep 10 01:09:55 EvanDotPro, define 'master dealer web interface'? because if it's p2k we're getting into proprietary territory. Sep 10 01:10:27 rawdr, dealers are paid under the assumption that you keep your hardware on your account, atleast for an extent of time Sep 10 01:11:10 rawdr, i'm not saying there's anything wrong with trying to convert it, i'm just saying it doesn't happen very often. and for rod's sake im playing devil's advocate Sep 10 01:11:11 It doesn't make any difference to them what hardware you use so long as you pay your bill. Which is why they allow you to swap ESNs Sep 10 01:11:41 zsoc: so how do I purchase a device which sprint, the dealers, the police ;-), and palm are all happy for me to have, and there is no implied "payment owing" to anyone? Sep 10 01:11:45 rawdr, to them, right, but you have an additional contract with the store you purchase the phone from. and actually, you have different 'rights' whether you purchase from a store or from sprint sales directly, contract is different Sep 10 01:12:07 rwhitby, like i said before, i don't see any implied problems at all, no matter what you do, but it's about perspective i suppose. Sep 10 01:12:22 What contract? You just agree to pay $X for a piece of equipment Sep 10 01:12:27 zsoc: honestly, i don't know what it is... it's just whatever web interface the retailers use to activate phones / plans / etc... my friend runs a little independant cell retail store in a strip mall. Sep 10 01:12:58 zsoc: he calls it master dealer something, so i was just regurgitating his terminology, lol. Sep 10 01:13:13 rawdr: yes, for a period of time 1/2 years Sep 10 01:13:42 heh. technically you can add bad esns in p2k, but it's strickly prohibited under any circumstances, and they are tracked and filtered out into reports by LP Sep 10 01:14:12 Eguy: huh? a 6 month contract? Sep 10 01:14:18 so what's the cost of an off-contract Pre ? Sep 10 01:14:19 all i've understood from all of this is that cdma is a pain in the ass. :| Sep 10 01:14:30 No 1 year or 2 year contract Sep 10 01:14:42 that's just for your sprint account, not the phone Sep 10 01:14:45 rwhitby: $550 for Sprint Sep 10 01:14:46 rawdr, if you cancel your account 60 days from setting it up, you have to bring your equipment back to the dealer, or send it back to sprint, according to the contract you sign or agree to Sep 10 01:14:47 it seems to me anyway Sep 10 01:14:49 in canada they say 300 bucks for the no-contract pre. Sep 10 01:15:01 rwhitby, define cost. Sep 10 01:15:22 but if I keep the account, on any or no phone and keep paying the bill, the hardware is mine. it seems to me anyway Sep 10 01:15:31 rawdr, that's correct, yes Sep 10 01:15:35 yes Sep 10 01:15:41 you don't have to return it Sep 10 01:15:45 zsoc: the amount of money I can pay to an official dealer who is authorised by Sprint or BellMo to sell a Pre, and not have any ongoing cost associated with owning that inactivated hardware. Sep 10 01:15:52 you don't get a rebate though Sep 10 01:15:56 hm, or so i thought... Sep 10 01:16:04 zsoc: insurance fraud aside, could i claim my pre stolen and pay the $100 deductible for my new one, and mail my "stolen" one to rod? very hypothetical since that's obviously insusrance fraud... just asking. Sep 10 01:16:10 rawdr, technically the hardware is yours anyway, they will never, ever, ever fight you for it. ever. contracts are meaningless anyway. Sep 10 01:16:13 you do get the rebate - that's why you're in contract Sep 10 01:16:33 rwhitby: it's still $550 for a Pre with no strings attached ;) Sep 10 01:16:36 rwhitby, different in different dealers, also different dealers have different costs for themselves, as they purchase different amounts from sprint (and yes, sprint, not palm) Sep 10 01:16:42 (the Sprint one that is) Sep 10 01:17:06 EvanDotPro, yes, and that's actually a federal crime in american, because sprint's insurance is _literally_ insurance. you can't sell it without being a licensed insurance agent in some states Sep 10 01:17:18 Eguy: I think I need to have one of those "no strings attached" type of Pre. Sep 10 01:17:28 lol Sep 10 01:17:34 if palm sold discounted equipment to devs, i'd probably get a second pre just for development Sep 10 01:17:38 Although I my uncle got a Pre from palm directly for $550 Sep 10 01:17:51 zsoc: lol i know, that's why i emphasized the hypothetical part. Sep 10 01:17:52 $550 is probably near cost for most dealers, so i could see that. Sep 10 01:18:09 heh now it is $149 with 2 year contract Sep 10 01:18:26 ajames: so you have one? what do you think of the keyboard? heh. i asked here earlier but i'm not sure if anyone saw the question. Sep 10 01:18:28 egaudet, as of this morning :) Sep 10 01:18:33 er, eguy, even Sep 10 01:18:38 stop having your names be so close Sep 10 01:18:48 hah Sep 10 01:19:04 I have been Eguy for many many many many years ;) Sep 10 01:19:42 I am curious what the Pixi will cost since it is designed for teens Sep 10 01:19:51 ... teens? Sep 10 01:20:01 So, what is the best means of getting the most cost-effective "no strings attached" Pre hardware? Sep 10 01:20:22 well chrisa: It is a lot like the Centro Sep 10 01:20:28 a low cost smartphone Sep 10 01:20:34 stop being 2-letter lazy! Sep 10 01:20:35 You're mistaking mass market as "teenagers" Sep 10 01:20:38 chrisa, ... adolescents? Sep 10 01:20:43 :P Sep 10 01:20:55 So teens happen to like that part of the market Sep 10 01:21:16 there's a big market for high-end feature phones / low end smartphones outside of the teen market. Sep 10 01:21:17 rwhitby, maybe check into canadian unactivated prices.. i know nothing about it and it could be cheaper Sep 10 01:21:35 Probably, I think I have been in LA too long Sep 10 01:21:53 every teenager has the top of the line BB/iPhone Sep 10 01:21:58 The project I've spent a year on isn't a teen phone Sep 10 01:22:15 chrisa, you didn't design the hardware tho :P Sep 10 01:22:31 zsoc: you mean form factor, right? Sep 10 01:22:48 yes Sep 10 01:22:48 right, sorry, form factor, forgot what type of people i'm talking to, generally i have to laymen everything Sep 10 01:23:07 what type of people are we zsoc? Sep 10 01:23:28 egaudet, intelligent, arrogant, developers? :> Sep 10 01:23:39 fail again Sep 10 01:23:52 ping me one more time zsoc! Sep 10 01:23:54 Eguy: people who know enough to access an IRC channel. that's the only assumption you can make ;-) Sep 10 01:23:57 There is a huge market for non-topend smart phones Sep 10 01:24:04 chrisa, how does it feel to work on something that so many people really like ? Sep 10 01:24:10 egaudet, crap i'm so sorry, i feel like a doofus :( Sep 10 01:24:18 chrisa: yep, it's the fastest growing segment isn't it? Sep 10 01:24:36 lol it's cool, make me feel special for a moment when the xchat starts blinking Sep 10 01:24:41 bpadalino: It would feel better if our stock went up instead of down when we announce products Sep 10 01:24:42 chrisa: It is the first non apple phone not entriely bashed to pieces on Engadget ;) Sep 10 01:24:48 chrisa, i agree there, i believe the pixi will be good for people who want smartphones without the nonsense. right now really the HTC Snap is the only good low end sprint offering. or the 8330. Sep 10 01:25:18 I wasn't around for the centro, but look at how many units moved for what people seemed to think was a mostly mediocre phone Sep 10 01:25:21 chrisa, i think the market was upset there isn't a GSM one to open your distribution up to the rest of the world .. Sep 10 01:25:38 chrisa: Not true, the Centro worked unlike the 700p Sep 10 01:25:50 I know nothing of the treo lines, though I do own a pro Sep 10 01:26:02 centro was pretty terrible, but a lot of people loved it. heck, i loved it and i didn't even use one Sep 10 01:26:18 I liked mine, it lasted me 2 years Sep 10 01:26:27 and still works Sep 10 01:26:48 chrisa, also - i think the market sees the intimate relationship with sprint as a bad thing since it's not as big as att or verizon .. limiting your market exposure Sep 10 01:27:02 i've actually seen a centro that was literally melted. the whole top half, 1/4 of the screen, and part of the boards. still worked some how Sep 10 01:27:04 The most important thing to note is that I am ridiculously clumsy and both the pre and pixie have survived falls onto concrete for me Sep 10 01:27:24 well, maybe not riduculously, but clumsy at the most amusing times for everyone else Sep 10 01:27:48 the pre is a slippery mofo Sep 10 01:27:48 bpadalino, Sprint wouldn't be smaller than those companies if ATT didn't buy Cingular/CellOne and Verizon didn't buy Alltel Sep 10 01:27:50 chrisa, can you put a driver hook into the hidd to make the button push act like a back gesture instead? i promise i won't tell anyone about it Sep 10 01:28:04 heh Sep 10 01:28:28 destinal_, yello joe Sep 10 01:29:13 bpadalino: only if you convince geist to give me omap boards he's not using anymore Sep 10 01:29:32 Lets be honest, probably not even then Sep 10 01:29:37 :( Sep 10 01:29:54 i didn't realize geist was a omap board hoarder! Sep 10 01:30:16 bpadalino: make which button act like what? Sep 10 01:30:20 all my test equipment at work is off to calibration .. all i have is a spectrum analyzer :( Sep 10 01:30:32 destinal_: button push (center) act like back gesture ... Sep 10 01:30:41 I do power work and I don't have my own scope or meter, if it makes you feel better Sep 10 01:30:50 I may ask to expense some soon though... Sep 10 01:30:51 bpadalino: we'll get there Sep 10 01:30:54 chrisa, a little bit Sep 10 01:31:12 chrisa, i was working on some IQ calibration stuff earlier so spectrum analyzer was all i needed Sep 10 01:31:22 hidd and plugins are only mysterious for the moment Sep 10 01:31:36 i think we all should put our heads together and figure out how to get rid of that emergency call button Sep 10 01:31:38 I only usually need to watch i2c/w1 lines Sep 10 01:31:41 does the hidd serve a socket ? Sep 10 01:31:48 tlz: Can't you just edit it out of the js? Sep 10 01:31:56 i actually hate working with w1 .. it's kind of ridiculous Sep 10 01:31:56 tlz, again, we like the FCC here. they are listening i'm sure anyway Sep 10 01:31:56 I swear there was a mod for this already in the past Sep 10 01:32:02 lol Sep 10 01:32:04 spi or i2c are a little better Sep 10 01:32:10 bpadalino: the plugin and hidd communicate with each other over a socket Sep 10 01:32:15 chrisa, ive been searching, but i cant find anything to edit Sep 10 01:32:16 bpadalino: w1 is fun when you have to bitbang the line Sep 10 01:32:26 bpadalino: err maybe that's hidd and luna Sep 10 01:32:31 and get microsecond timing accuracy Sep 10 01:32:34 chrisa, i work with FPGA's all day so everything is bitbanging Sep 10 01:32:34 or maybe both Sep 10 01:32:41 and my timing is impeccable ! Sep 10 01:33:08 but to do it with a micro .. that's got to be rough Sep 10 01:33:24 w1? Sep 10 01:33:28 one-wire Sep 10 01:33:33 usually for battery interfaces Sep 10 01:33:38 ah Sep 10 01:33:55 maxim seems to have a monopoly on the translators, and they're pricey Sep 10 01:34:13 which is surprising - since everything else maxim makes is cheap Sep 10 01:35:01 i want to make a modem board one of these days with a max19713 AFE (dual 45Msps ADC/DAC, some low-speed ADC/DAC for power monitoring and vctcxo correction, etc) .. it's like $10 Sep 10 01:35:04 super cheap part Sep 10 01:35:12 very fully featured Sep 10 01:35:52 hmmm Sep 10 01:36:04 chrisa, how do you like the rubberized feel of the pixi ? Sep 10 01:36:31 I've always had an inductive back, so I honestly don't know Sep 10 01:36:34 i found a thing in pincode.css, for .emergency-button-div { Sep 10 01:36:43 should i add a visible: false; in there somewhere lol Sep 10 01:36:51 tlz, I'm still suggesting you don't do this Sep 10 01:37:06 ok Sep 10 01:37:17 chrisa: well, it's nice that the touchstone stuff isn't pre only Sep 10 01:37:32 I guess it wouldn't make much sense if it were Sep 10 01:37:40 i have to say, the touchstone is really pretty great for charging .. i hate plugging devices in .. though i would have probably been just as happy with a magjack ala apple laptop fame Sep 10 01:38:06 * destinal_ seriously prefers the touchstone backplate for the pre to the stock one, by far Sep 10 01:38:36 me too destinal Sep 10 01:38:37 by far Sep 10 01:38:50 I might just buy the back, don't own a touchstone Sep 10 01:39:24 zsoc: it's worth it to just get the kit Sep 10 01:39:26 chrisa, so are you the one who deals with powerd then since you're doing power measurements ? Sep 10 01:39:51 using sense resistors to figure out how much current each piece is drawing ? Sep 10 01:40:23 So my pre hangs when i run resize2fs for 1500M, although 1G worked fine. just on a file in /media/internal, nothing else, any ideas? Sep 10 01:41:51 our board designers never put in the current sensing resistors for each of the power supplies .. so we end up having to hack the boards up and put current probes around wires Sep 10 01:42:04 no, powerd is the os team Sep 10 01:42:48 ah Sep 10 01:43:02 what types of scopes do you generally use at work ? Sep 10 01:43:14 I didn't do measurements for this project, I just did charging Sep 10 01:43:30 and I don't know a whole lot about scopes, just how to use the couple I've used Sep 10 01:43:34 I want to know who's decision it was to use upstart, i need to hug him Sep 10 01:43:52 ah .. i had a nice setup until cal took it away .. Sep 10 01:44:32 MSO8104A scope, E4438C waveform generator and ... i can't even remember the model number of the spectrum analyzer .. just another agilent one Sep 10 01:49:10 bpadalino, way to kill the channel ;) Sep 10 01:49:15 yeah sorry Sep 10 01:49:25 i am such a jerk :( Sep 10 01:49:58 bpadalino: keep it coming. Sep 10 01:50:16 keep what coming? killing the channel ? Sep 10 01:50:19 what did he do? Sep 10 01:50:23 Hi guys. Sep 10 01:50:31 or more numbers of equipment i use on a regular basis ? Sep 10 01:50:47 I only have a HP16550 here Sep 10 01:51:17 rwhitby, shame on you. IRC is about idle chatter, not idle chatters :> Sep 10 01:51:17 ah! my spectrum analyzer is an E4407 .. the 26GHz one .. Sep 10 01:51:26 since i am working on a project that works up in the 5GHz area Sep 10 01:51:52 you guys think the pre camera could do iris scanning with opencv? Sep 10 01:52:14 hehe, HP16550 looks nice! Sep 10 01:52:19 2M-deep channels Sep 10 01:52:26 is there any sort of pre-paid pay as you go plan with no monthly fee that can be used with a legit inactivated Pre? Sep 10 01:52:41 like just buying a GSM sim card at the airport ... Sep 10 01:52:46 no Sep 10 01:52:47 PuffTheMagic, what are the requirements for iris scanning? just compare those to the manufactors specs. Sep 10 01:52:52 rwhitby, i know it's crazy, but america is strange. Sep 10 01:53:06 CDMA carriers are pretty much jerks Sep 10 01:53:17 zsoc: im pretty sure 3mp is more than enough Sep 10 01:53:44 i just wonder how that extended depth of field works Sep 10 01:53:56 rwhitby, in fact, no prepaid carrier in america has legitimate data even, still all 2.5g, just portals and wap Sep 10 01:53:57 PuffTheMagic: leprechauns Sep 10 01:54:17 (I learned about photo tech from Discworld) Sep 10 01:54:24 rwhitby, although you can get prepaid phones for free, when buying like $20 of airtime, so they basically give away crap Sep 10 01:54:30 freakout: r u saying you wouldnt want an iris scanner instead of the lame keypad to unlock your pre? Sep 10 01:54:40 zsoc: those carriers really have you guys by the short and curlies, don't they? Sep 10 01:54:43 PuffTheMagic: oh god no Sep 10 01:54:54 I just like cracking lame jokes :P Sep 10 01:54:59 freakout: what about fase recognition Sep 10 01:55:02 freakout, you are the son of a woman who stands on the mountain of an angry god in a thunderstorm, shaking his fists and calling down profainity upon him while wearing gold jewlery. Sep 10 01:55:10 s/fase/face/ Sep 10 01:55:10 PuffTheMagic meant: freakout: what about face recognition Sep 10 01:55:16 ~botsnack Sep 10 01:55:16 :), freakout Sep 10 01:55:34 rwhitby, if by short and curlies, you mean the hair on our collaborative testicles, then yes. Sep 10 01:55:37 * freakout wonders what emoticon he'd get for typing "~botsMack" Sep 10 01:55:47 lol Sep 10 01:55:47 PuffTheMagic: that would extremely cool Sep 10 01:56:14 zsoc: good to see another fan in here :D Sep 10 01:56:31 freakout, even if my memory is crap, lol. played the mud for awhile even D: Sep 10 01:56:47 freakout, and techincally, i think they were imps, not leprachons ;) Sep 10 01:57:16 * freakout facepalms. How could he forget that? Sep 10 01:59:05 * Templarian will belive this is what is discussed when he is not here from now on. Sep 10 01:59:25 rwhitby, even worse, all of the prepaid/no contract carriers are generally owned by the contract carriers. and the few mvnos that aren't are either localized to area or getting bought up fast Sep 10 01:59:53 rwhitby: so... where did i leave off? Sep 10 02:00:00 with it not working Sep 10 02:00:04 xD Sep 10 02:00:12 lol! good call, oil Sep 10 02:00:31 i'm still confused on why it works for me, but not for rod Sep 10 02:00:35 Templarian, you did walk in at quit a time eh ;) Sep 10 02:00:41 and i'm hoping it's not a mac thing Sep 10 02:01:42 HattCzech: can you reply to my email with the output from running the xml through your script (and include your script just in case) ? Sep 10 02:01:55 sure Sep 10 02:01:58 use the xml I sent, so we can make sure we are both running the same thing. Sep 10 02:02:12 k Sep 10 02:02:12 HattCzech: we will make it work. Sep 10 02:14:08 Opensource communities are very interesting. Personally I feel like it's one of the closest things on earth we have to Utopia. Is that too philisophical? I've been involved in 3 or 4, and it seems to be the most interesting avenue to learn, help, and get to know unique people. Sep 10 02:16:12 zsoc: They bathe more frequently in Utopia. Sep 10 02:16:18 hah Sep 10 02:16:20 * freakout hides before room attacks Sep 10 02:16:47 i actually just got out of the shower Sep 10 02:17:00 so did freakout Sep 10 02:17:02 i know these things Sep 10 02:17:10 bpadalino: pics or it didn't happen :P Sep 10 02:17:11 heh Sep 10 02:17:26 aw man :( Sep 10 02:17:37 i hate being called on shens Sep 10 02:17:44 lol Sep 10 02:18:38 HattCzech: did you send that yet? Sep 10 02:19:04 not yet Sep 10 02:19:45 So I don't believe my question before ever got answered. Is it safe to assume the compositing on the pre is done with Indirect Rendering? Sep 10 02:20:54 the xml is outdated, so i'm attaching a new one Sep 10 02:23:03 zsoc: it's not x11 so probably not Sep 10 02:23:10 it seems to all be software rendered Sep 10 02:23:36 Really? Software rendered compositing? On this little bucket of bolts? Impressive. Sep 10 02:25:32 rwhitby: sent Sep 10 02:25:52 pretty sure Sep 10 02:26:01 i'd love to be shown otherwise though Sep 10 02:26:19 zsoc: the software rendering explains the choppiness at some points Sep 10 02:26:42 * freakout looks forward to Palm actually using Pre's graphics hardware Sep 10 02:26:51 looking in /dev and /sys i don't see anything resembling a drm Sep 10 02:26:52 i just want the new patch =p Sep 10 02:27:34 plus, and i hate to say this: the iphone's graphics are quite a bit smoother Sep 10 02:27:35 HattCzech: I think I found the problem Sep 10 02:27:40 ah? Sep 10 02:27:43 and it's nearly the same proc Sep 10 02:28:14 * ajames can't wait for gallium3d on the pre Sep 10 02:29:02 what did you find? Sep 10 02:37:10 HattCzech: self.data was not being reinitialised at the start of each tag, and it also wasn't being appended if the characters method got called multiple times. Sep 10 02:37:42 ahhh Sep 10 02:38:45 so that would mean you wouldn't have to worry about the newline stuff if it got called multiple times Sep 10 02:39:07 HattCzech: yep, nothing to do with what we were focusing on. Sep 10 02:39:25 awesome Sep 10 02:39:48 Hi all Sep 10 02:40:09 so you working on a way to store it from multiple calls? Sep 10 02:42:55 So, I'm trying to install a VNC client and there was some problems with gcc, during the configure it's telling me "checking for C compiler default output... configure: error: C compiler cannot create executables" I'm having a hard time finding information on how to get past this. Sep 10 02:43:01 HattCzech: check the feed now Sep 10 02:43:17 hey all Sep 10 02:43:25 heisenman_afk: g'day Sep 10 02:43:39 any updates on your fund? Sep 10 02:43:50 heisenman: $75 so far Sep 10 02:44:00 I finally read the thread in detail; need to respond to the first reply. Sep 10 02:44:01 On your way! Sep 10 02:44:14 I WAS a little hasty/shady in the way I put that up... Sep 10 02:45:43 ~botsack Sep 10 02:45:47 ~botsnack Sep 10 02:45:48 destinal_: aw, gee Sep 10 02:46:20 yay! description! Sep 10 02:46:21 sup dest Sep 10 02:46:40 HattCzech: now you just need to change the description to say "Just install it using Preware" ... ;-) Sep 10 02:46:42 destinal came out of hiding Sep 10 02:46:43 tharris-: sup Sep 10 02:46:55 lol, i did actually have that at first Sep 10 02:47:02 but that would be an additional step ;) Sep 10 02:52:20 HattCzech: is everything else you've seen in the feed data now fixed too? Sep 10 02:53:42 looks like it Sep 10 02:55:46 so did you undo the replace \r\n thing? Sep 10 02:55:55 tharris-: anything interesting going on? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Sep 10 02:59:57 2009