**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Sep 16 02:59:57 2009 Sep 16 03:02:57 kesne: so do you have webos-internals content on that feed? Sep 16 03:03:47 so Sep 16 03:03:54 has anyone used the nintendo emulator? Sep 16 03:03:56 i finally got it working Sep 16 03:04:02 was wondering if anyone was able to get sound? Sep 16 03:04:02 :D Sep 16 03:04:47 sportman: nebula is the guy to talk to about that. Sep 16 03:04:54 nebula: whats crackin :) Sep 16 03:07:45 ouch he has been idle since noon :( Sep 16 03:08:12 d Sep 16 03:09:53 im happy enough to even get it working though Sep 16 03:09:54 so wooo Sep 16 03:13:23 rwhitby: the upstart script, as it is now, will create the directory /opt if it does not exist. Are we sure this will be run while the rootfs is mounted read-write? Sep 16 03:13:55 JackieRipper: ah, good point. the postinst should create /opt, not the upstart script. Sep 16 03:18:27 rwhitby: http://webos-internals.pastebin.com/m49cfb565 Sep 16 03:20:39 JackieRipper: I wonder if it can be done more efficiently using /proc/mounts ... Sep 16 03:20:59 (I think you've captured all the cases we need to consider well in that script) Sep 16 03:22:32 I was thinking of checking to see if / is mounted rw, and mounting it rw if not, then creating /opt (if it doesn't already exist, obviously) and then returning / to it's original state Sep 16 03:23:55 I think the upstart script can assume that the postinst has done it's job, since that's the way the upstart script is installed. Sep 16 03:24:08 ok Sep 16 03:24:17 rwhitby: check out kesne's live chat, good stuff Sep 16 03:24:19 :P Sep 16 03:24:26 Are you listening to the chat? Sep 16 03:24:50 Of course it's funny!!! Sep 16 03:25:04 its hilarious kesne :P Sep 16 03:26:58 cool, kesne is ragging me ;-) Sep 16 03:27:01 rwhitby: checking it out? Sep 16 03:27:07 all's good, kesne :-) Sep 16 03:27:08 lol, kesne in troubleee. Sep 16 03:27:21 kesne: he's watching Sep 16 03:27:56 I'm glad I'm the opposite of Eguy ;-) Sep 16 03:28:29 kesne: everyone's cool in this channel ;-) Sep 16 03:29:01 lol, dont say take chill pills.. my 4th grade teacher said that. Sep 16 03:29:40 kesne: two thumbs up on the broadcast. Sep 16 03:31:08 ooh, the cat's out of the bag now ... Sep 16 03:32:35 hmm got a post install error trying to install virtual keyboard from webos quick install Sep 16 03:32:53 so has there been work to port andriod to the pre? Sep 16 03:32:57 just for shits and giggles? Sep 16 03:33:33 can an app add functionality? like the ability to play wmv files? Sep 16 03:33:33 rwhitby: http://webos-internals.pastebin.com/m5746b57d ? Sep 16 03:37:04 Decimate: take a chill pills Sep 16 03:37:19 i hated 4th grade so much. Sep 16 03:37:48 rwhitby: like the broadcast? :) Sep 16 03:38:07 kesne: let me know when the next broadcast is - loved it. Sep 16 03:39:19 this makes more and more reason for there to be a ustream app for the pre developed. Sep 16 03:40:04 what broadcast? Sep 16 03:40:07 did i miss? Sep 16 03:40:27 you missed it Sep 16 03:40:53 :( Sep 16 03:42:44 JackieRipper: do you know how i can make something a global variable Sep 16 03:42:44 ? Sep 16 03:43:03 atlanta: in what usage? Sep 16 03:43:38 in javascript or in the shell? Sep 16 03:43:42 javascript Sep 16 03:43:43 i try Sep 16 03:43:49 var name = blah Sep 16 03:43:54 var means local Sep 16 03:44:00 this. Sep 16 03:44:00 declare it without var Sep 16 03:44:00 ? Sep 16 03:44:07 ok Sep 16 03:44:11 name = blah Sep 16 03:44:23 ok Sep 16 03:44:28 it will be global for that app, not all of webos Sep 16 03:44:35 lol you are the man Sep 16 03:44:48 worked Sep 16 03:44:52 Ah Sep 16 03:45:02 Next broadcast is thursday folks Sep 16 03:45:05 Jason should be there Sep 16 03:45:18 kesne: good test run! Sep 16 03:45:32 Hah, next one will be good Sep 16 03:45:36 It's still a test though Sep 16 03:46:09 kesne: what you going to be showing in your broadcast Sep 16 03:46:10 ? Sep 16 03:46:21 Good stuff Sep 16 03:46:27 ok Sep 16 03:46:35 ill try to see if i can make time for it Sep 16 03:47:09 We'll talk about webOS Quick Install Sep 16 03:47:10 Lots Sep 16 03:47:13 And app news Sep 16 03:47:48 k Sep 16 03:49:08 damnit, seems mojo needs pulseaudio. >_< Sep 16 03:49:09 So yeah Sep 16 03:49:11 Try to attent Sep 16 03:49:24 now i have to re-emerge virtualbox with support for it. Sep 16 03:53:39 ewww Sep 16 03:53:41 emerge Sep 16 03:53:41 lol Sep 16 04:02:38 If you have installed Preware, WebOS Internal's over the air installer, you can simply choose and install the Terminal Plugin and then choose and install Terminal from the available applications. Sep 16 04:03:03 i dont see a selection called 'terminal plugin' before i install the 'terminal' selection on preware Sep 16 04:03:14 i must be reading that wrong Sep 16 04:06:56 can_: it's in the services category Sep 16 04:07:18 or just go to the list of everything and start typing "terminal" Sep 16 04:07:18 Quick question, if I did another live show, would you guys watch it? Sep 16 04:07:33 I would Sep 16 04:08:08 If Jason was on? Sep 16 04:09:12 ahh Sep 16 04:17:48 cool, have terminal working now Sep 16 04:17:58 off to bed for me. I have a t-con in 6.5 hours :( Sep 16 04:18:09 t-con? Sep 16 04:18:20 tele-conference Sep 16 04:18:22 can_: what was the problem? Sep 16 04:19:11 i was silly and installed it without installing the plugin first. really had no way of knowing when i just saw 'terminal' in the list of apps. Sep 16 04:19:53 Is there any talk of support for additional IM clients? Sep 16 04:19:54 Natively. Sep 16 04:20:38 PorkchopExpress: greg_roll is working on a libpurpleadapter replacement patch ipkg which adds other clients. Sep 16 04:26:36 yes im nearly done, just making the IPK files. been having a lot of trouble doing it Sep 16 04:27:48 is it okay to plug the touchstone into a usb port for power, even though it says not too? Sep 16 04:28:05 lol Sep 16 04:28:15 touchstone supposed to charge at 700ma Sep 16 04:28:20 and usb output is 500ma Sep 16 04:28:35 there might be an issue Sep 16 04:28:39 hrm Sep 16 04:29:14 greg_roll: are you making a replacement binaray or a second binary? Sep 16 04:29:24 if your USB port somehow CAN supply 1000ma you could make a custom cable which shorts D+ and D- together and you could do it. You may just fry your USB port though, so YMMV :) Sep 16 04:29:26 like are users gonn ahve to overwrite the old one? Sep 16 04:30:12 cut D+/D- on the host side, short them together on the guest side, I mean Sep 16 04:31:20 greg_roll: having trouble making ipk's? Sep 16 04:31:37 my usb port has a lightning bolt Sep 16 04:31:38 PuffTheMagic: to start with a replacement, if it works I will look at changing the service name Sep 16 04:31:43 http://www.usb.org/developers/devclass_docs/batt_charging_1_1.zip Sep 16 04:31:45 http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre-accessories/193160-successful-charge-between-pc-touchstone.html Sep 16 04:32:05 destinal: i think i just got it, they were failing to install on the emulator but i had the arch set to x86, i set it to all and now it doesn't complain Sep 16 04:32:23 aha Sep 16 04:32:41 greg_roll: use i386 Sep 16 04:32:45 all is bad Sep 16 04:32:51 usb can go up to 1.8A using the battery charging spec Sep 16 04:33:06 destinal: oh thanks! whats the arch for the Pre? Sep 16 04:33:08 destinal: i686 for emulator Sep 16 04:33:15 greg_roll: armv7 for Pre Sep 16 04:33:15 err Sep 16 04:33:29 destinal: i386 will probably work too, but Palm uses i686 Sep 16 04:33:46 greg_roll: ah, i686 then for emu Sep 16 04:34:12 greg_roll: armv7 for pre Sep 16 04:34:21 so i686 for emu and armv7 for the Pre thanks! Sep 16 04:34:32 I love it when a plan comes together. Sep 16 04:36:48 ok so if my IPK now installs according to palm-install but doesn't actually install any files, what could be wrong??? Sep 16 04:39:01 hmm MyTether Installer had an error installing Sep 16 04:39:28 greg_roll: email me the ipkg and I should be able to tell you Sep 16 04:40:12 rwhity: will do thanks :) Sep 16 04:44:23 can_: from what i've read on the precentral forums, and elsewhere, plugging the touchstone in a normal usb port wont necessarily "fry" anything, it just won't charge. Sep 16 04:44:51 or will start charging for a few moments and then stop, then start again, etc. Sep 16 04:45:05 those are the symptoms i've seen people mention. Sep 16 04:45:12 Azalyn: okay thanks Sep 16 04:45:37 Azalyn: What i mean is if you modify a USB cable to make your port look like a dumb charger vis a vis charger spec Sep 16 04:46:16 destinal: yeah i saw that hack on the forums. Sep 16 04:47:04 Azalyn: oh? I guess it's a pretty obvious idea. I didn't know it was on the forums already Sep 16 04:47:09 greg_roll: oh, you know that palm-install doesn't run the postinst, right? Sep 16 04:47:34 rwhitby: thought so, but i don't think its even copying down the files Sep 16 04:47:35 but the port still needs to be able to do 1a, and i'm not sure if can_ has that on whatever device that usb port is on. Sep 16 04:48:20 Azalyn: yeah, that's the thing, if you cut and short you're basically saying it's okay to draw 1a, and I guess some USB ports could be damaged by devices drawing more than they can safely provide (out of spec) Sep 16 04:48:24 talking about older ports of course Sep 16 04:48:31 the new ones will negotiate high power normally Sep 16 04:49:37 You know, it would stand to reason that if you had a usb port to plug in to, you'd probably have an electric socket too. You could just use that. Sep 16 04:50:12 PorkchopExpress: of course, but if someone asked the question they probably could figure _that_ out already so there may be a reason they can't. Sep 16 04:50:22 oh nifty re: touchstone off of laptop usb ports Sep 16 04:50:30 hm, i never thought that could actually damage anything. i mean if the device can't provide 1amp, then it seems like it'd be the same thing as plugging a lower amp AC adaptor in a device requiring more. which i've seen done many times without damage occurring. Sep 16 04:50:49 i guess the touchstone checks to make sure it can get the jooce Sep 16 04:51:00 although sometimes they will just not work. Sep 16 04:51:03 it does have a little micro on it, stands to reason it is teh smart Sep 16 04:51:11 yeah Sep 16 04:51:17 geist: can you do that? palm says not to Sep 16 04:51:22 Azalyn: I figured it was best to mention the disclaimer Sep 16 04:51:28 i dunno, i can ask though Sep 16 04:51:34 tying the data pins together sounds like a quick way to kill some ports Sep 16 04:51:35 i just dont kow how the touchstone really works Sep 16 04:51:43 i just laughed when those guys took it apart and said that they'd be surprised if it costed more than 5 dollars to make. :| Sep 16 04:52:06 destinal: good plan. Sep 16 04:52:11 Azalyn: since it is theoretically possible to damage a port, some can't supply 1A without giving up the smoke (which is why there's negotiation in the first place) Sep 16 04:52:14 i was sad to see a PIC microcontroller in the touchstone Sep 16 04:52:16 :( Sep 16 04:52:24 Anyone want to guest star on Keen Studios Live? Sep 16 04:52:29 bpadalino: why? :| Sep 16 04:52:34 what difference does it make? Sep 16 04:52:41 they are terrible microcontrollers Sep 16 04:52:49 it's a pic? didn't know that Sep 16 04:52:56 since all electronics are made up of magic smoke.. once released, you can't put it back in Sep 16 04:52:58 yeah, you can see the microchip logo Sep 16 04:52:58 but yeah, there are micros everywhere now Sep 16 04:53:04 i think we counted like 11 on the pre itself Sep 16 04:53:11 i would have loved to see an msp430 instead of a pic Sep 16 04:53:27 ok. :| Sep 16 04:53:40 they are terrible in what way though? Sep 16 04:53:44 destinal: hahaha, best way to explain all electronics Sep 16 04:53:46 reliability? or just bad design? Sep 16 04:53:54 it's just an old design Sep 16 04:54:05 much like, say... x86 Sep 16 04:54:12 but like x86 it hasn't stopped it Sep 16 04:54:19 bpadalino: I wonder if the PIC is read protected.. I imagine since most are.. Sep 16 04:54:37 as we've seen on PCs.. (like with that one realtek nic), even a terrible chipset, can be made to work properly with some driver magic. Sep 16 04:54:38 somehow i doubt it is .. Sep 16 04:54:43 So nobody? Sep 16 04:54:55 destinal, a lot of micros you can get out of that mode i was reading Sep 16 04:55:37 Azalyn: 8-bit with weak peripherals that only work part of the time it seems .. Sep 16 04:56:08 it's a very strange and limiting design when it comes to the stack as well Sep 16 04:56:21 beats a 6502 Sep 16 04:56:26 and that was pretty useful for a long time Sep 16 04:56:38 8051's are still used in all those damned cypress fx2 chips Sep 16 04:56:40 it depends how it is being used in the touchstone though. it isn't exactly a terribly complex device. Sep 16 04:56:45 they're just about as old i think Sep 16 04:57:08 if any of the "bad stuff" in that chip, isn't necessary for the functions of the touchstone, then its ok in the end. Sep 16 04:57:23 maybe if they went with an msp430 TI would have given them a bulk discount for ordering with the omap3's Sep 16 04:57:27 geist: x86 is an odd duck in that regard, what with the whole CISC -> RISC internal voodoo Sep 16 04:57:46 yep, though the modern day risc machines do the same thing Sep 16 04:57:48 i would think they considered all their options. :| Sep 16 04:57:52 Azalyn: PICs are best suited for hobbyist projects .. but a professional design? no way Sep 16 04:57:53 it's really an artifact of modern cpu design Sep 16 04:58:29 only we geeks notice those subtle details though Sep 16 04:58:50 bpadalino: you just wanted to be able to reprogram the msp430, didn't you ... ;-) Sep 16 04:58:51 i mean if touchstones are exploding and melting into a pool of lava, then that is when people notice. :) Sep 16 04:59:02 rwhitby: you see through my ruse :) Sep 16 04:59:40 imagine a beowulf cluster of touchstones. Sep 16 04:59:42 hehe Sep 16 04:59:44 oh i think i have a little keyspan usb serial dongle with one of those Sep 16 04:59:59 i can tell cause it failed one day, and now when i plug it in it shows up on usb as a 430 in DFU mode Sep 16 05:00:06 just ready for you to load codez onto it Sep 16 05:00:15 must have got its rom wiped Sep 16 05:00:18 give it the 0's and 1's it wants Sep 16 05:00:56 i thought about it for a bit, but never got around to it Sep 16 05:01:20 oh, and apparently. i have to recompile virtualbox yet again Sep 16 05:01:38 i came home with a headache the past 2 nights Sep 16 05:01:45 because palm-emulator needs virtualbox to have qt4 Sep 16 05:02:02 virtualbox is irritating me Sep 16 05:02:08 geist, what other micros are in there ? Sep 16 05:02:09 i wanted to have a gtk-only system :( Sep 16 05:02:16 i just updated to 3.0.6 and now i'm having issues Sep 16 05:02:20 there have to be a couple ARM's in the bluetooth/wifi stuff Sep 16 05:02:45 but i'll sacrifice. since i want to run this. not just for accessing linux and installing optware Sep 16 05:02:46 bpadalino: yeah, and the radio, and the touchscreen, and in the flash, and in the battery Sep 16 05:03:00 stupid emulator doesn't think i have virtualbox installed Sep 16 05:03:02 but i'd like to maybe try to learn some development on it. heh Sep 16 05:03:05 anyone else having this issue? Sep 16 05:03:14 HattCzech: I've seen another report that 3.0.6 and Palm emulator are not compatible on windows. I'm running them both together on the mac without problems. Sep 16 05:03:16 yeah, lots of nice systems in there Sep 16 05:03:33 ohhh, how i wish i had a mac :) hahah Sep 16 05:04:00 HattCzech: I was like that 3 months ago ;-) Sep 16 05:04:19 here goes my internet again (while i uninstall and reinstall virtualbox) Sep 16 05:04:20 by the way, earlier you guys confirmed something i've been wondering about. given that virtualbox is an x86 vm, i was wondering why the sdk and palm-emulator needed it... since the pre is arm. Sep 16 05:04:33 but heh.. so the emulator really is on i686 Sep 16 05:04:52 when you guys package native apps, you cross-compile them? Sep 16 05:05:05 Azalyn: yep Sep 16 05:05:25 we fooled with arm qemu for the emulator, but it wasn't fast enough Sep 16 05:05:35 moar mips! Sep 16 05:05:43 and compiling the rest of the world as x86 isn't hard at all Sep 16 05:05:48 Azalyn: I use the codesourcery toolchain running on ubuntu 8.04 LTS server for the preware and optware autobuilders. Sep 16 05:06:18 yay! 3.0.4 works... irritating virtualbox Sep 16 05:06:30 bpadalino: you like the mips arch? i hear it's a clean arch design-wise but that programming assembly on it is extremely difficult Sep 16 05:06:53 rwhitby: hm. sounds snazzy. Sep 16 05:06:56 no, the emu needed more MIPS to make it run faster .. Sep 16 05:07:06 oh. those kinds of mips. Sep 16 05:07:10 woo Sep 16 05:07:11 the MIPS architecture is clean, but ARM is fine as well Sep 16 05:07:13 guest star! Sep 16 05:07:15 Azalyn: not really, been using that set up for 5 years on nslu2-linux.org Sep 16 05:07:18 http://keen-studios.net/live/ Sep 16 05:07:23 needs more vups Sep 16 05:07:25 learning ARM is a good thing for up and comers Sep 16 05:07:54 yep Sep 16 05:08:03 certainly more fun than x86 Sep 16 05:08:14 though there is a serious lack of "embedded" programmers now it seems :( Sep 16 05:08:45 so arm asm is the easiest? Sep 16 05:08:52 it's pretty clean Sep 16 05:08:52 bpadalino: i'd love to get into that field, but nobody wants to hire me Sep 16 05:08:55 lemme get you an example Sep 16 05:09:08 i never thought i'd write "asm" and "easy" in the same sentence. :| Sep 16 05:09:11 HattCzech: do a little project .. the boards are cheap - and put that on your resume Sep 16 05:09:27 http://git.newos.org/?p=lk.git;a=blob;f=lib/libc/string/arch/arm/memcpy.S;h=3b7816dfb12d997c31a3a9ba28622c10dc71bf3a;hb=master Sep 16 05:09:31 i did that a bit, didn't help much Sep 16 05:09:42 that should actually be in bootie, since bootie is based on the lk project I have there Sep 16 05:09:51 or they're looking for someone with 3-5+ years experience Sep 16 05:10:06 bootie is a replacement bootloader? Sep 16 05:10:19 it's the bootloader we wrote for webos devices Sep 16 05:10:39 HattCzech: sorry to hear that .. :( i do FPGA work so i can't be too helpful Sep 16 05:11:07 i've played with FPGAs, and those are fun... xilinx spartan3... did a lot of fun stuff with those in school Sep 16 05:11:15 wish i could find something still doing that Sep 16 05:11:38 we made a processor, made a pong game, lots of stuff Sep 16 05:11:41 software defined radio uses them pretty extensively .. also video applications Sep 16 05:11:55 if you wanted to get into performance computing and/or networking .. Sep 16 05:12:13 they're used there since they can be used to test out experimental 100GBe links Sep 16 05:12:29 by the way, the kernel recompile page on the wiki mentions that there are three binary drivers. i googled around and it seems two of those three are out there in source form (exmap and dspbridge) Sep 16 05:12:41 they're pretty good with experimenting all around, since you can program them to do damn near anything :) Sep 16 05:12:51 then reprogram them to do something totally different Sep 16 05:13:08 does this actually mean that only one piece of hardware in the pre is not in opensource form or documented? (the wifi chip, which is the third binary module. a marvell chipset) Sep 16 05:13:30 the qualcomm modem ? Sep 16 05:13:59 i don't know, the wiki only mentions three kernel modules as being binary-only. Sep 16 05:14:05 wifi, yes Sep 16 05:14:22 modem runs on the modem cpu, so you never see it Sep 16 05:14:26 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Custom_Kernels#Download.2C_patch.2C_configure.2C_and_build_the_kernel. Sep 16 05:14:26 and it's *very* closed source :) Sep 16 05:15:04 it has it's own cpu? heh. how does it interface with the kernel? Sep 16 05:15:11 as a serial device? Sep 16 05:15:17 the modem is basically its own system. it talks to the main cpu via serial + usb Sep 16 05:15:23 geist, is there a known issue of GPS not being available if the jvm crashes during operation? (eg: never comes back up) Sep 16 05:15:26 it has its own ram and flash Sep 16 05:15:27 ttyACM or something? Sep 16 05:15:46 hsuart driver Sep 16 05:15:54 we wrote it, basically bypasses tty for performance reasons Sep 16 05:15:59 bluetooth uses it too Sep 16 05:16:15 bpadalino: no idea Sep 16 05:17:07 how big is your testing team over there at palm ? Sep 16 05:17:18 there are many of them Sep 16 05:17:20 different areas Sep 16 05:17:28 wait... you work at palm!? :O Sep 16 05:17:32 yes Sep 16 05:17:35 kernel team Sep 16 05:17:49 meet the man .. the myth ... the legend Sep 16 05:17:53 nowai Sep 16 05:17:58 wai Sep 16 05:19:32 i have to tell you then. the pre with webos, is probably the first product i have seen in years, that i don't mind that it has closed-source stuff on it. i'm usually pretty anti-proprietary, but *real* innovation really does move me. Sep 16 05:19:56 thanks Sep 16 05:20:07 i'm also glad that folks find it fun to hack on Sep 16 05:20:12 yeah, pragmatism in action. Sep 16 05:20:23 geist, do you go on more dates now or back when you worked at apple ? Sep 16 05:20:30 after personally being involved in two products that didn't really allow that (danger sidekick, iphone) it's nice to make a more open phone Sep 16 05:20:34 I hope you guys give apple the ass-kicking of a lifetime. :) Sep 16 05:20:36 they deserve it. Sep 16 05:20:50 bpadalino: hmm? Sep 16 05:21:32 chicks/dudes don't dig the fact you work at palm now that the pre is out and all over the place ? Sep 16 05:21:48 heh, this is silicon valley Sep 16 05:21:52 everyone does something cool Sep 16 05:22:05 and no, haven't been on a date in a while :( Sep 16 05:22:10 :( Sep 16 05:22:16 all work and no play Sep 16 05:22:20 should someone start a "get geist a date!" thread on precentral ? Sep 16 05:22:28 kind of, trying to fix that Sep 16 05:22:32 the whole "get rod a pre!" seemed to work pretty well Sep 16 05:22:38 I'll donate $50 ;-) Sep 16 05:22:44 gonna even get a haircut this week :) Sep 16 05:22:49 first time in 3 years Sep 16 05:22:53 yowza Sep 16 05:23:18 rwhitby: you need a pre first! Sep 16 05:23:26 pre: acquired Sep 16 05:23:42 next step: shipment to .au Sep 16 05:23:52 oh hah. was wondering why my laptop was burning a hole in my crotch Sep 16 05:23:54 * destinal cheers bpadalino. Sep 16 05:24:01 had warcraft running on the other desktop Sep 16 05:24:09 lol Sep 16 05:25:06 i drove out to buffalo to get the phone .. which is ~1h away ... and i can't imagine having a 1h commute every day to work .. dunno how people do it Sep 16 05:25:12 * rwhitby is indebted to bpadalino, literally ;-) Sep 16 05:25:19 Azalyn: yeah, even though big pieces of webos are closed source, the device itself feels more open than just about anything embedded I've worked with Sep 16 05:25:31 geist: do you know if palm is negotiating with marvell to get the wifi code opened or not? i imagine even if you knew, you probably couldn't tell us, but it cant hurt to ask. hehe Sep 16 05:25:48 yeah, can't say anything about that. i'll ask Sep 16 05:26:19 destinal: yeah. it's really great. Sep 16 05:26:20 Azalyn: from what I've seen I don't think palm is that concerned with getting things opened up as long as they have the code they need themselves Sep 16 05:26:34 bpadalino: I go on holidays from the 25th - so should have a little bit of time to play with it then - I can use the cache of PreCentral homebrew ipkgs on my laptop when offline for a week :-) Sep 16 05:26:44 honestly most of the openness so far seems to be to just be pragmatism. which is cool, it shows that OSS and business works Sep 16 05:26:50 a lot of opening vs not opening is simply finding the time Sep 16 05:26:58 you know, like, a year ago, i had my hopes pinned on the freerunner. because i really wanted an open phone. but man, *now* i think i was out of my mind. Sep 16 05:26:59 rwhitby: i'll try to get it shipped out tomorrow or thursday Sep 16 05:27:09 and yeah, it's great to see that linux is making real inroads, and it feels good to be part of it Sep 16 05:27:13 Azalyn: I have 4 freerunners. Sep 16 05:27:25 Azalyn: I was into it too except that the hardware was teh suck in terms of capability Sep 16 05:27:29 we've made a lot of progress that you'll never see, but against various hardware vendors that still dont completely get it Sep 16 05:27:29 well, 2 GTA01's and 2 GTA02. Only one of each works. Sep 16 05:27:34 Azalyn: especially data speeds Sep 16 05:27:47 yeah, and there was the limitation with the shared bus or something Sep 16 05:27:55 but I needed a hardware keyboard, to upgrade from the Treo 650 Sep 16 05:27:59 haha, rick_home is awsome! he does some crazy work! Sep 16 05:28:02 geist, it's a shame we'll never see it Sep 16 05:28:07 no, i mean you will see it Sep 16 05:28:18 you'll see it indirectly Sep 16 05:28:21 oh Sep 16 05:28:37 as in we have to fight a lot with vendors to get stuff opened up, but quite a few of them relent, and then find out it's not so bad Sep 16 05:28:46 the sd bus and the video chip were on the same bus or something i believe. Sep 16 05:28:46 no one ever sees the progress or work i really end up doing .. it's not super satisfying at times Sep 16 05:28:50 a bit frustrating Sep 16 05:28:53 android is doing a lot of this fight too, and we kind of stay in sync with them Sep 16 05:28:54 geist: wow, I am kind of surprised, but that's great Sep 16 05:28:58 which meant that if you wanted to play video... it would just not work. Sep 16 05:29:43 with regards to actual linux work, we have the advantage of having it all open sourced by necessity, so that kind of takes the whole choice off the table and makes it simpler Sep 16 05:29:53 ie, if it'll all have to get open sourced later anyway, no one can really argue about it Sep 16 05:30:05 you just gotta do it, and you just tell the vendors that they have no real choice Sep 16 05:30:07 geist: I've had some less than fun experiences so far in trying to get even GPL stuff from palm so far under GPL, but that seems to be changing Sep 16 05:30:10 geist, was there much of a push for binary blobs ? Sep 16 05:30:11 so here's hoping Sep 16 05:30:27 destinal: most of that is just the lack of time and organization on that front Sep 16 05:30:33 it'll get better over time Sep 16 05:30:44 bpadalino: hmm? Sep 16 05:30:51 i haven't accessed linux on my pre yet, but just from what i've read on the wiki. you can tell that the people that worked on it *know* linux/unix. Sep 16 05:30:57 oh you mean binary drivers from vendors? yeah, and we just say it's not feasible Sep 16 05:31:06 if they really wanna hold out, it goes in user space Sep 16 05:31:06 ah, that's good Sep 16 05:31:23 now, there's the caveat that we still did it for wifi, but that's kind of legacy Sep 16 05:31:29 decisions made before webos really got started up Sep 16 05:31:34 geist: yeah, especially when you're moving into more and more chipsets ,maintaining that stuff wouldn't be fun Sep 16 05:31:37 some companies might use linux as a kernel but will throw all their own junk over it, and all of it will be weird stuff that makes no sense. Sep 16 05:31:47 but this isnt the case here Sep 16 05:31:56 msm vs a8, etc Sep 16 05:31:57 under the hood it really does seem all standard Sep 16 05:32:04 so that is just really cool Sep 16 05:32:41 oh, comments are amusing... // Removing this for the CES demo - 2008-12-21 - NOV-37658 Sep 16 05:32:46 we try. but keep in mind we *want* to do the right thing Sep 16 05:32:50 sometimes we fail Sep 16 05:33:04 necessities of shipping a product Sep 16 05:33:50 geist: well I can tell that the whole attitude towards customers and hackers on the device is night and day when comparing apple to palm, so I'm optimistic Sep 16 05:33:58 already you guys have gone way ahead of what i could possibly have expected in a phone. a friend of mine had told me about the pre a long time ago, but it was only recently that i actually started looking into it, because i saw it on bell's site. Sep 16 05:35:07 i've been looking for a new phone for a year or two now. because i got kind of screwed with my last one. i didn't know what i was buying. (a nokia s60 phone with "symbian signed", and hardly no apps whatsoever compatible with it at the time) Sep 16 05:35:18 it's definitely nicer shipping open stuff Sep 16 05:35:21 obviously not just lip-service stuff too, when you see how easy it is to rebuild a kernel, flash a custom image, or just get root on a device Sep 16 05:35:28 oh jeeze, the 17th ... i almost forgot .. palm conference call - i wonder how it will go Sep 16 05:35:40 i probably spent 50 hours of my life sitting in meetings about how we were going to lock down iphone from hackers Sep 16 05:35:44 and of course it's all moot Sep 16 05:35:51 'they' have more time than you do Sep 16 05:35:55 'they' always win Sep 16 05:35:59 heh Sep 16 05:36:29 geist, only 50 hours? wow Sep 16 05:36:32 that's not too bad Sep 16 05:36:38 well,that was just my little piece Sep 16 05:36:45 ah Sep 16 05:36:57 geist: that's the weird thing too, I never got it.. why invest all that time / money / resource? Sep 16 05:37:14 maybe with the AT&T thing I can get trying for the lockin Sep 16 05:37:16 i did all this 'research' on the pre like last week. and almost a day later i was ready to buy it and went to see if they had it at futureshop (canadian chain owned by bestbuy) Sep 16 05:37:31 but for most companies, it's control to no purpose Sep 16 05:37:37 just a total waste Sep 16 05:37:38 if only the pre came with the schematics like the old school computers you used to buy Sep 16 05:37:43 :) Sep 16 05:37:48 i decided to wait until monday, because i already had a doctor's appointment that day so had to go out anyways. Sep 16 05:37:55 bpadalino: it's not that interesting, to be honest Sep 16 05:38:03 bpadalino: or the Openmoko phone, which not only had schematics but also gerber files. Sep 16 05:38:19 wow, gerbers too? that's just asking for ripoffs Sep 16 05:38:20 geist: I'd find it interesting ;-) Sep 16 05:38:31 bpadalino: it was _open source_ hardware Sep 16 05:38:48 bpadalino: they had cad files for the body too. Sep 16 05:38:51 wow, c source code too? that's just asking for ripoffs Sep 16 05:38:52 as things get more and more integrated, schematics almost get simpler Sep 16 05:38:53 for 3d printers Sep 16 05:38:58 more wires just going between big blocks Sep 16 05:39:28 geist: yeah, there is that. the test points for the pcb would be more interesting ... Sep 16 05:39:43 there aren't a lot Sep 16 05:39:45 destinal, i dunno - it's a little different ... with C you're selling bits ... with gerbers, you're selling a physical product Sep 16 05:40:26 would be nice when they get integrated to the point where you have one chip for all the standard cpu stuff, and maybe a primary bus. and then a second chip with communication stuff, with other buses like usb, and networking too (wifi, etc) Sep 16 05:40:27 heh Sep 16 05:40:37 well, yeah, that's kind of what it is now Sep 16 05:40:41 but, it's not that simple Sep 16 05:41:04 there are a *ton* of implications as to the exact layout, how the wires are routed, how the busses are powered, how the charging works, etc Sep 16 05:41:05 bpadalino: yeah, but I doubt they were afraid of knockoffs. making a knockoff of a modern phone? it's not like building a computer out of the same SOC's to run the same software would be terribly hard to figure out Sep 16 05:41:08 it's all a big pile of details Sep 16 05:41:20 and the details are what cause you to go through 5 revs or so before you get it right Sep 16 05:41:40 destinal, i suppose Sep 16 05:41:53 right now, i'm wondering how the whole LTE and WiMAX thing will play out. Sep 16 05:42:03 LTE should win hands down Sep 16 05:42:09 WiMAX is pretty terrible Sep 16 05:42:22 and then you'll probably end up with at least one or two custom chips, depending on how big you are (apple builds their stuff with tons of custom stuff, palm with less) Sep 16 05:42:35 when i heard about LTE, i figured all the carriers would just decide to step over WiMAX. but the Sprint move brings up some interesting scenarios. heh Sep 16 05:42:47 a lot of times you can get philips or maxim or whatnot to run you a special run of pmics or charger chips or whatnot Sep 16 05:43:30 or, you'll use a chip that by the time you ships is out of general production, but will continue making a run just for you Sep 16 05:43:47 so, trying to copy a design by looking at it externally to be sw compatible is basiaclly impossible Sep 16 05:44:13 we have a lot of .. i forgot what they're called .. last inventory contracts? Sep 16 05:44:29 so we get a notice for discontinuation of parts .. and we can choose to stock up Sep 16 05:44:34 if that's what its called... yeah Sep 16 05:44:40 if sprint pulls off a wimax network, without their shareholders deciding to kill that idea at some point. then they will very likely need to have lte+wimax dualmode chipsets for roaming. and this could create the economies of scale necessary to make those dualmode chipsets a really dirt cheap part. Sep 16 05:44:55 but we have to support products which were developed back in the 80's and 90's and still in production today Sep 16 05:45:00 which is amazingly difficult Sep 16 05:45:18 well, what'll happen is a company will come out with a new variant every year or so, and remove the old ones from their catalog Sep 16 05:45:29 bpadalino: do you also work for someone cool? Sep 16 05:45:48 not really ... i work for a tactical radio company and do software defined radio work Sep 16 05:46:14 we sell green radios to governments Sep 16 05:46:16 I've heard of companies making FPGA's to emulate old out of production IC's to maintain production of compatible units, but I guess that's probably not that common Sep 16 05:46:17 ah. you mentioned a conference call earlier or something Sep 16 05:46:18 with palm Sep 16 05:46:27 but we're getting into first responder stuff now Sep 16 05:46:58 destinal, most newer FPGA's don't support 5v IO .. some are starting to drop 3.3V IO as well Sep 16 05:47:44 wow, later than I thought.. gn all Sep 16 05:49:05 [01:33:57] oh jeeze, the 17th ... i almost forgot .. palm conference call - i wonder how it will go Sep 16 05:49:07 that. Sep 16 05:49:28 oh - that is their earnings call .. Sep 16 05:49:39 for the first quarter of fiscal '10 Sep 16 05:49:53 hm Sep 16 05:49:58 will probably get pelted with questions about how well the pre is selling Sep 16 05:50:34 i just hope the store really takes off Sep 16 05:50:45 i do too! Sep 16 05:50:55 i wanna buy me a nice house in a couple years Sep 16 05:51:04 tired of this crappy duplex thing Sep 16 05:51:09 in the bay area? better save that haircut money! Sep 16 05:51:18 yeah, no kidding Sep 16 05:51:26 i'm also wondering if theres gonna be an official onscreen keyboard. Sep 16 05:51:34 even the cheap neighborhoods are running like $450/ft^2 Sep 16 05:51:57 ridiculous prices Sep 16 05:52:15 since the one homebrew one could interfere with updates in the future, as i understand it. Sep 16 05:52:39 in the bay area... mobile homes are pretty affordable :) Sep 16 05:52:47 yeah, or house boats Sep 16 05:52:54 yeah man, go for a house boat Sep 16 05:52:55 redwood city :) Sep 16 05:52:58 although i'm doing fine with the hw keyboard right now. Sep 16 05:53:12 east bay is a bit cheaper. but then it's the east bay Sep 16 05:53:24 * ashi__colo has a trailer in san jose Sep 16 05:54:40 just live in the city that has the most murders in the state .. like i do - everything is cheap Sep 16 05:55:21 oakland? Sep 16 05:55:24 or miami? Sep 16 05:55:45 i'll give you the state, and you can guess the city: New York State Sep 16 05:56:08 buffalo? Sep 16 05:56:49 nah, Rochester Sep 16 05:57:07 i am pretty sure we beat out buffalo Sep 16 05:57:13 schenectady Sep 16 05:58:44 ah, damn Sep 16 06:01:00 oh hrm .. no, we have way more murders per 100k people Sep 16 06:01:41 they have more arson Sep 16 06:03:08 hey - this is a great thing to use wolfram alpha for! Sep 16 06:04:08 grats Sep 16 06:04:11 it sounds useful kind of Sep 16 06:04:47 finally i got palm-emulator working Sep 16 06:04:51 wolfram alpha ? it's only good for proving who has more murders Sep 16 06:04:54 is it supposed to have sound? Sep 16 06:05:10 no sound Sep 16 06:05:28 enjoy the silence Sep 16 06:06:04 well, that is weird, because palm-emulator launches virtualbox with --audio pulse Sep 16 06:06:05 :| Sep 16 06:06:15 I don't wanna sound like a queer or nothin', but I think Depeche Mode is a sweet band! Sep 16 06:06:21 shoulda put quotes around that Sep 16 06:06:27 they got some good tunes Sep 16 06:06:29 that's why i had to recompile vbox the first time. (second time was because of the gui) Sep 16 06:06:38 geist, quote from: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0124819/quotes Sep 16 06:07:07 it's a great date movie, btw - remember that for the future Sep 16 06:07:32 I am sancho Sep 16 06:07:54 heh Sep 16 06:08:25 the big lebowski is #1 on my movie chart .. but that's pretty high up there Sep 16 06:10:10 geist: oh, by the way, the guy at bell put in the wrong email for a profile when he was testing the phone at the store, i made a new profile later. but i'm wondering if the old one will auto-delete eventually if there is no confirmation? (which there wont be since it's not a valid address) Sep 16 06:10:28 night Sep 16 06:11:14 nite Sep 16 06:11:25 night bpadalino. Sep 16 06:38:12 hello, where are the homebrew apps located on the phone? Sep 16 06:39:01 maybe in /opt ? Sep 16 06:39:04 in /var/usr/palm/applications Sep 16 06:39:19 thanks Sep 16 06:39:37 np Sep 16 06:40:00 how about bookmarks? Sep 16 06:40:08 i added a bookmark to my launcher Sep 16 06:40:16 I have no idea Sep 16 06:40:18 when I do orange + click to remove it, the phone freezes Sep 16 06:45:40 using javascript replace with regexp, how do i use the value stored from a (.+) ? i'm trying \1 and it's not working Sep 16 06:47:55 antianalog, if you mean that while in the browser you went to the menu and Page and added to launcher, and then in the launcher you orange-click it and cannot delete it, then I can't help you, because that works for me Sep 16 06:48:22 try rebooting your phone.. Sep 16 06:49:40 I can tell you I had a lot of weirdness with my launcher, similar to what you're talking about and I had to replace some of the launcher files. Sep 16 06:49:43 l8r Sep 16 06:55:31 * hmagoo is back (gone 00:05:39) Sep 16 06:57:39 * hmagoo is away: I'm busy Sep 16 07:03:03 hello everyone Sep 16 07:06:03 hello everyone Sep 16 07:11:50 So when's the new Preware coming out? Sep 16 07:15:28 I wonder if my irc client is working, cause I can't see anyone saying anything??? Sep 16 07:16:49 Anyone here? Sep 16 07:20:01 maybe Sep 16 07:20:23 haha.. sorry my irc hasnt been working all day Sep 16 07:20:56 Now is a good time to leave feature requests. Because tons of people LOOK at the channel but no on really says anything, so your text stays on screen for a long time. :D Sep 16 07:21:33 As long as I have been in here, this chat usually moves quickly. Sep 16 07:22:15 not at midnight lol Sep 16 07:22:32 Not even at midnight sometimes, this thing has moved Sep 16 07:22:59 I have been in here at these times before and a lot of ppl talking. Sep 16 07:23:13 nothing to talk about Sep 16 07:23:13 Dunno maybe I get lucky Sep 16 07:23:19 1.2 is delayed until next week Sep 16 07:23:25 app catalog 9/24 Sep 16 07:23:28 Yeah tru, but who cares Sep 16 07:23:31 nothing this week Sep 16 07:23:49 The homebrew is far superior, and 1.2? What good is it adding? Seems like notta Sep 16 07:23:57 Lots Sep 16 07:24:04 apparently you have not read the change log Sep 16 07:24:07 I read the thing, nothing great Sep 16 07:24:28 ANYthing is good ;) Sep 16 07:24:28 this is Palm we are talking about Sep 16 07:24:32 I have about 10 times, one that Sprint released on its website and over at Precentral. Nothing spectacular is on it Sep 16 07:24:58 A video recorder would be nice, or even new modes to the camera Sep 16 07:25:11 those are very minor features Sep 16 07:25:16 not necessary right now Sep 16 07:25:19 the ability to have voice recognition Sep 16 07:25:25 small feature Sep 16 07:25:26 Features that all phones have? Sep 16 07:25:35 webos needs a lot of tweaking first Sep 16 07:25:39 Sorry but its pathetic it doesn't have any of them Sep 16 07:25:50 So go buy an iPhone 3GS Sep 16 07:25:53 It has all of them Sep 16 07:26:06 And it works 100% of the time right? Sep 16 07:26:08 Att sucks, and honestly need the multi tasking Sep 16 07:26:17 So don't complain then ;) Sep 16 07:26:32 Palm is very busy on a BRAND new OS Sep 16 07:26:35 things take time Sep 16 07:26:39 I'm just saying they should be released... Sep 16 07:26:52 Be patient Sep 16 07:27:00 Don't expect everything all up front Sep 16 07:27:16 It took Apple 3 revisions and Google 1 year ot get video recording Sep 16 07:27:20 to* Sep 16 07:27:32 I would not follow what Apple does sorry Sep 16 07:27:35 The Pre has been out 3 months Sep 16 07:27:45 Give it some freaking time Sep 16 07:27:51 Android had everything else but vr Sep 16 07:28:11 and anyway this is watercooler talk not internals talk Sep 16 07:28:23 huh? Sep 16 07:28:25 or #webos talk Sep 16 07:28:47 This channel is for development not watercooler chat Sep 16 07:28:55 you can join #webos-watercooler for that Sep 16 07:29:03 I have been in here before, I know whats talked about Sep 16 07:29:25 That was WebOs talk Sep 16 07:29:34 That was complaining ;) Sep 16 07:29:43 We have heard it a zillion times Sep 16 07:29:48 If you think so... Sep 16 07:29:50 Nothing is going to change Sep 16 07:29:58 Give it time Sep 16 07:30:03 lol Sep 16 08:19:44 rwhitby: seems the directfb git repo created incorrectly, the patch is wrong, I can not configure pbp stuff, the pbp part in configure.in is missing Sep 16 08:20:34 ameng: are you able to easily fix it and push a new version, or do I need to try and recreate from the files you sent me? Sep 16 08:22:01 how do you create it ? import the original directfb-1.2.8 code. then patch the pbp stuff? Sep 16 08:24:04 ameng: I imported the original directfb-1.2.8, and did a autogen then make distclean on that. Then I imported your directfb-1.2.8, then did an autogen and make distclean on that. then made the diff from those two results. Sep 16 08:25:42 anyone know how to get the device id? Sep 16 08:25:50 i dont want to write an app to get it Sep 16 08:26:23 ameng: if you tell me what files are wrong, I can copy them over from your tarball and import them correctly. Sep 16 08:26:48 configure.in is wrong Sep 16 08:29:10 ameng: fixed - "git pull" will get the correct version Sep 16 08:29:22 will try Sep 16 08:33:08 ameng: is there any other missing differences? Sep 16 08:33:23 compiling... Sep 16 08:38:47 rwhitby: get errors while compiling, do not know why Sep 16 08:39:48 ameng: did you manually modify any Makefile.in files? Sep 16 08:40:03 no Sep 16 08:41:23 or config.h.in ? Sep 16 08:41:32 no Sep 16 08:42:01 or ltmain.sh ? Sep 16 08:42:16 only modified configure.in and systems/Makefile.am Sep 16 08:48:07 ameng: I'll create a list of the files that are different and email it to you Sep 16 08:48:48 ok, thanks Sep 16 09:11:58 ameng: sent Sep 16 09:12:11 let me know if any of those should be included in the repo Sep 16 09:48:20 drunknbass: if you just want to get the device ID, it is in the help menu of Quick Contacts homebrew app. Sep 16 09:48:39 oh ok thx Sep 16 09:48:52 i was just curious what mine was, wanted to save it somewhere Sep 16 09:49:06 must be somewhere else obvious, but I didn't look hard enough. Sep 16 09:55:36 rwhitby: my autogen.sh does not do configure , i think that is why it does not work Sep 16 09:57:44 ameng: fix pushed Sep 16 10:03:01 rwhitby : I mean in the process you created the repo when you did an autogen.sh on my directfb, that did not do the configure Sep 16 10:03:20 but the original one did Sep 16 10:06:18 can you just do make distclean on my directfb and delete the useless files : cscope* , tags, then directly do a diff on the unpacked original directfb, or i can do that ? Sep 16 10:10:22 ameng: all the files that are created by the configure step should be excluded from the repo anyway, cause they are generated. Sep 16 10:10:44 you are right Sep 16 10:11:04 let me see why it does't work Sep 16 10:11:07 ameng: please feel free to make any changes you need and commit directly to the repo. Sep 16 10:11:23 ok Sep 16 10:11:54 I consider you to be the "owner" of those repos at the moment - I just helped set them up :-) Sep 16 10:12:16 :) Sep 16 10:47:10 hmm Sep 16 10:47:22 who is responsible for the postinst script for preware? Sep 16 10:47:24 rwhitby: ? :> Sep 16 10:48:11 hehe Sep 16 10:48:20 I thought I've been in here for the past week I was sitting on #bash Sep 16 10:48:27 I was like, "lotta shell questions for a palm channel." Sep 16 11:02:00 en0x: what's up? Sep 16 11:07:45 rwhitby: why in the postinst script there is none about precentral feed? Sep 16 11:08:01 well its not creating precentral.conf feed Sep 16 11:08:02 hmm Sep 16 11:09:30 en0x: precentral.conf comes in the ipkg file itself, cause it does not have architecture specific subdirs. Sep 16 11:15:25 oh i see coz i had some issues and had to remove everything in /var/etc/ipkg/ Sep 16 11:15:35 hehehe and i had to recreate precentral.conf Sep 16 11:18:26 en0x: you might want to reinstall ipkgservice ... Sep 16 11:18:47 cause you'll be missing three other feeds as well Sep 16 11:18:57 ok i'm doing it right now Sep 16 11:20:06 Preware 0.8.7 is released to the public feeds. Sep 16 11:20:21 i thought that the postinst is taking care of setting up repos Sep 16 11:20:27 but i was wrong thanks rwhitby Sep 16 11:25:33 http://forums.precentral.net/showthread.php?p=1897202#post1897202 i wonder where this app is at Sep 16 11:34:56 rwhitby: If I have Preware 0.8.5 installed, can I update to Preware 0.8.7 vie Preware or should I still use WebOSQuickInstall? Sep 16 11:35:21 you can always update preware using preware. even services now too. Sep 16 11:36:37 rwhitby: I thought so, but I wanted to be sure the version I had had the "changing the tyres" thing. thx Sep 16 11:36:53 changing the tyres was updating ipkgservice Sep 16 11:37:07 you can always change the paint job on a moving car ;-) Sep 16 11:37:13 hehe Sep 16 11:37:27 oil is going to kill me for that one ... Sep 16 12:00:40 can't change the oil on a moving car either... Sep 16 12:01:13 heh Sep 16 12:01:18 * hmagoo is away: Sep 16 12:09:42 * rwhitby bbt Sep 16 12:26:29 it won't let me update it Sep 16 12:26:47 something about service manager not being installed. Well, I can drop it into webos installer Sep 16 12:38:30 i wonder where the GSM pre is and why www.palm.com.au is going :( Sep 16 14:16:43 http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/ipkg.preware.org Sep 16 14:16:45 ;( Sep 16 14:27:00 oil: does the Preware app timeout or will it just hang? Sep 16 14:27:28 looks like it just hangs Sep 16 14:27:30 the server is down Sep 16 14:27:46 cant even get to the wiki Sep 16 14:27:54 really, ipkg should give up Sep 16 14:27:59 but it doesnt look like it ever does Sep 16 14:28:21 * Templarian pokes rwhitby Sep 16 14:29:59 im setting up eclipse Sep 16 14:30:03 gonna do a hello world app Sep 16 14:30:03 :D Sep 16 14:30:07 ! Sep 16 14:30:09 * sportman exicted Sep 16 14:30:36 sportman: Use Komodo. Sep 16 14:31:14 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Komodo_WebOS_Add-on_Install Sep 16 14:31:18 does it have a plugin for pre development? like eclipse does? Sep 16 14:31:25 ah Sep 16 14:31:27 yes i see :-p Sep 16 14:33:09 no sportman it has a plugin that is way BETTER than the eclipse plugin Sep 16 14:33:11 ah its not open source :( Sep 16 14:33:13 sportman, yes it does and Templarian is the creator/developer of that add-on :) Sep 16 14:33:19 very nice btw :) Sep 16 14:33:26 sportman, use Komodo Edit it's free to use Sep 16 14:33:34 Sportman komodo edit is open source and free to use Sep 16 14:33:36 alrighty :D Sep 16 14:33:36 sportman: Komodo Edit is open source Sep 16 14:33:38 * sportman grabs Sep 16 14:33:45 www.openkomodo.com Sep 16 14:33:45 thanks Templarian jcrawford Rick_work and friends :D Sep 16 14:33:48 (but the internals servers are down. Sep 16 14:33:51 but who cares if your editor is open source so long as it is free to use :D Sep 16 14:34:06 WHAT??!??@??@ Sep 16 14:34:27 http://webos.templarian.com/komodo/ sportmansince the link I gave before is down till the servers are up. Sep 16 14:34:44 s/sportmansince/sportman since/ Sep 16 14:34:44 Templarian meant: http://webos.templarian.com/komodo/ sportman since the link I gave before is down till the servers are up. Sep 16 14:35:07 sounds good Sep 16 14:35:07 :D Sep 16 14:35:18 * sportman hates server downtime :-p Sep 16 14:35:37 That's the thing we don't know why it's down since rwhitby is probably sleeping right now. Sep 16 14:35:37 what language is Komodo Edit written in anyway Sep 16 14:35:38 how much traffic do you guys get? Sep 16 14:36:00 jcrawford: It's Gecko 1.9 so JavaScript and Python etc. Sep 16 14:36:16 ah it's interpreted> Sep 16 14:36:19 Lot of XUL (it's why it's so extensiable) Sep 16 14:36:26 figured it would be written with Java/C Sep 16 14:37:11 * oil uses eclipse Sep 16 14:37:16 before, because i already used it Sep 16 14:37:22 now, just to irk Templarian xD Sep 16 14:37:26 Yes oil and you will soon be the only one. Sep 16 14:37:49 hey nebula you around? :D Sep 16 14:37:56 (other than puff, but he's doing java stuff and doesn't want to switch editors so he at least has a reason) Sep 16 14:38:06 i have a reason Sep 16 14:38:17 are there any new apps that need testing? Sep 16 14:38:21 * sportman wants to get his hands dirty :D Sep 16 14:39:16 haha you sound liek a druggie heading to the clinic Sep 16 14:39:26 "any new drug trials I can participate in? I'm itchin man!" Sep 16 14:39:27 sportman: start with hello world and go from there (although with komodo hello world is all setup through the GUI under New Project hehe) Sep 16 14:39:47 lol Templarian nice :D Sep 16 14:40:08 how easy are these apps to tie to online databases? Sep 16 14:40:26 id lvoe to make my very own todo app that is linked with my crm database Sep 16 14:40:30 sportman: not very hard. AJAX talks back and forth. Sep 16 14:40:34 :D Sep 16 14:40:36 yaysss Sep 16 14:42:04 Just make a secure API for your CRM first so that your app has something to talk to. I'm using xml, but I hear json works good also. Sep 16 14:42:45 I think json actually works better for pre apps Sep 16 14:43:00 and im a die hard xml-list (if there is such a thing haha) Sep 16 14:43:11 well i was thinking of just having apps talk to the database Sep 16 14:43:18 not even touch the crm software Sep 16 14:43:30 but json sounds about right Sep 16 14:43:44 AnOutsider: Yea, mine talks to a desktop application also or JSON would have been the choice. Sep 16 14:45:28 sportman: you have to have a middle script, JS cannot talk to a DB directly (other than SQLite on the device). Sep 16 14:46:15 speaking of,c an we use sqlite for our apps, or do we have to use depot Sep 16 14:46:22 havent gottem much into the data storage yet Sep 16 14:46:46 depot sucks Sep 16 14:46:47 AnOutsider: if the webos internals server wasn't down I would link you to the tutorial. Sep 16 14:46:52 depot is just a wrapper for sqlite Sep 16 14:47:07 heh Sep 16 14:47:28 (the cookies are probably in sqlite also lol) Sep 16 14:47:30 Templarian: does the documentation i plan on reading cover any of this? Sep 16 14:47:57 No, there are tutorials online for JavaScript JSON requests. Sep 16 14:48:23 true Sep 16 14:48:46 You might want to use Prototype to handle it. Since it's there anyway. Sep 16 14:49:32 oh this comes with prototype? Sep 16 14:50:00 webOS comes with prototype, but it is not guaranteed to stay available Sep 16 14:51:29 bbl Sep 16 14:54:56 wait, they're planning on removing it? or MAY? Sep 16 14:55:07 that would be kind of silly since their docs tell people it's there and to use it Sep 16 14:55:22 yeah, i dont see them completely removing it now Sep 16 14:55:27 since somany apps use it Sep 16 14:55:31 just use jquery or write everything in plain js :D Sep 16 14:56:21 * Templarian prefers plain JS. :) Sep 16 15:02:02 Prototype's pretty embedded in the Mojo framework, so it would be painful for them to ditch it now Sep 16 15:02:41 Though I wish they'd gone with something like Dojo or at least MooTools Sep 16 15:03:28 is there any documentation on the wallpaper service? Sep 16 15:03:49 I wisht hey would have written their own and just called it Mojo. Sep 16 15:04:22 * oil used prototype before the pre and likes it Sep 16 15:04:31 They could have done pretty well with Dojo, which already has a big foundation for html-based widgets Sep 16 15:04:59 That and a huge library of things like crypto and such Sep 16 15:05:29 The best thing I've heard about prototype is that rails uses it in helpers so you never have to touch it Sep 16 15:05:30 * gkatsev still thinks that jquery is the best Sep 16 15:05:54 I like yui personally, but I think what you like depends on a) your history and b) what you're trying to do. :-) Sep 16 15:05:56 jquery is good for simple to intermediate pages, but it doesn't offer a lot of benefits to full-blown apps Sep 16 15:06:10 YUI's not bad either Sep 16 15:06:10 lmorchard: agreed. Sep 16 15:06:19 where do the gui apps show up under the processes? i cant seem to find any of the apps that I am running Sep 16 15:06:37 they don't. THe apps you are running are all under LunaSysMgr Sep 16 15:07:24 oh yeah they are web apps. so thats the httpd for the pre? Sep 16 15:08:36 so there is no way to 'get at' an individual running app from the command line? ie killit, or what not.. Sep 16 15:08:43 they don't. THe apps you are running are all under LunaSysMgr Sep 16 15:09:00 there isn't really an httpd Sep 16 15:09:12 they're not running against an httpd Sep 16 15:09:23 they're running against the file system with some custom services. Sep 16 15:09:39 and there IS a way to kill an individual app Sep 16 15:09:52 Templarian does it from his Komodo Editor plugin Sep 16 15:10:15 Yea, it's just using the palm command line stuff. Sep 16 15:10:16 I think you can kill an app from palm-install on a desktop, or luna-send from a shell on the device Sep 16 15:10:31 Trying to look it up on the wiki, but it's being slow Sep 16 15:10:34 (or I am slow) Sep 16 15:10:55 lmorchard: wiki is down Sep 16 15:11:05 Ah. Sadness Sep 16 15:11:13 yeah i was trying to get to the wiki too Sep 16 15:11:18 if the wiki is being slow, that's better than it was Sep 16 15:11:25 (all the command line stuff is just a wrapper for luna-send btw) Sep 16 15:11:32 I submitted a trouble ticket to OSUOSL a few minutes ago Sep 16 15:13:05 palm had a page with its command line stuff, trying to find it again Sep 16 15:14:09 http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1552 Sep 16 15:15:09 is tethering still a bad thing to discuss? Sep 16 15:15:41 can_: matters where you are located. hehe. Sep 16 15:15:53 lol Sep 16 15:16:02 usa Sep 16 15:16:34 can_ allow me to direct you to the precentral forums thread on mytether. Sep 16 15:18:01 oil: you may want to put in some sort of timeout or retry button on the feeds. Just incase one of the other feeds goes down or something odd happens. Sep 16 15:21:09 Are there any gotchas with trying to migrate an app from the homebrew feeds to the official app catalog? Sep 16 15:21:33 As in, if the app catalog version is higher, will it just overwrite the last homebrew release? Sep 16 15:25:19 lmorchard: I think some people are using the homebrew as a development sandbox. That's what Preware was technically designed for in the first place. Sep 16 15:25:29 * Templarian brb food Sep 16 15:26:33 for how long the ipkg feed will be down? Sep 16 15:26:37 and webos-internals? Sep 16 15:30:06 hmm. preware wont get past the Updating.... screen. is that due to the wiki being down? Sep 16 15:30:13 yes Sep 16 15:30:25 hmph! lol Sep 16 15:50:36 yeah i only mentioned that timeouts were needed a month ago Sep 16 15:50:42 didnt realize they wernt implemented yet Sep 16 15:54:04 anyone else having problems logging in to the wiki? Sep 16 16:00:04 maybe new people will see this Sep 16 16:00:05 [ChanServ] The entry message for #webos-internals has been set to "The WebOS-Internals servers are down!!!! They will be up ASAP!!!!" Sep 16 16:02:04 PuffTheMagic: is there a reason they are down? maintainance? or something else? Sep 16 16:02:11 nfc Sep 16 16:02:15 ;] Sep 16 16:03:03 norwegian forest cat? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_Forest_Cat Sep 16 16:22:30 preware needs a timeout for checking version too Sep 16 16:34:30 its because the service is like hung up trying to update Sep 16 16:34:37 and it never responds to the version check Sep 16 16:44:18 are the touchstones worth getting? is the touchstone back cover heavier? Sep 16 16:45:44 the touchstone back is awesome Sep 16 16:45:50 and the touchstone itself is awesome Sep 16 16:46:06 i think its heavier cause its got magnets/etc in it Sep 16 16:46:21 but the matte finish is whats nice about it Sep 16 16:47:37 ordering Sep 16 16:47:53 the wife said I don't have to count it against my allowance... nothing to lose at this point Sep 16 16:48:01 (she has an allowance too) Sep 16 16:48:13 lol Sep 16 16:48:23 Not a fan of the touchstone. Sep 16 16:48:30 PorkchopExpress: why not? Sep 16 16:48:32 Especially for the price. Sep 16 16:48:40 the price is high Sep 16 16:48:50 And if you have two Pre's in your house, you get one backing when you buy a touchstone. Sep 16 16:49:03 ahh Sep 16 16:49:11 but not having to fumble with that little flap every time you want to charge it is nice Sep 16 16:49:21 yeah, the price doesn't bother me that much. It's only 40% higher than I'd have paid for the proprietary bs for my last phone Sep 16 16:49:30 oil: exactly Sep 16 16:50:33 i like the usb cable Sep 16 16:50:39 cause my usb port will break Sep 16 16:50:42 and then i get a new pre Sep 16 16:50:45 for free Sep 16 16:50:45 lol Sep 16 16:50:46 :D Sep 16 16:50:51 for free? Sep 16 16:50:58 I thought it was $100 replacement with the insurance Sep 16 16:51:00 1 year manufacturers warranty Sep 16 16:51:03 word Sep 16 16:51:04 i still have to fumble with it to develop Sep 16 16:51:09 so as long as its normal wear and tear Sep 16 16:51:11 they will give u it Sep 16 16:51:12 jettero: but i have the sprint warranty too Sep 16 16:51:13 free! Sep 16 16:51:25 Yeah, I have the sprint ripoff insurance... Sep 16 16:51:31 it's worth it even though it's a ripoff Sep 16 16:51:33 jettero: its not bad Sep 16 16:51:46 jettero: we have a 20% discount on your plans Sep 16 16:51:50 and that includes insurance Sep 16 16:51:52 :D Sep 16 16:52:04 and there are really 2 types of sprint insurance Sep 16 16:52:24 i wish i worked for sprint Sep 16 16:52:27 so i could get this shit free Sep 16 16:52:27 lol Sep 16 16:52:38 PuffTheMagic: who is "we"? Sep 16 16:52:44 oic Sep 16 16:52:51 jettero: my familty Sep 16 16:52:56 on a familty plan Sep 16 16:53:00 I get so much shit for free... I work for an ISP. I have two unmetered servers. :P Sep 16 16:53:01 family Sep 16 16:53:04 beat that with your sprint discount Sep 16 16:53:10 lol Sep 16 16:53:27 oh I'm on the sprint family data unlimited plan I thikn Sep 16 16:53:27 i have a unmetered server in germany at some university :D Sep 16 16:53:37 you just pay the rippoff up front instead of being shocked each month Sep 16 16:53:38 jettero: u lucky bastard Sep 16 16:53:49 sportman: yes Sep 16 16:53:58 jettero: there are like 6 types of claims you can put in with sprint insurance Sep 16 16:54:02 sportman: I don't really get paid enough without counting that and my very awesome retirement benefits Sep 16 16:54:05 and you only pay the deductable for 3 of them Sep 16 16:54:10 but I'd never leave here either Sep 16 16:54:15 ah ok jettero what company? Sep 16 16:54:21 i never got the insurance before either Sep 16 16:54:27 im considering applying for an IT position at cablevision/optimum Sep 16 16:54:28 but the oreo had me worried' Sep 16 16:54:29 sportman: it's a very tiny telephone company in Delton, MI Sep 16 16:54:32 ah Sep 16 16:54:46 we have like 3,000 subscribers, but an OC3 ... Sep 16 16:54:51 OC3 :) Sep 16 16:54:51 and customers don't use as much as you'd think Sep 16 16:55:06 and they don't use upstream at all really Sep 16 16:55:08 OC3's are beasts Sep 16 16:55:12 indeed Sep 16 16:55:23 our coverage area has an oc12 ring Sep 16 16:55:41 that's not internet though, it's voice and data but all ours Sep 16 16:55:43 RIT has 2 of them... when internet was uncapped my ftp dump site got like 20mb/s uploads and downloads :D Sep 16 16:55:59 yeah, I work here. I cap my shit. :) Sep 16 16:56:05 <--- not a total jackass Sep 16 16:56:16 I don't cap it that low though Sep 16 17:03:26 wiw the wiki is still down Sep 16 17:04:21 yea, they must have done something. Sep 16 17:04:55 I mighta just ordered the dual location kit twice... Sep 16 17:05:03 mmm browser weirdness Sep 16 17:45:31 oooooooooh, it's like you knew what i was gonna ask Sep 16 17:45:38 lol Sep 16 17:45:49 anyone have an alternative link for the webosquickinstall.jar? Sep 16 17:46:02 grr i wanna install virtual keyboard but the wiki is down Sep 16 17:46:20 omg, its the end of the world Sep 16 17:46:24 totally Sep 16 17:46:30 lol Sep 16 17:46:53 PuffTheMagic: speaking of, has anyone ever found a solution for the ~90 app limit yet? Sep 16 17:47:03 add new pages? Sep 16 17:47:30 bbl Sep 16 17:50:27 PuffTheMagic: that's not the limit Sep 16 17:50:57 Templarian: the 90 app limit has nothing to do with 3 pages and 20 apps per page? Sep 16 17:51:52 i couldnt find 90 apps worth installing anyway Sep 16 17:51:59 there is a way to add new pages?! Sep 16 17:52:04 can_: yup Sep 16 17:52:14 how?? Sep 16 17:52:18 its on the wiki Sep 16 17:52:18 :D Sep 16 17:52:21 try google cached Sep 16 17:52:22 idk Sep 16 17:52:36 * can_ throws a dead trout at PuffTheMagic. Sep 16 17:53:01 Templarian: ??? Sep 16 17:53:31 our work locks out google cache Sep 16 17:53:40 haha Sep 16 17:53:42 they consider it a proxy Sep 16 17:53:42 that sucks Sep 16 17:54:19 woo made my first scene Sep 16 17:54:19 Templarian: what does the app limit have to do with if its not related to the number of available pages and the number of apps that fit on a page? Sep 16 17:54:20 :-p Sep 16 17:54:50 PuffTheMagic: Space and I believe it's hard coded in isn't it? Sep 16 17:55:08 Templarian: i didnt think it was hardcoded anywhere Sep 16 17:55:09 (from what i've seen on precentral the limit doesn't have anything to do with pages. Sep 16 17:56:55 Templarian: i cant beleive palm would hard code soemthing like that Sep 16 17:57:44 and if it were in a .js file i would imagine that someone would have found it by now Sep 16 17:57:51 no one hex edited LunaSysMgr? Sep 16 17:58:37 Maybe not... either way hopefully 1.2 (whenever we get that) has a fix. Sep 16 18:03:23 thre are 4 occurances for the hex value for 90 in LunaSysMgr Sep 16 18:03:51 i wonder if it has to do with the sqlite db Sep 16 18:03:53 90? i thought it was 60 Sep 16 18:04:00 idk someone just said 90 Sep 16 18:04:37 * oil has never hit the limit Sep 16 18:05:15 oil: it's 60. Sep 16 18:05:18 ++ Sep 16 18:05:24 oil: not at the rate that good apps are comming out Sep 16 18:05:25 :D Sep 16 18:05:47 usually its a try it out, delete it type of thing Sep 16 18:06:09 Yea people need to stop making all these puzzel games and work on some more serious games. Sep 16 18:06:18 i play prejeweled and drugwars Sep 16 18:06:21 PuffTheMagic, Templarian: it's actually not a fixed number, some people seem to get stuck at between 60-90 apps Sep 16 18:06:22 thats about it Sep 16 18:06:40 it seems to have more to do with the size of /var than anything else, but from what i've read it's really not tied to the OS either Sep 16 18:06:41 sounds like a Filecoaster issue Sep 16 18:06:43 I play word ace and tetris from time to time. Sep 16 18:06:45 not a Preware issue Sep 16 18:06:46 idk Sep 16 18:06:56 lolol Sep 16 18:07:11 drpodder is good Sep 16 18:07:17 the issue is also not tied to the package manager, filecoaster, preload, and preware all seem to experience this issue Sep 16 18:07:21 i play wordwhirl wile i crap Sep 16 18:07:28 preware? Sep 16 18:07:31 i thought it didnt Sep 16 18:07:33 it oes Sep 16 18:07:39 it does, i've verified it myself Sep 16 18:07:40 * oil would love to see a screenshot Sep 16 18:07:53 how do you take screen shots? Sep 16 18:08:00 orange + sym + p? Sep 16 18:08:05 k Sep 16 18:08:21 Isn't Preware only limited to space? Sep 16 18:08:28 thats what i thought Sep 16 18:08:39 i've had preware experience this issue after 89 aps Sep 16 18:08:40 apps Sep 16 18:08:42 its not using installNoVerify (what the catalog/filecoaster/etc uses) Sep 16 18:09:22 was that simply because var was getting too full? Sep 16 18:10:07 well /var is only ~200mb afar Sep 16 18:10:09 so other installers stop at 60 due to the limit in how they install Sep 16 18:10:09 afair* Sep 16 18:10:18 not according to the forums. after people made more space (a la LVM, or symlink trickery) people were still not able to add more than a handful of apps Sep 16 18:10:19 but preware gets higher Sep 16 18:10:23 cause it fills up the space Sep 16 18:10:45 and preware and palms catalog needs at least 20% free space on /var Sep 16 18:10:57 but palms catalog has the 60 limit Sep 16 18:11:14 why apps aren't installed on the larger partition will forever baffle me Sep 16 18:11:37 Mousey: your not the only one... ;( Sep 16 18:11:45 well they should shrink /media/internal Sep 16 18:11:57 and use more space for /var like 1gb or so Sep 16 18:11:57 then people would bitch about not being able to fit as much music Sep 16 18:12:15 i dont put music on my pre Sep 16 18:12:16 :S Sep 16 18:12:18 oil, agreed, they should leave /media/internal big, just install apps there Sep 16 18:12:21 and they cant really install apps to /media/internal Sep 16 18:12:24 * Mousey puts music on his pre Sep 16 18:12:31 cause then anyone can get to the source from usb Sep 16 18:12:31 why not tho? Sep 16 18:12:33 oil: yea they can. Sep 16 18:12:34 and muck with shit Sep 16 18:12:45 remove ads Sep 16 18:12:45 etc Sep 16 18:12:46 thats retarded Sep 16 18:12:53 not something palm would probably do Sep 16 18:12:53 of course people are gonna do that anyway Sep 16 18:12:56 You can do that anyway, but why make it easier Sep 16 18:12:56 well if i had a car radio with bluetooth then probably i would put music on my pre but I dont so i dont it Sep 16 18:13:00 right Sep 16 18:13:08 just cause people can do it anyways doesnt mean make it super fucking easy Sep 16 18:13:23 just postponing the inevatible Sep 16 18:13:26 It because drag and drop easy Sep 16 18:13:27 * Mousey kant spel Sep 16 18:13:41 really though Sep 16 18:13:41 becomes* Sep 16 18:13:46 there isn't 60 apps worth installing Sep 16 18:13:48 IMHO Sep 16 18:13:53 seriously.. this is the most hackable phone since OpenMoko, SOMEBODY's gonna make it easy Sep 16 18:14:00 oil, that's today, webos is really young Sep 16 18:14:05 i have 46 apps total Sep 16 18:14:05 i know Sep 16 18:14:11 i have 57 Sep 16 18:14:12 but people running into it just need to delete some crap Sep 16 18:14:23 i have like 30 something Sep 16 18:14:25 Besides, measures like that are the start of fun DMCA suits, if they claim it's a protection mechanism Sep 16 18:15:06 and we all agree the DMCA is based on reality Sep 16 18:15:15 That doesn't really matyter Sep 16 18:15:29 lol Sep 16 18:15:58 It's a law, and if you circumvent protection measures covered by the DMCA, you can be pwned. even if the protection measures suck. their presence is enough Sep 16 18:16:08 maybe not, but eventually it will.. it's not like information theory is going to change just to appease industrial age mentalities Sep 16 18:16:47 But, someday's not today, and the apps aren't in /media/internal :) Sep 16 18:17:01 and by the you mean your Sep 16 18:17:06 ^_^ Sep 16 18:18:58 * Mousey goes back to work, apologies for being disruptive. Sep 16 18:19:11 bah, who's disruptive? :) Sep 16 18:19:43 webos-internals being down is pretty disruptive Sep 16 18:19:50 ...there's that Sep 16 18:19:51 right Sep 16 18:20:54 * Templarian was cleaning off his keyboard and almost hit enter. hehe Sep 16 18:21:35 Next time, type all your passwords before doing that Sep 16 18:21:45 yap yap and login names Sep 16 18:21:51 hunter23 Sep 16 18:22:12 Those keys are the dirtiest so i like to clean them in that order. Sep 16 18:25:02 i just lock the screen before doing cleaning Sep 16 18:25:15 ok so im looking for a tip Sep 16 18:25:19 What's the fun in that? Sep 16 18:25:25 * gkatsev tips sportman Sep 16 18:25:26 im trying to push to a different scene Sep 16 18:25:32 by pressing a button Sep 16 18:25:45 sounds simple Sep 16 18:25:50 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cow_tipping Sep 16 18:27:02 haha, someone actually did a study on whether cow tipping is possible Sep 16 18:27:15 lol Sep 16 18:27:25 :-p Sep 16 18:27:45 two people can tip a cow if it doesnt react, 4 if the cow does react Sep 16 18:29:10 in all seriousness is there any documentation on just the simple task of creating buttons to switch scenes? Sep 16 18:29:22 thats like mojo step 1 Sep 16 18:29:27 im sure its all over the place Sep 16 18:29:37 i found out how to have the stage push to scene one Sep 16 18:29:39 thats easy Sep 16 18:29:46 yea ill keep looking Sep 16 18:30:45 push a scene from a stage controloler, push a scene from a scene assistant, same line of code Sep 16 18:31:31 well thats what i thought Sep 16 18:31:41 but maybe i dunno the proper way of having a button trigger an event Sep 16 18:32:53 HEY ARE THE WEBOS-INTERNALS SERVERS DOWN??? (just kidding :)) Sep 16 18:33:01 O.o Sep 16 18:33:17 b00far: No, they just don't like you personally Sep 16 18:33:43 well I can't get onto the server Sep 16 18:33:44 <.< Sep 16 18:33:50 You too Sep 16 18:34:04 yes me too Sep 16 18:34:05 -.- Sep 16 18:34:12 You must've said something it didn't like Sep 16 18:34:14 oh yea, speakin gof Sep 16 18:34:21 does anyone have a lead on a generic jabber client? Sep 16 18:35:40 ok yeah it's def not me Sep 16 18:35:51 my servers sitting across the US can't get to it Sep 16 18:35:52 X Sep 16 18:35:54 XD* Sep 16 18:36:08 So Ohio, NJ, Denver, and Cali Sep 16 18:36:09 >.> Sep 16 19:03:10 damnit, I wanted to work on a wiki page for irssi >> Sep 16 19:03:14 damn page being down lol Sep 16 19:03:57 finch? anything? Sep 16 19:04:03 * Mousey is dying for a jabber client Sep 16 19:04:18 I tried loading finch Sep 16 19:04:25 one of the libraries while installing I couldn't find Sep 16 19:04:50 generic - Pidgin is what everyone here uses Sep 16 19:04:50 does bitlebee support jabber Sep 16 19:04:54 wow, i was kidding, but that's.. that's a good idea.. can we get the missing lib from debian/armel or something? Sep 16 19:04:55 you might get away with that Sep 16 19:05:00 oh lordy what happen to the servers Sep 16 19:05:12 you can get pidgin jabber client from www.pidgin.im/ Sep 16 19:05:19 yeah Sep 16 19:05:20 FreeTim: for the pre? Sep 16 19:05:30 yeah he's talking abotu on the pre Sep 16 19:05:38 ... Sep 16 19:05:41 oops Sep 16 19:05:45 and Mousey bitlbee will work with irssi Sep 16 19:05:54 i'm not familiar with bitlbee Sep 16 19:05:59 * Mousey googles Sep 16 19:06:07 http://www.bitlbee.org/main.php/news.r.html Sep 16 19:06:09 it's something Sep 16 19:06:24 may want to set the server up on a home machine though, may have to do some hacking to get it up and running on the pre Sep 16 19:07:18 I fixed the server (with a little help from Rick_work :P). Sep 16 19:07:32 oh yeah internals is alive! Sep 16 19:07:36 wooo Sep 16 19:07:37 lol Sep 16 19:07:38 yay! Sep 16 19:07:39 Templarian: what was wrong Sep 16 19:07:40 rebooted. Sep 16 19:07:45 memory leak Sep 16 19:07:46 oh ok Sep 16 19:07:47 atlanta: memory leak probably. Sep 16 19:08:11 At least we know how to fix it now. Sep 16 19:08:22 what would be an approrpiate section of the wiki to post how people to use irssi/screen/other terminal-based apps? Sep 16 19:08:23 (as long as it doesn't get so bad that we lose ssh) Sep 16 19:08:23 "reboot" :-) Sep 16 19:08:30 the almighty reboot Sep 16 19:08:35 ssh was SLOW.... Sep 16 19:08:41 75 seconds from attach to prompt Sep 16 19:08:46 ouch Sep 16 19:08:49 Rick_work: damn Sep 16 19:08:55 5 minutes from issueing reboot command to losing connection Sep 16 19:08:57 that is slower then connecting to my pre over evdo :P Sep 16 19:09:05 * Templarian goes off to classes till 9:30 5.5 hours of me keeping myself awake. Sep 16 19:09:07 wasnt the cause http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_Forest_Cat ? Sep 16 19:09:13 * Mousey would rather have a gui jabber client, but will try finch first Sep 16 19:09:23 finch++ Sep 16 19:09:47 or a nice Mojo'd libpurple frontend Sep 16 19:09:47 mmm Sep 16 19:10:01 * Mousey shrugs, hugs everybody, and goes to play on the wiki Sep 16 19:10:18 Mousey: there was some talk about that Sep 16 19:10:23 just some missing header files Sep 16 19:10:25 wiki -all better now- Sep 16 19:10:28 atlanta: there should be MOAR Sep 16 19:10:41 atlanta: i'm dying here, no jabber-on-phone ;_; Sep 16 19:10:44 atlanta - header files are now in webos internals git repository Sep 16 19:10:51 palm released them lgpl Sep 16 19:10:57 yeah working off libpurple would be a nice start for good multi-protocol support on the pre Sep 16 19:10:57 really for the adapter Sep 16 19:10:58 ? Sep 16 19:11:15 Rick_work: so they can recompile the adapter now? Sep 16 19:11:18 the luna headers, yep Sep 16 19:11:22 yes atlanta Sep 16 19:11:26 talk to PuffTheMagic Sep 16 19:11:44 oh lala been away from the computer to long Sep 16 19:13:04 good stuff Sep 16 19:13:34 punzada: well the best lead yet is finch for me, while i loath the little terminal screen, curses is on there, and if it's just a missing lib i can steal from another ARM distro, i'll be super happy Sep 16 19:14:10 well seeing that the headers are available now shouldnt be that hard to implement more clients Sep 16 19:14:20 i forget what lib it was that was needed Sep 16 19:14:26 something 3-letterish and with an L Sep 16 19:14:29 i think .. Sep 16 19:14:30 lol Sep 16 19:14:37 atlanta: thats good, cuz someone smarter than me should be doing this. Sep 16 19:14:45 lol Sep 16 19:14:49 I've poked and prodded more parts of this phone then a porn stars Sep 16 19:15:08 porn stars are known for hacking their phones? Sep 16 19:15:15 i was looking for a witty analogy to end that Sep 16 19:15:19 but just ended up hitting enter instead Sep 16 19:16:07 Luna Sep 16 19:16:38 Palm Pre(tm) the phone for hacking of choice among porn starts Sep 16 19:16:39 -t Sep 16 19:22:55 they buy it for it's pleasing shape, and keep it for its hackability Sep 16 19:23:32 lol Sep 16 19:46:13 punzada: greg_roll is working on that already Sep 16 19:47:00 PuffTheMagic: 0.1.1 doesn't work on the virgin pre either Sep 16 19:47:02 has anybody fixed the palm-novacom_0.3-svn177284-hud9_i386.deb package? Sep 16 19:47:13 what? Sep 16 19:47:17 its boken Sep 16 19:47:34 the contents are fine, but trying to install it (a la dpkg) it breaks Sep 16 19:47:43 * Mousey wonders if he's asking the wrong folks Sep 16 19:47:45 oil: ps -A | grep -c uber Sep 16 19:47:52 oil: in terminal Sep 16 19:48:34 punzada: I think screen comes as part of webos Sep 16 19:49:20 Mousey: trying to install it breaks where, with what error? it works fine for me Sep 16 19:49:41 on debian, whatever the stop/start scripts are fail Sep 16 19:51:21 * sportman is trying to find info on this whole connecting to database deal Sep 16 19:51:49 :/ Sep 16 19:51:49 how do you pipe in terminal? Sep 16 19:52:04 oil, ooo, good question Sep 16 19:52:06 sportman: #webos Sep 16 19:52:07 * Mousey pays attention Sep 16 19:52:12 sportman: the wiki (which looks up now) might help - http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Portal:SDK Sep 16 19:52:13 oooh, /me /join's Sep 16 19:52:16 also, try #webos Sep 16 19:52:16 oil forget about that part Sep 16 19:52:21 woot the wiki is back Sep 16 19:52:21 oil: just see if you see uber Sep 16 19:52:38 oil: it should run in /var/usr/bin Sep 16 19:52:45 i dont think it would need to be in /usr/bin Sep 16 19:53:07 but i just cleaned up my env and did a reboot Sep 16 19:53:14 and i iwll try a fesh install Sep 16 19:53:23 i do Sep 16 19:53:28 its there Sep 16 19:53:30 Mousey: See - http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Application:Terminal#Operating_notes Sep 16 19:53:37 oil: so how do you say its not working? Sep 16 19:53:52 * Mousey thanks destinal Sep 16 19:54:02 * Mousey thanks lmorchard too Sep 16 19:54:12 i miss php :( Sep 16 19:54:13 lopl Sep 16 19:54:20 Mousey: yw Sep 16 19:54:31 when i call it Sep 16 19:55:07 Pipe Orange-Period ("." key) Sep 16 19:55:11 how rocking Sep 16 19:55:25 oooh, its like a 101-keypad Sep 16 19:55:29 clever Sep 16 19:56:04 writing my first wiki ever Sep 16 19:56:05 oil: how are you calling it Sep 16 19:56:10 it's a milestone! Sep 16 19:56:11 ;x Sep 16 19:56:12 oil: from mojo? Sep 16 19:56:20 and with what params? Sep 16 19:56:53 * oil finishes eating before looking at it Sep 16 19:57:10 did you try luna-send? Sep 16 19:57:14 no Sep 16 19:57:28 am i on the private bus with out knowing ? Sep 16 19:57:57 # luna-send -n 1 palm://us.ryanhope.ubermonsrv/proc/mem/kb_main_total {} Sep 16 19:57:57 ** Message: serviceResponse Handling: 2, {"category":"/proc/mem/","method":"kb_main_total","returnVal":250916864} Sep 16 19:58:01 that works after fresh install Sep 16 19:59:45 yay preware 0.8.7! uh, where can i find a changelog? Sep 16 19:59:53 yea i have no idea what im doing :)! Sep 16 19:59:58 changelog: stuff changed Sep 16 20:00:05 lol Sep 16 20:01:01 * PuffTheMagic dont like that dark theme Sep 16 20:01:08 looks wonky Sep 16 20:03:53 oil: so can you confirm that luna-send works... cause if it does, that means im on the private bus and i have to set public some how Sep 16 20:04:06 well that is if you are doing everything right in mojo Sep 16 20:06:10 can you type {} with terminal? Sep 16 20:07:35 nfc Sep 16 20:08:04 i dont think you can Sep 16 20:08:10 and i can't luna-send without it Sep 16 20:08:17 this is why you need ssh Sep 16 20:08:27 this is why your service should just work Sep 16 20:08:29 xD Sep 16 20:08:36 it does f'ing work Sep 16 20:08:43 oil: i know Sep 16 20:08:55 i will make u script Sep 16 20:08:58 and u can wget it Sep 16 20:08:59 and run it Sep 16 20:09:03 lol Sep 16 20:09:54 oil: http://omploader.org/vMmQ5ZA Sep 16 20:10:59 do the methods also support not having subscribe: true? Sep 16 20:11:05 yeah Sep 16 20:11:14 just dont pass antything Sep 16 20:11:22 or send subscribe:false Sep 16 20:11:24 either way Sep 16 20:11:50 oil: the example i pasted just showed a non-subscribe:true Sep 16 20:12:42 oil: wget http://omploader.org/vMmQ5ZA -O test.sh; chmod +x test.sh; ./test.sh Sep 16 20:13:53 yeah Sep 16 20:13:56 * oil does know linux xD Sep 16 20:14:00 :D Sep 16 20:14:03 it returned correectly Sep 16 20:14:10 hmmm Sep 16 20:14:21 so someone stole your mojo Sep 16 20:14:27 or im on the private bus Sep 16 20:14:55 oil: if you are sure your mojo is right could you try using com.palm app id? Sep 16 20:15:59 it clearly responds with error text of "us.ryanhope.ubermonsrv is not running." Sep 16 20:17:46 for private bus do i have to do anything special beyond setting the id to com.palm.? Sep 16 20:18:25 yeah Sep 16 20:18:27 now it works Sep 16 20:18:31 on the private bus Sep 16 20:20:43 and, subscription doesn't appear to work Sep 16 20:22:07 http://bit.ly/bOLjk :) Sep 16 20:22:31 lol Sep 16 20:24:42 i cant winscp in via wifi on 1.2 :( Sep 16 20:25:01 exit Sep 16 20:25:57 AnOutsider: lmao. Sep 16 20:27:15 hehe Sep 16 20:35:02 oil: cause its subscribe not subscription Sep 16 20:35:14 \"subscribe\":true Sep 16 20:35:26 oil: i will try and get off the private bus :D Sep 16 20:35:35 oil: thanks for testin that Sep 16 20:39:03 parameters: {subscribe:true}, Sep 16 20:39:37 quoting it doesn't do anything different Sep 16 20:39:52 and escaping the quotes is pointless Sep 16 20:39:57 (from javascript) Sep 16 20:40:19 quoting let's me use "function" as a key :D Sep 16 20:40:34 right Sep 16 20:40:47 cause the word function is special Sep 16 20:40:54 but the word subscribe isnt Sep 16 20:41:14 yea I just jumped it way out of context :D Sep 16 20:42:13 Has anyone written something to back up conversations/etc so they can be restored before re-flashing the device? Sep 16 20:45:50 AnOutsider: are you the guy behind PreThemer? Sep 16 20:46:01 (and if not, room, who is?) Sep 16 20:47:51 yeah, its that guy Sep 16 20:48:14 nuh uh Sep 16 20:48:22 It's my homie Sep 16 20:49:24 heh. i'm poking around, it's a very nice effort Sep 16 20:49:40 do you mind if I make you a Z-grade Internet celebrity? ;) Sep 16 20:51:24 uhh Sep 16 20:51:27 I guess Sep 16 20:51:29 haha Sep 16 20:51:30 AnOutsider, how is the themes as ipk going? Sep 16 20:51:35 that's done Sep 16 20:51:41 well wtf? Sep 16 20:51:44 haven't made a preware feed yet tho Sep 16 20:51:48 lol Sep 16 20:51:49 lol Sep 16 20:52:07 * freakout pats oil gently on his... ewww.... sweaty head Sep 16 20:52:08 * egaudet going to checkout the site Sep 16 20:52:19 * freakout washes hand Sep 16 20:52:23 still thinking about what to do with keyboard themes Sep 16 20:52:33 I was thinkign about that earlier Sep 16 20:52:40 how many themes currently exist? Sep 16 20:53:06 is it worth a whole section of the site? Also,w erent there rumors of palm releasing one in a near update? Sep 16 20:53:39 There's close to a dozen I think Sep 16 20:53:49 * oil hasnt seen any rumor like that Sep 16 20:53:54 taking screenshot for wiki say hello everyone! Sep 16 20:54:11 lol Sep 16 20:54:20 hiaz Sep 16 20:54:26 The next release increases the theming power so I suspect it will generate a lot more themes Sep 16 20:54:28 s/hiaz/haiz/ Sep 16 20:54:28 AnOutsider meant: haiz Sep 16 20:54:45 Hey all... I am getting a refurbished Pre tomorrow... Does the orange + tap (delete) really delete all of my info from SplashID? Is there a method I can use to remove more of that data? Sep 16 20:54:53 well, I'm open to adding it. Is anyone doing Clock themes? or too much effort? Sep 16 20:55:39 MLJones8: doctor it Sep 16 20:56:51 Well I'm afraid if I doctor it... then I might fix my problem (not being able to send attachments via e-mail)... with that said I am taking the refurb becuase I have a launch day pre and wouldn't mind the new and improved Pre's (padding for the battery etc..) Sep 16 20:57:14 So prethemer handles the specific locations of images to be packaged up, or does it give that power/responsibility to the themers uploading zips? Sep 16 20:57:46 oil: then again, sprint probably wont try to fix my problem now that a replacment has come in... so perhaps I'll just run the doctor and hope they don't check it (if that fixes the problem). Sep 16 20:58:11 or a full erase from the info app Sep 16 20:58:45 egaudet: site does the heavy lifting. The upload the applicable images, site makes screenshots, packages a zip and ipk version, the user shares the link Sep 16 20:59:20 oil: thanks for the tips... But I'm really only concerned about the SplashID app... do you think/know that the tap + delete doesn't remove all of the files? Sep 16 21:01:08 For ipkgs, it's using /var as root directory right? So there's no way to package up things to extract outside of /var (e.g. /media/internal) Sep 16 21:01:51 if its stored in a sqlite db Sep 16 21:01:57 then orange-tap will delete the db Sep 16 21:02:07 im pretty sure anyways Sep 16 21:02:16 they may use an "external" db Sep 16 21:02:26 which goes in the usb area Sep 16 21:02:31 you can look and just remove it Sep 16 21:02:32 if its there Sep 16 21:03:18 where was it that shows how to add more pages to the plauncher Sep 16 21:03:18 Well I wouldn't know what to look for... perhaps I'll do a orange + tap then just delete the whole USB portion? Sep 16 21:03:49 can_: use webosquickinstaller from precentral.net Sep 16 21:03:56 yeah di that Sep 16 21:03:59 do* Sep 16 21:04:26 servers back up right? Sep 16 21:04:38 oil: thanks for the advice Sep 16 21:04:42 i have that already Sep 16 21:05:08 what servers? Sep 16 21:05:09 s/servers/servers are Sep 16 21:05:17 oh Sep 16 21:05:19 webos-internals? Sep 16 21:05:21 can_: if you have ver 2.03 then it can added to your pre via the tweak menu. Sep 16 21:05:21 yeah, its been working for me Sep 16 21:05:31 still checking for version Sep 16 21:05:32 on preware Sep 16 21:06:04 egaudet: my pre just loaded preware fine. Sep 16 21:13:01 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Linux_Tutorial_Irssi first wiki is done, in the sense that i dont know what else to add and that I may just further confuse readers with my poor explanations if I do >> Sep 16 21:14:38 * Mousey comments randomly Sep 16 21:14:45 this phone is so awesome, i think i'm gonna cry Sep 16 21:15:33 lol Sep 16 21:15:54 :( Sep 16 21:15:55 gsm please! Sep 16 21:16:01 bah gsm =P Sep 16 21:20:31 mmm gsm Sep 16 21:20:35 even if it blows in the us :( Sep 16 21:27:51 this channel's more fun than #webos Sep 16 21:32:45 loads Sep 16 21:39:38 well of course it is, while webos is filled with javascript weridos this is where the linux heads sit ;p Sep 16 21:40:28 I can haz in between Sep 16 21:40:31 * lmorchard writes some linux system admin scripts in JS just to confuse punzada Sep 16 21:42:23 lol Sep 16 21:42:35 egaudet_away: apparently, if im writing the subject of an email with the oskb, it will not scroll the text field. Sep 16 21:44:40 anyone know how many posts I need on precentral before I can start a thread? ;x Sep 16 22:20:02 morning Sep 16 22:20:08 apologies to all for the outage. Sep 16 22:20:40 It seems it was an awstats gobbling up too much memory. We've removed awstats (we'll do that on a different machine). Sep 16 22:31:24 morning rwhitby Sep 16 22:31:47 I'm really thinking the keyboard should be a plugin Sep 16 22:32:26 It would certainly help with the hacky patch system that breaks every release Sep 16 22:32:57 :P Sep 16 22:33:48 * sportman is ready to give up Sep 16 22:33:49 :( Sep 16 22:34:08 silly noob Sep 16 22:39:16 the watercooler channel is deaddy deadsville Sep 16 22:39:47 so, apart from the server outage, are there any other outstanding problems with Preware since the 0.8.7 release? Sep 16 22:41:21 had no problems myself, other than repeatedly failing install of that Agenda app -- but that's an alpha and probably just broken Sep 16 22:43:11 emoney here? Sep 16 22:43:59 egaudet Sep 16 22:44:20 hi Sep 16 22:44:54 was asked to join to debug an On Screen Keyboard install error Sep 16 22:45:53 yes ok, let's get to debugging Sep 16 22:46:12 just tell me what you want me to do. Sep 16 22:46:13 I am emoney from precentral btw. Do you have novaterm installed on your pC? Sep 16 22:46:25 no Sep 16 22:46:29 not that I know of Sep 16 22:46:44 have you downloaded the SDK? Sep 16 22:46:53 yes Sep 16 22:47:02 what OS are you running Sep 16 22:47:13 XP Sep 16 22:47:37 SP3 Sep 16 22:47:55 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Portal:Accessing_Linux Sep 16 22:48:23 get the novaterm.zip from the procedure section Sep 16 22:48:41 plug your pre into usb and run novaterm to connect to pre Sep 16 22:50:18 bah... navaterm says I must install .net framework Sep 16 22:55:05 other way is to install Terminal ... Sep 16 22:56:49 You know, Terminal does not work at all for me Sep 16 22:56:55 black screen, nothing else Sep 16 22:57:49 did you run the post-install script tobybot ? Sep 16 22:57:52 i should reinstall Sep 16 22:58:21 i had that issue when i upgrade cause it didnt run the post-install script Sep 16 22:58:41 hm! Sep 16 22:58:45 maybe that's it Sep 16 23:01:50 Novaterm is running, connected to localhost Sep 16 23:07:25 acydlord_aao: that was it. had to remove the plugin and reinstall that, and it works now. :) Sep 16 23:07:31 god i love this phone Sep 16 23:07:40 for real, dude. Sep 16 23:07:43 * Mousey only really exists to make random remarks about how cool this phone is Sep 16 23:07:52 goodnight all Sep 16 23:07:56 * Mousey waves Sep 16 23:09:22 tobybot: awesome Sep 16 23:25:01 kesne: someone stream Sep 16 23:35:02 Hey there Sep 16 23:35:29 http://preyourmind.org/project/issues/oskb Sep 16 23:49:43 Does anyone know why when i try to run "zip" & exclude /proc/ it still reads the directory & says "zip warning: name not found"? Sep 16 23:51:40 zomg hi Sep 16 23:52:04 whats the zomg for? Sep 16 23:52:15 uh, cuz, like, zomg! Sep 16 23:52:33 Webserver seems fine here... was it down? Sep 16 23:52:41 ~worship zomg Sep 16 23:52:42 * infobot prostrates himself before zomg. "I'm not worthy!" Sep 16 23:53:11 zsoc: yeah, it was down for a while. a runaway awstats process. we've moved awstats to a different machine so it doesn't happen again. Sep 16 23:54:36 rwhitby, cool story bro :> Sep 16 23:58:59 Anyone know if there is work underway on a 'call block' app? Sep 16 23:59:20 how about a nice asterisk client? Sep 17 00:00:20 zsoc: well i think the callblock will have to integrate with the phone app somehow Sep 17 00:00:23 hmm Sep 17 00:00:25 will be hard to do Sep 17 00:00:27 imho Sep 17 00:00:53 especially since there is no mic access in the apis Sep 17 00:01:18 why do u need mic for callblock? Sep 17 00:02:07 i was referring to the asterisk Sep 17 00:02:19 oh gotcha Sep 17 00:02:26 i have a callblock app, i press power twice Sep 17 00:02:34 i do miss the old treo options though Sep 17 00:02:42 block during $ and $ hour Sep 17 00:02:50 block from $group Sep 17 00:03:08 and the send text on missed call or ignore with text options Sep 17 00:03:15 no mic access?! Sep 17 00:03:28 can't be treated as a sound card i/o? Sep 17 00:03:51 this mean i'll never get ipkg install alsamixer Sep 17 00:03:52 ? Sep 17 00:03:52 havent dug in that deep, but palm has quite a bit locked away still Sep 17 00:03:56 acydlord_aao: the one with ignore and text options whould be nice Sep 17 00:03:57 stuff Sep 17 00:04:09 u was ignored coz i hate u u stupid hehehe Sep 17 00:04:10 en0x: yes it would Sep 17 00:04:14 in text message Sep 17 00:04:15 ;] Sep 17 00:04:19 acydlord: wow. well i for one will stay tuned Sep 17 00:04:50 Callblock app could work by polling dbus, no? Sep 17 00:05:01 * zsoc wonders what dbus looks like during an incoming call Sep 17 00:06:19 What do you mean no mic access? Works with gst. Not sure what "asterisk" is, maybe i'm being naive. Sep 17 00:07:42 zsoc: asterisk is a free software PBX service.. basically the base of all open source VOIP solutions Sep 17 00:07:43 OH, the pbx platform. hm. would require mic access, like said, lol. I was thinking just polling for recording. Sep 17 00:07:52 Mousey, gotcha gotcha :) thank you. Sep 17 00:08:08 s/base/basis/ Sep 17 00:08:08 Mousey meant: zsoc: asterisk is a free software PBX service.. basically the basis of all open source VOIP solutions Sep 17 00:08:17 thanks infobot Sep 17 00:08:28 infobot really helps out around here :> Sep 17 00:09:13 It's a bit spammy at times Sep 17 00:10:07 chrisa, honestly i think sometimes it has better input than some around here Sep 17 00:10:10 Nothing in the 1.2 update mentions anything about fixing the Pre's ability to actually answer a call. Sep 17 00:10:25 PorkchopExpress, your pre can't answer calls? should get that checked out Sep 17 00:10:45 When you hit "answer" it takes a while before it actually answers. Sep 17 00:10:49 This happens on both of my pre's. Sep 17 00:10:53 Our phone can't answer calls? That's problematic Sep 17 00:10:56 PorkchopExpress: i think i know what you mean Sep 17 00:10:57 It's a software problem, not a phone specific problem. Sep 17 00:10:57 PorkchopExpress, have you used a sprint phone before? Sep 17 00:11:07 PorkchopExpress: I've had Treo's since the 650. Sep 17 00:11:16 sorry. zsoc Sep 17 00:11:19 PorkchopExpress: they're big sillys, but yah, it takes a while for the call to actually connect Sep 17 00:11:23 Talking to myself. Sep 17 00:11:24 First his phone doesn't answer calls, now he's talking to himself.. hmm.... Sep 17 00:11:47 Mousey: It's not a Sprint problem. We have several Sprint phones. My son has a Samsung. No problem there. Sep 17 00:11:47 That's odd, I actually find my Pre answers calls _faster_ than my previous 2 phones. Never owned a Palm tho. Sep 17 00:11:48 i've had the phone still ringing and vibing while i was talking.. it's funky Sep 17 00:12:08 Mousey: Yeah. That's the ticket. Sep 17 00:12:17 I've answerred calls then had them go to voicemail as it keeps ringing. Sep 17 00:12:25 it's remarkably hard to tell when it's actually picked up the call Sep 17 00:12:34 Agreed. Sep 17 00:12:54 it never occurred to me to say anything about it, but i totally get that Sep 17 00:13:54 Are the full release notes anywhere yet? Sep 17 00:14:25 I find I can actually start talking long before the phone app opens. Sep 17 00:14:37 zsoc: I wish that were the case on mine. Sep 17 00:14:44 a little odd, but better than the opposite Sep 17 00:14:51 Yup. Sep 17 00:16:26 So would I have to shutdown dbus and restart it with VERBOSE=1 to see what's going on.. or is there like... a log i can tail somewhere.. Sep 17 00:16:58 * zsoc is clearly clueless about dbus Sep 17 00:17:33 dbus-util --capture, or use dbus's dbus-monitor Sep 17 00:17:53 dbus-util --capture 2>> /media/internal/bus.log Sep 17 00:20:17 Thank you for clarifying with the second line Sep 17 00:20:23 * zsoc wonders if he seems that clueless Sep 17 00:20:38 Also thank you non-sarcastically, for answering my question :D Sep 17 00:21:28 hah! Sep 17 00:21:31 No doubt. Not easy to find. Sep 17 00:21:44 dbus-util was hard to find ? Sep 17 00:22:09 I think he's trying to say I should have googled it Sep 17 00:22:17 ah Sep 17 00:22:42 Which I actually did try, albeit admittedly briefly Sep 17 00:23:18 well i find the phone app less responsible with wifi on Sep 17 00:23:30 they when you pick up a call it still rings or vibes Sep 17 00:23:37 but when you turn wifi off its fine Sep 17 00:24:22 Ah, that could be it, I almost never have wifi on Sep 17 00:25:09 well for sure the whole code can be more optimized Sep 17 00:25:19 idont even get why the phone boots so long Sep 17 00:25:32 it's probably because wifi is turned off when the phone is in standby ... when the phone rings, it tries to connect wifi and service your input Sep 17 00:25:45 bpadalino: right Sep 17 00:25:48 en0x, I assure you that comment was fairly offensive to chrisa. You try booting debian on a 500mhz processor ;) Sep 17 00:26:03 zsoc: i had debian on 400mhz processor Sep 17 00:26:07 and was way faster Sep 17 00:26:12 en0x, ok then, go tell him how to do it, lol Sep 17 00:26:14 in runlevel 5 Sep 17 00:26:26 with starting xorg Sep 17 00:26:34 well it starts luna ;) Sep 17 00:26:50 oh come on Sep 17 00:26:50 :p Sep 17 00:28:34 Just teasing :) I'm just saying, it probably does a lot of things different from a standard box... Sep 17 00:28:40 Also, dbus does A LOT in 30 seconds :P Sep 17 00:29:21 wel l but the thing is that u dont reboot ur phone every couple of hours Sep 17 00:29:24 :) Sep 17 00:29:30 You don't? Sep 17 00:29:35 could someone please help me with a way to edit my sudoers file from a vista 64 machine? Sep 17 00:29:41 Crap, I'm doinitrong then :P Sep 17 00:30:01 zsoc: what for? :P Sep 17 00:30:01 Necromek, uh, do you have access to novaterm or ssh through putty? Sep 17 00:30:16 Putty isn't working, and novaterm crashes after I enter any information Sep 17 00:30:27 en0x, more of a joke, but I tend to, uh "break things" a lot messing around. These days I tend to just restart java services tho, that usually fixes things Sep 17 00:30:38 Necromek, so how did you get sudo installed to begin with? Sep 17 00:30:41 what should I be entering into putty to get it to connect? Sep 17 00:30:51 i ran the IPKS from novacom in the command prompt Sep 17 00:31:14 Necromek, honestly I have no idea. I know the syntax for standard ssh is ssh user@yourip -p 222 (assuming you installed dropbear via the webos-internals script) Sep 17 00:31:25 did that Sep 17 00:31:34 does it connect/ask you for a password? Sep 17 00:31:47 putty doesn't. the local host disconnects Sep 17 00:32:00 honestly it might just be easier to install the terminal app via preware and type commands in there. Sep 17 00:32:15 usbnet is another option, but i know nothing about usbnet and windows (although it's a super synch in linux) Sep 17 00:32:15 ... I'm thinking so Sep 17 00:32:42 I've done all this before.. about a month and a half ago, on my old Pre. just got a new referb, and I'm having issues Sep 17 00:32:45 adding a user to sudoers is a 1 line affair in terminal :) Sep 17 00:33:31 hmm Sep 17 00:33:43 i need one more app for my pre and i'm done Sep 17 00:33:55 en0x, ? Sep 17 00:34:06 irc app :P Sep 17 00:34:09 my pre reboots everytime i turn on a tweek from webos quick install, is this normal? Sep 17 00:34:12 so i can bug you all the times Sep 17 00:34:13 :p Sep 17 00:35:53 en0x, i enjoy being bugged by you honestly Sep 17 00:36:30 hmm Sep 17 00:36:42 who was working on irc? libpurple mess right? Sep 17 00:36:44 well dont get used to it too much... i'm not gay Sep 17 00:36:54 s/used/use Sep 17 00:37:04 someone was working on irc service Sep 17 00:37:10 i dont remember who Sep 17 00:37:13 puff probably Sep 17 00:37:14 :p Sep 17 00:37:29 wow, i was more refering to that fact that you are reasonably pleasant and informative / enjoy adding to conversation, but gay was a good spin on it too Sep 17 00:37:45 buehehe Sep 17 00:38:15 * zsoc wonders if when Necromek gets back he should give him a sed line to add user to sudoers or should make him learn how to use vi Sep 17 00:38:20 * zsoc hugs vi Sep 17 00:38:43 i thought that u love emacs Sep 17 00:38:48 nah, that's not me bro Sep 17 00:39:10 emacs has more complicated combos than mortal combat Sep 17 00:39:11 :S Sep 17 00:40:07 epic emacs quote :P Sep 17 00:40:13 emacs <3 Sep 17 00:40:42 ok now that was funny Sep 17 00:40:44 hehe Sep 17 00:40:45 ... Please, please, for the love of Google, help me Sep 17 00:41:31 Necromek, install Terminal? Sep 17 00:41:40 I just got the terminal working with putty. Sep 17 00:41:42 can_: actually yes. it's not the Pre rebooting, it's the GUI restarting itself to implement the tweak. actually the WebOSQuickInstaller documentation explains all this Sep 17 00:41:55 Necromek, ah ok, now google vi :D Sep 17 00:42:09 then google ed Sep 17 00:42:13 then google nano Sep 17 00:42:17 then google pico Sep 17 00:42:19 ....haet you. Sep 17 00:42:19 use echo Sep 17 00:42:27 use cat > Sep 17 00:42:52 this sound ssuspiciously like an xkcd.. Sep 17 00:43:15 i am a noob at linux. I despise command line. please, help this poor supplicant hack his phone. Sep 17 00:43:19 cat 'can of tuna' Sep 17 00:43:23 ba dum dum Sep 17 00:43:43 echo "YOUR_USERNAME ALL=(ALL) ALL" > /path/to/suders/file Sep 17 00:43:43 :> Sep 17 00:44:20 * zsoc wonders if it's reasonable to create a service to poll dbus and sed trigger outputs to kill the telephony app when the 10 digit number wanting to be blocked is passed Sep 17 00:44:31 Also, en0x is right, echo is definitely the most efficient. Sep 17 00:45:01 so just type in echo "myname all=(all) all Sep 17 00:45:05 Although, I don't even know if the "incoming call" display is including in the telephony app Sep 17 00:45:07 en0x: actually you should maybe use >> Sep 17 00:45:24 Necromek, er, no, the whole line, but replace /path/to/sudoers/file with the actual path Sep 17 00:45:25 so just type in echo "myname all=(all) all" > /opt/bin/ Sep 17 00:45:33 Also, I'm pretty sure it's sudoers, not suders Sep 17 00:45:38 visudo Sep 17 00:45:41 or do I need to actually add the sudoer filename there? Sep 17 00:45:46 you need the file name Sep 17 00:45:58 what would the file name be? Sep 17 00:46:03 * Mousey leaves before this gets any uglier Sep 17 00:46:05 it's basically making you output what's in the quotes, and then "adding" (with >) to the file Sep 17 00:46:20 Mousey: no need Sep 17 00:46:31 en0x: too late! Sep 17 00:46:42 er /opt/etc/sudoers Sep 17 00:46:43 no? Sep 17 00:47:12 looking Sep 17 00:47:29 there's a sudo and a sudoedit Sep 17 00:47:42 echo "YOURUSERNAME ALL=(ALL) ALL" > /opt/etc/sudoers Sep 17 00:47:49 no, not /opt/bin, /opt/etc Sep 17 00:48:17 better yet... get WM smartphone Sep 17 00:48:18 hehehe Sep 17 00:48:22 also they were arguing about the difference between > and >>, but i don't think it matters here Sep 17 00:48:37 i dont know how I could use WM smartphone for a year Sep 17 00:48:49 since i got my pre I was like WTF how could I use WM Sep 17 00:48:59 wm is just.. bad, i'm sorry. Sep 17 00:49:00 permission denied Sep 17 00:49:07 Necromek, er, sudo su first Sep 17 00:49:16 well but WM can multitask too Sep 17 00:49:18 right, i mean su -i Sep 17 00:49:20 or something Sep 17 00:49:26 i use: sudo su - Sep 17 00:49:37 * zsoc boggles Sep 17 00:50:03 it's asking me for a password Sep 17 00:50:04 goddamn it Sep 17 00:50:10 en0x, what exactly is -i or i do? I always just smash commands into term until it does what i want, if it takes less than 3, i don't bother looking up why lol Sep 17 00:50:13 Necromek, it's your user pass Sep 17 00:50:30 zsoc: rtfm :p Sep 17 00:50:35 watch out guys, kesne is a false 'hey'er Sep 17 00:50:56 Decimation, pot calling the kettle Sep 17 00:50:56 -i The -i (simulate initial login) option runs the shell specified in Sep 17 00:51:00 the passwd(5) entry of the user that the command is being run as. Sep 17 00:51:09 That's why I don't read manuals. Sep 17 00:51:15 are caps important in this particular command? Sep 17 00:51:24 Besides, if i have 1/3 chance of getting the command right, what's the diff? I type fast Sep 17 00:51:27 Necromek, yes, verty Sep 17 00:51:28 zsoc: i have to read them everyday Sep 17 00:51:38 s/verty/very Sep 17 00:51:41 to do my work and write documentations for my own scripts at work Sep 17 00:51:48 en0x, i wish i was as awesome as you Sep 17 00:52:04 everyone does Sep 17 00:52:07 :S Sep 17 00:52:12 especially me tho Sep 17 00:52:28 Necromek, did we hold your hand enough?:> Sep 17 00:52:32 its like "if you want to be orginal you have to predict that somebody will try to copy you" Sep 17 00:52:36 :P Sep 17 00:52:52 sh: ECHO not found Sep 17 00:53:12 its low letters echo Sep 17 00:53:19 not ECHO linux is case sensitive Sep 17 00:53:29 how is it supposed to echo if you don't yell ? Sep 17 00:53:32 jeesh Sep 17 00:53:35 stupid linux Sep 17 00:53:37 lol, yes capitalization is _very_ important, that means to be accurate, not to make them all caps, lol Sep 17 00:54:23 Also, if the makers of 'sudo' were here right now, they would facepalm at us suggesting to edit it using echo Sep 17 00:56:13 hehe Sep 17 00:56:54 and sudoing to get into it Sep 17 00:56:58 ...let's see if it worked Sep 17 00:58:38 aaaand I can't transfer files. Sep 17 00:58:39 hmm Sep 17 01:00:29 Necromek, huh? transfer what? i'm confused Sep 17 01:00:39 Necromek, why did you need your user to be sudo'd anyway? Sep 17 01:00:47 the whole point was to be able to get SSH Sep 17 01:00:50 to transfer files Sep 17 01:00:59 Necromek, uh. scp ? Sep 17 01:01:06 SCP? Sep 17 01:01:12 i'm using filezilla as an sftp client Sep 17 01:01:22 I keep getting either access denied errors or write failure Sep 17 01:01:22 Necromek, what does sftp have to do with ssh? Sep 17 01:01:32 i'm connecting through ssh, I Thought. Sep 17 01:01:46 or maybe I'm just an idiot. I think this may be possible Sep 17 01:01:49 Necromek, your filesystem writable? also you need to be in a folder that your user can access Sep 17 01:02:26 Necromek, the other option, is to edit dropbear to allow root access (removing the -g switch in the config file) and connect to sftp with user root, but i probably wouldn't suggest that as a perm solution Sep 17 01:03:05 I LOVE DOCTORING MY PHONE Sep 17 01:03:25 weird Sep 17 01:03:28 What exactly are you moving around and why? What's wrong with using /media/internal as a drop point? Sep 17 01:03:32 mount -o remount,rw / have i tried again. Sep 17 01:03:37 Decimation, define doctoring, and do it with less yelling Sep 17 01:03:41 I hate renaming files. Sep 17 01:03:45 time to go home, later kids Sep 17 01:03:52 I doctor for fun Sep 17 01:03:55 I'm trying to put the branding back into my phone. Sep 17 01:03:58 Necromek, renaming what? i don't think we're geting to the core of the issue here. Sep 17 01:04:04 my old pre I had no problems with Sep 17 01:04:14 Just to see how quickly I can get it back to previous state Sep 17 01:04:15 I'm trying to apply a black dialer, load screen, and lock screen Sep 17 01:04:28 I used the Sftp method before Sep 17 01:04:39 and had no issues, transferring files in a GUI interface is much easier for me. Sep 17 01:04:49 I hate transferring manually, because I am not that accurate a typist, Sep 17 01:05:04 how? you can't log into sftp as user and then move files around all over the file system, the setup it _slightly_ safer than that Sep 17 01:05:14 If you paste the url to the images in here and tell me what image is what I will give you commands Sep 17 01:05:23 I mean.. on pastebin Sep 17 01:05:31 No image. they're all on my HD Sep 17 01:05:40 photobucket is your friend Sep 17 01:05:56 filebin ftw Sep 17 01:06:04 filebin? Sep 17 01:06:12 what are you thinking? wget and mv? Sep 17 01:06:40 i was more hoping wget to folder with overwrite tags Sep 17 01:07:06 Necromek, there we go, now that's using your noggin Sep 17 01:07:15 yeah wget and mv is simplest Sep 17 01:07:25 i really hate all the typing Sep 17 01:07:32 screw mv Sep 17 01:07:41 lol, do you know how tab complete works? :D Sep 17 01:07:43 Thats why copy pasta is delicious Sep 17 01:07:55 mmm.. copy pasta Sep 17 01:07:56 yes, and i'm not sure it would pick up filenames Sep 17 01:08:02 goddamn, i hate filename typing. Sep 17 01:08:05 tab complete picks up everything Sep 17 01:08:12 folders, file names, extensions Sep 17 01:08:39 I actually wrote a simple script to do almost all image changes Sep 17 01:08:53 It's a text based theme manager Sep 17 01:09:05 From the terminal it works like a pro Sep 17 01:10:06 Basically it's a total conversion, redoes messaging background, browser background, launcher background, photos background, music player background, webOS background and bootscreen all in one Sep 17 01:12:10 it's all in a script called Predesign, and you feed it an argument that specifies what files to rename, I'm just having trouble renaming back the current image to the individual identifier I had it set to before Sep 17 01:12:11 what is a total conversion? Sep 17 01:12:25 anybody have a keyboard driver version of the ui? Sep 17 01:12:28 driven Sep 17 01:13:33 I'm thinking about storing the old name of the current file used in a txt file, then reading the text file and renaming the file appropriately again when you apply a new theme Sep 17 01:15:45 ugh. Sep 17 01:15:48 anyone play with toppleball? Sep 17 01:16:06 Was just reading the forum about it today Sep 17 01:17:23 k4p741nkrunch: why not use a symlink? look at debian (or ipkg) alternatives Sep 17 01:19:06 k4p741nkrunch, it works ridiculously well. I'm blown away by the accelerometer response. and it's not even using the advanced service Sep 17 01:19:53 Yeah people think they need a snappier accelerometer response when you actually don't Sep 17 01:20:12 The 4Hz gives you enough time to look at the reaction of the ball from the last chang Sep 17 01:22:19 k4p741nkrunch, is it 4Hz or 4fps? Sep 17 01:22:47 4Hz Sep 17 01:23:40 * zsoc wonders how that somehow relates to... er.. windows.. of.. the uh.. processor.. and uh... something else Sep 17 01:26:09 * sportman waves to Templarian Sep 17 01:26:32 zsoc I don't know, but I know that it relates to doors very well Sep 17 01:26:39 * Templarian waves back, 4 hours of strait geography with a lab my brain is dead. Sep 17 01:26:46 When they get slammed in your face, it Hertz! Badumpssh Sep 17 01:27:04 k4p741nkrunch, nice. Sep 17 01:27:16 Templarian, I can almost guarantee you that didn't happen in America. Sep 17 01:27:41 zsoc: what? Sep 17 01:27:42 zsoc you know almost guarantee is an oxy-moron Sep 17 01:27:58 k4p741nkrunch, i disagree Sep 17 01:28:23 To the cooler! Sep 17 01:28:26 Templarian, 4 hours of Geography, would never happen in any school in america. That's why we can't figure out what continent most countries are in Sep 17 01:29:37 zsoc: it's a 4 credit class. I picked the one with the class and lab back to back so it's 2h 45min class with a 1h 15min lab. I left 15min early usually gets out at 9:30. And this is the US. Sep 17 01:30:09 Templarian, that sounds amazing Sep 17 01:30:37 you guys. Sep 17 01:30:50 you girls. Sep 17 01:30:51 Yes Decimation? :P Sep 17 01:31:07 americas got talent, it is down to some girl, and my moms cousin Sep 17 01:31:07 I HOPE HE WINS Sep 17 01:31:20 ok, themes in Preware is coming together .... Sep 17 01:31:21 Decimation, hey hey, people are recording this stuff here Sep 17 01:31:27 rwhitby, how can i help? Sep 17 01:32:35 Decimation: damn i'm missing it. Sep 17 01:32:45 Thanks for reminding me so i can get the tail end. Sep 17 01:34:43 Aww dang themes in Preware, now Predesign is shot Sep 17 01:34:55 And I was just getting symlink to work! Sep 17 01:37:23 But seriously, do it Sep 17 01:37:49 do it Sep 17 01:44:41 rwhitby, ipks get extracted from / ? Sep 17 01:45:10 egaudet: depends. Sep 17 01:45:19 egaudet: usually in /var for the way we use them Sep 17 01:48:51 egaudet, i could be wrong, but i suppose it depends on ipkg options? Sep 17 01:49:03 hence the whole ipkg /var install thing Sep 17 01:51:00 that's what I thought, but how is prethemer going to handle themes? postinst? Sep 17 01:51:57 egaudet, i would imagine yes... which i suppose would hm... be difficult to do in offline mode. the genius of rod will have to prevail Sep 17 01:52:22 Is there any implementation or use of the uber monitor service atm? Sep 17 01:52:29 so themes are going to have to be 'advanced' homebrew Sep 17 01:55:27 advanced homebrew? Sep 17 01:56:32 running a postinst after install? lol. I'm imagining preware can do that. Maybe it's a seperate feed that triggers running the postinst somehow.. i mean actually i think preware already does that Sep 17 01:56:40 egaudet: what is more advanced than patches? Sep 17 01:57:01 yeah i believe preware does postinst Sep 17 01:57:05 filecoaster doesnt Sep 17 01:57:13 we consider anything that runs postinst as 'advanced' homebrew right Sep 17 01:57:19 nfc Sep 17 01:58:21 well whatever, themes need postinsts, and they are similar to patching, and they could all use a standard for postinst Sep 17 01:59:42 http://palm.preapplications.net/checkers Sep 17 02:00:20 Templarian: he won. Sep 17 02:02:34 Decimation: explain who it was, I wasn't watching my roommate is reading. Sep 17 02:03:15 Kevin Skinner. Sep 17 02:03:21 AH Sep 17 02:03:24 YOU RUINED IT Sep 17 02:03:32 Awesome Sep 17 02:03:43 That guy's been pretty good so far. Sep 17 02:04:03 Decimation: is that the finals? Sep 17 02:04:13 Or semi? Sep 17 02:04:31 Templarian: he won it all. Sep 17 02:04:39 DAMN! Sep 17 02:04:54 It's like the cooler and internals are mixed up right now Sep 17 02:04:56 rofl Sep 17 02:07:00 k4p741nkrunch: i think we are done... Sep 17 02:07:26 where's my 1.2 dammit Sep 17 02:07:27 me and v3ritas have been trying to get tar to work with excludes Sep 17 02:08:39 Is there any implementation or use of the uber monitor service atm? Sep 17 02:09:03 ok. Finaly finished the crap. Sep 17 02:09:14 make sure you flush Sep 17 02:09:35 Now, my logo is back into my phone in about six places. I hate typing filenames out like that Sep 17 02:10:38 AnOutsider: 1.2 is probably a week away given the supposed paid app timeline Sep 17 02:10:43 * Templarian needs to go make icons for all of these optware things Sep 17 02:11:02 or, a week away or _less_, let us say Sep 17 02:11:55 Sept 24th I heard Sep 17 02:15:23 I heard 34th for the actual paid app rollout, so I assume 1.2 would be ebfore then. I expected it by now if they want to give people time to upgrade Sep 17 02:15:30 s/34th/24th/ Sep 17 02:15:30 AnOutsider meant: I heard 24th for the actual paid app rollout, so I assume 1.2 would be ebfore then. I expected it by now if they want to give people time to upgrade Sep 17 02:15:47 and ello Abyssul Sep 17 02:16:08 Ello mate Sep 17 02:16:36 i really wonder what these "paid" apps are gonna be Sep 17 02:16:52 im gonna laugh my ass of when they are as bad as some of the existing apps Sep 17 02:16:56 I suspect Sept 24th at the latest because Apple rolls outs an update (correct?) on the Sept 25. Palm always likes to shadow Apply Sep 17 02:17:52 the trick's getting a bit old... Palm needs to worry about Palm and not "sabotaging" Apple Sep 17 02:17:58 ~seen tharris Sep 17 02:18:00 tharris was last seen on IRC in channel #webos-internals, 21d 6h 9m 35s ago, saying: 'wonder who will ask the security questions =p'. Sep 17 02:18:14 ~seen tharris- Sep 17 02:18:15 tharris- was last seen on IRC in channel #webos-internals, 6d 1h 58m 5s ago, saying: 'ahh got a phone now'. Sep 17 02:18:47 AnOutsider Sep 17 02:18:59 its not so much sabataging, more just getting in the news WITH them Sep 17 02:19:13 get people comparing the companies, and the proudcts they sell. Sep 17 02:19:54 Right, but stand on your own two feet and not only be relevant because you're daring to go against another company Sep 17 02:20:25 eh, apple has stolen all their "innovations" anyway so why not have palm steal their limelight Sep 17 02:21:22 and maybe Jon forgot that he doesnt work for apple anymore, so everything is still running on apple timetables lol Sep 17 02:26:58 haha, I totally agree, I'm not bigging up apple at all. They put a lot of thought into the execution of their products, but int he end it comes down to poached ideas and clever marketing Sep 17 02:27:41 With that said... Palm should put as much time into their own products. They've been in this game for longer, I think they owe it to themselves to stand out on their own in the public eye vs being referred to as the company that's taking on the iPhone Sep 17 02:27:50 hah, my screen on/off button just broke on my pre Sep 17 02:28:01 thats what i get for owning one built 5/20/09 Sep 17 02:29:38 hello everyone, anyone out there with a Pre whos willing to alpha test some messaging plugins? (live messenger, yahoo messenger and ICQ?). I don't have a Pre and no messaging working in the emulator. Sep 17 02:30:05 greg_roll: right here. Sep 17 02:30:22 decimation: excellent Sep 17 02:30:35 goto http://cid-e47a245fdc43bd04.skydrive.live.com/browse.aspx/Public/Massaging%20Plugins and check out the readme.txt Sep 17 02:30:44 greg_roll: i can test live, ill make a yahoo account in a minute Sep 17 02:31:14 oh sexiness Sep 17 02:31:26 decimation: you will notice facebook chat on their but it wonk work until Palm updates some libraries on the Pre Sep 17 02:32:16 All the install and removal has been tested on the emulator. Messenger errors like Gtalk on the emulator so hopefully it works! Sep 17 02:32:42 greg_roll: quick install is froozen on "Installing:" org.greg.etc... Sep 17 02:33:18 decimation: yep, wait for luna to restart on your phone Sep 17 02:33:31 decimation: did you read the readme?? :):) I mentioned it there. Sep 17 02:33:43 greg_roll: nahh :p Sep 17 02:33:52 Ima test it out Sep 17 02:34:08 its been about 3 minutes id say Sep 17 02:34:25 decimation: I need to speak to Jason about it Sep 17 02:35:19 greg_roll: do you actually have greg.org?? Sep 17 02:35:27 if so, wow Sep 17 02:35:35 destinal_home: heh, we've already discussed that :-) Sep 17 02:35:53 decimation_home: no i don't. I spoke to rwhitby about this if this works I will change everything over from that Sep 17 02:36:10 destinal_home * ;) Sep 17 02:37:19 Yep, the messaging .ipk is hung on mine too Sep 17 02:37:21 Installation of Messaging Plugins has failed. Sep 17 02:37:21 *** Please try again *** Sep 17 02:37:21 If you continue to recieve errors post %temp%\Installer.log to forums.precentral.net Sep 17 02:38:19 damn :( whats the last few lines in Installer.log? (was that using the windows.exe or the .jar? Sep 17 02:38:38 windows.exe Sep 17 02:39:05 9/16/2009 10:38:22 PM Sending command... Sep 17 02:39:05 9/16/2009 10:38:22 PM Checking for response... Sep 17 02:39:05 9/16/2009 10:38:23 PM Response has been read. Sep 17 02:39:05 9/16/2009 10:38:28 PM Reading installation response... Sep 17 02:39:05 9/16/2009 10:38:28 PM ** Message: serviceResponse Handling: 2, {"returnValue":true , "ticket":2, "subscribed":true} Sep 17 02:39:07 Sep 17 02:39:32 decimation: could you try the jar? Sep 17 02:39:43 greg_roll: a service to install plugins? I have to admit, I'm skeptical Sep 17 02:40:30 destinal_home: i needed the service to update the palm database and to patch the messaging app Sep 17 02:40:55 greg_roll: jar says install complete Sep 17 02:41:20 decimation: hopefully luna will restart in 10-20 seconds Sep 17 02:41:28 greg_roll: no luna restart. Sep 17 02:41:59 greg_roll: but, services take up resources indefinitely and installation would tend to be a one time thing Sep 17 02:42:07 decimation: hmmmm, would you mind restarting and see if you have the plugins Sep 17 02:42:23 greg_roll: way ahead of ya ;) Sep 17 02:42:32 god this history homework sucks. Sep 17 02:42:38 destinal_home: i agree, i was thinking about that. Sep 17 02:43:13 I got the same as Decimation Sep 17 02:43:26 Abyssul: try the jar Sep 17 02:43:33 I did, restarting Pre now Sep 17 02:44:06 greg_roll Sep 17 02:44:09 when i go to add an IM account Sep 17 02:44:13 still google talk and aim :/ Sep 17 02:44:14 sorry guys as I said I dont have a Pre to test with. All of it works on the emulator. Sep 17 02:44:45 lol, greg_roll Sep 17 02:44:48 i just realized Sep 17 02:44:49 im running 1.2 Sep 17 02:44:51 :/ Sep 17 02:44:54 I have 1.1 Sep 17 02:45:20 i would think it would work with 1.2. abyssul: did yours work? Sep 17 02:45:29 Still restarting Sep 17 02:45:31 Give me some time Sep 17 02:46:40 greg_roll: showed up in quick install as installed..i just deleted it Sep 17 02:46:43 * egaudet should move my computer so that my chair is not right next to the outlet! Sep 17 02:46:48 sorry, don't have time right now to troubleshoot. Sep 17 02:47:02 guys im just running off to lunch, i will be back shortly. Post anything that happens and ill read it shortly Sep 17 02:47:06 What happened egaudet? Sep 17 02:47:24 decimation: thats odd! Sep 17 02:47:33 I kicked my power cord out again Sep 17 02:47:38 Hehe Sep 17 02:47:52 Weird, my pre isn't booting now. Its still loading... Sep 17 02:48:21 There we go Sep 17 02:48:23 lulz, app broke his pre Sep 17 02:48:31 Wow that was a long load Sep 17 02:48:38 Abyssul, spare us the suspense, what's broken? Sep 17 02:49:09 greg_roll you still here? Sep 17 02:51:27 he's gone to lunch Sep 17 02:53:17 Well... the plugins are shown, but its bugged. I cant http://s35.photobucket.com/albums/d182/hardwick246/?action=view¤t=messaging_2009-16-09_224942.jpg Sep 17 02:53:25 Damn I hit the enter button to early Sep 17 02:53:28 ~seen PreHero Sep 17 02:53:30 prehero was last seen on IRC in channel #webos-internals, 21h 25m 31s ago, saying: 'haha, rick_home is awsome! he does some crazy work!'. Sep 17 02:54:47 what I wouldn't give for an actual javascript console.... Sep 17 02:55:48 What I wouldn't give for CPU Scaling and/or gps tracking service Sep 17 02:56:16 Abyssul you using 1.2 yet? Sep 17 02:56:23 No Sep 17 02:56:32 I've decided not to Sep 17 02:56:44 Heard smartreflex on 1.2 was giving 3% per hour drain Sep 17 02:56:50 Abyssul: I wouldn't actually USE either of those.... Sep 17 02:56:59 Well thats you :p Sep 17 02:57:10 I get about 10% per hour IDLE lol Sep 17 02:57:27 I used to get 3% on my old Pre Sep 17 02:57:28 Have you tried just turning on smartreflex? Sep 17 02:57:29 although I have had two requests from commercial customers to write gps tracking based apps for the pre, and had to say "no" so, I guess, yeah, that's a good idea. Sep 17 02:58:15 smartreflex in 1.1? Sep 17 02:58:49 * zsoc 's phone was at 86% after 9 hours Sep 17 02:59:06 Couldn't you simply creating a listening service on the Pre and wait for a keyword that could be sent through email then have it respond with coordinates, or are you talking about another GPS tracking Sep 17 02:59:20 Yes smartreflex in 1.1 Sep 17 02:59:20 That works Sep 17 02:59:40 but Im looking for more of a app solution than tweak/patch/etc **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Sep 17 02:59:57 2009