**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Oct 16 02:59:57 2009 Oct 16 03:12:56 hm, i just got my touchstone, and i can't find a place to put it. Oct 16 03:13:25 I put it on top of my subwoofer.. but just awhile ago i heard a few weird sounds from the subwoofer. :| Oct 16 03:13:41 it must be causing em interference. Oct 16 03:14:18 i have electronics nearby in most other potential spots too though. Oct 16 03:15:06 with the phone on it or off of it? Oct 16 03:15:16 i had the phone on it Oct 16 03:15:29 phones have always interfered with speakers Oct 16 03:15:43 bet you won't have trouble with other electronics Oct 16 03:16:07 I'm thinking about going the touchstone route. The 2600 mAh battery is nice, but I really miss the slim form factor Oct 16 03:16:35 I just got mine as well a few days ago. can you not turn off the backlight when its on it? Oct 16 03:16:43 there might be a patch for that Oct 16 03:16:49 rawdr: ah.. that's true.. i forgot. i've noticed that before.. Oct 16 03:16:49 seems so stupid. the backlight will be on more hours during the night than I ever use it in the day Oct 16 03:18:26 whoever owns keen-studios.net needs to have a subdomain commander.keen-studios.net ;) Oct 16 03:19:04 the speaker thing seems to only happen when the phone is initially placed on the touchstone Oct 16 03:19:23 just tried. Oct 16 03:22:52 rawdr: http://www.precentral.net/homebrew-apps/brightness-unlinked Oct 16 03:23:00 there's a homebrew app to do it it seems Oct 16 03:23:38 that's good... hope that app is less buggy than when I first used it Oct 16 03:24:05 hehe Oct 16 03:25:15 i'll probably just lay the pouch on the surface of the screen at night. Oct 16 03:28:37 that app works better than it did but apparently now it wants to keep a notification on the screen whenever its running Oct 16 03:30:58 the forum says there should be a button to turn the screen off entirely Oct 16 03:32:07 there is, when its charging Oct 16 03:32:26 oh Oct 16 03:32:36 not that it won't turn the screen off. it just has a constant notification that its running Oct 16 03:32:40 not sure the purpose of that Oct 16 03:33:01 you could just run it when you need it Oct 16 03:33:23 i imagine more people have this issue, maybe palm will eventually have their own fix for it Oct 16 03:33:52 I imagine it could be patched easily enough without the extra hassle of brightness unlinked Oct 16 03:34:05 just surprised it doesn't bother anybody Oct 16 03:34:29 well, i'm sure it does. Oct 16 03:35:29 the launches in europe have started, so there will be more people with the phone, hopefully this will give palm more feedback Oct 16 03:35:46 and they'll take care of minor issues like that Oct 16 03:35:46 they must follow sites like PreCentral pretty closely Oct 16 03:35:51 I imagine they know about most of the issues Oct 16 03:36:24 would also be nice if they had an official touch keyboard. but they are probably sitting on that on purpose. Oct 16 03:36:53 because they might be afraid that their detractors will use such a patch as an excuse to bash the pre's hardware keyboard. Oct 16 03:37:39 some people will say "even palm thinks they screwed the keyboard up, that's why they released a patch to have an onscreen one!" Oct 16 03:38:10 I dunno, all WM phones have onscreen keyboards Oct 16 03:38:12 It might not be a huge priority because the devices already have keyboards Oct 16 03:38:14 not releasing it sort of shows that they have more confidence in their design. Oct 16 03:38:16 yeah Oct 16 03:38:40 the iPhone has a pretty impressive on-screen keyboard, but I'd still take a physical one any day Oct 16 03:38:55 tlp: yeah but that also would be a fairly easy fix. since they already have the symbol keyboard.. they'd just have to modify that. Oct 16 03:39:03 yeah Oct 16 03:39:12 right now they probably have their hands full Oct 16 03:39:18 what with the product launches worldwide Oct 16 03:39:19 etc Oct 16 03:39:31 I'm glad the GSM pre is finally getting out there. Oct 16 05:34:47 whats good Oct 16 05:35:00 carrots Oct 16 05:35:14 unboiled carrots Oct 16 05:35:34 ^^^^^^^^^ Oct 16 05:35:58 oc80z: mvapps Oct 16 05:36:32 re Oct 16 05:36:42 lol Oct 16 05:47:21 big ups, btw. Oct 16 05:47:25 boh boh, rw. Oct 16 05:59:00 wow Oct 16 05:59:04 its dead tonight Oct 16 05:59:20 Oh btw, just curious, anyones top volumee button gotten stuck on any of there pres? Oct 16 05:59:31 I just had mine do this 2 days ago :( Oct 16 05:59:38 Ive got a replacement on the way though Oct 16 05:59:46 and by stuck I mean non-functional as well Oct 16 06:00:01 not here Oct 16 06:18:55 not i Oct 16 06:19:01 the pam pre is a beast tho' Oct 16 06:19:27 sit on it, throw it on the ground, Oct 16 06:23:18 does anyone know if the latest iphone web browser support web workers and native json, given the webkit 4 code base? Oct 16 07:35:59 wow, this place is even quieter than usual tonight. Oct 16 07:39:00 hello together Oct 16 07:39:13 i tried to install optware Oct 16 07:39:17 and got an error Oct 16 07:39:31 Mounting the root file system read-write: Oct 16 07:39:31 OK Oct 16 07:39:31 Creating new /opt directory: Oct 16 07:39:32 OK Oct 16 07:39:32 Setting /opt to mount automatically at boot: Oct 16 07:39:33 OK Oct 16 07:39:34 Downloading the ipkg-opt Package file from the Optware package feed: Oct 16 07:39:35 Connecting to ipkg.nslu2-linux.org (140.211.169.169:80) Oct 16 07:39:37 Packages 100% |***************************************************************************************************************| 491k 00:00:00 ETA Oct 16 07:39:40 OK Oct 16 07:39:42 Downloading the latest ipkg-opt package from the Optware package feed: Oct 16 07:39:44 Connecting to ipkg.nslu2-linux.org (140.211.169.169:80) Oct 16 07:39:46 wget: content-length 488 is garbage Oct 16 07:39:48 ERROR: Failed to download ipkg-opt_0.99.163-10_arm.ipk Oct 16 07:39:50 Configuring the Optware feeds: Oct 16 07:39:52 OK Oct 16 07:39:54 Adding /opt/bin to the default $PATH: Oct 16 07:39:56 OK Oct 16 07:39:58 Updating the Optware package database: Oct 16 07:40:00 optware-bootstrap.sh: line 565: ipkg-opt: not found Oct 16 07:40:02 ERROR: Failed to update the local Optware package database Oct 16 07:40:04 sorry... pastbin: http://webos.pastebin.com/m4a4f3dbb Oct 16 07:40:06 can anyone help me with this issue? Oct 16 07:44:42 script is trying to download http://ipkg.nslu2-linux.org/feeds/optware/arm/cross/unstable/ipkg-opt_0.99.163-10_arm.ipk Oct 16 07:44:49 but this ipk-package doesn't exist Oct 16 07:52:44 rwhitby, ping? Oct 16 07:52:55 freakout: syn|ack Oct 16 07:53:06 aha, you are around. Oct 16 07:53:20 Where are those Aussie carrier settings hiding in the doctor?' Oct 16 07:53:49 freakout: I was just looking for that myself Oct 16 07:53:53 I can't seem to locate the original PreCentral post where they were first mentioned Oct 16 07:53:58 heh Oct 16 07:54:36 could noone help me with optware installation? Oct 16 07:54:51 marco__: where did the script you are running come from? Oct 16 07:55:05 the exact URL please Oct 16 07:55:13 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Next_steps Oct 16 07:55:20 official wiki Oct 16 07:56:00 marco__: feeds/optware/arm is not a valid feed location Oct 16 07:56:16 feeds/optware/cs08q1armel is the required feed Oct 16 07:56:49 marco__: have you modified the script at al? Oct 16 07:56:51 all? Oct 16 07:57:15 no... i thought $FEED_ARCH is arm Oct 16 07:57:33 line 209 constructs the download link as following: Oct 16 07:57:37 line 49 of http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/bootstrap/blobs/master/optware-bootstrap.sh says cs08q1armel Oct 16 07:57:40 wget "http://ipkg.nslu2-linux.org/feeds/optware/$FEED_ARCH/cross/unstable/${IPKG_FILE}" >> "$LOG" 2>&1 || error "Failed to download ${IPKG_FILE}" || return 1 Oct 16 07:58:01 you are right Oct 16 07:58:07 i tried to manually get the download Oct 16 07:58:19 and replaced $FEED_ARCH in the wrong manner Oct 16 07:58:27 but the script failes anyway Oct 16 07:58:37 ok, did you look in the log file? Oct 16 07:58:39 log-file is shown under: http://webos.pastebin.com/m4a4f3dbb Oct 16 07:58:46 yes of course Oct 16 07:59:00 Downloading the latest ipkg-opt package from the Optware package feed: Oct 16 07:59:00 Connecting to ipkg.nslu2-linux.org (140.211.169.169:80) Oct 16 07:59:00 wget: content-length 488 is garbage Oct 16 07:59:01 ERROR: Failed to download ipkg-opt_0.99.163-10_arm.ipk Oct 16 07:59:22 run the script with sh -x to see what wget command it is executing Oct 16 07:59:43 can you give me the full line please Oct 16 07:59:51 i'm an intermediate with unix Oct 16 08:00:50 oh... my mistake Oct 16 08:00:57 just add the -x parameter Oct 16 08:01:00 i will try it Oct 16 08:01:22 wget http://ipkg.nslu2-linux.org/feeds/optware/cs08q1armel/cross/unstable/Packages Oct 16 08:01:44 wget http://ipkg.nslu2-linux.org/feeds/optware/cs08q1armel/cross/unstable/ipkg-opt_0.99.163-10_arm.ipk Oct 16 08:02:19 manual download of the second link works Oct 16 08:02:26 why not with the script? Oct 16 08:02:33 good question Oct 16 08:02:43 it seems to work for lots of other people Oct 16 08:03:21 i'm using a german palm pre with webos 1.1.2 Oct 16 08:03:56 is it possible to move the file on my mac directly to the palm? Oct 16 08:04:06 just overpass download? Oct 16 08:04:24 does the manual wget work on the palm? Oct 16 08:04:55 should i try it? Oct 16 08:05:01 1.1.2? I though the GSM Pre had 1.1.3 ? Oct 16 08:05:19 yes, try it - I'm suspecting your Pre's network connection is broken. Oct 16 08:06:00 but i got the optware bootstrap via wget Oct 16 08:06:10 manually download the ipk-package doesn't work Oct 16 08:06:12 same error Oct 16 08:06:25 content length isn't equal to checksum i think Oct 16 08:07:39 wget some other large file from another site to both Pre and desktop and compare lengths and md5sums Oct 16 08:07:54 okay... please wait a minute Oct 16 08:09:32 just downloaded a file of 37 kb Oct 16 08:09:45 via the pre Oct 16 08:10:17 because it was a html file Oct 16 08:10:25 i can say it's complete and correct Oct 16 08:11:10 can i obtain webos version number via novaterm in any way? Oct 16 08:11:16 to verify version 1.1.2 Oct 16 08:11:24 maybe i'm wrong with that Oct 16 08:11:32 hello Oct 16 08:17:08 marco__: cat /etc/palm-build-info Oct 16 08:17:36 PRODUCT_VERSION_STRING=Palm webOS 1.1.3 Oct 16 08:17:44 marco__: do you get the same md5sum when you download the ipkg-opt file on Pre and desktop? Oct 16 08:18:43 Bloody hell. i just went through the IRC logs, but couldn't find any mention there either. Could have sworn I saw someone talking about it here Oct 16 08:18:59 yes rwhitby... they are equal Oct 16 08:20:00 but instead of downloading 74456 bytes (mac), it just downloaded 488 bytes Oct 16 08:20:11 maybe the redirect wasn't correctly managed? Oct 16 08:21:42 how can the md5sum be equal between such differently sized files? Oct 16 08:22:44 md5sum is calculated before download in optware bootstrap script i thought Oct 16 08:22:58 don't know exactly... i don't wrote the script ;) Oct 16 08:23:10 the script has nothing to do with it. Oct 16 08:23:20 what is the md5sum of the file you have downloaded on the mac? Oct 16 08:23:30 829863df48f694c88a5ec7922f7339f9 Oct 16 08:23:31 what is the md5sum of the file you have downloaded on the Pre? Oct 16 08:23:35 829863df48f694c88a5ec7922f7339f9 Oct 16 08:23:41 as i said... equal Oct 16 08:23:44 I do not believe you. Oct 16 08:23:52 what is the size of the file on the mac? Oct 16 08:23:57 Rockhopper Oct 16 08:23:58 what is the size of the file on the pre? Oct 16 08:23:59 should be Oct 16 08:24:02 RockLobster Oct 16 08:24:08 the pre didn't downloaded the file Oct 16 08:24:11 that is the error Oct 16 08:24:29 on the mac the ipk-file is 74456 bytes big Oct 16 08:24:34 you said the md5sum were equal, but the size of the file on the pre is only 488 when you wget it manually Oct 16 08:24:42 on the pre the file isn't existing Oct 16 08:24:53 because the script created a file ipkg-opt_0.99.163-10_arm.ipk.md5sum Oct 16 08:25:06 on the pre... it's content shows the same checksum as on the mac Oct 16 08:25:20 ok, we are not communicating properly here. is german your native language? Oct 16 08:25:26 yes Oct 16 08:25:47 ok, have you used wget on the pre to download the file on the pre? Oct 16 08:25:55 step by step Oct 16 08:26:16 as http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Next_steps says Oct 16 08:26:25 i changed to /tmp with cd /tmp Oct 16 08:26:39 forget the steps, answer my question please. Oct 16 08:26:41 i downloaded the optware bootstrap with wget http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/bootstrap/blobs/raw/master/optware-bootstrap.sh Oct 16 08:26:59 and executing the bootstrap resulted in the error Oct 16 08:27:15 the script tries to download ipk via wget Oct 16 08:27:23 and i tried it manually afterwards Oct 16 08:27:25 the script works - the network connection between your Pre and the ipkg site is broken. we are trying to debug why. please answer my questions or we stop now. Oct 16 08:27:26 with the same result Oct 16 08:27:46 okay... i hopefully answered your question... or not? Oct 16 08:27:56 Have you used wget on the pre to download the file on the pre? Oct 16 08:28:04 once yes Oct 16 08:28:48 and what was full command you used, the size of the resulting file, and the md5sum of the resulting file (from running md5sum on the actual file, not from looking at some other file0 Oct 16 08:29:29 wget http://ipkg.nslu2-linux.org/feeds/optware/cs08q1armel/cross/unstable/ipkg-opt_0.99.163-10_arm.ipk Oct 16 08:29:51 resulted in the message Connecting to ipkg.nslu2-linux.org (140.211.169.169:80) Oct 16 08:29:51 wget: content-length 488 is garbage Oct 16 08:29:56 rwhitby: /usr/lib/luna/CarrierNetworkSettings.db3 ? Oct 16 08:29:56 no file was downloaded Oct 16 08:30:02 I asked: "Do you get the same md5sum when you download the ipkg-opt file on Pre and desktop?" Oct 16 08:30:13 You said: "yes rwhitby... they are equal" Oct 16 08:30:25 do you still stand by that answer? Oct 16 08:30:32 because there is a file generated by the bootstrap which contains the md5sum Oct 16 08:30:46 i don't know how the script got the checksum Oct 16 08:30:49 it's there Oct 16 08:31:11 if i remove all files in tmp and use wget to get the ipk file, there is no file downloaded Oct 16 08:32:24 ok, so the answer is "no, I do not get the same md5sum when I download the ipkg-opt file on Pre and desktop", correct? Oct 16 08:32:46 yes... by manually usage of wget... i get not the same checksum Oct 16 08:33:27 ok, what is the size and md5sum of the file you get when you use wge to manually download the ipkg-opt file? Oct 16 08:33:35 wget Oct 16 08:33:45 there is absolutly no file in tmp after using wget manually Oct 16 08:33:59 because it interrupted with the message ... is garbage Oct 16 08:34:31 ok, so your Pre is not able to download files. The problem is with your Pre's network connection, not with the script. Oct 16 08:35:12 why could i when download the optware bootstrap script without any problems? Oct 16 08:35:24 just a question... Oct 16 08:36:02 i also tried a html file... with success Oct 16 08:36:25 good question, that was what I was trying to determine when you took us on a tangent by saying the md5sums where the same when they most certainly were not because you didn't even get a second file downloaded. Oct 16 08:36:42 okay... my mistake Oct 16 08:36:47 misunderstood you... sorry Oct 16 08:37:12 ok, let's start over. Oct 16 08:37:55 please use webos.pastebin.com to paste the exact output of running the wget command to manually download the ipkg-opt file Oct 16 08:38:45 http://webos.pastebin.com/m4e99137 Oct 16 08:42:24 rwhitby: http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-6/1039114/aha.jpg :) Oct 16 08:42:25 not really helping i guess Oct 16 08:42:36 try wget -v .... Oct 16 08:43:08 okay... one moment please Oct 16 08:43:30 invalid option Oct 16 08:49:41 hmm - ok, busybox wget does not have the verbose option it seemds. Oct 16 08:50:39 The ipkg-opt file is 78KB - please try downloading a binary file larger than that to Pre and Mac and compare Oct 16 08:50:57 okay... one minute Oct 16 08:51:41 rwhitby, not to keep interrupting. But would custom carrier settings be as simple as adding the correct values to this database? Oct 16 08:51:46 freakout: where is that file from? Oct 16 08:52:04 rwhitby: ze Doctor Oct 16 08:52:08 rwhitby: /usr/lib/luna/CarrierNetworkSettings.db Oct 16 08:52:15 bah Oct 16 08:52:19 /usr/lib/luna/CarrierNetworkSettings.db3 Oct 16 08:52:35 Seems to have everything Oct 16 08:53:21 rwhitby: a download of a 369k big file failed too Oct 16 08:53:31 rwhitby: Suppose we'd need to find out which international carriers have already been proved incompatible and compare to the list Oct 16 08:53:31 maybe there is a size restriction to downloads? Oct 16 08:53:37 * freakout dashes off to Precentral thread Oct 16 08:54:00 marco__: are you connecting via GSM or WiFi ? Oct 16 08:54:14 actually via gsm... i can change it to wifi Oct 16 08:54:18 if you want Oct 16 08:54:23 maybe this would be better Oct 16 08:54:52 i will give it a try Oct 16 08:56:49 marco__: yes, use Wifi, and separately work out why your GSM data connection is broken. Oct 16 08:57:44 it's really possible that there is a bandwidth-/size-limitation active with my provider Oct 16 08:57:48 i will try wifi now Oct 16 08:57:51 one moment please Oct 16 09:01:08 now the optware bootstrap script works Oct 16 09:01:29 marco__: that's great nes. Oct 16 09:01:30 news Oct 16 09:01:35 thank you very much Oct 16 09:01:39 one last question Oct 16 09:01:44 sure Oct 16 09:01:58 how can i reverse the settings done by the bootstrap script, if it's possible at all Oct 16 09:02:24 i think i made a mistake with the unprivileged user Oct 16 09:02:53 marco__: kill any processes running from /opt, umount /opt, remove /var/opt, remove /etc/event.d/optware-*, remove /etc/profile.d/optware Oct 16 09:04:14 did i understood it correctly, that the unprivileged user is installed to avoid root access for further connections to the pre for example via ssh? Oct 16 09:05:03 marco__: yes, but we are moving to just using root and ssh keys only, and the Optware packages in Preware can do that now. Oct 16 09:05:29 okay... good to here... great work by the way Oct 16 09:05:31 thanks a lot Oct 16 09:06:23 how can i get a list of all processes running from /opt? Oct 16 09:06:29 i tried to use »top« Oct 16 09:07:16 rwhitby: here we go. This guy says that his Swisscom (Switzerland) SIM card didn't work Oct 16 09:07:18 http://discussion.treocentral.com/palm-pre/209575-question-about-importing-pre.html#post1977309 Oct 16 09:07:30 rwhitby: Swisscom doesn't have an entry in the db Oct 16 09:08:59 did anyone try the ,meta-doctor on a german imported pre to bypass activation Oct 16 09:12:54 soulofdeath, not that I've seen reported Oct 16 09:13:15 im expecting mine in a couple of days Oct 16 09:13:28 and i will try to find for my self Oct 16 09:13:31 soulofdeath: mine in a week or two. Waiting for Paypal bank transfer to clear :) Oct 16 09:13:57 soulofdeath: which country are you in, and on which carrier? Oct 16 09:14:02 yeah my paypal payment approval took 2 days Oct 16 09:14:22 and i ordered dhl 2 days shipping but because of the weekend it should be here on monday Oct 16 09:14:28 im in Dubai Oct 16 09:14:37 my carrier is called etisalat Oct 16 09:15:04 though i didnt see a place where you have tutorials on how to flash your pre Oct 16 09:15:13 i mean a step by step guide Oct 16 09:15:19 and tools on how to do it Oct 16 09:15:22 i guess when i get it Oct 16 09:15:39 i would have a bigger urge to search Oct 16 09:15:40 more Oct 16 09:15:47 lol Oct 16 09:15:50 :) Oct 16 09:16:00 Have you downloaded a webOS doctor image soulofdeath? Oct 16 09:16:07 nope not yet Oct 16 09:16:25 the only link that i know about is the one from the official palm website Oct 16 09:16:36 which requires a serial number Oct 16 09:16:42 so as i get it Oct 16 09:16:43 i will Oct 16 09:16:56 is it a java app? Oct 16 09:17:05 oils-wlan:luna rwhitby$ sqlite3 CarrierNetworkSettings.db3 .dump | grep etisalat Oct 16 09:17:05 INSERT INTO "com_palm_data_carriernetworksettings_DataConnectionSettings" VALUES(2199023255789,'etisalat.ae',630,'mnet','mnet',1,1,'Data',1099511628371,1,2634,NULL); Oct 16 09:17:06 soulofdeath: yup Oct 16 09:17:09 or is it an exe or a dmg Oct 16 09:17:23 oh cool Oct 16 09:17:31 so the meta doctor should be the same Oct 16 09:17:42 soulofdeath: may have bad news for you though. Etisalat does not appear to be on the list of pre-configured carriers Oct 16 09:17:52 yeah i know Oct 16 09:18:03 i am hoping for someone to do a list Oct 16 09:18:07 lol Oct 16 09:18:09 freakout: what's the stuff I pasted above/ Oct 16 09:18:12 * freakout is writing a list right now Oct 16 09:18:20 lol Oct 16 09:18:35 oh great Oct 16 09:18:38 * freakout facepalms Oct 16 09:18:44 there is a list that the iphone community did Oct 16 09:18:53 that include all the carriers Oct 16 09:18:59 it was somewhere on modmyi Oct 16 09:19:05 INSERT INTO "com_palm_data_carriernetworksettings_CarrierNetworkSettings" VALUES(424,2,NULL,0,0,'ETISALAT',1,1,NULL,650,1,NULL,173,10,20,1,0,7,NULL,NULL,0,0,'123',1,1,1,1,NULL,0,0,0,0,560,'10.12.0.30','http://mms/servlets/mms',9201,400,595,5000,307200,480,640,20,NULL,1,1,0,0,0,1,1,1,1,2199023255789,2,2648,NULL); Oct 16 09:19:17 http://modmyi.com/wiki/index.php/Carrier_APN_Settings Oct 16 09:19:23 yeah here it is Oct 16 09:19:25 rwhitby: nice Oct 16 09:19:41 rwhitby: so, it's easy enough to manually add new entries. now they need to be tested Oct 16 09:20:04 doh Oct 16 09:20:07 no, you grepped that Oct 16 09:20:07 freakout: that could be your first app - display the carrier network table, and allow addition of entries Oct 16 09:20:31 used grep -i on the second one Oct 16 09:21:29 rwhitbyL Oct 16 09:21:33 opps Oct 16 09:21:37 thanks rwhitby Oct 16 09:22:22 anyone want to alpha test org.webosinternals.mvapp ? Oct 16 09:22:38 rwhitby: what does it do? Oct 16 09:23:24 actually, hold that thought, i need to go pick up my pizza. Oct 16 09:23:30 * freakout goes to pick up pizza Oct 16 09:23:50 rwhitby: do you think swapping Z and Y would work Oct 16 09:23:56 i have a QWERTZ bb Oct 16 09:24:16 and as far as i remember there was no solution for swapping Oct 16 09:33:32 rwhitby: can i ask you one more question? Oct 16 09:34:03 marco__: always Oct 16 09:35:01 can i delete the user created by optware and create a new one? Oct 16 09:35:11 that was the step i made a mistake before Oct 16 09:35:58 marco__: just vi /etc/passwd Oct 16 09:36:07 after making rootfs writeable Oct 16 09:36:41 okay... i will try it Oct 16 09:36:53 password is hashed in there right? Oct 16 09:36:55 md5 or sha? Oct 16 09:39:33 i just have to change fifth parameter (separated by :)?? Oct 16 09:41:20 i correct myself Oct 16 09:41:32 x as second parameter stands for password is stored in shadow file Oct 16 09:41:39 how can i edit the password? Oct 16 09:44:03 use passwd Oct 16 09:45:22 i'm logged in as root Oct 16 09:45:39 how do i specify which user's password should be changed? Oct 16 09:45:44 sorry for all the questions Oct 16 09:45:49 but i'm learning a lot right now Oct 16 09:49:35 got it »passwd « Oct 16 09:49:38 ;) Oct 16 09:53:08 not answering is often better than answering .... ;-) Oct 16 09:54:00 :P you are so right Oct 16 09:54:15 now i try to connect via ssh Oct 16 09:54:23 just got to know my palm's wan ip Oct 16 09:54:31 but i will get this one Oct 16 09:56:59 rwhitby: actually, Swisscom *is* in the db Oct 16 09:57:47 rwhitby: which I guess means more is required than just the listing in the table here Oct 16 10:00:55 rwithby: always get the router ip instead of the wan ip for my pre Oct 16 10:00:57 :( Oct 16 10:05:36 BTW rwhitby, did you ever try that GPS mod? Oct 16 10:07:08 freakout: nope, the tools required to do it seem to be illegally obtained, and reports are that they all contain trojans. Oct 16 10:11:10 rwhitby: ouch Oct 16 10:11:43 heh Oct 16 10:13:09 rwhitby: shame because otherwise it sounds like it would've solved the problem Oct 16 10:16:24 freakout: I don't think it would, actually Oct 16 10:16:44 now, to work out how we build patches for 1.1.3 ... Oct 16 10:18:47 guess we need WebOSCompatible stuff in the metadata first ... Oct 16 10:20:40 rwhitby: no? ('bout GPS) Oct 16 10:21:03 I doubt the GPS chip is returning the wrong lat Oct 16 10:21:26 bye everyone Oct 16 10:21:39 I figured it was getting screwy results 'cause it was trying to ping a sprint GPS server Oct 16 10:22:18 btw, can you check the german carriernetworksettings.db3 to see if it has the same info? i don't have the german doctor Oct 16 10:24:26 freakout: that's the one I did check Oct 16 10:25:59 bugger. Oct 16 10:32:58 rwhitby: by WebOSCompatible in meta i assume you mean something that'll tell people which webOS version the patch will work with? Oct 16 10:39:07 rwhitby: Speaking of patches is there a workflow to update the patches for different WebOS versions? There are quite a few that don't apply here. Oct 16 10:43:01 alphaone: that's just what I'm working out now Oct 16 10:43:12 rwhitby: Ah, good :-) Oct 16 10:43:26 alphaone: I'm thinking a git branch for each non-latest webos version in the field Oct 16 10:44:00 git branch sounds good Oct 16 11:08:41 rwhitby: actually QMAT or maybe bitpim should be able to do it Oct 16 11:12:26 the gps thing Oct 16 11:12:46 or can you be more clear what tools you meant Oct 16 11:14:13 tmzt: well, a tool that had a designated download site, instead of veiled instructions that ask you to google for it but beware of trojans ... Oct 16 11:14:46 name? pm is fine not looking for the tool just the name Oct 16 11:19:47 QPST Oct 16 11:22:51 right Oct 16 11:23:02 the file management part? Oct 16 11:23:29 it can be replaced with a dm tool Oct 16 11:23:37 http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre-tips-information-resources/206982-palm-pre-gps-additional-gps-modes-autonomous-assisted-cached.html Oct 16 11:23:39 like the one one the Pre already Oct 16 11:24:12 I have no idea what you mean by "file management part" Oct 16 11:26:12 there's a filesystem in the msm chip Oct 16 11:26:16 called efs Oct 16 11:26:43 QMATA can do this or I can ask viper to add it Oct 16 11:26:53 QMAT Oct 16 11:27:00 even the demo Oct 16 11:27:11 the mpt 0d is the important part Oct 16 11:28:43 I thought there was a second standalone gps chip Oct 16 11:29:00 not just the agps in msm Oct 16 11:29:44 tmzt: ok, qmat looks like the type of tool I'm looking for. Oct 16 11:30:32 yeah, there was source at some point Oct 16 11:30:50 but the DM protocol, including efs is fairly wll documented Oct 16 11:31:16 bitpim has a bad version of efs, ok for what it's used for Oct 16 11:32:09 if you can connect it with mpt though you could browse efs Oct 16 11:48:17 tmzt: you are on the webos ml? Oct 16 11:48:32 tmzt: If not: http://groups.google.com/group/webos-internals/browse_thread/thread/89c2b7aa8e2a5c80 Oct 16 11:49:03 tmzt: So we now have at least soem first protocol traces we can look at. Oct 16 11:53:07 cool Oct 16 11:53:13 link? Oct 16 11:55:11 tmzt: to the traces? It's attached to the mail Oct 16 11:55:24 http://groups.google.com/group/webos-internals/attach/b0d154420b1e28ba/gsm.log?part=3 Oct 16 11:55:38 /dev/modemuart gets opened as fd 10 Oct 16 11:55:52 So all write() and read() to 10 are interesting Oct 16 12:00:29 alphaone|gone: my plans for multi-version patches, are a git branch and tag for different webos version, and then different versioned feeds for webos-patches. The Makefile for each patch will record which versions are active for it, and the system will loop through those versions and create multiple versioned ipks which will later be put into separate feeds before being indexed. Oct 16 12:00:50 * rwhitby bbt - night all Oct 16 12:01:20 night rod Oct 16 12:02:16 night rwhitby Oct 16 12:02:51 Anyone here can tell me what 'mpt 0d' does on the Pre? Oct 16 12:03:19 The GPS post mentions it and it seems it exposes the modem interface over the micro USb port to the host?? Oct 16 12:03:27 * stefan_schmidt would love to have this Oct 16 12:04:37 yay, it seems indeed to be passthru Oct 16 12:04:45 need to check this later today Oct 16 12:05:24 root@castle:/var/home/root# mpt --help Oct 16 12:05:24 Usage: Oct 16 12:05:24 To enable passthru: mpt [port_spec] Oct 16 12:05:24 To disable passthru: mpt disable (or mpt x) Oct 16 12:05:24 [port_spec] Oct 16 12:05:24 dun (or '0') : DUN (port0) only Oct 16 12:05:26 diag (or 'd') : Diag port only Oct 16 12:05:30 dun,diag (or '0d') : DUN (port0) and Diag port Oct 16 12:05:32 diag,gps : Diag port and GPS port Oct 16 12:05:34 userial : Serial passthru with USB cable Oct 16 12:05:36 serial : Serial passthru with Serial cable Oct 16 12:05:38 oops, sorry Oct 16 12:05:40 wrong channel Oct 16 12:06:51 lol Oct 16 12:07:06 that seems to be very appropriate for this channel stefan_schmidt ;) Oct 16 12:07:57 freakout: it is. Just posting that much into a IRC channel is rude Oct 16 12:16:25 stefan_schmidt: i forgive you at any rate, heh Oct 16 12:16:29 night all Oct 16 12:17:14 night freakout Oct 16 12:21:17 im hungry Oct 16 12:21:25 hey stefan_schmidt what you up 2 Oct 16 12:22:37 atlanta: Just had some cornflakes Oct 16 12:22:59 lolo Oct 16 12:22:59 healthy Oct 16 12:23:04 * stefan_schmidt thinks he needs at least two mor microUSB cables Oct 16 12:38:08 i installed the virtual keyboard via WOQI, how do I get rid of it now? Oct 16 12:48:02 boh boh Oct 16 12:50:45 infobot hello Oct 16 12:50:46 Howdy Bub Oct 16 12:50:52 what is WebOS? Oct 16 12:50:59 what is WebOS? infobot? Oct 16 12:51:03 infobot!! Oct 16 12:54:09 hello infobot Oct 16 12:54:14 what is infobot? Oct 16 12:54:22 infobot? Oct 16 12:54:28 bleh Oct 16 12:54:31 good be Oct 16 13:00:48 ~seen rwhitby Oct 16 13:00:51 rwhitby is currently on #webos-internals (12h 22m 8s) #nslu2-linux (12h 22m 8s). Has said a total of 87 messages. Is idling for 1h 22s, last said: 'alphaone|gone: my plans for multi-version patches, are a git branch and tag for different webos version, and then different versioned feeds for webos-patches. The Makefile for each patch will record which versions are active for it, and the system will loop through those versions and ... Oct 16 13:01:26 well, I'll try. Good evening rwhitby even tho it's 11:30 at your home. Oct 16 13:01:32 See, infobot's not dead. Long Live Infobot!! Hip hip, hurray Oct 16 13:01:43 it never was dead Oct 16 13:02:01 it's just that our infobot doesn't seem to answer what is questions. Oct 16 13:02:38 read the funniest post on Precentral this am. Oct 16 13:02:56 "I have an app I need to make.....I have the same app for winmo......I just need to know how to change the files so I can use it on the pre.....do I just rename the file to .ipk??? Thanks for everyone help...." Oct 16 13:03:26 this ranks up with other questins like "Why does the sun shine in the daytime when it's light and we don't need it?" Oct 16 13:03:51 and proves the old addage wrong. There -are- stupid questions. Oct 16 13:28:06 Tell them that won't work, but claim it's because the winmo file is probably copyrighted by m$ . :) Oct 16 13:29:03 Is there a way to log off just on IM account? Oct 16 13:40:08 rick_home: Oct 16 13:40:11 you ahve a link to taht Oct 16 13:40:11 lol Oct 16 13:40:18 you have a link to that** Oct 16 14:08:36 check out this guys post Oct 16 14:08:36 http://forums.precentral.net/1979957-post10.html Oct 16 14:13:05 atlanta: that is odd I have loaded a ton of apps since doing a complete refresh and putting preware on and the fair dinkum app. Wonder if it didn't take for her phone Oct 16 14:14:30 maybe her /var is full Oct 16 14:15:09 good point probably has a bunch of music/video on it Oct 16 14:16:05 :D i finally got nap/ip_forwarding working last night Oct 16 14:16:06 so now i understand what I need to do with the network manager service/gui Oct 16 14:51:07 PuffTheMagic: cool cool you gonna start making the app? Oct 16 14:51:28 yeah... probably gonna be an all out network manager Oct 16 14:51:33 by the time im done with it Oct 16 14:52:20 cause if you have bt and wifi enabled but you try to do nat over usb0 to ppp(evdo) there are route issues Oct 16 14:52:29 so i have to mess around with that stuff Oct 16 14:52:49 which either means you need to turn off those interfaces or change the routes/metrics Oct 16 14:53:16 and its gonna allow setting addresses Oct 16 14:53:18 or using dhcp Oct 16 14:53:31 so it wouldnt be a stretch to integrate wpa_supplicant support Oct 16 14:53:43 and bt stuff Oct 16 14:54:14 my "lock" on /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward isnt really working Oct 16 14:54:24 so im gonna have to use inotify Oct 16 14:54:33 and when it gets modified set it back immediately Oct 16 14:54:48 gotca Oct 16 14:55:08 have u tried stoping the one connection manager Oct 16 14:55:11 to keep it from changing Oct 16 14:55:13 the damn Palm devs disabled some kernel features that would have made this even easier Oct 16 14:55:31 gotcha Oct 16 14:55:42 FS_CAPABILITIES is not enabled Oct 16 14:55:53 that sucks Oct 16 14:57:02 if that was enabled i could set CAP_DAC_OVERRIDE to that PmConnection thing Oct 16 14:57:02 and then chown the ip_forward file Oct 16 14:57:03 and it wouldnt be able to read/write it any more Oct 16 14:57:15 sounds logical Oct 16 14:57:16 cool cool Oct 16 14:57:27 atlanta: i didnt want to disable the PmConnection thing cause I dont know everything it does Oct 16 14:57:29 but i might have to Oct 16 14:57:36 egaudet_work: where the hell have u been Oct 16 14:57:37 gotcha Oct 16 14:57:42 in bed sick Oct 16 14:57:49 question can someone use MIT LICENSE code and then release an app closed source Oct 16 14:57:50 what have i missed Oct 16 14:57:52 ahh Oct 16 14:57:55 isnt that against the license Oct 16 14:57:56 egaudet_work: u getting better? Oct 16 14:58:06 yea Oct 16 14:58:10 thats good Oct 16 14:58:20 egaudet_work: i was camping so idk what i missed this working Oct 16 14:58:25 s/working/weekend/ Oct 16 14:58:25 PuffTheMagic meant: egaudet_work: i was camping so idk what i missed this weekend Oct 16 14:58:40 egaudet_work: oil has work done on the irc gui Oct 16 14:58:47 how was the camping Oct 16 14:59:03 ohh irc gui nice Oct 16 14:59:04 egaudet_work: and im starting a network manager service so we can have an opensource "tether" nat/ip_forwading app Oct 16 14:59:16 egaudet_work: camping was quick... but good Oct 16 14:59:47 how's the ipkg service Oct 16 14:59:57 egaudet_work: havent touched it Oct 16 15:00:12 egaudet_work: and Rick had a meeting with Sprint and they have goodies coming our way Oct 16 15:00:23 where did you leave it basically all working except confirmation right? Oct 16 15:00:23 in terms of new apis and shit Oct 16 15:00:51 nice goodies :D I read quickly something about that the other day Oct 16 15:01:03 egaudet_work: i got rid of one of the subscriptions, and integrated that data into the update call Oct 16 15:01:05 so now when you call update Oct 16 15:01:36 instead of having to listen to another subscription to get all the info Oct 16 15:01:36 while waiting for update to return Oct 16 15:01:36 you get all the updates on that initial call Oct 16 15:01:38 then the return Oct 16 15:01:40 errr.... Oct 16 15:01:43 i did that for list Oct 16 15:01:44 not update Oct 16 15:02:06 so you make a call to udpate and you get 700+ json objects for each feed item Oct 16 15:02:13 then u get an object with a "returnValue" Oct 16 15:02:21 to signal the end of the list Oct 16 15:02:26 ok cool Oct 16 15:02:49 im gonna have to modify the lib to add that same feature to update Oct 16 15:03:18 cause the callback in libipkg for info has a void *ptr Oct 16 15:03:24 that you can stuff the message object in Oct 16 15:03:29 but the callback for list does not Oct 16 15:03:42 so its either modify the lib and add support, Oct 16 15:03:53 or create some hashmap and track them which would be ugly Oct 16 15:05:27 what do they pass to the callback for list? Oct 16 15:05:50 nothing, its got not user data param Oct 16 15:05:54 like the other call back did Oct 16 15:06:00 s/not/no Oct 16 15:06:26 so where does the list data go Oct 16 15:06:55 So just to let someone know, I looked at the V3 of the 4x4 launcher and had a problem with it properly displaying the page count bars at the bottom. I have 6 pages, and it was telling me I was at the right end when I had one left. Oct 16 15:07:01 egaudet_work: http://git.webosinternals.org/?p=services/ipkgmgrsrv.git;a=blobdiff;f=src/ipkgmgr.c;h=6d0689408443db6c97ac11e9e7292c636aeb6aaa;hp=9361c808fdcddcfbf3a5c472a5c2ad1f6da92439;hb=ca2475c3c0c078b14a1e7fef715713e6c083d9db;hpb=a9b1c66b3875ebd09968c646f3baf7da7478a7d6 Oct 16 15:07:06 that should give you an idea of what I did Oct 16 15:07:37 Ron0001: contact the dev, should be in the maintainer field Oct 16 15:09:36 that doesn't look like wircd... Oct 16 15:09:38 xD Oct 16 15:09:46 * atlanta wishes he could read C Oct 16 15:10:15 thanks Oct 16 15:12:14 oil: i told you im doing this network manager thing really quick today and tomorrow Oct 16 15:12:44 oil: i will try and outline some the scenes i need in a text file if you want to start doing the gui Oct 16 15:12:51 I need a name for this service and gui Oct 16 15:13:19 notMyTeather Oct 16 15:13:43 ourTeather? Oct 16 15:13:45 xD Oct 16 15:13:45 See but i dont even wnat to use the word Tether... cause it has nothing to do with tethering Oct 16 15:14:05 tethering is using phone as modem Oct 16 15:14:07 which this is not doing Oct 16 15:14:18 its an abuse Oct 16 15:14:22 like using the term "rooting" Oct 16 15:14:23 ;) Oct 16 15:14:44 but, aunt minnie rooted her phone just so she could teather Oct 16 15:14:49 lol Oct 16 15:14:54 nmint Oct 16 15:14:55 lol Oct 16 15:15:00 network manager is not tethering :P Oct 16 15:15:29 oil: i guess this app is gonna need a rotating slogan bar like Preware ;) Oct 16 15:15:59 lol Oct 16 15:16:06 the one in preware is weighted, too Oct 16 15:16:15 its fancy stuff Oct 16 15:16:17 lol Oct 16 15:16:21 get started Oct 16 15:16:25 chip chop chip Oct 16 15:16:36 * oil is about to leave for work Oct 16 15:16:41 * oil is only half dressed right now Oct 16 15:16:42 sick day! Oct 16 15:16:46 dont worry, its the bottom half Oct 16 15:16:52 lol Oct 16 15:17:13 lol suck day Oct 16 15:17:17 i have no boss on fridays Oct 16 15:17:26 nice Oct 16 15:17:31 so its Pre dev day Oct 16 15:17:31 so i don't ever really do much Oct 16 15:17:39 but i dont have the sdk and shit at work Oct 16 15:17:46 u dont need the sdk Oct 16 15:17:52 use precomd Oct 16 15:18:01 lol Oct 16 15:18:10 but i need to compile it for win32 first Oct 16 15:18:19 "why is your phone hooked up"? Oct 16 15:18:26 "oh, charging" Oct 16 15:18:26 lol Oct 16 15:18:26 install the sdk on the pre itself and then ssh into it and do all the dev there? Oct 16 15:18:53 really though Oct 16 15:19:03 i dont need the sdk to create a scene with some toggles on it Oct 16 15:19:41 more than toggle Oct 16 15:19:44 ip address fields Oct 16 15:19:51 lol Oct 16 15:19:51 ok Oct 16 15:19:53 im outta here Oct 16 15:19:53 you will need to validate those ;) Oct 16 15:20:03 later Oct 16 15:20:30 bpadalino|work: ping Oct 16 15:20:36 hi Oct 16 15:21:22 bpadalino|work: the directions you had for precomd for win32 used cygwin..... Oct 16 15:21:35 the usb lib you used for that.... is it an oss lib Oct 16 15:21:41 or something windows specific? Oct 16 15:21:44 oss lib Oct 16 15:21:56 so building it with mingw should be no prob then Oct 16 15:22:02 is it the same lib for linux and bsd? Oct 16 15:22:06 http://libusb-win32.sourceforge.net/ Oct 16 15:22:32 ahh excellent Oct 16 15:22:34 its a port Oct 16 15:22:37 so api is same? Oct 16 15:22:39 yeah Oct 16 15:22:40 should be Oct 16 15:22:49 sweet Oct 16 15:24:03 doh Oct 16 15:24:05 right on their website Oct 16 15:24:06 100% API and functional compatible with the main libusb project. Oct 16 15:24:13 should have read before asking Oct 16 15:26:14 it's all good Oct 16 15:30:09 the Pixelpipe program copied all of the flickr work Oct 16 15:30:28 the flickr upload app Oct 16 15:31:23 thats not nice Oct 16 15:33:07 not nice? the flickr license allows it Oct 16 15:33:31 ... and they credited the flickr app as being the basis for their app ... Oct 16 15:33:34 but you cant release it as closed source can you Oct 16 15:33:42 yes you can Oct 16 15:33:46 oh ok Oct 16 15:33:47 i guess Oct 16 15:34:03 ummm Oct 16 15:34:05 basis it is the whole app lmfao its all cool i guess Oct 16 15:34:05 no Oct 16 15:34:07 i dont think so Oct 16 15:34:18 wait, that is MIT, not BSD Oct 16 15:34:18 yea i didnt think the MIT could be used like that Oct 16 15:34:22 (reading MIT) Oct 16 15:34:53 i was curious opened the thing up and just changed some variables and added a little menu options and closed sourced it Oct 16 15:35:23 The MIT license says: Oct 16 15:35:29 ermission is hereby granted, free of charge, to any person obtaining a copy Oct 16 15:35:29 of this software and associated documentation files (the "Software"), to deal Oct 16 15:35:29 in the Software without restriction, including without limitation the rights Oct 16 15:35:29 to use, copy, modify, merge, publish, distribute, sublicense, and/or sell Oct 16 15:35:29 copies of the Software, and to permit persons to whom the Software is Oct 16 15:35:30 furnished to do so, subject to the following conditions: Oct 16 15:35:42 in the terminal how you type the > Oct 16 15:36:07 shift-. Oct 16 15:36:14 dkj1: that was for you Oct 16 15:36:35 all of the "non-obvious" keystrokes are at http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Application:Terminal Oct 16 15:36:45 stefan_schmidt: the mpt stuff doesn't need a special driver IIRC, only modbprobe usbserial with the vendor and product ID Oct 16 15:36:48 the conditions are you have to put a disclamier Oct 16 15:36:58 That says "without restriction". Oct 16 15:37:06 I think what they did is on the up-and-up, then. Oct 16 15:37:59 nt4cats: thank you Oct 16 15:39:00 basically the MSD and MIT licenses are the same except the "no endorsement" clause Oct 16 15:39:17 http://www.opensource.org/licenses/mit-license.php Oct 16 15:39:23 http://www.opensource.org/licenses/bsd-license.php Oct 16 15:40:38 ratlanta / puff: ... so the pixelpipe people did exactly what the license allows them to do (and they were nice enough to credit Flickr in their release notes, which the license does not require) Oct 16 15:42:10 ratlanta / puff: ... now I'm not saying that they're being terribly nice in doing so (so the original 'not nice' comment may not be far off) -- but they are not violating the license. Oct 16 15:43:41 gotcha Oct 16 15:43:46 thanks for those links Oct 16 15:50:10 what would be the best way to put add on code to the phone app Oct 16 15:50:33 i need to add on some code to read a file that i will have a list of auto ignore numbers in' Oct 16 15:54:23 destinal: oh, that would be nice. Let me check. Oct 16 15:54:41 destinal: yay, thanks a lot. Oct 16 15:56:30 lunch time Oct 16 16:00:53 destinal: I'll send a patch to LKML to add the ID into usbserial later tonight. Thanks again for pointing it out to me. Oct 16 16:01:06 stefan_schmidt: no problem :) Oct 16 16:01:58 I lost the trick to using putty instead of novaterm after enabling dev mode what is need to be able to connect using putty Oct 16 16:02:37 hello Oct 16 16:03:16 trying to use the sudo su- on my pre and using password root via putty and its saying sorry try again, any help? Oct 16 16:03:51 i tried to change the password thru novacom and it doesnt seem to change from putty Oct 16 16:07:28 egaudet_work: ping Oct 16 16:11:29 PuffTheMagic, pong Oct 16 16:11:39 egaudet_work: how much work do you do at work ? Oct 16 16:11:42 haha Oct 16 16:11:50 varies :P Oct 16 16:12:11 well im starting a new service from scratch Oct 16 16:12:26 so if you want to help and get it done quicker you could see the process from the beginning Oct 16 16:13:13 alright, what service? the network service? Oct 16 16:13:17 yeah Oct 16 16:13:19 djk1 go to www.webos-internals.org and follow the instructions on the "accessing linux" page Oct 16 16:14:12 I would answer laozark but he left too quickly. :-/ Oct 16 16:14:29 ok my head is still a little foggy but I would be willing to help as much as I can Oct 16 16:14:54 atlanta_lunch you here? Oct 16 16:15:47 egaudet_work: oh yeah... already forgot your were sick Oct 16 16:16:30 :P Oct 16 16:17:02 swine flu? Oct 16 16:17:19 and just as I got sick and stayed home from work the transformer on the boiler went so I had no heat and hot water Oct 16 16:17:36 doubt it's swine, I dont think I've ever had the flu Oct 16 16:17:38 that is rough Oct 16 16:17:43 I haven't had a fever since I was a child Oct 16 16:17:53 wow Oct 16 16:18:16 if I ever get a fever I'd probably run to the ER lol Oct 16 16:18:44 * jbrett observes that "since I was a child" is a much longer time for some of us than others ;) Oct 16 16:19:33 but luckily for my small room, inefficient electronics and big blankets I didn't get too cold :P Oct 16 16:20:25 i eat my boogers and candy off the floor Oct 16 16:20:29 to enhance my immune system Oct 16 16:20:34 i dont get sick Oct 16 16:20:35 :D Oct 16 16:20:47 eww Oct 16 16:20:50 lol Oct 16 16:21:06 j/k Oct 16 16:21:10 * oil_work adds "i eat my boogers and candy off the floor" as a random tagline Oct 16 16:21:35 lol Oct 16 16:21:45 lol well it never fails for me, I never get sick until I fall into lack-of-sleep phases Oct 16 16:23:06 bottle your boogers and candy and sell them as immune boosters Oct 16 16:23:44 i should Oct 16 16:25:02 the really disgusting part is that there's probably a market for that sort of thing :P Oct 16 16:25:51 PuffTheMagic: you'll be rich, in addition to having a healthy immune system! Oct 16 16:26:23 * oil_work wouldn't buy it Oct 16 16:26:43 id rather get sick then eat someone elses boogers, seriously Oct 16 16:26:49 You could include a free data dump Oct 16 16:27:59 * jbrett rolls his eyes.. Oct 16 16:30:42 oil_work, we could hide the origins from you. Just market it as sodium, glucose, gotta be some vitamins in there Oct 16 16:31:31 oil_work: would you eat my boogers if you didnt age Oct 16 16:37:42 no Oct 16 16:38:44 Why is it when your wife becomes pregnant, all her female friends rub her tummy and say, "Congratulations!" Oct 16 16:38:44 But none of them rub your dick and say, "Well done!" Oct 16 16:39:19 oh, haha. Oct 16 16:40:34 :P Oct 16 16:41:26 If you put on a few pounds and get fat she will be disappointed also. Oct 16 17:00:35 Templarian -- anything new with Komodo or are you buried with school work? Oct 16 17:01:58 Just other projects and stuff. Oct 16 17:02:10 understood. Oct 16 17:02:42 Plus I haven't really been into developing the addon much since I want to work on my app idea a little. Oct 16 17:03:01 wondering if there's a chance of getting something equivalent to palm-list -f (tail -f) in the list command in the command window Oct 16 17:03:18 me discovers Preware's "Update All", glees! Oct 16 17:03:19 Yea sure, what does palm-list do? Oct 16 17:03:43 * Mousey is shocked to discover it does nothing yet! Oct 16 17:04:16 Rick_work: i'll add it right now let me just test it out. Oct 16 17:04:28 does the equivalent of tail -f /var/log/messages and then grep for the app name, and then cut off the nonsense at the front and end for a clean display Oct 16 17:04:59 the point being that it _keeps running_ instead of shutting down. Oct 16 17:05:22 and I didn't know if that COULD work or if your command thing was "batch" Oct 16 17:06:59 Hmm... it could work since it's a command line type thing. Oct 16 17:07:12 (ssh is the problem where i can't read an output stream right) Oct 16 17:07:58 Mousey: yeah, i forgot that i made the button visible again thinking i was going to make it work, but then never did Oct 16 17:09:02 i like the whole strip tease action tho.. lookey lookey? no touch! Oct 16 17:10:41 Rick_work: where is palm-list located I can't find that command... Oct 16 17:10:59 1.2 sdk? Oct 16 17:11:25 I have 1.2 but it's not with the other .bat's in the bin folder. Oct 16 17:12:35 Templarian My BAD -- palm-log.bat Oct 16 17:12:41 not palm-list.bat Oct 16 17:12:42 oh. lol Oct 16 17:12:57 I do that about 5 times a day. (type the wrong command.) Oct 16 17:13:30 if I write this it will replace the current log functions. Oct 16 17:13:30 so I finally just made a batch file for the "bad" name to call the "good" name Oct 16 17:13:42 well, it would be better. Oct 16 17:13:50 but you'll need a way to _stop_ it. Oct 16 17:14:02 Funny thing I'm the one that suggested that they add it. Oct 16 17:14:17 (they might of already been working on it, but meh) Oct 16 17:14:32 That was months ago through. Oct 16 17:14:35 though* Oct 16 17:15:05 they need to work on some esstenial stuff Oct 16 17:15:12 can u suggest that Oct 16 17:15:13 Rick_work: yea a X with a connection icon will show up for the console window. Oct 16 17:15:14 yep Oct 16 17:19:09 http://www.engadget.com/2009/10/16/mit-takes-the-wrappers-off-autonomous-robotic-helicopter-with-i/ < scary. Oct 16 17:23:58 That's odd palm-log doesn't kill the output when the app closes it stays open... hmm, guess that could be a good thing. Oct 16 17:27:36 Has anyone considered the possibility of changing roaming affinity rather than going all the way to roam-only? Oct 16 17:28:13 Seems like we don't have anything against using Sprint towers, we just want the tower with the strongest signal, eh? Oct 16 17:28:22 Templarian palm-log just picks back up when the app re-instantiates Oct 16 17:28:48 this is VERY handy when you're doing test,edit,compile,test fast cycles. Oct 16 17:31:39 will test that out when i get home Oct 16 17:31:45 i just use komodo edit Oct 16 17:31:53 didnt u make that Templarian Oct 16 17:31:56 the plugin Oct 16 17:32:37 i love it Oct 16 17:32:39 Might of. Oct 16 17:32:57 lol Oct 16 17:33:20 That's what we've been discussing integrating palm-log instead of my current ssh approach. Oct 16 17:54:18 oh lmao Oct 16 17:54:27 * atlanta welcomes himself to the party Oct 16 17:54:27 lol Oct 16 19:04:34 * nt4cats does not suggest ordering a large (20oz) 9% alcohol beer with lunch. Oct 16 19:04:47 (unless you don't want to be productive for the rest of the afternoon) Oct 16 19:07:14 nt4cats: aww come on Oct 16 19:07:20 order 2 Oct 16 19:07:26 and get your tolerance up to spec Oct 16 19:07:40 nt4cats: what did u order? Oct 16 19:09:16 i do that at least once a week Oct 16 19:10:46 i like going for the 30oz blue moons at my favorite pub Oct 16 19:11:00 2-3 of those and im ready to deal with the rest of my day Oct 16 19:13:08 lol Oct 16 19:13:13 you guys are funny Oct 16 19:13:58 puff: a bottle of "Arrogant Bastard" Oct 16 19:14:28 I'm an old man -- most certainly a light-weight these days Oct 16 19:17:20 http://www.arrogantbastard.com/ Oct 16 19:17:35 nt4cats: NICE Oct 16 19:17:41 Stone makes great beers Oct 16 19:17:58 errr Oct 16 19:17:59 nm Oct 16 19:18:03 stone dont make that Oct 16 19:18:07 I was thinking of Runination Oct 16 19:18:14 but Arrogant Bastard is good too Oct 16 19:18:18 that is a stone beer for sure Oct 16 19:18:27 yeah Oct 16 19:18:29 i was right Oct 16 19:18:33 * PuffTheMagic needs Beer Oct 16 19:18:45 chimay is also good Oct 16 19:19:54 Here is a website for chimay drinkers: http://tinyurl.com/2y3d (website is not Rick Astley, is safe for work) Oct 16 19:21:05 excellent use of tinyurl Oct 16 19:22:17 oil: I would use bit.ly, but it is hard to teach an old man to use new interwebs Oct 16 19:22:35 lol Oct 16 19:29:18 I have a really basic question about patches and quilt Oct 16 19:29:20 how do i update them Oct 16 19:29:49 im using the 4x4 icons patch and i see there is a v3 now. do i have to go through the stack and pop of the v2 version i had previously? Oct 16 19:30:10 theone: you should be using preware for patches now, it makes things much easier Oct 16 19:30:15 really? Oct 16 19:30:20 ok Oct 16 19:30:27 i can pop all them off and reapply them Oct 16 19:30:40 that'd be my recommendation Oct 16 19:30:55 how do i reboot luna after applying patches through preware? Oct 16 19:31:07 lunamanager Oct 16 19:31:11 the easiest way is to use preware to install an applicaiton called "luna manager" Oct 16 19:31:27 cool Oct 16 19:31:28 thanks Oct 16 19:31:41 devo: np Oct 16 19:31:55 too bad though, I liked the nerd cred of messing around with my phone through ssh Oct 16 19:32:08 devo: http://culturemob.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/DevoPic.jpg ?? Oct 16 19:32:14 you can update with ssh too Oct 16 19:32:47 update how? Oct 16 19:38:26 ipkg -o /var install *.patch Oct 16 19:38:30 I think Oct 16 19:38:40 you might have to remove the old one first Oct 16 19:38:56 prerm then patch Oct 16 19:39:49 and then postinst Oct 16 19:39:56 theonetruedevo: be like Steven Segal. He knows that he can kick anyone's ass who passes him walking down the street, but he doesn't feel the need to prove it. Oct 16 19:40:17 (or Chuck Norris) Oct 16 19:40:41 haha Oct 16 19:40:43 (or Dick Cheyney) Oct 16 19:40:47 err Cheney Oct 16 19:41:04 but he shoots people in the face Oct 16 19:41:22 devo: you have your action heroes, I have mine Oct 16 19:41:29 haha Oct 16 19:42:14 I still have a JCVD signed 8x10 from when i was a kid haha Oct 16 19:43:22 * nt4cats thinks that Dick Cheney could definitely shoot JCVD in the face given the opportunity ... Oct 16 19:44:02 jcvd? Oct 16 19:44:04 that sounds like a challenge Oct 16 19:44:19 jean-claude van damme Oct 16 19:44:22 van dam Oct 16 19:44:25 lol Oct 16 19:45:15 that short Belgian guy Oct 16 19:45:37 all i remember, is every movie hes in he does the splits Oct 16 19:45:43 Jean-Claude Van Damme (born Jean-Claude Camille François Van Vaerenbergh, 18 October 1960(1960-10-18)) Oct 16 19:45:45 like between two pillars or whatever Oct 16 19:45:49 EPR should probably change into a patch dependent package, whereby REMOVAL will remove all patches Oct 16 19:46:02 oil: that's the "hey, look at the package on that guy!" (tm) shot Oct 16 19:46:36 seriously Oct 16 19:46:59 a gis for "jean-claude splits" has 141k results Oct 16 19:47:00 thats all you need to be able to do to kick ass Oct 16 19:47:18 http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3435/3871852119_5a071b3037_o.jpg Oct 16 19:47:38 jealous? Oct 16 19:48:38 lol Oct 16 19:48:46 there is whole websites dedicated to him doing splits Oct 16 19:48:54 http://thegratuitoussplitsofvandamme.tumblr.com/post/63851169/the-gratuitous-splits-of-van-damme Oct 16 19:50:38 hahaha Oct 16 19:53:53 egaudet_work: ping Oct 16 19:58:21 rwhitby pong Oct 16 20:00:32 egaudet_work wins the point Oct 16 20:00:34 egaudet_work: I'd like to move the epr and any other thing which does not match the webos versioning convention out of the autopatch directory in preware/build.git so we can start to support multiple webos versions in that area Oct 16 20:01:02 why do they prevent that support? Oct 16 20:01:10 s/why/how Oct 16 20:01:55 I have no problems moving them out and all, just wondering what they are prohibiting Oct 16 20:04:30 not prohibiting, but just getting in the way of sed */Makefile ... Oct 16 20:06:44 how do you want to handle it? move them out or keep them in webos-patches feed? make a sub dir autopatch/patches/ for version specific patches? Oct 16 20:08:28 heyyyyy everyone. how goes? I have a question. it seems my phone "re-downloaded" 1.2.1 this afternoon, and now it shows a bunch of patches as "installed" but they're not functional, and I can't use preware to remove them (since they're not actually installed)... anyone have any pointers on how to fix this? Oct 16 20:09:01 egaudet_work: that's the bit i'm asking your opinion on Oct 16 20:09:13 EPR, FTW! Oct 16 20:09:22 dballing, install the EPR package found in available patches -> recovery then restart preware Oct 16 20:09:47 egaudet_work: for the patches themselves, I'm going to add a variable which says which webos versions they are compatible with, and then publish them into separate (and multiple) feeds Oct 16 20:10:36 ok so how about subdirectories for each webos version/feed Oct 16 20:10:51 autopatch/webos-1.2.0, autopatch/webos-1.1.3 Oct 16 20:11:03 running it now. I only started playing with preware like a week or two ago, so this is my first experience with the whole thing. :-) Oct 16 20:11:05 and then leave things like EPR in autopatch/epr Oct 16 20:11:36 egaudet_work: I was hoping to work out a way there there is just a variable in the Makefile WEBOS_VERSIONS = 1.2.0 1.1.3 .... and use git branches and tag comments for changelogs. Oct 16 20:12:23 then the Makefile emits multiple ipks and the top-level Makefile shuffles them to the right feed Oct 16 20:12:27 so branching modifications.git? Oct 16 20:12:33 egaudet_work: yes Oct 16 20:13:01 master is latest webOS version, previous versions are on branches. Oct 16 20:13:53 there are some patches that are valid for one version and not for another Oct 16 20:13:58 common.mk defines which version master relates to. Oct 16 20:14:18 egaudet_work: they would only list the appropriate versions in WEBOS_VERSIONS in the patch Makefile Oct 16 20:16:33 hmmm Oct 16 20:17:24 I think maybe we might want a better way than adding to every patch's Makefile Oct 16 20:19:49 egaudet_work: any other options you can think of which do not involve duplicating all the packaging of the patch? Oct 16 20:19:59 alphaone: are you following the patch management discussion above? Oct 16 20:20:38 rwhitby: I need to read backlog now. Was just wondering to what conclusion you came Oct 16 20:21:27 I just fixed my broken 5x4 patch installation on the Pre with the terminal app. Damn, I love this thing. :'-) Thanks for all the great software and documentation, guys! Oct 16 20:22:13 alphaone: still working out conclusion with egaudet_work Oct 16 20:22:37 alphaone: we're hoping you will be the one to test and rebase some patches for 1.1.3 :-) Oct 16 20:24:43 rwhitby: I can do that. Oct 16 20:25:24 I think using git branches and tags should be pretty slick Oct 16 20:26:49 alphaone: my thoughts at the moment are that the packaging Makefile for each individual patch would list the compatible versions and then loop across them to create independent versioned ipkgs including the patch file from the corresponding webos version tag in the modifications repo. Oct 16 20:27:42 alphaone: egaudet_work and I are determining whether that or subdirectories per version in the repo would be easiest for the workflow for moving from one webos version to the next Oct 16 20:29:08 rwhitby: You could look at the tags in the repo so you wouldn't need the variable, no? Oct 16 20:30:07 alphaone: at the moment, we always have a two-pass system. author updates the tag, and packager is able to push to alpha test feed before changing Makefile variable to match tag to cause autobuilder to publish new tag in production feed Oct 16 20:30:24 okay Oct 16 20:32:36 I think a top level Makefile might be best Oct 16 20:32:43 make 1.2.0, make 1.1.3 Oct 16 20:33:05 have the Makefile keep a list of patches to build for each webos version target? Oct 16 20:33:22 alphaone, stefan_schmidt: we're thinking we need OE on the autobuilder to start creating binaries and libraries for installation on the Pre. at the moment, the autobuilder is quite custom with regard to binaries for services and plugins. Oct 16 20:33:57 egaudet_work: ok, that's the other alternative (and is like we do for targets and packages in optware) Oct 16 20:34:59 egaudet_work: the question is when you want to publish an updated feed for patches, do you want the thing you need to change to be in a single top-level Makefile which gets changed many times by many people as they test, or in many lower-level Makefiles which can be concurrently updated by many people as they test? Oct 16 20:35:15 egaudet_work: I think the latter will work better to distribute the work with git. Oct 16 20:35:35 rwhitby: Well, I always prefer OE. The machine file and kernel recipe I wrote should be compatible with the Palm setup. Sadly they do not offer their own OE recipes. :) Oct 16 20:35:35 egaudet_work: but I see the convenience of the former if one person is testing all patches Oct 16 20:36:16 stefan_schmidt: yes, I should have added that to the list of requests I gave to Palm on the phone the other day. Oct 16 20:36:47 hmmm so you are saying if a patch updated for 1.1.3 but not for 1.2.0 for example Oct 16 20:36:48 stefan_schmidt: do we have an OE recipe for the emulator too? Oct 16 20:37:07 rwhitby: no Oct 16 20:37:20 stefan_schmidt: ok, we need that first then :-) Oct 16 20:37:26 rwhitby: All I did so far was the machine file and the kernel to get something started. Oct 16 20:37:31 it's i686 glibc 2.5 Oct 16 20:38:01 rwhitby: Not from my side for the next month. Really focusing on the challenge right now. Oct 16 20:38:18 I will play later more with webos for sure but I need focus now. :) Oct 16 20:38:21 stefan_schmidt: understood. do you guys have a wiki page on Pre OE build ? Oct 16 20:38:35 * stefan_schmidt goes back to study the modem traces Oct 16 20:38:59 rwhitby: no, not really. I'm the only one using the kernel anyway. :) Oct 16 20:39:01 http://134.169.172.106/~sschmidt/palmpre/ Oct 16 20:39:12 Thats were I put my build Oct 16 20:39:23 changes are all in OE.dev Oct 16 20:39:30 stefan_schmidt: can you push the conf dir too? Oct 16 20:39:58 rwhitby: sure, put there should be nothing magic. Moment. Oct 16 20:40:18 stefan_schmidt: thanks, we can work from that and not distract you from the challenge :-) Oct 16 20:41:01 rwhitby: :) Oct 16 20:41:10 rwhitby: its in the conf subdir Oct 16 20:41:20 rwhitby: but nothing interesting in there. Oct 16 20:41:33 rwhitby: I even set the machine name at the commandline. :) Oct 16 20:41:54 stefan_schmidt: ok, thanks. 'palmpre' is machine name? Oct 16 20:42:06 rwhitby: yes Oct 16 20:42:34 rwhitby: you may run into a problem with recommended sgx modules. Oct 16 20:43:06 rwhitby: You can either make an TI account and get their sdk or comment out the recommend in conf/machines/include/omap3.inc Oct 16 20:43:51 stefan_schmidt: any redistribution problems? Oct 16 20:44:13 oil: dependencies in Preware now allow us to say things like: http://forums.precentral.net/showthread.php?p=1980757 Oct 16 20:44:43 rwhitby: Good question. I did not get them. It'S the binary only GL driver stuff from imgtec. Oct 16 20:45:04 lol Oct 16 20:45:19 rwhitby: I may be possible to redistribute the binaries. But there should be a note when you get it from the TI side. Oct 16 20:45:23 Never tried myself yet Oct 16 20:46:36 ill add actually using the webosversion check this evening Oct 16 20:47:38 rwhitby, how did you plan to handle patches for different webos versions aside from WEBOS_VERSION = 1.1.3 1.2.0 etc... Oct 16 20:48:09 for instance tagging of branches? Will the 1.1.3 build always pull from the top of the 1.1.3 branch, or will there be webos version specific tags as well Oct 16 20:49:45 egaudet_work: tags work independent of branches Oct 16 20:50:12 a tag is just an alias for a commit. doesn't matter which branch it is in, checking out via the tag will get the correct version. Oct 16 20:50:29 right but I mean now you need tag version numbers per webos version Oct 16 20:50:31 the branches are just convenience for humans to see the right commit as the head Oct 16 20:50:59 so would it be WEBOS_VERSION = 1.1.3-1 1.2.0-3 1.2.1-6 etc... Oct 16 20:51:24 ah, no. the IPKG_VERSION would be independent of webos version Oct 16 20:51:40 well how do you build the patch package for each webos version Oct 16 20:52:14 you now have multiple "active" tags to build Oct 16 20:52:26 per webos version supported for any patch Oct 16 20:52:31 egaudet_work: the common.mk will loop over WEBOS_VERSIONS and create multiple ipkgs Oct 16 20:53:42 rwhitby, where is it going to get the files from modifications.git Oct 16 20:53:44 s/where/how/ Oct 16 20:53:44 egaudet_work meant: rwhitby, how is it going to get the files from modifications.git Oct 16 20:53:48 so, the patches feed will have both 1.2.1 and 1.1.3 ipks in it? Oct 16 20:54:10 for instance, we have patch A that is available in both 1.1.3 and 1.2.1 Oct 16 20:54:22 it's in modifications.git on branch 1.1.3 and master 1.2.1 branch Oct 16 20:54:35 the makefile is going to checkout WHAT for each of those version builds? Oct 16 20:54:58 what if 1.1.3 branch needs more updating/changes than 1.2.1, will all branches have to be retagged with webos-ipkg version? Oct 16 20:58:09 * freakout shambles into the channel in his pyjamas, nursing a coffee Oct 16 20:58:28 * Mousey installs backrub app on freakout's Pre Oct 16 21:00:55 freakout doesn't have one yet xD Oct 16 21:01:04 lol Oct 16 21:01:32 but it's a good idea nonetheless, Mousey Oct 16 21:01:42 * Mousey snaps fingers Oct 16 21:01:46 NEXT TIME, gadget Oct 16 21:05:15 egaudet_work: it will get the files via git checkout of a tag Oct 16 21:05:30 oil_work: I think we will have separate versioned feeds Oct 16 21:06:04 egaudet_work: the makefile will checkout a tag for each webos version Oct 16 21:06:21 if 1.1.3 is updated, 1.2.1 tag doesn't change Oct 16 21:07:11 egaudet_work: but you are right that updating 1.1.3 from 1.1.3-0 to 1.1.3-1 will also cause 1.2.1 packaging (not base patch) to go from 1.2.1-0 to 1.2.1-1 to, which will be confusing to users. Oct 16 21:08:43 rwhitby, right which means that if you update 1.1.3 patch you then have to retag ALL webos version branches Oct 16 21:08:51 no Oct 16 21:08:51 I do not like that Oct 16 21:08:55 you do not Oct 16 21:09:09 if you update a 1.1.3 patch, you update the 1.1.3 tag only Oct 16 21:09:13 the 1.2.1 tag does not change Oct 16 21:09:25 so 1.1.3 tag is not going to be versioned? Oct 16 21:09:31 and you keep those tags on separate branches for convenience of the human updating them Oct 16 21:09:32 we can only have one version per webos version of a patch? Oct 16 21:09:50 egaudet_work: the tags do not have -N on them today Oct 16 21:10:06 yes they do Oct 16 21:10:15 oh, really? Oct 16 21:10:20 1.2.1-1 Oct 16 21:10:21 yea Oct 16 21:10:31 ok, I've been talking out of my hat then. sorry, Oct 16 21:11:02 I'm not against changing it if it's for the better Oct 16 21:11:22 egaudet_work: ok, so WEBOS_VERSIONS then says 1.1.3-5 1.2.1-4 ? Oct 16 21:12:13 egaudet_work: that will remove the confusion for the end-user. Oct 16 21:12:20 and the reason for this is because we have multiple patches per tag, but not all patches update on a tag update Oct 16 21:12:56 egaudet_work: yes, this is what allows us to update two patches, but only publish one of the updates then the other later. Oct 16 21:13:25 the whole all patches in one repo idea might need to be revisited Oct 16 21:13:33 egaudet_work: ok, we will have X.Y.Z-N in WEBOS_VERSIONS Oct 16 21:14:17 egaudet_work: no, I think that still works. We may want to split the autopatch dir away from preware/build.git for access reasons if we open patch packaging updates up more widely. Oct 16 21:14:59 well i kind of like your only one webos version tag now Oct 16 21:15:30 ehh no nevermind then we'd have to much re-tagging Oct 16 21:15:38 ok X.Y.Z-N works for me Oct 16 21:16:24 and as long as the common.mk is the only one using the VERSION variable, packages that dont use modifications.git and this scheme (i.e. EPR) can use VERSION directly Oct 16 21:16:38 yes Oct 16 21:16:53 you could then still use WEBOS_VERSION for sed replacements without affecting those version-agnostic tools Oct 16 21:16:55 egaudet_work: so with X.Y.Z-N in WEBOS_VERSIONS in each patch Makefile, and common.mk loops over entries in that var to create multiple ipkgs Oct 16 21:17:22 egaudet_work: agreed, perhaps the inconvenience was only once for me with the initial splitting of VERSION Oct 16 21:17:56 egaudet_work: does this proposal make sense to you now that I am talking with a factual basis of tags? Oct 16 21:18:15 yea but I also agree it would benefit to easily see which directories are patch/modifications Oct 16 21:18:23 rwhitby, yea makes good sense Oct 16 21:19:17 I wouldn't mind putting all the modifications patches into autopatch/modifications/ Oct 16 21:19:45 virtual-keyboard will need a similar structure, but isn't pulled from modifications.git though Oct 16 21:21:35 egaudet_work: since it all comes from GIT_SRC and tags, it doesn't matter which repo the patch comes from. Oct 16 21:22:41 I'm just thinking for sed replacments Oct 16 21:22:54 but I guess those are rare cases Oct 16 21:25:00 speeeaking of ;) Oct 16 21:25:23 egaudet_work: ok, I'll take a look at this later today. I'm going to run 1.1.3 on my CDMA Pre for a while, so will use the patches I use as the test cases. Oct 16 21:26:20 AnOutsider: yes, have we worked out how to do sed replacements in themes and still be autopatch compatible? you could sed patch and then run diff afterwards to create a patch file on the fly ... Oct 16 21:27:58 that's kinda what I was thinking, been waiting to speak to egaudet, but I think I keep missing him Oct 16 21:28:22 I didnt knwo if I should be generating patches based on current file or a patch file or what Oct 16 21:28:46 but whenever you have time eric, drop me a line, ill try to stay connected while i work Oct 16 21:29:12 I got some time now Oct 16 21:29:29 I've been sick the last couple days so I've missed your pings Oct 16 21:29:56 heh, how long will you be online? Got these guys hounding me to get some creatives done by 530 (CST) Oct 16 21:30:18 I'll be heading home from work in a little bit, but should be back around 7-730 EST Oct 16 21:30:37 ok that would work best for me, I should be done by then Oct 16 21:30:41 it's a date ;) Oct 16 21:31:13 :P Oct 16 21:31:21 hawt Oct 16 21:31:39 oil_work checkboxes Oct 16 21:31:42 that's all I'm saying Oct 16 21:31:48 in what? Oct 16 21:31:53 preware Oct 16 21:32:01 oh, for multi-install Oct 16 21:32:05 :D Oct 16 21:32:07 mmm, checkboxes Oct 16 21:32:13 * Mousey checks 50 themes, GO! Oct 16 21:32:16 * oil_work was thinking togglebuttons Oct 16 21:32:37 toggle buttons to uninstall too hmmmm Oct 16 21:32:55 or, you could just include patch "packs" using dependencies Oct 16 21:33:05 hey, btw, who does the themes for precentral? Oct 16 21:33:10 so many patch packs based on user preference Oct 16 21:33:14 s/so/too/ Oct 16 21:33:15 egaudet_work meant: too many patch packs based on user preference Oct 16 21:33:16 like "essentials pack" Oct 16 21:33:19 Wonder if you guys would be open to implementing the theme uninstall thing? Oct 16 21:33:33 AnOutsider, Jason does the theme builder Oct 16 21:33:33 that installs all the really useful patches Oct 16 21:33:47 AnOutsider: and rwhitby does the packaging as ipk Oct 16 21:33:49 the 1.3 wishlist pack? Oct 16 21:34:03 oil_work, yea packs are going to be awesome, but that will just be most-use case. Others still want to multi-install on their whim Oct 16 21:34:09 toggle buttons sound awesome though ;) Oct 16 21:34:12 yeah thats what I meant, who generates the feed and ipk Oct 16 21:34:36 yeah, but im timid to do any code in preware that is package-type specific Oct 16 21:34:41 oh yea the autobuilder builds them, Rod wrote/maintains the script/makefiles for that Oct 16 21:34:51 cause as soon as i do something special for patches, AnOutsider is going to hound me to do something specific for themes Oct 16 21:35:00 oil_work, who said type specific? Oct 16 21:35:03 put toggle button all over Oct 16 21:35:07 every package Oct 16 21:35:08 lol Oct 16 21:35:11 themes? Oct 16 21:35:12 see Oct 16 21:35:39 rwhitby did have a good idea of install "configurations" Oct 16 21:35:42 that could be saved Oct 16 21:35:47 and used for multi-install after a doctor Oct 16 21:36:17 I like to install in bulk Oct 16 21:36:55 ah ok, ill ping rod about that then Oct 16 21:37:21 oil_work: regarding Preware, we need to start thinking about how we can incorporate mvapp support for installing stuff on /media/internals Oct 16 21:37:43 mvapp support? Oct 16 21:38:02 are we going to revisit the -o /var discussion? Oct 16 21:38:11 we're not just going to say "don't install so many shitty apps" and wait for palm to fix it? Oct 16 21:38:11 i.e. get away from it Oct 16 21:38:51 oil_work: that is the preferred solution, but we don't know what they are going to do or when Oct 16 21:39:09 so wtf does mvapp do? Oct 16 21:39:41 egaudet_work_: -o /var is useful cause it allows homebrew apps to be updates of app catalog apps (like reversi) and also matches palm-install and IDE installs Oct 16 21:39:52 oil_work: just moves and symlinks Oct 16 21:40:14 well preware can't run commands Oct 16 21:40:28 oil_work: agreed, it would need to be done by the service Oct 16 21:40:35 if you add a mvapp method Oct 16 21:40:44 I'm thinking what is the user experience first Oct 16 21:40:49 i can add a button or something somewhere Oct 16 21:41:01 probably from the app-view scene's appmenu Oct 16 21:41:08 e.g. does each installed app have a toggle for var/usb ? Oct 16 21:41:16 "Move To Internal" Oct 16 21:41:20 and a preference for default location Oct 16 21:41:22 or something like that Oct 16 21:41:38 i think we'd just default how it is now Oct 16 21:41:50 and have it as an app-by-app action you want to move Oct 16 21:42:08 oil_work: but when you get full you want to move automatically by default Oct 16 21:42:17 do you? Oct 16 21:42:29 anyway, some food for thought - I'm out for 2 hours or so now. Oct 16 21:42:40 rwhitby, why is that desireable? Oct 16 21:42:52 AnOutsider: code for PreCentral themes is in preware/build.git Oct 16 21:42:55 updating app catalog apps (like reversi) by homebrew Oct 16 21:43:21 i can update your paid app with crap if I get it in the feed Oct 16 21:43:21 egaudet_work_: so homebrew authors can release better versions that use services or undoc apis Oct 16 21:43:25 I know, but wanted to propose some changes, I'll ping ya when you get bac Oct 16 21:44:01 egaudet_work_: that's an interesting point. we'll need to think about that one. Oct 16 21:44:04 but now I must go Oct 16 21:44:05 and it still allows app catalog to uninstall advanced homebrew without running prerm while removing the prerm Oct 16 21:44:07 * rwhitby bbl Oct 16 21:44:10 k Oct 16 21:47:15 so, on a completely different tangent - anyone have any idea why the German Pre doesn't seem to bother with it's own carrier database? Oct 16 21:47:33 aye? Oct 16 21:47:54 There are settings for 240 international carriers in CarrierNetworkSettings.db3 Oct 16 21:48:02 all correct, so far as I can see. Oct 16 21:48:17 But unlocked German buyers report that the Pre doesn't load up the correct APN, MMS details etc Oct 16 21:48:29 Can make calls and send/receive SMS but that's about it. Oct 16 21:49:39 Anyone know where webOS sets that info? Oct 16 21:49:55 maybe this will jog your memory Oct 16 21:49:59 PLZ HELP!!!!!1111 Oct 16 21:50:53 * oil_work has no clue about such things Oct 16 21:53:30 lol Oct 16 21:53:32 http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/209887-anyone-have-email-would-get-me-top-palm.html Oct 16 21:54:29 lmao Oct 16 21:54:43 Palm seems to use a pretty standard firstname.lastname email system Oct 16 21:54:57 he should just try jon.rubinstein@palm.com Oct 16 21:55:20 * freakout thinks 'hmmmm, actually that's not a bad idea' Oct 16 21:55:32 * freakout composes hard-hitting no-holds-barred interview Oct 16 21:55:46 ....only to never receive a reply, ever. Oct 16 21:55:54 lol Oct 16 21:57:44 wmp.dll? i mean, really? Oct 16 21:57:47 okay, noob question. Can I grep the entire Doctor for a particular string? Oct 16 21:58:04 grep -v -i particular_thing directory/ Oct 16 21:58:04 i dont see why not Oct 16 21:58:08 grep -v -i particular_thing directory/* Oct 16 21:58:13 wait Oct 16 21:58:13 duh Oct 16 21:58:17 grep -r -i particular_thing directory/* Oct 16 21:58:18 that one Oct 16 21:58:22 heh Oct 16 21:58:25 ty both Oct 16 21:58:37 -v is exclude particular_thing Oct 16 21:58:42 -r is recurse directories Oct 16 21:58:50 * freakout is reading man now Oct 16 21:59:01 * freakout probably should have done that to start with, but was feeling chatty Oct 16 21:59:08 * freakout knows how rwhitby loves clutter in the logs Oct 16 22:08:16 some of the threads on precentral are just so funny Oct 16 22:08:27 lik3 Oct 16 22:08:29 like* Oct 16 22:08:42 a "patch request" to enable visual voicemail... Oct 16 22:09:06 well, it would be.... but it has to interact with Sprint's VV api. Oct 16 22:09:28 which they aren't actually announcing until the ADC conference. Oct 16 22:09:49 lol, but as a patch? Oct 16 22:11:31 it would require a patch, and a LOT of new code. :-) Oct 16 22:11:38 lol Oct 16 22:12:03 hehehehe he's thinking of just patcing the call list. He just doesn't know. Oct 16 22:12:14 yeah Oct 16 22:12:35 I mean, the phone display shows HOW MANY voicemails you have. Oct 16 22:12:47 and the missed call list shows WHO the calls are from. Oct 16 22:12:48 just, uh, patch it to show a list and all that Oct 16 22:12:53 lol Oct 16 22:12:57 How much work would it be to hook those together? Oct 16 22:13:29 idk, ive never looked at hte phone apps code Oct 16 22:13:42 i just thought it was funny Oct 16 22:13:48 oil_work the point is ALL the phone knows is how many Oct 16 22:14:19 right, the patch is going to call up sprint, demand visual voicemail, then just uncomment the code already in the dialer Oct 16 22:14:23 it isnt as funny as the guy this morning who asked if all he had to do to take an app from his winmo phone to the pre was to rename it with an IPK extension Oct 16 22:14:25 lol Oct 16 22:14:47 dont forget hte thread link i posted earlier Oct 16 22:14:53 http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/209887-anyone-have-email-would-get-me-top-palm.html Oct 16 22:15:39 that is funny. Oct 16 22:15:50 haha Oct 16 22:16:10 it's amazing how fast the German GSM pre hackers are moving on the machine. Oct 16 22:16:14 Astonishing to watch Oct 16 22:16:53 what kind of cool stuff have they done sofar? Oct 16 22:19:26 basically, they've already figured out how to talk to the modem and are vastly far along in decoding the packet communication between the cpu and the modem. Oct 16 22:19:44 nice Oct 16 22:20:42 woah, bunch of new apps in the catalog Oct 16 22:21:11 well crap Oct 16 22:21:22 reversi and simple big book still showing as "being reviewed" Oct 16 22:21:23 :-/ Oct 16 22:21:26 crap crap crap Oct 16 22:21:38 those yours? Oct 16 22:21:49 21, all for pay Oct 16 22:22:47 Rick_work: so does my dotgame update and blocked Oct 16 22:23:44 Rick_work - is that on a wiki somewhere? Oct 16 22:23:55 Rick_work: (about the German hackers) Oct 16 22:24:12 Rick_work: and have they worked out how to change the APN settings yet? Oct 16 22:24:21 oh, and one of them is the most expensive app yet! Oct 16 22:24:33 9.99 for "golf caddie" app Oct 16 22:24:55 oh wow Oct 16 22:25:09 its that homebrew one Oct 16 22:25:26 free: wiki.freesmartphone.org Oct 16 22:25:43 freakout: Oct 16 22:25:48 also on their ml Oct 16 22:25:56 the guy who made it was asking multiple questions how to do something daily Oct 16 22:26:02 and i answered quite a few of his questions Oct 16 22:26:12 i feel ripped off Oct 16 22:26:48 "DaveInFL" Oct 16 22:27:25 VV api? Oct 16 22:27:45 nah, there's google voice and imap Oct 16 22:28:00 somebody could do a patch if they wanted Oct 16 22:28:14 oil_work: lawsuit? xD Oct 16 22:28:23 tmzt: ty Oct 16 22:28:34 seriously Oct 16 22:29:37 don't trust cdma to tell you you missed a call Oct 16 22:29:39 ever Oct 16 22:30:20 * oil_work rarely "misses" calls Oct 16 22:30:25 i ignore a ton Oct 16 22:30:46 lol Oct 16 22:30:48 same Oct 16 22:32:20 frakking grep. "No such file or directory" my ass Oct 16 22:32:32 freakout: seriously though: http://forums.precentral.net/search.php?searchid=9829714 Oct 16 22:32:40 idk if that search link will work, its all threads created by him Oct 16 22:32:41 freakout webos-internals at google groups Oct 16 22:32:42 2 pages of threads Oct 16 22:32:51 90% asking for help doing something or another Oct 16 22:33:05 now he's got the most expensive app in the catalog Oct 16 22:33:08 oil: "Sorry - no matches" ? Oct 16 22:33:31 http://forums.precentral.net/members/daveinfl.html Oct 16 22:33:45 go to statistics, then find all threads started by Oct 16 22:34:01 im not saying im angry or hurt or anything Oct 16 22:34:03 i just think its funny Oct 16 22:34:20 lol. so do i now Oct 16 22:34:47 i think freakout should start an app, with no idea what to do, and create a bunch of threads asking how to make his app Oct 16 22:34:53 then sell it for boatloads of cash Oct 16 22:34:57 lmao Oct 16 22:35:07 * freakout has two ideas for an app, actually Oct 16 22:35:12 * oil_work steals them Oct 16 22:35:24 * freakout is pleased, because oil_work might actually make them xD Oct 16 22:35:34 lol Oct 16 22:35:48 pegIQ in new app cat at $0.99 is the DEMO JAVASCRIPT PORT APP FROM THE WIKI with cleaned up graphics. Oct 16 22:35:56 jesus. Oct 16 22:35:59 bwahahaha Oct 16 22:36:12 LOLOL Oct 16 22:36:17 like the blubber game or whatever it was called Oct 16 22:36:26 it was a canvas demo on the net Oct 16 22:36:28 with some background images Oct 16 22:36:36 There are some shockingly bad games in homebrew Oct 16 22:36:41 i remember looking at when i was playing with the canvas Oct 16 22:36:51 id love to release my towerdefense game Oct 16 22:37:02 sadly, ive never been able to balance it so it was fun :/ Oct 16 22:37:04 lots of work went into that Oct 16 22:37:06 what the hell? Brick from Ovlite is OK, even with JS graphics and garbage collection hangs, but they refused Max's brickbreak for the same reasons? Oct 16 22:37:17 oil_work, since when do games have to be balanced? Oct 16 22:37:17 still, i ask you Oct 16 22:37:23 WHERE'S SPACE TRADER? Oct 16 22:37:26 * freakout glares at fighting games Oct 16 22:37:28 cuz caps lock is fun Oct 16 22:37:33 freakout: so its somewhat fun Oct 16 22:37:38 all i can do is TOO easy, or TOO hard Oct 16 22:37:45 but Oct 16 22:37:47 maybe too hard is just right Oct 16 22:37:52 because i suck at it Oct 16 22:37:56 oil_work: exactly. got any pics? Oct 16 22:38:18 somewhere on precentral i posted some Oct 16 22:38:19 ok, one moderately clever app Oct 16 22:38:28 automatically change your wallpaper based on location. Oct 16 22:38:36 lol Oct 16 22:38:41 that is cool Oct 16 22:38:45 porn at home, bland colors at work Oct 16 22:38:50 hahaha Oct 16 22:38:55 really, that exists? Oct 16 22:38:55 naked women at strip club, windows 7 at work, flowers and lace at home. Oct 16 22:38:58 * Mousey looks Oct 16 22:39:02 lol Oct 16 22:39:15 chameleon $0.99 in app catalog today Oct 16 22:39:35 * oil_work just makes his own Oct 16 22:40:03 $0.99 "Phone home" -- tap app icon, dial your favorite number One tap dialer. Oct 16 22:40:04 My two app ideas were both just utilities that probably couldn't be released in the app cat yet anyways Oct 16 22:40:12 Jeezus. Oct 16 22:40:22 (1) Traffic counter - i figured you could just make something that reads the result from ifconfig Oct 16 22:40:39 ok. "Race to the bottom" $0.99 crap land here we are. Oct 16 22:40:43 jeezus Oct 16 22:40:45 (2) Carrier settings for MMS, APN etc that adds new entries to CarrierNetworkSettings.db3 Oct 16 22:40:46 freakout: http://forums.precentral.net/1799242-post148.html Oct 16 22:41:33 oil_work: that's nice. Release already, you damn perfectionist :p Oct 16 22:41:40 or at least send me an ipk i can play with myself Oct 16 22:41:42 its not fun Oct 16 22:42:01 its functionally great Oct 16 22:42:08 app idea (2) was rwhitby's, actually Oct 16 22:42:29 but now that i've seen that webOS seems to ignore the DB no matter what SIM you have in I don't see the point Oct 16 22:42:33 i think i sent the ipk to some people before Oct 16 22:42:41 whats your email, if i find it ill forward it to you Oct 16 22:42:44 is it not possible to get novacom drivers working on vista 64? Oct 16 22:43:07 it is possible Oct 16 22:43:18 and the most recent SDK should just do it automagically Oct 16 22:43:33 I just installed the most recent sdk, all I see are 32 bit drivers Oct 16 22:43:38 yeah, i found it, anyone else wanna test it? Oct 16 22:43:39 xD Oct 16 22:44:02 holob did the novacom service not install and run? Oct 16 22:44:04 palm\SDK\bin\novacom only has a directory "x86" and when I manually point the driver install to the \bin\novacom directory it barfs Oct 16 22:44:28 holob, it should have ALREADY installed it Oct 16 22:44:37 or the SDK install would have rolled back. Oct 16 22:44:41 I am not sure.. but it prompts for drivers when I plug the phone in... Oct 16 22:44:54 you should just be able to ignore that. Oct 16 22:44:55 I will reinstall the sdk Oct 16 22:45:03 freakout: i sent it Oct 16 22:45:08 well the novacom -t open tty:// says no device found Oct 16 22:45:13 holob wait Oct 16 22:45:14 holob: I got it working on my x64 Win7, so its definitely possible - can't remmeber how I got it working though :/ Oct 16 22:45:23 make sure novacomd is running? Oct 16 22:45:28 exactly Oct 16 22:45:33 go to control panel services Oct 16 22:45:45 administrative tools servies Oct 16 22:45:52 and make sure novacom is running Oct 16 22:45:55 if it is, you're done Oct 16 22:46:00 oil: got it Oct 16 22:46:16 lol Oct 16 22:46:19 or you can test by trying to install something to the phone Oct 16 22:46:22 going home now Oct 16 22:46:33 * oil_work wishes he was going home now Oct 16 22:47:35 home time is my favourite time Oct 16 22:48:04 thanks I'm reinstalling we'll see how that goes Oct 16 22:48:06 home time is my second Oct 16 22:48:11 meanwhile, izidor2 is testing MMS for me with a Czech SIM. Oct 16 22:48:11 sleep time is #1 Oct 16 22:48:17 * freakout crosses fingers Oct 16 22:49:04 yes, sleep is excellent Oct 16 22:49:09 i finally had a decent one last night Oct 16 22:49:29 freaking 8am shift this week. means i have to be up at 6. ugh. Oct 16 22:49:33 * freakout is not looking forward to boot camp Oct 16 22:53:19 lol Oct 16 22:55:15 http://forums.precentral.net/general-webos-chat/209900-preware-package-manager-service-help.html Oct 16 22:55:33 was the error message he retyped into his first post not clear enough as to what he should do? Oct 16 22:57:31 lmao Oct 16 22:58:12 so what do you think of the tower defense game? Oct 16 22:58:17 its not any fun is it Oct 16 22:58:51 * freakout hasn't installed yet, lol Oct 16 22:59:12 well wtf Oct 16 22:59:19 * freakout fires up emu now Oct 16 22:59:25 lol Oct 16 22:59:37 im not trying to rush you Oct 16 22:59:40 it really is garbage Oct 16 23:00:37 to quote Russell T. Davies, (former) head writer on the new Doctor Who Oct 16 23:00:59 "99% of the time you are writing, a little voice in your head is saying "This is crap, this is shit, no one will like this" Oct 16 23:01:13 paraphrase, mind you Oct 16 23:01:22 i hope the new guy doesn't suck Oct 16 23:01:27 * oil_work is a doctor who fan Oct 16 23:01:48 oil_work: oho he won't suck. He's the same guy who wrote the (IMO) best eps of the new who Oct 16 23:02:00 "Blink" "Girl in the Fireplace" "Silence in the Library" "The Empty Child" Oct 16 23:02:03 all his work Oct 16 23:02:15 oh Oct 16 23:02:22 so, he'll be good Oct 16 23:02:23 lol Oct 16 23:02:41 hang on, you mean the actor or the new head writer? lol Oct 16 23:03:00 both? Oct 16 23:03:08 lol Oct 16 23:03:29 oil_work: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9mDt68fuuY -- new actor in action, although it's hard to tell. The new girl is hawt though Oct 16 23:03:40 no audio at work Oct 16 23:04:14 * oil_work /msgs it to oil Oct 16 23:04:51 oil_work: here's another one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICjrCRq0oZM Oct 16 23:05:33 anyone catch the au futbal game the other night? crazy winning goal Oct 16 23:06:00 * oil_work isn't in to soccer Oct 16 23:06:08 or really any sport for that matter Oct 16 23:06:12 zsoc: soccer or rugby? Oct 16 23:06:29 * freakout jumps on the bandwagon for rugby come finals time Oct 16 23:06:37 but apart from that it can bugger off Oct 16 23:06:54 lol soccer Oct 16 23:07:16 PuffTheMagic, ping Oct 16 23:12:52 Czech SIM cards appear to work in German Pre :) Oct 16 23:12:59 with thanks to izidor2 Oct 16 23:24:29 oil_work: OMFG Oct 16 23:24:38 oil_work: tower defense is bitch hard Oct 16 23:24:48 are you a sadist or something? Oct 16 23:25:07 *puts on pumps and makeup and waits for egaudet* Oct 16 23:25:17 and what's this I hear? someone is making a tower defense for the pre? Oct 16 23:25:29 hi Oct 16 23:25:31 I considered porting one of my flash ones but didnt fancy redoing it in JS Oct 16 23:25:44 id definitely pay for a good TD game Oct 16 23:26:29 mmm.. td game Oct 16 23:26:34 its not any fun though :/ Oct 16 23:26:49 or a lemonade/zoo/amusment park sim Oct 16 23:27:10 got a preview of it oil? Oct 16 23:27:34 give me your email, ill send you an ipk Oct 16 23:28:27 thanks man Oct 16 23:28:46 so emoney Oct 16 23:28:49 bout them patches Oct 16 23:28:56 so Oct 16 23:29:04 * oil_work better not be seeing "TOWER DEFENSE BY ANOUTSIDER DOWNLOAD HERE" or anything xD Oct 16 23:29:09 I love ridiculously hard and finetuned games Oct 16 23:29:20 its not very finetuned Oct 16 23:29:25 its been tuned badly a lot though Oct 16 23:29:30 * zsoc fine tunes it Oct 16 23:29:38 * freakout releases TOWER DEFENSE BY FREAKOUT Oct 16 23:29:39 i dont have nearly enough enemies Oct 16 23:30:02 and my programmer art isn't the best Oct 16 23:30:22 but hey, its mostly functional Oct 16 23:31:35 like the reason i went with space themed is because triangles make pretty good enemies Oct 16 23:31:39 and lazers are easy to draw Oct 16 23:31:42 lol Oct 16 23:32:03 * oil_work is going home, brb Oct 16 23:32:05 oil_work, reminds me of Asteroids - in a good way Oct 16 23:32:09 lol Oct 16 23:32:15 ha, intalling now Oct 16 23:33:44 * Mousey updates feeds Oct 16 23:35:38 yeah this is pretty hard Oct 16 23:35:44 lil triangles just mocking my lasers Oct 16 23:35:48 pew pew peeeew Oct 16 23:36:07 AnOutsider, yep. Oct 16 23:36:36 * Mousey doesn't see it in preware Oct 16 23:36:39 * Mousey baws Oct 16 23:36:41 BAWWWWWWW Oct 16 23:37:00 Mousey, you'll need to do some special... favours... for oil to get it. Oct 16 23:37:12 Mousey: all I'm sayin' is, you'll need a webcam and some ping-pong balls. Oct 16 23:37:17 oh Oct 16 23:37:22 * Mousey only has pinballs Oct 16 23:37:22 hahaha Oct 16 23:40:52 anyone heard anything on pockets lately? Oct 16 23:41:03 whats pockets, where i stick my pre when it's off? Oct 16 23:41:23 Mousey, tdd framework for webos apps. Oct 16 23:41:35 oh Oct 16 23:42:19 like goldjs or something Oct 16 23:42:22 * Mousey has no clue Oct 16 23:42:32 tdd? Oct 16 23:43:34 infobot: tdd is test driven design Oct 16 23:43:35 ...but tdd is already something else... Oct 16 23:43:37 oh Oct 16 23:43:41 infobot: tdd? Oct 16 23:43:42 [tdd] A telecommunications device for the deaf: an electronic device for text communication via a telephone line. Other names for TDD include TTY (telephone typewriter or teletypewriter, although TTY is also a term used for teletypes in general), See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telecommunications_devices_for_the_deaf Oct 16 23:43:51 infobot: tdd is also test driven design Oct 16 23:43:52 okay, Mousey Oct 16 23:44:29 infobot: this strange rash on my thigh? Oct 16 23:44:40 ha Oct 16 23:45:01 damn. Oct 16 23:45:09 infobot does not know all Oct 16 23:45:09 so has anyone been running that lower-swap-threshhold patch and been seeing a noticable difference? Oct 16 23:45:58 infobot forget tdd Oct 16 23:45:59 acydlord: i forgot tdd Oct 16 23:46:08 inforbot tdd? Oct 16 23:46:16 infobot tdd? Oct 16 23:46:23 hah Oct 16 23:46:49 infobot: tdd? Oct 16 23:47:02 infobot: web os? Oct 16 23:47:11 infobot: IRC? Oct 16 23:47:13 * infobot forces os to muster up a db backed, web fronted application for keeping track of lawns mowed Oct 16 23:47:14 Welcome to IRC, where the men are men, the women are men and the little girls are FBI agents. Oct 16 23:47:21 infobot tdd is Test Driven Design Oct 16 23:47:22 acydlord: okay Oct 16 23:47:29 infobot tdd? Oct 16 23:47:31 rumour has it, tdd is Test Driven Design Oct 16 23:47:50 heh Oct 16 23:47:51 infobot: tdd is also test driven development -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Test-driven_development Oct 16 23:47:52 Mousey: okay Oct 16 23:48:15 that said, im gonna go play some uncharted2 Oct 16 23:48:17 lates Oct 16 23:48:33 infobot: uncharted2? Oct 16 23:48:56 infobot google uncharted2 Oct 16 23:49:02 fail Oct 16 23:49:18 infobot: tdd? Oct 16 23:49:19 i heard tdd is Test Driven Design, or test driven development -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Test-driven_development Oct 16 23:51:36 infobot: Tim Carroll? Oct 16 23:51:37 [tim carroll] an extraordinarily handsome writer for Palm Infocenter, the premiere Palm news site. He also has a lovely, masculine smell about him, with a hint of pine needles. He goes by the online alias "freakout". Oct 16 23:51:52 wow. no homo Oct 16 23:51:58 lol Oct 16 23:52:08 ~botsnack Oct 16 23:52:08 aw, gee, freakout Oct 16 23:52:15 infobot: Mousey? Oct 16 23:52:16 hmm... mousey is a fanboi Oct 16 23:52:20 nice Oct 16 23:52:21 lol Oct 16 23:58:11 Hmm, fairly sure I just did a nice brick job while attemping pulseaudio streaming. >> Oct 16 23:58:25 so no one tried the swap threshhold patch from the precentral forums? Oct 16 23:58:45 what should i install if i just want the ssh -client-? Oct 16 23:59:47 nm Oct 17 00:00:11 wooow, package deps ftw Oct 17 00:00:58 lol Oct 17 00:01:35 hmm, if this bootup doesn't finish within the next 3 mins i'm going to consider this thing borked Oct 17 00:01:49 can you novaterm to it? Oct 17 00:01:58 not sure yet Oct 17 00:02:01 that'll be next step Oct 17 00:02:09 and if not, incoming doctor Oct 17 00:02:10 lol Oct 17 00:02:17 infobot: zsoc? Oct 17 00:02:26 * Mousey imagines doctor being yelled in TF2 Oct 17 00:02:29 * zsoc pouts Oct 17 00:02:50 I have no luck with pulseaudio on the desktop i'm not surprised if I bricked my phone for trying to use it as well Oct 17 00:02:54 punzada, i doubt it's bricked :) Oct 17 00:03:09 I just think low-latency audio streaming from phone to pc and vice versa could have nice application Oct 17 00:03:18 so i've been trying to figure out how to correctly do it Oct 17 00:03:45 how do i keep sshd from running on boot? Oct 17 00:04:37 remove the event.d file Oct 17 00:04:47 danke Oct 17 00:05:11 punzada, yes that is very reasonable, and possible. actually i think i had it working for a minute Oct 17 00:05:32 PuffTheMagic, do you know anything about passing cached values to econf? Oct 17 00:06:11 punzada: great way to redirect phonecalls? Oct 17 00:07:34 maybe Oct 17 00:07:38 and wow Oct 17 00:07:41 i can't even novaterm Oct 17 00:07:47 lol Oct 17 00:07:53 * Mousey season's ssh startup script to tasste Oct 17 00:09:20 is the doctor image updated for 1.2.1? Oct 17 00:10:21 apparently it is Oct 17 00:10:22 nice nice Oct 17 00:17:47 PuffTheMagic, ping Oct 17 00:18:29 oil: regarding the offline mode not running postinst message that lots of people mistake as an error, do you think we should change it to green in the service or the app - it comes out stderr, but not everything in stderr is an error. Perhaps we can have a regexp whitelist for some phrases in stderr which prints green instead of red Oct 17 00:19:06 rwhitby, people perceive green as things that are ok? :P Oct 17 00:19:45 zsoc: yep, we currently print stdout as green and stderr as red, and people follow the colours to mean OK and BAD Oct 17 00:20:05 interesting Oct 17 00:24:28 but... but... its in strerr! Oct 17 00:24:34 zsoc: ? Oct 17 00:25:22 PuffTheMagic, i'm looking to --sync only a part of the tree, is that possible? Oct 17 00:25:33 no Oct 17 00:25:37 awesome Oct 17 00:26:01 zsoc: #gentoo-embedded is a good resource for cross compiling issues and what not Oct 17 00:26:12 and when im not around #gentoo for general help Oct 17 00:26:16 when i mentioned that i was editing builds without an overlay, i got like 20 crazy looks Oct 17 00:26:22 although its mosly noobs with retarded questions and little help Oct 17 00:26:28 lolol Oct 17 00:26:37 PuffTheMagic, hey, you're the one that said ask you every question i had, lol. I'll refrain :) i think i'm pretty much ok at this point Oct 17 00:26:47 yeah you still can Oct 17 00:26:52 but if im not around Oct 17 00:26:57 im pointing you to other resources Oct 17 00:27:07 ty :> Oct 17 00:28:31 Mousey: send me your email and ill send you an ipk Oct 17 00:29:12 ty! Oct 17 00:36:46 well I just realized one drawback to my 2600, webos doctor wants to charge to a certain percentage first before continuing >> Oct 17 00:37:12 good thing i keep my original one charged Oct 17 00:37:12 lol Oct 17 00:38:20 oil: u still around? Oct 17 00:38:55 no Oct 17 00:39:02 :) Oct 17 00:40:52 oil: so regexp-based green painter for phrases in ipkg log ? Oct 17 00:41:23 i can do it for that one line in stderr, was there others we don't want to appear as an error? Oct 17 00:50:41 not that I know of, but bound to be some I've forgotten about. that one seems to be the most often mistaken as an error. Oct 17 00:50:51 PuffTheMagic? did you have a question or something? Oct 17 00:51:27 well i was gonna ask if you want to start whipping up some basic scenes for that network manager service real quick Oct 17 00:52:18 what all do they have? Oct 17 00:54:40 PuffTheMagic, the writer of crossdev-wrappers is helping me right now.. pretty cool guy Oct 17 00:56:31 yeah solar is a cool guy Oct 17 00:56:47 you can get lots of help in the #gentoo-* channels Oct 17 00:56:57 the herd related channels Oct 17 00:57:02 the main channel is pretty useless Oct 17 00:57:28 #gentoo-dev-help is good for writing ebuilds and "dev" related stuff for non official devs Oct 17 00:57:32 seems to be true D: Oct 17 00:57:35 #gentoo-dev is just for devs basically Oct 17 00:58:24 whats really good on the pre today? Oct 17 00:59:07 entity-: let's see, A flood of 99 cent crapware apps..... Oct 17 00:59:29 does Rick sound bitter? Yes. Why Yes he does. Oct 17 00:59:53 dont forget the most expensive app yet Oct 17 01:00:16 oh yea, the one by the incompetant developer who wrote it with community assistance Oct 17 01:00:21 lol Oct 17 01:00:46 and the person who took the Webos Internals demo app for porting older javascript and tweaked the graphics and posted IT for 99 cents Oct 17 01:00:56 HAHAHA Oct 17 01:01:04 oil: that "what all do they have" question... was that to me? Oct 17 01:01:09 yeah Oct 17 01:01:18 the scenes? Oct 17 01:01:22 yeah Oct 17 01:01:31 i have no idea what all you need on them Oct 17 01:02:31 oil: the main scene should be a standard like "you know how to do those ;)" with a "interfaces" option and a "routes" options and a "settings/options" option Oct 17 01:02:42 of course the header with rotating slogans;0 Oct 17 01:03:51 the interfaces menu will then open a scene that lists all the interfaces on the system... clicking ont hem shows a scene that displays info about that interface and options to configure shit Oct 17 01:04:06 the routes options goes to a scene that displays all the routes Oct 17 01:04:25 options/settings will have the toggles for things like "maintain ip_forward" Oct 17 01:04:28 etc. Oct 17 01:04:37 rick_home: what was the license on that demo app? Oct 17 01:04:48 if it was GPL, you can open source his app if he has copied it Oct 17 01:05:35 rwhitby: I intend to check. Oct 17 01:05:40 But I have a better solution Oct 17 01:05:48 JenP and I are going to do a BETTER version. :-) Oct 17 01:06:11 since his is substantially lame and Jen wanted a new project to work on anyway, and her boyfriend is a professional graphics guy Oct 17 01:06:13 :-) Oct 17 01:08:12 rick_home: then sell for $0.98 Oct 17 01:08:22 if they will let us. Oct 17 01:08:26 :-) Oct 17 01:08:38 rick_home: if they don't threaten to send a copyright take-down notice Oct 17 01:08:50 I'd imagine Palm would comply fairly promptly Oct 17 01:08:54 s/don't/don't, / Oct 17 01:08:55 rwhitby meant: rick_home: if they don't, threaten to send a copyright take-down notice Oct 17 01:09:09 rwhitby: I have every intention. Oct 17 01:09:39 but since I -have- this working already, all it needs is clean up .... :-) Oct 17 01:10:14 oil: need more details? Oct 17 01:10:28 * rwhitby continues inching towards version-specific patch feeds Oct 17 01:10:42 PuffTheMagic: eventually Oct 17 01:10:58 i havent implemted any methods in the service yet Oct 17 01:11:06 but the first one will be "to maintain ip_forward Oct 17 01:12:05 since the palm netowkr thing keeps setting it to 0, i am using inotify to monitor the file and immediately set ti back to 1 once a mofification is detected Oct 17 01:12:11 so its not a simple toggle Oct 17 01:12:47 the toggle starts a thread that keeps setting it to 1 basically, there is another method to get the state Oct 17 01:12:59 so maybe u can add a led and a toggle for that Oct 17 01:13:09 the toggle if "on" means maintain ip_forward Oct 17 01:13:21 and the led shows whether ip_forwad is 0 or 1 Oct 17 01:13:43 the led in the home button? Oct 17 01:14:03 home button? Oct 17 01:14:07 idk Oct 17 01:14:11 what led are you talking about Oct 17 01:16:07 im picturing either the a led like icon right before the toggle switch, or the toggle button iteself also being an led Oct 17 01:19:18 ok Oct 17 01:21:31 oil: http://omploader.org/vMms1OA Oct 17 01:21:33 like that Oct 17 01:21:35 ahahaha Oct 17 01:21:48 no, yea, i understood what you meant Oct 17 01:21:54 lol Oct 17 01:21:57 but, awesome art Oct 17 01:22:00 i know thanks Oct 17 01:22:05 i don't think i can do it in the widget Oct 17 01:22:05 3 second gimp drawing Oct 17 01:22:10 its just, a widget Oct 17 01:22:16 you would habve to tweak the default palm one Oct 17 01:22:17 id have to look if it can be styled like that or what Oct 17 01:22:21 yeah Oct 17 01:22:22 probabaly work work that its worth Oct 17 01:22:25 but to the left of it is easy Oct 17 01:22:29 right Oct 17 01:22:44 so the led and the state of the toggle arent tied togetther Oct 17 01:23:00 i mean, the app you used to draw it didn't have a line tool? Oct 17 01:23:06 it does Oct 17 01:23:08 lol Oct 17 01:23:12 i didnt feel like using it Oct 17 01:23:17 lol Oct 17 01:23:20 haha Oct 17 01:23:36 that is what 400ml of sambuca will do to you Oct 17 01:23:59 just be luck i used the font tool for the text Oct 17 01:24:02 lucky Oct 17 01:24:26 ahaha Oct 17 01:24:27 seriously Oct 17 01:24:40 * oil saves url in notes as reference Oct 17 01:27:53 lol Oct 17 01:30:57 oil: make sure you replicate the shapes correctly ... Oct 17 01:32:26 lol Oct 17 01:34:58 now 3 people have bashed my art skillz Oct 17 01:36:19 you being one of them? Oct 17 01:36:57 to be fair.... Oct 17 01:37:34 PuffTheMagic, you're not known for your art :) nothing to be ashamed of :> Oct 17 01:38:08 Templiarian first and now oil and rwhitby in one shot ;) Oct 17 01:38:14 im not worried Oct 17 01:38:18 they are 3 second efforts Oct 17 01:38:19 freakout: hi, got your Pre yet? Oct 17 01:38:26 and not a sign of my sillzors Oct 17 01:38:41 greg_roll: in a week or two I hope Oct 17 01:39:02 freakout: where are you getting it from? Oct 17 01:39:05 greg_roll: waiting for frakkin' PayPal to clear Oct 17 01:40:15 freakout: did you ebay it? Oct 17 01:40:24 greg_roll: One of Ryan's contacts in .de is getting it for me Oct 17 01:40:40 he runs a palm fansite, they met at CES when Pre was announced Oct 17 01:41:25 freakout: nice! i'm still toying up what to do. If I get one and it breaks then its gone for good, but if an importer sells them maybe ill get some warrentee Oct 17 01:41:36 * rwhitby is going to wait for freakout to pathfind, or for Palm to send me a freebie, before laying down the cash Oct 17 01:41:48 * freakout thinks rwhitby is clever ;) Oct 17 01:43:58 greg_roll: Mine jsut needs to tide me over till the Oz Pre gets here Oct 17 01:44:28 freakout: if......... Oct 17 01:44:37 you've heard rumors of vodafone? Oct 17 01:44:49 i have Oct 17 01:44:51 vodafone rumours? Oct 17 01:45:02 i wrote to their PR to ask about it Oct 17 01:45:02 * rwhitby is on vodafone Oct 17 01:45:15 no answer yet. I'm going to phone on monday Oct 17 01:46:02 nice! I hope its not locked because im on 3 Oct 17 01:49:18 greg_roll: 3 is in the carrier database Oct 17 01:49:31 I spoke with a Czech dude on IRC earlier this morning Oct 17 01:49:55 He successfully uploaded an MMS, so it seems the auto network settings do work for some Oct 17 01:49:55 as long as its not locked im ok! Oct 17 01:50:29 plus I have code to add items to palmdatabase.db3 (thats how i get messaging stuff to work) so we can always add stuff to that DB too Oct 17 01:53:36 Any of you old school Palm OS people? Oct 17 01:56:12 greg_roll: nice! Oct 17 01:56:50 so your rumour is for novemmber release? Oct 17 01:56:58 greg_roll: November 30 Oct 17 01:57:13 sooo far away lol Oct 17 01:57:26 well if its not locked ill wait, otherwise ill have to get a german one Oct 17 02:00:51 yep Oct 17 02:01:01 I don't put much stock in the rumour Oct 17 02:01:05 I guess no one is a PalmOS person. :( Oct 17 02:01:07 greg_roll, it came from Twitter. lol Oct 17 02:01:08 Dang my wife and her centro Oct 17 02:01:11 dBsooner: i love PalmOS Oct 17 02:01:20 dBsooner: got a q? Oct 17 02:01:25 Yeah! Oct 17 02:01:34 I need a program to fix her Contacts Oct 17 02:01:39 Last, First sucks! Oct 17 02:01:39 freakout: twitter lol. hope its right!! Oct 17 02:01:47 She wants First Last. Oct 17 02:01:47 what's up with 'em? Oct 17 02:02:02 She wants better sorting. Oct 17 02:02:18 I THINK i found a program, but they want 19.95 for it. Oct 17 02:02:23 dBsooner: be aware, structural changes in preware/build/autopatch are underway to support concurrent webos versions Oct 17 02:04:12 rwhitby: why you gotta do that to me Oct 17 02:04:20 rwhitby: and I wasn't included? :D Oct 17 02:05:03 dBsooner: there was a free hack for older Treos. I'm googling but I can't find the damn thing anymore Oct 17 02:05:04 rwhitby: Sorry i ahve been gone the past 2 days. My sister is going into labor and I had to watch my nephew (9 months old) while she goes back and forth to the hospital. Oct 17 02:05:56 rwhitby: Then my youngest daughter has Flu Like Symptoms last night all night and this morning. Had to take her to the urgent care. She's good though. :D Oct 17 02:06:16 dBsooner: real life comes first Oct 17 02:06:16 freakout: Man I wish you could find it. Oct 17 02:06:29 dBsooner: still looking ;) Oct 17 02:06:31 rwhitby: But I am here now. needing to get some updates done. Oct 17 02:06:45 rwhitby: But I guess I can wait till you get the restructuring taken care of. Oct 17 02:06:55 rwhitby: I also have another question if I can pm you? Oct 17 02:07:02 greg_roll: if you want a German Pre, I may be able to ask my contact to get 2 of 'em. Oct 17 02:07:06 newbie patcher question: I assume that I need to reboot for a patch to take effect? Oct 17 02:07:13 elight: no Oct 17 02:07:22 elight: install Luna Manager Oct 17 02:07:32 elight: Then do "Restart Luna" from inside Luna manager. Oct 17 02:07:52 freakout: what cost did you manage? i know rwhitby was just over $800 (correct me if I remembered wrong) Oct 17 02:08:15 dBsooner: Guess that's not such a newbie question. Thanks! Oct 17 02:08:33 elight: Nah.. Newbie question, not so much on the answer. ;) Oct 17 02:08:40 heh Oct 17 02:08:49 greg_roll: Don't know shipping yet, but I'm paying the standard 481 EUR (so $782 AUD) Oct 17 02:08:52 Hey, I just code Mojo (so far). I haven't gone peeking at internals yet. Oct 17 02:09:03 Hell, I only just got my phone today. Been playing with the simulator for a few days. Oct 17 02:09:12 greg_roll: I'm guessing shipping will put it over $800. I may pay more so it gets here faster :p Oct 17 02:09:30 what is $800 ? unlocked gsm ? Oct 17 02:09:36 freakout: nice! i might just hold out a little longer..... Oct 17 02:09:36 bpadalino: yup. German. Oct 17 02:09:43 dBsooner: Ah, very nice. Battery percentage on status bar now working. :D Oct 17 02:09:46 make sure it all works too lol Oct 17 02:09:50 expensive Oct 17 02:09:55 greg_roll: yep, i'll be the guinea pig Oct 17 02:10:04 elight: good patch. I also like the date. and 4x4 ver3. Oct 17 02:10:16 dBsooner: Yes, I want the 4x4. Oct 17 02:10:20 freakout: and well gladly let you be that ;) Oct 17 02:10:20 bpadalino: yep. But we all have our vices. Mine is Palms. ;) Oct 17 02:10:21 3x3 is too much whitespace Oct 17 02:10:28 heh Oct 17 02:10:47 elight: I am going to push an update for 4x4 ver3 once rwhitby lets me in on what's going on with our build scripts. Oct 17 02:11:05 dBsooner: can't find it :( I'll keep looking though Oct 17 02:11:14 freakout: :*( Oct 17 02:13:03 dBsooner: feel free to keep working - just git pull regularly Oct 17 02:13:24 rwhitby: is there anything I need to pay attention to? like changes to Makefile's, etc? Oct 17 02:13:35 rwhitby: Who is working on this? You and egaudet? Oct 17 02:13:52 dBsooner: VERSION has been split to WEBOS_VERSION and IPKG_VERSION Oct 17 02:14:18 * oil thought dBsooner was the "patch meister" Oct 17 02:15:24 oil: yep, who uses the patch build system, which is under renovations to support multiple concurrent webos versions Oct 17 02:15:40 yeah, i gotta add that check to preware Oct 17 02:15:49 which means i have to stop working on the irc client xD Oct 17 02:16:10 oil, don't you dare ;) Oct 17 02:16:14 ha! Oct 17 02:16:39 oil: you may not have to do anything to the Preware app yet ... Oct 17 02:17:04 So what is the format of IPKG_VERSION? Oct 17 02:17:35 dBsooner: it's obvious - take a look, we've just split on the hyphen Oct 17 02:17:47 and the META_VERSION's will still be available? Oct 17 02:18:08 yes, no change to anything else Oct 17 02:19:32 ok Oct 17 02:19:37 it was a good idea Oct 17 02:20:15 any new coolo apps Oct 17 02:22:45 Where is pregame? His flashlight disappeared from the feed. Oct 17 02:23:20 nvm it's there typo. Oct 17 02:23:42 phail Oct 17 02:25:00 nvm it's gone, that's just installed. Oct 17 02:25:13 What happened to his app? Oct 17 02:26:06 you're using the service jason wrapped up? Oct 17 02:26:35 http://omploader.org/iMms1Zg+ Oct 17 02:26:37 gah Oct 17 02:26:38 no _ Oct 17 02:26:40 no +* Oct 17 02:26:48 its a gui i made for that service Oct 17 02:26:54 as i thought the toggle was too hard to hit Oct 17 02:27:54 * rwhitby back-ports the first patch for 1.1.3-0 Oct 17 02:28:06 which one? Oct 17 02:29:24 oh thank god. "Hide NFL App" and "Hide NASCAR App" Oct 17 02:29:32 lol Oct 17 02:29:38 That NASCAR app just screamed "desperate" on the part of Sprint and Palm... Oct 17 02:29:50 rwhitby: which one did you backport? Oct 17 02:29:58 oil: what is this app you just linked? Oct 17 02:30:13 a flashlight gui for pregames service wrapped by jason Oct 17 02:30:13 top bar phone radio toggle Oct 17 02:30:57 rwhitby: that doesn't work on 1.2.1? Oct 17 02:30:59 Oh no I was asking since there is a thread on precentral. I have it (I want him to add a toggle for stobe and normal though, but that's another subject). Oct 17 02:31:15 from my testing, its not fast enough for strobe Oct 17 02:31:20 my gui uses the whole screen as a button Oct 17 02:31:20 we should just write org.webosinternals.flashservice and be done with all these wrappers around orphaned services who's name is the same as the one with the security problem Oct 17 02:31:22 oil: idea for preware Oct 17 02:31:25 you can use two fingers and tap real fast Oct 17 02:31:31 it will take it a while to catch up Oct 17 02:31:45 oil: I can hit the button fast and it creates a strobe effect. Oct 17 02:31:55 oil: if you write an app, let me know and I'll write a new service to use which doesn't depend on that other stuff Oct 17 02:32:17 its just black screen that says ":tap for light" Oct 17 02:32:20 and when you do Oct 17 02:32:20 rwhitby: funky (WRT back-port) Oct 17 02:32:23 it says "tap to turn off" Oct 17 02:32:33 Packaged contents of all into /srv/preware/build/autopatch/top-bar-phone-radio-toggle/build/org.webosinternals.patches.top-bar-phone-radio-toggle_1.1.3-0_all.ipk Oct 17 02:32:50 i just thought pregames gui with the toggle to turn it on and off was too small a target to hit Oct 17 02:33:19 oil: can you make preware only display patches that are for the current webos version? Oct 17 02:33:30 dBsooner needs to stick around in the channel... Oct 17 02:33:34 you can grep that info from the webos statefile. Oct 17 02:33:34 dBsooner: there will be separate feeds Oct 17 02:33:39 oh Oct 17 02:33:40 LOL Oct 17 02:33:42 I need to read back. Oct 17 02:33:52 but, yes, preware will check that field if its in the metadata Oct 17 02:33:56 oil: Don't be mean. I already explained where I had been. Oct 17 02:33:59 since i assume both feeds will be in the package manager Oct 17 02:34:15 they can turn them off Oct 17 02:34:26 but preware still needs to not install something that isn't compatible Oct 17 02:34:42 oil: I'm thinking that an upstart script for package manager service will change the webos-specific feed to be the correct one Oct 17 02:35:04 i guess that works too Oct 17 02:35:13 i already wrote a function for preware to parse out the version# Oct 17 02:35:44 http://git.webos-internals.org/?p=applications/preware.git;a=blob_plain;f=app/models/utility.js;hb=HEAD Oct 17 02:35:47 at the bottom Oct 17 02:37:05 oil: I think both Preware and ipkgservice have to handle the webos version, for two layers of safety. don't show it, and don't install it. Oct 17 02:37:15 right Oct 17 02:37:37 (since ipkgservice could still install the wrong version if it was a dependency of something else that was available) Oct 17 02:38:18 right Oct 17 02:38:20 it won't even load it Oct 17 02:38:33 LOL! I get it! Many of the patches are just JS patches atop existing apps. Nice! I can do this. :D Oct 17 02:38:42 Well done. Oct 17 02:38:48 well, preware, its internal "list of packages" Oct 17 02:38:57 elight: almost ALL the patches are just JS patches. Oct 17 02:38:58 it just won't add packages to it that don't fit the version Oct 17 02:39:08 rick_home: oh that's just beautiful. Oct 17 02:39:20 lol Oct 17 02:39:29 god damn I am loving this phone. I feel like a kid in a toy store. Oct 17 02:39:34 lol Oct 17 02:39:35 we would just distribute FIXED FILES except it would violate palm IP Oct 17 02:39:50 oooh! Oct 17 02:39:51 I see. Oct 17 02:39:52 elight -- welcome to the candy store. We've been doing this since JUNE and it's still fun. Oct 17 02:39:57 note to those fixing up autopatch: it doesn't list the license in the metadata Oct 17 02:39:59 But patches are legit. That makes sense. Oct 17 02:40:21 we thought long and hard on that and decided that yes, patches are legit. Oct 17 02:40:34 rick_home: Yeah. Late to the game. Got fed up with iPhone (dev is too painful and too many restrictions) and Android? I'm so done with coding in pure Java. Oct 17 02:40:47 java rots minds. Oct 17 02:40:48 rick_home: Well, so far, Palm isn't objecting, right? Oct 17 02:40:53 rick_home: +1 Oct 17 02:40:56 palm is quietly supportive. Oct 17 02:41:06 as is sprint. Oct 17 02:41:15 I'm a Rubyist by way of Java. Prototype, sadly, makes a fair amount of sense. Although I dig jQuery. Oct 17 02:41:17 and like they said on lastweeks palmcast Oct 17 02:41:21 although that will become substantially less "quietly" in about 2 weeks. Oct 17 02:41:23 Sprint? Really? Oct 17 02:41:25 palm shold just take some of hte patches, wrap them in Oct 17 02:41:27 release 1.3 Oct 17 02:41:28 lol Oct 17 02:41:35 Well, as the scrappy underdogs, you're just giving them free features to tout. Oct 17 02:41:42 oil: they already did with 1.2 ;) Oct 17 02:41:51 i know Oct 17 02:41:53 they need to do moar Oct 17 02:42:00 elight yes. Without -- uh... yes, sprint is quietly supportive as well. Oct 17 02:42:08 hehe Oct 17 02:42:18 and come Oct 28 that will be -- substantally -- less quiet. Oct 17 02:42:21 Both Palm and Sprint have something to prove here. Makes sense. Oct 17 02:42:28 10/28? Oct 17 02:42:44 Seriously, Dion and Ben signing on to Palm is a lot of what converted me. Oct 17 02:42:47 check out the speakers list for the sprint ADC conference. Oct 17 02:43:15 * oil wants to read ricks complete script :) Oct 17 02:43:22 being -very- specific, check wednesday at 4 PM... :-) Oct 17 02:43:40 rick_home: link? I had the URL before... Oct 17 02:43:44 oil, I promised not to leak the powerpoint before the conference. Oct 17 02:43:49 ah Oct 17 02:43:53 dang. I just missed greg Oct 17 02:44:00 even if its after the conference, id still like to see it Oct 17 02:44:04 as i won't be there Oct 17 02:44:11 will it be videotaped? Oct 17 02:44:32 https://developer.sprint.com/site/global/community/events/2009devcon/2009sprintopendeveloperconference.jsp Oct 17 02:44:49 it will be recorded and posted on the sprint ADP web site. Oct 17 02:45:28 oh very nice Oct 17 02:45:29 nice Oct 17 02:45:32 then i don't feel bad missing it Oct 17 02:45:39 for $300, I was halfway tempted. Oct 17 02:45:50 especially considering the following: Oct 17 02:45:52 HTC and Sprint will be giving away 400 handsets at the HTC hands-on coding lab on October 26 Oct 17 02:46:02 yeah i saw that.... Oct 17 02:46:06 want to guess which room _I_ will be setting in Oct 17 02:46:12 lol Oct 17 02:46:15 oh, and those come with one month of free sprint service. Oct 17 02:46:23 The Oprah moment. ;-) Oct 17 02:46:26 They already had one lately though Oct 17 02:46:29 * oil brb, subway Oct 17 02:46:35 there's a rumor that there may be another as well. Oct 17 02:46:58 LOL Oct 17 02:47:06 punzada: ping Oct 17 02:47:11 Well I'm just a hobbyist on the Pre so far but 3 days into app hacking I'm loving it. Oct 17 02:47:38 Although the API is a little heavy on the ceremony. Mojo.Controller.getApplicationController.showBanner()? Really??? Oct 17 02:48:07 I already wrote a small script that just wraps that with notify(message) for plain text banners. Oct 17 02:48:10 Really. Oct 17 02:48:14 gah! there are wiki pages with ipkg-opt -o /var !!! Oct 17 02:48:34 o.O Oct 17 02:48:38 what should I change mine to? Oct 17 02:48:44 rick_home: umm... sorry, but where's the schedule for the conference? I don't see a ton of info on the page. Oct 17 02:48:47 That's totally my fault, stab me Oct 17 02:49:40 rwhitby: ping Oct 17 02:49:43 punzada: ipkg-opt installs optware stuff, which installs in /opt - you should not mix optware command line stuff installed with ipkg-opt (and no -o /var) and homebrew installed with ipkg -o /var Oct 17 02:50:03 ah Oct 17 02:50:04 I see Oct 17 02:50:32 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Linux_Tutorial_Irssi is the page which needs corrections Oct 17 02:50:56 elight: sorry Oct 17 02:50:58 https://developer.sprint.com/site/global/community/events/2009devcon/agenda/agenda2009adpconference.jsp Oct 17 02:51:09 yeah correcting it now Oct 17 02:51:33 k, fixed Oct 17 02:51:43 punzada: ipkg-opt installs into /opt, which could be mounted from anywhere, but is usually bind-mounted from /var/opt Oct 17 02:52:11 and it uses an ipkg database in /opt/lib/ipkg, which is completely separate from the one in /var/usr/lib/ipkg Oct 17 02:52:22 ah, I see. Oct 17 02:53:20 ooooh Oct 17 02:53:35 rick_home: so you and some others are talking about WebOS and FLOSS? Oct 17 02:54:10 I picked the wrong week to get a new client. Nuts. Can't go.... :-( Oct 17 02:54:25 elight: yep: and webos-internals, and Precentral and all that stuff and preware and feeds and Oct 17 02:54:32 very nice. Oct 17 02:55:12 And possibly missing out on a free Hero and free re. Aw, man... Oct 17 02:55:15 * elight facepalms Oct 17 02:55:53 I'm still waiting for Android to patch a Dalvik bug preventing JRuby/interpreted Clojure/Rhino/Jyton/et al from running. Oct 17 02:56:09 It won't be out until the next major release (sorry, off-topic) **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Oct 17 02:59:57 2009