**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Dec 27 02:59:56 2009 Dec 27 03:04:54 does anyone have a link to the webos doctor jar file? The link on the wiki doesnt work and I need to do the manual installation for x64 Dec 27 03:20:14 http://www.palm.com/us/support/downloads/pre/recoverytool/webos_java_sprint.html Dec 27 03:22:38 irritum thank you but that is only the .jnlp file I start the download but I have no idea where the actual jar is downloaded to Dec 27 03:22:42 I checked the same directory Dec 27 03:23:11 hmm... wherever your browser stores temp files? Dec 27 03:24:09 hmmm didnt think it would store in the browser since its a java application but I'll check thank you Dec 27 03:24:34 I had to open Dec 27 03:24:42 "Downloads" window in Firefox and use Dec 27 03:24:52 "Open containing folder" option Dec 27 03:25:04 to get to it Dec 27 03:26:51 nope mine doesnt seem to be downloading the jar to the same directory as the jnlp... I'm going to try searching Dec 27 03:33:49 found a working link Dec 27 03:39:58 busybox less is cr@p Dec 27 03:40:48 shy do I need to be root to do ipkg-opt info foo ? Dec 27 03:40:59 s/shy/why/ Dec 27 03:41:00 jacques3 meant: why do I need to be root to do ipkg-opt info foo ? Dec 27 03:47:57 how would I go about removing a patch entry in Preware? Like I have a patch that doesnt want to uninstall. Dec 27 03:54:01 Just where are the prerm's stored? Dec 27 03:57:10 I thought I had seen how to manually remove patches on the wiki, but now I can't find it. Dec 27 03:57:25 I found it Dec 27 03:58:08 where? Dec 27 03:58:44 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/IPKG_Service Dec 27 03:58:50 ipkg -o /var remove /var/usr/lib/ipkg/info/org.webosin ternals.patches.messaging-enter-key-for-new-line.prerm Dec 27 03:58:55 why isnt that working? Dec 27 04:01:13 space in the command ? Dec 27 04:01:34 what space? Dec 27 04:01:36 not supposed to put the .prerm in the remove line ? Dec 27 04:01:40 not sure Dec 27 04:03:29 i just used a sh command Dec 27 04:05:42 zsoc: thanks (was at a my aunt and uncles party thing). NoScript page is funny. Dec 27 06:26:45 re Dec 27 06:29:00 anything fancy happen while I was gone? Dec 27 06:56:29 re rwhitby Dec 27 06:58:08 rwhitby: what are your thoughts on the delegate licensing? Dec 27 07:35:58 jacques_pre: looks like a permissive BSD style Dec 27 07:36:11 but non-commercial only Dec 27 07:37:12 which licenses are allowed in optware? Dec 27 07:37:39 and they are not very clear Dec 27 07:37:39 good question Dec 27 07:38:13 it might be BSD style, but what is evaluation? Dec 27 07:38:32 evaluation for commercial use Dec 27 07:51:51 do we know anything about Palm's kernel patches? like what did they start with? 2.6.24-omap1 as a base? Dec 27 07:52:29 I'm diffing against that and it looks like they used something else. Dec 27 07:53:36 for example, many changes are only to remove the (or later version) from the GPLv2 license clause Dec 27 08:18:31 jacques_pre: PuffTheMagic has a kernel git repo on git.webos-internals.org Dec 27 08:19:51 yes, I have seen it. but is it just 2.6.24 with the Palm patchset applied? Dec 27 08:20:48 I am more interested in porting the palm-specific patches to newer kernels Dec 27 08:21:27 jacques_pre: there was some talk about it before in here - a search of irc logs is probably the best source of info Dec 27 08:22:16 jacques_pre: got the delegate optware host build done, now working out which binaries from that to copy into the target build to get it to work .. Dec 27 08:23:23 as a first step though I will build some modules which are missing from the kernel build Dec 27 08:24:13 it looks like Palm did not configure in any USB OTG nor host mode functionality Dec 27 08:24:15 jacques_pre: note that optware has a kernel-modules package for the Pre Dec 27 08:24:41 ooh, I had forgotten about that Dec 27 08:25:33 it's at version 1.01 at the moment - I'll update it for 1.3.1 Dec 27 08:29:38 do you recall any work toward USB host mode or OTG in the past? Dec 27 08:30:08 destinal was able to power up an external device, but I've not seen anyone get near enumeration Dec 27 08:30:52 personally, I'd rather leave that flimsy USB cover where it is :-) Dec 27 08:32:21 I really wand external storage Dec 27 08:33:49 has anyone done NFS over wifi performance tests? Dec 27 08:34:43 nope, but it should be fine Dec 27 08:35:13 getting close to having delegate cross compiled ... Dec 27 08:35:31 1.3.1 kernel source is still downloading Dec 27 08:54:12 linux 2.6.24 building for webo-1.3.1 Dec 27 09:34:53 delegate cross compile is being stubborn Dec 27 09:40:44 it's 3:40am here Dec 27 09:41:28 if it's still not working tomorrow I'll take a look if you want Dec 27 09:45:45 jacques_pre: I think I've got it licked Dec 27 10:11:22 got it to run on the Pre, but need to configure working directories Dec 27 10:11:43 jacques_pre: kernel-modules pushed to autobuilder for 1.3.1 Dec 27 11:22:21 * rwhitby just used delegate to get the Pre to log into a https server that requires ssl client certificates Dec 27 14:47:33 jacques_pre: ping Dec 27 14:56:27 hey guys in terms of raw processing, how does a pre compare to something like a psp? Dec 27 14:58:36 same hw Dec 27 14:58:51 psp is a 34xx i believe Dec 27 14:58:53 same hardware? Dec 27 14:58:56 maybe its a 35xx Dec 27 14:59:01 which is really the same hw too Dec 27 14:59:06 oh wow Dec 27 14:59:07 much semi faster Dec 27 14:59:13 what about the gpu? Dec 27 14:59:25 there is a break down somewhere Dec 27 14:59:27 but Dec 27 14:59:42 the 35xx are the public versions of 34xx Dec 27 15:00:06 like a joe blow could buy a 35xx out of a catalog, but not a 34xx Dec 27 15:00:21 but hw wise they are nearly identical Dec 27 15:00:23 oh and the 35xx is the Pre's processor? Dec 27 15:00:35 its a soc Dec 27 15:00:44 soc? Dec 27 15:00:50 system on a chip Dec 27 15:01:16 hmm ill have to look that up later on never heard that term Dec 27 15:01:35 its got cpu/gpu/dsp/usb/dvi/hdmi/sound all on 1 chip Dec 27 15:01:38 i beleieve Dec 27 15:01:51 wow..so video output is possible? Dec 27 15:01:58 if u take it apart Dec 27 15:02:06 yeah Dec 27 15:02:09 and solder on the connector Dec 27 15:02:45 that'd be a nice project one day...you could turn the Pre into a mini dvd player ha Dec 27 15:02:54 just buy a beagle board Dec 27 15:03:06 if u want to play like that Dec 27 15:04:04 I'll look into it Dec 27 15:04:33 But for now I'll just hang around and suck up the knowledge ;) Dec 27 15:05:24 So in theory, the Pre could run psp games if someone made some sort of emulator? Dec 27 15:10:32 idk about that Dec 27 15:11:35 psp is probably 35xx Dec 27 15:11:41 so just a tad faster Dec 27 15:11:49 and its much bigger Dec 27 15:11:56 so it can hold a better battery Dec 27 15:12:02 pre would probably die in 10 min Dec 27 17:10:58 i am not seeing wirc/wircd under preware this right? Dec 27 17:15:32 * Templarian goes and checks Dec 27 17:17:25 dreadchicken: nope they are there. Go to list everything and just type out "wirc" Dec 27 17:20:47 yeah, i don't see it. checked the feeds, updated the feeds, no dice. Dec 27 17:23:51 300 apps (themes turned off), is that what you see? "Santa Button (Beta)" from precentral is my latest app. Dec 27 17:25:41 looks like my url for webos-internals is "feed". Dec 27 17:57:04 dreadchicken: Yea, don't know what to say make sure preware is updated (but it should show up either way). Dec 27 18:03:55 phone doesn't seem to want to boot now for some reason Dec 27 18:04:05 I get the "palm" screen....and it stays there Dec 27 18:09:05 hmm did you add anything recently? Dec 27 18:09:52 no Dec 27 18:10:01 Did you try webos doctor? Dec 27 18:10:15 PuffTheMagic: pong Dec 27 18:10:44 I guess I'll try the doctor next Dec 27 18:10:47 jacques_pre: porting palms kernel patches to "a newer kernel" is a pipe dream Dec 27 18:11:26 why? Dec 27 18:12:21 cause there is non-palm omap3 support already upstream with conflicts with the palm code Dec 27 18:12:30 so its not a simple forward port Dec 27 18:12:44 not to mention .24 is way old compared to .32 Dec 27 18:13:09 no joy on webos doctor. it doesn't see the phone and won't let me click next Dec 27 18:13:28 do you have it usb mode? Dec 27 18:13:42 Templarian, no worries...pi'ed it back to normal. Dec 27 18:13:43 you have to turn the phone off then turn it back on but hold the volume up button Dec 27 18:13:48 if i remember right Dec 27 18:15:15 you'll see a big usb logo on the screen hemna Dec 27 18:16:04 PuffTheMagic: the palm omap support is not based on the linux-omap project? Dec 27 18:16:06 ok I'll try...it's stuck permanently at the "palm" screen Dec 27 18:16:28 jacques_pre: no palm started working on theirs about the time that project started Dec 27 18:16:32 Im pretty sure you have to hold the volume button up when you turn the pre on Dec 27 18:16:35 they developed in parallel Dec 27 18:16:38 with out mixing Dec 27 18:17:08 oh that's almost worst case scenario Dec 27 18:17:13 great. Dec 27 18:18:24 so is Palm's dspbridge unrelated to the upstream dspbridge too? Dec 27 18:18:34 nfc about that Dec 27 18:18:42 idk what version they are using Dec 27 18:19:12 yah it's hosed Dec 27 18:19:18 stuck at "palm" screen Dec 27 18:19:34 dr it Dec 27 18:19:38 logo doesn't have that pulsating halo on it either Dec 27 18:19:45 dr it Dec 27 18:19:48 dr doesn't recognize it's plugged into the usb Dec 27 18:20:08 hemna: boot into bootie mode Dec 27 18:20:38 hemna: when my pre got like that, only thing that worked was pulling battery, wait, replace it, plug into USB while holding volume up Dec 27 18:20:51 ah thats it hemna what they said Dec 27 18:21:17 ok I'll try that next Dec 27 18:21:19 thnx Dec 27 18:22:20 thats what thats called puff? bootie mode? Dec 27 18:23:06 ok I got a usb symbol on the display Dec 27 18:23:16 good Dec 27 18:24:13 dr should see it now, assuming novacomd stuff is properly installed Dec 27 18:25:00 ok dr is running Dec 27 18:25:01 phew Dec 27 18:25:13 cool Dec 27 18:28:16 * jacques_pre cleans his pre with compressed air. Dec 27 18:51:25 howd you make out hemna? Dec 27 18:53:45 Good afternoon, guys. Dec 27 18:54:51 Where should I post a bug with the virtual keyboard patch? Dec 27 18:57:36 Well anyways, I've found that pressing the delete key on the virtual keyboard while in the Notes app deletes the entire text of the note. Dec 27 18:59:57 whoops Dec 27 19:00:57 nfoxTc, dr restored it...it worked. phew. Dec 27 19:01:17 good Dec 27 19:01:43 yah I was sweating it a bit Dec 27 19:01:47 thanks for the help Dec 27 19:22:55 I launched google maps but I just get a white screen Dec 27 19:23:37 is there a blizzard going on ? Dec 27 19:24:30 lol Dec 27 19:25:37 I think all the people at the mall are saturating the network Dec 27 19:48:52 can usbnet coexist with a novacom connection? Dec 27 20:04:16 hello i have a weird situation yesterday I was working in Eclipse on an app I all the suddon can not make a button that will do anything I have tried all kinds of things including code from a previous app i built nothing seems to work Dec 27 20:05:30 Rjtaylor: have you tried asking in #webos ? Dec 27 20:05:45 no came here first Dec 27 20:06:55 I'm not sure how many ppl here use eclipse. Dec 27 20:07:33 ok thanks i will go there not to confrotable with IRC yet Dec 27 20:08:04 you can stay here too Dec 27 20:08:16 thanks Dec 27 20:09:09 what is the prefered platform you all use to program with Dec 27 20:12:46 I would like to know that too. Personally I am more of an infrastructure developer and haven't written any webos apps yet. Dec 27 20:16:59 biab Dec 27 20:17:07 gotta reboot Dec 27 20:21:42 linux here Dec 27 20:23:12 * jacques_pre is back. Dec 27 20:30:31 usbnet FTW Dec 27 20:37:44 aha. weechat works much better over ssh compared to novacom Dec 27 20:38:28 now if I could just get the colors properly configured it will rock Dec 27 22:04:34 morning Dec 27 22:04:42 jacques_pre: got delegate working Dec 27 22:05:35 morning rwhitby congrats on delegate Dec 27 22:06:12 what do I need to have commit access to optware? Dec 27 22:06:28 jacques_pre: nslu2-linux.org ssl client cert Dec 27 22:07:29 I got usbnet up on the F12 box, working getting it on gentoo imac now Dec 27 22:08:12 weechat works fine over a "real" connection, but elinks still segfaults Dec 27 22:09:09 did you know whenever an app segfaults, webos tries to send a dump over the internet somewhere? Dec 27 22:09:40 rwhitby: how do I get that cert? Dec 27 22:09:42 jacques_pre: yep, back to Palm Dec 27 22:11:24 jacques_pre: if none of your info has changed, I can create one Dec 27 22:12:13 rwhitby: which info would that be? Dec 27 22:12:48 jacques_pre: all the info that is in an openssl x509 certificate Dec 27 22:13:26 jacques_pre: oh, have you had write access in the past? Dec 27 22:13:52 rwhitby: the distant past probably Dec 27 22:14:44 lots of infrastructure changes since I was last committing Dec 27 22:37:27 hey so what is the deal with tethering Dec 27 22:37:40 do i need an app? Dec 27 22:37:46 is there an app? Dec 27 22:50:29 jacques_pre: now that I have openvpn and delegate working as unconfigured binaries, I need to work out how they will be used by webOS apps Dec 27 22:52:53 I imagine we will still be finding new uses for delegate a year from now Dec 27 22:52:55 hmm - need to work out the best way to adjust DNS settings first. maybe I need to work out how pmnetconfig works ... Dec 27 22:53:29 there's an /etc/pmnetconfig dir with lots of stuff in it ... Dec 27 22:54:30 so there is Dec 27 22:54:55 is that a palm app? Dec 27 22:57:30 usually pm* means palm app Dec 27 22:58:00 thanks bpadalino Dec 27 23:03:30 imac rebooted with new kernel and modules for usbnet Dec 27 23:04:05 new fglrx driver too - that's always a risk Dec 27 23:05:23 pmnetconfig if-up refers to cscotun0 for VPN Dec 27 23:05:44 I'm going to try changing that to just tun0 and see if that does the right thing for openvpn Dec 27 23:06:33 anyone know a good (cheap) source for the OEM wall charger? Dec 28 00:00:02 we need to start documenting the com.palm.connectionmanager undocumented calls. same for com.palm.wifi, com.palm.bluetooth, etc ... Dec 28 00:06:39 I can't remember who, but someone told me to take a look at beagle boards. Are you still around? Dec 28 00:07:24 nfoxTc: it wasn't me, but what's your question? Dec 28 00:08:04 Well I was told that the hardware was pretty much the same as a Pre Dec 28 00:08:07 this true? Dec 28 00:08:22 depends on your definition of "same" Dec 28 00:08:38 omap3, yes Dec 28 00:08:50 well, performance wise. Which is "faster" Dec 28 00:09:12 RAM/flash/display not too similar Dec 28 00:09:54 Which would you say is more powerful? Dec 28 00:10:11 did you see this: http://beagleboard.org/hardware Dec 28 00:10:46 Mhmm only thing is I dont have a list of the Pre's hardware to compare it to Dec 28 00:11:15 processor looks like same speed (well beagle can run up to 600MHz and Pre runs at 500MHz( Dec 28 00:11:47 pre is 3430 running at 500MHz with 256MiB rAM Dec 28 00:11:53 beagle board has better connectivity, and is designed to be a development board (as opposed to the Pre, which is designed to be a consumer device) Dec 28 00:12:20 * rwhitby just used BT PAN from Mac to Pre for the first time ... Dec 28 00:12:45 beagle board has 128MiB RAM and 256MiB NAND Dec 28 00:13:03 Hmm I see, hopefully that product doesn't disappear im really interested in getting one. Dec 28 00:13:07 NAND? Dec 28 00:13:16 NAND flsh Dec 28 00:13:18 flash Dec 28 00:13:31 as opposed to NOR flash Dec 28 00:14:31 beagle does not have integrated display with touchscreen, but it does have HDMI out Dec 28 00:14:52 beagle board isn't going to disappear Dec 28 00:15:07 oops, looks like DVI-D not HDMI sorry Dec 28 00:15:17 I found a touchscreen for it, its expensive though Dec 28 00:16:26 https://www.xenarcdirect.com/product.php?productid=16194 Dec 28 00:16:31 there is also the gumstix overo, but AFAICT they are never in stock Dec 28 00:16:57 the board is pretty powerful for its size Dec 28 00:16:58 you can (supposedly) get overo kits which include a display and touchscreen Dec 28 00:17:11 hmm wonder how much Dec 28 00:18:32 for example: http://gumstix.com/store/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=253 Dec 28 00:20:06 * rwhitby bbl Dec 28 00:20:34 a little expensive but not bad Dec 28 00:21:04 Im just in love with the side of the beagle board Dec 28 00:21:07 size* Dec 28 00:22:45 the gumstix, without the carrier board is much smaller Dec 28 00:23:07 which really only matters if you are intending to integrate the board into a small product Dec 28 00:23:43 hm not really no, how big is the one you linked me to? Dec 28 00:23:51 compared to an average laptop Dec 28 00:24:06 one thing I haven't found out is if there is a 3d accel driver for the beagle board. I suspect not. Dec 28 00:24:20 it says theres support for open gl Dec 28 00:24:27 same with gumstix; they tell you about the hardware capabilities but conveniently forget to mention there is no driver Dec 28 00:24:47 support as in hardware support or software support? Dec 28 00:25:00 hardware without driver might as well not exist Dec 28 00:25:24 true Dec 28 00:25:46 only a matter of time before someone develops one though Dec 28 00:26:08 ah ok that screen is only 3'5 inches huh thats small Dec 28 00:26:38 Id love to have something like that just to play around with, a little expensive for a toy though heh Dec 28 00:26:39 it's been many years and nobody has reversed that 3d hardware Dec 28 00:26:58 Oh I thought it was a newer product Dec 28 00:27:31 you need to talk to the PowerVR SGX guys to get the driver .. but software exists to develop OpenGL for that video processor Dec 28 00:27:41 before omap 3 there was omap 2 and before that omap1 Dec 28 00:27:56 http://www.imgtec.com/powervr/insider/powervr-sdk.asp Dec 28 00:28:03 they all have the same 3d (getting faster every time) Dec 28 00:28:14 i believe you are mistaken there Dec 28 00:28:40 bpadalino: which part? Dec 28 00:29:13 Hmm good to know, maybe when I completely learn C ill pick one up and try and make something out of it Dec 28 00:29:14 the interfaces for each of those 3d cards is pretty different .. same with the IVA stuff Dec 28 00:29:16 all different Dec 28 00:29:37 they all have wifi right? Dec 28 00:30:00 OMAP2 was basically Nokia dictating what they wanted in a chip .. and it was all put together in an ad hoc fashion .. Dec 28 00:30:02 does beagle have wifi standard? not sure Dec 28 00:30:11 no, usb for wifi or ethernet Dec 28 00:30:13 for beagle board Dec 28 00:30:31 but in terms of OMAP, there is a lot of errata Dec 28 00:30:33 in the OMAP2 Dec 28 00:30:46 bpadalino: yet we still have no 3d hardware accel on the N800 (OMAP2) Dec 28 00:30:59 talk to the powerVR guys - it's their piece of IP Dec 28 00:31:29 that's my point. there is no open information and no open drivers, and we can't even get binary drivers for linux AFAIK Dec 28 00:31:42 you can sign an NDA and get drivers Dec 28 00:31:54 apparently they charge so much for the driver licensing that nokia didn't include them Dec 28 00:31:59 Oh so theres no wifi? Dec 28 00:32:41 nfoxTc: right - use usb to get wifi on the beagle board Dec 28 00:32:47 gumstix overo fire has wifi onboard, beagle you can connect a USB wifi adapter Dec 28 00:32:49 there is a gumstix wifi board Dec 28 00:33:05 jacques3: http://www.imgtec.com/forum/printer_friendly_posts.asp?TID=52 Dec 28 00:33:33 contact those people if you want drivers Dec 28 00:34:32 oh ok Dec 28 00:34:59 bpadalino: are you saying the drivers are no cost? Dec 28 00:35:23 i'm not saying anything about the drivers other than TI has nothing to do with them, and if you want anything, you need to contact imgtec.com Dec 28 00:35:27 I can't tell from that if it's a PC SDK or if there are ARM drivers which people can get without paying $$$ Dec 28 00:35:29 because it's their piece of IP in that silicon Dec 28 00:36:06 there's no need to keep bitching about it - you can find out directly from the source what the deal is Dec 28 00:37:04 bpadalino: what's your interest in this? just for me to stop talking about it? Dec 28 00:37:11 mainly Dec 28 00:37:42 girls girls... Dec 28 00:38:31 Does the beagle board support the new sdhc cards? Dec 28 00:38:45 even though i dont know if i could trust a 32gb sd card... Dec 28 00:38:52 http://elinux.org/BeagleBoard Dec 28 00:39:26 thanks Dec 28 00:40:13 things sure have come a long way since I got my first PC...a 286 heh Dec 28 00:40:21 think the thing was like 8mhz Dec 28 00:40:26 jacques3: http://elinux.org/BeagleBoard#Graphics_accelerator - that's for you Dec 28 00:41:51 bpadalino: thanks for the info. I hadn't seen that. I will check it out. Dec 28 01:02:15 nfoxTc: did you know there is a #beagle channel on freenode? there are like 133 people on it now Dec 28 01:03:06 Oh no i didnt but ill check it out, thanks Dec 28 01:05:59 also, looks like revC beagle boards have 256MiB RAM Dec 28 01:06:21 that doesn't seem like much Dec 28 01:07:31 it's the same as the Pre Dec 28 01:07:47 Hmm Dec 28 01:08:29 Id just love to have a device I could do some DEV on in my pocket Dec 28 01:08:52 so I guess 256meg would be enough to compile some C programs on right? Dec 28 01:09:22 we compiled tons of stuff in 32MiB on the nslu2 Dec 28 01:10:00 and I emerged gentoo several times on an ARM handheld with 32MiB RAM Dec 28 01:10:45 c++ requires more RAM, but 256MiB should be plenty as long as you aren't doing too many resource-intensive things at once Dec 28 01:11:16 Hmm sounds good enough for me Dec 28 01:11:27 a little C and maybe a IRC client Dec 28 01:33:22 jacques: delegate is now in optware Dec 28 01:48:43 rwhitby: sweet! Dec 28 01:51:36 jacques_pre: http://code.google.com/p/dbus-tools/ Dec 28 01:52:44 moo looks interesting Dec 28 01:53:07 interesting, yeah I don't use zsh ;-) Dec 28 01:53:42 the dbus script should do introspection, so I can work out what methods com.palm.netroute has ... Dec 28 01:54:27 rwhitby: so I have a checked out version of optware, which I did before I had commit access. I can't checkout optware again right now because it's 333MiB Dec 28 01:54:44 is there a way I can use the checkout I have to commit changes ? Dec 28 01:55:22 introspection ftw Dec 28 01:55:46 jacques: to commit? not really. you can svn diff and send the patch to me ... Dec 28 01:56:15 jacques: seen this before? ImportError: /opt/lib/python2.5/site-packages/_dbus_bindings.so: undefined symbol: PyUnicodeUCS2_DecodeUTF8 Dec 28 01:56:23 ok np Dec 28 01:56:48 anyone tried to use mdbus on the pre? Dec 28 01:57:33 rwhitby: hmm, no, but could it mean trying to load a modules which requires unicode into a non-unicode python ? is there such a thing? Dec 28 01:57:41 ah, mickeydbus - forgot about it Dec 28 01:57:54 playya: does it require the dbus python module too? Dec 28 01:58:04 yes Dec 28 01:58:21 jacques: yeah, looks like our optware python and dbus-python have some compatibility problems Dec 28 01:58:59 and xml Dec 28 02:00:22 is glib-2.0 availble for the pre? Dec 28 02:00:46 hmmm, fascinating: http://pandorawiki.org/Floating_Point_Optimization Dec 28 02:09:09 playya: yep, all that stuff is in optware Dec 28 02:09:12 jacques: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Network_Management Dec 28 02:09:20 ok Dec 28 02:09:40 mickey did a rewite in vala Dec 28 02:09:58 if you only want to introspect, this is enough Dec 28 02:10:32 playya: got an armel binary somewhere? Dec 28 02:10:34 because it isn't dynamic it isn't possible to call methods yet Dec 28 02:10:44 no. not yet Dec 28 02:10:56 let me check if there's a OE recipe Dec 28 02:11:10 * playya doesn't own a pre Dec 28 02:11:13 * jacques is very interested in vala Dec 28 02:11:31 playya: are you part of FSO ? Dec 28 02:11:37 yes Dec 28 02:12:12 cool Dec 28 02:12:15 playya: has anyone got a good OE config that interoperates with Palm's base linux install? Dec 28 02:12:43 sorry. i don't know Dec 28 02:12:45 jacques: trying python-dbus on emulator to see if i686g25 optware feed has the same problem Dec 28 02:12:58 maybe you should ask daniel, jan or stefan Dec 28 02:13:07 or morphis Dec 28 02:13:11 rwhitby: maybe in addition to introspection we could run "strings" on some binaries ? but which ones... Dec 28 02:13:24 jacques: yep, been doing that Dec 28 02:13:44 on /usr/bin/PmNetConfigManager Dec 28 02:13:46 he successfully booted a own kernel with the elementary example in initrd Dec 28 02:14:28 is anyone besides morphis working on the pre modem? Dec 28 02:14:56 "most VFP floating point instructions can be exactly replicated using an order of magnitude faster NEON instructions" heh heh Dec 28 02:15:40 playya: getting a working OE config for a replacement rootfs is no problem - I can do that. It's getting a compatible one which I'm having problems with Dec 28 02:16:11 i don't know which toolchain they use Dec 28 02:16:21 cs07q3armel Dec 28 02:16:33 but i think you have to add all patches to OE for the pre Dec 28 02:16:36 glib 2.5 is the problem Dec 28 02:16:48 OE's glib 2.5 recipes are bitrotten Dec 28 02:16:57 (as you would expect, since it's so old) Dec 28 02:17:11 glibc that is Dec 28 02:17:13 libc? Dec 28 02:17:16 ah. ok Dec 28 02:17:24 yes that's quite old Dec 28 02:17:34 * jacques emerges dev-python/dbus-python Dec 28 02:18:02 but it's an old kernel, too. and afair 2.5 is better optimized for embedded systems Dec 28 02:18:25 hmm - I wonder if you could take the PmNetConfigManager binary from the emulator, and run it on a normal linux system, and then introspect it Dec 28 02:18:38 is that before the glibc maintainers decided they are not targeting embedded? Dec 28 02:18:48 these days I have been looking at eglibs Dec 28 02:18:57 2.6.24 is not that old in the embedded world, where some devices still ship with 2.4 kernels ... Dec 28 02:19:00 s/eglibs/eglibc/ Dec 28 02:19:01 jacques meant: these days I have been looking at eglibc Dec 28 02:19:41 shr already uses eglibc Dec 28 02:19:42 *cough* wrt54g *cough* Dec 28 02:19:45 ok, we really need to fix this optware dbus incompatibility then Dec 28 02:20:39 rwhitby: can you? run the emulator PmNetConfigManager on a normal system? Dec 28 02:20:53 jacques: dunno Dec 28 02:21:16 sigh. that was one of my tasks for this weekend - get the emulator working Dec 28 02:21:31 I got as far as finding the virtualbox rpms for F12 Dec 28 02:21:53 I need to take a week off work just to catch up to where I can be useful Dec 28 02:21:55 * rwhitby continues to be glad he always takes the path of least resistance with Linux distributions ... Dec 28 02:21:59 anyone knows if it's a good idea to use gsl on a smartphone without FPU? Dec 28 02:22:52 http://www.gnu.org/software/gsl/ that gsl ? Dec 28 02:23:10 yes Dec 28 02:24:02