**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Feb 22 02:59:58 2010 Feb 22 03:00:32 cryptk|wirc: :( Feb 22 03:00:50 sup? Feb 22 03:01:15 Something about icon and application. Feb 22 03:02:04 yeah, I need an icon made for my upstart manager app... zsoc said you may be interested Feb 22 03:02:19 if not,that's cool too Feb 22 03:02:23 cryptk|wirc, interested is a funny word, i just know he can do it :p Feb 22 03:02:34 okay. Feb 22 03:02:36 lol Feb 22 03:02:56 found another way to change the cpu speed without having to mod lunsysmgr Feb 22 03:03:14 I'm busy at the moment but if you want to just release it with a temp icon spring break is next week and I'll have more free time. Feb 22 03:04:09 well,it is testing feed atm... there is some more stuff to be done to it before it is ready for release Feb 22 03:05:33 http://i.imgur.com/SODlt.gif Feb 22 03:08:07 cryptk|wirc: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Icons add it to this list at the bottom and explain it in detail. Feb 22 03:08:33 will do once I get to work Feb 22 03:08:58 Are there general steps to remove leftover files from corrupt patches or does it depend on a case-by-case situation? Feb 22 03:17:31 cryptk|wirc: so, one issue? with Upstart Manager. Feb 22 03:17:49 cryptk|wirc: there are upstart scripts which are just "triggers" for long-running services. Feb 22 03:17:55 cryptk|wirc: e.g. ipkgservice Feb 22 03:18:32 the current interface will show these as "stopped" and people will try and "start" them, only to see them stopped again (when in fact the upstart script is stopped, but the service is running). Feb 22 03:19:01 Then I'll get lots of people saying that the Package Manager Service is not running (cause Upstart Manager says it is stopped) when in fact it is running. Feb 22 03:19:19 cryptk|wirc: none of this is your fault, and I don't have a good solution either. Feb 22 03:20:40 rwhitby, i suppose the solution is to also show the related services Feb 22 03:21:06 zsoc: I don't think we can easily get that relationship programmatically Feb 22 03:21:22 rwhitby, i didn't claim it was easy :D Feb 22 03:22:20 also i wish i knew why glib-genmarshal segfaults every 5th time i compile it. very odd Feb 22 03:24:31 cryptk|wirc, i like your "this.broke.horribly" comment Feb 22 03:25:01 zsoc: that came from it's JsTop origins, lol Feb 22 03:25:09 cryptk|wirc, oh lol ok Feb 22 03:25:20 if it ever stays there though then it did break horribly Feb 22 03:25:29 im a sucker for amusing code Feb 22 03:25:36 no, i just read fast :p Feb 22 03:25:51 it shows for a second because there are alot of services and it takes a sec to sort them all Feb 22 03:26:03 Does anyone know why preware might lose the url for the webos-patches feed? Feb 22 03:26:23 I may change it to 'zsoc.found.me' whatcha think? lol Feb 22 03:26:48 did it lose the url for it or is the feed just disabled? Feb 22 03:27:15 lol Feb 22 03:27:26 The feed is enabled but not working, and shows no url in the manage feeds screen. Feb 22 03:27:34 I am living having a touchstone in the bedroom... Feb 22 03:27:36 ghjm, corruption, most likely Feb 22 03:27:41 weird... Feb 22 03:28:03 ghjm, although... i believe that is suppose to auto-propagate based on os version Feb 22 03:28:03 I built my first one into my computer... Feb 22 03:29:07 I figured it might be a corrupt feeds list but can't find where the list is kept. Feb 22 03:30:16 ghjm, that file should be kept in /media/cryptofs/apps/etc/ipkg/ (i think?) Feb 22 03:32:18 found it, it's empty Feb 22 03:34:14 ghjm, what firmware you running? Feb 22 03:34:40 1.3.5.1 Feb 22 03:34:49 odd Feb 22 03:35:22 Are there general steps to remove leftover files from corrupt patches or does it depend on a case-by-case situation? Feb 22 03:39:32 ghjm: has the patches feed worked since you last installed the Package Manager Service? Feb 22 03:40:13 ghjm: or since you last rebooted the Pre? Feb 22 03:42:11 ugh, why would a package try to install static libs if you configure --disable-static Feb 22 03:42:59 gotta jet, later Feb 22 03:44:20 rwhitby: I don't remember if it has worked since the last package manager update. I rebooted a while ago and it didn't help. What's the url of the feed supposed to be? Feb 22 03:44:53 src/gz webos-patches http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-patches/1.3.5.1 Feb 22 03:45:21 ghjm: actually, please do the following: Feb 22 03:45:29 1) put the following line in the file: Feb 22 03:45:31 src/gz webos-patches http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-patches/all Feb 22 03:45:36 2) reboot the Pre Feb 22 03:45:54 3) make sure the ipkgservice upstart script has changed the 'all' to '1.3.5.1' Feb 22 03:46:23 ghjm: I want to see if it's a transient problem, or a reproducible problem on your device (in which case we can debug and fix it for everyone) Feb 22 03:47:41 is it ok to stop/start the service or do you really want me to reboot the whole pre? Feb 22 03:52:29 ghjm: reboot the whole Pre thanks. if a start/stop is broken then we're in real trouble. Feb 22 03:53:27 ok will do Feb 22 03:58:09 Time to head to work... You guys are going in my pocket. Feb 22 03:59:43 rwhitby: yes, after reboot it was correctly updated to 1.3.5.1 Feb 22 03:59:49 and works now. Feb 22 04:01:04 ghjm_: excellent, a transient, non-repeatable failure. Feb 22 04:01:15 yeah Feb 22 04:01:31 somehow, the webos-patches.conf file became zero length. Feb 22 04:02:12 ok, the upstart script currently does a sed to change the version. I can change that to embed the real URL in the upstart script so that if the file becomes zero length again, at least it will be fixed on the next reboot. Feb 22 04:02:50 reduces maintainability if the patches feed ever moves, but will improve the reliability in the fact of transient external effects like zero length conf files. Feb 22 04:03:48 Are there general steps to remove leftover files from corrupt patches or does it depend on a case-by-case situation? Feb 22 04:05:29 Another option would be to do what yum does and embed a tag (like $ver) in the config files, then replace it at runtime. Can you access the current webos version from within preware? I know nothing about the platform. Feb 22 04:11:09 ghjm: unfortunately, ipkg does not support that. Feb 22 04:11:32 ghjm: ipkgservice 0.9.36 is now in the testing feed - are you able to test it? Feb 22 04:11:45 could it pass an env var to the scripts? Feb 22 04:12:00 ipkg isn't even doing it in the case of Preware etc Feb 22 04:12:01 tmzt: no, the conf files are read directly by ipkg Feb 22 04:13:43 Did you guys have fun in there? Lol Feb 22 04:13:50 sure, I can test it. how do I add the testing feed? Feb 22 04:14:20 ghjm: easiest way to test it is to use the preware bootstrap script Feb 22 04:14:26 last three lines on the wiki page Feb 22 04:22:52 rwhitby: What do you want me to test? Just that it works or any specific activities? Feb 22 04:25:44 ghjm: just that it works and installs stuff Feb 22 04:26:22 ghjm: you could even make your webos-patches.conf file be zero length again, and then test that it is recreated with a service stop/sart Feb 22 04:26:24 start Feb 22 04:28:42 hola, actually at work now... Feb 22 04:30:03 Are there general steps to remove leftover files from corrupt patches or does it depend on a case-by-case situation? Feb 22 04:30:33 gollyzila: there are general steps Feb 22 04:30:38 start with running EFV Feb 22 04:30:49 then see what errors (if any) are in the IPKG log Feb 22 04:31:14 cryptk|work: Is there another way without uninstalling all my patches? Feb 22 04:31:15 those errors will tell you what files are modified with a non-AUPT-3 patch Feb 22 04:31:23 EFV does not uninstall patches Feb 22 04:31:26 EPR does Feb 22 04:31:34 Ohhh my bad Feb 22 04:31:36 EFV is Emergency File Verification Feb 22 04:31:44 it is in preware in the same place as EPR Feb 22 04:32:01 when you run EFV it will take a bit to 'install' Feb 22 04:32:08 I've already used EFV and it has showed patches that aren't even on my phone Feb 22 04:32:13 when it says installing, it is actually running (like EPR does) Feb 22 04:32:21 what did it say about them? Feb 22 04:32:36 Would you like me to run it again and paste the ipkg on pastebin? Feb 22 04:33:01 yes please Feb 22 04:33:43 and if you have novaterm or SSH set up can you also pastebin the output of ipkg -o /media/cryptofs/apps list_installed *patches* Feb 22 04:34:03 easiest through novaterm or SSH since you can copy/paste on your computer Feb 22 04:34:19 ~cryptk Feb 22 04:34:47 rwhitby: is ipkgservice supposed to be normally running or stopped? Feb 22 04:34:56 not sure Feb 22 04:35:00 I can check in a second Feb 22 04:36:58 seems it should normally be stopped and that it should run probably only during ipkg installs Feb 22 04:37:02 but rwhitby would know for sure Feb 22 04:37:05 Ok Feb 22 04:37:26 The new package manager does recreate webos-patches.conf from zero length, fyi Feb 22 04:37:30 I only got that info by looking at it's state while preware wasn't running Feb 22 04:37:36 cool Feb 22 04:37:59 Still don't know how it got that way, but at least now it's self-healing :-) Feb 22 04:38:18 if you do an upstart start on it, it runs for 5 seconds and stops. Feb 22 04:38:33 Hopefully that's normal. Preware seems to work and install software properly. Feb 22 04:38:42 how are you issueing the start? Feb 22 04:38:58 command line "start org.webosinternals.ipkgservice" Feb 22 04:39:03 it is probably supposed to get some kind of parameter when it starts Feb 22 04:39:07 ah ok Feb 22 04:39:13 and if it doesn't get one, then itdoesn't have anything to do... Feb 22 04:39:15 so it stops Feb 22 04:39:38 makes sense. Feb 22 04:39:42 ipkg -o /media/cryptofs/apps list_installed *patches* --------Does this output onto the ipkg log in /media/internal? Feb 22 04:40:13 no, just to the terminal where it is typed Feb 22 04:40:41 but you can do ipkg -o /media/cryptofs/apps list_installed *patches* > /media/internal/ipkg_list Feb 22 04:40:52 then there will be a file called ipkg_list in the USB partitions Feb 22 04:41:29 I'll do that then cause it's not outputting in PuTTY Feb 22 04:41:40 then you can open that file in notepad and copy the contents Feb 22 04:43:06 gollyzila: do you have any patches installed? Feb 22 04:43:21 if you don't then that command won't output anything Feb 22 04:43:29 Yes, a bunch Feb 22 04:43:29 it should give a list of all installed patches Feb 22 04:43:31 ok Feb 22 04:43:41 yeah, do you have terminal on your pre? Feb 22 04:43:57 if so, type it in there and see if it outputs anything Feb 22 04:45:59 http://webos.pastebin.com/mcd4549d Here's the output of EFV Feb 22 04:46:33 btw, ghjm my new app Upstart Manager is in the testing feed, it will let you stop and start services from within luna, no command line needed Feb 22 04:46:42 it also shows their current state and status Feb 22 04:47:08 I just installed it Feb 22 04:47:11 nice Feb 22 04:47:14 I noticed it when I added the testing feed Feb 22 04:47:31 yeah, I just got it all working earlier today, let me know if you have any questions or find any bugs Feb 22 04:47:39 will do, thanks Feb 22 04:47:42 gollyzila: there is nothing at that link Feb 22 04:48:02 ghjm: it uses the org.webosinternals.upstartservice service to get it's info Feb 22 04:48:22 and if it reminds you of JsTop, that is because it is JsTop... jsut heavily modified, lol Feb 22 04:48:31 Check the recent post on webos.pastebin.com Feb 22 04:48:56 the most recent one I see was 3 days ago Feb 22 04:49:16 http://webos.pastebin.com/ Feb 22 04:49:48 I guess this means I need a 4th page of icons after all :-) Feb 22 04:50:54 ipkg -o /media/cryptofs/apps list_installed *patches*-----------typing this on my Pre's terminal does output the list on the phone Feb 22 04:51:20 do ipkg -o /media/cryptofs/apps list_installed *patches* > /media/internal/ipkg_list on the phone Feb 22 04:51:32 that will put the output of the command in a file in the USB partition Feb 22 04:51:51 then jsut flip it into USB mode and copy it off, open it in notepad and you have the output Feb 22 04:52:06 Oh, but i already did that through PuTTY Feb 22 04:52:20 oh, then check in your USB partition Feb 22 04:52:44 as long as you had the > /media/internal/ipkg_list on the end then the output went to the USB partition instead of to the console Feb 22 04:52:55 I already pasted it on pastebin Feb 22 04:53:02 I can't see it on there... Feb 22 04:53:13 the most recent post I see to webos.pastebin.com was from 3 days ago Feb 22 04:53:18 and it expired already Feb 22 04:53:29 Ohhhh i did it on a private pastebin Feb 22 04:53:51 did you do it on http://webos.pastebin.com? Feb 22 04:54:32 yes, the one that is given at the top of the irc windo Feb 22 04:54:34 window Feb 22 04:54:37 hrm... Feb 22 04:54:40 try it once more please Feb 22 04:55:08 it still takes me to a private pastebin Feb 22 04:55:18 that is fine Feb 22 04:55:27 it isn't truely private Feb 22 04:55:36 jsut means that it isn't on the main www.pastebin.com Feb 22 04:56:22 So what should i do? Feb 22 04:56:32 did you try pastebinning it again? Feb 22 04:57:18 could have just been a hiccup with pastebin the first time, I have seen it do that before where it looks like it pastebinned it, but it really didn't Feb 22 04:58:06 Just did it again, It says that Anonymous last posted 32 hours ago Feb 22 04:58:31 what URL? Feb 22 04:58:38 it only shows in recent posts if you put in a name Feb 22 04:58:52 I did put in my name Feb 22 04:58:54 Gollyzila Feb 22 04:59:11 did you check the remember me check box? Feb 22 04:59:20 I have four postings on http://webos.pastebin.com/ Feb 22 04:59:20 jsut copy the URL from the address bar Feb 22 04:59:24 yes Feb 22 04:59:38 hrm... wonder why i can' see them... Feb 22 04:59:51 can you please copy and paste the URL from the address bar for me Feb 22 04:59:51 http://webos.pastebin.com/mcd4549d Feb 22 05:00:06 http://webos.pastebin.com/d620b8866 Feb 22 05:00:22 wth... they are both empty for me... Feb 22 05:01:03 I just PM'd ya my email addy, just email it to me Feb 22 05:02:19 thanks for your help cryptk, I'm going to bed now Feb 22 05:04:12 gollyzila: got your email, gimmie a few to look at it all Feb 22 05:05:18 okay. In the mean time, I'll do some Integrals of inverse trigonometric functions homework Feb 22 05:08:05 haha, have fun with that Feb 22 05:09:01 I wonder if there are AP Calculus IRC channels Feb 22 05:09:23 #math Feb 22 05:09:43 * rwhitby wonders where org.e-lnx.wee.patches.topbarmodeswitcher comes from ... Feb 22 05:10:01 I used to teach calc and diffy screw. Feb 22 05:10:18 gollyzila: it seems you are installing patches from many different sources - can you detail where you are getting patches from? Feb 22 05:11:30 You mean where I got the patches that I installed through WOSQI? Feb 22 05:11:48 rwhitby: all but two are org.webosinternals Feb 22 05:12:03 cryptk|work: http://webos.pastebin.com/m27e0ba7e Feb 22 05:12:13 I see at least three different patch sources Feb 22 05:12:19 yeah... pastebin must be broken for me Feb 22 05:12:31 that link has nothing in it for me Feb 22 05:13:00 I jsut get '* Unknown post id, it may have expired or been deleted' Feb 22 05:13:46 gollyzila: since I have no idea what org.e-lnx.wee.patches are, the only thing I can advise is to back up all your data, do a full erase and doctor, and then be more discerning about where you get your patches from. Feb 22 05:14:11 the dictionary/thesaurus, auto-enable-ip-forwarding-in-mobile-hotspot, ca.canucksoftware.patches.downloads aupt-1, and the mode switcher patches are all from the forums. But i already uninstalled the mode switcher patches. Feb 22 05:14:46 how were the mode switcher patches installed? Feb 22 05:14:48 The mode switcher patches are actually from a private repository the developer of Mode Switcher released to add into Preware Feb 22 05:14:49 are you sure that they uninstalled cleanly? Feb 22 05:15:16 were they installed through QI, and if so were they .patch files or were they pre-packaged .ipk files? Feb 22 05:15:27 gollyzila: please /msg me the feed location so I can check the postinst scripts for safety Feb 22 05:16:31 rwhitby: from the output of his ipkg -o /media/cryptofs/apps list_installed *patches* it seems that they aren't actually installed... Feb 22 05:16:36 http://wee.e-lnx.org/webos/feeds/stable Feb 22 05:17:02 unless they don't install to /media/cryptofs/apps Feb 22 05:17:06 But those patches on the feed are already updated Feb 22 05:18:23 You know what, know that I remember, the mode switcher patches that the EFV outputted were installed through WOSQI, which I downloaded from the Mode Switcher thread. But the developer has already removed them Feb 22 05:18:32 Sorry about the confusion Feb 22 05:18:51 ok, but were they ipk's that you installed through QI or were they .patch files? Feb 22 05:19:09 gollyzila: you will need to ask the author of those ipkgs in http://wee.e-lnx.org/webos/feeds/stable for support. Feb 22 05:19:10 they were .ipk Feb 22 05:19:28 .ipk is no beuno, never install pre-packaged patches Feb 22 05:19:41 if someone decides to distribute patches outside of the webos-patches feed, then they need to take responsibility for the support. Feb 22 05:19:41 you can't ensure that the scripts are good Feb 22 05:20:08 Okay. Feb 22 05:20:26 So I'll ask him how to remove the remanants of his patch Feb 22 05:20:28 BUt Feb 22 05:20:39 gollyzila: such a package could easily have installed a keylogger on your Pre. I hope you trust the author :-) Feb 22 05:20:40 rwhitby: what about the other patches that EFV tripped on Feb 22 05:20:41 what about the other patches? Feb 22 05:21:15 seems that they may be just remnants in the patches file and they aren't actually isntalled anymore Feb 22 05:21:20 gollyzila: for the org.webosinternals ones, just reinstall and remove the patch in question and it will clean up that file Feb 22 05:21:26 I do trust him, and so do alot of other people Feb 22 05:21:36 the same will probably work for the ca.canucksoftware ones too Feb 22 05:22:06 gollyzila: I'm sure he's trustworthy, but you see how easily it could be otherwise if someone had malicious intent ... Feb 22 05:22:09 well the landscape messaging is installed on my phone, but preware and WOSQI think it isnt Feb 22 05:22:53 ca.canucksoftware.patches.auto-enable-ip-forwarding-in-mobile-hotspot - 1.3.5.1-1 - Auto-Enable IP Forwarding In Mobile Hotspot ca.canucksoftware.patches.dict+thes-twit - 1.3.5-1 - Dict+Thesaurus-Twitter to UniSearch should both be able to be fixed by uninstalling and reinstalling the patches Feb 22 05:22:56 yeah i do. I'm glad I found out about the .ipk patches. I wish I couldve learned about it earlier Feb 22 05:23:29 rwhitby: did you have a chance yet to try the Upstart GUI? Feb 22 05:23:54 cryptk|work: yep, that's when I reported the stuff about people thinking that ipkgservice is stopped Feb 22 05:23:58 I was wanting to ask you if you knew what services would be good ones to include in a 'dangerous service' list... ones that should have an extra warning ebfore stopping/starting them Feb 22 05:24:09 cryptk|work: I'm going to need to reinstall them with WOSQI? Feb 22 05:24:14 gollyzila: yes Feb 22 05:24:40 the ones that aren't in preware, yes Feb 22 05:24:44 cryptk|work: I think it's probably the other way around - what services are safe to stop and start. Feb 22 05:24:57 ahh, so you think I should whitelist it instead Feb 22 05:25:02 would probably be easier Feb 22 05:25:03 cryptk|work: any one starting with ca.canucksoftware should be done using wosqi Feb 22 05:25:34 so basically have any non-custom service be 'dangerous' Feb 22 05:25:43 and custom services be 'safe' Feb 22 05:27:07 that is going to be my project for milestone 0.2.0, identify safe vs. dangerous services Feb 22 05:27:27 I just wish there were an easy way to tell if a service was stock or not Feb 22 05:27:56 I mean so far I can jsut check and see if it has a period in the name, but someone could easily make a one word, no period in the name service Feb 22 05:28:08 then it would get marked as dangerous Feb 22 05:29:16 ca.canucksoftware.patches.downloads aupt-1 I used to have this patch installed through WOSQI, but i removed it and installed the Preware version. Why does it show up in the log output of EFV? Feb 22 05:30:13 can anyone here help me figure out why I can't ssh into my phone via the cellular network? Feb 22 05:30:31 gollyzila: looks like wosqi, or the aupt-1 prerm script, did not clean up properly. Feb 22 05:30:38 gollyzila: what is the new name of the patch? the preware version of it? Feb 22 05:31:04 Let me check Feb 22 05:31:42 Unthrottle Download Manager Feb 22 05:32:37 I have altered the iptables lines to not limit by interface, and I have verified my ip is correct Feb 22 05:33:11 nn7: are you sure your provider is not blocking that port? Feb 22 05:33:24 rwhitby: would the output of ls -al /media/cryptofs/apps/usr/palm/applications/ | grep patches help Feb 22 05:33:26 ohhh.. good thought Feb 22 05:33:34 nn7: it's quite common Feb 22 05:33:47 should show every patch folder, wether or not it is installed/uninstalled properly Feb 22 05:34:17 have landed at IAH Feb 22 05:34:19 cryptk|work: nope, it's quite simple - reinstall the same patch using the same tool as it was originally installed, then remove using the same tool. Feb 22 05:34:22 rwhitby: thanks Feb 22 05:34:33 rwhitby: nice Feb 22 05:35:11 btw, about the whole "ipkgservice not running" problem... if that service is just a script to start the long running service, where is the actual service located at Feb 22 05:35:26 cryptk|work: in java Feb 22 05:35:39 ahh, so that service just kicks off a java process Feb 22 05:35:52 yep Feb 22 05:35:59 java thread actually Feb 22 05:36:02 yeah Feb 22 05:36:11 is there a way to query for that? Feb 22 05:36:18 next question. I installed nano with preware. I can see nano in /media/cryptofx/apps/opt/bin and /media/cryptofx/apps/opt/share, but it's not in /opt/bin and I can't execute it from my PATH Feb 22 05:36:37 should I add the /meda.... to my path or should the executable be linked elsewhere? Feb 22 05:36:42 someone asked me if webos apps could be written in java. I wasn't sure Feb 22 05:36:51 you could probably symbolic link it Feb 22 05:37:06 nn7: ah, I probably haven't fixed it's postinst yet Feb 22 05:37:06 jacques_pre: a webos-app as in runs inside luna can't as far as I know Feb 22 05:37:20 we are talking about background services Feb 22 05:37:21 cryptk|work: jps Feb 22 05:37:31 jps? Feb 22 05:37:42 command to query java threads Feb 22 05:37:44 `k Feb 22 05:38:43 would that jps command return a name or anything that could be matched to the service? Feb 22 05:39:05 then I could override the output of it... service says stopped, it has a java thread, java thread is running, mark it as running Feb 22 05:39:21 but I would need a way to match the java thread to the service Feb 22 05:39:32 and it would probably have to be done outside of the mojo app Feb 22 05:39:56 may need to be coded into the upstartservicemgr service somehow Feb 22 05:40:27 rwhitby: :D Feb 22 05:40:40 I don't want to come out with my super duper Service Manager app in the release builds if it is going to cause a ton of questions for you Feb 22 05:40:50 rwhitby: what confuses me is that it worked once Feb 22 05:41:02 rwhitby: I tried right after I installed it and it didn't work Feb 22 05:41:15 if you executed nano while in one of those folders then it would work Feb 22 05:41:18 I tried some time later (this is with "terminal" application) and it worked, although I couldn't navigate Feb 22 05:41:23 and it hasn't worked since then Feb 22 05:41:27 Feb 22 05:41:39 were you in one of the folders that the nano binary is located in? Feb 22 05:41:41 nn7: update feeds and install the new vesion Feb 22 05:41:45 if so it would run Feb 22 05:44:27 rwhitby: did you see my questions about a possible solution? Feb 22 05:44:50 So what should I do to fix the rest of the patches that showed up in the output of EFV? Feb 22 05:45:10 if they are a ca.canuck software patch, uninstall and reinstall though QI Feb 22 05:45:21 if it is an org.webosinternals patch uninstall and reinstall through preware Feb 22 05:45:36 for the other patches you are gonna have to talk to the creator of those ipk's Feb 22 05:45:42 sup folks? Feb 22 05:45:53 they give me errors, so im guessing you'll want the ipkg log? Feb 22 05:46:36 rwhitby: is there any way to navigate in nano without a directional pad? Feb 22 05:47:08 errors on uninstall or on reinstall Feb 22 05:47:31 are you doing this through terminal on the phone? Feb 22 05:47:50 On install, because Preware and WOSQI don't recognize them as installed Feb 22 05:47:52 try holding gesture and uising 2,4,6,8 as a d-pad Feb 22 05:48:34 yeah, IPKG log Feb 22 05:49:16 http://webos.pastebin.com/m31121225 Feb 22 05:49:54 yeah, my pastebin still no workie... Feb 22 05:49:59 I don't know wth is going on with it Feb 22 05:50:25 email then? Feb 22 05:50:42 yeah Feb 22 05:50:51 can you see my pastebin I jsut made under recent posts? Feb 22 05:51:26 http://webos.pastebin.com/m6f5e1b01 Feb 22 05:51:35 I wonder if it is happening both ways... Feb 22 05:51:42 rwhitby: that worked, thanks! Feb 22 05:51:45 if so, it could be a load balancer issue Feb 22 05:52:11 nn7: the d-pad thing? that was me not rwhitby lol Feb 22 05:52:18 woah, formatting is all whack through novaterm Feb 22 05:52:30 cryptk|work: the executable not in the path Feb 22 05:52:33 cryptk|work: just installed upstart mgr, it shows mhs as running....the problem is i dont have that anymore. i removed it because i couldnt get it to work. Feb 22 05:52:35 ahh Feb 22 05:52:44 any idea how to get rid of it Feb 22 05:52:55 hmm.. formatting is whack on the phone's terminal application too Feb 22 05:53:10 uhhh no. What's also weird is that after i had deleted all the other posts, they showed up again when i viewed the recent post i posted. but if i look at someone else's, they disappear and only the recent one shows Feb 22 05:53:29 my phone also has mobilehotspotd as running Feb 22 05:53:44 it could be part of fretether, may not be Feb 22 05:53:47 is there any place to put bug reports? terminal has a bunch of them Feb 22 05:53:54 it may be something native on the phone Feb 22 05:54:08 nn7: bugs in terminal? nevar Feb 22 05:54:13 :D Feb 22 05:54:36 sslow: but sadly, I don't support the services themselves, only the app Feb 22 05:55:08 nn7: see if the bug is already listed here Feb 22 05:55:09 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Application_talk:Terminal Feb 22 05:55:15 if not, it is a wiki, add it in Feb 22 05:55:24 cryptk|work: no I understand that...was just curious if you knew how to remove it Feb 22 05:55:44 no clue, it may be a service that is there natively in 1.3.5 Feb 22 05:55:59 cryptk|work: oic Feb 22 05:56:00 as in it comes with 1.3.5 and was there all along and freetether and such jsut use it Feb 22 05:56:08 it is Feb 22 05:56:24 ahh, see sslow, nothing to worry about Feb 22 05:56:27 it is supposed to be there Feb 22 05:56:49 but thanks for trying the app! let me know if you have any other questions Feb 22 05:57:20 it took me a good 12 hours of blood sweat and tears to learn enough mojo and freshen up on Javascript to make it Feb 22 05:57:27 (12 total, across 2 or 3 days) Feb 22 05:57:38 anyway, bbiab, govt mandated smoke break time Feb 22 05:57:42 cryptk|work: thats good..ive been cleanig my Pre and running patchless for about a week now then I saw that and wondered how i missed that Feb 22 05:57:57 why go patchless? Feb 22 05:58:08 AUPT will take care of it when OTA time comes Feb 22 05:58:11 (I hope) Feb 22 05:58:25 anyway, bbiab Feb 22 05:58:40 cryptk|work: just testing some of my patches to see if they slow it down any! Feb 22 05:59:40 ahh Feb 22 06:00:04 glad to see some people are testing the app I wrote (it is my first one) Feb 22 06:00:24 nn7: yeah, novaterm is a little whack Feb 22 06:00:29 cryptk|work: not worried about aupt! lol worst case we have to dr. Feb 22 06:00:49 sslow: indeed Feb 22 06:01:04 and I used the patch that lets you email all your contacts in a vcard Feb 22 06:01:17 then I imported that vcard into my google contacts account Feb 22 06:01:22 so now I have everything in one place Feb 22 06:01:34 if I have to doctor it is real wasy for me to get back up now Feb 22 06:01:40 dtzWill: connection problems? Feb 22 06:01:44 cryptk|work: anyway thanks for the hard work you do Feb 22 06:01:58 sslow: it wasn't that hard, but thanks! Feb 22 06:02:14 I don't work nearly as hard as some other people in here Feb 22 06:02:24 cryptk|work: yeah I can dr and be back in 30 mins Feb 22 06:02:24 is there any way to repeat the last line in terminal? (such as pressing the up arrow in bash) Feb 22 06:02:38 gesture + 8 Feb 22 06:02:56 gesture + 2,4,6,8 is how you do arrow keys in terminal Feb 22 06:03:17 what is "gesture"? Feb 22 06:03:28 the gesture area Feb 22 06:03:29 neither touching the screen or the little LED indicator work Feb 22 06:03:31 below the screen Feb 22 06:03:45 and is it gesture + blob + c? Feb 22 06:03:48 to the left or the right of the center button Feb 22 06:03:49 i think we're trying to call that meta-tap or something now Feb 22 06:03:57 oh, my bad Feb 22 06:04:00 metatap 8 Feb 22 06:04:02 lol Feb 22 06:04:21 the gesture area is the spot below the screen to the left and right of the center button Feb 22 06:04:42 tap it until the center LED lights up (hold your finder on it) then press 8 while holding your finger there Feb 22 06:04:46 that is up-arrow Feb 22 06:04:48 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Application:Terminal#Operating_notes Feb 22 06:04:49 holding down gesture, tapping blob, tapping 8, letting go of gesture -> displays 8 and reduces the terminal to card view Feb 22 06:05:06 what do you mean tapping blob? Feb 22 06:05:20 don't press the orange button Feb 22 06:05:24 that's the term I usually see for it, "blob" and "orange" Feb 22 06:05:26 just the button that has the 8 on it Feb 22 06:05:27 cryptk|work: if he dont have orange then he dont have center button either..lol damn verizon lol Feb 22 06:05:30 although it's a white square on mine Feb 22 06:05:38 yeah, don't use that button Feb 22 06:05:45 just gesture and the button that has the 8 on it Feb 22 06:05:59 no orange (or white, or grey, or whatever) Feb 22 06:06:08 oh, I see it says "gesture" at the top when I hit that Feb 22 06:06:15 well... "esture" Feb 22 06:06:19 err, 2 would be up... not 8 Feb 22 06:06:41 AHHH!!! Feb 22 06:06:44 there we go Feb 22 06:06:46 but gesture + 2,4,6,8 (without the orange/white button) Feb 22 06:06:48 yep Feb 22 06:07:01 that wiki page I posted has all the keyboard shortcuts for it Feb 22 06:07:16 liek how to do a | and whatnot Feb 22 06:07:26 yeah Feb 22 06:07:32 | = pipe Feb 22 06:07:35 cryptk|work: whats that url Feb 22 06:07:37 there's still the bug when you try to look up those shortcuts on the phone Feb 22 06:07:43 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Application:Terminal#Operating_notes Feb 22 06:07:43 I edited the wiki Feb 22 06:08:00 cryptk|work: thanks Feb 22 06:08:14 oh, how it clears the terminal Feb 22 06:08:44 any way to remove the painful contrasting colors? Feb 22 06:09:09 for some reason red and blue are really hard to read unless the brightness is up really high Feb 22 06:09:11 maybe it's just my eyes Feb 22 06:09:33 nn7: you old like me? lol Feb 22 06:09:39 sslow: getting there Feb 22 06:09:55 preferances. Feb 22 06:10:05 nn7: 42 with the eyes of a 60 year old Feb 22 06:10:16 webizard: yeah, those seem to be ignored Feb 22 06:10:44 cryptk|work: curved screen edge cuts of letters in all four corners Feb 22 06:10:46 mine isn't red/blue Feb 22 06:10:54 yeah, that one is in there already Feb 22 06:10:57 working here. changed it to bold and everything else typed in just bold Feb 22 06:11:09 I am going to work on a fix for that once my Upstart Manager is in a more finished state Feb 22 06:11:11 both novaterm and terminal come up with a red and blue prompt Feb 22 06:11:41 on your computer or on the pre? Feb 22 06:11:50 ohh... I late to the topic then. Feb 22 06:11:58 cryptk|work: novaterm on the computer, terminal on the pre Feb 22 06:12:31 I *think* novaterm was white until I installed preware Feb 22 06:12:47 nn7: novaterm and preware are not related in any way Feb 22 06:12:55 installing preware will not efect novaterm Feb 22 06:13:00 ok Feb 22 06:13:13 cryptk|work: did you get my email with my ipkg log? Feb 22 06:13:17 for the terminal app, go into it's app menu, prefrences and set it to white and black Feb 22 06:13:27 cryptk|work: it's set to white and black Feb 22 06:13:31 gollyzila: yeah, haven't had a chance to look at it yet, I am now though Feb 22 06:13:38 thanks Feb 22 06:13:38 nn7: try setting it to something else, then setting it back Feb 22 06:14:35 cryptk|work: I set it to green on magenta. I still have a red path, a blue username and #, then a green cursor Feb 22 06:14:51 and this is inside the terminal app on the pre right? Feb 22 06:14:58 yup Feb 22 06:14:58 not on your computer Feb 22 06:15:09 odd... Feb 22 06:15:12 mine doesn't have that Feb 22 06:15:41 I find it suspect that novaterm is identical Feb 22 06:17:55 gollyzila: seems the patch did not isntall cleanly Feb 22 06:18:15 and you are sure that it doesn't show as isntalled in QI? Feb 22 06:18:15 cryptk|work: for both of them? Feb 22 06:18:37 yeah Feb 22 06:18:43 nn7: if you use squarify corners tweak in wosqi it clears up the cut off corners in terminal Feb 22 06:18:47 could be the AUPT-2 bug, maybe not Feb 22 06:19:01 sslow: I am going to work on a different solution... Feb 22 06:19:02 bbiab Feb 22 06:19:27 oops, don't cat /etc/terminfo/l/linux Feb 22 06:19:50 cryptk|work: nope both of them do not show in WOSQI Feb 22 06:19:52 cryptk|work: im sure you can come up w/ a better way....just a workaround for now Feb 22 06:21:33 cryptk|work: found it, my environment variables has PS1 with what looks like ansi color codes Feb 22 06:21:43 just have to figure out how to unset that by default Feb 22 06:23:05 I found a /etc/skel/.bashrc which sets a clean PS1 but I don't start in bash when I start up terminal or novaterm Feb 22 06:28:45 nn7: i think you are interested in /etc/profile Feb 22 06:30:48 thanks Feb 22 06:32:03 hmm.. that doesn't have the funky color definitions, either Feb 22 06:32:13 ugh! 1:30am est time for precentral to crawl Feb 22 06:32:49 sslow: what do you mean? Feb 22 06:33:30 cryptk|work: I found it in /etc/profile.d/mobi.optware.bash Feb 22 06:33:45 gollyzila: every night between 1 and 2 est precentral slows to a crawl ..timeout eror Feb 22 06:33:46 even though I don't start up in bash, that file colors my prompt Feb 22 06:34:24 oooooohhh Feb 22 06:35:06 you're actually right, why is that? Feb 22 06:35:30 gollyzila: not sur if they are updating the servers or what but its really annoying...lol Feb 22 06:35:59 gollyzila: i mean EVERY NIGHT at this time. Feb 22 06:36:24 or day depending on where you are Feb 22 06:37:25 maybe cause most of the US is dark at this time. cause over here on the pacific side its 10:37 Feb 22 06:37:33 and if you try to post it almost always double posts it Feb 22 06:37:36 precentral is nice and fast for me Feb 22 06:37:54 must be some server between you and precentral Feb 22 06:38:22 I modified the sshd settings, is there any easy way to restart services on the phone or do I need to reboot? Feb 22 06:38:24 nn7: yeah, notice the loop at line 35 in /etc/profile Feb 22 06:38:25 cryptk|work: maybe but its every night like clockwork haha Feb 22 06:38:33 nn7: what service? Feb 22 06:38:53 sshd Feb 22 06:39:12 eieio: ahh.. thanks. I just used find and while and grep Feb 22 06:39:19 find|while;grep Feb 22 06:40:35 nn7: I am not seeing a sshd service on my phone, let me check if I have openssh installed or not Feb 22 06:40:52 I have to doctor alot from testing weird stuff so I lose track of what I have installed Feb 22 06:41:11 weird as in bootloaders and such Feb 22 06:41:23 eh, "reboot" works fine in terminal Feb 22 06:42:13 bootloaders, eh? Feb 22 06:42:19 yes Feb 22 06:42:22 nothing working yet Feb 22 06:43:30 nn7: duh... I didn't see it in my app because it isn't a service, lol Feb 22 06:43:32 it is a daemon Feb 22 06:43:33 anyone know what luna rescan does? Feb 22 06:43:38 yes Feb 22 06:43:48 what's the difference between a service and a daemon? Feb 22 06:43:49 it rescans the /media/cryptofs for new apps Feb 22 06:43:54 ahh, thanks Feb 22 06:44:14 a daemon si just a program that runs and waits for input basically Feb 22 06:44:28 then once it starts getting input it does something with it Feb 22 06:45:10 hahaha Feb 22 06:45:16 once the daemon si done doing it's thing, it go's back to waiting Feb 22 06:45:20 i typed ps auxw for the first time and saw the java command line Feb 22 06:45:35 a service starts up, and when it finishes doing it's thing, it stops Feb 22 06:45:36 this is what a call a command line gone horribly wrong Feb 22 06:46:22 yeah Feb 22 06:46:31 *sigh* java Feb 22 06:46:35 what are we ever going to do with you Feb 22 06:46:49 yeah Feb 22 06:46:56 nn7: http://www.cyberciti.biz/tips/what-is-the-difference-between-a-daemon-and-a-server-process.html explains the difference Feb 22 06:47:19 typically clients talk to daemons Feb 22 06:47:23 daemons call a service Feb 22 06:47:33 not always the case, but typically Feb 22 06:47:52 I guess I'm just used to fedora where I "service restart sshd" Feb 22 06:48:07 and some services never stop until the computer turns off, that doesn't make them daemons, just means they never finish Feb 22 06:48:17 their job is done when you are done using the computer Feb 22 06:48:27 those kind of walk the line between a service and a daemon Feb 22 06:48:39 ok, thanks Feb 22 06:49:00 ryanhope Feb 22 06:49:15 but as far as being able to stop and start actual services, I put an app in the testing feed just a few hours ago that lets you do just that Feb 22 06:49:24 it is called Upstart Manager Feb 22 06:49:31 testing feed only for now though Feb 22 06:49:49 not to be confused with /var/usr/sbin/org.webosinternals.upstartmgr ? Feb 22 06:50:02 it is related to, but not the same Feb 22 06:50:17 Upstart Manager is an app to give a GUI to upstartmgr Feb 22 06:50:47 without upstartmgr it is useless (and if you try and install it without upstartmgr preware will ask to install it) Feb 22 06:58:19 hey cryptk|work, were you able to find out what i should do about my "corrupt"patches? Feb 22 06:58:44 I am not sure what corrupted them... I don't know what all those other patches modified Feb 22 06:59:16 I would have to go with rwhitby's advice of do a full erase and a doctor... typically if he recommends that, then it is about the onyl solution Feb 22 06:59:38 and without knowing the details of those patches or what scripts they use it is hard to tell what they could have done Feb 22 07:00:02 Oh, I'm just talking about the patches that were in the ipkg log that i emailed you Feb 22 07:00:07 in the future, only install patches through preware OR .patch files through QI Feb 22 07:00:13 no pre-packaged IPK's Feb 22 07:00:16 those are found in Preware Feb 22 07:00:25 one sec phone Feb 22 07:06:03 that is the thing Feb 22 07:06:20 the other patches could have modified those files, or it could have been any number of things Feb 22 07:06:36 but something kept those patches from uninstalling cleanly Feb 22 07:07:11 one sec, phone again Feb 22 07:08:21 well I remember when AUPT first came out, Landscape messaging was giving errors when i tried to uninstall it. egaudet said that it was probably the order that i installed all the messaging patches. So i switched up the order and landscape messaging installed fine. and regarding named pages.... Feb 22 07:10:28 I had it installed with the 4x4 v3 patch and everything was fine and dandy. then the new AUPT-3 came out and i uninstalled named pages but the effects of the patch stuck. Then the 4x4 v4 with no arrows patch came out and i uninstalled v3 and then installed v4...... Feb 22 07:11:42 v4 named pages didn't mix and my launcher had no icons. i uninstalled v4, reinstalled v3, and now I have 4x4 v3 and a stuck named pages patch (which doesn't show as installed in Preware and WOSQI) Feb 22 07:16:44 back again Feb 22 07:16:53 sorry, I work at a helpdesk, so if the phone rings I have to work Feb 22 07:17:11 and there is a call in the queue... whatcha wanna bet I get it, lol Feb 22 07:17:49 yep, brb Feb 22 07:23:20 ok, finally off the phone Feb 22 07:23:47 wooh Feb 22 07:23:53 I honestly don't know what to do to fix it... you said EPR didn't get rid of them right? Feb 22 07:24:47 I would say run the WebOS repair Utility but I think there is a bug in the current version that makes it stop after a few files Feb 22 07:24:48 I said that I prefer I didn't EPR. Feb 22 07:25:05 ahh Feb 22 07:25:09 may be your only choice Feb 22 07:25:20 run EPR and the EFV and see if it comes out ok Feb 22 07:25:39 those patches may be stuck because of something modified by those pre-packaged IPK's Feb 22 07:25:54 there is no telling what scripts are used in those, and no telling what files they modified Feb 22 07:25:59 so if you installed a patch Feb 22 07:26:09 then one of those was not installed cleanly because of bad scripts Feb 22 07:26:13 and it modified those files Feb 22 07:26:16 it could cause problems Feb 22 07:26:17 phone... Feb 22 07:27:59 There currently isn't a way to have Preware save a list of your installed patches and have it install them right after an EPR, right? Feb 22 07:28:06 (please say no) Feb 22 07:28:15 i mean Feb 22 07:29:18 say "Yes! There is a way. It was just developed yesterday and you're going to be the first release-candidate user!" Feb 22 07:31:36 Yes! There is a way. It was just developed yesterday and you're going to be the first release-candidate user! Feb 22 07:31:52 if you want to hear lies, I can tell lies, lol Feb 22 07:31:59 lol Feb 22 07:32:11 I need a good photo hosting site Feb 22 07:32:22 I see webos supports facebook and photobucket Feb 22 07:32:39 I use photobucket Feb 22 07:32:41 I don't do facebook, and I don't exactly trust photobucket because it's "free" Feb 22 07:33:03 I don't see anything about making accss controlled albums Feb 22 07:33:07 I guess it's EPR for me then. Man, 62 patch installs.......one by one Feb 22 07:33:25 /cs/ces/s Feb 22 07:33:40 ~~~ Feb 22 07:33:42 ~~~ Feb 22 07:33:44 ~~~~~ Feb 22 07:33:46 grrrr Feb 22 07:34:06 ~botsmack Feb 22 07:34:08 OWW! Feb 22 07:34:32 woah, wtf? Feb 22 07:34:42 let me try Feb 22 07:34:46 ~botsmack Feb 22 07:34:47 OWW! Feb 22 07:34:51 COOL!!! Feb 22 07:36:30 Running EPR Feb 22 07:38:56 jacques: dunno. I guess maybe we need gallery on webos-internals.org Feb 22 07:39:30 jacques: there's always google picasa web albums Feb 22 07:40:33 rwhitby: I want to upload the pics I took, but we need an access controlled area Feb 22 07:40:45 jacques: nslu2-linux gallery? Feb 22 07:40:52 where pics can be staged until we decide to publish them Feb 22 07:41:24 jacques: rsync to mason? Feb 22 07:43:05 rwhitby: mason? Feb 22 07:44:18 jacques: I think you can make a private album on photobucket Feb 22 07:44:23 www.search2.net Feb 22 07:44:47 make a webos-internals photobucket account, make a private album... upload them to there and only give the username/pass out to the people that should have it Feb 22 07:45:07 then everyone with pics on their pre or cameras can upload them into there Feb 22 07:45:20 jsut an idea Feb 22 07:46:16 Man EPR is taking a while Feb 22 07:46:16 rwhitby: can you show me an example jps query and an example return? Feb 22 07:46:18 I'll make an account on photobucket and check it out Feb 22 07:46:23 I would check it out myself but I am at work Feb 22 07:46:41 I am brainstorming ways around the whole "why is my ipkg service not running" problem Feb 22 07:47:15 jacques: I have an account on there, but I have never done a private album... I am pretty sure it is possible though, I think I have seen private albums before Feb 22 07:47:36 gollyzila: the more patches you have the longer it takes Feb 22 07:48:06 I don't know if EPR will even fix those or not... Feb 22 07:48:26 cryptk|work: i hope it does. Phone is restarting Feb 22 07:49:38 after it restarts re-run efv Feb 22 07:49:46 will do Feb 22 07:50:21 phone again Feb 22 07:50:42 aha. I thought there must be a pay version of photobucket, it just was not mentioned at all on their site until I signed up Feb 22 07:52:04 Have you guys seen the recent Overclocking thread? It looks like the developer is getting almost all positive feed back from his "patches". Would you guys recommend people don't install it? Feb 22 07:52:12 I'm getting the pre Feb 22 07:52:15 lol Feb 22 07:52:22 getting the prO Feb 22 07:52:33 version of photobucket Feb 22 07:53:10 And did you hear? He and his partner have been able to overclock to 800mhz with a custom kernel Feb 22 07:53:41 cryptk|work: jps is a command line program Feb 22 07:54:54 gollyzila: yep, I'm working with them to make sure it's as fail-safe as possible for those people who's Pre will not run at that speed. Feb 22 07:56:07 rwhitby: This is exciting. So far, has it exploded anybody's Pre yet? Feb 22 07:56:21 rwhitby: I know it is a command line... I am wondering if there is a way to query it and compare it to the service names in /etc/event.d Feb 22 07:56:31 and then find if a java thread for those services is running Feb 22 07:56:49 then maybe add in a new method to the upstartmgr service, something liek a listjava method Feb 22 07:57:11 and then I can use that list to mark a service as running even though it isn't (because it's thread is running) Feb 22 07:57:23 cryptk|work: yep Feb 22 07:57:38 it would have to be queried in the upstartmgr service though, I don't think I can do that in a mojo app Feb 22 07:57:50 so we can work-around the problem, but not without a change to upstart service Feb 22 07:57:58 right Feb 22 07:58:11 so... let me know once you guys get the upstart service changed Feb 22 07:58:18 and tell me the new method name Feb 22 07:58:34 if you can have it return as similar to the list method as possible that would be great Feb 22 07:58:51 gollyzila: no information revealed yet Feb 22 07:58:57 uh oh. EFV says Detected stock files modified via a method other than supported patch technologies: File: /usr/bin/PmNetConfigManager Feb 22 07:59:03 I would keep them seperate though, I may at some point add in a toggle for it in prefrences Feb 22 07:59:20 gollyzila: re how the overclock patches are being implemented. Feb 22 07:59:33 also if you could add in a way to stop a services java thread Feb 22 07:59:43 probably through adjusting the clockspeed settings in the kernel Feb 22 07:59:47 jhojho: oh okay, my apologies. Feb 22 07:59:48 I can restart the thread by just starting the service so I don't need one to start a thread Feb 22 08:00:29 no rush though, just ping me if you ever do it (it is to your benefit, lol) Feb 22 08:01:17 I'm waiting to see the patch. I took a quick browse through the kernel a couple of days ago and think I know what needs to be changed but I need to go through in detail before trying any changes and figured if someone else was working on it already to let them take a stab at it first Feb 22 08:01:54 I did try using clipcarl's script+binary though and it seems to be stable wrt to setting things to 600mhz Feb 22 08:02:12 and the upside is no changes needed to the LunaSysMgr binary Feb 22 08:02:25 *and* the clockspeed is set to 250mhz when the lcd is off Feb 22 08:02:32 lunch time Feb 22 08:04:37 hmm, one of the features of photobucket pro account is ftp upload, but I sure can't find it on their site Feb 22 08:04:46 and they use a hell of a lot of flash for my taste Feb 22 08:07:02 cryptk|work: it's written, now to debug Feb 22 08:07:05 nm, found it in the help Feb 22 08:07:29 gollyzila: PmNetConfigManager is MyTether modifications Feb 22 08:07:48 cryptk|work: I don't know how to stop and start the java threads Feb 22 08:08:30 lol, I don't even have a ftp client on this machine Feb 22 08:08:59 not counting wget, which cannot put AFAIK Feb 22 08:13:19 rwhitby: I have MyTether so that's fine right? Feb 22 08:15:16 http://webos.pastebin.com/d76db90cf I'm getting this error when tryign to install app-launcher-named-pages-v6.patch through WOSQI Feb 22 08:17:41 morning Feb 22 08:17:50 howdy, swisstomcat Feb 22 08:18:38 ~seen rwhitby Feb 22 08:18:38 howdy christefano thanks again for helping with the scale booth Feb 22 08:18:40 rwhitby is currently on #webos-internals (20h 20m 40s) #oe (20h 20m 40s) #meego (20h 20m 40s) #nslu2-linux (20h 20m 40s). Has said a total of 101 messages. Is idling for 10m 51s, last said: 'cryptk|work: I don't know how to stop and start the java threads'. Feb 22 08:18:59 how many devices were given away? Feb 22 08:19:00 jacques: thanks! it was a great time. were you there? Feb 22 08:19:15 swisstomcat: 2 Sprint Pres and 1 Sprint Pixi Feb 22 08:19:45 did you have a contest? Feb 22 08:19:57 cryptk|work: new method is 'jps', and returns 'threads' instead of 'jobs', with only 'name' defined. In testing feed now. Feb 22 08:20:06 hey swisstomcat Feb 22 08:20:09 g'day Feb 22 08:20:20 christefano: yeah, thanks for your help! Feb 22 08:20:29 swisstomcat: there was a raffle at the end. I don't know how we pulled it off but it was on the loudspeaker and everybody in the conference hall was aware it was happening. Feb 22 08:20:30 i see that the preware not working thread is a bit more active Feb 22 08:20:39 but still no official word from palm Feb 22 08:21:48 rwhitby: thanks, but it was really my pleasure. :) Feb 22 08:21:52 christefano: I hear you got video of it too :-) Feb 22 08:22:03 i wish LA was not that far away Feb 22 08:22:15 swisstomcat: I don't ;-) Feb 22 08:22:16 there was someone with a video camera but I don't know who Feb 22 08:22:38 well, i wouldn't want to live in LA .. that's for sure Feb 22 08:22:46 santa barbara would be pretty cool Feb 22 08:23:00 swisstomcat: I used to feel that way but I had a 6 month gig in Los Angeles and liked it so much I stayed Feb 22 08:23:13 Santa Barbara's gorgeous Feb 22 08:23:36 for me LA is just too big Feb 22 08:23:47 yeah, it's pretty huge Feb 22 08:23:48 christefano: yeah I was running the booth Feb 22 08:24:00 what did you show at the booth? Feb 22 08:24:22 jacques: cool! I haven't figured out everybody's nicks and government names yet Feb 22 08:24:23 jacques, christefano: can you guys answer a question for me? Feb 22 08:24:33 rwhitby: I'll try, shoot Feb 22 08:24:49 http://twitter.com/Dijitek/status/9444713403 Feb 22 08:25:06 I'll reply with exactly what you say Feb 22 08:26:00 mousey's pitch to people was pretty excellent. "it's not a phone. it's a linux box, shaped like a phone." Feb 22 08:26:10 he knew his audience Feb 22 08:27:27 I'd say, "the reception was tremendous. half the attendees signed up for the raffle, and the booth even attracted Palm employees!" Feb 22 08:27:42 http://webos.pastebin.com/d76db90cf I'm getting this error when tryign to install app-launcher-named-pages-v6.patch through WOSQI Feb 22 08:27:57 Can someone help me please? Feb 22 08:28:02 I just ran EPR too Feb 22 08:28:32 10 of 40 images uploaded Feb 22 08:29:24 rwhitby: many people left the booth saying they were seriously considering a webos phone after playing with the demos Feb 22 08:29:43 very good Feb 22 08:30:22 the thing that got the most "wow"s was when I told people palm has instructions on their site for getting root Feb 22 08:31:02 I showed a lot of people the cost comparison by billshrink and they seemed impressed Feb 22 08:31:03 followed by when I mentioned how supportive palm has been of our project Feb 22 08:32:00 I liked how the guy from Palm kept correcting us whenever we said how hackable the phone is Feb 22 08:32:07 "accessible!" Feb 22 08:32:19 christefano: :-) Feb 22 08:32:36 who was it? chuq with a false beard and sunglasses? Feb 22 08:32:46 haha Feb 22 08:33:11 it was Matthew Tippet, the kernel programmer or team lead Feb 22 08:33:34 I'm not clear on what his title is Feb 22 08:33:34 he told me he was kernel team lead Feb 22 08:33:42 ah Feb 22 08:33:51 but then said something about also being community relations Feb 22 08:34:04 huh, I didn't know that Feb 22 08:34:24 the ex-AMD guy? Feb 22 08:34:28 he wants me to send him the logs from my phone when it locks up :-) Feb 22 08:34:42 nice Feb 22 08:35:24 gotta go. it was fun today, thanks again jacques! Feb 22 08:35:28 http://www.brightsideofnews.com/news/2009/11/24/matthew-tippet2c-ex-amd-linux-guru-joins-palm.aspx Feb 22 08:35:34 thank YOU christefano Feb 22 08:35:39 was just reading that article too Feb 22 08:36:02 any time. I'm happy to be at the next one, too Feb 22 08:36:08 oh man if only I'd know that then Feb 22 08:36:49 he's the guy in the white shirt in the pics from sat Feb 22 08:37:23 jacques: had he run any of our SDL games? Feb 22 08:37:41 and did he have Preware on his device ;-) Feb 22 08:37:46 he didn't mention it Feb 22 08:38:04 he told someone at the booth he had preware Feb 22 08:38:23 it was either mousey or christefano who related that to me Feb 22 08:39:02 21 of 40 images uploader Feb 22 08:39:06 uploaded Feb 22 08:40:23 http://webos.pastebin.com/d76db90cf Anyone know why I'm getting this error when tryign to install app-launcher-named-pages-v6.patch through WOSQI even though I just ran EPR? Feb 22 08:46:48 gollyzila: EPR only removes patches that it knows about, and which were installed using APT or AUPT. Feb 22 08:47:21 gollyzila: if something else has modified a file in a conflicting way, then you'll probably need to visit the doctor to get things sensible again Feb 22 08:49:49 I guess something is conflicting cause when I have 4x4 v4 and Named Pages in Launcher both installed, my launcher icons disappear. If i uninstall one of the patches, my icons reappear Feb 22 08:50:12 perhaps those two patches conflict Feb 22 08:51:25 yeah. I read on the forums that both of them modify the up arrow image in the launcher Feb 22 08:55:00 rwhitby: just saw your chats in scrollback, nice work man Feb 22 08:55:13 do the names it returns match the names of their services? Feb 22 08:55:30 cryptk|work: the do for org.webosinternals ones Feb 22 08:56:02 I am sure if the canucksoftware ones don't we can get Jason to change them Feb 22 08:56:59 cryptk|work: they will too - Jason contributes to and uses best practices. Feb 22 08:57:51 I am going to jus match services that have a period in their names and call those 'safe' and ones without periods 'dangerous'... if at some point in the future palm comes out with a service with a perios in it I will re-tool it then (while cursing at palm for breaking their current format) Feb 22 08:59:59 I found info on how to stop a java thread Feb 22 09:00:13 but it looks like the current code may have to be re-written a tad to make it work... Feb 22 09:00:13 http://www.devx.com/tips/Tip/31728 Feb 22 09:01:06 basically you have to add a method into the java threads and when you call that method it makes them stop Feb 22 09:01:13 doesn't look like there is a one stop shop for killing them Feb 22 09:01:23 outside of maybe killing by PID or something Feb 22 09:22:20 I love it how dtzWill_ comes and go's constantly throughout the night Feb 22 09:23:15 at some point I need to make a Wiki page for this thing... especially since I have one set as the homepage for it in the makefile, lol Feb 22 09:32:06 Pictures of the winners at the WebOS Internals booth at SCALE8x: http://twitpic.com/photos/webosinternals Feb 22 09:32:48 nice Feb 22 09:33:01 JayCanuck: your services, the java threads they spawn, do they use the same name as the services themselves? Feb 22 09:33:45 how do you mean Feb 22 09:35:22 I don't specify a custom thread name, so I believe thread name is auto-generated by the jvm Feb 22 09:39:31 i wonder if i could organize a booth at the swiss open source conference next month Feb 22 09:42:16 Should be all good then Feb 22 09:42:32 it is for my Upstart Manager that I was privmsging you about Feb 22 09:43:58 looks like the sign-up is already over :( Feb 22 09:56:20 yawn Feb 22 09:56:27 sup? Feb 22 09:56:51 nm Feb 22 10:12:32 indeed Feb 22 10:17:41 cryptk|work: so it works? Feb 22 10:18:17 haven't tried it yet Feb 22 10:18:26 at work, have to wait until I get home to try it Feb 22 10:24:47 no eclipse, or git, or emulator here Feb 22 10:24:49 lol Feb 22 10:48:52 rwhitby: I think I am going to re-write my 3 or 4 different functions that actually do the starting stopping and listing into just one function Feb 22 10:49:02 and just pass that function a parameter for what I want to do Feb 22 11:28:28 apparently they still have available spaces at the openexpo in switzerland Feb 22 11:29:05 who organized the booth in LA? Feb 22 11:29:17 speaking about open... someone at work jsut sent out a mass chat about discounted Microsift Office for Government employees... so I sent out a mass chat about OpenOffice being free for everyone, lol Feb 22 11:29:55 hehe, good idea Feb 22 11:30:23 ping rwhitby Feb 22 11:30:25 along with a link to OpenOffice.org Feb 22 11:42:16 rwhitby: Feb 22 11:42:26 ~seen rwhitby Feb 22 11:42:27 rwhitby is currently on #webos-internals (23h 44m 27s) #oe (23h 44m 27s) #meego (23h 44m 27s) #nslu2-linux (23h 44m 27s). Has said a total of 121 messages. Is idling for 1h 24m 46s, last said: 'cryptk|work: so it works?'. Feb 22 11:47:39 went to bed? Feb 22 11:48:03 anyone who organized the booth at scale? Feb 22 11:48:06 know Feb 22 12:01:59 no clue Feb 22 12:37:48 anyone tried to close an app via window.close()? Feb 22 13:00:16 swisstomcat, I have Feb 22 13:00:38 it doesn't work .. but i wonder if i should even have a "quit" button Feb 22 13:00:40 well, technically this.controller.window.close() Feb 22 13:00:54 this.controller.window.close() works for me Feb 22 13:01:14 the question is if it's good behaviour Feb 22 13:01:19 it is Feb 22 13:01:29 palm's documents seems to imply it's fine Feb 22 13:01:39 usually app don't have a "quit" button Feb 22 13:01:40 however, App Catalog guidelines state your app shouldn't have a quit button if you want it to be accepted Feb 22 13:01:52 ah, i see Feb 22 13:02:02 i better leave it out then :) Feb 22 13:02:17 for the record though, to quote palm: Feb 22 13:02:22 Mojo.Controller.appController.closeAllStages() and Mojo.Controller.appController.closeStage() do not work unless you create the respective stages with createStageWithCallback. This bug will be fixed in a future update. Feb 22 13:02:24 Workaround—Use window.close(), which has the same effect as closeStage(). Feb 22 13:02:36 yeah, i saw that Feb 22 13:03:35 you're the WOQI author, right? Feb 22 13:03:40 only time I've ever used it is with a notification popup alert Feb 22 13:03:42 yea Feb 22 13:03:56 great job .. i have used it many times Feb 22 13:04:10 ty :) Feb 22 13:08:44 guess i'll remove the quit button and let the user decide when to quit Feb 22 13:31:11 time to go home... Feb 22 13:31:15 later WHE's Feb 22 14:29:21 So there's a rumor spreading like fire to remove all patches before the update on the forums Feb 22 14:29:36 is there? Feb 22 14:29:45 i thought AUPT would take care of this? Feb 22 14:29:56 do you have a link? Feb 22 14:30:16 Yes, me too. http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/231739-urgent-announcement-patch-removal-before-1-4-a.html Feb 22 14:30:45 I thought you were always supposed to remove all patches before an update anyway. Feb 22 14:30:59 seems like old news to me Feb 22 14:31:08 I have faith, but it would be nice if someone could confirm or deny Feb 22 14:31:20 I would even suppose to docotor the pre for updating it.... Feb 22 14:31:22 No, not with AUPT technology Feb 22 14:31:37 i'm oldschool. don't know what aupt is Feb 22 14:31:49 same here. what's aupt? Feb 22 14:31:53 sometimes ignorance really is bliss. Feb 22 14:31:59 AutoUpdateTechnology Feb 22 14:32:05 let me check Feb 22 14:32:11 Do you guys not have patches? Feb 22 14:32:22 auto update patch technology Feb 22 14:32:24 ghjm: http://forums.precentral.net/webos-patches/227163-aupt-auto-update-patch-technology.html Feb 22 14:32:34 i have, or had, many but i install then with preware Feb 22 14:32:42 http://forums.precentral.net/webos-patches/230808-update-aupt-version-3-a.html Feb 22 14:32:51 i didn't reinstall any after sprint replaced my pre last week, i figuredi 'd wait till after 1.4 Feb 22 14:33:23 "It is important that you update all of your patches and verify that all patches are installed with the latest aupt-3 patch technology as soon as is convenient " Feb 22 14:33:28 from that thread Feb 22 14:34:46 @swisstomcat- thanks for posting those links. This new rumor started today and the OP is indicating that even with aupt-3 there may be issues. I thought I'd be able to get some feedback from on of the internals group Feb 22 14:35:10 hmm Feb 22 14:35:22 i guess they're all asleep :) Feb 22 14:35:31 i'm not an official member of the team Feb 22 14:36:28 Hmmm... I would assume that rwhitby or egaudet would actually make an announcement if there truly could be issues. We'll just have to wait for them then. Feb 22 14:36:52 yeah, that would be good Feb 22 14:37:18 they they push 1.4 live today? Feb 22 14:37:22 why all the sudden panic? Feb 22 14:38:07 i have no idea Feb 22 14:38:16 the OP is citing some intel Feb 22 14:38:52 where ever he has that from Feb 22 14:39:27 he either is, or wants us to think he is, a palm beta tester under nda. Feb 22 14:39:27 "Nobody" knows when 1.4 will arrive. Hopefully the OP is incorrect, I know how people are with their "intel" Feb 22 14:40:44 i'd wait for official word from the webos-internals people Feb 22 14:40:55 does anyone know how long it takes for sprint to swap ESNs? Feb 22 14:40:56 i can see you, invisibleman Feb 22 14:41:15 why not just epr, then reinstall patches after 1.4? It's not that big a deal. Feb 22 14:41:17 Erm somebody on the forums claims AUPT will not work with 1.4 http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/231739-urgent-announcement-patch-removal-before-1-4-a.html any truth to this? Feb 22 14:41:35 ghjm, because I'm switching phones? Feb 22 14:42:16 we were just talking about that, theinvsbleman Feb 22 14:42:33 i have not heard from the official people about that issue Feb 22 14:42:33 en0x: tool them about 10 seconds for me Feb 22 14:42:56 mikewx, can you do it over chat or u have to call them? Feb 22 14:43:04 en0x: i swapped about a week ago, they just scanned barcode on both and it was done Feb 22 14:43:07 en0x: i did it in store Feb 22 14:43:30 I am personally waiting for an official announcement from someone that knows. Feb 22 14:43:32 swisstomcat, All right are any of the guys that would know here at the moment? Feb 22 14:43:42 mikewx, oh i don't wanan go to the store that's the point... Feb 22 14:43:43 :) Feb 22 14:43:43 i don't think so Feb 22 14:43:49 all right then Feb 22 14:43:56 ~seen egaudet Feb 22 14:44:00 egaudet is currently on #webos-internals (4d 7h 46m 30s). Has said a total of 55 messages. Is idling for 13h 49m, last said: 'root@localhost port 5522'. Feb 22 14:44:10 mikewx, anyway i will get it figured out ;) Feb 22 14:44:24 en0x: Over the phone they always tell me to wait 2 to 4 hours, but I always try in 2 minutes and it always works. Feb 22 14:44:44 ghjm, kk thx for info ;) Feb 22 14:44:54 I just tweeted Jason Feb 22 14:45:01 Maybe he will answer Feb 22 14:46:00 egaudet would be the one to ask Feb 22 14:46:42 No big deal to remove the patches, but redownloading and installing 50+ patches can be time consuming. I'm going to wait for an official announcement before I do anything. Someone has to test out AUPT right? I wil Feb 22 14:47:11 What if 1.4 rearranges disk partitions again, or something like that? There's no way to know 100% what will and won't work. Feb 22 14:47:28 I'm sure we will get an answer before 1.4 frops Feb 22 14:47:30 drops* Feb 22 14:47:46 i don't thinks so that it will rearrange disk partitions Feb 22 14:47:55 i have not heard anything about that Feb 22 14:47:58 I'm not saying it will Feb 22 14:48:19 anyway i don't trust aupt :P Feb 22 14:48:19 I'm saying Palm is free to do any crazy thing they want Feb 22 14:48:29 and have done in the past Feb 22 14:48:43 I know AUPT has been tested so it SHOULD work. Feb 22 14:49:13 tested with 1.4? how, since nobody outside of Palm has it? Feb 22 14:49:18 It is common knowledge that webos-internals gets copies of the new versions to test stuff. Feb 22 14:49:30 they are just under NDA Feb 22 14:49:31 ghjm, there are ppl who have it Feb 22 14:50:10 I trust the webosinternals team, aupt, and everything else they put out. And if something does go bad we always have a doctor. Feb 22 14:50:50 With the hoopla this rumor has caused today I'm sure we will get an official answer before 1.4 hits Feb 22 14:51:00 well so basically aupt v4 is just: patch -R diff then reapply new patch? right? Feb 22 14:51:15 there is no aupt4 Feb 22 14:51:15 [; Feb 22 14:53:07 Trust me they have it tested for 1.4 http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-patches/1.4.0/ Just because WE don't have access doesn't mean THEY don't ;) Feb 22 14:53:19 en0x: I think it also includes a naming convention of where to put a copy of the unpatched file. Feb 22 14:53:41 TheInvsbleMan, :) Feb 22 14:54:12 There is no 1.4.0 feed Feb 22 14:54:19 click that link Feb 22 14:54:26 there is but forbidden Feb 22 14:54:27 :) Feb 22 14:54:28 it's there, you just don't have permission Feb 22 14:54:51 change the 1.4.0 in the link to 1.5.0... you get a different error Feb 22 14:55:08 so yes, the patches are tested Feb 22 14:55:45 If something comes up I'm sure it will be fixed before 1.4. If not I'm sure we will be given different directions Feb 22 14:56:26 wonder when it will drop Feb 22 14:56:54 supposedly the new rumor is on the 25th Feb 22 14:57:01 although since it won't have flash, I'm not sure if I actually care Feb 22 14:57:07 it will drop like it's hot ;D Feb 22 14:57:18 it will have some rudimentary video recording Feb 22 14:57:28 not something i use often, but would be nice to have Feb 22 14:57:46 i wonder if they will rewrite the whole gui to take advantage of gpu in pre Feb 22 14:57:47 You do realize the video recording is going to probably be very good, It is also going to include video editing/uploading Feb 22 14:58:03 but thats maybe in version 2.0 Feb 22 14:58:14 that's one of those things that everyone else seems to care about, but I personally just don't. Feb 22 14:58:27 tim: nope, didn't realize that. i use it quite seldom, but every once in a while it would be nice Feb 22 14:58:49 i used it once on my Centro in all the years I had it, but I caught a building collapse... Feb 22 14:59:06 what building? Feb 22 14:59:07 centro/treo that is Feb 22 14:59:10 i never had a phone with video recording ;d Feb 22 14:59:10 lol Feb 22 14:59:14 I was using the homebrew video recording and it actually was very high quality for a phone Feb 22 14:59:20 was a highrise dorm room at local state college :) Feb 22 14:59:35 planned or accidental? Feb 22 14:59:39 planned Feb 22 14:59:45 oh ok Feb 22 14:59:48 impressive as hell nonetheless Feb 22 15:00:24 I saw them blow up our old convention center, it was pretty cool Feb 22 15:01:12 Prof just announced we are watching clips from Office Space for the rest of class. It's gonna be a good day :) Feb 22 15:02:55 Has anybody had an issue with Calendar not syncing all events from Google? Feb 22 15:04:08 I've had my calendar not sync all events from Exchange Feb 22 15:04:38 http://www.sadistic.pl/shake-that-ass-vt32209.htm nice ass shaking ;) something to start a day ;) Feb 22 15:06:04 This morning the Pre decided not to display my events from my "school" calendar for Mondays and wednesdays, but the events for tuesday and thursday from the same calendar are still there Feb 22 15:06:14 All the events are showing just fine in Googlr Feb 22 15:06:17 Google* Feb 22 15:07:57 I've had it not show on the pre any events created from the pre, even though they all show in exchange Feb 22 15:08:37 i was having that problem with contacts, then i read that they don't sync with All Contacts anymore. maybe something similar with calendar? Feb 22 15:08:41 the only way I got it working again was delete/recreate the calendar account Feb 22 15:09:26 That's what I just did Feb 22 15:09:38 maybe sync would fix it Feb 22 15:09:40 I'll see if it works Feb 22 15:09:46 Nah sync didn't fix Feb 22 15:09:58 I just recreated all my calendar accounts Feb 22 15:10:13 For some reason there were 2 of each account but the 2nd of each was empty hmmm Feb 22 15:10:28 or put the phone in a north magnetic field and burn incense Feb 22 15:10:39 Lol Feb 22 15:10:46 Recreating the accounts worked Feb 22 15:10:53 odd issue but it's fixed Feb 22 15:11:42 who got their pre since day 1 still? Feb 22 15:11:55 I do, but I have had it replaced a few times Feb 22 15:12:03 I just traded my day 1 pre in last week Feb 22 15:12:21 because the touchscreen was intermittently not working Feb 22 15:12:32 my was perfect till 2 weeks ago when it cracked :( Feb 22 15:12:46 Currently I have a refurb, it has a few physical defects but it is the most functional refurb I have gotten yet Feb 22 15:13:04 i will see what kind of refurb i will get today :) Feb 22 15:13:11 I think I have been through 5 or 6 Pre phones already Feb 22 15:13:16 The refurbs always suck Feb 22 15:13:18 lol Feb 22 15:13:27 u got refurbs from sprint or palm? Feb 22 15:13:33 Sprint Feb 22 15:13:35 I have TEP Feb 22 15:13:58 i had tep I cancelled it because they said that i made the crack on my pre and it's not a cosmetic defect Feb 22 15:14:05 [; Feb 22 15:14:19 I got a new, non refurb replacement, I put the invisibleshield stuff on it so hopefully it will stay perfect Feb 22 15:14:21 and if i want to have it replaced i have to pay 100 bucks :) Feb 22 15:14:42 my pre developed a crack in the lower right corner of the face Feb 22 15:14:55 i wish that palm sent me pre with 1.4 webos on it ;D Feb 22 15:14:57 i made them replace it for audio quality issues, they ignored the crack. i have no dep Feb 22 15:14:59 er tep Feb 22 15:15:04 The one I am using currently came with a small crack above the charging port. Also it seems the area around the screen is not painted properly. I see a glow coming through the actual phone around the screen from the backlight Feb 22 15:15:13 I have never paid to have my phone replaced Feb 22 15:15:24 Sprint never makes me pay the deductable Feb 22 15:15:35 i don't believe in tep. phone has 1yr warranty :) Feb 22 15:15:53 In fact unless the damage is your fault you shouldn't have to pay the deductable Feb 22 15:15:54 mikewx, so when it has 1yr warranty u have to go thru manufacturer Feb 22 15:15:57 don't ya? Feb 22 15:16:00 Yes Feb 22 15:16:05 You need to ship it to Palm and wait for it Feb 22 15:16:06 nope Feb 22 15:16:09 really? Feb 22 15:16:12 sprint handles it for me every time Feb 22 15:16:15 maybe i'm lucky Feb 22 15:16:26 where u at? Feb 22 15:16:29 have they been defects or accidental damage? Feb 22 15:16:29 iowa Feb 22 15:16:41 TheInvsbleMan: as far as i'm concerned defects~ Feb 22 15:16:49 i don't abuse my equipment, i go out of my way to care for it Feb 22 15:16:51 Hmmm. Maybe they are just being nice Feb 22 15:17:07 i am sure i did absolutly nothing to cause that crack Feb 22 15:17:07 mine has defect too... crack next to usb port spreadint to the screen Feb 22 15:17:30 never dropped it, never had it in my pocket etc Feb 22 15:17:37 weird, you're saying Sprint is nice in Iowa? Is Santa Claus real there also? Feb 22 15:17:40 i use the belt clip case from palm Feb 22 15:17:47 Sprint is nice in MI and OH Feb 22 15:17:53 ghjm: only once a year Feb 22 15:17:55 They are always very nice to me :) Feb 22 15:17:57 MA suck ;) Feb 22 15:18:22 they give me new customer price evry 12mo on phone too, so when the next pre comes out, all over that Feb 22 15:18:51 this means that u r a premier customer Feb 22 15:18:52 i'm too Feb 22 15:19:41 well but if u upgrade ur phone every 12 months as a premier customer does it extends ur contract too? Feb 22 15:19:42 yeah Feb 22 15:19:49 prolly. haven't tried it yet Feb 22 15:19:56 I'd like the next pre to be dorkily huge, like old wince phones but higher res Feb 22 15:19:58 i'm sure it resets you to 2yr from the upgrade Feb 22 15:20:15 I'm not worried about extending my contract. I have no intention of leaving Sprint Feb 22 15:20:20 but I know it won't be Feb 22 15:20:41 me either, i've been with them since the beginning, about 14-15yrars Feb 22 15:21:19 it's kinda funny Feb 22 15:21:31 As long as my plan looks like this http://img.skitch.com/20100222-q618e8e74sy643u6c56ef6phhh.jpg I am never leaving Sprint Feb 22 15:21:31 their big thing was "month to month no contract" back when they started Feb 22 15:22:00 that's exactly what mine looks like except it has no TEP and a 25% discount :) Feb 22 15:22:10 btw, your ph# is showing Feb 22 15:22:25 lol I just realzied that Feb 22 15:22:28 removed it Feb 22 15:22:46 216, you're in cleveland Feb 22 15:22:56 i'm from that area Feb 22 15:22:56 I just gave your number to the jehovah's witnesses Feb 22 15:23:18 lol Feb 22 15:23:19 http://img.skitch.com/20100222-bx9k7mn16gpup9fkfssgt3ukxa.jpg Feb 22 15:23:24 there is a bretter link Feb 22 15:23:26 better* Feb 22 15:23:30 yes I am actually from parma Feb 22 15:23:37 i'm from elyria Feb 22 15:23:41 but currently in Ypsilanti, MI for school Feb 22 15:23:43 good stuff Feb 22 15:23:50 i moved to iowa 10 years ago this july Feb 22 15:23:52 hmm Feb 22 15:23:55 59.99 hmm Feb 22 15:24:15 yep :) Feb 22 15:24:24 anyone know why the gsm codec on testing has a dependency on the full widk? Feb 22 15:24:29 # Everything Data 450 $69.99 Feb 22 15:24:30 :( Feb 22 15:24:33 my monthly bill taxes and everything is $56 :P and yeah, i'm bragging Feb 22 15:24:35 that;s mine Feb 22 15:25:12 sprint.com/sero type in Russ.S.McGuire@sprint.com and 383 Feb 22 15:25:39 oh they're allowing sero for pre now? Feb 22 15:25:39 welcome to a better plan :) Feb 22 15:25:45 they always have Feb 22 15:25:53 the old SERO is not allowed Feb 22 15:25:58 but the new one has always been allowed Feb 22 15:26:03 ah Feb 22 15:26:22 I used to pay 49.99 for the same thing but with 1250 mins haha Feb 22 15:26:29 but when I got the Pre I had to change Feb 22 15:26:36 well since u have any mobile to mobile Feb 22 15:26:41 exactly Feb 22 15:26:55 yeah, i used to pay 49.99, and i bitched so much they gave me the everything Feb 22 15:26:59 and the only land lines I call are in my 3 numbers unlimited Feb 22 15:27:05 data 450 and then sprint employee discount Feb 22 15:27:21 Cool Feb 22 15:27:24 how much is sprint employee discount? through my work i get only 15% Feb 22 15:27:28 25 Feb 22 15:30:08 liking that plan en0x? Feb 22 15:30:19 TheInvsbleMan, ain't bad :) hook me up ;) Feb 22 15:30:29 haha just follow the instructions above Feb 22 15:30:40 ~seen rwhitby Feb 22 15:30:41 rwhitby is currently on #webos-internals (1d 3h 32m 41s) #oe (1d 3h 32m 41s) #meego (1d 3h 32m 41s) #nslu2-linux (1d 3h 32m 41s). Has said a total of 121 messages. Is idling for 5h 13m, last said: 'cryptk|work: so it works?'. Feb 22 15:30:42 so i have to go and bitch? : > Feb 22 15:30:52 though I doubt they will let you switch to it Feb 22 15:31:02 they MIGHT let you switch to it but it's doubtful Feb 22 15:31:21 anyway i'm happy with my current plan... i pay less than at tmobile or att Feb 22 15:31:24 so it aint bad Feb 22 15:31:31 http://wiki.howardforums.com/index.php/SPRINT_SERO there is some more info Feb 22 15:31:40 tells you how to convince them to let you switch Feb 22 15:33:17 Not sure if they still keep that wiki up to date though. I haven't checked it in years Feb 22 15:33:22 there is an email of an employee and 3 digits of employee id Feb 22 15:33:23 it looks like they updated it though Feb 22 15:33:24 http://delivery.sprint.com/m/p/nxt/epc/epclanding.asp Feb 22 15:33:25 blah Feb 22 15:33:37 russ.s.mcquire@sprint.com 383 Feb 22 15:33:42 use that Feb 22 15:33:57 he is the VP of sales I believe haha Feb 22 15:34:09 He released his info a LONG time ago Feb 22 15:34:16 so people could sign up for SERO Feb 22 15:34:56 not worky i'm going to googl Feb 22 15:34:57 e Feb 22 15:35:55 russ.s.mcguire@sprint.com Feb 22 15:35:58 lol spelled it wrong Feb 22 15:36:50 lol ok it's working ;) Feb 22 15:37:10 All right, good Feb 22 15:39:51 still i gotta call sprint and ask them to switch but probably won't happen Feb 22 15:39:57 I was never able to switch to sprint SERO, well I could have but they already give me a flat out -30% off my bill and they would have taken that away from me if I switched to SERO years ago when they had those offers going Feb 22 15:40:06 So I decided to keep my -30% Feb 22 15:40:22 Yea, it isn't likely to happen but people have had success with calling and asking to be switched Feb 22 15:41:02 If you are persistent and have a good story to tell them I'm sure they would have no problem switching you Feb 22 15:41:06 I really got the hookup with sprint, it was roughly 1998 or so when I signed up with them and my friend just outright gave me -30% off my bill ;) Feb 22 15:41:14 :) Feb 22 15:41:15 nice! Feb 22 15:41:53 And now I'm in their premier thing ? Where you get yearly full $150 subsidy instead of waiting every 2 years Feb 22 15:42:09 which is hot, but I don't see anything replacing my Pre anytime soon unless they announce an upgraded version Feb 22 15:43:28 me too Feb 22 15:44:08 ppl tell me that sooner or later i will switch from palm to iphone and i tell them that it won't happen unless iphone will come with hw keyboard Feb 22 15:44:24 nod Feb 22 15:45:00 well I have to head out all. Class is over Feb 22 15:45:03 some of my partners here at my job are pretty intelligent guys, I mean we do run a successful business etc. They've convinced themselves Apple has won the cell phone war Feb 22 15:45:04 See ya Feb 22 15:45:40 my bro just got iphone and well he is happy with it but to be able to run it on other network he has to jb it Feb 22 15:45:52 but I argue with them all the time, there's always people who want a variety of things: hardware keyboard (some prefere landscape, some prefer portrait), clamshell phones (you won't get rid of these so easily) and 9 digit pad (some people just want a plain-ol-phone) Feb 22 15:46:16 my second bro is a flip phone maniac Feb 22 15:46:33 he don't want any other phone unless it's a sexy flip phone Feb 22 15:46:42 nod Feb 22 15:46:47 hhrhr Feb 22 15:46:58 the war is never over Feb 22 15:47:43 i prefer candy bars. if they pixi had the pre's specs i'd be all over it Feb 22 15:48:12 Yeah Steve Ballmer had a really good speech once, I think it was with Engadget Feb 22 15:48:39 and he was talking about how no matter what the variables are when you get into products that are in the hands of 500 million people Feb 22 15:48:51 you always have a diverse marketplace and no one can really monopolise that Feb 22 15:49:08 the carriers seem to be doing a good job~ Feb 22 15:49:09 cars, tvs, cell phones, computers, etc Feb 22 15:49:35 No, in terms of the devices that are made (not the services) Feb 22 15:49:46 the problem is they dictate that too! Feb 22 15:49:54 you have 20+ big car companies, 20+ big tv companies, 20+ cell phone companies, 20+ computer companies Feb 22 15:50:02 competition is vibrant Feb 22 15:50:03 i have 4 Feb 22 15:50:09 and only 1 has great coverage. Feb 22 15:50:11 no Feb 22 15:50:15 and I use sprint anyway :) Feb 22 15:50:16 cell phone manufacturers Feb 22 15:50:18 hy there! Is something wrong with the patches feed? Feb 22 15:50:28 you're still hung up on the services part Feb 22 15:50:39 there are 20+ companies that make cell phone devices Feb 22 15:50:41 and there'll always be Feb 22 15:51:05 i'm trying to point out that all 20 of thosec ompanies who make devices are beholden to what the service providers tell them to do. Feb 22 15:51:15 Not really Feb 22 15:51:35 until i can purchase whatever phone I want at walmart and then take it to whatever service provider i want, it's not true choice Feb 22 15:51:51 psykoz: yes it is, trust me. I doubt it's changed much in hte last few years since i was involved with it Feb 22 15:52:20 otherwise you wouldn't have a missing call duration screen on sprint phones, and a teathering app that only works on verizon pres.... Feb 22 15:52:52 those are device features, that the carried used their weight to ban. Feb 22 15:53:02 if you want on our network, you won't have XX feature. Feb 22 15:54:13 That's fine, that doesn't negate the fact that there's lots of competititon in the manufactured device space Feb 22 15:54:19 competition* Feb 22 15:54:29 You have the same problem with automobiles and governments Feb 22 15:54:38 you can't have x-y-z car in our country unless it has 1-2-3 features Feb 22 15:54:42 x-feature can't work in China Feb 22 15:54:45 yadda Feb 22 15:55:03 doesn't negate the fact that there's a mass audience who likes automobiles and worldwide (globally) there's 20+ major manufacturers of cars) Feb 22 15:57:01 completely different situations Feb 22 15:57:13 government doesn't regulate cars nearly as much as you think Feb 22 15:58:51 if cell phone service providers had as much as a stranglehold as you claim they do on the industry they'd just make their own devices exclusively and not allow anyones device on their network ;) I think you're missing the overall point. WHen you look at niche markets that target a smaller audience, think portable mp3 players, e-book readers, etc Feb 22 15:59:04 You have a playing field where it is easy to monopolise those spaces Feb 22 15:59:14 apple iPod, amazon kindle, etc Feb 22 15:59:22 i disagree Feb 22 15:59:34 but when you are working in a global marketplace for a global product Feb 22 15:59:43 things that are measured in hundreds of millions trending towards billions Feb 22 15:59:43 the ipod isn't a global product? Feb 22 16:00:17 and the european cell marker is much more free than the american Feb 22 16:00:31 i'm talking specifically about the american market Feb 22 16:00:51 you have (for all intents and purposes) 3 carriers. Verizon, Sprint and AT&T Feb 22 16:01:16 mikewx: tmobile would be annoyed with you if they were here ... Feb 22 16:01:17 And only 1 of them will allow you to activate equipment that wasn't sold directly by them Feb 22 16:01:23 nt4cats: both of them? :-) Feb 22 16:01:43 isn't US Cellular larger than T-Mobile? :-) Feb 22 16:01:56 mikewx: I think there are at least 7 t-mobile customers, thank you very much. Feb 22 16:02:08 heh Feb 22 16:02:21 didn't verizon buy us cellular? Feb 22 16:02:52 no, they bought alltel Feb 22 16:03:01 yep, you're right. they bought someone Feb 22 16:03:10 alltel, us cellular, they're all the same Feb 22 16:03:14 which may have significant ramifications for us, as alltel and sprint had a mutual roaming agreement Feb 22 16:04:57 read this from jason robitaille: "Speaking on behalf of myself and WebOS Quick Install, I did many days worth of testing to make sure everything works well with AUPT on .patch files installed via WebOS Quick Install. And from my conversations with rwhitby and egaudet, it's clear the AUPT scripts themselves underwent VERY extensive testing to make sure everything works they way it should." Feb 22 16:06:03 :) Feb 22 16:06:19 oh my father has us cellular Feb 22 16:06:26 their coverage and voice quality is crap Feb 22 16:06:38 * oil had uscellular before sprint Feb 22 16:06:54 they were a great here locally Feb 22 16:08:48 we use them for some of our regional managers, in the sticks of iowa US Cellular is better than anyone else Feb 22 16:08:55 most of our corp is verizon though Feb 22 16:36:56 what to think now... as I mentioned last monday, for leaked release dates I generally add a week and a half to the estimate... 25th falls in line with that... but do I add another week and a half to that one... hrmmm Feb 22 16:39:29 february doesn't have enough days Feb 22 16:39:50 I typically ignore all the leaks and just wait till my buddy at palm tells me to update my pre. then I tell you all to do it, then wait a few days and do it myself :) Feb 22 16:40:10 feb has enough days for me Feb 22 16:41:28 brb Feb 22 16:41:50 msg mikewx: my buddy at palm is apparently better-placed than yours. I'm already running WebOS 2.2 on my Pre (shhh, don't tell) Feb 22 16:42:25 msg nt4cats prolly, all my old friends there got laid off years ago, i'm down to 1 friend there left and he's not a dev Feb 22 16:42:47 ;) Feb 22 16:43:21 besides, running 2.2, wow you're missing all the fun we have with patches :) Feb 22 16:43:46 what we need is ed to return and make us hackmaster-pre Feb 22 16:46:05 Yes, but webOS 2.2 includes preemptive mind reading [know what your wife is thinking even before she does] and SatIdiotKill (TM) [triggers laser beams from satellites to kill people who say stupid things in your presence] Feb 22 16:46:32 When I tune "PMR" into my wife, however, it always just says "you're in trouble". Feb 22 16:46:52 does it include mind modifying, also to be applied to said wife? Feb 22 16:47:08 There's a patch for that, I think Feb 22 16:51:28 i clearly need to update. hook me up! Feb 22 17:01:02 yey my palm pre arrived from palm Feb 22 17:01:18 wohoo Feb 22 17:03:15 grats Feb 22 17:09:16 ping rwhitby or egaudet Feb 22 17:09:26 *and/or Feb 22 17:09:29 lol Feb 22 17:09:56 how could I get the beta flash running? Feb 22 17:10:40 there is a flash beta? Feb 22 17:10:42 invent a time machine Feb 22 17:10:44 jaycanuck: haven't seen either one of them Feb 22 17:10:48 k Feb 22 17:10:56 ty swisstomcat Feb 22 17:11:13 official word would be great regarding the aupt/1.4 "panic" Feb 22 17:11:42 lol Feb 22 17:11:52 3 letters Feb 22 17:11:54 N Feb 22 17:11:56 D Feb 22 17:11:58 A Feb 22 17:12:09 yeah Feb 22 17:12:24 people are going crazy as you saw Feb 22 17:12:30 but regarding my faith in AUPT, I have full fait in it Feb 22 17:12:34 *faith Feb 22 17:12:35 people are fearful crazy animals. Feb 22 17:12:40 lol Feb 22 17:13:02 put 2 of them in a group and they cease to think for themselves and start going crazy Feb 22 17:13:14 forums are exhibit a. Feb 22 17:13:34 i'll wait for official word before i panic :) Feb 22 17:13:51 we'll get 1.4 when we get it Feb 22 17:13:57 exactly Feb 22 17:14:02 yep Feb 22 17:14:15 it's not like 1.3 is causing our pres to explode Feb 22 17:14:29 nope, that's a 1.4 feature Feb 22 17:14:38 there will be some upgrading pains, as there was with 1.3.5.x Feb 22 17:15:07 time for some lunch Feb 22 17:15:10 fixes were very quick usually Feb 22 17:15:30 I'm thinking about doctoring my phone ... only because I've done enough hacking on it while trying to figure things out that I'd feel better knowing that something I did isn't going to haunt me later Feb 22 17:15:44 lol, 1.3.1 ->1.3.5 was horrendous, though only cause the place where apps got installed to was changed Feb 22 17:15:46 how long does it take to doctor a phone? Feb 22 17:15:57 like 15-30min top Feb 22 17:16:03 yeah, at most Feb 22 17:16:10 it's quick and painless :) Feb 22 17:16:11 took me a week las time i tried, palm's backup wasn't so good at restore :) Feb 22 17:16:22 ... and, assuming a good WiFi connection, how long does a profile restore take? Feb 22 17:16:35 not long at all Feb 22 17:16:37 probably depending how much is stored in it Feb 22 17:16:43 for me it was quick Feb 22 17:16:57 (I know "it depends" is the real answer, but a few of you are saying 'quick', so that's good enough) Feb 22 17:17:20 I don't think I have a lot in my profile, most of my contacts and calendar are at Google ... Feb 22 17:17:50 does anyone else here have flash working for their pre? Feb 22 17:17:57 nope Feb 22 17:17:58 Thanks for the info. I may doctor it tonight Feb 22 17:18:14 icarus: if anyone did they'd be under a NDA and couldn't talk about it Feb 22 17:20:37 hmm, I see Feb 22 17:21:08 could I be referred to somewhere I could learn to how? Feb 22 17:21:44 learn how to what? Feb 22 17:24:35 question: will the internals dev kit install on osx? Feb 22 17:26:19 nvm Feb 22 17:36:54 hmm wtf Feb 22 17:36:57 I'm reading on precentral.net to do Emergency Patch Remover, but I see no such app. I see quite a few Emergency apps, but no remover (I have all feeds enabled except prethemer and precentral-themes Feb 22 17:37:00 preparing vision services Feb 22 17:37:14 what isit? :> Feb 22 17:37:51 BoomerET: checking for you ... Feb 22 17:38:42 I see Patch Recovery and Patch Installer Feb 22 17:38:54 I'm not sure which precentral.net posting you were reading, but the "emergency" thing that I know of that removes all of your patches is called "Emergency Patch Recovery" Feb 22 17:39:26 BoomerET: paste the precentral.net link you're looking at here and I'll see if I can confirm that's the one they're talking about Feb 22 17:40:32 http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/231739-urgent-announcement-patch-removal-before-1-4-a.html Feb 22 17:40:43 I typed that, the forums I have open on another computer. Feb 22 17:41:28 that's recommending you run the Emergency Patch Recovery program Feb 22 17:41:36 anyone know if we'll be able to run python programs with the pdk? Feb 22 17:41:51 Ok, they must named it removal instead of EPR Feb 22 17:42:02 I'm not sure that I agree with the recommendation, but that is what the user 'powerbyte' is recommending Feb 22 17:42:15 What do you recommend? Feb 22 17:42:27 that powerbyte guy is kind of a troll Feb 22 17:42:43 Updating like usual with patches installed and having faith in AUPT is what I recommend Feb 22 17:43:13 Is AUPT something I have to install first? Feb 22 17:43:23 no Feb 22 17:43:28 If you have patches it's built into them Feb 22 17:44:07 I have found that rwhitby and egaudet are very cautious and very open kind of guys. They wouldn't publish something to address upgrading-with-patches unless they had some capacity to test it and were confident that they weren't going to brick peoples' phones. Feb 22 17:44:19 They're not perfect, but they're very good. Feb 22 17:44:52 There really is no harm running EPR before upgrading to 1.4, but it shouldn't be necessary Feb 22 17:44:58 they spent months working on AUPT system Feb 22 17:45:23 ... and if there are any hiccups when 1.4 comes out, you can bet that they'll work very hard on delivering a fix for anyone/everyone who needs it. Feb 22 17:45:24 Hmm, no update for me yet (Sprint) Feb 22 17:46:14 BoomerET: don't hold your breath for the update, rumors have it coming out on the 25th. Chances of seeing it before then are very very small, and chances of it slipping past that are not very small :) Feb 22 17:46:26 I have no inside knowledge of the release date Feb 22 17:46:53 Odd, I thought I read that it was out, I must be still asleep. Feb 22 17:47:07 Yup, because my grammar seems to be backwards as well. Feb 22 17:47:13 I'm just giving you my interpretation of all of the same publicly-available information that we're all reading on precentral.net Feb 22 17:47:39 BoomerET: the latest post on 1.4 http://www.precentral.net/webos-14-arrive-feb-25th Feb 22 17:47:51 my life is so much better for not going to precentral Feb 22 17:47:59 is there a page on the internals wiki where i can find out which languages we'll be able to write for native code on the pre? or is it just c/c++ for sure? Feb 22 17:48:06 or am i asking in the wrong place Feb 22 17:48:33 codeslaw: there is an optware python package, at least I'm pretty sure there is. Feb 22 17:48:56 codeslaw: I don't think there is (yet) a way for python code to display any sort of UI, however. Feb 22 17:49:34 nt4cats: i just want to be able to call a couple of utility programs written in python from my javascript application Feb 22 17:49:40 if that's going to be possible Feb 22 17:49:47 codeslaw: but I am not a "python on the Pre and its associated UI implementation" expert by any means. I looked into it casually a month or two ago. Feb 22 17:50:31 codeslaw: I would assume that if your javascript program can invoke any native linux commands that it could also invoke python just as easliy (or just as difficult) Feb 22 17:51:18 codeslaw: note my use of the word "assume". I've never tried to do this. Feb 22 17:53:55 +1 to zsoc for being #webos-internal's latest precentral.net start Feb 22 17:54:07 s/start/star/ Feb 22 17:54:07 nt4cats meant: +1 to zsoc for being #webos-internal's latest precentral.net star Feb 22 17:55:03 nt4cats: I'm the muthafrickin' WHE Feb 22 17:55:55 http://www.whe.org/ ? Feb 22 17:56:19 ~WHE Feb 22 17:56:20 methinks whe is a WebOS Hacker Extraordinaire, which is what Joshua Topolsky called zsoc after he typed "make" one time... Feb 22 17:57:52 heh Feb 22 17:58:40 rwhitby: for when you awake, gsmwav seems to only be building for arm7. I don't understand the error in the builder logs Feb 22 17:59:35 rwhitby: and if you could update the makefile with a restart flag, until I can fix the postinst Feb 22 18:00:15 mdklein: oh come on, it's worth at least a ha. or a hehe. Feb 22 18:09:41 =) Feb 22 18:18:07 yap so it's a refurb i see the refurbished dates in ##rtn# Feb 22 18:39:01 Anyone using IRC from their phone? I'm currently messing around with Pound IRC and wIRCd and not sure of which to use, any input? Feb 22 18:39:40 mjkjr: use irssi ;) Feb 22 18:41:03 airmack: I'm looking for an app to use from my phone Feb 22 18:41:24 airmack: thank you Feb 22 18:41:49 you are welcome Feb 22 18:46:47 good evening (my time :-) ) Feb 22 18:47:55 I'm working on a wrapper/watchdog for the vpnc client on the pre Feb 22 18:48:54 I would like to check some internals about how the Pre metains the internet connection/ip stack with somebody how has looked as the pre sctips before I release script solution. Feb 22 18:50:45 is someone here at the moment how has looked into the pmnetconfic stuff too? Feb 22 18:52:06 The second questions that you need to install the vpnc package manuall now. It would be better if this is possible with preware, but I have no idea how much work it is to include it in the opware packages? Feb 22 18:55:30 weird Feb 22 18:55:44 device info says 1.3.5.1 but update app says that i need to update to 1.3.5.1 Feb 22 18:59:29 ignore this as it's a test Feb 22 18:59:50 mjkjr: use wirc Feb 22 19:00:05 mjkjr: it's actually a client :p pound just connects to webchats Feb 22 19:01:04 zsoc_wirc: i initially tried pound irc, uninstalled it and now am using wirc, thank you. Feb 22 19:01:41 mjkjr: also we're biased. wirc is a webos-internals project :) Feb 22 19:07:56 This wIRC app is great, thank you Feb 22 19:09:51 mjkjr2: welcome Feb 22 19:09:59 glad to see there are still new users Feb 22 19:10:52 PuffTheMagic: thank you. I've used IRC a few times but never thought I could on my phone. Feb 22 19:11:40 mjkjr2: wIRC is pretty shitty compared to most irc clients, i do have visions for new versions but my freetime has dropped to nil lately Feb 22 19:13:41 PuffTheMagic: well I think this is great compared to the pound irc I installed 10 minutes prior and couldn't get to work Feb 22 19:14:02 pound is a completly different approach Feb 22 19:14:28 requires a proxy i believe Feb 22 19:15:14 well it required me to remove it right away, no offense to anyone. Feb 22 19:17:30 *yawn* Feb 22 19:17:55 sorry about the brief absence -- my hard drive got fried Feb 22 19:18:18 oops Feb 22 19:18:31 you dropped it into the deep-fryer? Feb 22 19:18:33 :) Feb 22 19:18:55 rogue power supply ... apparently had a short on the 12V rail Feb 22 19:19:25 i'm still tryin to source a replacement pcb Feb 22 19:22:32 zsoc_wirc: i take it you were able to get gstreamer plugins compiled? Feb 22 19:40:21 http://yfrog.com/4itlnij good as new :D Feb 22 19:43:42 xcomp: I had a question for you about glib actually, but I think it works now Feb 22 19:44:04 xcomp: I've had gstreamer stuff compiling for awhile now, it's getting it packed up that's a pain in the neck Feb 22 19:44:12 Heck, if you can deep-fry twinkies and ice-cream, why not hard-drives? Feb 22 19:45:12 lulz Feb 22 19:47:21 Ok, I have a question, they're talking about flash in 1.4, does this mean just that you'll be able to watch youtube videos, or now you can use any site the has flash, for example, my employer uses flash menus. Feb 22 19:47:35 (Don't get me started) Feb 22 19:47:46 BoomerET: Feb 22 19:47:52 loot-, Feb 22 19:47:54 its for all flash Feb 22 19:48:04 and shockwave Feb 22 19:48:15 That's nice, that's one thing that upsets me about my iPod touch. Feb 22 19:48:17 what about silverlight? :P Feb 22 19:48:19 * en0x hides Feb 22 19:48:22 its supposedly no different (functionality wise) than the flash player you have installed on your desktop Feb 22 19:49:02 crapple refuses to not be evil, so adobe told them no flash for you Feb 22 19:49:14 irony Feb 22 19:49:29 one proprietary software nazi to another... Feb 22 19:49:58 loot-: actually apple is the one that refuses to implement flash Feb 22 19:50:02 not that it matters Feb 22 19:50:11 flash will be gone in 5 years anyway Feb 22 19:50:24 zsoc_wirc: not that they wont implement flash its that apple refuses to come to an agreement with adobe Feb 22 19:50:39 because apple wants to rape and pillage the land for every coin Feb 22 19:50:56 because they don't want crappy flash when adobe fixes it then they will implement it Feb 22 19:51:01 capple and microsuck should just merge and get it over with Feb 22 19:51:05 right now flash is a huge cpu hog Feb 22 19:51:08 who needs to a-holes when you can have one big one! Feb 22 19:51:12 s/to/two/ Feb 22 19:51:12 loot- meant: who needs two a-holes when you can have one big one! Feb 22 19:51:37 en0x: not true Feb 22 19:51:41 flash runs fine on the pre Feb 22 19:51:42 the only problem with html5 and video is the codec Feb 22 19:51:47 which has nearly the same CPU and GPU Feb 22 19:51:48 at the moment Feb 22 19:51:49 zsoc_wirc: alsa-lib is broken? Feb 22 19:52:06 the problem is Feb 22 19:52:13 apple does not want to pay for flash Feb 22 19:52:15 loot-, yes but we are talking about apple now :p flash uses almost 60% of cpu on mac Feb 22 19:52:20 and adobe does not want to give it away for free Feb 22 19:52:41 either way Feb 22 19:52:43 w00t? Feb 22 19:52:49 how adobe is charging for flash? Feb 22 19:53:01 its licensed Feb 22 19:53:10 if you sell a product thats flash enabled Feb 22 19:53:13 they license it Feb 22 19:53:46 where does it say that? Feb 22 19:53:49 xcomp: non-existent Feb 22 19:54:10 i never heard of such a crap Feb 22 19:54:16 so will we see some new members in this channel soon thanks to SCALE? Feb 22 19:54:26 so u r saying that google will pay adobe to have flash on android? :> lol Feb 22 19:54:31 zsoc_wirc: oh ... my bad! Feb 22 19:54:46 well ... I can't stage it now until if/when I can fix my hard drive Feb 22 19:54:51 en0x: it doesnt have to say it anywhere... its a proprietary product owned by adobe Feb 22 19:54:54 THEY say Feb 22 19:55:00 and they dont make what they say public information Feb 22 19:55:01 :P Feb 22 19:55:16 loot-, adobe knows that flash will die in few years... so they trying to get flash on everything that they can if they could put it on a toaster probably they would Feb 22 19:55:20 zsoc_wirc: for some reason i assumed that it was already there, but in fact I created it myself Feb 22 19:55:27 When I try to build the dev environment, libsndfile, alsa-sound and pulseaudio fail, so I moved them to nonworking. Feb 22 19:55:55 im not sure about that either because adobe has just kept pushing dynamic content delivery ever since they got into the busienss Feb 22 19:56:00 html5 is not going to change that Feb 22 19:56:00 thats why they are making flash plugin for mobile devices which is free Feb 22 19:56:01 not one bit Feb 22 19:56:02 xcomp: well push that isht man :D Feb 22 19:56:08 doesn't adobe make flash for linux, and isn't it distributed free, and thus who exactly are they charging for it? Feb 22 19:56:21 en0x: free to end users yea... its a propietary product thats licensed by adobe Feb 22 19:56:22 windzilla, that;'s what i'm wondering Feb 22 19:56:24 zsoc_wirc: lol ... sorry will have to wait a few days Feb 22 19:56:42 loot-, so how the heck r u saying that apple have to pay for flash? Feb 22 19:56:55 dude Feb 22 19:56:57 they have to bbuy a software to make flash animation/games thats it Feb 22 19:56:58 jesus are you guys thick Feb 22 19:57:03 * loot- face palms Feb 22 19:57:06 yap Feb 22 19:57:50 loot-: just ignore him, we all get it :D Feb 22 19:58:00 (: Feb 22 19:58:05 i haven't started yet Feb 22 19:58:14 business talk is lame Feb 22 19:58:34 evil businesses are lame Feb 22 19:58:34 baka ja ne... Feb 22 19:58:39 anyone here with deep framebuffer on pre knowledge? Feb 22 19:58:42 only 2 things matter in this channel, if software is open source or closed source Feb 22 19:58:56 am i the only person that uses git with latex? Feb 22 19:59:08 latex or silicon? Feb 22 19:59:14 latex is the shit! :) Feb 22 19:59:41 i write all the crazy math formula in latex Feb 22 19:59:41 :) Feb 22 19:59:44 LaTeX? Feb 22 19:59:45 LaTeX Feb 22 20:00:06 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LaTeX Feb 22 20:00:26 gotta capitalize all your consonants Feb 22 20:01:28 loot-: your talking about the product marketing licensing, so if you build a linux box with flash on it, and market it as hulu capable or something you would pay for it. Feb 22 20:01:47 PuffTheMagic: I never saw the advantage Feb 22 20:01:56 or latex? Feb 22 20:01:58 * nt4cats|work will brb Feb 22 20:01:59 or git and latex Feb 22 20:02:37 yeah ilove my LaTeX Feb 22 20:02:46 and my BibTeX Feb 22 20:02:57 my my custom document classes Feb 22 20:02:58 PuffTheMagic: git and latex, although I would be willing to say latex is a cogsci thing ;) Feb 22 20:03:00 and Beamer Feb 22 20:03:17 latex is not a cogsci thing Feb 22 20:03:21 PuffTheMagic: does using lyx count? Feb 22 20:03:30 its a science | math | publisher thing Feb 22 20:03:37 debilater: sure Feb 22 20:03:41 debilater: i didnt like it though Feb 22 20:03:46 kile ftw Feb 22 20:03:47 heh Feb 22 20:03:55 kile is ok Feb 22 20:03:57 i want plain text while editing Feb 22 20:03:59 PuffTheMagic: so I only need to figure out, how to integrate lyx with git :) Feb 22 20:04:18 yey 1.4 is out Feb 22 20:04:20 zsoc_wirc: kile is the best tex editor i've found so far Feb 22 20:04:33 PuffTheMagic: explain to me how latex git integration is useful Feb 22 20:04:36 en0x: don't make me smack you Feb 22 20:04:51 zsoc_wirc: well writing a tex document is sorta like programming Feb 22 20:04:59 en0x: I will literally kick you if you do that again. Feb 22 20:05:00 why not use git for version control Feb 22 20:05:26 zsoc_wirc: word and oowriter have revision support Feb 22 20:05:32 PuffTheMagic: oh, I was understanding your suggestion backwards. I get it now Feb 22 20:05:34 so git+tex is same thing Feb 22 20:05:48 no framebuffer guys here? this is my problem: I built gnash, an opensource flash player (it took an entire day to compile...). it runs, displays the startscreen of a flash game. until i tap on it, then the flash screen disappears while gnash still runs, any idea? Feb 22 20:05:49 PuffTheMagic: vim actually has some awesome time traveling functionality Feb 22 20:06:24 zsoc_wirc: well like when i get revision on this paper back from my old advisor when i merge in his changes git can handle it :D Feb 22 20:06:38 debilater: yes, opensource flash is buggier than sugar in an ant colony Feb 22 20:06:55 PuffTheMagic: that's a pretty neat idea actually Feb 22 20:06:56 hehe Feb 22 20:07:02 nt4cats, hahaha Feb 22 20:07:05 zsoc_wirc: I think it is a framebuffer/touchscreen problem, the game itself is actually running Feb 22 20:07:13 zsoc_wirc: git solves all of lives issues Feb 22 20:07:19 s/lives/lifes/ Feb 22 20:07:19 PuffTheMagic meant: zsoc_wirc: git solves all of lifes issues Feb 22 20:07:43 too bad Puffy didn't say "s/lives/wifes/" Feb 22 20:07:54 lol Feb 22 20:07:58 debilater: I disagree. if you get everything building in the widk, make a repo for an ipk, and package it in the testing feeds /unreleased in build.git, I will help debug it Feb 22 20:08:50 debilater: I suppose 'standard' opensource flash won't be compatible tho. it probably fights with luna for fb0 Feb 22 20:08:58 debilater: which oss flash is it? Feb 22 20:09:05 zsoc_wirc: gnash Feb 22 20:09:25 gnash is a flash engine? Feb 22 20:09:31 I thought it just used one Feb 22 20:09:57 oh I see.. hmmm Feb 22 20:10:07 zsoc_wirc: yes, executes swf 7,8,most 9, some 10 - so there are about 1million games which should work... Feb 22 20:10:19 does it support actionscript / flash games? description seems to quote it as being a video player Feb 22 20:10:31 zsoc_wirc: yes it does Feb 22 20:10:46 zsoc_wirc: there's a as interpreter built into it Feb 22 20:10:51 debilater: this is a pretty good idea tho, as buggy as oss flash is, this would make people happy / love you Feb 22 20:11:24 debilater: I would look into gnash debugger, or try to get a non broken gdb working on webos Feb 22 20:11:43 zsoc_wirc: currently I'm re-compiling it because I forgot to add debugging support (doh!), so I'll retry tomorrow... Feb 22 20:12:20 debilater: is the git in savannah.gnu.org the official one? (gnash.git) Feb 22 20:12:56 zsoc_wirc: no idea, I used latest snapshot (0.8.7) Feb 22 20:13:32 debilater: I think your best bet is to --enable-renderer=opengl and redo the gl code to gles Feb 22 20:13:50 debilater: and then force it to /fb1 somehow... I'll lool through the code Feb 22 20:14:04 debilater: it's cool tho that it loads in the browser. that's great news Feb 22 20:14:42 zsoc_wirc: I tried opengl but I didn't have the libs, what do youmean with "redo gl code to gles"? Feb 22 20:17:07 debilater: webos uses opengl ES 1.1 or 2.0. certain apis are incompatible with daddy gl 1 or 2 Feb 22 20:18:01 debilater: headers for opengl es are in the widk somewhere. xcomp uses them to build . uh Feb 22 20:18:10 something... evas gles engine Feb 22 20:18:35 zsoc_wirc: yes I've seen them, but how would I make gnash build happy with them? Feb 22 20:18:53 zsoc_wirc: I'll take a look at them Feb 22 20:18:58 debilater: fork gnash for webos Feb 22 20:22:10 debilater: there is a tiny chance gnash already avoids gles 2 incompatible apis (quads.. display lists... non float color stuff) Feb 22 20:22:10 ok I'll start with debugger and focring fd1 first :) Feb 22 20:22:14 but very unlikely Feb 22 20:22:21 debilater: good idea Feb 22 20:22:35 s/focring/forcing/ Feb 22 20:22:36 debilater meant: ok I'll start with debugger and forcing fd1 first :) Feb 22 20:52:35 interesting. it seems gnash projects on maemo and android have pretty much all failed miserably... Feb 22 20:53:16 I wonder if webos' standard npapi based browser / plugin kit is going to make this much easier Feb 22 21:03:55 doubtful, I had looked at it a bit way back Feb 22 21:14:13 my school is retarded. Feb 22 21:15:31 dtzWill: you have anything to add to my gnash conjecture? Feb 22 21:17:14 that's interesting. building gnash with --enable-media=ffmpeg enabled ffmpeg with SDL support. we might have an oss flash video player sooner than expected Feb 22 21:28:51 when did youview start to cost 4 bucks to use? Feb 22 21:31:16 what#s youview? Feb 22 21:36:52 youview is some visual voicemail service Feb 22 21:45:35 It used to be free for the app Feb 22 21:45:37 now its 4 bucks Feb 22 21:45:40 WTF?^ Feb 22 21:50:53 greed FTW Feb 22 21:51:07 s/W/L/ Feb 22 21:51:07 jacques meant: greed FTL Feb 22 21:51:21 morning Feb 22 21:52:14 morning egaudet-wirc Feb 22 21:52:57 morning egaudet Feb 22 21:54:22 egaudet: did you see this: http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/231739-suggestions-about-patch-removal-before-1-4-update-7.html Feb 22 21:54:25 it's since been closed Feb 22 21:58:46 last monday of feb and still no 1.4 this sucks Feb 22 22:01:48 I was just in the process of reading it swisstomcat . the original post sounds like it should have been dated 4 months ago :p Feb 22 22:02:16 i wondered why he would post such things without official word Feb 22 22:08:24 that powerbyte guy has been causing trouble on the board ever since the 1.4 rumors Feb 22 22:09:14 oh really? Feb 22 22:10:51 ~seen rwhitby Feb 22 22:10:52 yeah, he was the first guy to start all the 1.4 threads that started flooding the board and getting closed Feb 22 22:10:55 rwhitby is currently on #webos-internals (1d 10h 12m 54s) #oe (1d 10h 12m 54s) #meego (1d 10h 12m 54s) #nslu2-linux (1d 10h 12m 54s). Has said a total of 121 messages. Is idling for 11h 53m 13s, last said: 'cryptk|work: so it works?'. Feb 22 22:12:55 anyone know who organized the booth at scale? Feb 22 22:13:00 the preware booth Feb 22 22:13:50 on the move , going offline Feb 22 22:14:14 swisstomcat: jacques would probably know best he was one of the people running the booth Feb 22 22:14:30 either him or rod Feb 22 22:14:58 rod wasn't there but seemed to be running most of the stuff behind the scenes Feb 22 22:15:10 ~seen jaques Feb 22 22:15:11 jaques was last seen on IRC in channel #handhelds, 792d 7h 21m 45s ago, saying: 'Anybody here can help me with a 3900 installation, please?'. Feb 22 22:15:26 hmm Feb 22 22:15:29 probably the wrong guy Feb 22 22:15:56 i have the change to show preware at the swiss open source exhibition Feb 22 22:16:04 in march Feb 22 22:16:27 jacques is in the roiom right now Feb 22 22:16:49 s/roiom/room/ Feb 22 22:16:49 Kyusaku meant: jacques is in the room right now Feb 22 22:19:30 i'll contact him or rod, thanks Feb 22 22:21:27 g'night Feb 22 22:32:47 morning Feb 22 22:34:31 hey rwhitby Feb 22 22:34:56 how long is the warranty on pre? 1yr only? or 2? Feb 22 22:36:00 en0x: I have no warranty on any of my devices, since they are all imported. Feb 22 22:36:56 rwhitby, i kow ;) Feb 22 22:37:14 rwhitby: something happen to your phone? Feb 22 22:37:15 i wonder what palm will say when they receive my old pre Feb 22 22:37:19 rwhitby: you still technically have a 1 year manufacturers warranty from Palm, no matter where you go, right? Feb 22 22:37:53 destinal-home: not unless it's an international warranty, or I take it back to the place of original purchase. Feb 22 22:38:15 it doesnt say if they have international warranty Feb 22 22:38:28 morning rwhitby Feb 22 22:39:57 Anyone have a reason why I cant send pics via SMS? It happened with my new Pre Feb 22 22:40:02 It just stalls Feb 22 22:40:03 destinal-home: er, technically no. but palm would honor it prolly Feb 22 22:40:26 Abyssul_, that's weird I havent tested my new (cough cough cough) pre Feb 22 22:40:27 rwhitby: sure, but you should be able to ship a device to someone who lives in the area it was purchased and have them get it serviced, I would think Feb 22 22:40:48 You should ge that cough checked out En0x Feb 22 22:40:58 No really. I can't send any pics via MMS Feb 22 22:41:00 Abyssul_, right :) Feb 22 22:41:45 hmm this refurbed pre is ok except keyboard "space" no longer makes "click" sound :( Feb 22 22:41:52 i got it like that should I complain? :> Feb 22 22:42:05 No Feb 22 22:42:10 why? :( Feb 22 22:42:46 anyone traveled to mexico with sprint service? Feb 22 22:42:47 the downside of palm relying on its carriers for their return / RMA channel is that even though you have a warranty on a device even seperate from the carrier, it may be hard to get it RMA'd without service through the approved local carrier Feb 22 22:42:50 your keys click? Feb 22 22:43:03 jacques, yap i can hear them clicking Feb 22 22:43:08 my space has been wishy-washy from day one Feb 22 22:43:15 none of my keys click Feb 22 22:43:19 lol Feb 22 22:43:26 even on my old one my keys clicked Feb 22 22:43:27 now, the pixi - that has a clicky keyboard Feb 22 22:43:39 I dont wanna doctor my phone again :( Feb 22 22:43:39 I could immediately type faster on it Feb 22 22:44:06 is there any extra addon to have cheap calls to usa while in mexico? Feb 22 22:44:11 to sprint plans? Feb 22 23:01:28 is Feb 22 23:01:35 get.preware.org still up to date? Feb 22 23:02:13 because i used it an i got package manager in my launcher :) and preware Feb 22 23:10:32 the preware and service is old in preware installer will anyone update it? Feb 22 23:12:25 bah where is debilator Feb 22 23:18:40 once installed it can update itself Feb 22 23:22:01 egaudet-wirc, i know :p but still :P Feb 22 23:34:55 en0x: we don't change the installer often. we keep it at a stable version that we know has no problems being able to update. Feb 22 23:35:21 for example, if we changed it yesterday to ipkgservice 0.9.35, then we'd have to do it again for .36 Feb 22 23:35:32 if we changed it for preware 0.9.25, we'd have to do it again for 0.9.26 Feb 22 23:36:18 well it thought it was the old one before 1.3.5 but checked the changelog and it's the one after 1.3.5 release which fixes the path Feb 22 23:36:43 one more question Feb 22 23:36:59 is there a way to remove apps from palm profile? so they won't get redownloaded after webos doctor? Feb 22 23:37:39 en0x: no idea. that's a question for Palm. Feb 22 23:37:53 ithought maybe somebody knew Feb 22 23:51:59 so sleepy Feb 22 23:53:15 My Windows 7 machine's beta key is about to expire I'm thinking of putting a linux distro on it as the main OS but not sure what I want to do Feb 22 23:54:02 I'm sorta considering throwing a Hackintosh build on it, since the HW is compatible Feb 22 23:58:22 hmm, Fry's has pixi plus free and pre plus $150 on contract with verizon Feb 23 00:01:49 pretty decent deal but I wouldn't pay for a VZW plan Feb 23 00:12:57 yay, got my replacement pre Feb 23 00:16:42 Decimate: new pre or refurb? Feb 23 00:17:05 how do i tell? :P Feb 23 00:17:24 is it US pre or GSM? Feb 23 00:17:27 us Feb 23 00:17:52 go into phone and type #786## Feb 23 00:18:18 and what info tells me if its a refurb Feb 23 00:18:34 build date maybe Feb 23 00:18:40 I think there should be a part that says RECONDATE Feb 23 00:18:45 or RECON Feb 23 00:18:49 oh, that would be better Feb 23 00:18:51 with a yes or no Feb 23 00:19:09 recondstatus Feb 23 00:19:13 yes Feb 23 00:19:23 so it's a refurb Feb 23 00:19:25 k Feb 23 00:19:32 what's the build date Feb 23 00:19:35 slider feels nicer than my old one Feb 23 00:19:42 8/17 Feb 23 00:19:45 Kyusaku: do I have to actually attempt to call that number? Feb 23 00:19:50 just typing it does nothing Feb 23 00:20:04 jacques: its ##786# Feb 23 00:20:07 he typed it wrong Feb 23 00:20:09 jacques: it should autoappear Feb 23 00:20:14 oh Feb 23 00:20:14 my bad Feb 23 00:20:25 couldn't pull out my phone and try it Feb 23 00:20:29 in the middle of class Feb 23 00:20:36 why not :P Feb 23 00:20:56 it'd look like I was texting or something Feb 23 00:21:14 at least chatting on this laptop it looks like I'm taking notes Feb 23 00:21:19 :) Feb 23 00:22:19 I don't type that often enough to remember the format - I did it once right after I got the phone Feb 23 00:22:58 yeah I only used a few times Feb 23 00:23:13 the RTN code, EVDO code and DATA code Feb 23 00:37:09 hmmm Feb 23 00:37:23 there are some processes running that don't have pids or names Feb 23 00:37:40 azakus: in what way? Feb 23 00:37:46 I've decided to show them to the user, but they aren't really killable Feb 23 00:38:00 systemui has a process in luna that doesn't have a pid attached Feb 23 00:38:13 and there are some processes without appIds Feb 23 00:38:58 most seem to be background threads for the webbrowser to display an app Feb 23 00:40:42 oh so on my drive over whatever causes the phone to charge via TS screwed up again Feb 23 00:41:22 zsoc: it'll be more apparent when jstop 0.1.0 comes out sometime this week Feb 23 00:41:37 I just restarted it because I didn't really have the time to check what the problem is Feb 23 00:41:51 interesting Feb 23 00:42:02 maybe even today if I get around to making the dashboard scene to auto gc in the background Feb 23 00:42:15 configurable of course :P Feb 23 00:42:27 but I'm guessing if I get the phone in one of those charging/not charging loops long enough it can crash it Feb 23 00:43:26 I'll have to try it at home later Feb 23 00:44:49 it's interesting though, because the USB car charger indicates a strong enough charge being pulled but the phone isn't charging at all and will display a lower battery percentage on reboot Feb 23 00:49:23 rwhitby: gonna work on adding in that new method now... Feb 23 00:54:00 rwhitby: luna-send -n 1 luna://org.webosinternals.upstartmgr/jps '{}' returns an error Feb 23 00:54:19 ** Message: serviceResponse Handling: 2, {"returnValue":false,"errorCode":-1,"errorText":"Method \"jps\" with signature \"s\" on interface \"org.json\" doesn't exist\n"} Feb 23 00:55:13 cryptk: are you using the alpha test version of the service? Feb 23 00:55:34 wait... doh... never added the testing feed to my emulator... Feb 23 00:55:35 lol Feb 23 00:55:40 ~testing-feed Feb 23 00:55:41 methinks testing-feed is a means of testing new WebOS Internals products, documented at http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Testing_Feeds Feb 23 00:56:43 prethemer feed 404'd... Feb 23 00:56:45 no matter Feb 23 00:57:58 I think I am going to add a check also to make sure that the upstartmgr service is running and display an error if it isn't Feb 23 00:58:05 I will look at preware to see how it does it Feb 23 00:59:45 I love how the emulator battery stays at 69% Feb 23 01:02:31 hmm mosty of the ppl who got pre replaced got revision A of pre or rev b? Feb 23 01:04:45 rwhitby: still getting it Feb 23 01:04:56 I have spstartmgr 0.0.6 installed Feb 23 01:05:26 cryptk: did you restart java ? Feb 23 01:05:44 yeah, lemme try something else real fast Feb 23 01:06:11 also i found it odd that preware didn't ask to restart java... Feb 23 01:08:45 yeah I noticed that too about upstart uodate Feb 23 01:08:56 s/uodate/update Feb 23 01:09:03 bah screwed it up Feb 23 01:12:48 rwhitby: def not working Feb 23 01:13:55 I even reset my emulator to stock, installed preware and ipkg service, set up testing feeds, installed the testing-feed upstartmg (which did not ask for java restart), rebooted emulator and then tried through novaterm Feb 23 01:14:08 ** Message: serviceResponse Handling: 2, {"returnValue":false,"errorCode":-1,"errorText":"Method \"jps\" with signature \"s\" on interface \"org.json\" doesn't exist\n"} Feb 23 01:14:27 am i calling it right? Feb 23 01:14:27 luna-send -n 1 luna://org.webosinternals.upstartmgr/jps '{}' Feb 23 01:15:00 it is like the list method right? no parameters? Feb 23 01:15:09 hola jacques Feb 23 01:15:21 cryptk: yep, you're calling it right Feb 23 01:15:43 the jps command does work though Feb 23 01:16:36 although oddly i don't see the upstartmgr service listed in jps... Feb 23 01:17:11 howdy cryptk Feb 23 01:17:33 rwhitby: it seems that the new upstart isn't actually instaling, each time I restart preware it lists upstartmgr as having an update Feb 23 01:17:48 I click it and it just says "Service Updated: OK" Feb 23 01:18:02 no java restart, restart preware and it lists it again Feb 23 01:18:18 makefile problem? Feb 23 01:18:27 cryptk: ok, sorry but I'm in the middle of something fairly critical at the moment, so can't look at it yet. Feb 23 01:18:35 ok, np Feb 23 01:27:26 infobot: rwhitby is also an honorary WHE Feb 23 01:27:27 zsoc: okay Feb 23 01:27:41 * rwhitby just fixed a long-standing Preware bug. Feb 23 01:28:35 yay! Feb 23 01:30:14 * rwhitby is doing a *big* happy dance right now Feb 23 01:31:19 must be one of those no-disclosure security bugs :-| Feb 23 01:31:34 :-D Feb 23 01:32:10 he found the code i put in that let me take control of your pre Feb 23 01:32:42 d'oh Feb 23 01:34:16 * xaiki_ will never really understand why we don't use git to update the patches... Feb 23 01:35:16 updating preware now! Feb 23 01:35:22 lol Feb 23 01:35:22 xaiki: because patches are a joke, handled poorly, and we hate them Feb 23 01:35:33 xaiki_: also, go to sleep :p Feb 23 01:42:58 Hello? Feb 23 01:43:43 Having the "all gray" problem...tried uninstalling and reinstalling preware and pkg manager (pkg manager reinstalled first). No dice. Feb 23 01:45:06 bbiab Feb 23 01:45:11 Phishman10: reinstall package manager service using webos quick install 3.01 Feb 23 01:45:49 Did that... Feb 23 01:46:02 (twice) Feb 23 01:46:10 what's listed in the Manage Feeds page? Feb 23 01:47:26 Optware, palm-beta, palm-beta updates, palm-catalog, palm-web, palm-web updates, Precentral, Precentral-themes, Prethemer, Webos-internals, Webos-patches Feb 23 01:47:29 all are on Feb 23 01:47:55 and they all have URLs under them? Feb 23 01:48:08 Yep Feb 23 01:48:26 and you've hit "Update Feeds" ? Feb 23 01:48:41 yep Feb 23 01:49:09 ok, can you get a command line on the Pre that you can cut and paste from? Feb 23 01:49:22 just tell me how... Feb 23 01:49:26 (thanks, by the way) Feb 23 01:50:19 can you run novaterm on your host connected by USB ? Feb 23 01:50:52 same deal....tell me how and I'll give it a shot Feb 23 01:51:00 sorry such a n00b Feb 23 01:51:39 do you have WebOS Quick Install 3.01 running and connected to the Pre? Feb 23 01:51:44 yes Feb 23 01:52:30 commute time Feb 23 01:52:44 Phishman10: can you open the Linux command line window? Feb 23 01:53:00 done Feb 23 01:53:35 type "ipkg -o /media/cryptofs/apps update" without the quotes and without any typos Feb 23 01:54:02 lots of errors Feb 23 01:54:25 that's your problem Feb 23 01:54:26 Downloading http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/optware/all/Packages.gz wget: bad address 'ipkg.preware.org' Downloading http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/optware/armv7/Packages.gz wget: bad address 'ipkg.preware.org' Downloading http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/palm-beta-updates/Packages.gz wget: bad address 'ipkg.preware.org' Downloading http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/palm-beta/Packages.gz wget: bad address 'ipkg.p Feb 23 01:54:40 your Pre does not have a network connection Feb 23 01:54:49 or its on wifi Feb 23 01:54:52 Collected errors: ipkg_download: ERROR: Command failed with return value 1: `wget --passive-ftp -q -P /tmp/ipkg-aN6i70 http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/optware/all/Packages.gz' ipkg_download: ERROR: Command failed with return value 1: `wget --passive-ftp -q -P /tmp/ipkg-aN6i70 http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/optware/armv7/Packages.gz' ipkg_download: ERROR: Command failed with return value 1: `wget --passive-ftp Feb 23 01:54:54 and his network sucks Feb 23 01:55:09 that's simple...thanks! Feb 23 01:55:24 sitting in a building with limited signal...only wifi Feb 23 01:55:37 Preware 0.9.27 and Package Manager Service 0.9.36 released Feb 23 01:55:38 i'll give it a try outside Feb 23 01:55:40 try to bring up ipkg.preware.org/feeds in the browser Feb 23 01:55:51 the browser on the pre that is Feb 23 01:56:08 you should get an index of feeds Feb 23 01:56:35 error for no network Feb 23 01:56:43 i'll try it again outside in a bit Feb 23 01:56:49 thanks for all the help! Feb 23 01:56:53 yeah, lol Feb 23 01:57:28 <------------feels dumb Feb 23 01:57:32 thanks again Feb 23 01:57:36 dont Feb 23 01:57:44 you're not the first that has had that problem :) Feb 23 01:58:13 hopefully i won't be back..... Feb 23 01:58:15 so thanks! Feb 23 01:58:17 lol Feb 23 02:20:15 What is the status of glue? is it even feasible for webos? Feb 23 02:20:31 If I can get glue headers working properly, gnash should be a hop and a skip. Feb 23 02:32:53 oil: http://forums.precentral.net/showthread.php?p=2240435#post2240435 Feb 23 02:33:34 it's 'well oiled'' Feb 23 02:33:40 * zsoc ducks Feb 23 02:33:58 lol Feb 23 02:41:28 rwhitby, how do i build unreleased/ versions of things that are already in packages? Feb 23 02:43:08 ugh, where is debilator? Feb 23 02:43:29 and who writes a README that says "don't edit this" and then puts it in git Feb 23 02:45:07 hehe Feb 23 02:47:10 zsoc: you can have the same package in packages and unreleased Feb 23 02:47:21 rwhitby, right, i suppose that's the obvious answer :P Feb 23 02:47:34 so... what to do what to do.. I think i'll touch it anyway and argue with him later, lol **** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Feb 23 02:59:58 2010