**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Apr 01 02:59:57 2010
Apr 01 03:00:02 <bhuey> zsoc: what's his nick ?
Apr 01 03:00:03 <AtomicPlayboy> Okay, so it's not all messaging patches.
Apr 01 03:00:12 <zsoc> bhuey: Here? JayCanuck
Apr 01 03:00:18 <bhuey> ok
Apr 01 03:00:47 <bhuey> yeah, one of his patches isn't happy and it's making wonder if it effects more than just the what he's modified
Apr 01 03:01:15 <AtomicPlayboy> Is there a way to make auto-update-all fail gracefully and skip a failed patch instead of choking and dying?
Apr 01 03:01:37 <bhuey> facebook IM still isn't working though
Apr 01 03:01:38 <zsoc> AtomicPlayboy: yes, and there's a reason it doesn't atm
Apr 01 03:01:42 <AtomicPlayboy> Got it.
Apr 01 03:01:54 <AtomicPlayboy> I'll continue installing one at a time then.
Apr 01 03:02:01 <adamf> came here from preware site-- something has broken the 'update' app on my pre.  update app hangs.  have 17 patches....  does preware have an unpatch all command?
Apr 01 03:02:04 <AtomicPlayboy> So far no further errors.
Apr 01 03:02:15 <AtomicPlayboy> adamf - it's called "EPR"
Apr 01 03:02:20 <AtomicPlayboy> "EmergencyPatchRecovery"
Apr 01 03:02:26 <adamf> thank you
Apr 01 03:02:54 <nt4cats> My patches worked (4x4 icons no arrows, call duration in call log, command line, confirm delete [e-mail], fullscreen browser, hide musicplayer, hide nascar, notification repeat [messaging], notification repeat [phone], video downloads)
Apr 01 03:03:16 <AtomicPlayboy> Oh yeah, I suppose I should be keeping track of what I'm installing.
Apr 01 03:03:17 <AtomicPlayboy> :P
Apr 01 03:04:51 <jacques> updating - biab (I hope)
Apr 01 03:06:02 <AtomicPlayboy> SMS Tone Per Contact failed
Apr 01 03:07:18 <AtomicPlayboy> Reduce Minimum Brightness worked after trying again.
Apr 01 03:09:36 <AtomicPlayboy> Hm.
Apr 01 03:09:47 <AtomicPlayboy> Messaging Character Count seems to have gone through.
Apr 01 03:10:43 <nt4cats> Hmm call duration in call log applied fine, but it isn't showing up in my call log.  I'm guessing it was just a place holder ..
Apr 01 03:11:06 <nt4cats> sorry, it was working, the option needed to be toggled in preferences
Apr 01 03:11:07 <mjkjr> nt4cats, mine hit an error
Apr 01 03:11:49 <AtomicPlayboy> Okay, character counter did NOT install, and in fact uninstalled itself.
Apr 01 03:12:43 <AtomicPlayboy> ...that's...weird...
Apr 01 03:12:51 <AtomicPlayboy> I can't uninstall SMS Tone Per Contact.
Apr 01 03:13:21 <AtomicPlayboy> I'll be back later, I need to catch the bus home.
Apr 01 03:24:04 <jacques> back. updated.
Apr 01 03:24:06 <jacques> the update did not disable my usbnet
Apr 01 03:27:04 <zsoc> jacques: an anomaly then i suppose
Apr 01 03:28:02 <jacques> zsoc: well, I suppose I could be the anomaly
Apr 01 03:30:48 * mjkjr is trying to figure out why Preware says 
Apr 01 03:31:06 <mjkjr> "Done" but keeps spinning even after 2 reboots
Apr 01 03:34:49 <jacques> so far it appears all my patches updated perfectly
Apr 01 03:35:58 <Adora> THANK
Apr 01 03:35:59 <Adora> GOD
Apr 01 03:36:04 <Adora> I can finally patch 1.4.1
Apr 01 03:36:22 <adamf> ran EPR because 'update' app no longer works but hangs.  patches gone.  'update' app still hangs.  Probably time to save off pictures etc. and wipe the phone
Apr 01 03:36:46 <zsoc> Adora: I'm not sure He cares
Apr 01 03:38:28 <mjkjr> unless He has a Pre too =)
Apr 01 03:38:57 <nt4cats> my initial impressions of 1.4.1.1 are quite positive.
Apr 01 03:39:07 <nt4cats> It feels faster.
Apr 01 03:39:14 <nt4cats> My small set of patches worked fine.
Apr 01 03:39:23 <nt4cats> There is much happiness here ...
Apr 01 03:39:25 <castle`> maybe they overclocked it too :P
Apr 01 03:40:30 <castle`> aw just noticed a crack in the shell of my phone by the volume knobs
Apr 01 03:40:47 * mjkjr might be happy if Preware would show something besides "Done" and the spinning circle for over 10 minutes
Apr 01 03:41:02 <psykoz> I had one restart of Luna that wasn't expected but I don't know why nor have been able to reproduce
Apr 01 03:41:10 <psykoz> I like the one thing they did which was make the card start sliding into place as you swipe away a card upwards
Apr 01 03:41:22 <psykoz> it's such a smooth transition, I know it effectively has done nothing performance wise, just gives a good visual response that doesn't make you feel like you're waiting for that next card to pop into place after killing one
Apr 01 03:41:55 <psykoz> phone app hasn't done the weird hanging issue I had in 1.4
Apr 01 03:42:52 <castle`> just removed the mhz patch, now updating
Apr 01 03:43:30 <zsoc> castle`: it would get overwritten by the new kernel anyway, but it doesn't hurt i suppose...
Apr 01 03:43:53 <castle`> i assumed it would be fine honestly but i didn't know
Apr 01 03:44:03 <castle`> some people on the forums mentioned uninstalling it so i did
Apr 01 03:44:07 * mjkjr has never had a preware issue especially like this and doesn't know what to do first
Apr 01 03:44:21 <castle`> don't really know what a kernal is or does
Apr 01 03:45:09 <castle`> kernel*
Apr 01 03:45:44 <zsoc> castle`: it is the basic most important and therefore 'dangerous' part of any operating system.. so care isn't a bad thing :)
Apr 01 03:46:10 <jacques> kernel is interface between hardware and userspace
Apr 01 03:46:10 <castle`> i read about it once, just it didn't use terms i understood :P
Apr 01 03:46:12 <castle`> lol
Apr 01 03:46:35 <mjkjr> aaahhhh, off to the doctor!
Apr 01 03:46:45 <zsoc> jacques: I don't believe the word "userspace" means much to him
Apr 01 03:47:03 <jacques> hardware and applications ?
Apr 01 03:47:14 <jacques> but that's not as correct
Apr 01 03:47:21 <zsoc> jacques: that's not really true... there's a lot of things between hardware and applications lolo
Apr 01 03:47:34 <castle`> is userspace like myspace?
Apr 01 03:47:37 <castle`> just kidding
Apr 01 03:47:46 <castle`> update almost done
Apr 01 03:48:07 <jacques> -rwxr-xr-x    1 root     root      1134378 Mar 24 19:48 libglslcompiler.so*
Apr 01 03:50:07 <zsoc> jacques: that shouldn't be surprising, i believe glsl is compiled in real time as of a certain gles spec
Apr 01 03:50:47 <zsoc> i'll give the fs a good ol' diff once the doctor is out
Apr 01 03:51:19 <jacques> zsoc: libglslcompiler.so libOpenVGU.so libOpenVG.so libGLESv2.so libGLES_CM.so  - all touched
Apr 01 03:51:33 <zsoc> interesting
Apr 01 03:51:35 <zsoc> that could be anything tho
Apr 01 03:51:49 <zsoc> ffmpeg and gst-plugins-good was updated too
Apr 01 03:51:56 <zsoc> probably small bugfixes
Apr 01 03:52:00 <jacques> 1.4.1 SDK - http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1588&Itemid=55
Apr 01 03:52:01 <zsoc> gles stuff is probably related to the pdk
Apr 01 03:52:28 <zsoc> WOOO VBOX 3.1 SUPPORT hehe
Apr 01 03:52:36 <jacques> "The JSON parser employed by webOS has been replaced between 1.4 and 1.4.1."
Apr 01 03:52:57 <jacques> "As of webOS 1.4.1.1, apps will have 60 seconds to perform background operations in "headless" mode (with no stages open). In webOS 1.4.1, the limit remains 15 seconds, as it was in 1.4.0."
Apr 01 03:53:19 <jacques> so to answer someone's question, the .1 == 45 seconds
Apr 01 03:53:41 <zsoc> The emulator host mode thing is interesting
Apr 01 03:55:16 <Tibfib> rwhitby: the "Change EV icon to 3G" doesn't seem to work with 1.4.1.1
Apr 01 03:56:33 <Tibfib> (won't install anyway)
Apr 01 03:56:52 <rwhitby> time to write a script which checks which ones apply
Apr 01 03:57:18 <rwhitby> anyone seen dBsooner around?
Apr 01 03:57:21 <rwhitby> ~seen dBsooner
Apr 01 03:57:23 <infobot> dbsooner is currently on #webos-internals #webos-watercooler, last said: 'rwhitby: ping'.
Apr 01 03:57:44 <rwhitby> infobot: yeah, but *when*
Apr 01 03:57:59 <uNiXpSyChO> zsoc:  it gets overwritten but the backup remains of the old install... you have to delete it and reinstall to get backup.
Apr 01 03:58:00 <rwhitby> ~botslap
Apr 01 03:58:01 <infobot> OUCH! That hurt, rwhitby!
Apr 01 03:58:33 <pslag1> I'm new here, but here's my list of patches that did not install:
Apr 01 03:58:35 <zsoc> rwhitby: i thought dBsooner _was_ a script
Apr 01 03:58:36 <pslag1> no-auto-off-while-charging, SMS-tone-per-contact, keytoss-keyword-search
Apr 01 03:58:59 <pslag1> first two did not update/remove when they were just placeholders.
Apr 01 03:59:07 <rwhitby> uNiXpSyChO: I bet 90% of people will not delete the backup, and therefore when they uninstall it will put back the old kernel and they won't realise :)
Apr 01 03:59:12 <zsoc> pslag1: ty for the report
Apr 01 03:59:58 <uNiXpSyChO> rwhitby: yep.  and they probably wont even notice :)
Apr 01 04:00:49 <pslag1> I can provide list of 50 others that did install OK.  and so far seem to work.
Apr 01 04:00:50 <Mercury> rwhitby: One moment.
Apr 01 04:02:01 <Mercury> #webos-internals_2010-03-28.log.bz2:222:12:02 -!- dBsooner [~dBsooner@unaffiliated/dbsooner] has joined #webos-internals
Apr 01 04:02:13 <Mercury> #webos-internals_2010-03-16.log.bz2:1346:20:59 <+dBsooner> rwhitby: ping
Apr 01 04:02:17 <Mercury> That's the last time he spoke.
Apr 01 04:03:12 <zsoc> pslag1: we're ok on ones that are working :)
Apr 01 04:03:35 <Tibfib> A lot of jason's patches aren't 1.4.1.1 friendly
Apr 01 04:05:21 <zsoc> 1.4.1.1 + 800mhz kernel makes the dialer open so fast i cant get it to zoom in from splash mode before it loads
Apr 01 04:05:39 <zsoc> ok and half the time i don't even _see_ the splash
Apr 01 04:05:44 * zsoc yawns
Apr 01 04:05:57 <castle`> so the same 800mhz patch works with the update?
Apr 01 04:06:03 <castle`> or is there an updated patch i need to dl first
Apr 01 04:06:03 <zsoc|away> castle`: yes
Apr 01 04:06:10 <castle`> cool, thanks
Apr 01 04:06:26 <pslag1> fwiw, phone open that fast w/stock kernel.
Apr 01 04:07:36 <uNiXpSyChO> zsoc: according to some people you shouldnt be using 800Mhz
Apr 01 04:09:52 <rwhitby> according to me, each person should decide for themselves what they should be using :)
Apr 01 04:10:11 <castle`> rwhitby, do you use it? :)
Apr 01 04:10:13 <pslag1> risk is in the eye of the beholder.  :-)
Apr 01 04:10:22 <rwhitby> http://webos.pastebin.com/eiNJ2eKx is the list of patches that don't apply cleanly - anyone had one on that list which didn't fail?
Apr 01 04:10:51 <uNiXpSyChO> rwhitby: lol.  did you detect my sarcasm?
Apr 01 04:13:29 <Mercury> rwhitby: Did that answer your question on dBsooner? :)
Apr 01 04:16:15 <nt4cats> rwhitby, zsoc, et al: thanks for your work tonight (and leading up to tonight) getting 1.4.1.1 + patches working
Apr 01 04:17:23 <nt4cats> (and I should put myself in Rod's shoes and say "... your work this morning ..."
Apr 01 04:20:45 <nt4cats> nite folks.  Happy 1.4.1[.1]'ing!
Apr 01 04:23:52 <Dave__> uNiXpSyChO are you the guy that made the overclock patch?
Apr 01 04:24:53 <uNiXpSyChO> Dave_: yep
Apr 01 04:25:22 <rwhitby> the silent partner ;-)
Apr 01 04:25:32 <uNiXpSyChO> :-)
Apr 01 04:25:34 <Dave__> i just read an article that mentioned you
Apr 01 04:25:36 <Dave__> you're famous
Apr 01 04:25:51 <uNiXpSyChO> i got mentioned?  cant be.
Apr 01 04:26:00 <rwhitby> Dave__: which article?
Apr 01 04:28:08 <Dave__> http://news.techworld.com/mobile-wireless/3218825/palm-warns-users-off-webos-overclock-patch/?olo=rss
Apr 01 04:28:24 <Dave__> caj2008 too
Apr 01 04:28:36 <Dave__> they don't put quite the flare on your name that you do though uNiXpSyChO
Apr 01 04:29:01 * mjkjr is glad he looked at rwhitbys pastebin link
Apr 01 04:29:14 <Dave__> i hate how slow my Pre is. My friends with android phones are so much faster. but my phone also seems to get hot quite often so I don't think i'll be oc'ing it
Apr 01 04:34:49 <Dave__> uNiXpSyChO so is your patch just an oc patch or does it also optimize the kernel?
Apr 01 04:37:45 <uNiXpSyChO> Dave__: both... but more oc
Apr 01 04:38:15 <Dave__> is it truly underclocked from 600 to 500 out of the box?
Apr 01 04:39:09 <uNiXpSyChO> i guess you can call it that.  runs 500 normally except during games, then it runs at 600.
Apr 01 04:39:39 <Dave__> i'm canadian, we haven't been trusted with games yet
Apr 01 04:40:39 <uNiXpSyChO> so no 600 for you ;-)
Apr 01 04:41:37 <Dave__> i downloaded quake but it doesnt seem to work
Apr 01 04:41:53 <Dave__> nor does terminal actually
Apr 01 04:41:57 <mjkjr> i'd like to hear any opinions on the scaling app, offers a "set speed" function as well, i.e. 600
Apr 01 04:43:22 <uNiXpSyChO> i havent used the scaling app so I cant comment.  there is nothing in the stock kernel that would stop you from running at 600.
Apr 01 04:43:22 <Dave__> haven't even seen it
Apr 01 04:43:30 * bhuey got his Pre up and going again
Apr 01 04:43:36 <bhuey> weirdness with patches
Apr 01 04:43:44 <mjkjr> it's on precentral
Apr 01 04:43:57 <Dave__> anyoen had success with quake?
Apr 01 04:46:02 <AtomicPlayboy> rwhitby ping
Apr 01 04:48:01 <azakus> http://www.precentral.net/verizon-slahses-palm-pre-plus-4999-pixi-plus-2999
Apr 01 04:48:38 <Dave__> palm should give me a free palm pre plus
Apr 01 04:48:41 <Dave__> bastards
Apr 01 04:50:25 <mjkjr> unixpsycho: thanks
Apr 01 04:51:09 <Dave__> is there a new update tonight??
Apr 01 04:54:10 <AtomicPlayboy> Has anyone gotten Character Counter (messaging) patch to install on 1.4.1.1?
Apr 01 04:54:41 <AtomicPlayboy> I've pretty much gotten everything BUT that to install.
Apr 01 04:55:36 <Dave__> jeez im so out of the loop
Apr 01 04:56:10 <AtomicPlayboy> Dave__: What carrier are you on?
Apr 01 04:56:13 <AtomicPlayboy> And what device?
Apr 01 04:58:00 <Dave__> palm pre Bell Mobility
Apr 01 04:58:09 <AtomicPlayboy> Ah, okay.
Apr 01 04:58:29 <AtomicPlayboy> I don't think Bell is getting the update yet.
Apr 01 04:58:49 <firestrider> does secure erase only write 0s to the usb partition?
Apr 01 04:58:49 <Dave__> you get warning anyways right? so i'll have a chance to remove patches before the update comes out
Apr 01 04:59:23 <AtomicPlayboy> Dave__: By then the AUPT for 1.4.1.x will be complete, and you won't have to worry about removing.
Apr 01 04:59:40 <AtomicPlayboy> You'll still have to remove themes and any overclock/power step patches.
Apr 01 05:00:57 <firestrider> I had the overclock patch (800 mhz) and did a webos doctor... is that sufficient? I still had data on the device (photos, docs, pdfs, etc) after web os doctor
Apr 01 05:00:57 <mjkjr> i need a favor
Apr 01 05:01:10 <mjkjr> someone that HAD the oc kernal but installed it
Apr 01 05:01:11 <firestrider> before updating to 1.4.1.1
Apr 01 05:01:22 <mjkjr> type " ls /var/home/root "
Apr 01 05:01:24 <Dave__> AtomicPlayboy: i have no oc or theme stuff, but what is AUPT?
Apr 01 05:01:49 <mjkjr> s/installed/uninstalled/
Apr 01 05:03:22 <mjkjr> ls /var/home/root please
Apr 01 05:07:01 <AtomicPlayboy> Dave__: Auto-update patch technology. The patches can be updated through Preware instead of having to be uninstalled and re-installed.
Apr 01 05:07:11 <AtomicPlayboy> Also: SMS Tone Per Contact still not working.
Apr 01 05:08:05 <AtomicPlayboy> Timestamps Built-in doesn't work either.
Apr 01 05:08:29 <mjkjr> http://webos.pastebin.com/TYLZV1s6   hmmmm, lol
Apr 01 05:08:39 <firestrider> partial erase just erases apps and app data, full erase does everything partial erase does plus personal files on usb partition, and secure erase does what full erase does but the data isn't recoverable right? does web os doctor erase all personal files and apps/app data or just os specific stuff?
Apr 01 05:09:09 <AtomicPlayboy> And Disable Charge Alert Sound. :\
Apr 01 05:09:53 <mjkjr> And Marco conveniently leaves right before I post my pastebin, I couldn't get a technical answer from anyone else
Apr 01 05:10:10 <AtomicPlayboy> Actually, I'm going to reboot before I try installing anything else.
Apr 01 05:10:29 <mjkjr> the OC scripts uninstall fine but don't have a "cleanup" process that actually removes the .sh file
Apr 01 05:11:56 <firestrider> can someone answer my question please
Apr 01 05:16:56 <AtomicPlayboy> Aha. Charge Alert Disable did work. Didn't isntall the first time.
Apr 01 05:25:05 <AtomicPlayboy> Alright, looks like everything except SMS TPC installed fine.
Apr 01 05:25:14 <AtomicPlayboy> Not sure what the error with SMS Tone Per Contact is.
Apr 01 05:31:17 <AtomicPlayboy> And after 12 attempts, 13th time is the charm...SMS TPC installed. :P
Apr 01 05:31:19 <AtomicPlayboy> And good night.
Apr 01 05:36:22 * rwhitby finally gets a chance to do "Update All" on his 11 installed patches ...
Apr 01 05:42:02 <rwhitby> ... and it worked flawlessly.
Apr 01 05:42:33 <psykoz> I had 8 of my 9 patches install correctly with AUPT
Apr 01 05:48:22 <CorpX> i think i bricked my phone
Apr 01 05:48:25 <CorpX> damn it
Apr 01 05:48:34 <CorpX> pach is spinning but its stuck at close to 10)%
Apr 01 05:48:36 <CorpX> 100%
Apr 01 05:48:38 <CorpX> NM
Apr 01 05:48:42 <CorpX> just finished
Apr 01 05:48:42 <CorpX> hah
Apr 01 05:49:24 <swisstomcat> i've added the 1.4.1 webosdoctor link for o2 gsm
Apr 01 06:04:53 <gkatsev> rwhitby: looks like aupt has a bug where if a patch fails to update it gets removed. or something like that
Apr 01 06:06:34 <rwhitby> gkatsev: that's preware functionality.  if a package fails to install, the remnants of the half-installed package are removed.
Apr 01 06:07:03 <gkatsev> rwhitby: ah, ok. good to know
Apr 01 06:07:26 <rwhitby> I do agree that it's sub-optimal for upgrade scenarios, but by the time the new package has failed to install, the old package has already been removed
Apr 01 06:07:39 <gkatsev> makes sense.
Apr 01 06:08:05 <rwhitby> we need some sort of install queue concept in preware to fix that
Apr 01 06:08:13 <gkatsev> would it be easy to add a reinstallation of the dummy package for the AUPTs?
Apr 01 06:08:34 <rwhitby> now *that's* a good idea.
Apr 01 06:09:09 <rwhitby> hmm - let me think about how to do that, it's not obvious that it can be done.
Apr 01 06:09:37 <gkatsev> because i dont remember which patches i had that were broken. other than the add date patch
Apr 01 06:09:40 <rwhitby> (since ipkg will know that there is a new package available, and may try to install that no matter what aupt thinks it should do)
Apr 01 06:19:32 <gkatsev> hm... yeah, def something to look into
Apr 01 11:29:28 <jettero> man webos gets really pushy about upgrading
Apr 01 11:29:33 <jettero> you can't dismiss the notification or anything
Apr 01 11:30:18 <jettero> I'd upgrade now, but the last 5 upgrades or so (1.3.x, 1.4) haven't worked for me at all and I've had to doctor on a couple.  Doesn't seem smart to upgrade before work, although I made my setup much more vanilla last time
Apr 01 11:30:36 <jettero> mostly people went up to 1.4.1 with no trouble at all even with preware and a copule paches installed, right?
Apr 01 11:32:35 <en0x> yes
Apr 01 11:32:39 <en0x> i had no problems at all
Apr 01 11:32:46 <jettero> I might just risk it
Apr 01 11:32:47 <en0x> and 1.4.1.1 runs very nice ;)
Apr 01 11:33:06 <jettero> afterall, the reason I panick about making sure everything is working right is ... work.  If I have to fix it on work time, seems work related cuz I'm worried about work
Apr 01 11:33:19 <jettero> what is a panick? like a panic+picknick?
Apr 01 11:33:36 <en0x> idk first time i see panick :D
Apr 01 11:33:46 <jettero> heh
Apr 01 11:33:51 <jettero> ok, myabe it was just a typo
Apr 01 11:33:53 <jettero> :p
Apr 01 11:35:08 <en0x> http://i.imgur.com/HiSmH.jpg
Apr 01 11:35:09 <en0x> hahaha
Apr 01 11:35:11 <en0x> pedobear
Apr 01 11:35:12 <en0x> :D
Apr 01 11:50:28 <bpadalino> oh wow .. mobile hot spot plans are now free on vzw? not too shabby
Apr 01 12:18:56 <PuffTheMagic> i wonder what changed between 1.4.1 and 1.4.1.1
Apr 01 12:19:36 <en0x> football app
Apr 01 12:19:37 <en0x> :D
Apr 01 12:30:52 <PuffTheMagic> u guys see the cli interface on  http://xkcd.org/ now?
Apr 01 12:32:22 <en0x> yap
Apr 01 12:36:20 <en0x> looks like GC is much better
Apr 01 12:36:30 <en0x> start 3d game put it in card view
Apr 01 12:36:39 <en0x> wait few minutes run an app
Apr 01 12:36:52 <en0x> if you don;'t wait and run an app u will get too many cards error
Apr 01 12:37:43 <bpadalino> perceived snappiness is much better
Apr 01 12:43:03 <en0x> true
Apr 01 12:47:42 <Major> Good Morning all!
Apr 01 12:48:17 <en0x> its like an afternoon to me... i've been at work since 5am
Apr 01 12:48:18 <en0x> :S
Apr 01 12:48:23 <Major> A Tar question
Apr 01 12:48:33 <Major> LOL it's on 5:48 am here
Apr 01 12:48:38 <en0x> lo
Apr 01 12:48:38 <Major> on = only
Apr 01 12:48:47 <en0x> 8:48 am here
Apr 01 12:48:57 <Major> ah your east coast
Apr 01 12:49:00 <en0x> ya
Apr 01 12:49:00 <en0x> :P
Apr 01 12:49:20 <en0x> ok so whats the tar question
Apr 01 12:49:44 <PuffTheMagic> bpadalino: did u try 1.4.1?
Apr 01 12:50:21 <Major> if i ran tar -cvwf jpre.tar *.* in WOQI would it backup the pre completly? I'm creating a backup and restore program and need a way to make sure it is grabbing all the data for all programs
Apr 01 12:51:12 <en0x> why don't u run: tar -cf jpre.tar / |gzip
Apr 01 12:51:12 <en0x> ;D
Apr 01 12:52:22 <Major> :P
Apr 01 12:52:24 <Major> lol
Apr 01 12:52:50 <Major> cause i wasn't fully thinking and relying on other sources
Apr 01 12:53:52 <Major> one last question... WebOS does have a version of ftp on it right?
Apr 01 12:54:15 <en0x> idk i always use scp
Apr 01 12:55:36 <Major> that should work.
Apr 01 12:55:53 <rwhitby> I use rsync
Apr 01 12:55:59 <rwhitby> over wifi
Apr 01 12:56:10 <en0x> well in ur tar you should also omit /dev
Apr 01 12:56:22 <en0x> Major, or listen to rwhitby  :)
Apr 01 12:56:26 <rwhitby> from an automated central backup system called BackupPC which backs up all computers in my house
Apr 01 12:56:27 <en0x> rwhitby, u r up early :)
Apr 01 12:56:35 <rwhitby> en0x: 11:30pm here
Apr 01 12:56:40 <en0x> oh :)
Apr 01 12:56:42 <Major> Hello Rwhitby
Apr 01 12:58:01 <Major> rwhitby: I'm trying to do this as a App for the general user then have it upload to web hosting that I provide for such user.
Apr 01 12:58:43 <Major> en0x yeah the pre didn't like the tar command lol
Apr 01 12:58:50 <rwhitby> Major: have you seen Save/Restore ?
Apr 01 12:59:00 <Major> no
Apr 01 12:59:09 <rwhitby> http://bit.ly/saverestore
Apr 01 12:59:11 <Major> has someone already done this?
Apr 01 12:59:34 <Major> ah i see someone has... you lol
Apr 01 13:01:28 <Major> is this on Preware yet?
Apr 01 13:01:56 <Major> nevermind found the post saying it is
Apr 01 13:01:57 <rwhitby> yes
Apr 01 13:03:08 <Major> Do you plan on charging for this program or no
Apr 01 13:04:26 <rwhitby> any program that can access any part of the filesystem can never be in the app catalog, so can never be charged for.
Apr 01 13:06:26 <Major> ahhh I see. So in essence I would not be able to charge for the program that I am thinking of doing since it really will never be allowed in the app catalog.
Apr 01 13:06:39 <rwhitby> correct
Apr 01 13:07:20 <rwhitby> if a program in the app catalog can access any file, then I can write a webOS app that can steal your passwords.  Palm is not going to allow such a thing in the app catalog.
Apr 01 13:08:05 <Major> well then I might as well close down the app production.
Apr 01 13:08:08 <en0x> stealing passwords is fun ;d
Apr 01 13:08:13 <Major> lol
Apr 01 13:08:31 <en0x> rwhitby, do u use .htaccess on ipkg.preware.org? :>
Apr 01 13:08:44 <nt4cats> en0x: we already have all your passwords.
Apr 01 13:08:51 <rwhitby> en0x: subtly changing data is funner
Apr 01 13:09:22 <en0x> rwhitby, is there a chance that you can add to .htaccess "IndexOptions NameWidth=*" so I can see the whole name of .ipks?
Apr 01 13:09:50 <rwhitby> en0x: well, I'd probably just put it in the server config instead
Apr 01 13:10:21 <rwhitby> but I'll have to ask our Varnish expert what the equivalent it
Apr 01 13:10:25 <en0x> as u wish...
Apr 01 13:12:45 <Major> rwhitby I am assuming that 90%+ programs do not store there data in the same place
Apr 01 13:13:25 <rwhitby> Major: actually, 90% of the programs will just use databases and cookies.  Save/Restore is designed mainly for the other 10%, like the 3D games for example.
Apr 01 13:14:22 <Major> ls /home
Apr 01 13:14:25 <Major> OOps sorry
Apr 01 13:15:15 <Bmyers> hello rwhitby
Apr 01 13:15:46 <rwhitby> Hi Bmyers.  So the idea would be that when you hit the save button, it would generate a timestamp and pass the same timestamp down do the service for each call.  Then the "zip and email" function would pass that timestamp to a different service method which would return a filename
Apr 01 13:16:20 <rwhitby> alternatively, the method could take a list of id's and timestamps
Apr 01 13:16:40 <rwhitby> so you'd have a menu item which zipped up the selected apps and emailed it
Apr 01 13:16:54 <Bmyers> zip would be done outside of the email call which is mojo
Apr 01 13:17:04 <rwhitby> zip would be done by the service
Apr 01 13:17:09 <Bmyers> ok.
Apr 01 13:17:21 <Major> wow sound like someone else has a simular idea?
Apr 01 13:17:35 <rwhitby> there'd have to be another call to delete the zip file after it was emailed
Apr 01 13:17:42 <Bmyers> having not looked at your code yet, are you tar'ing things up now?
Apr 01 13:18:04 <rwhitby> or alternatively leave it there as an archive, for the basis of future "savesets" which you could unzip and restore.
Apr 01 13:18:18 <Bmyers> thats fine too..
Apr 01 13:18:28 <Bmyers> restore points...
Apr 01 13:18:31 <rwhitby> yep
Apr 01 13:18:48 <Major> rwhitby  if you are not in USB mode where does that file hide after it's done
Apr 01 13:19:04 <Bmyers> so do you create tar files now rwhitby?
Apr 01 13:19:09 <rwhitby> Bmyers: no
Apr 01 13:19:18 <rwhitby> just files in appid/timestamp directories
Apr 01 13:19:22 <Bmyers> just copy .db's to some safe place?
Apr 01 13:19:30 <en0x> oh google added evil bit to ajax api
Apr 01 13:19:33 <en0x> For April Fool's 2010, Google  added an &evil=true parameter to requests through the Ajax APIs
Apr 01 13:19:36 <en0x> ;D
Apr 01 13:19:41 <Major> lol
Apr 01 13:19:47 <rwhitby> yep, /media/internal/saverestore/appid/timestamp
Apr 01 13:19:56 <Holliefant> :) I am tooo stupid to get the pdk working, could someone tell what I am doing wrong? http://webos.pastebin.com/Xf80aT0Y
Apr 01 13:20:12 <Bmyers> so tgz /media/internal/saverestore/appid/timestamp
Apr 01 13:20:15 <Holliefant> sry its german
Apr 01 13:20:23 <rwhitby> Bmyers: so the first step will be to generate a timestamp in the mojo when the save button is pushed, and pass that down to the service save method
Apr 01 13:20:38 <Bmyers> oh, well maybe, /media/internal/saverestore/
Apr 01 13:20:45 <Bmyers> the whole thing...
Apr 01 13:21:04 <Bmyers> 1 big tar file would be easier than lots of little ones
Apr 01 13:21:12 <Major> agreed
Apr 01 13:21:22 <rwhitby> people will want to email just a single app's data
Apr 01 13:21:45 <rwhitby> so the service will support both single app/timestamp, and allapps/timestamp
Apr 01 13:22:12 <Bmyers> well, once back in mojo land i guess it wont matter
Apr 01 13:22:25 <Major> rwhitby what format is the timestamp in?
Apr 01 13:22:25 <Bmyers> all I would need to know is where the file is to email off
Apr 01 13:22:38 <rwhitby> Major: ISO8601 combined basic format
Apr 01 13:23:15 <rwhitby> Bmyers: right, but the mojo need to call the service when the user taps a row in the save screen (for a single app saveset) or when they select the menu option for a complete saveset
Apr 01 13:23:24 <Major> going to make me read.. .GASP lol
Apr 01 13:23:55 <Major> just kidding
Apr 01 13:23:59 <Bmyers> ok, and the service needs to relaunch with parameters to convey the tgz location
Apr 01 13:24:24 <rwhitby> Bmyers: and then later when the user taps a row in the restore screen, we could pop up the list of savesets that contain that app and allow them to select which one to restore
Apr 01 13:24:41 <Bmyers> pretty slick
Apr 01 13:24:56 <rwhitby> Bmyers: no, the mojo subscribes to the service, and gets the filename in the final stage=completed message
Apr 01 13:24:58 <Major> that is awesome rwhitby
Apr 01 13:25:19 <Bmyers> ok, I'll need to look at your code to get up to speed
Apr 01 13:25:25 <rwhitby> Bmyers: take a look at how Preware does subscriptions for long-running tasks like update and install
Apr 01 13:25:52 <Bmyers> ok
Apr 01 13:26:07 <rwhitby> Bmyers: at the moment, the service list method returns the latest timestamp, there will need to be another method to return all timestamps for an appid
Apr 01 13:26:24 <Major> rwhitby: Ok I understand about the ISO now but curious on one item I notice that it does hour - min- sec but after that is shows -0700
Apr 01 13:26:55 <Bmyers> rwhitby: u use eclipse or komo?
Apr 01 13:27:03 <rwhitby> a timestamp is useless unless you know what timezone it was created in
Apr 01 13:27:11 <rwhitby> Bmyers: I use emacs
Apr 01 13:27:39 <Major> Yeah you are absolutly correct and I should have realized that... maybe i should go back to bed lol
Apr 01 13:27:45 <rwhitby> Bmyers: but have eclipse installed
Apr 01 13:27:47 <Bmyers> ok, was hoping there was an easier method for me to get up to speed on your work rather than vi on my pre
Apr 01 13:28:00 <rwhitby> Bmyers: git.webos-internals.org
Apr 01 13:28:13 <Bmyers> there ya go... ok..
Apr 01 13:28:19 <rwhitby> Bmyers: you should be able to use the git plugin for eclipse to load that as a project
Apr 01 13:29:03 <Bmyers> wow, you guys have quite the library there..
Apr 01 13:29:05 <rwhitby> (well, we don't have the project config file for that one)
Apr 01 13:29:34 <Bmyers> hadnt looked in a while..
Apr 01 13:31:00 <rwhitby> ok, over the weekend I'll revamp the service and scripts to accept a timestamp when saving, rather than generating one in the scripts.
Apr 01 13:31:33 <rwhitby> the first step will be for the save screen to pass down that timestamp. then it can control which apps will have their save data lumped together
Apr 01 13:32:16 <Major> rwhitby are you guys talking about the save/restore program of yours?
Apr 01 13:32:20 <rwhitby> then I'll add an archive method which takes an optional appid and returns the generated archive file pathname
Apr 01 13:32:37 <rwhitby> Major: yes, Bmyers is offering to help on the mojo side
Apr 01 13:33:52 <Major> rwhitby cool
Apr 01 13:34:58 <rwhitby> ok, I'm gone. just turned midnight.
Apr 01 13:34:59 <Holliefant> :(
Apr 01 13:35:03 * rwhitby bbt - night all
Apr 01 13:35:04 <Bmyers> rwhitby: sounds good
Apr 01 13:35:08 <Bmyers> c u l8r
Apr 01 13:35:28 <Holliefant> anyone who could tell me what I am doing wrong again? :)
Apr 01 13:37:18 <VincentLaw> blast, just missed rwhitby
Apr 01 13:37:21 <VincentLaw> poke dBsooner
Apr 01 13:37:52 <Major> lol
Apr 01 13:48:29 <sdodson> Has /proc/cpuinfo always reported 600bogomips or is this something new with 1.4.1[.1]?
Apr 01 13:49:00 <en0x> i havent checked on mine yet
Apr 01 13:49:23 <en0x> i heard that it's going to 600Mhz only when you play games but when you don't it goes back to 500Mhz
Apr 01 13:52:04 <RagingMind> how much of the "traditional" set of userland linux stuff do they actually make use of in webos?
Apr 01 13:54:08 <RagingMind> I notice in the list of source stuff on http://opensource.palm.com/1.4.0/index.html that there's libpurple and pulseaudio
Apr 01 14:03:44 <zsoc_wirc> RagingMind: I'm confused by your question
Apr 01 14:03:55 <zsoc_wirc> they use everything on that page
Apr 01 14:04:10 <zsoc_wirc> media is alsa/pulseaudio and gstreamer/ffmpeg
Apr 01 14:04:53 <zsoc_wirc> maybe I'm confused by the idea of a traditional set of userland linux utilities/libraries
Apr 01 14:09:49 <RagingMind> I guess a better question would be how much custom stuff do they have to handle things?
Apr 01 14:10:15 <RagingMind> for example. is the camera a v4l device? and stuff like that
Apr 01 14:13:51 <nt4cats> RagingMind: my statment(s) here are pure conjecture -- I've never looked into this at all ...
Apr 01 14:14:17 <RagingMind> nt4cats, noted...
Apr 01 14:14:21 <nt4cats> RagingMind: ... but I'd assume that if it was a v4l device someone would have noticed that earlier and homebrewed video recording earlier
Apr 01 14:14:35 <zsoc_wirc> RagingMind: I can tell you anything you need to know about the media framework with much accuracy. anything outside of that I can not
Apr 01 14:14:41 <nt4cats> RagingMind: video recording WAS homebrewed, but I infer that it was pretty hackilicious
Apr 01 14:14:54 <zsoc_wirc> nt4cats: I take offense to that
Apr 01 14:15:08 <nt4cats> zsoc_wirc: that was a compliment
Apr 01 14:15:42 <zsoc_wirc> RagingMind: v4l2 has a custom webos patch, plus a low level driver daemon for the camera driver (camd) that interacts directly with the element
Apr 01 14:15:48 <zsoc_wirc> nt4cats: I know, I was joking :)
Apr 01 14:16:19 * tlp eyes the calendar 
Apr 01 14:16:27 * tlp suspects lots of joking
Apr 01 14:16:36 <nt4cats> RagingMind: but there is this guy 'zsoc' who is here occasionally.  I think he knows a guy who knows something about the webOS media framework
Apr 01 14:17:15 <zsoc_wirc> tlp: I'm not a big fan of april fools
Apr 01 14:17:43 * RagingMind hates interacting with people on 4-1
Apr 01 14:18:37 <zsoc_wirc> nt4cats: and if you must know, the big hurdle for video recording earlier was a lack of ability to mux properly. no compatible muxers were available for such an ancient version of glib/gst being used on webos
Apr 01 14:18:38 <tlp> ditto and ditto
Apr 01 14:18:57 <zsoc_wirc> nt4cats: and even after I backported multiples, they weren't compatible with palms crappy encoder
Apr 01 14:18:59 <nt4cats> zsoc_wirc: noted
Apr 01 14:19:05 <en0x> zsoc_wirc, did they finally updated gst?
Apr 01 14:19:09 <en0x> to newer version?
Apr 01 14:19:12 <Lumiere> zsoc_wirc: how hard would it be to get a basic reencoder on the pre? :)
Apr 01 14:19:34 <zsoc_wirc> nt4cats: I figured out a way to feed the raw frames to ffmpeg for encoding, but just as that happened palm released their muxer in 1.3.1
Apr 01 14:19:36 <Lumiere> or even just a container replacement
Apr 01 14:19:38 <tlp> Pure speculation, but I wonder if Palm took advantage of the work the Pitivi project is putting into gstreamer
Apr 01 14:19:47 <zsoc_wirc> Lumiere: it already does it
Apr 01 14:19:54 <zsoc_wirc> en0x: no, they wrote their own plugins
Apr 01 14:19:56 <RagingMind> gst-base is 10.21 in 1.4
Apr 01 14:20:28 <en0x> the newest one is 10.28
Apr 01 14:20:30 <Lumiere> zsoc_wirc: is it not a visible api atm?
Apr 01 14:20:32 <zsoc_wirc> Lumiere: after my current project, my next is a reencoder
Apr 01 14:20:36 <Lumiere> ah
Apr 01 14:20:57 <en0x> zsoc_wirc, what's ur current project? :>
Apr 01 14:21:01 * Lumiere hates .3gp totally useless once sent to computer
Apr 01 14:21:27 <zsoc_wirc> Lumiere: yeah, you can reencode using either gstreamer or ffmpeg, but for the former you need to write an application or use command line, and for the latter you need a 'working' ffmpeg compile
Apr 01 14:21:38 <Lumiere> lol
Apr 01 14:21:58 <zsoc_wirc> Lumiere: but I'm going to mke it transparent
Apr 01 14:22:12 <Lumiere> one of these days I will get into palm app development :)
Apr 01 14:22:27 * RagingMind actually likes using gst-launch over ffmpeg to reencode files from a command line
Apr 01 14:22:28 <zsoc_wirc> honeslty I would be glad to write APIs for mic/cam access, but I'm sure palm engineers are getting paid for that
Apr 01 14:22:53 <zsoc_wirc> RagingMind: I'm a huge gstreamer fan, but ffmpeg does have it's advantages... specifically transcoding
Apr 01 14:23:29 <zsoc_wirc> en0x: see my latest commit to precorderD on the gitweb
Apr 01 14:23:31 <RagingMind> I like the elements part of gst, it make it easy for me to follow exactly what's going on
Apr 01 14:23:45 <zsoc_wirc> RagingMind: I agree, and the debugging is top notch
Apr 01 14:24:19 <zsoc_wirc> RagingMind: the main 'mediaserver' (player/recorder) for webos is closed source, but it accepts --gst-debug, so it might as well be open
Apr 01 14:24:28 * RagingMind 's dirty little secret is that he doesn't have a Prē yet...
Apr 01 14:24:42 <RagingMind> soon... very soon  *evil laugh*
Apr 01 14:25:00 <zsoc_wirc> RagingMind: that's ok. I don't have an android phone but I try to keep up with the dev news there
Apr 01 14:26:22 <RagingMind> I think it's sad that there's so much focus on Android stuff just because it's made by google and they're the "cool kids" in the tech world at the moment
Apr 01 14:26:58 <zsoc_wirc> RagingMind: I would be developing on android right now if their media framework wasn't so foolish
Apr 01 14:27:04 <zsoc_wirc> literally foolish
Apr 01 14:27:36 <en0x> wow
Apr 01 14:27:40 <en0x> a voice recorder app :P
Apr 01 14:28:05 <RagingMind> I keep hearing from developer people how much more well thought out webos is... (though I do hang out in here, but of course there'd never be any bias)  ;)
Apr 01 14:28:31 <VincentLaw> its still very limiting
Apr 01 14:30:03 <Lumiere> just remember that at some level... the frameworks need to be limited on a cell phone for security
Apr 01 14:30:09 <Lumiere> hacked cell phones => BAD THING :)
Apr 01 14:30:42 <zsoc_wirc> I disagree
Apr 01 14:30:54 <zsoc_wirc> RagingMind: the biggest problem is transparancy to developers
Apr 01 14:30:59 <zsoc_wirc> and I mean webos developers
Apr 01 14:31:39 <RagingMind> I'm not a cell network nerd... but I do believe that if the network was properly designed then it would be resilient to crackers
Apr 01 14:31:40 <zsoc_wirc> linux devs can do... basically anything. but that doesn't translate to app catalog apps
Apr 01 14:31:55 <playya> anyone tested how many fingers are accepted by the pre's touchscreen? maybe 4?
Apr 01 14:32:17 <en0x> playya, the guy was talking about it during GDC
Apr 01 14:32:25 <en0x> playya, it's on their video about pdk
Apr 01 14:32:29 <nt4cats> playya: I've gone to 11 and it worked ...
Apr 01 14:32:50 <RagingMind> nt4cats, was your nose the 11th?
Apr 01 14:32:55 <en0x> playya, if i remember correctly he said 9
Apr 01 14:33:16 <en0x> i dont think he used nose for the 11th finger
Apr 01 14:33:19 <en0x> lol
Apr 01 14:33:22 <VincentLaw> because you know, you can easily fit 10 fingers on the screen and still see what the heck is going on
Apr 01 14:33:28 <zsoc_wirc> playya: 5
Apr 01 14:33:56 <zsoc_wirc> playya: I should rephrase, 5 is as many as you can code for.
Apr 01 14:34:16 <bpadalino|work> i have gotten 11 points to show up on the touchscreen in a testing mode
Apr 01 14:34:25 <bpadalino|work> but i believe 4 are supported by the pdk
Apr 01 14:38:22 <zsoc_wirc> bpadalino: not sure about official apis, but I'm pretty certain the sdl implementation supports 5
Apr 01 14:41:07 <bpadalino|work> is it 5 ?
Apr 01 14:41:10 <bpadalino|work> 5 mice ?
Apr 01 14:41:13 <bpadalino|work> possibly
Apr 01 14:42:00 <zsoc_wirc> bpadalino: I remember running the sdlmousetest and trying to get my thumb to fit on the screen with my other 4 fingers
Apr 01 14:42:15 <en0x> http://www.gdcvault.com/showConference.php?category=free&conference=280&expand_conferences=,280&type=1
Apr 01 14:42:21 <en0x> 34:10
Apr 01 14:42:26 <en0x> 5 fingers
Apr 01 14:42:48 <en0x> if u look at the video from GDC
Apr 01 14:44:04 <en0x> which is enough I guess
Apr 01 14:44:05 <en0x> :D
Apr 01 14:45:22 <bpadalino|work> yeah it was really difficult for me to get 11 points on the screen during the hardware test
Apr 01 14:49:59 <ghost_of_zsoc>  my wife just called me to let me know 1.4.1.1 broke her patches. I had to tell her to do a feed update in preware. sometimes my life seems redundent
Apr 01 14:50:28 <nt4cats> you should interact with your wife exclusively via the irc
Apr 01 14:50:54 <en0x> :>
Apr 01 14:51:19 <atlanta> Godmorning
Apr 01 14:51:37 <nt4cats> God morning to you, too.
Apr 01 14:51:42 <atlanta> lol at zsoc wife
Apr 01 14:52:03 <ghost_of_zsoc> god morning to all
Apr 01 14:52:23 <nt4cats> atlanta: if zsoc's wife was here right now she'd be shooting you with her laser eye-beams.
Apr 01 14:52:23 <atlanta> nt4cats: :-)
Apr 01 14:52:35 <atlanta> lol thats fine
Apr 01 14:53:00 <nt4cats> I've never met zsoc's wife (nor zsoc) -- but I have a wife and have learned that they *all* have laser eye-beams of death.
Apr 01 14:53:02 <atlanta> SOOOOOOOOO who wants to work on a free wifi program
Apr 01 14:53:02 <atlanta> ?
Apr 01 14:53:18 <en0x> yo mama
Apr 01 14:53:18 <en0x> :D
Apr 01 14:53:22 <atlanta> OH HELL NALL
Apr 01 14:53:22 <ghost_of_zsoc> atlanta: you?
Apr 01 14:53:28 * atlanta takes the gloves off 
Apr 01 14:53:33 <atlanta> ghost_of_zsoc: you got it
Apr 01 14:53:34 <atlanta> :-)
Apr 01 14:53:45 <atlanta> im tired of seeing mytether get 14.95 DONATIONS
Apr 01 14:53:45 <atlanta> lol
Apr 01 14:54:09 <en0x> hehe
Apr 01 14:54:23 <en0x> want it?
Apr 01 14:54:30 <en0x> i can give u mytether for free
Apr 01 14:54:56 <ghost_of_zsoc> en0x: please don't make me kick you again
Apr 01 14:55:04 <en0x> why?
Apr 01 14:55:18 <en0x> i donated so I can do whatever i want with my copy.. can't I?
Apr 01 14:55:30 <nt4cats> en0x: "Honor all licenses, carrier agreements and copyrights"
Apr 01 14:55:44 <ghost_of_zsoc> I'm sure there's some reason why you can't distribute it, and I'm not going to read through the license to find out
Apr 01 14:56:06 <en0x> yeye ye
Apr 01 14:56:46 <atlanta> lmfaoo
Apr 01 14:56:47 <nt4cats> hmmm ... just got a money-making idea ... a website called "the wives of #webos-internals"
Apr 01 14:56:50 <atlanta>  nall i dont need it
Apr 01 14:56:51 <atlanta> :-)
Apr 01 14:57:01 <atlanta> im going to create the service starting today
Apr 01 14:57:05 <Bmyers> hi atlanta
Apr 01 14:57:12 <atlanta> but if any one wants to help be my guess
Apr 01 14:57:12 <nt4cats> hot women and their webOS devices
Apr 01 14:57:12 <Bmyers> godmorning to ya
Apr 01 14:57:29 <atlanta> Bmyers: goodmorning brother
Apr 01 14:57:38 <Bmyers> hows FLA today?
Apr 01 14:59:11 <en0x> oh i'm getting sick of that april fool's day
Apr 01 14:59:13 <en0x> http://i.imgur.com/WMvwG.png
Apr 01 14:59:36 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: I'd be willing to prose most of our wifes are attractive
Apr 01 15:00:11 <TheInvsbleMan> enox: http://www.thinkgeek.com/ how about those Aril Fools products?
Apr 01 15:00:17 <TheInvsbleMan> April*
Apr 01 15:00:54 <en0x> oh 1.4.1.1 just killed my phone app, and email app
Apr 01 15:01:03 <en0x> they were not running in jstop
Apr 01 15:01:04 <en0x> :(
Apr 01 15:01:29 <RagingMind> if you *have* to donate an exact amount of money to get something can you legally call it a donation?
Apr 01 15:03:00 <ghost_of_zsoc> RagingMind: a mandatory donation.
Apr 01 15:03:19 <ghost_of_zsoc> RagingMind: freetether works fine, just doesn't do hotspot
Apr 01 15:04:22 <TheInvsbleMan> JayCanuck: While running 1.4 I had the 800mhz patch installed. Ran webOS RU. All it replaced was PmNetConfigManager. This messed up my data connection horribly. I manually replaced the file with the one from webOS doc and it is now working fine. Just giving you a heads up.
Apr 01 15:04:44 <JayCanuck> Repair Utility doesn't touch the kernel area
Apr 01 15:05:03 <JayCanuck> thus the issue
Apr 01 15:05:23 <TheInvsbleMan> Ahh all right.
Apr 01 15:05:30 <ghost_of_zsoc> JayCanuck: 'ello :)
Apr 01 15:06:17 <en0x> hmm I wonder why phone app, and email app was killed
Apr 01 15:06:21 <JayCanuck> you'd have the old custom kernel which used a modified PmNetConfigManager, so when you restored that, issues ensued. I'd recommend webOSDoctoring if you accidentally left it on
Apr 01 15:06:25 <en0x> i wasnt doing anything on my phone
Apr 01 15:06:38 <JayCanuck> hi ghost_of_zsoc
Apr 01 15:08:25 <TheInvsbleMan> See but an odd thing happened. The MD5 of PmNetConfigManager that was on my device after webOS RU did not match the md5 of the one contained in webOS doc
Apr 01 15:09:12 <nt4cats> I can't believe that there is only one RPN calc for webOS -- and it is $10!
Apr 01 15:09:33 <nt4cats> ... this is almost enough of a travesty that I'm considering writing software with a UI
Apr 01 15:11:00 <TheInvsbleMan> JayCanuck: In any case... Everything is working fine now.
Apr 01 15:11:07 <atlanta> Bmyers: 83
Apr 01 15:11:09 <en0x> beautiful... luna crash :S
Apr 01 15:11:21 <bpadalino|work> did you turn on core file generation ?
Apr 01 15:11:21 <atlanta> 1.4.1.1
Apr 01 15:11:23 <atlanta> is out
Apr 01 15:11:23 <atlanta> ?
Apr 01 15:11:31 <en0x> atlanta, since yesterday?
Apr 01 15:11:32 <en0x> :>
Apr 01 15:11:48 <atlanta> ghost_of_zsoc: does usb right
Apr 01 15:12:00 <en0x> bpadalino|work, nope I will
Apr 01 15:12:08 <en0x> i remember somebody was giving a command to do it
Apr 01 15:12:16 <atlanta> en0x: any new features to nut off to?
Apr 01 15:12:25 <en0x> atlanta, bug fixes mainly
Apr 01 15:12:27 <atlanta> ok
Apr 01 15:15:08 <atlanta> i definitely need the update my images be overwriting
Apr 01 15:15:10 <atlanta> what a b*tch
Apr 01 15:15:38 <atlanta> damn man wtf can we get proxy support
Apr 01 15:15:49 <atlanta> how hard is it to make luna use export or smoething
Apr 01 15:17:45 <en0x> i think i will need to visit a doctor
Apr 01 15:17:58 <atlanta> they want it to be a business phone i cant even use wifi at work
Apr 01 15:18:05 <en0x> anyway I will run my pre for another day or two without doctoring it and see if it will happen again
Apr 01 15:18:08 <en0x> the luna crash
Apr 01 15:18:18 <atlanta> en0x: NOGOOD
Apr 01 15:18:27 <atlanta> anyone on good with creating services
Apr 01 15:18:36 <atlanta> or better yet who made freetether again
Apr 01 15:18:36 <atlanta> ?
Apr 01 15:18:58 <en0x> atlanta, PuffTheMagic?
Apr 01 15:19:23 <atlanta> PuffTheMagic: you there buddy
Apr 01 15:19:59 <ghost_of_zsoc> atlanta: he won't do it unless he can rewrite it in lisp
Apr 01 15:20:20 <atlanta> what the program
Apr 01 15:20:21 <atlanta> ?
Apr 01 15:20:26 <atlanta> booooooo
Apr 01 15:22:08 <atlanta> ok solo i go
Apr 01 15:22:22 <atlanta> ghost_of_zsoc: u good with making services
Apr 01 15:22:23 <atlanta> ?
Apr 01 15:22:44 <atlanta> is there a tut on that i thought iremember seeing one
Apr 01 15:25:32 <atlanta> LISP LOOST CRAAZY
Apr 01 15:25:51 <ghost_of_zsoc> atlanta: start by knowing C (or pretending, like me)
Apr 01 15:27:05 <bpadalino|work> morning chuq .. looks like a pretty successful rollout of 1.4.1[.1]
Apr 01 15:27:14 <bpadalino|work> lunch time
Apr 01 15:27:22 <chuqui> morning. thanks!
Apr 01 15:28:35 <ghost_of_zsoc> chuqui: mornin. I agree with the successful rollout comment :) paid apps i
Apr 01 15:28:40 <ghost_of_zsoc> s a good thing
Apr 01 15:29:54 <nt4cats> The amount of NSFW content on reddit today is much lower than ususal.    Cruelest.  April.  Fools.   Joke.   Ever.
Apr 01 15:30:45 <atlanta> chuqui: morning
Apr 01 15:30:54 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: not on mine. you should see which subreddits are frontpaged on my account
Apr 01 15:31:01 <atlanta> ghost_of_zsoc: can i write it in java ?
Apr 01 15:31:24 <ghost_of_zsoc> atlanta: eh... java is very limiting, service wise imo
Apr 01 15:31:49 <atlanta> ok gotcha
Apr 01 15:31:56 <atlanta> i know the basics of C
Apr 01 15:33:12 <atlanta> hopefully that does me ell
Apr 01 15:33:20 <atlanta> now to look in get at some C services
Apr 01 15:34:04 <atlanta> git**
Apr 01 15:36:24 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: /r/eskimo_porn/ is pretty good today ...
Apr 01 15:39:27 <ghost_of_zsoc> it always is
Apr 01 16:09:54 <nt4cats> Pre Plus wins the laptopmag final four match -- on to the finals!
Apr 01 16:11:16 <nt4cats> wow, there have only been a total of 2 votes so far (1 each per phone) on the Tour vs Driod poll
Apr 01 16:11:18 <nt4cats> hah!
Apr 01 16:13:11 <en0x> troll
Apr 01 16:13:51 <nt4cats> yes I am a troll, usually, but had no trolling intentions with those statements ...
Apr 01 16:14:06 <en0x> hehe
Apr 01 16:14:28 <en0x> yesterday in the update thread I saw like 50 comments about the march madness
Apr 01 16:16:15 <TheInvsbleMan>  http://twitpic.com/1cbgtv  totally reminds me of http://bit.ly/bmuQJk. :)
Apr 01 16:17:23 <nt4cats> TheInvsbleMan: the '.' got included in the URL
Apr 01 16:17:30 <nt4cats> (2nd link)
Apr 01 16:17:48 <ghost_of_zsoc> not on my client
Apr 01 16:17:58 <TheInvsbleMan> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=368081856694785620#
Apr 01 16:18:09 <TheInvsbleMan> there ya go
Apr 01 16:18:25 <nt4cats> TheInvsbleMan: I have the technology required to click on my browser's address bar, delete the '.', and press Enter :)
Apr 01 16:18:49 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: what client are you using?
Apr 01 16:19:04 <TheInvsbleMan> You guys all remember that commercial?
Apr 01 16:19:06 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: wirc
Apr 01 16:19:07 * nt4cats is not a big fan of his current irc client, but is too lazy to randomly try other(s)
Apr 01 16:19:29 <en0x> irssi didn't included . in URL :)
Apr 01 16:20:00 <nt4cats> Hmmm, no wirc pacakge for Fedora
Apr 01 16:20:05 <TheInvsbleMan> I'm on webchat.freenode and it's not included either
Apr 01 16:20:33 <nt4cats> okay, then KVIrc is extra-sucky in terms of including '.''s in URLs
Apr 01 16:20:42 <TheInvsbleMan> But yea, I just saw that stream of Tweets last night and instantly thought of that commercial
Apr 01 16:21:51 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: what's wrong with xchat?
Apr 01 16:22:13 <en0x> it sucks on windows
Apr 01 16:22:13 <en0x> :p
Apr 01 16:25:10 <TheInvsbleMan> My campus blocks IRC clients :-./
Apr 01 16:25:23 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: nothing as far as I know
Apr 01 16:25:58 <en0x> mine doesn't ;)
Apr 01 16:26:00 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: ... when I decided to hang out here (much to the chagrin of all of you), I had an irc client installed (this one) ... and it hasn't annoyed me enough to try others
Apr 01 16:26:11 <en0x> err maybe because i'm one of the admins here...
Apr 01 16:26:24 <en0x> hmmm gotta think about this for a while
Apr 01 16:26:28 <nt4cats> ... but my 'annoyed' factor is increasing a bit
Apr 01 16:27:27 <TheInvsbleMan> btw for anyone wondering the 800Mhz patch is working just fine on 1.4.1.1
Apr 01 16:28:47 <en0x> my pre is blazing fast without the 800Mhz kernel!
Apr 01 16:29:11 <en0x> it's faster than my toaster
Apr 01 16:29:16 <TheInvsbleMan> haha
Apr 01 16:29:28 <en0x> ;D
Apr 01 16:31:03 <TheInvsbleMan> Is anyone working on trying other flavors of Linux on the Pre yet?
Apr 01 16:33:31 <nt4cats> This is nt4cats on XChat
Apr 01 16:38:02 <hucksy> hi Mousey
Apr 01 16:38:08 <Mousey> hi
Apr 01 16:46:55 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: what do you do
Apr 01 16:47:10 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: as in what is my job?
Apr 01 16:47:33 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: not necessarily, but if that's something you do, ok :)
Apr 01 16:48:48 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: I work at a startup slinging Python, using/running a 196-node Hadoop cluster, and utilizing a $2MM data warehousing appliance from Netezza.
Apr 01 16:49:05 <DarkSpecter> hi
Apr 01 16:49:21 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: I've spent most of the last 15 years in an architect role or as the manager/director running engineering groups.
Apr 01 16:49:41 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: sounds fancy. why don't we use you here again?
Apr 01 16:50:10 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: well, work keeps me pretty busy and I have 2 young kids at home.  I don't have a whole lot of time for side projects
Apr 01 16:50:51 <DarkSpecter> my update app tells me that there are app updates available even though there are none, normaly i wouldnt care but it's preventing me from geting the 1.4.1 update
Apr 01 16:50:59 <DarkSpecter> is there any way to fix that
Apr 01 16:51:20 <halfhalo_T400> what network are you on?
Apr 01 16:51:21 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: e.g. I spent 2.5 hours yesterday with my 5 year-old son picking him up from a party, getting him changed, feeding him, and then taking him to and assistant-coaching his t-ball practice
Apr 01 16:51:28 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: makes sense. well I use you for banter :>
Apr 01 16:51:48 <DarkSpecter> vodafone germany
Apr 01 16:51:54 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: 10 years ago that would all have been "side project" time
Apr 01 16:54:34 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: how did you get into a startup? just general job market woes or you believe in their vision?
Apr 01 16:55:40 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: ... well 2 jobs ago (a place called TruePosition) I worked for a guy I liked.  He left TP to join a startup (founded by the same guy who started TP 10 years prior), and I followed him there.
Apr 01 16:56:03 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: sounds like a good gig :)
Apr 01 16:56:51 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: that startup ran out of money a year ago -- and I was on the street (it has subsequently come back to life).  A friend of mine knew I was smart and looking for work and gave my name to the President of the startup I work for now.
Apr 01 16:57:24 <nt4cats> ... he called me, I came in, and they offered me a job that day.  I'll be here a year in 2 weeks.
Apr 01 17:00:10 <JayCanuck> anyone here know much about optware feeds?
Apr 01 17:01:14 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: it is very early-startup-y here ... lots of early 20-somethings here with all the hardware you want and a stocked beer fridge (and all the free food you want) -- beer pong games are likely to break out at any time ... and then there is the nearly-40 and nearly-bald guy [me] in the corner.
Apr 01 17:02:29 <nt4cats> ... but we're doing VERY well financially -- unbelievably well for a startup
Apr 01 17:02:54 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: where is it, and what do I need to know to get in? :)
Apr 01 17:03:54 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: we have offices in Philly and Manhattan.  http://www.invitemedia.com/
Apr 01 17:04:52 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: I can move to manhattan
Apr 01 17:06:09 <DarkSpecter> nobody a ide awhat could be the reason for the updater to be stuck in "app update" mode ?
Apr 01 17:06:24 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: which do you work in? :)
Apr 01 17:06:33 <nt4cats> ghost_of_zsoc: Philly
Apr 01 17:06:50 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats:  aw :/ well no reason to apply lol
Apr 01 17:09:15 <atlanta> mytether does things so ghetto
Apr 01 17:09:17 <atlanta> lordy
Apr 01 17:09:31 <hertzi> hey - I just played around with the emulator host mode in 1.4.1 and found 3 hidden apps: com.palm.app.collectlogs, com.palm.app.usbpassthrough, com.palm.app.monad - did I just never see them or are they new?
Apr 01 17:10:09 <atlanta> u just never seen them
Apr 01 17:10:30 <atlanta> i know the usb one is old
Apr 01 17:10:39 <hertzi> ok
Apr 01 17:11:19 <hertzi> does usbpassthough really make your pre a usb mouse?
Apr 01 17:11:33 <chrisa> o.O
Apr 01 17:12:08 <atlanta> .........
Apr 01 17:12:09 <ghost_of_zsoc> chrisa: hahaha best reaction
Apr 01 17:12:09 <atlanta> no
Apr 01 17:12:10 <atlanta> lol
Apr 01 17:12:51 <hertzi> what is it for then?
Apr 01 17:13:16 <hertzi> aaaaa
Apr 01 17:13:24 <hertzi> meant gps mouse
Apr 01 17:13:27 <hertzi> sorry
Apr 01 17:13:33 <chrisa> O.o
Apr 01 17:13:57 <DarkSpecter> could preware or the installer service be interfering with the update app
Apr 01 17:15:37 <hertzi> it has the mode GPS, Diag (diagnostic, I guess), and HCI controll port - just assumed that that means it woud give the gps data directly to the usb port...
Apr 01 17:17:56 <chrisa> Having the hardware doesn't mean they're connected in such a way or with software to provide such a thing
Apr 01 17:18:51 <bpadalino|work> what's software other than just virtual bits ?
Apr 01 17:19:01 <halfhalo_class> virtual bytes
Apr 01 17:19:35 <nt4cats> my bits and bytes aren't virtual, they're literal
Apr 01 17:21:56 <jacques> something is wrong with kernel.org
Apr 01 17:23:08 <loot-> chrisa: i take it you're one of the nano maintainers? "chrisa" popped up when i was using the source rpm
Apr 01 17:23:17 <bpadalino|work> hehe, cute
Apr 01 17:23:25 <chrisa> Alas, my name is not remotely unique
Apr 01 17:23:35 <ghost_of_zsoc> nt4cats: hey.. does your client support pms? :)
Apr 01 17:23:38 <jettero> awesome
Apr 01 17:23:40 <loot-> true but its unique enough to raise an eye brow
Apr 01 17:23:40 <chrisa> I tripped over 4 people with my name on the way to work
Apr 01 17:23:40 <loot-> :P
Apr 01 17:23:49 <jettero> my phone seems to be installing the update to 1.4.1 over and over and over and over
Apr 01 17:24:01 <jettero> at a certain point I'll have to give up and doctor
Apr 01 17:24:08 <jettero> this happened last time too.  I wonder what's going wrong
Apr 01 17:24:23 <jettero> clearly somethign I did, but I was really vanilla this time (preware, but that's about it)
Apr 01 17:25:38 <loot-> never had any of those problems
Apr 01 17:25:47 <bpadalino|work> they must not exist
Apr 01 17:25:51 <loot-> only doctored my phone twice now and ive had it a long time
Apr 01 17:26:14 <bpadalino|work> i've still not doctored my phone .. surprisingly enough it still works very well
Apr 01 17:26:29 <loot-> i didnt have to doctor mine either time
Apr 01 17:26:34 <halfhalo_class> lol
Apr 01 17:26:36 <loot-> i just did it to make cleaning it up faster
Apr 01 17:26:51 <loot-> testing kernels and putting gentoo userlands and crap on it
Apr 01 17:26:52 <jettero> yeah, I have no idea what I did
Apr 01 17:26:59 <loot-> hacking the poop out of the OS and what not
Apr 01 17:27:06 <loot-> makes it easier to just wipe it
Apr 01 17:27:09 <jettero> last time I surmized it was the crazy way I mounted /opt and maybe the /opt ipkg was too early int he path or something
Apr 01 17:27:12 <en0x> i think i track the issue that was killing the phone app and email app or luna restart
Apr 01 17:27:14 <jettero> but I don't have any of that this time
Apr 01 17:27:23 <en0x> but i need more time to be 100% sure
Apr 01 17:27:39 <jettero> I hate doctoring
Apr 01 17:27:47 <jettero> It takes like 4 hours to get everything put back where it should go
Apr 01 17:27:59 <loot-> wow mine never took that long lol
Apr 01 17:28:07 <bpadalino|work> i should make sure my core file options are still set
Apr 01 17:28:19 <loot-> last time i doctored it took like an hour to get it wiped and put back together... with preware and terminal even
Apr 01 17:28:21 <jettero> well, the doctoring doesn't take long, but rearranging all my icons, setting my feeds back up, etc
Apr 01 17:28:31 <jettero> sya bam, I got the ! yield sign
Apr 01 17:28:38 <jettero> fuck
Apr 01 17:28:58 <nt4cats> jettero: here on #webos-internals we say "golly"
Apr 01 17:29:04 <loot-> haha
Apr 01 17:29:05 <jettero> yeah, I suppose
Apr 01 17:29:38 <loot-> not i
Apr 01 17:29:59 <loot-> you hear curses coming from my cubicle all day
Apr 01 17:30:17 <loot-> lifes too short to care about a word :P
Apr 01 17:30:19 <nt4cats> loot-: you can keep your golly-ing language in your cube, then.  The rest of us are pure and innocent.
Apr 01 17:30:44 * loot- kills your purity and teaches you how to pour out a little liquor for it
Apr 01 17:31:32 <noradtux> hi
Apr 01 17:32:03 <noradtux> does someone know a way to play sound over a bluetooth handsfree-set in a car?
Apr 01 17:32:14 <jettero> I really gotta figure out what I'm doing to my phone that breaks the upgrade tool
Apr 01 17:32:15 <noradtux> and no, it does not understand a2dp ;)
Apr 01 17:32:25 <jettero> I'm considering not installing preware, but I doubt htat's it since it works for everyone else
Apr 01 17:33:42 <DarkSpecter> jettero: i wish my update app would at least try to download the webos update
Apr 01 17:33:51 <jettero> :)
Apr 01 17:34:17 <jettero> I'm not sure spending 40 minutes trying to update and then an hour with webosdoctor and then 3 hours putting things back is better than just starting with the webos doctor in the first place
Apr 01 17:34:33 <jettero> next update I might just grab the doctor first and not bother with the regular upgrade path
Apr 01 17:34:47 <DarkSpecter> no matter what i do all it tells me is that there are app updates available, but there are none
Apr 01 17:35:33 <DarkSpecter> i dont want to doctor, not sure if the free games will come back after that :P
Apr 01 17:36:58 <bpadalino|work> do you have the technical ability to debug why you are stuck in this loop ?
Apr 01 17:38:07 <DarkSpecter> well, i'm not sure as i dont realy know much about the webos/luna internals yet
Apr 01 17:39:14 <DarkSpecter> and i doubt that there is a hidden switch that lets the update app dump some debug info to my putty window ;)
Apr 01 17:40:05 <loot-> no but there are log files :P
Apr 01 17:40:48 <DarkSpecter> good to know :P
Apr 01 17:41:02 <DarkSpecter> guess i'll hunt them down now :P
Apr 01 17:41:56 <loot-> http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1805
Apr 01 17:43:41 <jacques> I keep hoping slashdot will learn restraint. I keep being very disappointed.
Apr 01 17:43:54 <jettero> doctoring isn't as painful as it sounds
Apr 01 17:44:01 <jettero> I just hate re-arranging my icons and things
Apr 01 17:44:15 <jettero> I also lost all my feeds (again) in prepodder I'm sure
Apr 01 17:44:26 <jettero> wait, maybe not.  I have the paid version again
Apr 01 17:44:29 <jettero> s/again/now
Apr 01 17:46:40 <halfhalo_class> http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2042
Apr 01 17:46:41 <halfhalo_class> sweeeet
Apr 01 17:46:57 <en0x> i hate losing sms after doctoring :(
Apr 01 17:47:11 <jettero> oh, that would suck if you kept them
Apr 01 17:47:19 <jettero> I tend to erase them every couple hours...
Apr 01 17:47:30 <jettero> if I want a record of the chat I take it to google talk or google voice
Apr 01 17:47:53 <jettero> I kinda wanna go to developer day
Apr 01 17:47:57 <jettero> that's the day of my finals
Apr 01 17:47:59 <jettero> so that's out
Apr 01 17:48:00 <en0x> i don;t like to go to google talk or google voice :p
Apr 01 17:48:02 <halfhalo_class> I am
Apr 01 17:48:05 <en0x> i want everything on pre :D
Apr 01 17:48:05 <jettero> week of I should say
Apr 01 17:48:14 <halfhalo_class> driving up with my friend the 22, coming back the 25
Apr 01 17:48:16 <jettero> your pre does google talk
Apr 01 17:48:26 <halfhalo_class> although my friend doesn't own a pre
Apr 01 17:48:31 <halfhalo_class> details, details
Apr 01 17:48:32 <jacques> wow. sure would be nice (hint hint) if palm flew some webos-internals folks (hint hint) out for the developer days  :-D
Apr 01 17:48:36 <jettero> you can also use google voice sms right through your regular old sms app
Apr 01 17:48:44 <jettero> just have your opponent sms you through your gv number
Apr 01 17:49:19 <en0x> jettero, so what? it doesn't mean I use google talk... maybe I only text message? :)
Apr 01 17:49:23 <loot-> Mojo.Controller.getAppController().showBanner("This device will self destruct in 10 seconds", {source: 'notification'});
Apr 01 17:50:00 <nt4cats> halfhalo_class: that does look awesome, except I live in Philadelphia and the commute would be a bitch
Apr 01 17:50:05 <halfhalo_class> heh
Apr 01 17:50:10 <halfhalo_class> I live in LA
Apr 01 17:50:10 <jettero> en0x: I can't fix your problems, I can only name solutions
Apr 01 17:50:15 <halfhalo_class> only a 6 hour drive
Apr 01 17:50:42 <jettero> I'd have to fly in
Apr 01 17:50:44 <jettero> pfft
Apr 01 17:51:21 <jettero> if only it was like a month later, I might.  It sounds fun
Apr 01 17:51:28 <jacques> I too would need to fly in, but I would be willing to do it :-)
Apr 01 17:51:39 <jacques> it is kinda sudden tho
Apr 01 17:52:10 <jettero> hrm, the initial signon after the doctor is going to suck
Apr 01 17:52:12 <jacques> I'm going to be in SFO for the embedded linux conference the week before that
Apr 01 17:52:17 <jettero> I'm roaming on one bar of 1x out here in the sticks
Apr 01 17:52:21 <loot-> if palm has free beer and half naked ladies
Apr 01 17:52:22 <jettero> I hope I can bring up the wifi
Apr 01 17:52:22 <loot-> im in
Apr 01 17:52:32 <jacques> loot-: only sony does that
Apr 01 17:52:37 <loot-> :~(
Apr 01 17:52:38 <halfhalo_class> SFO is where again?
Apr 01 17:52:44 <halfhalo_class> I should know it but I don't
Apr 01 17:52:52 <jacques> san francisco
Apr 01 17:53:06 * halfhalo_class would like to point out sunnyvale is 30 miles from SFO
Apr 01 17:53:31 * jacques knows. /me lived in sunnyvale "the heart of solicon valley" for a few years
Apr 01 17:53:38 <halfhalo_class> lies
Apr 01 17:53:39 <loot-> ugh dont remind me of the bay area
Apr 01 17:53:48 <jacques> s/soli/sili/
Apr 01 17:54:04 <loot-> ive had enough of the interstate 80's as i can possibly take
Apr 01 17:54:16 <loot-> i do miss in and out burger though
Apr 01 17:54:17 <jacques> halfhalo_class: but I live in TX
Apr 01 17:54:22 <halfhalo_class> excuses
Apr 01 17:54:28 <jacques> in-n-out FTW!!!!
Apr 01 17:54:39 <loot-> jacques: animal style!
Apr 01 17:54:40 <loot-> hahaha
Apr 01 17:54:46 <loot-> i talked someone into getting one of those once
Apr 01 17:54:49 <halfhalo_class> Thats what I'm getting for lunch
Apr 01 17:54:57 <jacques> loot-: two doublke-doubles animal style to go
Apr 01 17:55:03 <jacques> man I cannot type today
Apr 01 17:55:07 <jettero> my webos doctor seems to have frozen at 64%... but while I was complaining it jumped to 72%
Apr 01 17:55:07 <halfhalo_class> today?
Apr 01 17:55:13 <loot-> his animal style was bleeding all over him
Apr 01 17:55:15 <loot-> it was amusing
Apr 01 17:55:52 <loot-> something ive never seen in cali though
Apr 01 17:55:54 <jacques> I'd be willing to take time off work if Palm flew me in to the dev days
Apr 01 17:55:55 <loot-> backyard burger
Apr 01 17:56:02 <loot-> mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmm those are good
Apr 01 17:56:18 <jacques> here we have smashburger - almost as good as in-n-out (almost)
Apr 01 17:56:27 <loot-> we have five guys in DC
Apr 01 17:56:33 <loot-> same almost as good if not the same
Apr 01 17:57:16 <bpadalino|work> i like in-n-out a good deal more than five guys
Apr 01 17:57:30 <bpadalino|work> i also like fatburger more than five guys
Apr 01 17:57:59 <jacques> we have five guys here too, but I haven't tried it - smashburger is the first I have found which approaches in-n-out (for me - some ppl don't think in-n-out is anything special)
Apr 01 17:58:12 <jacques> (but those ppl are wrong)
Apr 01 17:58:14 <jacques> :-D
Apr 01 17:58:17 <loot-> best fast food burger ive ever had was backyard burger
Apr 01 17:58:44 <loot-> http://backyardburgers.com/
Apr 01 17:58:49 <jacques> dammit now I am getting hungry. and I wasn't planning on eating for seven more hours
Apr 01 17:59:02 <en0x> i just ate
Apr 01 17:59:02 <en0x> :D
Apr 01 17:59:56 <jacques> dear palm, please consider having a webos-internals presence at your developer days. your friend, jacques
Apr 01 18:00:14 <loot-> they plan to
Apr 01 18:00:23 <loot-> but its so expensive to fly rwhitby in that they didnt invite anyone else
Apr 01 18:00:26 <loot-> lol
Apr 01 18:00:33 <en0x> lol
Apr 01 18:00:49 <jacques> rwhitby is going to be there????
Apr 01 18:01:05 <loot-> remember... its april 1st :P
Apr 01 18:01:14 <jacques> you;re right - that's like $2k of plane ticket
Apr 01 18:01:41 <halfhalo_class> hotels cheap though
Apr 01 18:01:50 <halfhalo_class> but not the palm-sponsored one
Apr 01 18:02:01 <jacques> thing about rwhitby is he's quite busy, and he has a life. some of use have more free time for such things
Apr 01 18:02:14 <ka6sox> :D
Apr 01 18:02:16 * jacques faints dead away.
Apr 01 18:02:20 <ka6sox> heh
Apr 01 18:02:26 * jacques thought he saw a ghost.
Apr 01 18:02:32 <ka6sox> really?
Apr 01 18:02:36 <loot-> i could continue to pull your chain but
Apr 01 18:02:36 <ka6sox> where?
Apr 01 18:02:36 <loot-> meh
Apr 01 18:02:40 <loot-> april fools!
Apr 01 18:02:44 <ghost_of_zsoc> YES?
Apr 01 18:02:47 <jacques> ka6sox: how have you been?
Apr 01 18:02:56 <jacques> lol at ghost_of_zsoc
Apr 01 18:03:03 <ka6sox> very busy...
Apr 01 18:03:09 <ka6sox> out of town a lot.
Apr 01 18:03:35 <halfhalo_class> money?
Apr 01 18:03:54 <jacques> loot-: I figured you were kidding, but you had a quite valid point - rwhitby would be great to have at the palm dev days
Apr 01 18:04:00 <halfhalo_class> yeah
Apr 01 18:04:27 <halfhalo_class> Just for the "we are not opposed to homebrew" aspect
Apr 01 18:04:34 <halfhalo_class> the super duper knowledge is a plus
Apr 01 18:05:05 <jacques> things like this make me wish I still lived in the bay area
Apr 01 18:05:14 <halfhalo_class> lol
Apr 01 18:05:27 <nt4cats> rwhitby really doesn't know anything about webos.  He just copies-and-pastes content from the precentral forums here
Apr 01 18:05:37 <jacques> lol
Apr 01 18:06:21 <halfhalo_class> hell, thats what I do
Apr 01 18:06:21 <jacques> carp carp carp
Apr 01 18:06:29 <Flashpass> sorry if this has been asked before, but what exactly is the method for removing the overclock patch and keep all the other patches?
Apr 01 18:06:36 <jacques> if we weren't so close to a job, I could maybe make this work
Apr 01 18:07:08 <jacques> I'm going to be in SFO for embedded conference, could make a side trip to OR and back to bay area for dev days, then home
Apr 01 18:07:19 <halfhalo_class> you could, you know, just stay for a few extra days
Apr 01 18:07:38 <jacques> thing it, this close to a job I probably cannot be gone for two solid weeks
Apr 01 18:07:49 <jacques> s/it/is/
Apr 01 18:07:50 <infobot> jacques meant: thing is, this close to a job I probably cannot be gone for two solid weeks
Apr 01 18:08:01 <halfhalo_class> teleconference!
Apr 01 18:08:22 <en0x> oh i just got a txt message from sprint
Apr 01 18:08:29 <halfhalo_class> i hate them
Apr 01 18:08:45 <jacques> ruh-roh - please don't say they are clamping down on large amounts of data use
Apr 01 18:08:53 <en0x> "we noticed a recent spike in your account activity. please call .... bla bla bla"
Apr 01 18:08:56 <en0x> :D
Apr 01 18:09:09 * jacques lives in fear of that.
Apr 01 18:09:16 <halfhalo_class> Sprint needs mobile hotspot to stay competetive
Apr 01 18:09:22 <jacques> and plus
Apr 01 18:09:23 <ghost_of_zsoc> Flashpass: you don't need to remove it to upgrade to 1.4.1(.1) if that's what you're asking
Apr 01 18:09:29 <jacques> pre double plus good
Apr 01 18:09:41 <ghost_of_zsoc> sprint pre plus coming
Apr 01 18:09:53 * jacques wants
Apr 01 18:10:14 <halfhalo_class> I would buy it
Apr 01 18:10:26 <VincentLaw> blah I want the 800mhz ipk :/
Apr 01 18:10:45 <VincentLaw> I wouldn't even care to alpha-test it
Apr 01 18:10:46 <jacques> I would buy a plus and use my current pre as a dev phone
Apr 01 18:11:05 <halfhalo_class> Thats would I would try to do
Apr 01 18:11:11 <en0x> VincentLaw, i have the .sh script if u want
Apr 01 18:11:12 <en0x> ;d
Apr 01 18:11:31 <Flashpass> +ghost_of_zsoc: really? the overclock will just continue to work on 1.4.1.1?
Apr 01 18:11:55 <ghost_of_zsoc> Flashpass: no it will get overwritten by the update (new kernel)
Apr 01 18:12:05 <ghost_of_zsoc> Flashpass: just reapply it after, works fine
Apr 01 18:12:17 <en0x> why wouldn't it?
Apr 01 18:12:18 <en0x> :>
Apr 01 18:12:21 <VincentLaw> en0x: I think I still have it in previous versions somewhere lol
Apr 01 18:12:25 <Flashpass> +ghost_of_zsoc: oh interesting, precentral and others saying to remove it
Apr 01 18:12:34 <jacques> I don't suppose the sprint 1.4.1.1 doctor is available yet?
Apr 01 18:12:42 <halfhalo_class> it is
Apr 01 18:12:44 <halfhalo_class> just used it
Apr 01 18:12:56 <jacques> cool
Apr 01 18:13:03 <jacques> on the wiki yet?
Apr 01 18:13:07 <ghost_of_zsoc> Flashpass: What I'm telling you is accurate. I don't even visit P|C because of the useless crap that gets spouted there.
Apr 01 18:13:15 <halfhalo_class> no
Apr 01 18:13:22 <Flashpass> haha, ok
Apr 01 18:13:27 <jacques> yes, sweet
Apr 01 18:13:51 <Flashpass> +ghost_of_zsoc: so really all we generally care about is removing themes, right?
Apr 01 18:13:53 <halfhalo_class> oh damn it is
Apr 01 18:14:07 <en0x> Flashpass, right
Apr 01 18:14:13 <ghost_of_zsoc> Flashpass: right.
Apr 01 18:14:18 <Flashpass> awesome, thanks
Apr 01 18:14:23 <en0x> 10 dollars
Apr 01 18:14:23 <en0x> :D
Apr 01 18:15:02 <Flashpass> how about a high five?
Apr 01 18:15:17 <en0x> hmm how u will do that over the internet?
Apr 01 18:15:28 <halfhalo_class> high five the screen?
Apr 01 18:15:51 <halfhalo_class> I want a zune hd
Apr 01 18:15:56 <halfhalo_class> but I also don't want a zune hd
Apr 01 18:15:59 <halfhalo_class> hmmmm
Apr 01 18:16:12 <jacques> I want a Pre HD
Apr 01 18:16:20 <halfhalo_class> so do I....
Apr 01 18:16:22 <en0x> i want windows series 7 phone
Apr 01 18:16:23 <en0x> ;d
Apr 01 18:16:34 <halfhalo_class> Actually, I have a very specific featureset I want added to webos
Apr 01 18:17:45 <halfhalo_class> Mojo filesystem support, two new notification types, mtp, device stage, and custom desktop app
Apr 01 18:18:20 <halfhalo_class> oh, and usb host mode to go along with filesystem support, along with ftp, sshfs, smb
Apr 01 18:18:41 <jacques> Ok, as much as I hate /. "every article is a joke on april 1" this one made me lol - http://tech.slashdot.org/story/10/04/01/152257/AMD-Readies-Lottery-Core-CPUs
Apr 01 18:19:30 <nt4cats> halfhalo_class: ... and an app that lets you use the Pre's camera to focus on a person and when you press the button their clothes instantly fall off.
Apr 01 18:19:53 <halfhalo_class> baby steps, baby steps...
Apr 01 18:20:47 <nt4cats> halfhalo_class: I figured if you're getting your full wish list on the table you might as well get it all out there ...
Apr 01 18:20:53 <en0x> precentral should came out with something for april fool's
Apr 01 18:21:17 <Flashpass> nt4cats: that feature should really be on the top of his list!
Apr 01 18:21:42 <halfhalo_class> well, my wishlist isn't all that grand.  It would most likely be accomplished in under a monthish methinks
Apr 01 18:21:42 <jacques> now I kinda wish webos-internals had done something for april 1
Apr 01 18:23:03 <halfhalo_class> because mtp, device stage, and custom pc app are all based off of usb-gadget modifications, and the basis for the custom pc app are already present in the palm-xxxx apps
Apr 01 18:23:41 <halfhalo_class> the filesystem would basically be a mojo service that lets you get a json thingie of the files/folders in a directory
Apr 01 18:24:38 <halfhalo_class> the ftp/sshfs/smb stuff is linux crap thats simple, and can be mounted above /media/internal/ so apps can take use the mojo fs to interact
Apr 01 18:25:26 <halfhalo_class> and the pre already supports usb host mode, but usb-gadget flips on client mode whenever its plugged in
Apr 01 18:25:51 <halfhalo_class> see, very specific
Apr 01 18:26:06 <halfhalo_class> oh, forgot notifications
Apr 01 18:26:14 <nt4cats> halfhalo_class: and the nudifier
Apr 01 18:26:16 <oil> those things seem like something palm isn't going to do
Apr 01 18:26:18 <oil> lol
Apr 01 18:27:07 <halfhalo_class> the way I see it there should be two more notifications.  One is for widgets on the background, and the other is to send to the computer.
Apr 01 18:27:48 <halfhalo_class> IE for the widgets, you have a little html div on the background that could function as a small headless app
Apr 01 18:28:35 <halfhalo_class> and for the pc, it just sends html to the pc app which displays it and if set up, send back data in a callback
Apr 01 18:28:55 <halfhalo_class> IE you get a text, window pops up on desktop, you reply from desktop, pre gets message and sends it off
Apr 01 18:29:11 <halfhalo_class> Following me camera guy?
Apr 01 18:29:19 <ka6sox> jacques, how is the pixi?
Apr 01 18:30:19 <loot-> haha
Apr 01 18:30:33 <loot-> i just got a BOX full of free sun microsystems crap
Apr 01 18:30:45 <ka6sox> Space Heaters!
Apr 01 18:30:57 <oil> i dont see widgets on the background happening
Apr 01 18:30:59 <loot-> teflon coated button up shirts, wireless mice, mouse pads, pens, lanyards, water bottles, key chains, etc
Apr 01 18:31:04 <oil> while the desktop thing is a good idea
Apr 01 18:31:10 <oil> i also dont see palm doing it
Apr 01 18:31:13 <nt4cats> loot-: send them to me, I'm a swag whore
Apr 01 18:31:19 <halfhalo_class> Well, the backgorund thing would sorta be an app
Apr 01 18:31:29 <halfhalo_class> IE no other cards open its the background
Apr 01 18:31:29 <loot-> lol i just walked around the office handing out free shit
Apr 01 18:31:36 <oil> but you would have to toss all cards to see it
Apr 01 18:31:41 <oil> when the point of webos is to multitask
Apr 01 18:31:44 <halfhalo_class> but it other cards open it acts like a normal card
Apr 01 18:32:38 <halfhalo_class> and if you tap and hold in card view outside of a card, instead of going into card rearranging mode it brings you back to the widget card
Apr 01 18:32:57 <halfhalo_class> which would have a little deck of cards that would return you to card view on it in a corner
Apr 01 18:49:54 <PuffTheMagic> can someone answer why wireless network control sucks so bad on OSX?
Apr 01 18:50:22 <halfhalo_class> because?
Apr 01 18:50:51 <ghost_of_zsoc> PuffTheMagic: because it's not opensource
Apr 01 18:51:09 <en0x> hehe
Apr 01 18:51:28 <en0x> PuffTheMagic, apple guys want it simple come on man :)
Apr 01 18:51:37 <en0x> it's simple rich not feature rich
Apr 01 18:51:38 <en0x> :D
Apr 01 18:51:47 <jacques> like gnome :-|
Apr 01 18:51:57 <en0x> or dwm
Apr 01 18:51:57 <en0x> :D
Apr 01 18:52:19 <PuffTheMagic> en0x: but it dont even work
Apr 01 18:52:30 <PuffTheMagic> its a crap shoot
Apr 01 18:52:34 <PuffTheMagic> if i can connect or not
Apr 01 18:54:04 <en0x> i never had issues with it
Apr 01 19:23:41 <jettero> hrm, my preware install didn't go well
Apr 01 19:23:52 <jettero> it seemed to be working, but after this reboot it only shows 18 packages
Apr 01 19:23:55 <jettero> how do I refresh the feeds?
Apr 01 19:25:27 <jettero> oh, probably by selecting "update feeds"
Apr 01 19:25:29 <jettero> heh
Apr 01 19:26:38 <jettero> despite all this trouble, I still just love my pre.  Man I'm glad I didn't get an iphone
Apr 01 19:28:19 <RagingMind> I saw someone showing off their iPod touch lately... he was showing how cool it was after being jailbroken so that it could multitask with "cards" like webos
Apr 01 19:29:27 <chrisa> I am happy for anyone who voids a warranty to imitate a competitor's product
Apr 01 19:29:36 <NiteTrek> Any of the webOS gurus here? Specifically one that can answer a question about EPR?
Apr 01 19:30:42 <en0x> emergency patch recovery
Apr 01 19:30:43 <en0x> :D
Apr 01 19:30:59 <en0x> it's working as it should I used it yesterday ;)
Apr 01 19:31:15 <halfhalo> patches?  as in the cat?  HE CAME BACK?!?!?!
Apr 01 19:31:30 <en0x> ya
Apr 01 19:31:31 <NiteTrek> Yes...my question is.....would it be possible to update EPR to allow a "selective" EPR per patch instead of all of them?
Apr 01 19:31:44 <en0x> "everytime you install a patch got kills a kitten"
Apr 01 19:32:00 <halfhalo> yeah, those gots are deadly
Apr 01 19:32:09 <en0x> s/got/god
Apr 01 19:32:09 <en0x> lol
Apr 01 19:32:10 <en0x> ;]
Apr 01 19:32:20 <NiteTrek> The last 2 updates, AUPT worked fine on all my patches except for one....and I ended up having to use EPR to fix the issue, which defeats the purpose of using AUPT in the first place
Apr 01 19:32:47 <NiteTrek> I thought that if EPR had a selective patch recovery, it would greatly improve things
Apr 01 19:33:44 <NiteTrek> We could run AUPT first....and then if there are any stubborn patches, run EPR on just those.
Apr 01 19:38:22 <NiteTrek> Well, it was just a thought, I guess I'll try posting it in the forums. I think it was suggest before but haven't heard any update on it
Apr 01 19:49:34 <en0x> did u noticed that phone app in 1.4.1.1 is on steroids?
Apr 01 19:49:39 <en0x> it opens instantly
Apr 01 19:50:47 <Yoppo> for me not any app has open instantly after 1.4.0 not even on the 1.4.1 :(
Apr 01 19:50:58 <Yoppo> In 1.3.5.2 every app started almost instantly
Apr 01 19:51:11 <en0x> i dont remember having 1.3.5.2
Apr 01 19:51:46 <Yoppo> otherwise thou the WebOS has felt faster on every update, but for some odd reason for me the apps starts slowly on 1.4.x
Apr 01 19:52:00 <en0x> ;( sorry to hear that
Apr 01 19:52:23 <Yoppo> but maybe the 1.3.5.2 installation had something special on my phone :)
Apr 01 19:52:39 <en0x> yap a hidden viagra
Apr 01 19:52:40 <en0x> ;d
Apr 01 19:52:43 <Yoppo> yep
Apr 01 19:57:11 <Riekal> Yo
Apr 01 19:57:26 <Riekal> Anone here having issues with some feeds in preware?
Apr 01 19:57:42 <Riekal> seems like the precentral feed is down for me.
Apr 01 20:04:20 <loot-> they released flash for webos!!!
Apr 01 20:04:30 <Riekal> did then now?
Apr 01 20:04:44 <nt4cats> loot-: don't make me come to wherever you live and drown you.
Apr 01 20:04:44 <loot-> press release coming soon
Apr 01 20:04:48 <loot-> hahaha
Apr 01 20:04:52 <halfhalo> If your lying I will kill you
Apr 01 20:04:55 <nt4cats> loot-: that is not a funny april fool's joke
Apr 01 20:05:01 <nt4cats> halfhalo: you and me both, brother
Apr 01 20:05:12 <Riekal> lol
Apr 01 20:05:23 <nt4cats> loot-: that's like promising a 5-year-old that you're going to give him candy and then saying "april fools!"
Apr 01 20:05:28 <loot-> haha
Apr 01 20:05:30 <Riekal> hmm
Apr 01 20:05:38 <loot-> that might work on my nephew!
Apr 01 20:05:39 <Riekal> webOS 1.4.1.1
Apr 01 20:06:24 <halfhalo> Yup.  Time to do some killing
Apr 01 20:06:27 <loot-> im just trying to remain awake for these last 45 torturous minutes
Apr 01 20:06:45 <Riekal> haha
Apr 01 20:06:49 * Riekal goes home now...
Apr 01 20:06:56 <nt4cats> loot-: please tell me where you live ... and what would be a good time for me to stop by your house and hold your head under water for 7-10 minutes
Apr 01 20:08:39 <oil> lol
Apr 01 20:12:42 <nt4cats> loot-: ... still waiting ...
Apr 01 20:17:14 <nt4cats> loot-: I need to run so I'll have to kill you later, sorry.
Apr 01 20:17:47 <Decimate> hey, i cant download app catalog apps :/ what was the thing in preware called i needed to download after updates?
Apr 01 21:20:55 <rwhitby> morning
Apr 01 21:21:07 <halfhalo> mornin
Apr 01 21:21:23 <jacques> morning
Apr 01 21:22:22 <jacques> rwhitby: are you going to this? http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2042
Apr 01 21:30:13 <rwhitby> jacques: unlikely, unless I happen to be in the area for other reasons, which hasn't happened for a few years (I travel more to Japan these days than the US).
Apr 01 21:30:46 <rwhitby> Palm should have a virtual developer day
Apr 01 21:30:58 <rwhitby> Physical presence is so last century.
Apr 01 21:31:39 <Tibfib> +1
Apr 01 21:34:19 <jacques> rwhitby: good idea on the virtual, but I don't think it can replace face-to-face yet - they should do both
Apr 01 21:34:53 <sui> hi
Apr 01 21:34:55 <jacques> well, maybe with the new-fangled video conferencing ...
Apr 01 21:35:36 <jacques> I'm trying to work my schedule so I could be there
Apr 01 21:36:26 <rwhitby> awesome
Apr 01 21:37:38 <Tibfib> I wish I could go, sounds like it'll be great
Apr 01 21:37:58 <jacques> IMHO it has the potential to be great
Apr 01 21:39:04 <jacques> I went to a dev day at CRL for handhelds.org in like 2002 - it was fantastic
Apr 01 21:39:19 <halfhalo> Im going!  :p
Apr 01 21:39:38 <jacques> halfhalo: nice :-D
Apr 01 21:41:14 * Mousey starts downloading 1.4.1.1
Apr 01 21:42:10 <jacques> Mousey: howdy!
Apr 01 21:42:14 <Mousey> heyaz
Apr 01 21:42:26 <jacques> feels like I haven't seen you in a while
Apr 01 21:42:34 <Mousey> you haaaaaavent
Apr 01 21:42:38 <Mousey> ^_^
Apr 01 21:43:35 <jacques> don't tell anyone, but sometimes I wish C had exceptions
Apr 01 21:45:36 <geist> LIES.
Apr 01 21:47:46 <jacques> proper error handling in nested loops with locking is ... annoying
Apr 01 21:49:28 <Kyusaku> maybe Palm crew will wear silly pants!
Apr 01 21:49:52 <halfhalo> lulz
Apr 01 21:50:05 <jacques> maybe I will take photos
Apr 01 21:50:32 <halfhalo> I'm going to.  Gives me an excuse to use the camera on the pre.
Apr 01 21:51:42 <Kyusaku> some silly pants at Palm http://www.flickr.com/photos/girliemac/4440906877/
Apr 01 21:51:50 <jacques> that reminds me - I haven't tried the camera since update to 1.4.1.1
Apr 01 21:51:50 <halfhalo> bbiab home time
Apr 01 21:52:02 <jacques> in 1.4.0 it was kinda laggy
Apr 01 21:52:34 <jacques> Kyusaku: that's hilarious
Apr 01 21:53:08 <Kyusaku> jacques: I stumbled upon that photo gallery a week ago when doing Japanese IME research
Apr 01 21:53:49 <jacques> what the heck is this? http://www.flickr.com/photos/girliemac/4482436654/
Apr 01 21:54:00 <jacques> Kyusaku: good find
Apr 01 21:54:01 <Kyusaku> that flickr user/Palm employee uses a homebrew Japanese IME app
Apr 01 21:54:27 <Kyusaku> April Fools joke I think
Apr 01 21:54:35 <Tibfib> lol, the pixi can play a video
Apr 01 21:55:50 <hozer> Is terminal still broken?
Apr 01 21:55:54 <psykoz> I don't even think that was a april fools joke
Apr 01 21:56:05 <psykoz> that was just the palm logo replaced with a droid logo
Apr 01 21:56:07 <psykoz> and a theme ;)
Apr 01 21:56:58 <hozer> (last I tried it I found some references that it basically crashes)
Apr 01 21:57:34 <Kyusaku> psykoz: sorta if you see her twitter she spins it as an April Fools joke
Apr 01 21:57:39 <Kyusaku> "The rumor was true... Palm is now ditching WebOS for Android. http://flic.kr/p/7Q6EfA"
Apr 01 21:58:11 <Kyusaku> she's a front-end UI dev at Palm
Apr 01 21:58:19 <hozer> hey, well at least there's probably a working terminal :P
Apr 01 21:59:06 <Kyusaku> hozer: still broken, try Termius unless you need a pipe or something
Apr 01 21:59:26 <Kyusaku> s/Termius/Terminus/
Apr 01 21:59:27 <infobot> Kyusaku meant: hozer: still broken, try Terminus unless you need a pipe or something
Apr 01 21:59:48 <hozer> hehe .. is terminus functional (minus the pipe?)
Apr 01 22:00:03 <zsoc> hozer: sure, so is xterm
Apr 01 22:00:43 <zsoc> and i think there's a pipe
Apr 01 22:03:17 <hozer> zsoc: um.. xterm? can I ipkg-opt install xserver-xorg-palmpre or something :P
Apr 01 22:03:25 <jacques> http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Application:X
Apr 01 22:03:42 <jacques> there is indeed a |
Apr 01 22:03:48 <zsoc> hozer: no, like that link says, xserver and xterm are packaged up... works well
Apr 01 22:03:50 <zsoc> call it.. magiks
Apr 01 22:04:00 <hozer> nice
Apr 01 22:05:28 <hozer> err, there is not much info on the X page :P
Apr 01 22:06:04 <hozer> do you have to stop luna/mojo to run X?
Apr 01 22:06:08 <rwhitby> no
Apr 01 22:06:20 <hozer> so it's like the X-server on MacOSX then sorta?
Apr 01 22:06:22 <rwhitby> it's a package in the preware testing feed
Apr 01 22:06:56 <hozer> well that explains why nobody really cares to fix terminal.. why bother if X works ;)
Apr 01 22:09:12 <rwhitby> hozer: there's a $125 bounty for whoever fixes Terminal
Apr 01 22:09:21 <jacques> hozer: it's an X server in a card
Apr 01 22:09:28 <jacques> rwhitby: wow has that gone up?
Apr 01 22:09:40 <rwhitby> yep
Apr 01 22:10:58 <hozer> anyone got any idea what's wrong with terminal?
Apr 01 22:11:26 <jacques> has anyone checked if 1.4.1* has the same issue as 1.4.0 which broke terminal?
Apr 01 22:11:37 <jacques> would be funny if palm won the bounty
Apr 01 22:11:37 <hozer> how do I check what I'm running
Apr 01 22:11:53 <coles> jacques: just tried it now on 1.4.1, still dies
Apr 01 22:12:06 <jacques> coles: ok, thanks for the info
Apr 01 22:12:10 <hozer> is there a bugreport page with some details?
Apr 01 22:12:22 <hozer> I should be doing my taxes, but I want to break out a kernel debugger now ;)
Apr 01 22:12:23 <coles> thanks for the heads-up about X, though
Apr 01 22:12:54 <knickrox13> I'm guessing I'm not the only one with the sms contact patch right?
Apr 01 22:12:56 <jacques> last I heard it was a double free in the mojo framework
Apr 01 22:12:57 <knickrox13> I'm getting the following error...\n \nPrerm\nCheck for md5sum in usr/lib/ipkg/info\nApply anyway? [n]\nThen the hunks are ignored
Apr 01 22:13:00 <hozer> hrrm.. did the X-plane port for Palm use Mojo, or the X-server :P
Apr 01 22:13:15 <scoutcamper> hi all
Apr 01 22:13:27 <jacques> hozer: SDL
Apr 01 22:13:27 <knickrox13> Is there a way to remove it completely via commandline?
Apr 01 22:13:43 <jacques> well, SDL wrapped around opengl es
Apr 01 22:14:01 <jacques> the X server port also uses SDL / opengl ES
Apr 01 22:14:09 <hozer> jacques: nice
Apr 01 22:14:27 <jacques> it's the best way we have of taking advantage of the pre's hardware
Apr 01 22:14:33 <hozer> can the X-server pass accelerated opengl through to the hardware
Apr 01 22:14:47 <zsoc> hozer: using SDL
Apr 01 22:15:12 <jacques> currently the X server is using opengl only because it renders nicer - no glx / 3d acceleration is implemented
Apr 01 22:15:35 <rwhitby> jacques: played with Save/Restore yet?
Apr 01 22:16:23 <Mara-Zzz1> hah
Apr 01 22:16:25 <jacques> rwhitby: I have it installed - it looks very sweet - I haven't actually tried saving / restoring anything yet - mostly because I was waiting for SMS, but then I heard that may not happen any time soon due to technical reasons
Apr 01 22:16:38 <Mara-Zzz1> so how long before soemone puts KDE/Gnome on the pre? :>
Apr 01 22:16:45 <Mara-Zzz1> just to watch it die horribly, naturally
Apr 01 22:16:56 <jacques> Mara-Zzz1: well we already have QT
Apr 01 22:17:04 <Mara-Zzz1> jacques: yeah I know, I've played with it :)
Apr 01 22:17:05 <Mara-Zzz1> good stuff
Apr 01 22:17:16 <rwhitby> jacques: SMS saves, but doesn't restore
Apr 01 22:17:49 <jacques> that's kinda like my laptop - suspends but doesn't resume
Apr 01 22:17:52 <jacques> :-)
Apr 01 22:17:54 <Marajin> wonder if anyone'll go silly enough to put Android in a card/dual boot option/etc.
Apr 01 22:18:13 <scoutcamper> Marajin i want that ...
Apr 01 22:18:29 <Marajin> I suppose, it's theoretically possible if a bit of a nightmare
Apr 01 22:18:48 <scoutcamper> i believe all it needs is drivers written ...
Apr 01 22:19:02 <jacques> rwhitby: I think save/restore will be a must-have app
Apr 01 22:19:07 <Marajin> probably not even that really, don't forget WebOS is linux based, and so is android
Apr 01 22:19:36 <rwhitby> jacques: that's the only type of app I ever focus on :-)
Apr 01 22:19:43 <Marajin> Android has some kernel specific hooks and what though IIRC...
Apr 01 22:19:45 <zsoc> rwhitby: if it is limited to app data that is kept in /media/internal, could a version of save/restore make it into the app cat?
Apr 01 22:19:54 <jacques> heh - are you going to integrate it with meta-doctor? that would kill
Apr 01 22:19:56 <Marajin> I was tinkering with it back on my HTC Kaiser/Kovsky
Apr 01 22:20:24 <rwhitby> jacques: in general you need to reinstall and open the app before you restore the data
Apr 01 22:20:58 <jacques> rwhitby: OK hmm. throw in qemu-omap ...  ;-)
Apr 01 22:21:01 <rwhitby> jacques: that's why the restore screen defaults all toggles to off
Apr 01 22:21:08 <Marajin> actually I'm annoyed, the side of my pre's case has a crack in it (corner of the micro-usb slot) and I have no idea how it got there
Apr 01 22:21:12 <flare576> question: command-line command to force remove a patch applied with preware?  I'm getting "Unreversed patch detected"
Apr 01 22:21:26 <Marajin> no damage to functionality though, just a physical mark
Apr 01 22:21:57 <jacques> my screen was cloudy around the edges last night, then I realized it was (apparently) due to heat
Apr 01 22:22:12 <knickrox13> flare576: +1
Apr 01 22:22:33 <knickrox13> flare576: I just asked about the sms contact patch. Any cl to type to remove it?
Apr 01 22:22:49 <flare576> I know there is one, I just don't know if it uses quilt or ipkg-opt
Apr 01 22:23:04 <flare576> and the one I'm trying to rmove is the "No auto-off while charging"
Apr 01 22:23:04 <rwhitby> I wonder if Preware need a couple of extra menu commands when displaying an installed package like "Fake Removal" and "Fake Install"
Apr 01 22:23:31 <rwhitby> the trouble is they'd cause my problems than they solve cause people don't read
Apr 01 22:23:33 <flare576> rwhitby: or "Force remove"
Apr 01 22:23:56 <rwhitby> flare576: "I force removed my patch, and it's still there.  Preware sucks"
Apr 01 22:24:08 <flare576> it would be dangerous, though, especially if you can't remove things due the fact that thera re other requirements in place.
Apr 01 22:24:48 <rwhitby> flare576: or "I force removed the Package Manager Service and now Preware doesn't work anymore.  Is Preware broken on 1.4.1.1?"
Apr 01 22:24:57 <flare576> hah, exactly
Apr 01 22:25:07 <scoutcamper> Marajin on a scale of 1 to 10 how hard would porting droid be?
Apr 01 22:25:30 <rwhitby> actually, a real user post would have that last bit as a statement with an exclamation mark, rather than a question.
Apr 01 22:25:31 <Marajin> scoutcamper: hard to say without trying but much easier than porting it to some HTC devices I imagine
Apr 01 22:25:52 <flare576> "Preware killed my phone... and my family"
Apr 01 22:26:25 <scoutcamper> webos-internals should start a droid porting project, we need a grub loader done so we could do other linux's as well :D
Apr 01 22:26:46 <scoutcamper> flare576 Preware is AMAZING!!!!!!!!!! dont dis it or it will diss you ...
Apr 01 22:26:59 <flare576> sorry to ask again, though: if I wanted to force remove a patch, would I be looking for quilt commands, ipkg(-opt?), or rm?
Apr 01 22:27:02 <Marajin> In soviet preland, preware disses you :p
Apr 01 22:27:15 <flare576> scoutcamper: but... my family is dead :'(
Apr 01 22:27:41 <scoutcamper> flare576 blame apple, makers of all I-Phail products
Apr 01 22:27:44 <flare576> I'd like to avoid EPR because, well, it's really good at what it does )
Apr 01 22:28:02 <flare576> s/\)/\:\)/
Apr 01 22:28:03 <Mousey> epr was good to me!
Apr 01 22:28:33 <flare576> Oh yeah, EPR does exactly what it advertises, but I only want/need to tear out one patch that isn't playing by the rules
Apr 01 22:29:08 <scoutcamper> rwhitby we should make system restore patches
Apr 01 22:29:14 <scoutcamper> that would be amazing
Apr 01 22:29:18 <flare576> There's the culprit now, too :)  <whine>Jaaayyyyy, No Auto-Off while charging isn't removing!!!!!?!?!</whine> ;)
Apr 01 22:30:16 <VincentLaw> rwhitby: is dBsooner the only one capable of removing patches from preware? My Pandora Ad-Fix patch is no longer relevant, and should just be removed
Apr 01 22:30:18 <scoutcamper> rwhitby is it posible to do system restore or snapshots on the pre/pixi?
Apr 01 22:31:10 <rwhitby> VincentLaw: it should no longer be visible in 1.4.x
Apr 01 22:31:54 <rwhitby> scoutcamper: it's a turing machine.  anything is possible.
Apr 01 22:32:31 <flare576> rwhitby: this might be a dumb question, but when I type "ipkg-opt" WebOSQI's Linux CLI, all I get back is ipkg-opt: not found.... do we not use that anymore since palm changed the app destination?  I've been out of the loop
Apr 01 22:32:53 <rwhitby> flare576: you can install ipkg-opt through preware now
Apr 01 22:33:04 <rwhitby> then ssh in and use it
Apr 01 22:33:26 <rwhitby> (assuming you've also installed openssh from Preware)
Apr 01 22:33:57 <flare576> I see.  I was under the (incorrect) assumption that Preware used ipkg-opt
Apr 01 22:34:07 <rwhitby> incorrect
Apr 01 22:34:30 <rwhitby> preware uses ipkgservice, which uses ipkg -o /media/cryptofs/apps
Apr 01 22:34:40 <scoutcamper> flare576 see, preware is t3h fixz0rz
Apr 01 22:34:59 <flare576> ok dokey, that makes a lot more sense.  Additionally, when I install patches, is Preware doing quilt commands or ipkg commands using your guys's black magic?
Apr 01 22:35:01 <rwhitby> preware is nothing which is not spelt correctly
Apr 01 22:35:18 <knickrox13> Flare576: was ur question answered? Hard to find a good internet connection overseas
Apr 01 22:35:30 <flare576> knickrox13: almost :)
Apr 01 22:35:33 <rwhitby> flare576: the postinst script in each patch calls lsdiff and patch directly
Apr 01 22:35:46 <rwhitby> flare576: that's the basis of AUPT
Apr 01 22:35:55 <rwhitby> quilt is not used
Apr 01 22:36:08 <flare576> Ok, I think I'm starting to understand.
Apr 01 22:37:44 <flare576> so, if I want to manually remove the patch... I'd need to understand what files are being modified, find their backups, put the backups in place, and then remove ..... something so that Preware doesn't think it's installed anymore... is that accurate?
Apr 01 22:37:46 <rwhitby> ~seen egaudet
Apr 01 22:37:51 <infobot> egaudet <~egaudet@c-66-31-49-55.hsd1.ma.comcast.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #webos-internals, 8d 18h 34m 4s ago, saying: 'in the sense that it doesn't remount'.
Apr 01 22:38:00 <rwhitby> ~seen dBsooner
Apr 01 22:38:01 <infobot> dbsooner is currently on #webos-internals #webos-watercooler, last said: 'rwhitby: ping'.
Apr 01 22:38:10 <flare576> lol!
Apr 01 22:38:30 <rwhitby> flare576: yeah, that's accurate
Apr 01 22:39:16 <flare576> hmm, so I need to track down those updates and figure out what file to remove so Preware doesn't acknowledge it.
Apr 01 22:39:26 * rwhitby bbl, time to fix stuff around the house
Apr 01 22:39:37 <flare576> s/updates/backups/
Apr 01 22:39:37 <infobot> flare576 meant: hmm, so I need to track down those backups and figure out what file to remove so Preware doesn't acknowledge it.
Apr 01 22:40:00 <flare576> knickrox13: did you get any of that?
Apr 01 22:40:12 <flare576> and dBsooner are you around?
Apr 01 22:40:44 <zsoc> Does anyone have IM contact info for AnOutsider?
Apr 01 22:41:38 <scoutcamper> ~seen rwhitby
Apr 01 22:41:39 <infobot> rwhitby is currently on #webos-internals #oe #meego #nslu2-linux. Has said a total of 260 messages. Is idling for 3m 9s, last said: 'flare576: yeah, that's accurate'.
Apr 01 22:41:41 <knickrox13> Yeah I'm gonna try to hunt that stuff down using internalz
Apr 01 22:42:20 <knickrox13> But what did you mean when you said that you needed to remove...something so that preware won't think it's installed anymore?
Apr 01 22:42:36 <flare576> that's the piece I don't know yet
Apr 01 22:43:19 <flare576> I might have a misunderstanding about how Preware identifies "installed packages"
Apr 01 22:44:16 <zsoc> "preware is nothing which is not spelt correctly" --rwhitby
Apr 01 22:44:18 <zsoc> that is going on my wall
Apr 01 22:44:34 <flare576> hah
Apr 01 22:46:01 <knickrox13> I'm not finding any .js.reg files through internalz
Apr 01 22:46:05 <knickrox13> How bout you?
Apr 01 22:46:28 <flare576> I can't get SSH to like me right now
Apr 01 22:49:22 <Mousey> ...
Apr 01 22:49:30 <Mousey> how come installing patches isn't asking me if i wanna restart luna?
Apr 01 22:50:45 <Ron001> Mousey: if its installing a place holder, there is no need to restart luna.
Apr 01 22:51:01 <Mousey> but it's nooooooooooooooot
Apr 01 22:51:15 <Mousey> the first one i installed was a placeholder, but subsequently they're all real patches
Apr 01 22:51:24 <Ron001> hmm, dunno
Apr 01 22:51:57 <flare576> ah, SSH didn't like me because it's still set for port 22, and I was trying my "special" port
Apr 01 22:52:06 <Mousey> oh, this time it did
Apr 01 22:53:33 <flare576> I don't understand why you're looking for .js.reg :(
Apr 01 22:53:49 <flare576> doh :: scrolls down to the current convo::
Apr 01 22:54:50 <VincentLaw> Mousey: not all patches need luna restarts
Apr 01 22:55:19 <Mousey> seems new to me, but i like!
Apr 01 22:55:21 <VincentLaw> particularly ones that don't run all the time in the background
Apr 01 22:55:35 * Mousey bulks up on patchies
Apr 01 22:55:44 <Mousey> i <3 patches
Apr 01 22:55:49 <VincentLaw> I typically tell it not to restart luna until I install all patches
Apr 01 22:55:57 <VincentLaw> then use the luna manager in preware to restart it when I'm done
Apr 01 22:56:09 <Mousey> yah, i like that it got stuffed in there
Apr 01 22:56:24 <Mousey> i usually stop picking "later" after a while
Apr 01 23:00:26 <flare576> while I've got my find command going, anyone know where preware stores the postinst files?
Apr 01 23:00:56 <flare576> and now that my find command has come back empty... grrr
Apr 01 23:02:10 <flare576> helps to wild-card, n/m
Apr 01 23:09:23 <flare576> this is un-fun.  From this error message in the IPKG Log, I should be able to run a command over SSH and tell it to apply the patch despite the "Unreversed patch"
Apr 01 23:09:41 <zsoc> flare576: what are you doing?
Apr 01 23:10:30 <flare576> tryin to remove a patch.  the log sasy "Unreversed patch detected!  Ignore -R? [n]"  "Apply anyway? [n]"  "2 out of 2 hunts ignored...."
Apr 01 23:11:13 <flare576> at the very least I want to be able to use "Update All" to apply the rest of the patches and then deal with this one when I have time.
Apr 01 23:11:33 <zsoc> ipkg -o /media/internal/apps remove ?
Apr 01 23:11:41 <zsoc> er, /media/cryptofs/apps
Apr 01 23:12:47 <flare576> oh thank the Flying Speghetti Monster.
Apr 01 23:12:58 <flare576> lets see if Preware plays nice after that.
Apr 01 23:13:18 <zsoc> flare576: We prefer you don't thank deities in here.
Apr 01 23:13:25 <flare576> I knew it was something like that
Apr 01 23:13:36 <flare576> oh thank zsoc
Apr 01 23:13:50 <zsoc> flare576: No, I said _don't_ thank deities
Apr 01 23:13:52 * zsoc grins
Apr 01 23:14:04 <flare576> if knickrox13 makes it back in here, he'll want to know that command
Apr 01 23:14:21 <zsoc> flare576: honestly it's a terrible idea and you should never do it
Apr 01 23:14:22 <flare576> You guys are the best support group evar.
Apr 01 23:14:30 <flare576> Oh, I totally agree
Apr 01 23:14:34 <zsoc> but it'll fix your immediate issue
Apr 01 23:15:51 <flare576> it's like ripping the rug out from underneath Preware and webosQI
Apr 01 23:16:20 <zsoc> er... more like it alters the status file to 'uninstall' that patch
Apr 01 23:16:24 <zsoc> without running prerm
Apr 01 23:16:48 <zsoc> and since patches are never 'installed', just 'applied', you're removing that package id, but not unapplying the patch
Apr 01 23:17:34 <flare576> Oh... snap, I didn't realize it didn't actually run the prerm.... so, basically, if I don't at least re-install the patch, I'm leaving those files in a very bad state.
Apr 01 23:18:28 <flare576> like.. Florida
Apr 01 23:18:56 <zsoc> flare576: correct
Apr 01 23:20:38 <flare576> well, at least that let me finish the rest of "Update All" and a luna restart.  I should really get that command tatoo'd or something
Apr 01 23:21:29 <zsoc> hmmm
Apr 01 23:21:31 <zsoc> ~remove
Apr 01 23:21:34 <zsoc> ~patch
Apr 01 23:21:35 <infobot> i guess patch is just a tool to handle text file mutations according to a common format known as 'diff'. For kernel patching use (depending on type of patch): 'patch -p1 < patch.diff' or 'zcat patch.gz | patch -p1' or 'bzcat patch.bz2 | patch -p1', or `patch -ruN old_dir new_dir > tree.diff`
Apr 01 23:21:40 <zsoc> ~ipkg
Apr 01 23:21:41 <infobot> methinks ipkg is the Itsy Package Management system: http://www.handhelds.org/z/wiki/iPKG or find the source in the handhelds.org CVS http://cvs.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/familiar/dist/ipkg or see the howto at http://docs.zaurus.com/ipkg_howto.shtml
Apr 01 23:21:55 * zsoc shrugs
Apr 01 23:21:59 <zsoc> I thought I stuck it somewhere in there
Apr 01 23:22:10 * Mousey opens preware, sorts patches by price
Apr 01 23:22:41 <zsoc> hahah
Apr 01 23:23:11 <flare576> ~stupid_user
Apr 01 23:23:22 <flare576> I'm not in there, it's broken.
Apr 01 23:23:40 <Mousey> the bot's being upgraded to 1.4.1.1
Apr 01 23:23:50 <zsoc> infobot: flare576 is <reply> flare576 thinks he is a stupid user. I don't think he's that bad.
Apr 01 23:23:51 <infobot> okay, zsoc
Apr 01 23:24:01 <Mousey> ~sal
Apr 01 23:24:02 <infobot> somebody said sal was the Scientific Applications for Linux project, sponsored by Kachina Technologies, and can be found at http://sal.kachinatech.com/
Apr 01 23:24:03 <Mousey> ~asl
Apr 01 23:24:04 <infobot> Old enough, yes please, my place.
Apr 01 23:24:08 <flare576> ~flare576
Apr 01 23:24:09 <infobot> flare576 thinks he is a stupid user. I don't think he's that bad.
Apr 01 23:24:14 <flare576> hah
Apr 01 23:24:29 <Mousey> ~Mousey
Apr 01 23:24:30 <infobot> well, mousey is a fanboi, or the guy with the hair
Apr 01 23:24:33 <Mousey> ^_^
Apr 01 23:24:38 <jacques> anyone use their Pre with ad-hoc wireless networks?
Apr 01 23:24:56 <zsoc> jacques: i try _really_ hard not to, does that count?
Apr 01 23:25:23 * Mousey disables LED notifications for email
Apr 01 23:25:30 <jacques> zsoc: does it work?
Apr 01 23:25:38 <flare576> oh snap.... there are two "No Auto-Off While Charging" patches
Apr 01 23:25:49 <zsoc> jacques: no
Apr 01 23:25:52 <flare576> both tagged 1.4.1-1
Apr 01 23:25:57 <jacques> :-(
Apr 01 23:26:11 <zsoc> jacques: but that doesn't mean it cant
Apr 01 23:26:42 <Mousey> will greg_roll's jabber patches EVER make it into preware?
Apr 01 23:30:33 <flare576> zsoc: are dBsooner and egaudet the only folks to talk to about potential problems with the patch feed?
Apr 01 23:31:10 <zsoc> flare576: honestly, most of us don't care about themes, and only very, very slightly about patches
Apr 01 23:31:25 <zsoc> Those are the two patch workhorses, yes.
Apr 01 23:31:27 <flare576> oh... that must be sad for them :(
Apr 01 23:31:33 <flare576> I care very much about patches
Apr 01 23:31:48 <zsoc> flare576: I mean, many have _access_ to mess with the patches, if you need to suggest/submit something
Apr 01 23:32:31 <flare576> well, no, there's 2 patches with the same name, but I just noticed they do, indeed, have different package ID's, so it shouldn't be a problem, just confusing.
Apr 01 23:33:21 <zsoc> what is the diff of the ids
Apr 01 23:34:11 <flare576> org.webosinternals.patches.screen-lock-no-auto-off-while-charging vs org.webos.internals.patches.misc-no-auto-off-while-charging
Apr 01 23:34:24 <flare576> so, misc vs. screen-lock
Apr 01 23:35:06 <zsoc> interesting
Apr 01 23:35:26 <flare576> however, I can't apply the screen-lock patch, and the other is listed as "obsolete" as "category"
Apr 01 23:35:37 <zsoc> that probably means not to use it
Apr 01 23:35:39 <flare576> so... I'm back to square 1 kinda.
Apr 01 23:35:59 <flare576> 'cause the file is still screwed up, and I can't re-apply the patch
Apr 01 23:36:19 <zsoc> flare576: there are many patches that are incompatible with 1.4.1(.1) - it is up the maintainers of those patches to remedy the situation. All we can do is dummy out / take them down for the time being.
Apr 01 23:37:02 <flare576> oh, I'm not saying you guys can do anything in Preware for this, and I'm sure it's something I screwed up at some point in time.... I'm just tryin to figure out how to fix it is all
Apr 01 23:37:21 <flare576> you know what, standard step 1: Reboot.
Apr 01 23:37:31 <zsoc> flare576: rebooting is pointless 99.9% of the time
Apr 01 23:37:39 <zsoc> WOSIW
Apr 01 23:37:49 <zsoc> infobot: WOSIW is WebOS Isn't Windows
Apr 01 23:37:50 <infobot> okay, zsoc
Apr 01 23:37:58 <flare576> for the device, maybe.  For me, it gives me time that I have to think
Apr 01 23:38:04 <zsoc> heh
Apr 01 23:38:08 <flare576> I can't push buttons, all I can do is ponder.
Apr 01 23:39:56 <bhuey> folks
Apr 01 23:40:04 <flare576> hmm, especially if the device freezes during restart... that gives a lot of time.
Apr 01 23:40:19 <bhuey> flare576: I'm having the same problem with that patch
Apr 01 23:40:25 <bhuey> can't remove it no matterwhat I do
Apr 01 23:41:29 <flare576> bhuey: yeah... I havne't found a total solution yet
Apr 01 23:41:44 <bhuey> it's really up to the developer of the patch
Apr 01 23:42:00 <bhuey> might be AWOL at the moment
Apr 01 23:42:18 <flare576> zsoc was able to help me basically remove the reference inside of PreWare, but the files are still in a bad state
Apr 01 23:42:28 <flare576> which was nice 'cause I could update the rest of my patches
Apr 01 23:42:49 <zsoc> flare576: well, not necessarily. I would pull the file it's trying to patch/unpatch out of a doctor and checksum it
Apr 01 23:43:18 <flare576> zsoc: the patch is still having a visible impact on the UI
Apr 01 23:43:34 <zsoc> flare576: oh, in what way?
Apr 01 23:43:54 <bhuey> the messenger patches f-ed me the other day
Apr 01 23:43:55 <flare576> the toggle it adds to screen lock is still there
Apr 01 23:44:07 <flare576> let me finish restarting to verify
Apr 01 23:44:09 <bhuey> but the latest 1.4.1.1 update made it happier
Apr 01 23:44:12 <flare576> (had to pop the battery)
Apr 01 23:44:33 <zsoc> flare576: you can manually repair it. download 1.4.1.1 doctor, unpack it, grab the files that were changed, replace the overwritten ones
Apr 01 23:44:33 <bhuey> the new update makes the entire systme much more reliable it seems
Apr 01 23:44:43 <flare576> zsoc: I might have to, yeah
Apr 01 23:44:48 <bhuey> like it was during 1.3.5
Apr 01 23:44:53 <flare576> that's the next step
Apr 01 23:45:16 <flare576> I'd like to avoid that because I'm a giant scaredy cat.
Apr 01 23:46:21 <flare576> yup, still there
Apr 01 23:46:51 <zsoc> flare576: it will be a good learning experience
Apr 01 23:47:19 <zsoc> bhuey: 1.4.1.1 reverts a few core things back to a similar state to 1.3.5
Apr 01 23:47:19 <flare576> yeah... I wrote a 5x5 icon patch back when you still had to use quilt
Apr 01 23:47:36 <flare576> so, I know the file structure and crap.... I just don't like doing it.
Apr 01 23:47:46 <zsoc> hmmm.. i think my wife uses your patch
Apr 01 23:48:02 <zsoc> flare576: you'd like doing it more if you used linux on your desktop
Apr 01 23:48:02 <flare576> that is awesome :)
Apr 01 23:48:11 <zsoc> i knew your name seemed familiar, lol
Apr 01 23:48:29 <flare576> zsoc: I have no doubt, the pre is actually my very first linux box.
Apr 01 23:48:44 <CorpX> shit
Apr 01 23:48:50 <CorpX> my phone is stuck on ringer off
Apr 01 23:48:53 <CorpX> how do i turn it back on?
Apr 01 23:49:03 <flare576> the switch on top?
Apr 01 23:49:26 <CorpX> oh shit
Apr 01 23:49:30 <zsoc> CorpX: luna-send -n 1 palm://com.palm.audio/ringtone/setVolume '{"volume":100}'
Apr 01 23:49:31 <CorpX> i didnt even know there was a switch up there
Apr 01 23:49:32 <CorpX> hahaa
Apr 01 23:49:36 <zsoc> although that probably won't work if your switch is broken
Apr 01 23:49:36 <jacques> lol
Apr 01 23:49:37 <flare576> :)
Apr 01 23:49:41 <zsoc> YOU DIDN'T KNOW THERE IS A RINGER SWITCH?
Apr 01 23:49:46 <CorpX> lol wow ive had the phone for a year now
Apr 01 23:49:47 <CorpX> haha
Apr 01 23:49:48 <CorpX> so much fail
Apr 01 23:49:49 <flare576> welcome to the Palm Pre.
Apr 01 23:49:49 <zsoc> ..
Apr 01 23:49:58 <flare576> It has switches.
Apr 01 23:50:00 <zsoc> well, that's as much as I can take. Welcome to #P|C
Apr 01 23:50:19 * flare576 hugs zsoc 
Apr 01 23:50:21 <flare576> it'll be ok
Apr 01 23:50:38 <CorpX> i installed the mute icon patch and thought htat screwed me over
Apr 01 23:50:38 <CorpX> lol
Apr 01 23:50:43 <zsoc> infobot: CorpX is the guy who didn't find his ringer switch till he owned his phone for 10 months
Apr 01 23:50:44 <infobot> okay, zsoc
Apr 01 23:51:23 <flare576> alright, well, thank you zsoc for the help and advice on getting this patch back in line without resorting to EPR
Apr 01 23:51:29 <zsoc> np
Apr 01 23:51:32 <flare576> it's about time for me to start packing up
Apr 01 23:51:33 <CorpX> :(
Apr 02 00:02:08 <zsoc> Anyone up for a postinst sanity check?: http://webos.pastebin.com/cQzA6Dmv
Apr 02 00:18:22 <zsoc> lingfish: 'lo
Apr 02 00:18:44 <lingfish> HAI!!!!!!
Apr 02 00:18:48 <lingfish> Long time no speak :)
Apr 02 00:19:02 <zsoc> Yeah, been awhile. Whatcha up to?
Apr 02 00:19:38 <lingfish> Stupidly busy with a huge work project... playing with the new Cisco UCS platform and a whole lot more.  Fun.
Apr 02 00:19:42 <lingfish> What about you?
Apr 02 00:19:44 <lingfish> I see 1.4.1 is out, heh
Apr 02 00:20:14 <zsoc> my normal life endeavors, and squeezing a few hours out of the day to develop awesomeness like usual
Apr 02 00:20:49 <lingfish> heh, nice nice
Apr 02 00:20:58 <lingfish> I've been meaning to find 10 seconds and dig into WebKit a bit more
Apr 02 00:21:18 <lingfish> So any gotchas now with >= 1.4 and AUPT?
Apr 02 00:21:24 <lingfish> All my Preware stuff should stay?
Apr 02 00:21:27 <zsoc> What is our current method of building C services? I assume autobuilder still needs them prebuilt to package? I'll use the widk i guess...
Apr 02 00:21:55 <zsoc> lingfish: 'should', except stuff that's not yet supported in 1.4.1(.1) and themes need to be uninstalled, of course
Apr 02 00:22:02 <zsoc> lingfish: 800mhz patch works, just need to reinstall it after update
Apr 02 00:22:50 <lingfish> I'm not using any themes, and too scared about overclocking at this stage ...
Apr 02 00:22:57 <lingfish> and frankly, my batt life is shit enough as it is
Apr 02 00:23:24 <lingfish> So, for stuff that isn't updated for 1.4.x a shim stays there though right?  And will update when avail?
Apr 02 00:23:35 <lingfish> Or does it just uninstall and disappear off the planet (ie. the device)?
Apr 02 00:23:49 <zsoc> my battery life is fine... and the new kernel has governer options of some sort
Apr 02 00:23:59 <zsoc> lingfish: er, it stays on the device, but doesn't function, an update will appear when available
Apr 02 00:24:00 <uNiXpSyChO> zsoc: it does?
Apr 02 00:24:15 <zsoc> uNiXpSyChO: yeah, magical ones (my batt life isn't worse then before... so..?)
Apr 02 00:24:19 <lingfish> zsoc: righty, nice one.  And on the OC... you like it?  Think it's worth it?
Apr 02 00:24:20 <zsoc> or it _will_ have them? hehe
Apr 02 00:24:30 <zsoc> lingfish: if you plan on having your phone less than 3 years, then yes.
Apr 02 00:25:03 <lingfish> zsoc: remember that I'm in .au, and for a dead device I'd have to send back to Hong Kong or worse still, throw it in the bin ;)
Apr 02 00:25:14 <zsoc> lingfish: it will die, but not for awhile...
Apr 02 00:25:16 <uNiXpSyChO> zsoc: it will eventually.  or you can be brave and install my beta scaling kernel.
Apr 02 00:25:24 <lingfish> Again, my usual rant... Palm, please just start fully using h/w accel... I keep touching an iPhone and crying :(
Apr 02 00:25:52 <lingfish> You can still see that it looks like a PC without a DirectX driver :(
Apr 02 00:25:56 <chrisa> Who are you ranting too exactly?
Apr 02 00:26:00 <chrisa> *-o
Apr 02 00:26:07 <lingfish> chrisa: The Palm gods.
Apr 02 00:26:17 <zsoc> lingfish: h/w accel luna isn't necessarily _better_
Apr 02 00:26:20 <zsoc> or fast for that matter
Apr 02 00:26:35 <zsoc> software rendering has it's advantages
Apr 02 00:26:40 <lingfish> zsoc: I can't see why not.
Apr 02 00:27:26 <lingfish> zsoc: happy to be convinced otherwise, but right now, that statement makes no sense.  Safe to assume that using h/w accel would further save batt too... but mainly, scrolling lists or a webpage on an iCrap still looks far, far more robust and sexier, sadly.
Apr 02 00:28:33 <zsoc> lingfish: install the 800mhz kernel
Apr 02 00:28:37 <zsoc> seriously, it's like night and day
Apr 02 00:29:04 <lingfish> Tell you what... is there any good (fps-wise) tube or other vids demoing it?
Apr 02 00:29:20 <VincentLaw> uh yeah
Apr 02 00:29:24 <VincentLaw> the one that tells you how to install it
Apr 02 00:29:30 <VincentLaw> has demos showing how fast apps launch
Apr 02 00:29:35 <lingfish> No point watching some stupidass video filmed at 12 fps
Apr 02 00:29:40 <lingfish> VincentLaw: ah, nice
Apr 02 00:30:06 <lingfish> zsoc: so then tell me how it doesn't impact batt life?  That too makes no sense heh
Apr 02 00:30:41 <zsoc> lingfish: in very stringent testing, it doesn't impact battery life _much_
Apr 02 00:30:51 <lingfish> k
Apr 02 00:30:54 <zsoc> lingfish: and in future releases, there will be governors that lower the frequency when not needed
Apr 02 00:30:56 <zsoc> uNiXpSyChO: right?
Apr 02 00:31:40 <zsoc> uNiXpSyChO: also, i'd be curious to see what TI guys say about your work
Apr 02 00:31:52 <lingfish> zsoc: Would be nice then if Palm take that on ;)
Apr 02 00:33:11 <uNiXpSyChO> correct
Apr 02 00:33:24 <uNiXpSyChO> TI will frown at me... if they arent already
Apr 02 00:33:39 <rwhitby> zsoc: see saverestore for current best practice for autobuilder services
Apr 02 00:33:53 <lingfish> Heya Rod :)
Apr 02 00:34:05 <zsoc> rwhitby: ty
Apr 02 00:35:46 <Kyusaku> lingfish: comparison video of 800Mhz vs 500Mhz
Apr 02 00:36:06 <Kyusaku> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKKZkbwXjT8
Apr 02 00:36:18 <lingfish> Kyusaku: thanks heaps :)
Apr 02 00:36:59 <lingfish> Hrm, anyone else noticed that when you power the screen back on (if you have the slider already open) by using the centre button, screen brightness is not obeying the pref?
Apr 02 00:37:07 <lingfish> That a known issue?
Apr 02 00:37:27 <rwhitby> hey lingfish
Apr 02 00:37:32 <Kyusaku> I have never powered the screen by the center button
Apr 02 00:37:46 <lingfish> Try it... I've had it since way before 1.4
Apr 02 00:37:49 <Kyusaku> in fact I barely ever use the center button
Apr 02 00:38:06 <lingfish> It's just sometimes, I'll have it open... it goes to sleep, and using that button is easier to wake up
Apr 02 00:38:10 <jacques> biaw
Apr 02 00:38:13 <Kyusaku> only when an app locks up like if a browser is loading a image heavy page
Apr 02 00:38:14 <lingfish> s@up@it@g
Apr 02 00:38:21 * rwhitby bbl (bike riding with kids)
Apr 02 00:39:23 <rwhitby> lingfish: FYI, uNiXpSyChO and I are going to work on getting OC stuff into a custom Preware feed. At that point I'll probably install one of them.
Apr 02 00:39:48 <lingfish> rwhitby: righty, you're that confident (is that what you're saying?)
Apr 02 00:40:06 <rwhitby> lingfish: I have 2 GSM devices, and one Sprint.  So I have a spare.
Apr 02 00:40:12 <lingfish> uNiXpSyChO: sorry, I didn't mean to seem like I was bashing, or unappreciative of your work :)
Apr 02 00:40:20 <lingfish> rwhitby: k
Apr 02 00:40:35 <lingfish> Just making a list of all my Preware stuff, as I don't still trust AUPT ;)
Apr 02 00:40:36 <zsoc> rwhitby: er.. wait..
Apr 02 00:40:37 <rwhitby> And I'll be buying the unlocked GSM Pre Plus if/when it is released.
Apr 02 00:40:54 <zsoc> rwhitby: so if save/restore is 'best practice', then I need a new repo to combine precorder and precorderD
Apr 02 00:41:09 <lingfish> meh... too hard.. 34 installed items.
Apr 02 00:41:13 <rwhitby> zsoc: just put the service in with the app, like we do for saverestore
Apr 02 00:41:18 <zsoc> oh
Apr 02 00:41:21 <acydlord> rwhitby make sure you record the testing for posterity in case one of the phones releases it's magic smoke
Apr 02 00:41:32 <Kyusaku> the Japanese IME app developer tried to dishearten the justinput Japanese development last night with a comment on how much more complicated Japanese IME is to Chinese IME. I'm waiting on justinput's author Jeffery to respond to my translation of his comments on it
Apr 02 00:41:37 <zsoc> rwhitby: I can leave the git history in the service repo tho?
Apr 02 00:41:59 <rwhitby> zsoc: meh - it's not as if it's not going to be completely rewritten in C anyway, right?
Apr 02 00:42:09 <zsoc> rwhitby: it's already C
Apr 02 00:42:15 <zsoc> it had been for a few commits now
Apr 02 00:43:08 <Kyusaku> precorder's development is going to continue?
Apr 02 00:44:14 <zsoc> Kyusaku: It's been redeveloped as a general purpose 'recorder'. Current features include recording from microphone, with optional "voice activation", and recording from "stream" (ie: whatever your pre is playing at the time (except a phone call))
Apr 02 00:44:49 <Kyusaku> ah repurposing precorder, very nice.
Apr 02 00:45:08 <rwhitby> acydlord: the OC stuff probably won't hurt anything in the short term if you keep things cool, but don't expect more than a couple of years at 800MHz
Apr 02 00:45:40 <zsoc> Kyusaku: I figured it was a no-brainer, since 1.) there's STILL no voice recorder anywhere somehow, and 2.) I can do a lot of 'fun stuff' with gstreamer and i want to show it off
Apr 02 00:45:42 <rwhitby> (worst case if you have a device that is susceptible to electromigration in the lower half of the gaussian distribution)
Apr 02 00:45:58 <acydlord> yeah, those TI procs are pretty rugged, problem is that where I live the phone already gets intop the upper ends of operating temps without OC
Apr 02 00:46:06 <Kyusaku> I think the longest I've had a mobile device for regular use is 2 years.
Apr 02 00:46:24 <rwhitby> I had my last phone (a Treo 650) for 6 years.
Apr 02 00:47:02 * lingfish installs 1.4.1
Apr 02 00:47:10 <acydlord> i had my last phone for 14 months, that was the longest if you dont count the nokia 6210 i always kept around as a backup
Apr 02 00:47:25 <Kyusaku> zsoc: there definitely seems like a big demand for a voice recorder.
Apr 02 00:47:37 <mandaman2k> hey all, I've been trying to full erase my device, but it wont erase, it just stays grayed and nothing happens, just doctored to webos1.4.1.1
Apr 02 00:47:42 <zsoc> Kyusaku: I can't believe there isn't one yet. I'm literally flabbergasted.
Apr 02 00:47:53 * rwhitby bbl
Apr 02 00:48:04 <zsoc> bbiab
Apr 02 00:48:20 <acydlord> zsoc, maybe someone was waiting for the official pdk?
Apr 02 00:48:32 <Kyusaku> zsoc: I'm not sure what's up with Palm's hesitation on that.
Apr 02 00:49:04 <Kyusaku> official PDK doesn't even have mic API does it?
Apr 02 00:49:10 <acydlord> maybe palm didnt want us to have access to the mic cause the carriers are pissy about voip?
Apr 02 00:49:24 <acydlord> nope, sdl does though
Apr 02 00:50:16 <lingfish> Kyusaku: interesting vid... pity its low res... and doesn't show scrolling speed comparisons
Apr 02 00:51:21 <mandaman2k> anyone have an idea why it wont full erase?
Apr 02 00:51:44 <mandaman2k> or how to force a full erase?
Apr 02 00:52:38 <acydlord> device info > reset options > erase apps & data (if you're on 1.4.1
Apr 02 00:53:02 <acydlord> or device info > reset options > full erase
Apr 02 00:54:22 <Kyusaku> oh speaking of a full erase. I need to check my hosts file. I did a Secure Erase and Doctor last week and haven't been able to connect to GTalk
Apr 02 00:54:28 <mandaman2k> i've tried the device info > reset options > full erase and nothing happens it just stays there :S
Apr 02 00:54:59 <lingfish> All: tell me, is it easy to revert to a stock kernel when trying the 800MHz stuff?
Apr 02 00:55:39 <acydlord> mandaman2k, when you tap full erase does it bring u pa confirmation screen with secure full erase, full erase?
Apr 02 00:55:53 <acydlord> or is it just staying on the screen with usb erace, app/data erase and full erase?
Apr 02 00:56:23 <Kyusaku> lingfish: as easy as it is to install it
Apr 02 00:56:27 <Kyusaku> actually easier
Apr 02 00:56:31 <lingfish> nice.
Apr 02 00:56:40 <lingfish> And I assume it is tied to the version of WebOS?
Apr 02 00:56:55 <Kyusaku> because the install requires the extra step to download the script to the right directory
Apr 02 00:56:58 <mandaman2k> correct, it shows the 2 options, and i click the Full Erase, after that a little notification shows up on the buttom saying Erasing.. and the it just stays there...
Apr 02 00:57:43 <acydlord> it may take awhile to do the full erase, took around 15 mins the last time i did one
Apr 02 00:57:57 <Kyusaku> lingfish: yes, there's different ones for each version, there isn't one out for 1.4.1 yet though
Apr 02 00:58:10 <lingfish> k
Apr 02 00:58:11 <lingfish> ta
Apr 02 00:58:38 <Kyusaku> it does take a while but it should boot the phone into that black screen with circle progress bar
Apr 02 00:59:04 <Kyusaku> at least that's what it did when I did a secure full erase
Apr 02 00:59:22 <mandaman2k> yes, I know, but usually after the the notification at the bottom, the phone kinda reebots and starts the process
Apr 02 00:59:38 <mandaman2k> here it just stays grayed out and nothing happens....
Apr 02 01:01:54 <acydlord> may try checking in #webos to see if someone might have a better idea
Apr 02 01:02:38 <mandaman2k> and just for a random question, when you've been playing with patches and plugins and decide to clean them up, is it better to Dr or by doing a full erase is enough?
Apr 02 01:03:07 <Tibfib> mandaman2k: doctor
Apr 02 01:03:10 <acydlord> usually just running EPR is enough
Apr 02 01:04:15 <mandaman2k> yeah, thought about it too, but it also works for plugins not installed or that aren't the preware feed? for example the messaging plugin...
Apr 02 01:05:33 <acydlord> if it was installed via a current version of webosqi EPR should still work to remove it
Apr 02 01:05:55 <mandaman2k> ok ok, perfect, thanks a lot
Apr 02 01:06:52 <acydlord> no problem
Apr 02 01:07:53 <lingfish> Hrm, I'm finding this pattern of 'official' pages for apps/hacks being in forums rather annoying... is there not a site dedicated to the 800MHz patch?  Is it just me, I don't get using 15 pages of forums for the official representation of an app/hack/patch...
Apr 02 01:08:29 <izkeepsitreal> hi, how do I go about disabeling a specific feed?
Apr 02 01:08:40 <Kyusaku> lingfish: all you need is the first post
Apr 02 01:08:58 <Kyusaku> lingfish: the rest of the thread is for feedback on the patch
Apr 02 01:09:01 <izkeepsitreal> nm got it
Apr 02 01:09:38 <lingfish> Kyusaku: I get that... but finding that thread?  heh.  Get my point?  I think Precentral, or someone, should run a site that crosslinks to this stuff
Apr 02 01:09:50 <lingfish> ie. I just googled and first hit was for 1.3.5.x...
Apr 02 01:10:10 <Kyusaku> it's usually one of the first few threads in the tips and resources forum on precentral
Apr 02 01:10:19 <Kyusaku> it always gets bumped
Apr 02 01:10:37 <lingfish> Kyusaku: usually, yes.  But you still see my point right? ;)
Apr 02 01:11:13 <Kyusaku> not really, considering it's a practice that Palm has made an official statement that is frown upon
Apr 02 01:11:27 <Kyusaku> s/frown/frowned/
Apr 02 01:11:27 <infobot> Kyusaku meant: not really, considering it's a practice that Palm has made an official statement that is frowned upon
Apr 02 01:12:01 <lingfish> meh, my point is finding the most current info isn't made easy.
Apr 02 01:12:03 <Kyusaku> eventually it will make it to Preware through a custom feed to make it easier to find
Apr 02 01:12:24 <Kyusaku> but the patch is stated that technically it's still under alpha testing
Apr 02 01:12:54 <Kyusaku> something that's an alpha doesn't need to be cross-linked everywhere
Apr 02 01:12:57 <lingfish> Kyusaku: I was kinda talking more globally... with any cool new stuff that comes out... a forum thread isn't the right way to promote it in my eyes.
Apr 02 01:13:17 <lingfish> hrm, my Preware is stuck now after 1.4.1
Apr 02 01:13:28 <lingfish> stuck at loading Palm-catalog
Apr 02 01:13:37 <Kyusaku> lingfish: it's been promoted through several news channels(like ENgadget) as well as Precentral's front page
Apr 02 01:14:36 <lingfish> Ok, I'm not wording it right obviously.  Picture a wiki, that contains the most uptodate info.  Not some news threads, that link to another, that then link to Precentral, which then crosslinks to a forum thread
Apr 02 01:15:38 <Kyusaku> I imagine caj2008 will eventually add it to the wiki especially if it is publicly available via Preware.
Apr 02 01:15:57 <lingfish> Sure.
Apr 02 01:16:03 <Kyusaku> you could always bring that up to him in his thread
Apr 02 01:16:07 <lingfish> In the meantime, Preware be brokez :(
Apr 02 01:16:16 <Kyusaku> he seems to check that thread very often
Apr 02 01:16:32 <Kyusaku> stuck downloading or loading?
Apr 02 01:16:38 <lingfish> yeah loading
Apr 02 01:16:46 <lingfish> Never seen it take this long
Apr 02 01:17:09 <ka6sox> lingfish, you were able to download it but now it won't install?
Apr 02 01:17:31 <lingfish> ka6sox: nah I always had Preware installed... just finished my 1.4.1 update, launched Preware and...
Apr 02 01:17:37 <lingfish> perhaps I need to manually update feeds
Apr 02 01:17:47 <ka6sox> let me know if that works.
Apr 02 01:18:02 <lingfish> k
Apr 02 01:19:23 <lingfish> so far, no good
Apr 02 01:20:49 <ka6sox> lingfish, good..that means its not on my end :D
Apr 02 01:21:18 <lingfish> ka6sox: :/   haven't met you, hi, Jason.. are you new to the internals fold, or am I missing something? :)
Apr 02 01:22:00 <ka6sox> I'm the man behind the curtain...I work on infrastructure for the project.
Apr 02 01:22:11 <lingfish> ah.
Apr 02 01:22:46 <lingfish> ka6sox: well, thanks for doing what you do :)
Apr 02 01:23:03 <ka6sox> just my little part :D
Apr 02 01:23:48 <zsoc>  Ooook... so.. uh.. i just uncontrollably started disinfecting things. I don't have OCD.
Apr 02 01:23:52 <lingfish> Hrm, still stuck.  Bad bad bad :(
Apr 02 01:25:14 <ka6sox> bummers
Apr 02 01:25:18 <lingfish> Turning off palm-catalog
Apr 02 01:25:39 <lingfish> heh, now hands on Palm-catalog-updates
Apr 02 01:25:54 <lingfish> nice, its moving on
Apr 02 01:26:17 <lingfish> That seems to have fixed it
Apr 02 01:26:38 <lingfish> An issue with the Palm feed.
Apr 02 01:31:10 <lingfish> hrm, a few of my apps have now moved to "Unknown" category
Apr 02 01:33:42 <zsoc> rwhitby: for when you get back, i'm mildly confused by the (shell cd ../.. ; pwd) stuff in the build.git ... is mason actually building this stuff with a hack?
Apr 02 01:46:57 <Kyusaku> have you all seen this patent that webosroundup linked? http://www.google.com/patents?id=6C3JAAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4#v=onepage&q=&f=false
Apr 02 01:47:07 <Kyusaku> it's not about overclocking
Apr 02 01:47:08 <Kyusaku> but
Apr 02 01:47:22 <Kyusaku> some of the notes suggest potential for a 4G device
Apr 02 01:47:51 <zsoc> Just looking at the first image suggests 4G
Apr 02 01:47:57 <zsoc> or a super-world phone :p
Apr 02 01:48:17 <Kyusaku> the diagrams only make mention of BT and 802.11 bands
Apr 02 01:48:30 <Kyusaku> but the end notes make mention of WiMax
Apr 02 01:48:50 <Kyusaku> as an alternative to the diagrams
Apr 02 01:48:59 <zsoc> I think a 4G palm phone _might_ be a mistake... considering how little 'wimax' coverage there is right, now, how it would only work in america, and only on 1 carrier
Apr 02 01:49:11 <zsoc> they would need an LTE version for verizon/att, and that's 1-2 years out
Apr 02 01:49:37 <Kyusaku> LTE is also mentioned in the same section
Apr 02 01:49:40 <Kyusaku> but yeah
Apr 02 01:50:21 <zsoc> They are probably trying to be a general patent troll in a very smart way.
Apr 02 01:51:00 <Kyusaku> true that is Palm's general practice
Apr 02 01:51:28 <Tibfib> it seems to have worked out for them so far
Apr 02 02:01:25 <djk> is there something going on with preware? it keeps hanging on loading palm-catalog
Apr 02 02:01:38 <lingfish> djk: heh, I reported that about 30 mins ago.
Apr 02 02:01:42 <lingfish> Same thing happening to me.
Apr 02 02:02:11 <djk> ok so we're in company
Apr 02 02:02:20 <lingfish> I just disabled the feed for now
Apr 02 02:03:00 <djk> will do the same thanks
Apr 02 02:27:26 <lingfish> Hrm, now all I need personally is Latitude for WebOS and I'll be super-happy.
Apr 02 02:28:51 <lingfish> I do miss how my N95 could show me how many PS satellite locks it had...
Apr 02 02:29:24 <lingfish> s/PS/GPS/
Apr 02 02:29:24 <infobot> lingfish meant: I do miss how my N95 could show me how many GPS satellite locks it had...
Apr 02 02:32:16 <psykoz> hrmm
Apr 02 02:32:25 <psykoz> I wonder now that we have x-server how hard it'd be to port remote desktop over
Apr 02 02:33:08 <dtzWill> psykoz: rdesktop (note rdesktop doesn't have a gui, but still) is in the cross_compile git
Apr 02 02:33:26 <dtzWill> psykoz: i don't see why it wouldn't work, but i don't have an rdp machine to test against
Apr 02 02:33:36 <lingfish> I have plenty
Apr 02 02:34:17 <VincentLaw> I have my windows pc >.>
Apr 02 02:36:38 <dtzWill> anyway it should definitely to have a nice little rdesktop package like xterm :)
Apr 02 02:37:11 <VincentLaw> I would be very happy to have RDP :D
Apr 02 02:37:11 <lingfish> dtzWill: is there a web interface to internals git yet?
Apr 02 02:37:22 <dtzWill> lingfish: http://git.webos-internals.org/ ?
Apr 02 02:37:30 <lingfish> ta.
Apr 02 02:41:55 <Tibfib> heh, who started the psx4pre project?
Apr 02 02:43:25 <dtzWill> Tibfib: no one, it's empty ;)
Apr 02 02:43:43 <zsoc> Tibfib: the zod himself
Apr 02 02:44:34 <Tibfib> It made it pretty far, eh?
Apr 02 02:50:48 <hozer> what is the testing feed with the Xserver in it?
Apr 02 02:52:48 <dtzWill> ~testing-feed
Apr 02 02:52:49 <infobot> i heard testing-feed is a means of testing new WebOS Internals products, documented at http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Testing_Feeds
Apr 02 02:52:59 <oil> ~botsnack
Apr 02 02:53:00 <infobot> :), oil
Apr 02 02:53:08 <hozer> thanks
Apr 02 02:56:41 <hozer> hrrm.. is there any way to add the armv7 feed from preware, or do I need command line for that?
Apr 02 02:57:17 <Tibfib> hozer: yep look at the wiki
Apr 02 02:58:30 <hozer> I did, I can add one line in preware, but there doesn't seem to be a way to have both the 'all' and 'armv7' lines in one entry from preware
Apr 02 02:58:59 <Tibfib> you make em separate
Apr 02 02:59:12 <oil> lol
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Apr 02 02:59:56 2010