**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Nov 23 02:59:57 2010 Nov 23 03:00:25 SineOt: reflowing in place is pretty easy, just apply flame. removing, cleaning, putting new balls of solder under the chip and soldering it again, that's a bit more challenging Nov 23 03:02:06 I'm definitely hopeful now though. Nov 23 03:05:43 pretty sure the stupid usb cover thing is intentionally brokenly challenging to use to encourage buying touchstones lol Nov 23 03:06:06 dtzWill: I'd say that's a safe assumption, lol Nov 23 03:06:09 xD Nov 23 03:06:17 i mean i own two just not one in this ROOM bah Nov 23 03:06:22 the stock Pixi back has the magnetic flap embedded Nov 23 03:06:32 the touchstone Pixi back has it just glued on with a crappy adhesive pad Nov 23 03:06:43 more important to have one at work and one near bed so i can guarnatee each day my phone gets charged Nov 23 03:06:45 SineOt: lol Nov 23 03:07:04 it's like they went, "hey, we made them buy a touchstone now, let's just skimp on the magnet!" Nov 23 03:07:14 and mad b/c instead of touchstone awesomeness took me like 4 tries to put it on without pinching the usb cover and TRYING not to break it so this one lasts Nov 23 03:07:18 Pixi usb cover is better, but sucks Nov 23 03:07:20 might just have to buy another touchstone x.x (dammit it worked) Nov 23 03:07:26 needs long nails to open sometimes Nov 23 03:07:30 ah, i see. (re: pixi) Nov 23 03:07:43 bnceo: on the stock cover, yeah. I hate the Touchstone covers though... I've pulled magnets out of two of them just from opening and closing them :/ Nov 23 03:08:00 really? I never had a problem with a TS cover. Nov 23 03:08:14 yup, two green TS covers, both now without magnets! Nov 23 03:08:19 is rwhitby arround? Nov 23 03:08:20 ... and peeling Nov 23 03:08:23 ah. green Nov 23 03:09:09 bnceo: I take it you have the black one? Nov 23 03:09:28 ya. I tried looking for other colors cause my cousin have two pixis Nov 23 03:09:32 but I only found black Nov 23 03:09:37 well, black at cheaper price Nov 23 03:09:48 Verizon stores had them in stock for a while, but I don't know if they do now. Nov 23 03:11:00 I need to talk to Palm support again and get this green one replaced... Again Nov 23 03:11:42 I want a pink and blue one for my cousin Nov 23 03:11:48 wife and husband pixi owners Nov 23 03:11:58 aww, that's cute :3 Nov 23 03:12:09 my doing. convinced them to get palm phones Nov 23 03:12:15 but they were cheap and got the free pixis Nov 23 03:12:23 I think the Precentral store has them in stock for like 18$ right now, Verizon had them for 24$ Nov 23 03:12:27 Don't remember what Palm wanted Nov 23 03:13:13 I try to use amazon as much as possible. Prime = awesome Nov 23 03:13:25 free prime==better Nov 23 03:14:19 kept my .edu address from my alma mater Nov 23 03:14:27 SineOt: are those actually magnets in the TS cover or just metal discs? Nov 23 03:14:29 graduated 4 years ago, but still got it. hence my free prime Nov 23 03:15:22 destinal: you know, I have no idea Nov 23 03:15:29 oh, oh, oh! steam and itunes are fighting over bandwidth.. wonder who will win... Nov 23 03:16:51 haha Nov 23 03:17:19 threw a chrome download in there just for kicks... Nov 23 03:17:32 I was SO freaking sad to find out that in 10.6, the OSX iperf is broken and will kernel panic if you use fake pipes to bandwidth limit :C Nov 23 03:17:56 why the hell would I limit bandwidth... Nov 23 03:18:17 halfhalo: because you're on a connection that caps out at 300kBps and there's 4 people using it :T Nov 23 03:18:22 SineOt, you are epic at preware themeing, plz move on to 2.0 and make good themes there :D Nov 23 03:18:46 scoutcamper: which one is epic, the tasteful one, or the rainbow "fuck ur eyes" one with the flying mojo widgets Nov 23 03:18:53 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. No. I have 3MB/s down thankyouverymuch Nov 23 03:19:26 It's like getting punched in the butt with a broken glass bottle, because we're paying 29$ a month to get 300kBps :T Nov 23 03:19:47 heh, I tether with the epic sometimes... mmmm.... 4g..... Nov 23 03:20:38 halfhalo: paying the mobile hotspot price with 4G tethering would get us internet that's like 3x as fast for the same price :V Nov 23 03:20:48 ThisIsWhyIHateYouVerizon Nov 23 03:21:02 SineOt: use one dd-wrt box to do QoS /shaping for everyone Nov 23 03:21:16 destinal: that's what I did, until... DUN DUN DUN Nov 23 03:21:34 a long standing mystery safari bug reared its ugly head in the middle of a firmware update lol :B Nov 23 03:21:47 ouch Nov 23 03:22:02 borked it and I just haven't really had the cash to go out and replace it Nov 23 03:22:21 btw, firefox exists on the mac, I used safari to download firefox and then stopped using safari Nov 23 03:22:24 SineOt: Then get an epic! Nov 23 03:22:37 Safari is... decent save for no superbar Nov 23 03:22:47 halfhalo: too bad the hill in front of the house is tall enough that we don't get 4G at the house :C Nov 23 03:23:05 I used Safari to download the WebKit nightly and then stopped using Safari :T Nov 23 03:23:13 SUCKS FOR YOU!!!!wait, I don't get service at all at my house... Nov 23 03:23:25 SineOt: I see a long pole mounted wimax router in your future :) Nov 23 03:23:29 SineOt: try a tmobile hotspot? Nov 23 03:23:47 halfhalo: haha, don't joke. tmo & att are literal blackholes here Nov 23 03:24:26 my old Tmo prepaid phone wouldn't even ring if I was indoors, had to go stand in the middle of the street to get 2/8 bars ;p Nov 23 03:24:32 SineOt: Build a tower if you have to to get it to see over the hill Nov 23 03:25:06 right now I'm mostly just eying some of the cable plans that Charter has Nov 23 03:25:17 if I can get Sprint to ship us a 3G Airrave then we're set Nov 23 03:25:40 EVDO speeds here at the house are like... 300kbps. Whatever that works out to. Nov 23 03:25:54 bbiab Nov 23 03:26:03 and build a tower! :) Nov 23 03:26:13 although Sprint support seems to go "huh?" when they hear "3G Airrave." Nov 23 03:26:21 "The Airvana one, not the Samsung." Nov 23 03:33:25 I thought about trying to get a 3G femtocell just for kicks Nov 23 03:33:33 but I have good reception here Nov 23 03:36:35 we've got pretty bad + sprint pixi has no wifi, so... Nov 23 03:39:12 SineOt: bluetooth PAN Nov 23 03:40:04 yeah, pretty short range, but has its uses Nov 23 03:55:51 huh, would that even work? Sharing from a desktop to the Pixi? Nov 23 03:56:56 guess there's only one way to find out Nov 23 04:01:39 yeah, doesn't seem to work, destinal :( Nov 23 04:02:10 aw, for the developer coupon, they want a list of my apps. Glad I already ordered a Pre 2. :) Nov 23 04:28:23 ashi_todd: so why'd you take so long writing apps? Also, make some in the emulator and submit them to the catalog! :) Nov 23 04:30:14 if not the catalog, at least the pre central repository so it appears on preware Nov 23 04:31:07 oh wait, just read the line before that Nov 23 04:31:29 lol I wonder if they would consider a homebrew app as enough for a developer coupon Nov 23 04:31:45 rsanchez1: I don't know, if you had apps in preware you might be able to make the case -- it remains to be seen... Nov 23 04:31:55 I don't see why not, I mean, you made them Nov 23 04:32:19 I've got one app on preware, but it's not much of an app Nov 23 04:32:29 sounds like wirc Nov 23 04:32:31 BAZING Nov 23 04:33:26 do they have IRC client apps on other mobile OS's? Nov 23 04:34:22 yup Nov 23 04:35:29 * summatusmentis used to use jIRC on his nokia 6265 Nov 23 04:35:32 it will be nice when wirc becomes available in the official app catalog Nov 23 04:35:58 it can't in it's current form can it? Nov 23 04:36:14 only because it's a hybrid app Nov 23 04:36:18 I don't think they would allow it, being a hybrid app Nov 23 04:36:21 and those are still a no no for the official catalog Nov 23 04:36:26 but with 2.0 I don't see why not Nov 23 04:36:28 yup, webos 2.0 changes that Nov 23 04:36:36 hybrid apps are coming soon to a catalog near you... Nov 23 04:36:48 it's yet to be seen if 2.0 will let you run hybrids on the Pixi... :c Nov 23 04:37:04 does 2.0 allow hybrids even with C backends? Nov 23 04:37:10 SineOt: why not, you have SDL games on pixi now, right? Nov 23 04:37:16 I think if it's like wirc, where it doesn't handle graphics on the C side, it might work Nov 23 04:37:43 hybrids won't run on the Pixi Nov 23 04:37:50 but yes, there's some SDL stuff on Pixi I think Nov 23 04:38:08 the only buggy things with respect to pdk on pixi that I've heard have to do with 2D graphics Nov 23 04:38:25 and hopefully 2.0 fixes those bugs Nov 23 04:38:33 Yeah, I sure hope so. Nov 23 04:43:42 * phil_bw wanders by Nov 23 04:50:18 morning Nov 23 04:56:17 hey Rod Nov 23 04:56:30 good job at the dev days conference :) Nov 23 04:57:03 rwhitby: do you recognize "type": "native-palm" Nov 23 04:57:05 ? Nov 23 04:57:53 the pre 2/sprint pre splicing was pretty nice, too bad the result wasn't too useful Nov 23 04:57:58 phil_bw: thx Nov 23 04:58:14 rsanchez1: what do you mean, not a useful result? Nov 23 04:58:30 destinal: I have not seen it, but I've seen the jail config for it. Nov 23 04:58:41 I heard you ended up undoing the procedure because it wouldn't do OTA updates or something like that Nov 23 04:58:47 rwhitby: quickoffice's qoservice is one Nov 23 04:59:28 that's the only entry in the appinfo.json under it's native directory Nov 23 04:59:33 rsanchez1: the user who had volunteered needed to use their existing profile, so the CDMA board was swapped back. But that doesn't mean it was a bad result. Other people are moving it forward. Nov 23 05:00:04 I guess I didn't mean useful so much as I meant not 100%? Nov 23 05:00:14 rsanchez1, you are correct, no OTA because i dont see palm having a sprint pre 2 build to push Nov 23 05:00:26 And once folks like destinal, egaudet, etc get their Pre 2 from the telethon donations, it's bound to move even further forward. Nov 23 05:00:57 scoutcamper: well, that assumes that the eventual result reports itself as a Sprint device to Palm's servers ;) Nov 23 05:01:21 rsanchez1: sure, no new technique is 100% done on the first day. Nov 23 05:01:39 do you see yourselves eventually starting a mail-in service like the guys who plus sprint pre's? Nov 23 05:01:46 If it was simple enough to work 100% on the first day, then anyone could do it ;) Nov 23 05:02:22 rsanchez1: I wouldn't be surprised if those same guys start 2'ing sprint pre's, once we perfect the technique here.. Nov 23 05:02:24 rsanchez1: WebOS Internals isn't in the hardware upgrade business. WebOS World are doing that, and they are going to donate a percentage of the fee back to us for developing the tools they use. Nov 23 05:02:46 One of their guys is the person still trying things out at the moment. Nov 23 05:02:51 nice Nov 23 05:02:59 (And I believe the only other person who has replicated the experiment) Nov 23 05:03:20 * Tibfib is excited for pre2 on sprint Nov 23 05:03:26 I'll probably hold off on that for now though, I still have about 10 months left on my warranty Nov 23 05:03:31 I have faith in you guys :) Nov 23 05:03:38 webOS: probably the only place where people are swapping the guts of their phones just to get better hardware, haha Nov 23 05:03:53 Android? Fresh Roms? Pffft. iPhone Jailbreaks? Eh. Nov 23 05:04:18 heh, I suppose swapping comm boards and keyboards and other stuff that's been done so far is a little more serious. :) Nov 23 05:05:10 this stuff happens in other communities too Nov 23 05:06:45 other phone communities though? I haven't heard of anyone swapping the guts from say, an iPhone 4 into an iPhone 3GS Nov 23 05:06:57 or from... to Nov 23 05:07:45 SineOt: there are mobile phone people who swap BGA IC's to do upgrades Nov 23 05:07:55 that's a bit more challenging :) Nov 23 05:08:20 apple folk don't hack their phones, they just buy whatever Jobs offers to them Nov 23 05:08:53 rsanchez1: I think the jailbreak and openiBoot stuff would disagree with that ;P Nov 23 05:08:59 hack as in hardware hack, but then most iphone users still don't jailbreak Nov 23 05:09:05 to be blunt... i cannot find "preware" in the webOS quick install Nov 23 05:09:06 gah, beat me to it :) Nov 23 05:09:17 its jus not there Nov 23 05:09:18 would running Android count as a hardware hack? ;p Nov 23 05:09:34 oneloveaz, it's under the WebOS Internals feed Nov 23 05:09:39 not the default PreCentral feed Nov 23 05:09:39 what does that require? I've heard about it but never looked into it Nov 23 05:09:48 do you need to add hardware to your iphone to do it? Nov 23 05:10:15 * scoutcamper still lolz at the people walking arround saying "my I-Phone is on verizon, and i havent doen a hardware hack" :D :D Nov 23 05:10:35 ya i kno thats what i mean its not in any of the lists (all) (pixi) (pre) etc.... Nov 23 05:10:59 oneloveaz: look in the Preware Homebrew Documentation app for starter instructions. Nov 23 05:11:12 oneloveaz: unless it's a Pre 2. Nov 23 05:11:19 rsanchez1: you need to break the stock bootloader and rewrite it in hardware, I think Nov 23 05:11:25 its a pre plus... Nov 23 05:11:37 SineOt: what are you talking about? Nov 23 05:11:46 androiding your iphone Nov 23 05:11:50 SineOt: oh, sorry, overlapping conversations Nov 23 05:11:53 the openiboot stuff to boot android 2.2 on an iphone Nov 23 05:12:03 oneloveaz: look in that app then for instructions. Nov 23 05:12:20 what a sad thing when an iPhone can run 2.2, and stuff like the Hero will never see it ;p Nov 23 05:12:25 I have a friend who develops android apps, tried that on an iphone and android itself is extremely buggy, but his app worked surprisingly well Nov 23 05:12:45 and i have homebrew and installed novacom or whatever and instaslled a few lil changes battery % and etc but i cant find preware Nov 23 05:13:04 SineOt: well maybe not from OTA updates, but if you can hack 2.2 onto an iphone, hacking it onto an android phone has to be possible Nov 23 05:13:44 oneloveaz, try the Preware Homebrew Documentation app unless you are on a Pre 2, you support rwhitby and get good instructions Nov 23 05:14:34 ok i will try Nov 23 05:15:33 oneloveaz, it is in the official app catalog Nov 23 05:16:02 i have it jus havin trouble finding preware app to get on my phone Nov 23 05:17:17 oneloveaz: so you installed the change batter % and etc using webos quick install instead of preware? Nov 23 05:17:57 ya i didnt kno got excited and jus used quick install Nov 23 05:19:17 well, if it's not showing up on quick install, I would try installing it using a command line on device Nov 23 05:19:51 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Preware#Installing_Preware_from_the_Commandline Nov 23 05:20:52 are the patrches i alrerady installed gonna b ok.. can i try and install preware and then use that from then on.. Nov 23 05:21:43 they should be ok, but if they don't show up on preware after you install it I would remove them and reinstall using preware Nov 23 05:22:00 not really sure though, I always install over command line Nov 23 05:27:34 cd /tmp Nov 23 05:27:46 wget http Nov 23 05:28:01 destinal: yeah, I hadn't given app development much thought till there was the coupon, lol. Nov 23 05:28:19 I'll probably write something one of these days... Nov 23 05:28:21 all that do i type in one line or hit enter after each set Nov 23 05:28:38 hit enter after each Nov 23 05:28:59 ashi_todd: it's much easier if you already have a web app Nov 23 05:29:12 much easier still if it relies heavily or exclusively on canvas Nov 23 05:29:17 ah Nov 23 05:29:22 except for a few canvas gotchas Nov 23 05:29:30 rsanchez1: it's okay... i bought one w/o the discount, should arrive tuesday the 30th :) Nov 23 05:29:30 like gradients and getImageData Nov 23 05:29:35 that website link if u look at it it has # lines to type in.. do i type all of it and hit enter or enter after each line Nov 23 05:30:00 3 lines* Nov 23 05:30:11 ashi_todd: or if you're more a low-level c/c++ person, you could always write an SDL app Nov 23 05:30:28 do cd /tmp press enter, then wget http://bit.ly/preware-bootstrap press enter, then sh preware-bootstrap, press enter Nov 23 05:30:38 destinal: i'm more of a bash person, heh. Nov 23 05:30:42 * phil_bw avoids SDL, OpenGL is far more universal :) Nov 23 05:31:03 phil_bw: OpenGL-es is far from universal IMO Nov 23 05:31:20 yeah yeah, ES, you know what I meant :P Nov 23 05:32:01 OpenGL is universal on desktops and -ES for mobile but SDL should work on both (still I think most people use opengl-es for pre apps as well as iphone) Nov 23 05:32:22 yeah, SDL is quite universal on the desktop but not on mobile Nov 23 05:32:32 it's pretty sketchy on both iPhone and Android Nov 23 05:32:46 whereas OpenGL ES 1.1 is included on all three Nov 23 05:33:18 SineOt, is there an update preware+theme? Nov 23 05:34:11 (plus a little perl and python) hmmm i'll have to poke around... Nov 23 05:34:15 in other news, it's going to be bloody cold here in Oregon tomorrow... Nov 23 05:34:46 it might be in the mid 80's in Florida :D Nov 23 05:34:55 of course Nov 23 05:34:59 scoutcamper: just what I have done. You can have the ipk if you want. Nov 23 05:35:26 There's more I want to change but I wanted to bug oil about how likely external theme loading would be, or if he'd actually approve them to get bundled in Preware proper Nov 23 05:35:36 oh, rwhitby: I'm making some Preware themes :p Nov 23 05:37:00 rwhitby: including one with an animated rainbow background and flying mojo widgets :Q Nov 23 05:37:08 double rainbow? Nov 23 05:37:56 rwhitby: my thoughts exactly :) Nov 23 05:37:58 SineOt, link? Nov 23 05:38:17 scoutcamper: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/469264/PrewareThemes/org.webosinternals.preware_1.4.5_all.ipk this is the current state of it, I'll probably work more on it tomorrow Nov 23 05:39:30 rsanchez1.. does it take a while i entered the first two then it wrote a few lines then i entered the last line and its been sayin plz wait for a bit Nov 23 05:40:13 it shouldn't take too long after wget unless you have a slow connection, and sh preware-bootstrap probably shouldn't take that long either Nov 23 05:40:18 what phone are you installing this on again? Nov 23 05:40:33 palm pre plus for verizon Nov 23 05:41:04 its not doin anything... Nov 23 05:41:36 amd connection is fine Nov 23 05:44:25 which part is not doing anything? Nov 23 05:44:55 what version of webOS is installed on the phone, and what version of WOSQI are you using on what version of which host OS ? Nov 23 05:45:02 (why does no-one ask those questions first?) Nov 23 05:45:17 rwhitby, oil this is my latest revision http://twitpic.com/399cav Nov 23 05:45:24 rwhitby: forgot? Nov 23 05:45:29 sh preware-bootstrap i entered that and its jus sayin please wait Nov 23 05:45:40 what version of webOs? Nov 23 05:45:48 webOS Nov 23 05:45:52 oil, rwhitby i changed my scrim as well, wishing for it Nov 23 05:46:00 night Nov 23 05:46:29 1.4.5 web os Nov 23 05:46:49 oneloveaz: answer all of my question please Nov 23 05:46:55 oneloveaz: what version of webOS is installed on the phone, and what version of WOSQI are you using on what version of which host OS ? Nov 23 05:47:30 oneloveaz: BTW, you should always give that information as the very first thing, whenever you ask any question. Nov 23 05:48:36 i dont kno how to find the version of wosqi or which version of what host os????? sry. im kinda lost all a lil above my head. again sorry. Nov 23 05:49:00 host os = your computer's OS Nov 23 05:49:18 examples: OS X 10.5, Ubuntu 10.10, windows xp Nov 23 05:49:19 * phil_bw starts to wander off but falls asleep first Nov 23 05:49:27 are you on windows, mac, ubuntu? Nov 23 05:49:41 oh sorry windows vista Nov 23 05:49:49 oneloveaz: you should really follow the instructions in the Preware Homebrew Documentation app Nov 23 05:51:51 whatever dick i was jus askin for help Nov 23 05:52:40 oneloveaz, no need to be rude, he is just making a suggestion Nov 23 05:54:06 it was a condesending suggestion i read thru that part in the app and the files dont show up in the quick install Nov 23 05:54:33 oneloveaz: you still haven't given the version numbers requested Nov 23 05:54:58 then install the SDK and use palm-install and download the preware ipk from ipkg.preware.org Nov 23 05:55:07 lol Nov 23 05:55:09 ok .. Nov 23 05:55:12 that was wierd Nov 23 05:55:27 but slightly amusing Nov 23 05:55:42 amusing? it made my eyes gloss over :( Nov 23 05:55:46 true Nov 23 05:56:04 lol, is oneloveaz=WEBOSSUCKS Nov 23 05:56:05 ? Nov 23 05:56:05 well... it was amusing for me. and thats what matters Nov 23 05:56:55 lol idk why downloading over command line didn't work for him Nov 23 05:57:02 abusing the author of the tool you're trying to install is not a good problem solving technique ... Nov 23 05:57:20 I walked him through it and everything, telling him where to press enter Nov 23 05:57:32 he'll probably go and leave a one star review now :) Nov 23 05:57:40 I was getting ready to say " your calling the main internals guy a dick. see how far that gets you" Nov 23 05:57:43 oh he left Nov 23 05:57:44 ll Nov 23 05:58:03 i was about to comment about being unnecessarily bogus despite his behavior :) Nov 23 05:58:21 rwhitby: lol yeah your thought "Abusing... technique" was my thought exactly :) Nov 23 05:58:51 i'm still curious why WOQI didn't have preware in it? Nov 23 05:58:54 lol Nov 23 06:00:05 lol Nov 23 06:00:13 he was making fake issues im sure Nov 23 06:01:35 dtzWill: my guess is an old version of webOS or WOSQI Nov 23 06:01:44 has nothing better to do than to go into an irc room and make fake issues? Nov 23 06:02:02 lol fake issues. i wasn't saying that at all as much as it just seemed... odd. Nov 23 06:02:12 he did mention webOS 1.4.5 on a verizon pre plus though Nov 23 06:02:22 rwhitby: okay. i didn't know there was a version of WOSQI that couldn't install preware, but i'm sure it could be all kinds of things... Nov 23 06:02:49 didn't know how to get version of WOSQI Nov 23 06:02:50 dtzWill: any webOS version < 1.3.5 and any WOSQI version less than 3.1 (I think) will fail Nov 23 06:02:59 ah okay. interesting Nov 23 06:04:06 ruhroh Nov 23 06:06:25 ? Nov 23 06:08:05 oh I just remembered an odd problem I was having with a hybrid app earlier today Nov 23 06:08:19 oneloveaz: welcome back Nov 23 06:08:28 I tried to call a method on the object for the exe, but it always told me the object didn't have that method Nov 23 06:08:38 someone still has a pre 1.3.5 pre somewhere? Nov 23 06:08:45 even though I registered it in the plugin main function Nov 23 06:08:56 wondering if anyone knew what might cause that... Nov 23 06:09:41 oneloveaz, still having the same issue? Nov 23 06:09:44 destinal: some people doctor to 1.3.1 for illegal reasons Nov 23 06:09:54 dundunDUN Nov 23 06:10:15 in fact, some people doctor to 1.1.3 for another dubious reason Nov 23 06:10:51 rwhitby: binaries that got removed at various points down the line? Nov 23 06:11:19 yea... i read thru the doc. in the homebrew app on how to install preware and i cannont find it in quick install and command line wasnt workin probably user error lol but i dunno Nov 23 06:11:47 oneloveaz, what webos version number? 1.4.5? Nov 23 06:11:56 what webos quick install version? Nov 23 06:11:57 oneloveaz: again, what version of WebOS Quick Install? Nov 23 06:12:13 help > about Nov 23 06:13:07 the latest i jus did it 3 day ago and ues webos 1.4.5 Nov 23 06:13:18 on the menu, click help then about Nov 23 06:13:32 then give us version number that pops up Nov 23 06:14:13 "the latest" is never a valid response to "which version", cause there are some people that still think that the latest version of Preware is 0.9.6, simply because they personally have not noticed a later version. Nov 23 06:14:18 3.14 Nov 23 06:14:48 ok, WOSQI 3.14 on Vista connecting to webOS 1.4.5 - correct? Nov 23 06:14:49 * halfhalo uses webos 1 Nov 23 06:15:06 * scoutcamper uses webos the latest one Nov 23 06:15:36 ya i got it i tried looking on precentral.net and then saved it... Nov 23 06:16:10 scoutcamper: 2.0.1? Nov 23 06:16:28 yeah, 2.0.1 is the latest public version Nov 23 06:16:58 scoutcamper uses the one that's gonna ship on the palm pad :D Nov 23 06:17:33 rsanchez1, what makes you say that? Nov 23 06:17:38 jk... Nov 23 06:19:58 oneloveaz: can you access ipkg.preware.org on your vista computer? Nov 23 06:23:01 tes Nov 23 06:23:09 *yes Nov 23 06:24:03 it says index of "... "and "feeds" Nov 23 06:25:11 but wosqi can't see the feeds? Nov 23 06:26:22 maybe he needs to make a firewall exception for wosqi? Nov 23 06:27:24 is there a service you can poll directly for accelerometer information or is it only events in mojo? Nov 23 06:28:14 do i do something with this index of all the feeds...| Nov 23 06:30:16 oneloveaz: is there a reason why you don't answer the questions I ask? Nov 23 06:32:10 u asked if i could go to the link ipkgpreware... on my comp right? wosqi? whats that Nov 23 06:32:26 wosqi=webosquickinstall Nov 23 06:32:30 webos quick install, the app you're using to try to do all this Nov 23 06:32:58 does the list of apps in the feeds in wosqi match what you see directly on ipkg.preware.org ? Nov 23 06:33:49 do you see none, or lots, or what? give us some more information, remember you are the one who is asking for help, and everyone here is spending their spare time to help you at no cost, so don't make it harder for us to help than it has to be. give more information, not less. Nov 23 06:34:14 (and don't go around calling people dicks either) Nov 23 06:35:43 im trying ass its not like im purposely not giving u the info.. remember u are the expert and have a better understanding of this we are the one asking for help if i knewwhat i was doping i would b here. Nov 23 06:36:14 well dont b a cocksucker then and i wont Nov 23 06:36:25 oneloveaz: you do realize that rwhitby wrote most of these tools right Nov 23 06:36:27 ka6sox-work ping Nov 23 06:36:35 ka6sox- ping Nov 23 06:37:14 y is he a ass then? im trying u think i wanna make this hard???!!! Nov 23 06:37:23 hahaha Nov 23 06:37:29 take that Nov 23 06:37:41 * halfhalo hugs the channel Nov 23 06:38:11 if you were calling me a cocksucker, gee, I'd probably act like an ass too :p Nov 23 06:38:24 * halfhalo would get homicidal Nov 23 06:38:45 * scoutcamper would just use operator priveleges and ban him Nov 23 06:38:54 THATS TAKING THE EASY WAY OUT Nov 23 06:39:28 and whats the issue with that Nov 23 06:39:34 Nothing Nov 23 06:39:36 it's not as much fun? Nov 23 06:39:42 scoutcamper: turns people in martyrs Nov 23 06:39:57 into, rather Nov 23 06:40:10 so, anyone else with wosqi on vista who can confirm whether preware is in the feed in wosqi? Nov 23 06:40:15 haha, if you're running around throwing insults, who would you be a martyr for? Nov 23 06:40:30 rwhitby: I can check via win7 if needed Nov 23 06:40:35 please Nov 23 06:40:50 i have wosqi on win 7 and it works fine, and in vista compatability mode Nov 23 06:40:53 rsanchez1: generally the throwing insults part gets left off when you're going around martyring Nov 23 06:40:53 * halfhalo throws shoe at desktop to turn on it Nov 23 06:41:08 you know, inconvenient and all ;p Nov 23 06:41:22 lol rwhitby: I thought you were gonna say "so anyone else with wosqi on vista who WANTS TO BE BANNED?" Nov 23 06:41:23 haha Nov 23 06:41:43 well, i found it amusing anyway. Nov 23 06:41:47 dtzWill, lol! Nov 23 06:42:00 generally if you don't have enough respect for people to insult them you won't get a big enough group that you will actually be a martyr for Nov 23 06:42:10 but rwhitby isnt that mean Nov 23 06:42:17 * halfhalo is waiting for wosqi to download the doctor Nov 23 06:42:19 hey, might be the jet lag? Nov 23 06:42:22 lol jk Nov 23 06:42:58 jetlag=anrgy rwhitby ? Nov 23 06:43:11 is thats true rwhitby isnt allowed to travel anymore Nov 23 06:43:15 lol, :D Nov 23 06:43:34 haven't you been grump when you've had to travel across the pacific and then across the U.S.? Nov 23 06:43:40 happens to me every single time Nov 23 06:43:53 in all my travels between NYC and Beijing Nov 23 06:44:09 lol, im grumpy when i go from Cali to new yourk, so, yeah Nov 23 06:44:20 * rwhitby wonders who is grumpy Nov 23 06:44:35 That guy is in AZ Nov 23 06:44:41 ROAD TRIP! Nov 23 06:44:44 * rsanchez1 obviously doesn't go from beijing to NYC on a regular basis Nov 23 06:44:52 * scoutcamper points at rsanchez1 for insinuating that rwhitby is grumpy Nov 23 06:45:41 * rsanchez1 only said jet lag might be responsible for *something*, scoutcamper said jetlag = angry rwhitby Nov 23 06:45:54 * rwhitby also notes that if the person with the problem had actually read the info in PHD, it clearly points to the WOSQI forum thread for help on windows Nov 23 06:46:13 rsanchez1: I think you were suggesting that he might have been slow on the banhammer because he was jet lagged :) Nov 23 06:46:23 yeah that's it Nov 23 06:46:38 if it was rwhitby at 100% that guy would've been sent packing the first time Nov 23 06:46:38 lol Nov 23 06:47:06 actually rod's way too nice.. most of us here give people more chances than they deserve.. Nov 23 06:47:14 crap,, I accidentally closed the doctor download window and now its taking a really long time the second download Nov 23 06:47:20 * halfhalo is the opposite Nov 23 06:47:52 wich is why halfhalo doesnt get the banhammer Nov 23 06:48:02 being way to nice is what gets people to think you're nice :p Nov 23 06:48:03 destinal: I have to be nice now, a single one star review might drop me below angry birds :) Nov 23 06:48:17 rwhitby: hehe Nov 23 06:48:27 ... although you still end up with people calling you a tyrannical dictator Nov 23 06:48:35 No, I don't get the banhammer because I would ban *!@*.* Nov 23 06:48:36 hmm, I haven't reviewed angry birds yet... Nov 23 06:48:46 rhitby is our steve jobs? Nov 23 06:49:02 * rwhitby has no black turtlenecks Nov 23 06:49:12 * halfhalo sends him some Nov 23 06:49:13 this is halfhalo http://media.photobucket.com/image/no%20ban%20hammer%20for%20you/Menace73/I%2520CAN%2520HAZ/BanHammer.jpg Nov 23 06:49:16 does rwhitby carry ninja stars into airports? Nov 23 06:51:48 preware shows up Nov 23 07:04:58 night all Nov 23 08:17:15 Rick_work hey, did you talk to him? Nov 23 08:19:40 hotdp: did I meet you at dev day? Nov 23 08:19:55 * rwhitby doesn't remember anyone with hotdp on badge Nov 23 08:22:58 hey rwong Nov 23 08:23:01 ups rwhitby Nov 23 08:23:22 Yes but i did not give you my nick Nov 23 08:24:01 :/ I have made the conversion (getting a german comm board) in my Pre 2 from Dev Day Nov 23 08:24:17 Don't know if you talked to Rick ? Nov 23 08:25:23 * hotdp did not get the irc nick on the badge. Nov 23 08:27:38 * oil is wondering which face goes with the name hotdp now also Nov 23 08:28:06 * hotdp will tell you when the pictures from devday is live Nov 23 08:29:11 * hotdp think he knows what the paid apps are locked to and it is not the device but the comm board.. Nov 23 08:31:19 hotdp: ah, while I was standing at the laptop doing the comms board swaps waiting for the doctored device to boot? Nov 23 08:31:49 yes, paid apps are based on the device record, which is created from comms board info on first activation Nov 23 08:31:51 I was close to you at the swap yes Nov 23 08:32:41 lol Nov 23 08:32:58 My problem is this, i toke the comm board from a german device that i activated in Denmark (wich means i had no paid apps) but it into the Pre 2 and now this one has no paid apps :( Nov 23 08:33:06 hotdp: Rick_work was giving you incorrect information while I was on the plane Nov 23 08:33:18 yes, you will be accessing the same catalog Nov 23 08:33:27 there is no known way to get apps on that comms board Nov 23 08:33:42 hotdp: http://www.flickr.com/groups/1522884@N25/pool/ Nov 23 08:33:46 you in there? Nov 23 08:35:52 Oki. So if i find a german board with paid apps there is no problem? Nov 23 08:35:57 * hotdp looking at pictures Nov 23 08:36:41 * hotdp is not there.. Nov 23 08:38:53 * hotdp would like not to open he's beloved palm pre 2 againg for another com board switch Nov 23 08:41:01 hotdp: yes, german board with paid apps will link with your profile Nov 23 08:41:57 how long away do you think a paid app fix will be? think i heard something about you working on something? Nov 23 08:42:35 not me Nov 23 08:42:39 it's server side Nov 23 08:43:27 ok when i talked to you, you said you gonna do it to your own, have you had the time? Nov 23 08:44:39 my spare EU gsm card is no paid apps Nov 23 08:45:06 and I'm not going to make Pre 2 my production device just yet, until we get all the stuff I use ported Nov 23 08:45:13 I see Nov 23 08:45:17 and I have a UK Pre 2 on the way ;) Nov 23 08:45:20 * hotdp understands Nov 23 08:45:37 the one from swisstomcat? Nov 23 08:46:18 yes Nov 23 08:46:24 it will be my production device Nov 23 08:46:33 my current Pre 2 will be dev Pre 2 Nov 23 08:47:09 i see Nov 23 08:47:50 Do you think the slider takes any damage for each time you open the pre? Nov 23 08:49:07 slider? no. Nov 23 08:49:22 * hotdp is looking forward to the "global catalog Palm" talked about, but the "working on it" does not sound as soon Nov 23 08:49:59 heyho Nov 23 08:53:34 Do you guys know what db the "text assistiant" uses? I would like to add ALOT of danish words and dont loose them on doctor.. Nov 23 08:55:08 hotdp: we should add that to save/restore Nov 23 08:55:17 hey guys, quick question Nov 23 08:55:42 does someone know how can i creeat Nov 23 08:56:12 does someone know how can i create my own feeds server for my app? Nov 23 08:56:32 rwhitby do you think there is a sql file that i can change/open as i did when i should fix the carrier? Nov 23 08:57:01 hotdp: it's in /var/palm/data/smartkey/XT9/user_db.bin Nov 23 08:57:12 some binary format Nov 23 08:57:18 but easy to save/restore Nov 23 08:57:53 and you can key it off the text assistant appid Nov 23 08:58:05 hotdp: have you written any save/restore scripts before? Nov 23 08:59:20 anyone? please help, is there a turorial or any steps i should go throug to setting up my server? Nov 23 08:59:26 rwhitby: not at all when i changed the carrier settings i opend a db file in sql and i know sql. the binary thing i don't know anything about. Would like to add words in another way then on the phone, its very slow. Alot of danish words :D Nov 23 09:02:35 * hotdp is a little disapointed about not putting he's nick on he's badge at Dev Day.. Nov 23 09:04:31 oil, like your boom patch :P Nov 23 09:07:34 anyone? Nov 23 09:16:22 mandaman2k: ipkg.preware.org Nov 23 09:16:26 they are just files Nov 23 09:16:52 and the scripts we use to create them are on git.webos-internals.org in the preware/build.git repo Nov 23 09:20:03 rwhitby: thanks a lot, so all i got to do is put my files on the folder and run the script? by the way thanks for your hard work on the webos dev day Nov 23 09:23:52 mandaman2k: the makefiles in build.git show what to do Nov 23 09:24:57 rwhitby: jejeje, yep, just reading on that Nov 23 09:24:57 rwhitby: did you see my answer? Nov 23 09:25:57 hotdp: i don't know the format of the binary file to add things directly. Nov 23 09:26:32 Oki, i have to investigate that then, i will tell you if i find out Nov 23 09:27:09 And thanks for comming to Dev Day :) you did a good job Nov 23 09:30:39 wow this looks harder than i thought, jejeje Nov 23 09:47:23 I had read an article on the frankenstien 2.0, could someone point me to where it continued its testings? Nov 23 09:48:06 * hotdp Palm Support was not much help Nov 23 09:48:19 lol Nov 23 10:00:15 rwhitby: i will try to ask what the format is on the forum, there must be alot of people missing a tool lige that Nov 23 10:03:00 Was there any success with the frankendoctor? Nov 23 10:04:18 Reason I'm asking is that I might have an extra device to test with. Nov 23 10:09:16 xbonesx: which frankendoctor? Pre or Pre 2 ? Nov 23 10:09:59 webos 2.0 for older devices? Nov 23 10:10:17 stopped waiting for kernel source Nov 23 10:10:41 ah. Nov 23 10:11:09 Was worth a shot right? Nov 23 10:20:15 rwhitby is the jetlag bad? Nov 23 10:20:20 hotdp: not yet Nov 23 10:20:44 Are you at work? Nov 23 10:20:56 xbonesx: the learning from FrankenDoctor for Pre enabled the reverse-half-Frankendoctor for Pre 2 Nov 23 10:21:02 hotdp: tomorrow Nov 23 10:24:34 don't you think that it will be possible to take a whole danish dictionary and add it as binary when we know the format? Nov 23 11:36:05 hello. just to say that I succed to flashed my pre 2 this morning under XP Nov 23 11:36:38 I had to extract novacom from the .jar and install Nov 23 11:36:41 it Nov 23 11:40:28 GarthPS: that's what I've been saying for over a week now ... Nov 23 11:40:39 rwhitby: :) Nov 23 11:41:02 did you miss the twenty and posts on the subject? Nov 23 11:41:10 rwhitby: before I did not have a windows pc on hand :p Nov 23 11:41:20 ah, ok. Nov 23 11:41:27 rwhitby: yop I think+ linux there so Nov 23 11:42:07 rwhitby: and it seems that the .jar does not includ linux novacom driver (at all or updtaed for pre 2) as it does not detect it under linux Nov 23 11:42:47 yes, I tweeted about that last week to. Nov 23 11:43:28 rwhitby: so for you it is missing linux driver complitely or just un updated one ? Nov 23 11:43:29 you may want to follow the RES feed of @webosinternals ... Nov 23 11:43:45 rwhitby: I subscribded it yesterday :) Nov 23 11:43:49 my doctor is the same as yours Nov 23 11:44:36 there are no linux drivers for Pre 2 publicly available from Palm at this time Nov 23 11:44:52 rwhitby: ah ok ... :/ Nov 23 11:45:36 rwhitby: rss or atom because rss on is "unable to refresh" here Nov 23 11:46:02 oh atom as long as rss to refresh... Nov 23 11:46:19 Whatever Twitter provides. Nov 23 11:46:43 rwhitby: do you know what are the differencies between ueu version and ueu_una one ? Nov 23 11:48:03 use the latter Nov 23 11:48:26 difference is in the doctor wrapper only - identical on device Nov 23 11:49:52 rwhitby: in the doctor wrapped only ? can you detail please ? Nov 23 11:50:18 s/wrapped/wrapper Nov 23 11:50:34 jar/resources/recoverytool.config file, ApprovalMikeHash Nov 23 11:50:51 determines compatible models Nov 23 11:51:49 rwhitby: that's realy all ?? Nov 23 11:51:55 yes Nov 23 11:52:07 that is precisely the only difference Nov 23 11:54:59 rwhitby: ok thank you for this info. I just flashed my pre 2 with the first one half an hour ago. I does not worth it to reflash with the last one right ? Nov 23 11:55:16 correc Nov 23 11:55:18 t Nov 23 11:55:29 you would get an identical result Nov 23 11:59:49 rwhitby: ok thx again! so you are a linux user or windows user (or mac?) ( to know if I can ask you some question about novacom for linux) Nov 23 12:04:12 GarthPS: I use an OSX laptop with Linux and windows running in virtual machines when required. Nov 23 12:04:47 You can use precom-progs from git.webos-internals.org to communicate with novacomd on the device from Linux. Nov 23 12:06:18 * rwhitby bbt Nov 23 12:17:29 rwhitby: :D ok. yep I already used precom-progs' novacom. but I heard that it is not complet as novacom from palm. like get/send Nov 23 13:24:45 Heyho @ all Nov 23 13:58:14 cu Nov 23 14:23:17 is there a way to run the meta-doctor on windows (without emulation)? Nov 23 15:47:43 Ice8lue You still here? Nov 23 17:01:46 hey guys Nov 23 17:01:55 hi Nov 23 17:02:03 i am trying to solve the Verizon GPS issues Nov 23 17:02:06 hola Nov 23 17:02:21 sk4jc there's a patch for that. Nov 23 17:02:30 i submitted a patch but it was denied Nov 23 17:02:40 there is ALREADY a patch for that. Nov 23 17:02:42 yeah but it doesn't work Nov 23 17:02:45 oh Nov 23 17:02:51 ok, why was yours denied? Nov 23 17:02:51 this one might Nov 23 17:03:23 Testing 1.4.5: /usr/bin/patch -p1 --dry-run --no-backup-if-mismatch -d ../../../patches/rootfs/v1.4.5/ < /tmp/tmp.patch 2 Nov 23 17:04:01 I updated it and used the unidiff tool Nov 23 17:04:06 just not sure what that ment Nov 23 17:04:21 meant Nov 23 17:06:19 does your patch have an answer for what to do if there is no match? Nov 23 17:06:57 I just used a tool Nov 23 17:07:02 its the hosts file Nov 23 17:07:08 there should always be a match Nov 23 17:12:58 patch process requires a What if.... Nov 23 17:13:47 morning Nov 23 17:13:48 ok, how would i find out how to add this in Nov 23 17:17:38 not sure. There ought to be a howto somewhere. Oil? Destinal? DBSooner? Someone? Nov 23 17:18:12 i posted the patch at precentral and it appears to be getting good results for verizon users Nov 23 17:19:01 howto of what/ Nov 23 17:19:52 my patch failed submission because no backup if mismatch Nov 23 17:19:52 he's submitted a patch to the portal and go this back Testing 1.4.5: /usr/bin/patch -p1 --dry-run --no-backup-if-mismatch -d ../../../patches/rootfs/v1.4.5/ < /tmp/tmp.patch 2 Nov 23 17:20:57 that's not an error... Nov 23 17:21:27 and what does "got this back" mean? email? on the site? are you using http://patches.webos-internals.org Nov 23 17:22:25 here is the email i got back http://pastie.org/1320549 Nov 23 17:24:02 well that's a terrible lack of information email, we'll need to fix that Nov 23 17:24:19 ok so its not just me Nov 23 17:24:28 what's the patch name? Nov 23 17:24:34 did you resubmit it? Nov 23 17:24:38 Verizon aGPS Blocker Nov 23 17:24:39 yes Nov 23 17:25:43 not sure why it was rejected but it tests fine for me Nov 23 17:26:09 also, are there any utilities available to monitor outgoing IP address calls? Nov 23 17:26:32 I would like to find out if I am blocking the right IPs to verizon's aGPS server Nov 23 17:28:54 ip like in internet protocol? netstat? Nov 23 17:29:55 sk4jc: patch accepted, should be in preware within 20 minutes Nov 23 17:30:01 yes internet protocol Nov 23 17:30:10 egaudet_work: Thanks!! Nov 23 17:30:13 or so.. Nov 23 17:30:45 * halfhalo gets popcorn to watch autobuilder grind to a halt Nov 23 17:31:07 so would netstat monitor this? so if I had someone launch this and then VZNav it might tell me what IPs are being called? Nov 23 17:33:24 sk4jc: netstat is capable of monitoring internet connections, you can see them some time after they have been created. for some real analysis you'll need something like tcpdump. Nov 23 17:33:46 so, if you novaterm in you can run netstat Nov 23 17:34:17 i will look into this. looks like tcpdump is not installed on the pre Nov 23 17:34:20 netstat -at if its tcp Nov 23 17:34:27 yeah, thats why I first stated netstat Nov 23 17:35:11 bsm: thanks, i will check this out Nov 23 17:35:18 is tcpdump in optware? Nov 23 17:35:20 interesting, palm released the webos 2.0 source packages and no freaky hacking? I think I'll donate some money to webosi Nov 23 17:35:31 I got tcpdump.. somewhere, maybe from optware Nov 23 17:38:05 bsm: is that in preware? Nov 23 17:38:21 sk4jc, optware most likely Nov 23 17:39:18 optware bootstrap? Nov 23 17:39:22 i have that installed Nov 23 17:39:44 bsm: they released it very recently... Nov 23 17:40:07 it ought to be in the optware feed in preware. tcpdump 4.0.0-1 Nov 23 17:40:09 (and some of us have day jobs) Nov 23 17:49:09 OSP="http://opensource.palm.com"; for VER in `curl $OSP/packages.html | grep underline packages.html|sed 's/.*href..//;s/\/.*//'`; do curl $OSP/$VER/| grep cdnet|sed 's/.*">//;s/<.*//'|sort > $VER; done #gets all the lists Nov 23 17:49:37 diff -u 1.4.5 2.0.0 is interesting Nov 23 17:50:37 u-boot? Nov 23 17:50:59 qt, of course Nov 23 17:54:51 http://pastebin.com/pWWzUkqs (diff -u 1.4.5 2.0.0) Nov 23 17:59:07 OSP="http://opensource.palm.com"; for VER in `curl $OSP/packages.html | grep underline | sed 's/.*href..//;s/\/.*//'`; do curl $OSP/$VER/| grep cdnet|sed 's/.*">//;s/<.*//'| sort > $VER; done # fixed :) Nov 23 17:59:59 destinal: yeah i encoutered that. appreciate getting it most of the way there anyway :) Nov 23 18:01:02 destinal: slackware or just like 'darkstar'? :) Nov 23 18:02:06 dtzWill: liked the name (and it fits the look of my desktop) I had forgotten about the old slackware default until you mentioned it :) Nov 23 18:02:39 haha :) kk. Nov 23 18:06:02 grr I can't ssh again to my pre2 (using openssh with authorized_keys in /home/root/.ssh/) Nov 23 18:06:14 Permission denied (publickey,keyboard-interactive). Nov 23 18:06:33 GarthPS: permissions on .ssh and the authorized_keys files? Nov 23 18:06:45 cairo and cjson went away (are there no more pure c services to use it?), lots of version updates, not sure what goodfork is. new purple service, all the java stuff gone of course, LVM's there now with patches? Nov 23 18:07:47 new purple service? Does it have more interesting stuff in it? Nov 23 18:08:31 dtzWill: http://pastebin.com/EbZasT0y Nov 23 18:09:10 what's # sgxddk.tgz ? powervr stuff? Nov 23 18:09:12 GarthPS: chmod -R 600 /home/root.ssh Nov 23 18:09:33 err Nov 23 18:09:40 chmod -R 600 /home/root/.ssh Nov 23 18:09:48 GarthPS: ssh won't use keys that can be modified by other users Nov 23 18:12:34 dtzWill: yeah!! thx! I 've forgot that.. :) Nov 23 18:12:53 no worries, it bites you enough that it's now the first thing I check when pubkey fails :) Nov 23 18:13:04 probably before checking that i put the right key there haha Nov 23 18:13:16 since generally i'm already on top of /that/ :) Nov 23 18:13:18 anyway welcome :) Nov 23 18:14:11 dtzWill: so I wonder if we can get this beast called 2.0 running on pre with the new kernel source.. have you looked at it yet? Is powervr stuff there or in the sgxddk so we can get the proper pvr modules working now? Nov 23 18:15:35 destinal: not sure. certainly sounds compelling, and that was my thought as well. unfortunately i'm presently sick and busting my ass to be able to carve out a few days during thanksgiving to NOT work and be with fam :) Nov 23 18:15:53 i'm not sure exactly what role sgxddk is, but it's gotta be better than not having it. Nov 23 18:16:13 dtzWill: lol Nov 23 18:16:15 dtzWill: I'll try to play with it tonight, back to day job for now, alas Nov 23 18:16:34 hy Nov 23 18:17:09 destinal: sounds good. i should be around if nothing else :). gl at work :) Nov 23 18:17:43 dtzWill: just to be sur. no one can ssh to my pre if he does not have my private key plus my pwd right ? (because the sshd-config file is not like what I am used to) Nov 23 18:17:44 hello Nov 23 18:18:05 dtzWill: do we have documentation anywhere on developing and testing pre kernels or is it basically standard linux practices, then just novacom boot mem to try it? Nov 23 18:18:34 GarthPS: I'm pretty sure we only allow passwordless logins (password for your key is different) Nov 23 18:18:42 GarthPS: so yeah you should be safe :) Nov 23 18:18:51 I've got a question: if I want to use curl in my pdk app and compile it using the widk, I'll need a libcurl.so for armv7, right? Nov 23 18:19:05 GarthPS: one or the other, but the passphrase encrypts the key if your using one Nov 23 18:19:34 rsanchez1: already on the device. Nov 23 18:19:52 the problem I'm having is at the linking stage Nov 23 18:19:58 destinal: I'd try just booting it (and putting modules somewhere useful). I don't offhand know of other sticking points but if you get stuck i'm sure the kernel hackers can give you info :) Nov 23 18:20:03 -lcurl tells me it can't find curl Nov 23 18:20:16 I'm assuming that's how you would link to it Nov 23 18:20:20 rsanchez1: you could copy libs over from your doctor or device to your sb2 staging area Nov 23 18:20:35 ok I'll try that Nov 23 18:22:03 hmm it looks like the directory where it's finding the libraries already has a libcurl.so.4 file Nov 23 18:22:24 then it probably needs a symlink Nov 23 18:22:38 rsanchez1: could be yourlinker arguments are wrong and it's not finding it Nov 23 18:23:33 here's the command I'm using to compile: Nov 23 18:23:34 g++ -Wl,--allow-shlib-undefined -o test1 test1.o -L/srv/preware/cross-compile/rootfs/armv7/usr/lib -lpdl -lSDL -lcurl Nov 23 18:24:07 * dtzWill seconds symlink idea Nov 23 18:24:18 is there a libcurl.so -> libcurl.so.4 link? Nov 23 18:24:39 nope, I'll try that Nov 23 18:25:49 that seems to have done it Nov 23 18:25:56 hooray Nov 23 18:26:02 thanks Nov 23 18:26:31 oh, one more quick question Nov 23 18:26:45 rsanchez1: that inside the sb2 shell? Nov 23 18:26:46 it's telling me that it can't find libcrypto and libz Nov 23 18:26:53 yes, inside sb2 shell Nov 23 18:27:05 but I'm only using it to download a file, so are those libraries needed? Nov 23 18:27:08 ok thx ghuys Nov 23 18:27:20 rsanchez1: should be just warnings right Nov 23 18:27:33 since you are using ignore shlib Nov 23 18:27:48 yep, the same old warnings in the palm docs, plus libcrypto and libz Nov 23 18:28:22 just wondering on those last two... Nov 23 18:28:55 yeah it's just because they are used by libcurl most likely Nov 23 18:37:10 I'm trying to call a plugin method from javascript, but it gives me an error that the plugin object doesn't have that method Nov 23 18:37:31 I registered the method on the plugin side: PDL_RegisterJSHandler("downloadFile", downloadFile); Nov 23 18:38:08 did you call the complete routine too, forget the name Nov 23 18:38:36 yes? Nov 23 18:38:58 I'm sorry I don't know what you mean by that Nov 23 18:39:15 There's another function you have to call after registering all your JS handlers Nov 23 18:39:26 I forget what the name is though Nov 23 18:39:30 PDL_JSRegistrationComplete(); Nov 23 18:39:32 that one? Nov 23 18:39:34 yeah Nov 23 18:40:04 try to sleep a couple seconds in javascript before calling it, there's a bit of a race there since the plugin starts in parallel Nov 23 18:40:06 then yeah I have it right aftter PDL_RegisterJSHandler Nov 23 18:41:05 check out wirc for example, there's code to check for the plugin to come "alive" before doing anything. Nov 23 18:41:30 is that in the file wircPlugin.js? Nov 23 18:41:37 I'm using wirc as my example Nov 23 18:42:20 not sure where it is these days, haven't touched wirc code in a while Nov 23 18:42:54 it looks like that's being handled in another file, wircPlugin has a isReady boolean, but it's only set to false Nov 23 18:45:04 server-list-scene Nov 23 18:45:31 check out tryPlugin() Nov 23 18:46:50 bbiab, lunch Nov 23 18:47:30 alright, thanks Nov 23 18:48:36 Rick_work: back online Nov 23 18:51:45 Nov 23 18:55:18 Ice8lue I forgot what you were asking about. Nov 23 18:56:10 i did ask if the meta doctor can be run on windows somehow, without the need of emilation Nov 23 19:00:25 if I do openlog and syslog in the plugin, those messages would show up along with Mojo.Log.info() messages right? Nov 23 19:02:50 Ice8lue: well, cygwin potentially which is not emulation but just loading up a unix environment in windows. I don't know if anyone's tested that though Nov 23 19:03:54 destinal: riiiight, didn't even think about cygwin. i was using virtual box + ubuntu but that's really ineffective Nov 23 19:04:24 Ice8lue: I haven't found it ineffective, a little slower though Nov 23 19:05:03 destinal: well, 90% of my time i'm working on my netbook. slow isn't a starting point to describe that^ Nov 23 19:05:14 heh, good point Nov 23 19:07:55 =) but it's a nice toy though Nov 23 19:07:57 I'd like to make an open source doctor equivalent that takes all the resources from doctor and does the same thing Nov 23 19:08:10 not possible? Nov 23 19:08:29 very possible, just a significant project. Nov 23 19:09:04 it would let you change configuration settings to do all the stuff metadoctor has to rebuild a doctor to let you do Nov 23 19:09:17 hm but what's the point you want to reach? building the metadoc functionality into the normal doc? Nov 23 19:09:24 ^ya Nov 23 19:10:13 no, a 3rd party program that just takes a doctor or its resources as input and talks to novacom, it would mean we could alter its behavior easily without having to patch java code and the resources Nov 23 19:10:27 and no rebuilding a jar needed Nov 23 19:10:29 i whish they had an option to enable wifi to activate your profile... Nov 23 19:10:53 they don't on purpose. It is a decision. Nov 23 19:11:13 that way you have to have an actual PHONE on an actual CARRIER to activate a profile. you can't do it from a PC. Nov 23 19:11:56 yes. but that would make it a lot easier (and much cheaper) for people like me, who dont have a data plan Nov 23 19:12:28 i had to pay about 30bucks last month for just activating the profile...thx vodafone -.- Nov 23 19:13:29 ouch Nov 23 19:13:55 really the simplest way to start with the program is just build a customizer that lets you boot the installer image like the doctor does and apply modifications and patches before you even boot the device Nov 23 19:13:57 evening Nov 23 19:14:13 hey swisstomcat Nov 23 19:14:17 hey Nov 23 19:14:37 you could do the skip first use thing so that people can activate their wifi and then run first use, for instance Nov 23 19:14:56 turn on dev mode and other things also before ever booting Nov 23 19:15:45 also if you have a new device sitting at first use you wouldn't have to metadoctor and redoctor to get in Nov 23 19:15:48 ya that would be helpful Nov 23 19:17:18 it could probably use something like the webosqi model and call the doctor classes to do things.. hmmm.. or should we go the whole libusb novacom client replacement route (which would be more effort but not require a doctor download) Nov 23 19:17:42 Ice8lue: are you on german vodafone? Nov 23 19:17:49 the question is, if palm would interfer into that way Nov 23 19:18:02 i think using the standard doc would be okay for them Nov 23 19:18:07 bsm: yes Nov 23 19:19:31 Ice8lue: palm hasn't tried to interfere with wosqi. they've been pretty supportive of people modifying their own devices, it wouldn't be officially supported of course, but other than that either way would be fine Nov 23 19:19:40 Ice8lue: ever thought about getting the superflat internet wochenende? 12€ if you are a student, 200mb with throttling if you make more and 60 minutes to all carriers Nov 23 19:19:58 I screwed it up the first evening with the palm, called and said I had a "data accident" :D Nov 23 19:20:11 they returned me the money and got me a new plan Nov 23 19:21:08 destinal: I think that would be sweet, with libusb and everything Nov 23 19:21:20 bsm: well yes... i'm still looking for a new contract, but mine ends late march 2011 Nov 23 19:21:38 but definitely a big project Nov 23 19:22:13 Ice8lue: upgrading should be always possible with 2 years renewal, otherwise I'd change to O2o if my contract was ending Nov 23 19:22:23 destinal: yes, but that method would need to distribute the rom image with that tool. and i think palm wouldnt be pleased with that. and if you want the user to extract the image, they need the doctor aswell Nov 23 19:22:47 Ice8lue: it downloads it Nov 23 19:23:03 that's how QI works, but i rather the solution that doesn't require downloading doctor Nov 23 19:23:22 bsm: they got the vodafone flat + sms flat for 4,95€/month + 10€ internet flat (300mb, then gprs) Nov 23 19:23:49 quick question Nov 23 19:24:16 what's the best way of sideloading patches on the Pre2? Thanks Nov 23 19:24:21 hey ben Nov 23 19:24:27 twtomcat here Nov 23 19:24:28 Ice8lue: the nice thing is that if you make a customizer like this and you do it with libusb or something it wouldn't need the doctor at all unless you're actually doing full-out doctor style device recovery. if you rely on the palm classes, then it would need to download doctor Nov 23 19:24:48 hi swisstomcat Nov 23 19:25:08 hmmm^^ well, if you want to code it on c/c++ or python, count me in^ Nov 23 19:25:21 destinal: is there anything in the doctor we couldn't replicate Nov 23 19:25:26 if you have a tool like this you can actually fix a lot of problems without doctor, you can wipe a device from PC, apply patches, install software without dev mode if you want, back up / restore / edit tokens Nov 23 19:25:32 python sounds good, I've been meaning to learn it Nov 23 19:25:35 Ice8lue: which flat do you mean? Nov 23 19:25:43 yeah I'm thinking python + pyusb Nov 23 19:25:49 but I don't know python (yet) so it'll be interesting Nov 23 19:25:56 :D Nov 23 19:26:31 destinal: i am working with python for..mh..nearly 1 year now at university Nov 23 19:26:37 destinal: how does the doctor get the device to recovery mode (i.e. when dev mode is off) Nov 23 19:26:52 current project is an advanced webserver for embedded systems Nov 23 19:26:58 egaudet: you have to manually hold down vol-up starting it Nov 23 19:27:03 python is really cool and easy to use Nov 23 19:27:11 when dev mode is on it does tellbootie recover Nov 23 19:27:39 destinal: so a peson gets a new device, does no homebrew and he can't just doctor without manually going into recovery mode? Nov 23 19:27:53 egaudet_work: correct Nov 23 19:28:15 heh I always thought you could, but then again I haven't been out of dev mode for a long long time :P Nov 23 19:29:16 egaudet_work: wow you could even do a full-out package manager with this for webos's ipk pkg lib too Nov 23 19:29:33 in case we run into frankendoctor type scenarios where we can't OTA Nov 23 19:30:14 Ignore prev question schoolboy error, didn't have it in dev mode .... :| Nov 23 19:30:20 yeah, there's so many cool scenarios for this we definitely need to write it :) Nov 23 19:30:20 destinal: yeah :) could do a whole ton of stuff with it Nov 23 19:31:13 I hear libusb even works on windows so no reason this couldn't be fully cross platform Nov 23 19:33:32 yep Nov 23 19:34:40 destinal: big PLUS for that =) Nov 23 19:35:55 Ice8lue: heh, visions of people doing device recovery on sparc or alpha machines :) Nov 23 19:36:24 destinal: why not from another pre device? would just need a modified cable^^ Nov 23 19:37:51 Ice8lue: we don't have usb host mode on pre, yet. Nov 23 19:38:17 another idea, just hypothetically. if you would create a new partition inside of the flash memory, store a webos image there, could you reate some kind of recovery mode to recover the pre from that partition? Nov 23 19:38:29 without the need of a pc with doctor? Nov 23 19:39:29 Ice8lue: uh, that's tricky. you really need to boot the installer image and right now everyone does that from a PC Nov 23 19:40:21 blowing away the system you're booted into can be interesting to say the least Nov 23 19:40:26 yes. but recovering form pre itself would speed up that process alot. Nov 23 19:40:35 hm yes Nov 23 19:41:23 did someone get kexec working on arm? Nov 23 19:41:34 also you may want to rebuild the partition table from scratch, so where do you store your doctor image. it could work, but, challenges.. Nov 23 19:42:28 if you just want to rebuild rootfs you could expand /boot I imagine and make init do it. Nov 23 19:42:30 hmm Nov 23 19:42:59 rebuild rootfs hopefully won't be necessary if/when we migrate to aufs Nov 23 19:43:18 will need to think a bit about that^ Nov 23 19:44:08 Ice8lue: you could run a unjailed app that turns the webos install itself into a self-recovery system, basically, then reboot Nov 23 19:44:28 of course the system has to mostly work for that Nov 23 19:44:50 so I think it's of limited utility Nov 23 19:45:35 well yes... Nov 23 19:45:42 too bad ;) Nov 23 19:46:40 aufs is the answer, then no one will really need to fix the rootfs Nov 23 19:47:37 if your kernel works you could do some kind of boot menu where it can select which init to run, and if you had a rootfs image on another partition your recovery init could rebuild, too, without much of a running system Nov 23 19:47:54 I've never needed to do this away from a pc though so it's a lot of effort for little benefit Nov 23 19:49:04 ya Nov 23 19:49:53 hmm, I forgot that I was going to look into a chain loader once upon a time.. Nov 23 19:56:49 so I added timeout checks for the plugin method on the javascript side, but I'm still getting the error that the plugin method is not defined Nov 23 19:57:05 this is for a hybrid app, I was talking with egaudet about it earlier Nov 23 19:57:31 morning Nov 23 19:59:30 hi Nov 23 19:59:38 hi Nov 23 19:59:47 need some help with quilt Nov 23 20:02:27 for my plugin issue, I registered all the handlers on the plugin side, so I don't understand why it won't recognize that method on the javascript side Nov 23 20:02:39 pastebin your C code Nov 23 20:02:57 make sure your plugin is not exiting Nov 23 20:03:30 check /var/log/messages to make sure it's being started Nov 23 20:06:25 http://webos.pastebin.com/EWezaQL7 Nov 23 20:07:59 do you see your log messages? Nov 23 20:08:24 yep Nov 23 20:08:55 how are you calling the plugin method Nov 23 20:10:13 in the javascript, I create an object, set all its attributes, then append it to the DOM Nov 23 20:10:20 after that, call object.downloadFile(url) Nov 23 20:10:36 like wircPlugin.js does Nov 23 20:11:12 oh wait, hold on, looking at it a second time I'm missing some params Nov 23 20:11:50 rwhitby, oil, did you get a chance to poke over those prelim Preware themes? Nov 23 20:13:03 heh... rainbow preware Nov 23 20:13:21 damn right, it looks awesome :3 Nov 23 20:13:39 I had forgotten to appendChild param elements containing appid and exe :S Nov 23 20:13:42 trying out now... Nov 23 20:16:43 SineOt: prelim Preware themes? Nov 23 20:17:18 Ice8lue: Oil built in a theme picker hoping that people would submit themes for Preware... And I finally made use of it. :p Nov 23 20:17:41 cool =) can I have a look on that? Nov 23 20:17:46 One of them is an "advanced mode" theme that... Makes the app cycle through a rainbow and the widgets in the prefs scene float around and generally be dicks Nov 23 20:17:52 and the other is a more tasteful WIP theme Nov 23 20:18:20 sounds cool =) are they public? Nov 23 20:18:33 still no good Nov 23 20:19:56 Ice8lue: I guess? I have to build them into a Preware IPK but if you want it and won't complain if it uh, y'know, borks stuff, sure Nov 23 20:20:24 in the logs it looks like webos puts the app in the hybrid jail, then does a whole bunch of chown and mounting, then the executable starts, then nothing Nov 23 20:20:24 oil was thinking about changing it so that themes could be installed without needing to be bundled in Preware or something but yeah Nov 23 20:20:48 ok^^ isn't it possible to install them into a already set up preware? Nov 23 20:21:02 not with the way the theme picker is currently set up :( Nov 23 20:21:20 the picker in the preferences scene is hardcoded for the dark/light themes Nov 23 20:21:38 eventually, it might be possible to make it a patch but idk how to do that! I should probably start learning Nov 23 20:21:45 ah ok Nov 23 20:22:05 well if you want to, i'd like to test that Nov 23 20:22:07 I'd like to learn how to write patches Nov 23 20:24:20 this is the most current IPK I have... Be warned that it's marked as 1.4.5 so Preware might get wonky with later updates http://dl.dropbox.com/u/469264/PrewareThemes/org.webosinternals.preware_1.4.5_all.ipk Nov 23 20:24:41 And for those just wanting to see a screenshot, here's the tasteful one https://dl.dropbox.com/u/469264/PrewareThemes/preware_2010-22-11_183842.png Nov 23 20:25:32 SineOt: You should have versioned it differently - you've now stuffed those people Nov 23 20:25:54 rwhitby: oil recomended I change the version number to make sure that it overwrites properly Nov 23 20:25:55 they won't see that oficial preware version Nov 23 20:25:56 where's the one that isn't tasteful? Nov 23 20:26:16 1.4.4.1 would have been better Nov 23 20:26:25 I don't have a screen shot version, because it's animated and I can't figure out how to capture video Nov 23 20:26:32 since it's not an official release Nov 23 20:26:37 rwhitby: I'll change that when I get home then Nov 23 20:26:45 thx Nov 23 20:26:53 take like 30 photos and put them in an animated gif Nov 23 20:27:07 ^ Nov 23 20:27:10 ^^ Nov 23 20:27:15 1.4.4.1-SineOt would be even better Nov 23 20:27:50 rsanchez1: ahaha. I might try to screen record it in the emulator. The rainbow effect has to be seen to be fully understood Nov 23 20:28:03 will it blow my mind? Nov 23 20:28:05 rwhitby: okay. I'll repackage it when I'm back on my main comp later Nov 23 20:28:11 rsanchez1: yes, yes it will Nov 23 20:28:41 oh man, can't wait Nov 23 20:28:50 u will go blind Nov 23 20:29:31 yes, you will. cycling rainbows and flying mojo widgets Nov 23 20:29:46 double rainbow all the way! Nov 23 20:29:59 I had it turn the entire interface upside down but the origin for the rotation is set weird on my Pixi :C Nov 23 20:30:17 xD og Nov 23 20:30:18 the origin is based on and assumes a 320x480 screen Nov 23 20:30:21 omg Nov 23 20:31:03 soooo coool Nov 23 20:34:37 so yeah... don't install that IPK, Ice8lue, until I've had a chance to reversion it Nov 23 20:34:49 okay =) Nov 23 20:34:51 scoutcamper: I think you're the only other person who tried it, so same goes for you! Nov 23 20:51:11 snap, I got it working Nov 23 20:51:12 !! Nov 23 20:51:56 rwhitby: is there anyway to find out of the dictionary format without Palm? Nov 23 20:53:23 dunno Nov 23 20:53:56 ok.. Nov 23 20:54:52 rwhitby: sorry about the versioning stuff :< Nov 23 20:55:21 no worries, mate. Nov 23 20:55:25 looks like the problem I was having is that I set up the object in a document fragment, but never actually added that fragment to the DOM Nov 23 20:55:39 that's one of those d'oh moments Nov 23 20:56:01 rsanchez1: I've been having a lot of those lately ;P Nov 23 20:56:35 * SineOt spent like 45 minutes last night trying to figure out why his custom color wasn't overriding the default palm-dark one. Realized, later, that his custom color was REALLY similar to the default and it had been changed all along. Nov 23 20:56:59 oh man that would've REALLY frustrated me Nov 23 20:57:30 so now what I want to do is give the user an indication of how far along the download is Nov 23 20:57:36 set up a progress bar Nov 23 20:57:43 anyone have any advice on how to do that with curl? Nov 23 20:58:37 here's the pastebin for the plugin code for reference: http://webos.pastebin.com/EWezaQL7 Nov 23 20:59:25 do I have to worry if quilt writes: no patches applied? Nov 23 21:02:40 rsanchez1: I haven't used curl much, but does it provide some kind of output at all? Nov 23 21:03:19 well, the only other time I used curl was in PHP to handle ajax calls Nov 23 21:03:45 I assume they work similarly, so curl would return header info and then content for an http request Nov 23 21:03:54 curl might have a callback method? Nov 23 21:04:20 in C++, looks like curl let's you write the data to disk once it's finished downloading Nov 23 21:04:44 with the curlopts WRITE_FUNCTION and WRITE_DATA Nov 23 21:05:03 will it store the data in memory? can't believe Nov 23 21:05:09 but that's after it's finished downloading Nov 23 21:05:10 store/cache Nov 23 21:05:39 I'm looking more for in-progress callbacks I guess Nov 23 21:05:58 Yes, as above, you'll get "called" for every chunk of data libcurl reads off Nov 23 21:05:58 the server. Nov 23 21:06:07 I'll check out the curl docs, just wondering if anyone here had a quick recommendation before diving in Nov 23 21:06:10 that's what I read from a website Nov 23 21:06:18 wait, for the same function? Nov 23 21:06:28 for me it sounds the writefunc is called for each chunk of data Nov 23 21:06:34 oh, hmm... Nov 23 21:06:38 wouldn#t make sense otherwise Nov 23 21:06:44 http://marc.info/?l=curl-library&m=100204184522546&w=2 Nov 23 21:07:46 yeah that's what I'm doing Nov 23 21:07:58 gotta add a javascript callback then Nov 23 21:17:29 rsanchez1: so WIDK works decently well for palm's examples? Nov 23 21:18:26 I remember you said you had some issues earlier but I'm assuming you got them solved Nov 23 21:20:20 well, the one posted in their latest dev blog post just had the issue of no text being displayed Nov 23 21:20:22 root@palm-webos-device:/tmp# quilt refresh Nov 23 21:20:22 Nothing in patch /opt/src/patches/UberCalendar.patch Nov 23 21:20:27 I didn't get around to making that one work Nov 23 21:20:48 it's your pixi Nov 23 21:21:21 I haven't gotten around to testing it on my pre either Nov 23 21:21:39 actually, I'm gonna do that now Nov 23 21:22:12 how can I reset this quilt stuff Nov 23 21:28:31 it's not working for me right now Nov 23 21:28:39 palm's demo Nov 23 21:31:45 on the Pre? Nov 23 21:32:02 how was it: SDL_UpdateRect() ? Nov 23 21:32:10 with coordinates? Nov 23 21:33:27 actually I forgot what exactly it did Nov 23 21:33:31 it was something with SDL_text Nov 23 21:33:38 SDL_ttf Nov 23 21:33:45 right, but you need to update the screen at the end Nov 23 21:33:57 SDL_Flip... or SDL_UpdateSCreen() Nov 23 21:34:05 SDL_UpdateScreen has problems with coordinates Nov 23 21:34:08 yeah, should probably compile it again, I just tested it off the executable I already had Nov 23 21:34:10 partial updates Nov 23 21:34:22 I'll do that later Nov 23 21:36:35 can I use an existing patch file (which I need to apply with "-p 0") to setup the quilt? Nov 23 21:37:11 see ya later guys Nov 23 21:38:51 MetaView: quilt? I didn't think anyone had used that for webos in a long time Nov 23 21:39:07 oh i remember quilt Nov 23 21:39:25 and I thought it will speed up my qork a bit Nov 23 21:44:44 seems quilt need to be run in / Nov 23 21:45:05 ok, that's it for today... stupid quilt Nov 23 21:45:08 bbl Nov 23 21:48:03 yes, quilt needs to be run in / Nov 23 21:59:52 cu guys! Nov 23 22:14:59 hey all - looking for a recommendation on a program to convert video for maximum playability on the Palm Pre Plus... haven't had much luck yet - figured you WebOS Gods would know... Nov 23 22:15:26 Handbrake.fr Nov 23 22:16:17 aaaahhh, later after I get back from lunch: Someone with a Pre2 want to test something for me? Want to see if 2.0 added more H264 support for high profile Nov 23 22:16:35 SineOT: what settings would you recommend? Nov 23 22:17:17 let me pull them up real quick Nov 23 22:17:47 ah, I'll tell you later. Be back in like 20 minutes for lunch Nov 23 22:17:55 SineOT: Thanks - much appreciated... Nov 23 22:18:05 lol o.k. Nov 23 22:27:58 is there a python ipk somewhere I could install? Nov 23 22:29:02 fxprimex: is this what you need? http://developer.palm.com/distribution/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4112 Nov 23 22:29:05 fprimex, optware should have it Nov 23 22:30:32 can I get to optware from preware? bit of an optware noob Nov 23 22:30:53 ya Nov 23 22:31:30 k I will have a look. thanks! Nov 23 22:31:35 doesn't NavIt use Python?? Nov 23 22:36:38 hmm. I have optware on in the feeds and updated them, but python is not in the list of everything Nov 23 23:04:19 poot, PalmGuy left :< Nov 23 23:06:03 howdy all Nov 23 23:06:49 hola Nov 23 23:07:49 I guess everyone here just leaves irc on idling. the users of this channel read like a precentral hit list Nov 23 23:08:09 so, rwhitby: running into some problems repackaging it. Palm-package won't let me do anything but #major.#minor.#revision. Nov 23 23:08:27 rwhitby: so would 1.4.41 work fine, or would that still cause update issues since 41>5? Nov 23 23:08:43 that would be bad Nov 23 23:09:16 Yeah, it would be. Don't know how to tackle this since it won't package 1.4.4.1 Nov 23 23:09:31 * rwhitby bbl - commute Nov 23 23:10:19 * SineOt just says "fukkit" and goes with 0.0.0 Nov 23 23:11:03 hey scoutcamper Nov 23 23:11:20 destinal: hi how are you doing with hidd ? Nov 23 23:12:07 bpadalino: ok, let me see my notes. hidd's config is called /etc/hidd/HidPlugins.xml and each plugin uses a couple of sockets and a path to a .so Nov 23 23:12:34 last time I fired up IDA it looked like the calling mechanism after dynamically loading the .so was really really simple Nov 23 23:12:56 mainly I just don't know what I'm looking at in terms of reversing library calling conventions Nov 23 23:13:40 hey SineOt Nov 23 23:14:23 i see Nov 23 23:14:30 bpadalino: if you check out an emulator or doctor the xml should make it really clear what's where Nov 23 23:14:40 yeah i am checkng out the emulator right now .. Nov 23 23:14:51 a bunch of libhid* Nov 23 23:14:56 in /usr/lib .. Nov 23 23:14:58 scoutcamper: you installed that 'speshul' Preware, right? Nov 23 23:15:38 bpadalino: hidd --help has a lot of options too Nov 23 23:16:07 bpadalino: you have to stop hidd first though I believe Nov 23 23:16:27 yeah i see that hidd is running .. Nov 23 23:16:33 sysctl doesn't seem to want to control hidd ? Nov 23 23:16:44 "stop hidd" works on castle Nov 23 23:16:50 ah nice Nov 23 23:18:12 bpadalino: ah, --output-syslog and -vvvvvvvvv ;) should be handy Nov 23 23:18:43 actually no need for syslog if you run it in fg Nov 23 23:19:22 ooooh, what's the project today? :9 Nov 23 23:19:34 http://pastebin.com/m4JxaL12 Nov 23 23:20:17 SineOt: custom peripherals for hidd which is how peripherals talk to Luna etc Nov 23 23:20:32 yes, i am getting that same output .. Nov 23 23:21:22 SineOt: unfortunately it's closed source so we're figuring it out as we go Nov 23 23:21:34 good luck! Nov 23 23:21:37 because that sounds pretty cool Nov 23 23:21:55 yeah, i am getting some good output now .. very interesting .. Nov 23 23:22:14 SineOt: it's pretty much a necessity if you want to do, say a VNC server on a pre, or multitouch input or accelerometer or buttons on an emulator Nov 23 23:22:22 exciting stuff! :) Nov 23 23:22:33 destinal: you have the symbols it looks for already, right? Nov 23 23:22:36 just uncertain of their signatures? Nov 23 23:23:08 VNC would be awesome... Nov 23 23:23:24 dtzWill: I haven't played with it for a while until today and it looks like I didn't put it in the wiki, :( Nov 23 23:24:03 destinal: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Hidd ? Nov 23 23:24:26 heh, or actually, I did. thanks Nov 23 23:24:55 haha :D Nov 23 23:25:23 lol Nov 23 23:25:30 dtzWill: in my defense it was over a year ago :) Nov 23 23:26:08 wiki holds data much better than my memory Nov 23 23:26:09 interesting stuff .. Nov 23 23:26:22 destinal: yep, that's why the wiki is good :) Nov 23 23:27:11 bpadalino: so on the wiki also is an example of reading hidd events the normal way Nov 23 23:28:00 bpadalino: but nothing on the function calls to the library calls specifically except the names of function calls in logs Nov 23 23:28:30 s/calls s/ s/ Nov 23 23:28:30 destinal meant: bpadalino: but nothing on the function calls to the library specifically except the names of function calls in logs Nov 23 23:29:20 IIRC there's one function used to set up and it returns a struct of callbacks Nov 23 23:29:26 reminded me a bit of NPAPI but a lot simpler Nov 23 23:29:32 interesting Nov 23 23:30:04 oh it doesn't just dlsym for particular names? interesting. Nov 23 23:30:49 dtzWill: if memory serves, it does not. Nov 23 23:31:07 anyone good with figuring out calls to random binary libraries? Nov 23 23:31:40 probably the first thing to do would be to make an alternative caller to these libs that loads them and takes the part of hidd talking to them Nov 23 23:32:25 hrmm .. Nov 23 23:32:27 once we can do that successfully and we know how the plugins behave, we can make our own and load it into hidd via the config Nov 23 23:32:38 we have some symbols .. hold on Nov 23 23:33:56 bah i'm at work an no novacom/etc here. Nov 23 23:34:03 i've been temped to install it at work, but.... Nov 23 23:34:18 that's on slippery, slippery slope to never getting work done ever again Nov 23 23:34:19 :) Nov 23 23:34:21 *one Nov 23 23:34:29 very true Nov 23 23:34:52 i was looking at the symbols in the binary, running hidd under gdb and trying to figure out if we can gain any insight into what's going on after it's done loading stuff Nov 23 23:38:41 destinal: don't forget this work also allows for an awesome virtual keyboard :) Nov 23 23:39:18 some details about hijacking something to render it, but still! :) Nov 23 23:40:28 dtzWill: good point. I had originally been thinking of ways to extend the emulator but someone brought up VNC server the other day which with hidd and frame buffer capture should be possible so I started thinking about it again Nov 23 23:45:10 dtzWill: also if we ever want to try getting x86 emulator running on other devices, say, for developing tablet apps without having a tablet, it could come in handy. Nov 23 23:45:46 yes, it's crucial to a number of exciting developments :) Nov 23 23:45:47 :D Nov 23 23:47:45 bpadalino: there's a pid file in /var/run, it mknod's the sockets, and finally loads the .so's after all that Nov 23 23:47:50 (stracing) Nov 23 23:47:59 yeah .. Nov 23 23:48:27 have you tried intercepting the messages from the socket ? Nov 23 23:49:59 bpadalino: what's the best way to read from a socket? Nov 23 23:50:18 no idea :) Nov 23 23:50:22 I mean do you have to write a test harness binary or can it be done from cmd line Nov 23 23:53:37 not sure .. Nov 24 00:40:12 rwhitby: hmm, for some reason I thought get.preware was an outdated ipk Nov 24 00:40:33 maybe it only used to be Nov 24 00:41:28 destinal, the other day it was 10sept2010 Nov 24 00:46:47 yes, it's 1.3.8 Nov 24 00:47:01 I update it after significant end user usage of a new production version Nov 24 01:00:25 rwhitby: ok, that's new enough then. Nov 24 01:41:39 ka6sox, did u ever get around to finishing the app download stats that u were working on, would still like to see what the wirc trends look like Nov 24 01:42:19 PuffTheMagic, nope...too many hours and GB of logs left :( Nov 24 01:43:48 ka6sox, if you could get me a sample of the logs some time i could write C app that should be able to parse them pull out the stats that might be useful Nov 24 01:43:54 * halfhalo can pump through 100k of page hits in 5 seconds Nov 24 01:44:51 Save for user agent since the logs I got at work didnt have them Nov 24 01:46:33 Oh ssd, how I love you Nov 24 01:48:02 rwhitby: I went with 0.0.0 for my special edition preware, that fine? Nov 24 01:48:07 yep Nov 24 02:42:28 so anyone with a pre2 try to build/run 2.0 kernel yet? Nov 24 02:45:45 egaudet`: not yet. I only just noticed the 2.0 patch is up Nov 24 02:47:16 I built it for pre trying to frankendoctor but pvrsvrkm.ko still complains Nov 24 02:52:22 maybe wrong toolchain Nov 24 02:53:29 egaudet`: are you building with the new toolchain? Nov 24 02:53:59 I used cs10 but I guess I should have sued cs09 Nov 24 02:54:14 s/sued/used/ Nov 24 02:54:15 egaudet` meant: I used cs10 but I guess I should have used cs09 Nov 24 02:56:51 egaudet`: sounds like we may need newer binary kernel modules :( Nov 24 02:58:27 so, for the 2.0 kernel patches on opensource.palm.com, 48 is 2.0.0 and 54 is 2.0.1 Nov 24 02:58:45 (you can tell from the ipkg kernel.control file in the rootfs) **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Nov 24 02:59:58 2010