**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Dec 25 02:59:57 2010 Dec 25 03:24:23 merry Christmas folk Dec 25 04:27:04 rwhitby-pre, duplicated at reddinglights.com/Preware in html Dec 25 04:28:50 bbl Dec 25 04:33:06 scoutcamper|away: doesn't work Dec 25 04:37:27 ????? Dec 25 04:37:34 oil, whats broken? Dec 25 04:38:05 screenshot viewing Dec 25 04:38:12 preware install guides goes nowhere Dec 25 04:38:22 faq drawer does nothing Dec 25 04:38:37 hmmm Dec 25 04:38:48 preware install guide works, look at the link Dec 25 04:39:01 i have to figure out the screenshots Dec 25 04:39:20 when i click it, it doesn't take me to the guide Dec 25 04:40:25 updated Dec 25 04:40:51 nothing Dec 25 04:41:07 reddinglights.com/Preware Dec 25 04:41:13 that exact link Dec 25 04:41:21 reddinglights.com/Preware/index.html Dec 25 04:41:22 yeah Dec 25 04:41:34 hmmm Dec 25 04:41:37 what browser? Dec 25 04:41:47 when i click the preware install guides button, it doesnt go to guides Dec 25 04:41:49 chrome Dec 25 04:42:26 let me try, works fine on firefoc Dec 25 04:42:33 s/firefoc/firefox/ Dec 25 04:42:33 scoutcamper|away meant: let me try, works fine on firefox Dec 25 04:43:09 aha Dec 25 04:43:14 give me a sec Dec 25 04:48:40 ok, links work Dec 25 04:48:45 workingon screenshots Dec 25 04:55:32 uploaded Dec 25 04:55:38 oil, again Dec 25 04:56:08 * oil still gets nothin Dec 25 04:56:53 now? Dec 25 04:59:02 still doesnt work Dec 25 05:00:34 hmmm Dec 25 05:00:41 anyways, bbl Dec 25 05:00:42 does it work in firefox or ie? Dec 25 05:00:50 cya oil Dec 25 05:02:33 ok im done for Dec 25 05:02:55 merry x-mas Dec 25 05:05:38 Fixed!!!!!!!!!!!! Dec 25 05:38:01 hola Dec 25 05:38:07 scoutcamper|away: link me Dec 25 05:39:53 doesnt seem to work in chrome Dec 25 05:42:34 scoutcamper|away: faq doesnt work and neither do the installing preware drawers Dec 25 05:42:44 screenshots is cleaver? Dec 25 05:42:49 :) Dec 25 05:47:25 * Jack87 just noticed random page button... prepare yourselves for a flood of newb questions from him in the coming weeks Dec 25 05:54:38 Jack87, reddinglights.com/Preware Dec 25 05:54:57 all pulldown menuse need a pice of code i writing Dec 25 05:55:03 s/i/im/ Dec 25 05:55:03 scoutcamper|away meant: all pulldown menuse need a pimce of code i writing Dec 25 05:55:05 scoutcamper|away: found it in the log.. so you are trying to clone it? Dec 25 05:55:29 yes, but in html so others besides me can edit it Dec 25 05:56:25 as right now, you cant edit the current javascript site or it breaks Dec 25 05:56:39 so, im re-writing in html, then i will begin updting Dec 25 05:58:09 cryptk, reddinglights.com/Preware Dec 25 05:58:17 its almost done :D Dec 25 05:58:21 and in all HTML Dec 25 05:58:25 no javascript Dec 25 05:58:26 :D Dec 25 05:59:51 ok, aside from some CSS changes (fone size in some spots) I can't tell a difference from the live site... what all did you change Dec 25 06:00:09 I literally just woke up so it is very likely that I am missing it, lol Dec 25 06:00:37 cryptk, removed all javascript and replaced with equivelent html :D Dec 25 06:00:58 scoutcamper|away: pretty nice... Dec 25 06:00:59 only thing broken is the pulldown menu(FAQ, etc.) Dec 25 06:01:39 cryptk, now anyone with any knowledge of html should be able to update the site, with relative ease Dec 25 06:01:43 when scrolled down and hitting next for image... browser reloads to diff page but doesnt look as smooth as JS is there a way to make it happen in html/ Dec 25 06:02:05 Jack87, working on i, but for now, better than nothing d: Dec 25 06:02:15 i know i know most monitors are big. i am on netwook right now Dec 25 06:02:26 haha scoutcamper|away ya it looks great Dec 25 06:02:27 im on my huge 22' widescreen :D Dec 25 06:02:46 22 feet/? Dec 25 06:03:00 haha you werent kidding about huge Dec 25 06:03:23 ok... say it again 22"?? 22'?? Dec 25 06:03:30 what was wrong with the javascript? Dec 25 06:03:41 it is one of the core languages of the web... Dec 25 06:03:44 HTML, JS and CSS Dec 25 06:03:49 isnt javascript reletivly simple to edit Dec 25 06:04:03 if you are going to be doing we stuff, you should know those 3 at least Dec 25 06:04:27 * Jack87 is learning them Dec 25 06:04:33 ok, but that is like saying "I am going to build a nuclear reactor without knowing anything about physics" Dec 25 06:04:53 cryptk: whats physics? Dec 25 06:05:09 making a website without javascript... you are severely hindering what you can do... it is pretty much a core language of the internet Dec 25 06:06:58 what is it that makes you want to rewrite it without the javascript? other than some people may not know javascript? Dec 25 06:09:44 cryptk, right now, editing the xml the javascript builds into xml breaks the whole thing\ Dec 25 06:10:04 everyone has suggest rewrite to html/css so thats what i did :D Dec 25 06:10:30 yeah, but I wouldn't not use javascript, some things are best done with JS Dec 25 06:11:01 im using as minimal as i can, to mae the page as easily updateable as possible :D Dec 25 06:11:15 couldnt you just mak .js files that the script tags point to? Dec 25 06:11:17 ok Dec 25 06:11:23 and have main page all in html? Dec 25 06:11:39 sorry i am a newb Dec 25 06:11:45 but that totally seems doable Dec 25 06:12:02 I just wanted to make sure you weren't getting rid of all JS, some things on that site can't be done well without a little JS Dec 25 06:12:08 like the dropdowns, lol Dec 25 06:12:30 screen shots included! Dec 25 06:12:39 cryptk, and the screenshots, what ive done now is alittle wierd :D Dec 25 06:12:41 changing to a diff html file is not ideal i dont hink Dec 25 06:13:30 Jack87, especially not for updating main page 6 diff times :D Dec 25 06:13:44 ya... Dec 25 06:13:58 i can see it as building blocks to show you can do it i suppose Dec 25 06:14:28 but im off to bed, may work tommorow a little but will be a couple days till fully working, then start updating :D Dec 25 06:14:29 it is normal for things to go through multiple revisions Dec 25 06:14:44 Jack87, yeah, this is preware.org v2beta1 Dec 25 06:14:55 scoutcamper|away: its chritsmas tomorrow relax Dec 25 06:15:09 Jack87, i know d: if i get bored d: Dec 25 06:15:26 scoutcamper|away: hehe right : Dec 25 06:15:29 )goodnight Dec 25 06:15:41 finally go my phone working again by the way.. doctored of course Dec 25 06:15:54 lol took much less time Dec 25 06:16:11 Merry Christmas. buddy been wanting to go hit the bar tonight maybe i should Dec 25 06:17:33 cryptk: join me! haha Dec 25 06:17:47 you never did make your way out to utah in your travels did you/? Dec 25 06:18:08 i think i had mentioned for you to touch bases with me if you ever did ((so long ago)) Dec 25 06:18:44 yeah, never went to utah Dec 25 06:18:53 but to be fare, you never made it out to SA, TX Dec 25 06:19:21 cryptk: haha true... if i ever get a job for traveling.. Dec 25 06:19:29 hehe. what was that gig i totally forgot Dec 25 06:19:38 they were sending you everywhere Dec 25 06:20:03 I was building linux servers that were being strapped to UAV's to do all kinds of crazy stuff Dec 25 06:20:12 wild Dec 25 06:21:15 http://www.darkgovernment.com/news/reaper-sensors-called-gorgon-stare/ Dec 25 06:21:30 whats that Dec 25 06:21:59 what I used to be working on Dec 25 06:22:18 thats some crazy shit Dec 25 06:22:35 im too scared to ask any questions.. dont want dudes in black suits after me Dec 25 06:22:46 or you Dec 25 06:24:12 haha, I know what I am allowed to say about it Dec 25 06:24:23 big camera, see's very far... nobody is safe Dec 25 06:24:25 that sums it up Dec 25 06:24:40 hehe ya i read that much Dec 25 07:21:18 Jack87: lol Dec 25 07:47:09 * Jack-wIRC wishes topic had direct link to current log Dec 25 07:50:16 ya know... http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos-internals.txt Dec 25 07:51:09 for lazy wIRC users Dec 25 07:52:09 what does rwhitby-pre think? Dec 25 07:53:11 there we go, happy now Dec 25 07:53:50 cryptk: wow why don't you look at that? Thanks Santa. just what I wanted for X-mas Dec 25 07:54:00 except we can't do it Dec 25 07:54:04 I had to change it back Dec 25 07:54:12 character limit, it cut off the patches link Dec 25 07:54:25 'msg chanserv deop #webos-internals cryptk Dec 25 07:54:26 oh no.... I see Dec 25 07:54:56 you could always just bookmark it in your browser Dec 25 07:55:42 that's just not same as tapping in wirc Dec 25 07:56:13 oh well you tried Dec 25 07:56:14 bookmark it and make it a launcher in your pre Dec 25 07:56:28 then just open launcher, tap icon for log Dec 25 07:56:47 close.. Dec 25 07:56:57 hehe Dec 25 07:57:24 2011 Camaro 2SS... Dec 25 07:57:26 me want... Dec 25 07:57:27 ok... page added to launcher Dec 25 07:57:51 pretty! Dec 25 07:59:04 http://www.chevrolet.com/vehicles/2011/camaro/build.do Dec 25 07:59:08 look at the specs on it Dec 25 07:59:10 hum.. its not in launcher.. webos 2 bug? Dec 25 08:00:14 the 'as shown'? Dec 25 08:00:23 odd.. Dec 25 08:00:34 the way I want it specced, it will cost me $45K Dec 25 08:01:33 hehe Dec 25 08:01:39 corvet?.. Dec 25 08:02:02 I like how the page is pre friendly.... but can't find specs Dec 25 08:02:55 6.2L 426HP V8 Dec 25 08:02:58 ya its the m.chevrolet.com but..... specs are not included Dec 25 08:04:10 holy shit. that has cover engine in it Dec 25 08:04:51 ?? Dec 25 08:05:27 since when did cameros have 426hp? Dec 25 08:05:36 corvet Dec 25 08:05:45 sorry... pre auto correct Dec 25 08:06:23 so add to launcher is not working from browser :( Dec 25 08:07:34 or bookmarks... hum.. maybe because it is a text file? Dec 25 08:07:58 nope... browser bug has to be. Dec 25 08:08:20 the vette has 430 Dec 25 08:08:28 the camaro has 426 Dec 25 08:08:47 http://www.chevrolet.com/camaro-coupe/features-specs/ Dec 25 08:08:50 haha pretty dam close wow! Dec 25 08:08:52 that is the camaro specs page Dec 25 08:09:19 damn... browser keeps sending me to m.chevrolet.com Dec 25 08:10:13 Jack-wIRC, cryptk: 'evening :) Dec 25 08:10:13 with the price difference though.... I think you can do w/ out 4 HP Dec 25 08:10:32 hi dtzWill Merry Christmas Dec 25 08:10:43 merry merry christmas to you and to all as well :) Dec 25 08:11:20 dtzWill: did you see santa? Dec 25 08:11:41 nopers, he's a sneaky fellow. Dec 25 08:11:51 probably will come as SOON as i fall asleep :) Dec 25 08:11:52 he came and went... but didn't leave the gifts behind Dec 25 08:12:35 it just didn't fit under the tree Dec 25 08:12:45 so i should look outside?! Dec 25 08:12:56 :)... Dec 25 08:12:59 or is it lots of love :) hehe Dec 25 08:13:28 just scroll up in the log only like 5min Dec 25 08:14:09 I gave jack his christmas wish for about 30 seconds Dec 25 08:14:10 XX:48 mark Dec 25 08:14:41 cryptk: it was great while it lasted Dec 25 08:14:46 :) Dec 25 08:14:59 haha Dec 25 08:15:05 you got a topic for xmas \o/ Dec 25 08:15:14 * dtzWill jealous Dec 25 08:15:24 hehehe Dec 25 08:15:43 dtzWill: good idea.. you guys find something cleaver. Dec 25 08:17:17 bars stop serving at 1 :-(... going home Dec 25 08:18:03 I gave a hitch hiker a ride as my Christmas Good deed Dec 25 08:18:20 hehe kk. hopeflly you have enough.... holiday spirit in you :) Dec 25 08:19:41 if not... that hitch hiker will "fill him up" Dec 25 08:19:59 I dunno... time to be scrooge now I think Dec 25 08:34:24 ~beer Dec 25 08:34:24 * infobot has disconnected (Read error: 99 (Connection reset by beer)) Dec 25 08:39:52 i like beer. do you like beer? Dec 25 08:41:02 hum... cant change nick Dec 25 08:41:55 nick help Dec 25 08:42:13 lol Dec 25 08:42:16 it changed your nick Dec 25 08:42:24 it did Dec 25 08:42:29 ... to help... HAHA Dec 25 08:42:29 oops Dec 25 08:42:30 haha Dec 25 08:42:43 ahh! Dec 25 08:43:05 -NickServ- This nickname is registered. Please choose a different nickname, or identify via /msg NickServ identify . Dec 25 08:43:31 how do i do nick and password via commad Dec 25 08:43:35 so your nick is registered Dec 25 08:43:49 well, I just have mine set in my IRC client Dec 25 08:44:02 or you can identify like it told you to Dec 25 08:44:30 what is nickserv? Dec 25 08:44:46 that is how you can register your nick so that other people can't take it Dec 25 08:45:23 so identify, then change to your other names and do /msg nickserv group Dec 25 08:45:25 [01:43] -NickServ- You are now identified for jack87. Dec 25 08:45:28 finally Dec 25 08:47:18 hum... intresting Dec 25 08:47:24 I just technically never disconnect from IRC Dec 25 08:47:33 my server is ALWAYS connected Dec 25 08:47:36 then I connect to my server Dec 25 08:47:37 hehe Dec 25 08:47:55 i need to dissconnect from other clients Dec 25 08:48:06 I can connect from multiple clients to my server Dec 25 08:48:16 actually I need to reboot my server real fast, brb Dec 25 08:50:32 back Dec 25 08:50:44 cryptk: never say never :) Dec 25 08:51:10 the only time I disconnect is if I have to reboot my server Dec 25 08:51:15 I just upgraded the kernel on it Dec 25 08:51:26 hehe i had to say that Dec 25 08:51:33 that was really fast reboot Dec 25 08:51:45 faster then i could group my nicks Dec 25 08:51:49 than* Dec 25 08:52:33 did you restart the entire computer? Dec 25 08:55:47 Touchstone Accessories. I know I asked for this last year, but Uncle Jon promised a whole ecosystem of accessories for Palm devices, and we didn’t get anything accessory-wise the entire year. There’s so much more that the Touchstone tech could do... I’m kind of digging a Touchstone car charger with bluetooth for speakerphone/music (and a line out to my car, if you can swing it). Dec 25 08:56:00 ahhh! touchstone works fine in the car with palm charger Dec 25 08:56:08 other then that i dont under stand the other shit Dec 25 08:56:24 phone has speaker for speaker phone and bluetooth Dec 25 08:56:30 what the hell Dec 25 08:56:33 yep, restarted the entire server Dec 25 08:56:41 and znc doesn't start automatically at boot Dec 25 08:56:47 I rebooted, SSH'd in and started znc Dec 25 08:56:59 but I am fixing that... Dec 25 08:57:40 magicness Dec 25 08:57:42 one moment, going to restart znc with the init script I jsut made Dec 25 08:57:44 you are the ssh king Dec 25 08:59:38 hrm... init script didn't work... gotta find my bug Dec 25 09:01:17 Jack87: of course i like beer :). it was too much for poor infobot, however / Dec 25 09:01:17 good luck Dec 25 09:01:52 haha he is just enjoying the holidays is all in drunken glory Dec 25 09:02:07 cryptk: only you are ready to debug at this hour no one else Dec 25 09:02:40 hahaha Dec 25 09:02:44 irssi+screen ftw xD Dec 25 09:02:46 I am not even drunk, lol Dec 25 09:03:01 although never heard of/tried znc, is that a client or more like a bouncer? Dec 25 09:03:05 I use znc so that I can connect with xchat, irssi, basically whatever IRC client I want Dec 25 09:03:09 * dtzWill goes to znc.sf.net to rtfm Dec 25 09:03:12 bouncer Dec 25 09:03:24 kk cool Dec 25 09:03:56 i used to be a bouncer...... oh wait thats not what you ment Dec 25 09:04:02 hehe Dec 25 09:04:35 * Jack87 looking for beer in the fridge Dec 25 09:04:52 ok, lemme try this again Dec 25 09:06:05 ka6sox drank at the bar i worked at! but that was way before i was old enough to even go in there Dec 25 09:06:28 heh, i'm nowhere near you guys :( Dec 25 09:06:49 dtzWill: not too far Dec 25 09:07:49 oh that's right, you said ka6sox so i was thinking CA but that's not where you are at all :) Dec 25 09:07:53 so yeah not that far really :D Dec 25 09:08:05 so....when's the next midwest webos meet-up? xD Dec 25 09:08:29 haha dunno keep me posted though Dec 25 09:08:52 i vote park city utah. after nerdyness time to go snowboard Dec 25 09:09:22 and its half hour no air fare for me Dec 25 09:09:24 hehe Dec 25 09:09:28 i haven't snowboarded in 4 years.... but going in a week! :D Dec 25 09:09:44 nice! Dec 25 09:10:02 i hurt my ankle long boarding in the summer :( still hurts so i am sitting this season out Dec 25 09:10:17 where are you goin Dec 25 09:12:22 uh nowhere special i don't think. i'm in IL so anything more than a small hill is amazing :) Dec 25 09:12:33 should i cough up $250 bucks for pre2? or wait it out for sprint device? i am not leaving sprint Dec 25 09:13:20 hmmm we might actually be heading up to WI to devil's head Dec 25 09:13:42 woot! think it is workin! Dec 25 09:13:58 or not? Dec 25 09:14:10 oh cool! Dec 25 09:14:20 jump on i80 and just come here Dec 25 09:14:40 yeppers, init script now works Dec 25 09:14:48 I had the wrong path to the znc binary in it... fixed that... Dec 25 09:15:07 woot! Dec 25 09:15:36 then I moved the znc config from ~/.znc/ to /etc/znc (since I was turning it into a daemon) so I had to modify the znc config file so that it would know that it's SSL cert stuff was in a new location Dec 25 09:15:59 excellent Dec 25 09:16:39 rc.d defaults updated... now it will start at boot Dec 25 09:17:02 remember when i said never say never? Dec 25 09:17:09 cryptk: prove it! :P Dec 25 09:17:19 dtzWill: haha Dec 25 09:17:37 ok, here go's a reboot test Dec 25 09:17:52 cryptk: woo Dec 25 09:17:53 ready go Dec 25 09:18:37 ~seen cryptk Dec 25 09:18:41 cryptk <~cryptk@unaffiliated/cryptk> was last seen on IRC in channel #webos-internals, 1m 3s ago, saying: 'ok, here go's a reboot test'. Dec 25 09:19:01 cryptk: wb :) Dec 25 09:19:03 woo woo Dec 25 09:19:05 reboot works Dec 25 09:19:08 it worked yay Dec 25 09:19:12 \o/ Dec 25 09:19:15 damn this thing reboots fast Dec 25 09:19:43 * Jack87 watching lie to me and wondering if they can detect BS via IRC Dec 25 09:19:53 cryptk: thats what i said! Dec 25 09:20:16 you could watch the pings to it while I reboot it if you want proof, lol Dec 25 09:20:40 psh just blocking pings Dec 25 09:20:55 pics or it didn't happen Dec 25 09:20:56 then you could SSH in and reboot it yourself, haha Dec 25 09:21:11 cryptk: you sshed my phone! Dec 25 09:21:12 haha :). psh maybe that's a VM Dec 25 09:21:24 the server is a VM actually Dec 25 09:21:31 it is a virtual server with slicehost Dec 25 09:22:24 hahaha kk Dec 25 09:22:24 we need Lie to me british dude Dec 25 09:22:38 have you guys seen that show? Dec 25 09:23:10 never heard of it Dec 25 09:23:26 I have seen it Dec 25 09:24:10 detecting lies from face features... kinda gets repetitive but great entertainment at this hour... Dec 25 09:26:00 I wonder if bootchartd would work on a VPS... Dec 25 09:26:09 the British dude is a cocky bastard Dec 25 09:26:16 considering that there is no initram... Dec 25 09:26:46 cryptk: greek to me.... starting google process (loves browser client for this) Dec 25 09:26:50 cryptk: only one way to find out Dec 25 09:27:19 but what happens if it toasts the server though... Dec 25 09:27:26 I guess I could pull a backup image first... Dec 25 09:27:41 hehe Dec 25 09:28:06 you can ask halfhalo about the performance of these VPS's... he has three of them on the same setup as me Dec 25 09:28:20 actually, mine has twice the RAM etc as his do Dec 25 09:28:31 this thing is running on a 512MB ram server, lol Dec 25 09:28:49 hey... what would it take for me to have a server setup? from you Dec 25 09:29:03 sorry i have no need right now but just wondering if i ever did Dec 25 09:30:28 well, what would you want to be running on it? Dec 25 09:30:38 and would you be setting it up, or would you want me to do it? Dec 25 09:31:05 hum... me i suppose Dec 25 09:31:31 just run simple personal webpage and remote file storage.. maybe flux (torrent downloading if possible) Dec 25 09:32:04 more for learning purposes when i have the time Dec 25 09:32:20 I wouldn't do torrenting on it... at least not if you are on my employee account, lol Dec 25 09:32:39 haha no torrenting Dec 25 09:32:45 if thats the case Dec 25 09:32:53 a server the same as min would run you $9.50 a month, multiply that by 4 and that is the cost without my discount Dec 25 09:33:11 oh wow! Dec 25 09:33:29 ya.. if i was to torrent i should do my own server with own ISP huh? Dec 25 09:34:01 you could do it on slicehost, just not on my account Dec 25 09:34:24 because it is against the terms of just about ANY hosting company... if it is done on my account I can get in trouble at work Dec 25 09:35:02 well ya of course i wouldnt ever risk ones jjob. Dec 25 09:35:34 so worst case (not on your account) they just cancel your service? Dec 25 09:36:23 yeah Dec 25 09:36:34 you would have to cover paypal fees as well Dec 25 09:36:55 Jack87: look into good seedbox hosts if you want a torrent box Dec 25 09:36:58 intresting... Dec 25 09:37:11 I have a slick setup with halfhalo, he has a monthly subscription set up via paypal so that he auto-pays me each month for the servers he ahs on my account Dec 25 09:37:26 I am limiting how many people I do it for though, so far it is just me and him Dec 25 09:37:28 dtzWill: i just want to play with flux is all well setting up flux that is i guess i can do that in a vm on my computer Dec 25 09:37:35 sure Dec 25 09:37:41 or just dual boot your PC Dec 25 09:37:54 install Ubuntu along side your windows install Dec 25 09:38:00 then you can boot into each other Dec 25 09:38:06 Jack87: yeppers either solution (vm or dual-boot) should work fine for learning/poking Dec 25 09:38:11 my laptop is setup that way... Dec 25 09:38:29 me being a linux admin... everything I own jsut about runs linux Dec 25 09:38:50 my original xbox, all of my gadgets... every computer in the apartment is either linux only or dual boots Dec 25 09:38:59 lol Dec 25 09:39:01 * Jack87 needs windows for fallout new vegas Dec 25 09:39:13 that is why I have windows on my main computer, gaming Dec 25 09:39:54 my laptop is alwats running ubuntu with dual boot but only boots into ubuntu (unless gaming) and VMs to physical dirve Dec 25 09:40:30 i wish vbox was better at physical drive boot Dec 25 09:42:43 maybe one day Dec 25 09:44:35 alright well sleepy time for me guys Dec 25 09:44:44 merry christmas again, happy holidays to all :D Dec 25 09:44:48 'night, etc :) Dec 25 09:44:50 laters Dec 25 09:45:08 gtnight dtzWill and merry christmas Dec 25 09:45:16 and to all a goodnight Dec 25 09:46:31 cryptk: tell me a handy use for server Dec 25 09:46:51 I use mine for lots of things... Dec 25 09:46:53 i cant think of anything right now but i want one so bad Dec 25 09:47:11 run ZNC IRC bouncer, a full LAMP stack, a mumble VOIP server Dec 25 09:47:15 i just cant justify it in the sense of taking advantage Dec 25 09:48:33 i need to set one up physically first though to learn i suppose Dec 25 09:50:01 i do want to start developing apps soon maybe then. :) Dec 25 09:50:42 unless you need something that is always on, always working... then you can just do everything on a local machine Dec 25 09:51:00 now if you want to run something like I am at http://www.cryptkcoding.com then you would need a server Dec 25 09:51:11 cryptk: i have my work computer always on... and use it remotely as needed' Dec 25 09:51:51 thats good stuff! Dec 25 10:02:02 guys Dec 25 10:02:16 does anyone know if its possible to purchase US activated EU pre comm boards Dec 25 10:23:13 I haven't seen any advertised. Dec 25 10:26:43 me neither Dec 25 10:27:24 i reckon theres money to be made from a service like that Dec 25 10:28:08 sharkie: i dont think the EU market is all that large Dec 25 10:28:33 maybe 50-100 bucks? Dec 25 10:29:21 i reckon more because the price difference in the EU/US pres + the hassle of getting it activated with a US catalog Dec 25 10:30:14 sharkie: mark up sure... but how many will you actually be able to sell? Dec 25 10:31:23 probably about 1000 - 2000 Dec 25 10:31:44 already pricy as hell unlocked off contract. how much can you mark it up to be worth it to you and as small as the EU market is... how much of that small market can afford it Dec 25 10:32:02 man its not just the EU market that you're looking at Dec 25 10:32:10 there are a lot of Pres that have been imported from europe Dec 25 10:32:34 2100 band is the most widely used band outside of US/Canada Dec 25 10:32:42 maybe i am not sure what you want to do. Dec 25 10:32:53 well me personally Dec 25 10:33:00 i have a US Pre and im in australia Dec 25 10:33:04 pre 2 actually Dec 25 10:33:21 i didnt know that the bands wouldnt be compatible in 3G over here Dec 25 10:33:45 i can either sell my phone and buy the EU pre plus go through the hassle of sending it to the US to activate it Dec 25 10:34:12 err sorry eu pre 2 Dec 25 10:35:04 or if i can get my hands on the EU pre- comm board activated in US i can just put the comm board in my pre 2 Dec 25 10:35:41 hum... are comm boards easy to buy individually? Dec 25 10:35:56 i saw one on ebay but that was a sprint one Dec 25 10:37:22 intresting.... Dec 25 10:38:46 if the boards were wildly available i can see it working (but not many know how to swap com boards) Dec 25 10:41:29 the TAM would not justify the inventory costs Dec 25 10:41:39 sharkie: great idea no doubt. but i think most would rather wait for palm to make catalog available Dec 25 11:19:20 goodnight peeps. merry christmas Dec 25 12:26:22 woot, now my bouncer connects to freenode via SSL Dec 25 12:26:36 gotta love having everything be encrypted... (I wear a tin foil hat) Dec 25 14:28:35 so many people... Dec 25 17:55:41 * halfhalo yawns and wishes everyone a happy holidays Dec 25 20:22:34 Hellos Dec 25 20:24:01 Jack87: hi Dec 25 20:25:19 destinal: i never did get to test that reset command... now that my phone is up and running as it should dont really want to... do you have a preowned device to try it on Dec 25 20:25:42 merry christmas! Dec 25 20:25:47 Jack87: I just received one but haven't gotten around to it yet Dec 25 20:25:53 Jack87, come over here and make me a pizza... Dec 25 20:26:08 I want a pizza, but all of the pizza places are closed... Dec 25 20:26:09 i mean i ran it but while my modem was messed up so coulnt see if it worked Dec 25 20:26:50 cryptk: go to walmart! get desorno ill come bake it Dec 25 20:27:25 destinal: when you have the time let me know lets find a way to reset without MSL to get rid of previous info Dec 25 20:27:27 sweet, start driving, let me know when you get about 15 minutes from sea world and I will give you final directions Dec 25 20:27:54 * Jack87 didnt know there was sea world near cryptk Dec 25 20:28:11 cryptk: san diego? Dec 25 20:28:37 got the first half right Dec 25 20:28:39 San Antonio Dec 25 20:28:42 ah Dec 25 20:29:01 brb, gettin some booze Dec 25 20:29:19 * cryptk has no family and as of a week ago no girlfriend so I have nothing to do Dec 25 20:30:19 fyi all cryptk is not an alcoholic this is his midnight hour for his body clock Dec 25 20:31:04 * Jack87 wishes he didnt have a girlfriend... He cares for her.. Just too much damn work Dec 25 20:33:09 movie time... it just finished downloading... Dec 25 20:33:25 and Jack87, I might be an alcoholic... I drink at the normal times also, lol Dec 25 20:33:43 brb Dec 25 20:33:49 mmmmmm chardonay Dec 25 20:34:40 cryptk: fyi i will be at sea world in 23 hrs if i start now and go non stop Dec 25 20:36:47 cant have a merry christmas without the booze Dec 25 20:55:03 between the palm pre and palm pre plus com board swaps which chaise ends up being the main sprint phone? Dec 25 20:57:22 Jack87: which chaise? Dec 25 20:58:05 destinal: never mind Dec 25 20:58:07 thanks Dec 25 21:02:53 destinal: nm.... Dec 25 21:05:17 pie Dec 25 21:05:18 um putting the com board of + in - will give you stroage/ram of the plus in the sprint chassis right? Dec 25 21:06:14 but swapping the main board between the two phones will turn the pre+ to sprint phone Dec 25 21:06:33 is that possible? Dec 25 21:10:14 Jack87: swapping the comm board between a pre+ and sprint pre- is usually done to give you a sprint pre+ and also gives you a pre- that works on whatever the other carrier was Dec 25 21:11:34 your first statement didn't make sense, you only move the comm board and the "back" of the sprint device into the pre+ Dec 25 21:12:12 so it's the pre+ chassis for the most part Dec 25 21:13:48 the ram and emmc are part of the omap / main board, not the comm board Dec 25 21:14:12 destinal: moving sprint com board to verizon gives you a pre - on verizon with verizon chassis.... and moving verizon com board to sprint gives you a sprint pre + with sprint chassis Dec 25 21:14:29 Jack87: wrong on the chassis Dec 25 21:14:40 destinal: gotcha... reverse what i just said :) Dec 25 21:15:14 about chassis that is Dec 25 21:15:20 the pre- is still the same pre- it always was just with a new back and works on verizon Dec 25 21:15:44 yay, vzw pre- Dec 25 21:16:04 * oil has unlocked gsm pre- xD Dec 25 21:16:17 is main board swap an option as well? Dec 25 21:16:36 Jack87: uh, why swap just the OMAP board? Dec 25 21:17:04 cryptk, im 11hrs north of sea world Dec 25 21:17:05 unless you have a damaged pre+ I suppose Dec 25 21:17:15 destinal: only if oyu ca get it for like 10 bucks Dec 25 21:17:45 destinal: yup Dec 25 21:17:54 Jack87, ive got all the pre/pixi series hardware for each respective carrier :D Dec 25 21:17:56 Jack87: if you have a messed up device from a chassis perspective but a superior system board that would make sense Dec 25 21:18:12 Jack87: I dunno if anyone has tried it Dec 25 21:18:43 destinal: im not sure how it would handel with button vs none button Dec 25 21:19:04 i havent taken one apart yet to see but i think its simply a wire is all Dec 25 21:19:23 Jack87: losing button functionality wouldn't upset me. Dec 25 21:19:32 the gesture tap would still work Dec 25 21:19:51 * Jack87 i hates button... a lot! Dec 25 21:20:02 haha so it wouldnt bug me Dec 25 21:20:16 Jack87: you should ask rwhitby, maybe he's done just a OMAP board (aka system or main board) swap Dec 25 21:20:23 but i suppose its just a wire that goes to the board. really shouldnt make difference Dec 25 21:21:04 oil, i have a vzw pre- :D Dec 25 21:21:12 yeah Dec 25 21:21:28 but getting a unlocked gsm pre- means a sprint pre2 :) Dec 25 21:24:19 oil: this is true Dec 25 21:24:34 unfortunately, i can't attempt to activate it yet :( Dec 25 21:25:15 destinal: when swapping com board.. esn is attached to the com board correct? Dec 25 21:25:27 oil: why is that? Dec 25 21:25:43 the sprint pre- comboard is still activated on ebay dudes account Dec 25 21:25:59 he has to call and deactivate it before i can activate it on my account Dec 25 21:26:04 so, its just sitting there, doing nothing :/ Dec 25 21:26:09 huh... Dec 25 21:26:21 i dont think so dude.. just jump on your own account Dec 25 21:26:29 oil, you cant tell sprint you bought it? Dec 25 21:26:35 well, i called sprint to do just that Dec 25 21:26:38 and thats what they told me Dec 25 21:26:47 that it was already activated, and i couldnt activate it on my account Dec 25 21:26:51 they are dumb do it online on the website Dec 25 21:26:56 it errors Dec 25 21:26:58 which is why i called Dec 25 21:27:04 oh... the guy didnt get a new phone Dec 25 21:27:14 he just had it on a data plan for dev Dec 25 21:27:28 it still got evdo here for a few weeks then stopped Dec 25 21:27:28 did you contact the guy? Dec 25 21:27:31 yeah Dec 25 21:27:37 said he would call Dec 25 21:27:41 oil, get his ip, track him down and smack him till he does it Dec 25 21:27:45 that was last week, still waiting Dec 25 21:28:18 oil: swap it with your main pre? Dec 25 21:28:24 its my main pre Dec 25 21:28:37 * oil doesnt want to end up with no working phone Dec 25 21:28:59 have a none pre phone as a back up? Dec 25 21:29:12 no Dec 25 21:29:33 the only other sprint device i have is the pre- i can't activate Dec 25 21:30:35 Jack87: yeah the ESN follows comm board on pre Dec 25 21:30:41 oil, threaten to contact ebay and paypal on the guy? Dec 25 21:30:47 So you have Pre 2 with activated (on someone else's account) on sprint.... a sprint pre with pre 2 board... and a regular sprint 2? Dec 25 21:31:03 no Dec 25 21:31:09 pre* Dec 25 21:31:14 the comboard from the sprint pre- is in the pre2 Dec 25 21:31:27 scoutcamper: i bought it from him like 8 months ago Dec 25 21:31:36 pretty far past being able to do anything about it if he doesnt call Dec 25 21:31:53 oil, how much was it? Dec 25 21:31:56 and he keeps paying the bill to sprint? Dec 25 21:32:14 i dont think so Dec 25 21:32:24 scoutcamper: it was 8 months ago... i dont remember Dec 25 21:32:25 brb Dec 25 21:32:49 swap with working pre board. you will be fine Dec 25 21:33:05 oil, if hes not paying bill, then call sprint repetadly and say i bought this, he is not paying it, activate it now!!!!!!! Dec 25 21:34:12 all he has to do is swap it on his account with a diff phone he doesnt even need to activate it Dec 25 21:34:20 i mean doesnt need to call Dec 25 21:35:19 * halfhalo bids you all aeidu for the forseeable future Dec 25 21:36:56 ? Dec 25 21:37:17 ? Dec 25 21:37:25 destinal: swapping comm board from att or any other none sprint pre... same as doing w/ verizon? Dec 25 21:37:49 sorry, looking for the 'help' command .. Dec 25 21:38:08 * halfhalo is going home and dissasembling his computers Dec 25 21:40:03 rwhitby-pre, merry christmas from the USA! Dec 25 21:41:54 rwhitby-pre: Hi Rod, any interesting findings in the supplied data? Dec 25 21:42:52 Jack87: apparently any pre-/pre+/pre2 comm board works also in any of the above Dec 25 21:42:58 same process Dec 25 21:43:35 destinal: thanks... granted token changes are needed Dec 25 21:43:48 Jack87: right Dec 25 21:45:35 pa7fa: it's the manufacturing test firmware Dec 25 21:46:52 pa7fa, ?????????? Dec 25 21:47:06 pa7fa is my HAM radio Call..... Dec 25 21:48:04 pa7fa, mine is KJ6JXZ Dec 25 21:48:21 pa7fa, what manufacturing test firmware? Dec 25 21:48:37 rwhitby-pre: have you done omap board swaps? Dec 25 21:49:08 Well Matthew, than we have something in common! Dec 25 21:49:22 not swap, just disassemble Dec 25 21:49:26 pa7fa, :D Dec 25 21:50:00 rwhitby-pre: would pre+ board fit in sprint chassis? and be functional Dec 25 21:50:09 your opinion i suppose Dec 25 21:50:58 Rod: all pre an pre+ hardware can be swapped. Hardware-wise it all fits. Dec 25 21:51:10 Not sure about Pre2 hardware though. Dec 25 21:51:47 * rwhitby-pre defers to pa7fa, who repairs this stuff Dec 25 21:52:57 I had connected a Pre + display to a pre classic board. and it works. Never opend a Pre 2 (yet), but Dec 25 21:53:20 well richard, hows the weather in the netherlands? Dec 25 21:53:22 pa7fa: thanks for heads up! Dec 25 21:53:35 i am confident the Pre2 Hardware will fit to (mainboard, and display-wise. Dec 25 21:53:48 pa7fa: were you able to get a working on carrier classic palm pre with pre plus omap board? Dec 25 21:54:13 Matt: 10cm snow -4 degC Dec 25 21:54:23 Jack: yes. Dec 25 21:55:02 I combined a Sprint-classic mainboard on a Pre plus display, with a EU-GSM comm board. Runs fine Dec 25 21:55:03 pa7fa, its like a monsoon here, rain, wind, and 40 degreesF Dec 25 21:55:06 pa7fa: thanks! nice to know if i come across just a main board or a broken pre plus Dec 25 21:55:28 pa7fa: hehe ultimate frankin pre Dec 25 21:56:09 Lol. that experiment screwed up my profile though ;-) Dec 25 21:56:26 pa7fa: intresting... how so? Dec 25 21:56:38 Now need to expiriment on a Pre2..... Dec 25 21:56:54 pa7fa, you never use your main profile on a test :D Dec 25 21:57:51 was it the eu com board that made it act funky you think ? Dec 25 21:58:18 i dunno.. i cant figure out why it would effect profile on a pre/plus Dec 25 21:58:20 Well, the Profile is 'connected' to a combo of MOBO serial, and /or Modem Serial / IMEI / ESN If you swap one part, the profile screws-up. Dec 25 21:58:43 I think ROd does know more about that profile mechanics..... Dec 25 21:59:07 so how does one make a sprint pre plus without messing up profile? Dec 25 21:59:16 is that where the tokens come into play? Dec 25 21:59:51 Jack87, restate plz Dec 25 21:59:58 I do not know the SW part of this. Just make sure you don't have a production profile connected to one of the components.... Dec 25 22:00:41 * Jack87 is so confused about profiles.... Dec 25 22:01:10 Jack87, what is confusing you? cc @ oil Dec 25 22:01:10 Matt: i learned that the hard way.... lol Dec 25 22:01:26 pa7fa, lol! Dec 25 22:01:47 pa7fa: if profile is changed to a different device.. and the swap is done between two other devices... and now newlly created phone can log into old profile. as long as profile isnt linked to only one of the boards Dec 25 22:02:08 rwhitby: is there ANY profile resetting code in the test tools? Dec 25 22:02:36 so three devices needed total. one to hold profile... two for swap... then can transfer profile to new frankin pre Dec 25 22:02:55 Jack87, yep Dec 25 22:03:06 Jack: yes i assume you're right... but be careful with your data.... Dec 25 22:03:26 pa7fa, why not call palm and say, i bought this on ebay it broke my profile fix it Dec 25 22:03:28 pa7fa: will do... will test on test profile. :) Dec 25 22:04:21 pa7fa: your profile was linked to one of the boards and not the other when you did the swap rather being on a totally different device then the other two? Dec 25 22:04:47 I have a strange habit: I create always profiles for all units i test here: @mailinator.com with PW qwerty. Dec 25 22:05:18 pa7fa, you have alot of profiles :D Dec 25 22:05:35 Jack, not sure. it was a long time ago. I now th device was screwed-up needing a doctor, and my profile was busted. Dec 25 22:05:40 100's Dec 25 22:06:15 pa7fa: interesting.. thanks for letting me pick your brain Dec 25 22:06:48 Matt: Palm will not do anything with any profile...... Dec 25 22:07:31 pa7fa, interesting ... Dec 25 22:07:45 Here in EU we are struggeling with acces to paid apps, with deveices activated outside certain countries..... its a disaster. Dec 25 22:08:17 * scoutcamper votes we start an angry mob :D Dec 25 22:08:29 pa7fa: if device is activated in the states paid apps work? Dec 25 22:08:39 Jack87, yep Dec 25 22:08:46 pa7fa: what if profile is created on US activated device.... Dec 25 22:08:57 I sell pre2's in my webshop, and i let them activate in the UK. (i live in the Netherlands) to gain access to paid apps. Dec 25 22:09:02 can eu phone login to that profile Dec 25 22:09:12 just got done watching Unstoppable Dec 25 22:09:16 excellent movie Dec 25 22:09:25 Activation is done once: the first time. and yes, activated in the US is access to paid apps. Dec 25 22:09:55 Yes, only the first time counts. after that first time you can donanything with the phone. Dec 25 22:10:14 pa7fa, his question is, i buy a us phone(lets say i live in iceland) and make a profile on that phone, does it get us paid apps? Dec 25 22:10:25 pa7fa: i am saying.. profile created on US activated phone... and same profile used on an EU device later.. will that give paid apps. or does device physically need to be activated on US carrier Dec 25 22:10:32 scoutcamper: if someone activated it before yes Dec 25 22:10:39 or just profile needs to be created on US carrier? Dec 25 22:10:50 Jack87: it's the first activation on a given device Dec 25 22:10:59 nothing to do with the profile you actually use later Dec 25 22:11:12 You need to activate it in the USA, Canada, Germany, France, UK, or Ireland. You need to be IN one of those countries AND use one of their network SIMS. Dec 25 22:11:34 Profile is a differnt thing.... Dec 25 22:11:48 god it.. intresting Dec 25 22:12:08 so yeah buying a device or even a comm board with tokens from the US would do what you need Dec 25 22:12:30 So theoretically you can activate an GSM PRE on AT&T with a French SFR SIM card. That will give you access to the French app catalog. Dec 25 22:12:58 pa7fa: if you're actually in france on SFR at the time of activation yeah Dec 25 22:13:12 not on AT&T now Dec 25 22:13:13 no Dec 25 22:13:14 Also you can activate an GSM PRE on German O2 with a USA AT&T SIM card. That will give you access to the USA app catalog. Dec 25 22:13:33 nop Dec 25 22:13:35 no Dec 25 22:13:55 it's not the SIM Dec 25 22:14:09 it's SIM + being actually on that network at the time of activation Dec 25 22:15:54 Not in my experience. The Profile is connected to the SIM provider. The Network needs to be in a country which is 'approved' Dec 25 22:16:15 BTW Mexico is NOT one of them. Dec 25 22:17:01 can you just create tokens for the EU phone from US tokens Dec 25 22:17:39 pa7fa: so you're relying on international roaming here? if you have an ATT sim from the US you can activate on O2 in germany because it will roam on that network? and it's still counted as US ATT activation? Dec 25 22:17:50 Not sure about tokens. i thought rwhitby was working on that..... Dec 25 22:18:00 Yes, that is (should be) correct. Dec 25 22:18:36 But, if you activate in the nethelands, you will screw app cat access for paid apps. Dec 25 22:19:08 pa7fa: so using att sim there does not give you access to US cat Dec 25 22:19:37 because the ATT SIM doesn't roam there I assume? Dec 25 22:19:43 Which is (stil) irreversible. Only Palm can reset the activation (i've seen this, and can confirm it) Dec 25 22:20:14 No, Netehlands is not 'an approved country' Dec 25 22:20:42 pa7fa: Palm approved you mean or ATT? Dec 25 22:20:47 my guess would be that Palm/HP has to have agreements with the country to work out taxes on the app sales... no agreement to pay taxes... no paid app cat Dec 25 22:21:16 Only activation in USA, Canada, France, Spain, Germay, UK, and Ireland are 'approved' (Palm approved) Dec 25 22:21:19 pa7fa: so it needs to be any approved country + an approved network, and the profile gets associated with the network rather than the country? Dec 25 22:21:40 Yes, with teh network who provided the SIM. Dec 25 22:21:46 got it Dec 25 22:22:23 There are reports which do not agree with that assessment. Dec 25 22:22:45 You cannot use an Dutch Vodafone SIM on AT&T network. You CAN use a German O2 SIM, or Spanish Movistar SIM. Dec 25 22:22:53 Rod: i know.... Dec 25 22:23:40 Since it's possible to change tokens, can we generate an arbitrary serial # within a certain range and have it work? Dec 25 22:23:49 to start at initial activation again Dec 25 22:23:50 Most people forget to also take account of the age of your sister's boyfriend's cat when determining app catalog access ... Dec 25 22:24:11 Rod: but how to reset that darn activation. is it in the tools???? Dec 25 22:24:20 activation is based on imei, which cannot be easily changed like tokens Dec 25 22:24:21 Rod: and the color of the cat...... Dec 25 22:24:31 it is not in the tools Dec 25 22:25:10 rwhitby-pre: then I suppose one would have to change whatever makes the request to palm to send another IMEI, maybe one that belongs to a phone you own? Dec 25 22:25:11 and changing imei is illegal in many countries Dec 25 22:25:24 rwhitby-pre: I mean the request to palm, not the actual IMEI of the device Dec 25 22:25:25 Any other intersting stuff exept basic tests? Dec 25 22:25:56 Changing IMEI is VERY illegal here in NL Dec 25 22:25:56 pa7fa: hardware tests, that's all Dec 25 22:26:17 bbl Dec 25 22:26:22 pa7fa: I do NOT mean change the IMEI, just send another in the initial request to palm web services Dec 25 22:26:39 which is nothing to do with illegal cloning Dec 25 22:26:47 that would give the IMEI you send at activation app cat access Dec 25 22:26:53 but your device would not have it Dec 25 22:27:08 instead the device that has the IMEI you activated would get it Dec 25 22:27:32 cryptk: so change the rest of the client code to send the same one as well Dec 25 22:27:43 if we're talking about a web service, we can send what we want Dec 25 22:27:47 then you start getting into cloning Dec 25 22:27:59 cryptk: no, since we're not talking to the actual network with that IMEI Dec 25 22:28:04 just to palm web services Dec 25 22:28:07 plus, the code that handles the IMEI is likely in luna Dec 25 22:28:17 a.k.a. compiled binary Dec 25 22:28:26 Rod: is it possible a Palm-server initiated reset will reset the activation? Dec 25 22:28:31 destinal: Palm, rather than carrier, may consider that fraud Dec 25 22:28:52 pa7fa: it does not Dec 25 22:29:14 Okay, so i don't need to test hat ;-) Dec 25 22:29:27 rwhitby-pre: I suppose, but it still sucks that we can't do anything about this from our end Dec 25 22:29:52 destinal: that's the rules of the game ... Dec 25 22:30:16 rwhitby-pre: where are the rules defined exactly? :) Dec 25 22:30:29 rwhitby-pre: we're already a ways outside the box here Dec 25 22:31:30 Palm has to do something about this. With the upcoming tablets, a user wants to run his profile on more than 1 device. Dec 25 22:31:57 yeah, but have app authors agreed to that up front? Dec 25 22:32:01 also the geo-restrictions on paid apps, is really rediculous ... Dec 25 22:32:06 rwhitby-pre: a lot of this may become a moot point when tablets come out anyway Dec 25 22:32:41 I'm not sure they will have profiles on multiple devices. Dec 25 22:32:53 rwhitby-pre: unless they're also telephony devices Dec 25 22:33:02 I am hitting the sack (lol) merry Chrismas to you all!!! Dec 25 22:33:12 pa7fa, the geo-restriction is determined by the app developer, not by palm Dec 25 22:33:14 pa7fa: merry Christmas Dec 25 22:33:16 No indications in the code that they will, so I have to assume they will not. Dec 25 22:33:25 cryptk: wrong Dec 25 22:33:49 rwhitby-pre, when I submitted my app, I could choose what countries I wanted it in Dec 25 22:33:52 app devs can choose from a subset already chosen by palm Dec 25 22:34:00 ahh, that is what you mean Dec 25 22:34:14 yes, with paid apps it has to be a country that Palm has a tax agreement with Dec 25 22:34:28 I thought we were just speaking in general Dec 25 22:34:59 but in that subset of countries that Palm has agreements with, developers get to choose Dec 25 22:35:07 Now, HP should have tax agreements in at least 138 countries ... Dec 25 22:35:33 should, and I wouldn't be surprised if that causes the app cat to open up to many more countries in the future Dec 25 22:35:44 cryptk: if a dev chooses limited distribution, that's their right. Dec 25 22:36:19 rwhitby-pre: I guess it depends on whether first sale doctrine still holds Dec 25 22:36:48 there is no basic human right to have access to apps Dec 25 22:37:05 bye all! Dec 25 22:38:03 rwhitby-pre: no, it's down to copyright law, which IMO governs licensing for copying a thing but shouldn't govern *use* Dec 25 22:38:31 it is what it is, until it is changed. Dec 25 22:39:39 rwhitby-pre, I agree with you completely Dec 25 22:39:56 And in theory, first sale doctrine wouldn't apply in this case Dec 25 22:40:09 because I am not buying an app and then giving that app to someone else... Dec 25 22:40:17 I purchased the app... my phone did not Dec 25 22:40:39 you're also applying US law to supply of apps to other countries Dec 25 22:42:07 indeed, so first sale doctrine would definitely not apply in many cases Dec 25 23:00:51 * oil feels like he is going to burst Dec 25 23:03:54 Good evening everyone :) Dec 25 23:05:51 * halfhalo has to grab an old domain out of its redemption period and is shocked at the price Dec 25 23:11:04 Is there somebody from the navit project here? Dec 25 23:12:36 can anyone please tell me where the root folder is when the Pre is in flashdrive mode? Dec 25 23:14:28 when the pre is hooked up in usb mode you can't get to root Dec 25 23:14:30 oil: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Application:Zenity Dec 25 23:15:48 oil: are you sure? Dec 25 23:16:20 Not via the USB mode Dec 25 23:16:48 Nostradumbass: the root folder is always at /, but USB mode only presents /media/internal to the host computer Dec 25 23:17:02 i see Dec 25 23:18:47 +rwhitby: if Dec 25 23:19:05 +rwhitby: can I create the media and internal folder? Dec 25 23:19:35 +rwhitby: I mean if I don't see those directories, can I make them to the same effect? Or does it mean my Pre could be using a different directory? Dec 25 23:19:44 that folder already exists on every webOS device, and is the folder that is presented as the top-level folder when you connect to the device with USB drive mode Dec 25 23:20:21 +rwhitby: oddly enough it wasn't presented when I connect it Dec 25 23:20:41 I think you'll find it is. Dec 25 23:21:11 It is the directory which "appears" to be the root folder when you mount the Pre as a USB drive on a host computer. Dec 25 23:21:20 Is there somebody here with webOS2.0? I am having problems with all the terminal apps - I'd like to see some terminal running directly on the device, not only using ssh :( Dec 25 23:21:35 rwhitby: by throwing the mojo widgets out the window, i think i can get more to fit into the popup dialog Dec 25 23:21:53 sancho_sk: "Secure Shell" (in the webos-internals testing feed) is the only one that works on 2.0 Dec 25 23:22:21 oil: what subset of http://library.gnome.org/users/zenity/stable/ do you think we should do first? Dec 25 23:22:53 whats there (that im going to redo) is message dialogs Dec 25 23:22:53 +rwhitby: so there should always be a "media/internal" folder present when the Pre is plugged in as a flash drive? Dec 25 23:22:55 rwhitby: How can I add the repository into the device, plz? Dec 25 23:23:02 and the question thing Dec 25 23:23:09 ~testing-feeds Dec 25 23:23:10 somebody said testing-feeds was a means of testing new WebOS Internals products, documented at http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Testing_Feeds Dec 25 23:23:11 like, yes/no Dec 25 23:23:16 and text entry Dec 25 23:23:26 but im going to redo that into the popup instead of a full scene Dec 25 23:23:56 http://library.gnome.org/users/zenity/stable/zenity-message-options.html.en Dec 25 23:23:57 are there Dec 25 23:24:04 Nostradumbass: you will not see such a folder, since it is the folder which is presented as the root. There are many other folders on the device which are not presented over the USB interface, including the folders above the one you see. Dec 25 23:24:21 brb Dec 25 23:26:06 +rwhitby: so how do I go about placing a file in root? Dec 25 23:26:45 Use the Palm SDK's "novacom" utility, "put" subcommand. Dec 25 23:27:57 this will definitely be a who's on first scenario Dec 25 23:28:22 +rwhitby: would that be novaterm? Dec 25 23:28:45 hi all Dec 25 23:28:57 Nostradumbass: it would not Dec 25 23:30:00 +rwhitby: ok, and there is no other way to place a file in root Dec 25 23:31:22 You can use scp, or sftp, or rsync, or put it in /media/internal and mv it, or WebOS Quick Install, or Internalz, or any number of other methods. Dec 25 23:31:45 ooo can we have a info bot log command that links to http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos-internals.txt Dec 25 23:33:54 +rwhitby: ok thankyou, so if my Pre seems to be missing /media/internal does that mean it could have been deleted somehow and I should re-create the folders? Dec 25 23:34:07 Your Pre is not missing that folder Dec 25 23:34:31 Nostradumbass: can you access your device over USB mode? Dec 25 23:34:43 +rwhitby: I am right now and I don't see a media folder Dec 25 23:34:58 Nostradumbass: ok, you're just not getting it. Dec 25 23:35:00 infobot, log is located at http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/ and the latest log is located at http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos-internals.txt Dec 25 23:35:00 okay, cryptk Dec 25 23:35:03 ~log Dec 25 23:35:04 well, log is located at http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/ and the latest log is located at http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos-internals.txt Dec 25 23:35:09 there ya go Jack87 Dec 25 23:35:13 Nostradumbass: let's start from basics Dec 25 23:35:19 Nostradumbass: The Pre is running Linux, ok? Dec 25 23:35:24 cryptk: hehe thanks santa Dec 25 23:35:28 Linux has a root directory, called "/" Dec 25 23:35:35 I do what I can Dec 25 23:35:40 Nostradumbass: In that root directory, there is a "media" directory Dec 25 23:35:51 the infobot can learn anything... you just need to tell it what it is Dec 25 23:35:52 Nostradumbass: In that media directory, there is a "internal" directory Dec 25 23:36:02 infobot, Jack87 is someone who keeps requesting log information Dec 25 23:36:02 okay, cryptk Dec 25 23:36:04 cryptk: can log be located at http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos-internals/ instead? Dec 25 23:36:07 Nostradumbass: the "/media/internal" directory exists on every single webOS device, including yours. Dec 25 23:36:12 ~Jack87 Dec 25 23:36:13 well, jack87 is someone who keeps requesting log information Dec 25 23:36:21 lol Dec 25 23:36:21 Jack87, you can teach it yourself Dec 25 23:36:26 oh... Dec 25 23:36:33 just tell it what log is Dec 25 23:36:36 Nostradumbass: when you access the Pre using USB mode, it is *NOT* looking at the "/" directory, it is looking inside the "/media/internal" directory. Dec 25 23:36:52 +rwhitby: now that directory is not accessible through the USB drive partition correct? Dec 25 23:37:00 Jack87, format is, no (thing) is (defenition) Dec 25 23:37:07 Nostradumbass: so if there was a "/media/internal/foo" directory in Linux, it would appear in your USB drive as just "foo", not "/media/internal/foo". Dec 25 23:37:23 infobot, log is located at http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos-internals/ and the latest log is located at http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos-internals.txt Dec 25 23:37:24 ...but log is already something else... Dec 25 23:37:27 Nostradumbass: please read all of that carefully, and then respond. Dec 25 23:37:28 ~log Dec 25 23:37:29 i guess log is located at http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/ and the latest log is located at http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos-internals.txt Dec 25 23:37:48 Jack87: you can talk to infobot with /msg - please take advantage of that feature Dec 25 23:38:05 rwhitby: will do Dec 25 23:38:07 cryptk, scoutcamper: same applies to you Dec 25 23:38:19 yeah... forgot to mention that... I was just doing it in main channel to show you how it is done... Dec 25 23:38:25 +rwhitby: ok so by placing a file just within the USB drive it is in the /internal/media directory Dec 25 23:38:42 :D Dec 25 23:38:53 cryptk: how do i change what log is? Dec 25 23:39:01 Nostradumbass: try that sentence again Dec 25 23:39:28 (there is no /internal/media directory, but there is a /media/internal directory) Dec 25 23:40:01 tell it to forget log Dec 25 23:40:46 +rwhitby: the file I want to place in is a program that can be run through the Terminal, the directions state to place it in the "ROOT" of my phone, when running the application I type "insmod/media/interna/programname.ko" Dec 25 23:41:52 Nostradumbass: You'd better not make the same typos on the Linux command line that you are making in this conversation, or else you're going to royally screw your phone. Dec 25 23:42:29 +rwhitby: so does that mean when I simply place it on the USB Drive and not in any subdirectory it is automatically within the /internal/media portion of the phone? Dec 25 23:42:48 If you meant "/media/internal", then yes. Dec 25 23:42:59 +rwhitby: I just realized the direction have a typo, I think they meant /insmod/internal/media/programname.ko Dec 25 23:43:45 Nostradumbass, still has a typo Dec 25 23:43:49 Nostradumbass: I do not think you should be attempting this procedure. Find someone you know who has Linux experience and get them to do it. Dec 25 23:43:53 * Jack87 doesnt know any directory of insmod Dec 25 23:43:59 insmod /media/internal/programname.ko Dec 25 23:44:11 +cryptk: ok so insmod is a command Dec 25 23:44:14 but I concur with rwhitby Dec 25 23:44:35 Nostradumbass, you should probably find someone with some linux experience to help you with this... Dec 25 23:44:45 +cryptk: hence why I'm asking here Dec 25 23:45:02 if you get things wrong on the command line in your phone, it can result in a trip to the webOS doctor Dec 25 23:45:15 Nostradumbass: do you have SSH access Dec 25 23:46:13 Jack87: nope, does WebOS Quick Install have a way to backup an image? Dec 25 23:46:35 Nostradumbass: image? as in pictures you have taken w/ camera? Dec 25 23:47:17 Jack87: no a backup image, a way to mirror the Pre's partition Dec 25 23:47:49 best way to do that is rsyc but that will just back up the files Dec 25 23:48:03 webos quick install is not an advance user program Dec 25 23:48:13 Nostradumbass, I would highly recommend that you not do whatever it is you are trying to do... Dec 25 23:48:38 however if you tell me exactly what it is you are trying to do... I may be able to come up with a way that is safe for you (and others) to do it Dec 25 23:49:13 Jack87: i second that Dec 25 23:51:42 Nostradumbass: people cant help if they are being asked to blindly Dec 25 23:51:51 what are the rules here concerning what kind of content can be legally posted on this channel? I mean when it comes to utilizing a WebOS device to violate the EULA of another product? Dec 25 23:52:44 Nostradumbass: it's in the /topic Dec 25 23:53:18 no one is going to come after you. just say what it is you are trying to do. if it is frowned upon chatting here than someone will tell you Dec 25 23:53:26 If you're going to break the law, or a contract you have entered into, don't do it here. Dec 25 23:54:08 +rwhitby: it states one should honor all carrier licenses and copyrights. But I can assure you what the intended use is not to violate any copyright, even though it potentially can. Dec 25 23:55:18 it also says licenses Dec 25 23:56:35 he wants to run psfreedom Dec 25 23:56:41 Nostradumbass: if what you are attempting does not fit that, you should contact the author of whatever instructions you are following for assistance. I assuming it's not some WebOS Internals instructions you are following. Dec 25 23:57:33 +rwhitby: ok I am following these steps to install a particular piece of homebrew software: http://bit.ly/bmlywy Dec 25 23:58:06 bpadalino: right. there's a forum thread for that at http://psx-scene.com/forums/f6/psfreedom-n900-modified-work-palm-pre-65355/ - that would be your best place to ask for assistance Dec 25 23:59:27 +rwhitby: thankyou I was looking at the PS3 Hacks sight that didn't offer much information Dec 26 00:01:53 +rwhitby: the thing is I already downloaded whats supposed to be a pre-compiled version of PSFreedom but when I run "insmod /media/internal/psfreedom.ko" it returns No such file or directory found. Dec 26 00:02:58 * rwhitby bbl Dec 26 00:09:17 * halfhalo is almost completely paid off on his cc! Dec 26 00:13:43 nice - what are you going to buy to celebrate ? Dec 26 00:19:49 stuffs in vegas Dec 26 00:20:06 I have 23.32 on my card in pending transactions right now. Thats it Dec 26 00:20:38 nice Dec 26 00:32:27 lakers are getting hammered.... Dec 26 00:32:56 that is probably not good if they want to play basketball Dec 26 00:33:07 lol Dec 26 00:33:22 well, this IS LA were talking about Dec 26 00:33:55 halfhalo: ya they are.. bad! Dec 26 00:35:15 * halfhalo lives near LA Dec 26 00:35:42 * halfhalo was next to staples center for the last game of the finals in june Dec 26 00:36:51 * Jack87 doesnt live in LA anymore Dec 26 00:37:09 Go Jazz! Dec 26 00:38:45 cryptk, used to go to LA all the time Dec 26 00:43:15 Thanks for the advices, I'll get back to testing the navit ASAP. Have a good night all of you. Dec 26 01:24:54 folks Dec 26 01:24:59 merry christmas Dec 26 01:30:06 ok, off to a party, ttyl Dec 26 01:37:35 bye cryptk Dec 26 01:37:43 bye all Dec 26 01:58:25 kinect does not work with a damn dog Dec 26 02:10:10 halfhalo: work with a normal one? Dec 26 02:10:22 maybe Dec 26 02:10:30 but I have a crazy one Dec 26 02:10:57 * halfhalo is using a mac mini on his bed Dec 26 02:11:11 literally, mini+monitor+kb is all on my bed Dec 26 02:12:16 * halfhalo is redoing all his comp stuff to make it cleaner Dec 26 02:28:16 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136670 want Dec 26 02:29:14 what would you do with 40TB of space ? Dec 26 02:29:38 stuff? Dec 26 02:30:11 good answer Dec 26 02:30:30 My theory is no matter how much space you have on a new hard drive within 6 months your down to 20% Dec 26 02:30:43 interesting theory Dec 26 02:30:57 yup Dec 26 02:31:10 lol Dec 26 02:31:25 with 40TB of space, I'd never deal in lossless anything again. Dec 26 02:31:43 err, lossy Dec 26 02:33:52 * halfhalo shall buy a ups tomorrow Dec 26 02:34:50 and move my powerline adapter to the other side of the room Dec 26 02:34:55 that shall help my bandwidths Dec 26 02:45:21 halfhalo: haha, I somehow missed the '20 pack' part of that. Dec 26 02:58:37 :D **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Dec 26 02:59:56 2010