**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Jan 09 02:59:58 2011
Jan 09 03:00:13 <Loudergood> heh, the feature I'd like is batch installs...guess I'd better get to work..
Jan 09 03:00:22 <Tibfib> oil: thoughts?
Jan 09 03:00:25 <Tibfib> rick-nook: thoughts ?
Jan 09 03:00:51 <Tibfib> doing a unified updates/installed packages list would streamline things better
Jan 09 03:01:19 <Loudergood> Tibfib: did you figure out your BBM questions?
Jan 09 03:01:30 <oil> well we split the installed out by category
Jan 09 03:01:36 <Tibfib> oh, not really, but I think I figured it out
Jan 09 03:01:39 <oil> because there is so many different things we install
Jan 09 03:02:21 <Tibfib> oil: well it can be changed easy. It shows list of installed packages by a-z... tap top right drop down to filter between type of item
Jan 09 03:02:21 <oil> and im not sure following palms installed/updates list is the best plan
Jan 09 03:02:32 <oil> how often do you go in there and scroll for a minute to see what needs udpating
Jan 09 03:02:41 <Tibfib> "Update All" button
Jan 09 03:02:41 <oil> because its at hte bottom
Jan 09 03:02:45 <oil> right
Jan 09 03:02:54 <oil> but its hard to see what packages have updates
Jan 09 03:03:02 <oil> when they're mixed in with the 100 other things you have installed
Jan 09 03:03:03 <Tibfib> have the packages with updates at top
Jan 09 03:03:25 <oil> that could work
Jan 09 03:03:30 <Loudergood> oil: I have to agree with you there, I hate that.
Jan 09 03:03:36 <oil> but it would still mean installed packages go back to a flat package list
Jan 09 03:03:38 <Loudergood> floating them to the top is a good idea
Jan 09 03:03:39 <oil> instead of categorized
Jan 09 03:03:48 <Tibfib> oil: do you like it categorized?
Jan 09 03:03:52 <oil> i do
Jan 09 03:03:59 <oil> though i normally have installed as available
Jan 09 03:04:03 <oil> so i type to find it
Jan 09 03:04:10 <oil> if i want to uninstall something peticular
Jan 09 03:04:13 <Tibfib> well the top right dropdown could have categories
Jan 09 03:04:30 <Tibfib> just like apps and patches
Jan 09 03:09:35 <Tibfib> any other thoughts?
Jan 09 03:10:02 <oil> im just wondering if we should bother changing whats there before enyo
Jan 09 03:10:08 <oil> which would completely change the interface anyways
Jan 09 03:11:23 <Tibfib> yeah.. I'm not necessarily saying it would have to be now.. just what is hoped for w/ enyo
Jan 09 03:11:28 <Tibfib> hoped/planned
Jan 09 03:13:44 <rwhitby> WebOS 2.0 app catalog what's new page is a step backwards from Preware's List of Everything.
Jan 09 03:14:32 <Tibfib> yep
Jan 09 03:15:14 <Tibfib> rwhitby: do you think I want to go there? if so, I didn't explain very well
Jan 09 03:16:02 <rwhitby> no, just saying that Palm's ideas are not automatically better :)
Jan 09 03:16:13 <Tibfib> no, definitely not. gotta pick and choose :)
Jan 09 03:19:32 <Tibfib> rwhitby: any other thoughts?
Jan 09 03:21:54 <rwhitby> my thoughts were to do the "All" on others, and to revamp saved packages.
Jan 09 03:22:18 <rwhitby> everything else needs a longer discussion
Jan 09 03:23:02 <Tibfib> sounds good
Jan 09 03:35:59 <tmandry> guys: what is NApp?
Jan 09 03:36:46 <halfhalo> a nap going to the bathroom?
Jan 09 03:37:13 <tmandry> :|
Jan 09 03:37:59 <tmandry> it seems to be an internal webos lib that handles hardware interfacing and event calls
Jan 09 03:38:17 <tmandry> but I was wondering if anyone had more insight than that
Jan 09 03:39:25 * halfhalo dunnos.  He is attending to more important things.  Like slots
Jan 09 04:08:51 <Tibfib> http://www.webos-internals.org/images/5/57/OPS_App_Mockup1.png when is this from?
Jan 09 04:10:01 <Tibfib> is "The "Pre" in "Preware" does not refer to the Palm Pre, it refers to "before" as far as app testing goes, and is a pun on "Freeware"
Jan 09 04:10:02 <Tibfib> " still true?
Jan 09 04:11:06 <ka6sox> Tibfib, that sounds reasonable :D
Jan 09 04:11:26 <Tibfib> heh, from http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Preware_Design
Jan 09 04:12:53 <rick-nook> Still true.  Evenmoreso now
Jan 09 04:24:57 <coveredwagonkid> rwhitby: i found some more info about my openssh issues
Jan 09 04:26:38 <coveredwagonkid> rwhitby: when i try to start the mobi.optware.openssh service, it looks like it opens and closes itself
Jan 09 04:27:06 <coveredwagonkid> rwhitby: https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B6mJ_KaEM1PYMzk2YTk2MDgtY2VhNC00ZDQ4LThhZjEtZTJjOWM4ZTgxY2Mz&sort=name&layout=list&num=50
Jan 09 04:32:08 <destinal> Tibfib: heh, there may be more than a coincidence behind the pre in preware, but "pre" as in before makes it a lot more universally applicable than just to Pre
Jan 09 04:33:05 <Tibfib> interesting
Jan 09 04:33:46 <SineOt> and sounds better than Pixiware
Jan 09 04:34:21 <destinal> Tibfib: especially since we're likely to have a bunch of other devices that won't have pre in their names that should be supported on preware as well
Jan 09 04:36:22 <halfhalo> other devices are shiny
Jan 09 04:50:35 <tmandry> woot
Jan 09 04:50:39 <tmandry> Qt fixed!
Jan 09 04:54:09 <coveredwagonkid> can anyone weigh in on why the openssh service would hit the respawn limit?
Jan 09 04:56:48 <destinal> coveredwagonkid: because it's dying when it starts?
Jan 09 04:57:28 <destinal> that will make it respawn over and over until upstart stops trying to start it.   or do you mean more, why does it die on startup?
Jan 09 04:58:16 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: why would it continually die on startup?
Jan 09 04:58:47 <destinal> coveredwagonkid: I don't know why yours is doing that.  I suggest you try running openssh by hand, not through upstart, and look for errors
Jan 09 04:58:50 <destinal> also check the log files
Jan 09 04:59:19 <ka6sox> isn't preware what you put on before your clothes?
Jan 09 04:59:30 <destinal> ka6sox: lol
Jan 09 05:02:40 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: i have tried to start the service manually
Jan 09 05:03:04 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: i posted a link a little while to a lumberjack log export
Jan 09 05:03:36 <destinal> coveredwagonkid: try pastebin rather than google docs
Jan 09 05:03:54 <destinal> easier
Jan 09 05:04:16 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: google docs is just something i already had. will do on the pastebin
Jan 09 05:04:28 <destinal> it's easier for us to read too
Jan 09 05:05:13 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: the google docs is just a txt file, so formatting shouldnt be an issue
Jan 09 05:05:32 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: i didnt have google auto convert it
Jan 09 05:06:07 <destinal> coveredwagonkid: cool, well yeah when you get a pastebin up let me know :)
Jan 09 05:07:00 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: http://pastebin.com/HiktDiaA
Jan 09 05:07:36 <destinal> coveredwagonkid: eh, nothing really useful in all that
Jan 09 05:07:49 <destinal> coveredwagonkid: try running sshd by hand
Jan 09 05:07:51 <destinal> not the service
Jan 09 05:08:25 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: rwhitby suggested looking at /var/log/messages but im still parsing it...
Jan 09 05:08:45 <destinal> coveredwagonkid: yeah, grep ssh /var/log/messages    would be useful;
Jan 09 05:08:59 <ka6sox> coveredwagonkid, the issue with googledocs is that it disappears...(like it did for me)
Jan 09 05:09:03 <ka6sox> poof
Jan 09 05:10:45 <coveredwagonkid> http://pastebin.com/a2tNmiCj
Jan 09 05:11:01 <coveredwagonkid> thats the full dump from /var/log/messages
Jan 09 05:11:19 <coveredwagonkid> its from a few hours ago
Jan 09 05:11:43 <coveredwagonkid> i can pull a more recent one if that would help
Jan 09 05:14:31 <destinal> coveredwagonkid: nah, not seeing anything useful there either.  just try running sshd by hand
Jan 09 05:14:51 <destinal> maybe it'll spit something out on stderr
Jan 09 05:16:43 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: at the moment, i dont believe i have any other rsa keys loaded on this thing
Jan 09 05:17:47 <destinal> coveredwagonkid: not sure how that's relevant though
Jan 09 05:18:57 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: if i tried to use my pre as a client, wont it throw a fit if i dont have an auth key established with the server?
Jan 09 05:19:35 <destinal> coveredwagonkid: not saying to do anything like that.  just try running the ssh daemon binary from whatever shell you're doing all this stuff in
Jan 09 05:19:51 <destinal> so you can see what errors it outputs when it crashes and burns
Jan 09 05:20:01 <coveredwagonkid> regardless, "ssh -v" doesnt yield anything bad
Jan 09 05:20:11 <destinal> not the ssh client, the ssh server / daemon
Jan 09 05:20:42 <destinal> sshd
Jan 09 05:20:42 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: my bad, ive probably been looking at those logs too much
Jan 09 05:21:28 <destinal> coveredwagonkid: in /etc/event.d   find the mobi.optware.openssh  or whatever the name of the service is and read that configuration file to find out what command it runs to start the server binary
Jan 09 05:21:37 <destinal> then run that by hand on the command line yourself
Jan 09 05:22:15 <destinal> this way you can actually see the errors which you can't when it's running as a service through upstart
Jan 09 05:34:51 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: running the exec line from the conf file just results in nothing
Jan 09 05:35:28 <coveredwagonkid> destinal: idle cursor without prompt
Jan 09 05:36:05 <destinal> coveredwagonkid: that'll mean it's running in the foreground
Jan 09 05:36:47 <coveredwagonkid> hmmm
Jan 09 05:36:51 <destinal> as opposed to crashing
Jan 09 05:36:53 <destinal> interesting
Jan 09 05:39:06 <coveredwagonkid> would having the pre in dev mode affect how openssh would act?
Jan 09 05:46:53 <coveredwagonkid> while i wait for my pre to restart again, i have another potenitally stupid question
Jan 09 05:48:35 <coveredwagonkid> how often does ipkg.preware.org/feeds/ update the palm app catalog package list?
Jan 09 13:40:49 <ZehHa> coverdwagonkid: Got your problm
Jan 09 13:41:03 <ZehHa> problems solved?
Jan 09 13:42:10 <ZehHa> Anyone knows why precentral.net is down?
Jan 09 13:44:06 <rwhitby> ZehHa: seems fine here
Jan 09 13:46:14 <ZehHa> rwhitby: OK, then maybe it's a problem with my companys  internet access.
Jan 09 13:47:47 <ZehHa> rwhitby: Albeit all the other sites are loading fine.
Jan 09 13:50:31 <ZehHa> rwhitby: BTW - many, many thanks for all your efforts for webos!
Jan 09 13:50:39 <rwhitby> yw
Jan 09 13:56:47 <ZehHa> rwhitby: Yes, just opened the precentral site on my pre via mobile data connection; all is fine. Maybe my company's IT team blacklisted precentral.net...
Jan 09 13:57:27 <Loudergood> too much traffic going there ;)
Jan 09 13:59:58 <ZehHa> Yeah... And all from my working place... ;-)
Jan 09 14:04:24 <ZehHa> I would like to run OpenCPN on my Pre. But this needs full OpenGL (not only OpenGL-ES), wxWidgets, and gtk. Any chance to get it built on the Pre?
Jan 09 15:46:06 <ZehHa> Magically precentral.net is working again here in DE. :-D
Jan 09 17:12:54 <lumines> im trying to set up ssh on my pixi but i dont know which username is right. ive never set a password for root or any other user.
Jan 09 17:13:03 <lumines> thw wiki says > From a remote system SSH to your Pre using //your// username
Jan 09 17:13:20 <lumines> which is //my// username? D:
Jan 09 17:30:48 <lumines> ok, telnet works
Jan 09 17:31:06 <lumines> but i cant change the password with passwd
Jan 09 17:32:16 <lumines> hm :/
Jan 09 18:03:57 <fudge_> Could the pre2's os be ported over to the pixi regardless of hardware differences?
Jan 09 18:05:23 <bpadalino> fudge_: can you clarify what you're asking ?
Jan 09 18:07:04 <fudge_> could webos 2.0 be ported over to the pix
Jan 09 18:07:08 <fudge_> pixi*
Jan 09 18:08:05 <halfhalo> why would you....
Jan 09 18:08:14 <bpadalino> you mean from the webos doctors, or from the webos source?
Jan 09 18:08:21 <fudge_> webos doctors
Jan 09 18:08:23 <halfhalo> palm is releasing it for the pixi themselves evetually
Jan 09 18:08:36 <bpadalino> no
Jan 09 18:08:47 <fudge_> halfhalo: any specified date?
Jan 09 18:08:57 <fudge_> what about from the source bpadalino
Jan 09 18:09:07 <bpadalino> mark your calendar for feb 9th and wait for the webos event from hp
Jan 09 18:09:09 <halfhalo> what source
Jan 09 18:09:21 <bpadalino> fudge_: from hp's internal source, i am sure it's significantly easier
Jan 09 18:09:30 <fudge_> oh ok
Jan 09 18:10:00 <fudge_> anyone here has a pixi btw?
Jan 09 18:10:06 <bpadalino> lots of people
Jan 09 18:10:06 <halfhalo> heh... getting som androd tablets
Jan 09 18:10:09 <fudge_> lol
Jan 09 18:10:17 <bpadalino> i believe it's the preferred form factor for some people as well
Jan 09 18:10:40 <fudge_> anyone getting the buggy touch screen after they install overclock
Jan 09 18:10:58 <fudge_> i noticed when the phone gets hot, the screen fails to function till it cools back down
Jan 09 18:11:05 <bpadalino> whoops
Jan 09 18:11:19 <Loudergood> you may want to set your overclock lower
Jan 09 18:11:33 <Loudergood> my pre doesn't really like 1GHz
Jan 09 18:11:44 <fudge_> lol
Jan 09 18:11:47 <halfhalo> review units ftw
Jan 09 18:12:05 <fudge_> i play nfsu a lot, i need the highest clock
Jan 09 18:12:35 <fudge_> sometimes i take off the back cover to keep it cool
Jan 09 18:12:39 <halfhalo> well, since your pixi can't take it...
Jan 09 18:12:51 <bpadalino> strap an ice pack to it
Jan 09 18:12:55 <fudge_> lol
Jan 09 18:13:08 <halfhalo> I like that plan
Jan 09 18:13:12 <Loudergood> a little dry ice wont hurt it any
Jan 09 18:13:26 <Loudergood> might even be able to push it higher
Jan 09 18:13:38 <fudge_> Loudergood: whats the highest temp your pre had
Jan 09 18:14:12 <Loudergood> I actually don't know
Jan 09 18:14:14 <fudge_> i get as high as 120f with mobile hotspot and nfsu running
Jan 09 18:14:15 <fudge_> oh
Jan 09 18:14:24 <Loudergood> I set it to 800mhz and never looked back
Jan 09 18:14:24 <halfhalo> wow
Jan 09 18:14:28 <halfhalo> umm
Jan 09 18:14:37 <halfhalo> 120f Is a tad high
Jan 09 18:14:57 <fudge_> yea i know. feels like its gonna cetch fire
Jan 09 18:15:14 <fudge_> but i could care less. im due for an upgrade anyway
Jan 09 18:15:17 <Loudergood> that's not a bad temp for a desktop CPU, but a mobile one...
Jan 09 18:15:21 <fudge_> lol
Jan 09 18:15:30 <bpadalino> the part is probably only rated to +45C  .. so .. you may want to not do that
Jan 09 18:15:31 <Loudergood> I wonder if you could make it catch fire..
Jan 09 18:15:48 <bpadalino> you'd reflow the solder balls before you have it catch fire
Jan 09 18:16:03 <Loudergood> that's true
Jan 09 18:16:14 <Loudergood> unless they cause a short which starts a fire ;)
Jan 09 18:16:27 <halfhalo> or it was in gas
Jan 09 18:16:32 <halfhalo> with a short
Jan 09 18:16:33 <Loudergood> lol
Jan 09 18:16:40 <fudge_> lol
Jan 09 18:16:51 <Loudergood> yes, if we pour gasoline on it that would make it easier
Jan 09 18:16:52 <bpadalino> the battery getting hot would probably be the thing to explode ..
Jan 09 18:16:53 <halfhalo> home time soon finally
Jan 09 18:17:03 <bpadalino> those lion's do nasty things when they burst
Jan 09 18:17:27 <halfhalo> and soon demo archos units
Jan 09 18:18:02 <fudge_> http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh274/RobertR_93/photos-temp-0jpg-22.jpg?t=1294596821
Jan 09 18:18:15 <halfhalo> for... review.  yes. review.  let's go with that
Jan 09 18:18:47 <fudge_> 124f just sitting there charging
Jan 09 18:19:52 <fudge_> is there any way to get the pixi to run faster without OC'ing
Jan 09 18:21:37 <bpadalino> more exercise
Jan 09 18:21:53 <fudge_> lol
Jan 09 18:22:20 <fudge_> is there a channel for beta testing a kernel/patch
Jan 09 18:22:31 <fudge_> i have a second pixi thats just sitting here collecting dust
Jan 09 18:23:37 <halfhalo> this is that channel
Jan 09 18:23:43 <halfhalo> OF DOOM
Jan 09 18:24:29 <fudge_> lol
Jan 09 18:24:48 <fudge_> anything i could test as of right now
Jan 09 18:25:47 <halfhalo> dunno
Jan 09 18:25:55 <fudge_> ok
Jan 09 18:26:17 * halfhalo is on a bus going back to hotel to get car and drive home
Jan 09 18:26:39 <fudge_> using wirc?
Jan 09 18:26:45 <halfhalo> no
Jan 09 18:27:03 <halfhalo> I type in binary using telnet
Jan 09 18:27:34 <fudge_> i c
Jan 09 18:28:16 * halfhalo has an android phone
Jan 09 18:30:49 <halfhalo> even in the middle of overpriced vegas, gas is still cheaper tan socal
Jan 09 18:31:48 <fudge_> halfhalo: what brand/model is your andriod
Jan 09 18:32:31 <halfhalo> current one is epic 4g
Jan 09 18:32:46 <fudge_> oh
Jan 09 18:32:51 * halfhalo has many
Jan 09 18:32:59 <fudge_> lol do you have the intercept
Jan 09 18:33:13 <halfhalo> maybe
Jan 09 18:33:30 * halfhalo gets free swag^H^Hdemo units
Jan 09 18:33:39 <fudge_> nice
Jan 09 18:34:00 <fudge_> i was gonna go for the intercept until i read it has a crazy resolution
Jan 09 20:34:49 <tmandry> rwhitby: ok so Qt wasn't working (programs would segfault), I patched it and it works now. can I give you the patch? or I have it set up to compile in WIDK, I can give you that
Jan 09 20:56:13 <fudge_> any word yet for a flashlight on the pixi
Jan 09 21:45:03 <rwhitby> tmandry: please check the packages into the WIDK
Jan 09 22:06:03 <tmandry> rwhitby: ok. I can keep it in nonworking/ if you want since it's big and takes a long time to fetch
Jan 09 22:07:57 <tmandry> of course that hasn't really been an issue in the past :p
Jan 09 22:17:46 <rwhitby> tmandry: put it under dev-qt - we'll need to make the default target not build everything, and this is a good trigger.
Jan 09 22:17:52 * rwhitby bbl
Jan 09 22:20:56 <Shaikh> msg/ destinal Hey! I saw the WebOS 2.0 on the pre plus! Is that just a developer or did your plan work out as you wanted it to? haha
Jan 09 22:21:06 <Shaikh> hehe
Jan 09 22:21:11 <Shaikh> oops
Jan 09 22:22:48 <destinal> Shaikh: I think that was someone with a pirated copy of an early access software
Jan 09 22:23:12 <destinal> or a legitimate copy, even
Jan 09 22:23:19 <destinal> don't know where you saw it so not sure
Jan 09 22:23:27 <Shaikh> on precentral
Jan 09 22:23:42 <Shaikh> http://www.precentral.net/webos-2-0-poses-video-pre-plus
Jan 09 22:24:16 <Shaikh> ahh well then I guess it wasnt your doing.
Jan 09 22:24:32 <Shaikh> How is your research coming along?
Jan 09 22:24:36 <destinal> Shaikh: nah, if I get something working, it'll be everywhere :)
Jan 09 22:25:01 <Shaikh> awesome :)
Jan 09 22:25:57 <destinal> I keep pointing out that it may not be possible in the short term though since we may be missing files for castle where roadrunner versions won't work and that we can't easily create
Jan 09 22:26:19 <destinal> I'm experimenting but still hitting the SGX graphics core issues
Jan 09 22:26:21 <SineOt> I thought that was already known, destinal
Jan 09 22:26:37 <SineOt> can't remember who but someone basically narrowed it down to the binaries for the video drivers I thought
Jan 09 22:26:52 <destinal> SineOt: me and egaudet and a couple other folks
Jan 09 22:26:52 <Shaikh> it is known! and I have been told. But I saw that article on precentral and thought maybe it had been fixed.
Jan 09 22:27:11 <destinal> SineOt: that doesn't mean I've given up entirely
Jan 09 22:29:25 <destinal> SineOt: when we were running into issues and supposedly palm was releasing 2.0 for one of the carriers on pre in December I figured it wasn't that long to wait.  now from what we're hearing, we have no idea how long and it may be quite a while
Jan 09 22:33:07 <SineOt> I think we'll hear something at the event in Feb, but if it's an Oprah moment "GO DOWNLOAD IT NOW!!!" or a "few more weeks" thing IDK
Jan 09 22:34:07 <destinal> I suspect we'll get dates for webos 2.0 on castle at the event along with announcements for new tablets and phones there also but I doubt it will be a Steve Jobs "in the online store TODAY"
Jan 09 22:34:40 <SineOt> I wonder if Sprint still needs to approve updates, even if they've EOL'd the device.
Jan 09 22:35:10 <destinal> SineOt: EOL in this context is just end of new sales, not end of support
Jan 09 22:35:51 <destinal> support, new versions etc will continue with Sprint as it has before I imagine
Jan 09 22:36:44 <SineOt> Yeah, but can you honestly say that an EOL'd device with a new update will be very high on their priority list to get through, when they know that the platform won't be adding any new users and dwindling as people upgrade? :p
Jan 09 22:37:01 <SineOt> Sounds like something just asking for a 4 month delay from submission to OTA
Jan 09 22:37:22 <destinal> I doubt they'll lag behind that much, they still want to keep their customers happy
Jan 09 22:37:58 <destinal> so they get their new phone on sprint, not switch to another carrier etc
Jan 09 22:38:41 <destinal> plus Pixi is still being sold, and who knows if one of these new phones is headed to Sprint..
Jan 09 22:46:41 <SineOt> True.
Jan 09 22:47:03 <SineOt> But even then, the Pixi update would be a whole 'nother beast compared to the Pre one, especially on Sprint. No Wifi!
Jan 09 23:08:50 <tmandry> rwhitby: done
Jan 09 23:51:28 <fudge_> can someone explain to me how webos doctor knows which phone (pixi/pre) is connected to the pc?
Jan 09 23:51:45 <fudge_> iirc, it reads a xml file
Jan 09 23:51:59 <fudge_> or token
Jan 09 23:52:49 <rwhitby> it reads the tokens from the device
Jan 09 23:52:57 <fudge_> ok
Jan 09 23:53:52 <fudge_> just a theory; if i were to change a token value from a pixi to the value of a pre, would i technically be able to install webos for pre on a pixi?
Jan 09 23:54:00 * halfhalo is home finally
Jan 09 23:54:14 <rwhitby> fudge_: yes, but it would not boot
Jan 09 23:54:26 <fudge_> yeah, hardware and so on
Jan 09 23:54:30 <fudge_> just wondering :P
Jan 09 23:54:54 <rwhitby> just the small thing that the kernels are completely different
Jan 09 23:56:10 <fudge_> i see
Jan 09 23:57:02 <fudge_> could one possibly edit the kernel
Jan 09 23:57:18 <fudge_> modify it to pixi's specs, etc..
Jan 10 00:00:20 <rwhitby> well, you'd use the pixi kernel instead
Jan 10 00:07:47 <jhojho> rwhitby: actually, other binaries might not work if they have been compiled armv7 only
Jan 10 00:08:11 <rwhitby> indeed, a whole lot of things won't work. the kernel is just the first :)
Jan 10 00:57:33 <am1n0> hello
Jan 10 01:01:41 <am1n0> I'm about to doctor my phone, so I'm backing up appropriate things. I save/restored, exported contacts, et cetera. I sshed into the phone and began to cp -R /var /media/internal/var. It gave me errors regarding teh device files it found in the jails and the symlinks it found, expected, as you cant create symlinks/device files on a fat fs. My phone's screen then turned black (backlit) and it started to reboot. The palm logo is static now, and 
Jan 10 01:02:07 <am1n0> I'm assuming that the kernel crashed, but what action could copying have done to render the phone unstable?
Jan 10 01:10:19 <rwhitby> am1n0: copying from /proc or /sys can reboot a Pre
Jan 10 01:10:38 <rwhitby> am1n0: you should use the meta-doctor's "make backup" low-level filesystem dump feature
Jan 10 01:27:23 <fudge_> any kernels that are in beta that run above 800mhz
Jan 10 01:27:47 <msd181989> hey anyone active
Jan 10 01:43:00 <tmandry> what's the difference between EGL and GLUES? heh
Jan 10 01:50:01 <am1n0> rwhitby: sorry, my terminal pinged out and i didn't realize. that would make sense. i need to be less brute-force next time. ill go try meta-doctor's backup now. thanks.
Jan 10 01:51:26 <rwhitby> am1n0: meta-doctor's backup will even work when the kernel doesn't boot
Jan 10 01:51:56 <rwhitby> (it uses a memboot kernel and initramfs to do the work)
Jan 10 01:52:15 <am1n0> funky. kernel/ramdisk extracted from the doctor right?
Jan 10 01:53:03 <ka6sox-away> am1n0, thats what palm does with the doctor....no "extraction"
Jan 10 01:53:30 <am1n0> i did know that, but i don't have X on this box that i'm running the meta doctor from
Jan 10 01:54:19 <ka6sox-away> am1n0, you mean for running the java of the doctor?
Jan 10 01:54:24 <am1n0> yes
Jan 10 01:54:47 <am1n0> i make the patched doctor and then i move it over to a windows box and run it from there
Jan 10 01:55:06 <ka6sox-away> am1n0, thats what I do to
Jan 10 01:55:11 <ka6sox-away> +o
Jan 10 01:55:21 <am1n0> oy
Jan 10 01:55:30 <am1n0> novacom does not like my linux box for some reason
Jan 10 01:55:58 <am1n0> anyone seen this before
Jan 10 01:56:00 <am1n0> http://pastebin.com/5WyWsNWh
Jan 10 01:56:01 <am1n0> ?
Jan 10 01:57:04 <am1n0> it's recognized as a Manufacturer: bootie device
Jan 10 01:57:12 <am1n0> but doesn't look like any kind of interface is loaded for it
Jan 10 01:57:45 <am1n0> i cant do the novacom < uImage from my windows computer, can i?
Jan 10 01:58:14 <ka6sox-away> if you have the novacom driver on your windows machine yes
Jan 10 01:58:36 <am1n0> ok good. i do
Jan 10 01:58:46 <ka6sox-away> novacom boot mem file:// < uImage
Jan 10 02:01:29 * halfhalo yawns and ponders working on code
Jan 10 02:03:06 <am1n0> oy. now it's being recognized as a "novacom (bootie)"
Jan 10 02:03:09 <am1n0> this hasnt happened before
Jan 10 02:03:13 <am1n0> usually it's just a "novacom"
Jan 10 02:03:16 <am1n0> and drivers are installed
Jan 10 02:03:55 * halfhalo goes meh
Jan 10 02:04:19 <destinal> am1n0: novacom(bootie) means it's in the bootloader
Jan 10 02:04:35 <am1n0> but it needs a driver, right?
Jan 10 02:04:39 <destinal> no
Jan 10 02:04:41 <ka6sox> no
Jan 10 02:04:43 <am1n0> oh
Jan 10 02:04:44 <am1n0> odd
Jan 10 02:04:45 <am1n0> ok
Jan 10 02:04:46 <destinal> ka6sox also gave you the wrong command
Jan 10 02:04:52 <ka6sox> yes I did
Jan 10 02:04:53 <am1n0> tty:// ?
Jan 10 02:05:17 <ka6sox> doesn't he need to be in recovery mode first?
Jan 10 02:05:19 <rwhitby> instead of typing commands here, just look in the Meta-Doctor Makefile
Jan 10 02:05:28 <destinal> novacom boot mem:// < nova-installer-image-castle.uImage
Jan 10 02:05:34 <am1n0> ka6sox: i am
Jan 10 02:05:47 <destinal> am1n0: metadctor has makefile targets to do this all for you
Jan 10 02:05:52 * rwhitby always wonders why people retype stuff instead of just pointing to tested documents or sources :)
Jan 10 02:06:00 <halfhalo> Laziness
Jan 10 02:06:03 <am1n0> destinal: not on windows, sorry
Jan 10 02:06:12 <halfhalo> And general ineptitude
Jan 10 02:06:14 <am1n0> naah, i used to go to ##linux and tell people to read manpages
Jan 10 02:06:17 <am1n0> and look at me now
Jan 10 02:06:51 <destinal> am1n0: what are you trying to do?
Jan 10 02:08:59 <am1n0> well it actually didn't work until I ran the c program files palm dpinst.exe
Jan 10 02:09:10 <am1n0> where it installed a driver and novacom's command completed successfully
Jan 10 02:09:19 <am1n0> however the kernel is still hanging
Jan 10 02:09:37 <am1n0> destinal: the phone is no longer booting.
Jan 10 02:11:12 <destinal> am1n0: have you tried following last resort recovery in the wiki?
Jan 10 02:11:27 <am1n0> though, i gotta say, more documentation on the other targets in the makefile would be helpful ;)
Jan 10 02:11:35 <destinal> under Alternative Recovery
Jan 10 02:12:21 * halfhalo votes for markdownified docs
Jan 10 02:12:24 <am1n0> oh ok one second
Jan 10 02:12:51 <destinal> you novacom boot mem:// < nova-installer-image-castle.uImage      --  wait 15 seconds or so for the system to load,   run novaterm     (or novacom open tty://  would work as well)
Jan 10 02:13:32 <destinal> then there are some commands there to load up the LVM volumes and mount filesystems
Jan 10 02:13:34 <am1n0> it is an "unknown device"
Jan 10 02:13:41 <am1n0> yeah i read the makefile now ;p
Jan 10 02:13:47 <am1n0> should i reboot?
Jan 10 02:14:34 <destinal> am1n0: you need to get back into recovery mode,  novacom boot mem yourself a kernel, then novaterm in and mount up the filesystems,   (if you're not having metadoctor do it for you)
Jan 10 02:14:49 <am1n0> i am not, doing it manually.
Jan 10 02:14:55 <am1n0> i went into recovery mode, booted a kernel
Jan 10 02:15:04 <am1n0> the bootie device got detached
Jan 10 02:15:09 <am1n0> and now "usb device now recognized"
Jan 10 02:15:13 <am1n0> so i can't run novacom
Jan 10 02:15:19 <am1n0> should i leave the phone as-is and reboot hte computer?
Jan 10 02:15:56 <destinal> am1n0: I'd try reinstalling the novacom drivers
Jan 10 02:16:09 <destinal> this is an pre or pre+  (castle?)
Jan 10 02:16:14 <am1n0> castle
Jan 10 02:16:51 <destinal> yeah, try installing the novacom drivers from the doctor you're using
Jan 10 02:16:58 <destinal> should be an msi there
Jan 10 02:17:19 <am1n0> now it is an unknown composite device
Jan 10 02:17:21 <destinal> this is all so much more consistent and sane in linux than in windows IMO
Jan 10 02:18:02 <destinal> whenever you get into messing with usb devices designed for debugging things, linux is way easier
Jan 10 02:18:14 <am1n0> yeah i know
Jan 10 02:18:20 <am1n0> trust me-- i love linux
Jan 10 02:18:22 <am1n0> i would rather use it
Jan 10 02:18:36 <am1n0> but no interface is being installed for the bootie device at lesat
Jan 10 02:18:41 <am1n0> and novacom throws a fit
Jan 10 02:18:45 <am1n0> novacomd*
Jan 10 02:18:53 <destinal> am1n0: did you reinstall novacom drivers yet?
Jan 10 02:19:02 <am1n0> running dpinst.exe ?
Jan 10 02:19:05 <destinal> no
Jan 10 02:19:11 <am1n0> or NovacomInstallerx86.msi (or whatever is in the jar)
Jan 10 02:19:14 <destinal> yes
Jan 10 02:19:24 <am1n0> ok one moment
Jan 10 02:19:59 <am1n0> just for the record
Jan 10 02:20:05 <am1n0> now that is not in bootiemode
Jan 10 02:20:13 <am1n0> it is being recognized as a scsi generic
Jan 10 02:20:19 <am1n0> on linux at least
Jan 10 02:20:23 <am1n0> but lets try windows again
Jan 10 02:21:04 <am1n0> still unrecognizable :/
Jan 10 02:23:26 <destinal> am1n0: but does novacom see it?
Jan 10 02:24:16 <destinal> am1n0: and if you have linux why not just use that?
Jan 10 02:24:32 <am1n0> waiting on windows
Jan 10 02:24:34 <am1n0> http://pastebin.com/5WyWsNWh
Jan 10 02:24:37 <am1n0> just btw
Jan 10 02:25:04 <destinal> am1n0: what linux distribution?
Jan 10 02:25:07 <am1n0> opensuse 11.3
Jan 10 02:25:13 <am1n0> i extracted the deb file
Jan 10 02:25:14 <destinal> there's a known issue
Jan 10 02:25:16 <am1n0> from hp
Jan 10 02:25:17 <am1n0> ah
Jan 10 02:25:20 <am1n0> that would do it
Jan 10 02:25:43 <destinal> http://forums.precentral.net/web-os-development/238270-novacom-not-connect-opensuse-11-2-a.html
Jan 10 02:25:59 <am1n0> "unable to find device"
Jan 10 02:26:18 <am1n0> odd. i googled te error earlier
Jan 10 02:26:20 <am1n0> did not find that post
Jan 10 02:26:55 <bpadalino> that's why destinal has a + next to his name
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Jan 10 02:59:58 2011