**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Aug 17 02:59:57 2011 Aug 17 03:01:36 dtzWill: I absolutely love znc and it hasn't hurt my irc usage at all Aug 17 03:01:43 it's just makes things awesome. Aug 17 03:01:50 s/it's/it/ Aug 17 03:01:50 Tibfib meant: it just makes things awesome. Aug 17 03:01:51 sigh. Aug 17 03:06:45 I might like bnc's more if I didn't prefer to cli it Aug 17 03:07:01 and if I kept an autossh open for port forwarding Aug 17 03:20:05 dwc-, can use a bouncer with irssi Aug 17 03:20:20 irssi on TP sucks ass Aug 17 03:20:21 so Aug 17 03:20:24 there Aug 17 03:20:45 I use irssi on my shell Aug 17 03:20:51 but you can use irssi as a bnc Aug 17 03:20:55 and point your device at that Aug 17 03:21:06 wirc can connect to irssi proxy Aug 17 03:21:09 wirc, irssi, bitchx, whatever Aug 17 03:21:11 yes Aug 17 03:21:23 ZNC FTW Aug 17 03:21:39 +1 Aug 17 03:46:31 does anyone know where emails are stored in webos Aug 17 03:46:36 ? Aug 17 03:48:48 does the TP tether with bluetooth freeTether? Aug 17 03:49:23 nfc Aug 17 03:49:27 why not just use wifi Aug 17 03:59:00 summatusmentis: because, if its already connected to the pre via bluetooth for sms/call fwd'ing why not do internet that way too? Aug 17 03:59:14 /var/luna/data/emails of course :) Aug 17 03:59:37 gQuigs: why? Aug 17 03:59:49 I want to back up the emails Aug 17 03:59:58 lost access to the web server Aug 17 04:00:04 aren't they backed up on teh server---nevermind Aug 17 04:00:07 email bodies are stored in the filecache Aug 17 04:02:15 where is the filecache? Aug 17 04:02:42 type "mount" and you should see it Aug 17 04:02:46 I think I am looking at partial emails now... Aug 17 04:04:00 any other names for it? Aug 17 04:05:56 anyone tried to use a save/restore from a phone on the TouchPad? Aug 17 04:07:37 lol, wut? Aug 17 04:08:04 if I run save/restore on my phone, and put the dir on my touchpad, will it work..? Aug 17 04:10:09 I think it depends on the app Aug 17 04:10:17 but mostly yes iirc Aug 17 04:10:32 ah good Aug 17 04:20:34 hey all. installing widk and getting 'make: VBoxManage: Command not found' during 'make setup' Aug 17 04:21:22 I'm hosting on Windows, installing into an Ubuntu 11.04 VM Aug 17 04:21:28 32 bit Aug 17 04:32:24 ok, installed vbox server & qt libs into the ubuntu VM. I have VBoxManage now.. Aug 17 05:24:40 PuffTheMagic: TIDE, git or testing feeds? Aug 17 05:25:23 yes Aug 17 05:26:24 shall I build it from git or get it from the testing feeds? Aug 17 05:26:43 yes Aug 17 05:27:36 mmm.... o_O both? Aug 17 05:27:47 you could Aug 17 05:27:55 it is in testing feed Aug 17 05:27:59 build it if you want Aug 17 05:28:18 Ok, thanks :) Aug 17 07:05:00 Does xecutah's xserver not support ssh x forwarding? Aug 17 07:06:23 rrix: http://git.webos-internals.org/x11/xlauncher/tree/xecutah.sh is how it is started Aug 17 07:08:13 odd Aug 17 07:48:49 forwarding isn't part of the x server Aug 17 07:49:47 check that forwarding is on, that your display is set correctly, etc Aug 17 07:49:57 x cookie stuff works, etc Aug 17 12:43:16 so when the host server got bounced you didn't re-join Aug 17 12:43:22 argh... Aug 17 13:56:22 hey all, noticed that in xterm that ctrl on the bluetooth keyboard isn't recognized. I've got no Ctrl+c or Ctrl+[, etc. known issue? Aug 17 13:56:53 I'm getting set up to contribute, but have just been too busy with work lately Aug 17 13:57:34 fprimex, well known issue Aug 17 13:57:51 okie doke, thanks Aug 17 14:11:57 rrix: forwarding should work. i suppose i haven't tested it via xecutah for sure, but definitely a preferred way to test x server earlier on Aug 17 14:12:33 worst case you need to add a launch option, but i don't think so. just set DISPLAY=:0.0 and ssh out (-Y or so). Aug 17 14:12:42 lmk if that doesn't work for you :) Aug 17 14:21:14 anyone know if changes I specifically made to certain OEM AppInfo.json files (hiding from launcher) need to be reverted before an OTA update? Aug 17 14:23:16 I run EPR before very OTA update Aug 17 14:23:21 just to be safe Aug 17 14:38:30 dtzWill & rrix X forwarding works. when you ssh you need to use the -X flag and have DISPLAY set. If you are using the developer ssh setup(dropbear/Busybox version) it does not support -X so you will most likely need to use OpenSSH from optware in preware Aug 17 14:39:08 Does patching the LunaSysMgr binary break any "rules"? (or is this already being done by other patches?) Aug 17 15:33:25 Greetings, Programs Aug 17 15:46:40 trsohmers, greetings, User Aug 17 15:47:16 And how is the grid treating you, NuttyBunny Aug 17 15:48:04 Nice, too much work, so little time, but I think I'll manage it Aug 17 15:49:05 Heh Aug 17 15:49:40 So for some reason, Staples thought they made a mistake and gave me an EXTRA $100 discount ontop of the coupon and HP discount on my 32gb touchpad Aug 17 15:49:50 nice Aug 17 15:50:05 So i got my 32gb touchpad for $299 Aug 17 15:53:02 wow Aug 17 15:53:13 mine is $324 with my discount :/ Aug 17 15:53:17 but I'm happy :) Aug 17 15:53:25 trsohmers, wow, nice! Aug 17 15:53:51 Yea, I was really surprised Aug 17 15:54:12 Going to be presenting the Touchpad at a tablet wars linux user group meeting tonight Aug 17 15:54:19 nice Aug 17 15:54:27 awesome Aug 17 15:54:29 but ubuntu on there Aug 17 15:54:33 put* Aug 17 15:54:34 That's what I'm doing now Aug 17 15:54:35 make sure to Ubuntu chroot :) Aug 17 15:54:37 ^ Aug 17 15:54:41 awesome lol Aug 17 15:54:51 Having issues with metadoctor Aug 17 15:54:55 trying Aug 17 15:55:08 trying to install the dependencies on OSX… not showing up Aug 17 15:55:13 so going around and finding them manually Aug 17 15:55:14 not compiling, or failing? Aug 17 15:55:18 ah Aug 17 15:55:19 both Aug 17 15:55:25 Homebrew wasn't working Aug 17 15:55:29 if it was ubuntu, I have a fix.. but not osx Aug 17 15:55:41 It needs like.... make and java. not all that cmplicated Aug 17 15:55:46 So just reinstalled macports…it wasn't working a couple of weeks ago so I uninstalled it Aug 17 15:55:56 half halo it also needs some other stuff Aug 17 15:56:44 Yea, macports is working Aug 17 15:57:04 I like homebrew more though… gives you status of downloads and stuff Aug 17 15:57:32 Heh, whatever gets this working Aug 17 15:58:11 So you guys ported Xorg to the touchpad? Very impressive…been trying to get it working on Android for a couple of months Aug 17 15:58:30 wow, it needs wget eh. thats a bummer Aug 17 15:58:55 lol Aug 17 15:58:58 wget works Aug 17 15:59:33 I was having issues with gnutar and git-core Aug 17 16:00:45 So I was reading about Xecutah… does it work well on the touchpad? Aug 17 16:01:12 decently well Aug 17 16:01:51 I have a native install of Ubuntu working on my Xoom, but it is VERY buggy Aug 17 16:01:56 touchscreen doesn't currently work Aug 17 16:02:06 Haven't bothered releasing it Aug 17 16:10:11 How long does it usually take for you guys to charge your touchpads? Aug 17 16:10:34 we talking completely dead or almost dead? Aug 17 16:11:01 either Aug 17 16:11:10 I started charging mine about an hour and 15 minutes ago at 3% Aug 17 16:11:16 and it is at 15% now Aug 17 16:12:45 USB/TouchStone/wall? Aug 17 16:12:50 if its completely dead it will only trickle charge until there is enough power to get the low level charging stuff going on the TP, and after that it will charge pretty quickly if left idle/not doing much. Aug 17 16:13:23 Wall Aug 17 16:13:51 are you restoring apps/installing apps on it? Aug 17 16:13:58 halfhalo-work: you got a touchstone? Aug 17 16:14:02 Nope, it is just sitting their Aug 17 16:14:03 there* Aug 17 16:14:04 oy Aug 17 16:14:25 PatrickC: yes. Aug 17 16:14:42 is it worth the $79? Aug 17 16:15:29 trsohmers, are you charging with the official palm charger? Aug 17 16:15:35 trsohmers: iiinnnnteresting. should be charging faster than that. but it may be running some other stuff in the background right now Aug 17 16:15:49 PatrickC: don't know, didn't pay 79 for it Aug 17 16:16:00 Yes, the USB wall charger that came with it Aug 17 16:16:24 halfhalo-work: free thru work? Aug 17 16:17:24 no, I just know how to google. Aug 17 16:17:50 There was a coupon or something? Aug 17 16:18:44 no, but its cheaper some places online Aug 17 16:20:34 link? Aug 17 16:20:39 google isn't turning up much Aug 17 16:22:18 have you tried googling for touchstone. then going to google shopping. Aug 17 16:22:44 I googled 'hp touchpad touchstone cheap' Aug 17 16:25:08 halfhalo-work: never mind. its cheaper on HP's site then anywhere lol Aug 17 16:45:50 trsohmers: get it working? Aug 17 16:45:58 Waiting for this to charge some more Aug 17 16:46:01 let me check it Aug 17 16:46:27 36% Aug 17 16:46:37 I plugged in my Xoom at the same time, and it is at 84% Aug 17 16:46:43 get to at least 50% Aug 17 16:47:57 trsohmers: I usually get full charge in under 3 hrs while using it Aug 17 16:48:12 It's been charging for two hours and I haven't been using it Aug 17 16:56:05 are you toward the outside of wifi range? Aug 17 17:06:57 Yea, Lumiere Aug 17 17:07:05 didn't realize I left wifi on Aug 17 17:25:45 Hey guy… will setting up the ubuntu chroot erase all my data? Aug 17 17:25:53 I'm guessing since it has to partiton Aug 17 17:26:00 partition* Aug 17 17:29:08 trsohmers, yes, you have to meta-doctor Aug 17 17:29:40 I have purchased like two apps… I'll be able to reinstall them afterwards, correct? Aug 17 17:30:03 I remember in the early days of Android you couldn't even do that… you had to contact the developer and they would have to manually send you the app… wicked stupid back then Aug 17 17:33:22 yes, the appcat will let you download again Aug 17 17:47:44 how hard is it to make a chroot? Aug 17 17:47:51 I'm wanting to do it with this http://www.bodhilinux.com/ Aug 17 17:48:28 loop mount chroot is easy, you have to either metadoctor or resize the partitions live if you want a real partition Aug 17 17:48:39 , though* Aug 17 17:48:45 it has an ARM release too Aug 17 17:50:00 http://jeffhoogland.blogspot.com/2011/07/bodhi-linux-for-arm-alpha-1.html Aug 17 17:50:06 ARM version instructions Aug 17 17:50:18 mmm... Aug 17 17:50:22 when I get my touchpad (between friday and monday) I'll look into it Aug 17 17:50:35 it has "touchscreen" versions too Aug 17 17:50:45 w/ full ubuntu package support Aug 17 17:50:55 nah, I'll skip that one, I like things that work :) Aug 17 17:50:59 like nothing else Aug 17 17:51:01 :D Aug 17 17:51:02 oh, jeff hoogland, that guy Aug 17 17:51:11 wrong channel.. brb Aug 17 17:51:17 That guy that wrote a nice level headed blog post about how much Fedora sucks Aug 17 17:51:20 "If you have used Bodhi before then you may be aware that one of the profiles we offer by default is one that is optimized for touch screen devices." Aug 17 17:51:31 so don't trust him? lol Aug 17 17:51:46 He's just an ass; i've not used bodhi linux, it may be really nice Aug 17 17:52:19 well, I was just looking because it runs on old hw, and has a "tablet ready" mode Aug 17 17:52:20 PatrickC: It's pretty easy to make chroot images, and then partition them Aug 17 17:52:28 * rrix nods Aug 17 17:52:45 I'll get it running in a vbox first to see how it is Aug 17 17:52:48 Just need the rootfs of the OS, and then dd it Aug 17 17:52:51 PatrickC: You should definitely give it a shot and let us know how it fairs on the TP. :) Aug 17 17:52:51 then look at a chroot Aug 17 17:53:00 * rrix may try to get fedora-arm chroot set up at some point Aug 17 17:53:01 I will, once I get my tp :) Aug 17 17:53:11 PatrickC: You won't be able to run an ARM OS in Virtualbox… Virtualbox is a x86/x64 based Virtual machine Aug 17 17:53:13 not ARM Aug 17 17:53:24 There are x86 versions of bodhi Aug 17 17:53:28 trsohmers: it has x86 as well Aug 17 17:53:33 Ah, OK Aug 17 17:53:47 git-core has a TON of dependancies Aug 17 17:53:50 yep Aug 17 17:54:09 Been downloading and installing that for a half hour now Aug 17 17:54:26 wow Aug 17 17:54:39 It's downloading fast… but building is taking forever Aug 17 17:55:11 * halfhalo-work just uses xcode to install it Aug 17 17:56:00 Apparently us interns have to do compliance and ethics training at work. There goes my morning ... Aug 17 17:56:15 hah Aug 17 17:56:59 Oh, deadline is in december, pffft Aug 17 17:57:11 I'll get right on that Aug 17 17:58:11 halfhalo-work: What do you mean use Xcode to install it? Aug 17 17:58:22 xcode comes with git Aug 17 17:58:39 I know… the instructions on the wiki said to install git-core Aug 17 17:58:56 Funny, I NEVER follow instructions, but I am pretty clueless to webOS devices Aug 17 18:12:03 * NuttyBunny proceeds to create a 10Gb ext3fs partition for the NuttyPad :D Aug 17 18:12:47 Now to metadoctor this Aug 17 18:12:51 Wish me luck :| Aug 17 18:13:08 trsohmers: good luck :) Aug 17 18:13:37 lol Aug 17 18:14:33 So. Many. Dependencies Aug 17 18:15:22 Pretty much impossible to software brick this, right? Aug 17 18:16:15 I believe so Aug 17 18:16:27 but I don't have a tp yet, so I'm not 100% sure Aug 17 18:23:50 its possible to brick it Aug 17 18:27:12 halfhalo-work, how? killing the bootloader? :) Aug 17 18:27:36 yup. Aug 17 18:34:51 Downloading a ROM Aug 17 18:37:32 whats a ROM? Aug 17 18:38:03 NuttyBunny: you didnt....? Aug 17 18:38:35 Really Oblong Mandible. Aug 17 18:48:45 how do I launch local files through the web browser? I am having troubles finding this info. Aug 17 18:49:13 OK, so I am editing the makefile of metadoctor Aug 17 18:49:31 One of the options EXT3FS_PARTITION_SIZE Aug 17 18:49:43 should I uncomment that for chroot install? Aug 17 18:52:47 nevermind Aug 17 18:59:13 OK need some help.. Aug 17 18:59:18 I just started the webOS doctor Aug 17 18:59:29 Should I have the device on when doing it or what? Aug 17 19:00:01 And should anything be on the touchpad's screen? Aug 17 19:00:35 ? Aug 17 19:01:24 It hasn't rebooted or anything Aug 17 19:01:49 yes have the device on and it should put some kind of warning screen up I believe Aug 17 19:05:34 I've never done it to touchpad... put with my phones I keep off till doctor ask me to plug them in Aug 17 19:05:52 when you plug them in they turn on Aug 17 19:05:57 No warning screen came on Aug 17 19:05:59 or anything Aug 17 19:06:03 I can still use it Aug 17 19:06:20 did the Dr actually start? Aug 17 19:06:22 OK webos doctor just said could not reset my device Aug 17 19:06:23 Yea Aug 17 19:06:33 It was starting and the loading bar thing was there Aug 17 19:07:02 de mode? Aug 17 19:07:05 dev Aug 17 19:07:05 Any ideas? Aug 17 19:07:06 Yea Aug 17 19:07:15 WEll I think so Aug 17 19:07:22 I have preware installed and everything Aug 17 19:09:34 are you running the dr from command line? to see if there are any other errors Aug 17 19:09:44 No I am not Aug 17 19:09:45 I could start it Aug 17 19:09:51 just java -jar Aug 17 19:09:52 right? Aug 17 19:10:00 yeah Aug 17 19:10:40 Do I have to like restart devmode or something? Aug 17 19:10:55 like does it revert back after I reboot the device? Aug 17 19:11:15 no Aug 17 19:11:18 can I sum up what happened/happening? Aug 17 19:11:30 I'm trying to do like 5 things at once :) Aug 17 19:11:57 ok ill run it from the command line then Aug 17 19:12:03 trsohmers: recovery mode is what you should be in for a doctor Aug 17 19:12:12 how do I go into recovery mode? Aug 17 19:12:24 in the touchpad... hrmm.. 1 second Aug 17 19:12:28 NuttyBunny: we need u! Aug 17 19:12:50 NuttyBunny just did it, so.. :) Aug 17 19:13:08 if its the same as the phone, power off, and hold volume up when turning on Aug 17 19:13:33 hold volume up while connecting usb cable Aug 17 19:13:36 as you plug in usb Aug 17 19:13:50 or novaterm at any time while it's on and type "tellbootie recover" Aug 17 19:14:57 uhg Aug 17 19:15:05 now novaterm isn't working Aug 17 19:15:08 I thought the dr put you into recovery mode on its own? Aug 17 19:15:35 elpollodiablo1: it does Aug 17 19:15:42 elpollodiablo1, yep, but this is an alternate mode Aug 17 19:15:52 but forcing it into recovery mode can sometimes be better Aug 17 19:16:03 brb Aug 17 19:16:06 just making sure I wasnt going crazy Aug 17 19:16:16 lol Aug 17 19:16:17 Now I feel like a moron Aug 17 19:16:26 why? Aug 17 19:16:28 keep getting unable to find device Aug 17 19:16:28 no worries Aug 17 19:16:33 when trying to run novaterm Aug 17 19:16:42 reinstall nova? Aug 17 19:16:47 yeah Aug 17 19:16:51 if its like the phone Aug 17 19:16:51 maybe that'll fix it? Aug 17 19:16:53 It was working fine yesterday Aug 17 19:17:38 why are you Dr'ing it ? if you don't mind Aug 17 19:17:43 Now it's working Aug 17 19:17:52 woot Aug 17 19:17:55 Dr'ing it to chroot ubuntu Aug 17 19:17:56 cool Aug 17 19:18:03 noice Aug 17 19:18:06 * PatrickC is gonna do it w/o doctoring :) Aug 17 19:18:17 Now it's working :D Aug 17 19:18:32 awesome! Aug 17 19:19:41 And it's doctoring Aug 17 19:19:59 what fixed it? reinsyall nova? Aug 17 19:20:10 reinstall Aug 17 19:20:23 Nope Aug 17 19:21:08 used the stop then start scripts Aug 17 19:21:16 ahh Aug 17 19:26:59 Complete Aug 17 19:27:16 Yay Tux :D Aug 17 19:28:32 awesome! Aug 17 19:33:19 and it's restoring data… so glad I didn't brick it Aug 17 19:33:19 haha Aug 17 19:33:43 lol Aug 17 19:34:00 hmm.. I wonder if I can use the debian chroot instructions to make a bodhi chroot? Aug 17 19:34:21 Chroot is wicked easy Aug 17 19:34:31 really? Aug 17 19:34:33 just get the rootfs of the arm version of it Aug 17 19:34:33 I hope so Aug 17 19:34:37 tar it Aug 17 19:34:39 easy Aug 17 19:34:44 tar it Aug 17 19:34:49 then use dd to make a .img of it Aug 17 19:35:07 then use dd to partition the partition with the img Aug 17 19:37:30 ugh.. no arm download Aug 17 19:37:42 though there is an arm version... Aug 17 19:38:27 ….? Aug 17 19:38:43 isnt bodhi just ubuntu with enlightenment Desktop? Aug 17 19:39:16 elpollodiablo1: Bodhi is a linux with table designed interface Aug 17 19:39:23 and it runs with minimal resources Aug 17 19:40:03 webos would do this, " If you have another piece of ARM hardware you are interested in getting Bodhi Linux running on, first install Debian Squeeze or Wheezy and then add the following line to your sources.list" Aug 17 19:40:05 right? Aug 17 19:41:21 instructions here for anyone who wants to try it now. http://jeffhoogland.blogspot.com/2011/07/bodhi-linux-for-arm-alpha-1.html Aug 17 19:45:42 hey does anyone know if meta-doctor will be updated to use the new verizon 2.1 doctor for the pre2 so that the pre2 will get the new modem drivers? Aug 17 19:45:53 *modem firmware Aug 17 19:47:18 Installing ubuntu chroot now.. Aug 17 19:49:02 Uh WTF Aug 17 19:49:37 Now nothing is working... Aug 17 19:50:22 It started to reinstall my apps, they finished downloading and the progress bars were completed and then it just froze up Aug 17 19:50:29 do you have XTerm/Xecutah/XServer? Aug 17 19:50:39 oh weird Aug 17 19:50:59 I was trying to install them, but then it was saying that there was an application install already in progress Aug 17 19:51:02 and then that happened Aug 17 19:51:41 reboot? Aug 17 19:53:06 yea Aug 17 19:53:11 and it is trying to restore my applications again Aug 17 19:53:42 is there any way of preventing it from restoring applications? Aug 17 19:56:16 brb Aug 17 19:58:55 &j wirc Aug 17 19:59:19 oops Aug 17 20:05:41 Oy Aug 17 20:06:31 trsohmers: what happened? Aug 17 20:07:17 It's working Aug 17 20:07:31 Took 10 minutes to install the Ubuntu Aug 17 20:07:31 well Aug 17 20:07:34 I g2g Aug 17 20:07:36 be back later Aug 17 20:07:39 awesome Aug 17 20:55:33 well, the ubuntu chroot thingy was easy Aug 17 21:26:01 Greetings Aug 17 21:26:05 Having some issues with the ubuntu chroot.... Aug 17 21:26:35 trsohmers, ask away Aug 17 21:26:47 OK Aug 17 21:26:48 so Aug 17 21:26:49 wb Aug 17 21:27:21 I open up Zecutah Aug 17 21:27:25 Oy Aug 17 21:27:31 Xecutah Aug 17 21:27:39 I press Start XServer Aug 17 21:27:45 It opens up a new card Aug 17 21:27:51 I go back to the Xecutah card Aug 17 21:28:02 Press Start Ubuntu Chroot Aug 17 21:28:09 And I get a service error Aug 17 21:28:31 trsohmers, Webos version? 3.0.2? does xterm work? Aug 17 21:28:33 Unable to run command: /sbin/initctl start org.webosinternals.ubuntu-natty-chroot 2>&1 Aug 17 21:28:37 Xterm works Aug 17 21:28:40 and I am running 3.0.2 Aug 17 21:28:49 interesting Aug 17 21:29:33 initctl: (01857/66099497) Unknown job: org.webosinternals.ubuntu-natty-chroot Aug 17 21:29:51 try to start it from xterm? Aug 17 21:30:05 trsohmers: try rebooting, fixed it for me when i had that Aug 17 21:30:18 OK rebooting Aug 17 21:30:19 but in my case i assumed it was b/c i intentionally messed with the upstart stuff Aug 17 21:30:43 cd /media/cryptofs/apps/usr/palm/applications/org.webosinternals.ubuntu-natty-chroot/bin Aug 17 21:30:46 not sure what non-causing-problems path causes your issue; shouldn't be a problem i didn't think. Aug 17 21:30:48 then ./start-xterm.sh Aug 17 21:30:51 * dtzWill bbl Aug 17 21:31:04 ok thanks Aug 17 21:32:17 Greetings PatrickC Aug 17 21:32:25 hey trsohmers Aug 17 21:32:41 NuttyBunny: ping Aug 17 21:33:32 trsohmers: get chroot working? Aug 17 21:34:18 trying to Aug 17 21:35:48 No dice on reooting Aug 17 21:35:49 go Aug 17 21:35:58 going to try to manually start it Aug 17 21:37:40 Does term and such only support portrait viewing? Aug 17 21:38:35 trsohmers: on the phone, we hardcode to portrait yes Aug 17 21:38:45 trsohmers: on the TP we use the accel to guess orientation and use that Aug 17 21:39:04 (there's no known way to query the "actual" orientation (the current orientation luna is showing everything in) AFAIK) Aug 17 21:39:15