**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Aug 18 02:59:56 2011 Aug 18 03:00:33 It would be amazing to get X windows working on Android… how long did it take for Xorg to be ported to webos? Aug 18 03:01:19 nice, @palm retweeted the webathon Aug 18 03:01:42 trsohmers: dtzWill has been working on Xsdl for some time Aug 18 03:01:55 So he is the expert Aug 18 03:02:09 we had it working for the Pre 2 - it just became more popular when the TouchPad was released. Aug 18 03:02:35 trsohmers: he has done most of the Xsdl mods, yes, with some help from myself and others. Aug 18 03:03:03 Very cool Aug 18 03:03:46 Really seems like the webOS community is moving faster than Android in some places… Kind of sad it doesn't get the same recognition Aug 18 03:04:38 No, the recognition is there, the webOS community is better, but we still need support from big boys :( Aug 18 03:05:07 webos ftw! Aug 18 03:05:42 By recognition I mean average consumer… they know what an iCrap is, and what an Android device is… but chances are if they see a Pre or Touchpad, they wouldn't be able to identify it Aug 18 03:05:59 There is a chance with the Touchpad… HP has been doing some good advertising Aug 18 03:06:20 But the original commercials for the Pre… what the heck was Palm/Sprint thinking? Aug 18 03:06:33 ah, *that* recognition ... *sigh* yep... it's even worse in a country where there are no webOS devices being sold since the Pre- :( Aug 18 03:07:44 Where are you? Aug 18 03:07:49 ireland? Aug 18 03:07:56 Mexico Aug 18 03:08:08 oh Aug 18 03:08:17 ah Aug 18 04:34:52 Anybody with a sound understanding of the meta-doctoring process have a few moments free? I'm having a really weird issue, which I've seen reported with an older version of the meta-pre script for 2.1.0, but that was supposedly respoved in the new one -- still happening to me though. I've looked through the script itself, and I don't see anything that looks particularly relevant. Aug 18 04:35:09 Cerealklr, ask away Aug 18 04:35:15 Basically, it won't let me sign into either of my existing accounts or create a new one. Aug 18 04:35:37 I've verified a solid connection by pretending to have forgotten my password (and successfully changed it) Aug 18 04:35:43 but upon attempting to log in it again failed Aug 18 04:36:04 I've followed all the recommended steps, and actually disabled/deleted backups twice, wondering if I hadn't done something properly the first time Aug 18 04:36:48 I'm on a sprint franken pre+, fashioned out of a VZW Pre+ and a Sprint Pre-, and can verify that it worked on Sprint 1.4.5 vanilla after doing the token swapping and such Aug 18 04:36:55 im not sure on that one, ive seen it discussed, never paid to close of atention Aug 18 04:37:14 I'm sort of at wits end too, it's really, really weird. Aug 18 04:37:32 The only other course of action I can think of is to re-doctor with --wifi-only and then use Impostah to try and log in Aug 18 04:37:41 but I think my radio modem will still be disabled if I do Aug 18 04:38:09 though I suppose I could munge arguments manually and do skip first use w/out disabling the modem update Aug 18 04:38:17 Cerealklr, nope, just skip first use Aug 18 04:38:24 on palm.com Aug 18 04:38:30 there is a tool Aug 18 04:39:10 is there a flag for that on the doctor? Or is there a separate bypassing mechanism? Aug 18 04:39:33 Cerealklr, seperate tool for once the device is doctored Aug 18 04:40:09 okay, so skip first use, then try and use impostah? Aug 18 04:40:14 Cerealklr, https://developer.palm.com/content/resources/develop/developing_on_an_unactivated_device.html then impostah Aug 18 04:40:47 Okay, that sounds like a plan of action. Thank you very much for your time, and I'll ping back with the results! Aug 18 04:41:12 your welcome Aug 18 05:00:41 Found the problem! Still need to find a fix... Aug 18 05:02:26 scoutcamper: On trying to activate w/ Impostah I get: http://pastebin.com/vqitvFyz Aug 18 05:02:44 keeping in mind that 1.4.5 worked like a charm, which seems strange to me Aug 18 05:12:11 Can anybody confirm success using the meta-sprint-pre build script for the 2.1.0 meta-doctor with a Sprint Franken-VZW-Pre+? Aug 18 05:12:46 I'm getting a Bad ROMToken error, which suggests something was off in the baking process, but I know the script's been used successfully before and I don't see anything that sticks out as needing to be modified. Aug 18 05:28:06 Update on the situation: I don't see any references to a romToken anywhere except for the profile creation stage, so I'm not sure where to check the information and/or modify the values... http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Palm_Profile_Interactions Aug 18 05:28:21 If I can find out what that's pulling the value of romToken from I should be able to figure something out, at least. Aug 18 05:32:51 Many of the other values in that particular JSON object match up to objects in the device settings section of Impostah, so I'm assuming romToken is composed of one or more values in that region Aug 18 05:40:33 rwhitby: ping Aug 18 05:42:43 yes Aug 18 05:43:30 Forgive me if i'm wrong, but would you happen to know how to check the actual JSON payload from attempting activation through Impostah? Aug 18 05:44:36 I've pretty much isolated the issue stopping me from activating (it's a Sprint Franken-Pre+, worked on 1.4.5, won't activate to an account [new or old] on 2.1.0 w/ meta-doctor) Aug 18 05:45:13 there's something amiss with the romToken.buildVariant attribute of it's JSON payload to https://ps.palmws.com/palmcsext/services/deviceJ/authenticateFromDevice Aug 18 05:46:03 judging by what i've pieced together, but there isn't any literature on the significance of the numerical values, and the only example value available is for a GSM network, at http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Palm_Profile_Interactions Aug 18 05:47:04 I was hoping I could take a look at what my phone was sending and, if that didn't yield any results, find a few volunteers to output the value of the romToken attribute so I could compare with a few working samples Aug 18 05:48:15 The error I'm working on, if you were curious: http://pastebin.com/vqitvFyz Aug 18 05:50:00 what script did you use, and what are the dmmodel, dmcarrier and dmsets values reported by Show Properties ? Aug 18 05:51:13 I used the meta-sprint-pre-2.1.0 script, as recommended in the "Sprint Pre Plus" guide. I also went through the intermediary 1.4.5 stages, since the guide suggested that the direct upgrade path was broken. I'll pastebin those values, one moment. Aug 18 05:53:56 http://pastebin.com/5aErKrYY Aug 18 05:54:15 dmSets is wrong - it should be two values Aug 18 05:54:19 From my comparison to the working interchange I linked to, it looks like dmsets is fudged. Aug 18 05:54:22 Yep Aug 18 05:54:43 the scripts always result in two values, so you've done something manually to change that Aug 18 05:55:33 Well, I've run the deviceTool script to skip activation originally, since I was having this issue during FirstUse and couldn't activate. That probably wouldn't have caused it though, since the issue was pre-existing, right? Aug 18 05:55:52 dmSets is rewritten on every doctor Aug 18 05:56:02 the meta-scripts produce doctors with two calues Aug 18 05:56:04 values Aug 18 05:56:23 you've modified either the script, or the Makefile, or the command line, to produce an invalid doctor. Aug 18 05:56:41 what you did previously does not matter Aug 18 05:56:45 As to running the script, I left the script itself untouched. I ran make clobber prior to executing the script, since the build directory had already been used to compose my modified sprint 1.4.5 doctor w/ baked tokens. Aug 18 05:57:06 Oh! The modifications in the makefile are likely still there from the Sprint Pre+ baking!! Aug 18 05:57:15 I disabled carrier and model checks Aug 18 05:57:21 Would that have caused it? Aug 18 05:57:23 that will do it Aug 18 05:57:35 please update the wiki to remind folks not to do that Aug 18 05:57:39 as you're not the first Aug 18 05:57:41 Excellent! Sorry for the trouble, and thanks very much for your time. I'll fix it up and update the wik- Aug 18 05:57:50 and I thought I was a quick typer. Aug 18 05:57:58 =P Okay, I'll get it taken care of. Thanks again! Aug 18 05:58:07 np Aug 18 05:58:24 have you participated in the webathon ? Aug 18 05:59:31 The webathon? Haven't heard of it. Aug 18 05:59:50 http://t.co/08QAcg0 Aug 18 06:01:04 I suppose I still owe internals a few dollars. I'll go ahead and pitch in. =] Aug 18 06:03:33 Done and done. It's not much, but hopefully it'll help. Once I finally get my TP app released I'll be sure to donate a percentage too. =] Aug 18 06:08:42 rwhitby: Uh oh, new and stranger issues. I went ahead and did a git reset --hard HEAD to insure nothing was tampered with and then ran the script. Running the resulting doctor fails at the final step with the message "We were unable to reset your phone." and then quits. Aug 18 06:09:04 pastebin the log from running the doctor on the command line Aug 18 06:09:08 that log tells you why Aug 18 06:09:22 never double-click a doctor, cause then you're flying blind Aug 18 06:09:40 aye aye Aug 18 06:13:25 pastebin.com/UWfSYMpi Aug 18 06:13:47 first error is ~L105 Aug 18 06:14:03 107, rather. Aug 18 06:17:07 something wrong there. clobber everything and start again. Aug 18 06:32:01 rwhitby: Swapped to a different computer, rebuilt, installing now. Things are looking splendid. Thanks again! Aug 18 06:37:13 sweet Aug 18 08:06:58 hi all, I have a question: is there any way to remove ext3fs partition? Aug 18 08:07:13 I've build meta-doctor file using this script: "make DEVICE=preplus CARRIER=wr VERSION=2.1.0 ENABLE_DEVELOPER_MODE=1 DISABLE_UPLOAD_DAEMON=1 DISABLE_UPDATE_DAEMON=1 CUSTOM_MODEL_LIST=P100UEU clobber all" Aug 18 08:07:26 but the partition still there :D Aug 18 09:03:35 ok, np.. already figure it out :) Aug 18 09:03:35 thx Aug 18 14:01:56 Silly webos newbie question.. Is there a way to "submit" form elements on web pages / just type / app catalog / preware etc with a keyboard key? Aug 18 14:02:02 I thought enter would submit but it does nothing Aug 18 14:10:55 hey, Aug 18 14:11:13 what's the link to automake navit maps for particular region?, Aug 18 14:13:25 nvm, how about instructions 4 installing the bin file? Aug 18 14:15:59 appdata/org.webosinternals.navit/maps Aug 18 14:16:10 or something like that on your usb drive Aug 18 14:16:24 but I suggest using Navit Maps instead. much easier to manage Aug 18 14:18:35 on a pixi Aug 18 14:18:41 they didn't work b4 Aug 18 14:23:13 blap blap blap Aug 18 14:27:27 navit maps won't open Aug 18 14:27:34 white blank screen Aug 18 14:27:37 diagnosis? Aug 18 14:33:16 navit maps is being dumb Aug 18 14:34:35 which optware feed does ipkg-opt use? Aug 18 14:35:21 /opt/etc/ipkg/optware.conf Aug 18 14:35:50 dwc-: thanks checking it out now Aug 18 14:37:51 siestacat: uninstall/reinstall or run lumberjack to see the issue Aug 18 14:38:17 lumberjack? PatrickC Aug 18 14:38:35 its an app in preware that lets you look at an apps logs Aug 18 14:40:11 ok Aug 18 14:42:51 H: 'enter' is how i generally do it, pretty sure. Aug 18 14:51:33 siestacat: what did lumberjack say? Aug 18 14:52:05 "I am a lumberjack and I'm ok" Aug 18 14:52:07 hold on Aug 18 14:52:42 ok Aug 18 14:52:55 dwc-: lol Aug 18 15:07:42 Hi gang. I'm one of the 611 woot.com new TouchPadders :p Got PreWare installed, but can't find on the Wiki yet where to get a Terminal application or how/if it's possible to make it so that not all applications run as root. Can someone point me in the right direction? Aug 18 15:08:28 starkruzr: the terminal app is in testing right now Aug 18 15:08:37 Xecutah is what you want Aug 18 15:08:50 ~testing-feeds Aug 18 15:08:50 testing-feeds is a means of testing new WebOS Internals products, documented at http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Testing_Feeds Aug 18 15:09:04 AppCatalog apps don't run as root normally Aug 18 15:09:39 app cat apps I don't think *can* run as root.. correct me if I'm wrong. Aug 18 15:09:48 unless you sudo them, I'd imagine. Aug 18 15:10:05 I don't think webos has sudo Aug 18 15:10:14 but when you fire up Xecutah, for example, does it immediately drop you to # or to $? Aug 18 15:10:25 # iirc Aug 18 15:11:06 homebrew apps can get root access Aug 18 15:11:18 there's a file in webOS where permissions of apps are defined Aug 18 15:11:44 hm Aug 18 15:12:14 yeah, apps in preware (such as Internalz Pro) have root access if I'm not mistaken Aug 18 15:12:19 I guess many years of working in Linux and OS X makes me leery of having root be my default environment :) Aug 18 15:12:56 Xecutah and anything it opens run as root… so # Aug 18 15:13:32 I wonder if I can have it su to an unprivileged user when it starts Aug 18 15:14:08 somewhere in the Wiki I thought I saw an article called "create users and install Terminal - DEPRECATED" but I can't find it anymore Aug 18 15:14:33 you can do that by resetting permissions of the app in the file I mentioned Aug 18 15:14:50 starkruzr: you can use a web based terminal application Aug 18 15:14:57 but that still runs as root Aug 18 15:15:08 trsohmers: ssh? Aug 18 15:15:09 pc-world1: that sounds promising Aug 18 15:15:30 Not ssh… ajaxphpterm Aug 18 15:15:46 dtzWill, seems it does work with preware, just nothing else :( Aug 18 15:15:48 So it starts a localhost web server on your device, with an ajax/php application which acts as a terminal Aug 18 15:16:13 H: not even 'just type'? works fine here :/. hmm Aug 18 15:16:23 Why do you not want homebrew apps to run as root? Aug 18 15:17:32 hmm ok it does work for just type now. Think it may just have been lagging earlier:) Aug 18 15:17:36 (ok, forget this thing about resetting permissions file, then Xecutah will probably not work at all) Aug 18 15:17:38 pc-world1: it's just bad practice. Aug 18 15:17:57 but you can try to su to a jailed user Aug 18 15:18:06 that should work Aug 18 15:18:13 I probably will Aug 18 15:18:27 by "jailed user" do you mean users that are used by individual applications? Aug 18 15:19:29 yes Aug 18 15:19:39 just download a PDK app from the App Catalog Aug 18 15:19:40 run it Aug 18 15:19:45 get the userid/username via top Aug 18 15:19:52 and su to it Aug 18 15:20:08 then you can do all things the app would be allowed to do Aug 18 15:20:43 PDK apps from the AppCat get "jailed" in a chroot environment Aug 18 15:21:00 they have access to the application folder of the app itself and to the FAT partition (/media/internal) Aug 18 16:30:36 mmm... xterm uses the same window for drawing the scrollbar, but it doesn't scroll with the left mouse button, rxvt does the scrollbar using the wm decorator... *sigh* Aug 18 16:39:17 siestacat: get Lumberjack working? Aug 18 16:42:25 anyone else notice the lose of keyboard key press recognition in Xterm? Specifically for me it always happens after I use vncviewer. just wonder if it happens with any other X programs Aug 18 16:44:32 anyone notice keyboard input lose when using Xterm? When I run vncviewer Xterm doesnt seem to interperate keys being pressed anymore. just wondering if this has occured for any other X apps in xterm. Aug 18 16:45:40 elpollodiablo1, i never have, but i use rdp, not vnc so ... Aug 18 16:46:22 you do it in chroot or just forward X for rdp? Aug 18 16:52:37 elpollodiablo1: does it happen every time you use vncviewer? Aug 18 16:52:48 elpollodiablo1: and do keys stop being sent to other x apps, or just vncviewer? Aug 18 16:52:54 more info please ^.^ Aug 18 17:09:25 elpollodiablo1: follow mouse focus? Aug 18 17:09:37 does clicking in the xterm help? Aug 18 17:09:49 PatrickC : [2011-08-18 17:05:41] (LunaSysMgr) user.warning: org.webosinternals.navit-maps: Warning: indicated new content, but not active., palmInitFramework347:2527 Aug 18 17:36:19 . Aug 18 17:39:18 siestacat_: sorry, got disconnected.. Aug 18 17:39:29 siestacat_: not sure what that means Aug 18 17:40:32 [2011-08-18 17:35:40] (LunaSysMgr) user.crit: org.webosinternals.navit-maps: Error: {"errorCode": "ERROR", "errorText": "Invalid file."}, palmInitFramework347:2527 Aug 18 17:41:00 not sure... Aug 18 18:29:18 magic Aug 18 18:30:53 hi Tibfib Aug 18 18:31:04 heh, hi linuxjacques Aug 18 18:31:09 that message was on the wrong channel Aug 18 18:31:16 haha Aug 18 18:31:32 this is a useless bug report I know, but I was using nomnomnom today and my kernel crashed Aug 18 18:31:46 omg Aug 18 18:31:49 I'll get that fixed right away. Aug 18 18:31:51 wait, I doubt that Aug 18 18:31:58 wait, which kernel? Aug 18 18:32:02 wait, where am I? Aug 18 18:32:07 under the sea Aug 18 18:32:09 in a strange way. touches on the screen would cause it to flicker for a second Aug 18 18:32:42 and I could hear card swoosh sounds. sometimes the screen would go black, then touching again would show the nomnomnom gray background with the horizontal lines Aug 18 18:32:51 dtzWill: yes it happens everytime I use vncviewer. and yes keys stop being sent to other x apps inclusing Xterm its self. I normally have to load up a new xterm and kill the old one to get the Virtual keyboard to work. Aug 18 18:32:53 I am on the stock 3.0.2 kernel Aug 18 18:33:10 * oilsworkn blames nomnomnom for his tp crashing all the time now Aug 18 18:33:19 linuxjacques: well, let me know if it is consistent and if it only happens in nomnomnom Aug 18 18:33:27 oilsworkn: now wait a sec Aug 18 18:33:35 huzzah! Aug 18 18:33:35 at one point near the beginning of the crash, the kernel messages log said something like "adding new finger, 1100 fingers!!!" Aug 18 18:33:47 haha what Aug 18 18:33:52 does that mean Aug 18 18:33:56 I have the log at home. Aug 18 18:34:18 something with the ts driver multitouch implementation Aug 18 18:34:24 dwc-: mouse all works correctly, I have tried clicking all around but cant get keyboard to work untill I load up a new xterm. Aug 18 18:34:30 Tibfib: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huzzah Aug 18 18:34:36 haha Aug 18 18:34:43 its in urban dictionary too Aug 18 18:34:56 see also "hooray", "hooah" Aug 18 18:35:00 haha Aug 18 18:38:11 heh from ud: Aug 18 18:38:13 the crazy english version off "hooray" Aug 18 18:38:14 english dude 1: i say winston, lets go fetch some tea and crumpets. Aug 18 18:38:14 winston: Huzzah! Aug 18 18:39:48 lol Aug 18 19:31:52 Hey guys, I've discovered a strange issue w/ my Sprint Franken Pre+ on WebOS 2.1.0. Specifically, the Media Indexer appears to be inactive. I first ran into the issue when I tried to add a new ringtone, which it didn't pick up, no matter where I added it on the device. I decided it wasn't important and synced the device w/ Banshee on my home machine, and discovered that after syncing, though the music was decidedly present (as viewed by and st Aug 18 19:31:54 reamed through Internalz), the indexer hadn't picked it up. I read as much literature as I could find on the subject and saw that sometimes it takes a few minutes -- so I waited 10 minutes, then checked (nothing) and then a full reset (still nothing) and waited another 10 minutes (nothing). I then verified in Impostah that the only entries in the db for media.audio.file were the ringtones. Does anybody have a suggestion as to where to go from Aug 18 19:31:56 here? Aug 18 19:41:14 More info on the issue for anyone who might know something: I appear to be unable to backup to my account as well, and when opening the help application, it fails to retrieve tips because it's reporting my device ID as P101EWW (though my device ID in Impostah is still P100EWW as it ought to be). Aug 18 19:45:21 Show Properties lists DMModel: P100EWW but PRODoID as P101EWW, which I assume is the root of the issue. Aug 18 19:46:01 the indexer doesn't seem to pick things up on its own Aug 18 19:46:17 try rebooting (to make sure the indexer service is running, and not crashed) Aug 18 19:46:26 then put it in usb mode on a computer and take it back out Aug 18 19:49:02 dwc-: Okay, I've rebooted it again and put it back into USB mode. Aug 18 19:49:11 I'll go ahead and give it a minute or two and try again. Aug 18 19:49:33 I've mostly heard this secondhand, but have only had to try it once Aug 18 19:49:48 (where I've added stuff while the indexer was dead) Aug 18 19:50:28 wc-: Oh! loooks to be the spinny-wheel-of-indexing! Aug 18 19:51:28 hopefully not the spinny-wheel-of-pretending-to-be-indexing-but-the-service-is-dead-so-it-really-isn't Aug 18 19:51:38 That's exactly what I was wondering Aug 18 19:51:45 ^ how I usually know that the indexer is dead Aug 18 19:51:49 I don't think it ought take this long at 1Ghz w/ ~100 songs Aug 18 19:52:10 Can I restart the service manually? Or if not, with a luna or java restart? Aug 18 19:52:15 Or is this going to take another device reset? Aug 18 19:52:24 I'm not sure. I've always just rebooted. Aug 18 19:52:37 all maybe 3 times I've done this. Aug 18 19:53:26 I'm giving it a luna/java restart for sciences sake first. Aug 18 19:54:40 dwc-: Looking like a sad day for science, unfortunately. On to the hard reset. Aug 18 19:57:13 does the java restart does anything on webos 2.1.0? I thought I heard they took the jre out Aug 18 19:59:38 dwc-: If it does, it does it instantaneously (and I don't believe so, but when I DL'd internalz it requested a java restart, so I wasn't sure) Aug 18 20:00:28 dwc-: Well, this isn't looking good. I restarted, launched the music player, it claimed nothing existed, closed the music player, went into USB mode, safely ejected, launched music player again, and we're back to the spinny wheel... Aug 18 20:00:46 :\ Aug 18 20:02:54 I wish there was more literature on the media indexer. The stuff I can find from HPalm is all about its API Aug 18 20:03:03 and webos-internals, uncharacteristically, has nothing Aug 18 20:03:08 on the wiki Aug 18 20:04:30 what's Ur problem cereal? Aug 18 20:04:51 The Media Indexer on my Sprint-2.1.0-Franken-Pre+ is misbehaving. Aug 18 20:05:11 you try the ink hedami released? Aug 18 20:05:14 It isn't automatically detecting new media and, after being put into and removed from USB drive mode, appears to crash/hang Aug 18 20:05:14 ipk Aug 18 20:05:21 Yea, that was one of the first things I did Aug 18 20:05:24 but the issue isn't that Aug 18 20:05:28 at least, that isn't the only issue Aug 18 20:05:45 The indexer is legitimately not detecting new media (I checked the database w/ Impostah) Aug 18 20:06:01 I had to use internalz and mask my music folder... re start then un mask it and re start again Aug 18 20:06:11 what happens if you move all the stuff off the drive Aug 18 20:06:16 and let the indexer find nothing Aug 18 20:06:35 howdy Aug 18 20:06:35 ziplock503: That's just crazy enough to work Aug 18 20:06:36 that fixed my bug with music Aug 18 20:07:01 I'll be right back, I've got a quick call to make, then I'll give it a shot and ping you guys with results. Thanks again for the help! Aug 18 20:07:05 give it a go Aug 18 20:07:13 I guess masking is the same as actually removing the files Aug 18 20:07:16 no prob Aug 18 20:07:31 i've been playing around with PDF Redux on my Veer, and it seems that the rotation doesn't actually render. just gives me a black screen. Aug 18 20:07:41 rotate it back to portrait, and it renders just fine Aug 18 20:07:48 when it doesn't puke on the pdf, anyway Aug 18 20:09:28 i can't figure out if there's a bug reporting system for patches, so I don't know who to tell Aug 18 20:10:42 have any of you seen the news? Aug 18 20:11:10 :( Aug 18 20:11:36 pdt redux always been buggin for me .. pdf in general Aug 18 20:11:54 dave: that HP decided to take back all of the Touchpads from BestBuy and bury them in a landfill, ET for Atari 2600-style? Aug 18 20:12:21 yeah, it's amazing that the PDF reader on my old Symbian phone from like 2003 worked better than this one. Aug 18 20:12:50 thorsday: patches should have a homepage or precentral thread Aug 18 20:12:53 davegarbs: depend on what news you're talking about! Aug 18 20:13:02 pull up the page for the patch in preware and scroll down Aug 18 20:13:16 lol theyre taking back the touchpads too? Aug 18 20:14:02 holy crap, i was kidding Aug 18 20:14:03 but it's true Aug 18 20:14:08 hp is killing the entire webos line Aug 18 20:14:25 wow Aug 18 20:14:32 eh? Aug 18 20:14:33 what the hell? Aug 18 20:14:36 thorsday: we still have a chance. Aug 18 20:14:37 they're killing webos devices Aug 18 20:14:41 no, it's over Aug 18 20:14:42 not webos itself Aug 18 20:14:43 get real people Aug 18 20:14:47 they introduced the touchpad like three weeks ago! Aug 18 20:14:53 who cares? give me a damn cheap touchpad Aug 18 20:14:57 thank god im still within the return window Aug 18 20:14:59 If HP licenses to other manufacturers, now that Google bought Motorola, there's a chance things will work out. Aug 18 20:15:05 they bought Palm to kill it less than a year later? Aug 18 20:15:10 they just need to opensource webos Aug 18 20:15:11 cereal: you're dreaming mate. Aug 18 20:15:17 so, android + windows phone + webos is now licensed? Aug 18 20:15:18 hahaha Aug 18 20:15:21 thorsday: Aren't we all entitled to that? Aug 18 20:15:21 HP *is* webos right now Aug 18 20:15:23 yeah, okay. Aug 18 20:15:41 who's going to want an OS that even the owner doesn't want Aug 18 20:15:51 awesome Aug 18 20:15:51 me Aug 18 20:15:52 :p Aug 18 20:16:05 brand new phone that i'm locked into for the next 18 months, end-of-lifed Aug 18 20:16:13 after two weeks Aug 18 20:16:14 thankfully webos has done its job by making me an avid supporter of modern html5 web technologies Aug 18 20:16:14 more like an OS the incompetent owner can't monetize Aug 18 20:16:22 thorsday, HAHA Aug 18 20:16:38 linuxjacques: exactly Aug 18 20:17:33 Thi sucks so hard. Aug 18 20:17:42 /s/Thi/This Aug 18 20:19:00 i have to say that i'm in total shock Aug 18 20:20:07 So that's it...game over? Aug 18 20:20:10 thorsday & ziplock503: No dice w/ the masking. Even with the media masked it crashes. Unless it's counting the downloaded media? Aug 18 20:20:46 raven, looks that way Aug 18 20:20:47 you ever install that ipk hedami posted Aug 18 20:20:48 RavenIII: technically? No, Realistically? Likely. We can do crazy feats with software, as rwhitby and the guys have shown, but we simply can't produce hardware. Aug 18 20:20:59 they haven't fixed OBEX in three major release cycles Aug 18 20:21:07 That's nuts... Aug 18 20:21:13 ziplock503: the one to fix the permissions? Yes. But why would that be crashing the media indexer even if it hadn't been? Aug 18 20:21:27 so glad i spent $$ on apps in the last two weeks Aug 18 20:21:29 all for nothing Aug 18 20:21:32 or perhaps the music app is hanging because it isn't allowed to access the media indexer? but this is still post-install of that app. Aug 18 20:21:35 Good thing I switched back to my Evo...it's a shame though, I actually thought it would survive Aug 18 20:21:41 just asking cause I have it then I did the masking thing and my phone seems fine Aug 18 20:22:05 WEBOS IS NOT DEAD, HP IS JUST NO LONGER MAKING HARDWARE Aug 18 20:22:07 * drobbins cries Aug 18 20:22:29 this does not mean that webOS is never going anywhere again Aug 18 20:22:30 it's only mostly dead Aug 18 20:22:35 it just means we don't know where it's going Aug 18 20:22:48 :/ Aug 18 20:22:51 summatusmentis: Yes, but that means WebOS is yet again backing down. WebOS isn't dead. It's just mauled to the point of unrecognizability. Aug 18 20:22:58 but I only did the masking on my music folder not the media folder.... hope you figure it out Aug 18 20:22:59 summatusmentis: good poine, I could totally see Samsung putting aside some of its resources to make WebOS phones... Aug 18 20:23:05 For the record, I intend to remain on the ship until the entire mast is underwater. Aug 18 20:23:10 I maintain, at this stage, further loss of momentum == death Aug 18 20:23:14 RavenII: there's also talk of HP just spinning off it's hardware unit Aug 18 20:23:16 RavenII: I would like that too, but what are the chances? Aug 18 20:23:17 so is the pre3 coming or no? Aug 18 20:23:19 HP is the only company making webos devices Aug 18 20:23:23 there are ZERO licensees Aug 18 20:23:26 no pre3 Aug 18 20:23:30 as jacques said, if HP stops the charge, other manufacturers aren't going to want to either. Aug 18 20:23:34 thorsday: there are 0 licensees announced Aug 18 20:23:41 it's like 5 days before the pre3 launch Aug 18 20:23:44 and they've cancelled it Aug 18 20:23:46 wtf Aug 18 20:23:48 cerealklr_: ....Kyocera? Sanyo?...those are the only ones I could see even putting in any effort into WebOS. Aug 18 20:23:48 that's not right Aug 18 20:23:50 thorsday: The issue isn't that no licensees yet exist, it's that they're not going to WANT to exist, with HP ending on this note. Aug 18 20:23:58 there's a difference between stopping the charge, and shifting the people doing the charge Aug 18 20:24:00 those phones are already on trucks and in warehouses, and now what? Aug 18 20:24:07 thorsday: no one has said they've cancelled the pre3 Aug 18 20:24:08 just landfill the lot? Aug 18 20:24:31 thorsday: I'm sure they'll slash prices and liquidate, but still, this is going to kill what little forward motion HP gave us again. Aug 18 20:24:40 just tell me where I can buy tps and pre3s at pennies on the dollar Aug 18 20:24:54 yes please. Aug 18 20:24:54 do you people have the ability to read and understand? Aug 18 20:24:57 summatusmentis: where do you buy some of that optimism from? I have quite a bit of it overall, but your brand of optimism seems to be really potent Aug 18 20:25:16 RavenII: I'm worried, don't get me wrong, there's a lot of unanswered questions Aug 18 20:25:19 No, joke, jacques. I'll stock up a few of them for future usage. Aug 18 20:25:32 RavenII: but those unanswered questions are just that, they don't have answers Aug 18 20:25:40 Fair enough Aug 18 20:25:51 RavenII: so, once I have more information, I'll draw a more final conclusion Aug 18 20:26:03 RavenII: right now, we know very little, beyond HP is no longer making devices Aug 18 20:26:12 they haven't killed the webOS Business Group Aug 18 20:26:17 Now, I personally wouldn't mind them selling off the patents to the card/multi tasking to Google... Aug 18 20:26:28 does somebody with WebOS 2.1.0 have Impostah installed and 5 minutes of free time? I'd like them to check a value quickly for me so I can compare. Aug 18 20:26:58 RavenII: so that may mean that they're spinning off the hardware into a subsidiary, or that they're licensing webOS Aug 18 20:27:01 does the device matter cerealklr? Aug 18 20:27:01 we just don't know Aug 18 20:27:25 cerealklr_: I could install impostah...what do you need? Aug 18 20:27:34 fuck Aug 18 20:27:40 yep Aug 18 20:27:43 Lazar_Dobrescu: I don't believe so, no. It's an issue i'm having with the Media Indexer. I want to make sure I don't have permissions in the way Aug 18 20:28:11 k well I got a pre+ with it Aug 18 20:28:13 what do you need Aug 18 20:28:24 short-term thinking by HP Aug 18 20:28:36 my thoughts exactly. Aug 18 20:28:43 I disagree Aug 18 20:28:50 summatusmentis: what's your take on it? Aug 18 20:28:58 I think we're seeing the beginnings of a big shift in terms of business model by HP Aug 18 20:29:09 how so? Aug 18 20:29:17 I know they are now going to spin off their pc business... Aug 18 20:29:23 Lazar_Dobrescu: could you open Impostah, go to Databases, and choose Persistent, and then from the other dropdown "com.palm.media.permissions", and hit query? Aug 18 20:29:28 there's talk of them buying another software company Aug 18 20:29:30 and then confirm whether you have any results? Aug 18 20:29:34 summatusmentis: you think they'll get licensees Aug 18 20:29:42 summatusmentis: which one? Aug 18 20:29:44 drobbins: to me, it looks like they're shifting their business towards data/cloud Aug 18 20:30:07