**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Nov 08 02:59:57 2011
Nov 08 07:23:25 <moo> hi, how do i submit patch, that for same purpose but require different *.patch file, each patch applies to each webos version
Nov 08 07:25:44 <rwhitby> submit the first version as a new patch
Nov 08 07:25:48 <rwhitby> wait for approval
Nov 08 07:26:04 <rwhitby> submit other versions as updates, selecting only the version to which the patch applies
Nov 08 07:29:21 <moo> hrm.. that's what i did for the first round. but admins said that i have check the checkbox but i remember that i didn't check. too bad the submit form data is not email to me
Nov 08 07:29:44 <moo> and i re-submit the patch as a new/alternative version, he approved it
Nov 08 07:30:19 <moo> rwhitby: thx, i'll go for your way for another patch :)
Nov 08 07:33:49 <moo> rwhitby: another question. what if a patch version A is required for 2.1.0 and patch version B is required for 2.1.2 (veer). only 1 checkbox is only available for 2.1.*
Nov 08 07:34:11 <rwhitby> 2.1.2 feed is a symlink to 2.1.0 feed
Nov 08 07:37:11 <moo> yeah, so i have to submit a new/alternative patch for 2.1.2?
Nov 08 07:37:49 <rwhitby> is it different from the patch for 2.1.0 ?
Nov 08 07:38:56 <moo> yep. my patch is for 2.1.2. and i didn't know that. admin then check the patch against 2.1.0 and fail :P
Nov 08 09:02:42 <RichT23> moo: there are a few patches out that have a Veer version they just name then Patch (Veer)
Nov 08 09:03:50 <RichT23> for example "Adavced System Behavior (Veer)"
Nov 08 09:10:13 <moo> :)
Nov 08 11:00:24 <bhuey> rumors bah
Nov 08 11:02:59 <mOo> rwhitby: hi :)
Nov 08 11:03:03 <mOo> just got your mail
Nov 08 11:05:29 <mOo> the 2 patch i mention in the mail, is already approved
Nov 08 11:07:02 <mOo> the stable upload patch i upload today, should be fine patching against 2.1.0, tested using patch --dry-run -p1 agsinst files from doctor, i'll post patch updates once it's approved and also the veer version as a new patch
Nov 08 11:07:56 <mOo> btw, anyone know where is /etc/fstab from in 2.1.0 and 2.1.2? i failed to find it in doctor. yet it's there in 2.2.x+ doctor files
Nov 08 15:30:45 <Abyssul> how does one package a preinst script into a ipk
Nov 08 15:30:59 <Abyssul> I would use the IPK Packager but it only supports postinst and prerm.
Nov 08 15:33:51 <grep_awesome> Abyssul: you on a mac or linux?
Nov 08 15:33:52 <dwc-> I'm not sure those are supported
Nov 08 15:33:59 <Abyssul> win7 lol
Nov 08 15:34:15 <Abyssul> Just wondring since Im trying to incorporate file backup into my Angry Birds Unlock app
Nov 08 15:34:24 <Abyssul> and theres no point of those two scripts
Nov 08 15:35:41 <grep_awesome> so an ipk is packaged up with the "ar" tool. you can unpackage it with "ar -x com.mypackage.ipk"
Nov 08 15:35:50 <grep_awesome> then the prerm and postinst files go inside the control directory
Nov 08 15:35:58 <grep_awesome> you can look at Rod's example's here http://git.webos-internals.org/applications/hello/tree/control
Nov 08 15:37:30 <grep_awesome> the pm* files are executed on install, but are designed for the palm system. postinst and prerm are just for preware and webosquickinstaller because their output can be captured and logged
Nov 08 15:37:43 <grep_awesome> that's my understanding at least
Nov 08 15:37:50 <Abyssul> Its homebrew so it doesnt matter to me
Nov 08 15:39:08 <dwc-> palm-install uses the two pm*
Nov 08 15:39:08 <grep_awesome> any way that you cut it, you'll need the AR tool or the ipk packager. If you can't use / don't want to use the ipk packager, then look at Cygwin. It is a BASH shell for windows and allows for installing of linux tools like tar. I'll bet you can get "ar" with it too
Nov 08 15:39:30 <dwc-> preware/wosqi will use postinst/prerm
Nov 08 15:39:38 <dwc-> afaict, preinst is not supported
Nov 08 15:39:49 <grep_awesome> dwc-: much more condensed than my explanation :P
Nov 08 15:40:22 <dwc-> preware/src/luna_methods.c
Nov 08 15:40:37 <Abyssul> oh, I have WUBI so getting linux is no problem
Nov 08 15:41:15 <Abyssul> I was just curious if they were supported because using the script after its installed is useless since it overwrites the files...
Nov 08 15:41:47 <Abyssul> Although I could have the app transfer to a temp app directory, and use the postinst to mv them over and backup after install
Nov 08 15:41:49 <dwc-> you might want to use a postinst to do that
Nov 08 15:43:14 <Abyssul> yeah but that runs after the install, I need it before it installs :\
Nov 08 15:49:46 <Abyssul> http://pastebin.com/PAine3tP
Nov 08 15:49:51 <Abyssul> My postinst script
Nov 08 15:50:01 <Abyssul> Going with my new method
Nov 08 15:59:33 <Abyssul> I need a command for restarting luna for the script
Nov 08 16:00:48 <grep_awesome> luna-send -n 1 palm://ca.canucksoftware.systoolsmgr/lunaRestart {}
Nov 08 16:00:59 <Abyssul> Will that work in the script?
Nov 08 16:01:03 <grep_awesome> assuming that you have the system tools manager installed, yes
Nov 08 16:01:08 <Abyssul> there is pkill as well and "initctl stop LunaSysMgr && initctl start LunaSysMgr"
Nov 08 16:02:56 <Abyssul> Alright, off to class. Ill have to mess with it later.
Nov 08 16:20:55 <hjax> yay im finally getting a touchpad
Nov 08 16:22:24 * grep_awesome touchpad dance!
Nov 08 16:24:03 <hjax> :-)
Nov 08 16:26:12 <hjax> things i want to try: overclock, android, ubuntu
Nov 08 16:26:30 <hjax> is there any sort of restore function for if i really mess the thing up?
Nov 08 16:27:41 <Douilspee> hi
Nov 08 16:28:04 <grep_awesome> hjax: webosdoctor
Nov 08 16:28:14 <grep_awesome> hjax: it will recover the device from anything
Nov 08 16:28:24 <hjax> so i cant brick it then>
Nov 08 16:28:25 <hjax> ?
Nov 08 16:28:26 <Douilspee> to overclock u need some kernel patches from preware
Nov 08 16:28:37 <hjax> i know
Nov 08 16:28:50 <Douilspee> for ubuntu and android u need to read the right tuto
Nov 08 16:28:53 <grep_awesome> hjax: not to the best of my knowledge
Nov 08 16:29:01 <hjax> ok good :)
Nov 08 16:29:32 <Douilspee> ya if u follow tutos there is no risks
Nov 08 16:29:42 <Douilspee> but backup your datas :)
Nov 08 16:30:20 <Douilspee> i installed ubuntu before android
Nov 08 16:30:40 <hjax> can i have both installed at once?
Nov 08 16:30:45 <Douilspee> 3rd
Nov 08 16:30:45 <grep_awesome> yes
Nov 08 16:30:57 <Douilspee> ubuntu chroot inside webos
Nov 08 16:31:01 <grep_awesome> I have all three, but never use android
Nov 08 16:31:18 <Douilspee> android using dualboot
Nov 08 16:32:11 <Douilspee> grep_awesome: do you know how to mount ubuntu partition from android ? :)
Nov 08 16:33:07 <grep_awesome> Douilspee: I've never tried and I'm at work at the moment, unfortunately
Nov 08 18:05:52 <Abyssul> Anyone have a clue why my script isnt working?
Nov 08 18:05:53 <Abyssul> http://pastebin.com/PAine3tP
Nov 08 18:07:39 <dwc-> oh, you definitely can brick it...
Nov 08 18:08:03 <dwc-> wipe the flash completely and the doctor won't recover
Nov 08 18:08:18 <dwc-> Abyssul: run it by hand and see what turns up
Nov 08 18:08:29 <dwc-> I would guess that a lot of those paths you're looking for don't exist
Nov 08 18:08:44 <Abyssul> copy it to the device and use "sh postinst.script" ?
Nov 08 18:08:49 <dwc-> ya
Nov 08 18:09:00 <dwc-> that should point out a bunch of errors
Nov 08 18:09:04 <Abyssul> alright
Nov 08 18:10:52 <Abyssul> hmmm
Nov 08 18:10:56 <Abyssul> my syntax isnt right
Nov 08 18:11:41 <Abyssul> first time with script coding
Nov 08 18:12:04 <jcsullins> Abyssul: u are doing "/path/to/file/cmd file" and should be doing "cmd /path/to/file/file"
Nov 08 18:12:20 <Abyssul> yeah, im going off a example Jason used
Nov 08 18:12:27 <Abyssul> Ill switch over to how Rod uses it
Nov 08 18:16:46 <Abyssul> one step at a time, if I get this working, next is to make it TP and smartphone compatible
Nov 08 18:20:42 <Abyssul> it worked :)
Nov 08 18:20:53 <Abyssul> Now how can i distinguish between the two?
Nov 08 18:21:06 <Abyssul> I know if statements but what command to return the device
Nov 08 18:24:29 <Abyssul> "test -d" :)
Nov 08 18:27:03 <dwc-> that tests directories
Nov 08 18:27:08 <grep_awesome> just signed up to pie my boss in the face. woot
Nov 08 18:27:18 <dwc-> what's the difference that you need to care about between TP and smartphones
Nov 08 18:47:43 <dwc-> ah, it's not TP dependent then
Nov 08 18:47:46 <dwc-> it's APP dependent
Nov 08 18:47:56 <dwc-> (better than two birds, one pig)
Nov 08 18:48:11 <Abyssul> I guess but HD is only installed on TP so its all semantics on how you look at it
Nov 08 18:48:13 <Abyssul> and nice pun
Nov 08 18:48:22 <Abyssul> 1 bird, two pigs?
Nov 08 18:48:31 <dwc-> well, I have both HD and non-HD on my TP
Nov 08 18:48:48 <dwc-> you might consider iterating through a list of all appids
Nov 08 18:49:01 <Abyssul> It would unlock both of them
Nov 08 18:49:01 <dwc-> rather than trying to guess whether it's a TP or not and using HD/not HD
Nov 08 18:49:32 <Abyssul> http://www.precentral.net/angry-birds-level-unlock
Nov 08 18:50:25 <Abyssul> Sadly you cant label an app TP and smartphone compatible in the PC feeds
Nov 08 18:54:31 <grep_awesome> do we have an enyo wizards in here?
Nov 08 18:55:15 <grep_awesome> can't seem to figure out how to dynamicly update the items list of an enyo.Picker
Nov 08 19:02:38 <PuffTheMagic> that shouldnt be hard
Nov 08 19:02:41 <PuffTheMagic> what are you trying?
Nov 08 19:04:17 <grep_awesome> PUffTheMagic: I've tried calling this.$.picker.render() and this.render()
Nov 08 19:04:32 <grep_awesome> after doing something like this.$.picker.items = MYARRAY;
Nov 08 19:05:25 <grep_awesome> no changes show up. you can call create manually and it sorta works, but it screws up the rendering
Nov 08 19:05:35 <PuffTheMagic> i think you need to use the setter function
Nov 08 19:05:46 <grep_awesome> yeah, but I ddin't see one published in the api
Nov 08 19:06:00 <PuffTheMagic> all published variable have setter methods
Nov 08 19:06:25 <grep_awesome> wow, can't believe I missed that
Nov 08 19:06:31 * grep_awesome straps on a dunce cap
Nov 08 19:06:48 <grep_awesome> PuffTheMagic: thanks man
Nov 08 19:08:32 <PuffTheMagic> i dont remember if that works, but i think i've hit something like that before
Nov 08 19:08:43 <grep_awesome> it works
Nov 08 20:15:10 <rwhitby> Abyssul: package the files in the app directory, and have the postinst backup existing files and copy the new files in
Nov 08 20:20:08 <Abyssul> rwhitby, I figured it all out
Nov 08 20:20:28 <Abyssul> rwhitby, I ended up doing that exact thing
Nov 08 20:21:06 <grep_awesome> rwhitby: did you figure out what was triguring the system to overwrite the .service files for homebrew apps? I never had time to look at it this weekend
Nov 08 20:22:41 <rwhitby> grep_awesome: neither did I
Nov 08 20:23:10 <rwhitby> but it affects Tailor badly, so I'll need to figure it before I can make that beta.
Nov 08 20:23:49 <grep_awesome> rwhitby: time is in such short supply. I'll be sure to send you a pm if I figure it out
Nov 08 20:24:14 <rwhitby> now the kernels are out I may have some time today
Nov 08 20:24:53 <PuffTheMagic> rwhitby, do you have your tailor service name ending with .service?
Nov 08 20:25:30 <PuffTheMagic> i had to rename lots of stuff in wterm to get it to package and install properly
Nov 08 20:28:54 <rwhitby> PuffTheMagic: it does not, and yes, that's the first thing I'll be investigating based on your input from some days ago
Nov 08 20:36:45 <PuffTheMagic> rwhitby, had to adjust all the postinst stuff to reflect the new name too :/
Nov 08 20:38:48 <PuffTheMagic> rwhitby, i think all my changes were captured in this commit -> http://git.webos-internals.org/enyo/wterm/commit/?id=63b8efe10cbc1aca486407ae8ca8df4634b5fac7
Nov 08 20:39:35 <PuffTheMagic> and http://git.webos-internals.org/enyo/wterm/commit/?id=a28ec0f10ee0af93100d29f46dbf977677d598bf
Nov 08 21:10:31 <Syco54645_> ka6sox-away cryptk|offline linuxjacques etc
Nov 08 21:10:34 <Syco54645_> i got my tgouchpad
Nov 08 21:11:03 <grep_awesome> woot!
Nov 08 21:11:16 <Syco54645_> got it from tiger direct
Nov 08 21:11:19 <Syco54645_> but still
Nov 08 21:11:21 <Syco54645_> happy with it
Nov 08 21:11:28 <Syco54645_> never really used webos before
Nov 08 21:11:34 <Syco54645_> it is actually quite awesome
Nov 08 21:11:50 <Syco54645_> bah
Nov 08 21:11:53 <Syco54645_> need to reclaim my nick
Nov 08 21:12:30 <Syco54645> bam
Nov 08 21:12:39 <PatrickC> Syco54645, hope u like it
Nov 08 21:12:41 <PatrickC> i love mine
Nov 08 21:12:58 <Syco54645> PatrickC: im not going to lie, i bought it for the idea of running android
Nov 08 21:13:04 <Syco54645> but webos is really functional
Nov 08 21:13:12 <PatrickC> it is
Nov 08 21:13:17 <PatrickC> which is why its still my main phone
Nov 08 21:13:21 <PatrickC> pre- ftw
Nov 08 21:13:23 <Syco54645> i dislike the tile views at times
Nov 08 21:13:33 <PatrickC> tile viewsw?
Nov 08 21:13:35 <Syco54645> PatrickC: i need a bigger screen
Nov 08 21:13:36 <PatrickC> views*
Nov 08 21:13:40 <Syco54645> yeah, not sure what to call it
Nov 08 21:13:46 <PatrickC> bigger then 9.7
Nov 08 21:13:46 <Syco54645> where my email is like 3 pages
Nov 08 21:13:48 <Syco54645> over lapping
Nov 08 21:13:54 <PatrickC> an, panes
Nov 08 21:13:54 <Syco54645> for my phone
Nov 08 21:13:56 <Syco54645> ;)
Nov 08 21:13:56 <PatrickC> ah*
Nov 08 21:13:59 <Syco54645> ah yes
Nov 08 21:14:00 <Syco54645> panes
Nov 08 21:14:11 <PatrickC> i love them. seems soo nice and smooth
Nov 08 21:14:16 <Syco54645> i also wish that i could gesture on it
Nov 08 21:14:35 <PatrickC> yes, that is one thing i hated that they took away
Nov 08 21:14:40 <Syco54645> but yes, 4.3 inch screen on phone ftw
Nov 08 21:14:54 <Syco54645> wish hp and palm would have been smart about that
Nov 08 21:14:55 <PatrickC> what phone do u have?
Nov 08 21:15:04 <PatrickC> yeah.. well, there is a talk about that tonight
Nov 08 21:15:09 <Syco54645> the veer, which amazing that they crammed all that in, was too small
Nov 08 21:15:15 <Syco54645> i have the htc thunderbolt
Nov 08 21:16:03 <Syco54645> and looking at the galaxy nexus as well
Nov 08 21:16:10 <PatrickC> ah
Nov 08 21:16:22 <PatrickC> the only phone im looking at getting right now would be the iPhone 4s
Nov 08 21:16:49 <Syco54645> and looking at the galaxy nexus as well
Nov 08 21:16:51 <Syco54645> woops
Nov 08 21:16:53 <Syco54645> yeah
Nov 08 21:16:57 <Syco54645> i really like android
Nov 08 21:17:04 <Syco54645> they need to take a few queues from webos
Nov 08 21:17:08 <PatrickC> i never really liked it
Nov 08 21:17:16 <PatrickC> the only reason my touchpad is dualbooting right now is for games
Nov 08 21:17:21 <PatrickC> and netflix
Nov 08 21:17:34 <summatusmentis> I hated android when I used it
Nov 08 21:17:55 <Syco54645> i am glad that android dual boots
Nov 08 21:18:01 <Syco54645> i dont think i would want to lose webos
Nov 08 21:18:04 <summatusmentis> but they are taking cues from webOS, android hired away the guy who was the primary design guy of webOS
Nov 08 21:18:17 <Syco54645> i know
Nov 08 21:18:19 <Syco54645> i remember that
Nov 08 21:18:23 <grep_awesome> i hate... the launcher right now. hate it. I can't change the order of the default tabs... Everytime I change the files it freaks out
Nov 08 21:18:34 <PatrickC> grep_awesome, on webos?
Nov 08 21:18:37 <grep_awesome> aye
Nov 08 21:18:40 <PatrickC> did u try the patch in preware?
Nov 08 21:18:44 <Syco54645> but we have to wait to get those till we have jelly bean for those
Nov 08 21:18:50 <summatusmentis> that still doesn't let you change the order
Nov 08 21:18:54 <grep_awesome> nah, wrote my own launcher manager
Nov 08 21:19:00 <PatrickC> not the order, but adds more pages
Nov 08 21:19:02 <summatusmentis> Syco54645: some of the cues they're taking are in ICS
Nov 08 21:19:04 <grep_awesome> but you can only change the order of the ones that you tack on
Nov 08 21:19:04 <Syco54645> speaking of preware. any things to install? just got it up and going
Nov 08 21:19:08 <summatusmentis> swipe to kill apps?
Nov 08 21:19:10 <summatusmentis> that was webOS
Nov 08 21:19:17 <Syco54645> summatusmentis: they said more will be in jb
Nov 08 21:19:25 <summatusmentis> I'm sure more will
Nov 08 21:19:36 <summatusmentis> I think android is on the road to usability
Nov 08 21:19:42 <summatusmentis> but as it stands I have a hard time with it
Nov 08 21:19:47 <PatrickC> what do u guys expect to hear tonight?
Nov 08 21:19:55 <summatusmentis> meh
Nov 08 21:20:06 <summatusmentis> I'm waiting to see
Nov 08 21:20:11 <summatusmentis> speculating just makes me sad
Nov 08 21:20:12 <Syco54645> who is holding this talk
Nov 08 21:20:17 <Syco54645> i thought hp is done
Nov 08 21:20:27 <stbuehler> PatrickC: you pinged me a long time ago, but never responded to the pong :) wzup?
Nov 08 21:20:39 <summatusmentis> they've been "evaluating the future of webOS" for a number of months
Nov 08 21:20:48 <PatrickC> stbuehler, i forget now haha
Nov 08 21:20:57 <summatusmentis> allegedly, Meg Whitman is attending the meeting
Nov 08 21:20:59 <PaNeL> hello
Nov 08 21:21:06 <PatrickC> hey PaNeL
Nov 08 21:21:09 <Syco54645> summatusmentis: not sure who that is
Nov 08 21:21:16 <summatusmentis> CEO of HP
Nov 08 21:21:19 <PaNeL> heh
Nov 08 21:21:20 <summatusmentis> she used to run eBay?
Nov 08 21:21:37 <PatrickC> eys
Nov 08 21:21:37 <summatusmentis> also, ran for Governor of California, and lost
Nov 08 21:21:42 <PatrickC> lol
Nov 08 21:21:58 <Syco54645> summatusmentis: ah ok
Nov 08 21:22:02 <PaNeL> what's goin on?
Nov 08 21:22:07 <summatusmentis> she replaced Apotheker
Nov 08 21:22:22 <summatusmentis> PaNeL: nothin', just procrastinating grading my students assignments
Nov 08 21:22:23 <Syco54645> my tp is taking a long ass time to charge
Nov 08 21:22:29 <Syco54645> like 3 hours to get 50%
Nov 08 21:22:31 <Syco54645> is that normal?
Nov 08 21:22:44 <PatrickC> Syco54645, what charger?
Nov 08 21:22:52 <PatrickC> and are u using it while its charging?
Nov 08 21:23:01 <Syco54645> official hp charger
Nov 08 21:23:02 <Syco54645> and kinda
Nov 08 21:23:08 <Syco54645> not really using it heavily
Nov 08 21:23:27 <stbuehler> Syco54645: the 2A one, or the 1A (from a phone for example)?
Nov 08 21:23:37 <PaNeL> will be some HP meeting?
Nov 08 21:23:52 <summatusmentis> PaNeL: allegedly an all-hands meeting after business hours
Nov 08 21:24:10 <Syco54645> stbuehler: 2 amp
Nov 08 21:24:13 <PaNeL> thanks for info
Nov 08 21:24:21 <grep_awesome> summatusmentis: where did you hear that?
Nov 08 21:24:37 <summatusmentis> grep_awesome: precentral, webosroundup, the verge
Nov 08 21:24:41 <PaNeL> yes, looking at precentral
Nov 08 21:24:46 <PaNeL> now
Nov 08 21:25:09 <jcsullins> Syco54645: should charge much quicker with screen off
Nov 08 21:25:29 <grep_awesome> yeah, the screen eats power
Nov 08 21:25:54 <Syco54645> how long we talking? im worried something is messed up
Nov 08 21:26:25 <grep_awesome> Syco54645: it charges painfully slowly, but I've never timed it
Nov 08 21:26:43 <grep_awesome> if you have been using it while it charges then it will be even worse
Nov 08 21:26:45 <PaNeL> summatusmentis: i'm not expecting something new
Nov 08 21:26:50 <Syco54645> grep_awesome: ah ok. i only have my nook color and phone to compare it to
Nov 08 21:26:57 <Syco54645> which both charge really fast
Nov 08 21:27:01 <summatusmentis> PaNeL: the rumor is that they'll make a decision today
Nov 08 21:27:04 <grep_awesome> yeah, my ipad is done in like an hour.
Nov 08 21:27:19 <summatusmentis> quite frankly, I'm just waiting to see
Nov 08 21:27:46 <Syco54645> grep_awesome: im at 64% right now
Nov 08 21:27:50 <Syco54645> just plugged it in
Nov 08 21:27:53 <Syco54645> screen is off
Nov 08 21:27:57 <Syco54645> will check it in an hour
Nov 08 21:28:22 <Syco54645> maybe i will invest in the touchstone
Nov 08 21:28:23 <Syco54645> hmm
Nov 08 21:28:44 <PaNeL> i have my pre2 from march, I'm new, but I'm sad, because I found phone os, that i like
Nov 08 21:28:56 <summatusmentis> PaNeL: we're all sad
Nov 08 21:29:24 <PaNeL> and it's easy to develop for it
Nov 08 21:29:26 <grep_awesome> even half of hp is sad
Nov 08 21:29:49 <Syco54645> maybe hp will release a new phone, that doesnt suck. or get oems to release them.
Nov 08 21:30:17 <grep_awesome> they'd have to have that in product development months ago... and I'm afarid that isn't the case or it would have been leaked
Nov 08 21:30:18 <PaNeL> i'm now waiting for veer :)
Nov 08 21:30:25 <Syco54645> if i am going to be browsing the web on it i dont want a postage stamp screen like the veer
Nov 08 21:30:32 <grep_awesome> their best chance is to roll out the HP touchpad Go that the specs were leaked for
Nov 08 21:30:49 <Syco54645> well
Nov 08 21:30:53 <Syco54645> webos is quite awesome
Nov 08 21:30:54 <Syco54645> i must say
Nov 08 21:31:01 <Syco54645> i am thoroghly impressed
Nov 08 21:31:01 <summatusmentis> there's not gonna be new webOS hardware from HP, I can almost guarantee it
Nov 08 21:31:07 <PaNeL> yes
Nov 08 21:31:09 <summatusmentis> they might license/sell it
Nov 08 21:31:18 <Syco54645> they should open source it
Nov 08 21:31:25 <summatusmentis> they can't
Nov 08 21:31:28 <Syco54645> ?
Nov 08 21:31:35 <summatusmentis> patents are a big issue in the mobile space right now
Nov 08 21:31:48 <wrea> grep_awesome, the Go would've been awesome. I like the smaller tablets for the most part
Nov 08 21:31:57 <Syco54645> s/mobile space/with apple/
Nov 08 21:32:13 <summatusmentis> apple is 40% of the mobile space
Nov 08 21:32:17 <grep_awesome> wrea: yeah me too. imagine a nook or galaxy sized touchpad
Nov 08 21:32:19 <NuttyBunny> wrea, The Go was my target tablet, I was almost there in line to buy one!
Nov 08 21:32:21 <Syco54645> wrea: afaik webos was booting on nook color
Nov 08 21:32:43 <summatusmentis> and MS has signed a significant number of licensing agreements with android manufacturers
Nov 08 21:32:47 <summatusmentis> so it's not only apple
Nov 08 21:33:06 <summatusmentis> as it stands, webOS is covered, patent-wise
Nov 08 21:33:10 <grep_awesome> Syco54645: do you have a link to any material on the webos nook?
Nov 08 21:33:11 <Syco54645> summatusmentis: yes, but apple is patent trolling worse than ms was. i mean come on. slide to unlock patent? that is bs
Nov 08 21:33:16 <summatusmentis> if they open source it, webOS loses those
Nov 08 21:33:22 <PaNeL> what do you think about WP?
Nov 08 21:33:22 <Syco54645> grep_awesome: ask ka6sox-away or destinal
Nov 08 21:33:32 <summatusmentis> that patent has been in the system for a number of years
Nov 08 21:33:47 <summatusmentis> probably submitted when apple first released the iPhone (or before)
Nov 08 21:33:48 <Syco54645> still is bs
Nov 08 21:33:58 <Syco54645> should have never been granted
Nov 08 21:34:08 <summatusmentis> PaNeL: WP7 is neat looking
Nov 08 21:34:14 <summatusmentis> I'm not sure I like it well enough though
Nov 08 21:34:18 <Syco54645> i think wp7 is hard to use
Nov 08 21:34:19 <Syco54645> the tiles
Nov 08 21:34:23 <summatusmentis> Syco54645: regardless of whether or not it's reasonable, it is
Nov 08 21:34:36 <Syco54645> yes
Nov 08 21:34:39 <summatusmentis> so, given the patent issues, webOS isn't easily able to be open sourced
Nov 08 21:34:48 <Syco54645> indeed
Nov 08 21:35:23 <Syco54645> well i will be watching the news outlets closely for info on this meeting
Nov 08 21:35:36 <PaNeL> i have yesterday installed touchstone to my car :) and it's great
Nov 08 21:35:41 <Syco54645> with my limited (2 hours tops) time with webos it is amazing
Nov 08 21:35:58 <Syco54645> speaking of the touchstone, is it worth getting?
Nov 08 21:36:06 <summatusmentis> for the touchpad? unclear
Nov 08 21:36:07 <Syco54645> i like the idea of induction charging
Nov 08 21:36:10 <summatusmentis> for a phone? aboslutely
Nov 08 21:36:19 <Syco54645> that is how i felt
Nov 08 21:36:22 <summatusmentis> I love my phone touchstones
Nov 08 21:36:41 <Syco54645> does the qi charge the touchpad?
Nov 08 21:36:42 <PaNeL> I have blue tooth handsfree inbuild in car
Nov 08 21:38:10 <summatusmentis> qi?
Nov 08 21:41:22 <Syco54645> summatusmentis: also, regarding patents from apple. do you not have to defend your patents as soon as you know they are being infringed upon? if that is the case couldnt an argument be made that the slide to unlock was being infringed upon for 2 or 3 years and they didnt do anything thus rendering their patents null and void
Nov 08 21:41:25 <Syco54645> last patent thing
Nov 08 21:41:29 <Syco54645> i swear
Nov 08 21:41:47 <summatusmentis> Syco54645: they were just granted that patent
Nov 08 21:41:57 <Syco54645> oh, well then other patents then
Nov 08 21:42:00 <summatusmentis> I don't think they're obligated to defend it if it's pending
Nov 08 21:42:09 <Syco54645> i havnt been following the patent disputes
Nov 08 21:42:20 <summatusmentis> me neither with any real detail
Nov 08 21:42:21 <Syco54645> summatusmentis: regarding qi http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=qi+induction+charger&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=16560772780196458202&sa=X&ei=8KG5TvzFKIyasgKomNjUCA&ved=0CEsQ8gIwAw
Nov 08 21:42:23 <grep_awesome> summatusmentis: I'm pretty sure you do have to defend actually, or it goes to public domain
Nov 08 21:42:37 <summatusmentis> grep_awesome: if the patent is pending?
Nov 08 21:42:51 <summatusmentis> Syco54645: oh
Nov 08 21:42:52 <grep_awesome> summatusmentis: no after it is granted, so apple would need to start now
Nov 08 21:42:56 <Syco54645> grep_awesome: i have read that as well. so really, apple and ms not caring about patents till they are getting competition should remove their patents
Nov 08 21:42:57 <summatusmentis> grep_awesome: right
Nov 08 21:43:03 <summatusmentis> that's true
Nov 08 21:43:14 <Syco54645> but there are patents that they have held for years that they didnt care about till just now
Nov 08 21:43:27 <Syco54645> i mean motorola mobility is just as guilty
Nov 08 21:43:29 <summatusmentis> meh, honestly? patent reform is a different topic entirely
Nov 08 21:43:43 <Syco54645> but now
Nov 08 21:43:44 <Syco54645> i am done
Nov 08 21:43:54 <Syco54645> so summatusmentis thoughts on it working with qi?
Nov 08 21:43:59 <summatusmentis> no clue, honestly
Nov 08 21:44:40 <Syco54645> hm
Nov 08 21:44:44 <Syco54645> would it break it if not
Nov 08 21:44:44 <Syco54645> lol
Nov 08 21:44:52 <Syco54645> im gonna baby my tp
Nov 08 21:44:54 <summatusmentis> could, I suppose
Nov 08 21:45:03 <summatusmentis> might be able to fry the TS coils
Nov 08 21:45:06 <Syco54645> in fact, it is in a hyperbolic chamber right now
Nov 08 21:45:54 <summatusmentis> mines just in it's case, in my bag
Nov 08 21:46:05 <Syco54645> i bought the portfolio case
Nov 08 21:46:12 <summatusmentis> I got the HP one
Nov 08 21:46:13 <Syco54645> hopefully that was a good buy
Nov 08 21:46:16 <summatusmentis> whatever that's called
Nov 08 21:46:26 <Syco54645> the one with the flap that is like the ipad case?
Nov 08 21:46:51 <summatusmentis> that one with a flap that folds in 2 separate places
Nov 08 21:46:59 <summatusmentis> it's not really like the ipad case at all
Nov 08 21:47:00 <Syco54645> yeah
Nov 08 21:47:08 <PaNeL> i have no tp :( i was not successfull in firesale
Nov 08 21:47:11 <Syco54645> oh, i thought it was
Nov 08 21:47:21 <Syco54645> PaNeL: i got one from td, bundle for 279
Nov 08 21:47:21 <summatusmentis> Syco54645: I mean, it's designed to be a stand
Nov 08 21:47:25 <summatusmentis> but it's not magnetic
Nov 08 21:47:27 <PaNeL> but, waiting for developer coupon :)
Nov 08 21:47:32 <Syco54645> summatusmentis: oh no, ipad 1 case
Nov 08 21:47:33 <Syco54645> hold on
Nov 08 21:47:46 <summatusmentis> Syco54645: oh, perhaps
Nov 08 21:47:55 <Syco54645> this was before the magnetic case
Nov 08 21:48:05 <Syco54645> http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC361ZM/B
Nov 08 21:48:25 <summatusmentis> it's sorta similar to that, yeah
Nov 08 21:49:16 <Syco54645> cool
Nov 08 21:49:42 <Syco54645> how does the touchpad stay in it? does it slide into a cloth panel? i have not been able to find any up close pics
Nov 08 21:52:11 <summatusmentis> nope, the case wraps the touchpad pretty tightly
Nov 08 21:52:18 <summatusmentis> it's a rubberized shell type of thing
Nov 08 21:53:24 <PaNeL> summatusmentis: you are teacher? you mentioned students :)
Nov 08 21:54:12 <summatusmentis> I'm a TA
Nov 08 21:54:18 <summatusmentis> and a PhD CS student
Nov 08 21:55:10 <PaNeL> ah so
Nov 08 21:55:30 <summatusmentis> so, "teacher" is strong, but yes, I have students
Nov 08 21:55:58 <PaNeL> on my university they invited me to PhD, but I had enough learning :)
Nov 08 21:56:19 <summatusmentis> I like research a lot
Nov 08 21:56:30 <PaNeL> but now, after 5 years I will return back :)
Nov 08 21:56:32 <grep_awesome> summatusmentis: I envy you. I want to get my PhD so bad, but I don't have the time/money with a new baby.
Nov 08 21:56:52 <wrea> tell the baby too get a job
Nov 08 21:56:56 <wrea> to*
Nov 08 21:57:01 <grep_awesome> tried, wife intervened
Nov 08 21:57:24 <wrea> lol damn
Nov 08 21:57:34 <grep_awesome> shame, cuz a baby with a fuzzy onesy will beat the heck out of a roomba
Nov 08 21:57:38 <grep_awesome> and roombas are expensive
Nov 08 21:57:43 <grep_awesome> i was already doin the math
Nov 08 21:57:51 <summatusmentis> grep_awesome: there's someone else in my lab who has a new baby, and takes one day off a week
Nov 08 21:57:56 <summatusmentis> to babying
Nov 08 21:58:10 <grep_awesome> but does that person also work full time?
Nov 08 21:58:10 <PaNeL> :) work + study it's no so good, tried for 2,5 yeard
Nov 08 21:58:27 <wrea> rooma + cat = good. roomba + baby = bad
Nov 08 21:58:29 <summatusmentis> grep_awesome: well, here, PhD is "full time"
Nov 08 21:58:30 <Syco54645> hell i just want my masters
Nov 08 21:58:33 <Syco54645> but dont have the drive
Nov 08 21:58:52 <summatusmentis> grep_awesome: his wife works full time, and I think his wife's mom cares for the kid during the day
Nov 08 21:59:00 <grep_awesome> lucky guy
Nov 08 21:59:29 <grep_awesome> there are a few programs that you can get your phd at night, but I'm afraid it will be a few years before I can
Nov 08 21:59:47 <Syco54645> 17% in 30 minutes for charging
Nov 08 21:59:56 <grep_awesome> lol
Nov 08 22:00:02 <grep_awesome> consider that a bonus 2%
Nov 08 22:00:16 <VICODANAX> anyone else having problems updating muffle system logging on 3.04?
Nov 08 22:00:44 <grep_awesome> and it's time to go home, 'evening yall
Nov 08 22:01:08 <VICODANAX> Syco54645: you on the topic of battery life?
Nov 08 22:03:06 <Syco54645> VICODANAX: yes i am
Nov 08 22:03:15 <Syco54645> just got my touchpad
Nov 08 22:03:19 <Syco54645> making sure it is charging ok
Nov 08 22:03:24 <VICODANAX> are you on 3.04?
Nov 08 22:03:28 <VICODANAX> or 3.02?
Nov 08 22:03:34 <Syco54645> VICODANAX: i just updated
Nov 08 22:03:42 <VICODANAX> im noticing worse battery life on 3.04
Nov 08 22:03:48 <VICODANAX> i think im going to doctor to 3.02
Nov 08 22:04:06 <Syco54645> i just want to make sure the charging rate is ok
Nov 08 22:04:43 <VICODANAX> well what charger are you using
Nov 08 22:04:49 <VICODANAX> factory ac adapter with usb?
Nov 08 22:05:30 <Syco54645> yes
Nov 08 22:06:17 <Syco54645> at this rate it would take 4 or 5 hours to charge to 100%
Nov 08 22:06:23 <Syco54645> i dont mind if that is normal
Nov 08 22:06:29 <Syco54645> just want to make sure it isnt messed up
Nov 08 22:07:06 <VICODANAX> first charge might take a while
Nov 08 22:07:08 <VICODANAX> just be patient
Nov 08 22:07:15 <Syco54645> ok
Nov 08 22:07:23 <Syco54645> <3 this thing
Nov 08 22:07:23 <Syco54645> wow
Nov 08 22:08:14 <VICODANAX> have you installed preware yet?
Nov 08 22:08:30 <Syco54645> just plugging the usb into my computer actually
Nov 08 22:08:57 <VICODANAX> word
Nov 08 22:09:04 <VICODANAX> let it charge completely before you unplug it
Nov 08 22:09:09 <Syco54645> lol
Nov 08 22:09:10 <Syco54645> too late
Nov 08 22:09:20 <VICODANAX> i mean before you unplug it for more than a few mins
Nov 08 22:09:31 <Syco54645> ah
Nov 08 22:09:32 <Syco54645> yeah
Nov 08 22:09:45 <Syco54645> most it has been unplugged is maybe 10 minutes when the charger came out of the wall
Nov 08 22:09:48 <Syco54645> without me noticing
Nov 08 22:09:52 <Syco54645> installed preware
Nov 08 22:10:21 <VICODANAX> word
Nov 08 22:10:29 <VICODANAX> try to install muffle system logging
Nov 08 22:10:31 <VICODANAX> tell me if it works
Nov 08 22:10:31 <Syco54645> any tips on what to install?
Nov 08 22:10:35 <VICODANAX> yes
Nov 08 22:10:39 <VICODANAX> try that one first though
Nov 08 22:11:16 <Syco54645> how do i search?
Nov 08 22:11:42 <Syco54645> nvm
Nov 08 22:11:45 <VICODANAX> lol
Nov 08 22:11:52 <VICODANAX> btw
Nov 08 22:11:57 <VICODANAX> don't bother with cyanogenmod for a while
Nov 08 22:12:13 <Syco54645> installed
Nov 08 22:12:17 <VICODANAX> ok
Nov 08 22:12:17 <Syco54645> oh yeah
Nov 08 22:12:19 <VICODANAX> so it's me then
Nov 08 22:12:19 <Syco54645> i know
Nov 08 22:12:20 <VICODANAX> ok
Nov 08 22:12:23 <VICODANAX> lemme give you a thread
Nov 08 22:12:24 <VICODANAX> sec
Nov 08 22:12:25 <Syco54645> cm7 isnt very good right now
Nov 08 22:12:28 <Syco54645> what is luna?
Nov 08 22:12:55 <VICODANAX> the interface
Nov 08 22:13:00 <Syco54645> ah ok
Nov 08 22:13:03 <Syco54645> luna=launcher
Nov 08 22:13:17 <VICODANAX> yes
Nov 08 22:13:34 <VICODANAX> Syco54645: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1230708
Nov 08 22:15:00 <Syco54645> awesome
Nov 08 22:15:01 <Syco54645> thanks
Nov 08 22:15:05 <Syco54645> now i need to get going
Nov 08 22:15:10 <Syco54645> fiance is waiting on me
Nov 08 22:15:22 <VICODANAX> have fun
Nov 08 22:15:23 <VICODANAX> bye
Nov 08 22:15:33 <Syco54645> thanks again
Nov 08 22:15:38 <Syco54645> haha
Nov 08 22:15:39 <Syco54645> dinner
Nov 08 22:15:46 <VICODANAX> np see you around
Nov 08 22:15:48 <Syco54645> the daughter won a coloring contest
Nov 08 22:15:57 <Syco54645> gets free dinner at this grill
Nov 08 22:16:07 <VICODANAX> nice!
Nov 08 22:16:08 <VICODANAX> congrats
Nov 08 22:16:11 <VICODANAX> bring me a doggie bag!
Nov 08 22:16:12 <Syco54645> hells yeah
Nov 08 22:16:15 <Syco54645> haha
Nov 08 22:16:26 <Syco54645> need to disconnect from works vpn now, gonna boot me from here
Nov 08 22:16:28 <Syco54645> later
Nov 08 22:26:42 <PaNeL> time to go sleep
Nov 08 22:27:50 <PaNeL> bye
Nov 08 22:38:10 <Eire> Hi All
Nov 08 22:39:00 <Eire> Does anyone have problems trying to open www.hotmail.com from their touchpad?
Nov 08 22:39:26 <Eire> Mine will not open/load the page since day 1
Nov 08 22:41:15 <Eire> I just get the following when I try login
Nov 08 22:41:19 <Eire> This site may be experiencing a problem The site may not be a member of the Windows Live Network You can: You can sign in or sign up at other sites on the Windows Live Network, or try again later at this site.
Nov 08 22:41:58 <Eire> Anyone else getting the same error or is there a patch/fix to resolve this
Nov 08 22:42:20 <Eire> Any help is greatly appreciated
Nov 08 22:42:21 <VICODANAX> no because i dont use shitty hotmail
Nov 08 22:42:34 <VICODANAX> but let me try
Nov 08 22:43:32 <Abyssul> Doesnt work
Nov 08 22:43:37 <Eire>  Vic I am only asking a question not asking for a review
Nov 08 22:43:55 <VICODANAX> that wasn't a review ;)
Nov 08 22:44:06 <Eire> Thanks Abyssul do you get the same error
Nov 08 22:44:21 <VICODANAX> Eire: have you tried adding it as a mail account to mail
Nov 08 22:44:22 <Eire> It was a smart comment Vic
Nov 08 22:45:05 <Abyssul> Append it with sercure by going to http://hotmail.com
Nov 08 22:45:23 <VICODANAX> yeah it was.
Nov 08 22:45:27 <Abyssul> and changing the options in your account to check the box of "Use secure connection"
Nov 08 23:00:12 <Eire> Thanks for that Abysul it works a treat :-)
Nov 08 23:00:43 <Eire> 1 more question if I May sci
Nov 08 23:01:57 <Eire> how do you get the keyboard to come up when your in a browser and just want to use the down arrow key to scroll through a list/menu
Nov 08 23:02:51 <Eire> Anyone able to help please
Nov 08 23:02:58 <NuttyBunny> Eire, I don't think you can
Nov 08 23:03:23 <rwhitby> VICODANAX, Syco54645_work: please be aware that discussion of Android is off-topic in this channel. See the /topic for more details.
Nov 08 23:03:29 <Eire> Ok thanks NuttyBunny
Nov 08 23:04:15 <Eire> very last question IPromise
Nov 08 23:04:23 <rwhitby> and #webos-general exists for generic off-topic discussion
Nov 08 23:05:32 <Eire> How do you pm Someone in here when I click on a persons alias it just gives the option for a WhoIS or Query??
Nov 08 23:05:54 <rwhitby> say /msg <username> text
Nov 08 23:05:55 <Eire> Sry for all the questions
Nov 08 23:06:17 <VICODANAX> rwhitby: ok thanks
Nov 08 23:06:21 <rwhitby> Eire: #touchpad is the place for general touchpad questions
Nov 08 23:06:30 <VICODANAX> #touchpad is dead
Nov 08 23:06:42 <rwhitby> #webos-internals is for discussion about WebOS Internals software, techniques, etc.
Nov 08 23:06:55 <rwhitby> not generic "how do I do blah with a touchpad"
Nov 08 23:07:23 <VICODANAX> rwhitby: don't you get tired of saying the same thing over and over again? *poke* ;)
Nov 08 23:07:25 <rwhitby> VICODANAX: whether or not another channel is dead does not change what is on-topic in this channel
Nov 08 23:07:26 <Eire> ok thanks
Nov 08 23:07:47 <rwhitby> VICODANAX: yes
Nov 08 23:07:50 <Eire> Still learning
Nov 08 23:08:06 <rwhitby> VICODANAX: that that usually leads to kick-bans when I do
Nov 08 23:09:24 <dwc-> Eire: "query" is what you want
Nov 08 23:11:02 <VICODANAX> rwhitby: i can setup a bot to do that for you
Nov 08 23:12:02 <dwc-> ~offtopic
Nov 08 23:12:33 <dwc-> infobot, offtopic is <reply>#touchpad is the place for general touchpad questions. #webos-internals is for discussion about WebOS Internals software, techniques, etc.
Nov 08 23:12:33 <infobot> dwc-: okay
Nov 08 23:13:09 <Clark008> is there a patch to have arrow keys on keyboard?
Nov 08 23:13:41 <Clark008> sometimes trying to fix typos is harder than it seems cause I can't seem to click at the right place to get to those letters
Nov 08 23:17:32 <VICODANAX> dwc: you should do android is <reply> offtopic xxxx
Nov 08 23:18:11 <NuttyBunny> Clark008: Nope, but you can get a cheap bluetooth keyboard ;)
Nov 08 23:18:15 <dwc-> that won't autotrigger
Nov 08 23:18:28 <dwc-> someone would still have to say it
Nov 08 23:19:22 <Clark008> I have the touchpad keyboard
Nov 08 23:19:36 <VICODANAX> yeah if someone says the word the infobot should reply
Nov 08 23:19:36 <Clark008> but not going to carry that with me where the touchpad is going
Nov 08 23:20:04 <Clark008> I was hoping there'd be a patch to keyboard to allow for toggle arrows at the least
Nov 08 23:23:44 <NuttyBunny> you can simulate the keys
Nov 08 23:23:50 <NuttyBunny> but it's awkward
Nov 08 23:26:26 <Clark008> simulate the keys?
Nov 08 23:27:26 <NuttyBunny> It works at least in PDK programs, dunno if it works in webOS native programs, lemme find the link
Nov 08 23:29:17 <NuttyBunny> http://forums.precentral.net/hp-touchpad/299077-using-ctrl-esc-keys-tp-virtual-keyboard-works.html and http://forums.precentral.net/hp-touchpad/299077-using-ctrl-esc-keys-tp-virtual-keyboard-works.html#post3157456
Nov 08 23:47:53 <Clark008> that's neat, but I need it as regular keyboard, not simulated on xterm
Nov 08 23:52:19 <ka6sox-away> Clark008, buy a keyboard then.
Nov 08 23:54:10 <rwhitby> Clark008: there is no such patch
Nov 09 00:02:39 <Clark008> I have a touchpad keyboard, but it's not ideal to carry it all around where the touchpad will be going
Nov 09 00:02:41 <Clark008> thanks rwhitby
Nov 09 00:03:57 <Clark008> would it be hard to make one and have it goggle in xs, s, m, l options?
Nov 09 00:56:43 <roxfan> [01:53] <FL7> http://www.theverge.com/2011/11/8/2548121/hp-no-decision-webos
Nov 09 00:56:43 <roxfan> [01:53] <FL7> i love this shit
Nov 09 00:56:43 <roxfan> [01:54] <+Enron> breaking news: lol HP
Nov 09 00:57:06 <nightburn> in the coming months
Nov 09 00:57:25 <rwhitby> Predicted exactly, 5 hours ago: https://twitter.com/webosinternals/status/134012334288027648
Nov 09 00:58:06 <jhoff80> so i know it's bad timing with the laughable news but i totally screwed up my touchpad & am stuck at 8% on the doctor and can't get past it. i novacom mem booted the installer uimage, & did the mkdosfs command, and then held the power and center buttons to reboot, held the volume up button to go into recovery mode, and then webos doctor still tells me that it can't reset my device.  i tried the 'complete filesystem creation
Nov 09 00:58:08 <roxfan> Sorry, that page doesn’t exist!
Nov 09 00:59:43 <bpadalino> heh, in the coming weeks
Nov 09 01:00:13 <nightburn> yea rwhitby, i read your tweet early and I think I sublimely just typed it there. you're in my head man!
Nov 09 01:01:08 <AMR-1> well at least we may see 3.05 now
Nov 09 01:02:32 <nightburn> my vote is for full "open source"
Nov 09 01:02:51 <ka6sox> we don't get a vote
Nov 09 01:03:00 <summatusmentis> also, patents
Nov 09 01:05:36 <nightburn> sell the patents, open source the OS.
Nov 09 01:05:59 <summatusmentis> then the OS is open for patent suits
Nov 09 01:07:33 <jacques> oh, HP ...
Nov 09 01:07:36 <jacques> nm
Nov 09 01:08:38 <IGNTNUNLMTD> what else did you expect from them? lol
Nov 09 01:10:02 <jacques> :-\
Nov 09 01:10:57 <IGNTNUNLMTD> haha
Nov 09 02:34:54 <bhuey> no news, HA, is no news :)
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Nov 09 02:59:57 2011