**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Nov 01 04:47:57 2009
Nov 01 04:49:31 <rwhitby-_> Live logs are at http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos.txt
Nov 01 04:49:38 <rwhitby-_> Previous 24 hours at http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos-prev.txt
Nov 01 04:49:45 <rwhitby-_> Archives at http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos/
Nov 01 04:49:49 <rwhitby-_> Logging is now enabled.
Nov 01 04:50:51 <dkirker> rwhitby-_: how's that?
Nov 01 04:51:10 <rwhitby-_> look good to me
Nov 01 04:55:02 <rick_home> dkirker  thanks
Nov 01 04:55:11 <rick_home> public logs make finding stuff SO much easier.
Nov 01 04:55:12 <dkirker> np
Nov 01 04:55:17 <rick_home> Google is my friend
Nov 01 04:55:43 <rick_home> dkirker  I don't think I met you when I was in San Jose this week.
Nov 01 04:56:06 <dkirker> rick_home: you didn't. I haven't been in the Bay Area for a few months.
Nov 01 04:56:17 * dkirker isn't with Palm
Nov 01 04:56:46 <dkirker> I was an intern last summer, but I am back in school now.
Nov 01 04:59:07 <rick_home> ahhh
Nov 01 05:03:00 <dkirker> unless you meant something else...
Nov 01 06:16:16 <JenP> rick_home you still up?
Nov 01 13:45:37 <bmyers_here> how was that xtra hour of sleep?
Nov 01 14:02:26 <Roy-Pre101> bmyers_here: Not enough.
Nov 01 14:13:34 <webosschool-tore> so whats going on this morning?
Nov 01 14:15:34 <bmyers_here> its all happenening in phili.. GO YANKEES!!
Nov 01 14:18:01 <webosschool-tore> dang east coast world series.
Nov 01 14:19:06 <webosschool-tore> so I am putting together some material for our presentation at Iowa Code Camp… anyone have thoughts on a good sample app to build for beginners?  I am sick of RSS readers.
Nov 01 14:24:04 <bmyers_here> what kind of app? there are so many aspects to cover
Nov 01 14:24:21 <bmyers_here> storeage, presentation, logic..
Nov 01 14:26:30 <Roy-Pre101> webosschool-tore: Yeah, I'm going to put up a tutorial on webOS101 and I just don't know what to tackle there, either.  Though, I probably won't carry it farther than some simple widgets and maybe storage.
Nov 01 14:27:41 <Roy-Pre101> Maybe I'll do a simple simon game with a high score table.  something with buttons, styling, cookies, lists...
Nov 01 14:27:59 <ElVox_> i was going to suggest tetris but simon is good
Nov 01 14:28:17 <Roy-Pre101> Tetris involves a little too much movement for a beginner tutorial I think.
Nov 01 14:29:18 <ElVox_> hehe make a "duck hunt" game...basically just a click handler on an animated dom element
Nov 01 14:29:39 <bmyers_here> a shopping list perhaps? do some dynamic lists, some storage, widgets in the list, etc.
Nov 01 14:29:53 <webosschool-tore> Hmm. Simon is a good idea….duck hunt…that is a good idea too, something that seems harder than it really is.
Nov 01 14:33:07 <webosschool-tore> hey! Justin woke up!
Nov 01 14:33:13 <ElVox_> if you make a shopping list application that fetch prices from google's product search (based on your geolocation) and shows an estimated price-range for goods with estimated totals
Nov 01 14:33:17 <ElVox_> i would buy it :D
Nov 01 14:33:38 <webosschool-tore> Elvox_: good idea.
Nov 01 14:33:53 <webosschool-just> morning (yawn)
Nov 01 14:34:02 <webosschool-tore> that would be a good app to build upon...
Nov 01 14:35:49 <bmyers_here> nice, some ajax too...
Nov 01 14:36:23 <sugardave> Roy-Pre101: if you do a Simon game, I'm going to be pissed :P
Nov 01 14:38:16 <Roy-Pre101> It wouldn't be a -real- simon game.
Nov 01 14:38:29 <Roy-Pre101> Shopping list could be good, though.
Nov 01 14:38:32 <webosschool-tore> no…just a sample.
Nov 01 14:39:13 <webosschool-tore> I am liking the shopping list example too.  But I think the duck hunt has more potential to show that you can create some neat apps really quickly.
Nov 01 14:40:46 <webosschool-tore> speaking of animations… does anyone have a recommended physics javascript framework?
Nov 01 14:41:28 <Roy-Pre101> I'm using a jQuery physics module, but it's GPL so I'm leery of using it since the whole GPL thing is muddy when it comes to a .js file.
Nov 01 14:41:40 <webosschool-tore> Or is everyone like Roy and use their genius to write it themselves!
Nov 01 14:42:16 <webosschool-tore> whats the name of the module Roy?  is it any good?
Nov 01 14:43:00 <ElVox_> hmm now i want to try writing a js physics api...
Nov 01 14:44:09 <ElVox_> hey does the palm pre emulator come with a calculator? can't find it...
Nov 01 14:44:42 <webosschool-tore> I don't think so...
Nov 01 14:44:54 <Roy-Pre101> yes, it does.
Nov 01 14:44:56 <Roy-Pre101> 2nd page.
Nov 01 14:45:17 <webosschool-tore> oops!
Nov 01 14:45:19 <ElVox_> thats what the little bars mean? sheesh
Nov 01 14:45:25 <ElVox_> talk about not obvious
Nov 01 14:46:11 <ElVox_> if they looked like little pages it would make way more sense and if they expanded on click so you can click a specific page it would rock!
Nov 01 14:46:12 <bmyers_here> you mean the two || thingies?
Nov 01 14:46:19 <ElVox_> yup
Nov 01 14:46:38 <bmyers_here> oh shit.. well dont feel too bad. i didnt know either
Nov 01 14:46:48 <Roy-Pre101> haha
Nov 01 14:47:02 <bmyers_here> i guess we'll both read 100 pages of SDK before we read 1 page of owners manual..
Nov 01 14:48:18 <ElVox_> you shouldn't have to read a manual to get to page 2 of a multipage panel...actually, you shouldn't have to read a manual to KNOW that you are, in fact, looking at a multipage panel in the first place
Nov 01 14:48:52 <bmyers_here> i'm not impressed with pre's app nav anyway
Nov 01 14:49:05 <bmyers_here> unless it's because i havent read the owners manual..
Nov 01 14:49:25 <bmyers_here> 1 page for my apps, 1 page for theirs and 1 page for system stuff?
Nov 01 14:49:29 <bmyers_here> seems a little lame
Nov 01 14:50:06 <bmyers_here> there isnt a app category grouping like there was in the treo days?
Nov 01 14:51:00 <webosschool-tore> I can't wait until they open up the feature to add pages to the launcher.
Nov 01 14:51:44 <webosschool-tore> well right now you can't add enough apps to need it anyway…but I have heard many people that prefer to navigate from left to right than up and down.
Nov 01 14:52:18 <webosschool-tore> bmyers: you can move icons from one page in the launcher to another. just tap and hold.
Nov 01 14:52:54 <bmyers_here> yes but you dont have a games screen, a biz app screen, a useless app screen, etc
Nov 01 14:53:29 <webosschool-tore> true… we need them to open up the add page to launcher code.  There is a "patch" for that i believe.
Nov 01 14:54:02 <bmyers_here> would be nice i think to at least have the funtionality to organize like you had 8 years ago..
Nov 01 14:54:10 <ElVox_> My application doesn't fit on the pre browser for some reason...seems off by the height of the address bar
Nov 01 14:55:08 <ElVox_> err, not address bar, phone title bar
Nov 01 14:55:53 <webosschool-tore> ElVox_: you will probably have problems with the pixi too then...
Nov 01 14:56:10 <sugardave> so yeah...there was a time change....
Nov 01 14:57:29 <ElVox_> does the browser window (window.innerHeight) not reflect the display size minus the phone title bar? 'cause I am trying to place a div right on the bottom of the screen and it is below the bottom. it works in most every other browser (even iphone)
Nov 01 14:57:51 <sugardave> use position: fixed, bottom: 0
Nov 01 14:57:53 <sugardave> works great
Nov 01 14:58:53 <ElVox_> except i need the element right above it to fill in any space between the top of the window and the top of my bottom element...so i used javascript and an onresize event
Nov 01 15:01:11 <webosschool-tore> ElVox_: is this for a native app or a browser app that you need to work in browsers other than web-kit?
Nov 01 15:02:03 <ElVox_> it is a browser app right now. i might make it native in the future
Nov 01 15:07:29 <webosschool-tore> ElVox_: there is a trick (like making sure the body element's height is set.  Check out this example to see if it will work for you. http://ryanfait.com/sticky-footer/
Nov 01 15:10:20 <sugardave> sorry, I always assume webOS apps vs. web apps
Nov 01 15:20:48 <mychew> sorry dave, u know how to make Pre Emulator into Development mode?
Nov 01 15:21:04 <mychew> sorry i was trying to install preware and wanna try some basic sample app
Nov 01 15:21:48 <mychew> hm..looks like this room has a constant number of members, always 87 members? =p
Nov 01 15:22:32 <sugardave> mychew: the emulator should already be in developer mode, so you can skip that step when you read it (for the emulator only)
Nov 01 15:23:24 <mychew> oops...ok..let me go through again, i was glancing through to get a quick start..sorry
Nov 01 15:26:10 <ElVox_> WOOT! that footer hack works great! thanks webosschool-tore
Nov 01 15:26:19 <JenP> hi all!
Nov 01 15:27:12 <ElVox_> hi jen
Nov 01 15:27:27 <rick_home> hi jen
Nov 01 15:27:45 <rick_home> jen,   figured out a way to shortcut my development on the SG progect
Nov 01 15:27:56 <JenP> really?
Nov 01 15:29:57 <webosschool-tore> ElVox: no prob. let us know when your app/web site is done. would love to take a look at it.
Nov 01 15:32:22 <rick_home> webosschool-tore:   HI GUY!!!
Nov 01 15:32:42 <webosschool-tore> rick_home: hey! hows it going!
Nov 01 15:32:52 <rick_home> just got home about 8 pm last night
Nov 01 15:33:01 <rick_home> it was a long week.
Nov 01 15:33:12 <ElVox> since it started as a web app, the buttons are all way too small for a mobile device but it works in the emulator great :) need to rethink the ui a bit
Nov 01 15:33:49 <webosschool-tore> Man I bet! so what did you have going on after the conference?
Nov 01 15:35:10 <webosschool-tore> BTW for all of you that missed it, Rick gave a killer presentation at the Sprint Open Dev conf!
Nov 01 15:49:32 <ElVox> does webos supported animated gifs? my gif shows up but no animation (ony the first frame shown)
Nov 01 15:49:44 <JenP> YES it does
Nov 01 15:50:47 <ElVox> very weird...my (gif-based) "cursor" isn't blinking on the emulator
Nov 01 15:51:24 <JenP> i haven't done anything with cursors
Nov 01 15:52:01 <ElVox> well its just a gif that I use to represent the current input locale (i made a fake text box)
Nov 01 15:53:13 <rick_home> ElVox:   animated gifs work on the device
Nov 01 15:53:19 <rick_home> but not in the browser
Nov 01 15:53:23 <rick_home> but they do in mojo apps
Nov 01 16:05:38 <ElVox> O.o  ... oh
Nov 01 16:35:04 <kesne> Good Morning
Nov 01 16:35:40 <Logdog82> Good evening
Nov 01 16:36:57 * ElVox grumbles something about time zones
Nov 01 16:39:17 <kesne> ElVox: What is your timezone?
Nov 01 16:39:53 <ElVox> the right one? :P EST
Nov 01 16:44:57 <Giotto> hey
Nov 01 17:01:16 <Roy-Pre101> Hey
Nov 01 17:03:22 <mychew> hmm...i think Ubuntu 9.10 breaks my Palm SDK, novacom, and Emulator :S
Nov 01 17:05:20 <mychew> is there anyway to lodge this issue?or is it just my issue? :S
Nov 01 17:05:27 <Roy-Pre101> did you read the getting started on ubuntu forum on webOSdev?
Nov 01 17:05:43 <mychew> ubuntu forum?not the developer page?
Nov 01 17:06:17 <mychew> i follow the developer.palm.com instructions, but failed miserably multiple times
Nov 01 17:06:31 <Roy-Pre101> https://developer.palm.com/distribution/viewforum.php?f=31
Nov 01 17:06:45 <Roy-Pre101> 64 bit or 32 bit Ubuntu?
Nov 01 17:06:57 <mychew> 32 bit, roy
Nov 01 17:07:09 <Roy-Pre101> Should work then, check that forum for help.
Nov 01 17:07:25 <mychew> ok thanks for pointing me to there, Roy!
Nov 01 17:08:43 <Roy-Pre101> Sure thing
Nov 01 17:08:49 <Roy-Pre101> You're welcome.
Nov 01 17:14:33 <mychew> hmm...seems like not working, maybe mine is corrupted
Nov 01 17:14:36 <mychew> let me work it out
Nov 01 17:14:43 <mychew> take care guys..time to go off
Nov 01 17:22:35 <ElVox> how do you double-click something on a web app? the browser interprets it as a zoom and my event handler never runs
Nov 01 17:45:24 <ElVox> so no double clicking?
Nov 01 17:46:31 <kesne> Nope
Nov 01 17:50:00 <bmyers_here> add your own handler for the tap and dont stop propigate ?
Nov 01 17:50:09 <bmyers_here> add your own handler for the tap and stop propigate ?
Nov 01 18:00:40 <webosschool-tore> did anyone else know that if you prepend your template variables with a "-" like {-propertyName} it will not escape html.. had to share I was excited when I found that.
Nov 01 18:03:25 <Roy-Pre101> webosschool-tore: We all knew.
Nov 01 18:03:35 <Roy-Pre101> :D
Nov 01 18:04:11 <webosschool-tore> dang…and I suppose it is published somewhere so my looking through the source was for no reason. :)
Nov 01 18:04:21 <Roy-Pre101> It is.
Nov 01 18:04:32 <Roy-Pre101> Looking through source is good.
Nov 01 18:04:41 <Roy-Pre101> You should put something on the Wiki about templates, though.
Nov 01 18:04:52 <Roy-Pre101> I don't think there's any discussion there about how to use them.
Nov 01 18:05:31 <webosschool-tore> I think that we will have a lot of code from our classes we can eventually put on the wiki…. I am working on templates for the UI class now.
Nov 01 18:06:18 <webosschool-tore> so I am curious.  where is the "-" thing published at?
Nov 01 18:10:23 <Roy-Pre101> not sure.  Read it on the webOSdev site
Nov 01 18:11:12 <webosschool-tore> never found it…o well. I like looking in the source. :)
Nov 01 18:35:09 <kesne_hero> hey
Nov 01 18:41:58 <atlanta> hey hey hey
Nov 01 19:14:25 <lenux3> anyword on flash for pre
Nov 01 19:41:05 <aliendude5300> Hi, has anyone tried running the SDK in VirtualBox 3.0.8_OSE? Does it work?
Nov 01 19:42:21 <Giotto> didn't wanted to spend time with that, so I just downloaded the version that works for sure :P
Nov 01 19:50:59 <aliendude5300> For some reason it seems like the palm-novacom service is not installing, even though dpkg reports that installation was successful.
Nov 01 19:52:42 <Giotto> anything keeping you for going with the version that works for sure? :)
Nov 01 19:52:43 <aliendude5300> I'm on Ubuntu Karmic 9.10.
Nov 01 19:53:14 <aliendude5300> That's not related to virtualbox. I installed 3.04. That's a problem with the palm-novacom package... :/
Nov 01 19:53:27 <Giotto> ouch
Nov 01 19:54:02 <aliendude5300> When starting the emulator I get this message: "In order to install or debug applications in the Palm Emulator, the novacom service must be running on your desktop. Please verify that you have the latest Palm SDK installed correctly."
Nov 01 19:54:53 <aliendude5300> running start palm-novacom as root fails. It says Unknown job: palm-novacom
Nov 01 19:57:48 <aliendude5300> There is a file called "/usr/local/bin/novacom" that seems to be related to palm-novacom, but there is no novacomd...
Nov 01 20:00:47 <aliendude5300> Hmm... maybe the problem is because I am running Ubuntu Karmic 9.10? What OSes are you guys using?
Nov 01 20:01:21 <Giotto> I'm on OS X. switched from linux for exactly the same problems you're running into
Nov 01 20:03:37 <Giotto> I just downloaded VirtualBox and the SDK, double click, ok, ok, emulator works
Nov 01 20:03:59 <Giotto> come and join the dark side
Nov 01 20:04:44 <aliendude5300> I think the problem is because they didn't update the .deb packages for Karmic yet... I have no intentions of ever using Mac OS X. I hate proprietary restrictive software...
Nov 01 20:05:42 <aliendude5300> I'm gonna try the package here instead of the official Palm one: http://www.codemonkies.net/linux/index.php/2009/07/30/debian-palm-novacom-package/ might work...
Nov 01 20:06:30 <aliendude5300> Wow... that actually worked. novacomd started without any problems. Palm just needs to update their Ubuntu packages.
Nov 01 20:06:55 <aliendude5300> Everything works perfectly now! :D
Nov 01 20:07:50 <Giotto> hate leads to suffering. suffering leads to anger. anger leads to using OS X
Nov 01 20:07:57 <aliendude5300> lol
Nov 01 20:08:35 <Giotto> join the dark side! our numbers are few, yet we're powerful
Nov 01 20:08:48 <Giotto> ok, back to coding :D
Nov 01 20:09:57 <aliendude5300> is the mojo sdk supposed to have sound...?
Nov 01 20:20:54 <incidentist> aliendude5300: there are functions and services that play sound, but you won't actually hear the sound on the emulator.
Nov 01 20:24:42 <sugardave> aliendude5300: apparently Pre101 has something up about it at the webos101.com wiki (I haven't looked for it yet)
Nov 01 20:24:47 <sugardave> to get sound working in the emulator
Nov 01 20:30:34 <Giotto> hi swisstomcat
Nov 01 20:32:51 <swisstomcat> hey there
Nov 01 20:40:39 <dkirker> rwhitby: you have an unlocked GSM Pre, right?
Nov 01 20:41:19 <rwhitby> dkirker: not yet, it's in transit from Germany at the moment.
Nov 01 20:41:42 <dkirker> rwhitby: ooo, nice. How much did it cost?
Nov 01 20:42:05 <rwhitby> eu$481 plus shipping
Nov 01 20:42:36 <dkirker> sounds about right. that is what Expansys-usa has them for
Nov 01 20:42:45 <rwhitby> a colleague from freesmartphone.org bought it, checked it out at the shop for dead pixels and stuff, and then shipped it.
Nov 01 20:47:47 <swisstomcat> i've got an unlocked gsm pre too :)
Nov 01 20:48:41 <dkirker> I'd like to get one, but I don't have the $$.
Nov 01 20:57:12 <bmyers> r u gsm pre owners in the u.s.a?
Nov 01 20:58:15 <dpchoung> ha, i was wondering the same, bmyers.
Nov 01 20:58:32 <bmyers> yeah, can u take that to verizon and have it turned up?
Nov 01 20:58:55 <bmyers> i mean. i was on verizon and have actually enjoy the switch to sprint
Nov 01 20:59:13 <bmyers> coverage for data may not be -quite- as good but
Nov 01 20:59:24 <bmyers> call any moble is nice
Nov 01 20:59:36 <bmyers> cheaper monthly package than verizon
Nov 01 20:59:53 <bmyers> its been a nice honeymoon for a few months.
Nov 01 21:00:05 <bmyers> we'll see what sprint service is like in the long run
Nov 01 21:00:10 <dpchoung> if it's gsm i'm thinking probably wont' work on verizon or sprint, unless it does cdma too.
Nov 01 21:00:19 <bmyers> o
Nov 01 21:00:24 <bmyers> right
Nov 01 21:00:32 <swisstomcat> europe gsm owner here
Nov 01 21:00:57 <bmyers> is there gsm in the u.s.?
Nov 01 21:01:11 <bmyers> i dunno, i never read that stuff
Nov 01 21:01:15 <dkirker> bmyers: yes
Nov 01 21:01:24 <dpchoung> gsm is in u.s. but only for t-mobile and att.
Nov 01 21:01:25 <dkirker> AT&T and T-Mobile provide GSM in the US.
Nov 01 21:01:32 <bmyers> hate att and tmobile
Nov 01 21:01:36 <bmyers> no love loss there..
Nov 01 21:01:42 <dkirker> And a few other regional carriers .
Nov 01 21:02:53 <bmyers> how does one localize their app for lets say german?
Nov 01 21:03:18 <bmyers> there would be more than one translation for "Done" but some might not be "correct"
Nov 01 21:03:25 <bmyers> just curious
Nov 01 21:03:45 <swisstomcat> as far as i know there's builtin localisation for apps in the framework
Nov 01 21:04:17 <bmyers> right but you have to provide the translation from "No" to "Nein" to "Niet" etc... right?
Nov 01 21:04:24 <bmyers> or is there some limited dictionary?
Nov 01 21:16:51 <Roy-Pre101> bmyers: You have to do the translation yourself.
Nov 01 21:27:06 <swisstomcat> for example the agenda home-brew tool is partially lolcalized
Nov 01 21:27:30 <swisstomcat> most of the menu is german, one entry is still english
Nov 01 21:30:08 <swisstomcat> The translations "live" in the /resources/locale/strings.json file
Nov 01 21:30:16 <swisstomcat> according to the documentation
Nov 01 22:48:16 <Giotto> anyone has an idea why the inspector looses connection with the emulator?
Nov 01 22:48:44 <Giotto> I keep running into that and has to restart the whole emulator. ridiculously annoying :P
Nov 01 22:48:51 <Giotto> *have to
Nov 01 23:16:27 <MaxP> Hi all!
Nov 01 23:17:38 <Roy-Pre101> Giotto: You don't have to.  When you relaunch just right-click in the emulator and choose 'Reconnect'
Nov 01 23:19:30 <scooter26> hey MaxP
Nov 01 23:20:05 <Giotto> *FACEPALM*
Nov 01 23:20:15 <Giotto> thanks Roy-Pre101 :D
Nov 01 23:20:23 <Giotto> I owe you a beer
Nov 01 23:20:36 <Roy-Pre101> Do I get to pick the beer?
Nov 01 23:20:51 <MaxP> hey pre101
Nov 01 23:20:53 <Giotto> yup :)
Nov 01 23:21:05 <Roy-Pre101> Good deal.  Didn't want to get stuck with Budweiser.
Nov 01 23:21:08 <Roy-Pre101> :D
Nov 01 23:22:00 <Giotto> you can choose a panamanian one
Nov 01 23:22:40 <Roy-Pre101> What's Panama's best beer?
Nov 01 23:22:55 <wIRCer> Hey
Nov 01 23:22:56 <Giotto> I prefer the one called Atlas
Nov 01 23:23:02 <wIRCer> Woo
Nov 01 23:23:04 <wIRCer> It works
Nov 01 23:23:06 <wIRCer> Sorta
Nov 01 23:24:37 <Giotto> ok, here's the selection :) http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/images/misc11/panamabeers.jpg
Nov 01 23:25:52 <ElVox> soberana lol
Nov 01 23:26:55 <Roy-Pre101> Giotto: Making me thirsta.
Nov 01 23:27:02 <Roy-Pre101> Thirsty, too
Nov 01 23:27:53 <ElVox> thirsta? see just mention panamanian beers and he starts learning the language already
Nov 01 23:29:33 <Roy-Pre101> heh.
Nov 01 23:31:02 <Giotto> my spanish sucks :) got here, went to a cafe, tried to play the confident guy so I grabbed the menu and ordered a "café ou té con leche"
Nov 01 23:31:14 <Giotto> which actually means "coffee or tea with milk" :D
Nov 01 23:31:30 <kesne_pre> Hey all
Nov 01 23:32:06 <Giotto> hey
Nov 01 23:33:31 <kesne_pre> What's up?
Nov 01 23:34:04 <kesne> for some reason it isnt working?
Nov 01 23:34:34 <ElVox> yeah that happens in our native language sometimes too. my father was asked once if he would like a "soup or salad" with his meal and he replied. "Sure! I'll take a super salad...". Hilarity ensued.
Nov 01 23:35:14 <Giotto> lol :
Nov 01 23:35:15 <Giotto> D
Nov 01 23:35:42 <Giotto> ElVox: where are you from?
Nov 01 23:35:55 <Giotto> and you Roy-Pre101? need to know to deliver the beer
Nov 01 23:36:02 <ElVox> new jersey :D
Nov 01 23:37:56 <Roy-Pre101> Virginia
Nov 01 23:38:26 <Roy-Pre101> Giotto: I love that story.
Nov 01 23:41:00 <Giotto> I'll be in NY on my way back home in December for a couple of days
Nov 01 23:41:38 <Giotto> kinda hard to hand over the beer :)
Nov 01 23:41:52 <Roy-Pre101> I'll just take a virtual been then.
Nov 01 23:41:57 <Roy-Pre101> beer
Nov 01 23:42:00 <Roy-Pre101> Jeez.
Nov 01 23:42:02 <Roy-Pre101> I can't type.
Nov 01 23:42:07 <Roy-Pre101> Must have been all the beer.
Nov 01 23:42:34 <Giotto> haha
Nov 01 23:42:51 <ElVox> beer makes programming funner...makes debugging worser though :(
Nov 01 23:42:53 <Roy-Pre101> So where's home, Giotto?
Nov 01 23:43:01 <Giotto> Budapest, Hungary
Nov 01 23:43:26 <Roy-Pre101> Got the Pre already?
Nov 01 23:43:32 <Giotto> yup
Nov 01 23:43:35 <Giotto> picked it up in the US
Nov 01 23:43:39 <ElVox> nice, my parents tell me they are beautiful cities
Nov 01 23:43:58 <Giotto> and beautiful girls :)
Nov 01 23:44:02 <Roy-Pre101> So, it's not GSM in Hungary?
Nov 01 23:44:14 <Giotto> it's GSM, but I'm not intended to use it as a cellphone
Nov 01 23:44:29 <Roy-Pre101> Oh, well, that works I guess.
Nov 01 23:44:49 <Roy-Pre101> Shoot, can't you walk to Germany from Hungary and get a GSM one? :)
Nov 01 23:45:01 <Giotto> haha :D
Nov 01 23:45:37 <gkatsev> meh, i have irssi set to highlight on "gary" now you all keep saying hungary... pooh
Nov 01 23:45:44 <Roy-Pre101> Just planning on doing development?
Nov 01 23:45:58 <Roy-Pre101> gkatsev: hah.
Nov 01 23:46:08 <Giotto> yup, bought it as a dev machine
Nov 01 23:47:15 <Roy-Pre101> so, is the food more sugary?
Nov 01 23:47:18 <Roy-Pre101> Or vinegary?
Nov 01 23:47:20 <Roy-Pre101> In hungary?
Nov 01 23:47:36 <Roy-Pre101> (just pinging gkatsev)
Nov 01 23:47:40 <Giotto> it's meat with meat. helps if you're a carnivore :)
Nov 01 23:47:57 <Giotto> haha
Nov 01 23:48:22 <ElVox> in argentina they shoot vegans and feed their bodies to the cows
Nov 01 23:48:26 <Roy-Pre101> hah
Nov 01 23:48:46 <Roy-Pre101> I wondered why the beef was so good in Argentina.
Nov 01 23:49:15 <Giotto> haha. my kind of place :D
Nov 01 23:50:15 <ElVox> mmm free range argentine beef. if I wasn't so full I would be salivating
Nov 01 23:52:19 <ElVox> webos is so cool i wish palm could make it
Nov 01 23:54:06 <atlanta> anyone one
Nov 01 23:54:08 <atlanta> on**
Nov 01 23:54:49 * Roy-Pre101 whispers, "Shh, be quiet, atlanta's here"
Nov 01 23:55:04 <atlanta> lol
Nov 01 23:55:14 <Roy-Pre101> We were just discussing beef.
Nov 01 23:55:18 <atlanta> have u ever tried changing the color of text in the Textfield
Nov 01 23:55:28 <Roy-Pre101> Nope.
Nov 01 23:55:37 <Roy-Pre101> Templarian: Howdy.
Nov 01 23:56:00 <atlanta> i changed it but when it goes in focus to start typing it turns black
Nov 01 23:56:01 <atlanta> grrr
Nov 01 23:57:52 <incidentist> atlanta: how are you changing it?
Nov 01 23:57:58 <atlanta> css
Nov 01 23:58:04 <atlanta> color:#FFFFFF
Nov 01 23:58:09 <incidentist> what selector?
Nov 01 23:58:26 <incidentist> i think div[x-mojo-element="TextField"] should do it
Nov 01 23:59:15 <incidentist> since i don't remember the classes of the subdivs that get popped in by mojo
Nov 01 23:59:17 <atlanta> so how should i do that
Nov 01 23:59:28 <atlanta> #div[x-mojo-element="TextField"]
Nov 01 23:59:29 <atlanta> ?
Nov 01 23:59:38 <incidentist> div[x-mojo-element="TextField"] { color: #FFF; }
Nov 01 23:59:39 <atlanta> i just add my own class and do it that way
Nov 01 23:59:47 <atlanta> ok let me try that
Nov 01 23:59:47 <atlanta> brb
Nov 01 23:59:48 <atlanta> thanks
Nov 02 00:00:08 <incidentist> or .myClassName[x-mojo-element="TextField"] { color: irc://irc.freenode.net/#FFF; }
Nov 02 00:00:39 <incidentist> er, except for that last bit of gibberish there
Nov 02 00:00:51 <atlanta> k
Nov 02 00:00:55 <atlanta> yea the first didnt work
Nov 02 00:01:25 <Roy-Pre101> heh
Nov 02 00:01:33 <lenux3> anyone use the my tether app ?
Nov 02 00:01:38 <atlanta> nope still didnt work
Nov 02 00:01:42 <atlanta> only goes to white on blur
Nov 02 00:01:46 <Roy-Pre101> incidentist: Can you pop that up onto the wiki.  That's very useful.
Nov 02 00:01:46 <incidentist> huh. the global css must have a more precise selector. annoying.
Nov 02 00:01:49 <atlanta> when focused it turns black
Nov 02 00:01:57 <atlanta> where are those files you know
Nov 02 00:01:57 <atlanta> ?
Nov 02 00:02:10 <atlanta> global-textfields.css
Nov 02 00:02:18 <atlanta> thats the one the excel file says
Nov 02 00:03:47 <d03boy> did anyone's pre switch to the wrong time? mine is 3 hours off
Nov 02 00:06:10 <atlanta> yea
Nov 02 00:06:15 <atlanta> my timezone went wrong
Nov 02 00:06:24 <atlanta> i just switched the network switch back and forth
Nov 02 00:09:35 <atlanta> incidentist: still no go
Nov 02 00:09:43 <incidentist> atlanta: looking into it
Nov 02 00:09:49 <atlanta> thanks my mna
Nov 02 00:10:04 <atlanta> if not ill have to revert back to the unfeature richtext field
Nov 02 00:13:02 <incidentist> the text that appears when the textfield blurs has class .hint-text, which does get a color set, but it doesn't sound like that's what the problem is
Nov 02 00:14:47 <atlanta> nope
Nov 02 00:14:50 <atlanta> i changed hint text
Nov 02 00:14:58 <atlanta> but thats the initial text
Nov 02 00:15:05 <atlanta> the onfocus text didnt check
Nov 02 00:15:37 <ElVox> arg! im so trying to avoid making my webapp into a mojo app but it seems like the web browser was designed to frustrate me
Nov 02 00:16:35 <atlanta> ElVox: what is ur webapp
Nov 02 00:16:35 <atlanta> ?
Nov 02 00:16:48 <incidentist> atlanta: div[x-mojo-element="TextField"] input[type="text"] { ... }
Nov 02 00:16:52 <incidentist> i wonder if that works
Nov 02 00:16:59 <atlanta> testing
Nov 02 00:17:36 <atlanta> nope nope this is killing me
Nov 02 00:19:04 <ElVox> its just a stupid calculator but right now it depends on double-clicking. so i can work around that easily enough but my biggest gripe is the tendency for the browser to show the title bar if you move your finger (or mouse) a tiny bit during button click
Nov 02 00:20:25 <atlanta> gotcha
Nov 02 00:20:32 <atlanta> incidentist: i think /var/log/messages is gonna shed some light
Nov 02 00:21:31 <incidentist> how? it doesn't automatically output css info, and i don't know how to get it to say which rule it's using to compute the color of an element.
Nov 02 00:21:48 <atlanta> hold on it shows tap info
Nov 02 00:22:23 <Roy-Pre101> You can use palm inspector to see what CSS is applied, atlanta
Nov 02 00:22:31 <atlanta> that didnt work
Nov 02 00:22:31 <Roy-Pre101> Just drill down to the textfield.
Nov 02 00:22:33 <atlanta> when i tried
Nov 02 00:23:01 <reality9110> atlanta: problem?
Nov 02 00:23:06 <atlanta> 2009-11-02T00:22:51.044394Z [1895] qemux86 user.info LunaSysMgr: {LunaSysMgrJS} com.boapros.picturetweet: Info: got event 'mouseup' targeting element 'TEXTAREA#palm_anon_element_1maintweet-write' , file:///var/usr/palm/applications/com.boapros.picturetweet/index.html:0
Nov 02 00:23:22 <atlanta> thats what it says
Nov 02 00:23:28 <atlanta> reality9110: yea freaking textbox
Nov 02 00:23:47 <atlanta> got it
Nov 02 00:23:53 <atlanta>     TEXTAREA#palm_anon_element_1maintweet-write.
Nov 02 00:24:02 <atlanta> now how the hell was we ever gonna figure that out
Nov 02 00:24:20 <reality9110> what's he trying to do?
Nov 02 00:24:35 <atlanta> nevermind just doing TEXTAREA {...} worked lol
Nov 02 00:24:52 <atlanta> reality9110: trying to change the color of the textfield when typing
Nov 02 00:25:57 <atlanta> thanks incidentist
Nov 02 00:26:00 <reality9110> when typing or after typing?
Nov 02 00:26:16 <atlanta> typing
Nov 02 00:26:19 <atlanta> onfocus
Nov 02 00:26:56 <incidentist> atlanta: ahhh. you kept saying "textfield" which is very different from a "textarea".
Nov 02 00:27:07 <atlanta> no no
Nov 02 00:27:11 <atlanta> but it is a textfield
Nov 02 00:27:12 <atlanta> lol
Nov 02 00:27:17 <atlanta> <div id="tweet" name="textField" class="textme" x-mojo-element="TextField"></div>
Nov 02 00:27:20 <atlanta> thats what i have lol
Nov 02 00:27:24 <atlanta> which is puzzling
Nov 02 00:27:51 <incidentist> ah, yeah, makes sense. if you tell a TextField widget to be multiline, it uses textarea input elements.
Nov 02 00:28:05 <incidentist> i forgot it did that -- i only use single line TextFields
Nov 02 00:28:19 <atlanta> lol
Nov 02 00:28:23 <reality9110> I can get it to change onfocus
Nov 02 00:28:33 <Giotto> "com.palm.downloadmanager is not running" - ehhhh. any ideas on how to fix that?
Nov 02 00:28:33 <atlanta> how ?
Nov 02 00:28:38 <reality9110> But not change once typing begins.  Just when the person clicks on it.
Nov 02 00:28:48 <atlanta> yeae
Nov 02 00:28:58 <atlanta> u just have to change the textarea {}
Nov 02 00:29:09 <atlanta> Giotto: restart the phone
Nov 02 00:29:10 <atlanta> ?
Nov 02 00:29:20 <atlanta> thanks for your effort though incidentist
Nov 02 00:29:28 <incidentist> np
Nov 02 00:29:30 <Giotto> I'm running it on the emulator. should it work there?
Nov 02 00:29:41 <reality9110> #tweet input
Nov 02 00:29:41 <atlanta> now to get this padding to 0 grrr
Nov 02 00:30:09 <atlanta> reality9110: didnt work
Nov 02 00:30:20 <reality9110> Like hell it doesn't.
Nov 02 00:30:43 <Giotto> restarting the emaulator doesn't fixes it
Nov 02 00:31:00 <atlanta> lol it doesnt
Nov 02 00:31:04 <Giotto> ok :)
Nov 02 00:31:09 <atlanta> when you focus in and start typing it goes black
Nov 02 00:31:16 <Giotto> thanks for the help
Nov 02 00:31:18 <atlanta> Giotto: what are you trying to do
Nov 02 00:31:21 <reality9110> #tweet input { background: yellow }
Nov 02 00:31:47 <reality9110> Throw in the semicolon as well
Nov 02 00:31:53 <atlanta> testing
Nov 02 00:32:04 <Giotto> question number 2 would be how can I delete a downloaded file?
Nov 02 00:33:31 <atlanta> nope i dont believe no fileIO functions
Nov 02 00:34:05 <Roy-Pre101> atlanta: Did you get it sorted out?
Nov 02 00:34:19 <atlanta> Roy-Pre101: yup yupu
Nov 02 00:34:29 <reality9110> atlanta: That work?
Nov 02 00:34:29 <atlanta> Roy-Pre101: when using mutli line
Nov 02 00:34:39 <atlanta> Roy-Pre101: it makes it into a textarea
Nov 02 00:35:17 <atlanta> reality9110: nope
Nov 02 00:35:28 <Roy-Pre101> Can you post it here?  http://webos101.com/TextField
Nov 02 00:35:31 <reality9110> It has to
Nov 02 00:35:40 <atlanta> nope it has nothing to do with the background
Nov 02 00:35:42 <Roy-Pre101> Both cases.
Nov 02 00:35:48 <Roy-Pre101> multiline and single.
Nov 02 00:35:55 <Roy-Pre101> There's a styling section
Nov 02 00:36:01 <reality9110> Changing the color of the textfield when typing?
Nov 02 00:36:01 <Roy-Pre101> (I just added)
Nov 02 00:36:04 <atlanta> Roy-Pre101: what should i name it im bad with explain sometimes
Nov 02 00:36:14 <atlanta> Roy-Pre101: oh ok
Nov 02 00:36:17 <reality9110> Or rather, when focused
Nov 02 00:36:21 <gkatsev> Roy-Pre101: thanks, lol
Nov 02 00:36:23 <atlanta> rwhitby: when focused
Nov 02 00:36:39 <atlanta> reality9110: when focused
Nov 02 00:36:40 <reality9110> I'm using the code in my project...
Nov 02 00:36:45 <atlanta> to do what
Nov 02 00:36:52 <atlanta> change the font color on a multiline textfield
Nov 02 00:36:53 <atlanta> ?
Nov 02 00:37:13 <reality9110> Unselected it one color, selected/typing is another
Nov 02 00:37:19 <reality9110> it's
Nov 02 00:37:28 <atlanta> no go buddy
Nov 02 00:38:43 <reality9110> I'll post all I have...
Nov 02 00:38:46 <atlanta> ok
Nov 02 00:39:43 <reality9110> http://webos.pastebin.com/d61dae4e5
Nov 02 00:39:57 <reality9110> Where every you see grey, modify it to whatever color you need
Nov 02 00:40:20 <reality9110> Or white
Nov 02 00:40:54 <reality9110> Or transparent
Nov 02 00:40:58 <reality9110> heh
Nov 02 00:42:09 <atlanta> Roy-Pre101: check the page
Nov 02 00:42:13 <atlanta> change wording if u need
Nov 02 00:43:32 <atlanta> reality9110: lol i copied that exactly and still the same thing
Nov 02 00:43:37 <atlanta> watch
Nov 02 00:43:38 <atlanta> gold on
Nov 02 00:43:39 <atlanta> hold on
Nov 02 00:45:27 <reality9110> Change the #search to #tweet
Nov 02 00:47:32 <atlanta> http://i35.tinypic.com/25k4s8x.jpg
Nov 02 00:47:34 <atlanta> i did
Nov 02 00:47:36 <atlanta> im not slow lol
Nov 02 00:47:54 <atlanta> http://i36.tinypic.com/kcciti.jpg
Nov 02 00:47:56 <Giotto> looks like it needs a bit of tweaking :)
Nov 02 00:48:15 <atlanta> Giotto: nall its not that its just the color i was testing
Nov 02 00:49:03 <Giotto> :)
Nov 02 00:51:06 <atlanta> Giotto: it has been a pain in my a** but i got it now
Nov 02 00:52:04 <ElVox> this broadway analogy (stages, scenes, assistants...)  in the docs is giving me a headache
Nov 02 00:55:29 <Giotto> I didn't know it's a broadway analogy :)
Nov 02 00:55:45 <JenP> hi all
Nov 02 00:56:47 <reality9110> grrrr...need more screen space
Nov 02 00:56:58 <ElVox> reality, you and i both
Nov 02 00:57:07 <incidentist> ElVox: i do a lot of theater so i love the theatrical vocab. just imagine you're steven spielberg :P
Nov 02 00:57:18 <ElVox> or people with smaller fingers
Nov 02 00:57:46 <JenP> ugh no matter what i do i can't get the palm sdk to load on win 7
Nov 02 00:58:09 <ElVox> worked fine on 2008 enterprise
Nov 02 00:58:30 <JenP> are there special instructions for 7?
Nov 02 00:58:36 <ElVox> although java, for some reason, failed to register the path
Nov 02 00:58:44 <ElVox> so i had to do it meself
Nov 02 00:58:52 <JenP> how
Nov 02 00:59:39 <ElVox> go to a command prompt and type in "java -?" does it work?
Nov 02 00:59:53 <atlanta> u have to add the PATH
Nov 02 00:59:55 <JenP> one sec
Nov 02 01:00:34 <JenP> not recognised
Nov 02 01:01:14 <ElVox> you need to find java...in 64 bit windows it is in "C:\Program Files (x86)\Java\jre6\bin" but if you have 32 bit it is probably in "C:\Program Files\Java\jre6\bin"
Nov 02 01:01:36 <ElVox> you need to add that directory to your path...also make sure the palm SDK directory is in the path too
Nov 02 01:01:42 <incidentist> i know that when i updated to snow leopard, my java stuff wouldn't work until i told java to load 32-bit libraries instead of 64.
Nov 02 01:01:49 <incidentist> dunno if it's the same with win7
Nov 02 01:03:01 <ElVox> i don't know if there even is an official 64bit java for windows...at least the standard download off of oracle (spit) is just 32bit
Nov 02 01:03:49 <JenP> yeah i just thought of that too
Nov 02 01:03:52 <JenP> it's 64
Nov 02 01:03:56 <ElVox> ahhh
Nov 02 01:03:58 <JenP> so i'm reinstalling the java
Nov 02 01:04:04 <ElVox> 32bit only for emu
Nov 02 01:04:05 <JenP> new pc
Nov 02 01:04:09 <JenP> yeah....
Nov 02 01:04:13 <JenP> seriously?
Nov 02 01:04:18 <atlanta> grrr the hint text is not aligned when not in a  group with the text
Nov 02 01:04:33 <JenP> seriously? i can't run the emu in 64?
Nov 02 01:04:43 <ElVox> yup needs 32bit java (read that someplace) because i think virtualbox is 32bit or something
Nov 02 01:05:05 <ElVox> no you can run it in x64 but you need 32 bit java runtime environ
Nov 02 01:05:19 <JenP> huh?
Nov 02 01:05:25 <JenP> so install 32 not 64?
Nov 02 01:05:51 <ElVox> i have 2008 x64 and it works fine but i have 32bit java 6 (that is why it has the "program files (x86)" path)
Nov 02 01:06:51 <JenP> no i got it working
Nov 02 01:07:02 <ElVox> ooo cool
Nov 02 01:07:28 <JenP> yeah!
Nov 02 01:37:04 <Giotto> back to the 21th century! had to restart the generator
Nov 02 01:40:14 <Giotto> kinda weird to run out of electricity and do pre development with candlelight :)
Nov 02 01:41:48 <Giotto> hm, any way to disable a progressPill?
Nov 02 01:42:12 <Giotto> it doesn't have a property for it
Nov 02 01:42:43 <atlanta> checking
Nov 02 01:42:58 <Giotto> model.disabled = true doesn't work
Nov 02 01:49:29 <JenP> hi all!!
Nov 02 01:49:35 <Giotto> hi
Nov 02 01:49:40 <diov_> hey
Nov 02 01:50:39 <atlanta> hey
Nov 02 01:52:48 <JenP> hey guys
Nov 02 02:03:27 <edektor> so when palm accepts your application do you get an email from them or something prior to it being released?
Nov 02 02:03:27 <ElVox> what kid of apps is everyone making?
Nov 02 02:03:50 <_droO> im making a quick omegle.com chat app :)
Nov 02 02:03:53 <JenP> edektor very good question...i'm guessing not...cause i never got one
Nov 02 02:04:45 <edektor> JenP: Didnt you have to setup your account and stuff. With your paypal info and what not?
Nov 02 02:04:45 <Giotto> ehh, an email would be nice :P
Nov 02 02:04:59 <JenP> i never got anything back from them
Nov 02 02:05:12 <JenP> in fact i'm starting to think it was lost in the process...
Nov 02 02:05:15 <JenP> gonna resubit soon
Nov 02 02:05:55 <ElVox> what kind of app jen?
Nov 02 02:06:01 <edektor> Then when they do there monthly payments to devs how do they pay you if they dont have your info?
Nov 02 02:06:04 <ElVox> or is it top secret :)
Nov 02 02:06:09 <edektor> JenP: was your app free?
Nov 02 02:06:20 <JenP> nope wasn't free
Nov 02 02:06:28 <JenP> i haven't had any correspondence
Nov 02 02:06:40 <edektor> Then how do they know where to send your money?
Nov 02 02:06:55 <JenP> well once you get assigned a handler....
Nov 02 02:07:04 <JenP> eventually you'll set all that up...
Nov 02 02:07:06 <JenP> i imagine
Nov 02 02:07:33 <edektor> by handler you mean the URL tied to your app??
Nov 02 02:08:01 <JenP> by handler i mean the person who acts like a ...case manager?
Nov 02 02:08:06 <JenP> your poc
Nov 02 02:08:46 <edektor> oh.. so you get no warning at all about when you app is released?
Nov 02 02:11:32 <Giotto> that's just lame
Nov 02 02:11:46 <JenP> oh no ofcourse you do
Nov 02 02:12:01 <JenP> you just don't have any notification it's in the que to be reviewed for release
Nov 02 02:12:11 <JenP> once you get a handler assigned they'll talk to you
Nov 02 02:12:12 <Giotto> ok, I take it back then :) not the same thing
Nov 02 02:12:16 <JenP> tell you what needs to be done
Nov 02 02:12:21 <JenP> smiles.
Nov 02 02:13:34 <edektor> JenP: and that is when you give them your info?
Nov 02 02:13:49 <JenP> yes
Nov 02 02:13:57 <JenP> i imagine
Nov 02 02:14:09 <JenP> again...i personally haven't heard from them
Nov 02 02:14:12 <JenP> others have though
Nov 02 02:14:20 <JenP> pre101 would be a good person to ask
Nov 02 02:15:10 <edektor> k thanks.
Nov 02 02:16:18 <edektor> This question is for any Palm people in the room... Do you guys plan on having some sort of student developer discount for students that can prove they are in school?
Nov 02 02:36:54 <atlanta> what was the quest
Nov 02 02:36:56 <atlanta> ion
Nov 02 02:41:10 <Giotto> atlanta: anything on the progressPill disabling?
Nov 02 02:41:26 <Giotto> would be really nice if I actually doesn't have to hack around it :)
Nov 02 02:41:43 <atlanta> yea ur gonna have to hack
Nov 02 02:42:01 <Giotto> haha
Nov 02 02:42:03 <Giotto> ok
Nov 02 02:42:03 <atlanta> u can do like a condition type thing
Nov 02 02:42:15 <atlanta> to set it up when the conditions are met
Nov 02 02:42:21 <atlanta> thats the best way i can think of right now
Nov 02 02:42:56 <Giotto> I like monkey patching anyways :)
Nov 02 02:43:39 <Giotto> ehm, or maybe let's just go for a simple if statement :P
Nov 02 02:43:52 <Giotto> I'm running out of available brain-cycles
Nov 02 02:46:52 <atlanta> lol
Nov 02 02:46:56 <atlanta> brb cleaning time
Nov 02 02:47:02 <Giotto> kk
Nov 02 02:47:11 <Giotto> I get a shot of rum in the meantime :D
Nov 02 02:58:40 <Giotto> cheers!
Nov 02 02:58:49 <Giotto> brrrrrrrrrrr
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Nov 02 02:59:56 2009