**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Feb 13 02:59:58 2010 Feb 13 03:01:49 rwhitby: Or palm should provide detailed instructions on the app submission process, correct their documentation, and provide adequate lines of communication for developers. Feb 13 03:02:19 thats so crazy it just might work ... Feb 13 03:03:14 I should really just focus on iphone development and give up on the pre... Feb 13 03:04:25 This sucks! All of these people that are trying to update are all pissed off when I tell them they can't update and can't get a free copy -_- Feb 13 03:33:37 Bmyers: ping Feb 13 03:36:08 what is path to app databases? with ext: ? Feb 13 03:53:03 conundrum of the evening.....small spinners that work in emu don't on device...arrrg Feb 13 04:14:43 jfelectron: they may not be exactly the same webos version Feb 13 04:15:02 I know that seems like it defeats the point, but I've seen it in the past Feb 13 04:15:52 destinal: I think I figured it out....I have spinner in a view menu. On device, the spinner gets rendered first and then the view-menu just plops in front of it Feb 13 04:16:07 ah, timing issue? Feb 13 04:16:22 the emulator is a lot faster Feb 13 04:17:49 destinal: well..the rendering is all handled by the framework. I'm using the template feature of comman/view menus to insert a spinner as one of the 'buttons' Feb 13 04:18:41 destinal: I've noticed that on device noticeUpdatedItems with a bunch of items pretty much freezes any other rendering going on at the time Feb 13 04:26:16 in javascript 500556365 is automatically interpreted into a number is that right? Feb 13 04:26:27 sorry as a number Feb 13 04:27:58 found the error, it is a feed error Feb 13 04:28:28 hi all...I'm back Feb 13 04:29:11 LoneStar99: uhhh....not if it comes from a string...then you have to do parseInt(string, 10) Feb 13 04:31:12 why ",10"? Feb 13 04:31:35 base 10 Feb 13 04:31:44 aka 'normal' numbers Feb 13 04:32:04 parseInt is super nifty for binary to integer conversion Feb 13 04:32:07 conversion Feb 13 04:32:44 oh ok, Feb 13 04:32:50 thanks Feb 13 04:33:25 you can do like parseInt('011',2) and that equal 3 Feb 13 04:33:45 or rather '110' Feb 13 04:33:56 2^0+2^1 Feb 13 04:35:27 k Feb 13 04:36:23 is there a decent sudoku app for webOS? Feb 13 04:38:29 about: if var is not "numeric" then ... Feb 13 04:38:54 sorry what about Feb 13 04:41:51 Tibfib: seems to be atleast 20 Feb 13 04:42:19 Hehy, okay then Feb 13 04:42:27 guess I wont make one Feb 13 04:42:28 >.< Feb 13 04:42:37 yeah and one is EA Feb 13 04:42:49 Didn't that one suck? Feb 13 04:42:55 not sure Feb 13 04:42:58 I know the very first one suckeeed Feb 13 04:43:14 4/5 rating Feb 13 04:43:52 sudoku lite 25,000+ 1.5/5 rating Feb 13 04:44:04 hah... yeahhhhhh Feb 13 04:44:08 that ones it I think Feb 13 04:44:57 sudoku is somewhat saturated Feb 13 04:45:20 is the one liner to determine if a value is a number? Feb 13 04:45:24 there Feb 13 04:45:32 we haven't announced it yet but Syntactix has rights to http://www.tridoku.com/ check it out is a fun twist Feb 13 04:45:57 whoa Feb 13 04:46:05 that's weird looking, ima try that! Feb 13 04:46:22 yeah weird Feb 13 04:47:01 The trick is figuring out how to get the pencil numbers to all fit in the triangles LOL Feb 13 04:48:04 isNaN Feb 13 04:48:51 Arcitcus: I can see how that would be a problem...hah Feb 13 05:07:41 hi all Feb 13 05:07:49 If I want to provide a link to an application outside of the palm ecosystem what does it take for some one to be able to visit that link and install that app on their phone? Feb 13 05:07:55 Howdy JenP Feb 13 05:08:00 hi there Feb 13 05:11:12 scottb: http://developer.palm.com/webChannel/index.php?packageid=com.scottbyrns.codebreaker Feb 13 05:11:35 I'm trying to keep it outside of the palm ecosystem though Feb 13 05:12:17 I've got a couple of people that beta tested codebreaker that I've spoken to about doing private beta testing and I would like to provide them with unpublished builds to test Feb 13 05:14:20 contact rwhitby he will know for sure Feb 13 05:14:41 scottb: if they can use preware....you can create a private feed Feb 13 05:15:27 scottb: somehwere on preware.org or webos-internals.org is a howto to create a feed. Its just RSS, but has specific elements Feb 13 05:15:28 Just send them the ipkg file and they can use palm-install or WebOS Quick Install. Feb 13 05:15:32 ^^ Feb 13 05:15:43 jfelectron: Thank you :) Feb 13 05:15:56 yeah that's the easiest..but if they are squemish about that, the feed could be better Feb 13 05:16:05 rwhitby: Most of them don't know enough about a computer to handle that Feb 13 05:16:11 Thats why I chose them Feb 13 05:16:20 well, how can you get them to install the feed then Feb 13 05:16:22 catch 22 Feb 13 05:16:26 Yeah Feb 13 05:16:33 um, adding a custom feed is *far* more technical than using WebOS Quick Install. Feb 13 05:16:45 rwhitby: unless he makes an ipk to add a feed :) Feb 13 05:16:48 chicken / egg Feb 13 05:17:08 destinal: It was the gopher that came first Feb 13 05:17:51 Just put it on PreCentral ... no-one will notice it ... Feb 13 05:17:54 someone needs to make a patch that allows ipks to be installed from a web page or email Feb 13 05:18:23 scottb: actually, filecoaster Feb 13 05:18:25 yeah, so that those people who have been able to install an ipkg like Preware to be able to install the patch can then install an ipkg .... Feb 13 05:18:42 err yeah still have to install Feb 13 05:19:05 If they can install fileCoaster, then they can install the original package in question. Feb 13 05:19:18 THIS is just another reason palm's gatekeeper mentality sucks Feb 13 05:19:34 you aren't smart enough to make decisions about what to install, sorry Feb 13 05:19:43 what happens with a download in the device? Feb 13 05:19:50 It's quite simple. Either someone can install an ipkg, or they can't. If they can't then you're never going to be able to get them to be able to unless it goes through Palm's infrastructure. Feb 13 05:20:15 rwhitby: yeah, and Palm created the barrier, so I'm annoyed with them :-/ Feb 13 05:20:35 This is the bright line that allows Palm to allow homebrew to thrive, without any legal worries. Feb 13 05:20:50 destinal: so you'll be the first for my WebOS malware then....a nice army of Pre's for my DDOS needs Feb 13 05:20:56 :) Feb 13 05:21:04 rwhitby: don't get me started, that's such a loaded statement Feb 13 05:21:15 jfelectron: um, I think Preware already holds that place ... Feb 13 05:21:48 25K Pre's ready to do whatever Preware tells them to do. Feb 13 05:22:05 lol...yeah Feb 13 05:22:21 (and people wonder why we're so particular about security ...) Feb 13 05:22:21 the geeks are at your mercy Feb 13 05:22:24 rwhitby: this is the line we've created so we don't feel like we need to sue you for writing and publishing your own software? Feb 13 05:22:26 give me a break Feb 13 05:23:34 (or the idea that their carriers wouldn't let them have a noon-obvious switch enabling downloads like android, equally silly) Feb 13 05:23:46 destinal: no, this is the line which stops a litigious society such as yours suing Palm due to something some idiot developer does. Feb 13 05:24:00 rwhitby: the way they sue microsoft now? Feb 13 05:24:49 destinal: no, the way they sue mcdonalds. Feb 13 05:24:49 this is the apple game, everyone wants to emulate it, there's no evidence it's necessary, in any way Feb 13 05:25:19 destinal: I just observe the motivations that people espouse to me, these are not my motivations. Feb 13 05:25:39 rwhitby: microsoft makes windows mobile, and don't get sued b/c I can publish my own malware and someone can download it of their own volition Feb 13 05:25:58 touch feedback does not appear to work on img tags Feb 13 05:26:00 destinal: your argument is with Palm, not with me. Feb 13 05:27:11 so instead let's say "This is the bright line that Palm feels is necessary to allow homebrew to thrive, without any legal worries" :) Feb 13 05:28:09 destinal: agreed. Feb 13 05:29:16 (and I agree that it does simplify Palm's tech support operations and makes life easier for their security people) :) Feb 13 05:29:39 [plus makes them more money by lock-in, but I'm cynical] Feb 13 05:33:47 I'm sure that making it as easy as possible for developers to leave the money handling to Palm (and give the cut), and making is as hard as possible to sell apps outside of the app catalog, is a key part of Palm's app catalog strategy. Feb 13 05:34:22 If I was running a corporation like Palm that's what I'd do to satisfy my shareholders. Feb 13 05:36:49 scottb: anyway, your options are to use Palm's infrastructure, or teach your beta users to install an ipkg. Feb 13 05:36:55 there is no third option. Feb 13 05:36:55 definitely. I'm sure Palm looks back at the palmos stores that popped up and seeing a chance to be involved in all the software sales on their platform was very attractive (and with apple now has precedent) Feb 13 05:37:08 rwhitby: Ok Feb 13 05:37:50 I'll see about creating an auth system so my apps cant be run unless you enter credentials. Should keep the morons away at least Feb 13 05:39:09 scottb: you could have them rely on some javascript from your web site to work and have them submit nduid to your site to get that javascript back, or something Feb 13 05:39:34 Yeah, kinda what I had in mind Feb 13 05:39:59 So I'm working on a "WebOS Internals Supporter" application, which people would purchase to donate to WebOS Internals. But I don't see an easy way to give people a choice of donation amount ($0, $1, $5, $10, $20, etc) without having 5 different apps in the catalog ... Feb 13 05:40:30 in-app purchasing Feb 13 05:40:40 One app with paypal links? Feb 13 05:40:55 well, people can already donate via paypal. Feb 13 05:41:13 this is for those who don't want to go through that hassle, and just want to purchase it like any other app. Feb 13 05:41:14 rwhitby: yeah I think you're right Feb 13 05:41:31 but it feels a little too brighthouse :P Feb 13 05:41:37 still may as well do it Feb 13 05:41:40 scottb: the app will of course have a paypal link for additional donations Feb 13 05:42:15 (e.g. the $0 version is for those who can't purchase apps yet, and it will definitely have a paypal link) Feb 13 05:42:36 destinal: yeah, the brighthouse effect is what I'm trying to avoid. Feb 13 05:47:50 I think it's really the only way for now, but we should put in a feature request to palm about minimum and maximum cost for apps Feb 13 05:48:00 like, pay what you want, within these ranges Feb 13 06:02:01 So, I need some advice from WebOS developer gurus. Feb 13 06:02:35 http://git.webos-internals.org/trac/preware/ticket/18 Feb 13 06:03:38 Should I subscribe to that service the whole time Preware is running, and track whether any app catalog installs are in progress, or should I just call that service any time an install is requested in preware. Feb 13 06:04:45 I think the latter probably. When someone hits install, I can call the service to get the app catalog install status, and pop up a "Can't do that now" message if there's anything happening. Feb 13 06:28:15 halp! Feb 13 06:28:41 Have you guys used Ares to build a dialog and then use that as a view in a "traditional" webos app? Feb 13 06:29:09 * rbredow is tempted to try it since I've gotta build a fairly hefty dialog...not sure if it's more work than it's worth. Feb 13 06:29:33 Anyone know a good resource to go to for Web site problems? Pre 101 went down about 10 hours ago throwing a 'premature end of headers' error. Wordpress site, seems to render fine if using php from the command line. Feb 13 06:30:05 I haven't touched Pre 101 since Wednesday when I posted my last article. Feb 13 06:30:09 wow...I assume you can't just contact your web host? Sounds like a hosting issue. Feb 13 06:30:27 have you tried a simple reboot? Feb 13 06:30:27 Trying... Feb 13 06:30:37 shared host. Feb 13 06:32:21 Roy-Pre101: Can you dissect the request? My guess is its an Apache misconfiguration Feb 13 06:32:52 jfelectron: I might could... if I understood how to do that. Feb 13 06:33:55 Roy-Pre101: Can you access the server logs directly? Feb 13 06:34:02 Roy-Pre101: I assume you Feb 13 06:34:10 I can. error log is useless. Feb 13 06:34:11 you're seeing that error in the browser? Feb 13 06:34:17 Just the 'premature end of header' Feb 13 06:34:33 bugger.....hoping for a code or some shred Feb 13 06:34:46 hey roy! long time no see Feb 13 06:35:25 Hey Roy: I just looked at the other sites that are hosted on that server at dreamhost and they appear to be up and running. Not sure why, but it seems local to your site for some reason (not that that really helps) Feb 13 06:35:26 JenP: howdy. Feb 13 06:36:12 rbredow: Yeah, I wish I had a clue... Feb 13 06:37:18 rbredow: well....in what is likely a virtualized shared host.....nearly anything is possible :) Feb 13 06:37:26 Do you have wp-super-cache turned on? I'd turn that off first (move the plugin directory if you can't get into admin) Feb 13 06:37:43 jfelectron: absolutely Feb 13 06:40:13 man i don't understand most of this olympic opening ceremony Feb 13 06:41:11 I did rename the plugin directory but that didn't affect anything. Feb 13 06:41:25 It seemed like a good first step Feb 13 06:41:43 pandora--: That's because half's in French. Feb 13 06:41:45 :) Feb 13 06:41:47 bummer. another possibility might be something in the .htaccess file. Might not hurt to move that file to "temp" to see if WP comes back to life. Feb 13 06:41:54 I did that, too Feb 13 06:41:59 no joy Feb 13 06:42:01 Roy-Pre101: haha nonono did you watch it?? Feb 13 06:42:01 bummage Feb 13 06:42:22 "dreamhost" <-- there's the problem Feb 13 06:42:22 I didn't try both at the same time but that seems unlikely. Feb 13 06:43:29 Yes it does. Moving the htaccess file out of the way should have fixed it if it was a bad cache file. Feb 13 06:44:16 btw, Premature end of headers is often caused by the server running out of allocated resources for the script (hitting a memory limit) Feb 13 06:44:17 omg the ceremonies are like 10 hours long Feb 13 06:45:24 got to love that Adobe is trying to block HTML5 publication......they should just let Flash die honorably Feb 13 06:46:18 I'll try making a custom php.ini file. Feb 13 06:46:25 Had to do that before so I should be able to do it again. Feb 13 06:48:30 Sheesh, memory_limit is 90M Feb 13 06:48:41 seems like it should be enough Feb 13 06:49:37 I think the opening ceremonies at the olympics needs longer musical numbers. :) Feb 13 06:51:25 rbredow: ooommmmmmgggggg Feb 13 06:51:48 rbredow: this is the weirdest danceoff everrrr Feb 13 06:54:50 custom php.ini file with more memory didn't fix it. Feb 13 06:58:33 Adobe is trying to block HTML5 publication? what? why? how? I don't see any reason for them to Feb 13 06:58:41 HTML5 is no real threat to flash Feb 13 07:02:16 VincentLaw: Seems it's not HTML5 but the other documents bundled with it. Feb 13 07:02:46 But that was a cursory read of the situation and it's apparently still not public yet what the issue is. Feb 13 07:02:57 trouble ticket submitted to dreamhost. Feb 13 07:03:14 I'll go poke into the database but a database issue should throw an error. Feb 13 07:05:05 Anyone know a good, free web-site monitoring tool that could have told me about this problem hours ago? Feb 13 07:09:57 Yes--check out http://mon.itor.us/ Feb 13 07:11:42 Just checking again--anyone tried using an Ares generated view inside a "traditional" webos program? Is it more work than it's worth? Feb 13 07:12:31 stupid lack of voice Feb 13 07:13:45 anyone know how to tell when a dialog closes? from the scene that "showDialoged" it Feb 13 07:14:36 well, looks like the site is back up Feb 13 07:15:52 was is something you changed? Feb 13 07:16:57 Here's what support said: "I think this was caused by the move off netboot we did recently." Feb 13 07:17:10 Nice. Feb 13 07:17:13 "just tried restarting the apache daemon and now the site is loading. I Feb 13 07:17:13 am still unsure of what the cause is but I believe it was some left over Feb 13 07:17:13 issues from the move off netboot and you won't run into it agian." Feb 13 07:17:48 If you don't mind paying $20/month, I recommend linode highly. Your own virtual server. Feb 13 07:18:03 You don't realize how slow the shared host is until you have your own dedicated (partial) server. Feb 13 07:18:18 I've heard slicehost is good too. Feb 13 07:18:26 I have a friend using slicehost Feb 13 07:18:42 Of course, this shared host is worlds faster than my last host. Feb 13 07:19:03 So, I'm not too unhappy. This didn't help the happiness much. Feb 13 07:19:52 (also, it's 1/6th the price I was paying before) Feb 13 07:27:17 So, anyone used any free sites/tools to monitor website status? Feb 13 07:29:09 Yes--check out http://mon.itor.us/ Feb 13 07:29:15 sends an email when down and free. Feb 13 07:36:59 Will check it out later, thanks Feb 13 07:59:35 Anyone mess with Ares much? How the heck do you select the container around an object. There must be a keyboard shortcut. Feb 13 08:02:14 Aha, found it in the "view" tab. You can select any item in the object heirarchy there. Feb 13 08:03:29 rbredow: I've found Ares to be somewhat frustrating....tool around with it for five minutes and then give up and just code it by hand :) Feb 13 08:03:56 I'm there too. Figured it'd be perfect for making a complicated edit dialog with 15+ controls. But, no. Feb 13 08:04:05 Or at least not without more practice. Feb 13 08:04:26 ...or patience. Feb 13 08:07:18 do you know if its possible to edit the chrome.js in Ares without it opening the interface builder view? Feb 13 08:07:30 Not that I've found. Feb 13 08:07:52 You can keep it synced to a svn repository and edit it there I think. Feb 13 08:07:57 yeah Feb 13 08:09:39 in Ares having content that's larger than the viewport is really frustrating...it doesn't scroll nicely Feb 13 08:09:58 I remember undo working when it first rolled out. Not so much tonight for me. Feb 13 08:10:14 * rbredow goes back to Komodo edit and the stuff he knows better. Feb 13 08:10:52 you'll be tantalized by the thought of drag and drop UI design....it will lure you back :) Feb 13 09:17:53 anyone around with spanish on their Pre? Feb 13 09:29:02 Preware 0.9.23 released, with Spanish language support. Feb 13 11:42:03 hi everyone Feb 13 11:42:36 i have setup a radio button with two labels Feb 13 11:42:49 this.radioAttributes = Feb 13 11:42:49 { Feb 13 11:42:49 choices: [ Feb 13 11:42:49 {label : 'Yes', value : 1}, Feb 13 11:42:49 {label : 'No', value : 2}, Feb 13 11:42:50 ] Feb 13 11:42:50 } Feb 13 11:43:24 Now i want to use these values to call another scene Feb 13 11:43:42 Can anyone tell me how can i do so? Feb 13 12:03:45 rwhitby: there is a mistake in the german translation Feb 13 14:21:36 everyone sleeping in this morning ? Feb 13 14:30:13 yawn....stretch.... Feb 13 14:36:20 Bmyers: where is my ext: database stored... ? Feb 13 14:39:09 / media Feb 13 14:39:47 and that is accessible in USB mode? Feb 13 14:40:04 yes Feb 13 14:40:31 you're talking on the device right? Feb 13 14:40:35 I have a Myles user with a cracked screen & can't access the app menu to export Feb 13 14:40:57 wanna walk him thru copying the db to his PC and then copying it back to a new Pre Feb 13 14:41:21 lemme check it here Feb 13 14:41:32 found it. Feb 13 14:41:46 <__phil__> mornign all Feb 13 14:42:25 he does not need Dev Mode enabled to access it... ? Feb 13 14:42:38 hi __phil__ Feb 13 14:43:06 oh ok Feb 13 14:43:26 <__phil__> I just got a palm pre plus. just picked up the o'reilly book on programming webos, but meanwhile would like to get one thing started: wifi. I've transferred a .txt file with my wpa2 pass, but cannot find an app that'll let me copy/paste it into the wifi pass dialog. is there an app that'll let me do that? Feb 13 14:44:01 <__phil__> I've tried docview, preader, pdfview... Feb 13 14:47:59 you found your db haeffb: ? Feb 13 14:51:13 yes Feb 13 14:51:55 __phil__: email? Feb 13 14:52:44 <__phil__> haeffb: I'd rather not email it -- after all, it's my wifi pass. Feb 13 14:54:25 understood Feb 13 14:55:23 type slowly and carefully... Feb 13 14:56:31 Bmyers: clear enough? http://forums.precentral.net/showthread.php?p=2218592#post2218592 Feb 13 14:58:30 should be easy enough Feb 13 14:59:25 * haeffb going to be working on integrating Google import/export... Feb 13 14:59:43 can i peek over your shoulder there haeffb ? Feb 13 14:59:54 yep Feb 13 15:25:12 <__phil__> quit Feb 13 15:25:16 <__phil__> bye all Feb 13 15:40:00 rehi Feb 13 15:41:33 what up, swisstomcat? Feb 13 15:41:38 not much Feb 13 15:41:41 trying to fix my app Feb 13 15:41:54 aren't we all? Feb 13 15:42:04 probably Feb 13 16:11:12 Anybody have a pixi on Sprint? Feb 13 16:12:26 my wife does Feb 13 16:12:33 but she's not here at the moment Feb 13 16:13:24 Apparently some guy can't find RadioTime in his app catalog Feb 13 16:13:36 yeah, me too Feb 13 16:13:45 gsm pre Feb 13 16:13:45 You can't find it? Feb 13 16:13:47 yeah Feb 13 16:13:51 Son of a bitch Feb 13 16:13:52 i used to find it Feb 13 16:15:57 can't find my app either Feb 13 16:15:59 anymore Feb 13 16:18:49 Who's from Palm here? Feb 13 16:19:09 morning all! Feb 13 16:19:55 um the radiotime app is in the catalog for CDMA at least. i just updated it last night Feb 13 16:20:50 not sure if anyone from palm is here at the weekends Feb 13 16:20:53 hi jen Feb 13 16:21:03 hi swisstomcat Feb 13 16:21:32 if i search for "moo" i can't find my app anymore Feb 13 16:21:55 and preware can't load the palm catalog feed .. maybe they're having problems? Feb 13 16:22:03 Json: That doesn't help the rest of the users in the world though Feb 13 16:22:28 hi doc Feb 13 16:22:31 Hey jenP Feb 13 16:22:36 With the small j Feb 13 16:22:43 if i search for "radio", i just get 4 results Feb 13 16:22:57 maybe. where at? im in the us with sprint and i found the radiotime. and my palm catalog is loading in preware Feb 13 16:22:59 smiles...how's your day? Feb 13 16:23:33 cyrket finds it without a problem Feb 13 16:24:08 Hello, does palm participate in gsoc? Feb 13 16:24:16 I get 22 results for "radio" including RadioTime. Pre on Sprint Feb 13 16:24:16 gsoc? Feb 13 16:25:31 haeffb! morning Feb 13 16:25:54 google summer of code Feb 13 16:25:59 oh Feb 13 16:26:03 i mean as a organization Feb 13 16:26:29 any idea? Feb 13 16:26:37 i get 22 hits on Radio..Radio Time comes in as second Feb 13 16:27:08 swisstomcat: when I search Moo i get your app Feb 13 16:27:13 hey jenP Feb 13 16:27:26 jenp: well, i'm on a gsm pre Feb 13 16:27:30 Json: It's not appearing in Europe or on the Pixi Feb 13 16:27:35 ohhhhh Feb 13 16:27:44 This is incredibily half ass Feb 13 16:27:46 ed Feb 13 16:27:49 both used to appear Feb 13 16:28:10 humm.. that sounds a little strange (wish i had a gsm pre and a pixi to test) Feb 13 16:28:13 It's annoying that there are so many problems with the damn app catalog. Feb 13 16:28:17 yeah Feb 13 16:29:06 Json: I had somebody test a Pixi in #webos-internals and there's an ad agency selling ad space for Europe next week at MWC for us that is unable to find it in the UK Feb 13 16:30:33 thats no good. sounds like the new update 1.0.7 isnt worldwide yet. Feb 13 16:30:45 there was an update? Feb 13 16:30:59 yah. it popped up last week i installed it last night Feb 13 16:30:59 Yes Feb 13 16:31:21 ah, you mean an radiotime update Feb 13 16:31:27 Yes Feb 13 16:31:29 thought you were talking about an app catalog update Feb 13 16:31:48 nope. radiotime. Feb 13 16:32:14 Not to mention that this also affects our standing in the Hot Apps program Feb 13 16:32:26 webos update in a few days from the words of almost every blogs Feb 13 16:33:21 rumours or real? Feb 13 16:33:31 I venture it has probably never appeared for the Pixi Plus on Verizon Feb 13 16:34:57 real. supposidly to 1.4.1 on feb 15th Feb 13 16:35:32 i doubt it Feb 13 16:36:26 Json: I don't care about 1.4.1. I care about the app appearing in the app catalog. Feb 13 16:36:50 Not appearing in the App Catalog is nothing more than lost revenue Feb 13 16:36:51 oh i know. you created radiotime? and if so, kudos. Feb 13 16:37:03 Yes Feb 13 16:38:02 well again kudos. but i forget the update fixes but i think the app catalog is one of them. i have issues all the time with it. Feb 13 16:38:12 and technically palm still has it as a beta Feb 13 16:40:36 What as Beta? Feb 13 16:40:42 The App Catalog? Feb 13 16:41:09 yah Feb 13 16:41:20 yeah, says "beta" here Feb 13 16:41:22 its still in beta (in all technicallities) Feb 13 16:41:32 app catalog is no longer beta Feb 13 16:41:47 It's not beta here anymore. Feb 13 16:41:51 it is in europe Feb 13 16:42:07 oh. my app catalog still says beta here in the us Feb 13 16:47:26 Been on hold with Palm forever Feb 13 16:52:53 whatcha on hold for? Feb 13 16:53:04 I'm going to get this crap straightened out Feb 13 16:53:16 ah app catalog crap? Feb 13 16:53:22 Poor technical support representative Feb 13 16:53:31 I feel sorry for him Feb 13 16:54:16 And yes, the App Catalog crap Feb 13 16:54:43 He said, "I can have somebody call you back Monday." That was the wrong thing for him to say... Feb 13 16:55:00 lol...isn't MOnday a holiday? Feb 13 16:55:27 Yes. Except I'm not waiting until Monday for this to be fixed. Feb 13 16:55:45 smiles...doc remind me never to get you upset... Feb 13 16:56:02 Just never work technical support on the phone or on the internet. Feb 13 16:56:30 oh no..I've had to do that. It's a rite of passage after you graduate.... Feb 13 16:56:39 And if you do, and run into a person named Doc Lee, then just give him whatever he wants right off the bat, because you're going to in the end anyway. Feb 13 16:56:46 everyday I went home beaten up and cranky Feb 13 16:57:11 i used to work in technical support too years ago .. and liked it Feb 13 16:57:12 lol Feb 13 16:58:25 it wasn't bad when you had someone you could work with...but the others....ohhhh the others.... Feb 13 17:01:48 Oh wow. This next "escalated" tech support guy... Feb 13 17:02:08 Poor guy. He thought I was having the bug in the App Catalog where users can't download any apps. Feb 13 17:02:29 hrm, anyone know if i can ssh into my pre like i can the emulator and get log com.whichever.whatever info? Feb 13 17:02:53 i had people threathening to come by with their assault rifle Feb 13 17:02:56 And then he starts giving me this stuff about how the developer might not have it available for those countries and what not. Said, "How did you even know about the app?" "I made the app, buddy. That's how I know." Feb 13 17:03:08 digitalpowers: ssh to port 5522 Feb 13 17:04:02 swisstomcat: does it share the same port as the emulator? Feb 13 17:04:21 oh sorry, i missread Feb 13 17:04:29 you want to ssh into your pre Feb 13 17:04:31 digitalpowers: or use palm-log -d usb Feb 13 17:04:34 digitalpowers: Go to the webos-internals website. There's a tutorial Feb 13 17:04:41 you could use novacom .. novacom -t open tty:// Feb 13 17:05:50 yeah i got novacom working i was just hoping to use putty, but i am sometimes kinda a linux noob (read all the time) so i can never remember what tty even is so i couldnt translate that into something for putty Feb 13 17:06:08 digitalpowers: That's why they made tutorials... Feb 13 17:08:23 fair enough, i wil go a digging Feb 13 18:02:01 hello? Feb 13 18:02:14 hi Bmyers Feb 13 18:02:27 hi Jenp.. hows the vaca going? Feb 13 18:02:37 good...still in pjs Feb 13 18:02:44 its the best isnt it? Feb 13 18:02:48 it is... Feb 13 18:03:06 work called wanted me to come in for "only 4,...8 hours tops" Feb 13 18:03:26 seriously? did you tell them your were in mexico ? Feb 13 18:03:49 i left my phone in the car...they left it on VM...so i'm just choosing to ignore Feb 13 18:04:15 Lucky Feb 13 18:04:33 well doc my jog is nowhere near as important as yours Feb 13 18:04:38 When my work calls and says, "Hey, we need you to come in," it usually means shit hit the fan Feb 13 18:05:13 mine too...problem is theres ALWAYS something wrong... Feb 13 18:05:14 you figuring there was another person for fan cleanup Doc.. Feb 13 18:05:21 not you... Feb 13 18:05:41 too many projects...one programmer....not my fault they didn't hire another like i've requested for 3 yrs now Feb 13 18:06:17 I hate it when I get sent to some weird place Feb 13 18:09:11 yeah, New Jersey sucks Feb 13 18:09:36 even the pizza sucks there.. Feb 13 18:22:35 I think I will play web designer today Feb 13 18:22:48 this will be funny Feb 13 18:26:45 sugardave: if you need practice, my site could use some web design Feb 13 18:26:58 i can help with web design Feb 13 18:28:23 I need to make a theme for my Drupal Feb 13 18:28:37 the default theme is nice, but it is the default Feb 13 18:28:50 got any ideas? Feb 13 18:29:18 beyond "dark and looks nice"? not really :D Feb 13 18:29:24 going to play with photoshop today Feb 13 18:29:50 Is this valid in JS if ((A&&B)||(C&&D)) ? Feb 13 18:29:53 i would start with an already existing design that you like and change it to your liking Feb 13 18:30:07 jfelectron: I think so Feb 13 18:30:12 i'd say yes, jfelectron Feb 13 18:30:27 swisstomcat: yeah, I'm about to copy down all the drupal images and see what I'm dealing with Feb 13 18:30:53 ok cool Feb 13 18:32:08 sugardave: a webos inspired theme would be cool Feb 13 18:32:25 e.g http://preciouscoders.com/de/pre/index.html Feb 13 18:32:35 it sure would :D we'll see Feb 13 18:33:03 ah, that is nice and simple looking Feb 13 18:44:35 i'm gonna work on my animated gif background for my app.. should be fun.. Feb 13 18:44:46 something that blinks maybe.. Feb 13 18:45:12 no not really.. Feb 13 19:11:20 jfelectron: Yes that is, you can go so far as to say var bool = (0&&false)||(1&&true); Feb 13 19:11:45 && and || are not restricted to if statements Feb 13 19:12:13 You could even do something like var a = undefined; var b = a || {}; Feb 13 19:12:15 scottb: yes.....i'm well aware of boolean operations and JSs non-strict type comparison Feb 13 19:12:36 jfelectron: Ok :) Feb 13 19:12:53 scottb: yeac... I do b=a||{} all the time in functions where the argument is optional Feb 13 19:13:54 scottb: thanks though :) Feb 13 19:13:58 Np Feb 13 19:14:26 We have a large range of skill sets in here, never know who knows what Feb 13 19:19:42 I think I need to understand why these background pngs are actually 3 stacked vertically Feb 13 19:20:30 sugardave are you referring to css? Feb 13 19:21:57 jenP: eventually...I'm just looking at some source pngs at the moment...I think it's "active", "not active" and ???? Feb 13 19:22:09 yeah... Feb 13 19:22:22 what is the 3rd one? Feb 13 19:22:46 let me look Feb 13 19:23:48 stage? Feb 13 19:24:03 could be a transition from one to two and back...maybe it has something to do with the kind of touch-feedback you desire Feb 13 19:24:09 Oi! I wish I had real stats for my sales -_- Feb 13 19:24:16 because this "tab-right" png is exactly the same for 2 and 3 Feb 13 19:24:17 I can only guess at numbers Feb 13 19:24:36 oh, btw, this is totaly OT...I'm just looking at a default drupal theme's pngs Feb 13 19:24:43 no webos involved :D Feb 13 19:25:18 ah ok...diff ballpark Feb 13 19:25:30 this is some kind of defacto "graphics person" standard isn't it? Feb 13 19:26:16 defacto? idk...generally visual standards guide for proj determines it Feb 13 19:27:59 Any one have an idea of how accurate myappbox.com's hot apps ranking is? Feb 13 19:28:07 OH, it's the hover Feb 13 19:28:24 that's why it looks exactly like the active Feb 13 19:29:06 what's that called in html/css, jenP? rollover graphics? Feb 13 19:29:22 yes Feb 13 19:29:22 scottb: I'm guessing its in the ballpark Feb 13 19:29:49 jenP: thank you, that's what I was looking for :D Feb 13 19:29:53 Hmm 144th, not bad for for 1 day Feb 13 19:30:01 whats your app? Feb 13 19:30:03 lol sugardave you did all the work Feb 13 19:30:30 Code Breaker Feb 13 19:30:49 nice Feb 13 19:31:54 gosh dangit I want my other app to be on the market... >.< Feb 13 19:32:10 Tired of not making any money on apps Feb 13 19:33:09 Tibfib: what apps do you have? Feb 13 19:33:17 (I think I've asked before) Feb 13 19:33:44 http://tibfib.com/webos-applications/ Feb 13 19:33:48 countdown is the free one Feb 13 19:33:51 the other should go live this month Feb 13 19:34:04 just waiting for the company to submit it Feb 13 19:35:02 Oh nice, I've been planning to download and play countdown Feb 13 19:35:19 it's fun Feb 13 19:37:10 http://scottbyrns.com/3d/3d Test.zip && http://scottbyrns.com/3d/com.scottbyrns.3dtest_1.0.0_all.ipk Feb 13 19:37:22 Thats the 3d stuff I was talking about the other day Feb 13 19:37:27 Just remembered to upload it Feb 13 19:38:02 must have missed that conversation, what 3d stuff? Feb 13 19:38:51 It's a 3d cube that trys to keep it's self facing strait up when you tilt the phone Feb 13 19:38:57 oh nice Feb 13 19:39:00 Works most of the way Feb 13 19:39:19 The accelerometer data isn't as easy to work with as I would like but it does the job Feb 13 19:39:28 I'm using the pre3d library Feb 13 19:39:39 http://deanm.github.com/pre3d/ Feb 13 19:42:44 that's pretty cool Feb 13 19:47:14 Yeah, I thought so too Feb 13 19:47:29 Always wondered why no one did it on the iphone Feb 13 19:47:53 It's pretty simple to do but has an amazing impact Feb 13 19:48:13 It brings a level of realism to the object in the display Feb 13 19:48:27 You can more or less interact with it as you would a real object Feb 13 19:49:28 It's also cool if you switch the direction the cube tilts because it looks like an object is suspended inside the screen rather than like you are rotating your phone around a cube Feb 13 19:57:45 Hey all.. I am currently using OS X and Firefox (with SDK installed) to run Project Ares... I connected my phone via USB (Selected Media Sync) and then tried to launch my app from within Project Ares. However, I am receiving the "emulator/device must be connected to launch app" message. Feb 13 19:58:00 I tried searching the user guide, but couldn't find any detailed instructions as to what I'm doing wrong.. any ideas? Feb 13 19:58:28 mpholt: do charge only....rather than media sync Feb 13 19:59:46 Sorry, was disconnected Feb 13 20:00:06 Hey all.. I am currently using OS X and Firefox (with SDK installed) to run Project Ares... I connected my phone via USB (Selected Media Sync) and then tried to launch my app from within Project Ares.  However, I am receiving the "emulator/device must be connected to launch app" message. Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong? Feb 13 20:00:23 The app runs fine on the emulator, but trying to run it on my device Feb 13 20:00:43 you should use 'just charge' Feb 13 20:00:54 ohh Feb 13 20:00:56 but I haven't tried it on the phone itself Feb 13 20:02:26 hmmm.. no luck Feb 13 20:02:33 made sure it was connected prior to opening Firefox/Ares Feb 13 20:04:04 mpholt: I've never used the direct install thingy....download the package and install it using palm-install Feb 13 20:04:18 ok.. i'll give that a try Feb 13 20:04:20 thanks Feb 13 20:16:02 mpholt if your phone is in developer mode, when you say run in ares it installs and runs on the phone if it is attached, or on the emulator if not Feb 13 20:16:10 there's no way to pick, that's automatic. Feb 13 20:16:40 rick-home: thanks.. just realized, didnt have it in developer mode Feb 13 20:16:48 that would do it Feb 13 20:17:07 Yea.. sorry, noob error:0 Feb 13 20:20:46 thanks again Feb 13 20:20:52 welcome Feb 13 20:22:30 rehi Feb 13 21:32:14 hucksy: are you able to send a patch for the mistake in the german translation? Feb 13 21:34:14 what mistake? Feb 13 21:34:47 Was someone lookin' for me? Feb 13 21:35:03 swisstomcat: hucksy says there's a mistake in the german translation Feb 13 21:35:22 shall i check? Feb 13 21:35:33 or did he say where? Feb 13 21:35:42 swisstomcat: dunno what it is yet. he's one of this people who say there's a problem, but don't say where. Feb 13 21:37:23 rwhitby: Helpful report, eh? Feb 13 21:39:06 So, there's a new 0.9.24 version of Preware in the testing feed which locks out Preware installs, updates and removes if there is an App Catalog installation underway. Anyone want to test it? Feb 13 21:39:49 can't anymore :( Feb 13 21:58:42 anybody in here? Feb 13 21:59:10 yeah Feb 13 21:59:47 cool, believe it or not i havent used IRC before, wanted to see if people hang the webos room Feb 13 22:00:26 the forum on the dev site is a little underwhelming sometimes Feb 13 22:00:27 depending on the time, quite a lot of people are here Feb 13 22:00:34 good to know Feb 13 22:01:38 hehe, you wish Feb 13 22:02:07 bread and water probably :) Feb 13 22:03:48 i have a specific question if you dont mind, are CSS3 transitions supported in webos and if yes why is there a need for Mojo.Animate namespace? Feb 13 22:05:15 haven't used any of them yet Feb 13 22:19:08 hi all Feb 13 22:19:14 any1 awake ? Feb 13 22:19:21 on here Feb 13 22:19:23 one* Feb 13 22:20:04 :) Feb 13 22:20:36 i'm a Notes developer, and I'm seriously looking at the PRE Feb 13 22:21:14 I'm wondering where to find information how to create a 'account' support like there is for exchange Feb 13 22:22:06 unfortunately i have zero experience in that particular area so cant help you =( Feb 13 22:22:08 hi Feb 13 22:22:33 you mean a new synergy "provider" for notes? Feb 13 22:23:39 I think yes, I even can't find a reference on how to name it Feb 13 22:23:55 but from what I've been reading , this looks like what I would like to develop Feb 13 22:24:24 havent' read anything about writing them yourself Feb 13 22:24:39 damned Feb 13 22:26:24 You could create an app that syncs with Notes (somehow...?) and then have the app create an account to add events to calendar, etc. Feb 13 22:27:47 https://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1737&Itemid=262 Feb 13 22:28:26 https://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1751&Itemid=267 Feb 13 22:29:16 re Feb 13 22:29:56 haeffb_gon4steak, okay, I did think about this approach Feb 13 22:29:56 g'night everyone Feb 13 22:30:05 does sound reasonable Feb 13 22:30:25 although you'll need web access Feb 13 22:32:51 haeffb_gon4steak, so it is not me who has issues finding information on creating a synergy provide Feb 13 23:19:48 rick-home: Hey rick....is there anywhere one can read about the chrome.js that Ares uses? I recall you said you've been editing them manually... Feb 14 00:06:32 Anyone know the trick to get an ares scene to mix into a non-ares app? Can't figure out how to reference in ares.js without breaking my whole app. Feb 14 00:13:15 rwhitby: i dont know how to patch, but the mistake is in the subtitle: "Das" -> wrong, "Der" -> right Feb 14 00:13:36 rbredow: I've had the same question....dunno Feb 14 00:13:53 rbredow: the scene is being rendered using the chrome.js...but I don't know how Feb 14 00:14:25 I thought I could just add ares.js to my sources.js, but that breaks everything (not sure why). Feb 14 00:15:15 rbredow: how about just including the scene-chrome.js? Feb 14 00:15:53 rbredow: though I suppose ares.js is responsible for translating Feb 14 00:16:04 I did do that, but it pukes when it hits the first ares line. Feb 14 00:16:06 error: Error: Ares is not defined, line undefined, file undefined Feb 14 00:16:35 rbredow: hrrrmph...well there goes any possibility of me using it Feb 14 00:16:52 I'll post to the forums. This must be easy. Feb 14 00:17:44 anyone know how to set -webkit-border-image dynamically? Using element.setStyle doesn't seem to work with either '-webkit-border-image' or 'WebKitBorderImage' Feb 14 00:26:54 what about -webkitBorderImage or webkitBorderImage? Feb 14 00:38:24 Tibfib: will try those....thanks...this suggests that the fully camelized form should work https://prototype.lighthouseapp.com/projects/8886/tickets/970-setstyle-fails-to-set-moz-based-styles Feb 14 00:40:50 Yeah, I'm not sure, that's just what I've used for normal styles. Feb 14 00:40:58 textAling Feb 14 00:41:04 textAlign* and so on Feb 14 00:45:40 yeah...I'm familiar with the camelcase forms. I think that WebKitBorderImage actually does work Feb 14 00:45:50 leading W due to -w Feb 14 00:49:31 interesting Feb 14 00:52:45 i can't install ANYTHING via quickinstall jar. i keep getting invalid magic error 22 Feb 14 00:53:26 An Error occurred, return value: 22. ipkg: invalid magic Feb 14 01:00:18 no one eh? seems to be the record. people on precentral have the problem; no solutions thou. Feb 14 01:00:25 Tibfib: the problem seems to be that relative paths(ie. ../images/blah.png) don't work dynamically. I had this problem when setting the body background image dynamically. I had to use the full path Feb 14 01:01:38 Hmmmmmmmm Feb 14 01:09:09 jfelectron: is there a Mojo.appInfo.appPath? Feb 14 01:11:35 nope, there is not. Feb 14 01:12:03 haeffb: has the appInfo format changed? Heard some rumblings to that effect... Feb 14 01:12:38 near as I can tell, appInfo is just whatever you put into appinfo.json Feb 14 01:13:28 but I think there's a way to get app path, just don't remember what it is. Feb 14 01:26:51 haeffb: ahhh.....just wondering if palm requires certain fields be present when you submit Feb 14 01:27:28 1.3.5 added a launch help dialog thingy that pulls support info from appino.json..so I thought they might require that new stuff Feb 14 01:27:54 I do not think it's required. Unless you use their automagic help scene Feb 14 01:28:59 OK cool, thanks Feb 14 01:30:05 Tibfib: I give up I'm just using addClassName Feb 14 01:31:52 heh. such is life. Feb 14 02:33:16 Anyone know when the next update to webos will be out? Feb 14 02:33:25 And what might be in the next update Feb 14 02:35:07 hackNperl: 15th, 1.4. Flash **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Feb 14 02:59:57 2010