**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Sep 29 02:59:57 2010 Sep 29 03:00:19 hello? Sep 29 03:00:52 ESMTP v1.0 EHLO Sep 29 03:01:19 CONNECTION TERMINATED: NULL LINE ENDING Sep 29 03:01:51 * haeffb out - time for zzzzzz's Sep 29 03:01:55 nite Sep 29 03:02:04 i finally got webos running Sep 29 03:02:05 night Sep 29 03:02:18 but the emulator slows my system to a crawl.. Sep 29 03:02:22 laters haeffb Sep 29 03:02:57 anyone know why or how i can speed up it up? Sep 29 03:03:03 more RAM Sep 29 03:03:16 my ram is getting here the 30th Sep 29 03:03:42 I should max out this laptop Sep 29 03:04:25 Its 200 to max out my laptop or mac mini Sep 29 03:04:40 And not worth it for my desktop, since it already has 6GB Sep 29 03:05:03 ok, but can I get the checkbox values *other* than the one that was clicked? Sep 29 03:05:22 sugardave, but it runs fine with any other application Sep 29 03:05:36 what are your specs Sep 29 03:05:37 okay Sep 29 03:05:52 2ghz 512ram Sep 29 03:06:07 sugardave: u going to NYC for dev days? Sep 29 03:06:11 LoneStar99: nope Sep 29 03:06:22 i meant the exact processor, but the 512mb ram is your issue Sep 29 03:06:25 * sugardave is hoping for 3rd on in Austin. Sep 29 03:06:38 halfhalo, why? too little? Sep 29 03:06:43 yeah or San Diego =) Sep 29 03:06:51 yeah, WAY to little Sep 29 03:07:05 halfhalo, what is required? Sep 29 03:07:29 I reccomend at least 2GB. Sep 29 03:08:01 I mean... the pre plus has 512MB of ram... Sep 29 03:08:59 bah, I don't even know what speed/type of RAM is in here...that means a shutdown at some point. Boo. Sep 29 03:09:11 * halfhalo has 1x4GB ddr3 and 1x2GB ddr3 coming soon Sep 29 03:09:14 sugardave: use cpuz Sep 29 03:09:20 halfhalo, i have virtualbox installed..i wonder if its that? Sep 29 03:09:43 actionfigure: what OS u using? Sep 29 03:09:45 actionfigure: virtualbox IS the emulator Sep 29 03:09:50 ubuntu Sep 29 03:10:01 well Sep 29 03:10:05 it runs the emulator image Sep 29 03:10:11 sugardave, i just wonder if its configure correctly Sep 29 03:10:29 i installed it but didnt configure it Sep 29 03:10:31 your running vm with 512MB of ram.... Sep 29 03:10:34 512MB of RAM is just not going to cut it Sep 29 03:11:02 what about processor speed? Sep 29 03:11:10 not nearly as important Sep 29 03:11:25 I really feel sorry for you... Sep 29 03:11:27 I really do Sep 29 03:11:33 :\ Sep 29 03:11:37 halfhalo, thanks Sep 29 03:11:42 2gb for sure Sep 29 03:11:52 it runs nice on 4 Sep 29 03:11:52 and for processor? Sep 29 03:12:04 2ghz single core should cut it Sep 29 03:12:10 I was running it in 2GB RAM and 1.8 GHz single core Sep 29 03:12:18 it took a long time to start, but ran fine once up Sep 29 03:12:32 I dont think I own a single core computer anymore... Sep 29 03:12:39 hmmm Sep 29 03:12:45 Even the spare cpu's for spare cpu's are dual Sep 29 03:12:46 now I have dual core 2.5GHz and 4GB RAM Sep 29 03:12:51 i do need a new computer Sep 29 03:12:59 amd? Sep 29 03:13:03 intel Sep 29 03:13:05 amd quad core plus 4gb ram =win Sep 29 03:13:07 amd ok? Sep 29 03:13:15 Nah, amd on a budget is win Sep 29 03:13:15 oh, I'm sure it's fine Sep 29 03:13:26 i saw a amd dual core with 2g for $350 at staples Sep 29 03:13:38 build it yourself for less Sep 29 03:13:41 lappy :) Sep 29 03:13:43 and with a quad Sep 29 03:13:49 how much are quad? Sep 29 03:13:59 for a destkop? 99 Sep 29 03:14:07 what brand? Sep 29 03:14:12 wait Sep 29 03:14:12 amd Sep 29 03:14:21 motherboard and chip for 99? Sep 29 03:14:32 just cpu, mobo is like 60 Sep 29 03:14:44 all 4 for 99? Sep 29 03:14:56 and 4 gigs of ram? Sep 29 03:14:57 plus another 70 for ram and, lets say 100 for case/psu Sep 29 03:15:03 159 = cpu and board Sep 29 03:15:11 no ram Sep 29 03:15:30 so thats about $300? Sep 29 03:15:43 newegg.com Sep 29 03:15:47 ish Sep 29 03:15:54 but since im going that route...id get a nice graphics card Sep 29 03:15:55 might find something goof there Sep 29 03:16:07 s/goof/good/ Sep 29 03:16:20 thanks you guys :) Sep 29 03:16:25 i might have to do that Sep 29 03:16:32 but for now ill have to wait Sep 29 03:16:37 gfx is under 100 for a nice one Sep 29 03:16:43 not bad Sep 29 03:17:21 ok Sep 29 03:17:25 since im still new Sep 29 03:17:30 i have another question Sep 29 03:17:37 do you guys make any games? Sep 29 03:18:04 oh, how i love newegg... Sep 29 03:18:22 09/28/2010 19:09:00 IN TRANSIT TO[I] VAN NUYS, CA, US Sep 29 03:18:22 09/28/2010 19:08:00 DEPARTURE SCAN[I] LONG BEACH, CA, US Sep 29 03:18:31 2 days early Sep 29 03:18:35 halfhalo, you in lb? Sep 29 03:18:47 nope Sep 29 03:19:05 did you order something? Sep 29 03:19:28 yup Sep 29 03:19:31 ram from newegg Sep 29 03:19:35 nice Sep 29 03:19:46 van nuys? Sep 29 03:19:54 close enough Sep 29 03:20:06 cool..so do you make any games? Sep 29 03:20:11 nope Sep 29 03:20:16 im just here for the cookies Sep 29 03:20:17 what do you do? Sep 29 03:20:21 ahhhh Sep 29 03:20:26 * sugardave shudders at the thought of games made by halfhalo. Sep 29 03:20:34 lol Sep 29 03:20:40 cuz i was wonder how games made in 3dmax or flash are imported to webos for gaming Sep 29 03:20:50 actually, Death Race NG would be pretty good Sep 29 03:21:04 "Oh so you play by clicking this buttoOH GOD MY HANDS ARE MELTING" Sep 29 03:21:23 do you guys design apps? Sep 29 03:21:29 hi all! Sep 29 03:21:31 mebe Sep 29 03:21:31 hi JenP Sep 29 03:21:39 JenP, hello Sep 29 03:21:43 * JenP waves Sep 29 03:21:51 question for windows devs Sep 29 03:21:53 I write apps for other people, because I suck at design/graphics Sep 29 03:21:58 where is the default install location for the PDK/SDK? Sep 29 03:22:04 sugardave, im the opposite ;) Sep 29 03:22:13 sugardave, im good at design but forgot my js Sep 29 03:22:17 I..... wrote an app that i lost the code to and it doesn't work anymore for some reason Sep 29 03:22:24 I only do js, though...no PDK action from me Sep 29 03:22:26 BUT it still has a 3.5 star rating! Sep 29 03:22:31 halfhalo, :( Sep 29 03:22:49 so webos is mostly js? Sep 29 03:22:56 "lost" the source code of a Mojo app? impossible Sep 29 03:22:56 yup Sep 29 03:23:13 halfhalo, sorry to hear that..id love to try out your app Sep 29 03:23:16 anyone work much with the progress slider? Sep 29 03:23:24 well, you see... I never actually bought my own app Sep 29 03:23:26 JenP: a _little_ Sep 29 03:23:47 halfhalo, how do you buy your own app...you made it..its yours Sep 29 03:23:48 oh wait Sep 29 03:23:50 can anyone tell me that so I can put it in this tutorial? Sep 29 03:23:51 progress bar Sep 29 03:23:56 JenP: not at all :D Sep 29 03:24:04 hahhaha Sep 29 03:24:17 alexfner, what tutorial Sep 29 03:24:30 working on a set of PDK tutorials Sep 29 03:24:32 i have something to say but i hope i dont offend anyone Sep 29 03:24:41 alexfner, im new :) Sep 29 03:25:00 I'm trying to figure out if it's the best way to give the user a quick ability to increment/decrement a value Sep 29 03:25:03 is it me or did Blackberry RIM rip off Webos? Sep 29 03:25:17 what is the local directory where the PDK is installed on windows machines? Sep 29 03:25:21 alexfner: it's going to start out like "C:\Program Files\Palm\SDK...." Sep 29 03:25:30 but I don't know from memory Sep 29 03:25:42 I just want the specific directory Sep 29 03:25:45 I mean Sep 29 03:25:51 I want the exact directory Sep 29 03:25:58 so I can include it and it's factually accurate :) Sep 29 03:26:14 JenP: I use a slider thingie for speed adjustments in iHaveSpirit for the marquee and the flasher Sep 29 03:26:31 how do you like it? Sep 29 03:26:32 blue bar with the blue circle Sep 29 03:26:36 nodnod Sep 29 03:26:39 it's fine Sep 29 03:27:03 hmm then i'll give it a shot and see what it looks like Sep 29 03:27:05 it's slightly limiting Sep 29 03:27:21 if you want your minimum value to be on the left, you have to do some special things Sep 29 03:27:32 like what? Sep 29 03:27:42 it would be nice if they let you specify which side is minimum in the attributes Sep 29 03:27:44 I mean on the right Sep 29 03:27:46 sorry Sep 29 03:27:46 because that's exactly what i'll need Sep 29 03:27:53 ah kk Sep 29 03:27:56 min left is default Sep 29 03:28:15 ok that works for me Sep 29 03:28:26 for me it says "slower faster" Sep 29 03:28:38 but larger ms is slower and smaller ms is faster Sep 29 03:28:47 so I had to work around it Sep 29 03:28:52 i need it to show the span of numbers on movement Sep 29 03:29:23 to pick it? Sep 29 03:29:50 does everyone work on the system or use ares? Sep 29 03:30:06 well the value will be 0 on min and say 1000 on max Sep 29 03:30:07 I think more people are beginning to use Ares, but I do not Sep 29 03:30:26 JenP: yeah, that's fine, but the purpose of the widget is for the user to select the value? Sep 29 03:30:28 the ball must be in the position of a value from an equation Sep 29 03:30:36 sugardave, i use eclipes but it doesnt look like ares at all..no tools Sep 29 03:30:43 for the user to add or subtract from a value Sep 29 03:30:59 JenP: sounds perfect, then :D Sep 29 03:31:15 actionfigure: yeah, you have to do all the mojo by hand, no automatic widget setups or gui layouts Sep 29 03:31:26 yah?...but i think i'm gonna have to change the color Sep 29 03:31:27 that super sucks Sep 29 03:31:36 sugardave, i think ill stick with ares for now... Sep 29 03:31:40 JenP: no problem for a graphics person :D Sep 29 03:31:41 actionfigure: i like it much better. and you'll learn more too Sep 29 03:31:47 sugardave, its really nice working with it though Sep 29 03:31:57 yup...i do happen to know a few of those types Sep 29 03:32:02 I'm way too much of a control freak for Ares, I think Sep 29 03:32:03 JenP, true.. :) Sep 29 03:32:15 sugardave, you freak!!!! Sep 29 03:32:16 ;) Sep 29 03:32:25 JenP, do you make any apps? Sep 29 03:32:30 yes Sep 29 03:32:35 JenP makes THE apps Sep 29 03:32:42 JenP, what kind? like games? Sep 29 03:32:51 sugardave is playing Sep 29 03:33:02 DebtFree, Tasty Toons.... Sep 29 03:33:12 and i've done some partnering... Sep 29 03:33:17 tasty toons? i like the sound of that :) Sep 29 03:33:27 pegged, reversi Sep 29 03:33:28 do you have a link? id love to see it :) Sep 29 03:34:52 http://www.palm.com/us/products/software/mobile-applications.html if you go to the "Parenting" menu item in App Experience you'll see debt free Sep 29 03:35:20 ahhhh Sep 29 03:35:21 nice Sep 29 03:35:38 thanks Sep 29 03:36:26 what i dont understand is how if i made a flash game and want to make it work on the palm for gaming? Sep 29 03:36:49 actionfigure: you cannot do that Sep 29 03:36:57 why not Sep 29 03:37:02 for example Sep 29 03:37:26 Need for speed is make in 3dmax..but its played on the iphone and android.. Sep 29 03:37:46 need for speed is not made in 3dmax Sep 29 03:37:50 no? Sep 29 03:37:52 some models for need for speed were Sep 29 03:38:11 but still its made in a 3d program Sep 29 03:38:19 but the game itself runs on a custom 3d openGL ES 2.0 engine Sep 29 03:39:07 but you have to model it in a 3d prog and then use the 3d prog for the environment.. Sep 29 03:39:45 gah Sep 29 03:39:49 follow me on this Sep 29 03:39:51 this is a very interesting conversation Sep 29 03:39:52 3d games Sep 29 03:40:05 so when a professional studio makes a 3d game Sep 29 03:40:31 they used a program like 3dMax to make what's called a model. All a model is, is something that defines the shape of the thing that needs to be drawn, and gives texture coordinates to apply to the shape Sep 29 03:40:58 alexfner, i understand since ihave done modeling and sculpting on the computer Sep 29 03:41:32 right, so models are just definitions Sep 29 03:41:46 so you load the models, the definitions, into the game Sep 29 03:41:53 ok Sep 29 03:42:16 and then you have to write a bunch of logic to draw them, commonly called a rendering engine Sep 29 03:42:23 alexfner, what im saying is that after the game is completed and now you want to have it on a phone...how is that done Sep 29 03:42:51 actionfigure: need for speed for a phone is a completely new game from need for speed on a console Sep 29 03:42:54 they make new art Sep 29 03:42:58 new models Sep 29 03:43:03 a new rendering engine Sep 29 03:43:14 hmmm Sep 29 03:43:24 everything has to be dumbed down, to keep memory/computer power at an acceptable level for a mobile device Sep 29 03:43:46 i always thought the renderer which i call it is just producing what was made with all the codes defining the laws of the game Sep 29 03:44:33 alexfner, so from what i understand you saying is that the modeling is done only in the 3d prog but has to be rendered in a phone renderer? Sep 29 03:45:40 modeling is done well before hand, to create sprites Sep 29 03:45:48 oh ok Sep 29 03:45:53 these sprites are drawn using a rendering engine built for the device Sep 29 03:46:17 alexfner, so how is this done for webos? Sep 29 03:46:32 how is what done? Sep 29 03:47:03 games for webos Sep 29 03:47:11 like need for speed Sep 29 03:47:44 you insert mt dew and doritos into a cubefarm .. Sep 29 03:47:47 alexfner, just to let you know..ive already learned more just by talking to you :) Sep 29 03:47:52 and out poops a 3d game Sep 29 03:47:55 bpadalino, thats it!!!!! Sep 29 03:48:11 if you hear more grumbling .. insert more mt dew and doritos Sep 29 03:48:27 bpadalino, this a game we're talkinga bout not your stomach ;) Sep 29 03:48:37 D: Sep 29 03:48:52 ;) Sep 29 03:48:59 alexfner, i hope i didnt scare you away :( Sep 29 03:49:11 alexfner, i trying to learn to do games on the webos :( Sep 29 03:49:18 actionfigure: the developer picks a language to program in, such as OpenGL ES 1.1 or OpenGL ES 2.0, which are both available on the device Sep 29 03:49:24 don't worry :) Sep 29 03:49:29 I'm just working on other stuff Sep 29 03:49:46 and writes a game in one of those languages Sep 29 03:49:54 I'm going to go over it in a tutorial series Sep 29 03:49:55 not js? Sep 29 03:51:09 bpadalino, :) Sep 29 03:51:26 I pick english to program in Sep 29 03:51:31 so should i learn opengl? or javascript? Sep 29 03:52:05 why limit yourself? Sep 29 03:52:06 actionfigure: you could use either, javascript is easier, c++/openGL defines a much higher level of control to the developer, but is harder to learn because of it Sep 29 03:52:08 learn it all! Sep 29 03:52:35 alexfner, so i can make a game using js? Sep 29 03:52:43 if you want, yes Sep 29 03:53:01 hmmm Sep 29 03:53:18 alexfner, is there a link or something that helps me put all this together? Sep 29 03:53:32 you just have to read a lot about webOS Sep 29 03:53:36 and it all comes together Sep 29 03:54:04 for gaming? Sep 29 03:54:11 for example Sep 29 03:54:20 what are some games you like on the palm? Sep 29 03:56:40 think about it...there are awesome games for the palm..someone must be very knowledged in it all. so i wonder where they learned it all..i really dont think all the info is on palm.com Sep 29 03:57:09 Most of the simple games are simple javascript apps Sep 29 03:57:25 ahhh Sep 29 03:57:58 which there are tutorials for all over the place Sep 29 03:58:41 childsd3, thanks Sep 29 03:59:06 alexfner, thanks for clearing up so much..i greatly appreciate this conversation and all the info you gave me :) Sep 29 03:59:37 no problem :D Sep 29 04:00:04 alexfner, im keeping my eye on you for any other questions Sep 29 04:00:08 :) Sep 29 04:00:28 alexfner, see...you need to make youtube tutorials..that would help out so much Sep 29 04:00:48 alexfner, i get the picture of what you meant but still havent put it all together Sep 29 04:03:43 you'll get it, you've just got to push through the confusion Sep 29 04:03:46 i really dont wanna do hello world stuff :( Sep 29 04:04:03 giggles.....but they're so much fun Sep 29 04:04:05 i want to do 2d and 3d gaming :) Sep 29 04:04:12 hello JenP Sep 29 04:04:39 games!!! Sep 29 04:04:48 there must be a gaming develper here Sep 29 04:05:10 hi actionfigure Sep 29 04:05:16 actionfigure: you can't just jump right to games, or you won't be able to make games Sep 29 04:05:26 nodnod Sep 29 04:05:39 I could send you thousands of lines of game code, but it wouldn't do you any good cause you wouldn't understand it Sep 29 04:05:40 JenP, that was a joke Sep 29 04:06:13 alexfner, hmmm wondering if i should just do gaming modeling Sep 29 04:06:32 you wouldn't be able to do anything with it Sep 29 04:06:42 you'd have models but not be able to use them for anything Sep 29 04:07:10 is it that hard? Sep 29 04:10:01 actionfigure: here's what I'd suggest, start with something very simple, and javascript/html/css Sep 29 04:10:11 learn the palm SDK Sep 29 04:10:21 and learn how to use the canvas Sep 29 04:10:27 Google "Mozilla Canvas html5 tutorials" Sep 29 04:10:34 then make a very simple game Sep 29 04:10:38 ok thanks :) Sep 29 04:10:39 this will probably take a few weeks Sep 29 04:10:45 minimum Sep 29 04:10:48 alexfner, that does help a lot Sep 29 04:10:57 alexfner, its a start somewhere :) Sep 29 04:16:48 alexfner, well thanks again for all your help..i do appreciate it..ill start reading soon... :) thanks Sep 29 04:16:53 JenP, thanks Sep 29 04:17:06 Roy-Pre101: want to take a look at what I've done/proof read? Sep 29 04:18:30 sure Sep 29 04:20:11 Roy what news letter? i didn't get your message till this AM Sep 29 04:20:33 Hmmm... Looking through the Palm Reference Library, they list a few things as returning info of the type "double," which... As far as I've been able to find on google, was something killed a long time ago! What exactly does it mean to be the type "double?" Sep 29 04:21:08 Roy-Pre101: http://www.webos101.com/PDK_A_to_Z Sep 29 04:21:11 the first tut is up Sep 29 04:21:16 more precise decimal Sep 29 04:21:16 it's the basics, the intro Sep 29 04:21:35 so let me know if it works/makes sense Sep 29 04:22:06 hm Sep 29 04:22:31 then the accuracy on the GPS is way bad when it comes to velocity! Sep 29 04:22:33 but good to know Sep 29 04:22:51 does the GPS return a specific velocity? Sep 29 04:22:59 I thought it just gave coordinates Sep 29 04:23:19 which you then had to convert to a velocity by converting to vectors and finding the magnitude and dividing by the time Sep 29 04:23:24 oh, you know what Sep 29 04:23:26 durp Sep 29 04:23:33 it returns "Number representing the velocity in meters per second. If unknown, the value is -1." Sep 29 04:23:41 that's why it seems so off Sep 29 04:24:05 alexfner: you can apparently ask for velocity in getCurrentPosition Sep 29 04:24:12 didn't realize it was in meters per second though Sep 29 04:24:27 well this is news to me Sep 29 04:24:40 back in 1.1 or something, I tried to go from coordinates to velocity Sep 29 04:24:43 it sucked :/ Sep 29 04:24:52 using my own poor math Sep 29 04:24:55 it did give numbers Sep 29 04:25:02 and they seemed to be accurate Sep 29 04:25:03 alexfner: Wow! Ambitious article set, I love it Sep 29 04:25:08 but I couldn't normalize them Sep 29 04:25:25 of course, why you'd want velocity in meters per second I don't really know Sep 29 04:25:27 Roy-Pre101: yeah it's probably going to become bigger as I see that I need more, that's what I've got so far though Sep 29 04:25:46 SineOt: just convert you dingus! :D Sep 29 04:25:52 Very good. Sep 29 04:26:05 Did you have any issues cross-compiling chipmunk? Sep 29 04:26:11 I'll convert it to yards per fortnight! Sep 29 04:26:33 I am looking at some SDL GUI libraries and one I picked I'm having some issues cross-compiling. But I haven't spent a lot of time on it yet. Sep 29 04:26:53 no problems with chipmunk Sep 29 04:27:01 Anyhow, I need to sleep. Sep 29 04:27:06 I did have a small issue with soil, which required a custom version of the library Sep 29 04:27:10 It looks good so far. Sep 29 04:28:11 Also notice that you've hardcoded Pre screen resolutions but that's probably fine for a starter article. Sep 29 04:28:26 Particularly since it doesn't display anything! Sep 29 04:47:08 hi all Sep 29 04:47:46 so for windows 7 .. i download virtualbox / java / windows 7 64bit sdk .. install all of them and im suppose to be able to just open emulator right ? Sep 29 04:51:51 can anybody answer a quick question? Sep 29 04:52:07 just ask and see Sep 29 04:52:50 good morning Sep 29 04:53:01 hi MetaView, almost bed time here Sep 29 04:53:11 just got up Sep 29 04:53:20 well, past bed time but I'm a later night person Sep 29 04:53:24 kids have to go to school Sep 29 04:53:53 I've been trying to learn how to use webOS. I got everything set up on my computer correctly. And I also read through the tutorial here(http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1758&Itemid=20) and here(http://mobile.tutsplus.com/tutorials/webos/introduction-to-webos-sdk-development-part-2/) Sep 29 04:54:06 bbl Sep 29 04:54:46 but I'm having problems when I try to create my own application with out the tutorial Sep 29 04:54:56 what kind of a problem? Sep 29 04:55:01 so for windows 7 .. i download virtualbox / java / windows 7 64bit sdk .. install all of them and im suppose to be able to just open emulator right ? Sep 29 04:55:33 macman_: you should be able to run palm-emulator from the command line OR launch the link in the Palm SDK application directory Sep 29 04:55:46 I think you're still not supposed to just open the image in virtualbox, but that might have changed by now Sep 29 04:55:58 sugardave so this is what i did .. i uninstall java / virtualbox and sdk .. im re-doing them .. installing 1 by 1 Sep 29 04:56:04 macman_: launch the emulator from the bat file Sep 29 04:56:13 let me install first Sep 29 04:57:11 im install java / sdk / virtualbox Sep 29 04:57:19 very excited Sep 29 04:57:22 no Sep 29 04:57:25 vb before sdk Sep 29 04:57:28 java, virtual box, sdk Sep 29 04:58:06 ok Sep 29 04:58:16 d Sep 29 04:58:20 one sec Sep 29 04:58:38 java version "1.6.0_21" Sep 29 04:58:53 sugardave: formatting the slider with values on left and right is a pain Sep 29 04:59:04 I cheated Sep 29 04:59:11 share.? Sep 29 04:59:18 made my own labels underneath and floated them left and right Sep 29 04:59:27 adjusted the margin slightly Sep 29 04:59:31 oh that is good! Sep 29 04:59:40 you sneaky boy! Sep 29 04:59:43 ;) Sep 29 05:00:02 I'm all about "Mr. Right Now" Sep 29 05:00:10 lol Sep 29 05:00:20 im relly excited about the pre .. im going to get it in jan when im upgrade eligble .. i need some time with the emulator to make up my mind Sep 29 05:00:31 i currently went from blackberry / iphone / and now on android Sep 29 05:00:34 macman_: you'll love it Sep 29 05:00:35 macman_: there will (hopefully) be a new device by then Sep 29 05:00:51 webos 2.0 Sep 29 05:00:55 well ATt better get it fast Sep 29 05:00:56 lol Sep 29 05:01:19 does it matter where i intall sdk Sep 29 05:01:24 default location ? Sep 29 05:01:31 stick with the default Sep 29 05:01:53 I would to say one thing, gonna ride a beach cruiser on the boardwalk in 3 days, and would like to say to JenP and company. Thanks for coming out Sep 29 05:02:32 well guys i've got to go..need to get stuff ready for work tomorrow Sep 29 05:02:44 night JenP Sep 29 05:02:51 meh Sep 29 05:02:53 hmm Sep 29 05:02:55 palm pre new os Sep 29 05:03:00 or webos 2.0 Sep 29 05:03:03 night Sep 29 05:03:51 sugardave so just stick with sdk and wait till they annouce new palm Sep 29 05:04:05 another good thing .. my brother in law has a sprint palm pre .. he is getting an evo 4g Sep 29 05:04:13 he said i can have his when he gets it .. im on ATT Sep 29 05:04:20 so can i use his palm without a sim card ? Sep 29 05:04:22 err Sep 29 05:04:22 it won't work there Sep 29 05:04:29 what do you mean ? Sep 29 05:04:37 no, it's a different radio Sep 29 05:04:41 SPrint is CDMA Sep 29 05:04:41 yea Sep 29 05:04:47 i won't use it as a phone Sep 29 05:04:52 i will use it to get used to it Sep 29 05:04:54 oh Sep 29 05:05:01 then that will mostly work Sep 29 05:07:01 sugardave this new device .. can you link me or what ? Sep 29 05:07:04 just speculation ? Sep 29 05:07:32 it's all rumor right now (I think)...kinda been out of the loop for a few days Sep 29 05:07:50 what about the keyboard Sep 29 05:07:53 there has been some new stuff about certification testing being run on a new product Sep 29 05:07:57 i fat finger all keyboards Sep 29 05:08:11 since its linux i can put virtual keyboard right ? Sep 29 05:08:15 i heard it has no spell check Sep 29 05:09:09 ok Sep 29 05:09:13 no spell check that I'm aware of...there is a virtual keyboard patch, but nothing in the stock OS will support anything but the phone kb Sep 29 05:09:13 sdk is erroing out Sep 29 05:09:40 macmac_: might have better luck using the 32-bit java, vb, and sdk...that's what I hear from windows people in here Sep 29 05:09:52 Unable to access jarfile C:\Program Files (x86)\Palm\SDK\bin\\..\share\jars\webo Sep 29 05:09:52 s-emulator.jar Sep 29 05:10:08 will it work Sep 29 05:10:31 I ran 32-bit but on 32-bit windows...now I use Ubuntu Sep 29 05:10:53 yea i love ubuntu Sep 29 05:10:54 i dual bo Sep 29 05:10:57 boot* Sep 29 05:11:09 im on windows now cause of something else Sep 29 05:11:10 lol Sep 29 05:31:18 w00t its working Sep 29 05:31:24 i had to download java x64 Sep 29 05:31:36 one on java site is 64 bit even thought it says 64 Sep 29 05:37:24 question Sep 29 05:37:34 can you change the icons on th dock or at the bottom of the pre ? Sep 29 05:43:56 also Sep 29 05:44:04 can i emulate sending a text to the emulator ? Sep 29 05:49:12 lol Sep 29 05:49:15 everyone sleep ? Sep 29 05:49:19 Nope :) Sep 29 05:49:25 mind helping me ? Sep 29 05:49:37 wanna emulate sending a text to the sdk / emualtor while on a call Sep 29 05:49:54 Sorry. I don't know if that's possible or not. Sep 29 05:50:47 I think it is? the palm documentation should have more info Sep 29 05:59:48 so guys Sep 29 05:59:56 tablet. Sep 29 05:59:58 7 inches or 10? Sep 29 06:00:09 or... more Sep 29 06:00:19 24 inch Sep 29 06:00:24 74 inch tablet Sep 29 06:01:07 Portable one Sep 29 06:01:10 it's a bit of a pain because, when people are around what are they gonna gravitate more towards? the bigger screen Sep 29 06:01:56 just meet in the middle with an 8.5 inch tablet ;P Sep 29 06:02:18 both sizes are fine, with the 10 erring for more size and the 7 erring towards more portability Sep 29 06:02:35 personally? I'd love either one Sep 29 06:03:14 luna-send -n 1 luna://com.palm.pmradiosimulator/set_incomingsms {\"number\":\"4086177431\",\" Sep 29 06:03:14 message\":\"'Virtura Reality'\"} Sep 29 06:03:16 lol Sep 29 06:03:24 yea im just copying and pasting Sep 29 06:03:27 but that isn't working Sep 29 06:05:05 I'd prefer a 7 inch but half of tablets is showing other people things Sep 29 06:16:35 anyone like OpenGL and want to review the context of my tutorial thus far? Sep 29 06:17:01 where is it? Sep 29 06:20:08 http://webos101.com/PDK_A_to_Z Sep 29 06:20:11 tut 1 is done Sep 29 06:20:17 tut 2 is 1/5 done Sep 29 06:21:13 alexfner: awesome. I'll jump right into it Sep 29 06:21:37 let me know what's not right/poorly worded/difficult to understand Sep 29 06:21:50 there isn't much guts in the first tutorial, but there is going to be a ton in the second Sep 29 06:21:56 I am just getting tired Sep 29 06:22:21 May I nitpick? Sep 29 06:22:40 You could link to my 2 articles about using SDL and OpenGL as renderer Sep 29 06:22:45 or how is that said.. Sep 29 06:22:48 www.metaviewsoft.de/wordpress Sep 29 06:22:56 you know, it's awesome that Ares lets you add a StatusIndicator thing, but none of the documentation says what you need to do to change the status displayed b_d Sep 29 06:23:18 "hypercriticism" Sep 29 06:26:46 teemu: nitpick away Sep 29 06:27:56 alexfner: PDK vs. SDK gives the idea there would be some comparison of the two but the text only gives hints of the differences. Sure, it should be quite clear how JS/HTML/CSS differ from C code and its capabilities but the title is a bit misleading Sep 29 06:28:14 What I'd like to see there would be more comparison like you've done with sound. Sep 29 06:29:09 Or explain in the end why physics engine etc. would be a bad idea in JS Sep 29 06:29:35 keep going, I am listening Sep 29 06:29:37 Good morning Sep 29 06:29:52 good morning Sep 29 06:30:06 Or change title to PDK or SKD :) Just so that I wouldn't expect to find comparisons. Sep 29 06:30:10 SDK.. Sep 29 06:30:11 Anyone have an idea for a relatively simple app? The World Clock thing kinda flopped. Sep 29 06:30:54 KGF2009: why it flopped? Sep 29 06:31:05 teemu keep going :D Sep 29 06:31:07 What's wrong with the title? PDK_A_to_Z is not missleading Sep 29 06:31:18 anyway, I'm off to work, bbl Sep 29 06:31:22 later Sep 29 06:31:36 MetaView: true, that's not. But the subtitle or whatever it's called Sep 29 06:31:40 Ended up too complicated. Actually, I was thinking, perhaps, a PHPBB3 client type of thing. Anyone else think that'd be useful? Sep 29 06:31:45 PDK Versus SDK Sep 29 06:32:13 KGF2009: a forum reader? That'd be nice to have. PHPBB3, Simple Machines etc. Sep 29 06:32:19 teemu: Tutorial 1: Setup & The Basics of a PDK App ? Sep 29 06:32:38 oh, ok, I speak about "PDK Versus SDK" Sep 29 06:32:50 Damn there is much activity this morning:) Sep 29 06:32:53 could be changed into Intro Sep 29 06:33:01 but now I'm off :) Sep 29 06:33:16 alexfner: that's it about that heh. Nothing else :) Sep 29 06:33:48 Wow, 9 hours ahead of me. Where do you live, hotdp? Australia? Sep 29 06:34:05 To me the word "versus" means comparison of two or more things, so comparisons is what I'd expect with a topic like "PDK Versus SDK" Sep 29 06:35:38 hmm. Dictionary simply says it's alternative or in contrast with.. Sep 29 06:35:39 . Sep 29 06:37:26 Does anyone know how I would get the HTML contents of a webpage into a variable? Sep 29 06:48:15 KGF2009: A world clock app would be useful to work out where it's morning right now ;) Sep 29 06:48:45 Shhh. I'm researching the HTML structure of PHPBB3. Sep 29 06:49:04 KGF2009: just kidding. it's definitely not an easy app to get right. Sep 29 06:49:35 (BTW, he'll be in .eu somewhere. It's mid to late afternoon in Australia) Sep 29 06:49:49 Neither will this. But with this, it's gonna be something I will actually use. Sep 29 06:50:22 scratching your own itch is a powerful motivator Sep 29 06:51:00 * KGF2009 nodnods. Sep 29 06:51:17 rwhitby, I don't suppose you know how I'd save the contents of a webpage to a variable? Sep 29 06:52:04 rwhitby: who's managing the community wiki now, you or 101? Sep 29 06:52:05 Tibfib: he posted screenshots - http://forums.precentral.net/showthread.php?p=2684297#post2684297 Sep 29 06:52:42 alexfner: internals stuff at webos-internals.org, mojo/sdk/pdk stuff at webos101 Sep 29 06:53:00 interesting Sep 29 06:53:04 KGF2009: if you're researching it for the phpbb3 I'd be looking at rss or something Sep 29 06:53:10 I was just thinking about how poorly the community has documented webOS Sep 29 06:53:17 too bad we can't hire me to do it :D Sep 29 06:53:25 teemu, why's that? Sep 29 06:53:29 I mean I am going to try and dramatically improve the quality of SDK/PDK docs Sep 29 06:53:31 how poorly the community has done it? Palm didn't do a very good job at it either :p Sep 29 06:53:44 alexfner: excellent Sep 29 06:53:53 SineOt: I recognize that :) Sep 29 06:53:58 KGF2009: the templates and contents of websites change. You'd be better of looking for an more generic way of obtaining necessary data, such as RSS. Sep 29 06:54:19 SineOt: but it'd be nice if we could eliminate the questions on the forums and have them all available at webOS 101 Sep 29 06:54:25 KGF2009: other way around could be to create a mod for the forum software in question and access data from it. Sep 29 06:54:27 yeah Sep 29 06:54:44 alexfner: Tell you what - I'll give you 25% of what I get for running WebOS Internals ... Sep 29 06:54:55 * teemu applauds for alexfner Sep 29 06:55:07 I still can't find anywhere on developer.palm.com that talks about StatusIndicator :p Sep 29 06:55:36 :D, isn't that an Ares only widget? Sep 29 06:55:44 rwhitby: sounds good to me :) Sep 29 06:55:53 even the Ares documentation doesn't talk about it lol Sep 29 06:55:56 seriously how many times have you seen people ask about canvas support Sep 29 06:55:58 teemu, while that may be true, there are certain aspects of PHPBB3 code that remain the same through the templats. Sep 29 06:56:01 templates Sep 29 06:56:26 alexfner: here's your first paycheck: Sep 29 06:56:32 KGF2009: sure, but I'm just warning you of an endless work with the approach you're having now.. Sep 29 06:56:44 teemu, how so? Sep 29 06:56:52 awe too kind :D too kind :D Sep 29 06:57:30 http://www.webos101.com/Mojo_SDK Sep 29 06:57:32 look at that article Sep 29 06:57:34 KGF2009: if you're trying to make a client for phpbb3, or any other forum software, that is based on html code of the page then you're begging for trouble in my humble oppinion :) Sep 29 06:57:39 I am going to go nuts on this wiki Sep 29 06:58:17 teemu, that may be true, but I'm trying to go for a way that will support all PHPBB3 forums. Not all of them have RSS. Sep 29 06:58:21 KGF2009: so that's why I'm urging you to find other ways of accessing the data, something that doesn't change from forum to forum. Sep 29 06:58:28 they don't even half palm-install or palm-package or palm-log mentioned :/ Sep 29 06:59:00 KGF2009: I understand your goal but I doubt you can do that without having a mod or something like it for the forum.. Sep 29 06:59:05 rwhitby: do you know if these wikis have a way so that I can work on articles and not publish them until a certain date? Sep 29 06:59:18 alexfner: probably not Sep 29 06:59:37 KGF2009: I'm just saying, that it might be easier to create a mod and connect to that than to parse through html/js/whatever code and try to work with that Sep 29 06:59:51 alexfner: you can have private sections, and then move the page on that date I guess Sep 29 07:00:03 teemu, basically my goal is to send a request to the PHPBB3 forum and then use the resulting HTML to display it on the app in a more mobile-friendly fasion. Sep 29 07:00:46 KGF2009: you'd want a client for the forum software that is not like a browser, right? Sep 29 07:01:36 Yeah; like simple lists for posts instead of the fancy CSS-formatted ones. Sep 29 07:01:37 Roy-Pre101: we're going to make webOS101 a beacon of hope for other development communities wikis Sep 29 07:02:34 KGF2009: right. So before you start coding I'd make sure there's not mod or other ways other than html-parse to do what you want to do. Sep 29 07:03:34 I can't think of another way that would be compatible with all PHPBB3 installs. Sep 29 07:03:49 Unless someone -severely- modifies the PHPBB3 code, it should work. Sep 29 07:03:56 A mod would be Sep 29 07:04:18 By 'compatible' I mean out-of-the-box. Sep 29 07:04:26 Or tarball, in this case. Sep 29 07:05:00 Right. You have admirable goal but I'm just affraid it's endless. Sep 29 07:05:06 Endless task, that is. Sep 29 07:05:17 How is it endless? Sep 29 07:06:47 It could be if the way forum outputs its contents changes. Hopefully this is not the case. Sep 29 07:08:06 Really, I don't think that'll happen until something like PHPBB4. Sep 29 07:08:23 Ok :) Sep 29 07:09:05 But I still have yet to get over the hurdle of: How do I get the HTML code of a page into a variable? Sep 29 07:09:12 I don't want to discourage you or poo poo your idea Sep 29 07:09:46 quick googling hints of using httprequest for what you want to do but not sure if that's the way to do it Sep 29 07:13:56 man not having system wide copy paste in Ares is kind of a bummer Sep 29 07:41:01 Does anyone know some kind of Mojo magic or something that will let me get the HTML of a webpage? Sep 29 07:41:47 can't you just make a ajax request? Sep 29 07:41:51 GET Sep 29 07:41:52 A what? Sep 29 07:42:00 That should do it Sep 29 07:42:14 Which I do how? Sep 29 07:42:56 var request = new Ajax.Request("http://www.google.com", { method: 'get', evalJSON: 'false', onSuccess: this.feedRequestSuccess.bind(this), onFailure: this.feedRequestFailure.bind(this) }); Sep 29 07:43:31 And request will have the HTML? Sep 29 07:43:32 look at http://www.weboshelp.net/getting-started-with-webos/415-webos-and-ajax-revisited Sep 29 07:43:34 That Ajax comes from PrototypeJS Sep 29 07:43:37 yer Sep 29 07:43:59 that should do it Sep 29 07:58:22 hotdp, when I try to 'Mojo.Log.error("%j", request);' I get an error about INVALID_STATE_ERR. Sep 29 07:58:40 pastebin your code Sep 29 08:00:47 http://webos.pastebin.com/mUz25Adw Sep 29 08:02:04 1 sec Sep 29 08:04:17 That because it is all wrong :D Sep 29 08:04:54 You have to copy paste the whole example from the page. There are two events that are triggered, succes and failed. Sep 29 08:05:07 so you shall log at the req on success Sep 29 08:05:28 you can not just put the code in the request unless you write onSuccess Sep 29 08:06:36 i give you an example Sep 29 08:08:24 Or just google it if you don't understand Sep 29 08:08:28 but try to read Sep 29 08:26:35 hotdp, http://webos.pastebin.com/H7W2VDGd Sep 29 08:26:38 Still doesn't work. Sep 29 08:26:43 But no error. Sep 29 08:26:46 Just does nothng. Sep 29 08:35:32 is there any 'better' book than the Palm WebOS by o'reilly one might want to get for programming the Pre+? thanks. Sep 29 08:40:18 solix Sep 29 08:40:24 yesim? Sep 29 08:40:28 The web :) Sep 29 08:40:36 don't know any other books Sep 29 08:40:44 doh. haha... in print would be nice, or even ebook/pdf... for mobile :) Sep 29 08:40:46 But there are differennt Sep 29 08:41:03 yea, figured, but would like to get a heads up, before dishing out 50$usd. :) Sep 29 08:41:20 i understand. sorry i can't help.. Sep 29 08:41:50 meh. hehe, thats fine.. will google till i come across some more.. Thanks for the effort. :) Sep 29 08:44:19 Are there book reviews`? Sep 29 08:45:07 yeah... pretty bad for teh o'reailly one (listed above).... out of date info and pre-release info not accurate.. etc.. Sep 29 08:45:31 amazon has it, at 1 star. :/ Sep 29 08:45:59 eesh Sep 29 08:46:05 don't take that one Sep 29 08:46:11 nope. Sep 29 08:46:14 i know another one.. can't remember the name... Sep 29 08:46:58 well if you membe rit, im on/off here all the time, so lmk if you do :) thanks Sep 29 09:08:18 kinda crazy that the people/sales at the verizon store said 'they were unable' to 'demonstrate' the palmpre's because of the 'need to be activated'.... guess they never bothered to look @rwhitby patch in webos-internals.. shame really. would have probablysold a LOT better. Sep 29 09:08:44 er, not better, read: more. :) Sep 29 09:09:27 bbl Sep 29 09:09:32 they couldn't even convince the phone manufacturer to give them slightly modified demo units to improve sales? o_O Sep 29 09:16:42 sounds crappy Sep 29 09:16:48 palm has a tool to bypass activation for dev devices on their web site Sep 29 09:17:03 (you can't access app catalog afterwards, but it would work for demoing) Sep 29 09:17:33 hmm Sep 29 09:17:49 I have never heard a happy story from sales persons in USA Sep 29 09:17:58 When talking palm pre Sep 29 09:22:21 girl next to me on the bus today had a pre Sep 29 09:22:23 made me smile inside Sep 29 09:27:29 :) Sep 29 11:33:33 fhgfh Sep 29 12:23:23 morning everyone Sep 29 12:41:06 sugardave awake yet? Sep 29 12:43:00 don't think he is:D Sep 29 12:43:10 slacker Sep 29 13:17:35 slacker Sep 29 13:18:22 BMyers: are you just calling sugardave a slacker until he shows up? Sep 29 13:20:07 it usually works.. Sep 29 13:20:11 :) Sep 29 13:21:31 slacker Sep 29 13:22:45 haha Sep 29 14:06:08 I'm up now Sep 29 14:06:11 BMyers: what's up? Sep 29 14:09:54 now it's time to call BMyers a slacker Sep 29 14:10:08 no doubt Sep 29 14:13:58 haha Sep 29 14:14:23 bbl Sep 29 14:15:55 for sure Sep 29 14:45:09 re Sep 29 14:48:39 hi Sep 29 14:49:29 the sandbox only applied for PDK apps when started from app launcher? Sep 29 14:49:52 I mean, when started directly from a console, the sdandbox isn't there, right? Sep 29 15:25:13 rehi Sep 29 15:25:21 hi Sep 29 15:25:25 hey Sep 29 15:41:08 hi all question .. im trying to send an incoming sms to my emulator but for some reason it isn't working Sep 29 15:41:10 any ideas ? Sep 29 15:41:25 Is this the right way to read the value of a TextField? var value = this.controller.get('weightField').value; Sep 29 15:41:48 It's complaining about "get" being undefined. So I suspect that although that is correct, I am missing something else during setup Sep 29 15:45:05 this.controller.get("weightField").mojo.getValue(); Sep 29 15:45:21 Is it Ares or? Sep 29 15:50:45 not Ares Sep 29 15:51:36 hotdp: since "get" is undefined, I'm not going to make it to the end of that statement Sep 29 15:52:16 Paste bin your code Sep 29 15:54:35 hotdp: http://pastebin.com/nqkg3DS8 Sep 29 15:55:21 hotdp: It seems to me that this.controller is out of scope in my button handler: [20100929-09:38:10.342982] error: Uncaught TypeError: Cannot call method 'get' o Sep 29 15:55:21 f undefined, app/assistants/DataEntry-assistant.js:42 Sep 29 15:56:03 you need to .bind(this) Sep 29 15:56:17 in your listen... Sep 29 15:56:27 is it common to use text-fields without a button to "save" them? Sep 29 15:56:33 I know you don't need to Sep 29 15:56:49 but I'm wondering about usability Sep 29 15:56:51 I guess Sep 29 15:56:54 this.saveButtonTapped.bind(this) Sep 29 15:57:26 summatusmentis: you can save on every keypress if you want Sep 29 15:57:51 or whan the textfield loses focus Sep 29 15:57:58 I'm learning (trying to learn) webOS with a colleague who was supposed to do the GUI Sep 29 15:58:13 haeffb_pre: is that really inefficient? Sep 29 15:58:20 I'd rather be writing command line code Sep 29 15:58:44 So this is a quick and very dirty UI that I can use to connect the back end stuff Sep 29 15:59:02 is stage-assistant.js where I control the "overall" stage interactions? Sep 29 15:59:10 mfisch: also this.model.value will contain the textFields value in your code Sep 29 15:59:13 or rather, switching between scenes Sep 29 15:59:53 summatusmentis: don't take any UI design ideas from me ;) Sep 29 16:00:14 not really inefficient. depending on what you're doing with the text. Sep 29 16:00:36 just 'somewhat inefficient' Sep 29 16:00:46 haeffb_pre: it's just gonna be saved to a cookie Sep 29 16:00:52 but avoids losing data if user closes app Sep 29 16:01:45 I want a scene to be pushed on open if the user doesn't have cookie info saved, but if they do, it ought to be ignored Sep 29 16:01:50 then you can just grab it in deactivate() since cookies are synchronous Sep 29 16:01:56 haeffb_pre: this.saveButtonTapped.bind(this); in my setup() routine? Sep 29 16:02:18 where you define the listener, yes Sep 29 16:02:21 haeffb_pre: I didn't follow that Sep 29 16:02:27 or better... Sep 29 16:03:20 this.saveButtonTapped = this.saveButtonTapped.bind(this); Sep 29 16:03:37 then your listener call will work as is Sep 29 16:04:01 summatusmentis: which part? Sep 29 16:04:15 haeffb_pre: grab it in deactivate() ? Sep 29 16:04:35 this.saveButtonTapped = this.saveButtonTapped.bindAsEventListener(this); Sep 29 16:04:44 i like the longer one, it sounds better Sep 29 16:06:22 haeffb_pre, sugardave: thanks, it works! Sep 29 16:06:29 Good morning everybody Sep 29 16:06:37 now, why do I have to do this binding? Sep 29 16:06:40 hi Robdor Sep 29 16:06:59 mfisch: well, that's a great question...the answer to which I still don't know Sep 29 16:07:36 it's binding the listener to the object right? Sep 29 16:07:45 I just know that sometimes you have to bind...you want to do it for listeners so that you can reference the same bound object (function) when you stop listening on it Sep 29 16:07:53 otherwise, you will start leaking Sep 29 16:07:58 essentially telling the listenenr which thing to listen to? Sep 29 16:08:38 summatusmentis: I'm not sure if that's correct. let's say I have SomeAssistant.prototype.listTap = function(event) {...} Sep 29 16:08:47 I thought all this stuff was in the same "class"? Sep 29 16:08:54 hence all the "this" all over the place Sep 29 16:09:01 now when I set up a listen, I could do it like this: Sep 29 16:09:35 Mojo.Event.listen(this.controller.get(listId), Mojo.Event.listTap, this.listTap()); Sep 29 16:10:26 but, I could NOT stop listening on that, since stopListening looks for the same object you pass to it: Mojo.Event.stopListening(this.controller.get(listId), Mojo.Event.listTap, this.listTap()); Sep 29 16:10:41 this.listTap() may be the same function, but the running of it is not the same object Sep 29 16:11:05 so, you bind it: this.listTapHandler = this.listTap.bindAsEventListener(this); Sep 29 16:11:36 and now I can use the same object in my listen and stopListening: this.listTapHandler (without the closure or () following it) Sep 29 16:12:26 sugardave: so it seems like in binding, you're providing a reference to the object Sep 29 16:12:33 summatusmentis: yes Sep 29 16:13:00 you are telling the function what 'this' should refer to inside the function itself Sep 29 16:13:13 in this case, it would be the scene assistant Sep 29 16:13:32 so then are you providing a local object that then allows you access to the other object? or is it just a pointe? Sep 29 16:13:35 pointer* Sep 29 16:13:38 scope Sep 29 16:13:42 it's basically a pointer Sep 29 16:13:44 mfisch: if you do not .bind(this), then in saveButtonTapped, 'this' refers to the this.controller.listen function Sep 29 16:14:37 just consider it "magic" and do it for now... Sep 29 16:14:45 summatusmentis: since you did this.var = this.var.bind(this); this.var is now a pointer to the already ran and bound function...so that "object" will remain the same when you use it for listen and stopListening Sep 29 16:14:48 I wish the Palm "building your first app" were more in depth Sep 29 16:14:58 you will gain better understanding later... :) Sep 29 16:15:02 I wish I knew javascript Sep 29 16:15:07 sugardave: right, ok Sep 29 16:15:28 mfisch: as do we all Sep 29 16:15:34 what's javascript? Sep 29 16:15:37 :P Sep 29 16:15:46 sugardave: doing a .bind seems like it acts in a similar way to a function pointer in C Sep 29 16:16:04 summatusmentis: I will take your word for it :D Sep 29 16:16:14 not really, I don't think Sep 29 16:16:37 haeffb_pre: or, at least in the context of passing the bound this.var Sep 29 16:16:45 it's binding the scope of the called function Sep 29 16:17:05 javascript scope is weird Sep 29 16:17:06 to the current 'this' Sep 29 16:17:15 s/scope // Sep 29 16:17:35 lol Sep 29 16:18:01 all you have to know about scope in javascript is that it is function-scope, not block-scope Sep 29 16:18:30 this emulator rocks Sep 29 16:18:35 i know it will be nice to get the real thing Sep 29 16:18:46 Thats what she said eh Sep 29 16:19:39 Sometimes I think that javascript was created on a dare Sep 29 16:19:56 is stage-assistant.js the proper place to be making "on start" decisions about which scene to push? Sep 29 16:20:00 * sugardave has weird sorting requirements for this app. "Events should be listed date descending, but in each of those, untimed events should come before timed ones." Sep 29 16:20:18 summatusmentis: absolutely Sep 29 16:20:31 sugardave: so I can put real logic and things in there? Sep 29 16:20:36 yes you can Sep 29 16:20:54 I do all my cookie/db/startup stuff in the stage assistant Sep 29 16:20:56 mostly Sep 29 16:21:00 this MVC/scene-centric stuff is weird Sep 29 16:21:11 summatusmentis: I didn't even try to learn it like that Sep 29 16:21:55 sugardave: what you working on? Sep 29 16:21:58 sugardave: I'm coming from C/Java world, I don't like having multiple files all over the place :) Sep 29 16:23:02 the structure of large apps is really annoying Sep 29 16:23:23 like MojoMatters, I have to filter through a list of 300 directories to match the JS with the HTML Sep 29 16:23:29 but I suppose that most apps are much smaller Sep 29 16:23:57 at some point, I need to figure out how to switch between scenes Sep 29 16:24:45 this.controller.stageController.pushScene('myScene')m Sep 29 16:25:04 from a scene assistant. Sep 29 16:25:33 this.controller.pushScene(...); from stage assistant Sep 29 16:26:06 or swapScene(...) if you don't want to leave the existing scene on the stack Sep 29 16:26:26 I.e. go back to it with a back gesture Sep 29 16:27:39 push adds another scene to the stack, swap replaces the current scene with a new one Sep 29 16:27:46 oh, interesting Sep 29 16:27:53 is there a popScene? Sep 29 16:29:01 Hello Everyone Sep 29 16:29:46 hido Sep 29 16:30:28 man hotels near the Dev Day location are ~350 a night Sep 29 16:30:33 no way in hell Sep 29 16:30:44 need to find a cheap motel and take the subway Sep 29 16:30:47 you can sleep in my living room for 250 Sep 29 16:30:55 yes popScene() Sep 29 16:31:08 haeffb_pre: ok, so it does work like a stack Sep 29 16:31:09 but you would need to take a plane to go to the conference :p Sep 29 16:31:09 does that include breakfast? Sep 29 16:31:14 well, yes Sep 29 16:31:21 but I live in Germany :D Sep 29 16:31:40 * haeffb_pre will prob skip dev day. again. Sep 29 16:31:55 cost prohibitive to go to NYC Sep 29 16:31:57 haeffb_pre: a simple journal type app for a client Sep 29 16:32:55 what kills me is that untimed events are ordered properly for me, but not for him...I'm starting to wonder if it's a localization issue Sep 29 16:33:03 he's somewhere in Europe Sep 29 16:33:26 sounds like Sep 29 16:33:36 what do you sort them like? Sep 29 16:34:08 bbl Sep 29 16:34:16 Hello chuqui Sep 29 16:34:34 You don't have any tickets availible for JAOO 2010 right? Sep 29 16:35:06 MetaView: poorly, apparently...I'm about to re-do my sorting alogrithm, I think I took a couple of shortcuts in this last one Sep 29 16:35:53 sugardave: js sort or sqlite sort? Sep 29 16:35:54 hotdp: hey! Sep 29 16:36:27 sqlite order by desc, then go through some js sorting Sep 29 16:36:28 js sort Sep 29 16:36:31 They arent letting us rsvp yet are they? Sep 29 16:37:52 * haeffb_pre found that js sort would not maintain the original order from sqlite Sep 29 16:38:54 that is correct...I re-sort again in js because I have to handle the whole untimed vs. timed thing and of course I am "making sure" the date order is how I want it there, too Sep 29 16:39:16 it's mostly working, but I find that mine lists untimed first, then the rest in whatever damn order it wants Sep 29 16:39:18 CTLAdvance: rsvp? Sep 29 16:39:44 well rsvp or register for dev day on nov 20th Sep 29 16:40:22 my sorting stuff is all kinds of messed up Sep 29 16:40:53 including a .reverse() trhrown in for good measure Sep 29 16:41:19 chuqui would be nice, its not often Palm people visit my country :D Sep 29 16:42:16 hotdp: where are you? Sep 29 16:45:13 ahhh, but it's in NYC, right? :/ Sep 29 16:45:22 I should have my new app completed by then... Sep 29 16:45:22 yes Sep 29 16:46:32 chuqui - are you taking early registrations for dev day Sep 29 16:47:11 CTLAdvance: no, I'm not... sorry Sep 29 16:47:29 I figured as much but thought I would ask Sep 29 16:50:04 what if we gave you a puppy? Sep 29 16:51:04 haeffb_pre - he would need a rare bird... Sep 29 16:51:30 * CTLAdvance calls his bird transporter in brazil Sep 29 17:08:53 so I think this pre's internet just broke too Sep 29 17:09:08 hope the sprint store up here's cool about replacements Sep 29 17:09:14 is there anything special I need to do for a cookie? or just make one, and use it? Sep 29 17:12:24 make on, use it :D Sep 29 17:12:38 kk Sep 29 17:12:50 are the pre pluses more durable Sep 29 17:13:02 the sample is showing a model for the cookies, etc. Sep 29 17:13:10 that part doesn't make any sense to me Sep 29 17:13:27 torchie Plus should be better yes, the slider should be different Sep 29 17:13:53 what sample? Sep 29 17:19:23 haeffb_pre: samples/Data Sep 29 17:20:35 oh. haven't looked at that. Sep 29 17:21:09 there might be some cookie info on http://www.webos101.com Sep 29 17:31:07 haeffb_pre: thanks Sep 29 17:32:32 guys Sep 29 17:32:35 if i have to calls going Sep 29 17:32:37 how do i swap Sep 29 17:32:39 merge etc .. Sep 29 17:33:01 im in a conferene call Sep 29 17:33:37 can i split them Sep 29 17:40:19 anyone ? Sep 29 17:40:21 no Sep 29 17:40:27 swap Sep 29 17:41:29 i can only end all calls Sep 29 17:47:32 what Sep 29 17:47:38 you can only do a swap when you get an incoming call ? Sep 29 17:47:42 what if you add a call ? Sep 29 17:50:24 anyone awake ? Sep 29 17:51:04 okay, about to give up on an elegant solution for this odd sorting...going to construct date, hour and minute vars for every damn thing and compare them that way Sep 29 17:51:39 i have to end call calls Sep 29 17:52:43 btw, for new devs, Mojo Matters and Style Matters are pretty daunting advanced applications themselves....it's hard to glean some things from them Sep 29 17:56:49 hehehe Sep 29 17:57:04 chuqui i have send you an pm Sep 29 17:59:03 hotdp: okay. Sep 29 18:02:59 Hi ho Sep 29 18:03:50 anyone read my nagging n00b questions ? Sep 29 18:04:53 Yep, and don't know. Never done conference my self. Sep 29 18:05:15 what's the best way to push a scene after a button push? Sep 29 18:05:54 or rather, in the button listener, I've got this.controller.pushScene and it's generating errors Sep 29 18:06:09 summatusmentis: what errors? Sep 29 18:06:40 try this.stageController Sep 29 18:07:12 umm.. Sep 29 18:07:17 what is #palm for if they are all dead Sep 29 18:07:27 is this where everyone ask n00b questions + dev questions ? Sep 29 18:07:38 I guess so Sep 29 18:07:50 we talk about other stuff too Sep 29 18:08:02 with this.stageController I get: "error: Uncaught TypeError: Cannot call method 'pushScene' of undefined, app/assistants/addAccount-assistant.js:36" Sep 29 18:08:03 like the mythical woman creature no one has seen Sep 29 18:08:13 im thinking of getting a palm pre and on emulator trying to use it Sep 29 18:08:17 what, kense? Sep 29 18:08:19 i really would like it but trying to figure it out Sep 29 18:08:25 summatusmentis: yea, try with this.stageController Sep 29 18:08:28 gahg Sep 29 18:08:38 summatusmentis: sorry didn't read well enough your msg Sep 29 18:09:07 summatusmentis: did you bind your callback? Sep 29 18:09:12 hmm.. Sep 29 18:09:15 it's acting like where I'm calling it from doesn't know about the scene I'm trying to push Sep 29 18:09:28 Mojo.Event.listen(this.controller.get("addButton"), Mojo.Event.tap, this.handleButtonPress.bind(this)); Sep 29 18:09:41 and handleButtonPress is trying to push a scene Sep 29 18:10:06 so, yes Sep 29 18:10:22 try listen("addButton",.. Sep 29 18:10:51 that sucks Sep 29 18:10:55 teemu: wait, what? Sep 29 18:10:56 you have to end all calls and not just 1 Sep 29 18:11:41 teemu: that doesn't make any sense to me, "addButton" is named in a different file Sep 29 18:11:51 summatusmentis: you have this.controller.get. Trade that to "addButton" Sep 29 18:12:09 does that work? Sep 29 18:12:21 Is it the ID of the button you press? Sep 29 18:12:57 yes Sep 29 18:13:16 Then try that Sep 29 18:13:40 that didn't change any behavior, but now I get: "error: Error: Object addButton has no method 'addEventListener', line undefined, file undefined" Sep 29 18:15:09 Ok, keep that "addButton" there and change Mojo.Event.listen to this.controller.listen, in case that makes any difference Sep 29 18:15:48 Then it's 1:1 with mine. If that fails then there's something else Sep 29 18:16:10 that's failing Sep 29 18:16:34 but now I'm getting the "Uncaught TypeError: Cannot call method 'pushScene' of undefined, app/assistants/addAccount-assistant.js:36" error Sep 29 18:17:08 Care to pastebin some code? Sep 29 18:17:28 not at all, what do you want? Sep 29 18:18:22 I can give you the whole *-assistant.js Sep 29 18:18:33 It's up to you really Sep 29 18:18:41 More is better Sep 29 18:18:43 well, what is it you're looking for? Sep 29 18:19:07 setup and event methods Sep 29 18:19:30 http://pastebin.com/cYdxNWie Sep 29 18:19:35 that's the whole .js file Sep 29 18:20:18 this.controller.stageController.pushScene(...); Sep 29 18:20:32 yes Sep 29 18:20:50 sorry for not missing that earlier Sep 29 18:20:56 for not missing? Sep 29 18:20:57 plz Sep 29 18:21:01 oh Sep 29 18:21:06 thanks :) Sep 29 18:21:09 * teemu rolls eyes Sep 29 18:21:24 pushScene is a method of stageController Sep 29 18:21:33 Indeed it is. Sep 29 18:21:50 Didn't catch that earlier and here we are.. Sep 29 18:22:06 right, I didn't realize that stageController was a object within this.controller Sep 29 18:22:18 what a ride, eh? Sep 29 18:22:33 I've been working now for over 12h Sep 29 18:22:37 it's a prooerty of the sceneController Sep 29 18:22:45 property Sep 29 18:23:21 in scene assistant, this.controlller is a sceneController Sep 29 18:23:32 oh Sep 29 18:23:37 I wish palm docs were more complete Sep 29 18:23:45 in stage assistant, this.controller is... Sep 29 18:24:00 ...wait for it... Sep 29 18:24:10 summatusmentis: webos101.com Sep 29 18:24:13 ...a stageController Sep 29 18:24:20 dohtem: I've been looking there somewhat too Sep 29 18:25:04 101 is not complete either. but at least the examples generally work Sep 29 18:25:14 unlike Palms docs Sep 29 18:25:21 haeffb_pre: that thing you said earlier about saving textField upon losing focus, where do I find that? Sep 29 18:25:24 (sorry chuqui) Sep 29 18:25:40 sorry? Sep 29 18:25:48 sorry Sep 29 18:26:20 summatusmentis: that's more a philosophical question than something you can find Sep 29 18:26:34 chuqui: for ragging on Palms docs Sep 29 18:26:47 the truth is the truth... Sep 29 18:27:07 true Sep 29 18:27:11 we know it needs improvement. and we're working on it... you'll see the results down the road.... Sep 29 18:28:11 haeffb_pre: I mean, sure, "when do I notify to save" is, I'm looking for the technical stuff about how to modify when a textField notifies Sep 29 18:29:17 oh. look at the attributes for TextField widget Sep 29 18:29:32 changeOnKeypress or similar Sep 29 18:30:00 and then listen for the... propertyChange event ? Sep 29 18:30:26 hey guys Sep 29 18:30:38 chuqui: at the same time that I get my new phone? Sep 29 18:30:39 codeslaw, good luck =) Sep 29 18:30:44 right, it's the propertyChange event Sep 29 18:30:44 drat. Sep 29 18:31:04 haeffb_pre, you are getting a new phone? Sep 29 18:31:07 but when it fires depends on that attribute Sep 29 18:31:32 and maybe requiresEnterKey ? Sep 29 18:31:47 Nyceane: I sure hope so. Sep 29 18:32:42 haeffb_pre, how do you get a new phone? I want a new phone too =| Sep 29 18:32:52 I want a pre instead of using my droid Sep 29 18:33:07 =( Sep 29 18:33:13 lol Sep 29 18:33:52 I buy one Sep 29 18:34:16 sometimes, I buy two Sep 29 18:35:18 when i had my droid, there was no pre on verizon Sep 29 18:35:29 and now i have to wait for another year =( Sep 29 18:35:49 I just hope that when the next palm phone comes out, it's durable kit and I can afford it Sep 29 18:37:19 well, if i win this contest, i'll get myself next palm phone Sep 29 18:37:20 lol Sep 29 18:37:24 =D Sep 29 18:37:35 or go to palm event to get a free phone from them =D Sep 29 18:38:10 "You get a phone, you get a phone! EVERYBODY GETS A PHONE!!!" Sep 29 18:38:41 there was a sprint van at the middle of the school today Sep 29 18:38:53 they had 4g androids -- epic has nice graphics performance Sep 29 18:39:04 thing was hella smoother than evo Sep 29 18:39:51 but there is a problem, it does not run WebOS =D Sep 29 18:40:01 I almost became a Android Advocate lol Sep 29 18:40:05 yeah that's the big problem Sep 29 18:40:09 almost... Sep 29 18:40:13 android advocate heh Sep 29 18:40:28 then I found out that was a full time staff =| Sep 29 18:40:38 then I wasn't interested as much anymore Sep 29 18:41:04 advocation of task killers and fragmentation Sep 29 18:41:36 just like microsoft evanglist Sep 29 18:41:46 i didnt participate enough in the community to become one Sep 29 18:42:03 that's just a lot of time and dedication that I don't have =| Sep 29 18:42:15 this is only palm channel active in like 3 networks Sep 29 18:42:33 palm will do fine =) Sep 29 18:42:42 with hp as a hardware company, palm will be the next apple Sep 29 18:43:09 WebOS will be the kernal of all HP Printers Sep 29 18:43:41 can you get sdk on emulator ? Sep 29 18:43:44 err Sep 29 18:43:45 sorry Sep 29 18:43:49 can you get preware on emulator Sep 29 18:44:29 i dont know =| Sep 29 18:44:45 all i have been doing is making apps, i havn't been playing with hardware yet because I dont have one =| Sep 29 18:45:02 wow Sep 29 18:45:07 make apps and don't have a pre Sep 29 18:45:10 you have sdk though right Sep 29 18:45:11 same thing Sep 29 18:45:12 lol Sep 29 18:45:21 just not the gratification in your hands Sep 29 18:45:31 yah, there are some problems Sep 29 18:45:35 such as using pdk Sep 29 18:45:44 so i can only make crappy apps on pdk due to the fact i can't test Sep 29 18:46:46 hmm Sep 29 18:46:56 so i looked on webos-internals and it hink i installed pre-ware from command line Sep 29 18:46:57 * macman_ looks Sep 29 18:47:06 oo nice Sep 29 18:47:07 i have preware Sep 29 18:47:12 Nyceane: people on the forums claim they have gotten cheap used Sprint Pres on ebay for testing (~$40). Mught be worth looking into Sep 29 18:47:33 dohtem, i'll probably do that too Sep 29 19:05:50 what are some good apps ? Sep 29 19:09:17 macman_: What kind of apps are you looking for? Sep 29 19:10:45 dunno Sep 29 19:10:53 one is good: Mandel :D Sep 29 19:10:55 on my android iw as looking for multitasking aspp Sep 29 19:10:58 i don't need it Sep 29 19:11:01 palm does it automatic Sep 29 19:11:02 lol Sep 29 19:11:04 but i guess nayone has a different opinion Sep 29 19:11:52 im thinking Sep 29 19:11:55 like seriously Sep 29 19:12:01 on my android .. if it wasn't there i had to download it Sep 29 19:12:04 im trying to figure out what i want Sep 29 19:12:17 oh Sep 29 19:12:23 Yeah, oppinions will differ. I would say Plasma Cannon is must get. :) Sep 29 19:12:23 there an app that can add to the phone option Sep 29 19:12:36 i read on sprint pdf and on website that the only time you can swap a call is if you get an incoming call Sep 29 19:12:45 i placed to calls and i couldn't swap i could only merge Sep 29 19:12:52 also Sep 29 19:13:00 say im in a confrence .. how do i split the call Sep 29 19:15:32 wget http://bit.ly/preware-bootstrap Sep 29 19:15:35 oops Sep 29 19:15:39 On some phone networks, you can swap between calls only if the second call is incoming. Check with your wireless service provider for details Sep 29 19:19:12 yea weird Sep 29 19:19:18 i can only do a swap on an incoming call Sep 29 19:31:31 can you replace the pres launcher ? Sep 29 19:32:55 you could, the source is accessable, but no one did yet Sep 29 19:33:04 aw Sep 29 19:33:09 but it's highly configurable thx to homebrew patches Sep 29 19:33:10 so there are no apps or roms or whatever out there ? Sep 29 19:33:24 no apps? Sep 29 19:33:36 yea an app to replace the launcher Sep 29 19:33:53 not that I know, why would one? Sep 29 19:34:06 dunno Sep 29 19:34:09 just asking Sep 29 19:34:13 remember im coming from android Sep 29 19:34:14 lol Sep 29 19:34:17 the launcher is ok, if you miss something there is a patch for almost everything Sep 29 19:34:50 hmm Sep 29 19:34:54 where do i find the patch ? Sep 29 19:35:22 look at precentral.net there is a section: homebrew, patchs are part of it Sep 29 19:35:44 usually you can find them in an alternative appcat, called preware Sep 29 19:37:13 macman_: my experience is I don't need apps to modify phones behavior (launcher, multitask, etc) because webOS just works Sep 29 19:37:24 yea Sep 29 19:37:26 im seeing that Sep 29 19:37:27 :P Sep 29 19:37:39 my apps are things kike twitter, todo list, notes, etc Sep 29 19:37:43 like Sep 29 19:37:53 facebook app is good Sep 29 19:38:39 * macman_ dowlnoads it Sep 29 19:39:05 I use a stopwatch/timer app since my oven timer is broken Sep 29 19:39:09 this preware is simple compared to market Sep 29 19:39:12 well loads very fast Sep 29 19:39:20 preware is awesome Sep 29 19:39:25 and, of course Done! and Noted! Sep 29 19:39:34 im clilcking install on facebook Sep 29 19:39:36 and Myles Sep 29 19:39:37 its just sitting there Sep 29 19:40:00 facebook is in app catalog Sep 29 19:40:18 im on preware Sep 29 19:40:22 * macman_ is on emulatore Sep 29 19:40:26 emulator* Sep 29 19:41:41 facebook (Beta client) Sep 29 19:41:45 does tha tmke a diff ? Sep 29 19:41:59 preware will open the appcat to download it Sep 29 19:42:01 s/tha t/that Sep 29 19:42:08 yea just sitting Sep 29 19:42:11 should i reboot ? Sep 29 19:42:11 and since emu no likes appcat... Sep 29 19:42:16 aw Sep 29 19:42:23 there an ipk for it ? Sep 29 19:42:36 nope Sep 29 19:42:40 ok emu means no facebook Sep 29 19:45:07 well, trust me, it's good... :) Sep 29 19:50:55 this multitasking is flawless Sep 29 19:50:58 wow Sep 29 19:51:39 even on a friggin emulator Sep 29 19:52:40 webOS 2.0? Sep 29 19:52:59 to be fair, your emu probably has a slightly faster processor than the real thing... Sep 29 19:53:20 What is the proper way to share data between scenes? I have a list of objects that is backed by a Depot that I need to have as "global" and I'd like to set this up the correct way. I'm at a loss now on how to even google for this... Sep 29 19:54:26 you coudl use it as global var Sep 29 20:00:11 mfisch: you have a couple of options. One way to pass data between scenes is on push....you add arguments to the next scene's constructor and inside that construcutor do something like this.arg = arg; And now arg is a property of that scene controller Sep 29 20:00:37 or you put in the stage-controller Sep 29 20:00:42 on scene pop, you can pass an object to popScene and it will be available in the previous scene's activate method Sep 29 20:01:09 or you can rub some dirt on it Sep 29 20:01:16 MetaView's suggestion results in what you're talking about, I think..."global" objects Sep 29 20:01:22 wait, wrong question... Sep 29 20:02:13 you could also put everything in a separate .js file and include it in sources.json Sep 29 20:06:42 mfisch: in stage-assistant, outside of any function Sep 29 20:07:17 var Glob = {}; Sep 29 20:07:38 Glob.var1 = 'something' Sep 29 20:07:58 Glob.var2 = 10; Sep 29 20:08:33 you can then access Glob anywhere in the app (assuming single-stage) Sep 29 20:19:27 lol Sep 29 20:19:33 do most people in here have just the sdk ? Sep 29 20:20:18 * mfisch thinks that the Stage assistant global idea is the best one Sep 29 20:21:38 does the same logic apply for global methods? Sep 29 20:21:47 LoadDataFromDepot() StoreToDepot() Sep 29 20:22:57 * mfisch suspects that this is a javascript question at heart Sep 29 20:26:21 yes it does Sep 29 20:27:40 there's an example on 101 for using Depot to store app prefs that may be helpful Sep 29 20:28:54 We really need a remove all patches option in preware Sep 29 20:29:15 CTLAdvance: isn't that what emergency patch removal does? Sep 29 20:29:25 hmm Sep 29 20:29:33 * sugardave has only ever put 3 patches on his phone. Sep 29 20:29:40 so I'm no expert Sep 29 20:30:27 hmm Sep 29 20:30:31 ill have to look Sep 29 20:31:51 * CTLAdvance is impressed by the harware of the evo and the epic 4g Sep 29 20:35:00 there a factory reset on pre ? Sep 29 20:36:57 the webOS doctor will basically do that for you Sep 29 20:37:08 reinstalls the phone OS Sep 29 20:37:23 they are per carrier Sep 29 20:38:59 hrm Sep 29 20:39:01 hi. :) Sep 29 20:40:37 webos doctor ? Sep 29 20:40:39 that for me ? Sep 29 20:40:43 and can i run it on the emulator ? Sep 29 20:45:13 question Sep 29 20:45:19 i have an ipk right and i want to put it on emulator Sep 29 20:45:29 how do i get it there ? i can't just do palm-install correct ? Sep 29 20:45:42 yes Sep 29 20:45:54 you can Sep 29 20:46:10 palm-install -d tcp com.vendor.app Sep 29 20:48:33 no need for -d tcp option if the emulator is running and no other palm devices are plugged in Sep 29 20:48:47 less keystrokes :) Sep 29 20:49:51 he needs those keystrokes Sep 29 20:49:56 his fingers are weak and limp Sep 29 20:50:06 they need strengthening and discipline Sep 29 20:50:59 yes yoda Sep 29 20:51:25 thanks Sep 29 20:52:05 I think you want palm-install filename.ipk Sep 29 20:52:19 palm-launch takes the appid tho Sep 29 20:52:48 mmmm, he's right Sep 29 20:57:19 do i remove apps same way Sep 29 20:58:01 I'm getting this "warning: The scene assistant 'WelcomeAssistant' is not defined. Did you remember to include it in sources.json?" but I see it here in my sources.json, clear as day. what gives? Sep 29 20:58:28 palm-install -r com.mystuff.hello Sep 29 21:03:57 dohtem: probably a typo in your assistant.js Sep 29 21:04:30 Sprint just called to ask if I want to upgrade phones Sep 29 21:04:47 told him i'm waiting on new Palm phone Sep 29 21:04:55 did he laugh? Sep 29 21:04:58 j/k Sep 29 21:05:00 :) Sep 29 21:05:25 he said he got a long list of people to call back Sep 29 21:05:40 when a new Palm phone comes out Sep 29 21:05:56 but didn't know when Sep 29 21:06:13 dohtem: you use eclipse? Sep 29 21:06:35 yeah... but lately I have been working in Notepad++ Sep 29 21:06:40 why do you ask? Sep 29 21:06:51 wierd Sep 29 21:06:55 anyone use ipk fetcher ? Sep 29 21:07:15 aptana has a validator that is easentially jslint Sep 29 21:07:25 ess Sep 29 21:07:36 and finds those typos Sep 29 21:07:37 jslint hurt my feelings so i dont use it anymore Sep 29 21:07:39 for me Sep 29 21:07:59 lol BMyers Sep 29 21:07:59 folks! Folks! Sep 29 21:08:03 keep it down in here! Sep 29 21:08:14 *we're being watched* Sep 29 21:08:32 by the mighty overlords :^D Sep 29 21:08:48 funny enough, yesterday I ran some of my code through JSLint and so far so good. Just some "dont mix tabs and spaces" errors Sep 29 21:08:54 oops Sep 29 21:09:35 jslint said these pants make me look fat. i was really offended Sep 29 21:09:50 it also told me to lay off the donuts Sep 29 21:10:21 how does one get aptana to recognize such things as -webkit css properties and the canvas tag? Sep 29 21:10:46 codeslaw Sep 29 21:10:48 =( Sep 29 21:10:58 ? Sep 29 21:10:59 what can we do to bump your app? Sep 29 21:11:02 oh Sep 29 21:11:03 nothing Sep 29 21:11:25 is there a qr code app scanner for webos? Sep 29 21:11:30 no Sep 29 21:11:37 no macro camera Sep 29 21:11:45 can't "scan" anyway, could only take a picture and then load into app Sep 29 21:11:47 = cumbersome Sep 29 21:11:54 hopefully you'll get back up there by tomorrow Sep 29 21:11:59 camera data api would be nice Sep 29 21:12:04 didnt think so Sep 29 21:12:13 BMyers: it's not the pants. Sep 29 21:12:25 i hate jslint and you Sep 29 21:12:28 Nyceane: not likely, i have no momentum. dropped 7 spots in a week Sep 29 21:12:43 codeslaw: which app is this? Sep 29 21:12:47 songwave Sep 29 21:12:52 songwave Sep 29 21:13:17 the only good app beside angry bird in $10,000 range Sep 29 21:13:19 does your songwave app fart? Sep 29 21:13:28 or have boobs in it? Sep 29 21:13:40 angry bird will probably get the $50,000 range by tomorrow Sep 29 21:14:06 there are 6,000 difference between dog whistle and darth vader,those are mine Sep 29 21:14:09 or fart boobs? Sep 29 21:14:27 hybrib app Sep 29 21:14:29 motorboat? Sep 29 21:14:41 songwave doesn't far, but you could draw some 8bit boobs on the interface if you want Sep 29 21:14:44 fart* Sep 29 21:14:58 codeslaw, make an update and you might just make it Sep 29 21:14:59 = Sep 29 21:15:00 =D Sep 29 21:15:07 i did update man, but it's not going to happen Sep 29 21:15:08 sorry, if it's not electronic arts, and doesnt fart your chances are slim Sep 29 21:15:28 my app made it into the catalog yesterday Sep 29 21:15:38 we've got 2k plus downloads, it's in the fastest moovers Sep 29 21:15:42 but it isn't going to make it Sep 29 21:15:44 sigh Sep 29 21:16:02 i'm just saying Sep 29 21:16:13 i just hope they don't do another contest Sep 29 21:16:13 those don't have much chances anymore alexfner =| Sep 29 21:16:26 codeslaw, I think they'll do another one lol Sep 29 21:16:28 Nyceane: hmm? Sep 29 21:16:38 alexfner, competition ends tomorrow Sep 29 21:16:40 tablet app contest Sep 29 21:16:48 aka Sep 29 21:16:50 yeah Sep 29 21:16:58 not if they are smart. they are paying 10s of thousands of dollars for people to make, no offense, dog whistles and fart bombs Sep 29 21:17:13 who can make the most fart apps in a 5x7" format Sep 29 21:17:15 and then shitloads of money to EA games and gameloft - companies who don't give a crap about webos Sep 29 21:17:32 quantity over quality is a terrible, terrible idea for a contest Sep 29 21:17:42 codeslaw , just say how u feel. dont bottle it up inside Sep 29 21:17:54 that is how a feel Sep 29 21:18:30 http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/news/item/12139_Nokias_Ten_Million_Dollar_Deve.php Sep 29 21:18:53 the contest just conflicts with my natural inclination to try and put out a solid product Sep 29 21:19:07 is nokia a good platform for fart apps too? Sep 29 21:19:14 especially because a paid app, in the current state of the catalog, has no real chance of breaking 10k anytime soon Sep 29 21:19:46 codeslaw not when u can dl farts for free Sep 29 21:19:52 i actually met the guy at TED Sep 29 21:20:26 http://www.callingallinnovators.com/10M/judging_and_awards.aspx Sep 29 21:20:36 this is smart, people who gets top downloads only get a free phone Sep 29 21:20:58 then judges decides which one gets the cash prize Sep 29 21:21:14 much better Sep 29 21:21:19 i'm gonna look into that Sep 29 21:21:22 http://www.callingallinnovators.com/10M/faq.aspx Sep 29 21:21:31 what does "(1 grand prize = $1.9 Million marketing value" Sep 29 21:21:34 mean? Sep 29 21:21:35 first line of FAQ, "What do you mean by “High Quality” Apps ?" Sep 29 21:21:39 lol Sep 29 21:21:44 I like that Sep 29 21:22:29 Robdor: Hey, I've got a question for you. The sides of the phone, in my game Fling! are completely inelastic, seemingly Sep 29 21:22:30 they require fart noises to be hi-fidelity ? Sep 29 21:22:32 any thoughts? Sep 29 21:22:36 what platform are nokia apps built on Sep 29 21:22:48 they're made with lines in the physics engine Sep 29 21:22:48 just because its a freaking nokia phone, i dont even want to make a crappy app for a free phone Sep 29 21:23:06 i dont even have use for that free phone =| Sep 29 21:23:34 living large man.. free phone, free fart/boob apps.. what could be better but camillionare pimp'n your ride.. Sep 29 21:24:00 lol Sep 29 21:24:17 $10,000 is very hard to resist, i already started to spend that money again =| Sep 29 21:24:19 not very smart... Sep 29 21:24:20 why not a "Creative" category in that contest... music making apps, art apps, all i make are creation-oriented apps and nobody considers it a category Sep 29 21:24:26 wait, what?!?! Sep 29 21:24:27 http://news.cnet.com/8301-31021_3-20005315-260.html Sep 29 21:24:40 how did i miss that?! Sep 29 21:24:51 waiting for cnet to load its ads... Sep 29 21:24:53 um yeah.. Sep 29 21:24:59 that's old news man Sep 29 21:25:04 hp makes alot of prts Sep 29 21:25:25 imagine if your printer had boob-du-jour and could fart? Sep 29 21:25:29 alexfner: Are you setting the elastic_iterations when setting up the space? Sep 29 21:25:31 Mousey....well you must have.... er not sure how you missed it Sep 29 21:25:41 yes Sep 29 21:25:49 Hmmm, what is it set to? Sep 29 21:25:52 the balls are elastic Sep 29 21:25:55 the sides just aren't Sep 29 21:25:57 10? Sep 29 21:26:01 mmm now if I can make my fart app for a printer that prints the note of the fart it just played Sep 29 21:26:18 no health? wtf Sep 29 21:26:19 What elasticity did you set for the sides? Sep 29 21:28:37 Robdor, I have a lot of apps with web services ready Sep 29 21:28:46 all I need to do is creating interface, since server is doing all the logic Sep 29 21:28:47 anyone know what platform the nokia N8 runs on? Sep 29 21:29:02 codeslaw, linux Sep 29 21:29:09 development platforum, not OS Sep 29 21:29:21 I think its symbian Sep 29 21:29:45 no Sep 29 21:29:49 wait Sep 29 21:29:51 n8? Sep 29 21:30:02 n800 and n810 are on maemo which is a debian derivative Sep 29 21:30:15 i donno what an n8 is Sep 29 21:30:22 n8 is the lastest nokia device Sep 29 21:30:27 that isn't out yet or something Sep 29 21:30:28 i dont know Sep 29 21:30:48 "Employs advanced hardware and O/S level native APIs" Sep 29 21:30:55 this is hard when we dont have a device on hand to test... Sep 29 21:30:56 any commanly used 3rd party apps you guys use on a normal basis .. im writing a list Sep 29 21:31:00 esp with camera Sep 29 21:31:11 "Visually attractive, easy to use UI based on Symbian^3 UI guidelines and using Nokia Qt and Web UI design tools" Sep 29 21:31:14 symbian Sep 29 21:31:27 1? Sep 29 21:31:33 I think is set it at 1 Sep 29 21:31:40 oh, it's symban Sep 29 21:31:41 +i Sep 29 21:32:29 alexfner: The elasticity is 1.0f? Sep 29 21:32:51 yeah Sep 29 21:33:04 Weird. What is the friction? Sep 29 21:34:02 1.0f Sep 29 21:34:05 all built on Qt Sep 29 21:34:29 alexfner: Try lowering the friction to 0.3f or something. Maybe that will help. Sep 29 21:43:18 thanks Sep 29 21:43:19 oops Sep 29 21:48:16 Depot should persist across runs of the app, right?? Sep 29 22:07:14 hi Sep 29 22:12:29 hello Sep 29 22:25:05 Which is better or preferred? $("scrimId").show(); OR this.controller.get("scrimId").show(); ? Sep 29 22:31:06 dohtem: I would go with this.controller.get(" Sep 29 22:31:22 it's a scoping issue between scenes mostly Sep 29 22:33:04 $( isnt recommended for multistage apps Sep 29 22:34:53 hmm.. thanks guys Sep 29 22:36:18 doesnt matter if you're never ever ever going to make a multistage app Sep 29 22:36:49 this app wont be multistage but it's something to keep in mind Sep 29 22:38:03 make it a habit Sep 29 22:38:14 just in case Sep 29 22:40:03 if it's not multistage, you might want to consider dropping mojo entirely Sep 29 22:41:26 ? Sep 29 22:41:44 I use logs and error dialogs Sep 29 22:44:38 Roy-Pre1011: any way to upload images to webOS101? Sep 29 22:44:50 dohtem: hokay Sep 29 22:44:54 alexfner: Yes Sep 29 22:45:07 go on... Sep 29 22:58:38 anyone who works with canvas here? Sep 29 22:59:01 I'm trying to update the canvas wiki for webOS and I'd like to get your feedback on what you'd like/think it should include Sep 29 22:59:19 I haven't touched it much Sep 29 23:06:55 alexfner: dropping mojo means losing all the creamy widgety goodness Sep 29 23:07:26 haeffb: yes, but some times you don't want/need widgets, and if you get rid of it you remove a lot of weight from your application Sep 29 23:07:29 it will launch instantly Sep 29 23:07:32 for example Sep 29 23:26:00 can I simulate a slow network connection on the emulator? Sep 29 23:29:10 got a dialup account? Sep 29 23:29:34 tether? Sep 29 23:30:31 dialup? what's that? :) Sep 29 23:31:00 up until a month ago, my home internet was EVDO. Sep 29 23:34:01 * Loudergood still sells dialup at work occasionally Sep 29 23:37:14 greets to the meats my adoring compatriots Sep 29 23:55:21 just threw some stuff up for understanding javascript Sep 29 23:55:25 critiques welcome Sep 29 23:55:28 http://www.webos101.com/Javascript Sep 29 23:55:29 more coming Sep 29 23:56:08 gonna go get some food Sep 29 23:56:12 be back in a bit Sep 30 01:01:32 come on guys! Let's make these the best community docs there are! Sep 30 01:10:28 webos is not open source Sep 30 01:10:34 how do you make the best community doc? Sep 30 01:11:38 open source has nothing to do with good documentation Sep 30 01:11:48 we can go look at mojo and see exactly how palm does most js stuff Sep 30 01:11:58 we can explain the shit out of the concepts Sep 30 01:14:25 Roy-Pre1011: how do I upload stuff to webOS101? Sep 30 01:17:55 images Sep 30 01:17:56 for example Sep 30 01:22:29 rwhitby: could I talk you into writing a bit about the specifics behind the SDK, some general concepts Sep 30 01:22:41 like how Palm has extended the window object in an SDK application Sep 30 01:23:23 if I can't just say no! :D Sep 30 01:29:53 alexfner: well, there's one hurdle. I have no idea about how the Mojo stuff works. Sep 30 01:30:14 I realized right after I asked that, how it would be such a difficult thing to answer Sep 30 01:30:57 especially because I wrote, "*specifics* behind the SDK, some *general* concepts" Sep 30 01:31:02 you should have just slapped me right there Sep 30 01:31:04 I can tell you the full process from when the power is applied to the OMAP to when LunaSysMgr is launched, but I doubt most webos101 readers are interested in that :) Sep 30 01:46:43 alexfner, hiya :) Sep 30 01:46:49 hey Sep 30 01:46:49 bpadalino, hello again Sep 30 01:46:51 how goes it Sep 30 01:46:58 alexfner, been going a lot of reading Sep 30 01:47:08 alexfner, still trying to piece evrything together Sep 30 01:47:22 alexfner, did you say you can make games with html5 for webos? Sep 30 01:47:27 yes Sep 30 01:47:47 ohok thanks :) Sep 30 01:47:53 i was looking into opengl Sep 30 01:48:11 alexfner, do you know what blender is? Sep 30 01:48:27 yes Sep 30 01:48:51 i assume that blender can use opengl? Sep 30 01:49:03 i mean it has a opengl render engine in it? Sep 30 01:49:13 i use blender but never to design a game Sep 30 01:49:23 you can use html5 to make 2d games Sep 30 01:49:29 based on a small set of images Sep 30 01:49:31 very true Sep 30 01:49:33 nothing 3d, yet Sep 30 01:49:38 im so looking into that :) Sep 30 01:49:52 blender uses something called ray tracing, so it's not really related Sep 30 01:50:03 you could make models in blender though, if you chose Sep 30 01:50:06 i know you can make games with blender but.. Sep 30 01:50:39 i wonder if i can use a opengl render engine with blender Sep 30 01:50:45 so does it already have one? Sep 30 01:51:38 no Sep 30 01:51:42 ok Sep 30 01:51:48 you could never do anything like that on webOS Sep 30 01:51:54 huh? Sep 30 01:52:13 i thought as long as i use a opengl render engine i could use it in webos Sep 30 01:52:24 no Sep 30 01:52:37 i know i can use blender + sio2 to make games on the iphone Sep 30 01:52:39 you have to write something very custom to do that Sep 30 01:52:48 think about it this way Sep 30 01:52:53 oh :\ Sep 30 01:53:00 a mobile phone is 1/10000 the processing power of a desktop computer Sep 30 01:53:10 so you have to make something with 1/10000 the processing power Sep 30 01:53:13 needed* Sep 30 01:53:32 so need for speed is 1/1000? Sep 30 01:54:13 alexfner: There's an upload page. Sep 30 01:54:33 ho ho ho Sep 30 01:54:35 hokay then Sep 30 01:54:55 alexfner: Look in the toolbox on the left. Sep 30 01:55:04 toolbox eh? Sep 30 01:55:11 with wrenches and stiff? Sep 30 01:55:12 stuff* Sep 30 01:55:22 Something like that. Sep 30 01:56:26 "In the previous example, where this.x and this.y are used, this refers to Main's prototype." Sep 30 01:56:43 I don't think that's precisely correct. Sep 30 01:56:58 alexfner, you busy? :) Sep 30 01:57:04 haeffb, hiya :) Sep 30 01:57:08 haeffb: no? Sep 30 01:57:09 hello Sep 30 01:57:15 i have a link that i woiuld like you to look at Sep 30 01:57:20 http://web.appstorm.net/roundups/browsers/10-html5-games-paving-the-way/ Sep 30 01:57:20 this refers to the function Main ? Sep 30 01:57:39 and/or the instance of the function Sep 30 01:57:41 well it refers to Main indirectly, because it refers to the prototype which then refers to main Sep 30 01:58:09 this referst to the object. Sep 30 01:58:12 the object has a prototype Sep 30 01:58:21 maybe. Sep 30 02:09:44 haeffb: hmm... See if you make it Main ={ this} Sep 30 02:09:48 this can Sep 30 02:09:56 this doesn't refer to Main.... Sep 30 02:10:14 It might refer to the Main object Sep 30 02:11:46 function Main () { this.x = 1; this.y=2; }; Sep 30 02:11:57 the prototype is function Sep 30 02:12:18 every object has a prototype. and that prototype has a prototype, and it has a.... Sep 30 02:12:59 hmm Sep 30 02:13:21 prototypal inheritance Sep 30 02:14:04 * sugardave watches as the mysteries of "this" are unraveled. Sep 30 02:14:15 var aMain = new Main(); Sep 30 02:14:21 var bMain = new Main(); Sep 30 02:14:40 the prototype of aMain and bMain are both Main () Sep 30 02:14:58 * haeffb is confusing myself now. Sep 30 02:15:04 you're confusing me Sep 30 02:16:51 I think haeffb is correct...the object is created from the constructor function, so that is the object's prototype Sep 30 02:17:19 haeffb: I don't think I agree with you, this refers to the prototype, because anything you add to this is added to every instance of the object Sep 30 02:17:26 right? Sep 30 02:17:37 alexfner: maybe only new ones Sep 30 02:17:44 so inside Main.prototype = { Sep 30 02:17:46 this.x Sep 30 02:17:51 is added to Main.prototype.x Sep 30 02:18:09 and if I create multiple instances of Main, they all have the .x property Sep 30 02:18:17 therefore it refers to the prototype Sep 30 02:18:56 but then what happens to the objects you already made when you add a new property to Main.prototype? Sep 30 02:19:02 automatic update? Sep 30 02:19:06 I'm not sure Sep 30 02:19:30 so if you add something to Main.prototype Sep 30 02:19:39 all instances of Main automatically receive the changes Sep 30 02:19:44 if you haven't defined the property in that object, it will inherit from the Main.prototype Sep 30 02:19:45 win Sep 30 02:19:51 oh yeah Sep 30 02:20:05 but you CAN define the property in that object and override what's in the prototype Sep 30 02:20:19 right Sep 30 02:22:24 so who's right? Sep 30 02:22:29 I felt like I proved myself right Sep 30 02:24:27 judges? Sep 30 02:25:00 * haeffb feels it's time to go read "the good parts" again... Sep 30 02:25:06 yep Sep 30 02:25:38 plus, I gotta get to bed. Will resume discussion tomorrow Sep 30 02:26:03 <-- winrar Sep 30 02:37:51 alexfner, you there? Sep 30 02:38:15 yes Sep 30 02:38:29 dont mean to annoy you :P Sep 30 02:41:10 alexfner, thanks for your help Sep 30 02:41:17 sure **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Sep 30 02:59:57 2010