**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Mar 12 02:59:57 2011 Mar 12 03:16:30 whats happenin? Mar 12 03:16:45 just bein a guy, doin guy things Mar 12 03:17:38 lol Mar 12 03:20:33 PatrickC_Pre: any word from devmarketing Mar 12 03:22:17 was just about to ask you the same question :p Mar 12 03:22:19 no :'( Mar 12 03:22:45 'evening PatrickC_Pre Mar 12 03:22:55 hay dkirker Mar 12 03:38:50 hey, anybody in the bay area? Mar 12 03:39:53 brb Mar 12 03:39:56 and nope Mar 12 03:40:47 nyceane: yes Mar 12 03:42:49 wana go out and grab a drink? Dkirker? Mar 12 03:43:07 hit on some chicks too if they are available Mar 12 03:43:33 Tonight (this whole weekend, actually) doesn't work for me. Sorry. Mar 12 03:43:47 =( ok Mar 12 03:45:16 can't go to professional events anymore... Mar 12 03:45:26 too many dudes and can't realy hit on those girls =| Mar 12 03:45:55 awww Mar 12 03:47:02 PatrickC_Pre, do you live in the bay area? Mar 12 03:47:13 nope Mar 12 03:47:34 one sec Mar 12 03:47:52 kk Mar 12 03:48:34 wb Mar 12 03:48:43 thanks Mar 12 03:48:52 i still need a go out and hit on chicks buddy Mar 12 03:49:03 what were you doin? Mar 12 03:49:19 i m just bored Mar 12 03:49:24 and can't really work cuz my mind is not in int Mar 12 03:49:37 why'd you log off and back on? Mar 12 03:49:48 just moved here 2 month ago so I dont really know anybody here Mar 12 03:49:52 oh, cuz I wasn't verified Mar 12 03:50:18 how's the apartment? Mar 12 03:51:09 got roaches, but i killed them all and sprayed bunch of stuff Mar 12 03:51:17 =D Mar 12 03:51:59 fuuuun :p Mar 12 03:52:30 hay nuttybunny Mar 12 03:52:45 hey :) Mar 12 03:52:54 hi nuttybunny, do you live in the bay area? Mar 12 03:56:44 no, Iive in Mexico City :) Mar 12 03:56:52 s/Ii/li/ Mar 12 03:56:57 I finally can see why casinos makes so much money Mar 12 03:57:37 nyceane: because people are bad at math and game theory? Mar 12 03:58:25 destinal-pre, no, cuz people are bored and casino brings some sort of social interaction Mar 12 04:00:22 How did windows phone get so many apps so fast Mar 12 04:00:27 nyceane: so do bars and clubs. but they tend to make money too so that may back your theory Mar 12 04:00:43 manners: they pay? Mar 12 04:01:07 in casinos are you are active Mar 12 04:01:20 bars doesn't force you to do anything, you can just sit there and drink Mar 12 04:01:26 Palm should have done that. Those competitions were a waste of money Mar 12 04:01:57 who pays? Mar 12 04:02:45 windows pays devs I believe Mar 12 04:03:19 only if you have some real big hit apps like angry bird Mar 12 04:08:54 What about twitter? Why no official twitter app for webos but all the other platforms have Mar 12 04:19:24 hello friends! Mar 12 04:21:04 Is there any way to reset the contact DB, before I am forced to doctor my Pre 2? Mar 12 04:21:27 I have no accounts connected and yet the contacts list is full of all my fb contacts Mar 12 04:23:17 http://h41112.www4.hp.com/promo/webos/m/us/en/index.html Mar 12 04:39:19 screw it, doctor'd Mar 12 04:40:17 w00t Mar 12 04:41:15 awesome! Mar 12 04:45:01 :( Mar 12 04:47:36 what? Mar 12 04:49:25 #webos-internals will be able to help you Mar 12 04:58:13 lolol Mar 12 05:10:08 How can I setup palm profile on Pre2 with no sim card? Mar 12 05:12:35 #webos-internals :) Mar 12 05:12:47 they can better answer your question Mar 12 05:15:48 PatrickC_Pre: any news on the pre2 Mar 12 05:15:56 not yet Mar 12 05:16:35 wbu? Mar 12 05:17:48 i got a "yeah well send you one" then nothing Mar 12 05:18:33 when?????? Mar 12 05:18:57 week? Mar 12 05:19:08 how long did it take? Mar 12 05:19:43 few weeks to get that, then nothing following Mar 12 05:20:17 well, its more then I got Mar 12 05:21:23 PatrickC_Pre: heh, still no tangible evidence Mar 12 05:21:36 but you at least for a response :) Mar 12 05:21:44 I eventually emailed my dev rep... Mar 12 05:21:56 maybe she'll be able to do something for me Mar 12 05:22:48 awesomee Mar 12 05:23:26 well, I still haven't heard anything yet... Mar 12 05:23:45 PatrickC_Pre: dont get impatient Mar 12 05:24:02 its been almost 30 days..... Mar 12 05:24:20 PatrickC_Pre: youve followed up right Mar 12 05:24:29 2 times Mar 12 05:25:03 PatrickC_Pre: yeah, then id wait :) theyve gotta be swamped Mar 12 05:25:11 I know Mar 12 05:27:17 does being a "Senior Forum Member" count for hearing back sooner? :) Mar 12 05:27:49 PatrickC_Pre: lol Mar 12 05:27:59 why wouldn't it :p Mar 12 05:28:14 don't you get special privileges? lol Mar 12 05:28:23 yah right' Mar 12 05:28:31 I wish Mar 12 05:28:38 then I would be in luck Mar 12 05:28:52 just type just broke Mar 12 05:29:31 PatrickC_Pre: lol, arent you 15 Mar 12 05:29:37 yea Mar 12 05:29:39 just broke, heheh Mar 12 05:29:50 but I am a "Senior Forum Member" Mar 12 05:30:00 PatrickC_Pre: lol, youd be weird if you WERENT broke Mar 12 05:30:16 what? lol Mar 12 05:31:23 PatrickC_Pre: lol, im 22 and still broke as shit Mar 12 05:31:29 lol Mar 12 05:31:46 I was talking about just type stopped working :p Mar 12 05:32:25 the palm email app has a lot of code..... Mar 12 07:52:13 anyone know the best way to watch the buffering of a stream? Mar 12 08:39:22 MetaView: nice weather today here! what about south? Mar 12 08:42:22 hi Mar 12 08:42:34 sunny, 15 degress (prognose) Mar 12 08:42:41 degrees even Mar 12 08:44:17 nice Mar 12 08:44:43 yes, spring is here Mar 12 08:45:14 it's always the spring when the nuclear power plants explode... Mar 12 09:01:23 haha Mar 12 09:01:44 i do not hope it is flowed up by some acid rain Mar 12 10:38:16 are there any non-us app selling devs around? Mar 12 10:38:59 I don't quite understand what I need to do at palm in order to register as a dev. I need a US tax registration number of some sort... legal stuff scares me Mar 12 10:40:32 hi, it is possible to use third-party libraries for javascript games development for WebOS, like cocos2d-javascript? Mar 12 10:41:21 jorul: should be Mar 12 10:41:50 you can add the library to sources.json for instance Mar 12 10:44:15 madnificent: thx, ill check it Mar 12 10:44:34 any1 here has experience with client side certificates with the web browser ? Mar 12 10:54:17 SimpsonCH: it doesn't work Mar 12 10:54:50 ah, thought your were referencing the appstore stuff ;) Mar 12 10:55:20 rwhitby, is it a app limit ? or is in te api, iow if I would like to use it in ajax calls would that work ? Mar 12 10:55:53 there is no support for client side certs in the OS. Mar 12 10:56:51 FAIL Mar 12 11:02:05 yep Mar 12 11:06:21 any idea why they ommited that ? Mar 12 11:06:29 nope Mar 12 11:12:09 SimpsonCH: developer time, I reccon Mar 12 11:12:27 okay, since it is supported by webkit on iOS Mar 12 11:13:00 SimpsonCH: I doubt that it's impossible to hack in there in a homebrew manner, perhaps webos 2 supports it? Mar 12 11:13:58 no, it doesn't ;) Mar 12 11:16:05 i'm not to familiar with hacking though Mar 12 11:25:40 hmmm, Ares allows me to display a map inside my application, it seems. I want something like that in coded form... Mar 12 11:25:55 Actually: I want to let users select a location (or better yet, an area) Mar 12 11:27:00 me as well :) Mar 12 11:27:38 ah, you're trying the same thing? Mar 12 11:29:27 not trying, was looking into the same thing Mar 12 11:29:42 but if you installed the app, you can reverse it I would say Mar 12 11:30:06 installed what app? Mar 12 11:30:29 from ares Mar 12 11:32:48 * madnificent doesn't even find how he can download the app from ares Mar 12 11:33:16 ah got it Mar 12 11:35:11 so when you install it, then you can reverse engineer at as well Mar 12 11:35:22 * madnificent doesn't understand how the map gets in there Mar 12 11:35:44 I simply don't grasp where it creates the map Mar 12 11:38:19 you could see that in the code Mar 12 11:38:40 yeah, I had to save Ares again Mar 12 11:38:42 but then still Mar 12 11:38:59 it is created in javascript by opus.Gizmo blablabla, which tells me absolutely nothing Mar 12 11:39:34 only that that thing accepts some object of type Palm.Mojo.Map somewhere Mar 12 11:40:07 k Mar 12 11:40:12 food Mar 12 11:40:24 SimpsonCH: let me know if you'd figure it out Mar 12 11:59:26 hi guys Mar 12 11:59:48 I am having problems trying to update my model for a list Mar 12 12:00:34 I "declare" my model inside the setup() method and try to invoke it outside of it, but somehow he won't find my model Mar 12 12:00:40 (and update it) Mar 12 12:12:21 I'm not quite sure yet but it looks like a scope thing Mar 12 12:13:06 has anyone some sort of snippet code for updating models with different scope types? that would help me a lot Mar 12 12:14:51 i installed sdk and i can run emulator, and see sample apps when i click run in ares, but cmd doesn't recognize commands like palm-generate, what can be wrong? Im using now win7 Mar 12 12:15:52 that is weird Mar 12 12:16:01 try reinstalling Mar 12 12:16:13 commands work out for me just fine (also using win7) Mar 12 12:29:15 didn't help Mar 12 12:38:47 martinhacks: have you defined it through this.foobar = "bang"; ? Mar 12 12:39:01 martinhacks: emphasis on this Mar 12 13:52:01 webOs 2.X officialy annoys me, now... especialy the development situation is unbearable. :( Mar 12 13:53:57 MetaView: any luck with agenda? Mar 12 14:29:21 Garfonso: how come? Mar 12 14:31:44 the documentation of API/Framework things I looked into is close to useless and in parts also wrong... the only way to get some information is to browse the source code of the palm apps. Even the sample applications in the closed area contain severe bugs. :( Mar 12 14:32:04 It's just no fun developing for 2.x right now. It's not even close to fun... it's only frustrating. Mar 12 14:33:21 Garfonso: where do you live? Mar 12 14:33:38 in germany Mar 12 14:33:57 Garfonso: great! Have you sold any webos apps? Mar 12 14:34:11 or are you an official developer? Mar 12 14:34:45 I'm trying to get registered (belgian) but am not quite sure what I need to do for it. Frankly, legalese scares the hell out of me. Mar 12 14:35:59 no, I haven't sold anything.. I haven't even got any app inside the app catalog.. ;) Mar 12 14:36:45 you are trying to register as developer? Mar 12 14:38:56 yes Mar 12 14:39:10 I understand, what you are talking about... I didn't register for app catalog access, yet, neither... don't know about this tax stuff... ;) Mar 12 14:39:35 but I need to request a credit card for it first, apparently I need that to get my paypal synced up and I found 2 documents of the IRS which I think I need to file Mar 12 15:24:58 good morning Mar 12 15:32:15 the core is melting. great! Mar 12 15:32:18 suckers. Mar 12 15:36:01 leiru: you in japan? Mar 12 15:37:37 good thing I'm on the opposite side of the world... :/ Mar 12 15:38:49 madnificent: nope. germany Mar 12 15:40:09 they say, atomic power is save and it would happen 1 accident in 1 million years. now i am actually 26- and i saw 2 cores melting in my life. Mar 12 15:42:52 ... i think it's better i move to my own planet with hp/palm and some nice people. Mar 12 15:42:55 :) Mar 12 15:44:26 coffee & cigarette - best breakfast ever. Mar 12 15:45:39 leiru: can I come? Mar 12 15:45:44 leiru: can I get a pre3 then? Mar 12 15:45:57 I promise I'll be nice to it! Mar 12 15:46:27 madnificent: there will be a NDA Mar 12 15:46:56 lol Lichtlos Mar 12 15:48:39 Lichtlos: see you @ the easterhegg? Mar 12 15:49:02 first agenda out since yesterday Mar 12 15:51:10 leiru: I'm not sure. Mar 12 15:53:37 hp/palm should be more present i europe, btw. all events, relating to JS, node.js, enyo and so on are happening in the united states. :( Mar 12 15:56:47 everything I see looks like they're working on improving that Mar 12 15:59:47 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMU0tzLwhbE <- it'old but it's so funny Mar 12 16:00:03 developers! Mar 12 16:01:46 leiru: have you, perhaps, registered for the palm store so far? Mar 12 16:02:48 erm.. i don't think so Mar 12 16:02:54 why? Mar 12 16:04:09 leiru: I'm searching for someone that went through the scary process as I'm scared of legalese :) Mar 12 16:04:29 leiru: also, developers still stounds funny :) Mar 12 16:04:54 madnificent: do you mean a dev account in the catalogue? Mar 12 16:05:03 or do you mean a online-shop? Mar 12 16:06:37 leiru: app catalogue Mar 12 16:06:42 catalog, I think Mar 12 16:06:57 leiru: online shop? Palm doesn't provide us with something like that, right? Mar 12 16:08:29 for the appcatalogue i have registered an open source account so far. Mar 12 16:08:53 * madnificent would like to sell his app, could use the funds Mar 12 16:09:02 madnificent: http://www.palm.com/uk/en/products/phones/ Mar 12 16:09:23 thought you would mean smth like this Mar 12 16:09:33 ah, that kind of thing Mar 12 16:09:37 could've been so, yes Mar 12 16:09:43 then sell your app, what is your question? Mar 12 16:09:48 leiru: can you upgrade an open source account to a closed source one? Mar 12 16:09:51 nope Mar 12 16:10:07 they warn you about that if you choose open source Mar 12 16:10:15 leiru: I need to register myself and go through the US IRS or something something Mar 12 16:10:33 i am no us citizen. Mar 12 16:10:45 can't help you. Mar 12 16:10:47 me neither, you need to establish that you aren't a us citizen Mar 12 16:11:00 that's why I'm searching for someone not from the US that went through the proces Mar 12 16:11:01 s Mar 12 16:11:05 a Mar 12 16:11:21 I went through Mar 12 16:11:34 MetaView_: what country are you from? Mar 12 16:11:38 they ask you for a ID of your comapny and say, if you have no you will be taxed with the ireland taxes. Mar 12 16:12:09 Germany Mar 12 16:12:47 MetaView_: what paperwork did you have to file? Mar 12 16:13:08 You have to speak with the IRS to get an EIN which will be the prove that you are from a country which has signed an agreement about double-taxation with USA Mar 12 16:13:27 who is the IRS? Mar 12 16:13:48 leiru: US Internal Revenue Service Mar 12 16:13:52 you have to fill out this one formulare, then you call the IRS: the finance "behörde" Mar 12 16:14:12 MetaView_: where do you call them? The US embassy of your country? Mar 12 16:14:14 you better phone them, it is the fastest Mar 12 16:14:25 no, you call them in the USA Mar 12 16:14:48 google will give you some nice hints about Mar 12 16:15:12 ( I read I had to file W-7 and W-8BEN) Mar 12 16:15:44 so I should google regarding calling the IRS? Mar 12 16:15:55 I guess I used this one: http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=134007440409 Mar 12 16:16:28 My german isn't that good, but I'll try to read it Mar 12 16:16:57 you need SS-4 Mar 12 16:17:18 you fill it out, for your own reference Mar 12 16:17:21 then you call 001 215-516-6999 Mar 12 16:17:32 from 7:00 a.m. to 10:00 p.m local time Mar 12 16:17:48 Reason for the EIN is ”The applicant is a foreign person needing an EIN to comply with IRS withholding regulations.” Mar 12 16:19:25 MetaView_: the SS-4 is for a company, I think. I thought W-7 was its counterpart for normal persons. Mar 12 16:19:36 but say that I do that, I call them Mar 12 16:19:40 then they give me a number? Mar 12 16:19:59 yes, then they give you a number Mar 12 16:20:08 even as a sole person you are a company, or? Mar 12 16:20:42 hi madnificent sorry for the delayed answer Mar 12 16:20:52 MetaView_: I'm a sole person Mar 12 16:21:00 madnificent yes, tried the this.foobar already Mar 12 16:21:14 martinhacks: could you paste some of the code? Mar 12 16:21:23 martinhacks: perhaps we see something that's wrong :) Mar 12 16:21:34 yeah sure Mar 12 16:21:39 let me paste it on pastebin Mar 12 16:21:42 brb Mar 12 16:21:44 madnificent: you fill out SS-4, sry Mar 12 16:21:48 MetaView_: at least, if it's legally allowed, then I'd prefer to do it as a person :) Mar 12 16:22:01 SS-4 is what I did, as a sole developer Mar 12 16:22:02 MetaView_: no sorries here! You're helping me _a lot_ Mar 12 16:22:03 hay Mar 12 16:22:10 hello PatrickC_Pixi Mar 12 16:22:18 what up? Mar 12 16:22:22 MetaView_: so you phone them, you tell them you want to submit an SS-4? Mar 12 16:22:40 MetaView_: they ask you for the information, I get that silly number and what do I do next? Mar 12 16:22:50 I phone them and told them that I need an EIN and then we walked through the form Mar 12 16:23:21 when oyu have the number you fill out W-8BEN and scan it and send it to Palm as email Mar 12 16:23:37 MetaView_: smo just need an EIN when he's i making money, not for 0.00 $ apps, or? :) Mar 12 16:23:59 right Mar 12 16:24:00 MetaView_: ah, so the W-8BEN needn't be sent to the US embassy? Mar 12 16:24:31 no, the W-8BEN is for Palm, they show it the IRS when the IRS asks for their tax share... Mar 12 16:24:32 leiru: the open source account doesn't require you to go through this, it seems Mar 12 16:24:48 MetaView_: ah ok, I think I understand it now :) Mar 12 16:24:55 without the EIN/W-8BEN Palm will reduct 30% from your income to send it to the IRS Mar 12 16:24:57 madnificent http://pastebin.com/h2FW2ACz Mar 12 16:24:59 * madnificent checks out the rates to call the US Mar 12 16:25:10 no income, no taxes Mar 12 16:25:28 when you get income, you might want to avoid a double taxation... Mar 12 16:25:41 martinhacks: what's the output you get? Mar 12 16:25:47 MetaView_: treu Mar 12 16:25:49 well nothing Mar 12 16:25:50 MetaView_: true Mar 12 16:25:52 it just won't work Mar 12 16:25:57 and the list won't get updated Mar 12 16:26:19 martinhacks: does your MainAssistant.js file get loaded? Mar 12 16:26:29 martinhacks: does its setup function get called? Mar 12 16:26:31 btw: that's my google search for it: http://www.google.de/search?hl=de&safe=off&q=IRS+iphone+W-8ben&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq= Mar 12 16:26:34 yeah it does Mar 12 16:26:44 the method connectToServer gets called too Mar 12 16:26:50 the parsing works Mar 12 16:26:52 everything does Mar 12 16:26:59 except updating the model with the new values Mar 12 16:27:08 MetaView_: ah great! Thanks for adding that to the conversation :D my google-fu is low Mar 12 16:27:45 madnificent this.listModel is my model that needs to get updated, I save the new values on this variable called menu which I try to assign to the this.listModel.items = menu and it won't work Mar 12 16:28:50 I'm pretty sure it was something to do with scoping, because when I try assigning the values INSIDE the setup() method it works, but outside it doesn't Mar 12 16:28:59 martinhacks: the tables.each( function ...) doesn't have a bind(this). could that be it? Mar 12 16:29:15 madnificent: you're welcome, adding iphone makes it better, a lot of the devs there had to deal with it in the past Mar 12 16:29:25 hmm maybe madnificent Mar 12 16:29:26 let me try Mar 12 16:29:45 MetaView_: I'm really surprised that it's this 'hard'. I'd actually assume they'd go for double taxes unless you explicitly ask not to pay them doubly Mar 12 16:30:22 * madnificent doesn't see why this.controller.modelChanged needs two arguments, but hey... that's just me. Mar 12 16:30:45 (especially when that argument is this, which is rarely ever really this in javascript) Mar 12 16:30:49 lol madnificent Mar 12 16:31:09 MetaView_: thank you very very very much btw. It scares the hell out of me Mar 12 16:32:57 madnificent no nothing Mar 12 16:33:11 madnificent: at the end, it's easy Mar 12 16:33:19 I added the .bind(this) to the first .each (for the tables variable) Mar 12 16:33:33 and it still won't "find" my this.listModel Mar 12 16:34:11 hi guys, what simple game engine in js can u recommend to develop for webos? Mar 12 16:34:12 MetaView_: how long does the call take approximately (half an hour? 15 minutes?) Mar 12 16:35:16 15 mins Mar 12 16:35:59 martinhacks: fuction(transport) doesn't have the bind either Mar 12 16:36:32 tried that already Mar 12 16:36:33 exception Mar 12 16:36:34 martinhacks: I think you need to bind on all three functions in this case ): Mar 12 16:36:47 oh right, it can't access that Mar 12 16:36:53 ahm I always hack around it in a silly way Mar 12 16:37:26 I create a function setupHandlers which then creates all these things. By doing it in that function, I have a this object which has the right scope Mar 12 16:37:38 yeah he said anonymous methods cannot have the .bind() method Mar 12 16:37:41 you do have to call it at the start of your setup method, but it does work nicely Mar 12 16:37:59 how does your method look like? Mar 12 16:40:42 I did a Mojo.Log.info(this.listModel) inside the connectToServer() method and it showed: undefined Mar 12 16:40:50 so it's clearly a scope thing Mar 12 16:41:24 martinhacks: http://pastebin.com/rANNFCXW Mar 12 16:41:25 which kind of sucks, because I've bound all methods Mar 12 16:42:04 martinhacks: that's my normal hack around it... you can probably solve it in a more constructive manner... Mar 12 16:42:22 * madnificent can't see the scheme through javascripts ugly ugly algol syntax. Therefore, he misses the point. Mar 12 16:42:24 interesting Mar 12 16:42:37 martinhacks: does it work? Mar 12 16:43:23 * madnificent AWK, will read what martinhacks says soon Mar 12 16:44:25 debugging... Mar 12 16:44:55 no it didn't ... Mar 12 16:44:57 damn Mar 12 16:46:31 hrmm Mar 12 16:46:33 wait Mar 12 16:47:46 I love you Mar 12 16:47:47 ... Mar 12 16:48:03 lol Mar 12 16:48:22 madnificent you are a genius Mar 12 16:48:23 thanks a lot Mar 12 16:49:15 I've been struggling with this problem for days Mar 12 16:50:17 martinhacks, look out, hes really an evil genius plotting to take over the world Mar 12 16:50:32 his solutin includes a worm that will give him remote access to everything it touches! Mar 12 16:51:45 hmm have you guys worked with "handleLaunch" with dashboards? Mar 12 16:51:56 Like, how do I get it to not auto launch a card and launch a dashboard. Mar 12 16:51:57 ? Mar 12 16:52:04 Tibfib: haeffb has, I bet Mar 12 16:52:07 but he's not here Mar 12 16:52:10 darn Mar 12 16:52:26 lol SiLeNt_NiNjA1 Mar 12 16:52:58 hi sugardave Mar 12 16:53:02 hello Mar 12 16:53:07 the app is almost done, after two weeks work Mar 12 16:53:10 :) Mar 12 16:53:18 only 2 weeks? :) Mar 12 16:53:29 lol I know it took me quite a while Mar 12 16:53:45 shit, you should have seen how long it took me to get Mind Master written Mar 12 16:53:55 and it is garbage Mar 12 16:54:22 well your app is faily more complex than mine Mar 12 16:54:43 what does your app do? Mar 12 16:55:16 as stupid as it sounds: it parses a website and displays the data Mar 12 16:55:20 that's all Mar 12 16:55:36 any web site or a particular one? Mar 12 16:55:51 a particular one Mar 12 16:55:58 for my university Mar 12 16:56:00 if it did any website, and found relevant data, thatd be impressive :-D Mar 12 16:56:03 oh right Mar 12 16:56:06 the menu thing, yeah? Mar 12 16:56:11 so students know what's there to eat Mar 12 16:56:12 yea Mar 12 16:56:15 cool Mar 12 16:56:34 well you can SiLeNt_NiNjA1 but that would require mad NLP skills :) Mar 12 16:56:48 * sugardave schedules time on Watson. Mar 12 16:56:55 haha Mar 12 16:58:28 bah, everybody wants to be a SWAT engineer...my chances ar narrowing Mar 12 16:58:33 s/ar/are Mar 12 16:58:53 sugardave, s/ar/arrrrr Mar 12 16:59:00 pirate speach Mar 12 16:59:11 well I'm very happy for the achievement today Mar 12 16:59:19 I hope this app to be the first of many to come Mar 12 16:59:22 * SiLeNt_NiNjA1 awards martinhacks 20 achievement points Mar 12 16:59:30 * sugardave cheers martinhacks. Mar 12 16:59:44 I think webOS is an excellent plattform and is very underrated Mar 12 16:59:53 i agree Mar 12 16:59:57 we need to raise the app count Mar 12 16:59:58 its a little behind some of he others Mar 12 17:00:01 you and everyone else here Mar 12 17:00:12 and some of HPalm's latest happenings have annoyed alot of ppl Mar 12 17:00:34 but if they can hang on and stay relevant till the bumps are out of the way, they should do well Mar 12 17:00:38 yeah but they're trying to do things right Mar 12 17:00:42 just need to catch up on features Mar 12 17:00:43 can Mar 12 17:00:51 can't wait for their next announcement Mar 12 17:01:06 want touchpad Mar 12 17:01:08 supposed to be something on the 14th Mar 12 17:01:08 need touchpad Mar 12 17:01:12 will kill for touchapd Mar 12 17:01:13 yeah Mar 12 17:01:13 er Mar 12 17:01:18 yeah, ive been eyeing a tablet for awhile now Mar 12 17:01:34 SiLeNt_NiNjA1: what's on the 14th? Mar 12 17:01:49 supposed to be some small announcement Mar 12 17:01:53 it's a rumored announcment date for stuff. Mar 12 17:02:05 interesting Mar 12 17:02:05 its been mentioned in passing a cpl times in other interviews Mar 12 17:02:17 In addition, Leo Apotheker said that the company will unveil something big on March 14 that shows the "vision of what HP is capable of in the future." Mar 12 17:02:26 yeah, they could just be having another meeting w/ more show time for the same stuff for all we know Mar 12 17:02:29 but hey, well see Mar 12 17:02:46 well, at least this time I only have to wait 2 days Mar 12 17:02:51 lol Mar 12 17:02:56 lol Mar 12 17:03:13 im on a lucky streak, so im gonna guess they announce imminent availability of the touchpad Mar 12 17:03:29 "Apotheker admits there are "a few holes" in HP's portfolio but hopes that "one day people will say, 'this is cool as HP,' not 'as cool as Apple.'" Mar 12 17:03:31 <-- won $150 at the casino Mar 12 17:03:49 hope his wishes turn true Mar 12 17:03:57 * sugardave didn't lose money by not going to the casino. Mar 12 17:04:04 i didnt want to go Mar 12 17:04:13 in laws wanted to, and persuaded my wife she wanted to Mar 12 17:04:17 so we ended up going Mar 12 17:04:32 inlaws lost a bunch, we came out ahead :) Mar 12 17:05:35 where? Mar 12 17:05:45 motor city casino Mar 12 17:05:45 sugardave: you're a better dev than some of the peeps that have applied... just saying Mar 12 17:06:34 Tibfib: thanks, the only concern I have is they want PDK/C/C++ knowledge, but I might be able to persuade them :) Mar 12 17:06:51 sugardave: I hope so Mar 12 17:06:57 sugardave, do you do any c/c++ Mar 12 17:07:16 I do not, but if SWAT were my RealJob I'd have a lot of time to learn how to wield it Mar 12 17:07:41 to get a good solid base, read "The C Programming Language : Second Edition" Mar 12 17:07:57 written by the 2 guys who wrote c, and the book was the model for the standards Mar 12 17:08:06 as it is now, I had to choose to focus on one thing...Mojo, and it is being eliminated anyway :) Mar 12 17:08:24 SiLeNt_NiNjA1: I saw you mentioning that to somebody the other day, I will check it out Mar 12 17:08:32 I think I have a C++ somewhere already Mar 12 17:09:33 c++ is just a bunch of extensions on top of c in essence Mar 12 17:10:06 well not only Mar 12 17:10:12 c++ introduces a whole new concept Mar 12 17:10:14 I'm pretty confident I can pick it up...I can learn new programming languages pretty easily Mar 12 17:10:17 object oriented programming Mar 12 17:10:41 martinhacks, you can write oop in c as well, but c++ makes it easier Mar 12 17:11:02 you can use c memory alloc functions in c++ even Mar 12 17:11:16 I didn't know that SiLeNt_NiNjA1 Mar 12 17:11:18 aka alloc , realloc instead of delete / free ect Mar 12 17:11:28 I thought that was Objective-C for Mar 12 17:12:22 we wrote dynamic memory structures in Pascal, that's about as advanced in formal training as I ever got :/ Mar 12 17:13:16 I also think you'll catch up pretty fast sugardave Mar 12 17:14:35 objective c made it easier, and more centric as well Mar 12 17:14:38 added a ton of stuff Mar 12 17:15:38 what's goin on? Mar 12 17:16:42 https://ritdml.rit.edu/handle/1850/8544 Mar 12 17:16:56 objective c needs OS X right? Mar 12 17:17:00 article on how c can work in an object oriented fashion Mar 12 17:17:05 ahh I see, you use structs as "objects" Mar 12 17:17:07 not entierly, you can compile it elsewhere Mar 12 17:17:10 yup Mar 12 17:17:32 I always hated C Mar 12 17:17:36 then I can't use it :'( Mar 12 17:17:39 contains everything in the same way, and keeps you a bit closer to machine level for performance :) Mar 12 17:17:53 those damn headers Mar 12 17:17:55 PatrickC_Pixi, you can get objective c compilers for win32 Mar 12 17:18:00 haha yeah Mar 12 17:18:05 need to define everything Mar 12 17:18:09 yea Mar 12 17:18:33 can you code for webos in objective c? Mar 12 17:18:45 nope Mar 12 17:19:03 well, you probably could if you found an arm7 compiler for it Mar 12 17:19:05 what good does it do? Mar 12 17:19:20 PatrickC_Pixi ask apple Mar 12 17:19:23 :P Mar 12 17:19:35 that's what I thought lol Mar 12 17:19:42 its apples idea of a c# language thats compiled kindve like c Mar 12 17:19:55 well, kindve between c# and java id say Mar 12 17:19:57 lemme guess, for iOS? Mar 12 17:20:06 yep Mar 12 17:20:10 2 languages I don't know :p Mar 12 17:20:18 Java is easy Mar 12 17:20:22 silent_ninja, are you an iOS dev? Mar 12 17:20:26 no Mar 12 17:20:31 I just haven't had time to learn Java Mar 12 17:20:41 i dislike ios Mar 12 17:20:42 I'm going to, as Android requires it Mar 12 17:20:47 same here Mar 12 17:20:53 mac osx is ok, just cause it used freebsd 4.9 as the core Mar 12 17:21:06 but no ios for me Mar 12 17:21:07 but my old Pastor wants their app on iOS Mar 12 17:21:19 same here Mar 12 17:21:20 yeah I know that feeling PatrickC_Pixi Mar 12 17:21:24 tell him to go buy you te macbook pro youll need to submit it Mar 12 17:21:35 webOS FOR LIFE!! Mar 12 17:21:46 "Wow! nice app!, now why don't you develop it for Iphone too?" Mar 12 17:21:53 even airplay hasnt been able to get around apples latest submission req of requiring a mac Mar 12 17:21:57 I tried that, he asked if I had a friend who has one I could borrow Mar 12 17:21:57 WELL WHY DON'T YOU LEARN OBJECTIVE-C FIRST Mar 12 17:21:58 lol Mar 12 17:22:12 well... Mar 12 17:22:18 it looks hard :p Mar 12 17:22:29 PatrickC_Pixi, tell him for the length of time it takes to develop an app, nobody in their right mind will just give you a $2k laptop Mar 12 17:22:52 besides you have to pay to become an apple dev Mar 12 17:22:54 I'll dev it in windows, then compile it in osx I guess Mar 12 17:22:59 99$ a year I think Mar 12 17:23:01 he knows that Mar 12 17:23:22 and your app might not even get approved Mar 12 17:23:24 he is fine with $99 a year, just for with 2k for dev resources atm Mar 12 17:23:33 and y wouldn't it? Mar 12 17:23:46 idk how they work for app approval Mar 12 17:23:57 poorl, from what I hear Mar 12 17:24:00 poorly Mar 12 17:24:03 I know all apps that follow the rules here are allowed.. Mar 12 17:24:11 nice Mar 12 17:24:38 everyone remember the IBoobs app? Mar 12 17:24:47 nope Mar 12 17:24:49 it got rejected on apple a few years ago Mar 12 17:25:01 it got accepted on android last week Mar 12 17:25:05 well... look at the name :p Mar 12 17:25:17 what?! Mar 12 17:25:21 wow Mar 12 17:25:43 still, the app was simple and to my opinion, still decent if you compare it to some of the android market apps Mar 12 17:26:00 there is no central approval mechanism for android, right? Mar 12 17:26:03 android is stupidly hard to hack... Mar 12 17:26:08 what? Mar 12 17:26:10 I think not sugardave Mar 12 17:26:33 so that's the cool/dangerous part about android marketplace Mar 12 17:26:48 bbl time for lunch Mar 12 17:27:03 see ya Mar 12 17:27:20 wee here goes my new shiny meta dr Mar 12 17:27:43 and android... hard to hack? Mar 12 17:28:01 except for the devices that checksum it and try to blockyou in hardware, its actually pretty easy Mar 12 17:28:09 you need a custom ROM to hack Mar 12 17:28:22 and it wipes the device in order to do Mar 12 17:29:03 compare that to what it took them to get into the ps3, then tell me whats hard :) Mar 12 17:29:22 lol Mar 12 17:29:33 yeah the ps3 was a pain in the ass lol Mar 12 17:29:49 end user caveats dosnt make it hard to hack Mar 12 17:30:04 makes it somewhat annoying, as you need to take time to backup / restore ect Mar 12 17:30:08 but still not hard Mar 12 17:30:09 well.... Mar 12 17:30:17 hard compared to webOS :) Mar 12 17:30:51 webos that they just pretty much left wide open on purpose for us? Mar 12 17:31:10 and it makes it easy :) Mar 12 17:31:36 dont know if id term that "hacking" into it though Mar 12 17:32:03 i mean, if you walk in though an open front door, is it breaking and entering? Mar 12 17:32:08 now, its just trespassing Mar 12 17:32:21 lol Mar 12 17:46:20 argh Mar 12 17:46:34 arrrrgh Mar 12 17:46:37 ahoy matey Mar 12 17:46:42 i just realised that i saw no real person and no daylight since wednesday Mar 12 17:46:54 :) Mar 12 17:47:20 hi silent_ninja. Mar 12 17:47:54 mornin Mar 12 17:50:31 btw - the latest predoodle on precentral is pretty funny Mar 12 17:51:53 haha lol Mar 12 17:51:58 indeed. Mar 12 17:54:08 now the fun part, restoring everything after a fresh metadr Mar 12 17:55:10 i used a fresh profile for my frankenpre2, and all spare hw, so ill just read down my apps list and install them all :-P Mar 12 17:55:18 <-- app hoarder Mar 12 17:57:15 did it the same way for my pre2, SiLeNt_NiNjA1 Mar 12 17:57:28 wait until you arrive the phone-contacts :| Mar 12 17:57:34 thats easy Mar 12 17:57:41 all transfered to my google acct Mar 12 17:58:00 ah okay. mine were synced to palm-account Mar 12 17:58:15 theres a patch to email all contacts as vcards Mar 12 17:58:21 send that to gmail and import them Mar 12 17:58:45 copied them one by one to SIM-card Mar 12 17:59:13 i am careful with patches for my brand new device. Mar 12 18:01:01 well, since im on spare hardware, and can always doctor back Mar 12 18:05:39 that's a good point, i am nevertheless careful Mar 12 18:18:53 I just emailed myself the vcard and it worked Mar 12 18:19:16 and just erased the profile data and everything was happy :) Mar 12 18:29:54 yup, I sent the vcard to my gmail account and imported it Mar 12 18:33:56 MetaView_: any luck with agenda? Mar 12 19:36:19 Ah! Excellent, Subnet Calculator V2 ready. just a fast cleanup. Gotta take the dog for a Walk :D Mar 12 19:37:39 great! Mar 12 19:50:26 bbl Mar 12 21:01:07 odd.. my sprint bill is 0.14 more than usual... Mar 12 21:01:10 stupid taxes Mar 12 21:45:23 ugh this would have been so much easier if i didnt get hosed on my taxes Mar 12 22:05:26 I GOT A REPLY!!!!! Mar 12 22:06:38 cwayne: you here? Mar 12 22:06:56 ya whats up Mar 12 22:07:16 I got me a reply :) Mar 12 22:08:02 it was a very short email too Mar 12 22:08:45 niiice Mar 12 22:08:57 it said: Mar 12 22:09:22 Please send me your full mailing address and phone number Mar 12 22:10:32 nice Mar 12 22:12:22 yeep Mar 12 22:13:16 i wish i would get a reply Mar 12 22:14:21 who'd you email? Mar 12 22:14:33 marketing Mar 12 22:14:52 did you get a free pre+? Mar 12 22:15:10 no a pixi Mar 12 22:15:31 but you did get a free dev device? Mar 12 22:17:44 is that marketing@palm Mar 12 22:18:00 devmarketing@palm.com I believe Mar 12 22:18:50 i emailed them last week and they responded with "we will contact you for more information" Mar 12 22:18:55 nothing i since Mar 12 22:19:11 it took me almost 30 days to hear back from anyone Mar 12 22:19:27 and I only heard back because I emailed people directly Mar 12 22:20:11 i'm not even looking for a free device, just a discount haha Mar 12 22:20:12 brb Mar 12 22:20:26 lol Mar 12 22:20:33 I'm gettin the free device Mar 12 22:20:51 what apps do you have out? Mar 12 22:21:06 hahaha i dont have any out Mar 12 22:21:13 why not? Mar 12 22:21:14 lol Mar 12 22:21:22 i just started messing around with the emulator Mar 12 22:21:27 very new here Mar 12 22:21:33 * PatrickC_Pre can't wait to feel the form factor of the pre2! Mar 12 22:21:39 its easy Mar 12 22:21:51 just bug sugardave with any questions Mar 12 22:21:57 s/bug/ask/ Mar 12 22:21:58 :p Mar 12 22:22:04 haha Mar 12 22:22:43 i just really want a webos device to test on Mar 12 22:22:44 sugardave knows a ton and is very helpful (unless the answer is obvious) lol Mar 12 22:23:03 free pre2 verizon :) Mar 12 22:23:11 i'm in canada haha Mar 12 22:23:23 soooo :p Mar 12 22:23:24 brb Mar 12 22:24:11 well no verizon here! our gsm networks are pretty good Mar 12 22:25:19 the pre2 is gsm unlocked Mar 12 22:25:43 cwayne- yea but cost an arm and a leg .. maybe an eye ball Mar 12 22:25:59 joeb_: yar Mar 12 22:30:14 joeb_ make an app and you too can have a free pre2 :) Mar 12 22:31:41 PatrickC_Pre: lol, did they say when you'd be getting it? Mar 12 22:31:54 not yet Mar 12 22:32:12 it was just a "address and phone number please" kind of email Mar 12 22:34:55 PatrickC_Pre: yeah, ive been at that step for awhile Mar 12 22:35:16 but it was from my old dev rep, so idk Mar 12 22:35:32 it could get here on tues, or 5 weeks from now Mar 12 22:39:31 can you make a request and pull the users email address? Mar 12 22:42:46 afaik, no Mar 12 22:46:09 * Hendikins fires up Pre2, attempts to get more GPS data points in Melbourne. Mar 12 23:09:38 what the Mar 13 00:01:38 Anyone here have webos 2.1 on a sprint pre? Mar 13 00:02:43 if so can you open up the Nascar and Football app and tell me if they are working? I nottice on mine that while they open the app tells me to run an update Mar 13 00:07:02 quiet today Mar 13 00:11:31 seems like it Mar 13 00:11:43 though, I would expect that on a Saturday Mar 13 00:12:14 * oil is too busy being sick Mar 13 00:14:47 * dkirker is busy working on Universe Mar 13 00:22:02 if I have to work then the rest of you do too! Mar 13 00:22:39 I have a question about the terminal emulator on webos 2 Mar 13 00:22:50 i havent been able to get it to work Mar 13 00:23:10 mattsmcnulty: Great! I have been working on this alpha all weekend. :) Mar 13 00:23:22 RRRAD Mar 13 00:23:42 yea, id be totally happy to do tests or whatever Mar 13 00:23:43 COZAD_2o1o: http://metaviewsoft.de/wordpress/?p=560 Mar 13 00:23:45 i got 2.1 Mar 13 00:23:47 pre2 Mar 13 00:23:56 that will help you get Terminus working Mar 13 00:25:48 word Mar 13 00:25:51 i tried that Mar 13 00:26:02 hmm Mar 13 00:26:06 like made the correction but it didnt work Mar 13 00:26:07 I haven't... maybe I should Mar 13 00:26:15 like terminus gives me the prompt Mar 13 00:26:28 but it doesnt let me enter anything in Mar 13 00:27:11 toeurminaus Mar 13 00:29:11 mail came... no pre 2 :( Mar 13 00:30:01 lamee Mar 13 00:30:18 my parents have my Pre2. They should be bringing it tomorrow. :D Mar 13 00:37:31 2.1 backs up txts to cloud Mar 13 00:37:31 IM H Mar 13 00:37:32 AP Mar 13 00:37:36 im hap* Mar 13 00:37:47 if there's anything I've wanted out of a phone Mar 13 00:38:17 it's the ability to see years of conversational logs with irl peeps Mar 13 00:45:34 dkirker: how long did you wait from "confirmation" until arrival? Mar 13 00:46:30 Lichtlos: a while. Let me check my backlog Mar 13 00:49:20 :) Mar 13 00:57:24 Lichtlos: 1st email sent 2/15, reply back on 2/21. Phone sent around 2/28. Received 3/8 or 3/9. Mar 13 00:58:24 thanks :) Mar 13 00:59:26 yup Mar 13 01:00:09 my phone was sent around 3/1 but still has not arrived :( Mar 13 01:00:40 Where do you live? Mar 13 01:00:47 germany :) Mar 13 01:00:59 oh, well ya... Mar 13 01:01:19 It takes *at least* 7 days for UPS or FedEX ground to deliver in the United States Mar 13 01:01:58 took 8 for my phone, then there is International flight and customs. Mar 13 01:02:06 inside europe, UPS needs 1-2 days to me :/ Mar 13 01:02:08 Lichtlos: you received one as a non-us citizen? Mar 13 01:02:10 I would guess you'd probably get it this week. Mar 13 01:02:30 Lichtlos: yeah, strangely Europe has faster delivery than the US with UPS Mar 13 01:03:03 I've found that in all of the International packages that I have received, they spend most of the time in customs. Mar 13 01:03:18 Is there a way to make the font on the command menu smaller, or more dense? Mar 13 01:03:23 dkirker: sounds great :) thanks for the approximation Mar 13 01:03:39 Lichtlos: You're welcome! Did you email for a tracking number? Mar 13 01:04:14 dkirker: I did... like on the 3/4th Mar 13 01:04:22 ah Mar 13 01:04:32 but I have not received an answer yet Mar 13 01:04:53 I have asked too, but didn't receive a response, and then got my device... Mar 13 01:04:56 (which I don't mind, as long as it arrives :) Mar 13 01:05:32 waiting for a parcel is a great time, though Mar 13 01:06:06 anticipation renders these days somewhat more bearable :( Mar 13 01:10:00 Lichtlos: especially for a pre2 ^_^ Mar 13 01:12:59 since it's 2am here.... see you tomorrow guys :) Mar 13 01:14:08 night Lichtlos Mar 13 01:14:17 * madnificent should head to bed as well Mar 13 01:29:58 madnificent: the command menu is css Mar 13 01:33:37 * Hendikins gets further confirmation that the southern hemisphere bug is 2^32 / 1e7. He's tested at 27, 33 and 37 degree latitudes with exactly the same variance. Mar 13 01:34:09 interesting Mar 13 01:35:36 Well, +/- a normal amount of variation for AGPS. Mar 13 01:36:50 I plan to test in Perth later in the week. Mar 13 02:55:59 haeffb: I didn't find the classes of the commandmenu, but I assumed it was css, yes Mar 13 02:56:13 * madnificent is stuck with sqlite datetime fields **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Mar 13 02:59:57 2011