**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Nov 08 02:59:57 2011
Nov 08 03:00:53 <EricBlade> i vote they give Palm a billion dollars, and say "go at it on your own again, k?"
Nov 08 03:01:40 <rwatkins> unfortunatley your vote doesnt come with a billion dollars.
Nov 08 03:01:44 <EricBlade> unfortunately, that's not the kind of world we live in
Nov 08 03:02:09 <summatusmentis> I assume they're already considering a 1.2 billion to be money poorly spent
Nov 08 03:02:11 <rwatkins> ya, if its oracle, I think I'm pretty much out.
Nov 08 03:02:18 <rwatkins> MSFT would be fine
Nov 08 03:02:20 <summatusmentis> I think it's unlikely they'll pour that much more into it
Nov 08 03:02:31 <EricBlade> there is no "oops, i'm sorry, i bought your company and then surprise buttsecksed it" awards.
Nov 08 03:02:37 <Shadyman> haha
Nov 08 03:03:05 <EricBlade> unlike former CEOs who get those kinds of awards *grrr*
Nov 08 03:03:25 <PuffTheMagic> Tibfib> dang it feels good to code again
Nov 08 03:03:44 <PuffTheMagic> ^^ i saw this from afar and thought you said "dang it feels good to do coke again"
Nov 08 03:04:26 <wrea> lol
Nov 08 03:12:44 <EricBlade> wow i missed a nearly global internet outage this morning.  good thing those things don't last nearly as long as they used to in the old days
Nov 08 03:13:06 <sugardave> I blame Oklahoma
Nov 08 03:13:19 <EricBlade> Sounds reasonable.
Nov 08 03:13:21 <sugardave> and apparently, God agrees with me
Nov 08 03:13:28 <halfhalo> yup
Nov 08 03:13:57 <halfhalo> its ok, everyone hates oklahoma
Nov 08 03:14:04 <sugardave> even Oklahomans
Nov 08 03:14:13 <EricBlade> Oklamaha isn't that bad.  It's OK.
Nov 08 03:14:15 <Tibfib> sheesh. apparently we've had two earthquakes here in the past few days
Nov 08 03:14:23 <Tibfib> I haven't noticed either of them
Nov 08 03:14:30 <sugardave> EricBlade: you know why they say "Oklahoma is OK" right?
Nov 08 03:14:35 <sugardave> they can't spell "mediocre"
Nov 08 03:14:52 <EricBlade> Tibfib: quick get "What's SHaking" from the app catalog
Nov 08 03:15:02 <wrea> not surprising, i only felt 2 or so when i lived in california for those 21 years
Nov 08 03:15:15 <halfhalo> I slept through the '94 quake.
Nov 08 03:15:22 <sugardave> I still haven't ever felt one
Nov 08 03:15:24 <halfhalo> not so much the aftershocks though
Nov 08 03:15:48 <EricBlade> my brother moved to CA back in ... 1992? 3? he called home hysterical the first one.
Nov 08 03:15:58 <Tibfib> haha
Nov 08 03:16:11 <Tibfib> I'm starting to think my life is the truman show and everyone is faking the earthquakes
Nov 08 03:16:33 * halfhalo lives like 3 miles from the epicenter of the '94 quake
Nov 08 03:16:35 * EricBlade watches Tibfib on his TV
Nov 08 03:16:52 * Tibfib waves to EricBlade
Nov 08 03:17:01 <EricBlade> hey, now, use more fingers when you wave
Nov 08 03:17:06 * halfhalo watches football
Nov 08 03:17:12 <Tibfib> my bad
Nov 08 03:19:37 <EricBlade> oh, according to the What's Shaking app, OK just had another one about 30 min ago.  no wonder that came up.
Nov 08 03:20:49 <EricBlade> 4.7 is a pretty decent rumble, for those who've never been in one, isn't it?
Nov 08 03:21:02 <Tibfib> OK has had a couple lately
Nov 08 03:21:26 <Tibfib> a 7 IIRC
Nov 08 03:21:29 <EricBlade> yeah i heard about the one yesterday? or the day before? looks like some decent afters
Nov 08 03:21:35 <Tibfib> saturday I think
Nov 08 03:23:13 <halfhalo> all these new cars... i hate them
Nov 08 03:23:26 <halfhalo> with their fancy 30+ mpg and shiny 270+ hp
Nov 08 03:24:15 <Tibfib> jerks
Nov 08 03:24:29 <halfhalo> admittedly, I care not about the first
Nov 08 03:25:00 <Tibfib> so halfhalo, what are you up to lately? school?
Nov 08 03:25:10 <halfhalo> yup
Nov 08 03:26:55 <halfhalo> mmmm.... m5......
Nov 08 03:28:40 <Tibfib_> night
Nov 08 03:28:46 <summatusmentis> dude, 9:30
Nov 08 04:11:56 <PuffTheMagic> i love that the touchpad enables me to play freecell while I shit
Nov 08 04:12:28 <sugardave> truly you have reached Nirvana
Nov 08 04:42:07 <dwc-> I had that capability 20 years ago
Nov 08 04:42:41 <dwc-> 80386 sx
Nov 08 04:42:42 <summatusmentis> you have a touchpad 20 years ago?
Nov 08 04:42:46 <summatusmentis> dayum
Nov 08 04:48:45 <EricBlade> except the portable computers then would've cut off all circulation to your legs while you're sitting there
Nov 08 04:49:58 <EricBlade> well maybe not that bad. but still.
Nov 08 04:50:05 <sugardave> my 386SX was 25 MHz!
Nov 08 04:50:09 <sugardave> smokin'
Nov 08 04:50:16 <dwc-> actually, the one I had, I'm not sure it was any heavier than those 17 and 19" behemoths they sell these days
Nov 08 04:50:21 <sugardave> and it had _2_ MB RAM
Nov 08 04:50:27 <EricBlade> i waited to get a 386 till the 486's came out, so i cuold get a 33mhz 386 cheap
Nov 08 04:50:51 <dwc-> of course this one was probably like a 9" monochrome passive matrix LCD screen
Nov 08 04:51:30 <EricBlade> then my next upgrade was to AMD's first crowning achievemnet - 486/100
Nov 08 04:51:50 <dwc-> did you say cloning achievement?
Nov 08 04:52:28 <EricBlade> no, but i'm trying to think of a good joke here
Nov 08 04:52:30 <EricBlade> and i'm failing
Nov 08 04:52:50 <sugardave> there's nothing funny about clones
Nov 08 04:52:54 <sugardave> evil
Nov 08 04:53:44 <EricBlade> "Panasonic makes a multitasking 3D photo/video camera" ... which you can use to take photos and videos simultaneously.  i bet it doesn't run webos
Nov 08 05:07:48 * DougReeder waves hello
Nov 08 05:08:32 <dkirker> hello
Nov 08 05:09:02 <DougReeder> What are the topics tonight?
Nov 08 05:09:14 <rrix> We're discussing nuclear fission
Nov 08 05:09:31 <dkirker> hi rrix!
Nov 08 05:09:34 <rrix> Hi dkirker :)
Nov 08 05:09:50 <DougReeder> Uranium, Plutonium, or Thorium?
Nov 08 05:09:55 <rrix> Water
Nov 08 05:10:28 <DougReeder> That's rather tricky, without a handy supernova.
Nov 08 05:11:09 <dkirker> one of my servers is names supernova
Nov 08 05:11:12 <dkirker> will that work?
Nov 08 05:11:35 <DougReeder> I'm guessing not.
Nov 08 05:11:40 <dkirker> :'(
Nov 08 05:12:21 <dwc-> hey, we have one of those supernovae too
Nov 08 05:14:25 <EricBlade> oh, here's something i didn't catch in the newsblast earlier today ... ""The question now before us is what do we do with webOS software and do we come back to market with webOS devices," Whitman said. "It obviously will not be the same device but it will be version 2.0." "
Nov 08 05:18:28 <DougReeder> I missed the quote by Whitman - Google isn't very good at putting the origin of a story at the top of results.
Nov 08 05:18:49 <EricBlade> yeah it looks like that didn't come up until a couple hours ago on the latest updates to the story
Nov 08 05:19:42 <rwatkins> no news on last weeks apphack?
Nov 08 05:19:48 <DougReeder> But, really, the situation is not materially changed from August.  Still no hard info.
Nov 08 05:20:07 <DougReeder> None that I've heard, and I'm very interested to see what people came up with!
Nov 08 05:20:20 <rwatkins> ya, i would imagine
Nov 08 05:20:26 <DougReeder> The lack of keyboard input rules out many very useful applications.
Nov 08 05:21:06 <rwatkins> the app hacks have conveniently flushed out a bunch of issues .. hopefully making it back to the dev team.
Nov 08 05:21:06 <EricBlade> DougReeder: no hard info, but it at least shows that a resumption of something resembling sanity at HP is still on the table
Nov 08 05:22:16 <DougReeder> Mmmm, perhaps.
Nov 08 05:23:11 <hewball> lets hope this is the case
Nov 08 05:23:14 <DougReeder> Eh, there wasn't a lack of reported bugs waiting to be fixed before.
Nov 08 05:23:26 <rwhitby> EricBlade: where is that whitman quote from?
Nov 08 05:23:39 <EricBlade> rwhitby: http://ca.reuters.com/article/technologyNews/idCATRE7A66UM20111108?sp=true
Nov 08 05:23:45 <rwatkins> http://slickdeals.net/forums/showthread.php?t=3505854 - implies they've already been sending out coupons?
Nov 08 05:23:55 <DougReeder> Which reminds me, I need to re-run my tests and update all my bug report threads for 3.0.4.
Nov 08 05:25:09 <rwatkins> true.  but like obvious stuff - like no documentated way to detect rotation lock.  or that face up / face down are now gone.
Nov 08 05:25:36 <DougReeder> Face up/down is gone?  Bummer.  I couldn't think of a use for it, but there's got to be one.
Nov 08 05:26:43 <EricBlade> either gone, or someone failed to implement them
Nov 08 05:26:45 <rwatkins> for the phone its handy - turn off stuff when the phone is turned face down on a table.
Nov 08 05:27:18 <rwatkins> like keep silent during a meeting, then show notifications when flipped back over.
Nov 08 05:27:36 <rwatkins> it was there for 2.x.  gone in 3.0
Nov 08 05:28:16 <EricBlade> that is a handy idea.  was it actually implemented like that in the phones?
Nov 08 05:28:40 <summatusmentis> there's so many things that webOS got right
Nov 08 05:28:52 <rwatkins> EricBlade: you should be able to detect the orientation, dont know if anyone has written that for webOS.
Nov 08 05:29:29 <EricBlade> well if it wasn't implemented, it's not like something like that can be implemented from userspace, considering the security model
Nov 08 05:29:34 <rwatkins> i just discovered it was missing from the TP when trying to figure out which way the device was being turned - pitch/roll combined w/ orientation.
Nov 08 05:30:02 <rwatkins> you could likely add it to modeswitcher if its not already there.
Nov 08 05:30:15 <rwatkins> homebrew tho.  or put it just in your own app.
Nov 08 05:31:56 <rwatkins> face up / down was used for a magic 8 ball app written by the NYC webOS dev group a couple yrs ago
Nov 08 05:45:19 <rwatkins> looks like tonight be beta release night again
Nov 08 05:48:12 <DougReeder> How so?
Nov 08 05:48:27 <rwatkins> oh, just for my app
Nov 08 05:48:58 <rwatkins> putting out a new beta, likely fairly close to a new release - enyo on all 2.x devices and TP.
Nov 08 05:50:21 * DougReeder nods
Nov 08 05:52:15 * EricBlade thinks it's kinda neat sitting down and seeing my app running on a TouchPad, a Pre, and in a browser
Nov 08 05:52:22 * DougReeder waves goodnight
Nov 08 05:52:27 <rwatkins> night
Nov 08 05:52:55 <rwatkins> so .. is the performace resonable on a pre?  1.4 much worse than 2.x for enyo?
Nov 08 05:53:14 <rwatkins> have a pre, but need to dig it out and metadoctor to activate
Nov 08 05:53:17 <EricBlade> i should be getting a Pre2 in a day or two
Nov 08 05:53:22 <EricBlade> so i don't have a 2.x device to try it on
Nov 08 05:53:46 <EricBlade> i'd say "reasonable", but i'm not sure i'd love it
Nov 08 05:54:09 <rwatkins> i find enyo runs better on a pre2 than a pre3 - alteast for my app.
Nov 08 05:54:25 <EricBlade> i'm going to try installing some of the enyo sample programs on it, and see if even the most basic of stuff is quick or not
Nov 08 05:56:11 <EricBlade> it looks like it's got the same problem with dashboards, also my app scrim shows up all white, so it looks broken
Nov 08 05:56:28 <EricBlade> and i've got an input area that you can type and type and type in all day, and not ever see anything after the first 10 chars or so
Nov 08 05:56:37 <rwatkins> hm dont use scrims myself.  but ya, the dashboard thing I assume is an opacity issue w/ older webkits.
Nov 08 05:57:32 <EricBlade> hmm. and there's probably not a way to specify a class for the dashboard items, so that we can fix that somehow
Nov 08 05:58:04 <rwatkins> I had to just copy the dashboard code, and modify the files
Nov 08 05:59:36 <rwatkins> I think the edit was in dashboard.css, which is included by the depends.js in the folder w/ dashboard.html
Nov 08 06:01:46 <EricBlade> so, you basically created a whole new dashboard
Nov 08 06:01:47 <EricBlade> ?
Nov 08 06:01:52 <rwatkins> yes
Nov 08 06:02:40 <rwatkins> or more accurately, copied the entire dashboard code, fixed a line of css.
Nov 08 06:03:57 <rwatkins> likely some way to inject my own css in there somehow, but just wasnt interested in that level of hackery for this annoying issue.
Nov 08 06:03:59 <EricBlade> oh, i wonder if i could just make a sub-kind of Dashboard, which uses a sub-kind of DashboardItem that uses a fixed css
Nov 08 06:05:47 <EricBlade> or DashboardLayer
Nov 08 06:06:11 <hewball> EricBlade: so that quote, how does anyone interpret that as in version 2.0 software or 2.0 hardware
Nov 08 06:07:02 <rwatkins> EricBlade: I think you're stuck because Dashboard.js does openDashboard on the indexPath - the .html file
Nov 08 06:08:09 <rwatkins> the fault I think is with the background set in css for the body tag of the base html file.
Nov 08 06:09:24 <EricBlade> hewball: it looked like she was talking about hardware
Nov 08 06:12:01 <rwatkins> @GNU_RMS - I cant tell if the tweets are real RMS, or an "@Fake_RMS"
Nov 08 06:13:24 <dwc-> just for kicks, you can see how all your 2.x pre- users see your app
Nov 08 06:13:33 <dwc-> and meta 2.1 onto it for now
Nov 08 06:13:52 <rwatkins> ha
Nov 08 06:14:25 <rwatkins> I can actually run Paper Mache on the Pre - it just doesnt save the data - no localstorage.  have run it in the emulator.
Nov 08 06:35:47 <PuffTheMagic> dwc-, u had a 386 in your bathroom?
Nov 08 06:36:02 <PuffTheMagic> did the thing even boot before your shit was done?
Nov 08 06:36:32 <EricBlade> I put a VAX in a bathroom once.  though it was a bathroom no one ever used.  there wasn't enough room to use it after putting the VAX in.
Nov 08 06:39:15 <PuffTheMagic> lol
Nov 08 06:41:31 <dwc-> laptop, could go anywhere
Nov 08 06:42:32 <dwc-> the funny thing about old machines is they loaded such less-bloated software on boot it didn't actually take that long
Nov 08 06:43:40 <EricBlade> wow, the dev device program site is ... slooooooooow.
Nov 08 06:46:54 <EricBlade> rwatkins: i don't imagine you fixed the breakage to the dashboard from 3.0.4 while you were in there eh? :)
Nov 08 06:55:51 <rwatkins> EricBlade: what other breakage?
Nov 08 06:56:08 <EricBlade> rwatkins: the thing where it breaks if your dashboard is owned by something other than the main window
Nov 08 06:57:55 <rwatkins> no, I think my dashboard is always opened by my Root non-window
Nov 08 06:58:24 <EricBlade> yeah i think you're right on having to just copy the whole darn thing, since the dashboard itself is pretty much a whole app
Nov 08 06:59:12 <rwatkins> ya, kinda lame, but didnt see another reasonable option without trying to reach deep into the window or the construction code.
Nov 08 06:59:12 <EricBlade> unless...
Nov 08 07:00:10 <rwatkins> you could alos possibly construct your dashboard content to just cover it up perhaps.  at the time I just didnt have time to bother with that.
Nov 08 07:06:09 <EricBlade> omfg i've inserted code in 4 different places to attempt to ensure the app menu opens, and it's still not working reliably
Nov 08 07:09:32 <EricBlade> looks like even thoughi t's set lazy: false, it just plain doesn't exist sometimes
Nov 08 07:09:47 <rwatkins> sounds like a job for enyo.nextTick()
Nov 08 07:15:24 <EricBlade> it doesn't exist on the next tick, or on any other tick that i can reliably tell
Nov 08 07:31:10 <EricBlade> hmm. Toyota quaterly profit "drops" to $1B.  that must hurt.  maybe they could buy webOS
Nov 08 07:51:31 <panel> morning
Nov 08 08:34:45 <EricBlade> hmm. i have reliably figured out how to make the app menu work .. i have to card the app and then bring it back foreground. argh.
Nov 08 10:52:41 <gDD> want to disable accelerometer on HP Veer (2.1.2)
Nov 08 10:53:12 <gDD> really anonying when browsing
Nov 08 10:54:05 <gDD> someone suggested disable it in /dev/**, but don't know the exact name
Nov 08 16:33:24 <HattCzech_work> anyone on today?
Nov 08 16:39:17 <halfhalo> no
Nov 08 16:39:39 <HattCzech_work> okay, good
Nov 08 16:47:42 <panel> hi
Nov 08 17:19:56 <rwatkins-Zzz> ianbeck: re focus and powerscroll - not reasonable to make the hide show of keyboard always manual?
Nov 08 17:25:36 <rwatkins> there is no release production of webos 2.x for the original Pre or Pixi, correct?
Nov 08 17:30:23 <ianbeck> rwatkins: It would be non-ideal, since there are a fair number of places in the app that need keyboard access
Nov 08 17:30:43 <ianbeck> I suppose that would be one alternative that I hadn't considered, though
Nov 08 17:30:55 <rwatkins> ya, manually doing all that would be a pain
Nov 08 17:31:08 <rwatkins> focus/blur everywhere and see how far that gets you
Nov 08 17:32:29 <ianbeck> I'm currently trying to figure if there's a better method for adjusting the scroll position quickly than a two-finger gesture
Nov 08 17:33:02 <ianbeck> Probably would require even more UI, though (*sigh*)
Nov 08 17:33:57 <rwatkins> ya, if finger down is giving you focus and all that grief, I expect UI is likely your only option
Nov 08 17:35:00 <ianbeck> Yeah
Nov 08 17:35:25 <ianbeck> Highly vexing
Nov 08 17:35:26 <rwatkins> maybe single finger swipe from app out to the bevel or somethign, but the only one with some existing user knowledge of (though small) is the two fingered one
Nov 08 17:36:01 <rwatkins> I have two fingered power to top of the lists as well in Paper Mache, but not to the bottom of them yet.
Nov 08 17:36:25 <rwatkins> need to write a more extensive help document now - the 'intro' doc doesnt cut it for everything anymore.
Nov 08 17:36:31 <ianbeck> Heh, yeah
Nov 08 17:36:49 <ianbeck> What I'd really love to do would be to implement pinch to zoom way out, and then allow tapping to zoom into a particular section of the text
Nov 08 17:36:59 <ianbeck> But again, two-finger gestures
Nov 08 17:37:17 <rwatkins> tap to zoom in would be nice.  do that constantly in the browser
Nov 08 17:37:34 <ianbeck> And it's a gesture that's much more guessable than the power swipe
Nov 08 17:37:47 <ianbeck> My non-tech-savvy girlfriend was trying to do it constantly when she first tried the app
Nov 08 17:38:07 <ianbeck> Oh well
Nov 08 17:38:32 <rwatkins> BTW the latest Paper Mache the text is now justified - but only for the TouchPad.  be interested to know if you like reading that way better or not.
Nov 08 17:38:50 <rwatkins> (Beta)
Nov 08 17:38:54 <ianbeck> Generally, I'm not a fan of CSS-based justification just because it's so bad
Nov 08 17:38:57 <ianbeck> But I'll take a look
Nov 08 17:39:23 <ianbeck> For when the interface is not very wide, it would likely make a lot of sense, though
Nov 08 17:39:25 <rwatkins> ya, lemme know.  generally looks poor on the phones.  likely make it a preference
Nov 08 19:14:42 <rwatkins> http://www.theverge.com/2011/11/8/2547488/hp-all-hands-webos-fate
Nov 08 19:16:55 <ianbeck> Scary
Nov 08 19:17:07 <dwc-> not really
Nov 08 19:17:14 <dwc-> par for the course, for the last 3 mo
Nov 08 19:17:19 <rwatkins> as long as its not oracle
Nov 08 19:18:09 <rwatkins> i'd prefer 'we're closing up shop' to sale to them.
Nov 08 19:19:40 <ianbeck> I'd prefer just about anything other than "we are considering our options" :-)
Nov 08 19:20:35 <rwatkins> id take that over oracle
Nov 08 19:21:38 <EricBlade> if someone buys it and does nothing with it, they are abandoning 4m customers.  if hp keeps it and does nothing with it, they are continuing their abandonment of 4m customers.  If Palm's patents were viewed as especially valuable, people would be licensing them from Palm already, or would have made much more obvious attempts to purchase them, i'd think.
Nov 08 19:21:56 <EricBlade> unless the Amazon rumor is true, since that's been going the longest, and maybe they've been just hammering out the finer details since.
Nov 08 19:30:15 <nebj00la> keyword today is rumor/rumour
Nov 08 19:31:34 <eberon_> some finality would be nice, but I think I'd like to be dumped by webOS today, I'm tired of waiting for it, but I won't leave it =p
Nov 08 19:33:15 <NuttyBunny> I feel we went back in time... I feel like I'm in August 18th... *sigh*
Nov 08 19:33:17 <NuttyBunny> Hi all
Nov 08 19:33:18 <EricBlade> what is the difference between the "HP Palm Touchstone Charging Dock" on HP's site for 29.99, and the "HP NA Touchstone Charging Kit" for 41.99 ? anyone know?
Nov 08 19:33:49 <dwc-> direct link?
Nov 08 19:34:03 <dwc-> my guess is the charging dock is *just* the round dock
Nov 08 19:34:10 <NuttyBunny> the charging dock is the touchstone itself, and the kit should come with the AC adapter
Nov 08 19:34:10 <dwc-> and the kit includes a charger and cable
Nov 08 19:34:17 <dwc-> but really, don't buy either one of them
Nov 08 19:34:18 <NuttyBunny> ^^  that
Nov 08 19:34:24 <NuttyBunny> too expensive
Nov 08 19:34:37 <EricBlade> ahhh ok, i see dwc, ok one says use the charger provided with the phone
Nov 08 19:34:37 <dwc-> don't pay more than $5 for a touchstone dock
Nov 08 19:34:51 <EricBlade> yeah i was exploring the options before exploring the prices
Nov 08 19:36:00 <EricBlade> so, the same touchstone is good for all the models of pres, although apparently the original pre requires a "touchstone back cover"?
Nov 08 19:36:11 <NuttyBunny> correct
Nov 08 19:36:36 <dwc-> +pixi
Nov 08 19:37:13 <EricBlade> i should probably wait till after tonight to order any new stuff, maybe everything goes dark tonight
Nov 08 19:37:17 <dwc-> (also requires a touchstone back)
Nov 08 19:37:32 <dwc-> and +veer (comes with touchstone back)
Nov 08 19:37:50 <EricBlade> it also says the veer "requires HP power charger"
Nov 08 19:38:10 <dwc-> mmm, yea, I think so
Nov 08 19:38:26 <dwc-> I've only pulled the USB cable out of my veer box
Nov 08 19:39:02 <dwc-> but if the included power cable ends in the magnetic connector, yes you will need something (either a microusb cable or an actual power charger)
Nov 08 19:39:11 <EricBlade> so, what's the best deal out there on touchpad touchstones, any ideas?
Nov 08 19:39:49 <dwc-> http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/store/accessory?action=accessoryDetails&archetypeId=11901&accessoryId=44727 is probably the best deal on a phone touchstone dock
Nov 08 19:40:43 <dwc-> (and you can use the 2A touchpad charger with it just fine)
Nov 08 19:40:59 <EricBlade> i had no idea that Verizon was still selling Pre 2
Nov 08 19:43:24 <EricBlade> do the phones also have the ability to remember each touchstone, and run different apps on them?   and now to find a "back cover" for this pre
Nov 08 19:43:42 <rwatkins> no
Nov 08 19:44:19 <NuttyBunny> it was planned for the Pre3 touchstones but they never saw the light of the day
Nov 08 19:44:39 <fxspec06> okay so when is this meeting?
Nov 08 19:44:42 <NuttyBunny> anyone knows how much will we have to wait to know what happens in "the meeting"?
Nov 08 19:44:45 <NuttyBunny> hahaha
Nov 08 19:45:15 <EricBlade> but should i ever land with a Pre3, the one for the other phones does work with it
Nov 08 19:45:26 <rwatkins> EricBlade: yes
Nov 08 19:45:39 <dwc-> yep, pre3 works on the phone touchstone
Nov 08 19:45:48 <EricBlade> very nice.
Nov 08 19:46:06 <rwatkins> but not so good on the touchpad touchstone
Nov 08 19:46:38 <dwc-> slides down and falls off the bottom perch?
Nov 08 19:46:49 * NuttyBunny goes and tries
Nov 08 19:47:37 <rwatkins> actually sits up ok, but no connection.
Nov 08 19:47:53 <dwc-> yea, the charging coils are different
Nov 08 19:48:57 <nebj00la> i must admit, the veer is great to hold
Nov 08 19:49:15 <fxspec06> i know. it feels like 2 billion dollars
Nov 08 19:49:22 <nebj00la> certainly does
Nov 08 19:49:26 <nebj00la> i was skeptical
Nov 08 19:49:39 <NuttyBunny> NO WAY!!!!
Nov 08 19:49:42 <NuttyBunny> HAHAHAHAHAHA
Nov 08 19:49:44 <fxspec06> my pre 2 feels like another 2 billion. my touchpad... that feels like 10 billion dollars.
Nov 08 19:49:57 <NuttyBunny> The Pre3 IS CHARGING ON THE TOUCHPAD TOUCHSTONE!
Nov 08 19:50:21 <nebj00la> pre3 feels like 20 bucks when the two layers flop
Nov 08 19:50:27 <nebj00la> otherwise 3 million
Nov 08 19:52:50 <EricBlade> ok, and so the pre2 will just go straight to the touchstone without any adapters, covers, or what not
Nov 08 19:52:54 <dwc-> correct
Nov 08 19:54:59 <NuttyBunny> oh man... chuqui has left... Adora isn't here either...
Nov 08 19:55:05 * NuttyBunny worries
Nov 08 19:56:11 <EricBlade> hm. of course, that verizon link for $5 on the touchstones doesn't work, i hit "add to cart" and it says "Please select what model you'd like accessories for", and so I try again, andi t leads me to headsets.
Nov 08 19:57:47 <EricBlade> battery compatibility, i'm guessing that Pre and Pre2 are different?
Nov 08 19:57:53 <dwc-> no
Nov 08 19:58:17 <dwc-> (some) treos, centro, pre, pre2, all the same battery
Nov 08 19:58:32 <dwc-> pre3 is different, veer is different
Nov 08 19:58:41 <EricBlade> really? i'm seeing pixi/pre batts for $3
Nov 08 19:58:59 <dwc-> pixi I'm not certain
Nov 08 19:59:08 <dwc-> see if it's the same model #
Nov 08 19:59:10 <EricBlade> http://www.amazon.com/Palm-Standard-Battery-Pixi-Pre/dp/B002CMITYI/ref=pd_bxgy_cps_text_c
Nov 08 19:59:39 <dwc-> http://store.precentral.net/palm-standard-battery/8A37A5627.htm
Nov 08 19:59:51 <dwc-> I was going to pull palm, but P|C is close enough
Nov 08 20:00:04 <dwc-> (I trust them to be right more than some random amazon seller)
Nov 08 20:00:25 <EricBlade> i think i'll take a gamble on $3
Nov 08 20:00:51 <EricBlade> hoping for a future for webOS
Nov 08 20:06:40 <fxspec06> you know it can't be good when chuqi wins
Nov 08 20:06:44 <fxspec06> leaves*********
Nov 08 20:07:00 * fxspec06 didn't say wins, he said leaves
Nov 08 20:07:58 <NuttyBunny> you know it MUST be good when chuqui wins ;)
Nov 08 20:08:30 * NuttyBunny takes his Pre3 off the touchpad touchstone, it did charge.. funny
Nov 08 20:12:11 <fxspec06> you know what's funny? comedians.
Nov 08 20:16:53 <EricBlade> hmm. looks like $40 is the cheapest touchpad stone out there
Nov 08 20:36:28 <NuttyBunny> Do a barrel rool!
Nov 08 20:36:30 <NuttyBunny> roll!
Nov 08 20:36:31 <NuttyBunny> argh
Nov 08 20:36:36 <NuttyBunny> Do a barrel roll!
Nov 08 20:36:45 <NuttyBunny> it doesn't work here ;)
Nov 08 20:40:07 <fxspec06> Do a barrel roll again!
Nov 08 20:43:32 <NuttyBunny> 4:30pm Pacific time
Nov 08 20:55:17 <PuffTheMagic> http://www.webosroundup.com/2011/11/all-hands-meeting-tonight-for-remaining-webos-employees-likely-to-announce-future/
Nov 08 20:55:22 <PuffTheMagic> ^^ its judgement day
Nov 08 20:55:50 <rwhitby> it's been judgement day so many times before that I take that with a grain of salt
Nov 08 20:56:39 <rwhitby> "dear employees, I've gathered you here today to let you know that the executive team is working hard to determine the future for webOS. We ask you to be strong and hold to the course while our 19 determination teams report their results in the coming weeks"
Nov 08 20:57:14 <PuffTheMagic> lol
Nov 08 20:57:28 <wrea> lol
Nov 08 20:58:43 <PuffTheMagic> i wonder what RIM would do with webos
Nov 08 20:58:44 <wrea> I'd like to be the 20th team
Nov 08 20:58:51 <PuffTheMagic> add java back?
Nov 08 20:59:03 <summatusmentis> PuffTheMagic: we could only hope that they'd get rid of their fake webOS
Nov 08 20:59:25 <Shadyman> summatusmentis: FakeOS?
Nov 08 20:59:32 <PuffTheMagic> QNX
Nov 08 20:59:39 <PuffTheMagic> QNX == fauxWEBOS
Nov 08 20:59:49 <summatusmentis> Shadyman: whatever they run on the playbook
Nov 08 21:00:43 <PuffTheMagic> IF they replaced QNX with webOS that could be a potential positive of a sale
Nov 08 21:00:52 <PuffTheMagic> it means we could get hardware keyboards again
Nov 08 21:01:06 <PuffTheMagic> good hardware keyboards
Nov 08 21:01:18 <summatusmentis> it's more likely they'd try and merge the two
Nov 08 21:01:23 <summatusmentis> I would guess
Nov 08 21:01:47 <PuffTheMagic> they have less apps than webos though
Nov 08 21:01:57 <PuffTheMagic> there would be no point in merging them
Nov 08 21:02:23 <summatusmentis> wasn't the playbook recently deemed "secure enough for the US government"?
Nov 08 21:02:48 <wrea> yeah, for unclassified but secure comm afaik
Nov 08 21:03:02 <PuffTheMagic> back in 2009 i was at a human factors conference, a few months after Pre- launch, I was at a talk given by someone from RIM, and they were REALLY WORRIED about webos
Nov 08 21:03:11 <PuffTheMagic> and really liked what it bought to the table
Nov 08 21:04:26 <summatusmentis> they should've been REALLY WORRIED about iOS
Nov 08 21:04:37 <summatusmentis> since, you know, that's where they're losing their market
Nov 08 21:05:24 <dwc-> hmm, the rumor I hear is that there is no company-wide all-hands... might be an all-GBU one though
Nov 08 21:05:46 <PuffTheMagic> what is that like 3 people?
Nov 08 21:06:13 <dwc-> after the layoffs and the people leaving, yea, sounds about right
Nov 08 21:09:27 <PatrickC> hey..
Nov 08 21:09:35 <PatrickC> im wanting the dropdown menu in my app
Nov 08 21:09:38 <PatrickC> whats it called again?
Nov 08 21:09:42 <PatrickC> not the appmenu lol
Nov 08 21:11:05 <PatrickC> ah. think i found it
Nov 08 21:12:18 <PatrickC> nvm
Nov 08 21:12:36 <dawm_> popup menu
Nov 08 21:12:48 <PatrickC> thanks
Nov 08 21:13:02 <PatrickC> dont see that as an option.. enyo
Nov 08 21:13:16 <dawm_> mojo ftw
Nov 08 21:13:19 <dawm_> beetchs
Nov 08 21:13:25 <PatrickC> lolo
Nov 08 21:14:21 <PatrickC> dawm_, hows ailium coming?
Nov 08 21:14:28 <dawm_> dunno
Nov 08 21:14:36 <dawm_> waiting for more ram so photoshop doesnt die on me again
Nov 08 21:14:42 <PatrickC> lol
Nov 08 21:17:29 <PatrickC> hmm.. cant find anything in the docs :/
Nov 08 21:26:05 <NuttyBunny> Style matters - panels - submenus, is that what you're looking for?
Nov 08 21:26:16 <PatrickC> lemme look
Nov 08 21:26:21 <PatrickC> havent looked at stylematters yet
Nov 08 21:26:38 <rwatkins> read the API docs, try the components - https://developer.palm.com/content/api/reference/enyo/enyo-api-reference.html#enyo.Menu
Nov 08 21:29:01 <NuttyBunny> enyo.PopupSelect is the one used in style matters as well
Nov 08 21:31:25 <leiru> hu
Nov 08 21:32:32 <PatrickC> rwatkins, was looking for pickers
Nov 08 21:33:36 <PatrickC> hmm.. now i have the code for the style, now to make it work how i want it..
Nov 08 21:33:56 <PatrickC> now, webOS works with XML?
Nov 08 21:36:40 <rwatkins> they dont call it XMLHttpRequest for nothing
Nov 08 21:39:54 <NuttyBunny> enyo.xhrGet and enyo.xhrPost perhaps :)
Nov 08 21:40:11 <calcmandan_phone> Anyone have a spy report from the big meeting in sunnyvale?
Nov 08 21:40:29 <rwatkins> the one that started at most 9 minutes ago?
Nov 08 21:41:06 <PatrickC> NuttyBunny, rwatkins heh.. didnt see those.. :/
Nov 08 21:41:23 <NuttyBunny> ctrl-f is your friend my friend ;)
Nov 08 21:41:44 <NuttyBunny> I only searched xml in the api reference page
Nov 08 21:41:50 <PatrickC> yeah.. i should use that more often...
Nov 08 21:42:09 <PatrickC> but i also didnt know if it was better for me to use an XML to JSON convertor
Nov 08 21:42:16 <PatrickC> so i was looking up those
Nov 08 21:42:23 <calcmandan_phone> I thought it started at 1pm
Nov 08 21:42:23 <calcmandan_phone> Ok
Nov 08 21:42:23 <calcmandan_phone> Sorry I'm a bit anxious
Nov 08 21:42:33 <EricBlade> I saw 4:30 Central time, not Eastern time
Nov 08 21:42:39 <EricBlade> er, Pacific
Nov 08 21:42:47 <rwatkins> oh
Nov 08 21:42:49 <PatrickC> EricBlade, yeah, i think thats when it ends
Nov 08 21:42:55 * NuttyBunny needs to eat something... oh, well, while dropbox upload a 1mb file... one stupid megabyte, and it's been like 10 mins.. argh
Nov 08 21:42:56 <PatrickC> or is that when it starts?
Nov 08 21:43:06 <NuttyBunny> starts at 4:30 pacific
Nov 08 21:43:25 <NuttyBunny> less than 3 hours from now
Nov 08 21:43:53 <rwatkins> I assumed 430 was EST as they said "after market close"
Nov 08 21:44:06 <EricBlade> c-net mentions that potential buyers include Amazon, RIM, IBM, Intel, no mention of Oracle
Nov 08 21:44:33 <summatusmentis> all "potential buyers" things are rumors
Nov 08 21:44:51 <calcmandan_phone> Mh hmm
Nov 08 21:47:04 <dawm_> https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/learnmore
Nov 08 21:50:53 <PatrickC> hmm.. how would i turn the following into a function for webOS?
Nov 08 21:50:53 <PatrickC> function xmlToJson(xml) {
Nov 08 21:51:09 <PatrickC> would i have it 'xmlToJson function (xml) {'
Nov 08 21:51:26 <fxspec06> you would include it and then call it.. ?
Nov 08 21:52:02 <PatrickC> changed it to '	xmlToJson function(xml) {
Nov 08 21:52:02 <PatrickC> ' and still get an error
Nov 08 21:52:07 <fxspec06> not sure what you mean, "function for webOS" ........
Nov 08 21:52:36 <PatrickC> cause when it was 'function xmlToJson(xml)' i was getting errors
Nov 08 21:52:39 <fxspec06> you can define functions in many ways. pretty sure you're having a problem with scope
Nov 08 21:52:40 <Shadyman> fxspec06: I think PatrickC is trying to define a function in enyo
Nov 08 21:52:50 <PatrickC> Shadyman, exactly
Nov 08 21:52:54 <fxspec06> well, you can include a function anywhere.
Nov 08 21:53:02 <PatrickC> fxspec06, i know
Nov 08 21:53:07 <PatrickC> but this one makes enyo error
Nov 08 21:53:12 <fxspec06> if you write a function in a separate file, and include it, you can call it and pass whatever variables you want to it
Nov 08 21:53:26 <fxspec06> so that would be a "function for webOS"
Nov 08 21:53:36 <fxspec06> you can also append it to the end after an enyo.kind
Nov 08 21:53:41 <rwatkins> #webos has devolved into "how to write a function" ?
Nov 08 21:53:48 <PatrickC> http://pastebin.com/BZ3w3QXD
Nov 08 21:53:51 <fxspec06> you can create window functions etc. there's zillions of ways to write functions
Nov 08 21:54:12 <fxspec06> you can hide a function inside a function. or inside a variable. or a temp variable.
Nov 08 21:54:42 * fxspec06 blew his own mind again. back to doing law homework
Nov 08 21:55:01 <rwatkins> http://eloquentjavascript.net/chapter6.html
Nov 08 21:55:43 <PatrickC> rwatkins, i know how to write a function, but i want to know why mine is erroring out
Nov 08 21:55:51 <fxspec06> damn you rwatkins. why must you post things that i absolutely cannot live without reading further
Nov 08 21:56:08 <Shadyman> lol
Nov 08 21:56:20 <Shadyman> fxspec06: Solution: Don't click on links from rwatkins ;)
Nov 08 21:56:25 <PatrickC> lol
Nov 08 21:56:53 <rwatkins> or install Instapaper and "Read it Later"  tada!
Nov 08 21:56:56 <fxspec06> i didn't click it. i had to drag my mouse and then paste it in my browser
Nov 08 21:57:36 <fxspec06> crimestoppers.com << awesome website
Nov 08 21:58:19 <PatrickC> ah, fixed my own issue
Nov 08 21:58:49 <VICODANAX> anyone else notice worse battery life on 3.04?
Nov 08 21:58:50 <PatrickC> forgot the : .... hate those peskey things :P
Nov 08 21:58:57 <VICODANAX> I think im going to doctor 3.02
Nov 08 21:59:03 <PatrickC> VICODANAX, i havent noticed that yet
Nov 08 21:59:11 <VICODANAX> yeah there's a thread on xda about it
Nov 08 21:59:13 <summatusmentis> PatrickC: I wondered about that
Nov 08 21:59:18 <VICODANAX> i didnt notice it at first
Nov 08 21:59:19 <summatusmentis> but I know nothing about JS
Nov 08 21:59:19 <VICODANAX> but i am now
Nov 08 21:59:28 <PatrickC> summatusmentis, srsly?
Nov 08 21:59:49 <summatusmentis> well, compared to your other function declarations, there wasn't a :
Nov 08 21:59:54 <PatrickC> yeah
Nov 08 22:00:05 <summatusmentis> but yes, I don't know Js
Nov 08 22:00:11 <PatrickC> now.. to figure out why it doesnt pre-populate now.. when it did before
Nov 08 22:00:13 <summatusmentis> I also don't do webOS dev
Nov 08 22:00:18 <PatrickC> summatusmentis, wow.. thought u did for some reason
Nov 08 22:00:30 <summatusmentis> I've stared a couple of different times
Nov 08 22:00:33 <PatrickC> ah
Nov 08 22:00:38 <summatusmentis> just never had the time to follow through
Nov 08 22:00:47 <summatusmentis> besides, I know what an if-statement is :)
Nov 08 22:01:06 <PatrickC> haha
Nov 08 22:01:09 <PatrickC> i do now :P
Nov 08 22:01:17 <PatrickC> and an else if, and an else ;)
Nov 08 22:02:08 <halfhalo> what about.... a switch statement!
Nov 08 22:02:10 <PatrickC> hmm.. this is going to prove more difficult then i thought it would
Nov 08 22:02:21 <PatrickC> halfhalo, 'switch.... case...
Nov 08 22:02:22 <PatrickC> ?
Nov 08 22:02:31 <PatrickC> :)
Nov 08 22:02:53 <halfhalo> damn...
Nov 08 22:03:49 <PatrickC> i /somewhat/ understand them. not as much as i should
Nov 08 22:03:55 <PatrickC> but i have the basic knowledge of them
Nov 08 22:04:00 <PatrickC> unlike i used to with if/else :)
Nov 08 22:05:24 <fxspec06> switch .. case >> tell your mom to go to the store, instead of telling her to look in the refridgerator to figure out whether to go to the store or not :)
Nov 08 22:05:58 <dawm_> omg you suck PatrickC
Nov 08 22:06:04 <PatrickC> dawm_, what?
Nov 08 22:06:17 <dawm_> switch case > long if and else
Nov 08 22:07:37 <fxspec06> switch case assigns memory addresses to the switch. if / else evaluates each expression until returned true. one is supah fast and the other can be ... slow.
Nov 08 22:07:50 <fxspec06> and #webos is now #javascript
Nov 08 22:08:06 <rwatkins> #thefuture is now #javascript
Nov 08 22:08:53 <fxspec06> #javascript is #underrated
Nov 08 22:09:03 * halfhalo bets people dunnos what var x=0,y=true,z="red"; if(y,z=(x>10)?z="orange":z="apple"){return z;}else{return "blue"}; returns
Nov 08 22:10:01 <fxspec06> apple
Nov 08 22:10:28 <rwatkins> returns 'illegal return statement'
Nov 08 22:10:30 <fxspec06> false
Nov 08 22:10:33 <summatusmentis> what is the y,z syntax?
Nov 08 22:10:34 <fxspec06> illegal^
Nov 08 22:10:36 <fxspec06> there
Nov 08 22:10:48 <fxspec06> z cannot equal an expression
Nov 08 22:10:55 <halfhalo> bah!
Nov 08 22:11:00 <halfhalo> semantics
Nov 08 22:11:10 <fxspec06> f that, who would write that junk.
Nov 08 22:11:36 <fxspec06> lets make y = true, then put if(y)
Nov 08 22:11:56 <summatusmentis> you can't do y,z ?
Nov 08 22:12:02 <summatusmentis> I'm confused
Nov 08 22:12:14 <halfhalo> the if(y,z) syntax executes both the y and z parts of it no matter what, so if you go if(y,foo()), foo() would be run
Nov 08 22:12:23 <summatusmentis> I see
Nov 08 22:13:12 <fxspec06> so would it return blue then error
Nov 08 22:13:37 <fxspec06> red* then error
Nov 08 22:14:02 <rwatkins> but if only executes if foo() returns true
Nov 08 22:14:18 <summatusmentis> (x>10) won't evaluate and assign z the value?
Nov 08 22:14:49 <fxspec06> halfhalo just said the if executes twice. so it would be like a dual if statement.
Nov 08 22:15:12 <summatusmentis> no
Nov 08 22:15:20 <summatusmentis> it's still a single if statement
Nov 08 22:15:35 <rwatkins> z gets the return of z="apple"
Nov 08 22:16:23 <summatusmentis> rwatkins: right, because (x>10) evaluates to false
Nov 08 22:16:35 <fxspec06> right, z evaluates to apple. but z is never returned
Nov 08 22:17:05 <summatusmentis> z is never returned why? if(y,"apple") doesn't evaluate to true?
Nov 08 22:17:19 <fxspec06> z=(x>10) --- this is not a comparison
Nov 08 22:17:34 <fxspec06> this sets z to the expresssion (x>10) which is false
Nov 08 22:17:47 <fxspec06> then the rest of that mini if statement is illegal.
Nov 08 22:17:53 <fxspec06> right?
Nov 08 22:18:14 <summatusmentis> fxspec06: somthing?x:y is a short-hand if-else check
Nov 08 22:18:38 <fxspec06> yeah but the way that is written, sets z to (x>10). ther is no denying that
Nov 08 22:18:45 <summatusmentis> yes
Nov 08 22:18:52 <summatusmentis> but wouldn't (x>10) evaluate?
Nov 08 22:18:53 <fxspec06> that happens before the evaluation. so basically...
Nov 08 22:19:13 <fxspec06> false?z="orange":z="apple"
Nov 08 22:19:14 <summatusmentis> it happens before evaluation?
Nov 08 22:19:28 <summatusmentis> right, which sets z="apple"
Nov 08 22:19:40 <fxspec06> k so it ends up being apple anyways.
Nov 08 22:19:56 <fxspec06> ugh i must go run that
Nov 08 22:19:59 <fxspec06> any takers
Nov 08 22:20:10 <halfhalo> there is a 110% chance I screwed up typing the ?: thing.  because thats how I roll
Nov 08 22:20:20 <summatusmentis> and the y,z section evaluates, and return value is "apple"
Nov 08 22:20:24 <rwatkins> z=(x>10)?z="orange":z="apple" returns 'apple'
Nov 08 22:20:24 <summatusmentis> as I understand this
Nov 08 22:20:32 <fxspec06> halfhalo: not many ppl like you right now
Nov 08 22:20:53 <halfhalo> and I am ok with that!
Nov 08 22:20:57 <summatusmentis> rwatkins: and if(y,'apple') evaluates true
Nov 08 22:20:58 <summatusmentis> ?
Nov 08 22:21:32 <rwatkins> yes
Nov 08 22:21:37 <fxspec06> 'apple' is not nothing, so apple would be true.. therefore
Nov 08 22:21:43 <NuttyBunny> Orange Apple ?
Nov 08 22:21:48 <rwatkins> 'apple' is a string.
Nov 08 22:21:49 <fxspec06> the return would be Z. which is apple
Nov 08 22:21:56 <rwatkins> apple is a variable
Nov 08 22:22:12 <fxspec06> yeah it's a string but it's a string that is not equal to nothing
Nov 08 22:22:27 <rwatkins> ok, yes, its a non-empty string.
Nov 08 22:22:43 <PatrickC> anyone who wants to see YourRadio so far, https://www.box.net/shared/zngqzh3yiyd14pt0pm4q
Nov 08 22:22:44 <PatrickC> bbl
Nov 08 22:22:54 * halfhalo laughs evily
Nov 08 22:22:56 <summatusmentis> I'm familiar with js syntax enough
Nov 08 22:22:58 <fxspec06> PatrickC: you following all this? you could maybe learn something
Nov 08 22:23:01 <summatusmentis> but this makes sense to me
Nov 08 22:23:07 <summatusmentis> I'm not familiar*
Nov 08 22:24:58 <halfhalo> you know how x&&y means "evaluate both x and y" and x||y is "if x, then y"? x,y is "evaluate x, then no matter what it is, evaluate y"
Nov 08 22:25:18 <fxspec06> yes
Nov 08 22:25:33 <fxspec06> hm
Nov 08 22:25:50 <summatusmentis> wait, x||y is "if x, then y"?
Nov 08 22:25:52 <summatusmentis> really?
Nov 08 22:26:10 <fxspec06> it's or. he meant to say or
Nov 08 22:26:23 <summatusmentis> these are semantically different
Nov 08 22:26:27 <summatusmentis> and importantly so
Nov 08 22:26:30 <halfhalo> dur
Nov 08 22:26:32 <halfhalo> I mean or
Nov 08 22:26:39 * halfhalo is having one of those days
Nov 08 22:27:06 <summatusmentis> so were some of my students
Nov 08 22:27:10 <fxspec06> hm so what would be the point of that. i guess it's like, an if within an if. you can tell it to do something without writing an entirely new line.
Nov 08 22:27:10 <NuttyBunny> I will go with "orange", because it returns that and therefore exits the function :)
Nov 08 22:27:15 <fxspec06> so would that be an and or an or
Nov 08 22:27:42 <fxspec06> halfhalo: when does the if(x,y) evaluate?
Nov 08 22:27:43 <summatusmentis> they wrote their code in lab, and then were like "why doesn't it work?!?"
Nov 08 22:27:48 <summatusmentis> and I was all "you didn't print it"
Nov 08 22:28:16 <halfhalo> fxspec06 what do you mean when?
Nov 08 22:28:40 <fxspec06> does one or both need to be true? because it's not && and it's not ||
Nov 08 22:29:00 <fxspec06> oh
Nov 08 22:29:21 <fxspec06> it's an && that evaluates both?
Nov 08 22:29:39 <halfhalo> iirc, yes
Nov 08 22:29:39 <dawm_> || is or
Nov 08 22:31:00 <halfhalo> another example of the , operator is var x=1,y=2,z=3;
Nov 08 22:31:25 * fxspec06 figured that out while back <3
Nov 08 22:32:58 <NuttyBunny> ok, 4:30!!! I don't care it's on another timezone, I want good news now!!
Nov 08 22:33:16 <Shadyman> NuttyBunny: Good news is 4:20
Nov 08 22:33:19 <fxspec06> NuttyBunny: you want good news? legally you'll get paid this month!
Nov 08 22:33:21 <Shadyman> 4:30 is bad news
Nov 08 22:34:30 <NuttyBunny> fxspec06: Well, they (my employer) did lag on the payment, it was supposed to be on the 31th, and it was till last friday ;)
Nov 08 22:35:05 <fxspec06> tisk, tisk.
Nov 08 22:58:39 <fxspec06> https://twitter.com/#!/joshuatopolsky/status/134041663927631873
Nov 08 22:59:19 <summatusmentis> "wild stuff" means nothing
Nov 08 22:59:34 <PuffTheMagic> hes an ass clown
Nov 08 22:59:40 <dwc-> means "come send more eyeballs to our website so we get more revenue"
Nov 08 22:59:57 <summatusmentis> he may actually know something
Nov 08 23:00:04 <summatusmentis> the verge were the first to report the all hands meeting
Nov 08 23:00:44 <fxspec06> PuffTheMagic: i agree, but he may know something.
Nov 08 23:00:53 <dwc-> except the (non-palm) HP people I know said, "what meeting?"
Nov 08 23:01:00 <fxspec06> (and he's a good writer)
Nov 08 23:01:24 <akanster> Won't someone think of the printers?!
Nov 08 23:01:28 <summatusmentis> dwc-: maybe they're supposed to?
Nov 08 23:01:40 <summatusmentis> maybe it's an all-GBU-hands meeting
Nov 08 23:01:41 <dwc-> more likely, I think it'd be a palm gbu meeting
Nov 08 23:01:57 * NuttyBunny goes to his bed and curls in fetal position
Nov 08 23:02:08 <fxspec06> NuttyBunny: don't forget to suck on your thumb
Nov 08 23:02:10 * akanster hopes for some good news.
Nov 08 23:02:31 <NuttyBunny> fxspec06: mmm... I should wash my hands first ;)
Nov 08 23:02:36 <PuffTheMagic> NuttyBunny, watch out of the Grapeist http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fqq051BU2MY
Nov 08 23:02:54 <summatusmentis> akanster: if there's _real_ good news, I might be able to be convinced to stay w/ webOS
Nov 08 23:03:18 <akanster> stay as a dev or as a user?
Nov 08 23:03:20 <summatusmentis> I'm really tired of "thing happened, _maybe_ it's good news"
Nov 08 23:03:24 <PuffTheMagic> summatusmentis, me and my pixi have been waiting for years for "good news"
Nov 08 23:03:27 <summatusmentis> akanster: mostly user, I don't really dev
Nov 08 23:03:37 <fxspec06> something something false hope, something something been through this before
Nov 08 23:03:40 <summatusmentis> not to say I won't
Nov 08 23:04:20 <NuttyBunny> PuffTheMagic, hehehe... grapes people in the mouth.. killer :)
Nov 08 23:05:56 <halfhalo> oh silly vzw pre3 people.  thinking the phone will actually work.
Nov 08 23:07:19 * halfhalo pulls out his fully functioning vzw pre3 with tmo sim and goes to browse the web
Nov 08 23:07:53 * PuffTheMagic passes halfhalo a bowl of dicks
Nov 08 23:08:11 <summatusmentis> lolol
Nov 08 23:08:46 <fxspec06> i can't believe i just read that
Nov 08 23:08:57 <NuttyBunny> hehehe
Nov 08 23:08:59 <akanster> haha
Nov 08 23:09:00 <fxspec06> my imagination is scarred for life
Nov 08 23:09:01 <dwc-> puff, get a sim card already
Nov 08 23:09:48 <PuffTheMagic> dwc-, i dont need a sim card, i can just doctor it and skip the sim card nag screen
Nov 08 23:10:34 <akanster> speaking of bowl of dicks - http://twitter.com/#!/FINALLEVEL/status/11830397783
Nov 08 23:11:00 <summatusmentis> did you search twitter for "bowl of dicks"?
Nov 08 23:11:16 <akanster> lol, I remember that Ice-T diss
Nov 08 23:14:54 <NuttyBunny> http://eatabowlofdick.   com  <-- disgusting.. hahahaha (don't)
Nov 08 23:14:56 <summatusmentis> so, wild speculation: what if Google buys webOS? they get patents+web technology mobile OS+matias duarte's baby back
Nov 08 23:15:23 <NuttyBunny> they strip webOS and place things here and there inside android
Nov 08 23:15:30 <summatusmentis> related: "matias duarte's baby back baby back baby back"
Nov 08 23:15:32 <summatusmentis> NuttyBunny: indeed
Nov 08 23:15:36 <fxspec06> uhm. well. if google were to buy webos, i would probably say that uhm. i would be torn
Nov 08 23:16:46 <PuffTheMagic> i really drag this place down dont I
Nov 08 23:17:01 <summatusmentis> in terms of quality of conversation? probably ;)
Nov 08 23:17:38 <fxspec06> i wouldn't mind seeing webos tied into android. like, webos and android merging to create the ultimate OS. one os to rule them all
Nov 08 23:17:56 <fxspec06> i mean, that's what webos was supposed to become, right? people want android with webos cards and beauty
Nov 08 23:18:01 <PuffTheMagic> my predictions in order of likelyhood: MS, RIM, Amazon, Sony, HTC
Nov 08 23:18:12 <summatusmentis> you think MS is more likely than RIM?
Nov 08 23:18:13 <summatusmentis> interesting
Nov 08 23:18:28 <akanster> trying to hold a 4.3" phone in one hand and swipe up would be virtually impossible.
Nov 08 23:18:51 <fxspec06> i don't think MS is closely related to webos, but i think they would be a potential buyer. not sure if they would do it right, however
Nov 08 23:18:52 <summatusmentis> akanster: might lead to some sanity in phone sizes
Nov 08 23:18:52 <Clark008> I think htc already said no
Nov 08 23:19:08 <summatusmentis> Clark008: that's just speculation
Nov 08 23:19:13 <summatusmentis> nothing has been confirmed
Nov 08 23:19:21 <PuffTheMagic> MS would buy it for the IP case closed
Nov 08 23:19:26 <PuffTheMagic> never to make a device with it
Nov 08 23:19:37 <fxspec06> akanster: it's too bad android requires a massive screen size to be enjoyable (from what I've heard anyways)
Nov 08 23:19:44 <summatusmentis> I suppose that's true PuffTheMagic
Nov 08 23:19:54 <PuffTheMagic> QNX is a dead rip off of webOS so RIM could potentially make devices with it
Nov 08 23:19:58 <akanster> dunno if they require it... feels like an arms race to me
Nov 08 23:20:06 <PuffTheMagic> Amazon would kill it
Nov 08 23:20:14 <PuffTheMagic> Sony would kill HB
Nov 08 23:20:14 <summatusmentis> PuffTheMagic: that's maybe why I think RIM might be more likely than MS
Nov 08 23:20:20 <PuffTheMagic> and then kill the OS with a shit device
Nov 08 23:20:24 <Clark008> I thought the ceo said they're not interested
Nov 08 23:20:25 <fxspec06> amazon wouldn't know what to do with it. RIM would be solid choice
Nov 08 23:20:37 <PuffTheMagic> Clark008, gotta take what any of them say with a grain of salt
Nov 08 23:20:44 <fxspec06> don't want Sony to touch it
Nov 08 23:20:46 <summatusmentis> meh, I don't want to be a blackberry user :-P
Nov 08 23:20:55 <Clark008> if qnx is ripoff (and it is), rim don't need to spend anymore for webos
Nov 08 23:20:59 <fxspec06> HTC would be a top pick..
Nov 08 23:21:17 <fxspec06> webOS would benefit RIM in a huge way. don't count them out
Nov 08 23:21:38 <Clark008> they already spent on qnx, it would be a redundant purchase
Nov 08 23:21:50 <PuffTheMagic> Clark008, its a shitty rip off, and webos had more apps than qnx
Nov 08 23:21:52 <summatusmentis> look at how well qnx is going for them though
Nov 08 23:21:55 <fxspec06> not exactly
Nov 08 23:21:57 <NuttyBunny> woohooooo!!! :D  https://twitter.com/#!/sketch42_/status/134046642864267264
Nov 08 23:21:58 <Clark008> oh for sure
Nov 08 23:22:01 <Clark008> <3 webos
Nov 08 23:22:24 <Clark008> I dont' think webos is going to sell
Nov 08 23:22:27 <summatusmentis> NuttyBunny: you're kidding I assume
Nov 08 23:22:31 <Clark008> hp bought them for 1.2b
Nov 08 23:22:35 <summatusmentis> oh, I see
Nov 08 23:22:35 <PuffTheMagic> NuttyBunny, STFU! u cant quote PC
Nov 08 23:22:39 <Clark008> and they're not just going to give it away again
Nov 08 23:22:40 <summatusmentis> I didn't follow the link all the way through
Nov 08 23:22:49 <NuttyBunny> summatusmentis: He asked, I answered
Nov 08 23:22:54 <summatusmentis> yeah
Nov 08 23:23:02 <Clark008> they'll probably disperse its tech to the rest of the company
Nov 08 23:23:08 <PuffTheMagic> RIM needs to webOS to proctect it self from HP
Nov 08 23:23:10 <Clark008> probably on an enterprise level with their arm servers
Nov 08 23:23:20 <NuttyBunny> PuffTheMagic, we need to have some fun here :S   the suspense is killing me
Nov 08 23:23:24 <summatusmentis> gohometime
Nov 08 23:23:38 <Clark008> not for less than 1.2b
Nov 08 23:23:55 <PuffTheMagic> NuttyBunny, the suspense for what, the biggest let down in webos history?
Nov 08 23:23:59 <Clark008> which the value dropped because of the firesale debacle
Nov 08 23:24:21 <Clark008> it's a big loss if hp sells it, so they'll probably make use of its patents within elsewhere in the company
Nov 08 23:24:21 <NuttyBunny> PuffTheMagic, yep, I know, everything has been bad news since Feb. 9 :(
Nov 08 23:24:42 <PuffTheMagic> everything has been bad news since 2009/06/06
Nov 08 23:25:01 <Clark008> they'll probably replace some of the tech they're licensing with webos
Nov 08 23:25:08 <Clark008> like quickweb and touchsmart software
Nov 08 23:25:17 <Clark008> use in house, save money
Nov 08 23:26:40 <NuttyBunny> PuffTheMagic: even worse news around here... stuck on 1.4.0 with the Pre-, no Plus, no 2, no 3, not even Pixis :)   And no TP launch country :P
Nov 08 23:28:41 <EricBlade> wow, my touchpad just went insane or something. it's just been sitting here doing nothing for a few hours, i plug it in, and send an app update to it, and it comes back "err -107 Device has been disconnected." and it's running slow as molasses
Nov 08 23:30:21 <EricBlade> oh no, rapper Heavy D has died.
Nov 08 23:31:14 <akanster> Now that we've found love what are we gonna dooo..... with it!?
Nov 08 23:31:40 <fxspec06> omg such terrible song reference
Nov 08 23:31:52 <EricBlade> apparently that's what he was famous for
Nov 08 23:32:02 <fxspec06> i had to listen to that one on repeat at famous footwear for hours
Nov 08 23:32:10 <fxspec06> =(
Nov 08 23:32:18 <akanster> haha
Nov 08 23:32:19 <fxspec06> now i have to hear it more?!?
Nov 08 23:33:33 <akanster> with arms wiiiide opeen!! </more bad songs>
Nov 08 23:38:09 <fxspec06> now i have creed stuck in my head. thank you. thank you for getting creed stuck in my head.
Nov 08 23:38:48 * akanster is pleased
Nov 08 23:39:21 <dwc-> even if the userspace ends up with a similar look and feel, QNX I would say is significantly different from webos
Nov 08 23:39:30 <dwc-> qnx being a rtos
Nov 08 23:39:58 <dwc-> which, in theory, should take care of the "I'm sorry, you can't answer your phone before I drop the call" problems
Nov 08 23:41:43 * EricBlade goes back to Creed's first couple songs to remember what could've been instead of what became popular
Nov 08 23:42:21 <fxspec06> creed's weathered cd was awesome. like most of the songs. then er, nothing else happened. that was about all i remember of creed
Nov 08 23:45:00 <EricBlade> hmm. it looks like apps stop running, or at least timeouts completely stop running, when the display shuts down on the pre, yes?
Nov 08 23:45:18 <akanster> fxspec06: Don't make me sing My Sacrifice!
Nov 08 23:45:47 <fxspec06> i'm just going to have to fire it up on itunes, that way i don't have to listen to you sing
Nov 08 23:46:01 <fxspec06> i-i mean HP Play.
Nov 08 23:46:29 <akanster> you mean Songbird?
Nov 08 23:46:33 <EricBlade> ugh, creed on HP Play.  combine any more suckage, and you'll end up collapsing into a blackhole.
Nov 08 23:47:06 <fxspec06> creed, on hp play, running in a win 95 emulator on a sprint pre.
Nov 08 23:47:23 <EricBlade> i have doubts that hp play would "work" on win 95
Nov 08 23:48:03 <fxspec06> what year was 'weathered' released? 1963?
Nov 08 23:49:20 <akanster> 2001 IIRC
Nov 08 23:49:45 <akanster> I really didn't mind it but God, those songs were everywhere!
Nov 08 23:49:53 <fxspec06> anyone remember buzz ballads?
Nov 08 23:53:11 <NuttyBunny> brb.. gotta get the popcorn for the circus show that will come in 38 mins
Nov 08 23:55:02 <fxspec06> oh oh oh good idea i'll go make some popcorn.
Nov 08 23:55:16 <fxspec06> 36 minutes*
Nov 08 23:56:13 <wrea> I have a bag of really old kettle corn
Nov 08 23:56:29 <wrea> I got it with a movie at blockbuster a long time ago
Nov 08 23:56:59 <NuttyBunny> I'll go microwave this time :(
Nov 09 00:07:25 <akanster> so who got MW3?
Nov 09 00:11:54 <EricBlade> only fps games i play are made by id or involve Duke Nukem
Nov 09 00:13:33 <akanster> heathen!
Nov 09 00:13:48 <PuffTheMagic> i miss old 2d duck nukem
Nov 09 00:14:11 <dwc-> no MW3 -- no console, and my video card barely did WaW... it's not doing MW3
Nov 09 00:14:20 <dwc-> it's time to upgrade
Nov 09 00:15:10 <akanster> duck nukem?  was Launchpad McQuack in that one?
Nov 09 00:15:17 <akanster> PuffTheMagic ^
Nov 09 00:16:02 <PuffTheMagic> dnt remember, havent played it in years
Nov 09 00:16:04 <EricBlade> Maybe this meeting is so that they can all get together for a group picture for the eBay listing
Nov 09 00:17:23 <EricBlade> news republic just flashed "HP to sell webOS"
Nov 09 00:17:34 <EricBlade> but when i hit the article, it comes up "No Internet Connection"
Nov 09 00:19:11 <fxspec06> hot damn
Nov 09 00:19:28 <fxspec06> f me sideways. i need my comfort popcorn. brb
Nov 09 00:20:26 <directhex> akanster: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:MechWarrior_3_Coverart.png ?
Nov 09 00:20:41 <EricBlade> meh. that finally loaded, but it's just the same old article from the other day, just with the headline diff
Nov 09 00:20:46 <akanster> directhex: ?
Nov 09 00:20:55 <directhex> <akanster> so who got MW3?
Nov 09 00:23:54 <majoradam> i was trying to connect to freenode using wirc while tethering but get an error about registering for something
Nov 09 00:24:14 <NuttyBunny> 7
Nov 09 00:25:30 <majoradam> any plans to update wirc
Nov 09 00:25:56 <Freman> looks like I better go through those emergency steps for making sure my device works post-hp
Nov 09 00:26:20 <rwatkins-pre3> I think there is a half done enyo version of wirc?
Nov 09 00:27:57 <EricBlade> Freman: if everything just magically shuts down tonight, well, that would suck.
Nov 09 00:28:21 <PuffTheMagic> majoradam, oil fell in a whole and hasnt come out, idk when next wirc update will be
Nov 09 00:28:26 <majoradam> does it support that thing for freenode. cannot remember the name. needed for mobile connections
Nov 09 00:28:28 <PuffTheMagic> magnets, maybe once a new webos phone is announced
Nov 09 00:28:36 <EricBlade> i saw oil around here yesterday i think
Nov 09 00:28:36 <Freman> EricBlade, considering I won't have time to do this until tonight lol
Nov 09 00:28:56 <PuffTheMagic> freenode doesnt have a mobile specific option
Nov 09 00:29:04 <majoradam> i can imagine not being motivated.i know i wouldnt be
Nov 09 00:29:06 <PuffTheMagic> it might have a no identd option
Nov 09 00:29:32 <fxspec06> popcorn is cooked, and very buttery. i may get the screen of my touchpad greasy
Nov 09 00:29:45 <majoradam> sasl i think it is
Nov 09 00:29:49 <fxspec06> like super greasy. and i don't know if i will feel bad about it
Nov 09 00:30:21 <EricBlade> that's why i don't use my touchpad for pr0n
Nov 09 00:33:05 <summatusmentis> when is this meeting supposed to happen?
Nov 09 00:33:15 <halfhalo> now
Nov 09 00:33:27 <summatusmentis> oh
Nov 09 00:33:44 <fxspec06> right now
Nov 09 00:33:47 <wrea> it has begun..*dramatic music*
Nov 09 00:33:54 <fxspec06> link?
Nov 09 00:33:58 * oil peeks out of hole, goes back into hiding
Nov 09 00:34:02 <summatusmentis> there's no link
Nov 09 00:34:02 <summatusmentis> it's a meeting
Nov 09 00:34:03 <wrea> lol
Nov 09 00:34:06 <summatusmentis> they're not liveblogging it
Nov 09 00:34:12 <summatusmentis> you can't listen in on a phone call
Nov 09 00:34:19 <MadManMoon> I'm scared!
Nov 09 00:34:23 <fxspec06> i want a link to this call
Nov 09 00:34:24 <summatusmentis> you sorta have to be an employee to be able to be there
Nov 09 00:34:31 <akanster> we need spies!
Nov 09 00:34:33 <summatusmentis> it's not a call
Nov 09 00:34:40 <fxspec06> i still want a link
Nov 09 00:34:44 <EricBlade> IS THERE ANY NEWS ON TWITTER YET
Nov 09 00:34:45 <fxspec06> =[
Nov 09 00:34:48 * halfhalo knows a guy who knows a guy who knows a guy
Nov 09 00:34:59 * fxspec06 knows that guy too
Nov 09 00:35:03 <summatusmentis> nothing on twitter that I'm seeing
Nov 09 00:35:12 <fxspec06> twitter is silent
Nov 09 00:35:18 <fxspec06> it's like. the calm before the storm.
Nov 09 00:35:31 <EricBlade> so, by association, since i know of halfhalo and fxspec, that means i know two guys who know a guy who knows a guy who knows a guy.
Nov 09 00:35:42 <akanster> too many dudes
Nov 09 00:35:49 <EricBlade> yeah we need some ladies
Nov 09 00:36:06 <fxspec06> i know this guy that knew a guy that knows this girl
Nov 09 00:36:24 <fxspec06> but, sadly, it was just a rumor.
Nov 09 00:36:26 <halfhalo> I love how a quarter of my im list is not listed as away for 15 minutes
Nov 09 00:36:32 <EricBlade> are they the same two guys that knew that other guy, or are we adding more guys to this mix
Nov 09 00:37:11 <EricBlade> i knew a girl once that was into that sort of thing, but she said "the more the merrier stops around 8"
Nov 09 00:37:35 <siestacat> hey
Nov 09 00:37:36 <siestacat> problem
Nov 09 00:37:43 <siestacat> I can't do the OTA update to 3.0.4
Nov 09 00:37:49 <siestacat> If fails every time after I reboot
Nov 09 00:37:52 <EricBlade> DAMMIT THEY PULLED HTE PLUG ALREADY
Nov 09 00:37:58 <EricBlade> oh
Nov 09 00:37:59 <siestacat> I have cyanogenmod installed
Nov 09 00:38:27 <AMR-1> I'm sure the first words in the meeting will be if anyone is tweeting stop now!
Nov 09 00:38:37 <fxspec06> my recommendation: remove cyanogenmod, and see if that allows you to update
Nov 09 00:38:55 <siestacat> Well, shouldn't there be a way for me to avoid that?
Nov 09 00:39:07 <siestacat> I've got a ton of stuff installed and configured...
Nov 09 00:39:10 <fxspec06> not install cyanogenmod?
Nov 09 00:39:52 <EricBlade> seems the easiest thing to do would probably be to doctor 3.0.4 on, then reinstall the android moboot
Nov 09 00:40:08 <HattCzech_work> any news? i'm waiting for it
Nov 09 00:40:17 <majoradams> what news
Nov 09 00:40:18 <siestacat> I think doctoring removes cm too, not just moboot
Nov 09 00:40:31 <halfhalo> that makes it a win-win!
Nov 09 00:40:36 <summatusmentis> no news
Nov 09 00:40:41 <majoradams> anyone connected to irc from a sprint phone
Nov 09 00:40:42 <rwatkins-pre3> yea greek economy is in trouble.  that's the news.
Nov 09 00:40:51 <EricBlade> i doctored to 3.0.2, did an OTA update, and reinstalled moboot later, siesta. worked fine for me.
Nov 09 00:40:54 <akanster> and Italy's
Nov 09 00:41:08 <summatusmentis> majoradams: I'm not, but I have
Nov 09 00:41:12 <siestacat> EricBlade : you doctored while CM was installed>
Nov 09 00:41:29 <majoradams> you connected to greenies?
Nov 09 00:41:38 <majoradams> stupid autocorrect
Nov 09 00:41:42 <majoradams> freenode
Nov 09 00:42:02 <EricBlade> siestacat: yea. i may have completely reinstalled cm7, not just installed moboot, i don't recall specifically. either way, all my android stuff was still there
Nov 09 00:42:11 <majoradams> I don't know how this touchpad made it to market. Frustrating to use
Nov 09 00:42:24 <Freman> I might go back to 302 because 304 is all busted arse with the touchstone :(
Nov 09 00:42:29 <EricBlade> majoradams: i find it to be far easier to use than any of the competition
Nov 09 00:42:51 * EricBlade would gladly take the touchstone off your hands instead, freman :)
Nov 09 00:42:55 <majoradams> you must be a fn
Nov 09 00:42:57 <summatusmentis> webOS has some quirks, but it's pretty easy
Nov 09 00:43:00 <majoradams> fan
Nov 09 00:43:29 <Freman> I love webos, for the most part
Nov 09 00:43:40 <majoradams> the design choices kills it.
Nov 09 00:43:48 <Freman> whichc ones?
Nov 09 00:43:52 <majoradams> like the browser and mail
Nov 09 00:44:21 <Freman> think they're ok but they need to be implemented better...
Nov 09 00:44:40 <Freman> they're too slow, not as... polished as they could be
Nov 09 00:44:43 <majoradams> the way it launches apps and the problems with responsive. Could do with a keyboard with word prediction I can go on and on
Nov 09 00:45:25 <fxspec06> i just wish that webos got the treatment it deserves. like more coders.
Nov 09 00:45:27 <summatusmentis> majoradams: what version of the OS are you running
Nov 09 00:46:17 <siestacat> Hmm...
Nov 09 00:46:23 <siestacat> where's the 3.0.4 doctor?
Nov 09 00:46:24 <fxspec06> correct me if i'm wrong, but i imagine it would be safe to say the webos coder team has not had the resources available to expand the way they would have liked to..
Nov 09 00:46:26 <dwc-> majoradams: no SASL support, that's sometimes needed to connect to freenode, depending on your isp
Nov 09 00:46:27 <summatusmentis> responsiveness issues have mostly gone away in 3.0.4
Nov 09 00:46:30 <siestacat> I can't find it, and OTA is failing...
Nov 09 00:46:53 <majoradams> I updated to the most recent version. Lately I have been using android on it more but the bugs cause me to sometimes switch to webOS
Nov 09 00:47:02 <fxspec06> seistacat: try webosinternals.org, they have doctors on their site
Nov 09 00:47:05 <summatusmentis> the only keyboards with word prediction that I'm aware of are swiftkey on android
Nov 09 00:47:24 <summatusmentis> unless you mean spelling correction, in which case, webOS has it
Nov 09 00:47:33 <majoradams> sasl  phones when I connect from sprint phone
Nov 09 00:47:49 <majoradams> happens
Nov 09 00:48:02 <dwc-> maybe
Nov 09 00:48:30 <majoradams> my android phone works fine because the ice client support sasl but wirc does not seem to support it
Nov 09 00:48:31 <EricBlade> I wonder if I doctored the wrong software onto this Pre, or something.  Camera and Flash are failing, GPS is "not responding"
Nov 09 00:49:16 <majoradams> summatusmentis: the stock keyboard has word prediction
Nov 09 00:49:26 <rwhitby> fxspec06: actually, we just have a wiki page with links to all the doctors on HP's site
Nov 09 00:49:35 <dwc-> correct, wirc does not support sasl
Nov 09 00:49:41 <dwc-> (currently)
Nov 09 00:50:54 <rwatkins> oh.  my.  god.
Nov 09 00:51:04 <rwatkins> HP's Meg Whitman on webOS 'it's not obvious exactly what to do here'
Nov 09 00:51:14 <majoradams> I wonder if there are any plans. The coder probably not motivated at this point
Nov 09 00:51:27 <EricBlade> rwhitby: should we send put out the wosi-signal, triggering a massive download hit DOS'ing the doctor servers?
Nov 09 00:51:34 <EricBlade> s/put//
Nov 09 00:51:57 <HattCzech_work> rwatkins: where'd you hear such things?
Nov 09 00:52:03 <NuttyBunny> fuck
Nov 09 00:52:06 <rwatkins> theverget
Nov 09 00:52:09 <rwatkins> theverge
Nov 09 00:52:15 <dwc-> rwatkins: I don't think that's unreasonable...
Nov 09 00:52:18 <NuttyBunny> sorry for the curse but... fuck
Nov 09 00:52:24 <rwhitby> heh, I called it exactly a couple of hours ago
Nov 09 00:52:42 <Freman> so... we give up? or wait longer or?
Nov 09 00:52:50 <siestacat> lol
Nov 09 00:52:57 <siestacat> no definite annoucement>
Nov 09 00:53:04 <majoradams> webOS is like a toxic asset
Nov 09 00:53:13 <wrea> I figured it would amount to this. But a meeting just to say whats already been said seems dumb
Nov 09 00:53:14 <NuttyBunny> rwhitby, Yep, dead spot on :D
Nov 09 00:53:15 <dwc-> they should put out a statement... we'll have a decision in the coming months... meanwhile, keep working, we'll keep paying you
Nov 09 00:53:16 <siestacat> where are you guys finding this?
Nov 09 00:53:19 <majoradams> I wonder who will buy it
Nov 09 00:53:24 <savs> http://www.theverge.com/2011/11/8/2548121/hp-no-decision-webos
Nov 09 00:53:31 <wrea> Shouldve just sent an email
Nov 09 00:53:45 <dwc-> nah, image-wise it's better for her to show up
Nov 09 00:54:01 <klausa> http://www.theverge.com/2011/11/8/2547488/hp-all-hands-webos-fate
Nov 09 00:54:05 <klausa> There's that too.
Nov 09 00:54:09 <summatusmentis> lolol
Nov 09 00:54:24 <klausa> (BTW, that Verge layout is fucking aweful.
Nov 09 00:54:35 <summatusmentis> I really like the verge
Nov 09 00:54:40 <NuttyBunny> nice, verge is having issues handling the traffic... bah
Nov 09 00:54:42 <klausa> This Is My Next was nice, clean and readble... This is overloaded.)
Nov 09 00:55:16 <klausa> Article pages are not terrible, but landing page is awful.
Nov 09 00:55:17 <summatusmentis> I'm... wildly unsure what the point of this meeting was
Nov 09 00:55:26 <summatusmentis> I think it's good they're being communicative
Nov 09 00:55:29 <summatusmentis> but this is mostly useless
Nov 09 00:55:48 <EricBlade> meetings in the corporate world are very important things where very little ever happens.
Nov 09 00:55:54 <klausa> I mean - 3 column layouts work nice in newspapers, but definitely not online.
Nov 09 00:56:02 <webosrocks> so meeting already happened?
Nov 09 00:56:15 <summatusmentis> yes
Nov 09 00:56:17 <halfhalo> eh, the few all hands I was at stuff actually happened
Nov 09 00:56:20 <NuttyBunny> webosrocks: yep, and we got... nothing
Nov 09 00:57:10 <akanster> fuck this waste of time.
Nov 09 00:57:12 <webosrocks> wow just saw the articles, lame. i actually almost hope it's like acquirer cancelled at the last minute or something, b/c if that's it that's just wut
Nov 09 00:57:17 <EricBlade> 100 new tweets with #webos in the last 10 min
Nov 09 00:57:32 <webosrocks> never a dull moment when webos is in the house though, even when it's actually a dull moment
Nov 09 00:57:58 <fxspec06> http://www.precentral.net/hp-still-not-sure-what-do-webos
Nov 09 00:58:02 <fxspec06> the f is this shit
Nov 09 00:58:25 <EricBlade> that was also a very short meeting.
Nov 09 00:58:27 <webosrocks> this meeting: TOO MANY CARDS
Nov 09 00:58:30 <halfhalo> then again, the first all hands I went to was that crazy thursday
Nov 09 00:58:57 <torchie> oh snap
Nov 09 00:59:00 <torchie> what did I miss
Nov 09 00:59:05 <summatusmentis> torchie: bunch of nothing
Nov 09 00:59:06 <torchie> meg whitmain said idunno or something
Nov 09 01:00:00 <summatusmentis> I completely don't understand why you would meet to tell people this
Nov 09 01:00:22 <fxspec06> torchie: you missed another overhyped giant piece of nothing
Nov 09 01:00:30 <fxspec06> more announcements coming in the coming months.
Nov 09 01:00:33 <torchie> oh.
Nov 09 01:00:36 <fxspec06> seriously, can't make this shit up
Nov 09 01:00:43 <torchie> they just wanted to announce that they were going to announce announcing something
Nov 09 01:00:44 <NuttyBunny> Perhaps they were about to close operations but something happened, maybe they found something actually doable (yes, keep dreaming)
Nov 09 01:00:45 <EricBlade> alright everyone, back to writing code.
Nov 09 01:01:09 <NuttyBunny> EricBlade: yep, it seems we'll still be here for "the coming months"
Nov 09 01:01:41 <summatusmentis> she did say 3-4 weeks
Nov 09 01:01:54 <torchie> yo rwhitby's on the verge!
Nov 09 01:01:58 <summatusmentis> which is really just "the coming month"
Nov 09 01:02:01 <halfhalo> have to convert that to palm time summatusmentis
Nov 09 01:02:06 <PuffTheMagic> halfhalo, go back in the whole you cralled out of
Nov 09 01:02:13 <fxspec06> in palm time: that's about 15.2 years
Nov 09 01:02:14 <akanster> http://twitter.com/#!/KeldogSeven/status/134072127837057025
Nov 09 01:02:23 <PuffTheMagic> halfhalo, dont come back till canvas is working
Nov 09 01:02:23 <fxspec06> which is really just dog years. so translated to people years
Nov 09 01:02:26 <EricBlade> i'd never heard of this "Verge" site till today
Nov 09 01:02:40 <halfhalo> lol
Nov 09 01:02:47 <summatusmentis> EricBlade: it's This is My Next VERSION 2
Nov 09 01:02:57 <klausa> Nah
Nov 09 01:03:02 <akanster> Engadget: Reloaded
Nov 09 01:03:14 <NuttyBunny> oh crap, and it starts raining here. not good
Nov 09 01:03:20 <summatusmentis> TIMN: Electric Boogaloo
Nov 09 01:03:26 <klausa> This is My Next was The Verge (beta®)
Nov 09 01:03:30 <PuffTheMagic> EricBlade, there Verge is where a bunch of bloggers go to play ookie cookie
Nov 09 01:03:51 <summatusmentis> klausa: ok, touche
Nov 09 01:04:57 <torchie> came out like
Nov 09 01:04:59 <torchie> a week ago
Nov 09 01:05:35 <klausa> I just noticed.
Nov 09 01:05:47 <klausa> RSS feed in my GReader just went dead.
Nov 09 01:06:07 <torchie> you know what would be more fun than a steve jobs movie
Nov 09 01:06:09 <torchie> a webos movie
Nov 09 01:06:15 <klausa> They could at least post update that would say they're releasing and that we should update urls...
Nov 09 01:06:48 <summatusmentis> klausa: they've been talking about the verge for a long time
Nov 09 01:06:50 <torchie> jon rubenstein looking out a window drinking scotch
Nov 09 01:06:52 <PuffTheMagic> torchie, i want to see a rated R muppets movie
Nov 09 01:07:03 <summatusmentis> I want to hear the full story of the meeting
Nov 09 01:07:07 <torchie> as mckinney holding a cardboard box walks out of HP corporate
Nov 09 01:07:18 <torchie> dramatic scene with lots of dolly zoom as meg whitman decides what to do
Nov 09 01:07:26 <majoradams> so nothing came of the meeting
Nov 09 01:07:28 <IGNTNUNLMTD> This shit is just like my last relationship; dragged on forever and made me miserable… once I decided to jump ship, life was AWESOME. I know what my plans are.
Nov 09 01:07:32 <torchie> and then she slams her hands on the table and whispers:
Nov 09 01:07:37 <torchie> "i dont know."
Nov 09 01:07:37 <klausa> summatusmentis: Yeah, I know, but it's really wierd that they didn't made any official update saying 'HEY! We're live!'
Nov 09 01:07:45 <IGNTNUNLMTD> rofl torchie
Nov 09 01:07:46 <klausa> I noticed just today
Nov 09 01:07:50 <torchie> and then the screen cuts to black
Nov 09 01:08:02 <torchie> and instead of to be continued it says
Nov 09 01:08:06 <torchie> "in the coming months..."
Nov 09 01:08:12 <klausa> And it seems their old feed just went dead 10/31
Nov 09 01:08:26 <AproposTS> PuffTheMagic: Meet the Feebles?
Nov 09 01:08:27 <torchie> yeah verge dropped on nov 1
Nov 09 01:08:28 <NuttyBunny> reminds me of Duke Nukem Forever... "when it's done"
Nov 09 01:08:32 <klausa> Since October 21, 2005 you have read a total of 217,240 items.
Nov 09 01:08:33 <torchie> ooh
Nov 09 01:08:34 <klausa> Ohgod.
Nov 09 01:08:51 <IGNTNUNLMTD> …and then it sucked, NuttyBunny
Nov 09 01:08:52 <torchie> do you think there's room for 3D realms in the jobs rubi/en / stein movie
Nov 09 01:09:07 <torchie> like maybe as subtle cameos
Nov 09 01:09:15 <torchie> on tv screens in the background
Nov 09 01:09:31 <klausa> I liked DNF.
Nov 09 01:09:34 <klausa> Really.
Nov 09 01:09:38 <klausa> Ask me anything.
Nov 09 01:09:55 <PuffTheMagic> AproposTS, jim henson muppets
Nov 09 01:10:04 <torchie> IamA DNF fan
Nov 09 01:10:11 <torchie> TIL DNF was spposed to be bad
Nov 09 01:11:16 <AproposTS> PuffTheMagic: Oh, that one will probably have to remain firmly in your imagination unless the Henson estate gets really strapped for cash. ;)
Nov 09 01:12:44 <dawm_> hp.. you suck
Nov 09 01:12:47 <NuttyBunny> I want to beat someone
Nov 09 01:17:31 <fxspec06> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5X4N2exOsU&list=FLbYfoZIWCpVj_0w1wfjGr3Q&index=15&feature=plpp_video
Nov 09 01:17:35 <dwc-> 17:02 < summatusmentis> EricBlade: it's This is My Next VERSION 2
Nov 09 01:17:44 <dwc-> so... This Is My Next This Is My Next?
Nov 09 01:22:14 <fxspec06> oh hey so positive news here: webos is alive for another night!
Nov 09 01:22:39 <PatrickC> lol
Nov 09 01:23:36 <summatusmentis> dwc-: indeed :)
Nov 09 01:23:55 <PatrickC> argh.... no news :/
Nov 09 01:35:21 <NuttyBunny> no news is good news?
Nov 09 01:36:45 <rwhitby> NuttyBunny: no news is no news
Nov 09 01:37:13 <NuttyBunny> rwhitby, at least it wasn't bad news... as you say, just no news ..
Nov 09 01:38:14 <dwc-> no GNUs is bad news?
Nov 09 01:40:14 <fxspec06> well, it was news
Nov 09 01:40:19 <fxspec06> it wasn't exactly no news
Nov 09 01:40:39 <fxspec06> it was stale news. or holdover news. it was definitely news
Nov 09 02:05:41 <PatrickC> so.. how is everyone doing tonight?
Nov 09 02:05:46 <fxspec06> just made a new wallpaper guys: http://i.imgur.com/KEC34.png
Nov 09 02:07:04 <PatrickC> fxspec06, haha nice
Nov 09 02:08:11 <fxspec06> it's all white, to symbolize emptiness. actually i was just lazy, but it still symbolizes emptiness
Nov 09 02:14:00 <EricBlade> hmm.  on a enyo text input on pre, when i type into it, it doesn't scroll if the input is longer than the visible box.
Nov 09 02:14:25 <PatrickC> really...
Nov 09 02:14:27 <PatrickC> hmm...
Nov 09 02:14:40 <PatrickC> EricBlade, testing on the phone?
Nov 09 02:14:43 <PatrickC> which phone btw
Nov 09 02:14:47 <fxspec06> it never does
Nov 09 02:14:48 <EricBlade> sprint pre
Nov 09 02:14:56 <PatrickC> fxspec06, really?
Nov 09 02:14:58 <fxspec06> just don't type words ridiculously long
Nov 09 02:15:08 <PatrickC> EricBlade, GVoice?
Nov 09 02:15:10 <fxspec06> like aslkdghdfsgdfhbgjcdvbjxchvjhdujdfubudyvbrueybuyrebuiyrebvuryebtuyrbbeubgcvruebgu
Nov 09 02:15:27 <EricBlade> doesn't matter on spacing
Nov 09 02:15:56 <EricBlade> works on touchpad
Nov 09 02:16:18 <PatrickC> EricBlade, send me the IPK, ill try it on the pre3. see if it works
Nov 09 02:16:42 <fxspec06> patrickc: that's your solution to everything
Nov 09 02:17:12 <summatusmentis> is "phones make the business harder" actually valid
Nov 09 02:17:35 <PatrickC> fxspec06, its better to have it working on 1 phone, then to not know if it works on any
Nov 09 02:17:36 <EricBlade> hmm. looks like it's just the ToolInput
Nov 09 02:18:13 <fxspec06> patrickc: but there is an emulator. once again, this is somebody with a pay for app...
Nov 09 02:18:46 <fxspec06> "send me the IPK" is a demand.
Nov 09 02:21:21 <fxspec06> also, the mojo and enyo framework on the pre 3 and all pre / veer family models are virtually identical, from my experience. there are minor differences with mojo between 1.4.5 and 2.x os versions, but there is no evidence to suggest that enyo is different at all on any phones.
Nov 09 02:22:16 <fxspec06> therefore, it would be my conclusion that if something doesn't work in enyo on a pre+, and on a pre 2, that it also wouldn't work on a pre 3
Nov 09 02:23:23 <EricBlade> and why the hell doesn't enyo.getAppInfo() work most of the time
Nov 09 02:23:33 <EricBlade> or whatever it is
Nov 09 02:23:46 <EricBlade> fetchAppInfo()
Nov 09 02:25:29 <fxspec06> hm. maybe try fetching the info at appstart and store it in var in main kind.. then call it when u need it
Nov 09 02:27:25 <EricBlade> it only seems to work reliably on touchpad, never on pre, and occasionally on chrome
Nov 09 02:29:06 <fxspec06> i wonder if enyo has permissions to access fetchappinfo on phones. possibly an overlooked bug
Nov 09 02:29:17 <rwatkins> EricBlade: on 2.x it appears to return a string.  you need to parse it
Nov 09 02:29:18 <fxspec06> ask ben
Nov 09 02:29:30 <fxspec06> (or that)
Nov 09 02:30:40 <rwatkins>  appInfo = (enyo.fetchDeviceInfo() && (enyo.fetchDeviceInfo().platformVersionMajor < 2)) ? (JSON.parse(enyo.fetchAppInfo())) : enyo.fetchAppInfo()
Nov 09 02:31:08 <rwatkins> so I guess thats actually 1.x that it breaks
Nov 09 02:31:15 <rwatkins> but ya, its breaks
Nov 09 02:32:40 <EricBlade> aha, i do get a string on 1
Nov 09 02:32:48 <EricBlade> only after create() though
Nov 09 02:34:41 <EricBlade> now just to figure out how to make that input focus where the cursor is .. hmm... *goes away to ponder*
Nov 09 02:36:18 <dawm_> rubber
Nov 09 02:44:07 <nebula> it's one thing to ask me "are you sure you want to shut down" once...
Nov 09 02:50:36 <fxspec06> so only on toolinput
Nov 09 02:50:55 <fxspec06> open toolinput and see what's different i suppose
Nov 09 02:58:26 <EricBlade> mm if this were smoother, it would be better than the ipod version.
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Nov 09 02:59:57 2011