**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Nov 23 02:59:57 2011
Nov 23 03:06:31 <haeffb> whatup?
Nov 23 03:06:44 <wrea> not much here
Nov 23 03:07:10 <haeffb> when will HP shut down the webOS app cat servers?
Nov 23 03:07:43 <EricBlade1> friday
Nov 23 03:07:56 <haeffb> "Black" friday
Nov 23 03:07:58 <EricBlade1> or maybe tuesday
Nov 23 03:08:16 <EricBlade1> maybe the second saturday of next week
Nov 23 03:08:19 <haeffb> "Very Gray" tuesday
Nov 23 03:10:11 <haeffb> Mizzou vs Cal on ESPN2 in 8 minutes
Nov 23 03:10:50 <haeffb> unless this stupid football game goes OT
Nov 23 03:15:39 <rwhitby> haeffb: "In the coming weeks"
Nov 23 03:17:48 <haeffb> of course, wosi will have an alternate catalog up and running in...2 years ago.
Nov 23 03:19:14 <rwhitby> that's what I'm working on right now as it happens
Nov 23 03:19:34 <haeffb> rwhitby <- visionary
Nov 23 03:20:49 <moo> hrm.. strange. i don't see my patches being accepted or rejected
Nov 23 03:22:08 <EricBlade1> moo's patch status: Limbo.  Get the party drinks.
Nov 23 03:22:44 <siestacat> HP Touchpad number 2 selling tablet after iPad this quarter... reasonably sad, shows how bad Android tablets sell.
Nov 23 03:23:08 <EricBlade1> that's for a single model, though.
Nov 23 03:23:28 <siestacat> so?
Nov 23 03:24:40 <EricBlade1> so if i remember from reading the article, a single model of samsung? it was had 1M fewer sales than TouchPad, and then you add all the rest of the Android tablets onto that, and there's probably a world of difference between "tablets sold with webOS", "tablets sold with Android", and still the giant rhino "tablets sold with iOS"
Nov 23 03:27:20 <rwhitby> moo: I need to discuss those with you, but don't have time to do so right now.
Nov 23 03:29:57 <moo> rwatkins: ok, mail me when you have time
Nov 23 04:01:15 <rwatkins> moo: ?
Nov 23 04:18:58 <moo> rwhitby: sorry, wrong nick
Nov 23 04:19:04 <moo> rwhitby: ok, mail me when you have time
Nov 23 04:19:26 <dwc-> you did it again :P
Nov 23 04:19:46 <wrea> lol
Nov 23 04:20:52 <moo> lol
Nov 23 04:21:26 <moo> i'm worrying about the patch i'm forging right now :P
Nov 23 04:21:48 <rwhitby> moo: "flash life savior" - I'm concerned about this unknown side-effects this patch could have
Nov 23 04:22:35 <rwhitby> moo: "ISO date format" - the name is too generic for something which only patches CN
Nov 23 04:23:25 <rwhitby> moo: what is "callshow"
Nov 23 04:23:46 <moo> but CN date format == ISO date format. there is en_DK in linux
Nov 23 04:24:29 <moo> "callshow" is a patch made by another chinese guy to display geo location for incoming mobile numbers, (he use patch because it is implement in a different way than the webos original one)
Nov 23 04:25:12 <moo> becase it also replace some file other i want to patch or update, so an alternative version for my patch is required
Nov 23 04:26:49 <moo> i'm not sure why some of them don't submit patch to preware but to chinese feeds online
Nov 23 04:30:13 <moo> people use LANG=en_DK for English + ISO-date format under linux. why not en_CN in webos/mojo ? (there is no en_CN under linux, nor en_DK in webos mojo)
Nov 23 04:38:11 <rwhitby> moo: someone might want to submit an ISO date patch for en_AU, for example.
Nov 23 04:39:21 <rwhitby> "ISO date format for en_CN" would be a less generic name, allowing others to create other "ISO date for xx_XX" patches alongside it
Nov 23 04:39:51 <moo> hrm... okay
Nov 23 04:43:58 <moo> rwhitby: i use flash life savior for my self. so far so good
Nov 23 04:45:12 <rwhitby> I think it also needs a better name. "Flash" can mean "Adobe Flash" to many people in webOS.
Nov 23 04:45:32 <rwhitby> "Divert Log Files To RamDisk" may be a better name
Nov 23 04:47:21 <moo> yeah, the 'flash' trouble me for a long time to get a better name
Nov 23 04:47:27 <moo> "Divert Log Files To RamDisk" is nice :)
Nov 23 04:50:56 <moo> all patch update support up to 3.0.4 is ready. will submit updates once the patch is approved.
Nov 23 04:53:44 <fxspec06> so i pretty much give up on android development
Nov 23 04:54:50 <fxspec06> webos has infinitely better development tools
Nov 23 07:37:43 <EricBlade1> i dont imagine anyone knows of a way to test for the presence of flash?
Nov 23 07:38:24 <panel> hello
Nov 23 07:38:49 <panel> hmm
Nov 23 07:39:30 <panel> there's any alternative without flash ?
Nov 23 14:36:11 <Tibfib> prompt("got flash?")
Nov 23 14:44:02 * Freman flashes for Tibfib
Nov 23 14:44:25 <Tibfib>  *ahem* thank you
Nov 23 17:03:48 <dwc-> EricBlade1: websites do it all the time so I imagine there's a way
Nov 23 17:04:12 <EricBlade1> i mean from within a webos app
Nov 23 17:05:05 <dwc-> yea, how do they do it
Nov 23 17:06:08 <EricBlade1> mostly be specifying part of the page "if you have flash, present this, otherwise present that".  but i dont' want to do it from a web page
Nov 23 17:07:32 <Tibfib> flash isn't supported in webOS apps itself
Nov 23 17:07:41 <Tibfib> sooooo
Nov 23 17:13:18 <EricBlade1> this hottie about 22 at the T-Mobile store where i got my activation on my pre+, played with the phone for a few minutes, and said "wow these are so nice, why didn't they succeed?"
Nov 23 17:15:49 <dwc-> because they weren't iphones?
Nov 23 17:16:45 <Tibfib> EricBlade1: get her number?
Nov 23 17:17:46 <dwc-> get her picture?
Nov 23 17:19:20 <dwc-> solely to demonstrate to her the camera capabilities, of course
Nov 23 17:20:27 <Tibfib> of course
Nov 23 17:24:50 <halfhalo> What about the Children!!!
Nov 23 17:33:08 <EricBlade1> no unfortunately.  i doubt she'd have been very much into my girlfriend anyway.
Nov 23 17:34:07 <EricBlade1> anyone else experiencing big spikes in their downloads recently?
Nov 23 18:23:52 <ka6sox-farfarawa> The Children are lost.
Nov 23 21:04:38 <EricBlade1> hmm. i was just trying out the HTML5 audio in webOS 2.x on my cellular data connection .. it takes forever for it to start playing.. anyone know if it downloads the whole file before it starts, or if it caches some?
Nov 23 21:10:23 <Shadyman> EricBlade1: Depends on the setting.
Nov 23 21:10:37 <EricBlade1> what setting ?
Nov 23 21:10:50 <Shadyman> I forget which setting it is, but there is one that sets whether it caches or not
Nov 23 21:11:56 <EricBlade> well, there's one parameter that determines if it should load the sound immediately without being told to play it
Nov 23 21:12:21 <EricBlade> but i was more curious as to whether the audio starts playing only when it's fully downloaded, or if it streams
Nov 23 21:12:44 <EricBlade> judging by the amount of time it takes on this crap connection, i'm guessing only when fully downloaded
Nov 23 21:13:09 <Shadyman> preload?
Nov 23 21:13:27 <Shadyman> or autoplay
Nov 23 21:13:42 <EricBlade> there's a parameter for preload, but that's not exactly what i'm looking for
Nov 23 21:14:16 <EricBlade> it's a remote music player, so it sets the url to play on demand .. and on my cell connection it takes a -very- long time before it starts actually playing the audio
Nov 23 21:14:49 <EricBlade> so, if it doesn't stream that way, i'm probably better off sending it to the "streaming music player" application, eh
Nov 23 21:16:01 <Shadyman> watch this.$.sound.audio.readyState
Nov 23 21:16:17 <Shadyman> 0 is buffering, 4 is 'has enough to play'
Nov 23 21:17:51 <Shadyman> sound.audio.play(), sound.audio.pause(), sound.audio.currentTime() are all useful
Nov 23 21:17:59 <Shadyman> I use {kind: "Sound", audioClass: "media", preload: "true", src: ""}, for my define
Nov 23 21:18:49 <Shadyman> then i feed it the URL later on in the code, do a .play() and it buffers some, then plays when it's got enough to do so
Nov 23 21:19:09 <Shadyman> Hope that helps.
Nov 23 21:19:24 <EricBlade> hmm. the streaming audio player doesn't start the same way in webos 2 as it does in 3.
Nov 23 21:20:04 <Shadyman> Oh
Nov 23 21:20:13 <Shadyman> You're on 2, huh.. I missed that :x
Nov 23 21:22:19 <EricBlade> ok i guess it does stream.  27 seconds to start, and then about 20 seconds in, it pauses. ugh!
Nov 23 21:22:40 <EricBlade> i don't think this connection will be useful for this.
Nov 23 21:23:02 <dwc-> wait
Nov 23 21:23:09 <dwc-> "cellular data connection" you say?
Nov 23 21:23:14 <dwc-> is this the phone you just put on tmobile?
Nov 23 21:23:27 <EricBlade> yeah. with dialup speeds :|
Nov 23 21:23:37 <dwc-> then that's probably your issue
Nov 23 21:23:55 <dwc-> I'm guessing you probably cap out about 200-250kbps like I do
Nov 23 21:23:59 <EricBlade> yeah i'm testing it to see if this is something that's possible. it's probably not.
Nov 23 21:24:23 <dwc-> streaming audio is not something I typically even bother trying
Nov 23 21:24:34 <dwc-> (unless I really want to listen to the AM radio online streams)
Nov 23 21:24:44 <dwc-> but yes, it takes awhile to start up
Nov 23 21:26:04 <EricBlade> it'll be good for building connection handling into it
Nov 23 21:27:08 <EricBlade> heh downloading "Net Speed", and the progress meter is lethargic
Nov 23 21:28:08 <EricBlade> 63.7k download
Nov 23 21:31:31 <EricBlade> oh dear lord.  average is around 30kbps and ping time is average around 2 seconds.
Nov 23 21:34:07 <EricBlade> wifi is 2.7mb down, 750kb up, and 160ms ping .. the edge speed wasn't even able to calculate on uploads
Nov 23 21:37:13 <dwc-> I usually measure wi th dslreports's iphone speedtest
Nov 23 21:37:30 <dwc-> i.dslr.net/iphone_speedtest.html
Nov 23 21:39:26 <Shadyman> there's a webos speed tester app
Nov 23 21:40:27 <dwc-> yea, but the mobile webpage is a reasonable compromise while giving cross-platform comparison ability
Nov 23 21:40:33 <Shadyman> true
Nov 23 21:40:53 <dwc-> indoors with 2 bars of edge, it just gave me 47kbps
Nov 23 21:40:55 <Shadyman> assuming that rendering ability is about equal
Nov 23 21:41:17 <EricBlade> T-Mobile Detroit's data rates blooow
Nov 23 21:41:30 <dwc-> outdoors with good signal, I usually get ~150-250kbps
Nov 23 21:41:47 <EricBlade> that would be more acceptable
Nov 23 21:42:21 <dwc-> Shadyman: nothing from the data is rendered... I think they just ajax download something and don't actually display it
Nov 23 21:42:49 <dwc-> but yes, it would affected by the browser, js engines, etc
Nov 23 21:42:58 <Shadyman> Yayjax!
Nov 23 21:43:13 <dwc-> but hopefully at those slow speeds, the pipe is the bottleneck
Nov 23 21:44:17 <EricBlade> it would really impress me if i could live stream my whole music library from my network at home to my car. from anywhere.
Nov 23 22:16:16 <leiru> hi
Nov 23 22:16:34 <leiru> what was the timeframe hp said they will decide about webos?
Nov 23 22:18:05 <summatusmentis> you know, "soon"
Nov 23 22:18:31 <leiru> no they said something like 1 month, but i forgot when it was
Nov 23 22:19:00 <summatusmentis> I don't ever remember hearing 1 month, but I could have missed it
Nov 23 22:31:45 <EricBlade> "3-4 weeks" was late 1st week or early 2nd week of November i think
Nov 23 22:31:55 <EricBlade> whenever that last all palm meeting was
Nov 23 22:32:10 <leiru> ok thanks
Nov 23 22:32:33 <leiru> that was what i remembered, but wasnt sure
Nov 23 22:33:53 <EricBlade> i believe after the earnings call, someone got a quote that was something along the lines of "making decisions over the next couple of weeks, and announcing strategies in 2012".
Nov 23 22:34:28 <EricBlade> ok, that's annoying.  if you attempt to update an app, but the download fails for whatever reason, it kills the old ver of it
Nov 23 22:58:07 <PaNeL> hello
Nov 23 23:33:11 <dwc-> EricBlade: it should be unavailable in the launcher, but when you go to the sw update or where you get the "download failed" there should be a choice to "try again" or (i forget what) ... if you choose that option, it should become available again
Nov 24 01:32:14 <akanster> cheap Touchpad case - www.amazon.com/dp/B003P7VU40
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Nov 24 02:59:58 2011